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Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Food Stuff. I'm Anny Rees and

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Speaker 1: I'm Lauren boc Obam and oh it's finally here. Yes,

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Speaker 1: our Bourbon episode, long awaited, much anticipated, we hope, no goodness,

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Speaker 1: it has been pretty pretty often requested. Yes, and you

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Speaker 1: and I certainly have built it up just just a

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Speaker 1: little bit. Yeah, we took that whole field trip thing,

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Speaker 1: so now I'm starting to wish we had like really

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Speaker 1: lowered expectation. Oh yeah, No, it's gonna be good, be

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Speaker 1: really good. Well, if we ever figure out time travel,

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Speaker 1: then we'll go back and do that. We're going to

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Speaker 1: start out with a disclaimer. Oh yes, drink responsibly kids. Um. Also,

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Speaker 1: if alcohol is something you struggle with, definitely don't listen

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Speaker 1: to this one. I would say, sure, um, because it's

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Speaker 1: about bourbon and our American whiskey episodes on Irish whiskey

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Speaker 1: and Scott's Whiskey different forthcoming. Oh yeah, us, And there's uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, we do try to be relatively comprehensive here

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Speaker 1: at how stuff work. So well, you know we're still

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Speaker 1: part of that here in Food Stuff. But I'm not

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Speaker 1: going to say that this is the be all end

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Speaker 1: all everything Bourbon. There's a lot of information out there

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Speaker 1: about bourbon. There really is. Did not let us down, Yes,

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Speaker 1: this is some of it, yes, um, and this is

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Speaker 1: part one. This is our traditional food stuff breakdown. But

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Speaker 1: we are going to have interviews because we went on

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Speaker 1: a road trip to see urban country, but in particular

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Speaker 1: because the great folks at Wild Turkey invited us up

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Speaker 1: and we took him up on that off for a board,

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Speaker 1: did we, And so there will be a follow up

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Speaker 1: interview from someone who is worked in this business. I

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Speaker 1: was going to say a lot longer than us, but

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Speaker 1: we haven't worked in it at all at all, So

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Speaker 1: that's so it's not untrue. But yes, mr Mr Eddie Russell,

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Speaker 1: who is the master distiller and Wild Turkey sat down

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Speaker 1: with us and so we've got a whole other episode

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Speaker 1: that's an interview with him. It's pretty okay, just just right,

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Speaker 1: it's it's excellent. Um. So let's start with our our question.

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Speaker 1: We always start with bourbon. What is it? Well, bourbon

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Speaker 1: is a type of whiskey, whiskey being a distilled alcohol

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Speaker 1: made from a mash of grains like wheat, barley, corn,

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Speaker 1: and rye. So what you do you cook your grains

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Speaker 1: with water, you ferment that mash using yeasts, which turns

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Speaker 1: some of the sugars to alcohols too, and that produces

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Speaker 1: a distiller's beer that's about nine alcohol or so, and

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Speaker 1: then you distill that to create something a much stronger.

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Speaker 1: Distillation is basically a process where you heat beer or

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Speaker 1: wine to the point that the alcohol evaporates and can

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Speaker 1: be collected separately from the water or the alcohol and

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Speaker 1: alcohol soluble stuff from the water and water soluble stuff

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Speaker 1: and any solids, any solid, any solid you can imagine, yep.

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Speaker 1: And depending on the types and amounts of grain that

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Speaker 1: you use and the temperatures that you cook them at

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Speaker 1: in order to release their sugars, and the microorganisms that

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Speaker 1: you use to ferment them yeast poop, yeah once again, um,

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Speaker 1: and the exact process that you use to distill them,

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Speaker 1: and whether and how you age them. Whiskeys can taste

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Speaker 1: super different. They really can. Just kind of a lovely

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Speaker 1: thing about them. It absolutely is versatile. But Bourbon more specifically, yes,

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Speaker 1: Bourbon is sometimes known by its congress Official designation of

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Speaker 1: America's Native spirit. Well, Bourbon is a lot of things.

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Speaker 1: Here are the legal requirements you have to meet to

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Speaker 1: call your product burt. The fermentation grain a k A

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Speaker 1: mash and bourbon must be at least fifty corn fifty

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Speaker 1: one to seventy nine percent corn. I think anything more

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Speaker 1: than that, and it's a corn whiskey. Ah. Yes. Um.

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Speaker 1: A mix of wheat, barley or rye usually makes up

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Speaker 1: the rest um. That mix is called the mash bill

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Speaker 1: mm hmm. It has to be aged and new charred

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Speaker 1: oak barrels. I love that. Then it's new charred barrels.

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Speaker 1: We'll be talking more about that in a little bit.

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Speaker 1: Oh my goodness. Yes. When it enters those barrels, it

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Speaker 1: needs to be proof are lower and it leaves the barrels.

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Speaker 1: For bottles, it must be at least a D proof.

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Speaker 1: The only edition that can be made on the distilling

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Speaker 1: end is water to achieve the proof you're looking for.

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Speaker 1: No artificial colors are flavorings. On the consumer end, you

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Speaker 1: can add all kinds of things. To be called straight bourbon.

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Speaker 1: You have to age the bourbon at least two years.

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Speaker 1: If the aging process is less than four years, you

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Speaker 1: have to say that on the bottle. If a bottle

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Speaker 1: doesn't have the age on it, it's at least four

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Speaker 1: years old and probably for your lower the middle of

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Speaker 1: the road price point bottles right around four years. Some

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Speaker 1: folks argue that a true bourbon has to come from Kentucky,

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Speaker 1: and the world's bourbon does come from Kentucky. Others say

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Speaker 1: it just needs to be American made, which is the

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Speaker 1: tech nical definition. But yes, some people will indeed argue

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Speaker 1: with you. People love to argue about things like that.

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Speaker 1: This is just something people disagree about. No real law

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Speaker 1: saying it has to be from Kentucky. It could even

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Speaker 1: be made from outside of the US. I just clutched

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Speaker 1: my imaginary pearls. Did We both kind of sat back

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Speaker 1: in her seats. Um I did read this somewhat obvious

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Speaker 1: clarification though. If it says Kentucky straight Bourbon on the label,

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Speaker 1: it has to be from Kentucky. It's a good good

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Speaker 1: rule with them there. Yeah, the barrels that bourbon has

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Speaker 1: aged in do not actually have to be made from

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Speaker 1: American oak, which is kind of a thing that gets

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Speaker 1: floated around a lot um. Any old chart oak will do,

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Speaker 1: although American white oak is by far the most used

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Speaker 1: because it grows here, makes sense pretty pretty plentifully. Bourbon

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Speaker 1: can have lots of flavor notes but essentially it's sweet

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Speaker 1: and sort of spicy, with notes of like vanilla and

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Speaker 1: caramel and maybe baking spices with some savory undertones that

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Speaker 1: are in the yeasty to bready sort of range. And

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Speaker 1: you may have seen labels like high rye bourbon or

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Speaker 1: less commonly prominent these days high wheat or weeded bourbon,

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Speaker 1: and those labels aren't regulated down to like a particular

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Speaker 1: percentage of rye or wheat in the mash bill, but

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Speaker 1: they do indicate a higher than usual proportion of rye

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Speaker 1: or wheat has gone into that bourbon. High rise tend

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Speaker 1: to be a little bit spicier on the palette, think

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Speaker 1: like like bullet or basil hayden um. High wheats are

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Speaker 1: softer and more baked goods. They think like maker's mark.

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Speaker 1: Uh huh um. There's also high corn bourbons, which are

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Speaker 1: a little bit harder to come by and a little

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Speaker 1: bit sweeter. Uh. Side note, American rye whiskey is not bourbon,

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Speaker 1: but it is made in a similar way, just with

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Speaker 1: instead of corn. It has to be rye in the

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Speaker 1: mash bill. Canadian ride does not have a percentage requirement. Yeah, separate,

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Speaker 1: separate issue. So many issues around those side eyes side

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Speaker 1: eye to Canada, Sorry Canada, Canada. Um sour mash bourbon

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Speaker 1: another label you may have seen is a type of

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Speaker 1: bourbon whiskey that uses some fermented mash from a previous

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Speaker 1: batch in creating each new batch, sort of like a

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Speaker 1: like a sour dough starter, and sour mashes tend to

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Speaker 1: be a little bit sweeter and maybe more complex or

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Speaker 1: sort of funky. For that reason, I think I've been

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Speaker 1: described that way, complex and funky. I found a sticker

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Speaker 1: that said that on my jacket once. I'm not lying.

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Speaker 1: I believe you entirely. I don't know where it came from.

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Speaker 1: Promise I didn't put it there. I appreciated it. I

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Speaker 1: don't know how long it was there, but it's a

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Speaker 1: badge of pride, so I'll take it. Tennessee whiskey UM

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Speaker 1: is also not bourbon, but it's whiskey that's made in

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Speaker 1: Tennessee in the style of bourbon, except for the addition

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Speaker 1: of one extra step. Before aging, it's filtered through charcoal

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Speaker 1: and what's called the Lincoln County process. That charcoal is

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Speaker 1: made from the wood of sugar maples. See our Maple

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Speaker 1: Syrup episode for lots more about those but anyway, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the charcoal filters out some of the stuff and alcohol

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Speaker 1: that you might not want it there, some some of

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Speaker 1: the maybe harsher or spicier notes. Charcoal is especially good

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Speaker 1: at removing sulfuric compounds and so this creates a smoother,

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Speaker 1: perhaps mellower product. And yeah, that's why Jack Daniels is

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Speaker 1: called a Tennessee whiskey, not a bourbon. It's filtered through

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Speaker 1: those charcoal maple chips. We did try to stop by

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Speaker 1: there on our road trip up to Bourbon Country, but

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Speaker 1: it was a little like just out of the way enough, yeah,

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Speaker 1: that we didn't go. But Jack Daniels, if you're listening,

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Speaker 1: we've proven we'll make the trip if the invite is extended.

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Speaker 1: In this Yes, get in touch food stuff at how

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Speaker 1: stuff works dot com. That trap us and no, yes please,

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Speaker 1: I just wanted to clarify all all of that stuff.

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Speaker 1: But back to bourbon. Yes, um, typically the darker the color,

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Speaker 1: the higher the alcohol content. And of the three point

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Speaker 1: seven billion sales done annually, two point seven billion of

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Speaker 1: that is domestic. It is the most exported American spirit.

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Speaker 1: In Americans consumed twenty four million cases of US produced whiskey,

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Speaker 1: which is at increase from a decade earlier. Thirty seven

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Speaker 1: percent of these consumers were women, which I just like

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Speaker 1: to point out because it has been kind of a

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Speaker 1: stereotype that women don't drink whiskey. Whiskey is a mudden's drink. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: says we'll. Lauren and I both of are whiskey. We do, indeed,

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Speaker 1: we do, indeed, But it's growing in popularity and especially

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Speaker 1: I don't want to say especially reverseuse, but like over

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Speaker 1: overseas as well, which is kind of a new market

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Speaker 1: big deal. Oh, certainly, it's becoming increasingly a very big deal.

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Speaker 1: And we're going to get into some of the history

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Speaker 1: of why and how that is happening. But first we're

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Speaker 1: going to get into a quick break for a word

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Speaker 1: from our sponsor, and we're back. Thank you, sponsor. And

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Speaker 1: this brings us to our particularly murky history of it.

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Speaker 1: I feel like they say that all the time, but

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Speaker 1: this time, this time she means it. Yeah. It's fun though,

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Speaker 1: it is. It is. It's a lot of a lot

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Speaker 1: of the history of whiskey is kind of the stuff

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Speaker 1: of legend, and it's the type of product that people

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Speaker 1: like sort of pontificating about I think so yes, Um,

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Speaker 1: lots of people want to take credit for for this one.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, for sure. Now, American whiskey obviously descended from

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Speaker 1: Irish and Scottish whiskey, which both have a long history,

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Speaker 1: is going back to European monks in medieval times. But

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Speaker 1: American whiskey bourbon is its own, obviously younger thing, and

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Speaker 1: that's what we're focusing on today. Friendly history disclaimer of

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Speaker 1: the podcast. Before American whiskey became what we know it

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Speaker 1: as today, it was unaged and I imagine quite strong.

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Speaker 1: Written records indicate that the first grain distillery in America

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Speaker 1: occurred in seventeen thirteen. The colonists used whiskey as liquid

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Speaker 1: courage during the Revolutionary War, and um, when benuring West

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Speaker 1: and not kidding about that liquid courage, saying George Washington

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Speaker 1: proposed that public distilleries be constructed in States colonies at

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Speaker 1: the time where Revolutionary War battles were going down and said, quote,

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Speaker 1: the benefits arising from the moderate use of strong liquor

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Speaker 1: have been experienced in all armies and are not to

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Speaker 1: be disputed. He he was a distiller himself, so I

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Speaker 1: feel like he had a little bit of a personal

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Speaker 1: stake in the matter. Could be could be speaking of

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Speaker 1: moving west to persuade people to settle in the land

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Speaker 1: that would become Kentucky. Settlers who built cabins and planted

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Speaker 1: corn in that area were offered four acres to do

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Speaker 1: so as part of the seventeen seventy six Virginia Corn

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Speaker 1: Patch and Cabin Rights Act. That's a fun fun act. Name.

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Speaker 1: Kentucky was a part of Virginia at the time. UM

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Speaker 1: and this offer attracted a lot of immigrants from Scotland

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Speaker 1: and Ireland, and these immigrants were looking to distill some whiskey,

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Speaker 1: and lucky for those want to be distillers, Kentucky happens

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Speaker 1: to be over blue limestone. As we mentioned in our

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Speaker 1: Derby episode Yes Thank You, Um, blue limestone is a

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Speaker 1: great thing for filtering out iron and replacing it with calcium,

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Speaker 1: which imparts its grains and eventually whiskey with a sweeter,

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Speaker 1: less harsh flavor. Another thing that would end up coming

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Speaker 1: in handy when it comes to bourbon making in Kentucky

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Speaker 1: is the dramatic shifts in temperature. This is conducive for

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Speaker 1: the whiskey to move in and out of barrels, which

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Speaker 1: a large part of the flavor and the color. Um.

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Speaker 1: As you might surmise, Kentucky soil is great for growing corn,

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Speaker 1: and since it was the predominant grain in the area,

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Speaker 1: distillers decided to use that instead of rye. The Samuels,

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Speaker 1: the family behind Maker's Mark, claim that they got started

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Speaker 1: making bourbon in seventeen eighty three. However, they didn't start

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Speaker 1: selling it until eighteen forty. Still possible. Well, the man

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Speaker 1: behind the secret family recipe t W Samuel's set up

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Speaker 1: a distillery and the family bourbon got its start in ninete.

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Speaker 1: The family recipe was burned by someone in the family

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Speaker 1: injury I know, then retooled to be less bitter, resulting

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Speaker 1: in the Maker's Mark. We know today all his will

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Speaker 1: question mark. I think they're doing okay for themselves, so

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Speaker 1: I would agree. I would agree with that statement. Um.

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Speaker 1: Whether or not the Samuel's family story truly got its

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Speaker 1: start in the first commercial distillery opened in Louisville, Kentucky.

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Speaker 1: You might recognize the name because it's still Grace's Um

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Speaker 1: A lot of whiskey bottles Evan Williams. So, speaking of names, Yes, Annie,

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Speaker 1: how did bourbon get its name, well, let me tell you, Lauren,

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Speaker 1: if I can, if I may, in Bourbon County, Kentucky

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Speaker 1: was established. This area encompassed fourteen modern counties, not the

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Speaker 1: same today. The county was named after a French royal

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Speaker 1: family that we've mentioned before, the House of bourbon Um,

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Speaker 1: in honor of Frances, helped during the Revolutionary War or A. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's one theory. It wouldn't be where did the name

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Speaker 1: come from if there wasn't multiple series. Another theory is

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Speaker 1: um that has to do with two brothers from France

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Speaker 1: that settled in Louisville, Kentucky. According to this theory, it

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Speaker 1: was then that got the idea to send whiskey and

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Speaker 1: charred bells down to down the river to Louisiana. And

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Speaker 1: it's because they knew the French population there would enjoy

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Speaker 1: its similarity to Cognac a k French brandy Um. By

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Speaker 1: that time, Bourbon Street already had established itself as the

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Speaker 1: place to be in New Orleans, so people started looking

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Speaker 1: for the quote whiskey they sell on Bourbon Street. To

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Speaker 1: two theories to prevailing theories. You decide, we're gonna let

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Speaker 1: you make up your own mind. Listeners, absolutely Another um

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Speaker 1: story about who maybe maybe invented bourbon that we ran

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Speaker 1: into a lot was the one of Elijah Craig. Craig

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Speaker 1: was a Baptist minister who came up with aging corn,

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Speaker 1: whiskey and child barrels in nine, which was the same

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Speaker 1: year he opened a distillery. However, supporting evidence for this

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Speaker 1: tale is hard to come by, and there were corn

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Speaker 1: whisky distilleries in the area before se nine, so more

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Speaker 1: than one distiller may have come up with this idea,

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Speaker 1: but he does often get the credit. The story goes

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Speaker 1: that after experimentation, Craig decided the quickest way to clean

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Speaker 1: out a fish barrel before putting bourbon in it was

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Speaker 1: to burn and shar the inside. You know he's being

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Speaker 1: h thrifty. Um. He stamped the barrel with county of

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Speaker 1: origin bourbon and sent it down the river to Louisiana.

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Speaker 1: When it arrived ninety days later, the flavor had evolved

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Speaker 1: to become much smoother. People in New Orleans who sampled

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Speaker 1: it often asked for more whiskey from Bourbon, and one

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Speaker 1: of the reasons Elijah Craig's story as the inventor of

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Speaker 1: bourbon may have proliferated is due to the fact that

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Speaker 1: he was a Baptist preacher and his name was used

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Speaker 1: to combat all the pro prohibition folks. Yeah, although he

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Speaker 1: had been found guilty of producing whiskey without a license,

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Speaker 1: I think some other people say he maybe he didn't

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Speaker 1: invent barbon, but he invented charring of the barrel, and

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Speaker 1: that is part of what we define as bourbon. Nabsolutely,

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Speaker 1: so maybe that's another reason that he's often pointed to

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Speaker 1: as the inventor. But now let's talk about the whiskey rebellion. Oh,

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Speaker 1: this is a good one. Yeah, it's a it's an

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Speaker 1: intense one, it really is. Okay, So here's what went down.

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Speaker 1: The year was the president one George Washington, and order

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Speaker 1: to help pay down the federal deficit, and excise tax

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Speaker 1: was levied on whiskey and other distilled spirits. Whiskey in

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Speaker 1: particular had surpassed rum as the US's most popular liquor

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Speaker 1: after the Revolutionary War, and the triangle trade with Britain

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Speaker 1: decreased rum imports. As you're probably aware, Americans don't like

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Speaker 1: taxes to begin with, and particularly not on their whiskey.

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Speaker 1: You may know that from a little musical called Hamilton's

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Speaker 1: never heard of it. You should really check it out

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Speaker 1: playing at the fox right now. And this tax was

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Speaker 1: particularly disliked among distillers in Maryland and Pennsylvania. They grew

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Speaker 1: out of rye and made ride based whiskey for the exports.

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Speaker 1: People refused to pay the tax, and an excise officer

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Speaker 1: in Pennsylvania was tarred and feathered. Uh and a crowd

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Speaker 1: of six thousand gathered to protest. Allegedly UM one run

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Speaker 1: processor was loudly calling for the guillotine. How were the

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Speaker 1: excise tax collector? Yeah? Yeah, And one thing to note here,

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Speaker 1: A lot trade was done by barter at the time,

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Speaker 1: so a lot of folks didn't have cash. Wealthy Pennsylvania

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Speaker 1: landowner John Neville agreed to collect the Texas and western Pennsylvania. Silly,

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Speaker 1: silly John Neville. When angry mob gathered outside his house

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Speaker 1: one night, he shot into the crowd, killing a man,

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Speaker 1: and things escalated from there. The mob started shooting at Neville.

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Speaker 1: Neville sounded his early version of a home alarm, and

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Speaker 1: his slaves started shooting at the mob, forcing them all

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Speaker 1: to eventually flee. It wasn't over, however. The very next evening,

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Speaker 1: seven men converged on Nevill's home, only to find he

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Speaker 1: had wisely fled, leaving behind ten soldiers to defend it.

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Speaker 1: The mobs set the barn and slave dwellings on fire

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Speaker 1: and began shooting at the soldiers. An hour of gun

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Speaker 1: fighting ensued, leading to the death of the mob's leader. Furious,

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Speaker 1: the mob set fired to the main house and the

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Speaker 1: soldiers surrendered. The mob's new leader discovered that Pittsburgh was

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Speaker 1: going to distance itself from the attack on Neville's home,

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Speaker 1: and he used this info to convince his followers, seven

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Speaker 1: thousand of them, that they needed to attack Pittsburgh. A

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Speaker 1: Pittsburgh delegation responded with a peace officer of a peace

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Speaker 1: offering of whiskey, which the mob enjoyed and then was

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Speaker 1: too junk to follow through on their plan of attack.

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Speaker 1: Well played, Pittsburgh, I mean yeah. At first, Washington tried

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Speaker 1: to find a peaceful resolution, but when that didn't work,

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Speaker 1: he put on his general's uniform, labeled their actions as

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Speaker 1: treasonable opposition, and showed up in Pennsylvania with twelve thousand troops. Thus,

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Speaker 1: in seventeen o four, the Whiskey Rebellion came to an end.

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Speaker 1: This was one of America's first test of the federal government.

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Speaker 1: All about whiskey and taxes actually makes perfect sense to me,

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Speaker 1: it really does. The taxes repealed when Thomas Jefferson was

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Speaker 1: in office in eighteen o two. Thanks to this whole affair,

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Speaker 1: the US government was hesitant to tack whiskey, doing so

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Speaker 1: briefly to cover the cost of the World of eighteen

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Speaker 1: twelve and eventually the Civil War, choosing instead to tax rum.

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Speaker 1: They've renegged on that since then, Oh, absolutely they have.

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Speaker 1: There's a popular myth that the whiskey tax and rebellion

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Speaker 1: led to a lot of tax dodging distillers to make

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Speaker 1: the move to Kentucky. But this probably isn't true. Fun

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Speaker 1: but not true. I would guess at the time of

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Speaker 1: the rebellion there were already five hundred distilleries operating in

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Speaker 1: the state. George Washington didn't seem too bitter about the

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00:20:29,160 --> 00:20:31,399
Speaker 1: whole thing, though. Looking to make some cash after his

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00:20:31,400 --> 00:20:34,680
Speaker 1: presidency was over, he heated the advice of his Scottish

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Speaker 1: plantation manager and financed a distillery. By the end of

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Speaker 1: seventeen ninety seven, he had five copper stills. He was

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Speaker 1: making rye whiskey which he offered for fifty cents on

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Speaker 1: the gallon. His distillery was producing eleven thousand gallons a

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Speaker 1: year by Yeah, I wonder if he used it to

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Speaker 1: make his signature eggnog. I hope so I do too.

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Speaker 1: We have a someone in our office who makes George

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Speaker 1: Washington's recipe of signature eggnog every year. Yeah, producer Alex right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: producer Alex. It's delightful, and it's delightful, very boy, it's

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Speaker 1: not not boozy. Yes, um, we can only hope histories

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Speaker 1: of history, um any who. That distilly burned down in

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Speaker 1: eighteen fourteen, but was restored and turned into a distillery

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Speaker 1: museum in two thousand and seven. I would love to

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Speaker 1: see pictures if any listeners have been. Yeah. In Jacob

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Speaker 1: Beam sold his first barrel of whiskey. That Beam, Yes,

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Speaker 1: that Beam, Old Jacob Bean sour. I keep saying Bean,

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Speaker 1: It's beau. Since then, it's been passed down in the family,

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Speaker 1: including Jim Bean. That's where the name comes from. Also,

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Speaker 1: when I really wanted to go to and again, it

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Speaker 1: was a little kind of a little too far out

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Speaker 1: of the way. Yeah, we were on a tight schedule,

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Speaker 1: we were, but we hope to return one day. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we have our eyes set. We have more donuts to try,

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Speaker 1: free t shirts to earn. Yes. As rem grew more expensive,

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Speaker 1: whiskey grew more popular. Since Kentucky was located near several

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Speaker 1: rivers and slavery was legal in the state, the state's

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00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:15,680
Speaker 1: bourbon industry grew to able to move their bourbon easily

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Speaker 1: and produce it relatively cheaply. By the twenties, the word

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Speaker 1: bourbon in terms of American whiskey first started appearing in ads.

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Speaker 1: The Pepper Distillery developed the sour Mash in eighty three.

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Speaker 1: The Pepper Distillery would later become the Woodford Reserve. The

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Speaker 1: man behind this development was a Scottish doctor named James Crow.

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Speaker 1: The whiskeys he produced were really popular during the Civil War,

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Speaker 1: and he's sometimes credited with inventing bourbon because he knew

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Speaker 1: what methods to use to produce consistently good bourbon and

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00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:48,639
Speaker 1: he knew why it worked. On top of that, he

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Speaker 1: used charred cask, and he used corn, he aged it

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Speaker 1: and sour mash things. So he was certainly closing in

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Speaker 1: on what what we consider bourbon to be today. Yes, yeah, absolutely,

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Speaker 1: Bourbon officially becomes bourbon. In eighteen forty, yeah, I've been

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00:23:04,520 --> 00:23:07,480
Speaker 1: around this time. A process known as rectifying whiskey was

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Speaker 1: fairly common. That's where wholesalers would mix whiskeys from a

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00:23:11,320 --> 00:23:14,399
Speaker 1: handful of distilleries to arrive at a new, consistent product

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00:23:14,440 --> 00:23:16,920
Speaker 1: they would call their own. Most of them were on

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00:23:17,080 --> 00:23:18,639
Speaker 1: up and up, but a few would mix a tiny

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Speaker 1: bit of bourbon or whiskey with large amounts of neutral

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00:23:21,560 --> 00:23:25,199
Speaker 1: grain spirits and add in some flavorings ooh um. But

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Speaker 1: they would still call it straight whiskey. A recipe for

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00:23:28,440 --> 00:23:30,400
Speaker 1: it was even published in eighteen sixty, and that same

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00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:33,840
Speaker 1: year Americans were drinking more liquor than they had been

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Speaker 1: ten years earlier. At the same time, temperance movements were

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00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:39,639
Speaker 1: popping up in both Europe and the US. Some states

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00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:44,560
Speaker 1: banned alcohol long before prohibition. One organization promoting Moderation and

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00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:47,960
Speaker 1: Alcohol Consumption in New York had two sorts of membership levels.

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Speaker 1: Either you could swear off the liquor but enjoy as

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Speaker 1: much beer and wine as you'd like, or you could

397
00:23:52,800 --> 00:23:56,560
Speaker 1: swear off everything in what was called total abstinence. Members

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00:23:56,600 --> 00:23:58,840
Speaker 1: that shows from that got a tea next to their name,

399
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Speaker 1: and that's our two toe where it comes from. Maybe probably, probably,

400
00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:07,240
Speaker 1: I would say, but you know, the outbreak of the

401
00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:11,480
Speaker 1: Civil War also in eighteen sixty led to a whiskey shortage.

402
00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:14,840
Speaker 1: It was used to medicinally poured over wounds and um

403
00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:17,560
Speaker 1: as a painkiller, and also soldiers just drink it to

404
00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:20,240
Speaker 1: forget for a bit. All the destruction violence are for

405
00:24:20,359 --> 00:24:24,440
Speaker 1: let liquid courage that Washington deshrived. One account I read

406
00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:26,600
Speaker 1: claim to that a regiment of Union soldiers made a

407
00:24:26,640 --> 00:24:29,639
Speaker 1: batch up their own whiskey for Christmas eighteen sixty four.

408
00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:32,720
Speaker 1: The Sons of Temperance blamed some of the Union's losses

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00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:37,600
Speaker 1: on drinking probably whiskey, to which President Lincoln's secretary John

410
00:24:37,680 --> 00:24:41,240
Speaker 1: Hay responded, quote, the rebels drink more and worse whiskey

411
00:24:41,320 --> 00:24:45,920
Speaker 1: than me too. The Confederacy, which was lacking in food,

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00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:48,919
Speaker 1: declared prohibition on a state by state basis, buying as

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00:24:49,000 --> 00:24:51,919
Speaker 1: much whiskey as they could find for medicinal purposes. This

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00:24:52,040 --> 00:24:56,800
Speaker 1: was rather loosely obeyed. Some whiskey loving colonels just made

415
00:24:56,800 --> 00:24:59,679
Speaker 1: it themselves. A black market for whiskey. Rows and whiskey

416
00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:03,320
Speaker 1: went from about five cents to thirty five dollars a gallon.

417
00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:07,960
Speaker 1: Oh wow. Yeah. Once the war ended, a handful more

418
00:25:08,280 --> 00:25:12,040
Speaker 1: distilleries opened in Kentucky that you may recognize, the Stag

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00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:16,960
Speaker 1: Distillery in eighteen sixty six, ish, the Rippy Family Distillery

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00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:20,400
Speaker 1: that would become Wild Turkey in eighteen sixty nine, and

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00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:24,479
Speaker 1: Stitzel Distillery Stitzel Weller Distillery, home of Old Rip van

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00:25:24,560 --> 00:25:28,480
Speaker 1: Winkle Bourbon in eighteen seventy two. Old Rip van Winkle

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00:25:28,520 --> 00:25:30,920
Speaker 1: Bourbon would be resurrected and you can buy it if

424
00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:35,200
Speaker 1: you've got the money. To this day, it's it's really expensive,

425
00:25:35,800 --> 00:25:40,000
Speaker 1: like thousands of dollars expensive. Yes, I think we took

426
00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:44,359
Speaker 1: some pictures of some that we saw, just just a picture. Yeah.

427
00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:46,440
Speaker 1: Possibly the bottles, like there were a couple of bottles

428
00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:48,840
Speaker 1: of it, are empty bottles of it rather in the

429
00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:52,520
Speaker 1: Airbnb that we were staying in its decoration. Yes, Um

430
00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:57,600
Speaker 1: and producer Ramsey kept jokingly um texting us while he

431
00:25:57,640 --> 00:26:00,280
Speaker 1: knew we were in Kentucky asking him to bring back,

432
00:26:00,359 --> 00:26:03,720
Speaker 1: asking us to bring him back a bottle of this.

433
00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:06,480
Speaker 1: The only thing I want is just a bottle of pappies.

434
00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:09,760
Speaker 1: It was around this time, post Civil War and in

435
00:26:09,800 --> 00:26:13,480
Speaker 1: the midst of the Industrial Revolution that distilling started becoming

436
00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:18,440
Speaker 1: a large scale operation. Smaller numbers of larger producers were

437
00:26:18,520 --> 00:26:21,000
Speaker 1: working in the field, saving on costs with all of

438
00:26:21,040 --> 00:26:25,920
Speaker 1: this newfangled machinery and and also very newfangled production concepts,

439
00:26:26,320 --> 00:26:29,439
Speaker 1: assembly line kind of stuff, and those names that we

440
00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:32,600
Speaker 1: still know today were innovators in that sector for sure,

441
00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:37,240
Speaker 1: and something I found, uh, kind of cool, kind of weird.

442
00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:41,080
Speaker 1: Throughout Bourbon's history there was this interesting connection with prostitution.

443
00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:44,159
Speaker 1: One of the reasons behind this connection is police didn't

444
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:47,880
Speaker 1: search cars if a woman was present, that would be rude.

445
00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:51,560
Speaker 1: So even if they themselves weren't doing the bootlegging, bootleggers

446
00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:56,479
Speaker 1: wanted women around, and prostitutes could legally sell alcohol and weat.

447
00:26:57,400 --> 00:26:59,960
Speaker 1: In eighteen fifties, New York City women made two million

448
00:27:00,040 --> 00:27:03,200
Speaker 1: in dollars selling whiskey and three million and sex work.

449
00:27:03,840 --> 00:27:09,960
Speaker 1: So it's pretty even. Yeah, that's pretty impressive. In eighteen

450
00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:14,560
Speaker 1: seventy there was a whiskey scheme, a spirited plot, spirited

451
00:27:15,560 --> 00:27:21,480
Speaker 1: thank you. An investigation conducted in eighteen seventy four revealed

452
00:27:21,520 --> 00:27:23,959
Speaker 1: that the government agents task with keeping check of how

453
00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:26,720
Speaker 1: much whiskey was being made in the US had been

454
00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:29,800
Speaker 1: accepting the cash equivalent to about half of what a

455
00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:33,359
Speaker 1: distillery would pay in taxes in exchange for looking the

456
00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:37,880
Speaker 1: other way on a certain percentage of the distillery. Yeah,

457
00:27:38,280 --> 00:27:40,520
Speaker 1: this group of agents were a part of something called

458
00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:45,639
Speaker 1: the Whiskey Ring. Who um. When tax collectors not in

459
00:27:45,680 --> 00:27:48,000
Speaker 1: the rings showed up, distillery owners were told to fork

460
00:27:48,080 --> 00:27:51,840
Speaker 1: over the cash and quote play safe. The distillers were

461
00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:54,080
Speaker 1: told the money that they were paying the agents was

462
00:27:54,119 --> 00:27:56,920
Speaker 1: going into a fund to reelect the president at the time,

463
00:27:57,200 --> 00:28:02,280
Speaker 1: President Grant. The scheme whiskey gates, if you will, amounted

464
00:28:02,320 --> 00:28:05,520
Speaker 1: to an annual fifteen million gallons of whiskey, which would

465
00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:09,000
Speaker 1: have netted about seven point five million in taxes during

466
00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:12,680
Speaker 1: the four years before the Whiskey Ring was uncovered. Yeah,

467
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:15,520
Speaker 1: over three people were arrested and it turned into a

468
00:28:15,640 --> 00:28:20,040
Speaker 1: whole fiasco for Grant, who had friends implicated and therefore

469
00:28:20,520 --> 00:28:25,040
Speaker 1: kind of guilty by association. Um. The investigation also revealed

470
00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:30,080
Speaker 1: that Grant was probably having an extramarital affair. Bad day

471
00:28:30,119 --> 00:28:32,280
Speaker 1: for him. Then one of his friends that have been

472
00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:35,639
Speaker 1: arrested claimed Grant was involved in the whole thing. He

473
00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:41,320
Speaker 1: was not re elected a different times. I almost didn't

474
00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:45,160
Speaker 1: include this because it was complicated tax stuff, but it

475
00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:47,240
Speaker 1: was too good to leave out. Yeah, well, I think

476
00:28:47,240 --> 00:28:49,720
Speaker 1: that also there's there's enough complicated tax stuff involved in

477
00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:52,680
Speaker 1: whiskey that it's just it's part and parcel really is.

478
00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:56,760
Speaker 1: And throw back to our catchup episode, remember Dr Wiley

479
00:28:56,800 --> 00:28:59,600
Speaker 1: and all that concern about preservedves and dies and the

480
00:28:59,640 --> 00:29:02,840
Speaker 1: push for food standards. Um. We briefly mentioned it in

481
00:29:02,840 --> 00:29:05,000
Speaker 1: that episode, but one of the ways Dr Wiley convinced

482
00:29:05,040 --> 00:29:08,280
Speaker 1: President Roosevelt to go along with increased food safety regulation

483
00:29:08,600 --> 00:29:11,720
Speaker 1: was by presenting him with a bottle of bad whiskey.

484
00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:16,080
Speaker 1: Roosevelt was like, my God, not the whiskey. We must

485
00:29:16,160 --> 00:29:22,080
Speaker 1: because this and now I hope that's what he sounded like. Um.

486
00:29:22,160 --> 00:29:26,920
Speaker 1: And this brings us to prohibition yeah. Um. It was

487
00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:30,880
Speaker 1: an amendment to the US Constitution, one to be exact,

488
00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:33,920
Speaker 1: basically prohibiting alcohol in the US that went to effect

489
00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:37,960
Speaker 1: in ninety It was very not good for the bourbon industry.

490
00:29:38,400 --> 00:29:42,040
Speaker 1: It almost went completely under. A lot of distilleries never

491
00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:45,520
Speaker 1: reopened after this. Um. Ten distillers were given permission by

492
00:29:45,560 --> 00:29:49,520
Speaker 1: the US government to manufacture medicinal whiskey, including wood for

493
00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:53,920
Speaker 1: Reserve and Stitzel Weller distillery, and women played an instrumental

494
00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:57,520
Speaker 1: role keeping bourbon in American whiskey alive during prohibition. Like

495
00:29:57,560 --> 00:30:00,320
Speaker 1: we said, police went't search cars if women were in them.

496
00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:02,640
Speaker 1: Seems like a pretty big flaw in the whole system,

497
00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:06,720
Speaker 1: but in this case it helped them smuggle whole cases

498
00:30:06,760 --> 00:30:10,280
Speaker 1: of liquor. Some of these women made millions of dollars.

499
00:30:10,800 --> 00:30:13,480
Speaker 1: At the height of bootlegging, women had men beat five

500
00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:17,200
Speaker 1: to one when it came to sales. One famous example

501
00:30:17,280 --> 00:30:20,920
Speaker 1: is that of Gertrude to Lithgow, whose nicknames include included

502
00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:27,760
Speaker 1: Grace and Cleo Cleopatra Queen of bootlegging to be specific. Um.

503
00:30:27,840 --> 00:30:30,280
Speaker 1: While she was working for a London liquor exporter in

504
00:30:30,320 --> 00:30:33,280
Speaker 1: New York, when either she or her boss got the

505
00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:36,440
Speaker 1: idea to get into the bootlegging business. In her words,

506
00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:40,480
Speaker 1: fortunes were being made during prohibition and she wanted in

507
00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:45,200
Speaker 1: on it. In she sold two million gallons of rye whiskey.

508
00:30:45,280 --> 00:30:47,080
Speaker 1: And this is in the face of sexism. People didn't

509
00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:49,160
Speaker 1: want to buy from her. They thought she'd like had

510
00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:51,960
Speaker 1: no idea what she was talking about. Um. Some clouds

511
00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:54,600
Speaker 1: at the time had no skirt laws. Um. And in

512
00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:57,520
Speaker 1: some places, including a lot of distilleries. Women weren't allowed

513
00:30:57,560 --> 00:31:00,280
Speaker 1: to wear pants, so you can't come in you're in

514
00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:03,640
Speaker 1: a skirt. Yeah. During this time, it wasn't socially acceptable

515
00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:05,400
Speaker 1: for women to drink liquor either, so a lot of

516
00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:08,800
Speaker 1: people were quite suspicious of her motives. They were all

517
00:31:08,880 --> 00:31:11,400
Speaker 1: kinds of rumors about her being a spy or an

518
00:31:11,400 --> 00:31:15,440
Speaker 1: employee of the US government. She had quite the reputation

519
00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:18,520
Speaker 1: she had fans. She was followed by Papa Razzi and

520
00:31:18,600 --> 00:31:22,600
Speaker 1: eventually arrested and later released free of charges. There's a

521
00:31:22,600 --> 00:31:26,200
Speaker 1: whole book about this thing, um more stories than Cleo's,

522
00:31:26,280 --> 00:31:28,479
Speaker 1: but it's called Whiskey Women. They untold story of how

523
00:31:28,520 --> 00:31:32,160
Speaker 1: women saved Bourbon, Scotch and Irish whiskey by fred Minnick,

524
00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:34,960
Speaker 1: if you would like to seek it out. When prohibition

525
00:31:35,120 --> 00:31:39,640
Speaker 1: ended in nineteen thirty, Bourbon distilleris had lost a lot

526
00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:42,920
Speaker 1: of ground. They had to restock, and they were competing

527
00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:45,960
Speaker 1: with Canadian Irish whiskeys, which had both the lighter stuff

528
00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:48,840
Speaker 1: that Americans had come to prefer and the stronger stuff

529
00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:52,040
Speaker 1: already on hand for people who didn't prefer the lighter stuff,

530
00:31:52,080 --> 00:31:54,480
Speaker 1: and a lot of cases Bourbon had to start from

531
00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:58,600
Speaker 1: scratch for roses was the most popular post Prohibition bourbon,

532
00:31:58,680 --> 00:32:01,920
Speaker 1: and part because of a six scessful holiday marketing campaign

533
00:32:02,440 --> 00:32:05,880
Speaker 1: tying it to holiday celebrations or as an easy gift idea.

534
00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:09,480
Speaker 1: I still see this every year, Um the distillery. Yeah,

535
00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:11,760
Speaker 1: they ran it every year and so gotten people's heads

536
00:32:11,800 --> 00:32:14,120
Speaker 1: that you know what, maybe I will give so and

537
00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:18,600
Speaker 1: so bottle of four roses. Seeing this success, other distilleries

538
00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:21,840
Speaker 1: followed suit. Jim Beam even had a holiday ad in

539
00:32:21,880 --> 00:32:28,640
Speaker 1: nineteen sixty with Sean Connery, very distinguished, very The law

540
00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:31,160
Speaker 1: requiring bourbon to go in new barrels passed in the

541
00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:34,960
Speaker 1: mid nineteen thirties, pushed by a representative from Arkansas. The

542
00:32:34,960 --> 00:32:38,000
Speaker 1: wood from those barrels was largely from Arkansas at the time,

543
00:32:38,080 --> 00:32:40,840
Speaker 1: and in his words, you'll use more would if you

544
00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:44,320
Speaker 1: only use it to once. The timber lobby was a

545
00:32:44,400 --> 00:32:46,840
Speaker 1: major force to be reckoned with in the early to

546
00:32:46,960 --> 00:32:50,320
Speaker 1: mid nineteen hundreds, and through the Great Depression and beyond

547
00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:54,360
Speaker 1: it garnered really impressive tax breaks and other legislation to

548
00:32:54,640 --> 00:32:58,440
Speaker 1: increase jobs and revenue in that market. There is good

549
00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:01,560
Speaker 1: scientific reason to use new barrels for every batch of bourbon,

550
00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:06,080
Speaker 1: but the timber lobby certainly helped. Y uh, And although

551
00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:09,160
Speaker 1: it might sound wasteful, it's really not. Those barrels are

552
00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:11,480
Speaker 1: reused for all sorts of things. UM. Lots of craft

553
00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:14,800
Speaker 1: beers are now aged in bourbon barrels, and apparently some

554
00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:19,440
Speaker 1: of Scotch whiskeys are now aged in bourbon barrels. Um.

555
00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:23,560
Speaker 1: American bourbon barreling laws have apparently changed the timber of

556
00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:26,760
Speaker 1: Scotch significantly from what it was like prior to the

557
00:33:26,840 --> 00:33:30,120
Speaker 1: twentieth century, prior to this low going into effect, wherein

558
00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:34,920
Speaker 1: it was aged in European oak wine or sherry casks

559
00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:39,360
Speaker 1: until then. So who knew? That definitely came up. I

560
00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:42,560
Speaker 1: did a Scotch whiskey tour when I was in Scotland,

561
00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:47,280
Speaker 1: and I do remember that coming up and I love it.

562
00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:50,400
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I mean, I mean the story but also

563
00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:55,400
Speaker 1: Scotch both both both me as well. In the Bourbon

564
00:33:55,480 --> 00:33:58,880
Speaker 1: Institute was founded, their goal was to promote the heck

565
00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:02,480
Speaker 1: out of Bourbon, and I'd say their efforts were successful too.

566
00:34:02,560 --> 00:34:05,480
Speaker 1: By nineteen sixty two, Bourbon was the highest selling spirit

567
00:34:05,520 --> 00:34:09,320
Speaker 1: in America. Sales tripled from the Institute's inception in nineteen

568
00:34:09,400 --> 00:34:12,960
Speaker 1: fifty eight to nineteen seventy and Congress made the whole

569
00:34:13,080 --> 00:34:18,719
Speaker 1: America's native spirit thing official alas Sean Connery, but this

570
00:34:18,760 --> 00:34:21,319
Speaker 1: time in the form of James Bond's he put an

571
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:24,880
Speaker 1: end to all of that trader. I know, this preference

572
00:34:24,920 --> 00:34:30,680
Speaker 1: for vodka drinks, how quickly the tables turn Sean Connery.

573
00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:34,319
Speaker 1: In nineteen seventy three, vodka surpassed bourbon as America's most

574
00:34:34,440 --> 00:34:38,240
Speaker 1: consumed spirit. To be fair, to choose Bond, he doesn't

575
00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:42,319
Speaker 1: deserve all the blame. All we can also blame all

576
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:48,000
Speaker 1: the young ladies. Ladies, that's right. As more women started drinking,

577
00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:51,480
Speaker 1: the demand for a lighter liquor like vodka increased, the

578
00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:54,480
Speaker 1: beginning of the stereotype perhaps, or did women order vodka

579
00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:56,800
Speaker 1: because of the stereotype or did they just like vodka

580
00:34:57,040 --> 00:34:58,839
Speaker 1: could be any of those things, all of those things.

581
00:34:59,040 --> 00:35:02,520
Speaker 1: I actually think I've read in multiple places that women

582
00:35:02,560 --> 00:35:05,000
Speaker 1: did see it as more socially acceptable to order clear

583
00:35:05,719 --> 00:35:08,600
Speaker 1: quote lighter liquor because they weren't really supposed to be

584
00:35:08,680 --> 00:35:10,920
Speaker 1: drinking it, right, so like this could just be a

585
00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:15,760
Speaker 1: soda water. Yeah. Yeah. And speaking of James Bond, listener

586
00:35:15,880 --> 00:35:18,560
Speaker 1: Amy wrote in When She Got Wind, Uh we were

587
00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:20,799
Speaker 1: doing this episode and asked if we're gonna touch on

588
00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:24,800
Speaker 1: Kingsman to the Golden Circle, And disclaimer, I haven't seen it,

589
00:35:24,840 --> 00:35:27,719
Speaker 1: but I knew immediately why she asked. Before the movie

590
00:35:27,719 --> 00:35:29,640
Speaker 1: came out. I was wandering around New York Comic Con,

591
00:35:29,760 --> 00:35:33,880
Speaker 1: dress as Winter Soldier for work, as you do. I

592
00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:37,120
Speaker 1: walked past this very regal looking bar pop up where

593
00:35:37,120 --> 00:35:41,480
Speaker 1: you could sample Statesman Bourbon, which is a spinoff by

594
00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:45,080
Speaker 1: Old Forrester created for the movie What Um, which you

595
00:35:45,080 --> 00:35:47,200
Speaker 1: can now buy in stores, and you could buy it

596
00:35:47,239 --> 00:35:50,040
Speaker 1: several months before the movie came out Um. In the film,

597
00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:53,200
Speaker 1: an opening scene revolves around the discovery of a bottle

598
00:35:53,360 --> 00:35:55,840
Speaker 1: of this stuff in a safe, and characters drink it

599
00:35:56,040 --> 00:36:00,759
Speaker 1: throughout the film. Yeah, and the master taster describes the

600
00:36:00,800 --> 00:36:05,960
Speaker 1: flavor as characters well played. This has been pointed to

601
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:09,560
Speaker 1: as an interesting example of marketing. Yeah, that's like Willy

602
00:36:09,560 --> 00:36:12,600
Speaker 1: Wonka level. Yeah it really that's great. Yeah, that's what

603
00:36:12,640 --> 00:36:15,640
Speaker 1: it made me think of, or or horrifying in a

604
00:36:15,640 --> 00:36:18,560
Speaker 1: certain way. I don't know, it's interesting. I do know

605
00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:22,760
Speaker 1: that a lot of people professional whiskey connoisseurs who reviewed

606
00:36:22,760 --> 00:36:24,400
Speaker 1: it were like, you know, it's not my thing. But

607
00:36:24,440 --> 00:36:26,880
Speaker 1: I do appreciate that they really put like time and effort.

608
00:36:26,880 --> 00:36:30,360
Speaker 1: It wasn't like a cheap Yeah. It wasn't like bourbon

609
00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:33,960
Speaker 1: flavored or something like. It made a bourbon, yeah, exactly.

610
00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:38,080
Speaker 1: There would be a serious resurgence in whiskeys of all kinds,

611
00:36:38,120 --> 00:36:43,280
Speaker 1: starting slowly in the opulent nineteen eighties with increased consumer

612
00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:47,360
Speaker 1: demand for high quality and kind of conspicuous consumption liquors.

613
00:36:48,200 --> 00:36:51,440
Speaker 1: When the craft cocktail boom began in the early two thousand's,

614
00:36:51,480 --> 00:36:55,520
Speaker 1: a wide range of whiskey is found new old homes

615
00:36:55,600 --> 00:36:58,400
Speaker 1: in classic cocktails like the Manhattan and the old fashioned

616
00:36:58,600 --> 00:37:02,239
Speaker 1: Bourbon is pretty great in those. Simultaneously, state regulations on

617
00:37:02,280 --> 00:37:05,360
Speaker 1: distilleries were being loosened, making it more possible for small

618
00:37:05,360 --> 00:37:11,279
Speaker 1: businesses to start the long process of creating bourbons. By

619
00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:14,080
Speaker 1: sales of bourbon and Tennessee whiskey in the United States

620
00:37:14,080 --> 00:37:18,319
Speaker 1: were up almost year of a year, and as as

621
00:37:18,320 --> 00:37:21,800
Speaker 1: we suggested earlier, American whiskies were sixty percent of the

622
00:37:21,840 --> 00:37:25,400
Speaker 1: export market in terms of cash value worth than a

623
00:37:25,480 --> 00:37:29,919
Speaker 1: little a little under a billion dollars. That's these these days,

624
00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:34,160
Speaker 1: it's up to about a billion. Yeah. Huge international brands

625
00:37:34,160 --> 00:37:36,799
Speaker 1: have been buying up bourbon companies that have been owned

626
00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:40,680
Speaker 1: and operated by American families for decades, and those companies

627
00:37:40,680 --> 00:37:44,960
Speaker 1: are investing millions of dollars on increased production. The master

628
00:37:45,040 --> 00:37:51,040
Speaker 1: distillers and local owners have become celebrities. It's oh wild culture,

629
00:37:51,400 --> 00:37:55,240
Speaker 1: it really is. The bourbon resurgence though, has put stress

630
00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:59,640
Speaker 1: on the barrel making industry America because there are plenty

631
00:37:59,719 --> 00:38:03,279
Speaker 1: of oaks around or sometimes less than some of the

632
00:38:03,360 --> 00:38:07,160
Speaker 1: areas that they've traditionally been farmed or harvested from because

633
00:38:07,560 --> 00:38:12,360
Speaker 1: of settlement, because new population grace. But the recent recession

634
00:38:12,440 --> 00:38:15,400
Speaker 1: made logging less profitable, so there are fewer workers in

635
00:38:15,440 --> 00:38:19,000
Speaker 1: the logging industry to harvest the wood, and a couple

636
00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:22,280
Speaker 1: of rainy seasons have have made things a little bit difficult.

637
00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:26,720
Speaker 1: It's difficult for for barrel making times. But yeah, so uh.

638
00:38:26,960 --> 00:38:31,759
Speaker 1: Increased demand for bourbon plus decreased actual production of barrels

639
00:38:32,280 --> 00:38:37,400
Speaker 1: has seen distilleries basically entering bidding wars to get barrels

640
00:38:37,480 --> 00:38:44,080
Speaker 1: from these coopers. Yes, like offering like one markup on

641
00:38:45,080 --> 00:38:48,640
Speaker 1: what they are selling their barrels for. Oh man, I

642
00:38:48,640 --> 00:38:50,640
Speaker 1: wonder if we would ever reach a point where that

643
00:38:50,719 --> 00:38:56,719
Speaker 1: laws oh gets repealed because of a lack of barrel. Yeah,

644
00:38:56,840 --> 00:38:59,480
Speaker 1: maybe there's like a two tiered like maybe you have

645
00:38:59,560 --> 00:39:02,839
Speaker 1: to both specify how old it is and what kind

646
00:39:02,840 --> 00:39:07,440
Speaker 1: of bar process. Yeah, it is. It is really integral

647
00:39:07,520 --> 00:39:10,440
Speaker 1: to the taste of bourbon. And we are going to

648
00:39:10,480 --> 00:39:13,080
Speaker 1: get into that, but first we're going to get into

649
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:15,320
Speaker 1: one more quick break for a word from our sponsor,

650
00:39:26,080 --> 00:39:29,000
Speaker 1: and we're back. Thank you, sponsor, Yes, thank you. So

651
00:39:29,320 --> 00:39:33,680
Speaker 1: all right, if you're talking about the flavor involved in bourbon,

652
00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:37,560
Speaker 1: there is a serious science as much as an art

653
00:39:37,719 --> 00:39:40,719
Speaker 1: to that. There was this team of researchers back in

654
00:39:42,040 --> 00:39:45,440
Speaker 1: who we're looking into the chemical profile of American whiskeys,

655
00:39:45,440 --> 00:39:47,400
Speaker 1: and they presented their findings at this meeting of the

656
00:39:47,400 --> 00:39:50,759
Speaker 1: American Chemical Society. The team of researchers has led by

657
00:39:50,760 --> 00:39:57,040
Speaker 1: a guy named Tom Collins, and you cannot make this up. Nope,

658
00:39:57,719 --> 00:40:00,560
Speaker 1: it's I'm almost as fond of that as I am

659
00:40:00,600 --> 00:40:05,360
Speaker 1: of Dr Fowler, the chicken scientist. But what they found

660
00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:10,000
Speaker 1: across sixty whiskeys that they investigated, uh, some four thousand

661
00:40:10,280 --> 00:40:13,160
Speaker 1: non volatile compounds that the ones that don't tend to

662
00:40:13,239 --> 00:40:18,120
Speaker 1: evaporate off any given whiskey, contained hundreds of these flavor compounds.

663
00:40:18,800 --> 00:40:23,240
Speaker 1: They eventually identified some fifty to a hundred tannins, fatty acids,

664
00:40:23,239 --> 00:40:29,080
Speaker 1: and alcohols that make up a bourbon spirits spirit. And

665
00:40:29,120 --> 00:40:32,520
Speaker 1: they found that some compounds were characteristic of particular types

666
00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:37,120
Speaker 1: of American whiskey, of bourbon versus ry versus Tennessee whiskey, etcetera.

667
00:40:37,800 --> 00:40:41,160
Speaker 1: But they also found that sometimes what distillery a whiskey

668
00:40:41,200 --> 00:40:43,920
Speaker 1: came from mattered more than what was actually in its

669
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:47,799
Speaker 1: mash bill. They called this a distillery fingerprint, which I

670
00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:52,240
Speaker 1: imagine must be an artifact of the fermentation yeast cultures

671
00:40:52,480 --> 00:40:55,560
Speaker 1: and the handling during aging that brings out different and

672
00:40:55,600 --> 00:41:00,799
Speaker 1: specific qualities. I love that h The actual that make

673
00:41:00,920 --> 00:41:04,680
Speaker 1: up those fermented cultures are proprietary, They can be patented

674
00:41:04,760 --> 00:41:07,680
Speaker 1: here in the United States, and they are closely guarded.

675
00:41:08,719 --> 00:41:12,160
Speaker 1: Wild turkeys, for example, is from nineteen fifty four. Jim

676
00:41:12,200 --> 00:41:15,279
Speaker 1: Beams is supposedly from nineteen thirty three, caught wild on

677
00:41:15,440 --> 00:41:20,000
Speaker 1: James Beam's back porch after prohibition ended. This image of

678
00:41:20,040 --> 00:41:26,480
Speaker 1: just someone with a net got you makers Marks says

679
00:41:26,480 --> 00:41:28,200
Speaker 1: that they've got the same one they were using in

680
00:41:28,239 --> 00:41:32,000
Speaker 1: the eighteen sixties. As we covered in our Sour Beer episode.

681
00:41:32,080 --> 00:41:36,000
Speaker 1: Different species and subspecies and particular strains of yeasts and

682
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:40,840
Speaker 1: bacteria produce very different flavor compounds in alcohol, and some

683
00:41:40,920 --> 00:41:44,480
Speaker 1: distilleries like Four Roses will actually label their single barrel

684
00:41:44,520 --> 00:41:46,960
Speaker 1: bourbons with a code that can tell you which of

685
00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:49,160
Speaker 1: their yeast cultures they used for that batch, so that

686
00:41:49,200 --> 00:41:54,000
Speaker 1: you can kind of compare and contrast. So fun. Yeah,

687
00:41:54,239 --> 00:41:57,000
Speaker 1: and okay, here's where we're going to get into all

688
00:41:57,000 --> 00:42:01,959
Speaker 1: of that barrel stuff, because wood is crazy, y'all. It's

689
00:42:02,040 --> 00:42:05,280
Speaker 1: all right, as we dipped into in our maple syrup episode.

690
00:42:05,640 --> 00:42:10,360
Speaker 1: Trees lifeblood is sap, a watery, sugary stuff that's full

691
00:42:10,400 --> 00:42:14,040
Speaker 1: of various compounds that trees use for nutrition, self defense

692
00:42:14,080 --> 00:42:18,120
Speaker 1: against infection by insects and microbes, you know, healing powers,

693
00:42:18,160 --> 00:42:21,480
Speaker 1: all that tree kind of stuff. The exact components in

694
00:42:21,560 --> 00:42:24,640
Speaker 1: a given piece of wood from a given tree vary,

695
00:42:24,680 --> 00:42:27,360
Speaker 1: of course by the tree's species, but also by the

696
00:42:27,440 --> 00:42:30,840
Speaker 1: latitude and climate where the tree grew, the age and

697
00:42:30,880 --> 00:42:33,480
Speaker 1: size it was when it was harvested, the season it

698
00:42:33,520 --> 00:42:35,960
Speaker 1: was harvested in um, the part of the tree upper

699
00:42:36,040 --> 00:42:38,920
Speaker 1: or lower where the wood comes from. It's a living thing,

700
00:42:39,640 --> 00:42:44,440
Speaker 1: and it varies intensely and like any living thing would,

701
00:42:45,239 --> 00:42:48,520
Speaker 1: is made up of cells that are semipermeable. All those

702
00:42:48,520 --> 00:42:51,360
Speaker 1: compounds in the wood can cross in or out given

703
00:42:51,400 --> 00:42:53,839
Speaker 1: the right conditions. Of course, you don't. You don't want

704
00:42:53,840 --> 00:42:55,680
Speaker 1: the wood of a barrel to be too permeable. I

705
00:42:55,680 --> 00:42:57,640
Speaker 1: mean you want it to be water tight or liquor

706
00:42:57,680 --> 00:43:00,360
Speaker 1: type A is the is the case, it may bee um,

707
00:43:00,440 --> 00:43:04,240
Speaker 1: So as follow stuff as wood is, Cooper's barrel makers

708
00:43:04,360 --> 00:43:06,840
Speaker 1: are going to do a few things that bring even

709
00:43:07,280 --> 00:43:10,719
Speaker 1: more potential flavor compounds to the party. In order to

710
00:43:10,760 --> 00:43:15,600
Speaker 1: make that water tight thing happen. Okay, First, the raw

711
00:43:15,640 --> 00:43:18,440
Speaker 1: wood must be seasoned or dried. This this reduces the

712
00:43:18,480 --> 00:43:20,680
Speaker 1: amount of water in the wood, which is what drying

713
00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:23,560
Speaker 1: usually does, um, which is important because it shrinks the

714
00:43:23,560 --> 00:43:28,640
Speaker 1: wood down into a kind of evenly denser, more compact package.

715
00:43:29,480 --> 00:43:31,839
Speaker 1: This is the same thing that's done for firewood. If

716
00:43:31,840 --> 00:43:35,000
Speaker 1: you used raw wood for barrels, that drying would happen

717
00:43:35,040 --> 00:43:39,800
Speaker 1: over time anyway, but unevenly, and it could warp and crack.

718
00:43:40,520 --> 00:43:44,600
Speaker 1: No bueno. The traditional method for seasoning wood is outdoors,

719
00:43:45,080 --> 00:43:47,840
Speaker 1: slowly in the open air over the course of a

720
00:43:47,880 --> 00:43:52,279
Speaker 1: dry season, which exposes the wood to all kinds of

721
00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:55,279
Speaker 1: free range bacteria and yeasts which eats some of the

722
00:43:55,280 --> 00:43:57,359
Speaker 1: sugars in the wood and start producing some of your

723
00:43:57,360 --> 00:44:01,040
Speaker 1: flavor compounds and or precursors to flavor compounds. Heck in

724
00:44:01,120 --> 00:44:06,680
Speaker 1: bacteria poop, y'all we need like, I want a twenty

725
00:44:09,960 --> 00:44:15,040
Speaker 1: artists renditions of bacteria proof if anyone out there is

726
00:44:15,320 --> 00:44:20,399
Speaker 1: looking to add something to their portfolio, yeah saying I'm

727
00:44:20,440 --> 00:44:22,719
Speaker 1: not sure what that like mural would look like, but

728
00:44:22,840 --> 00:44:26,799
Speaker 1: I want to I want to know. Okay. Uh So,

729
00:44:26,920 --> 00:44:29,319
Speaker 1: once once the wood is seasoned, it can be made

730
00:44:29,360 --> 00:44:32,680
Speaker 1: into barrels or into staves for barrels, which are the

731
00:44:32,800 --> 00:44:35,640
Speaker 1: sections of a barrel. Yeah. To do this, the cooper

732
00:44:35,719 --> 00:44:38,880
Speaker 1: is going to heat the staves the planks so that

733
00:44:38,920 --> 00:44:43,000
Speaker 1: they bend, and in this process they're also toasting the wood.

734
00:44:43,719 --> 00:44:45,600
Speaker 1: H think think of the way that toasting a piece

735
00:44:45,640 --> 00:44:49,440
Speaker 1: of bread changes the flavors. The heat breaks down some

736
00:44:49,480 --> 00:44:52,600
Speaker 1: of the molecular structures in the wood, making some potential

737
00:44:52,640 --> 00:44:56,960
Speaker 1: flavor compounds available and creating some flavor compounds from the

738
00:44:56,960 --> 00:44:59,640
Speaker 1: stuff that's already there. The fancy to science term for

739
00:44:59,680 --> 00:45:02,959
Speaker 1: this being pyrolysis. And I'm pretty sure that all wood

740
00:45:03,000 --> 00:45:05,560
Speaker 1: barrels are at least a wee bit toasted from from

741
00:45:05,560 --> 00:45:08,760
Speaker 1: this heating process. But for bourbon barrels, they are also charred.

742
00:45:09,680 --> 00:45:13,000
Speaker 1: And this is where the cooper actually burns the inside

743
00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:15,319
Speaker 1: of the barrel. If you took a cross section at

744
00:45:15,360 --> 00:45:17,160
Speaker 1: least like like an eighth of an inch of it

745
00:45:17,200 --> 00:45:19,840
Speaker 1: would just be black. And it's about three millimeters for

746
00:45:19,880 --> 00:45:24,239
Speaker 1: all of our more sensible metric cousins out there. Uh

747
00:45:24,280 --> 00:45:27,359
Speaker 1: and okay, charring does a couple of things. First, you're

748
00:45:27,400 --> 00:45:30,800
Speaker 1: building a charcoal filter into the barrel. As we mentioned

749
00:45:30,800 --> 00:45:33,440
Speaker 1: way at the top of this episode, billions of years

750
00:45:33,480 --> 00:45:37,960
Speaker 1: ago charcoal. Charcoal filters some of the harsh flavor compounds

751
00:45:37,960 --> 00:45:42,000
Speaker 1: out of whiskey, so that's cool. You're also creating a

752
00:45:42,040 --> 00:45:45,799
Speaker 1: different set of flavors because as wood goes from a

753
00:45:45,920 --> 00:45:49,239
Speaker 1: light toast to a full char you're you're moving from

754
00:45:49,280 --> 00:45:53,440
Speaker 1: like vanilla and caramel and clove flavors, through nuts and

755
00:45:53,520 --> 00:45:57,320
Speaker 1: cedar and honey to like coffee and ginger and smoke.

756
00:45:58,080 --> 00:46:00,879
Speaker 1: And depending on your charring tech inek and and how

757
00:46:01,160 --> 00:46:03,799
Speaker 1: long you keep the whiskey in there, the whiskey can

758
00:46:03,840 --> 00:46:06,320
Speaker 1: access a little bit of all of that as it

759
00:46:06,440 --> 00:46:11,080
Speaker 1: ages barrels are so important to the flavor of finished bourbon.

760
00:46:11,320 --> 00:46:14,439
Speaker 1: Good white whiskey, which is the colorless distillate that goes

761
00:46:14,520 --> 00:46:17,520
Speaker 1: into barrels and becomes bourbon as it as it ages

762
00:46:17,560 --> 00:46:20,279
Speaker 1: and draws out compounds from the wood. White whiskey will

763
00:46:20,320 --> 00:46:24,040
Speaker 1: have flavors of corn and rye and barley whatever else

764
00:46:24,160 --> 00:46:27,200
Speaker 1: is going into your mash, but none of the spices

765
00:46:27,239 --> 00:46:31,040
Speaker 1: are vanilla's back In one Wayne Curtis was writing a

766
00:46:31,040 --> 00:46:34,920
Speaker 1: piece for The Atlantic and asked some dozen industry folks

767
00:46:34,960 --> 00:46:37,200
Speaker 1: about how much of a difference the barrel makes in

768
00:46:37,239 --> 00:46:40,520
Speaker 1: their bourbon's flavor, and they said they responded anywhere from

769
00:46:40,560 --> 00:46:48,160
Speaker 1: fifty eight of their bourbon is just barrel. That's that's fascinating. Yeah,

770
00:46:48,280 --> 00:46:53,080
Speaker 1: over half. The construction technology involved in the warehouses that

771
00:46:53,440 --> 00:46:58,400
Speaker 1: store bourbon is also really serious stuff. Traditionally, they have

772
00:46:58,440 --> 00:47:01,640
Speaker 1: these thick stone walls that act as insulators against the

773
00:47:01,719 --> 00:47:06,920
Speaker 1: extremes of heat and cold. Tin roofs rusted, which, being reflective,

774
00:47:06,960 --> 00:47:09,759
Speaker 1: help the building absorb less heat energy from the sun.

775
00:47:10,600 --> 00:47:13,040
Speaker 1: The bottom floor would be built over a bare dirt

776
00:47:13,080 --> 00:47:15,920
Speaker 1: crawl space, meaning that a little bit of ground moisture

777
00:47:15,960 --> 00:47:19,160
Speaker 1: can get in under their keeping the building humidified, and

778
00:47:19,200 --> 00:47:23,720
Speaker 1: that humidity plus ventilation from parallel windows throughout the building

779
00:47:24,000 --> 00:47:27,680
Speaker 1: and UH and stacking the barrels such that heat can

780
00:47:27,760 --> 00:47:31,440
Speaker 1: move up through the building means that you're you're further

781
00:47:31,560 --> 00:47:34,759
Speaker 1: moderating the temperature in there, keeping it warm in the

782
00:47:34,800 --> 00:47:39,080
Speaker 1: winter cool in the summer relatively relatively, because you do

783
00:47:39,120 --> 00:47:42,439
Speaker 1: want some differences in temperature, as Annie said earlier, because

784
00:47:42,480 --> 00:47:44,000
Speaker 1: that's going to be what causes the wood of the

785
00:47:44,000 --> 00:47:48,360
Speaker 1: barrels to interact with the alcohol inside of them. Okay,

786
00:47:48,520 --> 00:47:51,279
Speaker 1: when the contents of a barrel warm up, they're they're

787
00:47:51,280 --> 00:47:55,200
Speaker 1: going to expand slightly, thus increasing the pressure inside the barrel.

788
00:47:55,800 --> 00:47:59,399
Speaker 1: The barrel holds tight. So this pressure forces some of

789
00:47:59,400 --> 00:48:02,600
Speaker 1: of the olt hall that's expanding into the grain of

790
00:48:02,640 --> 00:48:06,200
Speaker 1: the wood. The carbon layer from that shar filters some

791
00:48:06,239 --> 00:48:09,399
Speaker 1: stuff out, and the alcohol, being a solvent, breaks down

792
00:48:09,440 --> 00:48:12,560
Speaker 1: some of the micro structures in the wood, releasing and

793
00:48:12,800 --> 00:48:17,080
Speaker 1: changing the compounds there. When the temperature cools down again,

794
00:48:17,160 --> 00:48:20,160
Speaker 1: that liquid contracts back out of the wood. This this

795
00:48:20,280 --> 00:48:23,040
Speaker 1: happens both on a small scale every day and night,

796
00:48:23,360 --> 00:48:25,839
Speaker 1: and on a larger scale throughout the seasons every year.

797
00:48:26,600 --> 00:48:30,640
Speaker 1: So much science happening. I got I got like kind

798
00:48:30,640 --> 00:48:33,520
Speaker 1: of for clumped during this again like which it needs

799
00:48:33,520 --> 00:48:38,160
Speaker 1: to be on our bingo card anyway, Lauren, Lauren gets emotional. Um.

800
00:48:38,280 --> 00:48:41,560
Speaker 1: Some distilleries will actually game this system by purposefully letting

801
00:48:41,560 --> 00:48:44,320
Speaker 1: their barrels get overly hot in the summer and overly

802
00:48:44,320 --> 00:48:47,200
Speaker 1: cold in the winter, thus increasing the rate at which

803
00:48:47,200 --> 00:48:50,319
Speaker 1: the bourbon draws compounds out of the wood and thus

804
00:48:50,360 --> 00:48:52,520
Speaker 1: decreasing the amount of time that it takes to age

805
00:48:52,560 --> 00:48:59,160
Speaker 1: the bourbon to a palatable level of bourbonosity. Burbon, I

806
00:48:59,200 --> 00:49:03,319
Speaker 1: think that's how it's prow I think, yeah, thank you,

807
00:49:03,320 --> 00:49:06,520
Speaker 1: you can. You can also use smaller barrels, thus increasing

808
00:49:06,560 --> 00:49:10,680
Speaker 1: the ratio of barrel surface to liquor and getting more

809
00:49:10,719 --> 00:49:14,480
Speaker 1: liquor to filter through the wood faster. Another factor that

810
00:49:14,560 --> 00:49:17,280
Speaker 1: comes in during aging, and one that is harder to rush,

811
00:49:17,719 --> 00:49:21,319
Speaker 1: is oxidation, because although barrels are water tight, they're not

812
00:49:21,520 --> 00:49:26,279
Speaker 1: totally air tight. As oxygen molecules interact with the compounds

813
00:49:26,320 --> 00:49:29,240
Speaker 1: in the whiskey, over time, they'll break some of them down,

814
00:49:29,560 --> 00:49:32,799
Speaker 1: leaving new chemicals that will interact with the wood in

815
00:49:32,880 --> 00:49:36,640
Speaker 1: new ways, creating new different flavor compounds. This is why

816
00:49:36,680 --> 00:49:39,280
Speaker 1: younger bourbons will tend to taste a little bit greener

817
00:49:39,680 --> 00:49:44,120
Speaker 1: or like corn ear. Really, oh, there's a joke. There

818
00:49:44,160 --> 00:49:47,560
Speaker 1: absolutely is all right in and let us know, and

819
00:49:47,560 --> 00:49:50,959
Speaker 1: and older bourbons will have sort of richer flavors. All

820
00:49:51,000 --> 00:49:53,279
Speaker 1: of this, um, all of this has been worked out

821
00:49:53,400 --> 00:49:56,600
Speaker 1: via trial and error over the past few hundred years.

822
00:49:56,760 --> 00:49:59,760
Speaker 1: And uh, you know, bourbon makers go in and taste

823
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:02,480
Speaker 1: a product that's aging in different barrels in different parts

824
00:50:02,480 --> 00:50:04,480
Speaker 1: of a warehouse. They find the ones that they like,

825
00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:07,040
Speaker 1: and they try to figure out how to create more

826
00:50:07,239 --> 00:50:10,799
Speaker 1: of those conditions across more of their stock. And it

827
00:50:10,840 --> 00:50:17,439
Speaker 1: can be really trially and really airy. Um. There's there's

828
00:50:17,440 --> 00:50:20,120
Speaker 1: a distillery in the Hudson Valley that plays loud music

829
00:50:20,120 --> 00:50:23,520
Speaker 1: and its warehouses to literally shake its whiskey up, hoping

830
00:50:23,880 --> 00:50:26,560
Speaker 1: to increase the interactions between the liquor in the wood.

831
00:50:26,960 --> 00:50:29,920
Speaker 1: There was one time that a tornado um hit the

832
00:50:29,920 --> 00:50:33,040
Speaker 1: Buffalo Trace Distillery in Kentucky and took off the roof

833
00:50:33,200 --> 00:50:36,240
Speaker 1: and one wall of one of their warehouses, exposing twenty

834
00:50:36,280 --> 00:50:40,080
Speaker 1: five thousand barrels inside to the elements for months while

835
00:50:40,280 --> 00:50:43,800
Speaker 1: they were repairing the building. Five years later, that stuff

836
00:50:43,840 --> 00:50:48,799
Speaker 1: was delicious, and no one had any idea why they

837
00:50:48,880 --> 00:50:53,080
Speaker 1: labeled it Tornadoes Surviving Bourbon, and customers loved it. I

838
00:50:53,120 --> 00:50:55,399
Speaker 1: mean not only because of the I mean I would

839
00:50:55,440 --> 00:50:58,880
Speaker 1: buy something called Tornado Surviving Bourbon, but I absolutely but

840
00:50:58,920 --> 00:51:02,200
Speaker 1: it was really tasty, appair, I love that. That's so cool?

841
00:51:03,680 --> 00:51:07,719
Speaker 1: Like why lots of factors. It really is kind of

842
00:51:08,000 --> 00:51:12,000
Speaker 1: trial and error and just hands off, all right, just like, well,

843
00:51:12,600 --> 00:51:15,080
Speaker 1: do your thing. I'll check you back in with you

844
00:51:15,120 --> 00:51:17,960
Speaker 1: in a year or two. Maybe I'll play some loud

845
00:51:18,080 --> 00:51:23,919
Speaker 1: music and maybe you'll dig that. Is it a stick

846
00:51:24,000 --> 00:51:29,480
Speaker 1: sort of day? What do you guys think? It's definitely

847
00:51:29,560 --> 00:51:34,040
Speaker 1: eighties like like hair metal. Yeah, I think so. I

848
00:51:34,160 --> 00:51:38,200
Speaker 1: certainly hope. So we clearly should make her own burbon.

849
00:51:38,680 --> 00:51:42,440
Speaker 1: Oh no, don't suggest that that's a lot of homework. Annie,

850
00:51:43,000 --> 00:51:46,480
Speaker 1: Well we have what is it six years before? Well,

851
00:51:46,480 --> 00:51:49,520
Speaker 1: that's a while, that's true, that's true. Okay, Yeah, let's

852
00:51:49,520 --> 00:51:53,040
Speaker 1: work on it. Although well, I guess you test it,

853
00:51:53,040 --> 00:51:55,200
Speaker 1: but how depressing it would it be? Wait that six years?

854
00:51:55,640 --> 00:52:00,640
Speaker 1: It's gross. There's there's a lot of the science has

855
00:52:00,680 --> 00:52:02,520
Speaker 1: been that has been laid out before us that would

856
00:52:02,600 --> 00:52:07,560
Speaker 1: help us on our way. Absolutely, um so this is

857
00:52:07,560 --> 00:52:13,839
Speaker 1: our our bourbon episode. Um there was so much, so much. Yeah,

858
00:52:13,880 --> 00:52:17,960
Speaker 1: this this didn't really get into the distillation process itself.

859
00:52:18,280 --> 00:52:20,120
Speaker 1: I think we went into that a little bit in

860
00:52:20,160 --> 00:52:24,279
Speaker 1: our Gin episode Gin and Tonic. Yeah, but I'd like

861
00:52:24,320 --> 00:52:26,399
Speaker 1: to get into more of that at a later time

862
00:52:26,400 --> 00:52:29,000
Speaker 1: and date when maybe when we do another Whiskey episode,

863
00:52:29,160 --> 00:52:32,680
Speaker 1: and again we're gonna have a follow up, right, So

864
00:52:33,120 --> 00:52:35,720
Speaker 1: this was sort of part of our our food stuff

865
00:52:35,880 --> 00:52:39,719
Speaker 1: road trip to Kentucky. Absolutely, yes, coming coming back to

866
00:52:39,760 --> 00:52:42,240
Speaker 1: you with the audio from our tour of the Wild

867
00:52:42,239 --> 00:52:47,160
Speaker 1: Turkey Facility and our interview with Eddie Russell. But in

868
00:52:47,160 --> 00:52:56,279
Speaker 1: the meantime, listener Samantha wrote, I was listening to the

869
00:52:56,280 --> 00:52:58,759
Speaker 1: Pasta episode today, and while I was already hooked since

870
00:52:58,840 --> 00:53:01,120
Speaker 1: pasta is kind of my favorite thing, a listener mail

871
00:53:01,160 --> 00:53:03,839
Speaker 1: regarding the garbage plate caught my ear. If you guys

872
00:53:03,880 --> 00:53:06,200
Speaker 1: ever come to Illinois, be sure to come to Springfield.

873
00:53:06,280 --> 00:53:10,880
Speaker 1: Done we have more Besides Abraham Lincoln. There is a

874
00:53:10,920 --> 00:53:14,520
Speaker 1: local dish here called a horseshoe. It's Texas toast topped

875
00:53:14,560 --> 00:53:17,760
Speaker 1: with meat, usually a Hamburger patty, then topped with French fries,

876
00:53:18,000 --> 00:53:20,440
Speaker 1: and then finally the whole thing is smothered in a

877
00:53:20,560 --> 00:53:23,960
Speaker 1: cheese sauce. It's delicious and horrible for you all. At

878
00:53:23,960 --> 00:53:27,200
Speaker 1: the same time. You may be wondering why it's called

879
00:53:27,239 --> 00:53:30,920
Speaker 1: a horseshoe yep um. There are many different stories surrounding

880
00:53:30,920 --> 00:53:34,080
Speaker 1: the name origin, although none have been confirmed. My husband

881
00:53:34,120 --> 00:53:37,440
Speaker 1: theory is that the toast represents the horse handler's hand,

882
00:53:37,880 --> 00:53:40,360
Speaker 1: the patty the hoof, and the fries are the nails.

883
00:53:40,760 --> 00:53:43,520
Speaker 1: I don't remember his reasoning for the cheese. Who needs

884
00:53:43,520 --> 00:53:47,000
Speaker 1: reasoning for cheese any aside? Off the top of my head,

885
00:53:47,320 --> 00:53:50,000
Speaker 1: I'm guessing it's because it's delicious and ties the whole

886
00:53:50,000 --> 00:53:54,640
Speaker 1: thing together. You're probably right, as cheese does for many things.

887
00:53:54,920 --> 00:53:57,960
Speaker 1: Oh oh, which so does it is the rug in

888
00:53:58,000 --> 00:54:00,840
Speaker 1: the room that you need? Um? Also, I want to

889
00:54:00,840 --> 00:54:03,120
Speaker 1: thank everybody wrote in and said that they also eat

890
00:54:03,160 --> 00:54:06,680
Speaker 1: their pasta separately. Yes, oh goodness, that was It was

891
00:54:06,800 --> 00:54:10,399
Speaker 1: very heartening. I know, I was like something inside me

892
00:54:10,800 --> 00:54:14,520
Speaker 1: east And also a lot of people wrote in that,

893
00:54:14,680 --> 00:54:21,319
Speaker 1: like our super producer Dylan, they eat Cheetos with chopsticks. Yeah,

894
00:54:21,560 --> 00:54:25,000
Speaker 1: it must be like a Cheeto Officia NATO thing. Yeah,

895
00:54:25,640 --> 00:54:28,600
Speaker 1: you know you've got to eat the Cheetos and you

896
00:54:28,640 --> 00:54:32,480
Speaker 1: don't want to get messy. It's very practical, and you

897
00:54:32,600 --> 00:54:36,600
Speaker 1: just look cool. You do. People are like certified people.

898
00:54:36,680 --> 00:54:39,080
Speaker 1: People will stop and ask you, hey, what are you doing.

899
00:54:40,120 --> 00:54:43,120
Speaker 1: It's like that Seinfeld episode where somebody's cutting up the

900
00:54:43,800 --> 00:54:46,200
Speaker 1: candy bar and then everyone starts doing it, and I

901
00:54:46,239 --> 00:54:50,200
Speaker 1: think it's really fancy and like a trend. Yeah, so

902
00:54:50,560 --> 00:54:52,600
Speaker 1: it could be a whole Cheeto trend, except this is

903
00:54:52,760 --> 00:54:55,879
Speaker 1: fancy in a trend. You heard it here on food

904
00:54:55,920 --> 00:55:00,120
Speaker 1: Stuff You Did, Taylor wrote, I really enjoyed your us

905
00:55:00,120 --> 00:55:02,600
Speaker 1: an episode on maple syrup. Thank you. I grew up

906
00:55:02,600 --> 00:55:05,040
Speaker 1: in a small Canadian town where we have a large

907
00:55:05,080 --> 00:55:08,440
Speaker 1: maple syrup festival every year. Several years ago, my then

908
00:55:08,560 --> 00:55:11,120
Speaker 1: boyfriend now husband and I were traveling in Europe and

909
00:55:11,160 --> 00:55:15,640
Speaker 1: brought several million liter bottles of Ontario syrup for our hosts.

910
00:55:16,280 --> 00:55:19,319
Speaker 1: Apparently we were over the liquid limit when flying out

911
00:55:19,400 --> 00:55:22,640
Speaker 1: of Ireland. Instead of letting the real Canadian syrup just

912
00:55:22,719 --> 00:55:25,040
Speaker 1: get thrown out by the Irish t s A, I

913
00:55:25,120 --> 00:55:27,680
Speaker 1: opened a bottle and drank it in the security line.

914
00:55:29,080 --> 00:55:31,760
Speaker 1: I was hopped up on sugar for the next several hours,

915
00:55:31,800 --> 00:55:35,600
Speaker 1: but it was worth it. Taylor, You're a hero. I

916
00:55:35,640 --> 00:55:40,239
Speaker 1: would have been so impressed. I oh man, that's that

917
00:55:40,400 --> 00:55:44,560
Speaker 1: is beautiful. Also, Taylor says, in response to a recent

918
00:55:44,600 --> 00:55:47,799
Speaker 1: listener male about the French Canadian pineapple anan us, I

919
00:55:47,840 --> 00:55:50,799
Speaker 1: think most of us were trying to scrub it from

920
00:55:50,920 --> 00:55:56,920
Speaker 1: our memory. It was quite unsettling, it was scrappable. It

921
00:55:57,040 --> 00:56:03,359
Speaker 1: was yep. I can't say a lamia no no. So

922
00:56:03,640 --> 00:56:06,160
Speaker 1: thanks to both of them so much for writing in.

923
00:56:06,400 --> 00:56:09,080
Speaker 1: You two can write to us. Our email is food

924
00:56:09,080 --> 00:56:12,120
Speaker 1: Stuff at houstuff works dot com. We're also on social media.

925
00:56:12,239 --> 00:56:14,919
Speaker 1: You can find us on Facebook and Twitter at food

926
00:56:14,960 --> 00:56:18,759
Speaker 1: stuff hs W and on Instagram at food stuff. We

927
00:56:18,840 --> 00:56:21,480
Speaker 1: hope to hear from you. Thank you to our super

928
00:56:21,480 --> 00:56:24,880
Speaker 1: producer Dylan Fagan, who went with us on this entire

929
00:56:25,239 --> 00:56:28,640
Speaker 1: bourbon journey. It's clearly a trend setter. Yeah, although he

930
00:56:28,680 --> 00:56:33,080
Speaker 1: does not like bourbon himself, no, but it was it

931
00:56:33,200 --> 00:56:37,080
Speaker 1: was a delight to have someone around who could drive

932
00:56:37,200 --> 00:56:40,440
Speaker 1: you and who would give us his drink tokens. Also,

933
00:56:40,480 --> 00:56:42,560
Speaker 1: he's just generally a delight to have around. I don't

934
00:56:42,600 --> 00:56:45,240
Speaker 1: want to emphasize that point. Thank you to you for listening,

935
00:56:45,480 --> 00:56:47,479
Speaker 1: and we hope that lots more good things are coming

936
00:56:47,520 --> 00:56:53,359
Speaker 1: your way.