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Speaker 1: Hey, everybody. We've already made our big tour announcement for

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Speaker 1: the year, but this is a little different because we

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Speaker 1: have added a show because Denver sold out, so we

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Speaker 1: have added a second show in Denver. Nice. Yeah, we're

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Speaker 1: going to be there on Wednesday. Then we added a

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Speaker 1: show the day before the same place, Gothic Theater, Englewood, Colorado.

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Speaker 1: And you can go to s Y s K live

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Speaker 1: dot com to get info and tickets for that show

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Speaker 1: and all the rest of our shows to Chuck. That's right, Boston,

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Speaker 1: April fourth, d C April five. St. Louis, Mayo and Cleveland, Ohio.

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Speaker 1: Come out and see us. Welcome to Stuff you Should

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Speaker 1: Know from how Stuff Works dot com. Hey, and welcome

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Speaker 1: to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. There's Charles W. Chuck Bryant,

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Speaker 1: there's Jerry over there. So it's Stuff you should know

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Speaker 1: the podcast Clean Studio version. I know it feels a

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Speaker 1: little weird in here, like, uh, like it's too good

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Speaker 1: for us or something, you know what I mean. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: just so you folks know, Jerry Test a couple of

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Speaker 1: the editor engineers here with coming in and cleaning up

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Speaker 1: the pile of spaghetti that used to flow from the

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Speaker 1: back of her workstation, not that it was Jerry's fault,

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Speaker 1: and she said, clean up my mess. Well, she clapped

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Speaker 1: twice in the whole. It looks good though, it does.

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Speaker 1: But now we actually have room to put stuff, so

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Speaker 1: we should put some stuff in here. I agree. It's

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Speaker 1: a little bear a papasan right, there would be nice.

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Speaker 1: I don't know. Well, we could put a small papason.

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Speaker 1: Most people don't realize. But this place is lousy with

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Speaker 1: Ikea lamps, I mean everywhere, and the cheapest ones, like

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Speaker 1: they're one of them is on fire right now? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that one, Yeah, smoldering, smoldering, still fire, chuck, speaking of fire, Yes,

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Speaker 1: you want to know somebody who had some fire in

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Speaker 1: her more than most people realize. Rosa Parks, who is

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Speaker 1: now one of my all time heroes because before the

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Speaker 1: Rosa Parks I knew again it was like the Harriets

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Speaker 1: Hubman episode. Learned about her in school. Um, she was

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Speaker 1: a great American, respect her, revere her. Here's why she

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Speaker 1: didn't give up her seat on the bus. No, like,

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Speaker 1: not only is that like just the tip of the iceberg.

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Speaker 1: It wasn't until about the last five or so years.

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Speaker 1: I think you know about the last four years, they're

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Speaker 1: like a full picture of this woman and who she was,

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Speaker 1: and like what she stood for and what drove her

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Speaker 1: emerged not just to the public in general, but to

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Speaker 1: two historians even because her personal papers were basically held

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Speaker 1: up in auction for years and years and years. And

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Speaker 1: now now that they've been donated for ten, like ten

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Speaker 1: years to the Library of Congress, we're starting to get

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Speaker 1: a clear picture of her, and she was even more

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Speaker 1: worth revering. And then people knew before. Yeah, I mean,

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Speaker 1: I think the what the story isn't uh is Rosa

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Speaker 1: Parks was just a quiet lady who was super tired

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Speaker 1: on the bus one day, so she didn't want to

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Speaker 1: get up. Her dogs were yapping. Yeah, not true. And

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Speaker 1: she even makes a point in her personal papers saying

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Speaker 1: I was forty two years old. Uh, I was no

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Speaker 1: more tired than I was after any day at work.

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Speaker 1: But what I was tired of was being told to

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Speaker 1: get up by a white bus driver to make room

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Speaker 1: for a white passenger that was not My dogs weren't barking, right,

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Speaker 1: so she um she I think one of the reasons

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Speaker 1: why she was kind of whittled down into this this

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Speaker 1: woman who was just tired and wasn't going to give

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Speaker 1: up her seat because she shouldn't have had two in

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Speaker 1: the first place. And then she was a very meek,

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Speaker 1: quiet person. Also is another way that she was drawn. Um.

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Speaker 1: I think one of the reasons why she was whittled

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Speaker 1: into that package was because she became an icon for

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Speaker 1: the civil rights movement. And one of the things that

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Speaker 1: the civil rights movement had to do, for better or worse,

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Speaker 1: was to get uh, the establishment, both white and black,

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Speaker 1: on the side of the civil rights movement, which was

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Speaker 1: a movement of agitation. Um. And if you agitated at

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Speaker 1: the time, this is the Jim Crow era that meant trouble.

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Speaker 1: This wasn't like just trouble like people are gonna yell

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Speaker 1: at you on Twitter. This was trouble like the cops

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Speaker 1: might arrest you for some made up in fraction and

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Speaker 1: then be and rape you on the way to the jail,

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Speaker 1: and then you would end up in the prison system

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Speaker 1: kind of trouble like. This is the kind of trouble

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Speaker 1: that a woman who refused to give up her seat

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Speaker 1: on the bus faced it at this time. Um. So,

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Speaker 1: the idea of taking a woman who was I guess

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Speaker 1: palatable to as many people as possible, and and saying,

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Speaker 1: look at this woman, we need to protect this woman's

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Speaker 1: rights and do what's right. Um. I think that's why

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Speaker 1: she got kind of wood old down into that. But

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Speaker 1: if you were looking back now historically she there's so

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Speaker 1: much more to her than than just that, and she

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Speaker 1: was certainly not meek and mild. Yeah, I mean, distilling

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Speaker 1: the story down for school books is uh is one thing,

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Speaker 1: but like I'm glad now that people can get a

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Speaker 1: more robust picture. Um. So a lot of this comes

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Speaker 1: from a website called Great Black Heroes dot Com had

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Speaker 1: a really good, lengthy article. Uh. And then also I

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Speaker 1: want to shout out a book series called Little People,

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Speaker 1: Big Dreams, And it's a kid's book series that we've

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Speaker 1: been reading to my daughter. In fact, it's kind of

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Speaker 1: all she wants to read right now. And they are

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Speaker 1: on great women in history and kind of brutally honest

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Speaker 1: for to be reading to kids. But they didn't. It's

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Speaker 1: kind of cool they weren't. They didn't whitewash anything. It's

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Speaker 1: sort of like, uh, Maya Angelo was not treated well

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Speaker 1: by white people, like you read that to your kid

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Speaker 1: and Rosa Parks this one, and then there's Free to Carlo,

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Speaker 1: Coco Chanel, Amelia Earhart, Mary Curie at Christie and more.

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Speaker 1: But um, but it's pretty brutal, like they draw Amelia

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Speaker 1: Hearts Skeleton on the Beach, kind of brutal. You know what.

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Speaker 1: That's the only one we haven't gotten to yet because

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Speaker 1: every night it's read free to Read, freed To But

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Speaker 1: it's literally like frieda Carlo is lying in the street

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Speaker 1: after she gets hit by a taxi and she's bloody

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Speaker 1: and her legs don't work again after. So, I mean,

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Speaker 1: it's pretty brutal stuff, But I don't know, it's kind

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Speaker 1: of cool, like kids can read the stuff and digest it.

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Speaker 1: I think it's a good way to begin them on

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Speaker 1: the path towards true stories and to sharpen them to

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Speaker 1: like a razor's edge at a young age, you know,

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Speaker 1: look out for taxis. Yeah, that's good. You know, that's

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Speaker 1: good advice at any age. All right, So Rosa Parks, Uh,

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Speaker 1: let's go back to where she was born in Tuskegee, Alabama,

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Speaker 1: on February four, nineteen thirteen. Uh too. While she was

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Speaker 1: born Rosa Louise Macaulay to James and Leonora mcaulay, who

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Speaker 1: are a carpenter and school teacher respectively. Right, her parents split,

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Speaker 1: I guess she I don't know how old she was.

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Speaker 1: I guess she was younger than six, But her father

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Speaker 1: went to go look for work up north, and her

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Speaker 1: mom wanted to stay in the South, so she and

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Speaker 1: her mom and her brother moved in with her mother's parents,

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Speaker 1: her grandparents, and her grandfather played a really distinct role

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Speaker 1: in shaping her because she moved in with him when

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Speaker 1: she was, like I said, around six, and at the

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Speaker 1: time in this place Pine Level, which is outside of Montgomery, Alabama. Uh,

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Speaker 1: there was a lot of clan violence, a lot of

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Speaker 1: violence against blacks of the hands of the Ku Klux Klan,

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Speaker 1: and Um, her grandfather was not having it. He was

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Speaker 1: actually he was the son of a slave woman and

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Speaker 1: slave owner, so he was um I believe half white.

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Speaker 1: Uh he was. He was a slave himself. He had

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Speaker 1: an owner UM at a young age who really brew

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Speaker 1: really mistreated him, trying to starve him for a little bit.

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Speaker 1: And her grandfather developed, um what she called, a very

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Speaker 1: intense passionate hatred for white people and definitely im part

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Speaker 1: of that to his daughters and his granddaughter grandchildren, wouldn't

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Speaker 1: let his grandchildren play with white kids, didn't let his

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Speaker 1: daughters work for white families. He was very much UM

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Speaker 1: and it sounds like pretty well founded against white people.

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Speaker 1: And definitely some of that rubbed off on Rose at

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Speaker 1: the very least her eyes were opened to just how

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Speaker 1: unjust the system was at the time when she was

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Speaker 1: growing up. Well, yeah, and just it wasn't even just

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Speaker 1: through his eyes. Like she went to a segregated school

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Speaker 1: that she had to walk to. White students were picked

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Speaker 1: up and bus to the school. Um. She went to

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Speaker 1: UH an elementary school called the Montgomery Industrial School for Girls,

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Speaker 1: very cool school. It was created by some UH northern

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Speaker 1: white Northerners to basically UM try and foster education in

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Speaker 1: these more rural black communities in the South. And that

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Speaker 1: didn't go over well educating kids, so that school was

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Speaker 1: burned down twice. And then coupled that with all the

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Speaker 1: you know, influence from her grandfather, and it's no surprise

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Speaker 1: that Rosa Parks from a very very early age was

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Speaker 1: UH was an activist. So and being an activist, we're

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Speaker 1: talking like from age six onward, right, So she dropped

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Speaker 1: out of school, which would have been a huge turning point. Um.

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Speaker 1: She had to take care of her grandmother and then

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Speaker 1: I think her mom later on because they both fell ill.

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Speaker 1: And she met I think age seventeen or eighteen, and

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Speaker 1: then later on, at age nineteen, married her husband, Raymond Parks,

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Speaker 1: and he encouraged her to go back and finished school

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Speaker 1: and she did. It was a huge move because she

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Speaker 1: was very much meant to be an educated person. So UM,

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Speaker 1: the fact that she she met Raymond was a huge

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Speaker 1: influence in that respect. He was also a big influence

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Speaker 1: on her because she said that he was the first activist,

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Speaker 1: like real activist, that she ever met. And I believe

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Speaker 1: this was even before the n double a CP was

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Speaker 1: in town. This guy was like a grassroots activist. UH.

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Speaker 1: And he and his group were basically armed. Do you

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Speaker 1: remember in the Black Panthers episode where like the whole

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Speaker 1: idea of arming yourself came out of the South. Um.

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Speaker 1: So this guy was like Raymond Parks was one of

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Speaker 1: the the real deal people who originated that UM and

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Speaker 1: he and the group of activists that he um he

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Speaker 1: met with, UH would but they would all come to

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Speaker 1: the house and everyone to have a gun. UH. And

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Speaker 1: apparently Rosa Parks said sometimes there were so many guns

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Speaker 1: on the table that she didn't have any place to

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Speaker 1: set the refreshments during these meetings. But these meetings weren't like,

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Speaker 1: you know, how are we going to get white people back?

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Speaker 1: It was how are we going to protect like the

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Speaker 1: Scottsboro Boys from false rape accusations? Um, he was he

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Speaker 1: was an early activists in Montgomery. Yeah, and later on

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Speaker 1: was a member of the Inn Double A CP. Uh.

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Speaker 1: We should do a show on the Scottsboro Boys at

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Speaker 1: some point. Uh, it's too much to get into here,

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Speaker 1: but the short version is, um, a group of black

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Speaker 1: men on a train were accused of rape by two

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Speaker 1: white women who uh just made up the story. Basically

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Speaker 1: went to trial a few times, and UM, well you

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Speaker 1: know what, we'll save the outcome, okay, because they are

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Speaker 1: all kinds of outcomes because it went to trial so

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Speaker 1: many times. Um. So she did finish high school and

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Speaker 1: she became involved along with her husband in the Montgomery

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Speaker 1: chapter the in Double A CP and worked as their

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Speaker 1: secretary for fourteen years. So not only was she an activist,

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Speaker 1: but she was um involved in in service of these organizations,

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Speaker 1: like she worked for them, like whatever, you need done,

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Speaker 1: I will do. And anyone who's ever volunteered like knows that, UM,

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Speaker 1: I guess footch soldiers, for lack of a better term,

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Speaker 1: are some of the most important people to like in

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Speaker 1: the Black Panthers episode when you know, the women didn't

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Speaker 1: get nearly the recognition they should have gotten for just

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Speaker 1: keeping that organization running on time. So but she was

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Speaker 1: more than a volunteer though. She had some really some

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Speaker 1: jobs with some real gravity. Like she was an investigator

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Speaker 1: of UM sexual assault of Black women by white men UM,

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Speaker 1: which is a very dangerous thing to do because you're

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Speaker 1: going to like interview witnesses to crimes that aren't being

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Speaker 1: prosecuted because they were perpetrated by white people. UM. She

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Speaker 1: uh was Justice for Prisoner advocate. She did a lot

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Speaker 1: of like really important stuff. And as she was doing

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Speaker 1: this stuff as the secretary for the local and WLE

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Speaker 1: and double a CP, she was also making contacts that

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Speaker 1: would later become really important in this nascent civil rights

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Speaker 1: movement that large grew out of the Montgomery bus boycott

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Speaker 1: we're going to talk about. I had no idea how

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Speaker 1: big of a an event it was, but I didn't

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Speaker 1: realize how far reaching the effects of it were oh yeah, uh.

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Speaker 1: And this another kind of important thing happened to her

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Speaker 1: as far as integration goes, is she got a job

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Speaker 1: type job at Maxwell Air Force Base for a little while, which,

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Speaker 1: because it was a federal institution, was integrated. And this

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Speaker 1: was the first time that she had um first time

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Speaker 1: she had worked in a basically been in a professional

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Speaker 1: integrated atmosphere. Uh. And that along with the Highlander Folk School,

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Speaker 1: which is maybe we should do a show on that too, uh.

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Speaker 1: In n she went to a meeting a workshop at

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Speaker 1: the Highlander Folks School. And this is in the hills

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Speaker 1: of Tennessee. Uh. And it is still open today as

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Speaker 1: the Highlander Research and Education Center. Uh, not in that

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Speaker 1: original building, but um, it was just this great folk

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Speaker 1: school where they prepared kids for activism. UM workers tried

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Speaker 1: to get people involved in civil rights and she actually

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Speaker 1: got sponsored by the white couple that she worked for,

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Speaker 1: uh to um go to these meetings at mont Egal, Tennessee.

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Speaker 1: So and that Maxwell Air Force Base you mentioned. One

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Speaker 1: of the things she later said, I think they found

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Speaker 1: in her papers was a description of like because it

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Speaker 1: was an integrated base, the bus service on base was

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Speaker 1: integrated as well, so she would be riding next to

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Speaker 1: like a white friend on the bus on base, and

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Speaker 1: then once they would get off of the bus on

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Speaker 1: base and get onto a city bus, they would have

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Speaker 1: to stop their conversation and get into the different sections,

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Speaker 1: the white section in the colored section. And that was

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Speaker 1: just the reality of it. Um. And one thing that

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Speaker 1: has really come through from her papers is that she

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Speaker 1: made a conscious decision to to never normalize that can

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Speaker 1: not be like, well, that's just how it is, that's

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Speaker 1: just life. That she would never let herself do that,

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Speaker 1: and instead it was this is this is messed up.

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Speaker 1: This has to be changed. Um. She was able to

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Speaker 1: get through her day with this knowledge, but she was

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Speaker 1: never like this is normal or this is okay. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean she said it required I think quote was

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Speaker 1: a lot of mental gymnastics just to survive day to

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Speaker 1: day as a black person in America. Uh So in

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Speaker 1: other words, yeah, not accept it and do everything I

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Speaker 1: can to wrap my head around what I can do

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Speaker 1: moving forward. Uh. Should we take a break? Yeah? Man,

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Speaker 1: all right, take a break and we'll come back and

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Speaker 1: we will um start on December one, very important day. Alright,

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Speaker 1: So it's December one, five Rosa Parks is working as

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Speaker 1: a seamstress at the time at a department store. She

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Speaker 1: gets off work like she does every day and boards

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Speaker 1: bus Cleveland Avenue bus at about six o'clock h And

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Speaker 1: here's the deal with the buses at the time, is uh,

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Speaker 1: there were a certain amount of rows set aside for

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Speaker 1: white people, and then there was a sign that said,

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Speaker 1: you know, black people were They probably said colored people

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Speaker 1: back then can sit from here back, but that sign

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Speaker 1: could move, so as more white people get on the bus,

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Speaker 1: the bus driver gets up and moves that sign back

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Speaker 1: and says, all right, black folks, you gotta get up,

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Speaker 1: get out of your seats because now the white section

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Speaker 1: is here, and just keep doing that until sensibly the

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Speaker 1: entire bus could be full of white people and they

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Speaker 1: just say, sorry, I'll have to get off. Right Yeah.

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Speaker 1: You either had to get up and move your seat.

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Speaker 1: If there were not seats left, you had to stand.

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Speaker 1: If there was no standing room, you had to get

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Speaker 1: off the bus right um. And then if the bus

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Speaker 1: you were getting on, if you were African American, if

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Speaker 1: the white section was already full, you had to get

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Speaker 1: into the front of the bus, pay, get off of

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Speaker 1: the bus and get onto that back door. You couldn't

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Speaker 1: even walk through the white section, right, and then you

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Speaker 1: you know, you could take your seat in the colored section. So, um,

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Speaker 1: there was a lot going on here. At least half

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Speaker 1: of this law was unwritten custom right. The local ordinance

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Speaker 1: in Montgomery, Alabama said that busses had to be segregated.

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Speaker 1: There was a white section and there was a colored section.

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Speaker 1: They put it right. All that stuff about moving the sign,

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Speaker 1: about getting up and like having to leave the bus

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Speaker 1: if there wasn't any standing room for you if more

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Speaker 1: white people came on, all of that was just customary.

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Speaker 1: That was not law, That was not the local ordinance,

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Speaker 1: but it was so practiced on a daily basis that

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Speaker 1: it might as well have been the law for sure. Um,

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Speaker 1: And that's really all that matters is if everyone was

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Speaker 1: playing ball, that's what was going to happen. Yeah, Because

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Speaker 1: like the courts would even prosecute as if you had

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Speaker 1: broken the law, if you had not actually broken the law,

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Speaker 1: but had broken this custom. So yeah, for all intensive purposes,

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Speaker 1: it was the law. So the driver of that bus

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Speaker 1: was one James Blake, and Rosa had uh, well, she

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Speaker 1: had a long memory and a previous incident with Mr

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Speaker 1: Blake twelve years previous, uh ninety three. She had paid

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Speaker 1: her fair and like you were talking about with um,

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Speaker 1: the fact that they couldn't even walk through the white section.

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Speaker 1: He said, you gotta get off the bus, go around

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Speaker 1: to the back. Uh forced her. Well, she had already

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Speaker 1: gotten and said no, you gotta re enter on the rear.

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Speaker 1: She got out and he was like psych, closed the

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Speaker 1: door and drove off with her bus fare. Right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: she had already paid. Yeah that was and she remembered

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Speaker 1: twelve years later who James Blake was. I would probably

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Speaker 1: not forget that bus driver. So on on this day

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Speaker 1: she got on and um, she took her seat in

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Speaker 1: the colored section and when she sat down a in

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Speaker 1: she was behind the sign. And I guess after a

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Speaker 1: couple of stops, and think about this man ament riding

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Speaker 1: the bus and say you have like seven stops, think

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Speaker 1: about that pit that would be in your stomach on

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Speaker 1: a daily basis, Like, am I gonna have to get up?

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna have to be humiliated? I am I gonna

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Speaker 1: have to give up my seat to a white person?

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Speaker 1: Because even if somebody who was told that they had

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Speaker 1: to get up because a white person needed to sit there,

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Speaker 1: even if they just kind of quietly complied that that

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Speaker 1: doesn't that doesn't get the point across how they were feeling. Right,

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Speaker 1: then anybody would be humiliated by that. And I read

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Speaker 1: that one of the reasons why busses, not just in Montgomery,

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Speaker 1: but throughout the segregated South, they were kind of flash

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Speaker 1: points because they were people were in such close quarters.

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Speaker 1: It was the racism was right up in your face

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Speaker 1: in front of a bunch of other people, so the

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Speaker 1: humiliation was even more pronounced. Right. So, so Rosa Park

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Speaker 1: gets on the bus. She takes her seat in the

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Speaker 1: colored section, and after a few stops, some white people

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Speaker 1: got on and the the driver, James blake Um, said

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Speaker 1: that it was time for them to move, that these

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Speaker 1: white people needed a seat, and uh he was moving

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Speaker 1: the sign back at least one row. Yeah. So at

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Speaker 1: this point, Um, there's one white dude left without a seat.

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Speaker 1: Uh So, as his custom, he made four black folks

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Speaker 1: get out of their two seats on that row. Everyone

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Speaker 1: had to move back because there had to be a

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Speaker 1: whole new white road just for this one guy. Three

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Speaker 1: of the passengers got up been moved. Rosa Parks just

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Speaker 1: slid over to the window seat and sat there and

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Speaker 1: he said, are you going to get up? And she

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Speaker 1: said no, I'm not. He said, well, if you don't

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Speaker 1: stand up, I'm gonna have to call the police and

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Speaker 1: have you arrested. And she said you may do that. Aw,

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Speaker 1: I don't know, man, I mean, just so brave. And

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Speaker 1: so the police did come. She was arrested, She was booked,

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Speaker 1: charged with the disorderly conduct, and bailed out by Clifford

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Speaker 1: der and Edgar Nixon, who were the local president of

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Speaker 1: the the chapter of the Double A c P at

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Speaker 1: the time. Right, So, um, she's out at least temporarily. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the next evening, so she spent the night in jail.

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Speaker 1: I don't I didn't run across any any statements or

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Speaker 1: any kind of evidence that she was like physically mistreated

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Speaker 1: or verbally abused by the police. Um, but that that

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Speaker 1: seems to be unusual for people who were arrested for

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Speaker 1: not giving up their seats on the bus. That she

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Speaker 1: was not mistreated. Yeah, I mean, I'm sure they didn't

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Speaker 1: throwout the welcome at No. You no, but um, there's

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Speaker 1: this is actually this is no worthy here. Do you

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Speaker 1: want to talk about how she was not the first

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Speaker 1: person that year, not the first woman to have been

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Speaker 1: arrested for not giving up her seat on the bus. Yeah. Sure,

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Speaker 1: this is something I didn't realize, and I think a

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Speaker 1: lot of people didn't realize this. But there were at

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Speaker 1: least two other women in Montgomery who were arrested that

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Speaker 1: same year. One was Claudette Colvin. She was fifteen at

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Speaker 1: the time. She got pregnant afterwards. Um, but she was

390
00:22:07,520 --> 00:22:13,080
Speaker 1: fifteen and uh, she in March was arrested for not

391
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Speaker 1: giving up her seat on the bus. Um. She said

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Speaker 1: at the time she was scared to death. But she

393
00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:21,479
Speaker 1: felt on one side, so journal Truth was holding her

394
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Speaker 1: down and on the other side, Harriet Tubman was holding

395
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Speaker 1: her down and she was not about to get up.

396
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Speaker 1: So they took her off the bus and arrested her.

397
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Speaker 1: And um, apparently she was ridiculed and treated rather roughly. Um.

398
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Speaker 1: There was another woman. Her name was Mary Louise Smith.

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Speaker 1: I believe she was eighteen at the time. She had

400
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Speaker 1: been arrested, like uh in October, um for the same thing.

401
00:22:42,119 --> 00:22:45,520
Speaker 1: I didn't get the impression that she was necessarily treated roughly.

402
00:22:46,040 --> 00:22:49,760
Speaker 1: But um. But Rosa Parks when she was arrested from

403
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Speaker 1: what I can tell, she was treated like the the

404
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Speaker 1: with the respect that would be afforded to a middle

405
00:22:55,880 --> 00:22:59,560
Speaker 1: class black woman at the time in Montgomery, Alabama, which

406
00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:03,120
Speaker 1: is to say, with maybe the slightest measure of respect,

407
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Speaker 1: which is to say, she wasn't beaten on the way

408
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Speaker 1: to jail. There's a book, by the way called Claudette

409
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Speaker 1: Colvin Colin Twice Towards Justice from phil Who's or Who's?

410
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Speaker 1: And Uh, I think a lot of people these days

411
00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:18,679
Speaker 1: are trying to shine a little light on some of

412
00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:21,119
Speaker 1: the lesser known figures of the civil rights movement, and

413
00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:22,919
Speaker 1: books are being written and stuff like that, which is

414
00:23:22,920 --> 00:23:25,840
Speaker 1: pretty awesome. And she she was asked, Claudette Colvin was

415
00:23:25,880 --> 00:23:28,600
Speaker 1: asked like, why why does she think it was Rosa

416
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Speaker 1: Parks and not her? And she had a whole list

417
00:23:30,840 --> 00:23:33,040
Speaker 1: of reasons and all of them are pretty legitimate. That

418
00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:37,160
Speaker 1: you know, Rosa Parks was a very again, a palatable

419
00:23:37,280 --> 00:23:40,920
Speaker 1: person to a large swath of people. Uh. And more

420
00:23:40,960 --> 00:23:43,320
Speaker 1: to the point, she was also fifteen, and the n

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Speaker 1: double a CP didn't think that a fifteen year old

422
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Speaker 1: was going to be the most reliable icon to kind

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00:23:48,600 --> 00:23:52,840
Speaker 1: of project into the national forefront. Yeah, not to say,

424
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Speaker 1: um that a lot of people have said over the

425
00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:58,119
Speaker 1: years that it was staged, so because they set Rosa

426
00:23:58,160 --> 00:24:00,919
Speaker 1: Parks up or not set her up, but they picked

427
00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:03,560
Speaker 1: her to do this because she was palatable. They staged

428
00:24:03,560 --> 00:24:05,639
Speaker 1: this whole thing to make which you know would have

429
00:24:05,680 --> 00:24:07,760
Speaker 1: been fine, uh, if that's the way you want to

430
00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:11,080
Speaker 1: kick start the bus boycott. But from all accounts, it

431
00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:14,720
Speaker 1: was a in the moment decision. She said, I didn't

432
00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:17,040
Speaker 1: know that I was gonna get arrested and then I

433
00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:19,919
Speaker 1: was gonna sit down. It's just something that happened, and

434
00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:21,960
Speaker 1: so so on the one hand, the people who say

435
00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:25,480
Speaker 1: that no, this was staged, Um, the n Double A

436
00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:28,959
Speaker 1: CP and even before then Double A CP was around.

437
00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:33,200
Speaker 1: Busses had been like a target of black activists in

438
00:24:33,320 --> 00:24:36,320
Speaker 1: Montgomery in particular for decades. I think the first bus

439
00:24:36,359 --> 00:24:39,160
Speaker 1: boycott was in nine and it wasn't even a bus.

440
00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:42,360
Speaker 1: There was a trolley line as well as boycotted. So

441
00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:46,879
Speaker 1: she and having already been the secretary of the N

442
00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:49,640
Speaker 1: Double A c P and an activist herself for years

443
00:24:49,640 --> 00:24:52,520
Speaker 1: by then, she must have been fully aware of the

444
00:24:52,560 --> 00:24:56,720
Speaker 1: potential outcome, which proved to be the actual outcome from

445
00:24:56,760 --> 00:24:59,320
Speaker 1: her arrest for not giving up her seat. But the

446
00:24:59,359 --> 00:25:02,800
Speaker 1: idea of saying that this was all staged, it does

447
00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:06,680
Speaker 1: a couple of things. It's almost like, um, a casually

448
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:09,440
Speaker 1: racist way of just kind of diminishing it because it

449
00:25:09,680 --> 00:25:13,320
Speaker 1: does two things. One, it takes away her bravery, because

450
00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:15,479
Speaker 1: if if it was, if it was staged to make

451
00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:18,120
Speaker 1: her own support the whole time, would have it would

452
00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:21,840
Speaker 1: have taken away a measure of fear um. And then secondly,

453
00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:24,440
Speaker 1: it also makes the double A C P look kind

454
00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:28,200
Speaker 1: of sneaky, like there's socially engineering stuff and then pretending

455
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:31,480
Speaker 1: like that's not the case. So I think by saying like, no,

456
00:25:31,640 --> 00:25:35,480
Speaker 1: this was staged, it really undermines the reality of the situation,

457
00:25:35,520 --> 00:25:39,720
Speaker 1: which is that this brave woman said she'd had enough. Yeah,

458
00:25:39,800 --> 00:25:43,080
Speaker 1: and you're right, she probably it probably occurred to her

459
00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:46,399
Speaker 1: the ramifications of this, but I bet you anything in

460
00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:49,600
Speaker 1: the moment, she was just like, Nope, nope, not getting up.

461
00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:54,560
Speaker 1: That's what I understand, That's what she's always said. Yeah, So, um,

462
00:25:54,600 --> 00:25:57,800
Speaker 1: here's what happened from there. She was arrested, like I said,

463
00:25:57,800 --> 00:26:00,080
Speaker 1: she gets out on bail um over that weekend, and

464
00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:02,800
Speaker 1: a bunch of churches got together and they started talking

465
00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:07,440
Speaker 1: boycott UM on the winter trial comes around as a

466
00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:10,440
Speaker 1: group called the Women's Political Council, and they handed out

467
00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:16,320
Speaker 1: thirty five thousand handbills that basically said, uh, please children,

468
00:26:16,400 --> 00:26:19,040
Speaker 1: grown ups, don't ride the bus at all on Monday.

469
00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:22,200
Speaker 1: Please stay off the buses on Monday. Let's really try

470
00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:25,720
Speaker 1: and make a difference here. Because it was I think

471
00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:29,760
Speaker 1: at the time black people made up seventy of the

472
00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:34,080
Speaker 1: passengers UM, so it could have a real impact on

473
00:26:34,119 --> 00:26:36,320
Speaker 1: like the finances of the bus company. Yeah, and it

474
00:26:36,440 --> 00:26:39,840
Speaker 1: just started out as a boycott for one day for

475
00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:44,479
Speaker 1: the Monday following Rosa Parte's arrest, which was that happened

476
00:26:44,480 --> 00:26:46,840
Speaker 1: on a Thursday. Uh, And they were just gonna do

477
00:26:46,880 --> 00:26:50,200
Speaker 1: it for one day. But the the success of it

478
00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:53,560
Speaker 1: was so surprising. I think they were hoping for like

479
00:26:53,640 --> 00:26:57,679
Speaker 1: fifty reduction. It turned out I saw both ninety and

480
00:26:59,359 --> 00:27:05,520
Speaker 1: reduction in ridership by African Americans that day, and that's

481
00:27:05,520 --> 00:27:09,119
Speaker 1: a big loss for the city bus line. Right. So

482
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:11,760
Speaker 1: it was such a success that they said, well, let's

483
00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:13,679
Speaker 1: maybe let's keep this going and see what we can

484
00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:17,159
Speaker 1: do with this. Because initially the demands of the Montgomery

485
00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:22,400
Speaker 1: Bus boycott of n was that, Um. One of them

486
00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:27,160
Speaker 1: was black black riders be treated with courtesy. Pretty low

487
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:33,439
Speaker 1: hanging request. Um. Another one was that, uh, the the

488
00:27:33,480 --> 00:27:36,000
Speaker 1: seats be given on a first come, first serve basis,

489
00:27:36,040 --> 00:27:39,400
Speaker 1: which was the law, and that black people sit from

490
00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:42,240
Speaker 1: back to front, White people sit from front to back.

491
00:27:42,560 --> 00:27:45,280
Speaker 1: So they were still saying like, we can keep the segregation,

492
00:27:45,800 --> 00:27:47,959
Speaker 1: but but people shouldn't have to give up their seats.

493
00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:51,240
Speaker 1: And then the last one was they wanted, um, black

494
00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:54,720
Speaker 1: bus drivers to be hired to drive the predominantly African

495
00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:57,760
Speaker 1: American routes so that that you didn't have to deal

496
00:27:57,800 --> 00:28:01,680
Speaker 1: with an armed, yeah, and armed white bus driver because

497
00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:04,000
Speaker 1: they were armed and they had basically police powers to

498
00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:07,520
Speaker 1: enforce segregation on the bus. So the original boycott thing,

499
00:28:07,960 --> 00:28:13,720
Speaker 1: their demands were not extraordinarily radical. And when the boycott

500
00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:17,119
Speaker 1: was a success on that first Monday, UM, they decided

501
00:28:17,160 --> 00:28:19,720
Speaker 1: to extend it and they also decided maybe they should

502
00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:22,480
Speaker 1: expand their demands a little more. So while all this

503
00:28:22,560 --> 00:28:25,119
Speaker 1: is going on, she was she was found guilty on

504
00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:29,080
Speaker 1: that Monday. She was fine ten bucks plus court costs

505
00:28:29,080 --> 00:28:33,200
Speaker 1: of four dollars for fourteen dollars total, and said, uh, nope,

506
00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:38,080
Speaker 1: I'm gonna appeal this conviction. She challenged the basically she

507
00:28:38,200 --> 00:28:41,360
Speaker 1: was what she was challenging was segregation in general, uh,

508
00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:45,040
Speaker 1: not being constitutional, and that ended up being the argument

509
00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:47,640
Speaker 1: that was, well, we'll get to the court case and

510
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:51,960
Speaker 1: how it escalated. But um, she was found guilty and UM.

511
00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:56,760
Speaker 1: The other notable thing that happened was one Ralph David

512
00:28:56,760 --> 00:29:00,280
Speaker 1: Abernathy and Dr Martin Luther King, who was young minister

513
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:04,479
Speaker 1: in town of Dexter Avenue Baptist. Uh. He was elected

514
00:29:04,520 --> 00:29:06,160
Speaker 1: president of what was called the m i A, the

515
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:11,720
Speaker 1: Montgomery Improvement Association, UM, which they formed because the success

516
00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:15,080
Speaker 1: of the boycott. So you have this new organization. Uh.

517
00:29:15,160 --> 00:29:18,200
Speaker 1: Then about a month later, UM, a month and a half,

518
00:29:18,280 --> 00:29:22,880
Speaker 1: at the end of January, Martin Luther King's home was bombed. Um.

519
00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:26,600
Speaker 1: Everyone was unharmed in the incident, but it really ramped

520
00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:30,120
Speaker 1: up um the stakes of what was going on. Yeah,

521
00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:34,360
Speaker 1: well for sure. And the they apparently the Montgomery Improvement

522
00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:38,640
Speaker 1: Association is credited with making the boycott successful. And the

523
00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:40,960
Speaker 1: way that they made it successful was through a car

524
00:29:41,000 --> 00:29:43,800
Speaker 1: pool they set up. They bought a bunch of station

525
00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:47,240
Speaker 1: wagons and put them in the name of some of

526
00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:52,480
Speaker 1: the black churches in town, and these these station wagons

527
00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:56,720
Speaker 1: would basically recreate the bus routes. They drove pre predetermined

528
00:29:56,800 --> 00:30:00,280
Speaker 1: routes UM and they were they were giving like twenty

529
00:30:00,400 --> 00:30:05,320
Speaker 1: thousand people arride every day. That's how successful this was.

530
00:30:05,720 --> 00:30:11,000
Speaker 1: And they put such a crimp UH in the finances

531
00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:13,280
Speaker 1: of the city bus line that had a couple of

532
00:30:13,320 --> 00:30:17,320
Speaker 1: things happened. One, they had to lay off workers, closed

533
00:30:17,320 --> 00:30:21,160
Speaker 1: down lines, raised their fares like it really hurt the

534
00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:24,760
Speaker 1: city bus lines. And then secondly, the city and I

535
00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:29,640
Speaker 1: believe maybe even the state sued the Montgomery Improvement Association

536
00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:35,920
Speaker 1: for for this boycott, which is apparently illegal under Alabama law. Yeah,

537
00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:39,760
Speaker 1: they they sued against the car service specifically saying that

538
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:43,239
Speaker 1: the bus company had an exclusive franchise UH and they

539
00:30:43,240 --> 00:30:46,520
Speaker 1: did get an injunction UH in November of nineteenfty six.

540
00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:49,560
Speaker 1: But all of this comes out of the fact that

541
00:30:49,720 --> 00:30:54,600
Speaker 1: in like thirty something years earlier in Alabama passed an

542
00:30:54,640 --> 00:31:01,600
Speaker 1: anti boycott act which basically said it's it's illegal for

543
00:31:01,640 --> 00:31:05,000
Speaker 1: you to not ride the bus in this case. In

544
00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:09,120
Speaker 1: that case, sure or at least organized people and get

545
00:31:09,160 --> 00:31:12,120
Speaker 1: them to not ride the bush. It was something like

546
00:31:12,160 --> 00:31:16,200
Speaker 1: it was a misdemeanor to organize against somebody carrying out

547
00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:18,520
Speaker 1: lawful business or whatever. So they were getting them on

548
00:31:18,560 --> 00:31:21,720
Speaker 1: two things, that boycott and then infringing on the bus

549
00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:25,680
Speaker 1: lines franchise in that city, right, right, So what do

550
00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:28,160
Speaker 1: you do if you are suing or I'm sorry if

551
00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:32,000
Speaker 1: you're uh, if you have an anti boycott act? I mean,

552
00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:35,520
Speaker 1: you can't arrest everyone. So they go after um, I

553
00:31:35,560 --> 00:31:38,760
Speaker 1: think eighty nine Martin Luther King Jr. And eighty nine

554
00:31:38,800 --> 00:31:43,240
Speaker 1: other other members of the m i A. And obviously

555
00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:45,160
Speaker 1: because they're the most I think how many of them

556
00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:48,840
Speaker 1: twenty four more ministers. They're the most prominent members. And

557
00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:51,920
Speaker 1: he's find five hundred bucks and I spent a couple

558
00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:54,000
Speaker 1: of weeks in jail. He said he's very proud of

559
00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:58,400
Speaker 1: his crime. Should be yeah, sure. So, um, now Martin

560
00:31:58,480 --> 00:32:03,480
Speaker 1: Luther King is um appealing. So you've got a few

561
00:32:03,520 --> 00:32:07,680
Speaker 1: things going on here. You've got Rosa Parks who has

562
00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:11,080
Speaker 1: been convicted and now is appealing her her ten dollars

563
00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:14,360
Speaker 1: plus four dollars in court costs fine for breaking the

564
00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:17,560
Speaker 1: city ordinance even though she didn't. You've got Martin Luther

565
00:32:17,680 --> 00:32:22,720
Speaker 1: King now who is appealing his five dollar fine for

566
00:32:22,840 --> 00:32:26,520
Speaker 1: the boycott and the infringing on the bus lines franchise.

567
00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:29,800
Speaker 1: And then you have something else. You have a class

568
00:32:29,840 --> 00:32:35,320
Speaker 1: action suit called Um Browder versus Gail and was Um

569
00:32:35,520 --> 00:32:40,240
Speaker 1: named after oh, what's her name? The the woman who's

570
00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:44,480
Speaker 1: the lead plaintiff in the case, her name is Aurelia S.

571
00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:47,600
Speaker 1: Browder Uh. And the Gail in the case was the

572
00:32:47,760 --> 00:32:52,840
Speaker 1: Montgomery um the Montgomery mayor, I think, William Gail. And

573
00:32:53,520 --> 00:32:55,200
Speaker 1: we'll talk about that. We'll let's take a break and

574
00:32:55,200 --> 00:32:57,400
Speaker 1: we'll talk about this case, and we'll we'll come back

575
00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:23,560
Speaker 1: to the drumbeat of the core system starting to kick in. Alright,

576
00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:27,840
Speaker 1: So appeals run slow anyway, but in the South, if

577
00:33:27,880 --> 00:33:31,120
Speaker 1: it's a if it's a case like this, it's gonna

578
00:33:31,200 --> 00:33:35,280
Speaker 1: go super slow because the hope from the white establishment is,

579
00:33:35,920 --> 00:33:38,280
Speaker 1: you know, maybe enough time will goes by, time will

580
00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:40,800
Speaker 1: go buying. These people just sort of get in line

581
00:33:40,840 --> 00:33:44,320
Speaker 1: and forget about it, get tired of this boycott and everything.

582
00:33:44,360 --> 00:33:46,440
Speaker 1: We'll just go back to normal. Yeah, which is kind

583
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:49,320
Speaker 1: of a gamble because this boycott was not showing any

584
00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:53,520
Speaker 1: signs of cracking, So they were basically making that bet

585
00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:56,400
Speaker 1: on the back of the city bus line and on

586
00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:59,000
Speaker 1: the jobs of the drivers who are being laid off

587
00:33:59,040 --> 00:34:05,680
Speaker 1: because ridership is down so low days. Right um, so

588
00:34:06,160 --> 00:34:09,080
Speaker 1: the like I said that this court, the drumbeat of

589
00:34:09,080 --> 00:34:11,239
Speaker 1: the court system was starting to grow a little bit

590
00:34:11,320 --> 00:34:14,120
Speaker 1: louder um. And you had three big cases Martin Luther

591
00:34:14,280 --> 00:34:19,800
Speaker 1: King's case, Rosa Park's case, and you had Browder versus Gail,

592
00:34:20,280 --> 00:34:24,120
Speaker 1: and Broder versus Gail represented four women originally five, but

593
00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:28,600
Speaker 1: four women who had been convicted of of breaking the

594
00:34:28,680 --> 00:34:31,760
Speaker 1: law for not giving up their seat on the bus

595
00:34:33,000 --> 00:34:36,680
Speaker 1: in Montgomery. One of them was Claudette Colvin, another was

596
00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:41,400
Speaker 1: Mary Louise Smith, I believe, and then um Aurelia Browder,

597
00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:47,719
Speaker 1: and then lastly was McDonald's Susie McDonald. Right. So, um,

598
00:34:47,840 --> 00:34:50,239
Speaker 1: these four women got together and sued the mayor, the

599
00:34:50,320 --> 00:34:55,360
Speaker 1: bus line, a few bus drivers, the city Public Works Commission, um,

600
00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:57,640
Speaker 1: just a big group of people. And they were suing

601
00:34:58,280 --> 00:35:01,680
Speaker 1: to to All three of those cases were suing the

602
00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:07,320
Speaker 1: question the constitutionality and the legality of segregation in general,

603
00:35:07,680 --> 00:35:11,560
Speaker 1: but specifically on the bus lines. And there was a

604
00:35:11,680 --> 00:35:14,839
Speaker 1: talk at first by Freddie Gray, who was the lead

605
00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:19,719
Speaker 1: lawyer in the Browder e Gael that um of including

606
00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:24,600
Speaker 1: Rosa Parks, but he very very wisely kept her separate

607
00:35:24,640 --> 00:35:27,280
Speaker 1: from that case because he said he wanted the courts

608
00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:29,880
Speaker 1: to just consider one thing, not whether Rosa Parks is

609
00:35:29,880 --> 00:35:34,520
Speaker 1: guilty or not, but whether the segregation on the Montgomery

610
00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:39,280
Speaker 1: buses was was legal and constitutional. So he kept those separate,

611
00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:41,759
Speaker 1: very very smartly. Yeah. I think he knew that he

612
00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:45,359
Speaker 1: could get this to the Supreme Court. Uh. This way

613
00:35:45,640 --> 00:35:47,680
Speaker 1: was a test case, and that was his his ultimate

614
00:35:47,719 --> 00:35:50,719
Speaker 1: goal because it was a state statute though in the

615
00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:54,160
Speaker 1: state Constitution of Alabama. It was of course first brought

616
00:35:54,200 --> 00:35:57,600
Speaker 1: before District court, three judges in U. S. District Court

617
00:35:57,960 --> 00:36:03,880
Speaker 1: on June. They ruled two to one that segregation was unconstitutional.

618
00:36:04,640 --> 00:36:06,880
Speaker 1: Of course, they cited Brown versus Board of Education as

619
00:36:06,920 --> 00:36:09,640
Speaker 1: president uh. And it eventually wound its way to the

620
00:36:09,680 --> 00:36:17,160
Speaker 1: Supreme Court on December. Actually that was pretty quick considering UH,

621
00:36:17,200 --> 00:36:21,279
Speaker 1: and they rejected all appeals and voted nine to nothing,

622
00:36:21,400 --> 00:36:26,440
Speaker 1: nine to zero that it was unconstitutional nine to nothing, um,

623
00:36:26,640 --> 00:36:29,360
Speaker 1: which is I mean, that's really saying something unanimous Supreme

624
00:36:29,360 --> 00:36:35,000
Speaker 1: Court decision regarding segregation in Yeah. So um, that was

625
00:36:35,040 --> 00:36:38,719
Speaker 1: a that was huge. I think Dr King was in

626
00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:41,120
Speaker 1: court that day when he was told by a reporter

627
00:36:41,280 --> 00:36:44,680
Speaker 1: about that decision, the Supreme Court decision. Um. And even

628
00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:49,760
Speaker 1: after he said, we're we're keeping up the boycott because

629
00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:53,840
Speaker 1: we're well, when they implement this desegregation on the buses

630
00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:57,600
Speaker 1: will stop the boycott. And after the Supreme Court ruling

631
00:36:57,640 --> 00:37:01,280
Speaker 1: came through the city of Montgomery, I saw pretty clearly

632
00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:03,600
Speaker 1: that there wasn't any way to keep this up any longer.

633
00:37:03,760 --> 00:37:07,280
Speaker 1: And I believe within three days the buses were desegregated.

634
00:37:07,640 --> 00:37:10,160
Speaker 1: And on the first day that they were desegregated, Rosa

635
00:37:10,200 --> 00:37:12,719
Speaker 1: Parks took her seat on a bus, uh, in the

636
00:37:12,760 --> 00:37:16,879
Speaker 1: front row, I believe. Yeah, they hired black bus drivers. Uh.

637
00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:19,880
Speaker 1: And this is after, by the way, three eighty one

638
00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:25,239
Speaker 1: days of a total sales loss of sixty five so um. Yeah.

639
00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:28,440
Speaker 1: And on the other side, Ralph David Abernathy's home was bombed.

640
00:37:28,680 --> 00:37:32,280
Speaker 1: Martin Luther King's home was bombed. Uh. People were in jail,

641
00:37:33,040 --> 00:37:35,640
Speaker 1: people were in court. It was a big struggle down

642
00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:39,200
Speaker 1: in Montgomery. Yeah. So in December twenty one, Dr King

643
00:37:39,880 --> 00:37:43,000
Speaker 1: and his white friend Reverend Clint Smiley sat together on

644
00:37:43,040 --> 00:37:46,960
Speaker 1: the front row with Ralph David Abernathy. Street here in Atlanta,

645
00:37:47,239 --> 00:37:51,440
Speaker 1: named for him, Edie Dixon and Fred Gray, the the

646
00:37:51,480 --> 00:37:54,640
Speaker 1: attorney that saw that case. So that was that was

647
00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:56,960
Speaker 1: a huge thing that did a number of things. It

648
00:37:57,000 --> 00:38:00,720
Speaker 1: made Rosa Parks and icon. Yeah, it projected um Martin

649
00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:04,240
Speaker 1: Luther King into the national spotlight. That was basically where

650
00:38:04,360 --> 00:38:08,680
Speaker 1: he first found national fame as and basically was like, well,

651
00:38:08,719 --> 00:38:11,880
Speaker 1: this guy's the leader of the civil rights movement now, um.

652
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:15,840
Speaker 1: And it also was a huge domino in the idea

653
00:38:16,040 --> 00:38:20,080
Speaker 1: of desegregation in general, not just on busses, not just

654
00:38:20,120 --> 00:38:23,759
Speaker 1: in Montgomery, but the concept it followed in the in

655
00:38:23,840 --> 00:38:27,360
Speaker 1: the wake of plus E v. Ferguson, which it was

656
00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:32,400
Speaker 1: just one of those court cases that said separate facilities

657
00:38:32,719 --> 00:38:35,480
Speaker 1: is inherently racist because the only reason you would have

658
00:38:35,520 --> 00:38:39,759
Speaker 1: separate facilities is because you think one group is superior

659
00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:42,920
Speaker 1: over the other and they shouldn't have to consort or mix.

660
00:38:43,680 --> 00:38:47,400
Speaker 1: That's inherently unconstitutional. And this was one of those dominoes

661
00:38:47,440 --> 00:38:51,080
Speaker 1: that fell in that chain that led to desegregation across

662
00:38:51,120 --> 00:38:56,560
Speaker 1: the Jim Crow South. And like a laser, this particular

663
00:38:56,680 --> 00:39:02,200
Speaker 1: case and the changes it brought were focused right onto

664
00:39:02,320 --> 00:39:07,439
Speaker 1: Rosa Parks, her act, her courage, what she did. Yeah,

665
00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:11,719
Speaker 1: and this was this was within our parents lifetime. I know,

666
00:39:11,840 --> 00:39:13,600
Speaker 1: I was wondering. I was like, why am I so

667
00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:16,000
Speaker 1: much more jazz about this than Harriet Tubman. I love

668
00:39:16,040 --> 00:39:19,920
Speaker 1: Harriet Tubsman Tubman story, but I remember when I was researching,

669
00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:22,440
Speaker 1: I wasn't new least dess and I realized, like, I

670
00:39:22,480 --> 00:39:25,440
Speaker 1: can relate to this woman so much better, just because

671
00:39:26,120 --> 00:39:29,279
Speaker 1: this is pretty pretty recent, you know. Well yeah, and

672
00:39:29,600 --> 00:39:32,400
Speaker 1: just the notion that, uh, where we are as a

673
00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:36,640
Speaker 1: country now racially, um, this was not that long ago.

674
00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:40,120
Speaker 1: So for the the people in the camp of saying

675
00:39:40,160 --> 00:39:44,160
Speaker 1: just get over things, um, African Americans, just get over things,

676
00:39:44,160 --> 00:39:47,200
Speaker 1: It's like this was not hundreds and hundreds of years ago.

677
00:39:47,719 --> 00:39:51,759
Speaker 1: This was very recently. These like my peers parents had

678
00:39:51,800 --> 00:39:55,279
Speaker 1: to live through this. Well, one thing Rosa Parks is

679
00:39:55,360 --> 00:39:59,120
Speaker 1: now known for what they didn't realize before is, you know,

680
00:39:59,280 --> 00:40:02,279
Speaker 1: she her act and like the civil rights movement that

681
00:40:02,320 --> 00:40:05,960
Speaker 1: grew out of over like the next ten years, fifteen years,

682
00:40:06,440 --> 00:40:10,080
Speaker 1: there's this idea that around. There was a button put

683
00:40:10,120 --> 00:40:12,880
Speaker 1: on that and it was like, you guys were successful,

684
00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:16,200
Speaker 1: way to go, we can stop doing this now. Rosa

685
00:40:16,239 --> 00:40:19,120
Speaker 1: Parks was like, no, no, it's not done. This hasn't

686
00:40:19,200 --> 00:40:21,799
Speaker 1: changed up until she died in two thousand and five.

687
00:40:22,000 --> 00:40:26,000
Speaker 1: She was like, the struggle is still continuing. People didn't

688
00:40:26,040 --> 00:40:29,479
Speaker 1: realize that about her until this collection was opened. Yeah,

689
00:40:29,520 --> 00:40:34,200
Speaker 1: she um, this all came. There was significant cost to

690
00:40:34,480 --> 00:40:38,080
Speaker 1: her family, to her, her husband. Um. Her and her

691
00:40:38,120 --> 00:40:41,600
Speaker 1: husband both suffered through stomach ulcers because of this. They

692
00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:47,799
Speaker 1: lost their jobs. Um. Eventually they left Alabama, said let's

693
00:40:47,840 --> 00:40:50,719
Speaker 1: go to Virginia. And Virginia wasn't a whole lot better

694
00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:53,279
Speaker 1: that they said, all right, let's go to Detroit. Kept

695
00:40:53,320 --> 00:40:56,360
Speaker 1: going north. Uh. And then finally, after not having a

696
00:40:56,400 --> 00:40:59,320
Speaker 1: job for a long time, she lets hired a secretary

697
00:40:59,440 --> 00:41:05,600
Speaker 1: for John Conyers, brand new, brand newly elected black congressman

698
00:41:06,080 --> 00:41:09,120
Speaker 1: who she would work for for twenty three years. And uh,

699
00:41:10,160 --> 00:41:12,200
Speaker 1: Mr Conyers, you know, he was the one who stepped

700
00:41:12,239 --> 00:41:15,640
Speaker 1: down last year after sexual assault allegations after serving many

701
00:41:15,680 --> 00:41:18,759
Speaker 1: many years in Congress. Um and was a civil rights icon.

702
00:41:18,880 --> 00:41:21,960
Speaker 1: So it's kind of a very sad ending to that story.

703
00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:26,880
Speaker 1: But Rosa worked for him. Um and seventy seven, her husband,

704
00:41:26,960 --> 00:41:31,279
Speaker 1: James died of cancer, her brother died of cancer three

705
00:41:31,280 --> 00:41:34,640
Speaker 1: months later. Her mom died two years after that. But

706
00:41:34,680 --> 00:41:38,480
Speaker 1: I get the sense that after that, it really, uh,

707
00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:40,839
Speaker 1: it really kind of freed her to really go back

708
00:41:40,880 --> 00:41:43,120
Speaker 1: to work and devote herself once again to the cause,

709
00:41:43,880 --> 00:41:47,000
Speaker 1: because after those family members passed away, she established the

710
00:41:47,080 --> 00:41:51,760
Speaker 1: Rosa Parks Scholarship Foundation, uh in the Rosa and Raymond

711
00:41:51,800 --> 00:41:56,840
Speaker 1: Parks Institute for Self Development, and wrote to memoirs she

712
00:41:56,920 --> 00:41:59,880
Speaker 1: was busy, she was uh and then very sadly And

713
00:42:00,320 --> 00:42:05,120
Speaker 1: I remember this in um when she was home invaded

714
00:42:05,640 --> 00:42:08,839
Speaker 1: and robbed, hit over the head by a guy named

715
00:42:08,920 --> 00:42:12,919
Speaker 1: Joseph Skipper. Yeah, man, that was just like, I mean,

716
00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:17,279
Speaker 1: for you kidding me with that for fifty eight bucks

717
00:42:17,320 --> 00:42:23,000
Speaker 1: of all the houses to accidentally break into. Yeah, what

718
00:42:23,040 --> 00:42:24,440
Speaker 1: do you think he knew it was Rosa Parks. I

719
00:42:24,440 --> 00:42:27,040
Speaker 1: don't know. I don't know, but he has seen nothing

720
00:42:27,080 --> 00:42:30,000
Speaker 1: to indicate that that was true. He knew that, um,

721
00:42:30,120 --> 00:42:34,240
Speaker 1: that he would go down as the man who robbed

722
00:42:34,239 --> 00:42:38,200
Speaker 1: and beat Rosa Parks. So, um, yeah, I don't. I

723
00:42:38,280 --> 00:42:41,560
Speaker 1: don't think he was he she was targeted because she

724
00:42:41,719 --> 00:42:43,839
Speaker 1: was Rosa Parks or anything like that. I think she's

725
00:42:43,880 --> 00:42:46,560
Speaker 1: just a little old lady. The impression I have is

726
00:42:46,600 --> 00:42:48,600
Speaker 1: it doesn't matter if she was Rosa Parks or not.

727
00:42:48,719 --> 00:42:51,360
Speaker 1: Sure you know what I'm saying. Yeah, yeah, so she

728
00:42:51,640 --> 00:42:55,080
Speaker 1: that was nine four, you said. And then like right afterwards,

729
00:42:55,120 --> 00:42:59,280
Speaker 1: there was a huge national outcry and she um moved

730
00:42:59,280 --> 00:43:03,319
Speaker 1: into a very secure high rise in Detroit, where she

731
00:43:03,400 --> 00:43:05,799
Speaker 1: lived until she died in two thousand five. I believe

732
00:43:05,840 --> 00:43:09,560
Speaker 1: she died in that apartment two years young. She had

733
00:43:09,600 --> 00:43:15,760
Speaker 1: a a slew of honors, unprecedented honors in this country. UM.

734
00:43:15,840 --> 00:43:19,319
Speaker 1: She was transported her body to Washington, d c uh

735
00:43:19,360 --> 00:43:22,080
Speaker 1: and she laid in honor under the rotunda, the US capital.

736
00:43:22,440 --> 00:43:25,840
Speaker 1: First woman to get that honor. Uh, the second African

737
00:43:25,880 --> 00:43:30,319
Speaker 1: American in the first non government UM American ever to

738
00:43:30,400 --> 00:43:33,840
Speaker 1: have this honor. I mean, that is a high honor.

739
00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:39,040
Speaker 1: When she died, every flag on public land in the

740
00:43:39,120 --> 00:43:43,000
Speaker 1: United States and around the world was flown at half masted,

741
00:43:43,520 --> 00:43:46,920
Speaker 1: which is pretty pretty great too. Yeah. George W. Bush

742
00:43:46,920 --> 00:43:49,880
Speaker 1: made sure that happened. Uh. And then here's just some

743
00:43:50,000 --> 00:43:54,120
Speaker 1: of her lifetime achievement awards. In double A. CP gave

744
00:43:54,160 --> 00:43:58,960
Speaker 1: her what's called the spin Garn Medal in their highest honor.

745
00:43:59,440 --> 00:44:01,879
Speaker 1: She's in the Mid Sigan Woman's Hall of Fame. Martin

746
00:44:01,960 --> 00:44:05,680
Speaker 1: Luther King Jr. Award nineteen eighty UM you could have

747
00:44:05,719 --> 00:44:09,400
Speaker 1: just stopped at the Michigan Hall of Fame, Michigan Women's

748
00:44:09,400 --> 00:44:12,920
Speaker 1: Hall of Fame. Uh, the Presidential Medal of Freedom in

749
00:44:14,600 --> 00:44:19,840
Speaker 1: ros Michigan Women's Hall of Fame, Congressional Gold Medal. No,

750
00:44:19,840 --> 00:44:22,600
Speaker 1: now we're in a contest. Um. Time magazine named her

751
00:44:22,640 --> 00:44:25,200
Speaker 1: was one of the twenty most influential iconic figures of

752
00:44:25,200 --> 00:44:28,320
Speaker 1: the twenty century. It's a big one, okay. Uh. And

753
00:44:28,360 --> 00:44:32,000
Speaker 1: then yeah, you mentioned George W. Bush ordered half mass

754
00:44:32,000 --> 00:44:34,880
Speaker 1: flags in two thousand five. So again there was this

755
00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:38,040
Speaker 1: this idea that she was just a tired, little old

756
00:44:38,120 --> 00:44:42,400
Speaker 1: lady who was quietly brave and didn't give up her seat,

757
00:44:42,440 --> 00:44:45,680
Speaker 1: and she was kind of meek and quiet um. And

758
00:44:45,920 --> 00:44:50,840
Speaker 1: in two thousand fourteen, her personal collection, the Rosa Parks Collection,

759
00:44:50,880 --> 00:44:54,399
Speaker 1: was sold to the Howard Buffett Foundation, Warren Buffett's son.

760
00:44:54,960 --> 00:44:57,400
Speaker 1: They bought it for a song at like four and

761
00:44:57,400 --> 00:45:02,920
Speaker 1: a half million dollars. And it's something like if dostgraphs,

762
00:45:03,480 --> 00:45:08,480
Speaker 1: and it is her personal papers, like notes for speeches,

763
00:45:08,640 --> 00:45:13,319
Speaker 1: notes for her books, I believe, um correspondence. And it

764
00:45:13,360 --> 00:45:16,280
Speaker 1: paints this picture that no one had of her before,

765
00:45:16,320 --> 00:45:19,120
Speaker 1: which was no like this lady was an activist they

766
00:45:19,200 --> 00:45:22,480
Speaker 1: went through her whole life. She was an activist who

767
00:45:22,760 --> 00:45:26,720
Speaker 1: um wanted to talk about and agitate for the rights

768
00:45:26,719 --> 00:45:30,920
Speaker 1: of black Americans and how messed up the situation was

769
00:45:30,960 --> 00:45:34,520
Speaker 1: that they lived in um and that she wouldn't normalize this.

770
00:45:34,880 --> 00:45:38,359
Speaker 1: She would she would learn to to to deal with

771
00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:40,200
Speaker 1: it as much as she needed to while she was

772
00:45:40,239 --> 00:45:43,360
Speaker 1: working to change it. Um. And there was just a

773
00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:45,879
Speaker 1: surprise to a lot of people when they cracked open

774
00:45:45,920 --> 00:45:49,279
Speaker 1: these papers and found that that picture of her. Yeah.

775
00:45:49,320 --> 00:45:51,879
Speaker 1: I also want to shout out article how history got

776
00:45:51,880 --> 00:45:55,040
Speaker 1: the Roads of Park story wrong? Um And this was

777
00:45:55,080 --> 00:45:58,440
Speaker 1: written by the same person who wrote the award winning

778
00:45:58,440 --> 00:46:01,080
Speaker 1: book The Rebellious Life of Mrs was A Parks. Her

779
00:46:01,160 --> 00:46:09,399
Speaker 1: name is Jean Theo Harris the Horus. It's all one word. Yeah,

780
00:46:09,400 --> 00:46:11,480
Speaker 1: I know it sounds like it should be hyphenated. It's

781
00:46:11,520 --> 00:46:13,600
Speaker 1: really easy to say, but how do you say it?

782
00:46:13,680 --> 00:46:17,280
Speaker 1: I have no idea. But Che's professor professor of Policy

783
00:46:17,320 --> 00:46:25,120
Speaker 1: at Brooklyn College of c n y Man great lady.

784
00:46:25,800 --> 00:46:28,640
Speaker 1: So if you want to know more about Rosa Parks,

785
00:46:29,480 --> 00:46:33,000
Speaker 1: go out on the internet, educate yourself. Seen that movie?

786
00:46:33,040 --> 00:46:36,640
Speaker 1: Have you seen that the about the bus boycott? No,

787
00:46:37,080 --> 00:46:42,480
Speaker 1: I mean it was a significant event. I had no idea. Um, okay,

788
00:46:42,520 --> 00:46:46,440
Speaker 1: well I think I said go search stuff in there somewhere.

789
00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:50,799
Speaker 1: So it means it's time for listener mail. I'm gonna

790
00:46:50,840 --> 00:46:54,880
Speaker 1: call this oh tiny Things alright, Hey, guys, let me

791
00:46:54,920 --> 00:46:58,000
Speaker 1: start off by saying, enjoyed the podcast very much. Aside

792
00:46:58,080 --> 00:47:01,239
Speaker 1: from being interesting and entertaining, it very much helps my

793
00:47:01,320 --> 00:47:04,560
Speaker 1: time in the car. We get that a lot can

794
00:47:04,640 --> 00:47:08,760
Speaker 1: you help people would go insane if it weren't for us. Um.

795
00:47:08,920 --> 00:47:11,959
Speaker 1: Several episodes ago, believe Chuck mentioned that you love tiny things.

796
00:47:12,080 --> 00:47:17,040
Speaker 1: I do, Josh like things that are grossly oversized. That

797
00:47:17,080 --> 00:47:19,719
Speaker 1: giant pocket watch over there, it's kind of a pain.

798
00:47:19,800 --> 00:47:23,319
Speaker 1: I'm wearing it like play fight. Uh. He mentioned loving

799
00:47:23,320 --> 00:47:26,480
Speaker 1: tiny things there's something extraordinarily satisfying about them. I agree,

800
00:47:26,920 --> 00:47:28,839
Speaker 1: I love tiny things. Would be remiss if I did

801
00:47:28,840 --> 00:47:33,120
Speaker 1: not bring um, bring you to the Museum of Jurassic

802
00:47:33,200 --> 00:47:37,400
Speaker 1: Technology that I don't know. I've been there too. Um.

803
00:47:37,400 --> 00:47:40,000
Speaker 1: It's in Los Angeles. There are not one, but two

804
00:47:40,080 --> 00:47:43,040
Speaker 1: fantastic exhibits of tiny things. But I have the needle

805
00:47:43,160 --> 00:47:46,680
Speaker 1: in micro mosaics. I don't think I saw those, did you?

806
00:47:47,200 --> 00:47:50,000
Speaker 1: The tiny thing I remember was like the dioramas of

807
00:47:50,040 --> 00:47:54,560
Speaker 1: the trailers, and I have the Needle. I remember that. Yeah,

808
00:47:54,880 --> 00:47:57,440
Speaker 1: I don't remember. The micro Mosaics I haven't been in

809
00:47:57,680 --> 00:48:01,040
Speaker 1: many years, though I have. The Needle features delightful, whimsical

810
00:48:01,120 --> 00:48:03,600
Speaker 1: miniature sculptures, actually small enough to fit into the eye

811
00:48:03,600 --> 00:48:06,080
Speaker 1: of a needle. There you m that's a little too

812
00:48:06,120 --> 00:48:08,759
Speaker 1: small for me. Okay, so you like so you like?

813
00:48:09,120 --> 00:48:11,120
Speaker 1: I like the tiny Tabasco bottles, So you get into

814
00:48:11,800 --> 00:48:13,560
Speaker 1: you like to feel like you're a giant, not like

815
00:48:13,600 --> 00:48:17,080
Speaker 1: a god. Yeah, exactly. I just want to be taller.

816
00:48:18,080 --> 00:48:21,920
Speaker 1: The micro Mosaics exhibit also requires a magnifying glass to enjoy.

817
00:48:22,000 --> 00:48:24,839
Speaker 1: However beautiful, this exhibit has a slightly creepy aspect to it.

818
00:48:25,200 --> 00:48:30,439
Speaker 1: The tiny mosaic pieces are in fact bits of butterfly wings. Yeah,

819
00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:34,200
Speaker 1: it's not too creepy. Oh, I mean they kill the

820
00:48:34,239 --> 00:48:37,360
Speaker 1: butterflies depends. Yeah, how do they come across those wings?

821
00:48:37,400 --> 00:48:40,200
Speaker 1: Where do they road kill? If so, that's fine, Yeah,

822
00:48:40,800 --> 00:48:43,640
Speaker 1: what a job, go out and just try and find

823
00:48:43,640 --> 00:48:47,360
Speaker 1: dead butterflies. All in all, these exhibits of a wonderful

824
00:48:47,400 --> 00:48:50,720
Speaker 1: Field of Magic Realism. Museum also features a lovely rooftop

825
00:48:50,719 --> 00:48:53,360
Speaker 1: garden as well of a meditative tea room to enjoy

826
00:48:53,719 --> 00:48:58,080
Speaker 1: complimentary cup of tea. Interesting. That is all guys, cheers

827
00:48:58,400 --> 00:49:01,200
Speaker 1: from Sandra Williams. Thanks up for the shout out, Sandra.

828
00:49:01,320 --> 00:49:03,440
Speaker 1: That is a indeed a great place. If you're ever

829
00:49:03,480 --> 00:49:06,000
Speaker 1: in Los Angeles, everybody go check out the Museum of

830
00:49:06,080 --> 00:49:10,640
Speaker 1: Jurassic Technology's going with your mind open and thank us later. Yeah,

831
00:49:10,640 --> 00:49:12,880
Speaker 1: get out of Ripley's Believe it or Not We'll go

832
00:49:13,040 --> 00:49:17,800
Speaker 1: to both. You know, sure I said get out of

833
00:49:17,840 --> 00:49:20,200
Speaker 1: Ripley's Believe it or Not? Okay, Yeah, But I mean

834
00:49:20,280 --> 00:49:22,640
Speaker 1: Jack Palance Man, how do you how do you pass that?

835
00:49:23,640 --> 00:49:26,520
Speaker 1: I don't get it? Remember he was the host of

836
00:49:26,560 --> 00:49:31,759
Speaker 1: the TV not Yeah. My brother worked with him on

837
00:49:32,600 --> 00:49:36,080
Speaker 1: City Slickers too, and there was one story where, uh,

838
00:49:36,640 --> 00:49:38,400
Speaker 1: you know, he's kind of old at the time, where

839
00:49:38,520 --> 00:49:41,000
Speaker 1: Scott as the A D s to walk him second

840
00:49:41,000 --> 00:49:42,399
Speaker 1: a D is to walk the talent to the set

841
00:49:42,440 --> 00:49:45,480
Speaker 1: from their trailer, and it was through the desert, the

842
00:49:45,560 --> 00:49:47,879
Speaker 1: rocky desert, and Scott was like, you know, look after

843
00:49:47,920 --> 00:49:50,160
Speaker 1: that wrong, Mr Palence or something like that. And one

844
00:49:50,200 --> 00:49:51,759
Speaker 1: day he was just like, I don't need you to

845
00:49:51,800 --> 00:49:56,719
Speaker 1: tell me how to walk. Scott like shrank down. Of

846
00:49:56,719 --> 00:49:59,120
Speaker 1: course I can't remember that's exactly what he said, but

847
00:49:59,120 --> 00:50:02,520
Speaker 1: but I'll bet that um Jack Palance felt so bad

848
00:50:02,560 --> 00:50:04,960
Speaker 1: for yelling at Scott of all the people do it,

849
00:50:05,320 --> 00:50:07,880
Speaker 1: you know that Scott and he didn't delight in Scott

850
00:50:07,920 --> 00:50:12,160
Speaker 1: like every next days. Yeah. Well, if you want to

851
00:50:12,160 --> 00:50:13,920
Speaker 1: tell us how great you think Scott is, you can

852
00:50:13,920 --> 00:50:17,200
Speaker 1: tweet to us. I'm at josh um Clark and at

853
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Speaker 1: com slash Charles W. Chuck Bryant. There's also uh facebook

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