WEBVTT - Reid Hoffman Talks AI Outlook

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<v Speaker 1>Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, our next guest needs no introduction, but we're gonna

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<v Speaker 2>give them one anyway. He's a Silicon Valley legend. He

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<v Speaker 2>helped build PayPal. He co founded LinkedIn. He was an

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<v Speaker 2>early investor in Facebook and Airbnb. He was the first

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<v Speaker 2>investor in open Ai. He co founded the AI company

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<v Speaker 2>Inflection Ai. He's on Microsoft's board. He's a partner at

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<v Speaker 2>the VC firm Greylock Partners. He's a New York Times

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<v Speaker 2>bestselling author, and he's also a podcast we have read Hoffmans.

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<v Speaker 3>Great to be here. Thank you for you.

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<v Speaker 4>As we were just talking, it's the loudest environment where

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<v Speaker 4>we've ever done a radio show before it so hopefully

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<v Speaker 4>it'll work.

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<v Speaker 5>It's working so far, so far, so good.

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<v Speaker 2>But I have to ask you, are you a real

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<v Speaker 2>or am I talking to some sort of AI digital

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<v Speaker 2>twin round?

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<v Speaker 5>Well, and explain why I have to ask that question, please, So.

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<v Speaker 4>As you as you know, I did an interview with

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<v Speaker 4>myself where I was talking to my own digital twin

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<v Speaker 4>read AI, and.

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<v Speaker 3>I did it in order to kind of show that

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<v Speaker 3>not only obviously there's a.

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<v Speaker 4>Whole bunch of concerns, there's concerns and political and misinformation

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<v Speaker 4>and and and a deep makes and a bunch of

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<v Speaker 4>other stuff that are real concerns. But even here there's

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<v Speaker 4>optimism to look at what can we shaped towards. And

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<v Speaker 4>I wanted to show not just how that message and

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<v Speaker 4>so I was like, okay, well let me talk to

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<v Speaker 4>my own read AI and see how it works. And

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<v Speaker 4>so and the reason why you asked that question, of course,

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<v Speaker 4>and you said, well, wait a minute.

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<v Speaker 3>That was pretty good. It was we're here in person,

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<v Speaker 3>you can tell this is I'm the real.

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<v Speaker 5>Sounds like this looked like you. Yes, yeah, it is

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<v Speaker 5>like you looked.

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<v Speaker 4>Like video audio and the words we're all AI generated.

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<v Speaker 3>It was zero from me. It was other than mirroring off.

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<v Speaker 4>My earlier videos, mirroring off my earlier podcast.

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<v Speaker 5>Use your use your book to train as well.

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<v Speaker 4>Yes, yeah, it used all everything I written to good

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<v Speaker 4>answers the way read wouldn't answered.

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<v Speaker 6>We're all going to have digital twins someday, and we're

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<v Speaker 6>gonna use us.

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<v Speaker 5>We go to the DMV for me, So I think

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<v Speaker 5>we must.

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<v Speaker 4>It's certainly possible. Certainly, if you're a media person, you'll

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<v Speaker 4>have a digital twin. Certainly if you're a leader, you'll

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<v Speaker 4>have a digital twin because it'll be used in If

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<v Speaker 4>you're a lawyer, you'll have one because then people can

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<v Speaker 4>talk to your digital twins and maybe at a cheaper

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<v Speaker 4>rate the dog you are preparing for your meeting or

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<v Speaker 4>that kind of thing. So I think it will be

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<v Speaker 4>a stack of areas for digital twins that will be

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<v Speaker 4>very real.

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<v Speaker 3>But I'm not sure all eight billion people were.

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<v Speaker 2>Also district well, so so why should this excite us

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<v Speaker 2>and not scare us and want us to all move

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<v Speaker 2>to bunkers.

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<v Speaker 4>So it should be, but naturally it should both excite

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<v Speaker 4>and scare us.

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<v Speaker 3>The scaret is the negative is the.

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<v Speaker 4>Scas is of political misinformation, you know, things that are

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<v Speaker 4>going to be happening this year in the US until

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<v Speaker 4>we're in other major elections of democracy. It should scare

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<v Speaker 4>us because there's questions around a minute, what did someone

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<v Speaker 4>who created a deep make of me doing something or

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<v Speaker 4>saying something?

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<v Speaker 3>I really am poor? Like you know, like you know

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<v Speaker 3>how I.

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<v Speaker 4>Think Trump is a corruption in democracy against the rule

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<v Speaker 4>on what happens to your created I love Trump.

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<v Speaker 3>You know that would be obviously a problem.

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<v Speaker 4>And so there's all kinds of ways that there are

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<v Speaker 4>real problems are So on the other hand, we will

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<v Speaker 4>we will, as we always do with technology, to figure

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<v Speaker 4>out how to navigate and get that not perfectly but sufficiently,

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<v Speaker 4>and there will be great things like for example, that's

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<v Speaker 4>part of the reason I started showing me. Hey, look here,

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<v Speaker 4>I'm making a deep bake of myself and it's not

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<v Speaker 4>that bad.

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<v Speaker 6>You know, read when you sat down, I said, the

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<v Speaker 6>conversations we have a lot of blueberg and we've written

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<v Speaker 6>about this is here.

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<v Speaker 5>You have Lincoln kind of the social.

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<v Speaker 6>Media site, that kind of the social media site that

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<v Speaker 6>seems to be clean, pure, You can stress any conversations

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<v Speaker 6>so we can get it right. So how is that

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<v Speaker 6>kind of a guiding for since in terms of jenai

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<v Speaker 6>and how do you think about this? What are the guardrails?

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<v Speaker 6>How do we regulate it?

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, and so the good news is the mostly frontier

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<v Speaker 4>model companies, Microsoft, Open Ai, Google are all putting a

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<v Speaker 4>lot of energy in that kind of making these models

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<v Speaker 4>healthy participants within the US, but within the global kind

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<v Speaker 4>of media ecosystem, like don't generate fake inflammation, be civil,

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<v Speaker 4>you know, don't do hate speech, don't enabe it self harm.

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<v Speaker 4>They all put a lot of energy and a lot

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<v Speaker 4>of work in that, and I don't.

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<v Speaker 3>Can invest hundreds of millions of dollars and teams one

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<v Speaker 3>hundreds of people in order to do that.

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<v Speaker 4>Now, one of the challenges is is that some of

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<v Speaker 4>these models are an open source, and as an open source,

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<v Speaker 4>someone else takes the open source model to something that's

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<v Speaker 4>not any of that with that right, and that's part

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<v Speaker 4>of the reason why we still have to navigate this.

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<v Speaker 6>So you have trust so that we can navigate it

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<v Speaker 6>correctly and safely in the future AI.

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<v Speaker 3>So the ultimate answer is absolutely yes. That doesn't mean

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<v Speaker 3>that there aren't.

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<v Speaker 4>Potholes, you know, bumps in the road, under scrapes all

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<v Speaker 4>the rest, and I guarantee you there will be those two.

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<v Speaker 2>The US can't get Vladimir Putin not to invade in Ukraine.

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<v Speaker 2>The world can't get him not to stop fighting there.

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<v Speaker 2>What convinces you that we could.

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<v Speaker 5>Get a leader like him not to use AI? Oh bad?

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<v Speaker 3>Zero percent?

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<v Speaker 4>Like if you said that, uh that Hooton will be

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<v Speaker 4>using AI to disrupt the US elections, you know probably

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<v Speaker 4>support Trump because that's his exit strategy from Ukraine.

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<v Speaker 3>Uh, he will do that. One is no way of

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<v Speaker 3>having it. The defense is not getting him not to

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<v Speaker 3>do it.

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<v Speaker 4>The defense is integrating AI in our own tech platform.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm using our stronger AI in defects.

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<v Speaker 2>So essentially saying, okay, well, maybe you see something on

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<v Speaker 2>Facebook and met platforms might have developed something that says, Okay,

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<v Speaker 2>well this isn't necessarily.

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<v Speaker 5>Something that's true.

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<v Speaker 3>Yes, but do you.

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<v Speaker 5>Trust Do you trust Facebook to do that?

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<v Speaker 3>Actually?

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<v Speaker 5>So, and you have a deep history with the company, Yes,

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<v Speaker 5>I have a deep.

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<v Speaker 3>History of the company.

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<v Speaker 4>I actually have talked to Zucker Bigger about it, and

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<v Speaker 4>they're investing in it. I think they're making a real effort.

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<v Speaker 4>So I think like they're really try. I'm more worried

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<v Speaker 4>about Twitter that I am about Facebook on this matter.

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<v Speaker 5>Okay, why are you more worried about Twitter?

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<v Speaker 3>Well, because, looks Elon.

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<v Speaker 5>Musk is someone you also go way beastly.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, and look, Elon is a literally one of the

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<v Speaker 4>heroes of our generation.

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<v Speaker 3>You know, uh, Space and.

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<v Speaker 4>Kind of Starlink and Tesla and easy just amazing, amazing, amazing.

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<v Speaker 4>You wouldn't have any of this about it. It is

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<v Speaker 4>so spectacular. On the other hand, before he buys Twitter,

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<v Speaker 4>he's like, oh, we have this problem with robots and

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<v Speaker 4>then after he bought the lot trying to get out

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<v Speaker 4>of the and then after your body, oh what robots,

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<v Speaker 4>and you're like, oh, the robots are still there. There's

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<v Speaker 4>still like Internet Research Agency watching robot farms doing shit.

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<v Speaker 3>Are you doing anything about them? I'm not hearing anything.

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<v Speaker 5>To be fair, I did see I did see an

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<v Speaker 5>ad on.

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<v Speaker 2>Twitter recently with a deep bake of Jeff Bezos pushing

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<v Speaker 2>a cryptocurrency. It's a paid ad, yes, that has showed

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<v Speaker 2>up repeatedly in my feed obviously not a proved vice.

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<v Speaker 4>Yes, yes, yeah, And so therefore, what are you doing

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<v Speaker 4>about AI and j Well, you know, elon is so complex.

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<v Speaker 6>Back from Milkin, he did a conversation with Michael Milton.

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<v Speaker 3>He said, very important to have.

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<v Speaker 6>Maximum seeking AI and maximum curious AI. And then it's

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<v Speaker 6>taught not to lie nor do things that are not true.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, walk the lock, don't just lock the dock. Well,

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<v Speaker 3>can I ask? I'm as curious as we have.

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<v Speaker 6>All these conversations about jen AI. How is it going

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<v Speaker 6>to impact my life? How's it really going to impact

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<v Speaker 6>him's life, How's it really going to impact your life?

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<v Speaker 4>So here's a simple way of looking at all of

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<v Speaker 4>us are going to have a personal AI assistant that

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<v Speaker 4>it's going to be helping with us with its focus

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<v Speaker 4>on us, right, so it'll be like, Hey, what do

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<v Speaker 4>you need help with? Do you need help with figuring

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<v Speaker 4>out say something like like where to go? What's entertaining

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<v Speaker 4>to do you know in the cities and I or

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<v Speaker 4>Oh I'm having this, I'm trying to figure out this

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<v Speaker 4>thing with my kids. Oh, we can help you with that.

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<v Speaker 4>Oh I'm trying to figure this medical thing. Oh I

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<v Speaker 4>can help you with that. Oh, I'm trying to figure

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<v Speaker 4>out I had this difficult conversation with a coworker. Oh,

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<v Speaker 4>I'll talk to you about that. It will help us

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<v Speaker 4>with a whole range of things, and like, for example,

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<v Speaker 4>part of what we found an inflection was really surprising

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<v Speaker 4>to us and very positive.

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<v Speaker 3>Which has pides personal intelligence is.

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<v Speaker 4>People will stay, Oh, I got these eight ingredients with

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<v Speaker 4>my friends what should I name? Or my toaster broke

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<v Speaker 4>and I fixed it and you're like, actually, in fact,

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<v Speaker 4>it helps with all of that. So that's that human

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<v Speaker 4>amplification that's helping us navigate our lives, which is the

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<v Speaker 4>thing I guarantee will be.

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<v Speaker 5>That I love the ingredients in the Fridge part of it.

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<v Speaker 2>Hey, if you're just joining us, we're speaking to the

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<v Speaker 2>REDA Hoffmann, the PayPal of LinkedIn, of open AI, of

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<v Speaker 2>Inflection AI, of the podcast Possible. But this certainly goes

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<v Speaker 2>on read I'm wondering about winners and losers when it

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<v Speaker 2>comes to AI AI in terms of companies.

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<v Speaker 5>You're on the board of Microsoft. I'm mented a couple

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<v Speaker 5>of the.

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<v Speaker 2>Big companies that you've invested in, that you founded. Is

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<v Speaker 2>there a concern that we're just going to see the

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<v Speaker 2>big companies like Microsoft, like in video, like Amazon, like

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<v Speaker 2>meta platforms, they're going to be the only winners when

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<v Speaker 2>it comes to AI.

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<v Speaker 4>What I guarantee you is they're not going to be

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<v Speaker 4>the only one. They will be winners.

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<v Speaker 6>Right.

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<v Speaker 4>Satia has just done a masterful job, like like remember

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<v Speaker 4>it started with a.

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<v Speaker 3>Million dollars deal with a five O one C three.

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<v Speaker 4>I think in the first time in the history something

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<v Speaker 4>like that's happening, like genius strategy from talking and I

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<v Speaker 4>think it will be Uh, it'll across all of these companies.

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<v Speaker 4>I think they will have strong winds going in the future.

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<v Speaker 4>On the other hand, you know at bray Locke, we're

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<v Speaker 4>investing a whole bunch of AI company.

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<v Speaker 3>We do it reasonably well.

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<v Speaker 4>We have a whole portfolio that we're excited about. And

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<v Speaker 4>I think that the I think that it's just you

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<v Speaker 4>don't play the same game. It's a little bit like

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<v Speaker 4>and you said, hey, I gotta start up. I'm gonna

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<v Speaker 4>try to make a new desktop search company. You're like, well,

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<v Speaker 4>one of the difficults, right there is this company called Google.

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<v Speaker 3>It's a little challenging.

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<v Speaker 4>Okay, you know, I'm gonna make a new handset mobile

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<v Speaker 4>phone device. You're like, oh, there's this company called a

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<v Speaker 4>whole it's a little challenging. So you know, you don't

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<v Speaker 4>do it that way. But there's gonna be a whole

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<v Speaker 4>range of other AI companies.

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<v Speaker 3>The things that will like everything from opportunities that the large.

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<v Speaker 4>Tech companies just can't focus on, to taking interesting risk

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<v Speaker 4>and making that risk look good and then all of

0:10:57.559 --> 0:10:59.440
<v Speaker 4>a sudden building out ins and mean, so I think

0:10:59.480 --> 0:11:00.280
<v Speaker 4>there's gonna be rain.

0:11:00.400 --> 0:11:03.839
<v Speaker 3>The startups are well excited about ideas. We have podcasts.

0:11:04.000 --> 0:11:05.120
<v Speaker 3>We have a great podcast.

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<v Speaker 5>You have a great new podcast.

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<v Speaker 6>Tell us about possible, Well, tell us about it, like

0:11:11.120 --> 0:11:12.400
<v Speaker 6>you want to talk too.

0:11:12.960 --> 0:11:15.959
<v Speaker 3>What are the conversations you want to have, so for me,

0:11:16.320 --> 0:11:17.040
<v Speaker 3>it's possible.

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<v Speaker 4>It's too much of the dialogue is about technology being

0:11:21.320 --> 0:11:26.360
<v Speaker 4>dangerous to us. How we evolve this humanity, how we

0:11:26.520 --> 0:11:27.840
<v Speaker 4>become better and more human.

0:11:27.960 --> 0:11:29.360
<v Speaker 3>It's throd technology.

0:11:29.640 --> 0:11:34.520
<v Speaker 4>It's it's clothing, it's classes, it's it's it's food, it's cooking,

0:11:34.600 --> 0:11:35.920
<v Speaker 4>it's fired, it's buildings.

0:11:36.240 --> 0:11:36.880
<v Speaker 3>All of this is.

0:11:36.840 --> 0:11:39.840
<v Speaker 1>Technology that's helped us make us as the human names

0:11:39.880 --> 0:11:42.840
<v Speaker 1>we are. AI will be saying as the whole point

0:11:42.880 --> 0:11:46.800
<v Speaker 1>I'm on the Possible podcast used to say, this is

0:11:47.080 --> 0:11:49.880
<v Speaker 1>how technology can help us become more human, not to go,

0:11:50.000 --> 0:11:53.400
<v Speaker 1>oh my god, what's coming in technology. It's it can

0:11:53.480 --> 0:11:56.440
<v Speaker 1>be great for us, and it's not that hard to shape.

0:11:56.640 --> 0:11:59.560
<v Speaker 3>We just need to shape it. Whether it's AI, whether

0:11:59.600 --> 0:12:01.000
<v Speaker 3>it's just the use of phones.

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<v Speaker 4>And you know, obviously people like to talk about what

0:12:03.280 --> 0:12:05.400
<v Speaker 4>social networks and they go, wow, that's going to have

0:12:05.440 --> 0:12:08.040
<v Speaker 4>a talented It's like, well, look at LinkedIn. LinkedIn's work

0:12:08.080 --> 0:12:11.000
<v Speaker 4>out pretty well, it's doable. It's doable, so let's do it.

0:12:11.360 --> 0:12:13.080
<v Speaker 2>We don't want to end with something that everybody loves

0:12:13.080 --> 0:12:15.880
<v Speaker 2>to talk about politics.

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<v Speaker 6>We all agree.

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<v Speaker 2>Look, you've been open about your feelings about these some Trump,

0:12:21.280 --> 0:12:24.000
<v Speaker 2>do you help fund Eugene Carroll's definition of lawsuits against

0:12:24.080 --> 0:12:27.840
<v Speaker 2>the former president. There are a lot of business leaders

0:12:27.880 --> 0:12:30.720
<v Speaker 2>out there, some of them people you work with very closely,

0:12:31.040 --> 0:12:34.840
<v Speaker 2>to say that business under a President Trump administration was

0:12:34.880 --> 0:12:38.760
<v Speaker 2>better than business under a Biden administration. And that's why

0:12:38.800 --> 0:12:41.480
<v Speaker 2>we're in the corner of Donald Trump when it comes

0:12:41.480 --> 0:12:42.360
<v Speaker 2>to twenty twenty four.

0:12:42.720 --> 0:12:43.480
<v Speaker 5>What do you say to them?

0:12:43.920 --> 0:12:47.960
<v Speaker 4>So I understand the approach that Trump reason is more

0:12:48.040 --> 0:12:51.240
<v Speaker 4>regulatory lightweight than Biden. And by the way, generally speaking,

0:12:51.280 --> 0:12:54.120
<v Speaker 4>being more regulatory lightweight is a good thing. I try

0:12:54.160 --> 0:12:56.760
<v Speaker 4>to encourage the Biden administration to do that. On the

0:12:56.800 --> 0:12:59.360
<v Speaker 4>other hand, what's more fundamental is the rule of law.

0:13:00.000 --> 0:13:03.680
<v Speaker 4>Business works much much better with a healthy, strong rule

0:13:03.720 --> 0:13:04.040
<v Speaker 4>of law.

0:13:04.559 --> 0:13:06.840
<v Speaker 3>You do not want to have leaders who are literally

0:13:07.679 --> 0:13:08.520
<v Speaker 3>in a court.

0:13:08.600 --> 0:13:11.199
<v Speaker 4>Like had been convicted by a court of you were

0:13:11.240 --> 0:13:16.480
<v Speaker 4>slandering about your sexual assault and a jury found you guilty. Right,

0:13:16.920 --> 0:13:20.199
<v Speaker 4>we should be a rule of law country first. And

0:13:20.200 --> 0:13:21.800
<v Speaker 4>by the way, this is what's the business leaders. By

0:13:21.800 --> 0:13:24.079
<v Speaker 4>the way, rule of law is what makes great business.

0:13:24.440 --> 0:13:27.080
<v Speaker 4>That's the reason why actually Biden is a matter of

0:13:27.080 --> 0:13:30.480
<v Speaker 4>president for business, even though the regulatory thing won't be

0:13:30.520 --> 0:13:31.240
<v Speaker 4>exactly what you.

0:13:31.200 --> 0:13:33.040
<v Speaker 3>Want, and we'll have to work on it. But rule

0:13:33.040 --> 0:13:36.560
<v Speaker 3>of laws fundamental and to your perspective, your point of you, yes,

0:13:36.679 --> 0:13:37.640
<v Speaker 3>my mind, yes, business.

0:13:37.640 --> 0:13:39.599
<v Speaker 6>But I do wonder that you know, soon as you

0:13:39.720 --> 0:13:43.240
<v Speaker 6>look at the November election, that outcome, if it is

0:13:43.400 --> 0:13:48.000
<v Speaker 6>not another Biden White House present, former president from back

0:13:48.000 --> 0:13:49.840
<v Speaker 6>in the White House, what does it mean for the

0:13:49.840 --> 0:13:52.920
<v Speaker 6>tech industry or in terms of the rule.

0:13:52.720 --> 0:13:53.880
<v Speaker 5>Of laws not plowed?

0:13:54.120 --> 0:13:56.840
<v Speaker 4>Well, So, look, I there's the tech industry can pride

0:13:57.440 --> 0:13:58.640
<v Speaker 4>under either administration.

0:13:59.600 --> 0:14:03.800
<v Speaker 3>But I do think that if either buy nor trust stuff.

0:14:03.880 --> 0:14:06.120
<v Speaker 4>But if I think Trump's elected, I think history will

0:14:06.160 --> 0:14:08.200
<v Speaker 4>look back as the beginning of the end of the

0:14:08.240 --> 0:14:11.760
<v Speaker 4>American world order, and that will have a massive effect

0:14:11.840 --> 0:14:12.959
<v Speaker 4>on global business.

0:14:13.120 --> 0:14:15.720
<v Speaker 5>How far are you willing to go? It's a reelect your.

0:14:16.480 --> 0:14:19.840
<v Speaker 4>Well, I'm willing to invest, I'm willing to speak, I'm

0:14:19.840 --> 0:14:23.560
<v Speaker 4>willing to campaign, I'm willing to try to Like when

0:14:23.600 --> 0:14:26.360
<v Speaker 4>a prominent business leader speaks up and says I'm pro drought,

0:14:26.520 --> 0:14:28.480
<v Speaker 4>I call them and I said, let's talk about it.

0:14:28.520 --> 0:14:29.760
<v Speaker 5>Do you ever change their mind?

0:14:30.000 --> 0:14:30.440
<v Speaker 3>Of course?

0:14:30.760 --> 0:14:32.720
<v Speaker 4>Look for example, look, one of the things you have

0:14:32.760 --> 0:14:34.560
<v Speaker 4>to do is think about blind spots, like I just

0:14:34.600 --> 0:14:38.560
<v Speaker 4>said something that was positive about how Trump's administration was running.

0:14:38.600 --> 0:14:40.720
<v Speaker 4>Like I inspite to say you want a new regulation,

0:14:40.800 --> 0:14:41.640
<v Speaker 4>we're move an old one.

0:14:41.960 --> 0:14:43.080
<v Speaker 3>It's an exactly right thing.

0:14:43.320 --> 0:14:46.800
<v Speaker 6>But I think what you said about globally the perception

0:14:47.160 --> 0:14:50.000
<v Speaker 6>of the rest of the world potentially what the US

0:14:50.040 --> 0:14:54.560
<v Speaker 6>means and what it is in terms of busy.

0:14:53.480 --> 0:14:57.360
<v Speaker 4>People will not trust us. They will say we now

0:14:57.440 --> 0:14:59.480
<v Speaker 4>no longer trust that. You're into the world of law

0:14:59.560 --> 0:15:01.040
<v Speaker 4>and equal system all the rest.

0:15:01.160 --> 0:15:03.600
<v Speaker 6>All right, if you weren't in a world where Jenna

0:15:03.640 --> 0:15:07.440
<v Speaker 6>AI was everything twenty seconds, what's the other technology? We

0:15:07.440 --> 0:15:09.320
<v Speaker 6>should have it on radars quickly.

0:15:09.800 --> 0:15:11.560
<v Speaker 4>Well, so the other thing that's following behind it is

0:15:11.560 --> 0:15:14.080
<v Speaker 4>synthetic biology. And when you put them together, by the way,

0:15:14.280 --> 0:15:17.560
<v Speaker 4>like the invention of new pharmaceuticals, new medicines, everything else,

0:15:18.360 --> 0:15:20.680
<v Speaker 4>it's like, let's just hold on to get to the future,

0:15:20.760 --> 0:15:22.400
<v Speaker 4>because the future could be so amazing.

0:15:22.680 --> 0:15:24.320
<v Speaker 6>You do you think about what AI could do right

0:15:24.400 --> 0:15:25.720
<v Speaker 6>and just play around?

0:15:27.280 --> 0:15:30.760
<v Speaker 3>Thank you so much, Thank you for enjuring my pleasure.

0:15:31.240 --> 0:15:32.320
<v Speaker 5>Appreciated read.

0:15:32.400 --> 0:15:33.160
<v Speaker 6>Thank you so much.

0:15:33.640 --> 0:15:37.280
<v Speaker 5>That's Reid Hoffman of PayPal Linked.

0:15:41.120 --> 0:15:44.760
<v Speaker 2>Saying that your Time's best selling author his podcast Possible

0:15:44.840 --> 0:15:45.760
<v Speaker 2>The Possible Podcast.

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<v Speaker 5>Season two started. It's out now,