Speaker 1: Hell I Sucked Dating with Dean Ungler and Dared Haven
Speaker 1: and I heard radio podcast. Hey, welcome to an all
Speaker 1: new episode of help I Suck at Dating. I am Jared,
Speaker 1: joined by Dean. Currently on the road. Uh, Dean, where
Speaker 1: are you up to? Right now? I'm with Kaylin and Pappy.
Speaker 1: We are headed back to Los Angeles. We've just spent
Speaker 1: a couple of days in Tahoe Ski and the breaking
Speaker 1: sick nar hanging out on the lake. Uh. And now
Speaker 1: we're headed home. What's the longest road trip you've ever
Speaker 1: done with Klin? The longest road trip I've ever done
Speaker 1: with Caitlin. Uh. We did a South Dakota drive that
Speaker 1: was like hours from Los Angeles. That one really sucked. Oh,
Speaker 1: it's so bad. You know, if you if you're able
Speaker 1: to successfully have a great road trip with someone, they're
Speaker 1: usually the one. I wouldn't say that any of them
Speaker 1: are great. I would just say that they're all different
Speaker 1: shades of uh uh, just normal boring driving. I mean,
Speaker 1: I would be careful though she's she's driving right now.
Speaker 1: You have to be nice to her. She's your life
Speaker 1: is literally in her hands. It's very rare to see
Speaker 1: her driving. I'm very appreciative of her to step in
Speaker 1: take the reins while I record this podcast with you guys,
Speaker 1: because I was worried I was gonna be even later
Speaker 1: than I usually am. I was like, Caitlin, I have
Speaker 1: to get us here by this time. But then I
Speaker 1: had to go there's this rock in in Tahoe Lake
Speaker 1: that I really wanted to jump off of naked, and
Speaker 1: I did it. But because of that we are now.
Speaker 1: You know, I was twenty minutes behind schedule and I
Speaker 1: had to have her step in and take the reins
Speaker 1: and drive us to the well. We do have some
Speaker 1: very special guests that are coming up later on the podcast.
Speaker 1: We have Ian, Jenkings, Alan and Jeremy. They have a
Speaker 1: new book, Three Dads and a Baby Adventures in Modern
Speaker 1: Parrington and Parrington. Why can I not say that word paring.
Speaker 1: Holy crap, it's been a long day. But they are
Speaker 1: as you can tell from the title, they are a
Speaker 1: throuple and they're raised two kids, and they talk about
Speaker 1: their experiences with that parenting. Uh. It's it's an interesting story,
Speaker 1: so definitely tune in later on. But first, of course, Dean,
Speaker 1: you and I have a lot, a lot to talk about,
Speaker 1: so we asked you guys on Instagram yesterday, what is
Speaker 1: something that your ex gave you that you just cannot
Speaker 1: get rid of? Because we talked about this before and
Speaker 1: I told you that there's a binder that my ex
Speaker 1: gave me that my dad found last summer when he
Speaker 1: was going through all the storage in the garage and
Speaker 1: he's like, well, do I'm gonna throw it out? And
Speaker 1: I felt guilty and I was like, oh, don't throw
Speaker 1: it out, like I I remember how much hard work
Speaker 1: that was. And we just kind of I was like,
Speaker 1: just put it back in storage and I don't want
Speaker 1: to see it, but I also don't want to throw
Speaker 1: it away. Um, Dean, do you have anything that of
Speaker 1: an X that you know? Like, Ah, I have, but
Speaker 1: I can't throw away. Uh. Well, the first thing that
Speaker 1: you said, the first thing that came to mind when
Speaker 1: you said that was Taylor for the longest time had
Speaker 1: an Air Force shirt that her ex gave her a
Speaker 1: long long time ago, and she would it wasn't just
Speaker 1: a shirt that like sat in the bottom of her dress.
Speaker 1: She would like wearing all the time. She heard all
Speaker 1: all the time she weared to like sleep at night.
Speaker 1: And I'm like, why are you wearing this guy shirt
Speaker 1: all the time? Yeah, she wants to defend yourself. Um,
Speaker 1: she yes, Okay, yeah it was a good sleeping shirt.
Speaker 1: And but but it was just one of those things
Speaker 1: where it's like she's wearing air for all the time,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, are you wearing your episode? Yeah, but
Speaker 1: now I sound like the over bearing boyfriend that's like
Speaker 1: your ex quoyfriend's shirt away. Um no, now she's told
Speaker 1: one of my shirts that she's sleeping every night. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but I'm sure Klin, did you kind of get Did
Speaker 1: ask Calin if she liked you getting jealous? Um? Dared
Speaker 1: ask if you like when I get jealous? Never never
Speaker 1: think um in terms of what I have when I
Speaker 1: next ever gave me that I can't get rid of them,
Speaker 1: I don't think so. I try to like detach myself
Speaker 1: from a lot of things. So not really a thing
Speaker 1: that I can think of. Do you you have that
Speaker 1: bind or does it actually have anything from any exes? No?
Speaker 1: Not really. She did have roses. So when we first
Speaker 1: got together, she said she saved all the roses that
Speaker 1: she received. Now, some were from me from Paradise, but
Speaker 1: they were also some from another guy that she was
Speaker 1: on Winter Games, with which I was not too happy.
Speaker 1: I understand why she saved the roses. Was like, you
Speaker 1: can't have those roses anymore. You got tossom, and I
Speaker 1: think she ended up tossing them. She only kept the
Speaker 1: roses that I gave her, So how do you how
Speaker 1: does she preserve the roses? And I think I remember
Speaker 1: keeping my first couple of roses and they like, they
Speaker 1: got gross and disgusting, so she dried him out somehow.
Speaker 1: I don't know she knew what she was doing. I
Speaker 1: tried to keep the roses, but then they just smelled
Speaker 1: a high heaven and like you, they just it was disgusting,
Speaker 1: so I threw them out. I still have a date
Speaker 1: card though. I still have a day card written technically
Speaker 1: written from Caitlin, but she didn't write it though, well,
Speaker 1: I mean it says from Caitlin. I'm you know, it's
Speaker 1: obviously whoever writes those day cards off the show? But
Speaker 1: how do you not keep that? You know? It's in
Speaker 1: my bed? I just I it's in a draw somewhere.
Speaker 1: I actually found it when we were moving and I
Speaker 1: showed Ash. I was like, holy crap, look at this,
Speaker 1: and it was from my new York one on one.
Speaker 1: You could sell it as like a piece, as like
Speaker 1: a work of art. We were thinking the same thing.
Speaker 1: Uh make a little dough on that. You know. I'm
Speaker 1: sure someone paid like a hundred bucks for a day
Speaker 1: card from the Bachelor. Well, anyway, so we did ask online,
Speaker 1: what is some of the things that your X gave
Speaker 1: you that you just cannot get rid of? Uh? You
Speaker 1: know a lot of people not gonna lie said anxiety. Uh,
Speaker 1: trauma was another big answer. Another one said their virginity.
Speaker 1: Uh well you know, yeah, you can't get that one
Speaker 1: back ken you. Uh their iPhone? Um, somebody said that
Speaker 1: they still have photos of them from fifteen to twenty
Speaker 1: years ago. That's a good question. Do you throw out photos? Like?
Speaker 1: All right, here's here's a digital as question. Did digital
Speaker 1: digital aged question for you? Do you delete pictures of
Speaker 1: your X on social media? Yes? Or no? Dean on
Speaker 1: social media? I think I did the I think so,
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure I did. I was just like, whatever,
Speaker 1: that's in all chapter. What I don't like is and
Speaker 1: it's funny because I have I have some really good
Speaker 1: friends who have recently just gone through breakups and what
Speaker 1: iPhone or Apple whatever? He is doing lately. Is they're saying,
Speaker 1: like this this memory from two years ago, and it's
Speaker 1: always like a cute photo of you and your analex girlfriend,
Speaker 1: and you like have to relive this trauma that you
Speaker 1: experience on regular Like you're kind of trying to get
Speaker 1: over this breakup, but your phone is not letting you
Speaker 1: get over it. So like, in that sense, absolutely you
Speaker 1: should leave. I mean the photos on your phone. Um,
Speaker 1: I just went back and deleted all my photos up
Speaker 1: until twenty nineteen. This is everything because I needed a
Speaker 1: free up space on my computer. That one is a
Speaker 1: little challenging to do because I was like, what if
Speaker 1: there's like some good diamonds in the rough here that
Speaker 1: I wanted referred to later. But then at the end
Speaker 1: of the day, I'm like, what's the point having Like
Speaker 1: what is the purpose are these serving? So I was
Speaker 1: just like, real, But there was a time I remember
Speaker 1: what when I think I went on The Bachelor at
Speaker 1: I can't remember if I untagged or deleted photos of
Speaker 1: my ex girlfriends and them, um, just because I wanted
Speaker 1: to protect their privacy a little bit better. Um, but
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure I've scrubbed my Instagram of all the
Speaker 1: pictures of any of my exodus. Yeah, well you're saying
Speaker 1: earlier about Facebook. What you're saying earlier about Facebook reminding
Speaker 1: you of past memories. I feel the same way. Facebook
Speaker 1: is now becoming like that friend you have that always
Speaker 1: says the wrong thing in front of your new girlfriend,
Speaker 1: Like if like the guy that you're you know, you're
Speaker 1: hanging out with your new girlfriend you just started dating,
Speaker 1: and like one of your old friends, Like, bro, you
Speaker 1: remember like three years ago when we ended up going
Speaker 1: home with those girls, and you're like, dude, shut the
Speaker 1: hell up. That's what Facebook is doing now. It's like
Speaker 1: bringing up memories of like, oh, look at that, that's
Speaker 1: me and my ex girlfriend as I'm standing right next
Speaker 1: to my wife, who's not the same person. Facebook, get
Speaker 1: the hell off here. Yeah, definitely, you definitely get like
Speaker 1: I have those friends that station they're not supposed to
Speaker 1: say or like shouldn't be saying. Well, I think I
Speaker 1: might be going through a dead spot. You guys, you
Speaker 1: might lose me on on the zoom here, Oh you're
Speaker 1: in and out. Well, hey, on the bright side, we're
Speaker 1: ten minutes outside of our destination, So Jackie, lose me.
Speaker 1: It's only gonna be for at most ten minutes. It
Speaker 1: could be worse. They'll be fine. I'll be able to
Speaker 1: carry the show for ten minutes. All right? What other responses?
Speaker 1: Do we have? An STD that's always the worst one,
Speaker 1: right there? Have you ever not to get to uh
Speaker 1: two into detail? Hair? But have you ever had an
Speaker 1: SDD scare? Dean not taking not to get two into
Speaker 1: detailed he says before, I mean, yeah I have. I'm
Speaker 1: not afraid to admit it. I did once in my
Speaker 1: early twenties and then again in my still early but
Speaker 1: slightly later twenties. Yeah. I don't know if I ever
Speaker 1: had like a full on scare, but like, there's definitely
Speaker 1: moments where I'm like, I'm even though you know I
Speaker 1: I did the right thing, I used protection, it's just
Speaker 1: like I'm I'm still paranoid enough to get checked out.
Speaker 1: Uh and luckily knock on wood. Uh, it was all,
Speaker 1: it was all, it was all good old text messages.
Speaker 1: I delete my text messages. Do you delete your text messages? Yeah?
Speaker 1: My around audibility, so they delete every month of every month.
Speaker 1: Old message deleted every month. What do if you have,
Speaker 1: like I don't delete Ashley's text messages? Because those are like,
Speaker 1: you know, it's I would want to keep those from
Speaker 1: memory sakes, Like when we first started dating, after we
Speaker 1: went through this weird time obviously because we were friends
Speaker 1: and then we started dating. So it was like that
Speaker 1: weird flirtatious time where I was like messaging her about
Speaker 1: Panera bread because I was just trying to figure out
Speaker 1: something to start a conversation. I'd like to go back
Speaker 1: and look at those text messages. What was it, what
Speaker 1: was your what was your tactic? What did you try
Speaker 1: to talk to her about? The broccoli cheddar soup? I
Speaker 1: was just I passed I was doing. I was like,
Speaker 1: it was so stupid. I remember texting Tanner. I was like,
Speaker 1: I feel awkward texting Ashley, what the hell is wrong
Speaker 1: with me? And He's like, well, bro, now you've come
Speaker 1: out with your feelings. It's like that new puppy love,
Speaker 1: that weird phase where you're just trying to talk to
Speaker 1: her one another and start up a conversation. And yeah,
Speaker 1: I was passing a Panera bread and I was like,
Speaker 1: I need to like stay in contact because you know,
Speaker 1: she may have been dating somebody else at the time,
Speaker 1: but I needed to be like I needed to keep
Speaker 1: reminding her like, hey, I'm here, I'm here, I'm not
Speaker 1: going anywhere baby, and um so I texted her like, oh,
Speaker 1: I'm craving broccoli and cheddar soup, and then I sent it.
Speaker 1: I was like, I'm such a freaking idiot. Why would
Speaker 1: I ever say that? That's what does that remind you of?
Speaker 1: There is like there's an episode of the Office where
Speaker 1: Darryl's like trying to flirt with the girl he works
Speaker 1: or something like that, and he goes, I'm getting my
Speaker 1: ice cream on and I was like, what kind of
Speaker 1: game is that? That's very similar? You're like it, and
Speaker 1: it's like, why would you text someone that you know?
Speaker 1: That's just like the thought that you have that then
Speaker 1: passes on a couple of seconds later, you know, But hey,
Speaker 1: that's that's you know looking back, like you said, like
Speaker 1: you're saying, is it's romantic and cute because of how
Speaker 1: it ended for you guys? Yeah, but if it didn't end, well,
Speaker 1: not be a romantic and cute would just be awkward.
Speaker 1: I wish I could go back to old text messages
Speaker 1: where I'm trying to like flirt with girls to be
Speaker 1: and like, I'm sure there's like just like endless messages
Speaker 1: back and forth about nothing because I just don't have
Speaker 1: the balls to ask someone out or like actually make
Speaker 1: a move. So I'm just like keeping the conversation going
Speaker 1: as long as possible until it comes to a point
Speaker 1: where it's so awkward that I'm finally like, So, like,
Speaker 1: you ever want to hang out or not. You don't
Speaker 1: have to if you don't want to, but like, if
Speaker 1: you have time, if you eat, you know, we could
Speaker 1: eat together. I think that's endearing. And I think a
Speaker 1: lot of girls I think that's endearing too. And I
Speaker 1: think it actually kind of helps build a solid foundation
Speaker 1: or if or when you eventually do get to hang
Speaker 1: out with them in person, you know, because then you
Speaker 1: kind of like have this background back and forth it's
Speaker 1: like banter maybe some inside jokes, uh. And so I
Speaker 1: think it's I think it's helpful at the end of
Speaker 1: the day. Yeah, I think it's quite nice. Another one
Speaker 1: of the responses that we got about something and X
Speaker 1: gave you can't get rid of this kind of fits
Speaker 1: right into your story from earlier. One was a jersey
Speaker 1: and the other one was a hoodie, so you know,
Speaker 1: sometimes no, no, no. This is a response from one
Speaker 1: of our listeners and they just don't want to give
Speaker 1: that hoodie up. You know, hoodies are expensive, man like
Speaker 1: prty bucks. You get a nice hoodie, keeps you warm,
Speaker 1: why give it up, especially if it's a jajeric one.
Speaker 1: My question is, like, I wonder if Klin's ex boyfriend
Speaker 1: ever like looked through his dresser and I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: I wonder where my favorite cotton T shirt is? You know,
Speaker 1: like poor guy doesn't have his favorite T shirt on
Speaker 1: him anymore because it's crazy ex girlfriend stole it. You know,
Speaker 1: would be really funny if he was looking on your
Speaker 1: Instagram and you posted a picture of Kalin in the sweatshirt.
Speaker 1: I I did post a picture of her wearing because
Speaker 1: she once because she wore a skydiving or something like that,
Speaker 1: and I posted a photo of her at the skydiving
Speaker 1: drop zone and she was wearing it, and I just
Speaker 1: I don't know. You're right, he might have son seen it, um,
Speaker 1: but at the end of the day he probably thought
Speaker 1: it was the coolest thing ever. I'm not gonna lie
Speaker 1: I would have now, I'm sure I don't know what
Speaker 1: the relationship is now. I I don't know, all right,
Speaker 1: what else have we got here. Uh, toxic toxic tendencies. Huh.
Speaker 1: Toxic tendencies is another answer that we got something your
Speaker 1: ex gave you that you can't give back. Do you
Speaker 1: have any toxic tendencies that an X gave you? Any
Speaker 1: toxic tendencies that the next might have given me? I
Speaker 1: think my first girlfriend that I was like over heels
Speaker 1: in love with cheated on me a lot. Uh, And
Speaker 1: so for a long time I had a lot of
Speaker 1: toxic tendencies and being like uh, not like presumptuous, but
Speaker 1: like overbearing or like stressed out or anxious up that
Speaker 1: was being cheated on or something that you know, I've
Speaker 1: worked through it. I don't think that toxic trait carries
Speaker 1: over to my present self, but it was definitely something
Speaker 1: I had to do with a lot of my like
Speaker 1: late teens, early twenties. Did you ever accuse her of
Speaker 1: cheating and then she was not cheating? Um? After that
Speaker 1: first girlfriend? You mean no, like during the first girlfriend,
Speaker 1: were you? Yeah? I guess right after the first girlfriend,
Speaker 1: after she's like traumatized you. Did you ever accuse a
Speaker 1: girl of cheating and be like I knew it and
Speaker 1: then she's like, Dean, that's my brother, right. I think
Speaker 1: that's probably why I was traumatized by the first time,
Speaker 1: was because I confronted her about it. I was like, Hey,
Speaker 1: what's the deal, Why are you cheating on me? And
Speaker 1: she was like, I'm not cheating on you. I was like,
Speaker 1: you literally have a hicky on your neck right now,
Speaker 1: Like I'm looking at your hickie and she goes, oh,
Speaker 1: this isn't a hickie that my pillow preased weird on
Speaker 1: my neck last night and it left this mark. And
Speaker 1: I was like so young and dumb and naive, and
Speaker 1: I was like, okay, that makes sense, and then like
Speaker 1: eventually my friends are right, oh, yeah, that was bad. Um.
Speaker 1: But later on I don't know. I think I don't
Speaker 1: think I ever like projected it outwardly, but inwardly I
Speaker 1: was always kind of like, you know, pretty toxic for
Speaker 1: myself about that that possibility. But that's the one I
Speaker 1: can really only think. But I don't have any other
Speaker 1: And do you have any toxic traits? Okay, not how
Speaker 1: toxic Aalin? It's a good question. I asked you in
Speaker 1: if I any toxic traits? And she just opens her eyes.
Speaker 1: Why her head yet? Um? What about you? Jared what
Speaker 1: toxic traits have you taken over training? Honestly, all the
Speaker 1: good traits I have, I I credit my my ex. Uh,
Speaker 1: I don't have like toxic. I'm trying to think of
Speaker 1: like someone specific a toxic tendency it I got from
Speaker 1: the next um. I can't think of any Like I
Speaker 1: only had one really long term girlfriend before I started.
Speaker 1: I went on the show and then obviously ultimately dated
Speaker 1: Ashley and she gave me no toxic If anything, I
Speaker 1: gave her toxic tendencies. It was very bad, I feel really,
Speaker 1: I mean I was I was a good boyfriend. I'd
Speaker 1: like to think knock on wood, but like there was
Speaker 1: definitely one time where she planned like a mini vacation
Speaker 1: for us, and it was kind of we were definitely
Speaker 1: broken up at this point, but still together. It's like
Speaker 1: that awkward phase, the worst phase of them all. And
Speaker 1: if anybody's gone through that long, excruciating breakup, you know
Speaker 1: exactly what I'm talking about, where like the breakup last
Speaker 1: six months and it's awkward, and you see each other
Speaker 1: and you hook up and then you're still broken up
Speaker 1: and you're seeing other people, but then you're still texting
Speaker 1: each other and it's like, are we friends, Let's try
Speaker 1: to be friends, and of course that never happens. So
Speaker 1: I was during that awful phase. And then she like
Speaker 1: planned a little vacation kind of because her family had
Speaker 1: a house in Black Island, but she wanted us to
Speaker 1: like stay at a hotel l another night, and I
Speaker 1: said I would go, and then I totally bailed on
Speaker 1: her when she was already there, and I felt horrible. Granted,
Speaker 1: truth be told, I couldn't get out of work, but
Speaker 1: also truth to be told, I never tried taking the
Speaker 1: day off prior to being scheduled to work, so it
Speaker 1: was definitely my own fault that I felt terrible about.
Speaker 1: So hopefully she didn't gain any toxic tendencies from me. Yuh,
Speaker 1: so you don't think you have any toxic traits apparently though,
Speaker 1: Oh me, I have tons of toxic traits. But they're
Speaker 1: from my own, you know, my own psycho being, not
Speaker 1: somebody like, not from somebody imprinting. I'm just I'm I
Speaker 1: was born, this this psycho human being that Ashley decided
Speaker 1: to marry. So I was I was gonna say, because
Speaker 1: I do know I think my most toxic trait, uh,
Speaker 1: But you're right, it wasn't placed on you from someone else.
Speaker 1: I think it just is something I've popped it on
Speaker 1: my own, and it's I always expect Kalen to be
Speaker 1: able to read my mind and know what I'm thinking,
Speaker 1: and if she which if she doesn't, if she's not
Speaker 1: able to do that, which of course she's not able
Speaker 1: to do that because no one's a mind reader. I
Speaker 1: then get upset with her or not being able to
Speaker 1: treat my mind. Um. And I think that's definitely my
Speaker 1: most topic trait as a partner. Yeah, I have that
Speaker 1: trade to you know. I don't understand women can do
Speaker 1: everything but they can't read minds. Come on, now, I
Speaker 1: don't buy that. They definitely read our minds, they just
Speaker 1: choose not to go. They just choose to go against
Speaker 1: whatever we want, even though they know what we want.
Speaker 1: That's what I'm convinced toff. I don't know if I
Speaker 1: agree with that per se, but uh, let's go through
Speaker 1: a couple more. I mean a lot of them are
Speaker 1: like clothing items sweat pants, Um. One is fear of rejection, UM.
Speaker 1: Another one's condoms, well, you know, practicality, uh, pictures, debt, debt,
Speaker 1: what kind of X left you in debt. That's sounds horrible.
Speaker 1: I mean I can see that. I can see that too.
Speaker 1: I won't say who it is, but there's definitely someone
Speaker 1: who uh uh that ash and I know that dated
Speaker 1: someone who might have been like a little bit of
Speaker 1: a mood shure, not intentionally, but they were just kind
Speaker 1: of going through a little bit of a struggle bus
Speaker 1: and I think they left us a little bit in debt. Um.
Speaker 1: Who is it? Is it a family friend or a
Speaker 1: bachelor person? No? No, not a bachelor, not a bachelor person. Um,
Speaker 1: but no, I'm teasing. They're they're wonderful um or something. Nick. No.
Speaker 1: Nick was very gracious and he let me live for
Speaker 1: free in his place for like five months, which is
Speaker 1: very nice. He still holds it over my head though
Speaker 1: it's been three years. And I gave him a little
Speaker 1: bit of money and I gave him my friendship. Isn't
Speaker 1: that good enough? I lived with the man, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean? That's that's rent enough. You co created
Speaker 1: the Brochiler or whatever the heck were calling that? Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: what was that thing? The the the bad chill, bad chilling, right, Honestly,
Speaker 1: when I go back and watch those so for anybody
Speaker 1: who's listening to this podcast right now that doesn't know. Uh.
Speaker 1: Dean and I did this did this YouTube thing with
Speaker 1: Nick Viles, Me and Nick and Dean were we recapped.
Speaker 1: It was Becka Koufferin's season of The Bad Bachelor Bachelorrette
Speaker 1: and we did spoofs called the Bad Chiller where we
Speaker 1: woud dress up as the contestants and were dressed up
Speaker 1: as Becca and and do a funny read, you know,
Speaker 1: two minute recap of the show. When I go back
Speaker 1: and watch those, I mean they're high entertainment. It's good
Speaker 1: stuff in there. Yeah. Yeah, I think you, uh, that's
Speaker 1: really gonna be even when you become as big of
Speaker 1: a movie star as Tom Cruise, I think we're gonna
Speaker 1: be able to look back at that series and kind of,
Speaker 1: you know, understand that that's like the genesis of where
Speaker 1: you got your start. Oh totally. The only reason I'm
Speaker 1: gonna get cast in a Mission Possible eight is because
Speaker 1: of Nick Violes Bad Chiller. Um. We do have some
Speaker 1: great guests coming up. Like we said before, we have
Speaker 1: Ian Allen and Jeremy Uh. They have their new book,
Speaker 1: Three Dads and a Baby. They're gonna talk about their
Speaker 1: relationship what it's like parenting, Uh, in a throuble, what
Speaker 1: it's like just being in a throuble. Funny story, I
Speaker 1: told us on the podcast. My neighbor are former neighbors,
Speaker 1: used to be in a throuble, and uh, they would
Speaker 1: argue all the time, but they were very much in love.
Speaker 1: So I hope, I hope they're doing well. But anyway,
Speaker 1: we're not talking about them. We're talking about Alan, Jeremy
Speaker 1: and Ian, and we're gonna talk to them right after
Speaker 1: this break. Welcome back to help I suck at dating.
Speaker 1: Of course, I'm Jared and joined by Dean, and we
Speaker 1: have three very special guests who are joining us via
Speaker 1: zoom right now, author of the new book Three Dads
Speaker 1: and a Baby Adventures in Modern Parenting. We have Ian Jenkings,
Speaker 1: and we have Alan and Jeremy. Gentlemen, thank you so
Speaker 1: much for joining us today. How are you We're doing great?
Speaker 1: Thank you? Of worse, So I want to talk to
Speaker 1: you guys because obviously you have your new book Three
Speaker 1: Dads and a Baby, So Ian, Alan, and Jeremy, you
Speaker 1: are in a throuble. So Ian, I was wondering if
Speaker 1: you could talk about what exactly a throuble is for
Speaker 1: somebody who doesn't know. Yeah, sure, a throuble is just
Speaker 1: kind of like a couple. But there's three people here.
Speaker 1: And honestly, when people meet us, if they come over
Speaker 1: to our house, it sounds exotic, But soon after they
Speaker 1: get to know us, they realize that we're a family
Speaker 1: like any other. And we make dinner, we have guests,
Speaker 1: we take care of our kids. You know, we watch
Speaker 1: television occasionally. It's pretty ordinary. Actually, yeah, just you guys
Speaker 1: are a normal family. You have two kids, Piper and Peter.
Speaker 1: If I Piper and Parker, yeah, excuse me, half an
Speaker 1: approaching too, and they are delightful and they are also
Speaker 1: delightfully napping right now. That's while perfect timing to record
Speaker 1: the podcast. I just gotta say, it's it's funny. The
Speaker 1: fruity and slip of Jared the super super fanbok is
Speaker 1: misstakes Parker's name for Peter, because I was gonna I
Speaker 1: was gonna ask if that was what was going on
Speaker 1: sound Spider Many. I mean, I might be a fan
Speaker 1: of your friendly neighborhood Spider Man. A little Peter Parker
Speaker 1: never heard anybody um so alan um. I wanted to,
Speaker 1: you know, talk to all three of you. So, so Alan,
Speaker 1: who started the relationship? Did you guys all meet at
Speaker 1: the same time? We're two of you together and then uh,
Speaker 1: you know, then you guys formed a throuble. How did that,
Speaker 1: um turn into the relationship that you're in now? Yeah,
Speaker 1: we we didn't all meet at the same time. So
Speaker 1: I've been with Ian for eighteen years and we've been
Speaker 1: with Jeremy now for about nine years. So yeah, Ian
Speaker 1: and I met when we were in medical training, UM
Speaker 1: a long time ago, and got together and stayed together
Speaker 1: and uh, you know, we it was mostly Ian's dride,
Speaker 1: but we had over the years and impetus kind of
Speaker 1: just or to maybe open our relationship. And of course,
Speaker 1: you know, I was raised a fairly kind of a
Speaker 1: conservative environment, and it was something that I was like,
Speaker 1: I'm not sure I really had to wrap my mind
Speaker 1: around what would that would mean? And UM, gradually just
Speaker 1: kind of became acclimated to the idea of trying to
Speaker 1: sort out what are sort of the social mores and
Speaker 1: expectations that make made me resisent versus what are the
Speaker 1: potential pros and benefits that could come from it. And
Speaker 1: so it was sort of like baby steps to working there,
Speaker 1: working towards there, and then you know, we met Jeremy
Speaker 1: about nine years ago, and Jeremy and I instantly hit
Speaker 1: it off and we've really actually just been a threable
Speaker 1: ever since then. So it's definitely something where if you
Speaker 1: had asked me, you know, twenty years ago, UM, when
Speaker 1: I was in my early twenties, would I ever imagined
Speaker 1: being in a threatle I would say that is crazy,
Speaker 1: that's insane, That's not something that I could have envisioned myself. UM.
Speaker 1: But I like to think, you know, I'm forty three now,
Speaker 1: and at this phase of life, I think sometimes we
Speaker 1: have expectations for ourselves. UM that can cause us a
Speaker 1: lot of disrupt distress when they're not met UM or
Speaker 1: you feel like you're kind of you know, not on
Speaker 1: that path. And what I've learned is that often what
Speaker 1: life hands you and what evolves in life is better
Speaker 1: than any expectation you could have dreamt up, you know.
Speaker 1: So uh, for me, the reality of our relationship is
Speaker 1: is great. It's it's richer, it's fuller. We have kids now,
Speaker 1: which I wasn't sure what was going to happen before. UM,
Speaker 1: And so for me, UM, that the I think the
Speaker 1: moral of this story is kind of being having openness,
Speaker 1: um and really thinking about your own expectations and how
Speaker 1: that's either helping you or maybe hindering your in certain areas.
Speaker 1: Examining that really helped me over the years, kind of
Speaker 1: wrapped my mind and just kind of be open to it.
Speaker 1: And so it was something that just evolved pretty naturally. Jeremy,
Speaker 1: what about what about you? I'd be curious abou your
Speaker 1: perspective then, since you kind of were the one that
Speaker 1: came in nine years later. Yeah. So you know, I
Speaker 1: was also raised really conservative. My dad was a pastor
Speaker 1: from Montana. Um, so, uh, accepting the fact that I
Speaker 1: was gay it was hard enough. Uh. Never never thought
Speaker 1: i'd be in a throuble. But um, yeah, you know
Speaker 1: I met Ian online. Uh, and we're talking on a
Speaker 1: dating site, and um, you know, I was kind of
Speaker 1: I'm always cute and he's a doctor, Like I'm feeling
Speaker 1: good about myself. And at the end of our conversation,
Speaker 1: he was like, oh, well, my partner and I would
Speaker 1: love to meet you. And I was like, oh, I'm sorry,
Speaker 1: I just misunderstood. I thought you were open to dating.
Speaker 1: And he said, oh, no, my my partner and I
Speaker 1: opened to the idea of dating someone else and I
Speaker 1: was like, oh, I'm really not into that. Sorry, that's
Speaker 1: just not really my jam. And he said, oh, that's okay. Well,
Speaker 1: we're always looking for new friends, um, if you just
Speaker 1: want to be friends. And so the next day I
Speaker 1: and I met just to make sure that we were real.
Speaker 1: And the day after that, I came to their house
Speaker 1: for dinner and we actually called out our anniversary, like
Speaker 1: we basically were together on UM. So you know, what
Speaker 1: I say is it's not for everyone, but if you
Speaker 1: are the right temperament, you know, it really works for us.
Speaker 1: It's an amazing regulationship. We've been together in gay years,
Speaker 1: like a hundred eighteen years. So yeah, it's it's it's
Speaker 1: been great. I had met one throuble prior to meeting
Speaker 1: Alan and Ian that just where I was living in
Speaker 1: Hawaii and they were on vacation there, and they were
Speaker 1: super They're like actors on Broadway and really dynamic and
Speaker 1: really open about like, this is our relationship. So I
Speaker 1: kind of had a you know, I knew what the
Speaker 1: relationship kind of looked like. Uh, and I think that
Speaker 1: would be a little bit more open to it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Ian and Alan, you guys were in the relationship for
Speaker 1: nine years. So what are some pros to be to
Speaker 1: being in a throuble compared to being in a couple. Well,
Speaker 1: there's a long list, but I I like to say
Speaker 1: that I find it unlikely that any two people are
Speaker 1: going to be a perfect match for each other. And
Speaker 1: so I have learned amazing things from both of these guys.
Speaker 1: They teach me and enhance my life in different ways.
Speaker 1: And there's just like activities that I might tend to
Speaker 1: do more, you know, they're interested um or Jeremy's more
Speaker 1: interested in, or that Allen's more interest it in, or
Speaker 1: that we all are interested in, and it's just like
Speaker 1: this really great balance. It's just like an additional perspective.
Speaker 1: If there's ever like you don't really fight, but if
Speaker 1: there's ever like a disagreement, you know, we're having a conversation,
Speaker 1: then there's a third person there, and it's like a
Speaker 1: three party judicial panel. There's never a tie. And and
Speaker 1: someone can be like, hey, and you gotta check your bs,
Speaker 1: like you're being inappropriate, you're being defensive, like you're in
Speaker 1: the wrong this time, And I have to say Okay, Um,
Speaker 1: you know, I see what you're saying, and it's sort
Speaker 1: of like helps us in a way. Um, you know,
Speaker 1: to have that additional voice. Um and I have we
Speaker 1: have kids, so it's amazing having two partners to help
Speaker 1: out with that and again teach me different things aboutout
Speaker 1: parents and they have to take great care of the kids.
Speaker 1: So it's just for me, it's been like a blessing.
Speaker 1: There's more communication acquired. Um, but like one guy is great,
Speaker 1: two guys is awesome? Why stop at two? What? What
Speaker 1: can we can we go more than that? I don't
Speaker 1: know if that or the communications still the family calendar
Speaker 1: gets really complicated all yeah, Oh I gosh, I can
Speaker 1: only imagine. I'm curious. You guys ever just get tired
Speaker 1: and or fed up of having to like explain your
Speaker 1: your situation, your circumstances, your relationship anything like that. Like
Speaker 1: I feel like at some point it would be a
Speaker 1: little exhaustive, but I could be wrong. I'm curious. Um gosh,
Speaker 1: this many years into it, No, Um, it's you know,
Speaker 1: if we meet strangers, I guess. Um. But once we thought,
Speaker 1: oh this, we want this relationship to to be real.
Speaker 1: We wanted we wanted to go somewhere we're willing to
Speaker 1: take that risk and that chance. Um, then we made
Speaker 1: a commitment to just being open about it in our
Speaker 1: kind of day to day lives with our family, with
Speaker 1: our friends. M just you know, uh, it's akin to
Speaker 1: the process of coming out all over again. And so
Speaker 1: you know that can be a big barrier to I
Speaker 1: think people being on it honest and then living kind
Speaker 1: of unauthentic their authentic selves, authentic relationships with people, and
Speaker 1: it can be really emotionally exhausting. So I think we
Speaker 1: already knew from our own coming out process some just
Speaker 1: being gay like that's we're not I'm too old to
Speaker 1: live like that again, that's not going to happen. So
Speaker 1: this is working for us. That's the stability and security
Speaker 1: that I need. And if someone else likes or it
Speaker 1: doesn't like it, you know, it's like take it or
Speaker 1: leave it. So that has been really helpful where it's
Speaker 1: not like we're navigating all the time. Who knows, who
Speaker 1: doesn't know? How are we gonna do this? How are
Speaker 1: you talking to do that? So you know, most of
Speaker 1: the questions just tend to come from superficial interactions you're
Speaker 1: at on vacation or you're kind of meeting some new people,
Speaker 1: and everyone has some level of curiosity, which I think
Speaker 1: is totally normal for encountering somebody in a unique relationship.
Speaker 1: But for the most part, I'd say that's it doesn't
Speaker 1: usually get too start hireson because our universe of our family,
Speaker 1: our friends, you know, our day to day life here
Speaker 1: in San Diego, people know. So it's not something that
Speaker 1: I'm managing to that, you know, to that emotional level. Yeah, absolutely, now,
Speaker 1: And you said something I really liked where you talked
Speaker 1: about commitment. I think one of the most forgotten things
Speaker 1: in a relationship is commitment, because everybody says, well, the
Speaker 1: most important thing in a relationship hip as communication, And
Speaker 1: of course, yes, of course communication is extremely important relationship.
Speaker 1: But I find that the most important thing in a
Speaker 1: relationship is commitment, committing to your partner. And I love
Speaker 1: that you said that no matter whether you're committing to
Speaker 1: some one other person or two other people, like you're
Speaker 1: creating a relationship, whether you're in a couple of ruffle
Speaker 1: like you guys are in a partnership together. Um, and
Speaker 1: that's pretty cool, that's pretty special. And you guys are
Speaker 1: all parents which is very exciting. You have two kids,
Speaker 1: which is ian what you wrote about in your book.
Speaker 1: So what is it like being three parents together raising
Speaker 1: two kids? You know, people sort of wondered, like, how
Speaker 1: do you do that? And I come back and I
Speaker 1: say like, well, how do you do it with less help?
Speaker 1: That's my big question. People were like, oh, you know,
Speaker 1: there's like immediate jealousy for most of our straight friends
Speaker 1: when they realized we had extra hands on deck during
Speaker 1: like the early baby months, and they're like, oh, I
Speaker 1: can't believe you had two spouses helping you. And I'm like, no, no,
Speaker 1: it gets better because um, the mother of our children
Speaker 1: stayed with us for both of those newborn periods, so
Speaker 1: there's actually four adults pitching in to help with a
Speaker 1: kid and all taking turns overnight. So no one was
Speaker 1: ever really tired at any point, which is totally amazing
Speaker 1: for having two small kids. So it is totally fantastic.
Speaker 1: That is to me like the biggest thing that sort
Speaker 1: of stands out, And some people are like, well, how
Speaker 1: do you manage it with three different voices? We talk
Speaker 1: about stuff, you know, we talked about like, hey, what
Speaker 1: are we going to feed the kids? And allow them.
Speaker 1: Are we going to let them watch television? What are
Speaker 1: our values and how are we going to transmit that?
Speaker 1: How do we handle a temper tantrum? And we just
Speaker 1: have a conversation about it. And like I said, these
Speaker 1: guys teach me amazing stuff every time. So Alan is
Speaker 1: a psychiatrist, he's done training in child development. Like he's
Speaker 1: an authority sort of on the patter, and he gives
Speaker 1: us great ideas for making sure our kids grow up
Speaker 1: like mentally healthy. Um. Jeremy's like a nurturer. That's like
Speaker 1: his job is to take care and raise the animals,
Speaker 1: including primates, and that's what we do at home. You
Speaker 1: raise primates. So I'm like, fill me in. Guys, guys
Speaker 1: are the best of both worlds. That's awesome. So Jeremy
Speaker 1: then question for you then. So needless to say, all
Speaker 1: three of you guys were on the same page about
Speaker 1: kids from the get go. Was there any type of
Speaker 1: like convincing that had to go on? But was there
Speaker 1: any type of like nudging in certain directions from any
Speaker 1: one to any other person? Yeah, I mean I think
Speaker 1: we were, um, we actually were all a little bit
Speaker 1: nudged al and I had um wanted to have kids,
Speaker 1: but you know, it just seemed prohibitably difficult. And then
Speaker 1: we actually had some friends um offer us there leftover embryos,
Speaker 1: and um, so we actually started that and unfortunately those
Speaker 1: didn't take, so then we ended up making our own embryos.
Speaker 1: But um, yeah, I mean definitely it's the same conversations
Speaker 1: that I would imagine everyone has. Um on, you know,
Speaker 1: this is gonna it changes your life obviously, upsets everything
Speaker 1: that was kind of what your day to day was. Um.
Speaker 1: One thing that always kind of flabber gas every gay
Speaker 1: person that I know that has had kids is when
Speaker 1: people say, oh, you know, they're not gonna be good
Speaker 1: pair inson and they can't handle this. But you know,
Speaker 1: every gay person who has children has really had to
Speaker 1: do it with intention. You're not getting accidentally pregnant like
Speaker 1: those kids are you know, the most wanted kids in
Speaker 1: the world. So um yeah, we you know, we we
Speaker 1: all had to talk about it obviously, just like everyone else,
Speaker 1: and Ian probably needed the most kind of gentle gentle nudging.
Speaker 1: But um but we all you know, are very happy
Speaker 1: we did it at this point. Yeah, And I think
Speaker 1: it's probably not dooling different than many relationships where one
Speaker 1: may have a stronger desire than the other partner. And
Speaker 1: I always wanted it to have kids, but I also
Speaker 1: Ian was open to it a little bit more different,
Speaker 1: and I just thought, me, personally, I'm not having kids
Speaker 1: within a different person. And when Jeremy, when Jeremy came
Speaker 1: in the mix, you know, he wanted kids, and it
Speaker 1: just sort of shifted that balance. Um, and I think
Speaker 1: we all thought, oh, I think I will actually like this,
Speaker 1: and we've been surprised. I mean, Ian I loves being
Speaker 1: up here now. And so it is a good example,
Speaker 1: you know, like another relations where someone could be a
Speaker 1: little bit on defense and different. And it happens anyway
Speaker 1: that kids, and it's you know, they end up being
Speaker 1: great parent Oh totally. I hear all the time, like
Speaker 1: my friends say I don't like kids, I don't want
Speaker 1: to be a parent, and then they become a parent
Speaker 1: and they love their children. I mean there's just something
Speaker 1: different obviously, as you guys have experienced between you know,
Speaker 1: playing with your friends kids and you know having kids
Speaker 1: of your own. Obviously, Um, and it's really cool because
Speaker 1: you guys, so I just want to make sure I
Speaker 1: get this right. I'm so sorry, Piper, your firstborn was
Speaker 1: the first child ever to have a Polly family listed
Speaker 1: on a birth certificate UM, which is quite incredible. Yeah,
Speaker 1: as far as we're aware, these things can happen on
Speaker 1: sort of a small court level, So there could possibly
Speaker 1: be people that are just we're just gonna say it's
Speaker 1: the first time position, but fair point. Uh So, I
Speaker 1: guess as as three guys in the throuble, would you,
Speaker 1: I mean, of course you would advocate it, But do
Speaker 1: you think that this is something that will consistently start
Speaker 1: happening further? Do you think more and more people will
Speaker 1: be open to the idea. You know what, maybe there
Speaker 1: isn't just one person out there for me. Maybe there
Speaker 1: are multiple people out there for me, and if we're
Speaker 1: able to communicate enough, we can be in a committed
Speaker 1: relationship together. Yeah. Absolutely, I do. I learned a lot
Speaker 1: about this writing the book, because you know, we just
Speaker 1: wanted to have this relationship and then we wanted to
Speaker 1: have a family. We weren't trying to make a point
Speaker 1: or be famous or anything. When I was writing the book,
Speaker 1: I learned more about this, and UM found a research
Speaker 1: study where they interviewed like younger people and found out
Speaker 1: that more than a fifth of them have been in
Speaker 1: a relationship where there was an agreement and it wouldn't
Speaker 1: be monogamous, so like a consensual nonmonogamy, And and that's
Speaker 1: now when nonmonogamy is kind of frowned on. I think
Speaker 1: when more people are aware that it's an option and
Speaker 1: you can be respectful and honest with each other and
Speaker 1: have some kind of you know, non traditional relationship, more
Speaker 1: people will want that and see that there's benefits to
Speaker 1: them and of partners to have it UM. And there's
Speaker 1: lots of changes that are happening in the world. So
Speaker 1: up and down California and the West Coast, we know
Speaker 1: that lawyers and judges have discussed our case UM at
Speaker 1: like judicial conferences, and so they're all aware of it,
Speaker 1: and it has now served as precedent, so other families
Speaker 1: can sort of seek that, probably on the West Coast
Speaker 1: at least in California. And we know that there's also
Speaker 1: laws that are changing. So Somerville, Massachusetts became a place
Speaker 1: where polyamorous families were respected and have UM legal standing,
Speaker 1: not marriage, but you know, some recognition there, and there's
Speaker 1: movements to pass similar legislation in other cities, including around
Speaker 1: the Bay Area to start. Um, so that's happened. And
Speaker 1: we know that there's a throutle in Canada that also
Speaker 1: got a Polly birth certificate about two years after hours,
Speaker 1: So I do think we're going to see more of
Speaker 1: this in the future. That's great that I love what
Speaker 1: what what Jeremy said too, that you know, there are
Speaker 1: no accidents or surprises. It's a very intentional process, intentional
Speaker 1: decision making. And because of that, the children are going
Speaker 1: to be well taken care of, well like well loved
Speaker 1: more so than you know, you can imagine anywhere else too.
Speaker 1: So I can definitely see it happening more and more.
Speaker 1: And I think like even just the concept of throubles
Speaker 1: we've we've discussed on this podcast a few times are
Speaker 1: starting to kind of become more and more mainstream too,
Speaker 1: So I think it definitely is something that's um gonna
Speaker 1: kind of keep coming around as far as I can tell. Yeah, Ian,
Speaker 1: as you said, you just wanted to be in a
Speaker 1: happy relationship and have kids, have a family, like that's
Speaker 1: what everybody wants. And so thank you so much for
Speaker 1: you guys coming on and talking about your experiences about
Speaker 1: your book that just uh, Ian that you just wrote
Speaker 1: Uh Three Dads and a Baby Adventures in Modern Parenting,
Speaker 1: which is available now on Amazon. Uh it just got released, correct.
Speaker 1: I was released on the ninth of last month, and
Speaker 1: you can get an Amazon, Barnes and Noble or bookstore
Speaker 1: Dot or lots of places. I just want to do
Speaker 1: a brief pitch for this. It's been kind of terrible
Speaker 1: year for everyone. We haven't been able to see people.
Speaker 1: There's been lots of bad news. Everyone's put under a
Speaker 1: lot of stress. It's kind of a funny and hardware
Speaker 1: story at the end, so like enjoy it. I think
Speaker 1: we all need a nice little happy story right now. Right. Um, So,
Speaker 1: once again, Jeremy Ian Allen, thank you so much forgotting
Speaker 1: for you guys, coming on and taking the time. We
Speaker 1: really appreciate it. Thanks guys, thanks for having us. All right,
Speaker 1: welcome back to help I Suck a Dating. That was
Speaker 1: a fantastic interview, very interesting, very interesting stuff. Dean is
Speaker 1: still almost at the airport right now, um, so hopefully
Speaker 1: the pilot will hold the plane for a little bit longer.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's help I Suck a Dating. I'm sure
Speaker 1: he's a big fan and we'll be willing to uh
Speaker 1: stall the plane for our podcast, right, I think. So
Speaker 1: A question for you off topic from I'm sure what
Speaker 1: you're about to get us into. Have you done the
Speaker 1: vaccine yet? No? Not yet. I wanted to U in
Speaker 1: Rhode Island. It's gonna be open to people, I think everybody,
Speaker 1: like starting April sixt or something like that. Have you,
Speaker 1: um no, okay, don't know. I've been trying. We're on
Speaker 1: like all of these waitlists and like you know, if
Speaker 1: a place has extras that they're gonna throw away, then
Speaker 1: they call these people. And we have we know friends
Speaker 1: that have gotten them through that same process. But we
Speaker 1: haven't been called up for the for to be a
Speaker 1: bat yet. But yeah, no, my mom is scheduled to
Speaker 1: get her first dosage tomorrow, which is great. My dad's
Speaker 1: already vaccinated. I want my mom to get vaccinated. Those
Speaker 1: are obviously the two most important, um, just because they're older,
Speaker 1: so and then hopefully I can get you know, Ashley
Speaker 1: is a little wary about taking the vaccine just because
Speaker 1: we're trying, and I think, you know, more studies have
Speaker 1: shown that that it doesn't affect fertility, or it doesn't
Speaker 1: affect a pregnancy at all. So I think she's leaning
Speaker 1: more and more towards taking it, but I'm gonna take it.
Speaker 1: Um nice, Well, we have Ben's h baschetor party in
Speaker 1: a little over a month too, so it'd just be
Speaker 1: nice to, like, you know, be fully vaccinated before we
Speaker 1: go off and do that. I'm definitely trying to get
Speaker 1: fully vaccinated before we go to that. I know, dude,
Speaker 1: if we get COVID in Mexico, we have to quarantine
Speaker 1: in Mexico for two weeks. Yeah, I mean, like, quarantine
Speaker 1: in Mexico for two weeks. Thing doesn't sound that bad
Speaker 1: in my opinion. I just like, you can't leave the room,
Speaker 1: oh right, right, right, it's a little bit different than
Speaker 1: being in Mexico. Yeah, it's not like we're just hanging
Speaker 1: by the pool with COVID. You know. Um, that's a
Speaker 1: good point. All right, Well I did. Uh. So we
Speaker 1: don't have any emails, which is, come on, stuck, army,
Speaker 1: what are we doing here, guys? You gotta send some emails.
Speaker 1: We love emails. It's it's Dean's favorite parts, my favorite
Speaker 1: parte What the email is? I'm gonna be honest, you guys.
Speaker 1: I love Jared Mark East and Becky everyone that works
Speaker 1: on this podcast. The only reason I even bother showing
Speaker 1: up every week is because the emails. And this week,
Speaker 1: I like, I honestly might as well just not even
Speaker 1: showed up. Um, So I would like to keep showing up.
Speaker 1: I would like to still be you know, engaged in
Speaker 1: this podcast because I love the podcast, because I love
Speaker 1: the email. So keep emailing us. Please give some juicy, juicy,
Speaker 1: crazy goss to talk about and discuss. Email us at
Speaker 1: I suck at dating at I heart media dot com.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna I'm gonna plug this probably a few more times.
Speaker 1: I suck at dating at I heart media dot com.
Speaker 1: Email us your dating stories, your questions, your scenarios, whatever
Speaker 1: you want. We want to hear all of it. So
Speaker 1: email us, please, please please. Before I stopped showing up
Speaker 1: for work. Um, so, seeing how we don't have any emails,
Speaker 1: I found a really interesting article on Zena dot com
Speaker 1: because the headline was when at virtual dating with body
Speaker 1: language tips from a former FBI agent. So an FBI
Speaker 1: agent is going to give us tips about how you
Speaker 1: can read your date and these are signs that your
Speaker 1: date likes you. So if you read your date's body language.
Speaker 1: This is a way to decipher whether he or she
Speaker 1: is interested in you. Apparently, someone who is entranced entrance
Speaker 1: by another person will tilt their head toward them. That's
Speaker 1: a way to show someone they like you. So, Dean,
Speaker 1: if I tilt my head forward like this towards the camera,
Speaker 1: apparently I'm really into you. Nice. I mean I I
Speaker 1: have picked up on some of your physical cues before, um,
Speaker 1: you know, kind of about the way that you feel
Speaker 1: towards me. So it's good to get that reaffirmation through
Speaker 1: this expert. Yeah. No, it's good because this is about
Speaker 1: virtual dating, you know, which is like the new norm, bro,
Speaker 1: the new norm. Absolutely, And it's funny because it's pretty
Speaker 1: easy to pick up on social I'm sorry on physical
Speaker 1: cues in person, but you're right, it's way different when
Speaker 1: you're forced to do it over. Yeah, that's good to
Speaker 1: know they're leaning towards you, I know. So Navarro says,
Speaker 1: we only expose our next to people were really comfortable with.
Speaker 1: So apparently someone who is comfortable with you will tilt
Speaker 1: their head towards you. Uh. Some some people may lean
Speaker 1: their whole bodies towards the camera, which means they're really
Speaker 1: into you, they might be like ready for marriage at
Speaker 1: that point. Frequent and lasting smiles also show that your
Speaker 1: date is off to a good start. So if they're smiling, obviously,
Speaker 1: that's that's obvious, right, If they're smiling and laughing, you
Speaker 1: know the date's going well. And and then he goes
Speaker 1: on and says people who are interesting each other are
Speaker 1: more likely to pren p r e n am I
Speaker 1: an idiot? Do I? I don't know what that means.
Speaker 1: I've never heard that word before. Pren mark do you
Speaker 1: know what pren means? You're the most intelligent one? I
Speaker 1: feel like in here, Becky's pretty smart too. I think
Speaker 1: of it as like a like a special grooming thing.
Speaker 1: But it's usually used in like the animal kingdom, Like
Speaker 1: I think of animals preening themselves as a mating ritual.
Speaker 1: What I look up the definition? That's what first came
Speaker 1: to mind. Okay, he he, I should have continued reading.
Speaker 1: By the way, Riley is on this, and Riley is
Speaker 1: very intelligent. Everybody's smarter than Dan and I. That's pretty
Speaker 1: much the point I was making. Anyway, he goes on.
Speaker 1: He says preening behaviors included fixing your appearance, like touching
Speaker 1: your hair and straightening out your clothes. Okay, so if
Speaker 1: your date's a little fidget fixing their hair, you know,
Speaker 1: making sure their share the shirt looks good, that means
Speaker 1: they're into you. That's a great sign. So we're gonna say,
Speaker 1: leaning towards the camera, exposing the neck, laughing and smiling
Speaker 1: and fidgeting, like fixing the hair and making sure they
Speaker 1: look good, fixing the shirt, all good things. Would you agree, Dean,
Speaker 1: I don't want to. I don't want to take anything
Speaker 1: away from this. Uh, this very intelligently written article is
Speaker 1: none of the stuff like obvious, Like I don't think
Speaker 1: anyone really needs to read this stuff to know that
Speaker 1: it's it's like true, you know, like it just sounds
Speaker 1: like such such like a obviously to me. But I agree,
Speaker 1: But you know, sometimes we forget about the obvious. So
Speaker 1: these are all these are signs that I'm about to
Speaker 1: read that your date is not into you. You know,
Speaker 1: they're just not into you. So obviously not all virtual
Speaker 1: meetups end with your date falling madly in love with you.
Speaker 1: So one sign of person is not feeling the love
Speaker 1: is if he or she furrows the Glabella the spot
Speaker 1: between the eyebrows. Okay, so we're like my unit brow lies.
Speaker 1: That would mean like I'm I'm I'm really like going
Speaker 1: for like my my Batman look. You know, you furrow
Speaker 1: the eyebrows they go down. This will happen, especially if
Speaker 1: the other person is saying something that's really dumb or stupid.
Speaker 1: That's not attractive to you, all right, So if somebody
Speaker 1: has that, like everybody knows that look right where like
Speaker 1: the eyebrows go down, it's like the look of shock
Speaker 1: or you're like, what, yeah, Dean's doing it right now.
Speaker 1: So Dean, if you do that on a virtual day,
Speaker 1: it's not gonna work out between you and I. Can
Speaker 1: we just take a step back and think or like
Speaker 1: you started that, we didn't have to worry about this.
Speaker 1: So glad I was actually thinking about that the other day.
Speaker 1: A buddy mine's single, and I'm like, good god, you
Speaker 1: poor thing. Like that just sucks right now. Not only
Speaker 1: can you not meet in person, I mean you can
Speaker 1: meet in person, but you obviously take a little bit
Speaker 1: of a risk if you're both if you're not vaccinated,
Speaker 1: and then now you have to read physical cues over
Speaker 1: a camera. I can't read physical cues. In person, I
Speaker 1: would be the worst data right now, I would be
Speaker 1: the ultimate sucky dater. To make matters worse, I don't
Speaker 1: even like hanging out with my single friends, especially like
Speaker 1: in the in the COVID era, They're like, let's go out,
Speaker 1: let's do stuff, and I'm like, no, no way, Like
Speaker 1: why would I want to go out and do something
Speaker 1: to like risk my health? A and like so you
Speaker 1: can like go meet girls. I don't want to. I
Speaker 1: don't want to be part of that. No, I'm not
Speaker 1: gonna do that with you. So like, in addition to
Speaker 1: how sucky it is to be single, I like, I like,
Speaker 1: I'm I'm not like avoiding my single friends, but I'm
Speaker 1: definitely seeing them a lot less. You know, it's just
Speaker 1: because you're in a relationship. And I don't understand why
Speaker 1: people want to go out to dinner so late. Like
Speaker 1: some of my friends are like, hey, let's grab dinner.
Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, yeah, let's go out because there you know,
Speaker 1: Ashley can call him, it will be a thing. They're like,
Speaker 1: all right, I made a reservation at eight. I'm like,
Speaker 1: a PM, you want to go to dinner a PM?
Speaker 1: I'm can, is there a six thirty opening, like, what
Speaker 1: are we? What are we doing here? Like I plan on.
Speaker 1: I want to be back in my house by nine
Speaker 1: the latest. You know, I gotta get it takes a
Speaker 1: little while. I want to settle down and be under
Speaker 1: the covers by ten thirty. What's your skincare routine? How
Speaker 1: long does it take you at night? Five second? I
Speaker 1: don't have one. Unfortunately, I don't even wash my face
Speaker 1: before I go to bed. Is that bad? You don't
Speaker 1: wash your face before you go to bed at night? Well,
Speaker 1: I washed my face during the day, like time. I
Speaker 1: washed my face every day. I just don't watch it
Speaker 1: before I go to bed. Oh, I have a horrible,
Speaker 1: horrible story that I After I did it, I was like,
Speaker 1: I probably need to share this on help I second dating,
Speaker 1: and it's so bad and so gross, but it's just
Speaker 1: it's part of it happened to me recently, and I
Speaker 1: need to share. It's a part of who you are.
Speaker 1: That's what we're all about here, So we all know.
Speaker 1: My hygiene is a little lack luster. I want to
Speaker 1: say I showered two three times a week tops, three
Speaker 1: times tops two two most three times. So the guy
Speaker 1: who washes his body two or three times a week
Speaker 1: is busting my balls about not washing my face twice
Speaker 1: a day. That was the joke. He didn't pick up
Speaker 1: on it. So that keep that in mind, right, And
Speaker 1: I've kind stop shoving cue tips in my ear because
Speaker 1: I keep seeing all these you know, bad articles come
Speaker 1: out about how it's could be damaging all that kind
Speaker 1: of stuff, and so I'm just like, oh, just like,
Speaker 1: let my u X grow and let me let the
Speaker 1: ear wax b the uax. Dude, if this is a
Speaker 1: story about you pulling out like a lot of ear wax,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna throw up. Well, so flashback actually because this
Speaker 1: is a kind of an important bit as well. When
Speaker 1: I was going to treatment for my hip, I was
Speaker 1: doing a lot of hyper barracks stuff and you're getting
Speaker 1: put into like simulated multiple atmospheres, so like you know,
Speaker 1: your your white blood cell count raises unimportant. They do
Speaker 1: ear exams before every single one of them, um, and
Speaker 1: every single time I talked to a doctor, Hugh goes, yeah,
Speaker 1: you're fine. You got a whole crap ton of ear
Speaker 1: wax in there though, every single time, and a doctor
Speaker 1: looked at my ear aft said anyway, So I took
Speaker 1: a shower, my one, my one weekly shower. I took
Speaker 1: what was this on Tuesday or Wednesday, I want to say,
Speaker 1: And I was like, you know what, I haven't shot
Speaker 1: the cute top of my ear in a while, so
Speaker 1: let's go ahead and see what's in there. So I
Speaker 1: shove it in, start moving around, and all the sudden,
Speaker 1: everything in that ear becomes like way more muted and quiet,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, what, did I just broke my ear drum?
Speaker 1: Something right? Something badges that happened. And then I started
Speaker 1: like digging again, and it gets get more and more.
Speaker 1: And what I was doing was I was shoving ear
Speaker 1: wax into my ear eventually and just clogged the whole
Speaker 1: ear canal. And I was like, oh crap, that sucks.
Speaker 1: Let me see if I can clean out my other
Speaker 1: ear then and I'll just focus on fixing this other year.
Speaker 1: And so I started you my other year, and I
Speaker 1: did the exact same thing. And so I'm sitting there
Speaker 1: and I'm like, I it's like I was like totally
Speaker 1: brown listening to the parents, you know, like it was
Speaker 1: so so, so bad, and so I started freaking out
Speaker 1: and I'm like, Kalin, we need to have like some
Speaker 1: at home remedies to pick this out. So we like
Speaker 1: got warm water, um salt water, put it in the
Speaker 1: ear for like five minutes, started like wiping it out.
Speaker 1: A little bit was coming out, but it didn't fix anything.
Speaker 1: And then this is when it gets grossed. And then
Speaker 1: I was like standing there and I was like, what
Speaker 1: can I do? Like what could I get in my
Speaker 1: ear to get on the other side of this ear
Speaker 1: wax to push it out? And I remembered Dr Chris
Speaker 1: Strandberg Cupcake from your season, who were both good friends
Speaker 1: with Uh, he's my dentist and he, uh last time
Speaker 1: I saw him, gave me a water pick and the
Speaker 1: water pick is phenomenal, a water floster for your teeth.
Speaker 1: I used it every morning and every night before I
Speaker 1: go to bed, and I was like, you know what,
Speaker 1: that might just be the thing that I need. And
Speaker 1: so I set the intensity to like middle intensity on
Speaker 1: the water pick, put the thing in my ear hole
Speaker 1: and I just started like moving it around, and eventually
Speaker 1: the water got behind all of the big wall of
Speaker 1: ear wax that I just kept cramming in there with
Speaker 1: the with the Q tip, and it pushed it all out.
Speaker 1: And I kid you not it was like a thumbnail
Speaker 1: size thing of just big that ball at ear wax,
Speaker 1: and oh my god, it's I could like literally hear colors.
Speaker 1: I was, I became this like super started exactly. And
Speaker 1: then I was like, and I had to do to
Speaker 1: the other ear too, so both ears. I used the
Speaker 1: water pick to excavate. I'm not joking, like, uh, like
Speaker 1: a stack of like five dimes put together, like stack
Speaker 1: on top of each other. That was kind of like
Speaker 1: the density of each ball of ear wax that came
Speaker 1: out of my ear. It was maybe the nastiest thing
Speaker 1: I've ever seen come out of my body. I mean,
Speaker 1: sorry for that whole long explanation story, but I mean
Speaker 1: that's a good I've always wondered what I should do
Speaker 1: besides a cotton swab, because people tell you don't put
Speaker 1: those in your ears. So I'm sure I have a
Speaker 1: build up of ear wax. I just don't know how
Speaker 1: to segue now. I'm not gonna lie. I think we
Speaker 1: should just wrap up the podcast on that. Honestly, the
Speaker 1: rest of this FBI investigation in virtual body language pretty
Speaker 1: you know, straightforward. If your dates looking away frequently or distracted,
Speaker 1: not a good sign. If they're pulling away from the camera.
Speaker 1: Not a good sign. Uh. And then apparently some people
Speaker 1: may also have more tension in their lips and even
Speaker 1: shift their jaw if they're not interested in the other person.
Speaker 1: So that's good to know. There's also red flags to
Speaker 1: look out but look out for. But honestly, I can't
Speaker 1: think of anything besides Dean's ear wax right now, So
Speaker 1: I think it's a pretty good time to wrap up
Speaker 1: this podcast. Uh, do us a favor if anything weird
Speaker 1: like that happens to you between now the next week's episode,
Speaker 1: just take a mental note of it. And I would
Speaker 1: like to hear you know some weird crazy thing that
Speaker 1: might have I mean, I might buy one of those
Speaker 1: what is it a water pick? Water pick? If you
Speaker 1: don't buy every ears, buy for your gums, because that
Speaker 1: thing every night I floss and brush and now I'm
Speaker 1: gonna buy it from my ears water pick and I
Speaker 1: us listening everything when I do all four things every
Speaker 1: morning and every night. I think we should add but
Speaker 1: for the water. The water pick is not invent for
Speaker 1: shooting water into your ears and is not recommended by
Speaker 1: iHeart radio producers of this. It's like it's recommended by me.
Speaker 1: We should put a disclaimer at the beginning of the
Speaker 1: podcast like they do in front of Jackass, where it's
Speaker 1: like these are done by quote unquote professionals. Don't try
Speaker 1: this at home. Yeah, listen, don't try the water pick
Speaker 1: in your ears at home. Okay, just bad news, but Mary,
Speaker 1: because my gums. They pull so much gunk out of
Speaker 1: my teeth every time, even after floss and brushing and
Speaker 1: using mouth wash. They're phenomenal. So get a get a
Speaker 1: water pick. Report back to me. Don't stick in the ear.
Speaker 1: We don't want you to sue us because we told
Speaker 1: just sick water picture unless you get some new wax
Speaker 1: stuck in there. But that's gonna do it. For this
Speaker 1: week's episode, I'm so sorry for my my, my surroundings.
Speaker 1: If you heard any like beeping or revving of the engine,
Speaker 1: that's just Kalin driving like a maniac. So I apologize
Speaker 1: for that. But thank you, guys, Thank you to our guests. Uh, dared,
Speaker 1: do you want to thank them for Yeah? Of course.
Speaker 1: Make sure you pick up their brand new their their
Speaker 1: book Three Dads and a Baby Adventures in Modern Harrington Harrington.
Speaker 1: Good god, what's the matter with me? Our guests Ian
Speaker 1: Allen and Jeremy. They were awesome. Thank you so much
Speaker 1: for coming on, and thank you to everyone who is
Speaker 1: going to email us because, like I said, man emails
Speaker 1: are the only reason I logged in to zoom. Uh.
Speaker 1: They're the only reason I agreed to do this podcast
Speaker 1: every single week, So please give me a reason to
Speaker 1: keep coming to work. I suck at dating at iHeart
Speaker 1: media dot com email us. I suck at dating at
Speaker 1: iHeart media dot com, email US. I suck a dating
Speaker 1: at Iheartdia dot com email us. That wasn't a glitch.
Speaker 1: I had to say it three times because now you're
Speaker 1: not going to forget it. It's I suck at dating
Speaker 1: at I heeart media dot com. And just to be clear,
Speaker 1: discounts is showing up for work. Huh yes, Mark, it does,
Speaker 1: it absolutely does. This is my one, my one weekly obligation. Um. Anyways,
Speaker 1: that's gonna do it for this week's episode. Thank you
Speaker 1: guys so much for listening. Be sure to tune next week,
Speaker 1: where maybe we suck just a little bit less ear
Speaker 1: wax out of every year. Follow help by Suck at
Speaker 1: Dating on I Heart Radio or wherever you listen to
Speaker 1: podcast