1 00:00:01,200 --> 00:00:01,359 Speaker 1: Man. 2 00:00:01,400 --> 00:00:04,400 Speaker 2: First of all, Man, we appreciate you coming on the show. 3 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:06,960 Speaker 2: You wanted the ones for us, you know, you wanted 4 00:00:06,960 --> 00:00:09,559 Speaker 2: the ones that uh I looked at. I don't know 5 00:00:09,560 --> 00:00:11,720 Speaker 2: about C because he wanted a guy like us, a 6 00:00:11,760 --> 00:00:14,560 Speaker 2: dunker like us. But one of the ones I looked 7 00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:16,400 Speaker 2: at and took a lot of stuff that I added 8 00:00:16,440 --> 00:00:19,360 Speaker 2: to my game from you. But we definitely appreciate you 9 00:00:19,400 --> 00:00:21,840 Speaker 2: coming on the show. Yeah, we appreciate it. 10 00:00:21,840 --> 00:00:23,479 Speaker 3: I appreciate being here. And I'll tell you, when I 11 00:00:23,480 --> 00:00:26,239 Speaker 3: first played against you, you didn't you didn't hold back, 12 00:00:26,280 --> 00:00:27,080 Speaker 3: you went right at me. 13 00:00:28,240 --> 00:00:32,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, it would come your rivals when you first got 14 00:00:32,600 --> 00:00:34,760 Speaker 2: to the league. Who was the first person to bust yours? 15 00:00:35,560 --> 00:00:38,440 Speaker 3: So look, I'm a fan of y'all show. So congrats 16 00:00:38,479 --> 00:00:40,559 Speaker 3: on what you guys have been doing. I think it's awesome. 17 00:00:40,880 --> 00:00:42,760 Speaker 3: I know that's the question you always leave with. And 18 00:00:42,800 --> 00:00:45,000 Speaker 3: I've been one of those guys that people have mentioned. 19 00:00:46,560 --> 00:00:49,360 Speaker 3: I couldn't really remember, like I honestly, like like I 20 00:00:49,440 --> 00:00:52,320 Speaker 3: literally because I came in the league and like my 21 00:00:52,440 --> 00:00:55,880 Speaker 3: first you know, I don't know, five six, ten games 22 00:00:55,880 --> 00:00:57,600 Speaker 3: whatever I was doing work. So I had to actually 23 00:00:57,680 --> 00:01:00,120 Speaker 3: go through a ter. I had to come back, go 24 00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:04,480 Speaker 3: back and look and you'd appreciate this. My second game, 25 00:01:04,920 --> 00:01:10,560 Speaker 3: dude from Chicago, Kenny Norman, and now I had like 26 00:01:10,600 --> 00:01:13,080 Speaker 3: twenty four against him, and I think we won the game, 27 00:01:13,120 --> 00:01:16,960 Speaker 3: but he had thirty on me and he didn't. I 28 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:19,880 Speaker 3: don't think I respected his shooting. He might have hit 29 00:01:19,880 --> 00:01:21,640 Speaker 3: a gang of threes on me. But that was when 30 00:01:22,080 --> 00:01:25,120 Speaker 3: I think I realized because Kenny Norman wasn't like a 31 00:01:25,240 --> 00:01:28,080 Speaker 3: starr in league's name, but like it just showed you 32 00:01:28,120 --> 00:01:31,880 Speaker 3: that anybody on any given night was capable of giving 33 00:01:31,920 --> 00:01:33,600 Speaker 3: it to you. So I gotta give a shout out 34 00:01:33,640 --> 00:01:34,800 Speaker 3: to snake Kenny Norman. 35 00:01:40,319 --> 00:01:41,040 Speaker 1: Yo, yo yo. 36 00:01:41,120 --> 00:01:45,160 Speaker 4: We live on location, live from Orlando, Florida, Me and 37 00:01:45,240 --> 00:01:48,600 Speaker 4: the Blackest one man. We got a neighbor, he lives here, right, 38 00:01:49,600 --> 00:01:51,640 Speaker 4: so we ain't have to do much to make this happen. 39 00:01:51,680 --> 00:01:53,600 Speaker 1: We got the Duke Legend. 40 00:01:53,160 --> 00:01:56,480 Speaker 4: The Hall of Fame with the NBA to oh, and 41 00:01:56,600 --> 00:02:00,400 Speaker 4: here a former player who owned a franchise. That's a hey, hey, 42 00:02:00,440 --> 00:02:02,240 Speaker 4: we ain't had one of them up in here yet. 43 00:02:03,160 --> 00:02:06,120 Speaker 4: Give it up for the big time Grand hill gee, 44 00:02:06,200 --> 00:02:07,720 Speaker 4: hill man, we appreciate. 45 00:02:07,280 --> 00:02:07,880 Speaker 1: You putting up. 46 00:02:08,520 --> 00:02:27,360 Speaker 2: Yes, I want to ask you, have you ever heard 47 00:02:27,360 --> 00:02:28,640 Speaker 2: of the Grand Hill drill? 48 00:02:29,680 --> 00:02:31,200 Speaker 1: Yes, I heard. 49 00:02:31,320 --> 00:02:34,160 Speaker 3: I heard it, but I was playing and so I'm 50 00:02:34,200 --> 00:02:41,639 Speaker 3: in Phoenix at the end of my career and Igor, yeah, he's. 51 00:02:41,520 --> 00:02:43,480 Speaker 1: Our assistant when we was in l A first one. 52 00:02:44,600 --> 00:02:46,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, so he's with us. He's an assistant that with 53 00:02:46,720 --> 00:02:51,600 Speaker 3: Alphre Phoenix and Goran Dragic. He's putting him through drills 54 00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:54,480 Speaker 3: and he says, okay, now through the Grand Hill move, 55 00:02:54,880 --> 00:02:57,480 Speaker 3: and I'm like, Grant Hill move, and so it's like, 56 00:02:57,600 --> 00:02:59,560 Speaker 3: I guess it was like through the legs and then 57 00:02:59,639 --> 00:03:03,440 Speaker 3: kind of you either crossover a goal. Yeah, And that's 58 00:03:03,440 --> 00:03:05,240 Speaker 3: the version I know, but I don't know if that's 59 00:03:05,280 --> 00:03:05,680 Speaker 3: what you have. 60 00:03:06,200 --> 00:03:08,760 Speaker 2: Like when I was in high school, my sophomore year, 61 00:03:08,760 --> 00:03:12,320 Speaker 2: I went to NBA camp and one of the coaches 62 00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:15,480 Speaker 2: was demonstrating and he was telling us like, this is. 63 00:03:15,440 --> 00:03:16,359 Speaker 1: The Grand Hills drill. 64 00:03:16,400 --> 00:03:19,040 Speaker 2: And the Grand Hill drill was you gotta take one 65 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:22,280 Speaker 2: or two dribbles from half court and dunked the ball. 66 00:03:22,560 --> 00:03:24,480 Speaker 2: So a lot of kids up there couldn't dunk the 67 00:03:24,520 --> 00:03:27,360 Speaker 2: ball in one or two dribbles, but he used me 68 00:03:27,400 --> 00:03:29,919 Speaker 2: as an example, and I can do it. So I 69 00:03:29,960 --> 00:03:33,760 Speaker 2: added it to my regiment when I fast break and 70 00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:36,080 Speaker 2: all that, I always count my dribbles and not take 71 00:03:36,200 --> 00:03:38,960 Speaker 2: unnecessary dribbles because the reason of the drill was not 72 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:42,120 Speaker 2: to take unnecessary dribbles. Then I used to watch you, 73 00:03:43,240 --> 00:03:45,520 Speaker 2: like when you used to play in transition. You never 74 00:03:45,600 --> 00:03:48,600 Speaker 2: took unnecessary dribbles when you was going. It never was 75 00:03:48,640 --> 00:03:51,240 Speaker 2: a dribble two more times to get there. It was 76 00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:54,360 Speaker 2: always a three dribbles, two dribbles, and he was at 77 00:03:54,360 --> 00:03:56,160 Speaker 2: the rear of dunk it. So I always used that, 78 00:03:56,200 --> 00:04:00,760 Speaker 2: And I wondered, did you ever hear that drill out say, 79 00:04:00,800 --> 00:04:02,000 Speaker 2: that's the Grand Hill drill? 80 00:04:02,440 --> 00:04:05,240 Speaker 3: No, I see, I had noted you did that. No, No, 81 00:04:05,280 --> 00:04:07,320 Speaker 3: I know I did. I mean I think so, look 82 00:04:07,360 --> 00:04:09,680 Speaker 3: when I came in the league and early on, you know, 83 00:04:09,760 --> 00:04:13,240 Speaker 3: going against Snake, going against you know, Cedric Ceballos, my 84 00:04:13,280 --> 00:04:16,440 Speaker 3: first guys at my position, you didn't have a lot 85 00:04:16,480 --> 00:04:19,719 Speaker 3: of guys that were accustomed to guarding somebody at the 86 00:04:19,800 --> 00:04:22,560 Speaker 3: three who could handle the ball. And certainly now you 87 00:04:22,600 --> 00:04:25,560 Speaker 3: look around everybody, you know, stuff I've done, stuff you've done. 88 00:04:25,680 --> 00:04:28,280 Speaker 3: All players who've come with tall, versatile can do a 89 00:04:28,360 --> 00:04:31,159 Speaker 3: number of things. So that kind of like, I think 90 00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:33,960 Speaker 3: the fact that I could handle the basketball, and I 91 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:35,920 Speaker 3: was athletic and you know all the other things. So 92 00:04:36,600 --> 00:04:40,120 Speaker 3: for me getting a defensive rebound and bringing it up, 93 00:04:40,279 --> 00:04:43,120 Speaker 3: pushing and pushing it. And I always felt like if 94 00:04:43,160 --> 00:04:45,839 Speaker 3: I bust out and I beat the fours and the fives, 95 00:04:45,960 --> 00:04:49,200 Speaker 3: now I'm playing three on three and now I got space. 96 00:04:49,680 --> 00:04:51,400 Speaker 3: I go back to when I was like eight nine 97 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:53,840 Speaker 3: years old, and you know, back then, you're big and 98 00:04:53,880 --> 00:04:56,800 Speaker 3: they put you inside and nobody you know what I'm saying, 99 00:04:56,839 --> 00:04:58,680 Speaker 3: And so I remember one time my dad was like, man, 100 00:04:58,720 --> 00:05:01,400 Speaker 3: get the rebound, bring it up, and I was like, 101 00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:03,520 Speaker 3: I can't do that. I'm a center. And he's like, 102 00:05:03,600 --> 00:05:05,240 Speaker 3: now you can do it, and so I you know, 103 00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:06,760 Speaker 3: I joked that I did it all the way to 104 00:05:06,839 --> 00:05:09,320 Speaker 3: the Hall of Fame. But to me, that was a way. 105 00:05:09,360 --> 00:05:13,080 Speaker 3: If I get a defensive rebound, it's a scoring opportunity. 106 00:05:13,320 --> 00:05:15,640 Speaker 3: And that was in pickup ball, that was at the gym, 107 00:05:15,920 --> 00:05:19,040 Speaker 3: that was in college, and that carried on into the NBA. 108 00:05:19,839 --> 00:05:23,520 Speaker 3: And so efficient with the dribble. You know, I had 109 00:05:23,520 --> 00:05:26,000 Speaker 3: a crossover. You know, growing up in DC, everybody tried 110 00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:30,200 Speaker 3: to cross over back then, but in transition, tall don't 111 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:33,839 Speaker 3: look at two thirty, I'm coming downhill at you. That 112 00:05:34,080 --> 00:05:36,480 Speaker 3: was my game and I don't think a lot of 113 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:39,040 Speaker 3: people really fully understood. And people see at the end 114 00:05:39,080 --> 00:05:42,039 Speaker 3: where it's a different role, but early on that's that's 115 00:05:42,080 --> 00:05:44,360 Speaker 3: what I did well, was handle the basketball and get 116 00:05:44,400 --> 00:05:46,120 Speaker 3: to spots on the floor I wanted to get to. 117 00:05:46,279 --> 00:05:48,159 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what I got from you. 118 00:05:48,240 --> 00:05:50,400 Speaker 2: After that, I went to that camp of me just 119 00:05:50,440 --> 00:05:54,320 Speaker 2: really watching your dribble off of defensive rebound. I can 120 00:05:54,320 --> 00:05:57,960 Speaker 2: scan the floor instantly, but I never after I got 121 00:05:58,000 --> 00:06:01,120 Speaker 2: to half court, I never wasted another dribble. It was 122 00:06:01,160 --> 00:06:03,560 Speaker 2: either two three dribbles. I never tried to go more 123 00:06:03,600 --> 00:06:05,440 Speaker 2: than two three dribbles because I tried to get there. 124 00:06:06,080 --> 00:06:08,360 Speaker 1: Because it made me get there quicker. You know what 125 00:06:08,400 --> 00:06:08,760 Speaker 1: I'm saying. 126 00:06:08,839 --> 00:06:10,520 Speaker 3: Yeah, no quiet and no look, man, if you're coming 127 00:06:10,560 --> 00:06:12,720 Speaker 3: downhill and you can take two dribbles, should. 128 00:06:12,480 --> 00:06:14,239 Speaker 1: And you're our size half court? 129 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:16,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, if you can get to the real kaboom, then 130 00:06:17,000 --> 00:06:19,960 Speaker 3: you should get to the real until the defense collapses, 131 00:06:20,120 --> 00:06:23,400 Speaker 3: if you can make a play. That was that was 132 00:06:23,440 --> 00:06:25,279 Speaker 3: what I did. I mean, you know, we weren't a 133 00:06:25,360 --> 00:06:29,200 Speaker 3: running team, but when opportunity presented itself in those Detroit years. 134 00:06:28,960 --> 00:06:29,840 Speaker 1: That's what I tried to do. 135 00:06:30,480 --> 00:06:35,279 Speaker 2: Your father was a former NFL player, How did basketball 136 00:06:35,520 --> 00:06:39,600 Speaker 2: come into play? When starting off the history is is football? 137 00:06:40,400 --> 00:06:43,000 Speaker 3: Good question? So you know, for me, I grew up, 138 00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:46,280 Speaker 3: it was all football. You know, I was told that 139 00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:48,720 Speaker 3: that was one of the first words what I'm saying, 140 00:06:48,720 --> 00:06:51,080 Speaker 3: which is kind of a difficult word for a baby, 141 00:06:51,120 --> 00:06:55,120 Speaker 3: but you know, as a kid, pictures of the house, 142 00:06:55,200 --> 00:06:58,800 Speaker 3: everything's you know, helmet, shoulder pads. I remember going to 143 00:06:59,520 --> 00:07:02,800 Speaker 3: Redskin Park, going to you know, Cleveland where he played 144 00:07:02,800 --> 00:07:05,400 Speaker 3: at the end of his career. And for my dad, 145 00:07:05,600 --> 00:07:07,360 Speaker 3: you know, he didn't play football till he was in 146 00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:10,240 Speaker 3: high school. So his first love was baseball. So he 147 00:07:10,280 --> 00:07:13,480 Speaker 3: always felt like you had to be older, a little 148 00:07:13,520 --> 00:07:17,480 Speaker 3: bit more physically mature to play. And he didn't want 149 00:07:17,520 --> 00:07:20,800 Speaker 3: some little league coach, you know, thinking they were you know, 150 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:22,320 Speaker 3: Vince Lombardi. 151 00:07:21,960 --> 00:07:24,160 Speaker 1: Or he played in the era or whatever it was 152 00:07:24,240 --> 00:07:24,880 Speaker 1: going down. 153 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:29,160 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, because of that, he didn't want, you know, 154 00:07:29,200 --> 00:07:31,040 Speaker 3: he wanted me to be a little bit more developed. 155 00:07:31,040 --> 00:07:33,960 Speaker 3: And so by the time I got to high school, 156 00:07:34,680 --> 00:07:36,800 Speaker 3: you know, I was in love with basketball. I mean, 157 00:07:36,840 --> 00:07:40,080 Speaker 3: that was my sport, that was I couldn't get enough 158 00:07:40,120 --> 00:07:42,040 Speaker 3: of it, and it kind of like maybe like nine 159 00:07:42,120 --> 00:07:44,840 Speaker 3: ten years old. That's when it started to flip for me. 160 00:07:45,760 --> 00:07:49,559 Speaker 2: You know, you see, you know, was it somebody local 161 00:07:49,640 --> 00:07:50,760 Speaker 2: or you seen somebody on TV. 162 00:07:50,840 --> 00:07:54,000 Speaker 3: That's a good question. Good question. So first of all, 163 00:07:54,400 --> 00:07:57,800 Speaker 3: as you guys know, it wasn't like it is now 164 00:07:58,040 --> 00:08:00,560 Speaker 3: where you just get everything you want. You know, every 165 00:08:00,600 --> 00:08:03,880 Speaker 3: college game, aba game, It's on your phone, on your 166 00:08:04,240 --> 00:08:08,080 Speaker 3: mobile device, smart TV whatever. Like back then, there was 167 00:08:08,120 --> 00:08:11,200 Speaker 3: like one game that came on on the weekend. And 168 00:08:11,240 --> 00:08:13,640 Speaker 3: then you know, I was in d C. So the Bullets, 169 00:08:13,720 --> 00:08:17,120 Speaker 3: but they weren't really great in the eighties. But for me, 170 00:08:17,240 --> 00:08:19,480 Speaker 3: it was it was a couple of things. It was Georgetown, 171 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:23,480 Speaker 3: you know, watching Georgetown pat Ewing, you know that team. 172 00:08:23,880 --> 00:08:26,080 Speaker 3: And then one of the guys that played at Georgetown 173 00:08:26,200 --> 00:08:29,240 Speaker 3: went to my high school, Michael Jackson. Michael was the 174 00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:32,280 Speaker 3: point guard on that team. So I remember watching Michael 175 00:08:32,320 --> 00:08:34,400 Speaker 3: in high school and I'm you know, I'm a little kid, I'm, 176 00:08:34,559 --> 00:08:37,400 Speaker 3: you know, nine ten years old, and it was around 177 00:08:37,480 --> 00:08:41,679 Speaker 3: that time where watching him watching those high school teams, 178 00:08:42,440 --> 00:08:46,280 Speaker 3: and then Georgetown called. We bought a Betamax in nineteen 179 00:08:46,320 --> 00:08:49,880 Speaker 3: eighty two and the first thing we recorded was the 180 00:08:49,920 --> 00:08:54,200 Speaker 3: Final four North Carolina Georgetown when Carolina and George did 181 00:08:54,240 --> 00:08:56,640 Speaker 3: that game when a shot and it was like almost 182 00:08:56,640 --> 00:08:58,839 Speaker 3: like that moment, it was like, man, that's what I 183 00:08:58,920 --> 00:09:02,640 Speaker 3: want to do. And then my parents got season tickets 184 00:09:02,640 --> 00:09:05,640 Speaker 3: for Georgetown games and so we became big Georgetown fans. 185 00:09:05,679 --> 00:09:07,200 Speaker 4: Time out of time out of time out of time 186 00:09:07,240 --> 00:09:09,360 Speaker 4: out of time out, How the hell did you go 187 00:09:09,440 --> 00:09:12,920 Speaker 4: to Duke and this town? Look they got big John, 188 00:09:13,040 --> 00:09:13,560 Speaker 4: How did. 189 00:09:13,440 --> 00:09:16,040 Speaker 1: You go to Duke? What in the world? 190 00:09:16,280 --> 00:09:19,680 Speaker 4: Like what I know, every Georgetown fan senor listening like 191 00:09:19,720 --> 00:09:20,840 Speaker 4: where did we go wrong? 192 00:09:21,040 --> 00:09:21,280 Speaker 1: You know? 193 00:09:21,520 --> 00:09:24,320 Speaker 3: You know what's funny is that even my senior year, 194 00:09:25,000 --> 00:09:27,160 Speaker 3: beginning my senior year, the whole senior I committed to 195 00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:30,160 Speaker 3: Duke early senior year high school, we still went to 196 00:09:30,160 --> 00:09:34,520 Speaker 3: Georgetown games. And so I think, I think a couple 197 00:09:34,600 --> 00:09:36,959 Speaker 3: of things. One and my mom just passed and so 198 00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:39,520 Speaker 3: God bless you know her and r Ip and all that. 199 00:09:39,600 --> 00:09:44,199 Speaker 3: But I needed some distance, like you know, yeah, I'm 200 00:09:44,200 --> 00:09:47,200 Speaker 3: an only child of two only children, and I felt like, man, 201 00:09:47,240 --> 00:09:49,480 Speaker 3: my mom and my dad would be you know, in 202 00:09:49,559 --> 00:09:52,760 Speaker 3: my dorm every day, and so I needed, you know, distance. 203 00:09:52,840 --> 00:09:57,000 Speaker 3: And so obviously Duke coach k was a Chicago guy. 204 00:09:57,400 --> 00:10:00,760 Speaker 3: He was up and coming, and and you know I 205 00:10:00,840 --> 00:10:04,000 Speaker 3: was because I watched that first game of Georgetown Carolina. 206 00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:06,280 Speaker 3: I became a Carolina Georgetown fan. So those were the 207 00:10:06,280 --> 00:10:09,960 Speaker 3: two teams I followed. But coach k kind of came 208 00:10:10,000 --> 00:10:13,280 Speaker 3: in there, and you know, and just I believed him 209 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:14,760 Speaker 3: like one of the things that makes him great and 210 00:10:14,800 --> 00:10:17,400 Speaker 3: we can get into it later, but his ability to 211 00:10:17,440 --> 00:10:20,200 Speaker 3: connect with people and his ability to get you to 212 00:10:20,280 --> 00:10:23,200 Speaker 3: buy in, and so much of coaching is buying in 213 00:10:23,920 --> 00:10:26,400 Speaker 3: and so but I couldn't, you know, I felt like, man, 214 00:10:26,440 --> 00:10:28,839 Speaker 3: my parents, my boy, everybody, just you know, it'd be 215 00:10:29,280 --> 00:10:31,640 Speaker 3: I needed some space and I needed a chance to 216 00:10:31,679 --> 00:10:32,679 Speaker 3: grow up a little bit too. 217 00:10:32,880 --> 00:10:35,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, when was the year that you when you were 218 00:10:35,600 --> 00:10:37,600 Speaker 2: in high school, when was the year that you felt 219 00:10:37,600 --> 00:10:40,640 Speaker 2: that you was turning a corner of No, I'm not 220 00:10:40,760 --> 00:10:43,199 Speaker 2: just the best player at my school. I'm one of 221 00:10:43,240 --> 00:10:45,080 Speaker 2: the best players in the state and I'm one of 222 00:10:45,080 --> 00:10:46,360 Speaker 2: the best players in the country. 223 00:10:47,960 --> 00:10:51,600 Speaker 3: So it kind of happened before high school. So I'm 224 00:10:51,640 --> 00:10:54,000 Speaker 3: young form my grade. So I graduated high school in 225 00:10:54,040 --> 00:10:57,640 Speaker 3: ninety but I could have been ninety one and so 226 00:10:57,720 --> 00:11:01,800 Speaker 3: thirteen and under AAU championship, we were in Saint Louis 227 00:11:02,640 --> 00:11:05,240 Speaker 3: and uh, lou it's right. We would say, yeah, we 228 00:11:05,160 --> 00:11:08,280 Speaker 3: were at Washington University. Yeah, Washed you we were there 229 00:11:08,480 --> 00:11:13,720 Speaker 3: and Chris Webber, Jaylen Rose, they were there with what 230 00:11:13,720 --> 00:11:18,120 Speaker 3: do they call the super Friends, Alan Henderson with misicipal 231 00:11:18,200 --> 00:11:20,199 Speaker 3: guardens like they had a lot of So they all 232 00:11:20,240 --> 00:11:22,600 Speaker 3: were rising eighth graders. I was a rise in ninth grader. 233 00:11:23,400 --> 00:11:26,280 Speaker 3: So we ended up winning the whole thing, and I 234 00:11:26,320 --> 00:11:29,520 Speaker 3: remember afterwards the guy on my team, Jamie Warren, got 235 00:11:29,520 --> 00:11:32,920 Speaker 3: the MVP and uh, his dad was the coach, and 236 00:11:32,960 --> 00:11:34,920 Speaker 3: he hit the game winning layup, so he you know, 237 00:11:35,480 --> 00:11:36,960 Speaker 3: but I was I was kind of like hurt, like 238 00:11:37,000 --> 00:11:39,480 Speaker 3: I was like I should have been the MVP. So 239 00:11:39,559 --> 00:11:42,040 Speaker 3: that was I remember my dad was trying to like, 240 00:11:42,120 --> 00:11:44,480 Speaker 3: you know, you know, just you know, like we won, 241 00:11:44,559 --> 00:11:46,600 Speaker 3: but he also see them a little you know, feel 242 00:11:46,640 --> 00:11:49,120 Speaker 3: a certain way, and so I said, i'mnna come back 243 00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:50,199 Speaker 3: next year. I'm gonna be the MVP. 244 00:11:50,880 --> 00:11:51,360 Speaker 1: And uh. 245 00:11:51,440 --> 00:11:55,360 Speaker 3: And so I think having that confidence going against the 246 00:11:55,400 --> 00:11:57,880 Speaker 3: best in my age and now went to high school 247 00:11:58,280 --> 00:12:01,520 Speaker 3: playing varsity. Now the differentence was all those guys were 248 00:12:01,520 --> 00:12:05,120 Speaker 3: playing eighth grade ball, you know, that following year, I'm 249 00:12:05,120 --> 00:12:08,080 Speaker 3: playing high school playing varsity. So I came back the 250 00:12:08,120 --> 00:12:11,520 Speaker 3: next year fourteen and under, and I like we were 251 00:12:11,559 --> 00:12:14,720 Speaker 3: in Seattle. I dominated and got the MVP and we lost. 252 00:12:15,280 --> 00:12:18,000 Speaker 3: We lost in the finals. And so but that was 253 00:12:18,040 --> 00:12:21,280 Speaker 3: like that period where I knew, okay, like with my peers, 254 00:12:21,640 --> 00:12:23,720 Speaker 3: like this is this is real, this is you start 255 00:12:23,720 --> 00:12:27,160 Speaker 3: getting recruited all of that. But but going into high 256 00:12:27,200 --> 00:12:30,079 Speaker 3: school having that momentum, it's different now because you got AAU. 257 00:12:30,320 --> 00:12:32,120 Speaker 3: Kids play a lot younger, but back then it was 258 00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:36,000 Speaker 3: one tournament. You had people from different regions you met 259 00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:37,920 Speaker 3: at the nationals and we won. 260 00:12:38,320 --> 00:12:40,600 Speaker 4: How did that feel for you to be, like you say, 261 00:12:40,640 --> 00:12:43,440 Speaker 4: you pop's an NFL player, Like for you to be 262 00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:46,120 Speaker 4: kind of like forging your own way and like starting 263 00:12:46,120 --> 00:12:47,920 Speaker 4: to be noticed, like you know, you started saying you 264 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:50,240 Speaker 4: getting recruited and things like that. How did that feel 265 00:12:50,280 --> 00:12:52,920 Speaker 4: for you as somebody who growing up with a professional 266 00:12:52,960 --> 00:12:54,040 Speaker 4: athlete dad. 267 00:12:55,040 --> 00:12:58,080 Speaker 3: I think there's pressure. Your children might might have felt it. 268 00:12:58,480 --> 00:13:00,360 Speaker 3: You know, it might have been more pressure for me 269 00:13:00,480 --> 00:13:03,360 Speaker 3: if I played the same sport. But you know, my 270 00:13:03,480 --> 00:13:07,520 Speaker 3: dad obviously his career. My mom was you know, an 271 00:13:07,520 --> 00:13:10,439 Speaker 3: accomplished business woman, and so you know, you go through 272 00:13:10,480 --> 00:13:13,200 Speaker 3: those weird middle school years. We're trying to figure things out, 273 00:13:13,520 --> 00:13:17,400 Speaker 3: and and you know, look, I didn't have great confidence. 274 00:13:17,480 --> 00:13:20,240 Speaker 3: I stuttered, like I just you know, and I think 275 00:13:20,559 --> 00:13:22,559 Speaker 3: for me, I'm trying to find my way a little bit. 276 00:13:22,600 --> 00:13:25,760 Speaker 3: At that time, basketball was my thing. 277 00:13:25,760 --> 00:13:27,040 Speaker 1: And it was a thing. 278 00:13:27,160 --> 00:13:28,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, and here's the thing, Like, here's the thing. I 279 00:13:28,679 --> 00:13:32,079 Speaker 3: realized that as a parent now too, no matter how 280 00:13:32,160 --> 00:13:35,520 Speaker 3: much money, no matter how many connections and how many 281 00:13:35,720 --> 00:13:39,520 Speaker 3: resources we have, you can't teach hunger and you can't 282 00:13:39,600 --> 00:13:42,320 Speaker 3: make it for your children. Particularly in sports, it's the 283 00:13:42,440 --> 00:13:45,120 Speaker 3: ultimate meritocracy. You know, we go man on my like 284 00:13:45,880 --> 00:13:47,400 Speaker 3: either you're gonna win or I'm gonna win, you know 285 00:13:47,440 --> 00:13:49,959 Speaker 3: what I'm saying. In other industries, other walks of life, 286 00:13:50,000 --> 00:13:53,880 Speaker 3: sometimes connections can open doors, but in sports it's the 287 00:13:54,000 --> 00:13:57,520 Speaker 3: ultimate like if you're better, you better, you better, like 288 00:13:57,559 --> 00:13:59,600 Speaker 3: that's it. If the team's better, then that's it. You 289 00:13:59,640 --> 00:14:02,160 Speaker 3: shake it and then you move on. And so so 290 00:14:02,280 --> 00:14:05,560 Speaker 3: for me to like prove myself that I'm doing this 291 00:14:05,840 --> 00:14:08,839 Speaker 3: independent of them, I think that was important at that period. 292 00:14:08,559 --> 00:14:09,280 Speaker 1: Of time of my life. 293 00:14:09,480 --> 00:14:11,760 Speaker 2: How was it, you know, we are we come up 294 00:14:11,840 --> 00:14:13,960 Speaker 2: the era with some old man. It was the era 295 00:14:14,480 --> 00:14:16,560 Speaker 2: But how was that to see your name in like 296 00:14:16,600 --> 00:14:19,160 Speaker 2: the Streets and Smith and like see your name and 297 00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:22,000 Speaker 2: all them high rankings and seeing them other names that 298 00:14:22,080 --> 00:14:24,680 Speaker 2: you see up there, and you know, you coming from 299 00:14:24,720 --> 00:14:27,640 Speaker 2: western Virginia to see your name up there with the 300 00:14:27,680 --> 00:14:29,240 Speaker 2: rest of them, Like, how is that for you? 301 00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:31,080 Speaker 3: So you said Street Smith's you are old. 302 00:14:31,760 --> 00:14:34,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, that is so. 303 00:14:34,560 --> 00:14:39,200 Speaker 3: Like I would start like as a fan, you're starving 304 00:14:39,360 --> 00:14:44,080 Speaker 3: for anything basketball, anything in the magazine, anything in black 305 00:14:44,120 --> 00:14:49,360 Speaker 3: and white, remember the All American teams, and they had 306 00:14:49,400 --> 00:14:53,320 Speaker 3: the photo spreading there. And then they'd have those preseason 307 00:14:53,640 --> 00:14:57,000 Speaker 3: publications and you'd read about the I'd read the stories 308 00:14:57,000 --> 00:14:59,800 Speaker 3: of like, Okay, this guy. I remember reading about Damon 309 00:14:59,840 --> 00:15:02,400 Speaker 3: Bay who was in my class, and it was like 310 00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:10,640 Speaker 3: he was like an urban legend. N remember like reading 311 00:15:10,680 --> 00:15:13,480 Speaker 3: about Kenny before I played against him, and so and 312 00:15:13,520 --> 00:15:16,600 Speaker 3: then for me there was Michael Jackson who was older. 313 00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:19,360 Speaker 3: But then Dennis Scott. So Dennis was in my hometown. 314 00:15:19,680 --> 00:15:22,480 Speaker 3: And so Dennis was from wrestling, well he grew up 315 00:15:22,520 --> 00:15:25,080 Speaker 3: in Maryland but moved over to wrestling. And so Dennis 316 00:15:25,160 --> 00:15:27,760 Speaker 3: was high school player the year with Marcus Liberty. They 317 00:15:27,800 --> 00:15:31,440 Speaker 3: were the top two guys and so Marcus Liberty, Marcus 318 00:15:31,480 --> 00:15:36,040 Speaker 3: Living and Marcus Liberty was he was cold, and so 319 00:15:36,160 --> 00:15:39,320 Speaker 3: watching Dennis go through it and then just like being 320 00:15:39,360 --> 00:15:41,440 Speaker 3: such a fan and then all of a sudden like man, 321 00:15:41,480 --> 00:15:44,560 Speaker 3: I'm here, you know, I'm in it, I'm parade All 322 00:15:44,600 --> 00:15:48,600 Speaker 3: American and you know, five star Nike Camp, like going 323 00:15:48,680 --> 00:15:50,840 Speaker 3: that whole that whole path. 324 00:15:51,040 --> 00:15:51,400 Speaker 1: It was. 325 00:15:52,800 --> 00:15:55,120 Speaker 3: I wasn't even thinking about the NBA, man Like, it 326 00:15:55,200 --> 00:15:57,840 Speaker 3: just seems so far fetched at that time. It was like, man, 327 00:15:57,880 --> 00:16:00,000 Speaker 3: I just want to make the McDonald's and getting them 328 00:16:00,040 --> 00:16:00,720 Speaker 3: McDonald's game. 329 00:16:02,960 --> 00:16:04,800 Speaker 1: How was it for you when you found out? 330 00:16:04,840 --> 00:16:07,360 Speaker 4: Like, because I know, like our generation that was like now, 331 00:16:07,400 --> 00:16:10,440 Speaker 4: it's so many different things that could still be you know, 332 00:16:10,600 --> 00:16:13,440 Speaker 4: then then raised they level, but back then the McDonald's 333 00:16:13,480 --> 00:16:17,920 Speaker 4: was the top tier. K McDonald's, you youn stamped, you 334 00:16:18,040 --> 00:16:19,160 Speaker 4: just damp of approval. 335 00:16:19,200 --> 00:16:21,040 Speaker 1: So how did that feel when you got that? 336 00:16:21,080 --> 00:16:23,760 Speaker 4: Because I know, like me, you watched the years before 337 00:16:23,840 --> 00:16:26,040 Speaker 4: when they announced the teams on TV and you get 338 00:16:26,080 --> 00:16:27,480 Speaker 4: to see it, Like, how was that for you when 339 00:16:27,520 --> 00:16:29,040 Speaker 4: you was in your moman getting your shot? 340 00:16:29,400 --> 00:16:29,920 Speaker 1: It was great. 341 00:16:30,320 --> 00:16:33,960 Speaker 3: I The crazy thing is I played in the West 342 00:16:34,120 --> 00:16:36,720 Speaker 3: because there were so many players and ah yeah, and 343 00:16:36,760 --> 00:16:38,840 Speaker 3: so they had and I was point guard, Like I 344 00:16:38,880 --> 00:16:40,840 Speaker 3: played point my senior year in high school. 345 00:16:41,000 --> 00:16:43,480 Speaker 1: And actually you were six seven. 346 00:16:43,800 --> 00:16:47,280 Speaker 3: I was six seven, six eight and center of the point, 347 00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:50,360 Speaker 3: so I can handle the ball. Dean Smith actually recruited 348 00:16:50,360 --> 00:16:52,440 Speaker 3: me as a point guard and he thought I could 349 00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:53,240 Speaker 3: be a point guard. 350 00:16:53,720 --> 00:16:54,520 Speaker 1: But no, it was crazy. 351 00:16:54,560 --> 00:16:58,360 Speaker 3: It was in Indianapolis at the old Marcus Square Arena. Obviously, 352 00:16:58,400 --> 00:17:00,000 Speaker 3: as you come up, you know these guys you play 353 00:17:00,120 --> 00:17:02,320 Speaker 3: against these guys, you know, I mean some guys I 354 00:17:02,360 --> 00:17:05,159 Speaker 3: didn't know at that point in my life. It was 355 00:17:05,200 --> 00:17:08,560 Speaker 3: the most incredible week of my life. 356 00:17:08,720 --> 00:17:13,080 Speaker 2: Outside of Georgetown. Was in anybody else? That almost got you. 357 00:17:13,800 --> 00:17:20,080 Speaker 3: So my five schools Duke, Georgetown, Carolina, Virginia, and Michigan. 358 00:17:20,680 --> 00:17:22,680 Speaker 3: Those were and I was a big Sean Higgins fan 359 00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:26,080 Speaker 3: and another tall guy that could play on the perimeter. 360 00:17:26,800 --> 00:17:29,240 Speaker 3: Matter of fact, when they won in eighty nine, I 361 00:17:29,320 --> 00:17:32,320 Speaker 3: went up there for an unofficial visit the next next 362 00:17:32,400 --> 00:17:37,359 Speaker 3: weekend and I met I met Ramel Robinson, I met 363 00:17:37,440 --> 00:17:41,280 Speaker 3: Mark Hughes. It was got Demetrius Caleb who was on 364 00:17:41,320 --> 00:17:43,760 Speaker 3: that team. So I was a big, big Michigan fan. 365 00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:46,240 Speaker 3: I probably wouldn't have played because the fan five would 366 00:17:46,280 --> 00:17:49,359 Speaker 3: have come in the next year eventually, but I was 367 00:17:49,400 --> 00:17:52,160 Speaker 3: a Michigan fan. But it was Due Carolina. It came 368 00:17:52,200 --> 00:17:54,520 Speaker 3: out of Duke Carolina, and you know, and I think 369 00:17:54,560 --> 00:17:56,199 Speaker 3: part of it too. Back then, it was like that 370 00:17:56,320 --> 00:17:59,440 Speaker 3: was what you saw, you know, in Virginia, DC area. 371 00:17:59,480 --> 00:18:02,760 Speaker 3: You saw big geese and you saw a CC. We 372 00:18:02,800 --> 00:18:05,639 Speaker 3: didn't see a whole lot of big ten basketball in 373 00:18:05,680 --> 00:18:06,040 Speaker 3: that area. 374 00:18:06,119 --> 00:18:08,119 Speaker 1: Now it was all on ESPN. They was all that 375 00:18:08,200 --> 00:18:09,480 Speaker 1: big East Providence. 376 00:18:10,280 --> 00:18:13,960 Speaker 4: Everybody, did you do like a press conference that you 377 00:18:14,080 --> 00:18:14,720 Speaker 4: just announced? 378 00:18:14,880 --> 00:18:15,120 Speaker 1: Nah? 379 00:18:15,160 --> 00:18:17,320 Speaker 3: I just announced it. Yeah, we didn't. There was no 380 00:18:17,359 --> 00:18:18,080 Speaker 3: press conference. 381 00:18:18,400 --> 00:18:20,840 Speaker 4: So you just broke people's the whole u n C 382 00:18:21,040 --> 00:18:22,639 Speaker 4: hard over there, that whole split. 383 00:18:22,760 --> 00:18:25,440 Speaker 3: So let me tell you what happened. So I went 384 00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:29,440 Speaker 3: to Duke my first visit was Due and at that point, 385 00:18:29,800 --> 00:18:32,399 Speaker 3: I'm still thinking Carolina because you got to understand, like 386 00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:36,080 Speaker 3: growing up everything was North Carolina. Every I had all 387 00:18:36,119 --> 00:18:41,119 Speaker 3: the slag and everything Carolina, you know, colored shoes. So 388 00:18:41,160 --> 00:18:43,760 Speaker 3: I go to Duke. We even go over to Chapel 389 00:18:43,840 --> 00:18:46,560 Speaker 3: Hill on one of the nights to a party on 390 00:18:46,600 --> 00:18:49,879 Speaker 3: my visit to do and because the schools are just 391 00:18:50,040 --> 00:18:54,359 Speaker 3: seven so they're so close and even there was a 392 00:18:54,400 --> 00:18:56,240 Speaker 3: young lady who went to high school with me who 393 00:18:56,280 --> 00:18:58,320 Speaker 3: was a little bit older. She's passed away, but she 394 00:18:58,720 --> 00:19:00,359 Speaker 3: I reached out to her while I was down there. 395 00:19:00,359 --> 00:19:02,040 Speaker 3: She's like, you're not going to Douke car I was like, nah, 396 00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:04,720 Speaker 3: I'm just here on a visit and she said, all 397 00:19:04,840 --> 00:19:06,800 Speaker 3: you got to come to Carolina. So like that's where 398 00:19:06,840 --> 00:19:10,000 Speaker 3: my head was at. But there was something about the visit. 399 00:19:10,440 --> 00:19:13,119 Speaker 3: There was something about coach k there was something about 400 00:19:13,160 --> 00:19:16,160 Speaker 3: the team, like I just bought in. And so when 401 00:19:16,200 --> 00:19:18,199 Speaker 3: I came back, I was like I told my parents, 402 00:19:18,240 --> 00:19:20,480 Speaker 3: like I'm ready to go to Duke, and they're like, 403 00:19:21,160 --> 00:19:24,320 Speaker 3: visit the other schools. Dean Smith's coming in on Tuesday, 404 00:19:24,960 --> 00:19:27,520 Speaker 3: you know. So Dean Smith came to the house with 405 00:19:27,560 --> 00:19:30,800 Speaker 3: Phil Ford and it was a great visit, sitting in 406 00:19:30,800 --> 00:19:33,399 Speaker 3: the kitchen, he and my dad going back and forth talking. 407 00:19:33,480 --> 00:19:37,480 Speaker 3: My dad's like, you know, idolizing Dean Smith. And the 408 00:19:37,520 --> 00:19:39,280 Speaker 3: next day I was like, this is where I want 409 00:19:39,320 --> 00:19:41,760 Speaker 3: to go now, my dad. So the following weekend, we're 410 00:19:41,760 --> 00:19:46,119 Speaker 3: supposed to go to Michigan and Bo Shimpbeckler, who was 411 00:19:46,160 --> 00:19:48,520 Speaker 3: then the ad former coach. He was going to sit 412 00:19:48,560 --> 00:19:51,280 Speaker 3: with my dad watching the football game Michigan know the 413 00:19:51,400 --> 00:19:54,320 Speaker 3: Dame and it was the great game where Rocket is 414 00:19:54,359 --> 00:19:58,600 Speaker 3: smile had like two or three touchdowns. And so he 415 00:19:58,600 --> 00:20:00,440 Speaker 3: he didn't speak to me for like a week because 416 00:20:00,440 --> 00:20:03,080 Speaker 3: he was like, man, man, you gotta come on, man, 417 00:20:03,119 --> 00:20:05,440 Speaker 3: go to these visits. But I just knew, like this 418 00:20:05,520 --> 00:20:08,159 Speaker 3: is where I wanted to be. And so anyway, but 419 00:20:08,200 --> 00:20:12,560 Speaker 3: that was it was Duke Carolina. But coach K, you know, 420 00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:14,080 Speaker 3: he he got me. 421 00:20:14,160 --> 00:20:15,320 Speaker 1: He got you, he got me. 422 00:20:15,640 --> 00:20:19,360 Speaker 2: You got the coach K come from a military background. 423 00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:23,439 Speaker 2: He loved hard, he worked hard. You the start of 424 00:20:23,720 --> 00:20:25,960 Speaker 2: this Duke era. You part of the start of the 425 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:28,439 Speaker 2: team with the Duke Carol. You got Bobby Hurley and 426 00:20:28,920 --> 00:20:31,560 Speaker 2: you have the squad, and you know, nobody picked you 427 00:20:31,560 --> 00:20:34,560 Speaker 2: out to win, nobody picked out to really go deep 428 00:20:34,640 --> 00:20:37,159 Speaker 2: because you had all these teams like UNLV. How was 429 00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:40,560 Speaker 2: that to start the era of Duke with that team 430 00:20:40,600 --> 00:20:41,200 Speaker 2: that first year? 431 00:20:42,280 --> 00:20:46,560 Speaker 3: So the year before I arrived my high school senior year, 432 00:20:47,080 --> 00:20:52,040 Speaker 3: Duke loses to UNLV in the finals nineteen ninety championship game, embarrassed, 433 00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:56,480 Speaker 3: slow out here, blowout and they returned everybody from that team, 434 00:20:56,560 --> 00:21:00,280 Speaker 3: Stacey Allum and Larry Johnson Greg Anthony Anderson Hunt the 435 00:21:00,359 --> 00:21:05,160 Speaker 3: whole team preseason number one. First day we meet as 436 00:21:05,160 --> 00:21:07,560 Speaker 3: a team at Duke, Coach k puts on the board 437 00:21:07,680 --> 00:21:13,040 Speaker 3: nineteen ninety one NCAA National champions And I'm sitting there like, man, 438 00:21:13,080 --> 00:21:16,560 Speaker 3: is he crazy? Like I'm looking around watched the year, 439 00:21:17,040 --> 00:21:19,040 Speaker 3: looking around the room. I'm like, because we lose three 440 00:21:19,080 --> 00:21:23,160 Speaker 3: starters who are seniors, Robert Brickey, Ala Abd Nabi, Phil Henderson, 441 00:21:23,560 --> 00:21:26,480 Speaker 3: you got Latoner, it's going to be a junior. He's 442 00:21:26,520 --> 00:21:29,040 Speaker 3: a good player. You know he's gonna take a step forward. 443 00:21:29,520 --> 00:21:32,119 Speaker 3: Hurley had an up and down freshman year, and you 444 00:21:32,200 --> 00:21:34,959 Speaker 3: got a bunch of role players and five freshmen. I'm thinking, like, 445 00:21:35,920 --> 00:21:37,359 Speaker 3: I can help this team, but I don't know if 446 00:21:37,359 --> 00:21:42,400 Speaker 3: we can beat that team. But his leadership in establishing 447 00:21:42,800 --> 00:21:46,040 Speaker 3: that goal from day one, like every year I was there, 448 00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:51,480 Speaker 3: it was only about winning championships. So planning that seed 449 00:21:51,600 --> 00:21:55,000 Speaker 3: and everything we did that first year was preparing us 450 00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:57,800 Speaker 3: for that moment. And so if we had two games 451 00:21:57,800 --> 00:22:01,359 Speaker 3: in three days, if we played Carolina on a on 452 00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:04,359 Speaker 3: a Tuesday night and in Carolina State Northklina State on 453 00:22:04,400 --> 00:22:07,399 Speaker 3: a Thursday, he would break it down like this is 454 00:22:07,440 --> 00:22:10,720 Speaker 3: what we're gonna see in a tournament. Play on Saturday, 455 00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:14,280 Speaker 3: then you got to bounce back emotionally and recover and 456 00:22:14,320 --> 00:22:18,800 Speaker 3: recharge and play Monday. So everything was geared towards towards winning. 457 00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:22,320 Speaker 3: And then just as the season kind of got went along, 458 00:22:22,359 --> 00:22:24,400 Speaker 3: we had we went through a bunch of stuff that year, 459 00:22:24,440 --> 00:22:27,520 Speaker 3: but we just kind of gradually heaked at the right time, 460 00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:30,400 Speaker 3: you know, and and sure and then as fate would 461 00:22:30,440 --> 00:22:32,920 Speaker 3: have it, we ended up playing, you know, playing UNLV again. 462 00:22:33,480 --> 00:22:35,959 Speaker 2: How was it like going into that game? Y'all done 463 00:22:36,040 --> 00:22:37,800 Speaker 2: got through this season? Y'all have made it to the 464 00:22:37,840 --> 00:22:41,960 Speaker 2: province land right before the game, y'all finna play them again? 465 00:22:42,040 --> 00:22:43,800 Speaker 1: And you know what's going on in that. But what 466 00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:44,919 Speaker 1: was coach k like? 467 00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:47,720 Speaker 2: What made him motivate y'all to be so confident out 468 00:22:47,760 --> 00:22:49,480 Speaker 2: there that that y'all can slay the giant? 469 00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:51,479 Speaker 3: Well, first of all, we had a whole week to prepare, 470 00:22:51,760 --> 00:22:54,520 Speaker 3: so unlike the year before we had one day, we 471 00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:58,679 Speaker 3: had a whole week. We actually practiced five against seven 472 00:23:00,119 --> 00:23:03,240 Speaker 3: and to get used to the speed and the quickness 473 00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:06,720 Speaker 3: and the athleticism of UNLV, they had the a meeba defense. 474 00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:09,280 Speaker 3: And then I think one of the things that I'm 475 00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:11,320 Speaker 3: patting my own back here. But I think I was 476 00:23:11,359 --> 00:23:14,000 Speaker 3: on the team, and so now I'm another ball handler. 477 00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:17,440 Speaker 3: I played power forward. I was you know, Larry Johnson's 478 00:23:17,440 --> 00:23:20,520 Speaker 3: guarding me. He's not used to guarding somebody six seven 479 00:23:20,560 --> 00:23:23,640 Speaker 3: sixty eight who could be a pressure release, who can 480 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:26,160 Speaker 3: bring the ball up. So now you didn't have Greg 481 00:23:26,200 --> 00:23:29,119 Speaker 3: Anthony and Anderson Hunt hounding Bobby Hurley. You had another 482 00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:32,160 Speaker 3: guy who could bring the ball up. So that helped 483 00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:35,240 Speaker 3: us get into our stuff. And but he just pumped 484 00:23:35,280 --> 00:23:37,199 Speaker 3: us up. He pumped us up, made us believe. We 485 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:39,160 Speaker 3: went in thinking we could win. We probably the only 486 00:23:39,240 --> 00:23:42,560 Speaker 3: people who thought we could win. Two funny stories. 487 00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:42,800 Speaker 1: One. 488 00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:46,320 Speaker 3: So before we leave, I gotta get my hair right, 489 00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:48,480 Speaker 3: you know, we go to the barbershop. Of course back 490 00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:49,440 Speaker 3: then I had the flat time. 491 00:23:49,560 --> 00:23:51,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, so we go to the barber. 492 00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:54,280 Speaker 3: You know this is crazy. We go to the barber 493 00:23:54,760 --> 00:23:57,040 Speaker 3: and you know our barber used to you know, used 494 00:23:57,040 --> 00:23:58,560 Speaker 3: to drink. He used to drink a lot while he's 495 00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:01,000 Speaker 3: cutting hair. But you didn't think anything of it. See 496 00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:04,359 Speaker 3: cuts t Lang, Tony Lang, my roommate, cuts his hair, 497 00:24:04,480 --> 00:24:07,840 Speaker 3: and Tony had like a ball fade back then and 498 00:24:07,880 --> 00:24:10,320 Speaker 3: then I get in the chair and so the mirror 499 00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:13,520 Speaker 3: is behind me. He didn't have a mirror on this side, 500 00:24:13,760 --> 00:24:16,120 Speaker 3: and so my back is to the mirror while he's 501 00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:18,679 Speaker 3: cutting me, and Lang's sitting in front of me. So 502 00:24:18,800 --> 00:24:22,240 Speaker 3: Lane's trying to like kind of give me that look. 503 00:24:25,880 --> 00:24:29,480 Speaker 3: So anyway, I guess the alcohol. I don't know what happened, 504 00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:33,359 Speaker 3: but when it's done, I'm like, I'm mad now, Like 505 00:24:33,400 --> 00:24:36,240 Speaker 3: I'm like, dude, I'm about to go on National TV 506 00:24:36,320 --> 00:24:39,400 Speaker 3: with his hair and I didn't want to pay for it, 507 00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:42,720 Speaker 3: and I got mad, Like I got mad. Lange's laughing, 508 00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:45,719 Speaker 3: so we don't speak on the drive. He I got 509 00:24:45,760 --> 00:24:47,200 Speaker 3: in a fight when we got to the dorms because 510 00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:49,959 Speaker 3: I was like, I blamed him for not letting me know. 511 00:24:52,119 --> 00:24:53,680 Speaker 3: And then the crazy thing was, you know, this is 512 00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:57,399 Speaker 3: coach k He said before the game, said, look, I 513 00:24:57,400 --> 00:25:01,480 Speaker 3: don't want y'all doing anything crazy like on bald or like, 514 00:25:01,600 --> 00:25:04,199 Speaker 3: you know, do something different than you normally would do, 515 00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:06,320 Speaker 3: because I think, you know now I would just cut 516 00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:08,400 Speaker 3: it down and bald it, you know, but back then, 517 00:25:08,440 --> 00:25:10,520 Speaker 3: this is like this nineteen ninety one, you know, it 518 00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:13,359 Speaker 3: was a different time. So I go out in one 519 00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:18,760 Speaker 3: of the most historic final fours and have some iconic moments. 520 00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:21,400 Speaker 1: With the worst, like I have bowl cut flat top, 521 00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:23,640 Speaker 1: Like the ball wasn't even even like it was when 522 00:25:23,680 --> 00:25:24,159 Speaker 1: you see it. 523 00:25:24,320 --> 00:25:26,359 Speaker 3: When I see that, I'm like, I'm making bear it. 524 00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:29,639 Speaker 3: Like I can't even watch those games because I just 525 00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:30,960 Speaker 3: think of that story. 526 00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:36,000 Speaker 1: It was terrible. Man about the past. The perfect pass. 527 00:25:36,320 --> 00:25:38,760 Speaker 1: You made it? Oh with t laighter You think you 528 00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:41,200 Speaker 1: can make that throw again? That was like on the money. 529 00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:44,520 Speaker 3: So one of the things we did every day was 530 00:25:44,520 --> 00:25:47,040 Speaker 3: we do two mandrills. You guys know, you know two mans. 531 00:25:47,040 --> 00:25:49,080 Speaker 3: You got tout, you know, you throw the ball off 532 00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:52,080 Speaker 3: the backboard, outlet it go, do a layer. The next 533 00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:54,120 Speaker 3: time it's a jump shot. So you'd have a partner 534 00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:57,919 Speaker 3: and it would progress to a baseball pass. And we 535 00:25:57,960 --> 00:26:00,280 Speaker 3: did it every day. And so I would, you know, 536 00:26:00,320 --> 00:26:02,440 Speaker 3: I'll talk trash like you know, it's in the jeans 537 00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:06,000 Speaker 3: because I play football. So I could throw the ball 538 00:26:06,480 --> 00:26:09,360 Speaker 3: and like person, run down the court, catch it in stride, 539 00:26:09,480 --> 00:26:11,920 Speaker 3: lay it in. And so I think coach knew in 540 00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:14,280 Speaker 3: that moment that I was, you know, I was the 541 00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:17,440 Speaker 3: one that could make that pass. We had a game, 542 00:26:17,480 --> 00:26:20,600 Speaker 3: we lost two games that year in ninety two, and 543 00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:22,720 Speaker 3: one of them was the Way Force and we had 544 00:26:22,720 --> 00:26:26,320 Speaker 3: to get a play where similar play, but they put 545 00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:29,639 Speaker 3: six ten Trelawney Owens on me and I threw the 546 00:26:29,680 --> 00:26:31,960 Speaker 3: ball and it curves and it led later to the 547 00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:34,359 Speaker 3: sideline where we stepped on the out of bounds. So 548 00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:36,000 Speaker 3: I remember after that game, I'm like, you know, if 549 00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:38,200 Speaker 3: I remember him in that situation again, I'm just gonna 550 00:26:38,200 --> 00:26:41,560 Speaker 3: step back. You know, they can be you know, defense 551 00:26:41,640 --> 00:26:43,720 Speaker 3: can be standing whatever, but if you step back, it 552 00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:46,320 Speaker 3: just gives you more gives you more room. And so 553 00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:48,640 Speaker 3: when I came out of the huddle and they didn't 554 00:26:48,680 --> 00:26:50,760 Speaker 3: have anybody on me, I'm like, oh, I got it. 555 00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:53,439 Speaker 3: You know, I'm gonna do my part what I gotta do. 556 00:26:54,040 --> 00:26:57,639 Speaker 3: And thankfully, you know, Christian was Christian gets. You know, 557 00:26:57,680 --> 00:27:00,120 Speaker 3: obviously it's been a documentary on him, and you know 558 00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:02,240 Speaker 3: we look at his pro career and it didn't quite 559 00:27:02,359 --> 00:27:06,119 Speaker 3: pan out with the expectations, but he was just good 560 00:27:06,800 --> 00:27:10,199 Speaker 3: of a college basketball player that I've ever seen, and 561 00:27:10,560 --> 00:27:13,120 Speaker 3: I'm talking starting in nineteen eighty two. I didn't see 562 00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:17,560 Speaker 3: before that. You know, the UCLA, you know lou Else 563 00:27:17,560 --> 00:27:21,520 Speaker 3: Center and Cream and all of that, but from the 564 00:27:21,560 --> 00:27:26,000 Speaker 3: modern era in terms of accomplishments, in terms of like 565 00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:29,040 Speaker 3: just stepping up to the challenge. 566 00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:31,639 Speaker 1: Against show up every big game. 567 00:27:31,720 --> 00:27:33,879 Speaker 3: I mean, Shack's even said it before that Christian like 568 00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:39,359 Speaker 3: busted it, like you know, Shaq, Larry Johnson, Alonzo like 569 00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:44,359 Speaker 3: Christian was competitive. Christian brought it and he has some 570 00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:46,880 Speaker 3: you know, he has some good players around him to that. Yeah, 571 00:27:46,920 --> 00:27:50,240 Speaker 3: but he he got it done and we rode him 572 00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:52,119 Speaker 3: those years like he was and in that game, he 573 00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:54,320 Speaker 3: didn't miss a shot. He was perfect from the field 574 00:27:54,359 --> 00:27:56,920 Speaker 3: from the free throw line, thirty points and of course 575 00:27:56,920 --> 00:27:58,120 Speaker 3: he hit that big shot at the end. 576 00:27:58,280 --> 00:28:01,480 Speaker 4: Tell me this, everybody knows and it's talked about. It's 577 00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:05,679 Speaker 4: one of the biggest rivalries and sports. Like what was 578 00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:08,440 Speaker 4: it like your first time as a freshman? Like where 579 00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:10,760 Speaker 4: was the game? Was it at Duke or at UNC 580 00:28:10,960 --> 00:28:13,320 Speaker 4: when you guys, when you first got a chance to 581 00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:15,919 Speaker 4: be a part of this rivalry, Like what was that? Like? 582 00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:18,400 Speaker 3: Let me tell you before the games? So we get 583 00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:19,960 Speaker 3: down there, my guy. 584 00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:23,560 Speaker 1: I know that schools, so it was probably something extra 585 00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:24,920 Speaker 1: waiting for you. Oh, no question. 586 00:28:25,080 --> 00:28:29,640 Speaker 3: So I'm trying to think of like like a rivalry 587 00:28:29,720 --> 00:28:32,200 Speaker 3: like I don't know in Illinois if it would be Illinois, 588 00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:38,560 Speaker 3: but just like the proximity. So my thing is like 589 00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:42,080 Speaker 3: in Florida, Like you got Florida, Florida state, right, So 590 00:28:42,120 --> 00:28:45,520 Speaker 3: we live here in Florida, we understand what that rivalry is. 591 00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:48,680 Speaker 3: But the schools are six seven miles from each other. 592 00:28:48,920 --> 00:28:52,800 Speaker 3: Like it's intense, like to the point where you're in 593 00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:58,640 Speaker 3: the cafeteria and Duke is the largest employer in Durham. 594 00:28:58,680 --> 00:29:00,840 Speaker 3: So you got somebody in the cafe tears, somebody at 595 00:29:00,840 --> 00:29:03,280 Speaker 3: the bookstore, some people who worked there who are Caro, 596 00:29:03,280 --> 00:29:05,760 Speaker 3: A lot of fans who are talking trash to you 597 00:29:06,240 --> 00:29:08,040 Speaker 3: on your own campus, you know what I'm saying. So 598 00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:10,479 Speaker 3: it's like I call it living with the enemy, and 599 00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:12,680 Speaker 3: it finally goes both. And back then we were up 600 00:29:12,760 --> 00:29:15,560 Speaker 3: and coming, like we're more established now we've had success, 601 00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:19,120 Speaker 3: but it was all all Carolina back then. But I 602 00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:22,040 Speaker 3: realized that my guy, like one of my closest friends 603 00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:24,160 Speaker 3: when I was in high school was Brian Reese. Brian 604 00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:27,440 Speaker 3: Reese played at Carolina from New York, played at tallerent 605 00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:30,160 Speaker 3: time with Adrian Archery from the Bronx. You know, he 606 00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:31,840 Speaker 3: had come down in high school to visit. I had 607 00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:33,520 Speaker 3: gone up to New York, like, so we had a 608 00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:37,080 Speaker 3: good friendship. So freshman orientation, we go over to a 609 00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:41,800 Speaker 3: party over at Carolina and it's their freshman orientation. So 610 00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:44,520 Speaker 3: we're both at the party and we didn't speak and 611 00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:47,200 Speaker 3: literally we'd see each other out and about and for 612 00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:50,120 Speaker 3: four years didn't speak. So that's what I'm saying, that's 613 00:29:50,240 --> 00:29:53,560 Speaker 3: all of a sudden, you kind of helicopter into this 614 00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:56,760 Speaker 3: this unique sort of like it's hard to describe it, 615 00:29:56,840 --> 00:29:58,480 Speaker 3: but and it was to the point too when you 616 00:29:58,520 --> 00:30:01,280 Speaker 3: went over there. You never went over there like a loan. 617 00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:05,200 Speaker 3: You know, I'm just saying because something might have like 618 00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:06,800 Speaker 3: you know what I'm saying, Like it was always like 619 00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:08,560 Speaker 3: always that energy was there. 620 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:09,680 Speaker 1: I mean, you know these are. 621 00:30:09,560 --> 00:30:12,720 Speaker 3: Two pwy's, you know they're not. But I'm just saying, 622 00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:14,480 Speaker 3: like you just always felt like. 623 00:30:14,760 --> 00:30:17,840 Speaker 1: Being in enemy territory without nobody which and. 624 00:30:18,120 --> 00:30:19,560 Speaker 3: But you know, they would come over, the guys in 625 00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:21,560 Speaker 3: their team. They would try to date the girls that 626 00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:23,600 Speaker 3: do because we would try to date the girls over there, 627 00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:25,960 Speaker 3: and so we socialized. We'd be at parties, but we 628 00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:28,680 Speaker 3: never like connected. It was always be in the same room, 629 00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:29,760 Speaker 3: but we kept our distance. 630 00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:32,320 Speaker 2: How was the atmosphere like walking in the gym and 631 00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:35,840 Speaker 2: seeing seeing how hype y'all fans was when you having 632 00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:38,240 Speaker 2: the home games and just seeing how crazy they fans 633 00:30:38,360 --> 00:30:39,080 Speaker 2: was when you having. 634 00:30:40,040 --> 00:30:42,800 Speaker 3: I thought that just what that's what college basketball was. 635 00:30:43,240 --> 00:30:45,760 Speaker 3: And what I mean by that is the Camon crazies 636 00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:48,720 Speaker 3: were crazy. They were creative, they were loud, they you know, 637 00:30:48,760 --> 00:30:50,760 Speaker 3: it was a great environment for us to play in. 638 00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:54,080 Speaker 3: It was a great environment I think for opposing teams. 639 00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:55,280 Speaker 3: You know, y'all are competitors. 640 00:30:55,320 --> 00:30:56,120 Speaker 1: If you play. 641 00:30:56,400 --> 00:30:57,719 Speaker 3: So you come in there, you're gonna want to put 642 00:30:57,760 --> 00:31:00,960 Speaker 3: up numbers like I did exactly. I'm sure you did, so, 643 00:31:01,720 --> 00:31:03,120 Speaker 3: you know. And then when we went on the road, 644 00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:05,400 Speaker 3: you know, we felt that you know what I'm saying, 645 00:31:05,440 --> 00:31:07,960 Speaker 3: and and so I just kind of thought like this 646 00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:12,560 Speaker 3: was normal sort of college basketball energy, and really the 647 00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:14,840 Speaker 3: reality it wasn't. And also too, I think what was 648 00:31:14,840 --> 00:31:18,520 Speaker 3: happening Duke was becoming a really good team. We had 649 00:31:18,560 --> 00:31:22,400 Speaker 3: good success. You know, there was the private school element. 650 00:31:22,520 --> 00:31:25,640 Speaker 3: We had some good white players, so like it was 651 00:31:25,680 --> 00:31:29,320 Speaker 3: an interesting time. And then we beat UNLV, which was 652 00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:31,680 Speaker 3: you know, on an all black team. We beat Michigan 653 00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:34,000 Speaker 3: and fanb five, So there were there's sort of these 654 00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:35,640 Speaker 3: cultural wars that were going on. 655 00:31:35,680 --> 00:31:37,560 Speaker 4: How did that feel for you to be one of 656 00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:39,360 Speaker 4: the because, like you said, you were talking about that 657 00:31:39,480 --> 00:31:43,160 Speaker 4: time period, Duke was used as the as the private 658 00:31:43,520 --> 00:31:46,320 Speaker 4: school with the white guys. You wanted a few black 659 00:31:46,400 --> 00:31:48,400 Speaker 4: dudes and you, like you wanted better players. So how 660 00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:51,240 Speaker 4: did that feel for you to be basically you you 661 00:31:51,560 --> 00:31:54,280 Speaker 4: on the quote unquote other side or whatever from our 662 00:31:54,360 --> 00:31:55,520 Speaker 4: culture basically. 663 00:31:55,120 --> 00:31:57,320 Speaker 3: Well, and I felt that, I mean I experienced that 664 00:31:57,840 --> 00:32:01,680 Speaker 3: as a fan one with Georgetown, the pride that you know, 665 00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:04,200 Speaker 3: even though Georgetown is like Duke in a lot of 666 00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:06,720 Speaker 3: ways or like the pause, you know, I mean it's 667 00:32:06,720 --> 00:32:09,840 Speaker 3: a probably more like it's like both like school, small 668 00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:14,320 Speaker 3: private school, a predominantly white institution. But to see, you know, 669 00:32:14,560 --> 00:32:17,760 Speaker 3: an all black team with a strong black coach. I 670 00:32:17,760 --> 00:32:20,560 Speaker 3: identified with that, and that was what I was drawn 671 00:32:20,600 --> 00:32:23,880 Speaker 3: to as a fan of the NBA, the Lakers, like 672 00:32:23,920 --> 00:32:26,520 Speaker 3: I hated the Celtics. I hated the Celtics because Larry 673 00:32:26,560 --> 00:32:29,040 Speaker 3: Bird and Kevin m and they were good, right, you 674 00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:31,200 Speaker 3: know what I'm saying. Yeah, they were white, you know 675 00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:34,960 Speaker 3: what I'm saying. And so so I understand the sentiment. 676 00:32:35,360 --> 00:32:38,120 Speaker 3: I do think though when I was in it, I 677 00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:41,280 Speaker 3: didn't realize what was happening. I didn't realize that this 678 00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:43,680 Speaker 3: was going on. And what I mean by that is, 679 00:32:44,360 --> 00:32:46,600 Speaker 3: you know, we would insulate, like I didn't read the 680 00:32:46,640 --> 00:32:49,000 Speaker 3: newspaper like you know, I mean, I might get the 681 00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:51,880 Speaker 3: campus newspaper. I'm not paying money to like, you know, 682 00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:54,680 Speaker 3: buy newspapers, And not that the newspaper would show that, 683 00:32:55,120 --> 00:32:57,080 Speaker 3: but I think they kind of painted this picture of 684 00:32:57,200 --> 00:33:01,640 Speaker 3: like good first banda white verse black, and I just 685 00:33:01,640 --> 00:33:04,000 Speaker 3: think we were kind of oblivious to it. To my point, 686 00:33:04,280 --> 00:33:06,760 Speaker 3: everywhere we went we would hate it, and every time 687 00:33:06,800 --> 00:33:08,600 Speaker 3: somebody came to see us, they would hate it. And 688 00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:09,959 Speaker 3: so I think there was a part of it. I mean, 689 00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:13,920 Speaker 3: this may sound like I'm pleading ignorance, but and then 690 00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:16,520 Speaker 3: when I would go out like Durham, you know, there's 691 00:33:16,560 --> 00:33:19,520 Speaker 3: a real sort of rich African American history in Durham. 692 00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:23,040 Speaker 3: Durham was that city where in North Carolina, if you 693 00:33:23,080 --> 00:33:26,280 Speaker 3: wanted a job opportunity, you came to Durham. You know, 694 00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:28,960 Speaker 3: in DC, coach k built, you know, I like to 695 00:33:28,960 --> 00:33:32,760 Speaker 3: say the foundation of Duke basketball was from DC. You know, 696 00:33:32,920 --> 00:33:36,960 Speaker 3: Johnny Dawkin's, Tommy Amicker, Billy King, Brian like myself. He's 697 00:33:36,960 --> 00:33:41,320 Speaker 3: got Danny Ferry. So at home, everybody showed Duke love. 698 00:33:41,600 --> 00:33:43,680 Speaker 3: You know, at least they showed me Duke love, you 699 00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:45,600 Speaker 3: know what I'm saying. And then in Durham, so I 700 00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:48,440 Speaker 3: didn't see, I didn't feel that, but I get it, 701 00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:51,200 Speaker 3: I understand it. So I was oblivious to all of it. 702 00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:53,360 Speaker 3: You know, we were just trying to win. We were kids, 703 00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:56,640 Speaker 3: we were having fun. But I understand looking back at 704 00:33:56,640 --> 00:33:58,480 Speaker 3: it now where that came from. 705 00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:01,120 Speaker 4: One other thing before we move on from Duke. I 706 00:34:01,160 --> 00:34:03,720 Speaker 4: want like because I asked JJ this when we had 707 00:34:03,800 --> 00:34:06,440 Speaker 4: JJ on there, when you were going into Duke as 708 00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:08,239 Speaker 4: a freshman, and when you decided you're gonna get that 709 00:34:08,360 --> 00:34:10,120 Speaker 4: cause did you ever foresee And I don't know if 710 00:34:10,160 --> 00:34:12,080 Speaker 4: you see yourself this way, but I think the rest 711 00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:14,560 Speaker 4: of the world do that. You now looking at like 712 00:34:14,680 --> 00:34:17,719 Speaker 4: how great, how much success Duke has had, all the players, 713 00:34:18,239 --> 00:34:20,080 Speaker 4: did you ever think like you would be one of 714 00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:23,000 Speaker 4: the people, like if that was like a Mount Rushmore, 715 00:34:23,120 --> 00:34:25,280 Speaker 4: you would be in there, like of all of these 716 00:34:25,560 --> 00:34:29,920 Speaker 4: unbelievably great players, accomplishments and not obviously Coach k is 717 00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:33,239 Speaker 4: above everything. But like amongst the players, like I felt 718 00:34:33,280 --> 00:34:36,120 Speaker 4: like JJ one of them guys like that, like to 719 00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:38,080 Speaker 4: be a sit the top or something like that. 720 00:34:38,440 --> 00:34:40,600 Speaker 1: You ever thought about that. It's a great question. 721 00:34:40,680 --> 00:34:44,240 Speaker 3: You know you went to De Paul for two years, okay, 722 00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:46,720 Speaker 3: and you you went right out of high school, no college. 723 00:34:47,719 --> 00:34:51,600 Speaker 3: But say, I admire what you did, and I'll explain why. 724 00:34:52,200 --> 00:34:55,160 Speaker 3: When I arrived at Duke, I didn't see what everybody 725 00:34:55,200 --> 00:34:58,239 Speaker 3: else saw. I knew I was a good player, but 726 00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:02,319 Speaker 3: I did lack some confidence and belief, and I think 727 00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:06,759 Speaker 3: basketball helped build that over time. So I didn't come 728 00:35:06,800 --> 00:35:09,839 Speaker 3: in thinking I was going to like do work. I 729 00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:12,880 Speaker 3: actually I needed to be pushed a little bit. I 730 00:35:12,920 --> 00:35:15,959 Speaker 3: needed to be pushed into greatness, if that makes sense. 731 00:35:16,080 --> 00:35:19,920 Speaker 3: And so coach pushed me and I said this, and 732 00:35:19,960 --> 00:35:21,960 Speaker 3: it may come across the wrong way. I said it 733 00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:24,920 Speaker 3: at the Hall of Fame Enshrineman, he was one of 734 00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:25,600 Speaker 3: my presenters. 735 00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:26,080 Speaker 1: But like. 736 00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:30,720 Speaker 3: I, you know, and it's sound, it may come across 737 00:35:30,719 --> 00:35:33,920 Speaker 3: the wrong way, but he gave me permission to be like, 738 00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:36,560 Speaker 3: it's okay to be great, and I think I wanted 739 00:35:36,560 --> 00:35:39,360 Speaker 3: to fit in and so sometimes to be great, you 740 00:35:39,440 --> 00:35:41,880 Speaker 3: got to stand out, and I struggled with that a 741 00:35:41,920 --> 00:35:45,960 Speaker 3: little bit. So to answer your question, I far exceeded 742 00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:50,280 Speaker 3: my expectations. I never like Jersey retirement, like I wasn't 743 00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:52,839 Speaker 3: even forget about the NBA. Like I wasn't even thinking 744 00:35:52,880 --> 00:35:55,960 Speaker 3: about the NBA. That's why I say I marveled at you, like, hey, 745 00:35:56,239 --> 00:35:59,200 Speaker 3: I can do this, and I'm gonna do it. I 746 00:35:59,239 --> 00:36:02,359 Speaker 3: needed to grow into that, and by the time I 747 00:36:02,480 --> 00:36:06,440 Speaker 3: left college my senior year, where now it's on me. 748 00:36:07,120 --> 00:36:10,319 Speaker 3: Couldn't hide behind Bobby, couldn't hide behind Christian. Now I'm 749 00:36:10,360 --> 00:36:13,960 Speaker 3: the leader. I'm one that's responsible for, you know, getting 750 00:36:13,960 --> 00:36:16,400 Speaker 3: all of us to the mountaintop or whatever. We lost 751 00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:19,480 Speaker 3: that year the Arkansas Scottie Thurman hit a great shot 752 00:36:19,480 --> 00:36:23,120 Speaker 3: against us. But that year and that experience in the 753 00:36:23,160 --> 00:36:27,680 Speaker 3: collect the cumulative for years, prepared me for the expectation 754 00:36:28,040 --> 00:36:30,319 Speaker 3: and the pressure that comes with being a top pick 755 00:36:30,360 --> 00:36:30,920 Speaker 3: in the NBA. 756 00:36:31,120 --> 00:36:34,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, how was it like at the draft? Your mother, 757 00:36:34,200 --> 00:36:38,080 Speaker 2: your father's successful Black people, and all they want from 758 00:36:38,120 --> 00:36:40,720 Speaker 2: you is to have a goal or dream or something 759 00:36:40,719 --> 00:36:43,000 Speaker 2: that you want to do. And your father was a 760 00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:46,240 Speaker 2: professional athlete, and now they get to see their son 761 00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:50,359 Speaker 2: at the draft, becoming a man, taking another step up 762 00:36:50,400 --> 00:36:53,919 Speaker 2: in life and play with the men. Now, Like, how 763 00:36:54,000 --> 00:36:56,520 Speaker 2: was that for them to see your father and your 764 00:36:56,560 --> 00:37:01,759 Speaker 2: mother just excited for you and what you. 765 00:37:00,680 --> 00:37:03,440 Speaker 3: You know, I never I never really have asked them that. 766 00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:05,560 Speaker 3: I mean, I think I can get a sense just 767 00:37:05,600 --> 00:37:08,000 Speaker 3: sort of having gone through it with them. I mean, 768 00:37:08,040 --> 00:37:11,319 Speaker 3: it was an incredible ride. I think they enjoyed every 769 00:37:11,320 --> 00:37:13,840 Speaker 3: minute of it, you know, and in the high school 770 00:37:13,840 --> 00:37:16,239 Speaker 3: and even in the college. And I think, you know, 771 00:37:16,239 --> 00:37:18,600 Speaker 3: it was a little bit of bittersweet at that moment 772 00:37:19,120 --> 00:37:23,239 Speaker 3: because I think they realized that, yes, now I'm going 773 00:37:23,239 --> 00:37:26,520 Speaker 3: into this, I'm a man, I'm no longer on the payroll. 774 00:37:27,320 --> 00:37:30,920 Speaker 1: Take care of yourself now, I mean, you know, but like. 775 00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:33,920 Speaker 3: All the good that comes with that. But then also 776 00:37:35,080 --> 00:37:37,879 Speaker 3: it changes when you get to the league. Parents aren't 777 00:37:37,960 --> 00:37:40,920 Speaker 3: is involved, you know, in college the parents are like 778 00:37:40,960 --> 00:37:44,040 Speaker 3: you know, high school and so you know, And for 779 00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:48,080 Speaker 3: me as a parent, nothing gives me greater joy than 780 00:37:48,520 --> 00:37:52,520 Speaker 3: watching and supporting and following my kids and watching them 781 00:37:52,520 --> 00:37:54,600 Speaker 3: in their sports. Like I got a daughter who plays soccer. 782 00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:58,640 Speaker 3: I'm the videographer. I'm the one up I'm sending all 783 00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:02,719 Speaker 3: the parents of video I'm like all into it, and 784 00:38:02,840 --> 00:38:06,080 Speaker 3: I got another daughter who is an MMA fighter. 785 00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:07,560 Speaker 1: I never thought i'd get into it. 786 00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:09,839 Speaker 3: Like now you know, I'm watching fights with her, I'm 787 00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:13,680 Speaker 3: taking her to Vegas and so you know, having gone 788 00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:16,560 Speaker 3: through it, not that they they're still young and you 789 00:38:16,600 --> 00:38:18,319 Speaker 3: know she'll get mad at me for saying this, But 790 00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:22,120 Speaker 3: like the MMA thing, like you're conflicted about because you're like, 791 00:38:22,400 --> 00:38:25,240 Speaker 3: if she loses, it could be really scary and thankfully 792 00:38:25,320 --> 00:38:28,480 Speaker 3: she hasn't lost yet, the hopefully won't lose, but if 793 00:38:28,520 --> 00:38:30,879 Speaker 3: you lose, it could be serious. So you don't want 794 00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:34,480 Speaker 3: them to lose. But if they win, they want to 795 00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:38,840 Speaker 3: keep doing it. So it's like, you know, that's not 796 00:38:38,960 --> 00:38:40,680 Speaker 3: you know, as my wife says, you know you make 797 00:38:40,719 --> 00:38:42,960 Speaker 3: plans and God laughs. But as a parent, yeah, so 798 00:38:43,080 --> 00:38:45,600 Speaker 3: I can only imagine for my parents like they just 799 00:38:46,239 --> 00:38:48,000 Speaker 3: and you know what, to be able to share the 800 00:38:48,080 --> 00:38:49,880 Speaker 3: journey with them, the ups and the downs, because there 801 00:38:49,920 --> 00:38:52,799 Speaker 3: were some downs too, But that moment, like that was 802 00:38:52,840 --> 00:38:57,000 Speaker 3: a surreal moment. You guys experienced the guests have experienced it, 803 00:38:57,040 --> 00:38:59,520 Speaker 3: and it's almost like you feel like you like, man, 804 00:38:59,560 --> 00:39:00,000 Speaker 3: I made it. 805 00:39:00,239 --> 00:39:02,400 Speaker 4: Yeah, right when you're shaking his hand and you're looking 806 00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:05,800 Speaker 4: off into the crowd and the cameras flash you like, lady, 807 00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:07,640 Speaker 4: I didn't watch this so many times. 808 00:39:08,120 --> 00:39:10,600 Speaker 2: Your parents, you know, you feel like you did something 809 00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:13,640 Speaker 2: to make them proud of you, eat of achieving something. 810 00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:16,120 Speaker 2: That's what I felt when my mom and grandma was there. 811 00:39:16,200 --> 00:39:19,319 Speaker 2: So you drafted to the Pistons number three. You know 812 00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:21,920 Speaker 2: your boys drafting number three? You eve them three boys? 813 00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:27,040 Speaker 2: You know you get drave like you you're a fan 814 00:39:27,080 --> 00:39:30,480 Speaker 2: of history. You know the Isaias and the Joe Dumars. 815 00:39:30,760 --> 00:39:33,880 Speaker 2: They won in an era where nobody gave them a 816 00:39:33,960 --> 00:39:36,600 Speaker 2: chance to win, in the Larry Bird and Magic John's era. 817 00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:40,040 Speaker 2: But like I said, your eyes have become your rivals. 818 00:39:40,080 --> 00:39:41,880 Speaker 2: I remember my cousins telling that you can't be a 819 00:39:41,960 --> 00:39:45,959 Speaker 2: fan no more. And the way you started that season off, 820 00:39:46,120 --> 00:39:47,879 Speaker 2: you definitely want no fan no more. 821 00:39:48,320 --> 00:39:50,280 Speaker 1: Because I say, how you you shook Scottio. 822 00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:52,520 Speaker 2: But how was it like your first year being there 823 00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:56,560 Speaker 2: and seeing the guys that you you dreamed about playing against, 824 00:39:56,760 --> 00:40:00,799 Speaker 2: playing with? And now, like you say, it's all on you. 825 00:40:00,880 --> 00:40:03,719 Speaker 2: Now you don't have the leat nerves or nobody to 826 00:40:03,800 --> 00:40:06,640 Speaker 2: kind of give you that push in front, even Isaiah 827 00:40:06,719 --> 00:40:08,920 Speaker 2: and Joe Dumars and then was on their back end, 828 00:40:09,160 --> 00:40:12,440 Speaker 2: like you right in and ready to go, and they 829 00:40:12,480 --> 00:40:15,560 Speaker 2: wanted you, the organization, the town wanted you to go. 830 00:40:16,120 --> 00:40:19,000 Speaker 2: How was that to have that pressure and to be 831 00:40:19,400 --> 00:40:21,439 Speaker 2: ready to go and to you know, test your mic. 832 00:40:21,880 --> 00:40:23,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, no, that's a great question. 833 00:40:23,480 --> 00:40:26,120 Speaker 3: I think it was a bit of a transitional period 834 00:40:26,160 --> 00:40:28,960 Speaker 3: for that franchise. You know, they hit the Bad Boys, 835 00:40:29,200 --> 00:40:32,360 Speaker 3: had great success, they won, they kind of were declining. 836 00:40:33,480 --> 00:40:38,400 Speaker 3: Lambert retired mid year the year before Isaiah retired. That 837 00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:41,080 Speaker 3: summer I got drafted. Joe was still on the roster. 838 00:40:41,840 --> 00:40:44,480 Speaker 3: The year before, they drafted Lindsay Hunter and Allen Houston, 839 00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:46,880 Speaker 3: so I was next up. So it was almost like 840 00:40:47,200 --> 00:40:50,120 Speaker 3: you could feel like a transition was occurring, but the 841 00:40:50,200 --> 00:40:54,480 Speaker 3: expectations weren't high at all. You know, the summer before 842 00:40:54,840 --> 00:40:57,640 Speaker 3: I arrived at in Detroit, I was down at Duke 843 00:40:57,680 --> 00:41:00,160 Speaker 3: and I was just playing pick a ball summer and 844 00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:05,560 Speaker 3: Quinn Snyder, who you know, formerly coached recently at Utah. 845 00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:08,080 Speaker 3: You know, he at that point had been an assistant 846 00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:11,839 Speaker 3: with Larry Brown with the Clippers, and so in pickup ball, 847 00:41:11,880 --> 00:41:13,920 Speaker 3: he was like, yo, man, like, when you play pick 848 00:41:14,000 --> 00:41:15,400 Speaker 3: up you're coming at people. 849 00:41:15,440 --> 00:41:15,919 Speaker 1: Bob Bob. 850 00:41:16,040 --> 00:41:18,680 Speaker 3: You know, you do the legs crossover getting by people, 851 00:41:18,719 --> 00:41:22,960 Speaker 3: but when you play in the game, you're backing people down, 852 00:41:23,239 --> 00:41:26,040 Speaker 3: you know. And so I'm doing like the magic. You know, 853 00:41:26,080 --> 00:41:28,640 Speaker 3: Steve Smith handled like this and he said in the NBA, 854 00:41:28,760 --> 00:41:31,560 Speaker 3: you can do that, and so I remember him like 855 00:41:31,640 --> 00:41:33,880 Speaker 3: literally told me that maybe two weeks before I left 856 00:41:34,040 --> 00:41:36,680 Speaker 3: to go to like camp, and so when I got there, 857 00:41:36,719 --> 00:41:39,239 Speaker 3: I was like, like it, like really sounds crazy. 858 00:41:39,320 --> 00:41:40,680 Speaker 1: I was like, man, this is easy. 859 00:41:40,880 --> 00:41:43,920 Speaker 3: Like I'm going against guys that aren't used to defending 860 00:41:44,320 --> 00:41:46,920 Speaker 3: this kind of play. So my first game, like I 861 00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:49,919 Speaker 3: came in and you know, like I don't know twenty 862 00:41:50,080 --> 00:41:52,000 Speaker 3: I mean, I don't remember the game, but I've heard 863 00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:54,920 Speaker 3: about it because I think Polo did something similar recently. 864 00:41:54,920 --> 00:41:57,680 Speaker 3: But I had like twenty five, ten and five, and 865 00:41:57,760 --> 00:41:59,799 Speaker 3: I was able to just get to where I. 866 00:41:59,760 --> 00:42:00,719 Speaker 1: Want to speed through. 867 00:42:01,080 --> 00:42:03,439 Speaker 3: I'm calling my boys out, like yo, man, the league man, 868 00:42:03,480 --> 00:42:07,320 Speaker 3: it's overrated, Like I'm myself, you know what I'm saying 869 00:42:08,120 --> 00:42:09,960 Speaker 3: and all of that. But you know, once they get 870 00:42:09,960 --> 00:42:12,200 Speaker 3: a scouting report on you and they figure you out 871 00:42:12,200 --> 00:42:14,680 Speaker 3: after fifteen games, they got a little bit harder. But yeah, 872 00:42:14,680 --> 00:42:16,759 Speaker 3: like I was ready, like I was confident, I was 873 00:42:16,760 --> 00:42:18,960 Speaker 3: assured who I was. I was ready for the moment. 874 00:42:19,600 --> 00:42:23,080 Speaker 3: I embraced the challenge of being like the face or whatever. 875 00:42:23,880 --> 00:42:25,760 Speaker 3: And it was crazy. It was a bit of a whirlwind. 876 00:42:25,800 --> 00:42:25,960 Speaker 1: You know. 877 00:42:26,040 --> 00:42:30,839 Speaker 3: Jordan had retired and for whatever reason, a lot came 878 00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:35,319 Speaker 3: my way and so I'm signing shoe deals and doing 879 00:42:35,360 --> 00:42:39,080 Speaker 3: commercials and you know, magas like everything was just happening 880 00:42:40,000 --> 00:42:41,040 Speaker 3: really really fast. 881 00:42:41,080 --> 00:42:43,719 Speaker 4: How was it to be the first rookie to lead 882 00:42:43,840 --> 00:42:46,680 Speaker 4: the All Star and votes fan voting like you beat 883 00:42:46,719 --> 00:42:50,080 Speaker 4: shock out like and no rookie had ever led the 884 00:42:50,200 --> 00:42:53,120 Speaker 4: league in votes for All Star Like? How Like at 885 00:42:53,120 --> 00:42:55,040 Speaker 4: that point you had to be like damn. 886 00:42:56,960 --> 00:42:59,080 Speaker 3: I mean, like I remember, I remember the PR guy there, 887 00:43:00,160 --> 00:43:02,759 Speaker 3: Matt Doebeck. He was like, man, it's a chance that 888 00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:05,880 Speaker 3: you may start an All Star game. I'm like, start, Like, 889 00:43:06,600 --> 00:43:08,000 Speaker 3: do it? I can't. 890 00:43:09,920 --> 00:43:12,000 Speaker 1: Start. You gonna lead the whole joint. 891 00:43:12,120 --> 00:43:14,640 Speaker 3: But I think a couple of things. One, the league, 892 00:43:15,400 --> 00:43:20,440 Speaker 3: the NBA is a global marketing and public relations firm. 893 00:43:20,880 --> 00:43:23,520 Speaker 3: Like that's what they do, no matter who comes in 894 00:43:23,600 --> 00:43:27,399 Speaker 3: at Like, they can promote and market their players all 895 00:43:27,400 --> 00:43:30,200 Speaker 3: over the world. We all can go all over the world, 896 00:43:30,200 --> 00:43:32,800 Speaker 3: which we've done, and people know who we are because 897 00:43:32,840 --> 00:43:36,440 Speaker 3: of our association with the league, and so when this 898 00:43:36,800 --> 00:43:38,880 Speaker 3: I call fresh meet, but when there's young, you know, 899 00:43:38,960 --> 00:43:42,520 Speaker 3: young players coming in, They're gonna promote them. I think 900 00:43:42,560 --> 00:43:47,600 Speaker 3: the benefit I had was in some ways playing at Duke. 901 00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:52,080 Speaker 3: Whether you liked Duke or you hated Duke, you saw Duke. 902 00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:56,480 Speaker 3: And I remember before I left, coach K's wife, missus Rzewski, 903 00:43:56,560 --> 00:43:58,879 Speaker 3: she she told me like, of and I'm not saying 904 00:43:58,920 --> 00:44:01,000 Speaker 3: the right numbers, but she said, like, of the one 905 00:44:01,040 --> 00:44:03,919 Speaker 3: hundred and twenty games or one hundred and fifteen games 906 00:44:04,000 --> 00:44:06,759 Speaker 3: you played in college, one hundred and twelve of them 907 00:44:06,800 --> 00:44:11,800 Speaker 3: are national TV. And so the visibility over four years, 908 00:44:11,960 --> 00:44:14,960 Speaker 3: playing three Final four championship game, I just felt like 909 00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:17,719 Speaker 3: that people knew who I was. And then I came 910 00:44:17,760 --> 00:44:20,800 Speaker 3: in out the gate and I was like I was balling, 911 00:44:21,760 --> 00:44:25,280 Speaker 3: and so a combination of that and maybe the league 912 00:44:25,320 --> 00:44:27,560 Speaker 3: like it. Just I mean, I was just like, man, 913 00:44:27,600 --> 00:44:29,759 Speaker 3: I just want to come in and like show that 914 00:44:29,800 --> 00:44:33,440 Speaker 3: I was worth the pick. But then when it started 915 00:44:33,480 --> 00:44:35,359 Speaker 3: all happening, it was like and then the All Star 916 00:44:35,480 --> 00:44:38,840 Speaker 3: like I like, I'm watching these guys just a year before, 917 00:44:38,920 --> 00:44:42,200 Speaker 3: and now I'm in the room with Scottie and you know, 918 00:44:42,320 --> 00:44:45,600 Speaker 3: Harry Payton, Sean Campbell, all these guys, and so I 919 00:44:45,600 --> 00:44:48,200 Speaker 3: don't know if I felt like I belonged and I 920 00:44:48,239 --> 00:44:50,960 Speaker 3: felt like I still had a lot of work to do. 921 00:44:51,200 --> 00:44:53,759 Speaker 3: But I mean that changed over, you know, in a 922 00:44:53,840 --> 00:44:55,520 Speaker 3: few years. But like at first it was it was 923 00:44:55,560 --> 00:44:57,239 Speaker 3: like I said, it was a whirlwind, man, Like it was. 924 00:44:57,960 --> 00:44:59,920 Speaker 4: So you did you ever feel like in that ear 925 00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:01,879 Speaker 4: early part of it, that you that you had some 926 00:45:01,920 --> 00:45:04,040 Speaker 4: people looking at you like they trying to give you 927 00:45:04,080 --> 00:45:05,919 Speaker 4: something that you don't deserve, and like, oh, I'm gonna 928 00:45:05,920 --> 00:45:07,719 Speaker 4: show y'all that I gotta serve y'all up. 929 00:45:07,880 --> 00:45:10,799 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think people thought Duke, you know, his kids 930 00:45:10,800 --> 00:45:13,520 Speaker 3: getting all this attention whatever, So they came at you, 931 00:45:13,640 --> 00:45:17,479 Speaker 3: but like like I was going right back at right. 932 00:45:17,520 --> 00:45:20,120 Speaker 3: So and then you know, look, I think I think 933 00:45:20,200 --> 00:45:23,799 Speaker 3: subconsciously I always live with that. I think people, look, oh, 934 00:45:23,840 --> 00:45:26,200 Speaker 3: you know your dad play in the NFL. You know 935 00:45:26,560 --> 00:45:28,120 Speaker 3: we're gonna go at them, you know what I'm saying. 936 00:45:28,160 --> 00:45:31,520 Speaker 3: And so like coming up ten eleven twelve, like playing 937 00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:34,799 Speaker 3: older people, people have these and so like I only 938 00:45:34,840 --> 00:45:36,359 Speaker 3: know how to play one way, so I'm not that's 939 00:45:36,360 --> 00:45:40,360 Speaker 3: not gonna intimidate me or whatever. So but that you 940 00:45:40,400 --> 00:45:43,000 Speaker 3: know that that didn't And like I said, it sounds 941 00:45:43,000 --> 00:45:44,840 Speaker 3: pretty harrigan me safing, But like I came in like 942 00:45:44,880 --> 00:45:49,600 Speaker 3: I was, like I was busting there, you know for real, 943 00:45:49,719 --> 00:45:51,640 Speaker 3: like I had a really good start. Well, you know, 944 00:45:51,640 --> 00:45:54,520 Speaker 3: I still still wonder why I shared the COVID Rookie 945 00:45:54,520 --> 00:45:57,160 Speaker 3: of the Year with Jay kids like it. 946 00:45:58,440 --> 00:46:03,640 Speaker 2: Okay, you know we dream about the league, and you 947 00:46:03,680 --> 00:46:05,200 Speaker 2: know one of the things we dreamed about the league 948 00:46:05,239 --> 00:46:07,960 Speaker 2: having the nickname or having our own shoe. Did you 949 00:46:08,080 --> 00:46:11,040 Speaker 2: think that, Like you look back now, like this is 950 00:46:11,560 --> 00:46:15,440 Speaker 2: your Felix shoe is like one of the classics of 951 00:46:15,480 --> 00:46:18,680 Speaker 2: the culture, like to this day is still a classic 952 00:46:18,719 --> 00:46:20,920 Speaker 2: of the coach I had. 953 00:46:20,400 --> 00:46:22,440 Speaker 3: And it's a great story. 954 00:46:25,760 --> 00:46:30,160 Speaker 2: I never liked the Felix shoot, but yours was the hardest. 955 00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:34,920 Speaker 1: Credibility because of the shoes. 956 00:46:35,080 --> 00:46:37,520 Speaker 3: I appreciate that, and I appreciate the question. And there's 957 00:46:37,520 --> 00:46:41,560 Speaker 3: a little story there. So I was Nike, like I 958 00:46:41,719 --> 00:46:44,440 Speaker 3: was all the way. Like you know, we wore DTAs 959 00:46:44,480 --> 00:46:47,480 Speaker 3: for three years at Duke and then the last year 960 00:46:47,480 --> 00:46:50,680 Speaker 3: we wore Nikes and I went out to Beaverton, and 961 00:46:51,000 --> 00:46:54,200 Speaker 3: you know, did the whole thing, you know, before really 962 00:46:54,239 --> 00:46:57,399 Speaker 3: before the draft, and I remember sitting with Phil Knight 963 00:46:57,800 --> 00:46:59,840 Speaker 3: and he was like, you know, it speaks to his. 964 00:47:01,520 --> 00:47:03,040 Speaker 1: Vision for the future. 965 00:47:03,640 --> 00:47:07,200 Speaker 3: But he was talking about the Far East and talking 966 00:47:07,200 --> 00:47:09,400 Speaker 3: about going over to China and the Far East and 967 00:47:09,440 --> 00:47:14,280 Speaker 3: those countries and expanding and growing. 968 00:47:14,040 --> 00:47:16,880 Speaker 1: The game, but growing Nike in those markets. 969 00:47:17,520 --> 00:47:19,480 Speaker 3: And he was saying, you and how you you know, 970 00:47:19,640 --> 00:47:23,040 Speaker 3: comport yourself like you would really resonate. He wanted to 971 00:47:23,080 --> 00:47:27,360 Speaker 3: have me at the Great Wall of China via satellite 972 00:47:27,360 --> 00:47:30,239 Speaker 3: for the NBA Draft, and so all my people were like, 973 00:47:30,320 --> 00:47:33,680 Speaker 3: that's a great idea, and I'm thinking, i want I 974 00:47:33,719 --> 00:47:35,120 Speaker 3: want that moment with commission to start. 975 00:47:35,239 --> 00:47:35,960 Speaker 1: I want to be there. 976 00:47:36,800 --> 00:47:41,680 Speaker 3: But like it was all Nike. The negotiations got kind 977 00:47:41,680 --> 00:47:43,759 Speaker 3: of screwed up. They kind of low balled me, and 978 00:47:43,800 --> 00:47:49,120 Speaker 3: it was posturing whatever. And then Fela's headquarters were in Baltimore. 979 00:47:49,160 --> 00:47:51,000 Speaker 3: My dad's from Baltimore, so he said, let's just go 980 00:47:51,040 --> 00:47:53,719 Speaker 3: over there and look, not thinking anything of it. So 981 00:47:53,800 --> 00:47:56,279 Speaker 3: we go over there and you know, I'm like, Okay, 982 00:47:56,320 --> 00:47:58,240 Speaker 3: they got some nice stuff, you know, and I'm thinking, 983 00:47:58,280 --> 00:48:00,759 Speaker 3: like growing up like Eiven, the country clubs, like the 984 00:48:00,800 --> 00:48:03,359 Speaker 3: tennis players or like the dough Boys and the wrap 985 00:48:03,400 --> 00:48:06,120 Speaker 3: you know, Fela. But that was and Feiela was kind 986 00:48:06,120 --> 00:48:08,239 Speaker 3: of like I don't know, it was kind of like 987 00:48:09,360 --> 00:48:11,400 Speaker 3: aspiration on the eighties, you know what I'm saying, Like, 988 00:48:11,560 --> 00:48:13,040 Speaker 3: you know it was it was looked at it, but 989 00:48:13,080 --> 00:48:15,880 Speaker 3: it wasn't looked at as a performance brand from basketball. 990 00:48:16,960 --> 00:48:19,319 Speaker 3: So I'll be real with you. Like they had they 991 00:48:19,360 --> 00:48:21,800 Speaker 3: had a couple of sheets of paper at the conference 992 00:48:21,840 --> 00:48:23,840 Speaker 3: room and I turned to that second page and the 993 00:48:23,880 --> 00:48:27,200 Speaker 3: money you know, I could. 994 00:48:27,040 --> 00:48:30,440 Speaker 1: Wear for FeelA, you know what I'm saying. But they 995 00:48:30,520 --> 00:48:33,720 Speaker 1: got money. He got I'm getting low balled over here. 996 00:48:35,280 --> 00:48:41,480 Speaker 1: They know what they offer. They got money. 997 00:48:41,640 --> 00:48:42,200 Speaker 2: That was it. 998 00:48:42,239 --> 00:48:43,239 Speaker 1: I mean, I hate to say it. 999 00:48:43,280 --> 00:48:46,160 Speaker 3: That was the initial like okay, like that opened my 1000 00:48:46,200 --> 00:48:50,080 Speaker 3: eyes and then you know, we just we ended up going. 1001 00:48:49,880 --> 00:48:52,520 Speaker 2: Forward with the reception you got because a lot of 1002 00:48:52,560 --> 00:48:55,080 Speaker 2: people had your shoe, A lot of people wore your 1003 00:48:55,080 --> 00:48:58,200 Speaker 2: shoe to have people like, yeah, you got the deal, 1004 00:48:58,280 --> 00:49:00,360 Speaker 2: but people still got to buy your shoes to see 1005 00:49:00,400 --> 00:49:03,279 Speaker 2: people wearing it the way they was wearing it. 1006 00:49:03,400 --> 00:49:04,640 Speaker 1: How was that for you? 1007 00:49:04,800 --> 00:49:07,040 Speaker 3: It was crazy? So one thing, I don't know if 1008 00:49:07,040 --> 00:49:11,000 Speaker 3: this this still stands, but I want to say, up 1009 00:49:11,080 --> 00:49:14,960 Speaker 3: until like two thousand, it was the highest grossing debut shoe, 1010 00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:17,920 Speaker 3: like a signature shoe, and that included like Jordan, that 1011 00:49:17,960 --> 00:49:21,680 Speaker 3: included Shack, included Ai all those guys. So I was, 1012 00:49:21,800 --> 00:49:23,760 Speaker 3: like I said, I was overwhelmed, Like, didn't I didn't 1013 00:49:23,800 --> 00:49:26,839 Speaker 3: see that coming. You know, they had Jamal Mashburn from 1014 00:49:26,840 --> 00:49:29,400 Speaker 3: the year before he wore Feelers, but now all of 1015 00:49:29,440 --> 00:49:32,200 Speaker 3: a sudden, it just it took off one of the 1016 00:49:32,200 --> 00:49:33,640 Speaker 3: big things. And I think it was a period of 1017 00:49:33,640 --> 00:49:36,520 Speaker 3: time too where you have the convergence of sport and 1018 00:49:36,880 --> 00:49:40,680 Speaker 3: music and culture. But like one of the like method 1019 00:49:40,719 --> 00:49:44,360 Speaker 3: Man wore them in the video with Mary j you know, 1020 00:49:44,520 --> 00:49:47,680 Speaker 3: like that was like that was crazy to me, like, oh, smack, 1021 00:49:47,719 --> 00:49:50,239 Speaker 3: he's wearing my shoe, like you know, and then you 1022 00:49:50,360 --> 00:49:52,680 Speaker 3: go places, you go to games and kids would want 1023 00:49:52,680 --> 00:49:54,879 Speaker 3: you to sign the shoes or you might you know, 1024 00:49:55,120 --> 00:49:57,399 Speaker 3: see people wearing your shoes at the mall or whatever. 1025 00:49:57,520 --> 00:50:00,319 Speaker 3: So it was just like like, man, I got my 1026 00:50:00,320 --> 00:50:03,120 Speaker 3: own shoe, like and then you know, seeing your stuff 1027 00:50:03,360 --> 00:50:05,560 Speaker 3: like they send you guys probably still got to you know, 1028 00:50:06,000 --> 00:50:08,520 Speaker 3: but like you know with jump Man, but they send 1029 00:50:08,560 --> 00:50:11,560 Speaker 3: you all types of apparel and shoes my boys are good, 1030 00:50:11,600 --> 00:50:15,920 Speaker 3: Like everybody's good, everybody wearing Fela, and so it was 1031 00:50:16,040 --> 00:50:18,160 Speaker 3: just you know it was man, life was good. I 1032 00:50:18,160 --> 00:50:19,200 Speaker 3: can't complain like I was. 1033 00:50:19,239 --> 00:50:22,480 Speaker 4: How is it to like like he said, you did 1034 00:50:22,520 --> 00:50:24,359 Speaker 4: all of that back then, and you know it did 1035 00:50:24,360 --> 00:50:25,480 Speaker 4: what it did like you said it did. 1036 00:50:25,480 --> 00:50:27,000 Speaker 1: The records to the debut shoe. 1037 00:50:27,640 --> 00:50:29,960 Speaker 4: Was it mind blowing when they came back to you 1038 00:50:30,040 --> 00:50:32,320 Speaker 4: like we want to retro and bring it out now 1039 00:50:32,760 --> 00:50:36,200 Speaker 4: in two thy twenty one when they first brought it 1040 00:50:36,239 --> 00:50:39,040 Speaker 4: back of twenty like to see a baker comeback and 1041 00:50:39,080 --> 00:50:42,040 Speaker 4: you like, y'all really want to do this again, like 1042 00:50:42,080 --> 00:50:43,600 Speaker 4: you know what I'm saying, Like, how was that for you? 1043 00:50:44,239 --> 00:50:47,200 Speaker 3: So it was crazy, Like I remember twenty eight it 1044 00:50:47,239 --> 00:50:49,719 Speaker 3: was twenty eighteen. We were talking and I went in 1045 00:50:49,760 --> 00:50:51,920 Speaker 3: to meet with Fila and I literally just went in 1046 00:50:52,360 --> 00:51:00,000 Speaker 3: because I wanted some like like Volor sweatsuits and had 1047 00:51:00,600 --> 00:51:03,480 Speaker 3: I left Fela, went to Adidas for a couple of years, 1048 00:51:03,520 --> 00:51:06,479 Speaker 3: went to Nike, and I finished my career wearing Nike. 1049 00:51:07,040 --> 00:51:11,560 Speaker 3: And so I'm in New York. John Epstein who's passed away, 1050 00:51:11,600 --> 00:51:14,000 Speaker 3: but he was the CEO then. He was the CEO 1051 00:51:14,200 --> 00:51:16,680 Speaker 3: when I was with Fila at the end, I just 1052 00:51:16,719 --> 00:51:19,200 Speaker 3: went in to kind of clear the air. We hadn't 1053 00:51:19,360 --> 00:51:21,640 Speaker 3: you know, hadn't caught up in a while. And I 1054 00:51:21,680 --> 00:51:23,000 Speaker 3: was just like, I was just like, man if I 1055 00:51:23,000 --> 00:51:26,319 Speaker 3: could get some you know, some gear, I'm good. And 1056 00:51:26,360 --> 00:51:28,040 Speaker 3: he was like, you know, we want to we want 1057 00:51:28,040 --> 00:51:32,760 Speaker 3: to reconnect. The nineties are in. Kids today like things 1058 00:51:32,760 --> 00:51:35,960 Speaker 3: that have a story, like vinyl. Vinyl's in with this 1059 00:51:36,080 --> 00:51:39,680 Speaker 3: young demographic Vinyl there's a story. You know, got the 1060 00:51:39,719 --> 00:51:42,920 Speaker 3: photo album, you got the credits, like it's it's a picture, 1061 00:51:43,040 --> 00:51:45,520 Speaker 3: like very different than kids now just downloading. 1062 00:51:45,560 --> 00:51:46,400 Speaker 1: There's no you know. 1063 00:51:46,440 --> 00:51:49,200 Speaker 3: Back in the day, that's how we felt connected to 1064 00:51:49,239 --> 00:51:54,319 Speaker 3: the artists by looking at the you know. And so 1065 00:51:54,920 --> 00:51:58,000 Speaker 3: the shoes too, like there's a story behind it and 1066 00:51:58,080 --> 00:52:00,640 Speaker 3: people they want that. And so I was like, all right, 1067 00:52:00,719 --> 00:52:03,320 Speaker 3: y'all say, I was thinking that people really want the shoes, 1068 00:52:03,360 --> 00:52:05,960 Speaker 3: but they put them back out, you know, I still 1069 00:52:05,960 --> 00:52:10,160 Speaker 3: get a royalty check and and it's it's crazy, you know. 1070 00:52:10,280 --> 00:52:13,120 Speaker 3: So it's it's it's all good. But I never saw 1071 00:52:13,160 --> 00:52:14,840 Speaker 3: that coming. I never saw that coming. 1072 00:52:15,000 --> 00:52:17,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's part of the culture. It's culture driven. 1073 00:52:17,320 --> 00:52:20,000 Speaker 2: So I knew it was coming back, right just seeing 1074 00:52:20,040 --> 00:52:22,120 Speaker 2: everything else come back, like, yeah, you gotta get them 1075 00:52:22,160 --> 00:52:23,520 Speaker 2: grand Hill and feel a grand Hill. 1076 00:52:23,600 --> 00:52:25,560 Speaker 1: That's the only time I hear feel a name. And 1077 00:52:25,680 --> 00:52:28,520 Speaker 1: when they mentioned your shoe name, Hey, but tell me 1078 00:52:28,560 --> 00:52:29,000 Speaker 1: this though. 1079 00:52:29,080 --> 00:52:32,120 Speaker 4: So your rookie year, you're the first rookie to ever 1080 00:52:32,160 --> 00:52:37,000 Speaker 4: get lead, to lead to all staring votes, like that's cool. 1081 00:52:36,280 --> 00:52:41,040 Speaker 4: And then your second year you outvote MJ. What the fuck? 1082 00:52:42,040 --> 00:52:46,360 Speaker 4: Like it's like, come on, bro, like what that was crazy? 1083 00:52:46,480 --> 00:52:49,040 Speaker 4: That was every where your mind when when that happened, 1084 00:52:49,040 --> 00:52:52,200 Speaker 4: like that's like that's not gonna happen, but then that happened. 1085 00:52:52,360 --> 00:52:54,520 Speaker 3: Yeah, No, I mean that that was. That was I 1086 00:52:54,560 --> 00:52:58,000 Speaker 3: still don't you know, I don't know how that. I'll 1087 00:52:58,040 --> 00:52:59,919 Speaker 3: be honest with you. I mean that was I got 1088 00:53:00,040 --> 00:53:00,239 Speaker 3: got it. 1089 00:53:00,280 --> 00:53:01,279 Speaker 1: I came back too. 1090 00:53:01,440 --> 00:53:04,880 Speaker 3: So yeah he did, and coming off space chain like 1091 00:53:04,920 --> 00:53:07,280 Speaker 3: it was just a lot of you know, the league 1092 00:53:07,320 --> 00:53:10,480 Speaker 3: needed him. Everybody wanted him back and braced him back. 1093 00:53:10,520 --> 00:53:13,359 Speaker 3: And at this point, you know, I kind of gotten 1094 00:53:13,400 --> 00:53:13,919 Speaker 3: to know Mike. 1095 00:53:14,200 --> 00:53:14,439 Speaker 1: Mike. 1096 00:53:15,239 --> 00:53:17,719 Speaker 3: I see him in Durham, you know, from time to time. 1097 00:53:17,960 --> 00:53:20,120 Speaker 3: But a real funny story. So I'm I'm in LA 1098 00:53:20,280 --> 00:53:23,520 Speaker 3: the summer of ninety five, after my rookie year, and 1099 00:53:24,440 --> 00:53:28,240 Speaker 3: I'm there to do. I'm taping living single, so doing that, 1100 00:53:28,840 --> 00:53:32,360 Speaker 3: and they built this this dome for Mike on the 1101 00:53:32,400 --> 00:53:34,919 Speaker 3: Warner Brothers a lot, and I find out that they're 1102 00:53:34,960 --> 00:53:39,480 Speaker 3: playing pickup ball, and so I go over there. Now, 1103 00:53:39,480 --> 00:53:41,680 Speaker 3: I got my grand Hill two's with the patent leather. 1104 00:53:41,880 --> 00:53:45,879 Speaker 3: He's got his with the patent letter. 1105 00:53:46,040 --> 00:53:46,239 Speaker 1: Yeah. 1106 00:53:47,280 --> 00:53:49,640 Speaker 3: So like I'm thinking, like the dude too, you know, 1107 00:53:49,680 --> 00:53:54,680 Speaker 3: he's stealing. They're not out yet, they're not in the 1108 00:53:54,680 --> 00:53:58,000 Speaker 3: stores yet. And so we're playing pickup ball. Now that 1109 00:53:58,080 --> 00:54:02,200 Speaker 3: first day, man, when I tell you I gave him 1110 00:54:02,239 --> 00:54:05,319 Speaker 3: the business, I was killing Mike like I was like 1111 00:54:05,440 --> 00:54:08,040 Speaker 3: literally like my jumper, I didn't really shoot the ball 1112 00:54:08,080 --> 00:54:10,120 Speaker 3: with my jumper was hitting. I'm crossing them up like 1113 00:54:10,120 --> 00:54:12,480 Speaker 3: I'm just like I'm going at him to the point 1114 00:54:12,480 --> 00:54:14,360 Speaker 3: where once again I get I'm done. I get on 1115 00:54:14,400 --> 00:54:16,799 Speaker 3: the phone with my boys. Yo, I'm killing Mike man, 1116 00:54:17,719 --> 00:54:20,120 Speaker 3: like you know all of that. And then I came 1117 00:54:20,120 --> 00:54:20,960 Speaker 3: back the next day. 1118 00:54:21,440 --> 00:54:24,239 Speaker 1: Oh my, like a whole other person. I should have 1119 00:54:24,360 --> 00:54:25,560 Speaker 1: just quit while I was ahead. 1120 00:54:26,480 --> 00:54:28,040 Speaker 3: And I don't know if I was really killing him 1121 00:54:28,080 --> 00:54:32,440 Speaker 3: like like like like I said, but in my mind, 1122 00:54:32,480 --> 00:54:33,160 Speaker 3: I was killing him. 1123 00:54:33,160 --> 00:54:34,799 Speaker 1: Oh you hit one shot on Mike. It's like we 1124 00:54:34,800 --> 00:54:35,399 Speaker 1: were a team. 1125 00:54:35,520 --> 00:54:39,960 Speaker 3: But like, man, the next day, all that footwork in 1126 00:54:40,000 --> 00:54:42,640 Speaker 3: the polls, like guarding me, not letting me get anywhere, 1127 00:54:42,680 --> 00:54:46,120 Speaker 3: Like it was a whole different person. And but I 1128 00:54:46,160 --> 00:54:48,880 Speaker 3: had that one moment. But now he I always enjoyed 1129 00:54:49,760 --> 00:54:52,879 Speaker 3: competing against him and competing with him in the All 1130 00:54:52,920 --> 00:54:56,359 Speaker 3: Star Game. And but I didn't guard him a whole 1131 00:54:56,360 --> 00:54:58,480 Speaker 3: lot because I messed up with Scottie a lot. But 1132 00:54:59,080 --> 00:55:01,640 Speaker 3: to beat him in all like, come on, man, I 1133 00:55:01,719 --> 00:55:03,759 Speaker 3: still I don't know if my mom was you know, 1134 00:55:03,880 --> 00:55:07,480 Speaker 3: vote multiple times, but something happened. 1135 00:55:11,120 --> 00:55:11,440 Speaker 1: All right. 1136 00:55:11,480 --> 00:55:14,359 Speaker 4: As you guys know, we've been giving away digital collectibles 1137 00:55:14,360 --> 00:55:17,839 Speaker 4: on each episode. The secret word for this episode is 1138 00:55:17,880 --> 00:55:21,040 Speaker 4: thirty three all lower case, no spaces. 1139 00:55:21,360 --> 00:55:23,760 Speaker 2: When I got to the league, one of my moves 1140 00:55:23,760 --> 00:55:27,120 Speaker 2: that used to work was the right to left cross over. 1141 00:55:28,160 --> 00:55:31,560 Speaker 2: Seeing your right to left cross over all the time, Like, 1142 00:55:31,960 --> 00:55:33,960 Speaker 2: how was it for your right to left to work? 1143 00:55:34,000 --> 00:55:36,319 Speaker 2: When you send your right to left work every game? 1144 00:55:36,320 --> 00:55:37,960 Speaker 2: Because I seen you bring it out there again, you 1145 00:55:37,960 --> 00:55:40,520 Speaker 2: don't bring it out all the time. One time, maybe 1146 00:55:40,520 --> 00:55:43,040 Speaker 2: in the first half, one time, maybe in the second half. 1147 00:55:43,640 --> 00:55:44,799 Speaker 1: To see that move work. 1148 00:55:44,880 --> 00:55:47,800 Speaker 2: How was that because I seen you cross Scottie and 1149 00:55:47,880 --> 00:55:50,759 Speaker 2: dunk that thing, and I was their right to left 1150 00:55:50,800 --> 00:55:53,600 Speaker 2: work every single time he bring it out. 1151 00:55:54,000 --> 00:55:56,319 Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, it's funny because I would go through 1152 00:55:57,000 --> 00:55:59,680 Speaker 3: my legs left to right and then try to come 1153 00:55:59,719 --> 00:56:03,320 Speaker 3: cross s you're over, And that came from watching Chris 1154 00:56:03,440 --> 00:56:07,720 Speaker 3: Jackson and Tim Hardaway. But I couldn't do it. 1155 00:56:07,600 --> 00:56:11,759 Speaker 2: Like all the way. 1156 00:56:10,560 --> 00:56:11,720 Speaker 1: And I just couldn't. 1157 00:56:12,000 --> 00:56:14,400 Speaker 3: So to me that like dribble through the legs, it's 1158 00:56:14,480 --> 00:56:17,120 Speaker 3: kind of a lazy set up and then either I 1159 00:56:17,239 --> 00:56:19,800 Speaker 3: cross you up or go you know. And I probably 1160 00:56:19,840 --> 00:56:22,920 Speaker 3: carried a little bit, but but no, I mean, like 1161 00:56:22,960 --> 00:56:27,319 Speaker 3: I said, like, I don't think players were used to 1162 00:56:27,480 --> 00:56:30,920 Speaker 3: somebody coming out like that. Back then, somebody told and 1163 00:56:31,000 --> 00:56:35,160 Speaker 3: I remember, man, I remember years later, I was guarding KD. 1164 00:56:35,760 --> 00:56:36,440 Speaker 1: I was in Phoenix. 1165 00:56:36,480 --> 00:56:39,279 Speaker 3: I'm guarding Durant, and you know with Durant, like back then, 1166 00:56:39,440 --> 00:56:43,799 Speaker 3: my strategy with Kevin was, you know, he kind of 1167 00:56:44,480 --> 00:56:46,359 Speaker 3: kind of ships from his left side, so he's gonna 1168 00:56:46,360 --> 00:56:48,960 Speaker 3: go left, he's gonna pull up if he goes right. 1169 00:56:49,560 --> 00:56:51,120 Speaker 3: I want to force him to go right, but I 1170 00:56:51,120 --> 00:56:53,000 Speaker 3: want him to pull up. You know, he may get 1171 00:56:53,000 --> 00:56:54,200 Speaker 3: to the right. I don't want him to go right 1172 00:56:54,239 --> 00:56:57,600 Speaker 3: to the right. And so man, one time he's guarded 1173 00:56:57,640 --> 00:56:59,880 Speaker 3: me and he did a he did a double cross 1174 00:57:00,040 --> 00:57:02,600 Speaker 3: over on me, and like, yeah, yeah, you know he did. 1175 00:57:03,200 --> 00:57:04,880 Speaker 3: I don't know what he did, but he did something. 1176 00:57:05,640 --> 00:57:07,680 Speaker 3: And it was just like man, like you know, the 1177 00:57:07,719 --> 00:57:10,080 Speaker 3: bar just cause you know, and he had a crazy 1178 00:57:10,160 --> 00:57:13,000 Speaker 3: jump shot. But but the game's part of the game evolving, 1179 00:57:13,120 --> 00:57:15,600 Speaker 3: you know, and you you know, we're standing on on 1180 00:57:15,719 --> 00:57:18,919 Speaker 3: other people's games and we get inspired by that, and 1181 00:57:18,960 --> 00:57:21,440 Speaker 3: you know, you see guys now doing things that are amazing. 1182 00:57:21,480 --> 00:57:24,320 Speaker 3: But back then, I think like j Kidd, Like I 1183 00:57:24,320 --> 00:57:26,680 Speaker 3: think one of the things with Jay Kidd, he didn't 1184 00:57:26,720 --> 00:57:27,640 Speaker 3: beat you with anything. 1185 00:57:28,240 --> 00:57:31,160 Speaker 1: He was just so fast. Change. 1186 00:57:31,680 --> 00:57:34,520 Speaker 3: Yeah, and you know I think I think I was 1187 00:57:34,600 --> 00:57:37,560 Speaker 3: deceptively quick. You know, you look at sometimes I look 1188 00:57:37,600 --> 00:57:39,720 Speaker 3: at the stuff. I'm like, man, I look slow, but 1189 00:57:39,760 --> 00:57:41,760 Speaker 3: I think I could cover. I could get bob people, 1190 00:57:42,120 --> 00:57:44,520 Speaker 3: you know. And uh and I didn't really shoot the 1191 00:57:44,520 --> 00:57:47,680 Speaker 3: ball that great. I developed that later. But but yeah, 1192 00:57:47,720 --> 00:57:49,919 Speaker 3: on the crossover that, like I said, DC, everybody wanted 1193 00:57:49,880 --> 00:57:50,439 Speaker 3: to cross over. 1194 00:57:50,640 --> 00:57:52,760 Speaker 4: That was that was I want to rewind back to 1195 00:57:52,880 --> 00:57:55,160 Speaker 4: going out that LA and being in the dome because 1196 00:57:55,160 --> 00:57:57,520 Speaker 4: you you share something like me and my boy. Here 1197 00:57:57,560 --> 00:57:59,680 Speaker 4: you was in year two. You know what I'm saying, 1198 00:57:59,720 --> 00:58:02,520 Speaker 4: You going out there, lady be a big time TV 1199 00:58:02,640 --> 00:58:05,400 Speaker 4: show star on Living Single? We did those things. We 1200 00:58:05,440 --> 00:58:08,640 Speaker 4: was on Artists and one on one im all this one. 1201 00:58:08,720 --> 00:58:12,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, I remember, like, tell me how that was for you? 1202 00:58:12,600 --> 00:58:14,920 Speaker 4: And it's like, i'mna, I'm gonna bring up my wife 1203 00:58:14,920 --> 00:58:17,479 Speaker 4: and I gotta bring up Ashley because they big Living 1204 00:58:17,520 --> 00:58:19,640 Speaker 4: Single fan, Like literally, you know how everything on the 1205 00:58:19,760 --> 00:58:21,720 Speaker 4: on the APPSNDE. I'll wake up in the middle of 1206 00:58:21,760 --> 00:58:23,840 Speaker 4: the night and Living Singles on TV in my house. 1207 00:58:23,880 --> 00:58:26,760 Speaker 4: So for real, it was like I didn't see it, 1208 00:58:27,160 --> 00:58:29,200 Speaker 4: but she was like, you gotta ask them about the 1209 00:58:29,640 --> 00:58:32,960 Speaker 4: about be on Living Single. So she was shortly to me, 1210 00:58:33,080 --> 00:58:35,520 Speaker 4: how was that for you? And she brought up a 1211 00:58:35,560 --> 00:58:37,760 Speaker 4: great point. She was like, how come in the nineties 1212 00:58:37,880 --> 00:58:40,040 Speaker 4: or that what we did it in the early two thousand, 1213 00:58:40,080 --> 00:58:43,080 Speaker 4: but like why all the TV shows always had us 1214 00:58:43,120 --> 00:58:46,440 Speaker 4: in some elementary school gym with a little with a 1215 00:58:46,480 --> 00:58:50,200 Speaker 4: little jersey, Yo, they can't put the NBA stuff and 1216 00:58:50,240 --> 00:58:53,080 Speaker 4: then they got us dunking on a little basket like that, 1217 00:58:53,200 --> 00:58:55,480 Speaker 4: Like how was that whole experience for you though. 1218 00:58:55,480 --> 00:58:58,640 Speaker 1: Well, you're right about the basketball court. That was. 1219 00:59:00,160 --> 00:59:02,840 Speaker 3: That was crazy. So I didn't know what I was 1220 00:59:02,840 --> 00:59:03,440 Speaker 3: getting into. 1221 00:59:04,000 --> 00:59:05,960 Speaker 4: And this man was on there for y'all A don't know. 1222 00:59:06,000 --> 00:59:08,320 Speaker 4: Please go look at he on there playing the piano. 1223 00:59:12,800 --> 00:59:13,560 Speaker 1: Let me let me tell you. 1224 00:59:13,560 --> 00:59:19,040 Speaker 3: So I had done earlier that year, I did home improvement. 1225 00:59:19,360 --> 00:59:21,680 Speaker 3: So I did that, but that was just you know, 1226 00:59:21,800 --> 00:59:25,440 Speaker 3: that was based in Detroit. It was a natural so 1227 00:59:25,680 --> 00:59:28,160 Speaker 3: and it was just like one scene and so it 1228 00:59:28,240 --> 00:59:31,640 Speaker 3: was like easy, and so they agreed they asked me 1229 00:59:31,640 --> 00:59:33,160 Speaker 3: to do it. So I flew out to l A. 1230 00:59:33,840 --> 00:59:38,720 Speaker 3: And remember the old hotel Nico Beverly Hills. Yeah, maybe 1231 00:59:38,720 --> 00:59:41,000 Speaker 3: it's a different name, but when you guys got there, 1232 00:59:41,040 --> 00:59:44,200 Speaker 3: but it was, so I'm staying there. They dropped the 1233 00:59:44,200 --> 00:59:48,000 Speaker 3: script off the night before the reading, and so I 1234 00:59:48,000 --> 00:59:51,200 Speaker 3: didn't even look at the script, like, I just got 1235 00:59:51,240 --> 00:59:53,920 Speaker 3: one scene, you know. So we get to the table reading, 1236 00:59:54,480 --> 00:59:57,200 Speaker 3: and if we tape on a Tuesday night, I think 1237 00:59:57,240 --> 00:59:59,720 Speaker 3: the table reading is like the next day, so like 1238 00:59:59,720 --> 01:00:02,560 Speaker 3: a whin today. So they taped the episode before the 1239 01:00:02,680 --> 01:00:04,680 Speaker 3: night before and then we're sitting there and we're going 1240 01:00:04,720 --> 01:00:08,680 Speaker 3: through and I'm like, damn, I gotta really act like 1241 01:00:08,680 --> 01:00:10,560 Speaker 3: I got a lot of stuff. Like I'm like, I'm like, 1242 01:00:11,000 --> 01:00:15,000 Speaker 3: they got me kissing and they got me singing. I'm like, 1243 01:00:15,680 --> 01:00:17,560 Speaker 3: you know, I can't do all that. Like I'm like 1244 01:00:18,160 --> 01:00:23,000 Speaker 3: not that. I'm like I can't. I'm just like So 1245 01:00:23,040 --> 01:00:26,880 Speaker 3: the funny thing is we go through rehearse all week. 1246 01:00:27,000 --> 01:00:28,760 Speaker 3: We got the weekend off. That's when I was playing 1247 01:00:28,760 --> 01:00:31,919 Speaker 3: ball with MJ. We do a dress rehearsal the night before. 1248 01:00:31,960 --> 01:00:34,360 Speaker 3: I think it was like the Monday night the following week. 1249 01:00:35,280 --> 01:00:38,760 Speaker 3: So I had a kissing scene with Latifa on the 1250 01:00:38,800 --> 01:00:41,720 Speaker 3: couch and but we never rehearsed, so I didn't know, 1251 01:00:42,680 --> 01:00:45,480 Speaker 3: like what are we doing here? You know, like it 1252 01:00:45,520 --> 01:00:46,600 Speaker 3: was never nobody told me. 1253 01:00:46,640 --> 01:00:50,400 Speaker 1: Like just kids like the nick right you were. 1254 01:00:54,120 --> 01:00:59,960 Speaker 3: So so the scene was the scene was we kissed 1255 01:01:00,400 --> 01:01:04,440 Speaker 3: to black so that man's kissed the commercial until we 1256 01:01:04,560 --> 01:01:12,720 Speaker 3: get cued who when to stop kissing? Yeah, So so 1257 01:01:12,720 --> 01:01:14,800 Speaker 3: so we do the scene like I mean, if I 1258 01:01:14,840 --> 01:01:17,000 Speaker 3: see it now, like leading up to I'm nervous. I'm 1259 01:01:17,000 --> 01:01:19,600 Speaker 3: nervous about like this part, Like I'm like, I don't 1260 01:01:19,600 --> 01:01:25,800 Speaker 3: know what what are we doing? Like discussed like like 1261 01:01:25,880 --> 01:01:28,840 Speaker 3: talk to me, you know, I mean, like I'm I'm 1262 01:01:28,840 --> 01:01:30,560 Speaker 3: not the real actor here, you know what I'm saying, Like, 1263 01:01:31,240 --> 01:01:39,120 Speaker 3: and so scene comes and you know, kissing, and they 1264 01:01:39,120 --> 01:01:42,200 Speaker 3: don't cure us, and so it felt like we were 1265 01:01:42,240 --> 01:01:47,360 Speaker 3: on the couch like forever longer than I had anticipated. 1266 01:01:47,560 --> 01:01:50,400 Speaker 3: Let's leave it at that, and so but anyway, now 1267 01:01:50,400 --> 01:01:52,120 Speaker 3: it was, it was, it was cool, and it was 1268 01:01:52,320 --> 01:01:55,640 Speaker 3: it was a show. I still get more people that 1269 01:01:55,840 --> 01:01:57,360 Speaker 3: talk to me like running to him, like, Man, I 1270 01:01:57,400 --> 01:01:59,800 Speaker 3: saw you a living sing or people might even. 1271 01:01:59,720 --> 01:02:02,120 Speaker 1: Tweet love hilarious. 1272 01:02:02,120 --> 01:02:04,000 Speaker 3: But that was a classic show class and I was 1273 01:02:04,040 --> 01:02:07,439 Speaker 3: you know, I definitely did more than I than I bought. 1274 01:02:07,600 --> 01:02:12,600 Speaker 4: Man with playing pianos, singing, saying the Queen Latifa, the regime. 1275 01:02:15,760 --> 01:02:16,840 Speaker 4: That thing was funny. 1276 01:02:16,840 --> 01:02:17,080 Speaker 1: Man. 1277 01:02:17,840 --> 01:02:21,560 Speaker 2: The decision to leave Detroit and go to Orlando, Like, 1278 01:02:22,800 --> 01:02:25,840 Speaker 2: just take us through the process of the talks. 1279 01:02:26,120 --> 01:02:27,920 Speaker 1: What made you decide to finally go? 1280 01:02:28,520 --> 01:02:31,720 Speaker 2: What you was thinking on as the team was getting 1281 01:02:31,720 --> 01:02:34,959 Speaker 2: set up with t Mac and particularly maybe Duncan trying 1282 01:02:34,960 --> 01:02:35,520 Speaker 2: to come over there. 1283 01:02:35,960 --> 01:02:39,160 Speaker 1: What's your version of of it? Well, two things. 1284 01:02:39,160 --> 01:02:42,400 Speaker 3: One, I never thought I'd leave Detroit, and I mean 1285 01:02:42,440 --> 01:02:45,920 Speaker 3: I obviously did, but my intention was, you know, like 1286 01:02:46,000 --> 01:02:48,919 Speaker 3: to me, it was Isaiah like every before every game 1287 01:02:48,920 --> 01:02:50,880 Speaker 3: in the Palace. I looked at his banner like, to me, 1288 01:02:51,000 --> 01:02:54,000 Speaker 3: I'm that's the standard, that's what I'm chasing, that's what 1289 01:02:54,040 --> 01:02:57,840 Speaker 3: I want to accomplish. And when I got hurt, I 1290 01:02:57,880 --> 01:03:00,440 Speaker 3: hurt my ankle. It was kind of missman. At the 1291 01:03:00,520 --> 01:03:03,680 Speaker 3: end of that last year, I was probably emotional and 1292 01:03:03,720 --> 01:03:06,400 Speaker 3: probably upset and directed a lot of that anger towards 1293 01:03:06,480 --> 01:03:09,440 Speaker 3: the team. And so I think in that moment then 1294 01:03:09,480 --> 01:03:12,080 Speaker 3: I started thinking like, man, amb out it, you know, 1295 01:03:12,120 --> 01:03:16,280 Speaker 3: basically long story short, like, yeah, exactly so. But I 1296 01:03:16,280 --> 01:03:18,560 Speaker 3: think prior to that, prior to the injury, I wasn't 1297 01:03:18,600 --> 01:03:22,680 Speaker 3: thinking at all about leaving Detroit. And so you know, 1298 01:03:22,800 --> 01:03:25,000 Speaker 3: Tim and I had the same agent, and we both 1299 01:03:25,000 --> 01:03:27,680 Speaker 3: made a trip down to Orlando the year before that 1300 01:03:27,760 --> 01:03:30,480 Speaker 3: year Doc Rivers coached them. They were five hundred, They 1301 01:03:30,520 --> 01:03:33,920 Speaker 3: had a lot of pieces. They didn't really have the stars, 1302 01:03:33,960 --> 01:03:38,040 Speaker 3: you know, they had some good support pieces and we 1303 01:03:38,080 --> 01:03:40,880 Speaker 3: had a good visit. Obviously I've said this before publicly 1304 01:03:41,000 --> 01:03:46,920 Speaker 3: that you know, Tim's girlfriend asked Doc good wives or 1305 01:03:46,960 --> 01:03:48,240 Speaker 3: girlfriends travel on the team? 1306 01:03:48,280 --> 01:03:51,360 Speaker 4: Plane dropped the ball on this from bo Yeah, I 1307 01:03:51,360 --> 01:03:52,840 Speaker 4: mean dropped the ball on. 1308 01:03:52,760 --> 01:03:55,120 Speaker 3: This, And so I didn't know at the time, but 1309 01:03:55,160 --> 01:03:58,240 Speaker 3: I guess that last year in San Antonio, the Spurs 1310 01:03:58,280 --> 01:04:02,600 Speaker 3: started allowing had to happen and started really recruiting her 1311 01:04:03,320 --> 01:04:05,280 Speaker 3: in a way to help keep tom. This is what 1312 01:04:05,320 --> 01:04:08,400 Speaker 3: I've been told. I don't know if this is the absolute, sir, 1313 01:04:08,840 --> 01:04:12,320 Speaker 3: absolute truth. And so she was accustomed to that. For 1314 01:04:12,400 --> 01:04:14,680 Speaker 3: me at that point, like girlfriends and wives didn't travel 1315 01:04:14,680 --> 01:04:17,120 Speaker 3: one that was like to me, that seemed like a 1316 01:04:17,280 --> 01:04:18,960 Speaker 3: like an unusual question. 1317 01:04:19,080 --> 01:04:22,400 Speaker 1: It depends like it's changed that one a usual thing. 1318 01:04:22,440 --> 01:04:25,120 Speaker 2: But if somebody was and were going home and they 1319 01:04:25,200 --> 01:04:27,440 Speaker 2: there instead of them waiting the whole day to the 1320 01:04:27,480 --> 01:04:29,479 Speaker 2: next day to leave, they were like, come on ride 1321 01:04:29,520 --> 01:04:30,120 Speaker 2: back with us. 1322 01:04:30,680 --> 01:04:30,880 Speaker 1: You know. 1323 01:04:31,400 --> 01:04:33,480 Speaker 3: When I got to Phoenix, like that was under like 1324 01:04:33,680 --> 01:04:35,360 Speaker 3: that was that was. 1325 01:04:34,880 --> 01:04:35,720 Speaker 1: A whole different Phoenix. 1326 01:04:39,120 --> 01:04:43,720 Speaker 4: Our homeboys could sit in practice, you know that little Yeah, 1327 01:04:43,760 --> 01:04:46,840 Speaker 4: our homeboys would sit like and chill and watch practice. 1328 01:04:47,120 --> 01:04:48,960 Speaker 3: So that was the first time that I experienced that 1329 01:04:49,000 --> 01:04:50,920 Speaker 3: when I got to Phoenix seven years later. But at 1330 01:04:50,920 --> 01:04:52,680 Speaker 3: that point, when I heard that question, I was like, 1331 01:04:52,760 --> 01:04:55,440 Speaker 3: that just seemed it seemed out of the ordinary. But 1332 01:04:56,160 --> 01:05:00,360 Speaker 3: and then Tim mac he didn't make the try, but 1333 01:05:00,400 --> 01:05:02,160 Speaker 3: they were talking about, look, we can get all three 1334 01:05:02,160 --> 01:05:05,560 Speaker 3: of y'all. I don't think I didn't know t Mac 1335 01:05:05,680 --> 01:05:08,720 Speaker 3: was that good. I knew he was good, and he. 1336 01:05:10,160 --> 01:05:12,280 Speaker 1: At that point I didn't know. 1337 01:05:12,720 --> 01:05:16,560 Speaker 3: I mean, he was good in Toronto. He could defend, 1338 01:05:16,640 --> 01:05:20,240 Speaker 3: he could score, but I didn't realize. So I'm thinking, 1339 01:05:20,320 --> 01:05:23,040 Speaker 3: you got me, you got Mac, you got Tim Man, 1340 01:05:23,480 --> 01:05:27,760 Speaker 3: We're off to the races. And uh and then Tim, 1341 01:05:28,120 --> 01:05:30,760 Speaker 3: you know, ended up staying. They recruited him hard. David 1342 01:05:30,840 --> 01:05:33,560 Speaker 3: Robinson flew back from Hawaii like he did. He made 1343 01:05:33,600 --> 01:05:36,320 Speaker 3: the right decision. I mean, that was obviously the right thing. 1344 01:05:36,400 --> 01:05:39,280 Speaker 3: But you know, for me, I showed up. 1345 01:05:39,600 --> 01:05:40,640 Speaker 1: Ankle just wasn't right. 1346 01:05:40,840 --> 01:05:44,520 Speaker 3: Basically, long story short, came back too soon and probably 1347 01:05:44,520 --> 01:05:47,640 Speaker 3: should have waited initially a little bit longer, and then 1348 01:05:47,680 --> 01:05:51,840 Speaker 3: coming back too soon. I'm gonna probably explain more than 1349 01:05:51,840 --> 01:05:55,000 Speaker 3: I should, but I ended up getting what's called a 1350 01:05:55,040 --> 01:05:58,120 Speaker 3: non union. And the non union is that if these 1351 01:05:58,120 --> 01:06:02,320 Speaker 3: two fingers are one bone and they break, typically what 1352 01:06:02,360 --> 01:06:04,440 Speaker 3: they do is they you know, they put them back together. 1353 01:06:04,680 --> 01:06:06,720 Speaker 3: They put pins in there to hold it together and 1354 01:06:06,800 --> 01:06:11,360 Speaker 3: let the body heal. But the two bones healed, but 1355 01:06:11,400 --> 01:06:14,600 Speaker 3: they didn't heal together. And so now that's what took 1356 01:06:15,280 --> 01:06:18,400 Speaker 3: essentially three more years and three more surgeries to try 1357 01:06:18,400 --> 01:06:20,520 Speaker 3: to get that to heal. So I do think I 1358 01:06:20,560 --> 01:06:22,560 Speaker 3: can't say this with absolute certainty, but I think if 1359 01:06:22,960 --> 01:06:25,960 Speaker 3: if we had waited a little bit longer, I'm responsible 1360 01:06:26,000 --> 01:06:28,200 Speaker 3: as was. I can't blame the team or not. Like 1361 01:06:28,720 --> 01:06:30,800 Speaker 3: to me, nobody put a gun to my head and 1362 01:06:30,800 --> 01:06:34,040 Speaker 3: said you got to play, But like that sort of 1363 01:06:34,120 --> 01:06:38,080 Speaker 3: derailed the next four years. But what was interesting though, 1364 01:06:38,520 --> 01:06:41,000 Speaker 3: right away I'm sitting there like, man, this team Mackett. 1365 01:06:41,040 --> 01:06:44,440 Speaker 3: Like before the season started, I'm like, oh my man, 1366 01:06:44,440 --> 01:06:47,080 Speaker 3: if I can get right with him, yeah, like it's 1367 01:06:47,120 --> 01:06:47,360 Speaker 3: gonna be. 1368 01:06:47,480 --> 01:06:49,720 Speaker 2: We went through one he went through every time I 1369 01:06:49,840 --> 01:06:52,280 Speaker 2: seen it was thirty. 1370 01:06:52,400 --> 01:06:54,000 Speaker 1: I want to ask you this though. 1371 01:06:54,160 --> 01:06:56,120 Speaker 2: I want you to explain from your point of view, 1372 01:06:56,160 --> 01:06:59,000 Speaker 2: and I want you to explain how strong your wife 1373 01:06:59,080 --> 01:07:02,280 Speaker 2: has to be in this, Like when you're going through 1374 01:07:02,320 --> 01:07:06,200 Speaker 2: an injury doing the things that we're doing and doing 1375 01:07:06,240 --> 01:07:09,280 Speaker 2: for something that we love so much to do, and 1376 01:07:09,360 --> 01:07:11,840 Speaker 2: you can't get out there and play to go through 1377 01:07:11,880 --> 01:07:14,440 Speaker 2: that injury, you have to persevere. You got to have 1378 01:07:14,480 --> 01:07:17,520 Speaker 2: a mindset, you know what I'm saying, a strong mindset, 1379 01:07:17,560 --> 01:07:20,520 Speaker 2: and it'd be tough days that you have. I want 1380 01:07:20,560 --> 01:07:23,640 Speaker 2: you to just explain to like man, what you went 1381 01:07:23,720 --> 01:07:27,720 Speaker 2: through when you went through the whole process to not 1382 01:07:27,800 --> 01:07:31,040 Speaker 2: give up on yourself to finally come back with Phoenix. 1383 01:07:31,080 --> 01:07:33,000 Speaker 2: And so for far, because I see every player, like 1384 01:07:33,000 --> 01:07:35,120 Speaker 2: when I see d Rose, when I see another player 1385 01:07:35,120 --> 01:07:39,600 Speaker 2: that go I know, the mindset, the mental the daily 1386 01:07:39,760 --> 01:07:42,320 Speaker 2: work that every day and not only you, if you 1387 01:07:42,400 --> 01:07:45,120 Speaker 2: have a spouse or a wife, she has to go 1388 01:07:45,200 --> 01:07:48,480 Speaker 2: through that same stuff with you and be there with 1389 01:07:48,560 --> 01:07:51,480 Speaker 2: you on your low days and on your high days. 1390 01:07:51,800 --> 01:07:52,640 Speaker 2: So explain that. 1391 01:07:53,600 --> 01:07:55,800 Speaker 3: And you've had you had a knee right then, yeah, yeah, yeah, 1392 01:07:55,800 --> 01:07:58,040 Speaker 3: so you've both probably lived in micro fashion. 1393 01:07:58,120 --> 01:07:58,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, so. 1394 01:08:00,040 --> 01:08:01,840 Speaker 3: That's that's a great question. I think first of all, 1395 01:08:01,880 --> 01:08:04,960 Speaker 3: with the wives, with the spouses that I think everybody 1396 01:08:05,000 --> 01:08:07,960 Speaker 3: sees the perks that come with being married, you know 1397 01:08:08,040 --> 01:08:10,840 Speaker 3: to somebody in the NBA. But there's also there's the 1398 01:08:11,000 --> 01:08:13,280 Speaker 3: challenges you know what I'm saying, and the schedule, you know, 1399 01:08:13,360 --> 01:08:16,760 Speaker 3: being gone times. I think, feeling like you're you know, 1400 01:08:16,920 --> 01:08:19,479 Speaker 3: a single parent, you know, So it's not I have 1401 01:08:19,600 --> 01:08:21,799 Speaker 3: respect for that, and I think unless you've been in it, 1402 01:08:21,800 --> 01:08:25,120 Speaker 3: it's hard to fully understand. But then the injuries, like 1403 01:08:25,200 --> 01:08:30,920 Speaker 3: that's you know. So you know, I had five ankle 1404 01:08:31,000 --> 01:08:36,240 Speaker 3: surgeries and I'm on crutches, and so you know, I 1405 01:08:36,280 --> 01:08:39,040 Speaker 3: had a little bell. You know, it's like something you 1406 01:08:39,080 --> 01:08:40,880 Speaker 3: know what I'm saying, and so to me like eventually 1407 01:08:40,960 --> 01:08:43,200 Speaker 3: through that bell. And then when I had to have like, 1408 01:08:43,280 --> 01:08:45,280 Speaker 3: I don't know, my third surgery for surgery, it was 1409 01:08:45,360 --> 01:08:47,639 Speaker 3: kind of like I remember, she was like I can't 1410 01:08:47,640 --> 01:08:48,320 Speaker 3: take another. 1411 01:08:48,080 --> 01:08:51,759 Speaker 1: Sort like just so the toll on them is really 1412 01:08:52,040 --> 01:08:52,280 Speaker 1: you know. 1413 01:08:53,040 --> 01:08:56,320 Speaker 3: I do think for us though, as athletes, were naturally 1414 01:08:56,439 --> 01:09:02,120 Speaker 3: conditioned to fight. And I always say, like we're in 1415 01:09:02,160 --> 01:09:06,000 Speaker 3: a game, you're down ten with six mince left, you 1416 01:09:06,040 --> 01:09:08,960 Speaker 3: believe you got a chance. You go against We talked 1417 01:09:09,000 --> 01:09:11,120 Speaker 3: about Michael Jordan. You're going You're not going You're going 1418 01:09:11,160 --> 01:09:13,000 Speaker 3: out there to compete, you know what I'm saying. You 1419 01:09:13,080 --> 01:09:15,960 Speaker 3: playing the Bulls, or you playing you know, the Warriors 1420 01:09:16,040 --> 01:09:19,800 Speaker 3: during the during their dynasty, or you're playing any great team. 1421 01:09:20,280 --> 01:09:22,840 Speaker 3: You going in there feeling like you're gonna win and 1422 01:09:22,880 --> 01:09:25,760 Speaker 3: you may not win. But that's the mindset that I 1423 01:09:25,800 --> 01:09:30,519 Speaker 3: think sports helps to cultivate. And so going through an injury, 1424 01:09:30,520 --> 01:09:31,800 Speaker 3: it's like I'm gonna fight through this. 1425 01:09:31,960 --> 01:09:32,120 Speaker 1: Now. 1426 01:09:32,120 --> 01:09:34,360 Speaker 3: It wasn't always easy. You know what I'm saying. You 1427 01:09:34,360 --> 01:09:37,120 Speaker 3: had your ups and your downs, and for me, what 1428 01:09:37,280 --> 01:09:39,559 Speaker 3: I realized, I suppressed a lot of it, Like I 1429 01:09:39,680 --> 01:09:42,120 Speaker 3: just kind of like I'm gonna get through it, like 1430 01:09:42,160 --> 01:09:44,000 Speaker 3: I'm here, like okay, I'm gonna make up it. On 1431 01:09:44,040 --> 01:09:46,200 Speaker 3: the back end, I kept saying, I'm gonna play until 1432 01:09:46,200 --> 01:09:49,559 Speaker 3: I'm forty. And I'm telling y'all the day I turned forty, 1433 01:09:49,760 --> 01:09:53,639 Speaker 3: I was with the Clippers my last year. My knee 1434 01:09:54,160 --> 01:09:56,840 Speaker 3: like I was done and it was training camp and 1435 01:09:56,880 --> 01:09:59,640 Speaker 3: I knew like my body and I kept saying I 1436 01:09:59,640 --> 01:10:02,800 Speaker 3: should have at forty five, you know. But yeah, like 1437 01:10:02,840 --> 01:10:04,920 Speaker 3: I think, I think it's so going through all of 1438 01:10:04,960 --> 01:10:07,360 Speaker 3: that it was hard. I don't think I really dealt 1439 01:10:07,400 --> 01:10:09,639 Speaker 3: with it until I got to the Hall of Fame. 1440 01:10:09,840 --> 01:10:12,559 Speaker 3: And what I mean by that is, I'm the type 1441 01:10:12,600 --> 01:10:16,240 Speaker 3: of person that I'm goal oriented. I got things I 1442 01:10:16,280 --> 01:10:20,000 Speaker 3: want to accomplish. I don't look back. I'm constantly looking forward. 1443 01:10:20,040 --> 01:10:24,040 Speaker 3: In my house in Detroit, my house in you know, Orlando, 1444 01:10:24,120 --> 01:10:27,240 Speaker 3: different stages of my career and where we've lived. I've 1445 01:10:27,240 --> 01:10:31,360 Speaker 3: never displayed my accomplishments because I'm always trying to go forward, 1446 01:10:31,360 --> 01:10:33,960 Speaker 3: trying to do something new, trying to accomplish something else. 1447 01:10:34,360 --> 01:10:36,559 Speaker 3: I always felt like that made you soft if I 1448 01:10:36,600 --> 01:10:38,920 Speaker 3: did that, because you rest naturally on your lort. So 1449 01:10:38,920 --> 01:10:41,400 Speaker 3: I wanted to stay hungry. And so when I got 1450 01:10:41,400 --> 01:10:43,720 Speaker 3: to the Hall of Fame, and that build up to 1451 01:10:43,760 --> 01:10:47,759 Speaker 3: the Hall of Fame, that's naturally a moment to reflect. 1452 01:10:48,080 --> 01:10:50,479 Speaker 3: It's naturally work. Yeah, you're just gonna reflect on everything. 1453 01:10:50,520 --> 01:10:53,920 Speaker 3: It's the last it's like the capstone on your career. 1454 01:10:54,080 --> 01:10:57,000 Speaker 3: And so in that moment, I think I started to 1455 01:10:57,040 --> 01:11:01,679 Speaker 3: realize that I suppressed a lot of things and didn't 1456 01:11:01,720 --> 01:11:04,320 Speaker 3: fully deal with them in real time. And look, I 1457 01:11:04,320 --> 01:11:07,240 Speaker 3: mean people suppress things that are far worse than not 1458 01:11:07,280 --> 01:11:10,479 Speaker 3: being able to play. But but I was just driven, 1459 01:11:10,560 --> 01:11:13,040 Speaker 3: like I was like, I'm I'm gonna figure out a 1460 01:11:13,040 --> 01:11:18,000 Speaker 3: way to get and so I wasn't the same player 1461 01:11:18,080 --> 01:11:22,000 Speaker 3: when I came back. And that's the one not that 1462 01:11:22,080 --> 01:11:25,960 Speaker 3: I have regrets, but I think when you when you 1463 01:11:26,000 --> 01:11:28,880 Speaker 3: have your art, when you have your weapons, and you 1464 01:11:28,960 --> 01:11:31,679 Speaker 3: go out on the court, you have to have a belief. 1465 01:11:31,880 --> 01:11:34,479 Speaker 3: I don't care who you're going against, you always feel 1466 01:11:34,560 --> 01:11:37,360 Speaker 3: like I'm the best player or I'm gonna win this matchup. 1467 01:11:37,439 --> 01:11:39,639 Speaker 3: And I felt that before I got hurt. Like when 1468 01:11:39,680 --> 01:11:42,040 Speaker 3: I was on that court, I'm like, man, he got 1469 01:11:42,120 --> 01:11:44,320 Speaker 3: to guard me. But you know, like you know whatever 1470 01:11:44,400 --> 01:11:47,200 Speaker 3: I mean, Just you have to think that you guys 1471 01:11:47,240 --> 01:11:49,880 Speaker 3: have all felt that way. I could, I know because 1472 01:11:49,920 --> 01:11:51,519 Speaker 3: I played against y'all and I can feel it, and 1473 01:11:51,560 --> 01:11:54,320 Speaker 3: you can tell when somebody doesn't, you know, when somebody's scared. 1474 01:11:55,160 --> 01:11:59,400 Speaker 3: And so when I came back, I didn't have that 1475 01:11:59,600 --> 01:12:03,880 Speaker 3: same edge. I didn't have that same I don't want 1476 01:12:03,880 --> 01:12:08,559 Speaker 3: to say same dog, but that same standard. Maybe I 1477 01:12:08,600 --> 01:12:10,960 Speaker 3: was just happy to be back, which is a beautiful thing. 1478 01:12:11,400 --> 01:12:12,920 Speaker 3: You know what I'm saying. You've been out for so long, 1479 01:12:12,960 --> 01:12:14,560 Speaker 3: it's beautiful to be like, I'm appreciative. 1480 01:12:15,040 --> 01:12:15,679 Speaker 1: But like I didn't. 1481 01:12:15,840 --> 01:12:18,240 Speaker 3: I didn't come back like you know, kicking ass, taking 1482 01:12:18,320 --> 01:12:20,360 Speaker 3: names type of dam I came back just like, hey, 1483 01:12:20,479 --> 01:12:21,559 Speaker 3: you want me to guard, you want me. 1484 01:12:21,560 --> 01:12:22,400 Speaker 1: To do that? Do it. 1485 01:12:24,840 --> 01:12:26,599 Speaker 4: This is where I can remember about him coming back, 1486 01:12:26,600 --> 01:12:28,559 Speaker 4: because I can tell I had a lot of respect 1487 01:12:28,720 --> 01:12:31,080 Speaker 4: for when you did finally make it back to the court, 1488 01:12:31,120 --> 01:12:33,439 Speaker 4: because I can remember we played, we guard each other, 1489 01:12:33,840 --> 01:12:36,320 Speaker 4: and I was like, you like, all right, like he 1490 01:12:36,360 --> 01:12:39,200 Speaker 4: ain't that g here about the goddamn But I can 1491 01:12:39,360 --> 01:12:43,200 Speaker 4: remember being like yo, like after the game, like push 1492 01:12:43,280 --> 01:12:45,760 Speaker 4: ain't by nothing like you here out here going though, 1493 01:12:45,880 --> 01:12:48,800 Speaker 4: like play hard as ship, you know what I'm saying, 1494 01:12:49,160 --> 01:12:52,920 Speaker 4: Like like you said and everything guardening like still you 1495 01:12:52,960 --> 01:12:55,360 Speaker 4: said he wasn't about to go, you know, turn back 1496 01:12:55,400 --> 01:12:56,760 Speaker 4: the clock, but like you still would. 1497 01:12:56,960 --> 01:12:58,719 Speaker 1: Your jumper was better, more consistent. 1498 01:12:58,760 --> 01:13:00,519 Speaker 4: I feel like he was more of a I'm shot there, 1499 01:13:00,680 --> 01:13:02,960 Speaker 4: but like to me, it was just like I can't 1500 01:13:03,000 --> 01:13:05,200 Speaker 4: believe man playing his fucking hard like he playing harder. 1501 01:13:05,479 --> 01:13:08,880 Speaker 4: He was playing hard a head like like hustling. Like 1502 01:13:08,960 --> 01:13:11,000 Speaker 4: then I felt like you was more you had gotten 1503 01:13:11,040 --> 01:13:13,479 Speaker 4: strong and was way more physical then, Like I was 1504 01:13:13,520 --> 01:13:15,759 Speaker 4: like that's what I feel like he trying to push 1505 01:13:15,840 --> 01:13:18,960 Speaker 4: and like I'm the pusher, like he's trying to push me, 1506 01:13:19,120 --> 01:13:21,880 Speaker 4: like okay, But like I can remember then, I remember 1507 01:13:21,880 --> 01:13:24,360 Speaker 4: you playing like you got like I think, like oh 1508 01:13:24,479 --> 01:13:26,240 Speaker 4: nine one of them years, you played like all eighty 1509 01:13:26,240 --> 01:13:29,080 Speaker 4: two games, and I remember like it wasn't like obviously 1510 01:13:29,120 --> 01:13:31,280 Speaker 4: one like big deal. But I'm wanting them people to 1511 01:13:31,320 --> 01:13:32,880 Speaker 4: watch all of the games, and I can remember them 1512 01:13:32,920 --> 01:13:35,080 Speaker 4: talking about it and I was like god damn, Like 1513 01:13:35,080 --> 01:13:37,479 Speaker 4: like I remember having a whole lot of respect for 1514 01:13:37,520 --> 01:13:39,639 Speaker 4: that like, boy, this boy went through what he went through, 1515 01:13:39,680 --> 01:13:42,200 Speaker 4: and like just off the strength of all that, you 1516 01:13:42,200 --> 01:13:44,720 Speaker 4: wouldn't think he gonna get another eighty two in like 1517 01:13:44,720 --> 01:13:45,880 Speaker 4: at some point for you to. 1518 01:13:45,800 --> 01:13:47,760 Speaker 1: Have to play all eighty two and I could. 1519 01:13:47,840 --> 01:13:49,719 Speaker 4: I was thinking to myselide, I know that was something 1520 01:13:49,760 --> 01:13:51,240 Speaker 4: that he was like, I want to do, Like that 1521 01:13:51,360 --> 01:13:53,600 Speaker 4: was probably like a goal. And so like for me, 1522 01:13:53,760 --> 01:13:56,200 Speaker 4: like when I saw like you may have thought, we 1523 01:13:56,240 --> 01:13:58,880 Speaker 4: respected that shit, Like me and everybody that I was 1524 01:13:59,120 --> 01:14:01,599 Speaker 4: peers with in teams, well, we was all talking about 1525 01:14:01,640 --> 01:14:03,600 Speaker 4: like yo Ghill playing Hart as fuck, like you know 1526 01:14:03,640 --> 01:14:05,519 Speaker 4: what I'm saying, Like, so it was a respect factor 1527 01:14:05,520 --> 01:14:06,320 Speaker 4: from us for it. 1528 01:14:07,080 --> 01:14:08,479 Speaker 1: I mean, Fro, I appreciate you sharing that. 1529 01:14:08,479 --> 01:14:10,200 Speaker 3: I mean, I think you look at it and like 1530 01:14:10,200 --> 01:14:12,479 Speaker 3: I said, it's not a bad thing, but like every moment, 1531 01:14:13,520 --> 01:14:15,600 Speaker 3: it's like you look at it differently. I'll tell you 1532 01:14:15,640 --> 01:14:17,800 Speaker 3: a story. So I used to get to the jump 1533 01:14:17,840 --> 01:14:21,160 Speaker 3: ball and this you know Phoenix he is. I get 1534 01:14:21,160 --> 01:14:23,080 Speaker 3: to the jump ball and you see somebody or whatever 1535 01:14:23,360 --> 01:14:24,880 Speaker 3: and they look up at my hair and they see 1536 01:14:24,920 --> 01:14:27,080 Speaker 3: the grays and I was like, oh they see my 1537 01:14:27,120 --> 01:14:29,000 Speaker 3: grad I'm I'm gonna run the shit out and so, 1538 01:14:29,520 --> 01:14:31,160 Speaker 3: and like, I'm just gonna run up and down the 1539 01:14:31,200 --> 01:14:32,680 Speaker 3: court all day exactly. 1540 01:14:33,360 --> 01:14:37,240 Speaker 1: I'm like, yo, what running so hard? I swear to 1541 01:14:37,320 --> 01:14:39,639 Speaker 1: you that shit is funny because he used to be gone, 1542 01:14:40,280 --> 01:14:40,479 Speaker 1: you know. 1543 01:14:40,600 --> 01:14:42,479 Speaker 3: And Nash he's gonna throw it to you know what 1544 01:14:42,479 --> 01:14:44,800 Speaker 3: I'm saying. So like, I'm like, I'm gonna I'm gonna 1545 01:14:44,800 --> 01:14:47,479 Speaker 3: get three four layups, just beating everybody down the floor. 1546 01:14:48,000 --> 01:14:49,800 Speaker 3: And but no, I mean it was you know what, 1547 01:14:49,840 --> 01:14:51,759 Speaker 3: I'm glad I did it. I still had the desire 1548 01:14:51,800 --> 01:14:55,840 Speaker 3: to love and once it's over, it's over. And I 1549 01:14:55,880 --> 01:14:58,200 Speaker 3: saw that with my dad. I saw with his generation 1550 01:14:58,840 --> 01:15:00,920 Speaker 3: that once you walk away from from it, there's no 1551 01:15:01,000 --> 01:15:03,720 Speaker 3: going back. So I'm gonna do it as long as 1552 01:15:03,720 --> 01:15:04,040 Speaker 3: I can. 1553 01:15:04,120 --> 01:15:06,599 Speaker 2: And we're in the league that you know, they smelled 1554 01:15:06,640 --> 01:15:09,400 Speaker 2: blood if they see you got an injury, you a 1555 01:15:09,400 --> 01:15:11,519 Speaker 2: little bit hurt. You can't do the things that we 1556 01:15:11,560 --> 01:15:15,400 Speaker 2: have done seen you do before. We're not taking nobody's 1557 01:15:15,439 --> 01:15:18,320 Speaker 2: taking no chance on you. They're not giving you nothing. 1558 01:15:18,360 --> 01:15:20,680 Speaker 2: They're not gonna you gotta take everything you get in 1559 01:15:20,720 --> 01:15:23,040 Speaker 2: this league. So I know, like when you come back, 1560 01:15:23,280 --> 01:15:25,840 Speaker 2: like just seeing Penny, you know, Penny was one of 1561 01:15:25,840 --> 01:15:28,320 Speaker 2: our favorites and getting into the league, and Penny is 1562 01:15:28,439 --> 01:15:31,680 Speaker 2: with Phoenix, Penny one, the guy that was jumping and 1563 01:15:31,800 --> 01:15:33,720 Speaker 2: moving and all that, and we was going. 1564 01:15:33,479 --> 01:15:36,560 Speaker 3: At his ass, like let me, let me take a 1565 01:15:36,560 --> 01:15:38,720 Speaker 3: story about that, not Penny, but a story about MJ. 1566 01:15:39,000 --> 01:15:42,000 Speaker 3: So his last year with the Wizards, it's gonna be 1567 01:15:42,040 --> 01:15:42,799 Speaker 3: his last season. 1568 01:15:43,880 --> 01:15:44,639 Speaker 1: We go to DC. 1569 01:15:45,640 --> 01:15:48,599 Speaker 3: We played him earlier in the year and it was crazy, 1570 01:15:48,600 --> 01:15:50,880 Speaker 3: like I'm guarding him Jay and he's he's older now 1571 01:15:51,120 --> 01:15:53,240 Speaker 3: he's not. Obviously you guys were in the league when 1572 01:15:53,240 --> 01:15:55,479 Speaker 3: he was playing that year, But I blocked the shot 1573 01:15:55,520 --> 01:15:57,800 Speaker 3: two or three times, like I feel like like I'm 1574 01:15:57,840 --> 01:16:00,479 Speaker 3: just kind of like, you know, like Gardener, I'm saying. 1575 01:16:00,520 --> 01:16:00,840 Speaker 1: And so. 1576 01:16:02,320 --> 01:16:05,600 Speaker 3: We played him on tn T and we go to 1577 01:16:05,680 --> 01:16:08,800 Speaker 3: DC and my doctor who was in Baltimore. I think 1578 01:16:08,840 --> 01:16:11,200 Speaker 3: this was like this was the two thousand and two, 1579 01:16:11,280 --> 01:16:13,400 Speaker 3: two thousand and three seasons, so it might have been 1580 01:16:13,479 --> 01:16:17,840 Speaker 3: like in November or December, go see the doctor. My 1581 01:16:17,920 --> 01:16:21,400 Speaker 3: ankle's messed up again, and like, I'm gonna have to 1582 01:16:21,400 --> 01:16:24,280 Speaker 3: have season ending surgery, but I want to play. 1583 01:16:24,120 --> 01:16:26,519 Speaker 1: Against Mike one more time. 1584 01:16:25,960 --> 01:16:27,400 Speaker 3: Because I know this is it, Like I'm not gonna 1585 01:16:27,400 --> 01:16:35,560 Speaker 3: see him again. Man, he was killing me. I should 1586 01:16:35,080 --> 01:16:37,559 Speaker 3: have you know, I should have once again, I should. 1587 01:16:37,360 --> 01:16:39,240 Speaker 1: Have quit when I was ahead. 1588 01:16:39,280 --> 01:16:42,599 Speaker 3: But the ego, the pride, the competitive so the same 1589 01:16:43,240 --> 01:16:46,840 Speaker 3: stupid little turndown play, and I couldn't I couldn't move, 1590 01:16:47,760 --> 01:16:49,679 Speaker 3: and he knew, like you know, so to your point, 1591 01:16:49,760 --> 01:16:52,600 Speaker 3: like you know, like you know when you you know 1592 01:16:52,680 --> 01:16:55,000 Speaker 3: when somebody's scared, you know, you just know it. And 1593 01:16:55,120 --> 01:16:57,680 Speaker 3: and you know when somebody wants to compete, and you 1594 01:16:57,720 --> 01:17:01,000 Speaker 3: respect when somebody's gonna want to square with you and compete. 1595 01:17:01,080 --> 01:17:03,040 Speaker 3: You may win, they may win, but you respect that 1596 01:17:03,080 --> 01:17:03,839 Speaker 3: they're not scared. 1597 01:17:03,960 --> 01:17:07,080 Speaker 4: I want to get your your take your perspective, because 1598 01:17:07,120 --> 01:17:09,280 Speaker 4: we had a few guys on here that was part 1599 01:17:09,320 --> 01:17:12,200 Speaker 4: of that team, the College Select team that played against 1600 01:17:12,200 --> 01:17:16,360 Speaker 4: the Dream Team, and we had a few different stories about, 1601 01:17:16,439 --> 01:17:19,720 Speaker 4: you know, how y'all was doing well, and we had 1602 01:17:19,840 --> 01:17:22,840 Speaker 4: Mashburn hot Bird ran up on him and talk talk 1603 01:17:22,960 --> 01:17:25,920 Speaker 4: records to him, like tell me your perspective, Like how 1604 01:17:26,040 --> 01:17:27,800 Speaker 4: was that for you the whole experience? 1605 01:17:27,840 --> 01:17:28,840 Speaker 1: What was you thinking. 1606 01:17:28,600 --> 01:17:32,400 Speaker 4: Before, during, and after that whole experience with the Dream Team. 1607 01:17:34,040 --> 01:17:37,240 Speaker 3: That was one of the best weeks of my life. 1608 01:17:37,479 --> 01:17:39,479 Speaker 3: I mean, just as a fan, it was after my 1609 01:17:39,520 --> 01:17:45,519 Speaker 3: second year duke. It's me Mashburn, Allen Houston, Penny, Robby Early, Mons, Ross, 1610 01:17:45,640 --> 01:17:50,080 Speaker 3: Rodney Rogers, eight of us, and well oh Man Camp 1611 01:17:50,240 --> 01:17:54,639 Speaker 3: see well like yeah, I mean we so we get 1612 01:17:54,680 --> 01:17:58,680 Speaker 3: to La Joya. We're in a nice hotel resort. We 1613 01:17:58,800 --> 01:18:01,960 Speaker 3: get there early. We go out and play that first game, 1614 01:18:01,960 --> 01:18:03,479 Speaker 3: and I know there's been a lot of talk about 1615 01:18:03,520 --> 01:18:08,000 Speaker 3: what happened, but we we busted. You know, we went 1616 01:18:08,080 --> 01:18:11,000 Speaker 3: at them. Allan Houston hit like ten threes. Weber was 1617 01:18:11,080 --> 01:18:16,120 Speaker 3: just dunking everything inside. Bobby could get by into the paint, 1618 01:18:16,200 --> 01:18:20,519 Speaker 3: make plays everybody, Penny, myself, We're bringing the ball like 1619 01:18:20,600 --> 01:18:23,479 Speaker 3: dunk like just it was. It was one of the 1620 01:18:23,479 --> 01:18:27,040 Speaker 3: more like most magical moments that I've ever had because 1621 01:18:27,040 --> 01:18:29,240 Speaker 3: you're going against these heroes and we didn't have like 1622 01:18:29,280 --> 01:18:32,639 Speaker 3: we didn't like nowadays, you're top high school, top college player. 1623 01:18:32,640 --> 01:18:35,000 Speaker 3: You might play against the pro. You might see him. Shoot, 1624 01:18:35,040 --> 01:18:36,519 Speaker 3: you might have played against him in high school, you 1625 01:18:36,520 --> 01:18:38,479 Speaker 3: know what I'm saying. Like back then, it was just. 1626 01:18:38,400 --> 01:18:39,120 Speaker 1: It was a little bit. 1627 01:18:40,560 --> 01:18:40,760 Speaker 4: Yeah. 1628 01:18:40,800 --> 01:18:42,240 Speaker 1: So all he's a Leegends. 1629 01:18:42,120 --> 01:18:46,799 Speaker 3: Magic bird, Michael, like you know, Clyde pat Ewen Malone. 1630 01:18:46,960 --> 01:18:50,280 Speaker 3: I mean just down the list, and then well before 1631 01:18:50,280 --> 01:18:52,200 Speaker 3: that day though before that day, so we had a 1632 01:18:52,200 --> 01:18:55,160 Speaker 3: little practice the day before and we all were getting 1633 01:18:55,160 --> 01:18:57,559 Speaker 3: back from practice and we get on the elevator and 1634 01:18:57,640 --> 01:19:00,800 Speaker 3: Larry Bird's on the elevator and he's chirp. Now at 1635 01:19:00,800 --> 01:19:03,920 Speaker 3: this point, I didn't realize Larry talked trash. But he's talking, 1636 01:19:04,000 --> 01:19:06,559 Speaker 3: and I didn't realize how big he was. He's six ten, 1637 01:19:07,800 --> 01:19:10,639 Speaker 3: and but he's on the I'm like, yo, he talks 1638 01:19:10,680 --> 01:19:11,519 Speaker 3: a lot of truck, didn't. 1639 01:19:11,520 --> 01:19:12,400 Speaker 1: I didn't see that. I didn't. 1640 01:19:12,800 --> 01:19:15,880 Speaker 3: But nah, man, look you know what you say. I 1641 01:19:15,920 --> 01:19:19,040 Speaker 3: can't remember. He's like, y'all get y'all rest because blah 1642 01:19:19,040 --> 01:19:21,519 Speaker 3: blah blah. He was like talking all his noise, And 1643 01:19:21,600 --> 01:19:24,880 Speaker 3: so Coach k in the Dream Team documentary said that 1644 01:19:24,960 --> 01:19:28,720 Speaker 3: Chuck Daily threw that scrimmage to kind of get them 1645 01:19:28,760 --> 01:19:32,040 Speaker 3: to focus. But nah, and he tried to say, Michael, 1646 01:19:32,200 --> 01:19:35,120 Speaker 3: he sat Michael out. Man, look, Michael, watch some of them. 1647 01:19:35,560 --> 01:19:36,880 Speaker 3: He might not have got all of it. He got 1648 01:19:36,920 --> 01:19:39,040 Speaker 3: some of it, but it ain't like the rest of 1649 01:19:39,080 --> 01:19:41,400 Speaker 3: the guys were terrible, Like you you know what I'm saying, Like, 1650 01:19:41,439 --> 01:19:45,000 Speaker 3: even if Michael did sit, they should they should have won. Now, 1651 01:19:45,040 --> 01:19:47,639 Speaker 3: the next day we couldn't get the ball over half court. 1652 01:19:48,479 --> 01:19:52,080 Speaker 3: We had Michael and Scottie. It was it was a 1653 01:19:52,160 --> 01:19:55,120 Speaker 3: whole but it was a whole different. But it woke 1654 01:19:55,200 --> 01:19:56,880 Speaker 3: him up, you know what I'm saying. And it showed 1655 01:19:56,960 --> 01:19:59,240 Speaker 3: them that they could lose. But that was man. 1656 01:19:59,240 --> 01:19:59,880 Speaker 1: We were in La Joy. 1657 01:20:00,080 --> 01:20:02,800 Speaker 3: Yeah, you know we're hanging with Mike Scott like. 1658 01:20:02,840 --> 01:20:04,879 Speaker 1: It was just man, it was unreal. 1659 01:20:05,120 --> 01:20:09,200 Speaker 3: We still we talk amongst ourselves, like Penny myself, Alan. 1660 01:20:09,680 --> 01:20:12,160 Speaker 3: We got to do a documentary on that week. 1661 01:20:12,320 --> 01:20:15,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, just through our lens we experience. 1662 01:20:15,400 --> 01:20:17,280 Speaker 3: We all on the verge of being in the NBA. 1663 01:20:17,960 --> 01:20:19,479 Speaker 3: We all, you know, a lot of us go on 1664 01:20:19,520 --> 01:20:23,160 Speaker 3: to be All Stars. But what that was like for us? 1665 01:20:23,880 --> 01:20:26,920 Speaker 3: But that showed me, yo, I can play on this level. 1666 01:20:27,000 --> 01:20:28,880 Speaker 3: Like that showed me I can play with these guys. 1667 01:20:29,080 --> 01:20:32,120 Speaker 3: And it was a real I need that document. I 1668 01:20:32,160 --> 01:20:33,000 Speaker 3: need to see all. 1669 01:20:32,880 --> 01:20:35,720 Speaker 1: That I need. I need to How was it? 1670 01:20:36,360 --> 01:20:39,400 Speaker 2: How is it to hear like your peers, you know, 1671 01:20:39,479 --> 01:20:42,719 Speaker 2: guys like even on our show man guys, just because 1672 01:20:42,760 --> 01:20:45,160 Speaker 2: I know your crit didn't go the way you wanted 1673 01:20:45,160 --> 01:20:48,960 Speaker 2: it to go. But to hear guys like us and 1674 01:20:49,040 --> 01:20:52,240 Speaker 2: other guys and other veterans and Hall of famers just 1675 01:20:52,280 --> 01:20:55,160 Speaker 2: speak up on your game, what they liked about your game, 1676 01:20:55,240 --> 01:20:58,360 Speaker 2: the way you play, the way you carried yourself, Like 1677 01:20:58,479 --> 01:21:00,200 Speaker 2: how is that for you? 1678 01:21:00,240 --> 01:21:02,200 Speaker 3: No? I mean, look, I mean anytimes somebody you know 1679 01:21:02,280 --> 01:21:05,280 Speaker 3: says anything that's that's positive and you feel good about it. 1680 01:21:05,320 --> 01:21:08,760 Speaker 3: I think. I think what I struggled with was I 1681 01:21:08,760 --> 01:21:12,840 Speaker 3: don't know if I saw what everybody else saw or 1682 01:21:12,880 --> 01:21:16,080 Speaker 3: what those people such as yourselves have said today and 1683 01:21:16,120 --> 01:21:16,879 Speaker 3: also said. 1684 01:21:16,720 --> 01:21:17,519 Speaker 1: Throughout the years. 1685 01:21:17,920 --> 01:21:20,719 Speaker 3: And what I mean by that is, for a period 1686 01:21:20,760 --> 01:21:23,120 Speaker 3: of time, looking back on my career, I saw the struggle. 1687 01:21:23,160 --> 01:21:25,640 Speaker 3: I saw the hurt, fighting through the injury and then 1688 01:21:25,720 --> 01:21:28,960 Speaker 3: coming back and having the outrun que to score. Like 1689 01:21:28,960 --> 01:21:31,320 Speaker 3: you know what I'm saying, like being that role player 1690 01:21:31,560 --> 01:21:35,200 Speaker 3: that sometimes I forgot who I was before all that. 1691 01:21:35,320 --> 01:21:38,519 Speaker 3: And so, you know, I think writing a book, having 1692 01:21:38,560 --> 01:21:40,760 Speaker 3: to go back and live in these moments and you know, 1693 01:21:40,840 --> 01:21:43,519 Speaker 3: talk about things what you know, what I recall, like 1694 01:21:43,560 --> 01:21:46,680 Speaker 3: it helped me sort of appreciate the totality of my 1695 01:21:46,800 --> 01:21:52,040 Speaker 3: career and appreciate those moments because like you know, like 1696 01:21:52,040 --> 01:21:53,839 Speaker 3: like my wife, you know, it's what I missing bad analogy, 1697 01:21:53,880 --> 01:21:55,800 Speaker 3: but my wife you know, my wife is recording artists 1698 01:21:55,800 --> 01:21:58,679 Speaker 3: and all that and so, and she's not super super active, 1699 01:21:58,720 --> 01:22:00,599 Speaker 3: but she still works and you know, gets out there 1700 01:22:00,600 --> 01:22:03,160 Speaker 3: from time to time. But you know, we live in Orlando, 1701 01:22:03,479 --> 01:22:05,760 Speaker 3: and like, you know, she'll play tennis with you know, 1702 01:22:06,040 --> 01:22:09,519 Speaker 3: the ladies at the tennis club or whatever, and they 1703 01:22:09,520 --> 01:22:12,360 Speaker 3: don't really know who she is, you know what I'm saying. 1704 01:22:12,520 --> 01:22:14,599 Speaker 3: And so they're like, oh, you sing, do you do 1705 01:22:14,880 --> 01:22:17,840 Speaker 3: barmesfah's and weddings, you know, and like so they don't, 1706 01:22:17,920 --> 01:22:21,320 Speaker 3: you know, But then we go to certain markets and 1707 01:22:21,360 --> 01:22:23,040 Speaker 3: like we go to Atlanta, we go to Detroit, we 1708 01:22:23,120 --> 01:22:26,200 Speaker 3: go to DC. Like she's a star. And so sometimes 1709 01:22:26,280 --> 01:22:29,439 Speaker 3: you forget who you are or forget what you've done. 1710 01:22:29,760 --> 01:22:32,120 Speaker 3: And so for me to be able to reflect, to 1711 01:22:32,160 --> 01:22:33,960 Speaker 3: go through the Hall of Fame, to write a book, 1712 01:22:34,439 --> 01:22:38,320 Speaker 3: to just like like just appreciate those years. But here's 1713 01:22:38,320 --> 01:22:42,000 Speaker 3: the thing I'm chasing, Isaiah, I'm chasing legends. When I'm 1714 01:22:42,000 --> 01:22:45,519 Speaker 3: in Detroit, we're not winning. We're not having that success. 1715 01:22:45,560 --> 01:22:48,200 Speaker 3: We won twenty eight games my first year, forty six 1716 01:22:48,280 --> 01:22:52,080 Speaker 3: my second, fifty four my third, and then we went 1717 01:22:52,160 --> 01:22:56,720 Speaker 3: backwards my last three years. And so to me, I 1718 01:22:56,760 --> 01:22:58,840 Speaker 3: didn't know it wasn't because I was in Detroit or 1719 01:22:59,080 --> 01:23:01,320 Speaker 3: but we weren't winning, you know. I came from Duke, 1720 01:23:01,360 --> 01:23:03,160 Speaker 3: where it was about winning, and I felt like we 1721 01:23:03,200 --> 01:23:05,479 Speaker 3: had a chance even if we didn't win. The goal 1722 01:23:05,760 --> 01:23:08,000 Speaker 3: was to win, and you start looking around like we 1723 01:23:08,400 --> 01:23:10,360 Speaker 3: know where close to winning, and so it was hard 1724 01:23:10,400 --> 01:23:13,519 Speaker 3: for me to celebrate my own individual when as a 1725 01:23:13,520 --> 01:23:15,479 Speaker 3: team we weren't having that kind of success. 1726 01:23:15,600 --> 01:23:18,479 Speaker 2: I never lost ever in my life until I got 1727 01:23:18,479 --> 01:23:22,400 Speaker 2: to the NBA, being on just losing hard. So it's 1728 01:23:22,439 --> 01:23:25,120 Speaker 2: hard to just lose when you ain't never lost like 1729 01:23:25,160 --> 01:23:25,920 Speaker 2: that before. 1730 01:23:26,479 --> 01:23:28,719 Speaker 4: I look at it, though, like coming from like looking 1731 01:23:28,760 --> 01:23:32,160 Speaker 4: at it, I'll say this from this perspective being who 1732 01:23:32,760 --> 01:23:34,160 Speaker 4: you know what I'm saying, who you were, and the 1733 01:23:34,200 --> 01:23:37,000 Speaker 4: projection of where everything could have win if you stayed healthy, 1734 01:23:37,720 --> 01:23:40,800 Speaker 4: For you to have that perseverance and fight to go 1735 01:23:40,880 --> 01:23:43,120 Speaker 4: through everything you went through and then steal like like 1736 01:23:43,120 --> 01:23:44,840 Speaker 4: you said, when you came out on the other side, 1737 01:23:44,920 --> 01:23:46,840 Speaker 4: you knew you weren't the same dude, But for you 1738 01:23:46,920 --> 01:23:50,120 Speaker 4: to still operate the way you did and go about 1739 01:23:50,160 --> 01:23:53,160 Speaker 4: things the way you did and be like you were 1740 01:23:53,200 --> 01:23:55,519 Speaker 4: an example. And I wasn't even in that locker room 1741 01:23:55,800 --> 01:23:57,680 Speaker 4: just to know that you came back and did what 1742 01:23:57,720 --> 01:23:59,240 Speaker 4: you did and we're doing what you were doing in 1743 01:23:59,280 --> 01:24:02,600 Speaker 4: that way, like that had to be inspirational to the 1744 01:24:02,640 --> 01:24:05,080 Speaker 4: people that was watching and seeing like it was ground 1745 01:24:05,080 --> 01:24:07,160 Speaker 4: here like and being to comeback and not be that 1746 01:24:07,240 --> 01:24:08,560 Speaker 4: you ain't have to do that, like you know what 1747 01:24:08,560 --> 01:24:10,439 Speaker 4: I'm saying, Like that was that was dope to me. 1748 01:24:10,600 --> 01:24:13,200 Speaker 3: Well, I appreciate you sharing that. And first of all, 1749 01:24:13,240 --> 01:24:17,040 Speaker 3: I think I think it's hard in any sport when 1750 01:24:17,080 --> 01:24:21,960 Speaker 3: you've been you've been, you know, at the top and 1751 01:24:22,080 --> 01:24:26,840 Speaker 3: now to not be that same player. And you know, 1752 01:24:27,000 --> 01:24:30,320 Speaker 3: for me sometimes it just happens gradually as you get 1753 01:24:30,360 --> 01:24:33,120 Speaker 3: older exactly you know, you kind of and you adjust, 1754 01:24:33,400 --> 01:24:36,960 Speaker 3: you adjust your game accordingly. But for me, like it 1755 01:24:37,080 --> 01:24:41,240 Speaker 3: happened like and sover. I'll give you an example my 1756 01:24:41,360 --> 01:24:43,640 Speaker 3: last year in Detroit. And I know somebody is going 1757 01:24:43,680 --> 01:24:45,559 Speaker 3: to correct me on this, but like my last year 1758 01:24:45,600 --> 01:24:50,160 Speaker 3: in Detroit against Orlando, I might have averaged thirty eight, 1759 01:24:50,240 --> 01:24:53,799 Speaker 3: thirty or whatever, high thirties forty your game against Orlando. 1760 01:24:54,040 --> 01:24:57,479 Speaker 3: Manti Williams, coach of Phoenix, Money's my guy. I come 1761 01:24:57,520 --> 01:25:02,120 Speaker 3: the next So that was to thousand season. I come 1762 01:25:02,160 --> 01:25:05,639 Speaker 3: to Orlando in September. We're playing pickup ball and Manni's 1763 01:25:05,720 --> 01:25:10,120 Speaker 3: kicking my butt and so and obviously I'm not right, 1764 01:25:10,400 --> 01:25:12,000 Speaker 3: you know what I'm saying. And Minni's a great player, 1765 01:25:12,000 --> 01:25:14,400 Speaker 3: but like he's having his way with me, and so 1766 01:25:15,360 --> 01:25:18,839 Speaker 3: like to not, like I said to not, You're accustomed 1767 01:25:18,880 --> 01:25:21,880 Speaker 3: to being able to do things and then not being 1768 01:25:21,920 --> 01:25:23,960 Speaker 3: able to do it, and then okay, how am I 1769 01:25:24,000 --> 01:25:27,800 Speaker 3: going to adjust? And so sometimes I wish I would 1770 01:25:27,840 --> 01:25:29,920 Speaker 3: have pushed myself a little harder. But also I'm proud 1771 01:25:29,960 --> 01:25:33,200 Speaker 3: that I was able to reinvent myself. I went to Phoenix. 1772 01:25:33,760 --> 01:25:35,840 Speaker 3: Now I go from having a ball in my hands 1773 01:25:35,880 --> 01:25:38,599 Speaker 3: my whole career now I'm standing in the corner trying 1774 01:25:38,640 --> 01:25:39,439 Speaker 3: to be this guy. 1775 01:25:40,840 --> 01:25:42,439 Speaker 1: How was that like in Phoenix? 1776 01:25:42,600 --> 01:25:46,160 Speaker 2: Like they had confidence in you to not only play, 1777 01:25:46,360 --> 01:25:49,479 Speaker 2: but we're finna put you on the best player, Like 1778 01:25:49,560 --> 01:25:52,320 Speaker 2: you got a known history of having an ankle problem, 1779 01:25:52,320 --> 01:25:54,800 Speaker 2: but we're putting you on Kobe, We're putting you on 1780 01:25:54,880 --> 01:25:58,800 Speaker 2: every team's best player. And they have the confidence in you. 1781 01:25:58,960 --> 01:26:01,639 Speaker 2: So there should be a definitely a big confidence booster 1782 01:26:01,680 --> 01:26:04,720 Speaker 2: and you for the organization a team to believe in 1783 01:26:04,760 --> 01:26:08,519 Speaker 2: you and not only believe in you, but to be like, yeah, 1784 01:26:08,640 --> 01:26:12,960 Speaker 2: we we trust in you to make their best player 1785 01:26:13,520 --> 01:26:16,439 Speaker 2: have the hardest game they can have. And out of 1786 01:26:16,479 --> 01:26:18,360 Speaker 2: all the players that we got, you the one that 1787 01:26:18,400 --> 01:26:22,320 Speaker 2: we choosing to do that coming off not playing that 1788 01:26:22,400 --> 01:26:23,120 Speaker 2: many years. 1789 01:26:23,200 --> 01:26:24,960 Speaker 1: And you know what I'm saying, Well. 1790 01:26:24,800 --> 01:26:26,960 Speaker 3: First of all, I don't know if I made it 1791 01:26:27,000 --> 01:26:30,920 Speaker 3: hard for Kobe. Now you didn't, you know, I kind 1792 01:26:30,920 --> 01:26:34,120 Speaker 3: of part of reinventing. I became a defensive stop, and 1793 01:26:34,160 --> 01:26:36,040 Speaker 3: I was like, they put me on Tony Parker, they 1794 01:26:36,080 --> 01:26:38,559 Speaker 3: put me on Baron Davis, they put me on Monte Ellis, 1795 01:26:38,560 --> 01:26:41,160 Speaker 3: they put me on whoever on the perimeter. And I 1796 01:26:41,240 --> 01:26:44,120 Speaker 3: kind of relished that that role. But I think part 1797 01:26:44,160 --> 01:26:46,519 Speaker 3: of it. And this is not an indictment on players 1798 01:26:46,560 --> 01:26:51,120 Speaker 3: today or the environment of grassroots basketball today. But when 1799 01:26:51,120 --> 01:26:53,840 Speaker 3: we came up, you went to the park, or you 1800 01:26:53,880 --> 01:26:56,000 Speaker 3: went to the playground, you went to the gym. We 1801 01:26:56,080 --> 01:26:59,280 Speaker 3: probably played with older people. And the thing about the 1802 01:26:59,280 --> 01:27:01,800 Speaker 3: park is one the objective is to win, but the 1803 01:27:01,840 --> 01:27:04,040 Speaker 3: two is how do I have value on this court? 1804 01:27:04,360 --> 01:27:07,200 Speaker 3: Because if if I pick so and so and they 1805 01:27:07,240 --> 01:27:10,280 Speaker 3: can't shoot, but they're taking jumpers like they can shoot 1806 01:27:10,280 --> 01:27:13,479 Speaker 3: like him, they're not gonna get picked. So you got 1807 01:27:13,520 --> 01:27:17,719 Speaker 3: to figure out how I can. Okay, I'm twelve, I'm thirteen, 1808 01:27:17,800 --> 01:27:20,360 Speaker 3: I'm playing with twenty. I'm playing with men. I can't 1809 01:27:20,360 --> 01:27:22,720 Speaker 3: play with them like I play with my boys. So 1810 01:27:22,760 --> 01:27:23,719 Speaker 3: I gotta set screens. 1811 01:27:23,760 --> 01:27:26,960 Speaker 1: I got you. You can't make a misake, young fella. 1812 01:27:26,960 --> 01:27:28,320 Speaker 1: I shouldn't even pick the young fellow. 1813 01:27:30,000 --> 01:27:33,599 Speaker 3: And I don't think kids today experience that. They learn 1814 01:27:33,680 --> 01:27:37,840 Speaker 3: in a silo with the coach, they learned trainer. They 1815 01:27:37,840 --> 01:27:39,440 Speaker 3: don't learn how to like, okay. 1816 01:27:40,080 --> 01:27:43,360 Speaker 2: Level the levels, but they don't get the other stuff 1817 01:27:43,360 --> 01:27:44,080 Speaker 2: that comes with. 1818 01:27:44,520 --> 01:27:45,920 Speaker 3: Part of it even too. Like I feel like we 1819 01:27:46,960 --> 01:27:50,080 Speaker 3: grow up being gms. Okay, I got my five, I 1820 01:27:50,120 --> 01:27:52,640 Speaker 3: got I gotta get a show play with you know 1821 01:27:52,680 --> 01:27:54,320 Speaker 3: what I'm saying, how are we gonna what are we 1822 01:27:54,400 --> 01:27:56,439 Speaker 3: gonna do to where we can stay. 1823 01:27:56,200 --> 01:27:57,720 Speaker 1: On the court all day, all day? 1824 01:27:57,920 --> 01:28:01,400 Speaker 3: And so yeah, sometimes your boy, you're be like yo, 1825 01:28:01,560 --> 01:28:03,080 Speaker 3: like man, you got to sit this one man like 1826 01:28:03,120 --> 01:28:04,760 Speaker 3: you know, whatever, whatever it can be. And so I 1827 01:28:04,840 --> 01:28:07,720 Speaker 3: feel like part of that you figure out how to 1828 01:28:07,760 --> 01:28:09,800 Speaker 3: add value. The ball's not going to be in my hand. 1829 01:28:09,840 --> 01:28:13,760 Speaker 3: Steve Nash, two time MVP a'mar screening role I'm not 1830 01:28:13,840 --> 01:28:16,840 Speaker 3: a great shooter. I can hit the corner three. What 1831 01:28:16,960 --> 01:28:18,479 Speaker 3: do I have to do to stay on the court? 1832 01:28:18,920 --> 01:28:21,240 Speaker 3: And you figure it out? And that's what I you know, 1833 01:28:21,520 --> 01:28:23,600 Speaker 3: and I just feel like that foundation of how we 1834 01:28:23,680 --> 01:28:26,360 Speaker 3: came up playing you figure it out now when we 1835 01:28:26,400 --> 01:28:28,639 Speaker 3: get older and we you know, we we can dominate 1836 01:28:28,680 --> 01:28:30,840 Speaker 3: the court when we're coming up or when you know, 1837 01:28:30,840 --> 01:28:32,240 Speaker 3: when we're at that level. 1838 01:28:32,520 --> 01:28:33,360 Speaker 1: But there's a point. 1839 01:28:33,200 --> 01:28:35,320 Speaker 3: Where you're trying to like play with the big boys. 1840 01:28:35,320 --> 01:28:37,920 Speaker 3: You're trying to but the objective is to win. And 1841 01:28:38,000 --> 01:28:40,000 Speaker 3: so that to me was I got to play this 1842 01:28:40,120 --> 01:28:41,680 Speaker 3: role and this is what I got to do that 1843 01:28:41,760 --> 01:28:43,640 Speaker 3: It's a different role than what I've done before, but 1844 01:28:43,640 --> 01:28:45,080 Speaker 3: I'm gonna do it, and I actually, you know what, 1845 01:28:45,160 --> 01:28:48,240 Speaker 3: I actually enjoyed it. Like I enjoyed I'll say this, man, 1846 01:28:48,360 --> 01:28:51,400 Speaker 3: Like if you look at the nineteen years of my 1847 01:28:51,479 --> 01:28:55,040 Speaker 3: career being like a you know, the all star superstar level, 1848 01:28:55,680 --> 01:28:57,760 Speaker 3: being hurt and having to go through all of that, 1849 01:28:58,520 --> 01:29:01,960 Speaker 3: and then coming back being a contributor, being a role player, 1850 01:29:01,960 --> 01:29:04,839 Speaker 3: and then my last year in LA I'm not playing, 1851 01:29:05,680 --> 01:29:07,760 Speaker 3: so I'm coming in three on three like matter of fact, 1852 01:29:07,800 --> 01:29:10,120 Speaker 3: games will be over. I'm like gotta go home. I 1853 01:29:10,120 --> 01:29:11,920 Speaker 3: gotta go home to sleep because my game is tomorrow, 1854 01:29:12,400 --> 01:29:14,240 Speaker 3: you know, and you do them four on four, three 1855 01:29:14,320 --> 01:29:16,799 Speaker 3: on threesy. 1856 01:29:15,880 --> 01:29:19,599 Speaker 4: Lot of people's it's some kids out there right now 1857 01:29:19,720 --> 01:29:22,679 Speaker 4: on some roster that's you know, not getting playing time 1858 01:29:22,760 --> 01:29:26,000 Speaker 4: and assisting after practice telling them come on, let's get 1859 01:29:26,000 --> 01:29:28,880 Speaker 4: our work in, and somebody getting an attitude and they 1860 01:29:28,880 --> 01:29:29,680 Speaker 4: don't want to do it. 1861 01:29:29,760 --> 01:29:32,439 Speaker 1: Grant fucking here and I was doing it. 1862 01:29:32,479 --> 01:29:34,040 Speaker 3: And look, you know, we had a crazy team. We 1863 01:29:34,080 --> 01:29:36,840 Speaker 3: had you know, Blake Chris, Paul DeAndre, but we had 1864 01:29:36,880 --> 01:29:40,439 Speaker 3: like Matt Barnes, Coron Butler, Jamal Crawford, Willie Green, bell Up. 1865 01:29:40,479 --> 01:29:42,080 Speaker 3: I mean we had a we had we should have 1866 01:29:42,080 --> 01:29:44,200 Speaker 3: done better. We had a really good team. But like 1867 01:29:44,640 --> 01:29:47,400 Speaker 3: to me, like that was like because you love the game, man, Look, 1868 01:29:47,560 --> 01:29:50,439 Speaker 3: I don't know if you guys physically can still play, 1869 01:29:50,560 --> 01:29:52,000 Speaker 3: you know, I don't know if a. 1870 01:29:52,120 --> 01:29:56,080 Speaker 1: Working I can. I choose not choose not to because 1871 01:29:56,080 --> 01:29:58,080 Speaker 1: I want to stay healthy. You want to stay healthy, man. 1872 01:29:58,160 --> 01:30:03,200 Speaker 3: So it's it's it's entight. So it's a privilege. It's 1873 01:30:03,200 --> 01:30:06,599 Speaker 3: an honor to be able to in the NBA. Come on, man, 1874 01:30:06,640 --> 01:30:09,160 Speaker 3: every day is an opportunity how many years did y'all 1875 01:30:09,200 --> 01:30:12,160 Speaker 3: play in the league? I got ten, thirteen. 1876 01:30:12,240 --> 01:30:12,599 Speaker 1: Okay. 1877 01:30:13,680 --> 01:30:16,720 Speaker 3: We all came up with people, you know, boys in 1878 01:30:16,800 --> 01:30:19,679 Speaker 3: high school whatever, who had the same dreams that we had. 1879 01:30:19,960 --> 01:30:23,719 Speaker 3: We were fortunate to take it further. At some point 1880 01:30:23,720 --> 01:30:27,800 Speaker 3: they had to walk away. But my theory is the 1881 01:30:27,880 --> 01:30:30,360 Speaker 3: longer you do it, the harder. 1882 01:30:30,040 --> 01:30:31,040 Speaker 1: It is to walk away. 1883 01:30:31,680 --> 01:30:34,599 Speaker 3: You know, Okay, eighteen, I'm not good enough to go 1884 01:30:34,600 --> 01:30:37,960 Speaker 3: from high school to college, all right, you know, I 1885 01:30:38,240 --> 01:30:40,479 Speaker 3: go to college, start working whatever I can play at 1886 01:30:40,520 --> 01:30:43,880 Speaker 3: the why whatever the case may be. But you it's 1887 01:30:43,920 --> 01:30:47,760 Speaker 3: easier to accept. But as the older you get and 1888 01:30:47,840 --> 01:30:50,760 Speaker 3: the longer you've done it, I'm not saying that, you know, 1889 01:30:51,200 --> 01:30:54,360 Speaker 3: financial I mean whatever, I'm not saying that. You know, 1890 01:30:54,640 --> 01:30:57,360 Speaker 3: there's certainly perks, and we all know that that exists. 1891 01:30:57,720 --> 01:31:00,920 Speaker 3: But the part of belonging, like being a part of 1892 01:31:01,000 --> 01:31:04,800 Speaker 3: something bigger than yourself, like that's something that that's all. 1893 01:31:04,800 --> 01:31:05,040 Speaker 1: You know. 1894 01:31:05,120 --> 01:31:09,040 Speaker 3: I'm forty years old, and look, I'm doing amazing things 1895 01:31:09,080 --> 01:31:12,599 Speaker 3: now in my retirement, if you will, in my career 1896 01:31:12,640 --> 01:31:16,360 Speaker 3: and business and all that or whatever, but nothing replaces 1897 01:31:16,720 --> 01:31:19,479 Speaker 3: that can And I'm forty years old and I'm walking 1898 01:31:19,479 --> 01:31:20,160 Speaker 3: away from it. 1899 01:31:20,439 --> 01:31:23,120 Speaker 4: And it's hard, and this is the other reality you 1900 01:31:23,240 --> 01:31:25,280 Speaker 4: walking into. Like you say, we all been through it. 1901 01:31:25,320 --> 01:31:29,960 Speaker 4: We as athletes, right, we the only people when you 1902 01:31:30,040 --> 01:31:35,120 Speaker 4: talk about people getting doctor degrees, becoming lawyers or judges 1903 01:31:35,160 --> 01:31:37,559 Speaker 4: and all this, and when they reached the pinnacle of 1904 01:31:37,560 --> 01:31:41,240 Speaker 4: their career, they about to ride this thing out. 1905 01:31:41,560 --> 01:31:42,160 Speaker 1: Not us. 1906 01:31:42,360 --> 01:31:45,880 Speaker 4: If you lucky, like you said, forty man, you lucky 1907 01:31:45,920 --> 01:31:48,080 Speaker 4: you get to thirty two. You know what I'm saying. 1908 01:31:48,160 --> 01:31:50,519 Speaker 4: Thirty you know what I'm saying. We was Fortunately all 1909 01:31:50,560 --> 01:31:52,479 Speaker 4: of us got past that age. You know what I'm saying. 1910 01:31:52,479 --> 01:31:54,720 Speaker 4: Like then as soon as you you know and I 1911 01:31:54,800 --> 01:31:56,400 Speaker 4: know you know it for a fact because we do 1912 01:31:56,439 --> 01:31:59,360 Speaker 4: similar things, like I don't care who you are. Soon 1913 01:31:59,360 --> 01:32:01,200 Speaker 4: as you walk out of the door and you not 1914 01:32:01,280 --> 01:32:03,960 Speaker 4: doing this no more. You back at square one. They 1915 01:32:04,000 --> 01:32:07,400 Speaker 4: tell you they don't want you us. They don't want 1916 01:32:07,479 --> 01:32:10,280 Speaker 4: us walking in the door to be an analyst at 1917 01:32:10,280 --> 01:32:12,559 Speaker 4: Turner or to work for the Magic. They don't want 1918 01:32:12,600 --> 01:32:15,200 Speaker 4: us walking in talking about we played twenty years in 1919 01:32:15,240 --> 01:32:17,360 Speaker 4: the league. We know this and that naw. They want 1920 01:32:17,400 --> 01:32:19,880 Speaker 4: you to humble yourself when you starting over from block. Hey, 1921 01:32:19,880 --> 01:32:21,840 Speaker 4: you need to come in pint a pad in hand, 1922 01:32:21,920 --> 01:32:24,680 Speaker 4: ready to learn, humble, and you don't know more than me, 1923 01:32:24,880 --> 01:32:28,920 Speaker 4: like and in some respects, I'm sitting here like time out. 1924 01:32:29,280 --> 01:32:31,080 Speaker 4: I do need to learn, I do need this, but 1925 01:32:31,160 --> 01:32:33,639 Speaker 4: fuck that, I know more than you, Like I've been 1926 01:32:33,680 --> 01:32:35,960 Speaker 4: doing this since, like what you're talking about, and I 1927 01:32:36,000 --> 01:32:38,240 Speaker 4: know what deep in way more in depth inan you 1928 01:32:38,320 --> 01:32:40,400 Speaker 4: like what you're trying about, like and we find that 1929 01:32:40,439 --> 01:32:42,840 Speaker 4: out along the way too, Like, yeah, we do need 1930 01:32:42,880 --> 01:32:45,000 Speaker 4: to learn a fucking lot, but like, hold up, well 1931 01:32:45,160 --> 01:32:46,160 Speaker 4: it's awesome shit too. 1932 01:32:46,240 --> 01:32:48,720 Speaker 3: It's the technical aspect of like certain things. I mean, 1933 01:32:48,760 --> 01:32:51,160 Speaker 3: you guys have obviously done very well here and done 1934 01:32:51,200 --> 01:32:54,160 Speaker 3: other things in media, and so yeah, you're making that transition. 1935 01:32:54,240 --> 01:32:54,920 Speaker 1: You gotta learn. 1936 01:32:55,120 --> 01:32:57,479 Speaker 3: Okay, I'm supposed to speak or project or do this 1937 01:32:57,600 --> 01:33:00,320 Speaker 3: or do that, but when it comes to basketball, nah, 1938 01:33:00,400 --> 01:33:03,000 Speaker 3: I mean, look, you know, I know you guys know. 1939 01:33:03,080 --> 01:33:04,439 Speaker 1: I mean I know Q better. 1940 01:33:04,479 --> 01:33:06,439 Speaker 3: I don't know you as well, although we've you know, 1941 01:33:07,000 --> 01:33:09,559 Speaker 3: competed against each other and so on, but like just 1942 01:33:09,640 --> 01:33:11,400 Speaker 3: even playing against like I know you know the game. 1943 01:33:11,840 --> 01:33:13,960 Speaker 3: You know what I'm saying, and you know it's more 1944 01:33:14,000 --> 01:33:16,240 Speaker 3: than just and I'm not saying you had to have 1945 01:33:16,320 --> 01:33:19,200 Speaker 3: gone through what we went through. But it helps you 1946 01:33:19,200 --> 01:33:20,640 Speaker 3: know what I'm saying, When you know what it's like 1947 01:33:21,320 --> 01:33:25,840 Speaker 3: to lose, and you know, going to losing street, Okay, 1948 01:33:25,840 --> 01:33:27,840 Speaker 3: then how do you manage that? And how do you 1949 01:33:27,920 --> 01:33:31,360 Speaker 3: prepare like you've lived it? And so there's instantly a bond, 1950 01:33:31,479 --> 01:33:34,559 Speaker 3: instantly a sense of like we understand each other. 1951 01:33:34,640 --> 01:33:37,320 Speaker 2: To be a former player and be a co owner 1952 01:33:37,720 --> 01:33:40,840 Speaker 2: of a franchise, like you know, it's a dream come 1953 01:33:40,880 --> 01:33:43,519 Speaker 2: true for a lot of players to be in that position, 1954 01:33:43,920 --> 01:33:46,200 Speaker 2: for you to be in that position, and how is 1955 01:33:46,240 --> 01:33:47,479 Speaker 2: that for you and your family? 1956 01:33:48,800 --> 01:33:51,800 Speaker 3: You know, it's I mean, it's surreal. And the fact 1957 01:33:51,800 --> 01:33:54,840 Speaker 3: that it happened so quickly after I retired, two years 1958 01:33:54,880 --> 01:33:57,800 Speaker 3: after I retired. But I was thinking about this from 1959 01:33:57,880 --> 01:34:01,280 Speaker 3: day one. And remember I don't know if you were 1960 01:34:01,280 --> 01:34:05,400 Speaker 3: in Detroit when mister Davidson, Bill Davison was the owner there, No, 1961 01:34:05,680 --> 01:34:09,320 Speaker 3: I CA Okay, So I remember I signed this big 1962 01:34:09,400 --> 01:34:12,439 Speaker 3: rookie contract back when my year was the last year 1963 01:34:12,479 --> 01:34:13,040 Speaker 3: that you know. 1964 01:34:13,040 --> 01:34:16,280 Speaker 4: Oh yeah, that when big Doll held everybody up, set there, 1965 01:34:16,479 --> 01:34:18,480 Speaker 4: set down, Go ahead. 1966 01:34:18,200 --> 01:34:23,439 Speaker 3: Tell you, I'm glad I got more money. But so 1967 01:34:23,600 --> 01:34:25,920 Speaker 3: you know, nineteen ninety four, I signed like forty six 1968 01:34:25,960 --> 01:34:28,720 Speaker 3: million dollars, which is a lot of money now, I 1969 01:34:28,760 --> 01:34:32,280 Speaker 3: was probably more money back then. And I remember Bill Davison, 1970 01:34:32,560 --> 01:34:35,760 Speaker 3: he owns his team. This is a little side thing. 1971 01:34:35,920 --> 01:34:38,840 Speaker 3: He's got his real business over here. And so I'm like, man, 1972 01:34:38,840 --> 01:34:40,960 Speaker 3: I want to be in that position one day, and 1973 01:34:41,000 --> 01:34:43,120 Speaker 3: I want to be in that role. And so I 1974 01:34:43,360 --> 01:34:45,760 Speaker 3: you know, literally, I'm not sure how it would happen, 1975 01:34:45,840 --> 01:34:48,160 Speaker 3: but I knew it would happen at some point. And so, 1976 01:34:49,000 --> 01:34:53,280 Speaker 3: but to have the responsibility Tony Wrestlers are managing partner, 1977 01:34:53,280 --> 01:34:55,600 Speaker 3: I'm vice chairman of our ownership group. To take a 1978 01:34:55,680 --> 01:35:00,000 Speaker 3: franchise and add value to it, to build the infrastructre 1979 01:35:00,080 --> 01:35:04,559 Speaker 3: sure the new arena, practice facility, G League team. You 1980 01:35:04,600 --> 01:35:07,960 Speaker 3: guys know this, Atlanta was a team in a market 1981 01:35:08,080 --> 01:35:10,600 Speaker 3: that Atlanta was always a city everybody. 1982 01:35:10,320 --> 01:35:12,920 Speaker 1: Liked to go to, people like to live there. 1983 01:35:12,920 --> 01:35:16,880 Speaker 3: It's affordable, so great cities, got an international airport, there's 1984 01:35:16,920 --> 01:35:20,679 Speaker 3: a lot of culture there. But the franchise had never 1985 01:35:20,760 --> 01:35:23,519 Speaker 3: really been you know what I'm saying, Like it was 1986 01:35:23,560 --> 01:35:26,439 Speaker 3: just something was missing, and so I always looked at 1987 01:35:26,439 --> 01:35:29,400 Speaker 3: that as an opportunity. And so we're proud of what 1988 01:35:29,439 --> 01:35:32,360 Speaker 3: we've done. We're proud of the work, but we know 1989 01:35:32,400 --> 01:35:34,120 Speaker 3: we got a lot more work in front of us. 1990 01:35:34,400 --> 01:35:38,560 Speaker 3: You're from Chicago, you know there's a pride in Chicago 1991 01:35:39,080 --> 01:35:43,719 Speaker 3: for all Chicago sports, whether they're winning or losing. You're loyal. 1992 01:35:44,120 --> 01:35:47,519 Speaker 3: Philly has that, Boston has that, and so building that 1993 01:35:47,600 --> 01:35:51,240 Speaker 3: emotional connection with the audience, like that's something that we 1994 01:35:51,280 --> 01:35:54,160 Speaker 3: work hard, but it's fun. And the great thing is 1995 01:35:54,200 --> 01:35:58,839 Speaker 3: that I'm appreciative as a former player. My voice is strong, 1996 01:35:59,200 --> 01:36:02,559 Speaker 3: and they value you my voice and my thoughts on things, 1997 01:36:03,120 --> 01:36:04,519 Speaker 3: you know, and so we you know. And one thing 1998 01:36:04,520 --> 01:36:07,400 Speaker 3: I think Adam Silver talking with Adam is he recognizes 1999 01:36:07,600 --> 01:36:12,240 Speaker 3: we need more former players in those roles who can 2000 01:36:12,240 --> 01:36:16,200 Speaker 3: add value to ownership groups, who have a perspective that 2001 01:36:16,479 --> 01:36:18,760 Speaker 3: most ownership groups don't have. I can look at our 2002 01:36:18,760 --> 01:36:20,800 Speaker 3: team and tell I know exactly what's going on, Like 2003 01:36:20,800 --> 01:36:23,000 Speaker 3: I mean different times, and this is over the course 2004 01:36:23,080 --> 01:36:25,560 Speaker 3: of years. I can say, Okay, this they don't like 2005 01:36:25,600 --> 01:36:28,160 Speaker 3: this guy, or this guy, this guy's shooting too much, 2006 01:36:28,280 --> 01:36:30,000 Speaker 3: or something's going on, like you can just see it 2007 01:36:30,000 --> 01:36:32,040 Speaker 3: because you lived it. You know what I'm saying. And 2008 01:36:32,080 --> 01:36:35,200 Speaker 3: so certain things that maybe others who haven't been through, 2009 01:36:35,320 --> 01:36:36,240 Speaker 3: like you're saying. 2010 01:36:36,240 --> 01:36:37,360 Speaker 1: You have that perspective. 2011 01:36:37,640 --> 01:36:39,400 Speaker 4: That's why you can walk in, like you said, you 2012 01:36:39,439 --> 01:36:41,040 Speaker 4: can see it. They can be talking about it for 2013 01:36:41,080 --> 01:36:42,880 Speaker 4: a week and you walk in one day and just 2014 01:36:42,880 --> 01:36:47,360 Speaker 4: start laughing, and you know, like straight up, this is 2015 01:36:47,360 --> 01:36:50,479 Speaker 4: what I want to ask. Though you refer to signing 2016 01:36:50,520 --> 01:36:54,800 Speaker 4: forty six million as a rookie, First of all, that 2017 01:36:54,880 --> 01:36:55,800 Speaker 4: shit been over with. 2018 01:36:56,040 --> 01:36:57,360 Speaker 1: They was the class to stop. 2019 01:36:57,840 --> 01:37:00,640 Speaker 4: They don't don't say, look I want to So what 2020 01:37:00,680 --> 01:37:02,960 Speaker 4: I want to ask is like, from your perspective as 2021 01:37:02,960 --> 01:37:05,920 Speaker 4: a rookie, part of the rookie class, you about to 2022 01:37:05,960 --> 01:37:07,800 Speaker 4: get this big bag. And this is all normal for 2023 01:37:07,880 --> 01:37:10,120 Speaker 4: y'all at the time. It's not like some craze happened 2024 01:37:10,120 --> 01:37:13,479 Speaker 4: when you see him say he holding out? Did y'all 2025 01:37:13,880 --> 01:37:16,280 Speaker 4: have any thoughts like should we be asking for more? 2026 01:37:16,400 --> 01:37:19,280 Speaker 4: What was your just whole perspective when it was all happening. 2027 01:37:19,360 --> 01:37:22,240 Speaker 3: So Glenn Glenn Robinson was the number one pick, Jay 2028 01:37:22,320 --> 01:37:26,200 Speaker 3: Kid was two, I was three, Danielle Marshall was four. 2029 01:37:26,560 --> 01:37:30,599 Speaker 3: Of the four of us, I signed first, and maybe 2030 01:37:30,600 --> 01:37:32,519 Speaker 3: they didn't like that because I kind of maybe set 2031 01:37:32,520 --> 01:37:36,479 Speaker 3: the market. I think Jason went for fifty four. Big 2032 01:37:36,520 --> 01:37:39,000 Speaker 3: Dog was holding out for one hundred. He ended up 2033 01:37:39,000 --> 01:37:45,040 Speaker 3: getting sixty. I think he got sixty eight. And I mean, man, look, 2034 01:37:45,840 --> 01:37:47,720 Speaker 3: you could have given me twenty or ten. Like I 2035 01:37:47,840 --> 01:37:49,120 Speaker 3: was just you know what I'm saying, Like you go 2036 01:37:49,240 --> 01:37:53,720 Speaker 3: from essentially, I mean, obviously my parents, you know, subsidized me, 2037 01:37:53,800 --> 01:37:54,400 Speaker 3: but I didn't have it. 2038 01:37:54,439 --> 01:37:55,360 Speaker 1: I mean, I didn't have any money. 2039 01:37:56,439 --> 01:37:59,200 Speaker 3: And then all of a sudden, you sign a contract 2040 01:37:59,200 --> 01:38:01,960 Speaker 3: like it's it's it's the most incredible thing and also 2041 01:38:02,000 --> 01:38:04,960 Speaker 3: the scariest thing at the same time. But yeah, I 2042 01:38:04,960 --> 01:38:07,840 Speaker 3: mean it was it was crazy. And they did away 2043 01:38:07,840 --> 01:38:11,280 Speaker 3: with that after that. Immediately they did the rookie sliding. 2044 01:38:11,439 --> 01:38:14,760 Speaker 4: Now we got a rookie scale slotted one through. 2045 01:38:15,120 --> 01:38:17,240 Speaker 3: You can blame my class. You can blame my class 2046 01:38:17,240 --> 01:38:19,040 Speaker 3: for that, but that was no. That was crazy. 2047 01:38:19,080 --> 01:38:19,280 Speaker 1: Man. 2048 01:38:19,439 --> 01:38:22,960 Speaker 2: I got a start bench trade for you gotta start one. 2049 01:38:22,960 --> 01:38:24,719 Speaker 1: You got a bench one, you got trade one. 2050 01:38:25,520 --> 01:38:30,000 Speaker 2: Kevin Durant, t Matt and. 2051 01:38:30,040 --> 01:38:32,920 Speaker 1: Bird, who do you start? 2052 01:38:33,280 --> 01:38:38,519 Speaker 2: Ev'm all shooting them all small forwards too. 2053 01:38:38,600 --> 01:38:41,599 Speaker 1: But that's actually not so hard for me. Preference base. 2054 01:38:41,760 --> 01:38:45,200 Speaker 3: But yeah, I mean, that's that's that's tough, man, Because 2055 01:38:45,240 --> 01:38:48,240 Speaker 3: like I hated Larry Bird, but man, he was he 2056 01:38:48,360 --> 01:38:52,200 Speaker 3: was cold. But I'm gonna stick with the modern era. 2057 01:38:52,320 --> 01:38:57,920 Speaker 3: So I'm gonna go. I'm gonna go start Durant bench 2058 01:38:58,040 --> 01:39:01,960 Speaker 3: Mac and I'm trading Bird. I'm sorry because I don't 2059 01:39:02,080 --> 01:39:04,360 Speaker 3: know what. I don't know how his game. It would 2060 01:39:04,360 --> 01:39:08,840 Speaker 3: be interesting. It's it's unfair to compare errors. But shoot, 2061 01:39:08,880 --> 01:39:10,559 Speaker 3: I think Larry Bird would probably do that too. 2062 01:39:11,479 --> 01:39:15,880 Speaker 1: I think he would give these folks working. 2063 01:39:16,000 --> 01:39:18,639 Speaker 3: I think he would say the same thing I said. 2064 01:39:18,880 --> 01:39:20,960 Speaker 3: I think he would do the same. There was something similar. 2065 01:39:21,439 --> 01:39:24,000 Speaker 4: So I always asked this question on here, and I mean, 2066 01:39:24,080 --> 01:39:27,240 Speaker 4: I feel like without even asking it, you being a 2067 01:39:27,240 --> 01:39:30,280 Speaker 4: part owner in the Hawks is sufficient enough if we're 2068 01:39:30,280 --> 01:39:33,160 Speaker 4: gonna bypass that that little piece of information, like. 2069 01:39:33,160 --> 01:39:33,600 Speaker 1: We don't know. 2070 01:39:33,760 --> 01:39:37,280 Speaker 4: I want to know maybe the young wild g Hill 2071 01:39:37,360 --> 01:39:40,200 Speaker 4: that was like when you sign that forty six, I 2072 01:39:40,240 --> 01:39:40,760 Speaker 4: won't know. 2073 01:39:40,720 --> 01:39:42,639 Speaker 1: What what what g Hill did? 2074 01:39:42,840 --> 01:39:45,240 Speaker 4: The biggest purchase you made where you look back on 2075 01:39:45,320 --> 01:39:47,120 Speaker 4: it like what the hell was I doing? But in 2076 01:39:47,160 --> 01:39:51,120 Speaker 4: that moment you enjoyed the hell out that. I don't 2077 01:39:51,120 --> 01:39:53,280 Speaker 4: want to hear about No Mody taking care of no 2078 01:39:53,360 --> 01:39:55,240 Speaker 4: house And I'm talking about something where you look back 2079 01:39:55,280 --> 01:39:57,840 Speaker 4: on it like, yeah, that was stupid, crazy, it was 2080 01:39:57,920 --> 01:39:59,200 Speaker 4: It was fly at the time. 2081 01:40:01,600 --> 01:40:01,920 Speaker 1: We didn't. 2082 01:40:02,840 --> 01:40:06,280 Speaker 3: Here's the thing though, like and this this may surprise 2083 01:40:06,360 --> 01:40:09,479 Speaker 3: you a little bit. I didn't buy anything my first 2084 01:40:09,760 --> 01:40:13,439 Speaker 3: like I didn't like, I didn't buy a car. I 2085 01:40:13,479 --> 01:40:16,839 Speaker 3: was in Detroit. I had to deal with General Motors. 2086 01:40:17,400 --> 01:40:19,519 Speaker 3: They gave me a car, and then they gave me 2087 01:40:19,560 --> 01:40:21,240 Speaker 3: another car. They gave me a car, and then they 2088 01:40:21,240 --> 01:40:23,439 Speaker 3: gave me a car I could rotate every like two months. 2089 01:40:24,160 --> 01:40:28,320 Speaker 3: I was with Fila. They owned Ferrari, so they gave 2090 01:40:28,400 --> 01:40:31,960 Speaker 3: me a Ferrari. And I think the only thing like 2091 01:40:32,040 --> 01:40:35,040 Speaker 3: I really got into, like my vices was probably closed 2092 01:40:35,200 --> 01:40:39,040 Speaker 3: like bond suits and uh. But like like I mean, 2093 01:40:39,240 --> 01:40:42,720 Speaker 3: I didn't have I didn't go crazy like like out 2094 01:40:42,720 --> 01:40:44,120 Speaker 3: the gate, like I didn't at. 2095 01:40:44,000 --> 01:40:47,559 Speaker 4: Any point when like Tea, I bought a plane he 2096 01:40:47,600 --> 01:40:51,800 Speaker 4: had he had was you on his teammate jet? 2097 01:40:52,439 --> 01:40:54,240 Speaker 1: No? No, no no, So did he tell you all that 2098 01:40:54,439 --> 01:40:56,080 Speaker 1: about the Jets? But the jet? Yeah? 2099 01:40:56,120 --> 01:40:57,880 Speaker 3: Okay, So let me tell you this funny story with that. 2100 01:40:58,000 --> 01:41:02,559 Speaker 3: So y'all know you know Dorian Boiling he was Mercedes dealership. 2101 01:41:02,960 --> 01:41:06,760 Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, baseball from baseball, I won't mention it. So 2102 01:41:07,760 --> 01:41:09,760 Speaker 3: I tried to a plane to go to Atlanta. This 2103 01:41:09,960 --> 01:41:12,080 Speaker 3: matter be in like two thousand and nine. I pull 2104 01:41:12,160 --> 01:41:14,600 Speaker 3: up to the plane. They give me an upgrade, you know, 2105 01:41:14,720 --> 01:41:18,120 Speaker 3: from a mid size jet to a bigger jet. And 2106 01:41:18,200 --> 01:41:21,960 Speaker 3: I pull up and it's t mag on the tail 2107 01:41:22,880 --> 01:41:25,760 Speaker 3: and come to find out like this dude bought this 2108 01:41:25,800 --> 01:41:28,280 Speaker 3: big old plane, had a flight attendant in there, like 2109 01:41:28,600 --> 01:41:30,000 Speaker 3: twelve thirteen seats. 2110 01:41:29,760 --> 01:41:30,280 Speaker 1: On the plane. 2111 01:41:30,280 --> 01:41:32,120 Speaker 3: And I'm like, I was like, man, what. 2112 01:41:32,080 --> 01:41:32,880 Speaker 1: Am I doing wrong? 2113 01:41:33,000 --> 01:41:35,960 Speaker 3: Like at first, I was like man, but then I start, 2114 01:41:36,000 --> 01:41:38,840 Speaker 3: you know, because I'm always you know, like I said, 2115 01:41:38,840 --> 01:41:41,640 Speaker 3: and I have a different, maybe a unique perspective in 2116 01:41:41,680 --> 01:41:45,880 Speaker 3: that just I heard all the horror stories from my parents, 2117 01:41:46,040 --> 01:41:49,280 Speaker 3: my dad, from people his generation. Now, they didn't make 2118 01:41:49,320 --> 01:41:51,920 Speaker 3: the money that we made during our time, but like 2119 01:41:52,080 --> 01:41:54,920 Speaker 3: that's all I ever heard that people, you know, and 2120 01:41:54,960 --> 01:41:57,799 Speaker 3: not that everybody struggled, but there was something that did. 2121 01:41:58,120 --> 01:42:01,120 Speaker 3: So I always went in. I always went in like fearful, 2122 01:42:01,200 --> 01:42:04,040 Speaker 3: like paranoid. And so, don't get me wrong, over time, 2123 01:42:04,439 --> 01:42:06,360 Speaker 3: as you make a lot of money and you put 2124 01:42:06,400 --> 01:42:08,679 Speaker 3: it away and you start investing and you do things. 2125 01:42:09,160 --> 01:42:11,120 Speaker 3: You know, I have a rather large home. You know, 2126 01:42:11,240 --> 01:42:13,880 Speaker 3: certain things that you know that I have, but I 2127 01:42:13,880 --> 01:42:15,639 Speaker 3: don't regret. You know what I'm saying. But I didn't 2128 01:42:15,680 --> 01:42:19,320 Speaker 3: do that right away, you know, But no, I don't really. 2129 01:42:19,360 --> 01:42:22,679 Speaker 4: I mean, I ain't get the purchase yet. Did y'all 2130 01:42:22,720 --> 01:42:24,880 Speaker 4: hear the purchase? I need to hear the purchase. What 2131 01:42:24,920 --> 01:42:25,080 Speaker 4: was it? 2132 01:42:25,160 --> 01:42:27,240 Speaker 1: I know you ain't get Did you get a jewelry? 2133 01:42:27,320 --> 01:42:27,800 Speaker 1: What did you get? 2134 01:42:27,840 --> 01:42:30,120 Speaker 4: You got something to call something? I'm talking about out 2135 01:42:30,160 --> 01:42:32,720 Speaker 4: your pocket? Not a Rari that was given, although that's 2136 01:42:32,760 --> 01:42:34,519 Speaker 4: fucking bald. Somebody get. 2137 01:42:35,920 --> 01:42:37,679 Speaker 1: That's like a bar right there. 2138 01:42:38,439 --> 01:42:41,120 Speaker 3: So I think when I was when I was dating 2139 01:42:41,120 --> 01:42:44,240 Speaker 3: my wife and we rented a house out Malleable, I 2140 01:42:44,240 --> 01:42:47,479 Speaker 3: think it was like the summer of ninety seven, and 2141 01:42:47,600 --> 01:42:51,120 Speaker 3: so I bought a Porsche convertible that we could you 2142 01:42:51,120 --> 01:42:53,680 Speaker 3: know that we were you know that we would have 2143 01:42:53,720 --> 01:42:55,599 Speaker 3: and we you know, scoot around or whatever. 2144 01:42:57,479 --> 01:43:00,240 Speaker 1: But I was trying to I was like, yeah, I 2145 01:43:00,280 --> 01:43:04,640 Speaker 1: was trying to press so. 2146 01:43:04,720 --> 01:43:06,479 Speaker 3: But then I'm moving back to Detroit where you don't 2147 01:43:06,520 --> 01:43:06,960 Speaker 3: really need to. 2148 01:43:09,520 --> 01:43:09,960 Speaker 1: Get rid of. 2149 01:43:10,120 --> 01:43:11,960 Speaker 3: So I think that was maybe like the first one 2150 01:43:11,960 --> 01:43:14,599 Speaker 3: where I was like, that was what I'm talking about. 2151 01:43:14,600 --> 01:43:16,479 Speaker 3: That wasn't the smartest That is exactly what. 2152 01:43:16,400 --> 01:43:19,840 Speaker 4: I'm looking for. Got, you know, at this point, she 2153 01:43:20,080 --> 01:43:26,840 Speaker 4: just the breed. She ain't the wife got about in Malibu. 2154 01:43:32,960 --> 01:43:33,759 Speaker 1: That was so much. 2155 01:43:34,040 --> 01:43:39,320 Speaker 2: You know, one more thing I want to ask you, Uh, 2156 01:43:39,520 --> 01:43:42,880 Speaker 2: what do Coach K mean to you? Like the years 2157 01:43:42,920 --> 01:43:47,200 Speaker 2: and the friendships and the talks and even after you left, 2158 01:43:47,960 --> 01:43:50,320 Speaker 2: overall it's in his career. 2159 01:43:50,320 --> 01:43:52,559 Speaker 1: What do Coach K mean to you? Yeah? 2160 01:43:52,600 --> 01:43:57,360 Speaker 3: I mean just excellence, you know, friendship, you know, just 2161 01:43:57,400 --> 01:44:00,439 Speaker 3: the standard of you know, there's a reason and why 2162 01:44:00,840 --> 01:44:02,360 Speaker 3: he's successful. 2163 01:44:02,240 --> 01:44:05,320 Speaker 1: And outside him being from Chicago. That's right now. 2164 01:44:05,479 --> 01:44:07,600 Speaker 3: And here's the thing. So the funny thing was, you know, 2165 01:44:07,720 --> 01:44:09,760 Speaker 3: I can't imitate coach well, you know every we all 2166 01:44:09,800 --> 01:44:12,639 Speaker 3: would imitate him at times, and but he always talked 2167 01:44:12,640 --> 01:44:15,320 Speaker 3: about how he was from Chicago and how he was tough, 2168 01:44:15,960 --> 01:44:17,439 Speaker 3: and he was like, you know, I got a bunch 2169 01:44:17,479 --> 01:44:19,760 Speaker 3: of subourbon kids on my team, you know, like you know, 2170 01:44:20,320 --> 01:44:22,479 Speaker 3: and so you know, and then you you talk about 2171 01:44:22,560 --> 01:44:25,080 Speaker 3: is you know the guys he grew up with in Chicago, 2172 01:44:25,320 --> 01:44:27,439 Speaker 3: and he talked about how tough they were, different things 2173 01:44:27,479 --> 01:44:29,559 Speaker 3: he would do, and he's trying to motivate us or whatever, 2174 01:44:29,600 --> 01:44:31,519 Speaker 3: and then you meet the guys and there's nothing tough 2175 01:44:31,520 --> 01:44:36,840 Speaker 3: about it, Like this is this is Moent like was 2176 01:44:36,840 --> 01:44:40,040 Speaker 3: the nicest guy in the world, you know, so you 2177 01:44:40,120 --> 01:44:42,600 Speaker 3: know those are those were no. But I mean, but 2178 01:44:42,640 --> 01:44:44,040 Speaker 3: here's the thing. I mean, I say this about coach 2179 01:44:44,080 --> 01:44:47,799 Speaker 3: in Chicago. He coached and look, I get the perception, 2180 01:44:48,000 --> 01:44:50,720 Speaker 3: I get Duke, and it can be people feel a 2181 01:44:50,720 --> 01:44:53,519 Speaker 3: certain way, can be polarizing, but he coached like he 2182 01:44:53,560 --> 01:44:56,040 Speaker 3: was from the inner city in Chicago, Like the there 2183 01:44:56,080 --> 01:44:59,880 Speaker 3: really was a toughness about him. Of course he's pos. 2184 01:45:00,320 --> 01:45:04,840 Speaker 3: She looks the party, but like like he's a fighter. 2185 01:45:05,040 --> 01:45:08,559 Speaker 1: Show up there. No was it the last game when 2186 01:45:08,560 --> 01:45:10,720 Speaker 1: he didn't like what happened he signed like that, but. 2187 01:45:12,200 --> 01:45:15,600 Speaker 3: No, no question, no question, and so like even like 2188 01:45:15,640 --> 01:45:17,160 Speaker 3: you know, and I used to kind of roll my 2189 01:45:17,200 --> 01:45:18,840 Speaker 3: eyes and then I did it. 2190 01:45:19,160 --> 01:45:20,320 Speaker 1: It was kind of brainwashed. 2191 01:45:20,320 --> 01:45:23,719 Speaker 3: But like taking charges, Like the thing about that is 2192 01:45:23,760 --> 01:45:26,400 Speaker 3: your sacrifice in your body for the team. 2193 01:45:26,640 --> 01:45:28,320 Speaker 1: Like that's the tough thing to do. 2194 01:45:28,640 --> 01:45:30,120 Speaker 3: And so we did have to take the charge reels 2195 01:45:30,680 --> 01:45:32,599 Speaker 3: like you had to take If you didn't take a charge, 2196 01:45:32,600 --> 01:45:35,639 Speaker 3: you didn't play. And so you know what I'm saying. 2197 01:45:35,720 --> 01:45:37,760 Speaker 3: And so so I know when you play against a 2198 01:45:37,800 --> 01:45:43,519 Speaker 3: do guy, you're taking them charges again. But that was 2199 01:45:43,640 --> 01:45:46,320 Speaker 3: that was ingrained in us, and the philosophy was just 2200 01:45:46,400 --> 01:45:50,720 Speaker 3: it was, it was rooted in like that's the ultimate sacrifice. 2201 01:45:50,880 --> 01:45:52,680 Speaker 3: Maybe a little bit of West Point. We's in there 2202 01:45:52,680 --> 01:45:55,400 Speaker 3: as well, you know what I'm saying. But like, but that, 2203 01:45:55,560 --> 01:45:57,400 Speaker 3: like you had to have that to play for him. 2204 01:45:57,479 --> 01:45:58,599 Speaker 3: Here's a beautiful thing too. 2205 01:45:59,000 --> 01:46:00,080 Speaker 1: He wasn't. 2206 01:46:01,200 --> 01:46:02,680 Speaker 3: And he'll get mad at me for saying this, but 2207 01:46:02,720 --> 01:46:05,559 Speaker 3: he wasn't a great exce and no guy. He didn't 2208 01:46:05,600 --> 01:46:09,040 Speaker 3: beat you with x'es and o's, but he was great 2209 01:46:09,040 --> 01:46:12,320 Speaker 3: at getting you to believe in, buy in and taking 2210 01:46:12,360 --> 01:46:16,559 Speaker 3: all these different personalities and coming together. And that's why 2211 01:46:16,600 --> 01:46:18,559 Speaker 3: I thought he was so great with the Olympic team 2212 01:46:19,040 --> 01:46:20,200 Speaker 3: because he can connect. 2213 01:46:21,120 --> 01:46:22,720 Speaker 1: You know, you got a great team. 2214 01:46:23,560 --> 01:46:25,880 Speaker 3: He knows how to connect with everybody on a personal 2215 01:46:25,920 --> 01:46:28,160 Speaker 3: He knew how to deal with me, and dealing with 2216 01:46:28,200 --> 01:46:32,040 Speaker 3: me was different than someone else. That's his genius. That's 2217 01:46:32,080 --> 01:46:33,120 Speaker 3: where he's so special. 2218 01:46:33,720 --> 01:46:34,800 Speaker 1: Excellent. We didn't run nothing. 2219 01:46:34,840 --> 01:46:36,200 Speaker 3: I mean when I was at school, we didn't run 2220 01:46:36,200 --> 01:46:39,000 Speaker 3: any players. You know, we just played. But yeah, I 2221 01:46:39,080 --> 01:46:42,520 Speaker 3: just think how to I think as an example of excellence, 2222 01:46:42,640 --> 01:46:45,320 Speaker 3: but also as a leader. You know what leadership is, 2223 01:46:46,000 --> 01:46:50,559 Speaker 3: and leadership is connection Leadership is honesty. Leadership is doing 2224 01:46:50,600 --> 01:46:52,760 Speaker 3: and saying the tough things that need to be you know, 2225 01:46:53,320 --> 01:46:56,280 Speaker 3: but all of that, he gave us the blueprint and 2226 01:46:56,360 --> 01:46:59,880 Speaker 3: to me, all those qualities not only working basketball but 2227 01:47:00,120 --> 01:47:00,799 Speaker 3: working life. 2228 01:47:01,120 --> 01:47:03,439 Speaker 1: That's what I'm appreciative of. That a great moment. 2229 01:47:03,680 --> 01:47:05,720 Speaker 2: You know, I'm not a crazy big Duke fan, but 2230 01:47:05,760 --> 01:47:09,680 Speaker 2: I was really enjoying and loving the moment of all 2231 01:47:09,760 --> 01:47:12,680 Speaker 2: y'all being together and being there for Coach K and 2232 01:47:12,720 --> 01:47:16,280 Speaker 2: seeing just the errors of all the Duke greats. How 2233 01:47:16,400 --> 01:47:19,360 Speaker 2: was that getting that type of energy and being all 2234 01:47:19,400 --> 01:47:22,479 Speaker 2: in the room and seeing everybody that she probably ain't 2235 01:47:22,520 --> 01:47:25,920 Speaker 2: seen in years, and you know, something like this has 2236 01:47:25,960 --> 01:47:27,080 Speaker 2: never happened like. 2237 01:47:27,080 --> 01:47:29,320 Speaker 1: That, all them together at one time, like that was 2238 01:47:29,360 --> 01:47:30,880 Speaker 1: a dope moment. It was. 2239 01:47:31,120 --> 01:47:35,240 Speaker 3: It was a magical moment. And you know, I think 2240 01:47:36,120 --> 01:47:41,880 Speaker 3: the beauty of Coach K I guess or one of 2241 01:47:41,960 --> 01:47:45,200 Speaker 3: the things that's unusual was just the longevity of his 2242 01:47:45,320 --> 01:47:50,320 Speaker 3: career and to be able to lead, to motivate, to 2243 01:47:50,520 --> 01:47:56,439 Speaker 3: inspire to teach young men over multiple eras is different. 2244 01:47:56,880 --> 01:48:00,679 Speaker 3: We know, just players today in the NBA are very 2245 01:48:00,720 --> 01:48:03,960 Speaker 3: different than our era, and so how do you connect 2246 01:48:04,000 --> 01:48:05,400 Speaker 3: with them? How do you, you know, how do you 2247 01:48:05,439 --> 01:48:07,640 Speaker 3: get through to them, how do you recruit them? And 2248 01:48:07,720 --> 01:48:11,479 Speaker 3: so his ability to adapt and adjust over the years, 2249 01:48:11,960 --> 01:48:14,080 Speaker 3: whether you love him or hate him, you have to respect. 2250 01:48:14,439 --> 01:48:16,360 Speaker 3: Then he was able to do that. So to see 2251 01:48:16,400 --> 01:48:19,879 Speaker 3: all these people from different eras from the early eighties 2252 01:48:20,000 --> 01:48:23,160 Speaker 3: up until you know, late teens or whatever, I mean, 2253 01:48:23,600 --> 01:48:26,200 Speaker 3: all coming back, it was it was a powerful moment. 2254 01:48:26,640 --> 01:48:28,880 Speaker 3: I also it was funny because afterwards I went and 2255 01:48:28,880 --> 01:48:31,240 Speaker 3: sat with my wife. I told her, I said, there's 2256 01:48:31,280 --> 01:48:33,000 Speaker 3: no way, there's no way in hell we're gonna win 2257 01:48:33,040 --> 01:48:33,400 Speaker 3: this game. 2258 01:48:34,520 --> 01:48:35,160 Speaker 1: She said, what I mean? 2259 01:48:35,200 --> 01:48:37,880 Speaker 3: I said, if I'm eighteen years old and I just 2260 01:48:38,280 --> 01:48:41,080 Speaker 3: experienced all of that, it's gonna be hard for me 2261 01:48:41,240 --> 01:48:45,559 Speaker 3: now to like concentrate. It's almost like the ring ceremony, 2262 01:48:45,720 --> 01:48:47,800 Speaker 3: you know when somebody the team wins open at night 2263 01:48:47,880 --> 01:48:50,120 Speaker 3: and they come out lay an egg and so and 2264 01:48:50,160 --> 01:48:52,400 Speaker 3: give give credit to Carolina. They played great, but like 2265 01:48:52,520 --> 01:48:54,920 Speaker 3: it was just it was too much. But it was 2266 01:48:54,960 --> 01:48:58,000 Speaker 3: a great moment, and I'm glad he was able to 2267 01:48:58,080 --> 01:48:59,960 Speaker 3: kind of be celebrated on this way. 2268 01:49:00,080 --> 01:49:02,320 Speaker 1: That was a dope, dope, dope moment. 2269 01:49:02,400 --> 01:49:05,040 Speaker 2: And like I said, just seeing the rors and how 2270 01:49:05,080 --> 01:49:08,280 Speaker 2: long I've been watching Duke basketball and just to see 2271 01:49:08,320 --> 01:49:11,400 Speaker 2: all the guys from JJ to the Boozers to everybody 2272 01:49:12,080 --> 01:49:12,960 Speaker 2: that was just dope. 2273 01:49:13,160 --> 01:49:15,320 Speaker 1: That was how I knew that the rival we was real. 2274 01:49:15,400 --> 01:49:18,560 Speaker 4: Though when the only thing as a kid that I 2275 01:49:18,600 --> 01:49:21,160 Speaker 4: could draw the conclusion from. I'm taking it back to 2276 01:49:21,200 --> 01:49:25,679 Speaker 4: Sega Genesis Coach K Basketball, they did not have UNC 2277 01:49:25,880 --> 01:49:26,439 Speaker 4: on the game. 2278 01:49:28,080 --> 01:49:30,400 Speaker 1: You remember that you ain't see what's not on the game? 2279 01:49:31,120 --> 01:49:31,360 Speaker 1: I don't. 2280 01:49:32,120 --> 01:49:36,639 Speaker 3: The question is it Coach K Carolina say they didn't 2281 01:49:36,680 --> 01:49:37,639 Speaker 3: want to be a part of Listen. 2282 01:49:37,680 --> 01:49:38,400 Speaker 1: That was my part. 2283 01:49:38,640 --> 01:49:41,200 Speaker 4: It was the hate so heavy that somebody either didn't 2284 01:49:41,200 --> 01:49:43,040 Speaker 4: make it happen or they didn't want it to happen. 2285 01:49:43,200 --> 01:49:44,840 Speaker 3: I used to say, the love is so fake, but 2286 01:49:44,880 --> 01:49:47,639 Speaker 3: the hate is so real. Like it just you gotta 2287 01:49:47,720 --> 01:49:49,920 Speaker 3: be a part of it to understand it. But there's 2288 01:49:49,920 --> 01:49:52,759 Speaker 3: a respect because we need each other to be good 2289 01:49:53,360 --> 01:49:55,720 Speaker 3: for the rivalry to be good, but we don't want 2290 01:49:55,760 --> 01:49:56,760 Speaker 3: the other to be that good. 2291 01:49:57,360 --> 01:50:00,320 Speaker 2: Out of all the teammates you had over your NBA career, 2292 01:50:00,400 --> 01:50:03,840 Speaker 2: if you had to pick four other players to add 2293 01:50:03,920 --> 01:50:07,720 Speaker 2: on to yours to five, who would beat them four 2294 01:50:07,760 --> 01:50:12,559 Speaker 2: other players on it? You got it for the players 2295 01:50:12,720 --> 01:50:14,479 Speaker 2: all the teammates you can play in the NBA with. 2296 01:50:14,880 --> 01:50:17,400 Speaker 2: If you had to pick four of them to run it, 2297 01:50:17,439 --> 01:50:19,120 Speaker 2: who would be the four teammate? 2298 01:50:19,800 --> 01:50:24,000 Speaker 3: Matt, you know I gotta put I gotta put Joe 2299 01:50:24,080 --> 01:50:24,559 Speaker 3: du Mars. 2300 01:50:25,040 --> 01:50:25,240 Speaker 1: Joe. 2301 01:50:25,439 --> 01:50:28,000 Speaker 3: Joe could play. Man Joe Joe could play. He was 2302 01:50:28,080 --> 01:50:29,920 Speaker 3: older when I played with him, but he could play. 2303 01:50:32,360 --> 01:50:35,559 Speaker 1: Ut Max Joe, do you know you can go small? 2304 01:50:36,360 --> 01:50:39,439 Speaker 3: I got Chris Paul and I got Steve point guard, 2305 01:50:39,479 --> 01:50:42,679 Speaker 3: so I gotta figure out between those two. But I'll 2306 01:50:42,720 --> 01:50:44,800 Speaker 3: go with Steve. I didn't really play, so I'll go 2307 01:50:44,920 --> 01:50:47,320 Speaker 3: with Steve. So I got Steve, Joe me Man. 2308 01:50:47,320 --> 01:50:54,639 Speaker 1: I need a big Marist, oh Dwhite or Mar the White? 2309 01:50:54,720 --> 01:51:00,760 Speaker 1: I got you the White. I forgot it. So Steve Nash, Joe, 2310 01:51:01,640 --> 01:51:02,320 Speaker 1: I'm taking Joe off. 2311 01:51:02,360 --> 01:51:03,160 Speaker 3: I'm taking Joe off. 2312 01:51:03,240 --> 01:51:09,599 Speaker 1: Okay, Joe, I'm gonna go Steve Nash, t Mag, Amar 2313 01:51:11,439 --> 01:51:17,360 Speaker 1: Dwight and the White. I'm gonna do. That's a crazy 2314 01:51:18,880 --> 01:51:26,519 Speaker 1: off the bench. Yeah, t Mag didn't. Yeah, the big 2315 01:51:26,600 --> 01:51:26,920 Speaker 1: ball like. 2316 01:51:26,920 --> 01:51:31,120 Speaker 3: The big guys like nowadays, you would go tomorrow. You 2317 01:51:31,160 --> 01:51:32,639 Speaker 3: know what I'm saying. You couldn't have too bigs. 2318 01:51:32,880 --> 01:51:36,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, nowadays with them, how they run how the white 2319 01:51:36,960 --> 01:51:38,000 Speaker 1: you gotta play with them arow. 2320 01:51:38,720 --> 01:51:41,000 Speaker 3: I played with him after his knee and he was still. 2321 01:51:41,479 --> 01:51:43,920 Speaker 4: I played with him when he he ain't give a fuck. 2322 01:51:44,680 --> 01:51:48,680 Speaker 4: That's like they listen, Leeve got lucky because he had 2323 01:51:48,720 --> 01:51:50,880 Speaker 4: to live. He had the I stuff before the knee. 2324 01:51:50,960 --> 01:51:52,960 Speaker 1: That that's what like slowed him down. 2325 01:51:53,200 --> 01:51:56,880 Speaker 4: He remember that, but I know that like he had 2326 01:51:56,920 --> 01:51:59,240 Speaker 4: too the iron the knee thing kind of they like 2327 01:51:59,400 --> 01:52:00,840 Speaker 4: he was about to have to get him a shoot. 2328 01:52:00,960 --> 01:52:02,599 Speaker 1: The league was about to be in his hand. 2329 01:52:03,479 --> 01:52:07,320 Speaker 3: He was about after that year, you guys had he 2330 01:52:07,360 --> 01:52:08,000 Speaker 3: got out of there. 2331 01:52:08,160 --> 01:52:09,040 Speaker 1: He got hurt that next. 2332 01:52:09,040 --> 01:52:10,760 Speaker 4: That's what I'm saying you that that's when he was 2333 01:52:10,840 --> 01:52:12,400 Speaker 4: about to get the shoe and everything. 2334 01:52:12,439 --> 01:52:13,679 Speaker 1: That's when it slowed down. 2335 01:52:13,800 --> 01:52:16,400 Speaker 4: They had to He still came back with evengs, but 2336 01:52:16,479 --> 01:52:19,559 Speaker 4: it like you know, it's stopped the whole scent. 2337 01:52:19,800 --> 01:52:21,840 Speaker 2: No, no, no, you're right, you're right about that. You 2338 01:52:21,960 --> 01:52:24,240 Speaker 2: had a lot of dunk Ones. You know this this 2339 01:52:24,360 --> 01:52:26,720 Speaker 2: ain't your part of the second, but you had a 2340 01:52:26,760 --> 01:52:31,240 Speaker 2: lot of dunk Ons. No, he's dunk by itself all 2341 01:52:31,240 --> 01:52:34,599 Speaker 2: the time. You had a lot of dunk Ons. Which 2342 01:52:34,680 --> 01:52:37,080 Speaker 2: one is like one of your favorite, like one of 2343 01:52:37,160 --> 01:52:40,920 Speaker 2: your memorable moments that you always remember or they always 2344 01:52:40,960 --> 01:52:43,040 Speaker 2: send it to you on the ground or whatever. But 2345 01:52:43,160 --> 01:52:45,840 Speaker 2: which one of them dunk ons that you remember the most. 2346 01:52:46,120 --> 01:52:50,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean anytime you caught somebody, you know, especially 2347 01:52:50,120 --> 01:52:53,840 Speaker 3: a big guy like Kim Bay. I mean, I mean, 2348 01:52:53,880 --> 01:52:55,679 Speaker 3: I always like to And obviously we know the Kenba 2349 01:52:55,800 --> 01:52:57,719 Speaker 3: is going through some health right now, so our prayers 2350 01:52:57,720 --> 01:52:59,559 Speaker 3: are with him. But the ken Bay was always fun 2351 01:52:59,720 --> 01:53:01,800 Speaker 3: and and he would always point the finger. It was 2352 01:53:01,920 --> 01:53:04,639 Speaker 3: kind of a fun thing back and forth with him. 2353 01:53:04,760 --> 01:53:09,240 Speaker 3: But it was Alonzo, and you know, there was there 2354 01:53:09,320 --> 01:53:12,000 Speaker 3: was a play. There was a play that I think 2355 01:53:12,120 --> 01:53:15,400 Speaker 3: really kind of resonated in Detroit. And you know, it's 2356 01:53:15,439 --> 01:53:19,920 Speaker 3: interesting because Detroit, Detroit's obviously blue collar bad boys, and 2357 01:53:20,000 --> 01:53:22,840 Speaker 3: all of a sudden, this privileged kid from Duke and 2358 01:53:22,960 --> 01:53:25,040 Speaker 3: all the perceptions that come with that comes to their 2359 01:53:25,120 --> 01:53:28,280 Speaker 3: city and so it's probably a weird thing for them 2360 01:53:28,360 --> 01:53:30,280 Speaker 3: for fans in Detroit at the time to digest. 2361 01:53:30,960 --> 01:53:32,679 Speaker 1: But there was a play. 2362 01:53:33,000 --> 01:53:35,280 Speaker 3: I'm on defense, I'm guarding hard away and I go 2363 01:53:35,439 --> 01:53:38,519 Speaker 3: under the screen and Zoe's trying to roll back then 2364 01:53:38,560 --> 01:53:42,080 Speaker 3: you could roll, and so somehow we get tangled up, 2365 01:53:42,920 --> 01:53:45,400 Speaker 3: and I guess he falls over me, and it looks 2366 01:53:45,439 --> 01:53:48,120 Speaker 3: like a body slammed him. And our body slamed him 2367 01:53:48,120 --> 01:53:49,040 Speaker 3: and threw him on the ground. 2368 01:53:49,120 --> 01:53:51,000 Speaker 1: I'm like, I get up. I'm like, oh shit, like. 2369 01:53:53,080 --> 01:53:54,720 Speaker 3: If we were in front of the bench, you know, 2370 01:53:54,920 --> 01:53:57,080 Speaker 3: and some thinking, okay, these guys better come out here, 2371 01:53:57,200 --> 01:53:58,880 Speaker 3: like you know, you know, we're front of our own bench, 2372 01:53:59,600 --> 01:54:01,920 Speaker 3: and he itself and the thing is like, I know Zoe, 2373 01:54:02,000 --> 01:54:03,640 Speaker 3: like I know Zoe since high school, like you know 2374 01:54:03,680 --> 01:54:06,759 Speaker 3: what I'm saying, we were from Like, so he didn't 2375 01:54:06,800 --> 01:54:08,680 Speaker 3: do anything, but it looked like I threw him down. 2376 01:54:09,920 --> 01:54:12,600 Speaker 3: And in the very next possession, we go down the 2377 01:54:12,640 --> 01:54:15,840 Speaker 3: other end and I, you know, I go against Marley, 2378 01:54:15,880 --> 01:54:18,479 Speaker 3: I go baseline and Joe comes and I and I 2379 01:54:18,600 --> 01:54:23,000 Speaker 3: dunk on him. And uh so that that sequence right 2380 01:54:23,080 --> 01:54:25,479 Speaker 3: there was was was a And the funny thing was, 2381 01:54:25,560 --> 01:54:28,040 Speaker 3: I'm my college roommate t Lang. He's on the bench, 2382 01:54:28,400 --> 01:54:30,880 Speaker 3: so I'm looking at him after I dunk because I 2383 01:54:30,960 --> 01:54:33,480 Speaker 3: taught you know, I taught trash as my guy, so 2384 01:54:33,520 --> 01:54:35,760 Speaker 3: I'm gonna tak trash to him. But but that was 2385 01:54:35,920 --> 01:54:37,760 Speaker 3: that was probably the one. I mean, I had a 2386 01:54:37,840 --> 01:54:39,360 Speaker 3: few here and there, but that was the one that 2387 01:54:39,400 --> 01:54:41,280 Speaker 3: I think I know about this. 2388 01:54:44,280 --> 01:54:44,560 Speaker 1: I had. 2389 01:54:44,640 --> 01:54:47,160 Speaker 3: Zoe was one of my presenters at the Hall of Fame, 2390 01:54:48,640 --> 01:54:51,680 Speaker 3: and part of it was what he went through with 2391 01:54:51,760 --> 01:54:55,040 Speaker 3: his injury, his illness and how he fought through that. 2392 01:54:55,440 --> 01:54:59,360 Speaker 3: And when I was going through my stuff looking for inspiration, 2393 01:54:59,520 --> 01:55:03,080 Speaker 3: he the spies. But yeah, I mean that. You know, 2394 01:55:03,160 --> 01:55:05,880 Speaker 3: everyone's Mazoe must not like now. Zoe's my guy. Always 2395 01:55:06,000 --> 01:55:08,320 Speaker 3: liked Zoe. But you know, when you compete, you compete. 2396 01:55:08,440 --> 01:55:11,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, zol Man, that's the big homie. Man, that's a 2397 01:55:11,360 --> 01:55:12,680 Speaker 1: big homie. Much love. 2398 01:55:12,800 --> 01:55:14,920 Speaker 4: But I ain't shaking hands with him no more. He 2399 01:55:15,080 --> 01:55:18,000 Speaker 4: shake hands too, Damn hard man. You know, don't make 2400 01:55:18,120 --> 01:55:19,960 Speaker 4: no sense to shake Nobody's hearing that. 2401 01:55:20,080 --> 01:55:24,360 Speaker 1: Damn hall All right, that's a rap man. 2402 01:55:24,440 --> 01:55:27,600 Speaker 4: We was live on location with the Duke Legend, the 2403 01:55:27,880 --> 01:55:31,640 Speaker 4: NBA Legend, Hall of Fame, but NBA Top seventy five, 2404 01:55:31,840 --> 01:55:34,040 Speaker 4: all of that, all of that, all of that live 2405 01:55:34,120 --> 01:55:34,760 Speaker 4: on location. 2406 01:55:35,000 --> 01:55:41,920 Speaker 1: Geehill Man, we appreciate you, big dog. I appreciate y'all. All. 2407 01:55:42,000 --> 01:55:43,800 Speaker 4: I want to thank y'all for you're continued support of 2408 01:55:43,840 --> 01:55:45,120 Speaker 4: The Knuckleheads podcast. 2409 01:55:45,400 --> 01:55:46,520 Speaker 1: Be sure to give us two. 2410 01:55:46,480 --> 01:55:49,160 Speaker 4: Taps by writing a review and rating five stars wherever 2411 01:55:49,200 --> 01:55:51,280 Speaker 4: you get your podcasts and make sure to hit that 2412 01:55:51,320 --> 01:55:54,080 Speaker 4: subscribe button so you don't miss an episode. You can 2413 01:55:54,160 --> 01:55:56,520 Speaker 4: also watch all the episodes on the Players Tribute on 2414 01:55:56,600 --> 01:56:00,600 Speaker 4: YouTube page. Follow us on social media at Knuckleheads podcast 2415 01:56:00,920 --> 01:56:04,680 Speaker 4: enjoined our Knuckleheads Facebook group for exclusive content. Thanks again 2416 01:56:04,800 --> 01:56:07,160 Speaker 4: all of our guests and fans. This wouldn't be possible 2417 01:56:07,160 --> 01:56:07,720 Speaker 4: without y'all. 2418 01:56:22,920 --> 01:56:25,480 Speaker 1: The Players Tribute dot com