Speaker 1: Hi, listeners, welcome back. I'm Natur Glover Towab and you
Speaker 1: need to hear this. I wish sometimes that there was
Speaker 1: someone to tell me you are making the right decision,
Speaker 1: excellent choice. But often we have to figure things out
Speaker 1: the hard way. We have to either suffer the consequence
Speaker 1: or celebrate when we've made a good choice. And with relationships,
Speaker 1: it's hard to predict how we'll feel after we make
Speaker 1: difficult decisions. And when it comes to family relationships, oh
Speaker 1: my gosh. We have been told for years and years
Speaker 1: and years how to behave, how to function in our families,
Speaker 1: and so when we have to get to the point
Speaker 1: of making difficult decisions such as estrangement, it's like, is
Speaker 1: this the right decision? Am I doing the right thing?
Speaker 1: Thing needs to happen for me to end the relationship.
Speaker 1: That's always a really difficult thing to process. I think
Speaker 1: there are some things that can happen in a family
Speaker 1: relationship where society and you know, even ourselves will be
Speaker 1: more accepting that this relationship has to end. If there
Speaker 1: is some you know, significant violence, it's like okay, yes, well,
Speaker 1: clear cut, don't talk to that person anymore, right, Or
Speaker 1: if there is some you know, major thing that happens.
Speaker 1: But what if it's I just don't like the people
Speaker 1: in my family. We just don't have anything in common.
Speaker 1: We really don't have a relationship. Those things matter too, right,
Speaker 1: But many of us feel the pressure. We feel the
Speaker 1: need to stay in those situations, whether we feel uncomfortable anxious.
Speaker 1: It's like, stay in those situations because guess what, it's
Speaker 1: your family. Push your anxiety to the side. You should
Speaker 1: talk to these people. Maybe you don't have anything to
Speaker 1: talk about, you should listen to them, talk, just be
Speaker 1: in the relationship. There is no easy way to process
Speaker 1: these situations. So in today's call, we will talk about estrangement,
Speaker 1: and estrangement is never an easy option. I want you
Speaker 1: to keep that in the back of your head, for
Speaker 1: the people you know who are going through it, for
Speaker 1: the people who are considering it, and certainly for those
Speaker 1: who are already in it. It is never an easy option,
Speaker 1: and it's a well thought out one. You know, many
Speaker 1: times we think estrangement is abrupt, like this person called
Speaker 1: and you were like, no, never talking to them again.
Speaker 1: It takes lots of time. Many times you are reflecting
Speaker 1: you are taking years and months and really trying to
Speaker 1: be in a relationship. So when it gets to the
Speaker 1: point of uugh, I don't think I can do this anymore.
Speaker 1: It does typically come from years and years of trying,
Speaker 1: let's listen to today's call.
Speaker 2: So I'm having a hard time deciding if an estrangement
Speaker 2: for my family is best. I grew up in a
Speaker 2: household where we didn't communicate, and issues we had between
Speaker 2: each other were frequently pushed under the rug. And the
Speaker 2: last few years, my wife and I have used their
Speaker 2: techniques and we strive to communicate clearly and raise our
Speaker 2: future family to do the same. Unfortunately, my family history
Speaker 2: goes pretty far back, and I did not have the
Speaker 2: tools that I have now for communicating my boundaries and
Speaker 2: frustrations with my family. It essentially started eight years ago
Speaker 2: with my sister not accepting my wife, who was my
Speaker 2: girlfriend from college at the time. At first, it was
Speaker 2: just general coldness towards her, which could almost go unnoticed,
Speaker 2: but it eventually turned into my sister inviting me the
Speaker 2: things and asking me not to bring my girlfriend, or
Speaker 2: asking her to step out of any family pictures, and
Speaker 2: excluding her in every way possible from family events. She
Speaker 2: does not treat my brother this wife this way. But
Speaker 2: I think that's because my brother's wife was never seen
Speaker 2: as a threat to their family culture and she's known
Speaker 2: her since childhood. My wife and I live in a
Speaker 2: city area, whereas my family lives in a rural area,
Speaker 2: and my wife and I choose not to drink alcohol
Speaker 2: for health and religious reasons, whereas my family is almost
Speaker 2: always binge drinking and seems to feel uncomfortable with the
Speaker 2: fact that we don't drink.
Speaker 1: Drinking is like a mirror for some people. When you
Speaker 1: say I don't drink, They're like, what's wrong with my drinking?
Speaker 1: You've said nothing about their drinking, their lifestyle choices, but
Speaker 1: it certainly makes them think that you're saying something about them.
Speaker 1: This can be you know, with family, at work and
Speaker 1: social environments. I've seen it play out. If you turn
Speaker 1: down a drink, make it really uncomfortable about their drinking.
Speaker 1: So what do they do? They're like, Okay, you need
Speaker 1: to drink. Are you sick? What's going on? It's are
Speaker 1: you on medicine? It's it's almost like there has to
Speaker 1: be a significant reason that you're not drinking, and just saying,
Speaker 1: you know, I don't want to, I don't like the
Speaker 1: taste of alcohol or religiously, I don't mean, I've even
Speaker 1: heard people say, well, there was wine in the Bible,
Speaker 1: you know. So people come up with all sorts of
Speaker 1: reasons for you to do what they're doing because, guess what,
Speaker 1: it makes them more comfortable doing these things that you
Speaker 1: don't do anymore. And so they're saying, if you are
Speaker 1: just like me, we could just be really comfortable in
Speaker 1: this relationship. If you are different from me, we will
Speaker 1: be uncomfortable. And boy, won't they make it uncomfortable. They
Speaker 1: will make it uncomfortable. They will talk about it, they
Speaker 1: will bring it up. It will be a whole thing
Speaker 1: around drinking. So that is, you know, that is a
Speaker 1: common challenge in family relationships, particularly at gatherings. You know,
Speaker 1: even if you're the person hosting the gathering and you
Speaker 1: don't have alcohol there, you know, it's like, you don't
Speaker 1: have any alcohol here? Should we go to the store.
Speaker 1: It's like, no, I just want to lemonade and tea.
Speaker 1: You know, I don't drink and it wasn't on the menu.
Speaker 1: So it can be a really tough conversation, particularly in
Speaker 1: families where binge drinking is a thing they may see
Speaker 1: that you are noticing their behaviors that they're not ready
Speaker 1: to maybe change or accept or do anything about. And
Speaker 1: so if you're not doing those things, they see that
Speaker 1: as judgment. It's like, Oh, you're walking around judging me,
Speaker 1: and it's like, Ah, I'm actually judging myself. I don't
Speaker 1: want to do it. I'm thinking about myself and being
Speaker 1: very selfish in this decision. It really has nothing to
Speaker 1: do with you. Let's keep listening.
Speaker 2: Shortly before our wedding five years ago, I confronted my
Speaker 2: sister about the way she exclused my wife and treats
Speaker 2: us like we are invisible. She told me that she
Speaker 2: cannot accept my wife into the family because she didn't
Speaker 2: come to enough family events in the three years we
Speaker 2: dated before marriage, and she told me I wasn't acting
Speaker 2: like her brother anymore. I told my mother about this
Speaker 2: interaction to ask for help, and she told me to
Speaker 2: try harder, while she ignored her behavior and chose to
Speaker 2: continue supporting my sister's housing, schooling, and daily errands. Afterwards,
Speaker 2: my family continued to pretend to be one happy family,
Speaker 2: and my wife and I continued to attend the larger
Speaker 2: family events where we were casually avoiding my sister and
Speaker 2: not really talk to her. We were still cordial overall,
Speaker 2: and my wife has always been very kind to my sister.
Speaker 2: So I'm not quite sure what we did wrong in
Speaker 2: the first place, other than not attending enough family events.
Speaker 2: As my sister says, we moved two hours away after
Speaker 2: marriage for our career choice. My family tells us they
Speaker 2: never see us, but they refused to drive our way,
Speaker 2: and it's a lot of work for us to drive
Speaker 2: two hours to family events to be ignored by my
Speaker 2: sister and parents. Last year, my sister got married and
Speaker 2: her fiance called us drunk one month before the wedding
Speaker 2: can be to get a suit and be a groomsman.
Speaker 2: I told him no because it was last minute, and
Speaker 2: said that I would like to work on the relationship
Speaker 2: before committing to something like that. My sister's fiancee agreed
Speaker 2: that the relationship between my sister and I was poor
Speaker 2: and that he wanted it to be better. After her
Speaker 2: fiance is called, I texted my sister and offered to
Speaker 2: work on the relationship if she ever wanted to talk,
Speaker 2: but she never responded to my text. I felt pretty
Speaker 2: rejected and like I had my answer. Later, my mom
Speaker 2: called me and was upset I refused to be a groomsman.
Speaker 2: My mom said she doesn't like the way my sister
Speaker 2: and I don't talk and said that my wife must
Speaker 2: have just got off on the wrong foot and told
Speaker 2: me to try harder. I told my mom that I
Speaker 2: contacted my sister about working on the relationship and she
Speaker 2: ghosted me. But my mother still blames me for our
Speaker 2: strained relationship and has done more harm than help between
Speaker 2: my sister and I.
Speaker 1: Enough family events? Huh? You know how many? Was enough?
Speaker 1: Was there like some tally that you didn't know about,
Speaker 1: Like if this person comes to eight family events, they
Speaker 1: would be accepted into the family. Was it ten? Was
Speaker 1: it twelve? That's a pretty vague response for disliking someone.
Speaker 1: You know, I don't like them because they didn't come
Speaker 1: to enough family events. Hmm. I wonder if it's much
Speaker 1: harder to say, you know, I really don't have a reason.
Speaker 1: I just don't like this person. She reminds me of
Speaker 1: my third grade teacher. I don't know, you know, just anything.
Speaker 1: Sometimes we don't even have like this will thought out.
Speaker 1: I don't know what's happening. Maybe we feel like we
Speaker 1: have to come up with something that makes sense. But
Speaker 1: when we're just making stuff up, it always it doesn't
Speaker 1: make any sense because it's like made up. And maybe
Speaker 1: people feel like the truth of why you don't like
Speaker 1: someone is too hard. Maybe the truth of I had
Speaker 1: a different relationship with my brother before this person was
Speaker 1: in the picture is much harder to say than you know,
Speaker 1: she didn't come to enough events. Maybe you know, you
Speaker 1: think like if I say this thing, this will get
Speaker 1: them off my back. And it's like that thing is
Speaker 1: not what makes the most sense, and it truly can't
Speaker 1: speak to what this situation is. So there has to
Speaker 1: be something else going on here. I don't know what
Speaker 1: that something else is and you may never find out.
Speaker 1: But it's never okay to be mean to a stranger
Speaker 1: because you don't see them often enough, Like I don't
Speaker 1: I don't know about that one. But let's think about
Speaker 1: this situation of your mother telling you to be the
Speaker 1: bigger person. I heard that a few times, where your
Speaker 1: mom is like, be the bigger person, be the bigger person.
Speaker 1: And maybe you're taller, so you are being the bigger person.
Speaker 1: Or maybe there are other things that you can release,
Speaker 1: you can let go of. But when you decide to
Speaker 1: spend your life with a person and you have this
Speaker 1: family member who is going out of their way to
Speaker 1: be mean, not including people in pictures, not wanting them
Speaker 1: at events, ignoring them all of these things. That is
Speaker 1: pretty hard to be big around, right, because it's like
Speaker 1: it's me behavior and it's inappropriate. It's almost saying, hey,
Speaker 1: I'd like for you to end your relationship with this
Speaker 1: person for us to even have a relationship, And I
Speaker 1: wonder what the relationship will look like if they try
Speaker 1: to be nice to this person, if they included them, Like,
Speaker 1: there's another way to do this. This is not the
Speaker 1: only way to show up. And so if you're choosing
Speaker 1: to show up in that way, I don't know if
Speaker 1: it's on you to be the bigger person, you will
Speaker 1: be ignoring a lot. And it sounds like you have
Speaker 1: you've tried to, you know, maintain your distance at some
Speaker 1: of these events and play nice and show up and
Speaker 1: all of these great things, and none of it is working.
Speaker 1: So being the bigger person is not always a solution
Speaker 1: to chaos. We love to use that as a solution, like,
Speaker 1: you know what, if you're the bigger person, they'll stop
Speaker 1: hitting you. It's like, what, so if I just block
Speaker 1: myself for ten minutes, then they'll stop, Like when does
Speaker 1: this end? When does it stop being put on you
Speaker 1: to recover a situation that you're not even creating. There
Speaker 1: is some blame that's being displaced in this situation. In
Speaker 1: terms of the expectations for distance. You are talking to
Speaker 1: a person who left their home city and moved ten
Speaker 1: hours away. And I will say that for some family
Speaker 1: members that can be very challenging, and the expectations around
Speaker 1: living away can sometimes look like, well, you move, so
Speaker 1: you visit, right, It's like you moved away, so you're
Speaker 1: responsible for visiting. We don't have to come see you.
Speaker 1: That is an interesting way to think. And what typically
Speaker 1: happens is some resentment sets in and you're like, you
Speaker 1: know what, Well, if it's not important for you to
Speaker 1: see me, I don't care about seeing you anymore. But
Speaker 1: I'm hearing that you do care a little bit, right,
Speaker 1: like you would want in these relationships that people return
Speaker 1: to favor that if you drive two hours and sometimes
Speaker 1: they would drive two hours, sometimes they would want to
Speaker 1: be a little bit involved in your life too. The
Speaker 1: way that this typically happens is, you know what's happening
Speaker 1: with you where it's like, no, we refuse to visit you.
Speaker 1: And then there's this one person who's always doing the visiting.
Speaker 1: And for some people that's okay. They love going back home,
Speaker 1: they love seeing their family in this familiar environment. And
Speaker 1: for other people, it's like, I want to see you here,
Speaker 1: and it sounds like you've been very clear about that, like, hey,
Speaker 1: we'd like you to visit, and your family is letting
Speaker 1: you know we're not visiting. You chose to move away
Speaker 1: to that job far away, We don't need to visit you.
Speaker 1: If you want to see us, you come here with
Speaker 1: that information. You get to decide what you do with it.
Speaker 1: I don't know if there's a right or wrong there.
Speaker 1: You can take that information and say, hey, I'm not
Speaker 1: going back to visit them, or you could take that
Speaker 1: information and say, you know, I'll go for these big events,
Speaker 1: or you know, I'll go every other weekend. It's really
Speaker 1: your choice and how much you want to be connected
Speaker 1: to them. There is no right or wrong there. That's
Speaker 1: the challenging thing about making difficult decisions. We try to
Speaker 1: think of them as right or wrong decisions instead of difficult.
Speaker 1: It's like is this decision right or wrong? And it's like, no,
Speaker 1: it's just challenging. It's just a hard decision. I don't
Speaker 1: know if it's a law to be broken in this decision.
Speaker 1: I don't know if something will happen if you make
Speaker 1: this decision. It's just a really hard one. And it
Speaker 1: seems like you have chose for some time to continue
Speaker 1: to make that drive for two hours to visit your family.
Speaker 1: But I wonder what is it doing to the relationship
Speaker 1: When we're doing things and we feel like we're not
Speaker 1: being treated fairly and the love is not being reciprocated,
Speaker 1: that resentment comes up and it starts to look like, like,
Speaker 1: why am I seeing these people anyway? They don't even
Speaker 1: come to see me. Why am I going out of
Speaker 1: my way to operate in their space and they won't
Speaker 1: even operate in my space? You know, For me, it
Speaker 1: has looked like when I go back to Detroit, it's like, Hey,
Speaker 1: this is the space I'll be. If you want to
Speaker 1: come to this space to see me, you can. I'm
Speaker 1: not driving all over the city to see people. I've
Speaker 1: already come eight hundred miles. I'm not driving to more.
Speaker 1: I'm not driving one and a half more unless you're ninety.
Speaker 1: So that's my position. And then also I will visit
Speaker 1: as often as I feel the need to visit. Sometimes
Speaker 1: it has been multiple times a year, sometimes it has
Speaker 1: been no year, you know, So it really depends on
Speaker 1: what feels okay, what feels good. There is no right
Speaker 1: or wrong. There's certainly the opportunity for people to come
Speaker 1: and visit me, some people, not all. But it does
Speaker 1: feel good when the connection is reciprocal. I support your stuff,
Speaker 1: you support my stuff. I call you, you call me.
Speaker 1: I'm excited to see you, You're excited to see me,
Speaker 1: Like there is something relational in that. If I am
Speaker 1: doing all the stuff, if I come to all your
Speaker 1: birthday parties, all your thanksgivings and I can never have
Speaker 1: my own, or I can have these events and you
Speaker 1: won't be there, I'm starting to feel like am I
Speaker 1: the only one in this relationship. It's like, you know,
Speaker 1: I just need to put a little picture of you
Speaker 1: at the table, because that is the way I'll have
Speaker 1: to remember you in my life because you actually won't
Speaker 1: be here. It'll just be you in my mind. There
Speaker 1: will be this picture, but no person. I'm wondering if
Speaker 1: there is a need to have more one on one
Speaker 1: conversations about this or is it it's like a family
Speaker 1: collective conversation where you talk about Hey, you all, it's like, no, you, sister, you, mom,
Speaker 1: you cousin, you just one on one conversations around Hey,
Speaker 1: next weekend, would you like to come visit? Because sometimes
Speaker 1: people don't visit because they haven't had a direct in light.
Speaker 1: And then you have other people who will say like, oh,
Speaker 1: I'm going to come and see you, and you know,
Speaker 1: they may need a little push to say, hey, you
Speaker 1: said you would visit. It's been a mom So I
Speaker 1: wonder what the clarity around that has looked like. But
Speaker 1: we'll keep listening because maybe that's not even what you want.
Speaker 1: Maybe you just want to cut ties and I'm just
Speaker 1: talking about visitation, and you know, maybe it's not a thing,
Speaker 1: So let's keep listening.
Speaker 2: In the last year or two, my sister has been
Speaker 2: more cordial towards us, but never more than a conversation
Speaker 2: about the weather or something bland like that. I still
Speaker 2: talk with my brother and his wife on the phone,
Speaker 2: but we do not visit as frequently due to living
Speaker 2: far away. My parents and I talk, but it's also
Speaker 2: very limited conversations and not very deep overall. We see
Speaker 2: my family for the big holidays and weddings, but that's
Speaker 2: about it. During one holiday event, my mom told everyone
Speaker 2: the company I worked for, but it was the wrong
Speaker 2: company and I hadn't worked for them in two years.
Speaker 2: I use that as an example to say our overall
Speaker 2: connection is quite poor. We recently found out that both
Speaker 2: my sister and my brother's wife are pregnant and do
Speaker 2: three months apart. They all live within twenty minutes of
Speaker 2: each other, so I expect that they will all spend
Speaker 2: a lot of time together with their children. I know
Speaker 2: that no matter how hard I try, I will only
Speaker 2: be able to attend larger events for my new niece
Speaker 2: and nephew. My wife and I have not been able
Speaker 2: to have children yet, and we are struggling to decide
Speaker 2: our level of involvement with my family. We find ourselves
Speaker 2: very stressed every time we attend their events, sometimes because
Speaker 2: we are the only ones that don't drink, but also
Speaker 2: because my family spends a lot of time together without us,
Speaker 2: and we feel very awkward and disconnected.
Speaker 1: Are you interested and improving the connection without lumping everyone together?
Speaker 1: Which relationships do you want to be more involved in
Speaker 1: Maybe it's a relationship with your mom or this family
Speaker 1: member or that family member. I'm hearing the conversation being
Speaker 1: centered around the family as a whole instead of looking
Speaker 1: at everyone as an individual. Maybe you're not ready to
Speaker 1: sever tisee with your mom, but you might be ready
Speaker 1: to sever ties with your sister. I wonder how you
Speaker 1: can build those relationships out independently, even though they have
Speaker 1: relationships with these other people. I also wonder, as you're
Speaker 1: having these conversations with them, are you allowing them to
Speaker 1: remain surface level if you want them to be deeper?
Speaker 1: Are you asking questions? Are you saying, hey, I'm working
Speaker 1: at such and such, or are you just yeah, so the
Speaker 1: weather here there's sixty five. Are you going along with
Speaker 1: the surface level conversations or are you trying to go deeper? Now,
Speaker 1: sometimes people don't have the capacity for deep and maybe
Speaker 1: you do. I'm hearing a shift in what you're desiring
Speaker 1: in the relationship, and so if it's your desire, I
Speaker 1: wonder if you need to lead the charge. If you
Speaker 1: are the person who needs to take some of these
Speaker 1: relationships deeper, you get to decide, you know a little
Speaker 1: bit what these relationships look like. Now, if they're showing
Speaker 1: that they don't have the capacity for deeper, that's a
Speaker 1: different thing. But maybe they do. Maybe they do have
Speaker 1: some capacity to talk about things beyond the weather or
Speaker 1: beyond you know whatever. Sports teams. Oh my gosh, when
Speaker 1: people have surface level conversations and it involves sports, my
Speaker 1: eyes want to pop up my head. I'm not a
Speaker 1: big sports person, so it's like, okay, can we just
Speaker 1: talk about anything else? But you know, it's it's where
Speaker 1: people go, you know, it's like, oh, your team this
Speaker 1: or your team that are Oh the weather here. It's like, okay,
Speaker 1: we're we're not talking about anything, and I really want
Speaker 1: to talk about something. How do we do that? In
Speaker 1: other relationships? We just keep going, We just bring those
Speaker 1: things up. I can't think of friends that I've developed
Speaker 1: close relationships with where the conversation goes on about weather
Speaker 1: longer than twenty seconds or a sports team longer than
Speaker 1: twenty second. It's like girl is hot here, girl is
Speaker 1: cold here. Okay, so what happened at you know? So
Speaker 1: how do we go deeper with people and really build
Speaker 1: a relationship beyond this stuff? Because sometimes when we have
Speaker 1: differences they don't know what to talk about with us.
Speaker 1: But I have found that all people have something. I
Speaker 1: might not be able to talk to you about self
Speaker 1: help and psychology, but we can connect around gardening.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: I love to know what you're planning right now. I'd
Speaker 1: love to know how your zenias are growing. Have you
Speaker 1: had any butterflies in your garden? Okay, Well, if we
Speaker 1: can't talk about gardening, I'd love to talk to you
Speaker 1: about shoe and soles and which ones you have found
Speaker 1: to be the most comfortable. Well, if we can't talk
Speaker 1: about shoe and soles, I would love to talk and
Speaker 1: on and on and on. So there is something we
Speaker 1: can talk about, you know, even if it's a past story.
Speaker 1: Remember the time I put on my snowsuit and I
Speaker 1: forgot to put You know, whatever it is, it's something there,
Speaker 1: you know, and we have to go beyond what our
Speaker 1: present is. Yeah, and maybe it's making a declaration. I
Speaker 1: don't want this anymore. I don't even want to talk
Speaker 1: about the weather. It's cold, is high, it's rain and
Speaker 1: its cloudy. Got it. We have covered weather, maybe not
Speaker 1: today's weather, but we have got weather. What are you
Speaker 1: watching on TV? What do you think about that character Jack.
Speaker 1: You can shift those conversations to certainly make them a
Speaker 1: little bit deeper. If you start to do that and
Speaker 1: you feel like, oh my gosh, these folks don't have
Speaker 1: the capacity. They only want to talk about this thing.
Speaker 1: There is nothing there. Every time I try to talk
Speaker 1: about this, they bring it back to that, then you
Speaker 1: are free to make a decision from there. The other
Speaker 1: thing I suggest is creating individual relationships, not this collective
Speaker 1: family as a unit thing. Everybody is an individual. They
Speaker 1: have different stuff, So try, you know, really getting in
Speaker 1: on the one on one relationship. Lastly, I'm hearing a
Speaker 1: little bit of feeling left out. I feel left out
Speaker 1: and they have this relationship, this conversation, this connection that
Speaker 1: I'm not a part of. Even with the drinking, you know,
Speaker 1: like there is a sense of being left out, like
Speaker 1: I am, I'm not in the stuff with them, So
Speaker 1: it's like I'm sitting on the sidelines. It's kind of awkward.
Speaker 1: Everybody's you know, they're drinking. That makes it seem like
Speaker 1: they're having a lot of fun and I'm over here,
Speaker 1: or they're bringing up these things like yeah because last time,
Speaker 1: and it's like, oh, and I'm over here. This is
Speaker 1: something that happens, and we don't talk about it enough.
Speaker 1: When you start to make these changes in your life
Speaker 1: and you start to develop community and connection outside of
Speaker 1: your family, you go back to your family and you're like,
Speaker 1: are you my people? Are we still people? What can
Speaker 1: we talk about? I don't even like to talk about
Speaker 1: this stuff. And that's when we start to think about
Speaker 1: those relationships one on one, when we start to consider
Speaker 1: the value of them and maybe even nurture them in
Speaker 1: a different way. Let's keep listening.
Speaker 2: My mom stopped calling or texting us after she found
Speaker 2: out both of my siblings were pregnant, and I know
Speaker 2: she's busy, but it feels as though they have their
Speaker 2: happy family without us. If we want to maintain a
Speaker 2: relationship with them, we will have to do all the
Speaker 2: work and drive two hours to each event. I feel
Speaker 2: unsupported and concerned that when my wife and I have children,
Speaker 2: my family will not parciprocate our efforts with things like
Speaker 2: attending the shower or helping the baby after birth, etc. Etc.
Speaker 2: And we'll keep telling us that our house is too
Speaker 2: far for them to drive to. My wife and I
Speaker 2: feel as though we are essentially already emotionally estranged on
Speaker 2: some level, as we only see my family for big
Speaker 2: holidays and events, But we wonder if it's easier to
Speaker 2: cut ties completely as we haven't had any luck resolving
Speaker 2: things with my sister. My mom continues to support her
Speaker 2: behavior without even reaching out to us. My family has
Speaker 2: never abused or physically harmed me, so it's hard to
Speaker 2: think that we could be estranged over something as minor
Speaker 2: as my sister not wanting to include us in the family.
Speaker 2: So I guess my question is, how do you decide
Speaker 2: when it's time to be officially estranged from a family
Speaker 2: and if there's a good way to move forward with
Speaker 2: this relationship.
Speaker 1: Thanks The deciding fact for estrangement is typically when staying
Speaker 1: in the relationship is harder than the actual leaving of
Speaker 1: the relationship. I hear you minimizing your experience by saying
Speaker 1: you've never been abused or physically harmed, but you have
Speaker 1: been emotionally neglected. You haven't felt their presence, the relationships
Speaker 1: haven't been nurtured, and that is a really big deal.
Speaker 1: You're giving more weight to their being some physical scar
Speaker 1: and very little weight to the emotional scars that you're
Speaker 1: carrying with this relationship, you have already taken the first step.
Speaker 1: You are emotionally estranged from your family. There is no
Speaker 1: emotional connection there, and what you're doing is you're hanging
Speaker 1: on by a thread with the physical contact. It seems
Speaker 1: like you need to decide where you want to be
Speaker 1: in these relationships, and you can remain in limbo. You
Speaker 1: may not need to make a decision today, but you
Speaker 1: are in the deciding process of what these relationships can
Speaker 1: look like. It may not be complete detachment. I won't
Speaker 1: answer the phone if you call, but it might be
Speaker 1: allowing them to lead the charge a little bit more,
Speaker 1: allowing them to miss you. Having some hard conversations may
Speaker 1: help the situation. Does your mom even know that you've
Speaker 1: noticed that she's not calling? Have you said that, Mom,
Speaker 1: I haven't heard from you in a few weeks. Why
Speaker 1: haven't you called me? I'd love to hear from you
Speaker 1: more often. That can be really helpful to your mom,
Speaker 1: because perhaps she hasn't noticed the thing about your family
Speaker 1: not being present when you have children. It's not a
Speaker 1: thing yet, you know, and I know it sounds like
Speaker 1: it's very likely, but I wonder what it would look
Speaker 1: like if the relationships are improved. Maybe they will be.
Speaker 1: We don't know that part yet, so to have any
Speaker 1: feelings about that, it's kind of like, h we don't know,
Speaker 1: maybe you know, we don't know yet, But what we
Speaker 1: do know is the relationships are not where you want
Speaker 1: them to be today. There seems to still be a
Speaker 1: desire to have these relationships because you're talking about it.
Speaker 1: It's something you're thinking about. But what the relationships can
Speaker 1: look like might be different. It might be less of
Speaker 1: a relationship or it could be more. There is no
Speaker 1: right or wrong to this, because this is really a
Speaker 1: matter of the heart. This is something that involves your emotions.
Speaker 1: You know, you're feeling awkward, you're feeling nervous, you're getting anxious.
Speaker 1: Those are indicators of someone who might be on a
Speaker 1: cusp of any relationship with their family because it becomes
Speaker 1: so uncomfortable to be around them. That can be addressed
Speaker 1: by having some conversations if that's the road that you
Speaker 1: would like to take, or you can decide to not
Speaker 1: be in those relationships. It would involve you having more
Speaker 1: conversations with your wife and being really clear about why
Speaker 1: you're even keeping the relationships, Why am I in these relationships?
Speaker 1: Which of the matter. If I were to leave this relationship,
Speaker 1: what would change in my life? If I stayed in
Speaker 1: this relationship, how would my life look? Those are all
Speaker 1: important questions for you to answer with each relationship, not
Speaker 1: as a family collective, but each relationship. And you may
Speaker 1: find that with different people you have different answers. Allow
Speaker 1: yourself some space to really figure that out on an
Speaker 1: individual level. With your family members, you need to hear
Speaker 1: this estrangement sometimes happens with a big event, a big blowout,
Speaker 1: but most often it happens from little things adding up
Speaker 1: over time. You can get to a point where nothing
Speaker 1: has happened that's too big, but it's such an offense
Speaker 1: to the stuff that has already happened in the relationship.
Speaker 1: So if you are sitting with something, if you are
Speaker 1: sitting on something, stop letting it go and address it
Speaker 1: in your relationships. You need to hear this. This is
Speaker 1: an iHeart production hosted by me Nedra Glover to wob
Speaker 1: Our executive producer is Joel Bonique. Our senior producer and
Speaker 1: editor is Mia don Taylor. Send us a voice memo
Speaker 1: with your questions about boundaries and relationships at You need
Speaker 1: to hear this at iHeartMedia dot com. Please be sure
Speaker 1: to rate our show wherever you listen to it, and
Speaker 1: share this episode with someone who needs to hear this.
Speaker 1: Talk to you next time.