1 00:00:02,120 --> 00:00:04,840 Speaker 1: You're listening to Math and Magic, a production of I 2 00:00:05,000 --> 00:00:10,840 Speaker 1: Heart Radio. I went to a Catholic school. There was 3 00:00:10,920 --> 00:00:12,879 Speaker 1: five black kids in the school. I was one of 4 00:00:12,920 --> 00:00:17,560 Speaker 1: the everybody's driving I Rocks and listening to Billy Idol. 5 00:00:18,040 --> 00:00:21,560 Speaker 1: They're all also listening to run DMC. They're also listening 6 00:00:21,600 --> 00:00:25,159 Speaker 1: to Best Boys, and they wanted him more. Music was 7 00:00:25,200 --> 00:00:29,440 Speaker 1: the thing that was clearly the connector. If you started 8 00:00:29,440 --> 00:00:32,239 Speaker 1: the conversation from what we have in common versus what 9 00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:35,519 Speaker 1: we have in different you'll actually be surprised at all 10 00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:37,760 Speaker 1: of the commonalities that you have and you can build 11 00:00:37,800 --> 00:00:40,360 Speaker 1: on top of that. That path was the path I 12 00:00:40,360 --> 00:00:50,879 Speaker 1: worked my whole career with. I'm Bob Pittman. Welcome the 13 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:54,080 Speaker 1: Math and Magic stories from the Frontiers and Marketing. We 14 00:00:54,280 --> 00:00:57,800 Speaker 1: examine that very special mix of the analytics and insights 15 00:00:57,800 --> 00:01:01,320 Speaker 1: and marketing math, but that very full excitement, craziness and 16 00:01:01,400 --> 00:01:05,479 Speaker 1: sheer creativity magic and how those come together to create 17 00:01:05,560 --> 00:01:10,240 Speaker 1: legendary marketing ideas and businesses. Today we've got the perfect 18 00:01:10,280 --> 00:01:14,520 Speaker 1: example of someone who has had amazing insights plus the 19 00:01:14,560 --> 00:01:17,399 Speaker 1: creative talent to build new products and businesses from them. 20 00:01:17,720 --> 00:01:27,160 Speaker 1: Steve Stout. Steve was in the music businesses hip hop 21 00:01:27,240 --> 00:01:30,440 Speaker 1: was blowing up. He figured out how that could change movies, music, 22 00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:34,920 Speaker 1: and advertising, often combining them into one unified effort. He's 23 00:01:34,959 --> 00:01:37,679 Speaker 1: the CEO and founder of two well known companies, United 24 00:01:37,760 --> 00:01:41,480 Speaker 1: Masters that helps music artists retain control of music and translation, 25 00:01:41,920 --> 00:01:45,039 Speaker 1: a creative agency doing some of the most forward thinking 26 00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:49,120 Speaker 1: work and connecting big brands the culture and often the 27 00:01:49,120 --> 00:01:52,240 Speaker 1: influencers in music and sports as well. He grew up 28 00:01:52,240 --> 00:01:55,960 Speaker 1: in Queen's High school. Injury derailed the possible careers of 29 00:01:56,080 --> 00:01:58,960 Speaker 1: athlete and set him on another path. We want to 30 00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:01,720 Speaker 1: get into that path. But before we do that, let's 31 00:02:01,760 --> 00:02:07,200 Speaker 1: welcome Steven. I like that in yet, and we're going 32 00:02:07,240 --> 00:02:10,240 Speaker 1: to jump into you in sixty seconds. We're gonna ask 33 00:02:10,280 --> 00:02:14,120 Speaker 1: you some questions lightning round style. Don't think too long, 34 00:02:14,240 --> 00:02:15,720 Speaker 1: just say the first thing that comes to your mind. 35 00:02:15,800 --> 00:02:18,160 Speaker 1: So here we go. Do you prefer Manhattan or Queen's 36 00:02:18,639 --> 00:02:23,480 Speaker 1: Manhattan Chocolate or Vanilla Vanilla eminem or Dr Dre Dr Dre. 37 00:02:23,680 --> 00:02:27,200 Speaker 1: Yankees are Mets, Mets, Giants are Jets. I hate them both. 38 00:02:28,280 --> 00:02:32,440 Speaker 1: It's about to get harder. Secret talent seen around Corners 39 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:36,360 Speaker 1: favorite city, New York. This is gonna be a really 40 00:02:36,400 --> 00:02:39,960 Speaker 1: tough one. Best live concert? Wow, what I haven't seen? 41 00:02:40,280 --> 00:02:42,239 Speaker 1: I would love to have seen Bob Molly play live, 42 00:02:42,680 --> 00:02:44,800 Speaker 1: and it's very hard to find anybody who's seen it. 43 00:02:45,400 --> 00:02:49,880 Speaker 1: Have you seen him Jamaica? I love Jamaica. I've never 44 00:02:49,880 --> 00:02:52,760 Speaker 1: seen him live. The best live concert I've ever been to. 45 00:02:54,120 --> 00:02:57,160 Speaker 1: Smartest person you know. The smartest person I know is 46 00:02:57,240 --> 00:03:00,960 Speaker 1: Ben Orwits. Hardest working celebrity you've managed. I can tell 47 00:03:00,960 --> 00:03:04,640 Speaker 1: you the hardest working celebrity I've worked with is Lebron James. 48 00:03:04,960 --> 00:03:08,400 Speaker 1: Worst bad or fashion trend you've participated in. Everybody was 49 00:03:08,440 --> 00:03:12,200 Speaker 1: wearing yellow pants, but it was a part of everybody 50 00:03:12,280 --> 00:03:17,000 Speaker 1: was doing it. Who would play you in a movie? NS? 51 00:03:17,520 --> 00:03:22,400 Speaker 1: Proudest achievement starting a family. What's one food you'd never eat? 52 00:03:22,720 --> 00:03:26,640 Speaker 1: I don't like any like it's a substance like a jelly, jellyfish, 53 00:03:26,800 --> 00:03:32,280 Speaker 1: jelly anything jelly. I'm I'm not touching that. Jelly's out. Okay, 54 00:03:32,440 --> 00:03:36,880 Speaker 1: Final one? Where was your last vacation? Last vacation was 55 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:41,640 Speaker 1: in Paris? Okay, let's get started. Great quote from you. 56 00:03:42,040 --> 00:03:46,440 Speaker 1: Music moves culture. What do you mean by that? Culture 57 00:03:46,520 --> 00:03:49,600 Speaker 1: really is a set of rules in which a group 58 00:03:49,640 --> 00:03:52,960 Speaker 1: of people lived by and moved by music has always 59 00:03:53,080 --> 00:03:57,240 Speaker 1: been one of the greatest indicators of where the world 60 00:03:57,320 --> 00:04:00,760 Speaker 1: was moving to. If you listen to the lyrics, if 61 00:04:00,760 --> 00:04:03,480 Speaker 1: you listen to the subject matter, where the perspective of 62 00:04:03,520 --> 00:04:05,680 Speaker 1: the song is coming from, where the artist is coming 63 00:04:05,680 --> 00:04:08,280 Speaker 1: from themselves, he'll tell you a lot if you follow 64 00:04:08,320 --> 00:04:11,800 Speaker 1: that line. Most people don't follow that line. And when 65 00:04:11,800 --> 00:04:13,680 Speaker 1: I got into the marketing business, what I wanted to 66 00:04:13,680 --> 00:04:18,400 Speaker 1: do was use that line around music in the culture 67 00:04:18,440 --> 00:04:22,880 Speaker 1: that it was an indicator of, to remove models of segmentation. 68 00:04:23,240 --> 00:04:26,360 Speaker 1: When I got into the business, Bob, the thing that 69 00:04:26,440 --> 00:04:30,560 Speaker 1: was most appalling to me was eighteen to twenty four black, eighteen, white, 70 00:04:31,400 --> 00:04:34,679 Speaker 1: eighteen and twenty four hispanic. These things don't even mean anything. 71 00:04:35,160 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 1: There are fake segmentation media metrics that was created at 72 00:04:39,680 --> 00:04:42,279 Speaker 1: a time when I guess it mattered, but it really 73 00:04:42,279 --> 00:04:45,479 Speaker 1: didn't matter at the time when MTV came around, But 74 00:04:45,560 --> 00:04:47,880 Speaker 1: yet it was still a currency that was being traded upon, 75 00:04:48,200 --> 00:04:51,359 Speaker 1: and I think it made no sense. And I always 76 00:04:51,400 --> 00:04:56,360 Speaker 1: felt like music proved that model out, but everyone kept 77 00:04:56,360 --> 00:04:59,800 Speaker 1: on refuting it because it was a good business to 78 00:04:59,880 --> 00:05:03,320 Speaker 1: be in segmentation studies. So you obfuscate that and keep 79 00:05:03,320 --> 00:05:08,520 Speaker 1: going back to reach and general audience demographics. In the sixties, 80 00:05:08,560 --> 00:05:11,600 Speaker 1: before FM really took hold, a m would play everything 81 00:05:12,240 --> 00:05:15,320 Speaker 1: Otis writing and then you'd play at Karen Carpenters song 82 00:05:15,400 --> 00:05:18,640 Speaker 1: right after it didn't matter. And then FM when they 83 00:05:18,640 --> 00:05:22,679 Speaker 1: started splitting the signals, is when segmentation really became alive 84 00:05:22,760 --> 00:05:24,880 Speaker 1: on radio because you got a chance to make up 85 00:05:24,920 --> 00:05:29,640 Speaker 1: all these narrowcasting. Narrowcasting. Okay, there it is, and I 86 00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:32,960 Speaker 1: think that narrowcasting has done a lot to affect media's 87 00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:35,640 Speaker 1: perspective on how you look at people and how you 88 00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:38,880 Speaker 1: put people into boxes. One of the most craziest things 89 00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:40,839 Speaker 1: I've seen when I was in the record business. It 90 00:05:40,920 --> 00:05:44,680 Speaker 1: was the mid nineties and rap music started to take off. 91 00:05:44,800 --> 00:05:49,320 Speaker 1: The crazy thing was at the pop stations didn't play 92 00:05:49,440 --> 00:05:52,600 Speaker 1: rap music. They probably let one in the playlist. Then 93 00:05:52,640 --> 00:05:55,599 Speaker 1: they started letting two in, but they were much more 94 00:05:55,680 --> 00:05:58,600 Speaker 1: focused on Britney Spears and that stuff rather than the 95 00:05:58,720 --> 00:06:03,279 Speaker 1: rap music. But the local sponsors they wanted return and 96 00:06:03,279 --> 00:06:05,200 Speaker 1: they knew that the young people were listening to rap, 97 00:06:06,279 --> 00:06:11,120 Speaker 1: so they started this format called urban crossover. Urban It 98 00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:15,440 Speaker 1: was a category of stations that had range that could 99 00:06:15,520 --> 00:06:19,279 Speaker 1: play hip hop music and some pop records. Hot ninety 100 00:06:19,320 --> 00:06:21,720 Speaker 1: seven in New York was a churban station. Probably one 101 00:06:21,920 --> 00:06:25,159 Speaker 1: six in l A was a urban station. And these 102 00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:28,040 Speaker 1: were crossover urban stations. And when I seen that, I 103 00:06:28,080 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 1: was like, Wow, this industry is twisted. When did you 104 00:06:31,279 --> 00:06:34,600 Speaker 1: have this insight? I mean, it's clearly fuels what you're 105 00:06:34,640 --> 00:06:37,440 Speaker 1: doing fuel sud the fuels your marketing. Where did this 106 00:06:37,480 --> 00:06:40,520 Speaker 1: insight come from? Living with my eyes open? Man? I 107 00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:43,240 Speaker 1: grew up. I went to a Catholic school. There was 108 00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:45,440 Speaker 1: five black kids in the school. I was one of them. 109 00:06:46,560 --> 00:06:50,719 Speaker 1: I'm going to school and as much as everybody's driving 110 00:06:50,760 --> 00:06:54,720 Speaker 1: Irocks and listening to Billy Idol, they're all also listening 111 00:06:54,760 --> 00:06:58,800 Speaker 1: to Run DMC, They're also listening to Beastie Boys, and 112 00:06:58,839 --> 00:07:01,880 Speaker 1: they wanted him more. I didn't like Billy Idol's music. 113 00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:04,279 Speaker 1: I didn't cross over that way, but there were songs 114 00:07:04,320 --> 00:07:06,160 Speaker 1: that I got introduced to I did like I did 115 00:07:06,200 --> 00:07:09,600 Speaker 1: like the Bengals, like I definitely like the Banker's record, right. 116 00:07:09,800 --> 00:07:12,720 Speaker 1: So there were things that I started being introduced to, 117 00:07:12,720 --> 00:07:15,240 Speaker 1: and I'm like, once we remove these walls, we have 118 00:07:15,400 --> 00:07:18,920 Speaker 1: more in common than the world actually realizes. And I 119 00:07:18,920 --> 00:07:22,119 Speaker 1: think that's what led me to that insight, and really 120 00:07:22,160 --> 00:07:25,000 Speaker 1: that's what led me. That path was the path I 121 00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:28,200 Speaker 1: woke my whole career with understanding that if you started 122 00:07:28,200 --> 00:07:31,000 Speaker 1: the conversation from what we have in common versus what 123 00:07:31,040 --> 00:07:34,320 Speaker 1: we have in different you'll actually be surprised at all 124 00:07:34,320 --> 00:07:36,520 Speaker 1: of the commonalities that you have and you can build 125 00:07:36,560 --> 00:07:38,440 Speaker 1: on top of that. Once I started going into the 126 00:07:38,440 --> 00:07:41,679 Speaker 1: working world and started seeing people being separated, I didn't 127 00:07:41,720 --> 00:07:45,400 Speaker 1: understand that because that's not the way I was in school. 128 00:07:45,520 --> 00:07:48,560 Speaker 1: That's not was in my social life at school, that's 129 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:50,480 Speaker 1: not how it was on my football team at school. 130 00:07:51,040 --> 00:07:54,800 Speaker 1: And music was the thing that was clearly the Connector 131 00:07:54,920 --> 00:07:56,800 Speaker 1: let's go back a little bit. Your mom was a 132 00:07:56,880 --> 00:08:00,840 Speaker 1: nurse with the Merchant Marine immigrants from triniday At, so 133 00:08:01,000 --> 00:08:04,080 Speaker 1: your first experience must have been understanding and navigating a 134 00:08:04,200 --> 00:08:07,040 Speaker 1: culture right there in Queens. Did that play a role 135 00:08:07,080 --> 00:08:09,000 Speaker 1: in this? I mean, well, yeah. When we first moved 136 00:08:09,000 --> 00:08:12,120 Speaker 1: to Queens, we lived right now Bellmont Race Track, and 137 00:08:12,600 --> 00:08:14,800 Speaker 1: we were one of the few black families on the block. 138 00:08:14,840 --> 00:08:16,600 Speaker 1: It was a block of fifty houses. I used to 139 00:08:16,640 --> 00:08:21,080 Speaker 1: count the houses really long. The neighborhood reverse the gentrified. 140 00:08:21,320 --> 00:08:24,200 Speaker 1: There was like only two white people left by the time, 141 00:08:24,320 --> 00:08:26,400 Speaker 1: the early eighties game, and it was a bunch of 142 00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:28,960 Speaker 1: Caribbean people like us, and they started living in that 143 00:08:29,080 --> 00:08:33,000 Speaker 1: area in Queen's Village. Things started to change when more 144 00:08:33,280 --> 00:08:35,600 Speaker 1: people from the Caribbean moved into the neighborhood. Let me 145 00:08:35,800 --> 00:08:38,800 Speaker 1: stay in your past a little bit. You were high 146 00:08:38,800 --> 00:08:42,040 Speaker 1: school football player, certainly had dreams of the pros than 147 00:08:42,120 --> 00:08:44,920 Speaker 1: you had. An injury changed all that, but one another path. 148 00:08:45,480 --> 00:08:48,280 Speaker 1: You attended a number of colleges and you joined this 149 00:08:48,400 --> 00:08:50,600 Speaker 1: very famous club of which I'm also a member of, 150 00:08:50,679 --> 00:08:54,240 Speaker 1: the college dropouts. Why did you leave college? I was bored, Bob. 151 00:08:54,400 --> 00:08:56,640 Speaker 1: There was nothing in it that made me feel I 152 00:08:56,679 --> 00:08:58,920 Speaker 1: didn't have the desire to be a good student. I 153 00:08:58,920 --> 00:09:01,240 Speaker 1: didn't care enough. I didn't even know what I was 154 00:09:01,280 --> 00:09:04,240 Speaker 1: gonna do, but I knew I couldn't do that. You 155 00:09:04,280 --> 00:09:08,000 Speaker 1: were a kid that shoveled, snow erected tensive flea markets, 156 00:09:08,040 --> 00:09:13,319 Speaker 1: delivered newspapers saying Christmas carols, everything every man, and then 157 00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:16,640 Speaker 1: at nineteen you were actually signing up people for mortgages. 158 00:09:16,679 --> 00:09:17,920 Speaker 1: You were in the real estate. That was in the 159 00:09:17,920 --> 00:09:20,080 Speaker 1: real estate businesses. So how do you make the jump 160 00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:22,840 Speaker 1: from the real estate business to the music business. How 161 00:09:22,840 --> 00:09:25,160 Speaker 1: did you get that idea? During that time, I had 162 00:09:25,200 --> 00:09:27,400 Speaker 1: met a girl. She was in the Army reserves, and 163 00:09:27,400 --> 00:09:29,280 Speaker 1: there was another guy in the Army reserves of her 164 00:09:29,920 --> 00:09:33,000 Speaker 1: who told about making dance records. And you can put 165 00:09:33,480 --> 00:09:36,280 Speaker 1: like two thousand dollars and cut a dance record. You 166 00:09:36,360 --> 00:09:39,360 Speaker 1: make like five ten pieces of final and you can 167 00:09:39,360 --> 00:09:42,120 Speaker 1: sell them at records and you can sell them to DJ's, 168 00:09:42,840 --> 00:09:45,560 Speaker 1: And there were these dance artists that were looking for 169 00:09:45,920 --> 00:09:48,800 Speaker 1: guys to do that. As an entrepreneur, you look under 170 00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:52,040 Speaker 1: every single rock. Anything could be an opportunity. You don't know, 171 00:09:52,559 --> 00:09:54,520 Speaker 1: you can't predict where the opportunity is going to come from. 172 00:09:54,520 --> 00:09:56,480 Speaker 1: So I took the meeting with the guy and he 173 00:09:56,559 --> 00:09:59,560 Speaker 1: happened to be the DJ of Kid and Play. I 174 00:09:59,559 --> 00:10:01,600 Speaker 1: didn't mean anything because I was actually doing good. I 175 00:10:01,640 --> 00:10:06,240 Speaker 1: had like forty two dollars in the bank. Yeah, and 176 00:10:06,280 --> 00:10:10,640 Speaker 1: you were how old nineteen. I didn't need anything from them. 177 00:10:10,679 --> 00:10:12,600 Speaker 1: So I was around them and I didn't need money 178 00:10:12,640 --> 00:10:14,480 Speaker 1: from them. I just wanted to be around and see 179 00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:17,719 Speaker 1: what they were doing. Fast forward, I became Kid and 180 00:10:17,720 --> 00:10:19,959 Speaker 1: Players road manager, and that's how I got into the 181 00:10:20,040 --> 00:10:22,920 Speaker 1: music business. So you go to r C A you 182 00:10:23,000 --> 00:10:27,080 Speaker 1: wind up as A and R director. Joe Galante? How 183 00:10:27,080 --> 00:10:29,760 Speaker 1: old were you? You were a kid. Joe Galante took 184 00:10:29,800 --> 00:10:32,040 Speaker 1: my phone call. You just called him, and I just 185 00:10:32,080 --> 00:10:37,800 Speaker 1: called Joe Galante. Joe Galante had come from Nashville to 186 00:10:37,840 --> 00:10:41,520 Speaker 1: New York. I knew Joe decades ago from country news. 187 00:10:41,640 --> 00:10:44,240 Speaker 1: That's crazy, and I didn't know who he was. Somebody said, 188 00:10:44,240 --> 00:10:46,600 Speaker 1: there's a guy named Joe Galante who's giving out deals. 189 00:10:46,920 --> 00:10:50,280 Speaker 1: I called Joe Galante up. He takes a meeting with 190 00:10:50,360 --> 00:10:54,719 Speaker 1: me and pays me four thousand dollars a month as 191 00:10:54,760 --> 00:10:58,200 Speaker 1: a consultant. I'm literally sitting on my mother's step, living 192 00:10:58,200 --> 00:11:01,480 Speaker 1: at home, getting fourth thousand dollars a month. I couldn't 193 00:11:01,480 --> 00:11:04,839 Speaker 1: even believe this. The check just kept coming coming. And 194 00:11:04,880 --> 00:11:09,160 Speaker 1: then he introduced me to the guy who ran ahead 195 00:11:09,200 --> 00:11:12,800 Speaker 1: of black music most segmentation, Skip Miller. Skip Miller was 196 00:11:12,840 --> 00:11:15,520 Speaker 1: a former motown guy. He came to run it, and 197 00:11:15,800 --> 00:11:18,960 Speaker 1: they turned me from a consultant into an employee, and 198 00:11:19,000 --> 00:11:21,360 Speaker 1: they hired me as an A and R executive. Converted 199 00:11:21,400 --> 00:11:26,280 Speaker 1: me so we're on segmentation. They shut down the Black 200 00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:29,960 Speaker 1: Music division. Why did they shut it down? Because the 201 00:11:30,040 --> 00:11:33,760 Speaker 1: record business didn't know anything. Capital shut down, the Black 202 00:11:33,840 --> 00:11:37,080 Speaker 1: music Department r c A shut down, the Black music Department. 203 00:11:37,320 --> 00:11:40,280 Speaker 1: Columbia had just got rid of Deaf Jam Michael Bolton 204 00:11:40,360 --> 00:11:43,080 Speaker 1: was still selling records. All the things that they knew 205 00:11:43,160 --> 00:11:45,720 Speaker 1: was still working. So you know, Bob, how it goes. 206 00:11:46,040 --> 00:11:48,760 Speaker 1: People get accustomed to the thing. They know they can 207 00:11:48,800 --> 00:11:50,400 Speaker 1: get fat off of that. Why are you gonna worry 208 00:11:50,400 --> 00:11:52,920 Speaker 1: about tomorrow? They could just keep eating off for yesterday. 209 00:11:53,400 --> 00:11:55,160 Speaker 1: They don't even know who these guys look like. What 210 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:59,240 Speaker 1: did they They were wearing yellow pants. They didn't want 211 00:11:59,280 --> 00:12:01,880 Speaker 1: those guys around down and they really got rid of it. 212 00:12:01,880 --> 00:12:03,880 Speaker 1: They didn't know the difference been good and great. And 213 00:12:03,920 --> 00:12:06,000 Speaker 1: I remember the day I was trying to get this 214 00:12:06,080 --> 00:12:09,240 Speaker 1: one producer the songs to do a remix for and 215 00:12:09,240 --> 00:12:11,839 Speaker 1: he kept them blowing off the meeting. This guy's meeting 216 00:12:11,880 --> 00:12:14,480 Speaker 1: me at ten am. Meet skipped Miller at eleven am. 217 00:12:14,679 --> 00:12:17,280 Speaker 1: The guy supposed to meet at ten am does not 218 00:12:17,760 --> 00:12:20,800 Speaker 1: show up till eleven He walked in my office. He's 219 00:12:20,800 --> 00:12:23,360 Speaker 1: on the phone. He had just got into some trouble 220 00:12:23,400 --> 00:12:26,600 Speaker 1: with his girlfriend and he's like gosh, hushing me and 221 00:12:26,600 --> 00:12:29,959 Speaker 1: I'm like, look, I'll come back. They're shutting down the 222 00:12:30,000 --> 00:12:32,960 Speaker 1: black music department. Kip Mill fires me. So when I 223 00:12:33,000 --> 00:12:35,160 Speaker 1: come back in my office, this guy is sitting there, 224 00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:38,120 Speaker 1: there's no remix to give him. I said, I just 225 00:12:38,160 --> 00:12:41,200 Speaker 1: got fired. He goes, well, my girlfriend just broke up 226 00:12:41,200 --> 00:12:44,320 Speaker 1: with me. I said, well, what are you gonna do? 227 00:12:44,640 --> 00:12:46,800 Speaker 1: He goes, why don't you manage me? And I managed 228 00:12:46,880 --> 00:12:49,600 Speaker 1: him and we went on a run. The track Masses 229 00:12:49,640 --> 00:12:53,199 Speaker 1: we produced, I Ruled the world that whole, first NAS 230 00:12:53,240 --> 00:12:58,160 Speaker 1: album discovered, Foxy Brown made Hello, Cool Jay's Big Jobum 231 00:12:58,200 --> 00:13:01,120 Speaker 1: marriage he Blige album. We went on a run for 232 00:13:01,160 --> 00:13:04,360 Speaker 1: like five years, Candy Rain for Soul for Real. We 233 00:13:04,400 --> 00:13:07,680 Speaker 1: went on a run making records and that ended up 234 00:13:07,720 --> 00:13:12,440 Speaker 1: becoming my my thing, managing producers. I literally got five 235 00:13:12,520 --> 00:13:15,040 Speaker 1: went back to the office, and my career was sitting 236 00:13:15,080 --> 00:13:19,079 Speaker 1: in the room. Your future was there sitting in the room. 237 00:13:19,120 --> 00:13:22,360 Speaker 1: So how did you rejoin a major record company? What 238 00:13:22,440 --> 00:13:25,280 Speaker 1: was that appeal? You go back to Sony Senior VP 239 00:13:25,360 --> 00:13:29,000 Speaker 1: of A and R President of Urban Music. Well, what 240 00:13:29,120 --> 00:13:33,120 Speaker 1: happened was NAS takes off. The guys at Columbia know 241 00:13:33,240 --> 00:13:36,839 Speaker 1: nothing about black music. They could sit around and they 242 00:13:36,840 --> 00:13:38,960 Speaker 1: act like they have great ads by closing their eyes 243 00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:41,000 Speaker 1: and you know when the song plays, like as if 244 00:13:41,000 --> 00:13:44,640 Speaker 1: they're doing something. You've met guys who do that. They 245 00:13:45,120 --> 00:13:47,560 Speaker 1: they closed their eyes. They're like, oh my god, you're 246 00:13:47,559 --> 00:13:51,440 Speaker 1: not climb Davis. Just don't close your eyes. So they're 247 00:13:51,440 --> 00:13:53,880 Speaker 1: sitting there closing their eyes and ship, we want you 248 00:13:53,960 --> 00:13:56,640 Speaker 1: to come on and do this at Columbia, and I'm 249 00:13:56,679 --> 00:14:01,400 Speaker 1: like nah. They offered me some money and I remember 250 00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:04,679 Speaker 1: looking at the guy's face like, Yo, you crazy. I'm 251 00:14:04,679 --> 00:14:08,280 Speaker 1: not doing that. And then Mariah wanted to work with 252 00:14:08,320 --> 00:14:11,800 Speaker 1: the producer's Mariah Carry And Mariah was really running black 253 00:14:11,880 --> 00:14:15,120 Speaker 1: music at Columbia. She knew everything. She could close her 254 00:14:15,120 --> 00:14:16,760 Speaker 1: eyes because she knew exactly what the fun she was 255 00:14:16,760 --> 00:14:19,920 Speaker 1: listening to. She said, I want to work with those 256 00:14:19,920 --> 00:14:22,960 Speaker 1: talented guys, and because I managed them, Matola wanted to 257 00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:24,600 Speaker 1: sit down with me. Her husband Tommy, he was the 258 00:14:24,640 --> 00:14:27,800 Speaker 1: CEO Sony at the time. And when I sat down 259 00:14:27,800 --> 00:14:30,400 Speaker 1: with Tommy, he was looking at the guy who ran 260 00:14:30,520 --> 00:14:33,960 Speaker 1: Epic and the guy who ran Columbia and said, they 261 00:14:34,000 --> 00:14:36,360 Speaker 1: don't know what the funk they're doing. Those guys are 262 00:14:36,360 --> 00:14:39,920 Speaker 1: trying to work Freddie Jackson. No disrespect to Freddie Jackson, 263 00:14:39,960 --> 00:14:42,200 Speaker 1: but R and B music was sort of on its 264 00:14:42,240 --> 00:14:44,960 Speaker 1: way out, and he needed the next guy, and he 265 00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:47,720 Speaker 1: gave me a job overseeing both of his things. Meanwhile, 266 00:14:47,760 --> 00:14:50,400 Speaker 1: these guys are older guys, and they're like they weren't 267 00:14:50,400 --> 00:14:53,440 Speaker 1: mentors of mine. But I certainly felt weird acting like 268 00:14:53,480 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 1: that I was their boss. But they certainly couldn't sign 269 00:14:55,720 --> 00:14:58,840 Speaker 1: anything and make any real decisions unless I got a 270 00:14:58,920 --> 00:15:01,440 Speaker 1: chance to see whether they knew it or didn't know it. 271 00:15:01,520 --> 00:15:05,200 Speaker 1: How old were you? Then this must have been wildly 272 00:15:05,200 --> 00:15:08,280 Speaker 1: heavy stuff. It gets wilder. Okay, let's give it to me. 273 00:15:08,320 --> 00:15:12,480 Speaker 1: Let's get wilder. So I started doing that worker at Mariah. 274 00:15:12,560 --> 00:15:16,120 Speaker 1: It's fantastic, she takes off. I'm gonna give Mariah Carey 275 00:15:16,160 --> 00:15:19,560 Speaker 1: credit right here. Nobody wanted old dirty Bassett on the 276 00:15:19,600 --> 00:15:23,240 Speaker 1: Fantasy remix at Sonny. They didn't even understand that that 277 00:15:23,320 --> 00:15:28,120 Speaker 1: was Mariah Carrie's decision, and she put everything on the 278 00:15:28,120 --> 00:15:30,680 Speaker 1: line to make that call. She had everything to lose. 279 00:15:30,840 --> 00:15:34,920 Speaker 1: She didn't need that audience. She didn't need a rap audience. 280 00:15:35,120 --> 00:15:38,120 Speaker 1: People do it now because they need it. Madonna does 281 00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:40,440 Speaker 1: a song with the guy from Ray Shermerd because she 282 00:15:40,560 --> 00:15:43,880 Speaker 1: needs that. When Mariah Carrey was doing that, she didn't 283 00:15:43,880 --> 00:15:45,800 Speaker 1: need that ship at all. She was doing it because 284 00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:48,400 Speaker 1: she knew that ship was fresh. She put that format 285 00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:52,000 Speaker 1: in play, and she risked it all. Her husband didn't 286 00:15:52,000 --> 00:15:54,640 Speaker 1: want it, her label head didn't want it. She did that. 287 00:15:54,960 --> 00:15:58,160 Speaker 1: She brought black music to Columbia and a lot of 288 00:15:58,160 --> 00:16:00,520 Speaker 1: people came there because they wanted to be around that 289 00:16:00,640 --> 00:16:04,920 Speaker 1: orbit that she had. For sure. I sat there, I 290 00:16:04,960 --> 00:16:07,920 Speaker 1: did it for a while. Everything was cool for a minute, 291 00:16:08,400 --> 00:16:11,720 Speaker 1: and then Jimmy Ivan came and he wanted me. How 292 00:16:11,720 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 1: did Jimmy know about you? What was your relationship? Okay, 293 00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:16,560 Speaker 1: so here goes that one. There's a guy named John McClain, 294 00:16:16,960 --> 00:16:19,680 Speaker 1: very famous at Ain't M Records. He was at Interscope 295 00:16:19,760 --> 00:16:22,560 Speaker 1: early when they started it. He also made Janet Jackson's 296 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:24,320 Speaker 1: albums when she was at Ain't M. He Hi, Jimmy, 297 00:16:24,400 --> 00:16:26,840 Speaker 1: Jim Terry Loose. I don't know who your audience is listening, 298 00:16:26,880 --> 00:16:29,640 Speaker 1: but they're gonna get full musicology. That's what we want. 299 00:16:30,280 --> 00:16:34,640 Speaker 1: John brings me out to meet with him because he 300 00:16:34,680 --> 00:16:38,560 Speaker 1: wants opproducers to produce records for Interscope. I go out 301 00:16:38,600 --> 00:16:42,040 Speaker 1: there to three days go by No John McClaine, and 302 00:16:42,040 --> 00:16:43,920 Speaker 1: they have me stay at the Lowe's in Santa Monica. 303 00:16:44,440 --> 00:16:46,760 Speaker 1: Day one, it's like, okay, cool mangan on the three 304 00:16:46,840 --> 00:16:51,000 Speaker 1: day free hotel or whatever. Day three, it's like, what 305 00:16:51,040 --> 00:16:55,480 Speaker 1: the funk is this? John's assistant calls Jimmy and says, 306 00:16:55,520 --> 00:16:58,000 Speaker 1: to Jimmy, John has some guys sitting in a hotel 307 00:16:58,040 --> 00:17:01,560 Speaker 1: for three days. So I go sit down with Jimmy 308 00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:04,320 Speaker 1: and we started talking about music. Within a week, Jimmy, 309 00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:08,040 Speaker 1: it offers me John John. That's how it happened. That's 310 00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:12,199 Speaker 1: how it happened. No regrets leaving Sony. No. When I 311 00:17:12,280 --> 00:17:14,280 Speaker 1: listened to this. So I had one year left on 312 00:17:14,320 --> 00:17:17,520 Speaker 1: my Sony deal, and Jimmy signs me a year out. 313 00:17:18,320 --> 00:17:21,280 Speaker 1: The first year is a consultant, but I'm already signed 314 00:17:21,320 --> 00:17:23,520 Speaker 1: for the next four years beyond that consultant. It's like 315 00:17:23,560 --> 00:17:26,080 Speaker 1: the NETS deal with Kevin Durant. They know the year out, 316 00:17:26,119 --> 00:17:28,640 Speaker 1: but they got the next three years. So my year out, 317 00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:32,399 Speaker 1: I met Sony knowing I'm going right to interscope. I 318 00:17:32,560 --> 00:17:35,680 Speaker 1: do one or two things that interscope. One of the 319 00:17:35,720 --> 00:17:37,960 Speaker 1: things I had to do was relocate the New York office, 320 00:17:38,359 --> 00:17:41,960 Speaker 1: so I put their office right near Sony, so I'd 321 00:17:42,000 --> 00:17:48,720 Speaker 1: run back and forth between Sony and Interscope Sony to know. 322 00:17:50,520 --> 00:17:55,720 Speaker 1: Sony had no idea. I would run from street to 323 00:17:55,840 --> 00:17:58,919 Speaker 1: fifty seven Street for meetings that first year all the 324 00:17:58,960 --> 00:18:02,080 Speaker 1: time because I was setting up my entire office over that. 325 00:18:02,240 --> 00:18:07,879 Speaker 1: It is crazy, I was, you show up at dinner Scope, 326 00:18:08,080 --> 00:18:12,520 Speaker 1: You've got amazing artist d MX and ri Ku Dr Dre. 327 00:18:14,200 --> 00:18:17,280 Speaker 1: When I got to Interscope, my job was to get 328 00:18:17,359 --> 00:18:19,520 Speaker 1: rid of all the things that wasn't working. So tell 329 00:18:19,520 --> 00:18:22,880 Speaker 1: me what wasn't working. Dr Dre and death Row had 330 00:18:22,880 --> 00:18:27,240 Speaker 1: broken up, so Dr Dre was building Aftermath. He hadn't 331 00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:29,680 Speaker 1: yet signed Himinem and the first project he did was 332 00:18:29,720 --> 00:18:32,520 Speaker 1: a project that I put together called The Firm. It's 333 00:18:32,560 --> 00:18:34,800 Speaker 1: old a million records. It should have been bigger because 334 00:18:34,800 --> 00:18:39,200 Speaker 1: it was a supergroup, but it definitely gave him his start, 335 00:18:39,200 --> 00:18:43,040 Speaker 1: and he's always been grateful with me. But sure, what 336 00:18:43,119 --> 00:18:45,639 Speaker 1: was your vision for it? I didn't really have a 337 00:18:45,760 --> 00:18:48,399 Speaker 1: vision for it. That would be unfair for me to 338 00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:51,040 Speaker 1: say that. I just knew that. Being around Jimmy, I 339 00:18:51,119 --> 00:18:53,159 Speaker 1: learned a lot. But the thing I brought that that 340 00:18:53,320 --> 00:18:56,359 Speaker 1: was important was he wouldn't want what was happening in 341 00:18:56,400 --> 00:18:58,959 Speaker 1: New York. So I brought over a group, the Rough Riders, 342 00:18:59,320 --> 00:19:02,680 Speaker 1: and that brought a Swiss and a bunch of artists 343 00:19:03,119 --> 00:19:05,399 Speaker 1: that was important at that time, and that was a 344 00:19:05,440 --> 00:19:07,879 Speaker 1: big deal for us. That was a big deal that 345 00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:09,879 Speaker 1: mattered a lot. And then I went with Jimmy to 346 00:19:09,920 --> 00:19:13,440 Speaker 1: go sign Enrique Iglesias. Ricky Martin had just taken off 347 00:19:13,440 --> 00:19:16,520 Speaker 1: and we wanted to get into the Latin game, and 348 00:19:16,640 --> 00:19:19,760 Speaker 1: Enrique had just got out of his deal and Edgar 349 00:19:19,800 --> 00:19:22,840 Speaker 1: Brafman owned Universal at the time, and he really wanted 350 00:19:22,960 --> 00:19:26,720 Speaker 1: that artist. Basically said we want to pay forty million 351 00:19:26,720 --> 00:19:28,840 Speaker 1: dollars for it was like that kind of money. And 352 00:19:28,880 --> 00:19:31,840 Speaker 1: I remember I was the guy running around trying to 353 00:19:31,920 --> 00:19:34,040 Speaker 1: entertain him better than everybody else. I brought him out 354 00:19:34,040 --> 00:19:36,480 Speaker 1: to the things, you know, took him to different places 355 00:19:36,560 --> 00:19:39,440 Speaker 1: or whatever. Anyhow, we ended up signing them. The first 356 00:19:39,480 --> 00:19:42,040 Speaker 1: record we broke was actually on the Wild Wild West soundtrack, 357 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:45,760 Speaker 1: was a song called Bala Moss. So let's go to movies. 358 00:19:46,280 --> 00:19:48,800 Speaker 1: You get in the movies about this time, Wild Wild West, 359 00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:51,480 Speaker 1: Men Black? Yes, I did Men in Black at Sony. 360 00:19:52,000 --> 00:19:55,640 Speaker 1: And what happened was I just knew that back then 361 00:19:56,240 --> 00:20:00,240 Speaker 1: movie soundtracks had big recording budgets because they would part 362 00:20:00,240 --> 00:20:02,760 Speaker 1: of the p and A. They basically put two or 363 00:20:02,760 --> 00:20:05,920 Speaker 1: three million dollars towards marketing the movie, towards the soundtrack. 364 00:20:06,119 --> 00:20:08,320 Speaker 1: So if you were the record company who got that soundtrack, 365 00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:11,960 Speaker 1: you would essentially get marketing money from the movie company 366 00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:14,920 Speaker 1: that was unrecoupable. So it was great marketing. And back 367 00:20:14,960 --> 00:20:17,200 Speaker 1: then people would buy ship. I mean people put the 368 00:20:17,280 --> 00:20:19,560 Speaker 1: dows and creeks out. I mean I had a big 369 00:20:19,600 --> 00:20:22,240 Speaker 1: hit on it. People would buy anything, so men in 370 00:20:22,280 --> 00:20:25,160 Speaker 1: black sold and I was in the Will Smith business. 371 00:20:25,200 --> 00:20:28,000 Speaker 1: So when I went to Interscope, I said, let's do 372 00:20:28,119 --> 00:20:30,400 Speaker 1: Wah wah west over in the Scope. And the first 373 00:20:30,400 --> 00:20:34,280 Speaker 1: song we did was Bollamos and it was huge, huge, 374 00:20:34,520 --> 00:20:37,320 Speaker 1: And then right after that was will Smith wa while 375 00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:39,480 Speaker 1: West and they both came out around the same time. 376 00:20:39,520 --> 00:20:42,040 Speaker 1: And that was another big mark in my career because 377 00:20:42,040 --> 00:20:44,240 Speaker 1: I did it and I got credit for doing it. 378 00:20:45,119 --> 00:20:47,560 Speaker 1: Just hold on a second, because we've got so much 379 00:20:47,600 --> 00:20:50,119 Speaker 1: more to talk about. We'll be back after a quick break. 380 00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:57,200 Speaker 1: Welcome back to Math and Magic. We're here with Steve Stout. 381 00:20:58,960 --> 00:21:04,320 Speaker 1: You had this incredible career in music at sort of 382 00:21:04,320 --> 00:21:07,840 Speaker 1: this moment that music was going through a major change. 383 00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:10,080 Speaker 1: You were one of the leaders of that change, and 384 00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:13,639 Speaker 1: then you jumped advertising. You start this agency with Peter Arnell, 385 00:21:13,800 --> 00:21:18,400 Speaker 1: legendary person. What did you think advertising needed that you 386 00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:21,160 Speaker 1: had the record business didn't know that difference been good 387 00:21:21,160 --> 00:21:23,800 Speaker 1: and greet at that time. There were guys who I 388 00:21:23,880 --> 00:21:26,640 Speaker 1: felt that weren't my equivalent and talent making the same 389 00:21:26,640 --> 00:21:29,280 Speaker 1: amount of money I was making. That didn't bother me 390 00:21:29,359 --> 00:21:31,919 Speaker 1: so much, but it made me feel like I actually 391 00:21:31,920 --> 00:21:34,760 Speaker 1: went through depression. I think, because I'm like, what is this? 392 00:21:34,920 --> 00:21:39,760 Speaker 1: If this is about paying some black executive who can 393 00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:42,399 Speaker 1: speak to guys on the street and speak to the 394 00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:45,480 Speaker 1: white guys that corporate and gather as much hip hop, 395 00:21:45,480 --> 00:21:48,760 Speaker 1: ACTX and R and b X as possible and everybody 396 00:21:48,760 --> 00:21:50,920 Speaker 1: gets paid two million dollars to do that, then I 397 00:21:50,920 --> 00:21:53,080 Speaker 1: don't want to do that. And that's just how I am. 398 00:21:53,280 --> 00:21:56,320 Speaker 1: I learned that from my dad. The principles didn't add 399 00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:58,760 Speaker 1: up to me, and it was all about the principle 400 00:21:58,800 --> 00:22:00,679 Speaker 1: was too many dolls a lot of money, but I 401 00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:04,720 Speaker 1: couldn't make it make sense. So why advertising? Because after 402 00:22:04,760 --> 00:22:07,240 Speaker 1: Will Smith put out Men in Black and sold all 403 00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:11,520 Speaker 1: those albums and ultimately sold all those glasses, and it 404 00:22:11,560 --> 00:22:13,280 Speaker 1: was the guy who did the product placement for Ray 405 00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:16,399 Speaker 1: Band with the glasses. So I met somebody who said, 406 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:19,439 Speaker 1: that's good that you're making money selling the music, but 407 00:22:19,560 --> 00:22:22,080 Speaker 1: you can actually be entrepreneurial and sell the things around 408 00:22:22,080 --> 00:22:25,520 Speaker 1: the music. Who are your clients? Have? Pass was one 409 00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:28,680 Speaker 1: I did, reboking McDonald's. So my big thing was I'm 410 00:22:28,680 --> 00:22:32,800 Speaker 1: loving it for McDonald's and rebok the jay Z sneaker, 411 00:22:32,920 --> 00:22:36,399 Speaker 1: the fifty cents sneaker, the Farrell sneaker, and how do 412 00:22:36,440 --> 00:22:39,600 Speaker 1: you converge hip hop and sport and put that together? 413 00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:45,040 Speaker 1: So you guys sold pass Omnicom two million or so 414 00:22:45,240 --> 00:22:47,560 Speaker 1: was supported number. Why did you sell it? I mean, 415 00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:50,840 Speaker 1: you guys were on fire. I was thirty two years old. 416 00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:54,480 Speaker 1: I made a bowload of money. Maybe that's the reason 417 00:22:55,320 --> 00:22:56,760 Speaker 1: I didn't have to worry about money again for the 418 00:22:56,800 --> 00:22:59,320 Speaker 1: rest of my life. That was how I thought about it. 419 00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:03,920 Speaker 1: So you jumped into advertising. You have this immediate success, 420 00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:07,720 Speaker 1: You monetize it very quickly, putting inside the money and 421 00:23:07,840 --> 00:23:11,600 Speaker 1: the interesting stuff. Why did you learn about advertising on 422 00:23:11,680 --> 00:23:15,680 Speaker 1: this first foray into it? The Emperor was but as 423 00:23:15,760 --> 00:23:18,760 Speaker 1: naked that all these guys running around didn't know ship 424 00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:22,879 Speaker 1: about anything. I'd listened to you see TV commercials that 425 00:23:23,040 --> 00:23:26,480 Speaker 1: had fake rap music in the background and casting was 426 00:23:26,560 --> 00:23:30,720 Speaker 1: really bad, like four white guys and one ambiguous black guy. 427 00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:33,359 Speaker 1: It was supposed to be friends. And I was sitting 428 00:23:33,359 --> 00:23:36,920 Speaker 1: there there going this is all wrong. This stuff isn't 429 00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:41,840 Speaker 1: really good, But nobody that can make it good has 430 00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:43,879 Speaker 1: a seat at the table. Why didn't they have a 431 00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:48,320 Speaker 1: seat at the table? Segmentation There was an older generation 432 00:23:48,320 --> 00:23:51,719 Speaker 1: of African Americans that were doing African American creative agencies. 433 00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:55,040 Speaker 1: They were incentivized to do stereotypical African American work, so 434 00:23:55,080 --> 00:23:58,200 Speaker 1: it'd be like a car driving get the New christ 435 00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:01,920 Speaker 1: Love blah blah blaw. You could hang with your homies 436 00:24:02,200 --> 00:24:06,760 Speaker 1: some stupid ass ship that's not real, and they would 437 00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:08,680 Speaker 1: do that because that's what the companies would buy, because 438 00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:14,359 Speaker 1: that's what they thought was what African Americans wanted. And 439 00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:17,639 Speaker 1: I'm like, that's not it. I'm gonna take everything I 440 00:24:17,720 --> 00:24:20,520 Speaker 1: learned from the music business and bring it to advertising. 441 00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:23,720 Speaker 1: And that's why I called the company Translation, because I 442 00:24:23,760 --> 00:24:26,359 Speaker 1: was gonna translate the values of what I've seen in 443 00:24:26,440 --> 00:24:29,880 Speaker 1: culture the fortune companies. How did you build the agency? 444 00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:35,080 Speaker 1: You're really starting this when that's this is me and 445 00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:39,520 Speaker 1: a desk and two assistance in an office at a 446 00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:44,399 Speaker 1: fish tank. When I left Universal, Jimmy and Doug Morris, 447 00:24:44,720 --> 00:24:47,480 Speaker 1: they took a percentage of the business. It was a 448 00:24:47,480 --> 00:24:50,160 Speaker 1: small percentage, and they gave me, I think, like two 449 00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:52,679 Speaker 1: years of I could stay in there and do it. 450 00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:56,200 Speaker 1: So I had this tank, two desks to assistance, and 451 00:24:56,600 --> 00:24:59,560 Speaker 1: me and I went and got busy. My first early 452 00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:02,359 Speaker 1: clients was Hewlett Packard, which was fantastic. How did you 453 00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:06,160 Speaker 1: get Hewlett Packard? This is an unlikely company you would expect. 454 00:25:06,320 --> 00:25:09,000 Speaker 1: McDonald's came to me first because McDonald's I'm loving it. 455 00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:12,280 Speaker 1: I did at Arnell Group. So when I left, McDonald's 456 00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:15,240 Speaker 1: said we're retaining you immediately. Don't worry about it. You're good. 457 00:25:15,720 --> 00:25:19,199 Speaker 1: Inter Scope was a lead generator for me. That's how 458 00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:21,440 Speaker 1: I used them. I used them as a lead generator, 459 00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:23,400 Speaker 1: so if I need any production done, I'd use them. 460 00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:26,600 Speaker 1: But like if somebody called them and said could we 461 00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:30,240 Speaker 1: put blah blah blah in an ad, they'd say you 462 00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:34,160 Speaker 1: should look at this company translation and that Jimmy would 463 00:25:34,160 --> 00:25:36,719 Speaker 1: do that, or Jimmy's company would do that. Steve Burman, 464 00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:40,960 Speaker 1: So they called Calie Fierina wanted to do something with 465 00:25:41,080 --> 00:25:43,680 Speaker 1: music and it was cool. They let me into the meeting. 466 00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:46,760 Speaker 1: They had just did a deal. Steve Jobs did one 467 00:25:46,800 --> 00:25:50,560 Speaker 1: of his Steve Jobs like deals to them. HP made 468 00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:54,320 Speaker 1: their own version of the iPod, which looked exactly like 469 00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:57,560 Speaker 1: the iPod. He just basically got them to distribute the iPod. 470 00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:00,959 Speaker 1: He got a little logo that was really small somewhere 471 00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:04,680 Speaker 1: in the back. They couldn't do anything so that you'd 472 00:26:04,720 --> 00:26:08,080 Speaker 1: go buy it. With Steve Jobs when it was the iPod, 473 00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:10,240 Speaker 1: they have distribution, and he didn't want to build a 474 00:26:10,240 --> 00:26:14,080 Speaker 1: distribution team, so he used HPS distribution to give them 475 00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:16,480 Speaker 1: the HP version of the iPod. They may have made 476 00:26:16,480 --> 00:26:18,320 Speaker 1: a dollar margin on it, but it was then being 477 00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:23,240 Speaker 1: cool and he got distribution in Circuit City and Best 478 00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:27,479 Speaker 1: Buy and everything because HP had the sales team. So 479 00:26:27,520 --> 00:26:29,000 Speaker 1: I said, we call it for your Ina and her 480 00:26:29,040 --> 00:26:30,879 Speaker 1: ade agency at the time, and I said call it 481 00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:34,920 Speaker 1: when you unveil this, What are you gonna unvail? Everybody's 482 00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:38,520 Speaker 1: selling them ads. No one thought about the core problem 483 00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:41,000 Speaker 1: and said what we're gonna do. We're gonna use your 484 00:26:41,040 --> 00:26:44,760 Speaker 1: printing business and we're gonna make customizable tattoos so that 485 00:26:44,840 --> 00:26:47,199 Speaker 1: people can customize their iPods. We're gonna go back to 486 00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:49,720 Speaker 1: interscope and we're gonna get all of the artists on 487 00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:52,720 Speaker 1: Interscope to give us their image and likeness so that 488 00:26:52,760 --> 00:26:56,199 Speaker 1: we can actually make these tattoos. So HP did the 489 00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:59,920 Speaker 1: iPod deal, not to sell iPods, but to sell printing 490 00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:04,280 Speaker 1: ink and these sheets. One of my best ideas didn't 491 00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:07,000 Speaker 1: catch fire, but it caught fire enough to put me 492 00:27:07,040 --> 00:27:09,040 Speaker 1: on a fast track to help being Gorow my company. 493 00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:10,360 Speaker 1: And by the way, it was one of those things 494 00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:12,359 Speaker 1: that you know, it came like this. I looked at it. 495 00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:14,760 Speaker 1: I'm like, nobody has an answer. But if you take 496 00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:17,680 Speaker 1: this thing back to printing, which is where they made 497 00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:21,320 Speaker 1: their profits, they did this lost leader deal in order 498 00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:23,600 Speaker 1: to go back, but no one had that idea and 499 00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:26,199 Speaker 1: what to print. I went to deals with the n 500 00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:29,720 Speaker 1: b A Major League Baseball in his scope. I still 501 00:27:29,760 --> 00:27:32,359 Speaker 1: have this stuff and it won like Time magazine idea, 502 00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:35,240 Speaker 1: you know, one of top ten ideas, these printable skins. 503 00:27:35,280 --> 00:27:38,560 Speaker 1: They called them skins. It was two thousand four five. 504 00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:43,560 Speaker 1: So you've done this remarkable job. You launched Translation now 505 00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:47,080 Speaker 1: your own agency. Two thousand eleven, you release a book, 506 00:27:47,440 --> 00:27:50,080 Speaker 1: The Tanning of America, How hip hop created a culture 507 00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:53,080 Speaker 1: that rewrote the rules of the new Economy two thousand 508 00:27:53,119 --> 00:27:55,960 Speaker 1: foh one makes a four part documentary out of it, 509 00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:58,680 Speaker 1: The Tanning of America, One Nation under hip Hop? What 510 00:27:58,760 --> 00:28:01,439 Speaker 1: was the big insight here? Is this about segmentation or 511 00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:05,800 Speaker 1: is this about beyond? What happened was the world started 512 00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:08,520 Speaker 1: to see it at this time. There was this day 513 00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:11,320 Speaker 1: when they would look at a black kid wearing tight 514 00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:13,959 Speaker 1: jeans and a skateboard and he was looked at like 515 00:28:13,960 --> 00:28:16,320 Speaker 1: he was a sellout. He's listening to rock music, forget it. 516 00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:20,320 Speaker 1: And there was his white kid and greenwage. I just 517 00:28:20,359 --> 00:28:22,679 Speaker 1: think a Tommy, He'll figure his son where in his 518 00:28:22,720 --> 00:28:26,920 Speaker 1: hat backwards, a Yankee hat backwards, baggy pants, and people 519 00:28:26,920 --> 00:28:30,800 Speaker 1: would call him a wigger, terrible words, and I'm like, 520 00:28:31,040 --> 00:28:36,199 Speaker 1: they're not that, you idiot. They grew up listening to 521 00:28:36,320 --> 00:28:39,200 Speaker 1: hip hop music. They grew up with these worlds collided. 522 00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:43,000 Speaker 1: Fred Durst is not a wigger. Fred Durst grew up 523 00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:45,920 Speaker 1: listening to Run DMC. Were you talking about You guys 524 00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:48,480 Speaker 1: are wrong. You guys don't know what you're talking about. 525 00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:51,280 Speaker 1: You're sitting back growing up with a Bruce and Bob 526 00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:55,320 Speaker 1: Dylan and a lot judging these kids. These kids grew 527 00:28:55,400 --> 00:28:58,680 Speaker 1: up listening to different music, music drives cultures. My point, 528 00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:00,960 Speaker 1: they're sitting there saying only things about these kids, and 529 00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:03,800 Speaker 1: I wanted to write a book that not only stopped 530 00:29:03,800 --> 00:29:06,560 Speaker 1: them from shaming it, but I wanted to put a 531 00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:10,120 Speaker 1: flag in the ground that the world has changed, and 532 00:29:10,160 --> 00:29:13,680 Speaker 1: that segmentation is over. The cover of a book is 533 00:29:14,200 --> 00:29:18,200 Speaker 1: the Census Bureau form, and every box is checked. One 534 00:29:18,200 --> 00:29:20,320 Speaker 1: of the greatest things I learned on that journey of 535 00:29:20,360 --> 00:29:23,320 Speaker 1: writing that book and doing the documentary was I actually 536 00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:27,560 Speaker 1: went to the U. S. Census Bureau and I got 537 00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:29,240 Speaker 1: a meeting with a guy who ran it. His name 538 00:29:29,280 --> 00:29:32,080 Speaker 1: is Steve Jos and I walk in. I'm like, Steve, 539 00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:35,040 Speaker 1: I'm writing a book called at Taining of America and 540 00:29:35,360 --> 00:29:37,800 Speaker 1: just that in the third and he's he's like a 541 00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:40,480 Speaker 1: forty five year old white guy at time says, I 542 00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:42,360 Speaker 1: know everything you're talking about. I said, why, he goes, 543 00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:45,120 Speaker 1: My daughter is twenty seven years old getting married next 544 00:29:45,120 --> 00:29:47,800 Speaker 1: week to an African American. I can tell you everything 545 00:29:47,840 --> 00:29:51,800 Speaker 1: about this. We sat down and we became great, great friends. 546 00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:56,520 Speaker 1: The U. S. Census Bureau wants this information to be shared, 547 00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:02,040 Speaker 1: so Steve with go with me to go visit clients, 548 00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:05,280 Speaker 1: and the government would pay for it. And I do 549 00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:10,120 Speaker 1: my spiel to a client about my company and translation 550 00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:14,000 Speaker 1: and changing demography, and then I'd break out the guy 551 00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:17,440 Speaker 1: who runs a census bureau to back me up. And 552 00:30:17,480 --> 00:30:20,000 Speaker 1: the government was paying for this. They didn't take a 553 00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:22,719 Speaker 1: piece of your business, did they. No, they didn't take 554 00:30:22,720 --> 00:30:25,320 Speaker 1: piece of my business. I mean he pitched butter Wiser, 555 00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:28,320 Speaker 1: he pitched state Farm. State Farm changed how they were 556 00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:31,800 Speaker 1: zoning rentals. They had it all wrong. That's amazing. And 557 00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:35,960 Speaker 1: this was really early in this data science. Nobody called 558 00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:41,480 Speaker 1: it anything. It was called obvious. When we talk about 559 00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:44,000 Speaker 1: math and magic, one of the hot things today is 560 00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:47,160 Speaker 1: had him recognized. Recognition has always been at the key 561 00:30:47,200 --> 00:30:49,560 Speaker 1: of you. I don't even know how people don't have that. 562 00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:52,440 Speaker 1: It's the first thing I see. I can't even not 563 00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:55,240 Speaker 1: see that. So in spite of you being a creative guy, 564 00:30:55,520 --> 00:31:00,400 Speaker 1: you're also a bath mind. Until my daughter of time. 565 00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:04,520 Speaker 1: Math is life. If you understand math, and you understand 566 00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:07,520 Speaker 1: the logic that leads you to the process of how 567 00:31:07,560 --> 00:31:09,280 Speaker 1: you got to that answer, you could apply that to 568 00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:12,840 Speaker 1: anything in life. So you built a team in this 569 00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:16,360 Speaker 1: era to Literally one of your skill sets is building 570 00:31:16,480 --> 00:31:20,000 Speaker 1: a great team. How do you think about finding talent 571 00:31:20,120 --> 00:31:22,880 Speaker 1: to work with you and what's your core concept of 572 00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:26,520 Speaker 1: a team. I've been hit or miss on building a 573 00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:31,520 Speaker 1: great team. To be fair, I've been really strong at 574 00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:36,720 Speaker 1: finding people believe in the values I ranked that really high, 575 00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:41,600 Speaker 1: really high versus your actual skills set. Even when building 576 00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:44,920 Speaker 1: Translation at the beginning, I couldn't get typical advertising guys 577 00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:48,320 Speaker 1: from Gray or any of the advertising companies B B, 578 00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:50,720 Speaker 1: d O because they didn't understand I was selling a 579 00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:54,720 Speaker 1: different product. When I started Carol's dought, I couldn't just 580 00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:58,040 Speaker 1: hire people from the current beauty business selling a different product. 581 00:31:58,960 --> 00:32:03,400 Speaker 1: But United Masters is we're building this convergence of culture, 582 00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:08,120 Speaker 1: technology and storytelling. With this combined companies of Translation united 583 00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:11,160 Speaker 1: mass together. So I gotta find different people. People that 584 00:32:11,320 --> 00:32:14,120 Speaker 1: understand ad tech, people that understand a hot song on 585 00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:17,120 Speaker 1: the street, and people who understand how to write a 586 00:32:17,280 --> 00:32:20,840 Speaker 1: sixty second commercial, and they have to work together. They 587 00:32:20,840 --> 00:32:24,440 Speaker 1: have to work together. So convergence of these skill sets 588 00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:27,640 Speaker 1: only come together if you find people who believe in 589 00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:30,680 Speaker 1: it and have empathy. But also in the midst of 590 00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:32,960 Speaker 1: all this, I built a beauty business called Carl's Daughter, 591 00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:36,480 Speaker 1: a woman from Brooklyn who built a business selling it 592 00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:39,920 Speaker 1: out of our house, yet nobody would invest in her. 593 00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:43,680 Speaker 1: And you had African American women going to Sapphora but 594 00:32:43,760 --> 00:32:45,680 Speaker 1: had nothing to buy. They wanted to go in the 595 00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:48,800 Speaker 1: store because it's Saphora, it's hot, but yet there's nothing 596 00:32:48,840 --> 00:32:51,040 Speaker 1: that speaks to them. It's not a shade of foundation 597 00:32:51,080 --> 00:32:53,080 Speaker 1: that speaks to them, and it's not a fucking hair 598 00:32:53,120 --> 00:32:56,200 Speaker 1: product that can deal with their hair type. Nothing. But 599 00:32:56,280 --> 00:32:58,719 Speaker 1: yet they walk in the store to buy lip gloss 600 00:32:58,800 --> 00:33:00,440 Speaker 1: or something because they want to be seen with us 601 00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:04,200 Speaker 1: a far back. That bag, that ship hurts me. Part 602 00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:06,840 Speaker 1: of what I do as a business guy is connected 603 00:33:06,840 --> 00:33:11,680 Speaker 1: with a story that feels like an uphill battle that, 604 00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:15,960 Speaker 1: with money, effort, and time will persevere. Like my favorite 605 00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:18,440 Speaker 1: movie is Rocky, So I try to find Rocky in 606 00:33:18,600 --> 00:33:22,920 Speaker 1: every single fucking story I can find where's the Rocky? 607 00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:25,640 Speaker 1: And once I can find it, whether it be Carol's daughter, 608 00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:30,480 Speaker 1: or the advertising business or now artists with United Masses, 609 00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:33,400 Speaker 1: I wake up in the morning fighting that fight. I 610 00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:35,760 Speaker 1: want everybody to see it as clear as I see it, 611 00:33:36,040 --> 00:33:39,760 Speaker 1: that we can win this fight. It's gonna turn because 612 00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:42,600 Speaker 1: it doesn't make any sense. And things that don't make 613 00:33:42,640 --> 00:33:47,600 Speaker 1: any sense have an expiration day. So obviously we hear 614 00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:51,520 Speaker 1: love audio. But not only is radio stronger than ever podcasting. 615 00:33:51,560 --> 00:33:53,560 Speaker 1: What you're doing right now is taking the world by storm. 616 00:33:53,680 --> 00:33:57,200 Speaker 1: Smart speakers are the new home radio. Spotify as the 617 00:33:57,240 --> 00:34:01,560 Speaker 1: new Tower records. We've made this migration from physical to 618 00:34:01,680 --> 00:34:05,160 Speaker 1: downloads to streaming music. How do advertise or thing to 619 00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:09,000 Speaker 1: adjust their approach to being in sync with the consumer, who, 620 00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:12,200 Speaker 1: by the way, loves and embeds audio in their life 621 00:34:12,440 --> 00:34:16,440 Speaker 1: and artist social media is the new MTV and Spotify. 622 00:34:16,640 --> 00:34:19,080 Speaker 1: Apple Music is the new Tower Records, and radio is 623 00:34:19,080 --> 00:34:22,320 Speaker 1: the new radio. Radio is always, you know, the companion. 624 00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:25,200 Speaker 1: We think of ourselves, not at the music. We're your friends. 625 00:34:25,360 --> 00:34:28,480 Speaker 1: Radio is always driven by the personalities that it created, 626 00:34:28,360 --> 00:34:32,840 Speaker 1: and create great personalities. You've got great radio. The truth 627 00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:35,160 Speaker 1: of the matter is I talked about this with retail. 628 00:34:35,560 --> 00:34:38,840 Speaker 1: In the beginning, you go in e commerce, you would see, 629 00:34:39,120 --> 00:34:41,640 Speaker 1: you know, a picture and then you know, you buy it, 630 00:34:41,680 --> 00:34:43,400 Speaker 1: and it was clunky, it didn't work, And all of 631 00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:46,560 Speaker 1: a sudden they started getting better, like zoom in, zoom 632 00:34:46,600 --> 00:34:49,320 Speaker 1: out turning that got modeled to the side turned it 633 00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:52,480 Speaker 1: to the left. Then uh Netaport they came out and 634 00:34:52,520 --> 00:34:54,920 Speaker 1: they put editorial, you don't have to all wear one thing. 635 00:34:54,920 --> 00:34:57,120 Speaker 1: It'd be you know, this topic from one brand, this 636 00:34:57,160 --> 00:34:59,640 Speaker 1: is from another brand, and it'd be some editorial about it. 637 00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:02,960 Speaker 1: And that became a better shopping experience. And then all 638 00:35:03,000 --> 00:35:08,560 Speaker 1: of a sudden it's stopped right there. That's it. It's optimized. 639 00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:12,879 Speaker 1: E commerce really hasn't moved from that. You go down 640 00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:16,319 Speaker 1: to all these store fronts and everybody's worried about what's 641 00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:21,400 Speaker 1: happening on e commerce. These windows nobody's doing anything, like 642 00:35:21,520 --> 00:35:25,000 Speaker 1: no innovation in the windows. And you have this physical location, 643 00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:29,359 Speaker 1: you got glass this big, with all this technology, Why 644 00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:32,120 Speaker 1: aren't you doing anything? Why isn't the glass and Instagram screen? 645 00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:36,440 Speaker 1: The same thing happened to radio. The advertising guys aren't 646 00:35:36,520 --> 00:35:39,080 Speaker 1: being creative with the format. Some of the work I've 647 00:35:39,080 --> 00:35:43,960 Speaker 1: done in radio. You well, one of the things I 648 00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:48,759 Speaker 1: did when Interscope launched, they wouldn't play dr Drains Dugan radio. 649 00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:53,640 Speaker 1: They would not play. So what Jimmy did was Steve Berman. 650 00:35:53,960 --> 00:35:57,960 Speaker 1: They went and bought the last commercial spot in a 651 00:35:58,040 --> 00:36:03,680 Speaker 1: pod and did not say anything but played sixty seconds 652 00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:07,400 Speaker 1: of the song nothing but a g Thing Baby. People 653 00:36:07,480 --> 00:36:09,200 Speaker 1: thought that was the song. They didn't know it was 654 00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:13,040 Speaker 1: a commercial, and that's how the song took off. I 655 00:36:13,120 --> 00:36:16,400 Speaker 1: went to Bill Wrigley Jr. And pitched him an idea. 656 00:36:17,000 --> 00:36:21,200 Speaker 1: We were gonna remake the double Mint jingle. We remade 657 00:36:21,200 --> 00:36:23,879 Speaker 1: the double Mint jingle. This is the best work done 658 00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:25,919 Speaker 1: in radio. I could played his ship for you, blow 659 00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:29,920 Speaker 1: your mind. I made the song call Forever Chris Brown 660 00:36:29,960 --> 00:36:32,840 Speaker 1: Forever and he says, wr pleasure do wr fund in 661 00:36:32,880 --> 00:36:35,960 Speaker 1: the song. We rewrote the double Mint jingle using that 662 00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:39,040 Speaker 1: same Forever melody, and then I did the exact same thing. 663 00:36:39,120 --> 00:36:42,800 Speaker 1: I brought sixty seconds, let it play like it was forever. 664 00:36:43,280 --> 00:36:46,280 Speaker 1: So when the song played, it all sounded like forever, 665 00:36:46,360 --> 00:36:49,600 Speaker 1: and then it changed into the double Mint jingle. The 666 00:36:49,640 --> 00:36:53,080 Speaker 1: song went number one, the song number one, and it 667 00:36:53,200 --> 00:36:57,360 Speaker 1: was a jingle that double Mint owned. Thinking about radio 668 00:36:58,080 --> 00:37:02,120 Speaker 1: and being colorful and artful with it and figuring out 669 00:37:02,120 --> 00:37:05,160 Speaker 1: how to tie the music in with the advertising in 670 00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:08,719 Speaker 1: a way that it feels entertaining but yet informative, so 671 00:37:08,840 --> 00:37:11,560 Speaker 1: you stay engaged. How do you make it all sound 672 00:37:11,600 --> 00:37:14,680 Speaker 1: like holy shit? I actually want to be engaged if 673 00:37:14,719 --> 00:37:17,160 Speaker 1: it doesn't pull you in, you don't care about it. 674 00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:19,520 Speaker 1: Before we end, I just want to hit music industry 675 00:37:19,560 --> 00:37:23,080 Speaker 1: really quickly. You have United Masters, whole new way of 676 00:37:23,080 --> 00:37:25,760 Speaker 1: thinking about artists. How does this fit into the future 677 00:37:25,760 --> 00:37:28,120 Speaker 1: of the music business. I think the future the music 678 00:37:28,160 --> 00:37:31,240 Speaker 1: business is artists going direct. It's a d i y world. 679 00:37:31,320 --> 00:37:33,840 Speaker 1: The amount of songs going up on Spotify and Apple 680 00:37:33,880 --> 00:37:36,880 Speaker 1: every single day keeps growing tremendously. They're not coming through 681 00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:40,640 Speaker 1: major labels, They're coming through different platforms that are given 682 00:37:40,680 --> 00:37:45,160 Speaker 1: these artists shot to be heard. And what United Masses. 683 00:37:45,160 --> 00:37:47,600 Speaker 1: What I wanted to do was do that at scale. 684 00:37:48,120 --> 00:37:50,400 Speaker 1: How do you bring some technology to make it easy. 685 00:37:50,680 --> 00:37:53,719 Speaker 1: We just launched the app on July fourth. It went 686 00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:55,959 Speaker 1: took off, went to number twenty nine and the app store. 687 00:37:56,239 --> 00:37:59,239 Speaker 1: Why there was a bunch of artists that said, how 688 00:37:59,280 --> 00:38:00,759 Speaker 1: can I get a and if you send me a 689 00:38:00,800 --> 00:38:03,440 Speaker 1: song on my eye Message, how can I get it 690 00:38:03,440 --> 00:38:06,600 Speaker 1: from my eye message to Spotify? What are the only 691 00:38:06,600 --> 00:38:09,480 Speaker 1: guys doing that right now? Your engineer sends you a 692 00:38:09,520 --> 00:38:11,520 Speaker 1: song and you go, man, this is ready to go. 693 00:38:12,040 --> 00:38:15,600 Speaker 1: Within thirty seconds, your songs up on Spotify. That's the 694 00:38:15,719 --> 00:38:18,680 Speaker 1: kind of innovation that I want to bring to the 695 00:38:18,760 --> 00:38:21,160 Speaker 1: music business for the d I y world. I think 696 00:38:21,160 --> 00:38:24,319 Speaker 1: there's a place for the legacy labels, but um I 697 00:38:24,360 --> 00:38:28,200 Speaker 1: think that they have never been big and speedy on innovation. 698 00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:32,759 Speaker 1: We're going to continue to push innovation forward and we 699 00:38:32,880 --> 00:38:36,720 Speaker 1: have hits. Labels are coming in paying seven million dollars 700 00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:40,919 Speaker 1: eight million dollars brand new artists just maintain market here. 701 00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:43,480 Speaker 1: So we're disrupting. And when I put that ad tech 702 00:38:43,520 --> 00:38:45,839 Speaker 1: on top of it, we're gonna really show them where 703 00:38:45,880 --> 00:38:47,840 Speaker 1: to make money. I think the record business needs to 704 00:38:47,840 --> 00:38:50,000 Speaker 1: become the media business. And if I can turn the 705 00:38:50,040 --> 00:38:52,680 Speaker 1: record business into the media business, then we're doing it. 706 00:38:53,200 --> 00:38:56,440 Speaker 1: So we always end this each episode with a salute 707 00:38:56,440 --> 00:38:58,560 Speaker 1: to the math and magic of marketing. If you think 708 00:38:58,600 --> 00:39:01,920 Speaker 1: about it, who's the eightist math person in the business 709 00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:06,880 Speaker 1: You've encountered Doug Morris from Sheer Creative. Who's the best magician? 710 00:39:08,719 --> 00:39:12,440 Speaker 1: Steve Stout, you were inducted into the Advertising Hall of Achievement. 711 00:39:12,520 --> 00:39:14,480 Speaker 1: You were at Age Executive of the Year in two 712 00:39:14,480 --> 00:39:17,640 Speaker 1: thousand and thirteen. Recently, Fast Company named you as one 713 00:39:17,680 --> 00:39:20,880 Speaker 1: of the most creative people in business. You're brilliant man. 714 00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:25,840 Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us. Thank you, Thank you. Here's a 715 00:39:25,840 --> 00:39:29,080 Speaker 1: few lessons I learned during my conversation with Steve. One, 716 00:39:29,480 --> 00:39:32,320 Speaker 1: if you really want to cut through the noise, stop 717 00:39:32,400 --> 00:39:36,120 Speaker 1: focusing on what separates us and instead figure out what 718 00:39:36,200 --> 00:39:39,600 Speaker 1: we have in common. In Steve's view, market segmentation is 719 00:39:39,600 --> 00:39:42,960 Speaker 1: an outdated and often misguided approach that puts people into 720 00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:46,880 Speaker 1: boxes that don't really reflect reality. To surround yourself with 721 00:39:46,880 --> 00:39:49,919 Speaker 1: people who share your values. In Steve's case, that meant 722 00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:53,319 Speaker 1: building a team who wanted to fight uphill battles, whereas 723 00:39:53,360 --> 00:39:57,000 Speaker 1: he put it, find the rocky in every single story. Three. 724 00:39:57,160 --> 00:40:00,359 Speaker 1: Steve believes music drives culture. If you want to see 725 00:40:00,360 --> 00:40:03,319 Speaker 1: where things are headed, people's listening habits are smart place 726 00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:13,319 Speaker 1: to start. I'm Bob Pittman. Thanks for listening. That's it 727 00:40:13,400 --> 00:40:15,960 Speaker 1: for today's episode. Thanks so much for listening to Math 728 00:40:16,040 --> 00:40:18,799 Speaker 1: and Magic, a production of I Heart Radio. This show 729 00:40:18,880 --> 00:40:22,040 Speaker 1: is hosted by Bob Pittman. Special thanks to Sue Schillinger 730 00:40:22,120 --> 00:40:24,480 Speaker 1: for booking and wrangling our wonderful talent, which is no 731 00:40:24,680 --> 00:40:28,720 Speaker 1: small feat Nikkiatore for pulling research bill plaques and Michael 732 00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:31,840 Speaker 1: Asar for their recording help, our editor Ryan Murdoch, and 733 00:40:31,920 --> 00:40:35,800 Speaker 1: of course Gayle Raoul, Eric Angel, Noel Mango, and everyone 734 00:40:35,840 --> 00:40:39,000 Speaker 1: who helped bring this show to your ears. Until next time,