Speaker 1: Yeah, my name is Clay Nukeleman. This is a production
Speaker 1: of the bear Grease podcast called The Bear Grease Render,
Speaker 1: where we render down, dive deeper, and looked behind the
Speaker 1: scenes of the actual bear Grease podcast, presented by f
Speaker 1: HF Gear, American made purpose built hunting and fishing gear
Speaker 1: that's designed to be as rugged as the places we explore.
Speaker 1: I have a I do have a big I do
Speaker 1: have a big mustache, it's a fact. And I have
Speaker 1: a pretty big beard. But Dan's beard has has like mass, course,
Speaker 1: like it's a mask, like it's dense. It's horse is
Speaker 1: it not? Yeah, it's It's a good beard. It I've
Speaker 1: always said that. That's the main reason I like Dan.
Speaker 1: I didn't have I had no Did you know Dan
Speaker 1: looks good in a beard. I'll be honest with you.
Speaker 1: Thank you, Josh. I'm not gonna tell all your people
Speaker 1: what I think about your beard. But Gary, the world
Speaker 1: saw that picture of me and Clay at the cost
Speaker 1: Tot River and Clay and Nucombe without a beard is
Speaker 1: a handsome man. Clay Nuncombe with a beard is a
Speaker 1: handsome man. Josh Spillmaker without a beard is a It
Speaker 1: hurts the eyes to look at how you were a
Speaker 1: handsome man. You saw it? Did you see what I
Speaker 1: wrote on on Instagram? The reason I didn't have a
Speaker 1: beard was probably because you told me it held too
Speaker 1: much scent and I would never kill a deer. While
Speaker 1: here's the thing, Dad, listen. Gary Nucombe was a banker.
Speaker 1: He had to look professional when he went into the
Speaker 1: bank every day to be se sporting a little to
Speaker 1: go to so his the way he lived in sense
Speaker 1: free in a in a positive way. I mean, I
Speaker 1: think this is a good thing. And so I've always
Speaker 1: had a beard, Clay. When I met you, your hair
Speaker 1: was like wild and you had a beard. How did
Speaker 1: that upstanding career imprint on you? Why don't you do?
Speaker 1: You want to give your it is he just wanted
Speaker 1: to go opposite of anything. And I mean, and that's
Speaker 1: and you know one other thing. Look where you ended up.
Speaker 1: I mean, you're one probably inch from Folsom not in Mexico,
Speaker 1: but prison all he's lacking as a neck tattoo. It's
Speaker 1: just a little deeper than the color shows. Welcome to
Speaker 1: the bear, Gary, surrender man. Yeah, this is this has
Speaker 1: started off great. Hey, this is we have a we
Speaker 1: have a secret guest. We will reveal this guest later,
Speaker 1: but this guest has committed not to make a peep.
Speaker 1: The energy, the energy of the bear Grease render Christmas
Speaker 1: party which you are all a part of. Congratulations, this
Speaker 1: is a Christmas party. And why don't you describe the
Speaker 1: core that you see around? Well, it's lovely, it's seasonal.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of antlers and old books. It actually
Speaker 1: looks like it always does, except for the Christmas cookies.
Speaker 1: That's what I was about to say. There is, and
Speaker 1: I've already had at least one, but I've been told
Speaker 1: I can't eat anymore because it makes a lot of
Speaker 1: noise through the mic. It's a little testy about for
Speaker 1: a Christmas party. There's I will say, there's tension in
Speaker 1: the room at Christmas. I'm not feeling of expectations. I
Speaker 1: think under a Christmas party with a lot of times
Speaker 1: about why you can and can't be, you will have
Speaker 1: fun on my terms. Uh, that is exactly right, That's
Speaker 1: exactly right. Hey, We're we are going no foreshadowing here, folks.
Speaker 1: We're we're going to have an actual Christmas party. We
Speaker 1: have gifts, We're gonna have it. We're gonna have a
Speaker 1: gift exchange. There's gonna be singing, there's going to be refreshments.
Speaker 1: This is gonna be incredible. There's the saddest part of
Speaker 1: this is that Brent Reeves couldn't be here, So Bret,
Speaker 1: we have an empty chair for We'll have a special
Speaker 1: holiday greeting for us. Although will be on this episode
Speaker 1: of Wonderful, So I will introduce my guests though. To
Speaker 1: my left, Dr Dan Route, Hey, great to see you, Dan,
Speaker 1: Great to be here. Yes, to your left, my lovely wife,
Speaker 1: Missy Nukelem always good to be here. Yes, great to
Speaker 1: see you. Good to see you. Marry Christmas, Merry Christmas.
Speaker 1: To to your left, Josh the Lambridge spilmmaker, Which I'm
Speaker 1: thrilled that the land Bridge came up once again and
Speaker 1: this episode it did. I feel like every time the
Speaker 1: word land Bridge is mentioned, there should be like a
Speaker 1: little jingle or something like, hey, I got your new
Speaker 1: tattoo though that you need on your neck. Now that
Speaker 1: Gary thinks we should be in prison, they walked their
Speaker 1: quote unquote, I like that it's tagline. They walked there.
Speaker 1: I mean he said it like a real matter of fact.
Speaker 1: He said they walked there, like it was like he
Speaker 1: he started it and stopped it in such a way
Speaker 1: with the enunciation of his voice, like there was no arguing.
Speaker 1: I noticed you wanted there was a small part of
Speaker 1: you that wanted to kind of bring up a different view,
Speaker 1: and then you quickly were like, Okay, let's move on. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I love it. I mean, I'm pro lanb. Bridge, but
Speaker 1: I'm also pro you know Taylor Keenes saying the Cherokees
Speaker 1: came from the South via water route. This is a lot.
Speaker 1: This is deep waters pun intended. But your tattoo should
Speaker 1: say they walked here. I like it, Like and the
Speaker 1: and the Vikings made it to Heathenar, Oklahoma. We know
Speaker 1: that for sure. The ruinstone look it up. Okay. To
Speaker 1: Josh's left is our secret special, very dear special guest.
Speaker 1: But her left is Gary new come back from wherever
Speaker 1: he's been, back from the grave. Good to be here.
Speaker 1: Where have you been? Gary? Well, I can't tell you.
Speaker 1: It's secret, secret secret. I'll tell you what. I will
Speaker 1: give you a little hint though. I've been doing some
Speaker 1: research thinking about writing a book on the Black Panther. Y. Hey,
Speaker 1: I think I can go ahead and foreshadow this meat eater.
Speaker 1: We are coming out with a hat that is going
Speaker 1: to be the design of the Bargaras hat. It's gonna
Speaker 1: have those same colors. It's gonna be a patch hat
Speaker 1: with the same colors, and it's got the silhouette of
Speaker 1: a black panther and it says believe Yes. That will
Speaker 1: be for sale on the meat Eator dot com. Very,
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna say soon and soon when we're talking
Speaker 1: about geologic time might be like, you know, like February
Speaker 1: soon might be like when this thing comes out with me. Well,
Speaker 1: everything except for when we're talking to geologic time. Well, okay,
Speaker 1: when I say soon, there are many qualifications to that
Speaker 1: term soon to Some people might be like tomorrow, got
Speaker 1: it soon, But I don't know exactly when soon is.
Speaker 1: So there's a believer hat. So well, it's good to
Speaker 1: see you, so to Gary Newcoms. Right is our special guest,
Speaker 1: my dear mother in her dream sweater. Welcome. Well, it's
Speaker 1: good to be here. It's an honor to be here
Speaker 1: with the witty bold people. Idiots. You realize that your
Speaker 1: name comes up a lot. Oh listen, yeah, well just
Speaker 1: in my life though, yeah, yeah, juju, Like I don't
Speaker 1: even I quit qualifying who Juju is. When I talk
Speaker 1: to people, just say Juju said, and they're like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's Clay's mom. So great to have you. And the
Speaker 1: reason Juju is here is because Juju is the is
Speaker 1: the queen of holiday, festive, energy and life. Do you agree, Dad? Absolutely?
Speaker 1: Like when you go to Juju's house day after Thanksgiving,
Speaker 1: man the Santa Claus has come out of wherever they
Speaker 1: live the rest of the year, and they're all over
Speaker 1: the house, Angels, Nativity scenes, immaculate Christmas trees. We we
Speaker 1: opened some gifts the other day at Juju's house with
Speaker 1: it for our kids, and the wrapping paper on those
Speaker 1: there was more intent put in that they're wrapping, inspirational
Speaker 1: like rapping that. I was like, you put more thought
Speaker 1: into this than I did the first year. And that
Speaker 1: is a true statement because I didn't know what our
Speaker 1: house is gonna look like until just to be clear,
Speaker 1: I did, true story. So Juju, Wow, that's that's quite
Speaker 1: a t And she did bring this festive tray of cookies,
Speaker 1: delicious trees and stars. We could only eat one, but
Speaker 1: they're really good because how many did you have? Did
Speaker 1: you have the Christmas tree at the star the star
Speaker 1: that means something juju? What is your what? What do
Speaker 1: you think about? What do you think about the bargarase
Speaker 1: like our format? Are you cool with the way we're
Speaker 1: doing this? Oh? I enjoy it. I love listening to
Speaker 1: the I love listening to the Beargrease. Then I will
Speaker 1: love podcast, and then I love listening to what y'all
Speaker 1: say about it, the narrative of it. It's interesting and Uh,
Speaker 1: y'all are so funny. I have to laugh at who's
Speaker 1: your favorite Burger's character. I'm gonna I'm gonna red on that.
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna say. How do you feel like Clay
Speaker 1: has been? Tell them not to ask me hard questions?
Speaker 1: And they're asking me hard just one. How do you
Speaker 1: feel like Clay has been with all the commenters feel now?
Speaker 1: I've had a little talk with him about that. I
Speaker 1: tell him not to be so hard on a few
Speaker 1: of them, to listen to them because they are really
Speaker 1: saying what they think. Yeah, they are, they do say
Speaker 1: what they do say. What do you feel like that?
Speaker 1: They're always right? But you know you have to be
Speaker 1: a little gracious with them. I think you could be
Speaker 1: gracious with a lot of people in your life. Um,
Speaker 1: so do you do you feel like the formats working though?
Speaker 1: Do you think there's any kind of marketing Uh, marketing
Speaker 1: problems with like having this documentary style podcasting and the
Speaker 1: render people getting confused? Did you have any difficulty with so?
Speaker 1: Several of my friends listen and they enjoy it. They
Speaker 1: enjoy the talk among you guys, the kidding and the
Speaker 1: laughing and uh. But they also enjoy when you all
Speaker 1: are serious and you talk about the concept or the
Speaker 1: subject you're talking about. Who do you think who do
Speaker 1: you think the smartest person on the end? Oh, I'm
Speaker 1: going to say, Mr new I have to live with it.
Speaker 1: Everybody here is you know, guess what. She's a kindergarten teacher.
Speaker 1: Of course she's going to say that. Welcome to my life.
Speaker 1: You're all great. You do you notice that she's kind
Speaker 1: of leading us like we were a kindergarten class. All
Speaker 1: of a sudden, I feel really special, and I know
Speaker 1: everyone else does too. I feel like times right around
Speaker 1: the corner, and I remember all the letters of the alphabet.
Speaker 1: Everybody gets a ribbon. It's all coming back to Okay,
Speaker 1: all right, here's what we're gonna do. We're now going
Speaker 1: to have our Okay, it is now time for us
Speaker 1: to have our Christmas gift exchange. Okay in white elephant fashion. Yeah, so, Josh,
Speaker 1: why don't you describe? We have a few gifts here
Speaker 1: for those of you that brought gifts. Whoever gets to
Speaker 1: go first gets to pick a gift. They're gonna open
Speaker 1: it and they're going to be excited about what it is.
Speaker 1: The next person can either steal that gift or they
Speaker 1: can pick a new one, and so down the line. However,
Speaker 1: whoever the last person is, they can steal or they
Speaker 1: can open, but then it goes back to the first person.
Speaker 1: They can keep what they've got, or they can steal
Speaker 1: one of the gifts that are already question Okay, do
Speaker 1: you need to draw numbers? Who goes first? Juju? How
Speaker 1: about you? Do you pick a number? Who goes first
Speaker 1: will close their eyes? Just just just go for how
Speaker 1: many gifts have? Number one? She's gonna go first, Okay,
Speaker 1: Gary's number two, Clay's number three, Daniels four, and I'm
Speaker 1: gonna let Josh b last I actually in white elephant
Speaker 1: let me say five. So should we announce what we've got?
Speaker 1: And here we've got a gift hidden Underneath, we have
Speaker 1: a gift that's long and skinny, wrapped in a bare hide.
Speaker 1: We have a very large gift about a sixteen by
Speaker 1: twenty thirty by forty. I'm not really good, I know
Speaker 1: that's a big range. We have a box about the
Speaker 1: size of a cordial cherries chocolate covered cherries box festival analogy,
Speaker 1: and then we have about shoe box. I'm just thinking
Speaker 1: about things that I've bought in Okay, So your first, Missy,
Speaker 1: what will you choose? Chocolate covered cherries? Okay? Wow? This
Speaker 1: is Josh says, this is a good one. This is
Speaker 1: from the land Bridge, this is from this is from
Speaker 1: so I've got a very great rapping job. I have
Speaker 1: to tribute that to sp She she loves wrapping gifts
Speaker 1: and she's very crafty. Keep asking her to come and
Speaker 1: help me do things. Okay. And inside the box is
Speaker 1: a smaller present wrapped in bubble rap. Okay, Oh whoa
Speaker 1: belt buckle with a like Josh's. Is that a black
Speaker 1: I made that last night? Is that look at the
Speaker 1: back of it and that commemorative commemorative and it says
Speaker 1: bear grease two. So it's a It's a silver belt
Speaker 1: buckle with beadwork of a bear on it. Very classy.
Speaker 1: That is great. Well, that's not yours can have. It
Speaker 1: can only be stolen once. Okay, Gary, you're up next.
Speaker 1: What are you going to choose? Let me look at that.
Speaker 1: Don't look too close, scary. You are until four o'clock
Speaker 1: in the morning, so much more talented than you look.
Speaker 1: You know what one, I'm gonna take this guy right here. Okay,
Speaker 1: Gary's taken. I feel like I need a vaccination to
Speaker 1: even touch it. Yeah, Garry has has chosen so that
Speaker 1: you can post it on Instagram. Hold that up, dad.
Speaker 1: I can't tell if it's an old rifle or if
Speaker 1: it's like the front quarter of a white tailed deer.
Speaker 1: Did do I get to keep the bear hide? Um?
Speaker 1: If you want it? Yes, No, I'm not sure I
Speaker 1: want it, but I'm and I'm excited about seeing that.
Speaker 1: Like everybody's sitting here with their mouths up and just
Speaker 1: I'm gonna give it a muzzleloader. Hopefully it's not my muzzleloader.
Speaker 1: Would when you hit on it, holy, that is my muzzleloader.
Speaker 1: But my mum, are you sure? How do you know
Speaker 1: that's yours? Most definitely look familiar? Okay, Um, that is
Speaker 1: Josh's muzzloader chosen to give it away in this gift exchange. Um,
Speaker 1: I guess I have the opportunity to steal less about Okay, okay,
Speaker 1: this is this is a decoy. This is a decoy gift.
Speaker 1: The funny part of this is that that is Josh's
Speaker 1: musloder that he lent me that I haven't give it back. Okay,
Speaker 1: bullet in it. No, I I took the breach out
Speaker 1: of it, so just for safety, so we didn't shoot anybody.
Speaker 1: Hold on, we got we gotta work through this because
Speaker 1: this is this is you. We've actually got to work
Speaker 1: through this because I don't have the right to give
Speaker 1: away Josh's musloder. That's what was funny. Okay, that was funny.
Speaker 1: This is this is this is this is a first
Speaker 1: Light dirt bag. Duff read read the tag this so
Speaker 1: first Light has a serious that this came from Salvage.
Speaker 1: Salvage it was, it's been it was built ten or
Speaker 1: twelve years ago, it's been used, it's been to a
Speaker 1: last twice. It's got COVID inside. Boy. Now, really, this
Speaker 1: is a this is a nice piece First Light. I mean,
Speaker 1: this is this is I'm a bag there's certain things
Speaker 1: I like, and I got one of them. Okay, A
Speaker 1: little bit like this is the Michael Scott white elephant,
Speaker 1: where it kind of is like the was not even
Speaker 1: a white elephant. I mean, I will boys, I look
Speaker 1: like an old guy, but I'll whip your fan if
Speaker 1: I take this thing. Believer, believer, I got. There's two
Speaker 1: of us now, okay, Josh, who's next? There is one
Speaker 1: underneath the Yeah, there's I'm just taking this. I'm taking
Speaker 1: this one. So I've got at this is intricate. If
Speaker 1: if archaeologists dug this out of the ground one day,
Speaker 1: they would go, why did they spend that much time
Speaker 1: wrapping it? Why would they do that? What couldn't they
Speaker 1: have used their resources in other ways? They would have
Speaker 1: said that, okay, a target box target gets from target
Speaker 1: a nice look at this big buck hitch cover that's
Speaker 1: truck and some Christmas socks nice and uh a little
Speaker 1: um a little like sign that says genius at work.
Speaker 1: We need two of those, very good. Thank you. This
Speaker 1: So this is terrible on two fronts. Leave my bag, Alonge,
Speaker 1: because number one, my gift is way below the level
Speaker 1: of all these gifts. Wait, is your my gift is
Speaker 1: under unwrapped under the bare hide. Okay. Number two, why
Speaker 1: this is terrible is you're gonna steal. I'm gonna steal
Speaker 1: Misty Dann't wear that, sucker. I will wear it right now. Well, wow,
Speaker 1: this is getting changing. So I had the option of
Speaker 1: the gift I brought or Dann change their belt buckle
Speaker 1: that quick. That's I know. I man. It was like
Speaker 1: he keeps a sparre in his pocket and he was
Speaker 1: just waiting to do that. It looks good though. I
Speaker 1: love this. Thanks, you're welcome. I mean, I'm gonna okay,
Speaker 1: it's took it from me. Please do not choose myne
Speaker 1: It's awesome. This is your other. Why is you're taking
Speaker 1: your own? Okay, under the bear skin cancers mystery flavors.
Speaker 1: Let me just tell you, well, I cain't downplay this,
Speaker 1: but let me just introduce this gift a little bit.
Speaker 1: These are experimental mountain dew flavors that we acquired, and
Speaker 1: it is my joy to turn them over to you.
Speaker 1: You can either drink them or use them to kill plants.
Speaker 1: Experimental mountain dew flavors. Does that mean you'll have tasted
Speaker 1: these and have so these are used these. I think
Speaker 1: if you save this like a Star Wars figuring, both
Speaker 1: of these twelve packs have been unspoilt. I've got twenty
Speaker 1: four Mystery Flavor Mountain d that's right. Okay, So who
Speaker 1: doesn't have a gift, Josh Spellmaker, so I can steal
Speaker 1: you can steal or Newcomb or Misty Newcomb's gift here.
Speaker 1: It's it's ladies and gentlemen, I will tell you it's
Speaker 1: it's the size of a large picture frame, has kind
Speaker 1: of a picture frame. He feel about it, very nicely wrapped.
Speaker 1: It's going to be a black panther. I think, I
Speaker 1: think I'm gonna keep this one because I need I'm
Speaker 1: pretty certain it's artwork and I need smartwork from my shop. Yes,
Speaker 1: you do this. The look Clay Newcomb has given me
Speaker 1: right now is that like, do you know what this is?
Speaker 1: Do you know what it is? You're the worst? I can't,
Speaker 1: I can't say it. I like Gary Newcomb keep his bag.
Speaker 1: Although I'm gonna say I'm gonna take whatever's in this
Speaker 1: and my muzzleloader. Yeah, that's partly the reason I gave
Speaker 1: it away, because I was looking for a reason to
Speaker 1: give it back to you. This is what I always
Speaker 1: dreamed of, a picture of a giant picture of giant
Speaker 1: portrait of a big Cheshire cat grin. And that is
Speaker 1: a museum quality frame from someone you know, very dear, Yes,
Speaker 1: and I'm serious, that is a probably a three frame
Speaker 1: job on that. It's an excellent frame. In What I
Speaker 1: like about it, Josh, is that it was given to us.
Speaker 1: It's a wonderful picture by a very skilled photographer in
Speaker 1: big at least at least it's bigger than Josh's Torso
Speaker 1: like when I just took a picture of a giant
Speaker 1: picture of my face, and so it was a high
Speaker 1: quality was given to us. All sign it for you
Speaker 1: right now. It just always felt a little big in
Speaker 1: our house, almost idolatrous, you know, like the one thing
Speaker 1: that Okay, for the record, we did not ask for this,
Speaker 1: nor did the artist of this portrait to sees it
Speaker 1: hanging in my shot nervous. A little bit about that,
Speaker 1: A little bit about that. So the second thing, hey,
Speaker 1: the one thing that we have learned is that wherever
Speaker 1: you put it in a room, those eyes, buddy, they
Speaker 1: follow you, like that like that statue of Jesus that follows.
Speaker 1: We would take place watching like whenever the kids would
Speaker 1: get in trouble when they were a little and Clay
Speaker 1: would be on the road, I would just point to
Speaker 1: the wall. Can you turn it away from me? What
Speaker 1: you're wearing the Arkansas baron. But know that the reason
Speaker 1: that little grin is they're so big is I had
Speaker 1: just killed a beautiful white tailed buck that had a
Speaker 1: four inch drop time on Christmas Eve. Really yeah, which
Speaker 1: it is a Christmas photo? That photo of Christmas Eve. Well,
Speaker 1: I'll tell you what that's good for, Like those little
Speaker 1: little darts as a little so two thoughts. A lot
Speaker 1: of dictators make everybody put their picture on the wall
Speaker 1: and there wherever. That or the fact that that misty
Speaker 1: you really need to keep that. That's the kind of
Speaker 1: thing if you don't want to put it out like
Speaker 1: your egotistical you put it in the attic and think
Speaker 1: what the little grand babies. I mean, they'd go, well,
Speaker 1: see that's been our attic for about a decade. It
Speaker 1: needs to be in the act three or four decades old.
Speaker 1: I killed water Witch in two thousand eleven. Well, that's
Speaker 1: a highlight of my life. Fantastic. I just want to
Speaker 1: give everybody a clause. Great job on the gifts, really
Speaker 1: put your heart into it. And Josh, uh, sorry about
Speaker 1: keeping your mind so long. I've also got all your
Speaker 1: gear with it. Okay, great, I have to wait another
Speaker 1: year to get that excellent wrap it up and drop
Speaker 1: it off at your house. Okay. So now we'll get
Speaker 1: into So this was like a holiday specialty section okay
Speaker 1: at the Burgray Shrender. Now we're getting into the serious
Speaker 1: part of the render. What did you guys think of
Speaker 1: the last render crew? You know, it was the guys
Speaker 1: from on X was Jared Larson, Zack Sandal and then
Speaker 1: Rusty Johnson, Rustin Johnson, Hunter, Rude Justin Michow. I mean,
Speaker 1: they did pretty good. I have to say that there
Speaker 1: was a lot of them, and it always kind of hurts.
Speaker 1: I have to say that also that you know, we're
Speaker 1: such distinctive personalities. It kind of they kind of just
Speaker 1: all ran together. There's a couple of distinctive personalities in there,
Speaker 1: but they kind of all ran together. I think that really.
Speaker 1: So Josh said, none of them has what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: what the render crew that you have here. If it
Speaker 1: ain't broke, don't fix it. Okay, that's one view point
Speaker 1: I will say after the previous time that another crew
Speaker 1: was brought in, I will admit, but they stepped it
Speaker 1: up and I went into this one with pretty low expectations.
Speaker 1: I thought they were fantastic. I actually really had a
Speaker 1: good job. I thought, we're going to listen to this.
Speaker 1: I did listen to Okay. I thought they did good.
Speaker 1: Did you think about Rusty Johnson getting anxiety sickness before
Speaker 1: he hunts? I thought that was interesting that he would
Speaker 1: he would gag And do you ever get excited about
Speaker 1: anything that much? Well, I can't say that. I had,
Speaker 1: Like before you the day before Thanksgiving when Jujuice cooking,
Speaker 1: she is like pomped. I mean just like I cannot wait.
Speaker 1: Is there is there a time that you are just
Speaker 1: like absolutely stoked to be doing what you're doing. Oh? Yes, shopping,
Speaker 1: seeing my grand babies. I get excited about that. Gets
Speaker 1: pretty pumped up about teaching kids to read too. Well, yeah,
Speaker 1: I do love that about I enjoyed those guys comments though.
Speaker 1: I remember them talking about one guy, one cameraman and
Speaker 1: the tree stam would talk your ear off and the
Speaker 1: other cameraman wanted to talk but his hunter. I guess
Speaker 1: it was that. Yeah, he wouldn't talk, and he'd sit
Speaker 1: there for hours not saying anything. It was a hunter.
Speaker 1: Hunter is like he has like long red hair and
Speaker 1: he's just a funny guy. You're just around him and
Speaker 1: you're like, he's really funny. And so Rusty is real serious?
Speaker 1: Is it Rusty Son that's a lawyer. Yeah, And so
Speaker 1: Rusty and Hunter went together and it was just real
Speaker 1: funny because Rusty is this dead serious white to Hunter,
Speaker 1: and Hunters this like he's a good Hunter. I'm not
Speaker 1: taking anything away from him. But he had I don't
Speaker 1: know that he had been around somebody like Rusty, and
Speaker 1: so it was real funny. But they came together in
Speaker 1: the end. Jujuka, that's what the Renders all about, unity,
Speaker 1: unpolarizing the nation. I feel like I need I need
Speaker 1: to unpolarized. I mean, you've polarized a bunch of our
Speaker 1: friends now with your statements about their performance on a podcast.
Speaker 1: I will say that will newcom and I don't want
Speaker 1: you all to be mad at her about this. But
Speaker 1: after the first like non what do we call us
Speaker 1: regular render? Non regular crew? We need an acronym. Yeah
Speaker 1: in our um she called us and said, hey, that
Speaker 1: was really great. The ones that you thought weren't great.
Speaker 1: She said, that was really great. Sometimes I feel very
Speaker 1: overwhelmed by the regular crew, and she said it actually
Speaker 1: gives me. She described it as I'll just say, anxiety
Speaker 1: inducing to listen to us. Well, I mean, I could
Speaker 1: see if she's having trouble sleeping, enjoying listening to the
Speaker 1: first non regular said that it was great. Then we
Speaker 1: do this one and she's like, she came home for
Speaker 1: the holidays and she said, Dad, that last Render crew
Speaker 1: you had, She said, it's always my favorite whenever it's
Speaker 1: a different crew said that. She said that. I mean,
Speaker 1: you don't what she said to me. I think, you know,
Speaker 1: I just think that the insecurities of this render crewe.
Speaker 1: It is just glowy. Uh. It's like job security. You know,
Speaker 1: you can't brag on the guy next to you. You
Speaker 1: got a bad mouthing. I thought you thought zero second
Speaker 1: irregular crew was probably the best. The first irregular crew
Speaker 1: was probably second best. In this bunch right here, myself included,
Speaker 1: we're probably third. To be honest, I enjoyed. I enjoyed
Speaker 1: marking that bunch, maybe because I just had met him.
Speaker 1: That's what I was going to say if you had
Speaker 1: known those guys because they were the nicest guys. Mark
Speaker 1: and Andreas and Tyler and Joe. I mean way, you
Speaker 1: know us too. Guys are nice too. But truly I
Speaker 1: like both groups. I think a little variety is pretty cool. Still,
Speaker 1: maybe we could arrange a fistfights between the two crews
Speaker 1: between us and Willow. Just sitting in as a guest
Speaker 1: on the on the Render when you're not used to
Speaker 1: doing it, I can say that right now. It's it's
Speaker 1: hard to think of something really cool to say every time.
Speaker 1: And you guys never had any trouble things. You guys
Speaker 1: have mastered it. You too, You TOOI company. So it's
Speaker 1: fun listening. Well, there's just a little bit of a
Speaker 1: little bit of housekeeping to do here. Um, now that
Speaker 1: it is Christmas time. It's now that it is Christmas,
Speaker 1: I would like to make a formal apology to all
Speaker 1: the Render listeners who put up their Christmas lights before Thanksgiving.
Speaker 1: You want to apologize to them, I do, because now
Speaker 1: that it's Christmas and we're all pumped for Christmas, I'm like,
Speaker 1: maybe they were instrumental in helping you get pumped. Maybe
Speaker 1: they were Maybe maybe they were right The whole time.
Speaker 1: Clay flip flops again, and my friend Ryan Pettigrew called
Speaker 1: me out on it and he said, Clay, I put
Speaker 1: up Christmas lights on November the first, and he said,
Speaker 1: because my wife wants me to do it, and we
Speaker 1: love Christmas. And he's real big dude, and like I
Speaker 1: wouldn't want to fight him. We had some petty criminals
Speaker 1: come through our neighborhood night before last and steal Christmas
Speaker 1: decorations out of people's front yard. Really, I wish they
Speaker 1: would still Halloween a creations. They leave those, Okay, So
Speaker 1: to get after the heart of the podcast here, guys,
Speaker 1: were three three podcasts into a four part series. The
Speaker 1: fourth part is gonna be one of my favorites. I'm
Speaker 1: working on it as we speak. What did y'all think
Speaker 1: of this third one? So the to clarify sometimes it
Speaker 1: probably jumbles into one big section. The first podcast, the
Speaker 1: first in our series, was on George mcjunkin. Okay, And
Speaker 1: and for those maybe who haven't heard it might want
Speaker 1: to go back. George mcjunkin was the freed slave who
Speaker 1: in nineteen o eight found the Falsome site reported it
Speaker 1: the people. It wasn't until after he was dead that
Speaker 1: they recognized what it was that he had found. And
Speaker 1: so the whole first podcast we dove into George mcjunkan's
Speaker 1: life and him being a cowboy, and it was all
Speaker 1: about him and very little about the Fulsome site. But
Speaker 1: that's part of the Falsome story. Part number two was
Speaker 1: diving into Falsome and I introduced well the authority on
Speaker 1: the folsome site in the nation, Dr David Meltzer from
Speaker 1: s m U. Incredible guy. And the reason he is
Speaker 1: the authority on Falsome is he literally wrote a textbook
Speaker 1: on Falsome. It's right up there. So that book, I mean,
Speaker 1: it is it isn't It is like an academic textbook.
Speaker 1: It's not a book that you would give away and
Speaker 1: be like, hey, you'll enjoy reading this. I mean it's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: you would. You would given to him and would be like,
Speaker 1: you're gonna really struggle with this. Why did you look
Speaker 1: at me when you said that? I loved it? But
Speaker 1: I'm just saying it wasn't like written like some entertaining,
Speaker 1: purposefully entertaining nonfiction book. And so we talked about the
Speaker 1: archaeology and I needed to sort out just a general
Speaker 1: understanding of archaeology. So we talked about the processes of
Speaker 1: verification of the site, and we learned about the drama
Speaker 1: of the Fulsome site, and that there were other sites
Speaker 1: that were probably as legit as Fulsome that had human
Speaker 1: points with old Ice age mammals, but they didn't count
Speaker 1: because of the way they were excavated and understood and
Speaker 1: in and found different way. So that was really interesting.
Speaker 1: The third well, and then we just established what happened
Speaker 1: to the Fulsome site, which was thirty two bites and
Speaker 1: Antick was killed by human hunters and the only reason
Speaker 1: we know that we would have thought they got struck
Speaker 1: by lightning. And I'm gonna come back to that, Josh,
Speaker 1: had it not been for the twenty ish stone points
Speaker 1: that were found amongst the bones, and that there were
Speaker 1: fractures in bones that were clearly impact fractures from stone points.
Speaker 1: So while these animals were alive, humans were chunking spears
Speaker 1: allowed darts. We don't know. You will learn whether it
Speaker 1: was spears or allowed of darts in part four. And
Speaker 1: there is question. Okay, I have figured they were and
Speaker 1: gen Le, when you talk to people, they almost everyone
Speaker 1: just for sure says, yeah, they were add but when
Speaker 1: we talked to the expert on Adeladdles, there is question
Speaker 1: because you cannot necessarily determine an ad ladle point based
Speaker 1: upon its size as compared to some of the bigger
Speaker 1: arrow points. And my future guests who you don't know
Speaker 1: who it is yet he he talks about I mean,
Speaker 1: he just dives into it big time, probably Addles, but
Speaker 1: it's not definitive. So we talked about that, and then
Speaker 1: in part three is when we talked about gourmet butchering,
Speaker 1: and then we talked about the cultural impact of dating
Speaker 1: human arrival in North America back you know, seven eight
Speaker 1: thousand years further than we thought. But what y'all think,
Speaker 1: what y'all think about the gourmet butchering stuff? You know
Speaker 1: that that was very interesting to hear because one of
Speaker 1: my biggest questions about the whole thing is, you know,
Speaker 1: if we're talking about a small group of people, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe fifty people, why did they want to kill thirty
Speaker 1: two bison? I mean that's just a huge pile of work,
Speaker 1: you know, thinking about you know, thirty to forty thousand
Speaker 1: pounds of meat. Why did they need to kill all that? What?
Speaker 1: What drove them to kill that many. Why didn't they
Speaker 1: kill five? And you know, say, hey, we gotta work
Speaker 1: cut up, cut out for us? They were Americans, Why
Speaker 1: killed five if you can kill thirty? But but you
Speaker 1: know the fact of them thinking, well, I'm just gonna
Speaker 1: take you know, there was no sense of of ethic
Speaker 1: hunting ethic back then, So the idea of the gourmet butchering.
Speaker 1: You know, they might have just seen, hey we'll get
Speaker 1: thirty two tongues out of this. You know, there was
Speaker 1: no thought process inside of that. So I I felt
Speaker 1: like that kind of helped me understand the thought process
Speaker 1: behind it of of these ancient people's doing. You know,
Speaker 1: the question too would be why wouldn't they kill I mean,
Speaker 1: you're you're your people that are living. It's almost hand
Speaker 1: the mouth. I mean, there is no you're not storing
Speaker 1: up at five oh one K for ten years down
Speaker 1: the roads. You are literally killing stuff that can not
Speaker 1: A five o one ks hopefully does a lot of
Speaker 1: the finances. Yeah, I feel is a nonprofit retirement account. Okay, okay,
Speaker 1: so the four oh one K, they don't have four
Speaker 1: oh one case, they have one case. They don't have
Speaker 1: any case. And the only security for the future that
Speaker 1: they have is what they've killed today and whatever the
Speaker 1: preservation techniques would have been, which could have been the
Speaker 1: ice and snow and them storing the meat in the
Speaker 1: snow through the winter, or they made pemmican. There was
Speaker 1: a whole section about or melts. Are that talking to
Speaker 1: me about pemmican? Which I just we just couldn't then. Well,
Speaker 1: I mean they would have used the meat to make pemmican.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, they did they make it back then, they
Speaker 1: believed they did. Where they would have have been a
Speaker 1: mixture of meat and berries and other stuff fried out
Speaker 1: and flattened, and they could have it could have lasted,
Speaker 1: you know, months. Could they not also smoked the meat?
Speaker 1: I'm presuming you know, I think they're hunter together like
Speaker 1: banned societies today that will kill a giraffe and you know,
Speaker 1: you've got fifteen pounds of meat and there's twenty five
Speaker 1: of them, and they'll smoke the meat to preserve it,
Speaker 1: to preserve it. You know, it's not rock solid preservation,
Speaker 1: but it's better than just letting it go bad and
Speaker 1: wasting it. Yeah, for sure. So the question would just
Speaker 1: be why wouldn't they kill as many as they possibly could?
Speaker 1: Because they would not have. I mean, it wouldn't have
Speaker 1: been even in the thought process for them to think,
Speaker 1: you know what, we're gonna let a couple of these
Speaker 1: guys go. We presume there was not that thought process. Well,
Speaker 1: if they're like, what do Steve Ronnella mentioned that they
Speaker 1: took the hides, and you know, could it be possible
Speaker 1: they didn't take all the meat, but they took the
Speaker 1: what meat they needed. Well, used the hides to build
Speaker 1: shelters and tps or whatever you in their huts were calmed.
Speaker 1: Was that brought out? Was that well, that's a good
Speaker 1: That is a great answer to a potential potential answer
Speaker 1: to the question of why they killed that many. If
Speaker 1: they weren't going to use all the meat, presumably they
Speaker 1: used all the hides because there were no tailbones, zero tailbones,
Speaker 1: and the tailbones were left in the hides when they
Speaker 1: carried him off. I think, jujus beat all your experts.
Speaker 1: What do you think? I'm not sure, but I thought
Speaker 1: about leaving all those folsome points. How hard it was
Speaker 1: to make those folsome points, how long it took to
Speaker 1: chisel out. But I guess it was deep in the
Speaker 1: animal and they couldn't pull it back out. But I thought, wow,
Speaker 1: if they could have taken those twenty points back with them,
Speaker 1: class classic mother like I would have come back from
Speaker 1: that hunt and you do would have been like Clay, baby,
Speaker 1: where's your Folsom points? And it had been like I
Speaker 1: broke up? But she would have been like Clay didn't.
Speaker 1: Daddy worked hard for those, whereas was Dr Meltzer able
Speaker 1: to determine the points that we're at the Fulsome Museum
Speaker 1: where those legit, No, we don't. None of those that
Speaker 1: we saw at the Fulsom Museum were from the Fulsom site.
Speaker 1: None of them. All the points from the Falessome site
Speaker 1: are in big museums, and there's several that are unaccounted
Speaker 1: for don't and they might be this one I was
Speaker 1: looking for that show. You know what, if I had
Speaker 1: thought about it, why ethan gift, I would have got
Speaker 1: a fulsome replica. They are. They're one of the coolest
Speaker 1: stone points I've ever seen. I want one now, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I know, they're They're awesome, the way they're so thin
Speaker 1: and delicate and so they're beautiful. Yeah, they're awesome. You know.
Speaker 1: It's one of the those things that if you didn't
Speaker 1: know it was beautiful if no one, if you didn't
Speaker 1: know the backstory, you'd look at the point and you
Speaker 1: just go, oh, cool stone point. But when you know
Speaker 1: the history, and after episode number four, every household in
Speaker 1: America is gonna want a fulsome record point foreshadow in
Speaker 1: this is not foreshadow and this is like a straight
Speaker 1: up shadow. We make a fulesome point on episode like
Speaker 1: clicking clack make it. I wonder if like the Fulesome
Speaker 1: people's ran into the Clovis people's and they were like
Speaker 1: judging their points, like we talk about that too. I'm
Speaker 1: being dead serious because like those clos points, they're okay,
Speaker 1: But have you seen these fulsome points technology differences? Hey,
Speaker 1: I want to bring up a couple I had a
Speaker 1: couple of comments. I had a buddy of mine, Scott Brown,
Speaker 1: a good friend of mine. He wrote me and he
Speaker 1: sent me a link to an article of something that
Speaker 1: happened pretty recently where nineteen cows were killed by lightning.
Speaker 1: There's a big, big pile of cows and all of
Speaker 1: their tailbones were evaporated, right, and the lightning shaped these
Speaker 1: stones into the stone points. Well, he wasn't trying to
Speaker 1: say that that's what happened but he was. He was
Speaker 1: just bringing up a good point, he said, He said,
Speaker 1: have you ever thought about a lightning strike? Four? Because
Speaker 1: it is unusual how the bones were piled up, and
Speaker 1: there's lots of reasons why that didn't happen. Number one,
Speaker 1: the stone points, but they could have been struck by
Speaker 1: lightning and then fulsome hunters came by and found him
Speaker 1: and butchered him. But that would not explain Dr Meltzer
Speaker 1: if he's listening to this right now, which I'm hoping
Speaker 1: he's not. Uh, he would like want to like fight
Speaker 1: me for saying that, because they did find impact fractures
Speaker 1: in a few bones, not many. I mean, it's not
Speaker 1: like every single bison they were able to see where
Speaker 1: it was. That would be, that would be you would
Speaker 1: expect not to find a bunt. That's right, That's right.
Speaker 1: I'm just trying to get my mind around and maybe
Speaker 1: this you talked about this more in the next episode.
Speaker 1: A spear with a stone head. I mean, I take
Speaker 1: my bow with a seventy pound draw weight and I shoot,
Speaker 1: and if I have a bad shot on a white tail,
Speaker 1: it hits the shoulder, and I mean it might crack
Speaker 1: a bone in there. For sure, but just my hand
Speaker 1: with a wooden shaft on a spear and a stone,
Speaker 1: I don't know if I could throw it hard enough
Speaker 1: to crack a rib. Yeah, that could have got literally
Speaker 1: to jab well. So there's a lot of things going.
Speaker 1: And what the fundamental thing is physics momentum the calculation
Speaker 1: of momentum, which is a calculation of the velocity and
Speaker 1: the mass of this thing. And when you start doubling, tripling,
Speaker 1: quadrupling the mask compared to the modern eras which we're shooting,
Speaker 1: which are in the four fifty s range, you start
Speaker 1: like multiply that times ten in the momentum, which moment
Speaker 1: them is. People that are familiar with ed Ashby's ideas
Speaker 1: are not his ideas, just kind of he made this
Speaker 1: famous and archery community. When you when you're talking about
Speaker 1: how much an arrow a projectile point will penetrate into something,
Speaker 1: the correct calculation to use as momentum because momentum measures
Speaker 1: of vector, which if a vector has a direction. You
Speaker 1: hear a lot of people talk about kinetic energy. That
Speaker 1: that's what people in the nineties used to talk about.
Speaker 1: We used to we used to do the kinetic energy.
Speaker 1: We used to mass times of velocity square. Well, the
Speaker 1: kinetic energy, but basically kinetic energy is not the right one.
Speaker 1: Momentum is And to answer your question, really we're go
Speaker 1: into great detail. Devin Pettigrew is the probably the nation's
Speaker 1: expert on addle addles and he has actually done experiments
Speaker 1: on bison carcasses with addleaddles, and I mean they just
Speaker 1: like punch right through them. You know, they probably would
Speaker 1: have found more impact fractures too. Weren't they taken weren't
Speaker 1: they taking rib racks out of there? You know, because
Speaker 1: if you're gonna shoot something or shooting that's a good point.
Speaker 1: It probably hauled off. I'm surprised Juju didn't think of that. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: because if you if if the main target on a
Speaker 1: bison is going to be as ribs, and then you
Speaker 1: were taking rib racks, you're taking away the evidence of
Speaker 1: probably where it went through. They were covering their tracks.
Speaker 1: They knew we were gonna be sniffing them out ten
Speaker 1: thou years later. Um, I'd like to read another in
Speaker 1: because my mother's here and uh she is, and she
Speaker 1: has asked me to be nice to people that write in.
Speaker 1: I would like to talk about this guy. Um No,
Speaker 1: it was actually really good. I love the last episodes
Speaker 1: on Fulsome and George mcjunkin. Here's this question, how did
Speaker 1: they know? It all happened in one day? Could this
Speaker 1: not have been a great place to herd and reliably
Speaker 1: make successful and repeatable kills? Given that it was said
Speaker 1: they could go there their whole lives without coming into
Speaker 1: contact with someone outside of relations, and that they were
Speaker 1: probably in groups of around fifteen, doesn't it make sense
Speaker 1: that killing thirty two is a little excessive? He says
Speaker 1: with them, I would think any hudder would want to
Speaker 1: care for their tools, and killing so many at one
Speaker 1: time would seem This goes right back to what Juju said.
Speaker 1: As a hunter, I would think I would want to
Speaker 1: take care of my tools, and killing so many at
Speaker 1: one time would seem to be not only waste of resource,
Speaker 1: but potentially costing their time and hard work and making
Speaker 1: these tools. So basically, he says, could that many bison?
Speaker 1: Could it have been spread over multiple years in a
Speaker 1: unique kill site. Yes, this is a honey hooleive killing
Speaker 1: tree That makes a ton of sense. What do you
Speaker 1: think that I think that the guy and I'll let
Speaker 1: him take my place on the render? Wow? Yeah, Nick
Speaker 1: Brown that it must be from Canada. He said cheers
Speaker 1: didn't didn't they say that they could like good bones
Speaker 1: when they were laid down in sentiment the sections that
Speaker 1: were white or how long they stayed white. It would
Speaker 1: be interesting to hear Dr Meltzer tell us why that
Speaker 1: that is wrong, because he probably would. But presumably if
Speaker 1: I mean, if you, I don't think they could whittle
Speaker 1: it down to if it was even just a couple
Speaker 1: of years, like maybe it was a five year period.
Speaker 1: I don't know that they would be able to go
Speaker 1: to that much detail it all. That's a great I mean,
Speaker 1: because if you've got to if they're they find this
Speaker 1: little box canyon and the you know, the first time
Speaker 1: it happens, they get a few of these bison, there
Speaker 1: are no dummies. They're just gonna keep going for days
Speaker 1: and leave this thing behind. And it worked perfect. I mean,
Speaker 1: you get a good spot when you're hunting, you never
Speaker 1: forget that spot never, and you're gonna go back. Yeah,
Speaker 1: well it I'm not I'm not saying i'd give this.
Speaker 1: I give Nick credit for coming up with a good idea.
Speaker 1: I really believe if Meltzer were here, he would be
Speaker 1: able to say, Well, because, man, I'm telling you, the
Speaker 1: amount of research that they did on this site and
Speaker 1: the the technology that they that they used to understand
Speaker 1: the stratification over those animals and the what was going
Speaker 1: on with erosion is just mind blowing. And that's part
Speaker 1: of the book that I couldn't even follow. It was
Speaker 1: just so technical. What do you think did they have, uh,
Speaker 1: any estimation of the number of people involved? Well, we
Speaker 1: have no idea. Well, I talked about couldn't be. I mean,
Speaker 1: thirty two could be a very small number if I've got,
Speaker 1: you know, a million people in my group, even though
Speaker 1: I know there wouldn't be that, right, they said, I
Speaker 1: mean that there was you know, you got a little
Speaker 1: community of three people or something. I mean, well, okay,
Speaker 1: So they they believe that these people were in much
Speaker 1: smaller groups than that, just by the size of their
Speaker 1: camps in different places. They think they stayed in groups
Speaker 1: of about twenty five and at different times of the
Speaker 1: year would come together. So but could it have been
Speaker 1: a hundred people? Sure, yeah, it could have been. And
Speaker 1: they don't know what time of year it was, either
Speaker 1: the fall, okay, so it you know, I'm just thinking
Speaker 1: if it was closer to winter than they could have
Speaker 1: preserved him in the cold weather a lot better. Uh,
Speaker 1: But they think it was the fall, and they well,
Speaker 1: they know it was the fall based upon the teeth
Speaker 1: of the baby calves. And but so let's just say
Speaker 1: it would have been September. Meltzer said, you know, September October,
Speaker 1: and it was colder back then. I mean, it was
Speaker 1: in the end of the ice age. I'm just thinking,
Speaker 1: I'm thinking in terms of white tail, you know. But
Speaker 1: they bison don't just walk around in twos and threes.
Speaker 1: There it's an entire herd and there's calves, and they
Speaker 1: basically found a herd slaughter. Okay, here's another, there's another.
Speaker 1: Probably it's probably not gonna be multiple years because they're
Speaker 1: looking at their looking at the behavior of the animals
Speaker 1: as well well, because it's a cow calf herd, a
Speaker 1: cow cal So if it had been a mix of
Speaker 1: bulls and cows and calves, that's a good that's good point.
Speaker 1: I still give Nick credit for having a good idea, Like, Nick,
Speaker 1: did they have plans to excavate further? You said that
Speaker 1: was a sixty bus sixty square. It appeared to me
Speaker 1: to be very small the area they had actually excavated.
Speaker 1: But when I brought that up to Dr. Meltzer, he
Speaker 1: didn't think that. He just kind of acted like that.
Speaker 1: It was kind of silly for me to think that,
Speaker 1: because probably it's a big site that they excavated. I mean, archaeologists,
Speaker 1: you know, they might look at a place like half
Speaker 1: as big as this room, and they might spend two
Speaker 1: years inside of it. So the fact that it was
Speaker 1: you know, maybe seven sixty by sixty, which would be
Speaker 1: like a ten yard bowshot by a ten yard bowshot.
Speaker 1: He he thought that they found everything. He really did. Well.
Speaker 1: They said they didn't find any evidence of their their
Speaker 1: their living quarters or camping or anything that they got
Speaker 1: to be something nearby. I've got it, yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: four five Juju goes back to full sum. I'm seeing
Speaker 1: like Indiana Jones music, Give her a whip, give her
Speaker 1: a we go camping in the woods. I mean, these
Speaker 1: guys are hunter gathers there on the move. There, twenty
Speaker 1: some out of them, and they're carrying everything on their backs.
Speaker 1: You know, two years after camping in a spot on
Speaker 1: a piece of land, you'd never know. I camp there
Speaker 1: and I've got a tent in the stove and all
Speaker 1: kind of drive my truck in there. They're packing even
Speaker 1: lighter than that. Yeah, you know, they're not, it's not there.
Speaker 1: The campsites that they find, they're typically looking at fire,
Speaker 1: you know, charcoal residue, and then just bones and whatnot
Speaker 1: of what they ate because they were eating meat, and
Speaker 1: then stone points. I mean, like, that's about it. And
Speaker 1: then if it's in some kind of if it's in
Speaker 1: some situation where it can be preserved, whether it's a
Speaker 1: really arid place that doesn't have a lot of moisture
Speaker 1: that gets covered up quickly, or if it's in a
Speaker 1: cave or you know. But yeah, I mean, just the
Speaker 1: idea that we could go back and find where they
Speaker 1: camped is to me kind of wild. I think that
Speaker 1: you could. I was I can't remember who said it,
Speaker 1: but I was pretty taken back by um the gentleman's
Speaker 1: comment that even though you might not have art like
Speaker 1: cave paintings from this period, that there art most likely
Speaker 1: would have been in songs and stories and so like
Speaker 1: immaterial mark immaterial art. So when culture shows up, which
Speaker 1: is immediately when you have us as humans arrived, everything
Speaker 1: you talked about with like being uniquely human. It really
Speaker 1: added a whole another layer on top of the Fulsome site.
Speaker 1: For me is clearly these people, however it went down,
Speaker 1: they're working together, and they're working in mass and you
Speaker 1: don't have people working together without culture and relationships and stories,
Speaker 1: and that kind of blew my mind. It's like, wow,
Speaker 1: that goes all, that goes all the way. But you know,
Speaker 1: there were there were other parts of the world where
Speaker 1: we do have evidence during that time of art and
Speaker 1: music and stuff. Just for whatever reason, the Fulsome hunters
Speaker 1: and the way they lived we don't have evidence of it,
Speaker 1: which I was introduced to a new term by my
Speaker 1: future guest Devin Pettigrew called preservation bias. Preservation bias, though,
Speaker 1: is this idea that we are only looking at and
Speaker 1: studying stuff that there is physical material evidence left by,
Speaker 1: and so we we find stuff like stone points and think,
Speaker 1: oh man, this whole culture was based around stone points.
Speaker 1: But that's just the thing that lasted. So what what's
Speaker 1: all the other stuff that didn't last? You know, I
Speaker 1: loved it so much. When Steve talked about he brought
Speaker 1: up the idea of what kind of a day was this?
Speaker 1: And it's think about this ten thousand years later, we
Speaker 1: are devoting this all this time of us talking about
Speaker 1: one single day in the life. Theoretically we're devoting so
Speaker 1: much now to this one single day. You would have
Speaker 1: had to have thought that this was a pretty unique
Speaker 1: day for them. But then, like Steve said, if you
Speaker 1: were just a freezing American household, what are the chances
Speaker 1: that you're gonna freeze it when something radically unusual is happening.
Speaker 1: And so, you know, his point was this was probably
Speaker 1: just a day in the park for these guys to go,
Speaker 1: or maybe a day of the season. You know, we
Speaker 1: talked about that potentially being a honey hole. Maybe that
Speaker 1: was you know, September October there there. What do you think,
Speaker 1: I mean, do you think this was unusual or this
Speaker 1: was just normal? This is just what falsome hunters did? Well,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean, no one knows. Uh. I
Speaker 1: would think it would be fairly normal occasionally, if that
Speaker 1: makes any sense. I mean, it's like you hunting, Dan,
Speaker 1: I mean some some days you have or some maybe
Speaker 1: every four or five years you might have ten or
Speaker 1: fifteen deer come by, or you know, and most most
Speaker 1: years and you're lucky to have one or two. But uh,
Speaker 1: you know, I think to survive, they had to have
Speaker 1: days like that occasionally. It would be my thinking, but
Speaker 1: that would be an unusual, unusual day. Think about the
Speaker 1: preservation bias of that. Though. The chances of us finding
Speaker 1: something really unusual would be wildly statistically improbable, would it not.
Speaker 1: The fact that we found anything is statistically improbable. But
Speaker 1: then whatever, you if you find something, there had to
Speaker 1: be a whole lot of that happening in order for
Speaker 1: you to find it. So yeah, I think it's gonna
Speaker 1: be somewhat kind of like garious. Juji, if your life
Speaker 1: was frozen in time on a Tuesday afternoon, what would
Speaker 1: you be doing? Praying you out of prison? Any number
Speaker 1: of things, Planning for Thanksgiving, dinning for Christmas next year,
Speaker 1: taking notes, deciding not to take that one you ju
Speaker 1: nwcom is a legend where she comes from in the
Speaker 1: school systems. I think the best way to demonstrate this
Speaker 1: is your trip to this bar. Oh wow, someone there.
Speaker 1: I don't know if that's too off the well. I mean,
Speaker 1: you've opened up a whole kind of the one time,
Speaker 1: the one time I went into this bar the one time.
Speaker 1: So if we were just randomly find you if you
Speaker 1: would have been thousand years later and clays remains are
Speaker 1: at the line. Bar I bet that happened once in
Speaker 1: his whole life. I have a thought there. I just
Speaker 1: looked up Maslow's model before we started this, and they've
Speaker 1: changed it. This is crazy. But when I was in
Speaker 1: college in the seventies, early seventies, late sixties, Maslow's model. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, and the very first one was security. I mean,
Speaker 1: you don't worry about a full wheeler. You're not worrying
Speaker 1: about shopping for Christmas. You're worried about where's my next
Speaker 1: meal coming from? And so their whole life, I would
Speaker 1: say they had didn't move up to that next section
Speaker 1: of insurance or security or whatever it might be. I mean, yeah,
Speaker 1: for a nine oh twelve our system or you know
Speaker 1: whatever you're gonna make up next. Uh, but uh, totally
Speaker 1: different in the way we are. You just think it's
Speaker 1: so unusual that we have so much time to go
Speaker 1: monkey around. I mean, you know, we work forty hour week.
Speaker 1: I mean, what do you do with the rest of
Speaker 1: that time? I mean we're out monkey and stuff up.
Speaker 1: And we were human experience compared to the vast majority
Speaker 1: of humans that have lived on planet Earth. I mean,
Speaker 1: you remember those statistics about hundred and seventeen billion Homo
Speaker 1: sapiens that have ever lived seven point eight billion on
Speaker 1: the planet today. Of humans that have ever lived, there's
Speaker 1: no demographic data on them because their lives are lost
Speaker 1: before history was recorded. I remembered, sir, Hey, I remember
Speaker 1: my dad. I mean, when when I was a kid,
Speaker 1: I mean, it was like we didn't have time for
Speaker 1: all this recreation. I mean, you know, I mean, it
Speaker 1: wasn't like, you know, we're going out and eat two
Speaker 1: or three times a week. You know, we weren't. I mean,
Speaker 1: you know, it was just remember I remember you. So
Speaker 1: when we when I was a kid, I remember us
Speaker 1: going to a piece of property or something, and you
Speaker 1: were oftentimes looking for a piece of land or something,
Speaker 1: and we talked about the view. You know, boy, this
Speaker 1: this is a pretty view on this property, and that
Speaker 1: view gave it value. And I remember you told me,
Speaker 1: you said, man, back when we were kids, people didn't
Speaker 1: think like that. People people bought a piece of property
Speaker 1: because they could make a living or homestead on it,
Speaker 1: or like they weren't they weren't thinking about this aesthetic
Speaker 1: things that we now attribute value to. So when you
Speaker 1: think about those people, what they did. They got up
Speaker 1: in the morning and they had their coffee and they
Speaker 1: weren't talking about some fishing trip like Josh would be doing.
Speaker 1: They're trying to catch a fish. We got to feed
Speaker 1: the fan. Yeah, yeah, now that's a very that That
Speaker 1: point is what most impacts me about understanding who these
Speaker 1: people were. It's just they lived radically different lives in us.
Speaker 1: Yet we're just like us. Absolutely, they were just they
Speaker 1: were just like us. If you would have took one
Speaker 1: of their babies and put it into Juju Nucam's class
Speaker 1: at her school, that kid could have grown up and
Speaker 1: been the president of the United States. And you know,
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, go ahead, dad, Well you know, I just
Speaker 1: say that we can adapt to anything. I mean, we
Speaker 1: could actually go back to almost those times and get adapted.
Speaker 1: Get you know how we've handled COVID when when they
Speaker 1: put through me into basic training. Man, I could have
Speaker 1: spent the rest of my life in basic training. I
Speaker 1: mean I just adjusted to it. So hard times we
Speaker 1: adjust to it. You know. We we looked, we set
Speaker 1: new goals and objectives and we enjoy accomplishing them. And uh,
Speaker 1: I think these were happy people and they love life.
Speaker 1: You know, when you started describing the things, how would
Speaker 1: you like to live in this extreme cold weather? How
Speaker 1: would you like to wear animal stuff? I was going
Speaker 1: I like it. I like that. I like this, do
Speaker 1: you heard me? And then when you got to the park,
Speaker 1: and afterday, I go, I don't like this. I mean
Speaker 1: I probably would have enjoyed where the thing is is.
Speaker 1: You wouldn't have known any different, That's right, That's right,
Speaker 1: you would. You would not have had anything to compare
Speaker 1: it to. They thought they were living high on the hog.
Speaker 1: That's right. When I was in college, if I had
Speaker 1: known that these girls were gonna have sell phones and
Speaker 1: all this stuff they have, I would have been unhappy.
Speaker 1: But I wasn't unnappy because I had no idea I'd
Speaker 1: ever have a cell phone or all the technology. But
Speaker 1: are you going to leave your listeners wondering what Juju
Speaker 1: was doing in a bar? Okay? Yeah? Yeah, so this
Speaker 1: is what happened, is uh And again we're talking about
Speaker 1: how famous and loved Juju is in the community down there.
Speaker 1: And uh so one time me and me and Bear
Speaker 1: were hunting and we lost our mule. Okay, we're out
Speaker 1: in public land and the mule got away from us.
Speaker 1: We were camping, mule got away from us, ran off.
Speaker 1: We come back to camp, mule's gone, and where I
Speaker 1: was hunting, the closest civilization was this establishment that was
Speaker 1: a bar okay and um so it was. It was
Speaker 1: a Saturday night and we hiked off in the dark.
Speaker 1: Because I'm not gonna go into full detail, you could
Speaker 1: watch me tell this story and its entirety on the
Speaker 1: Barony Magazine YouTube channel. And so I was afraid that
Speaker 1: we were camped way in the back country and it
Speaker 1: was dark. We came back to the camp and the
Speaker 1: mules gone. I figured, the mules run back to the truck,
Speaker 1: and it's gonna be just freaking havoc out, you know,
Speaker 1: by itself. And I figured somebody was gonna drive by.
Speaker 1: I see a mule with a broke lead rope, and
Speaker 1: I think I was dead or something. And so I
Speaker 1: envisioned like the sheriff's coming and looking for me and whatnot.
Speaker 1: So I said, bear, we gotta get that. We gotta
Speaker 1: go find this mule. Hauled my saddle out all the
Speaker 1: way out, like carrying the saddle on my shoulder along
Speaker 1: with our whole camp and uh, get back down to
Speaker 1: the truck and the mule's not there. Well, I drive
Speaker 1: to the closest place, which was this bar, and I
Speaker 1: got and I walked its Saturday night. I pull up
Speaker 1: and Bear was a young kid at the time. This
Speaker 1: was years ago. Bear was like ten years old, And
Speaker 1: I go, Bear, if I don't come out, you, if
Speaker 1: I'm not back here in ten minutes, you're getting this
Speaker 1: truck and you drive until you find somebody. What did
Speaker 1: you think that that was actually a joke. I didn't
Speaker 1: say that. What I did tell him was was I
Speaker 1: just said, Bear, you hunker down in this car, this truck,
Speaker 1: and do not answer. I mean, if somebody walks over
Speaker 1: here to this truck, just high okay. It's a rough place.
Speaker 1: And so I walk into this bar and I'm fully
Speaker 1: decked out and camo and I walked through the door
Speaker 1: and the place is just bouncing, you know, with country music,
Speaker 1: and uh there's I don't know, ten or fifteen people there,
Speaker 1: and there's just a classic bar, you know, and the
Speaker 1: music is so loud you can't hear anything. And I
Speaker 1: I walk up to the bar and the bartender pretty
Speaker 1: quickly comes over to me and I just go. I
Speaker 1: just remember I said this almost word for words. This
Speaker 1: is like a bad joke. My name's Clay Nukem. And
Speaker 1: I lost my mule and I'm yelling this, okay because
Speaker 1: the music so loud. I lost my mule, and I
Speaker 1: want to leave you my phone number in case somebody
Speaker 1: sees it or you find it and you can call me.
Speaker 1: And he goes, what he can't hear it? So I
Speaker 1: yell at even louder, and by this time everybody in
Speaker 1: the whole bar is looking at me, and they're all listening.
Speaker 1: And I guess because I'm yelling so loud, they all
Speaker 1: can hear me. Can the music down? Yeah? I mean
Speaker 1: I should have said that. I should have said Alexis
Speaker 1: turned the music down. Um. And so I just remember
Speaker 1: yelling at this guy and he's just like looking at me,
Speaker 1: just like and like, I got two people down from me, goes,
Speaker 1: have you ever been in there before that? MW? And
Speaker 1: I go, doll, the mule has never been back there,
Speaker 1: and he goes, you'll never find that, MW. I remember that,
Speaker 1: and then and then standing up, I just want to
Speaker 1: make it clear, and I'm talking to this bartender, and
Speaker 1: then to my left like seven or eight people down
Speaker 1: at the end of the bar. This guy, this guy
Speaker 1: stands up, and I'm telling you, he was wobbling just
Speaker 1: a little bit, and he said, what's your name? And
Speaker 1: I looked at him and I realized he's talking to me,
Speaker 1: and I said Clay Knuckle. And he said, is your
Speaker 1: mother Judy Knuckle? And I go and like a thousand
Speaker 1: things are going through my mind, mainly why does this
Speaker 1: man know my mother's name. I didn't know what to say.
Speaker 1: I didn't know if we're about to get in a fight.
Speaker 1: I didn't know you i'm your father. So I just
Speaker 1: kind of bow up and I say, yes, she is.
Speaker 1: And he got his his his his countenance turned from
Speaker 1: like stern and inquisitive. He just kind of like melted
Speaker 1: into a smile and he said, she's my teacher. He
Speaker 1: didn't say he didn't say she was my teacher. He said,
Speaker 1: she is my teacher. This is a grown man, like
Speaker 1: older than me. And he loved Juju so much that
Speaker 1: apparently he is like Juju Nukam was my teacher, And
Speaker 1: did you do a lot of teaching on the bars, Judy?
Speaker 1: And so I came home. I went back and I
Speaker 1: said I walked in and I said, Juju, well, they
Speaker 1: sure know your name down at the bar, and I
Speaker 1: had a few questions for her. Did you find the mule? Yes,
Speaker 1: the mule came back to our original campsite. No, it
Speaker 1: was a mule. I don't have name. She was wild
Speaker 1: as a wind, which nearly killed me multi time. Good
Speaker 1: reason to get a Yeah. I warned the guy that
Speaker 1: I gave her to or that I traded her too.
Speaker 1: I told him, I said, she'll kick you and she'll
Speaker 1: run off with you. I fear that he didn't tell
Speaker 1: the God that I have not heard. You cannot find
Speaker 1: that man to save your life. I was honest with him.
Speaker 1: All right, Hey, merry Christmas. Than I enjoyed it. I
Speaker 1: enjoyed cookies and thank you. All right we got before
Speaker 1: we send you off on the render. Today we got
Speaker 1: a little song for you, Josh Spellmaker. We wish you
Speaker 1: a merry Christmas. We wish you a merry Christmas. We
Speaker 1: wish you a merry Christmas. And happy do We wish
Speaker 1: you a merry Christmas. We wish you a merry Christmas.
Speaker 1: We wish you a merry Christmas. Happy do you? Good time? Widings?
Speaker 1: We bring to you and the kid tidings for Christmas
Speaker 1: and a happy new Year. We wish you a merry Christmas.
Speaker 1: Wish you a merry Christmas. We wish you a merry Christmas.
Speaker 1: Harry Christmas, our good buddy, Brent Reeves couldn't make it
Speaker 1: to the Render Christmas party. Very sad, but here's a
Speaker 1: message from Brent. Hey. This is Brent Reeves with a
Speaker 1: bear Grease, Render Hate. I couldn't be at the party today.
Speaker 1: I know it was a good time because there was
Speaker 1: a lot of good folks there. I got everybody the
Speaker 1: presence that they wanted, except for you, Clay. I'm I'm sorry, buddy.
Speaker 1: They just don't make a Steve Vanilla action figure. Best
Speaker 1: I could come up with was an old naked g
Speaker 1: I Joe we found in the attic that belonged to
Speaker 1: my son. I made him a suit close out of
Speaker 1: a out of a squirrel eyed that we were saving
Speaker 1: the type flies with. That is just going to have
Speaker 1: to do until we can come up with something different.
Speaker 1: I do want to thank you guys for allowing me
Speaker 1: to be a part of this and wish every one
Speaker 1: of you and everyone listening a very very merry Christmas.
Speaker 1: What do you think that was terrible,