WEBVTT - Democracy Hangs in the Balance 0:00:11.840 --> 0:00:14.880 Good morning, peeps, and welcome to wik a Effi Daily. 0:00:15.120 --> 0:00:20.240 On this Martin Luther King Junior Holiday, I want to 0:00:20.239 --> 0:00:24.680 start off today by talking about something that I literally 0:00:24.800 --> 0:00:32.040 just experienced and it helped me clarify some of the 0:00:32.080 --> 0:00:35.720 feelings that I've been having as of late. You know, 0:00:35.800 --> 0:00:43.920 there will be no doubt every lawmaker, Republican Democrat, over 0:00:44.000 --> 0:00:52.280 the course of today um manipulating and using Martin Luther 0:00:52.440 --> 0:01:00.000 King's words and his life to excuse their white suppose 0:01:00.000 --> 0:01:07.800 I'm as saying, to excuse their lies that they believe 0:01:07.920 --> 0:01:15.200 that because they provide holidays and pageantry and recognition to 0:01:15.400 --> 0:01:19.560 black leaders, that they had a hand in assassinating, whether 0:01:19.640 --> 0:01:27.000 by character or physically, that they can somehow redeem themselves. 0:01:28.200 --> 0:01:33.479 And what I have been sitting with over the past 0:01:33.520 --> 0:01:39.800 couple of years really is the rage that I have, 0:01:40.080 --> 0:01:43.040 and I talk about this often. I talk about this, 0:01:44.000 --> 0:01:50.440 you know, often, because it's real, and the rage that 0:01:50.520 --> 0:01:52.960 I have about the lies that I've been told about 0:01:52.960 --> 0:02:00.360 this country from its founding to the present time is true. 0:02:00.440 --> 0:02:06.680 Us living inside of the quote that if you don't 0:02:06.920 --> 0:02:09.880 understand or learn your history, that you are destined to 0:02:09.919 --> 0:02:15.280 repeat it. We are living inside the reality of that text. 0:02:18.600 --> 0:02:26.079 People don't really understand what Martin Luther King Junior in 0:02:26.120 --> 0:02:31.320 his thirties, mind you, what he did, what he meant, 0:02:33.040 --> 0:02:39.960 and what his life meant and his struggle meant to 0:02:40.600 --> 0:02:47.320 advancing equity and justice in this country. White people love 0:02:47.360 --> 0:02:51.840 to hold him now after he is dead, as they 0:02:51.880 --> 0:02:58.960 do many of our leaders who chose nonviolence in the 0:02:59.040 --> 0:03:03.240 face of unreal, lenting violence. They applaud it, but they 0:03:03.320 --> 0:03:09.640 never question why they have allowed the white community to 0:03:09.840 --> 0:03:19.960 be able to be terrorists, to be able to beat 0:03:20.000 --> 0:03:25.000 Black people for wanting to be treated with dignity and respect, 0:03:25.160 --> 0:03:38.440 to pull veterans off of buses following their tours and 0:03:38.560 --> 0:03:44.360 beat them to blindness. Right, stories that we just learn 0:03:44.400 --> 0:03:48.080 about over the course of time because they have been buried. 0:03:48.920 --> 0:03:54.600 They've been buried as a way to justify this systematic 0:03:56.040 --> 0:04:08.520 dismantling of black humanity. I'm reflecting now too, on the 0:04:08.560 --> 0:04:16.640 fact that my rage really is massed grief, that what 0:04:16.760 --> 0:04:21.120 I am feeling each and every day. And forgive me, 0:04:21.200 --> 0:04:25.000 because I may actually get incredibly emotional, but what I've 0:04:25.040 --> 0:04:27.200 been feeling each and every day over the past couple 0:04:27.200 --> 0:04:32.839 of years, and I have been projecting as rage is 0:04:32.920 --> 0:04:38.560 really this profound loss, and what did I lose exactly 0:04:40.920 --> 0:04:43.960 the sense that collectively is a nation, that we had 0:04:43.960 --> 0:04:52.200 a desire to be better, that each generation had a 0:04:52.320 --> 0:04:58.599 shared value in wanting to strive to not only produce 0:04:58.720 --> 0:05:02.640 more and be more in this capitalistic structure and this 0:05:03.600 --> 0:05:08.240 hamster wheel of productivity that we have been duped into, 0:05:09.200 --> 0:05:14.400 but into the expansiveness of allowing people to show up 0:05:14.440 --> 0:05:18.480 as they are and respect that just by virtue of 0:05:18.520 --> 0:05:26.960 them being. And what I realize, and what becomes crystallized 0:05:27.040 --> 0:05:31.800 with each and every passing day as we witness the 0:05:31.880 --> 0:05:37.960 crumbling of our republic, is that what I had believed 0:05:37.960 --> 0:05:44.680 to be true what guided me into my professional path 0:05:44.920 --> 0:05:54.760 that has been so entwined with my personal path, because 0:05:54.800 --> 0:05:59.080 I believe in justice right, and I don't believe that 0:05:59.160 --> 0:06:06.480 because you may be black or Latin X or Muslim 0:06:06.760 --> 0:06:15.719 or queer, or a woman, or live at the intersection 0:06:15.839 --> 0:06:22.200 of multiple identities, that you're undeserving or that you need 0:06:22.240 --> 0:06:28.120 to somehow consistently prove your worth, because I feel like 0:06:29.960 --> 0:06:36.920 that is what white America has always demanded of anyone 0:06:37.000 --> 0:06:39.760 who was not white, who was not siss, who was 0:06:39.800 --> 0:06:44.840 not Christian, who was not male, is to prove to 0:06:44.880 --> 0:06:49.279 me that you are worthy to stand alongside me, to 0:06:49.360 --> 0:06:55.000 sit at my table, not a table that I made right, 0:06:59.480 --> 0:07:05.039 but to me your worthiness. And then I get, as 0:07:05.279 --> 0:07:10.320 white America, to be the judge, jury, and executioner on 0:07:10.440 --> 0:07:16.000 whether or not you have made your case. And I 0:07:16.040 --> 0:07:20.840 think that what I will say that I appreciate most 0:07:21.000 --> 0:07:28.800 about young people right now is that they are occupying 0:07:28.840 --> 0:07:32.000 a different set of being that I don't need to 0:07:32.040 --> 0:07:35.440 prove shit to you right that I am worthy by 0:07:35.520 --> 0:07:41.640 virtue of my birth. That I don't need to dress 0:07:41.800 --> 0:07:47.640 like you, speak like you, love like you, assimilate into 0:07:48.600 --> 0:07:54.880 your confines of what you believe American or Americanism is. 0:07:58.440 --> 0:08:03.840 And I can't help thinking that and knowing. It's not 0:08:03.920 --> 0:08:06.840 even a thinking, it's a knowing. It's a knowing that 0:08:06.920 --> 0:08:13.240 everything that we are experiencing right now is in is 0:08:13.280 --> 0:08:20.320 a direct result of a black man and a black 0:08:20.360 --> 0:08:30.640 family occupying the White House that was built by enslaved Africans, 0:08:30.680 --> 0:08:37.640 that we as a nation, for one brief moment, believed 0:08:37.720 --> 0:08:45.080 that we could grow past our foundation, the foundation being 0:08:45.160 --> 0:08:52.840 white supremacy, being patriarchy, and being violenced that when Barack 0:08:52.840 --> 0:08:56.600 Obama said that we are not Read States, we are 0:08:56.640 --> 0:08:59.000 not Blue States, we are the United States. That I 0:08:59.080 --> 0:09:03.880 actually believe that, and I believe that at that moment 0:09:07.840 --> 0:09:13.120 that we were living in what I can only understand 0:09:13.240 --> 0:09:23.160 now in this divine capsule, not by the creation of 0:09:23.200 --> 0:09:33.560 this man, but by the creation of the answered dreams 0:09:33.559 --> 0:09:47.119 and prayers of an enslaved and brutalized people that they 0:09:47.360 --> 0:09:51.400 could continue to pray and to dream for something that 0:09:51.480 --> 0:09:55.400 they would never in fact experience, and that their children 0:09:55.440 --> 0:09:58.440 may never in fact experience, and their grandchildren may never 0:09:58.480 --> 0:10:01.760 in fact experience. But they believed in something that was 0:10:01.840 --> 0:10:08.280 so above and beyond where they were currently stationed. That 0:10:08.440 --> 0:10:17.920 is divine thinking. And what I realize that has been 0:10:17.960 --> 0:10:32.400 the fuel of my rage is how just how brief 0:10:34.320 --> 0:10:43.679 the experience was. It doesn't mean that the impact wasn't felt, 0:10:44.600 --> 0:10:52.360 but the experience of that hopefulness, of that light, of 0:10:52.400 --> 0:10:57.880 the feeling that we did this grand, beautiful thing together, 0:10:58.200 --> 0:11:08.160 that we moved outside of the initial understanding of the 0:11:08.200 --> 0:11:13.400 American project into being something bigger and bolder and more expansive. 0:11:13.960 --> 0:11:21.200 And I realize now just how extraordinary those eight years were. 0:11:23.040 --> 0:11:27.319 And I think about it in the way that posts 0:11:27.320 --> 0:11:36.000 the Civil War, that the brief experience of Reconstruction, the 0:11:36.120 --> 0:11:43.520 election of black officials, the ability at that time for 0:11:43.640 --> 0:11:46.760 black men to then be able to vote. Like I 0:11:46.960 --> 0:11:56.160 think about these brief moments, and then what would follow 0:11:57.559 --> 0:12:05.800 the audaciousness of Reconstruction, which only lasted for about twelve years, 0:12:06.880 --> 0:12:14.320 would be one hundred years of Jim Crow. And in 0:12:14.440 --> 0:12:23.360 recognizing that truth, what follows the eight years of the 0:12:25.120 --> 0:12:31.359 Obama era? Will it be a hundred years of Trumpism? 0:12:31.440 --> 0:12:37.600 Will it be a hundred years of darkness? One hundred years? 0:12:41.800 --> 0:12:51.319 A friend of mine posted a performance by the bassist 0:12:51.360 --> 0:12:58.880 and jazz musician Esperanza Spalding at the White House during 0:12:58.880 --> 0:13:03.400 the Obama years for Barack Obama's Poetry Slam where he 0:13:03.440 --> 0:13:08.520 had the rapper and actor common I believe that he 0:13:08.760 --> 0:13:13.920 was like the host that evening and so many amazing, 0:13:14.679 --> 0:13:20.240 amazing artists of color performed. And my friend just recently 0:13:20.280 --> 0:13:28.040 posted Esperanza Spalding's performance and it was her cover of 0:13:28.360 --> 0:13:37.200 Lauren Hills Tell Me, Tell Him. And I pulled it 0:13:37.280 --> 0:13:40.520 up and I was watching it and it's a three 0:13:40.559 --> 0:13:45.440 and a half minute clip and it is quiet. It 0:13:45.600 --> 0:13:48.800 is nothing but the base and the majesty of her 0:13:48.960 --> 0:13:59.559 voice in this White House, and I burst into tears. 0:14:00.640 --> 0:14:04.760 I burst into tears listening to it, because it was 0:14:04.800 --> 0:14:13.160 when I had the aha moment that they were able 0:14:13.200 --> 0:14:22.680 to rip away everything, to erase everything, and in its 0:14:22.760 --> 0:14:31.760 place put something so vapid, so hateful, so gross, in 0:14:31.880 --> 0:14:43.040 its place, to remind us that we are undeserving, unworthy 0:14:43.200 --> 0:14:48.440 of being in command of the people's house, of being 0:14:48.680 --> 0:14:55.800 in leadership of this country. So the rage that I 0:14:55.920 --> 0:15:03.160 have is truly masked grief that I haven't really grieved 0:15:03.760 --> 0:15:12.040 the loss of not the Obamas as people, but what 0:15:12.240 --> 0:15:17.440 that moment in time symbolized, not only to the country 0:15:17.480 --> 0:15:30.160 but to the world, progress, hope, a brighter future, all 0:15:30.200 --> 0:15:35.320 of which is gone now and every day is like groundhogs, 0:15:35.360 --> 0:15:43.600 a day of hell, of anxiety, of fear, of hopelessness, 0:15:43.640 --> 0:15:59.840 of darkness. So on this Martin Luther King Holiday, I 0:16:00.080 --> 0:16:04.200 think it's not only important to reflect on how we 0:16:04.320 --> 0:16:09.200 got to where we are right now, but to also 0:16:10.720 --> 0:16:27.520 light candles, say prayers, meditate on the death of possibility, 0:16:27.600 --> 0:16:31.560 because I need to be able to mourn what we 0:16:31.680 --> 0:16:37.080 have lost in a very real and definitive way in 0:16:37.200 --> 0:16:42.240 order to be able to even imagine what comes next, 0:16:44.000 --> 0:16:48.160 Because right now I feel like we are trapped inside 0:16:48.840 --> 0:16:55.680 of the eye of a hurricane and everything around us 0:16:55.800 --> 0:16:59.120 is being torn to shreds, and it is slow moving, 0:16:59.160 --> 0:17:07.359 and it is hover and it shows no sign of 0:17:07.560 --> 0:17:11.840 releasing us from its grasps. And so in order for 0:17:11.920 --> 0:17:18.800 us to even imagine, dream and turn those dreams into 0:17:18.920 --> 0:17:26.600 plans and steps, I think that today, for me anyway, 0:17:26.880 --> 0:17:32.080 is going to be a day of mourning what was, 0:17:32.200 --> 0:17:37.399 so that I can settle my soul, put it to rest, 0:17:39.920 --> 0:17:45.000 and figure out what the purpose is going forward, what 0:17:45.080 --> 0:17:49.080 the work is right? Because we always say keep fighting, 0:17:49.160 --> 0:17:54.240 keep fighting, don't give up. But what are exactly are 0:17:54.240 --> 0:18:04.800 we fighting for? Who exactly are we fighting? Because these 0:18:04.840 --> 0:18:11.640 people that are currently destroying our country are the spawn 0:18:11.720 --> 0:18:14.480 of those who have always sought to destroy our country. 0:18:17.560 --> 0:18:26.800 They aren't aging out and dying, they are reincardinating. So 0:18:26.840 --> 0:18:33.360 with the acknowledgement of that, where do we go? What 0:18:33.440 --> 0:18:38.960 do we do? And so for today, instead of planning, 0:18:39.440 --> 0:18:46.359 instead of plotting, instead of screaming, I'm going to sit still, 0:18:49.200 --> 0:18:54.040 I'm going to shed tears. I'm going to be quiet 0:18:55.119 --> 0:19:00.640 and see what comes. And I wish that for all 0:19:00.680 --> 0:19:05.400 of you as well. Coming up next is my conversation 0:19:05.840 --> 0:19:10.119 with our friend Glenn Kirshner on the latest that is 0:19:10.200 --> 0:19:14.080 unfolding at the Justice Department, the latest that is unfolding 0:19:14.160 --> 0:19:17.399 in our quests for justice, and whether or not that 0:19:17.600 --> 0:19:28.479 is actually going to happen. I wish you well, friends, folks. 0:19:28.600 --> 0:19:31.000 You know that I'm always very excited when we have 0:19:31.200 --> 0:19:35.040 our friend, the host of Justice Matters and MSNBC legal analyst, 0:19:35.080 --> 0:19:37.480 Glenn Kirshner join us each and every week here on 0:19:37.600 --> 0:19:42.040 woke f to help guide us through what is becoming 0:19:42.119 --> 0:19:47.920 an increasingly just treacherous road that I believe that America 0:19:48.040 --> 0:19:52.280 is on when it pertains to seeking justice at all. 0:19:52.800 --> 0:19:55.879 You know, Glenn, I just want to jump right into 0:19:56.040 --> 0:20:01.240 the biggest news right which is the arrest by the FBI, 0:20:01.440 --> 0:20:07.959 the indictment of Stuart Rhodes, who is the leader of 0:20:08.000 --> 0:20:15.080 the oath Keepers, who has been in conservative Republican spaces 0:20:15.119 --> 0:20:19.040 for over a decade. As as we've been learning more 0:20:19.200 --> 0:20:25.560 about him. He is a former Army paratrooper who has 0:20:25.600 --> 0:20:30.440 a law degree from Yale. And I say all these 0:20:30.480 --> 0:20:33.440 things not as if to pump him up, but for 0:20:33.560 --> 0:20:38.920 us to recognize, like I said on previous shows, that 0:20:39.600 --> 0:20:42.200 we have been fooling ourselves, Glenn, I think in thinking 0:20:42.240 --> 0:20:44.680 that the people that we are dealing with are dumb, 0:20:45.320 --> 0:20:48.440 thinking that the people that we are dealing with are 0:20:48.600 --> 0:20:54.359 under educated, right, are easily duped by Trump and Trumpism, 0:20:54.400 --> 0:20:57.520 and are just kind of along for the ride like puppets. 0:20:58.240 --> 0:21:03.080 That's not who Stuart Rhodes is. Is he? No? But 0:21:03.280 --> 0:21:06.960 I don't know that he took any constitutional law classes 0:21:07.000 --> 0:21:13.480 at Yale when he was endeavoring to get his JD. So, 0:21:13.920 --> 0:21:18.440 you know, anybody who is fooled by Donald Trump's rhetoric 0:21:18.720 --> 0:21:22.960 or persuaded by Donald Trump's nonsense. I don't like to 0:21:23.040 --> 0:21:25.119 use the word dumb, but you know, you're not a 0:21:25.119 --> 0:21:28.880 critical thinker. You can't assess for yourself what's going on. 0:21:29.440 --> 0:21:33.080 You know this, this is a really consequential indictment. I 0:21:33.119 --> 0:21:37.840 think we've only indicted a seditious conspiracy charge something like 0:21:37.880 --> 0:21:40.600 half a dozen times, dating back to the nineteen thirties. 0:21:40.840 --> 0:21:44.119 Sometimes we have some success with him in court, sometimes 0:21:44.160 --> 0:21:48.240 we don't. This is an important charge and when you 0:21:48.280 --> 0:21:51.840 read the forty eight page indictment signed by the current 0:21:52.000 --> 0:21:55.000 US Attorney for the District of Columbia, Matt Graves, who 0:21:55.160 --> 0:21:58.600 has been in the job since November fifth. You know, 0:21:58.840 --> 0:22:03.640 it's it's block busters stuff because you know, there there 0:22:03.680 --> 0:22:08.800 were four cooperating witnesses from the oathkeepers who flipped, and 0:22:09.200 --> 0:22:12.400 once that happened, you know, there was a lot of 0:22:12.680 --> 0:22:14.840 work that needed to be done by the FBI and 0:22:14.920 --> 0:22:18.399 the prosecutors to take all of the information they provided, 0:22:18.800 --> 0:22:22.960 not only sort of through their testimony before the grand jury, 0:22:22.960 --> 0:22:26.880 which I'm sure they did, but all of the electronic 0:22:26.960 --> 0:22:31.639 information and investigate it. And you know, anytime you get 0:22:31.680 --> 0:22:34.760 a huge dump of electronic information, you have to go 0:22:34.800 --> 0:22:41.080 about the hard work of subpoenaing dozens of electronic service providers, 0:22:41.119 --> 0:22:45.160 whether it's social media or cell phone providers or cell 0:22:45.320 --> 0:22:49.679 site information to figure out where each cell phone was 0:22:50.160 --> 0:22:52.480 at the moment it was communicating with other cell phones. 0:22:52.520 --> 0:22:55.719 So these things take a long time, you know, and 0:22:55.960 --> 0:22:58.720 in an investigation like this, you don't want it to 0:22:58.760 --> 0:23:02.840 take a long time. Cause we saw the crimes on video, 0:23:03.160 --> 0:23:06.639 and that's why we're so darn frustrated. We know the 0:23:06.720 --> 0:23:10.480 crimes were committed, we know the crimes were inspired and 0:23:10.640 --> 0:23:14.679 incited by Donald Trump. That's reinforced in this forty eight 0:23:14.720 --> 0:23:18.200 page indictment, by the way, so we're like, when are 0:23:18.240 --> 0:23:23.280 you going to take down the middle level criminal players, 0:23:23.359 --> 0:23:26.679 never mind the upper echelon. Because as important as this 0:23:26.760 --> 0:23:29.480 indictment is, and yes, I want to embrace it, I 0:23:29.520 --> 0:23:32.320 want to celebrate it, but and I don't want to 0:23:32.359 --> 0:23:35.879 begin to complain about the fact that they're not working 0:23:35.960 --> 0:23:39.480 their way up. But the Department of Justice, by returning 0:23:39.520 --> 0:23:45.520 this indictment indicted the lower level criminal fish for more 0:23:45.640 --> 0:23:50.000 consequential criminal charges. The next step, Danielle, has got to be, 0:23:50.119 --> 0:23:53.760 in my estimation, moving your way up to at least 0:23:53.760 --> 0:23:58.000 the middle level criminal fish, the Bannons, the Giuliani's, the 0:23:58.080 --> 0:24:03.640 don Juniors, the Eastman's, the clarks and the politicians. Right, 0:24:03.800 --> 0:24:07.040 they have been complicit in some of what was going on. 0:24:07.520 --> 0:24:12.760 I understand how long and difficult and challenging and involved 0:24:12.760 --> 0:24:18.200 these investigations are investigated, gang cases, reco cases, conspiracy cases. 0:24:18.520 --> 0:24:22.640 They take a long time, they're work intensive, but democracy 0:24:22.920 --> 0:24:25.320 still hangs in the balance. So I think we need 0:24:25.359 --> 0:24:28.000 to begin working our way up to the middle level 0:24:28.080 --> 0:24:32.399 and ultimately the upper echelon of the criminal fish. You know, 0:24:32.600 --> 0:24:34.959 one of the things that has been standing out to 0:24:35.000 --> 0:24:38.359 me with regard to what is being uncovered in this 0:24:38.440 --> 0:24:42.080 indictment is first of all, Stuart Roads and it's been 0:24:42.119 --> 0:24:44.280 all over cable news, so I know that you have 0:24:44.560 --> 0:24:47.840 either talked about it or watched it. A tweet that 0:24:47.880 --> 0:24:50.000 he not a tweet. Excuse me, I keep saying that 0:24:50.240 --> 0:24:54.600 a signal text that he sent out on December eleventh, 0:24:55.080 --> 0:25:00.520 right weeks ahead of January sixth, where he said that 0:25:00.560 --> 0:25:05.160 if Joe Biden and I'm paraphrasing Joe Biden is certified 0:25:05.200 --> 0:25:08.680 as president of the United States, it's going to be bloody, right, 0:25:09.680 --> 0:25:15.280 and that people need to get prepared. These people, these 0:25:15.320 --> 0:25:19.320 oath keepers, they are not just quote unquote regular joes 0:25:19.600 --> 0:25:23.560 like mainstream media has decided with regard to these as 0:25:23.560 --> 0:25:27.639 they refer to them MAGA tourists, right. These are people 0:25:27.680 --> 0:25:32.920 who are former and current military law enforcement first responders. 0:25:33.720 --> 0:25:37.720 They had heavy artillery that was hanging out in Virginia 0:25:37.960 --> 0:25:41.520 but a couple of miles away from the Capitol building. Oh, 0:25:41.560 --> 0:25:46.639 they're posting this, Glenn. They posted right on social media. 0:25:47.000 --> 0:25:51.280 So again I ask, and you know, because I have 0:25:51.400 --> 0:25:55.440 to tell like the honest truth, because I said, let 0:25:55.520 --> 0:25:59.439 this let Stuart Rhodes had been black let Stuart Rhodes 0:25:59.520 --> 0:26:02.439 had been in Latin X. Let him have been a 0:26:02.520 --> 0:26:06.040 Muslim American. Do you think that the Justice Department would 0:26:06.080 --> 0:26:08.720 be waiting to dot all of their eyes and cross 0:26:08.760 --> 0:26:11.199 all of their tees before they haul him in. And 0:26:11.240 --> 0:26:16.439 so it isn't just about how much work it takes 0:26:16.480 --> 0:26:19.840 to put together these cases, but it's about the urgency 0:26:20.400 --> 0:26:24.520 behind it, right, and about recognizing a threat when a 0:26:24.560 --> 0:26:28.240 threat is actually present. So again I say, you know, 0:26:28.400 --> 0:26:31.679 how is it that all of this information was hanging 0:26:31.680 --> 0:26:35.520 out in the open for anybody at the FBI, the CIA, 0:26:35.640 --> 0:26:39.639 the Justice Department to have seen and we're here over 0:26:39.800 --> 0:26:44.520 three hundred and sixty five days later. You know, it's funny, Danielle, 0:26:44.560 --> 0:26:48.040 because you just put your finger on the part of 0:26:48.080 --> 0:26:53.000 the indictment that made my heart sink, and that was 0:26:53.080 --> 0:26:56.640 the fact that they had an arsenal in a motel 0:26:56.840 --> 0:27:01.399 just across the river from the Capitol. And when I 0:27:01.440 --> 0:27:04.840 read this indictment, I thought to myself, how can it 0:27:04.880 --> 0:27:08.080 be that there are so many people in the oathkeepers 0:27:08.119 --> 0:27:15.240 who are involved in this incredibly dangerous operation and all 0:27:15.280 --> 0:27:20.359 of our law enforcement agencies missed it? Because what in 0:27:20.440 --> 0:27:23.919 a perfect world or even a competent world. What should 0:27:23.960 --> 0:27:27.879 have happened was this plot should have been discovered and 0:27:27.920 --> 0:27:31.920 there should have been search warrants prepared to be executed 0:27:32.320 --> 0:27:36.720 on the motel rooms where they were storing their arsenals 0:27:36.720 --> 0:27:40.919 of weapons. And yet none of that happened. How can 0:27:40.960 --> 0:27:44.840 that be? That's problematic. And the other thing is you 0:27:45.800 --> 0:27:49.879 mentioned how these efforts are still ongoing. And if you 0:27:49.880 --> 0:27:52.919 look at the very end of the factual part of 0:27:52.960 --> 0:27:57.480 the indictment, starting on page thirty there is a section 0:27:57.600 --> 0:28:02.679 labeled co conspirators can in you plotting after the January 0:28:02.760 --> 0:28:05.320 sixth attack on the Capitol. And here is how the 0:28:05.440 --> 0:28:10.760 factual recitation ends in the indictment. On page thirty thirty two, 0:28:11.280 --> 0:28:17.080 it says, on inauguration Day, January twenty twenty one, James 0:28:17.119 --> 0:28:21.680 messaged other individuals quote after this, if nothing happens, it's 0:28:21.760 --> 0:28:26.639 war civil war two point zero and Rhodes messages to 0:28:26.800 --> 0:28:34.000 other others to organize local militias to oppose President Biden's administration. 0:28:34.960 --> 0:28:40.280 This war is ongoing. And if DJ doesn't recognize the 0:28:40.360 --> 0:28:45.880 sense of urgency there, um, we're in trouble. You know again, 0:28:46.360 --> 0:28:50.600 you know, I tie this back to Florida Governor Ronda 0:28:50.680 --> 0:28:55.160 Santis a couple of months ago saying at a press 0:28:55.200 --> 0:28:59.840 conference that he wanted to institute his own Florida Army 0:29:00.480 --> 0:29:03.760 Right that would only listen to him, be beholden to him, 0:29:03.920 --> 0:29:07.760 be funded by the state of Florida, and there would 0:29:07.800 --> 0:29:12.560 be no federal oversight. Are we not connecting the dots here? 0:29:13.120 --> 0:29:16.360 For everything that is being said out loud? Do you 0:29:16.440 --> 0:29:21.000 think that there is the caution? And I don't know 0:29:21.040 --> 0:29:24.880 what else to call it, Glenn right, because I'm using 0:29:24.920 --> 0:29:27.760 euphemisms because there are lots of other words that I 0:29:27.800 --> 0:29:30.880 want to use. But do you think that this slow 0:29:31.000 --> 0:29:36.360 walking right is it going to be to our ultimate detriment? 0:29:36.680 --> 0:29:41.080 Because they are telling us out loud what they're doing. 0:29:41.320 --> 0:29:43.960 They want a civil war. Not only do they want one, 0:29:44.000 --> 0:29:47.440 they're prepared for it. They're armed, they have folks in 0:29:47.640 --> 0:29:53.600 every apparatus of law enforcement, of military right. They enter 0:29:53.680 --> 0:29:55.560 the Capitol building. One of the things that stood out 0:29:55.600 --> 0:30:00.400 for me a military stack right. This was and just 0:30:00.960 --> 0:30:05.600 taurists that were lost or people that were quote unquote 0:30:05.640 --> 0:30:11.960 swept up, they were organized in their formation. How How 0:30:12.520 --> 0:30:15.560 are we not wrapping our arms around this and picking 0:30:15.640 --> 0:30:19.560 up these people? Every single day and bringing not just 0:30:19.920 --> 0:30:25.760 seditious conspiracy, Glenn, but terrorism charges. And I ask you 0:30:25.800 --> 0:30:28.680 that what is the difference between these things and what 0:30:28.880 --> 0:30:34.560 is the heaviest weight that could be pushed at these people. So, 0:30:36.400 --> 0:30:41.040 first of all, there is no criminal charge of domestic terrorism. 0:30:41.080 --> 0:30:47.040 There are enhancements, sentencing enhancements for terrorists inspired violence, but 0:30:47.680 --> 0:30:51.000 that's something I think that should be addressed with legislation. 0:30:51.640 --> 0:30:55.520 But anytime I hear myself saying we need more legislation, 0:30:55.640 --> 0:30:57.440 I mean, when you look at how many laws we 0:30:57.520 --> 0:31:01.160 have on the books that go unenforced, it's laughable. So 0:31:01.400 --> 0:31:06.040 more laws are not necessarily the be all and end 0:31:06.080 --> 0:31:10.400 all of addressing this problem. But my real concern right 0:31:10.440 --> 0:31:14.320 now is we're going after the foot soldiers of the insurrection. 0:31:14.960 --> 0:31:18.960 Maybe not quickly enough, maybe we're not getting enough of 0:31:19.000 --> 0:31:23.600 them charged as we would like. But they're only the 0:31:23.640 --> 0:31:27.000 foot soldiers of the insurrection. If you leave the command 0:31:27.080 --> 0:31:33.960 structure of the insurrection intact, the politicians from Trump on down, 0:31:34.160 --> 0:31:37.960 many of the politicians who are still active members of Congress, 0:31:38.040 --> 0:31:41.840 guess what, they just recruit another batch of foot soldiers. 0:31:42.800 --> 0:31:46.719 So taking the foot soldiers out is important, has to 0:31:46.760 --> 0:31:51.280 be done. But it only accomplishes so much. In the 0:31:51.320 --> 0:31:53.240 long run. It's like putting a band aid on a 0:31:53.280 --> 0:31:57.000 gaping chess wound. You've got to take the command structure out. 0:31:57.360 --> 0:32:00.800 And that is Trump, that's any member of Congress who 0:32:00.880 --> 0:32:04.600 may have given reconnaissance tours to these people who ended 0:32:04.680 --> 0:32:08.120 up attacking the capital. And let's remember there were members 0:32:08.120 --> 0:32:13.560 of Congress giving capital tours on January fifth, at a 0:32:13.640 --> 0:32:19.360 time when the COVID prohibitions said nobody can come into 0:32:19.440 --> 0:32:24.520 the capital unless you're there on official congressional business. And 0:32:24.600 --> 0:32:28.440 you have members of Congress giving constituent tours and violation 0:32:29.040 --> 0:32:33.440 of those rules, well, those seem to be reconnaissance tours. 0:32:33.600 --> 0:32:38.040 Those people have to be held accountable or you're just 0:32:38.400 --> 0:32:44.520 enabling insurrection, you know I, Because here's the thing. The 0:32:44.640 --> 0:32:48.400 next insurrection is occurring right like it's in the works. 0:32:48.760 --> 0:32:53.880 We thought initially and was said that one six was 0:32:53.920 --> 0:32:57.920 address rehearsal. And I fully believe that, right. I fully 0:32:57.960 --> 0:33:04.840 believe that there are other plans that our current law enforcement, 0:33:04.920 --> 0:33:11.640 our current systems of justice are not paying attention to. 0:33:12.400 --> 0:33:16.120 You tweeted out that Steve Bannon should be on the lookout. 0:33:16.800 --> 0:33:22.400 What are the charges outside of seditious conspiracy that we 0:33:22.480 --> 0:33:25.440 can be looking at for these the mid level people 0:33:25.480 --> 0:33:27.520 that you were talking about, and to me, they're kind 0:33:27.560 --> 0:33:31.200 of mid high right when you're when you're leading a 0:33:31.240 --> 0:33:34.880 war room, right with Juliani and Steve Bannon. Then then 0:33:34.920 --> 0:33:38.479 you got the coordination of Steve Rhodes on the ground 0:33:38.600 --> 0:33:43.600 with the foot soldiers coordinating like a tactical attack and 0:33:43.720 --> 0:33:50.480 having a quick force task like this was an operation, right, 0:33:50.560 --> 0:33:54.960 Like I just what are what are the other charges? 0:33:55.000 --> 0:33:57.640 What are we looking at? And how long? If it 0:33:57.680 --> 0:34:00.920 took us over a year to get here sadly to say, 0:34:01.080 --> 0:34:06.760 we're pushing up against midterms, right, like, how is this 0:34:06.800 --> 0:34:13.000 getting done? So? Yeah, the reason I felt like Bannon 0:34:13.120 --> 0:34:16.520 might be in the crosshairs now after we saw the 0:34:16.640 --> 0:34:21.960 details released in yesterday's indictment is because everything Bannon described 0:34:22.080 --> 0:34:26.000 in advance of January sixth, it's going to be swift, 0:34:26.080 --> 0:34:28.560 it's going to be moving, it's going to be devastating. 0:34:28.600 --> 0:34:31.280 It's going to be like something we've never seen before 0:34:31.600 --> 0:34:37.839 come to DC. That is basically foreshadowing of exactly what 0:34:37.880 --> 0:34:42.800 the oathkeepers did on January six So here's the good news, 0:34:42.840 --> 0:34:47.120 you know, courtesy of the four oathkeepers who have flipped 0:34:47.120 --> 0:34:50.200 and are cooperating with the FBI and the federal prosecutors. 0:34:50.480 --> 0:34:54.600 And this indictment, I predict, will cause even more oathkeepers 0:34:54.640 --> 0:34:56.880 to flip. And there's a lot of talk in the 0:34:56.920 --> 0:35:01.120 indictment about encrypted apps being used to communicate securely. Well, 0:35:01.640 --> 0:35:05.080 that's great. It sounds high speed and safe and secure 0:35:05.560 --> 0:35:09.440 until people begin to flip and tell the FBI and 0:35:09.480 --> 0:35:15.040 the prosecutors what those communications were on those encrypted apps. 0:35:15.440 --> 0:35:18.200 And I have to tell you if there are people 0:35:18.239 --> 0:35:21.960 like Steve Bannon, if there are members of Congress, if 0:35:21.960 --> 0:35:27.040 there are staff members of members of Congress who communicated 0:35:27.160 --> 0:35:33.000 in any way encrypted apps, cell phones, text messages, social media, DMS, 0:35:33.120 --> 0:35:38.439 or otherwise with any of these oath keepers, they will 0:35:38.520 --> 0:35:42.120 not be sleeping soundly after they see this indictment that 0:35:42.280 --> 0:35:45.840 came down because they're gonna get got. It's a matter 0:35:45.880 --> 0:35:49.160 of time. It's taking too long. The closer we get 0:35:49.200 --> 0:35:52.640 to the midterms, I think the more problematic it becomes. 0:35:52.719 --> 0:35:55.000 I'm not one of those people who thinks it's a 0:35:55.040 --> 0:35:59.360