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Speaker 1: Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: Welcome back, coast favorite doctor Michael Salo back with us.

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Speaker 1: A pioneer in the development of exo politics. He's the

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Speaker 1: author of Exposing US government policies on extraterrestrial life and

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Speaker 1: exo Politics. A couple of his other books include Kennedy's

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Speaker 1: Last Stand, US Air Force Space Secret Space Program, Shifting

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Speaker 1: et Alliance, and Space Force It's Amazing Story All Buy Together.

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Speaker 1: Doctor Salo was an assistant professor and researcher and residence

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Speaker 1: in the School of International Service at the American University

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Speaker 1: until two thousand and four. He's got a PhD in

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Speaker 1: Government from the University of Queensland in Australia, and also

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Speaker 1: the founder of the Exo Politics Institute. Michael, welcome back,

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Speaker 1: my friend. How are you. I'm well, George, I'm really

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Speaker 1: I'm really excited by this new book coming out and

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Speaker 1: looking forward to catching up again soon at the Contact

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Speaker 1: in the Desert. Oh great, I'm looking forward to seeing.

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Speaker 1: I just had Michael tellinger on he's going to be

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Speaker 1: out there too, so we'll all be out there. That'll

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Speaker 1: be fun and we're going to celebrate my birthday a

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Speaker 1: little bit later on that day and the weekend, we'll

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Speaker 1: do that. So tell me more about the secret space programmer,

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Speaker 1: in your opinion, what is it exactly? While the Air

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Speaker 1: Force has been secretly studying retrieved extraterrestrial craft from the

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Speaker 1: nineteen forties, most people, many people have heard of the

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Speaker 1: Roswalt crash, there are other crashes that happened before that

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Speaker 1: that are not as well known. One in particular, that

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Speaker 1: happened in Los Angeles in nineteen forty two. I think

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Speaker 1: was very important because that time, in nineteen forty two,

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Speaker 1: just after the US entered into the Separd Moore War,

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Speaker 1: the major aviation companies were all located in Los Angeles,

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Speaker 1: so they all saw that Los Angeles air raid incident

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Speaker 1: and that UFO. And even though you know their priority

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Speaker 1: was obviously in building bombers and five craft for the

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Speaker 1: Army Air Force for the war effort, there was nevertheless

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Speaker 1: a secret effort to understand where these technologies came from,

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Speaker 1: who the pilots were, and whether extraterrestrial life was visiting us.

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Speaker 1: And that was something that some of the most senior

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Speaker 1: Air Force leaders of the time, in particular General Arnold,

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Speaker 1: who was a five star general, actually the only five

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Speaker 1: star general to have served with both the US Army

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Speaker 1: and the US Air Force. He goes back so far

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Speaker 1: from Michael. He was trained in flying by the Right Brothers. Well,

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Speaker 1: that's right. He was a pilot for the Right Brothers

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Speaker 1: back in the early nineteen nineteen ten nice something, way back,

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Speaker 1: way back. So he was a pioneer. And the interesting

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Speaker 1: thing is that he was a pioneer in the innovation

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Speaker 1: of aircraft. And he was also the person who laid

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Speaker 1: the foundations for the Air Force to enter into a

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Speaker 1: new error, which was to learn as much as it

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Speaker 1: could about these craft that were being retrieved from all

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Speaker 1: over the place and to reverse engineer them as far

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Speaker 1: as possible. And so Arnold set the process in place.

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Speaker 1: He was working with major aviation companies such as the

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Speaker 1: Douglas Aircraft Company and Donald Douglas, the head, the person

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Speaker 1: who started up the Douglas Aircraft Company. His daughter was

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Speaker 1: married to have Arnold's son, so they were very close.

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Speaker 1: And what happened was Douglas set up within the Douglas

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Speaker 1: Aircraft Company a top secret think tank to study some

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Speaker 1: of these retrieved craft, and in nineteen forty five that

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Speaker 1: was funded by Arnold using surplus Army funds to the

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Speaker 1: tune about ten million dollars at the time, which today

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Speaker 1: translates to well over one hundred million or several hundred million,

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Speaker 1: So it was an enormous amount of money. And this

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Speaker 1: was all to study exactly what was behind the UFO

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Speaker 1: phenomenon and to study retrieved extraterrestrial craft. So this was

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Speaker 1: something that the Army Air Force was pursuing during the

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Speaker 1: secondmore War along with companies like the Douglas Aircraft Company,

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Speaker 1: and this was a mention eventually led to the creation

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Speaker 1: of the Rand Corporation. So first you have the nineteen

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Speaker 1: forty five the creation of the Rand Project, and in

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Speaker 1: nineteen forty eight you have its separating from Douglas and

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Speaker 1: becoming the Rand Corporation. And that has to this day

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Speaker 1: been really one of the key institutions studying this whole

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Speaker 1: extraterstrial phenomenon and how the Air Force should respond to

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Speaker 1: it and how was behind all of this. Wasn't he

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Speaker 1: He was the one that got it started. He was

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Speaker 1: he provided the funds, and he was the one that

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Speaker 1: realized that this was a new error, just as or

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Speaker 1: you know, the ripe brothers actually in a new error,

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Speaker 1: and he was a part of that. He recognized this

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Speaker 1: the new error that the Air Force would have to

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Speaker 1: deal with would not the be aviation industry as such,

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Speaker 1: it would be the spacecraft. And so that was something

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Speaker 1: that he pioneered. And in fact, the very first paper

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Speaker 1: hypothesizing or discussing the development of the world's first flying

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Speaker 1: sourcer or the first orbital spacecraft was put out by

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Speaker 1: the RAM project, and that appeared in nineteen forty six,

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Speaker 1: and that was that was the one that really got

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Speaker 1: the Air Force going down this track of understanding how

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Speaker 1: important space was for its few operations and to start

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Speaker 1: to develop the craft for space deployment. And that was

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Speaker 1: happening in the ninety bodies. So that was over seventy

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Speaker 1: years ago. Why did they decide to keep it secret,

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Speaker 1: including Roswell back in nineteen forty seven. I think there

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Speaker 1: are many reasons why they decided. I mean, there's ones

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Speaker 1: that many people have talked about, which is disclosing the

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Speaker 1: truth about these anti gravity technologies. Using free energy sources

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Speaker 1: would basically gut the petrochemical industry and the US economy

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Speaker 1: would would be basically revolutionized, and a lot of wealthy

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Speaker 1: people stood to lose a lot of money. So that

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Speaker 1: was one of the major reasons. But I think probably

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Speaker 1: the most powerful reason was that the US National security

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Speaker 1: apparatus had no real answer to what was going on

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Speaker 1: with the flying source of phenomenon. I mean, they understood

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Speaker 1: that we were being visited, that craft were crashing, that

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Speaker 1: there were different extraterrestrial races involved in all of this,

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Speaker 1: but to kind of like understand it all and to

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Speaker 1: present to the part to the public all this data

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Speaker 1: without knowing exactly well, you know, are these extraterrestrials to

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Speaker 1: be trusted? Are they foes? Are they? And what about

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Speaker 1: the Germans? You know, the Germans set up something in Antarctica?

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Speaker 1: Do we reveal that? So I think at the end

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Speaker 1: of the day, they decided that secrecy was the best

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Speaker 1: course until they could find a way to reveal all

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Speaker 1: this to the general public without causing either a kind

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Speaker 1: of economic collapse or a societal collapse. And they're still

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Speaker 1: keeping it secret. Well, they have tried to disclose. I mean,

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Speaker 1: it's not been a monolithic being. I mean the Air

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Speaker 1: Force has been over the years, been involved in a

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Speaker 1: number of disclosure initiatives. I mean people have talked about

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Speaker 1: how they were encouraged by the Air Force to do

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Speaker 1: some kind of disclosure, an announcement or a film. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I'm thinking of Robert Mneger's film in the nineties seventies

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Speaker 1: where he was basically tasked by the Air Force to

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Speaker 1: put together a disclosure video, but in the end they

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Speaker 1: didn't give him the film that from their archives showing

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Speaker 1: these flying sources landing at Polomon Air Force Space. So

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Speaker 1: the Air Force has you, in fits and bursts, tried

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Speaker 1: to reveal the truth, but it's always been kind of

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Speaker 1: like one step forward, two steps back type thing. But

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Speaker 1: now with this Space Force, I think we are getting

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Speaker 1: really close now because ultimately any sensible person is going

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Speaker 1: to ask, well, why is the US developing a space

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Speaker 1: force if we've only got satellites up there. Well, that's

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Speaker 1: true too. Now, there was another player who came on

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Speaker 1: the scene, General Curtis Lamay tell us about his involvement. Well,

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Speaker 1: he was a very important figure because he was the

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Speaker 1: guy that was very much involved in setting the agenda

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Speaker 1: in terms of the research and development of the retrieved

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Speaker 1: Roswell craft. So he was the person in charge of

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Speaker 1: research and development for the US Air Force, or at

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Speaker 1: the time it was called the Army Air Force. It

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Speaker 1: became the renamed Air Force Stember forty seven. So the

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Speaker 1: Roswalt crash happen in July of forty seven. So he

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Speaker 1: set it all up, and over the years he continued

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Speaker 1: to play a key role in trying to help the

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Speaker 1: Air Force get on top of these captured craft. He

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Speaker 1: became the Air Force Chief of Staff, and there was

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Speaker 1: an incident. I know you've had David Adair on. He's

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Speaker 1: talked about how he was taken to Area fifty one

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Speaker 1: and he was basically asked to work out the propulsion

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Speaker 1: system for this huge extraterrestrial craft based on his work

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Speaker 1: on a smaller propulsion system for his own rocket. And

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Speaker 1: he said that the person that was instrumental in that

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Speaker 1: was Curtis LeMay. So you know, right there you have

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Speaker 1: just you know, even during his retirement, Curtis LeMay continued

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Speaker 1: to play this pioneering role, or this critical role in

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Speaker 1: helping the Air Force understand you know, what the heck

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Speaker 1: was behind the flying sources. You know, what kind of

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Speaker 1: propulsion system did they use, how how how did navigation work?

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Speaker 1: What was the importance of the pilot in all of that,

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Speaker 1: and so these were sort of really critical questions and

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Speaker 1: the Air Force did make progress right right up until

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Speaker 1: the sixties and seventies understanding these technologies and getting some

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Speaker 1: of these captured technologies to fly again. Build You House

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Speaker 1: was an Air Force engineer, and he says that in

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Speaker 1: the sixties, in the fifties and the sixties that one

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Speaker 1: of the captured craft from the Kingman Arizona crash, I

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Speaker 1: think that was in nineteen forty eight, that was in

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Speaker 1: such good condition after the crash that the Air Force

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Speaker 1: was able to repair it and use it as as

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Speaker 1: as a model for setting up a flight simulator for

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Speaker 1: Air Force pilots to fly flying sources. So this was

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Speaker 1: something that he said was happening in the fifties and sixties.

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Speaker 1: He was involved in that. That was Build You House.

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Speaker 1: And then you have the remarkable testimony of people like

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Speaker 1: Brad Sorenson and Martin mcclandish who say that in the

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Speaker 1: in the nineteen eighties the Air Force had its own

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Speaker 1: operational flying sources and that they saw three of these

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Speaker 1: being shown at an air show it Adwards Air Force

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Speaker 1: Base in nineteen eighty eight. Was it based on reversed

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Speaker 1: ufful technology. Michael, Absolutely, that was exactly what they did.

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Speaker 1: They used the principles they gained from the captured extraterrestrial

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Speaker 1: craft and also what the Germans had had developed during

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Speaker 1: the Second World War. And just to give the listeners

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Speaker 1: an idea of exactly how many craft were being studied,

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Speaker 1: several sources say that at Area fifty one that there

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Speaker 1: were nine flying sources that were in storage. There were

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Speaker 1: being studied by the Air Force and by the different

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Speaker 1: aircraft companies such as Lockheed. Five of them were extraterrestrial

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Speaker 1: in origin, and four of them were German two too.

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Speaker 1: I was going to say, I've always heard stories that

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Speaker 1: the Germans may have been even more ahead of us

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Speaker 1: in this kind of area. They definitely were. They began

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Speaker 1: in the nineteen twenties studying these kinds of principles. Did

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Speaker 1: they have a retrieved sorcery? The first retrieved SACER was

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Speaker 1: in nineteen thirty three, that was in Italy, that was

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Speaker 1: moderna Italy. But the Germans actually used esoteric sources to

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Speaker 1: get to get information about the flying saucer phenomenon. Now,

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Speaker 1: what's an esoteric SACER and an esoteric source like like

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Speaker 1: Maria Osach and the real society. These were ladies that

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Speaker 1: claimed that they were able to communicate with extraterrestrials, and

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Speaker 1: also some of the ancient texts found in places like

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Speaker 1: India that described the v manas So the Germans were

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Speaker 1: studying all of this in the nineteen twenties, trying to

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Speaker 1: get to the bottom of it, and they made tremendous progress,

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Speaker 1: so that by the nineteen forties they'd gotten so far

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Speaker 1: ahead that they actually tried to operationalize some of these

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Speaker 1: flying source of craft. But just as the Mesha Schmidt

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Speaker 1: to sixty one jet fighter was deployed towards the end

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Speaker 1: of the Second Wore War, but it was too late.

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Speaker 1: I mean, the Allies had kind of broken the back

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Speaker 1: of the German military might, and so even these advanced

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Speaker 1: craft that they were able to get up there, there

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Speaker 1: were just too few of them to combat one thousand

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Speaker 1: bomber raids. Did they fly them over the United States?

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Speaker 1: That happened later. That happened in soon after the Operation

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Speaker 1: High Jump expedition in Antarctica, when Admiral Bird led that

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Speaker 1: naval expedition, And there have been lots of rumors of

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Speaker 1: the battle down there with the German flying sources that

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Speaker 1: basically dealt the Navy a bloody in a bloody nose.

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Speaker 1: Back in the early nineteen forty seven, the war was

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Speaker 1: already over. That's right, yes, because at least that part

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Speaker 1: of the war, the Navy understood that the Germans had

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Speaker 1: succeeded in building bases underground bases in Antarctica, and so

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Speaker 1: that was the real purpose behind Operation High Jump. But

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Speaker 1: what also happened was that after the Navy suffered casualties

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Speaker 1: and so it ended that mission. Early Admiral Bird went

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Speaker 1: to Chile and gave a speech where he warned of

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Speaker 1: a new enemy that could fly from pole to pole

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Speaker 1: very very rapidly, and that the US had to face this.

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Speaker 1: While only months later, only three months later, you had

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Speaker 1: the Kenneth Arnold's siding in Washington State and he saw

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Speaker 1: nine crescent shaped craft flying information. And I believe, and

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Speaker 1: this is what I argue in the book and present

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Speaker 1: the data that I was able to find in support

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Speaker 1: of this, that these craft were actually German craft that

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Speaker 1: were deployed from Antarctica that began overflights of the US.

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Speaker 1: And the goal was not to fight the US. The

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Speaker 1: goal was to basically convince the US military that the

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Speaker 1: Germans had succeeded in understanding the principles behind flying, source

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Speaker 1: of technologies, anti gravity, push and filed physics, all of

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Speaker 1: these advanced concepts that the Air Force knew were vital

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Speaker 1: to being able to fly and reverse engineer these crafts.

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Speaker 1: At the ones were demonstrating that they had succeeded in that,

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Speaker 1: and they were basically indicating that we want to negotiate,

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Speaker 1: we want to partner in reverse engineering these crafts and

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Speaker 1: building and building fleets of them, and so let's make

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Speaker 1: a deal. And I guess they wanted to do it

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Speaker 1: before the Soviet Union picked up on it, right, Well,

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Speaker 1: the Soviets were always very anxious over this possibility that

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Speaker 1: the United States could enter into an alliance with the

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Speaker 1: German breakaway colonies in Antarctica. That was the soviets the

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Speaker 1: greatest fear, because the Soviets knew that they had nothing

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Speaker 1: that could match what the Germans had developed down in Antarctica,

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Speaker 1: and they knew that if the US partnered with the Germans,

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Speaker 1: that the US would qualitatively move way ahead of the

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Speaker 1: German of the Russians. And that's exactly what happened. Listen

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Speaker 1: to more. Coast to Coast AM every weeknight at one

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Speaker 1: a m. Eastern and go to Coast to Coast am

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Speaker 1: dot com for more