Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and Bloomberg
Speaker 1: Quick Takes Tim Stinovich from Bloomberg Radio. There's a long
Speaker 1: long way to go when it comes to diversity and inclusion,
Speaker 1: certainly in Hollywood. McKinsey's out with a study about just that,
Speaker 1: looking at black representation in film and TV. Shoining us
Speaker 1: to talk about it is McKinsey partner Sheldon Lynn joining
Speaker 1: us on the phone in San Diego, along with Nina's Shaw,
Speaker 1: attorney and founding partner at black Light black Light Collective,
Speaker 1: that's coalition of black Hollywood executives, and she is on
Speaker 1: the phone in Los Angeles. Sheldon and Nina. Nice to
Speaker 1: have you here on Bloomberg. Sheldon, let me kick it
Speaker 1: off with you tell us about this study. Hi, Carolyn,
Speaker 1: and thanks for helping me. Sure excited to be here. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So you know, we did this work um for a
Speaker 1: confluence of the factors, and I would say there were
Speaker 1: three main ones. Number One, there was the real lead,
Speaker 1: so film and TV happens to be among the worst
Speaker 1: performers university across all a your American industries. Number Two,
Speaker 1: we felt we could add a net new contribution on
Speaker 1: the existing body of work, in particular around building the
Speaker 1: business case. What is the value at stake from a
Speaker 1: failing to pursue diversity inclusion in Hollywood. Number three was
Speaker 1: where Nina and the Black Hair Collective came in was
Speaker 1: we felt there was a real path to change here
Speaker 1: working with our folks who wanted to drive change forward.
Speaker 1: So that's a bit of a context around the court.
Speaker 1: We'll need to come on in on this and we're
Speaker 1: gonna dig into some of the results of of what
Speaker 1: the mckensey research found out. But you know, I've been
Speaker 1: reading some of the interviews you've done. You've talked about
Speaker 1: being in the entertainment space, being a talent lawyer where
Speaker 1: you've often only been the are You've often been the
Speaker 1: only black individual in the room when there's something going on. Yes, well,
Speaker 1: first of all, Sheldon, thank you so much, and Carol
Speaker 1: gred to be here. Yes, UM, you know, I think
Speaker 1: that's the entertaining industry as a whole. UM. Often UM
Speaker 1: is viewed in a light of being a bit more
Speaker 1: progressive than its numbers would indicate. UM. And I think
Speaker 1: that's that's that progress that those progressive notions are real. UM.
Speaker 1: I don't want to in any way imply otherwise, but
Speaker 1: but often it just doesn't match up. And I think
Speaker 1: the wonderful thing about this study was that it really
Speaker 1: dug in and it took a look at the numbers,
Speaker 1: and I think the number that stands out for all
Speaker 1: of us is this notion that ten billion dollars in
Speaker 1: annual revenues every year is being lost as a result
Speaker 1: of the lack of diversity in the business. And that's
Speaker 1: something that should appeal to all of us as as
Speaker 1: something that can be cured. Right, Like we often have
Speaker 1: conversations here that above and beyond being the right thing
Speaker 1: to do in terms of diversity and inclusion, there's often
Speaker 1: a business cost Sheldon by not having that diversity. Yeah, absolutely,
Speaker 1: and Nina said it right. So the headline was that
Speaker 1: there is a ten billion dollar opportunity here for us
Speaker 1: to pursue diversity inclusion. And it came from what we found,
Speaker 1: you know, quite surprising for a well established industries, a
Speaker 1: set of factors that were in effect suppressing the market
Speaker 1: the true market for black lid content in three important
Speaker 1: and although surprising ways. The number one was on distribution.
Speaker 1: So we found that on average it and the film
Speaker 1: was being shown in thirty fewer countries versus a white
Speaker 1: LID project, even though the black LID projects made more
Speaker 1: per country. And the second thing, from our return of
Speaker 1: investment perspective or a I, we found that black lid
Speaker 1: projects were receiving ten less in marketing allocation even though
Speaker 1: they were making more UM per dollar spent at the
Speaker 1: box off, specifically sixteen cents more per dollar spent on marketing.
Speaker 1: And perhaps the most heart breaking part of the equation
Speaker 1: in terms of market inefficiency well the fact that only
Speaker 1: four percent of the projects coming out of Hollywood were
Speaker 1: accounted for by black treatings. To find us having black marieters, directors, producers,
Speaker 1: creators behind the camera, which again is on a sounding
Speaker 1: number when you think about the population average of thirteen
Speaker 1: point four percent. So those factors together combined to the
Speaker 1: big number ten billion dollars in lost value and that's
Speaker 1: just from black representation. Yeah, pretty dramatic. Still with us
Speaker 1: is McKinsey partner Sheldon Lynn. He is joining us on
Speaker 1: the phone in San Diego. Nina Shaw with us attorney
Speaker 1: and founding partner Black Light Collective. It's the two of
Speaker 1: them together have come together put out this mckensey report,
Speaker 1: partnering on it, and it's all about diversity, equity, and
Speaker 1: inclusion when it comes to the film and television industries. Nina,
Speaker 1: I want to get bring you in here because you
Speaker 1: did work with them on this big time. The goal
Speaker 1: of their part was to humanize black lives. Tell us
Speaker 1: how you did that. It wasn't just statistics and numbers,
Speaker 1: it was real people that you got to. Now we're
Speaker 1: we were fortunate, um within the ninety or so individuals
Speaker 1: who formed this loose coalition, the Blacklight Collective, you have
Speaker 1: literally hundreds of years of experience in the entertainment industry um. Uh,
Speaker 1: people in the representation business like me, but also people
Speaker 1: in the production business. So I thought that we lent
Speaker 1: an incredible perspective as people who work day to day
Speaker 1: in this industry and have done so for many years. Uh.
Speaker 1: And and our collective action as an as a group
Speaker 1: is really indicative of the kind of collective action that
Speaker 1: we need to see within the industry. I think the report.
Speaker 1: One of the report's conclusions is that this these are
Speaker 1: tough problems to solve if they're being done within insular organizations,
Speaker 1: that it's going to take a collective action across many
Speaker 1: of the businesses in the industry to really address these solutions.
Speaker 1: And that's in the first step in that of course,
Speaker 1: is acknowledging that that these problems exist and that they
Speaker 1: have to mend its financial impact. And we're so grateful
Speaker 1: to Mackenzie for having done the work that really allows
Speaker 1: us a launching pad for wheel change. All right, and
Speaker 1: sit tight for second, guys, I just want to bring
Speaker 1: a headline crossing the Bloomberg terminal. The CDC Advisors reaffirmed
Speaker 1: backing of J and J vaccine authorization. So again we
Speaker 1: knew the CDC was meeting today, they were again ten
Speaker 1: days at the use of that drug has been halted
Speaker 1: here in the United States. But the CDC advisors coming
Speaker 1: out and reaffirming their backing of the J and J vaccine. UH,
Speaker 1: that's emergency authorization for here in the United States. So
Speaker 1: we now once again have another drug UH and vaccine
Speaker 1: specifically that can be used against COVID nineteen here in
Speaker 1: the United States. UM, let me get back to talking Michelle,
Speaker 1: then lenover at Mackenzie, Nina Shaw of the Black Light Collective. Nina,
Speaker 1: let me just follow up corporate America has had a
Speaker 1: tough time. They're doing better, but when it comes to
Speaker 1: senior positions in particular, whether it's women, whether it's black individuals,
Speaker 1: whether it's minorities, you know, they seem to increasingly still
Speaker 1: or at least, I should say, continue to get left
Speaker 1: out of some of those senior positions. And many would
Speaker 1: say that until we have that, it's going to be
Speaker 1: hard to kind of approve it or improve it all along, um,
Speaker 1: you know, all along the employment chain, if you will,
Speaker 1: do you agree? Is that the same for Hollywood and TV? Yes? Um,
Speaker 1: you know, the lack of representation, really the underrepresentation off screen,
Speaker 1: the underread representation and leadership roles absolutely holds us back.
Speaker 1: Now we've seeing progress. You see more people on screen,
Speaker 1: and that is a good thing. It is still not
Speaker 1: as as good as we would like it to be,
Speaker 1: but we must not forget that those games that we're
Speaker 1: making in front of the camera need to also be um,
Speaker 1: also be had behind the camera and in the c suite.
Speaker 1: And one of the things that people say to me
Speaker 1: when they read the report that really knocks them out
Speaker 1: is that how the entertainment industry is actually behind many
Speaker 1: other sectors of the UH economy in terms of its
Speaker 1: diversity and inclusion, because most people, when they are asked
Speaker 1: to guess at which are the most diverse sectors, would
Speaker 1: put us much higher in that in that in that
Speaker 1: chain than we really are. So this has been this
Speaker 1: this report has been great because it really, um have
Speaker 1: made concrete that which many of us who work in
Speaker 1: the industry always knew to be true. Right if there's
Speaker 1: something too when you put out the numbers and show
Speaker 1: it how it really is versus just um, you know,
Speaker 1: general observations, Sheldon, let me ask you to about stereotyping
Speaker 1: and bias nous within Hollywood and TV. Part of the
Speaker 1: report talks about, you know, the creative limitations that are
Speaker 1: imposed on black talent that you know, I think there
Speaker 1: is a stereotyping going on in terms of roles. We
Speaker 1: see that going on, right, UM, tell us little bit
Speaker 1: more about that, absolutely, Carol, you know you touched on
Speaker 1: it before, Um. But one things we're able to do
Speaker 1: with Nina and the Black leg Collective will really get
Speaker 1: into the lived experiences and to be fear on credit.
Speaker 1: A lot of work has been done on the topic
Speaker 1: of the versity in Hollywood. So doctor Hunted U c
Speaker 1: l A doctor and Christina roman At U c l
Speaker 1: A and Dr Stacey Summit USC has done a fear
Speaker 1: bit of work. So we actually came in and tried
Speaker 1: to add to that, and one was really digging into
Speaker 1: the lived experiences of black professionals and I think we found,
Speaker 1: you know, across the many individually, Dad, I think we
Speaker 1: divie would over fifty professionals in depth in addition to
Speaker 1: the broader Black leg collective, and we catalog Carol forty
Speaker 1: five pain points all the way from how you get
Speaker 1: an internship, getting paid well enough they can take that internship,
Speaker 1: to getting an agent, to getting your projects stereotyped, to
Speaker 1: the visions on certain around things like you're in makeup,
Speaker 1: the perspective on what your public is worth based on
Speaker 1: what market it will and we're not selling. So all
Speaker 1: these pain points add up again that this massive value
Speaker 1: destruction and what I would you know, point people to
Speaker 1: is the real loss potentially around the creative art form.
Speaker 1: How many additional great projects from black credits could we
Speaker 1: have had if we had these conditions that negated these
Speaker 1: fortified pain points that black professional space has been navigated
Speaker 1: the industry right, Well, yeah, there's a quote in the
Speaker 1: in the research one creative executive saying, quote, when studios
Speaker 1: are looking for black content, they're looking for Wakonda or poverty,
Speaker 1: with no in between. And then talk about black actors
Speaker 1: who have to say, who explained, I have to take
Speaker 1: stereotypical work because that's what's out there. But then when
Speaker 1: I when I take those roles, they say that's all
Speaker 1: I'm capable of. So it's this vicious cycle, Nina. One
Speaker 1: thing I want to get to before we leave. We've
Speaker 1: just got about a minute left here. What's the black
Speaker 1: tax i? It represents something that we see across society. Um,
Speaker 1: And it's unfortunate this notion that you have to work harder,
Speaker 1: essentially pay dues at a certain level before you can
Speaker 1: get to just even an even playing field, and that
Speaker 1: makes entry into the into the entertainment industry in particular
Speaker 1: extraordinarily difficult. Um Sheldon alluded to the fact that many
Speaker 1: of the entry points are in jobs that don't pay
Speaker 1: a living weight, so that immediately restricts the number of
Speaker 1: people you can come and if you are not from
Speaker 1: a background, and you don't have a family or other
Speaker 1: means of support during this time, you find yourself unable
Speaker 1: to compete, and then you look up and people who
Speaker 1: started with you are far ahead of you because they
Speaker 1: didn't have to take a second job to support themselves
Speaker 1: doing their first job. They sent that time at home
Speaker 1: reading scripts and and and networking and do the things
Speaker 1: that advanced them in their career. And I can think
Speaker 1: of several examples. Well, you know, I hope we can
Speaker 1: continue this conversation in the future because I think it's
Speaker 1: great that you guys have put out this research and
Speaker 1: now people have something that they can work off of it,
Speaker 1: because now it's got to lead to hopefully actions to
Speaker 1: make a change. Mckensey partner, Sheldon Lynn, thank you so much.
Speaker 1: Nina Shaw, attorney and founding partner at black Light Collective.
Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg