1
00:00:04,078 --> 00:00:07,318
Speaker 1: The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.

2
00:00:14,158 --> 00:00:15,158
Speaker 2: Hey there, welcome back.

3
00:00:15,198 --> 00:00:18,878
Speaker 1: It's another episode of the Book of Joe podcast with me,

4
00:00:18,998 --> 00:00:22,718
Speaker 1: Tom Berducci and Joe Madden and Joe. This is a

5
00:00:22,758 --> 00:00:26,638
Speaker 1: great time of year. We know it's October, It's playoff baseball.

6
00:00:26,678 --> 00:00:30,678
Speaker 1: There's nothing like it. We're coming off four sweeps in

7
00:00:30,758 --> 00:00:34,078
Speaker 1: the first round of the Wildcard Series, so we are

8
00:00:34,118 --> 00:00:38,358
Speaker 1: going to dive into our previews of the four division series.

9
00:00:38,558 --> 00:00:43,358
Speaker 1: But first we have to talk about the Wildcard Series

10
00:00:43,958 --> 00:00:48,078
Speaker 1: and especially the decision by John Schneider the Toronto Blue Jays. Joe,

11
00:00:48,078 --> 00:00:52,638
Speaker 1: We've talked a lot about managers running games, losing influence

12
00:00:52,758 --> 00:00:54,558
Speaker 1: to have the freedom to make calls in the course

13
00:00:54,558 --> 00:00:55,038
Speaker 1: of the game.

14
00:00:56,038 --> 00:00:59,478
Speaker 2: My goodness. We could spend the whole podcast on that decision.

15
00:00:59,558 --> 00:01:04,278
Speaker 1: We won't, but we will definitely dive into iteople who

16
00:01:04,278 --> 00:01:04,918
Speaker 1: didn't see it.

17
00:01:05,398 --> 00:01:08,198
Speaker 2: Where were you? By the way, the.

18
00:01:08,158 --> 00:01:11,918
Speaker 1: Blue Jays took out a dominant starting pitcher, a guy

19
00:01:11,918 --> 00:01:14,958
Speaker 1: who the manager admitted had his best stuff all year.

20
00:01:14,998 --> 00:01:18,598
Speaker 1: That was Jose Barrios, and the game immediately fell away

21
00:01:18,758 --> 00:01:21,078
Speaker 1: for the Toronto Blue Jays and they went home after

22
00:01:21,158 --> 00:01:26,558
Speaker 1: taking out their hot starting pitcher after forty seven pitches

23
00:01:26,958 --> 00:01:29,398
Speaker 1: left to mount without a run being scored, all because

24
00:01:29,438 --> 00:01:32,758
Speaker 1: there was a pregame script to flip the lineup over

25
00:01:32,798 --> 00:01:36,638
Speaker 1: from Minnesota. Bring in the left hander, you say, Kakuchi. Listen,

26
00:01:36,678 --> 00:01:39,438
Speaker 1: they didn't hit. I get that it wasn't the only

27
00:01:39,478 --> 00:01:43,238
Speaker 1: reason why they lost, but that was one reason why

28
00:01:43,278 --> 00:01:45,478
Speaker 1: the Toronto Blue Jays are sitting at home right now.

29
00:01:45,598 --> 00:01:48,758
Speaker 1: So that's a quick thumbnail of what happened. Joe, I

30
00:01:48,758 --> 00:01:50,638
Speaker 1: can't wait. I was thinking about you when I saw this.

31
00:01:50,718 --> 00:01:51,998
Speaker 1: I can't wait for your take on this.

32
00:01:52,598 --> 00:01:54,678
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'll beusly. I was watching it, or I was

33
00:01:54,678 --> 00:01:56,918
Speaker 3: actually listening to it. I was driving back from Florida.

34
00:01:57,438 --> 00:02:00,398
Speaker 3: I was in my car and I'm hearing this all

35
00:02:00,478 --> 00:02:04,678
Speaker 3: go on. And again, there's nothing to illustrate everything we've

36
00:02:04,678 --> 00:02:07,998
Speaker 3: been talking about all year, pretty much in our podcast,

37
00:02:08,238 --> 00:02:14,238
Speaker 3: more than that particular decision. It truly represents the influence

38
00:02:14,278 --> 00:02:16,078
Speaker 3: on the front office on the game, where the analytical

39
00:02:16,118 --> 00:02:19,118
Speaker 3: department on the game. I don't know John Schneider. I've

40
00:02:19,198 --> 00:02:21,038
Speaker 3: never met him, but I listened to him and I

41
00:02:21,038 --> 00:02:23,638
Speaker 3: think he speaks really well and I could see where

42
00:02:23,638 --> 00:02:25,878
Speaker 3: he's a great communicator at that clubhouse, and I could

43
00:02:25,918 --> 00:02:30,038
Speaker 3: also see where he really fits in well with today's

44
00:02:30,478 --> 00:02:33,838
Speaker 3: method and a front office. He speaks well, and I

45
00:02:33,918 --> 00:02:36,598
Speaker 3: like that about him a lot, But in this situation

46
00:02:36,758 --> 00:02:41,798
Speaker 3: like that, there's no more compelling evidence or exact evidence.

47
00:02:41,798 --> 00:02:44,718
Speaker 3: What happens prior to a game. They talked about it,

48
00:02:44,758 --> 00:02:48,038
Speaker 3: he was told about it, and if this popped up,

49
00:02:48,158 --> 00:02:49,878
Speaker 3: even if it's early, even if he's throwing the ball,

50
00:02:49,918 --> 00:02:52,678
Speaker 3: well we still need to do this. That's exactly what happened.

51
00:02:52,718 --> 00:02:54,678
Speaker 3: There was no gray area, there was probably no room

52
00:02:54,718 --> 00:02:57,838
Speaker 3: for latitude on his part, and eventually that's what you

53
00:02:57,878 --> 00:03:00,998
Speaker 3: see happen right there. Now, I'll put myself kind of

54
00:03:01,038 --> 00:03:02,598
Speaker 3: on the boiler plate here a little bit too. In

55
00:03:02,638 --> 00:03:05,118
Speaker 3: the World Series and twenty six, we had talked about

56
00:03:05,118 --> 00:03:09,758
Speaker 3: that the day before with Johnny Lester and Kyle Hendricks,

57
00:03:10,038 --> 00:03:12,238
Speaker 3: and a big part of that also was to get

58
00:03:12,318 --> 00:03:15,558
Speaker 3: David Ross involved as a catcher. But I was really

59
00:03:15,558 --> 00:03:17,998
Speaker 3: a big part of that discussion and I was totally

60
00:03:18,078 --> 00:03:21,678
Speaker 3: on board with it. The eventual decision to take Kyle

61
00:03:21,718 --> 00:03:24,678
Speaker 3: out of that game and bring Johnny in was based

62
00:03:24,718 --> 00:03:27,838
Speaker 3: on Johnny wrman up a couple times, and also one

63
00:03:27,878 --> 00:03:30,158
Speaker 3: man on if another get my man gets on, then

64
00:03:30,318 --> 00:03:33,478
Speaker 3: Kyle Hendricks would have had to face Lindor in a

65
00:03:33,518 --> 00:03:35,518
Speaker 3: real dirty situation. He did not want to put you

66
00:03:35,558 --> 00:03:36,798
Speaker 3: on in that moment. So there was a lot of

67
00:03:36,838 --> 00:03:40,918
Speaker 3: stuff going on. But I do agree with the conferences

68
00:03:41,278 --> 00:03:43,838
Speaker 3: or talking about it before the game, absolutely, But nobody

69
00:03:44,278 --> 00:03:45,958
Speaker 3: made me do that or asked me to do that

70
00:03:46,038 --> 00:03:48,518
Speaker 3: in that particular moment. THEO did not, Jed did not.

71
00:03:49,038 --> 00:03:51,438
Speaker 3: That was my read on the situation based on our

72
00:03:51,438 --> 00:03:54,918
Speaker 3: discussion the previous day, combined with the fact he walks

73
00:03:55,078 --> 00:03:57,078
Speaker 3: the leonof hitter cent on a pitch that was a

74
00:03:57,118 --> 00:03:59,878
Speaker 3: strike would have been a third out. Here comes a

75
00:03:59,998 --> 00:04:02,678
Speaker 3: kipnist who had been hot with Lindor on deck, and

76
00:04:02,718 --> 00:04:04,198
Speaker 3: that's where you have to think a little bit farther

77
00:04:04,198 --> 00:04:06,718
Speaker 3: in advance. So I'm just saying that I've been involved

78
00:04:06,718 --> 00:04:10,118
Speaker 3: in these situations and we had scripted it or talked

79
00:04:10,118 --> 00:04:12,158
Speaker 3: about it in advance, but had a tremendous amount of

80
00:04:12,198 --> 00:04:14,758
Speaker 3: latitude to make up my own mind what I wanted

81
00:04:14,758 --> 00:04:17,678
Speaker 3: to do, and I did. And regarding the Schneider situation,

82
00:04:17,838 --> 00:04:19,838
Speaker 3: I'm sure it was scripted and talked about a lot,

83
00:04:20,118 --> 00:04:21,878
Speaker 3: but I don't think there was as much latitude. There's

84
00:04:21,918 --> 00:04:24,518
Speaker 3: not as much latitude for the manager right now to

85
00:04:24,598 --> 00:04:27,558
Speaker 3: really be more unilateral in his decision making.

86
00:04:27,998 --> 00:04:29,918
Speaker 2: Yeah, I listen, there's a lot of things I don't

87
00:04:29,998 --> 00:04:30,518
Speaker 2: like about it.

88
00:04:30,718 --> 00:04:33,358
Speaker 1: And I know your situation was different as well, because

89
00:04:33,518 --> 00:04:35,478
Speaker 1: you had seen Kyle Hendrick give up a couple of

90
00:04:35,478 --> 00:04:36,318
Speaker 1: hard hit balls.

91
00:04:36,998 --> 00:04:38,558
Speaker 2: They were starting to square him up.

92
00:04:38,638 --> 00:04:40,758
Speaker 1: In this case, there was a walk to Royce Lewis,

93
00:04:41,038 --> 00:04:44,518
Speaker 1: but that was an understandable walk because Lewis has been

94
00:04:44,598 --> 00:04:46,478
Speaker 1: the red hot hitter for the Twins.

95
00:04:47,038 --> 00:04:48,398
Speaker 2: It was a very competitive walk.

96
00:04:48,478 --> 00:04:50,838
Speaker 1: He just was not going to give in, nor should

97
00:04:50,878 --> 00:04:52,798
Speaker 1: he for a guy who hit two home runs in

98
00:04:52,838 --> 00:04:53,278
Speaker 1: Game one.

99
00:04:54,158 --> 00:04:56,358
Speaker 2: Stuff wise, if you want to go by metrics, you

100
00:04:56,398 --> 00:04:57,158
Speaker 2: love the metrics.

101
00:04:57,158 --> 00:05:01,158
Speaker 1: Sure, his velocity had all four of his pitches were

102
00:05:01,238 --> 00:05:03,238
Speaker 1: up from one to two and a half miles an hour.

103
00:05:03,998 --> 00:05:06,678
Speaker 1: They did not hit a ball ninety five miles an

104
00:05:06,718 --> 00:05:09,278
Speaker 1: hour or harder. They just did not square him up.

105
00:05:09,518 --> 00:05:12,238
Speaker 1: And the manager admitted it was probably his best stuff

106
00:05:12,278 --> 00:05:14,118
Speaker 1: all year. But you have to go back even to

107
00:05:14,158 --> 00:05:17,118
Speaker 1: the first inning after this thought was planted in his head,

108
00:05:17,238 --> 00:05:19,438
Speaker 1: whether from him or somebody in the front office, or

109
00:05:19,598 --> 00:05:22,598
Speaker 1: most likely a combination of both, that Kokuchi was going

110
00:05:22,638 --> 00:05:25,118
Speaker 1: to come into this game to turn around the lineup

111
00:05:25,118 --> 00:05:27,798
Speaker 1: because Minnesota does have a lot of left handed hitters,

112
00:05:28,118 --> 00:05:30,718
Speaker 1: their right handed platoon guys probably are a bit weaker

113
00:05:30,758 --> 00:05:33,318
Speaker 1: than their lefties. I get that. They so they had

114
00:05:33,358 --> 00:05:36,478
Speaker 1: that in mind. But what they did was they didn't

115
00:05:36,478 --> 00:05:37,078
Speaker 1: watch the game.

116
00:05:37,118 --> 00:05:37,798
Speaker 2: They didn't pay.

117
00:05:37,638 --> 00:05:39,678
Speaker 1: Attention to what the game was telling them to do,

118
00:05:40,118 --> 00:05:42,478
Speaker 1: so they wound up bringing in Kokuchi, who is not

119
00:05:42,638 --> 00:05:46,438
Speaker 1: pitched out of the bullpen the entire year, and brought him.

120
00:05:46,358 --> 00:05:47,478
Speaker 2: Into a dirty situation.

121
00:05:47,718 --> 00:05:50,078
Speaker 1: There's just so many things wrong with this, Joe that

122
00:05:50,838 --> 00:05:52,838
Speaker 1: it's I didn't like the fact that Snyder and I

123
00:05:52,878 --> 00:05:53,398
Speaker 1: agree with you.

124
00:05:53,758 --> 00:05:55,438
Speaker 2: I like John Schnider, great guy.

125
00:05:55,478 --> 00:05:57,358
Speaker 1: I think he's going to be a good manager, but

126
00:05:57,398 --> 00:05:59,478
Speaker 1: he doesn't have enough of pedigree at this point in

127
00:05:59,518 --> 00:06:01,638
Speaker 1: his career to stand up to his front office and say,

128
00:06:01,678 --> 00:06:02,918
Speaker 1: this is how I'm running the game.

129
00:06:03,078 --> 00:06:05,318
Speaker 2: I'm going to react to what I'm watching. What I'm

130
00:06:05,318 --> 00:06:07,678
Speaker 2: watching is Jose Breas is dominating.

131
00:06:07,918 --> 00:06:10,838
Speaker 1: Why would I ever do something to take out a

132
00:06:10,878 --> 00:06:12,638
Speaker 1: guy who's dominating for.

133
00:06:12,678 --> 00:06:13,078
Speaker 2: Me, Joe.

134
00:06:13,118 --> 00:06:16,238
Speaker 1: Rule Number one for a manager is never make a

135
00:06:16,318 --> 00:06:20,638
Speaker 1: decision that makes the other team happy. John Schneider made

136
00:06:20,718 --> 00:06:24,198
Speaker 1: the Minnesota Twins happy. Throw the script out. Don't make

137
00:06:24,238 --> 00:06:25,718
Speaker 1: the other team happy. It's that simple.

138
00:06:26,038 --> 00:06:28,078
Speaker 3: You're right. All that stuff is right on the money.

139
00:06:28,118 --> 00:06:31,358
Speaker 3: The stuff that is planted in your head before the game. Wow,

140
00:06:31,518 --> 00:06:34,358
Speaker 3: if I told my players that many things to consider

141
00:06:34,438 --> 00:06:37,078
Speaker 3: before the game, or created any sense of doubt in

142
00:06:37,118 --> 00:06:39,518
Speaker 3: my player's minds before the game, that'd be the worst

143
00:06:39,558 --> 00:06:42,438
Speaker 3: possible thing I can do with They don't realize. They

144
00:06:42,518 --> 00:06:45,238
Speaker 3: being front office people and analytica guys, when you do

145
00:06:45,318 --> 00:06:48,758
Speaker 3: things like this, when you constantly feel your manager's heads

146
00:06:48,878 --> 00:06:52,158
Speaker 3: head up or heads up with thoughts and ideas and

147
00:06:52,318 --> 00:06:55,398
Speaker 3: mandates and all this stuff, this creates so much doubt

148
00:06:55,398 --> 00:06:57,918
Speaker 3: in your mind that you get away from you. You

149
00:06:57,998 --> 00:07:01,558
Speaker 3: cannot have your own process of thinking things through it.

150
00:07:01,638 --> 00:07:03,798
Speaker 3: Like you're saying, watch the game, pay attention to the game.

151
00:07:03,998 --> 00:07:05,958
Speaker 3: What am I seeing right now? What do I need

152
00:07:05,998 --> 00:07:07,238
Speaker 3: to do? What do I need not to do? With

153
00:07:07,398 --> 00:07:09,878
Speaker 3: the decision to make us do nothing, that's a decision.

154
00:07:10,278 --> 00:07:14,078
Speaker 3: But it's true, man, so many things are floating in

155
00:07:14,118 --> 00:07:16,918
Speaker 3: your head. I'm certain Kevin cashed a great job with

156
00:07:16,958 --> 00:07:18,598
Speaker 3: the Rays, but I know when he took Snell out,

157
00:07:19,038 --> 00:07:20,718
Speaker 3: all the voices are in the back of your head

158
00:07:20,718 --> 00:07:23,798
Speaker 3: in that moment. It's just true. I've been through it.

159
00:07:23,838 --> 00:07:26,758
Speaker 3: I've been through it more recently the latter part of

160
00:07:26,798 --> 00:07:29,598
Speaker 3: my managing with the Cubs and then with the Angels.

161
00:07:29,998 --> 00:07:32,718
Speaker 3: There's so many things floating up there based on stuff

162
00:07:32,718 --> 00:07:36,358
Speaker 3: that you'd been told before the game, and it's independent

163
00:07:36,398 --> 00:07:40,318
Speaker 3: of your own baseball common sense, your own baseball sensibilities

164
00:07:40,358 --> 00:07:44,158
Speaker 3: that you've been raised with. Whenever you with an athlete

165
00:07:44,238 --> 00:07:46,358
Speaker 3: or a manager or whomever, any we're talking in about

166
00:07:46,358 --> 00:07:48,758
Speaker 3: athletic situation, the last thing you want to do, the

167
00:07:48,878 --> 00:07:50,598
Speaker 3: very last thing you want to do, is present doubt.

168
00:07:51,078 --> 00:07:53,158
Speaker 3: You have to present it in a way that you

169
00:07:53,238 --> 00:07:55,638
Speaker 3: might give options or things they consider, but don't say

170
00:07:55,638 --> 00:07:59,518
Speaker 3: it in a way that this person, the person making

171
00:07:59,558 --> 00:08:03,678
Speaker 3: the decisions and the hot moment, doubts his decision making

172
00:08:03,918 --> 00:08:07,198
Speaker 3: based on the fact that you may actually it may

173
00:08:07,198 --> 00:08:09,438
Speaker 3: actually cause you. It does make you go against maybe

174
00:08:09,478 --> 00:08:11,918
Speaker 3: what you truly believe needs to be done right here,

175
00:08:12,118 --> 00:08:14,398
Speaker 3: and that's wrong, and that to me, is absolutely wrong.

176
00:08:14,438 --> 00:08:16,638
Speaker 3: So I'm just trying to give you the overarching, overall

177
00:08:17,158 --> 00:08:20,198
Speaker 3: scope or look at this thing. But that phrase is true, Tommy,

178
00:08:20,318 --> 00:08:23,238
Speaker 3: really true. They planned so many things in your head

179
00:08:23,718 --> 00:08:27,038
Speaker 3: that you doubt yourself and you cannot make that baseball

180
00:08:27,078 --> 00:08:29,278
Speaker 3: decision that you've been trained to do. Well.

181
00:08:29,318 --> 00:08:33,798
Speaker 1: Listen, he had Kokuchi throwing as early as the first inning.

182
00:08:33,998 --> 00:08:37,478
Speaker 1: He had Hennes's Cabrera up in the third inning, with

183
00:08:37,638 --> 00:08:41,198
Speaker 1: Barrios dominating with just thirty pitches into a game. So

184
00:08:41,238 --> 00:08:43,638
Speaker 1: he managed the game with his hand on a fire alarm.

185
00:08:43,878 --> 00:08:45,718
Speaker 1: He couldn't wait to go to the script.

186
00:08:46,238 --> 00:08:46,838
Speaker 2: I get it.

187
00:08:46,998 --> 00:08:49,398
Speaker 1: I get that script, but keep that in your back pocket.

188
00:08:49,838 --> 00:08:51,958
Speaker 1: You don't watch the game. And I didn't like the

189
00:08:51,998 --> 00:08:55,078
Speaker 1: fact that after the game John Schneider did not use

190
00:08:55,118 --> 00:08:56,198
Speaker 1: the pronoun.

191
00:08:55,918 --> 00:08:59,318
Speaker 2: I own it. Yeah, well, tell me what.

192
00:08:59,118 --> 00:09:02,398
Speaker 1: You saw that made you make that decision. Don't say

193
00:09:02,398 --> 00:09:05,278
Speaker 1: you can second guess me, second guess the organization. It's

194
00:09:05,318 --> 00:09:08,878
Speaker 1: not about the organization. You are a leader, you are

195
00:09:08,918 --> 00:09:13,198
Speaker 1: a decision maker. And again, the script is wonderful to

196
00:09:13,238 --> 00:09:15,758
Speaker 1: go into a game with, but you at some point

197
00:09:15,878 --> 00:09:20,318
Speaker 1: have to say I made this decision because and finished

198
00:09:20,318 --> 00:09:21,518
Speaker 1: that sentence with conviction.

199
00:09:21,758 --> 00:09:24,318
Speaker 2: I didn't see conviction. I saw a guy that was just.

200
00:09:24,638 --> 00:09:26,718
Speaker 1: I don't know why, he just, as you said, his

201
00:09:26,758 --> 00:09:29,798
Speaker 1: head was filled with a preordained idea and he couldn't

202
00:09:29,838 --> 00:09:30,638
Speaker 1: wait to go to it.

203
00:09:30,878 --> 00:09:32,878
Speaker 2: And by the way, players know this.

204
00:09:33,438 --> 00:09:34,838
Speaker 1: I don't know if you saw the quotes from Wit

205
00:09:34,958 --> 00:09:38,558
Speaker 1: Maryfield after the game, he flat out said, I hated it.

206
00:09:39,318 --> 00:09:41,438
Speaker 1: He said, this is what's going on in baseball. They're

207
00:09:41,478 --> 00:09:45,558
Speaker 1: taking away from managers what they're doing here. I hated it.

208
00:09:45,758 --> 00:09:48,838
Speaker 1: That's one of your own players. Forget about making the

209
00:09:48,878 --> 00:09:52,158
Speaker 1: other team happy, you're making your own players unhappy.

210
00:09:52,518 --> 00:09:56,158
Speaker 3: Yeah, listen, what's out standing. And again it just proves

211
00:09:56,198 --> 00:09:59,118
Speaker 3: the point or personifies the point that they are middle

212
00:09:59,118 --> 00:10:02,798
Speaker 3: managers producing middle managers and not managers anymore. And I've

213
00:10:02,798 --> 00:10:04,318
Speaker 3: talked about this, and I'm telling you, man, if it

214
00:10:04,358 --> 00:10:06,238
Speaker 3: continues along this path, you're gonna have a head coach

215
00:10:06,278 --> 00:10:08,638
Speaker 3: and no longer a manager. You're going to be somehow

216
00:10:08,638 --> 00:10:11,398
Speaker 3: wired up to the press box or somebody upstairs in

217
00:10:11,558 --> 00:10:14,358
Speaker 3: game to have decisions being sent down to you. It's

218
00:10:14,358 --> 00:10:18,078
Speaker 3: basically at almost at that point already. It is. It's

219
00:10:18,118 --> 00:10:21,438
Speaker 3: it's very distracting. It's it really takes a lot of

220
00:10:21,478 --> 00:10:23,118
Speaker 3: joy out of it, not only for the manager of

221
00:10:23,158 --> 00:10:26,038
Speaker 3: course and the coaching staff, but also players just like

222
00:10:26,038 --> 00:10:28,958
Speaker 3: like with exemplified there with what he said, and I

223
00:10:28,998 --> 00:10:32,518
Speaker 3: really I credit him for speaking up like he did,

224
00:10:32,518 --> 00:10:35,678
Speaker 3: and it wasn't trying to hammer his manager. He was

225
00:10:35,678 --> 00:10:38,998
Speaker 3: talking to an over overarching point regarding what's going on

226
00:10:39,038 --> 00:10:41,358
Speaker 3: in the game in general. And it's true. It's it's

227
00:10:41,398 --> 00:10:44,638
Speaker 3: there's no there's no equivocating here. It's absolutely true. That's

228
00:10:44,678 --> 00:10:47,118
Speaker 3: what's going on. It's happened in other cities. I know

229
00:10:47,158 --> 00:10:49,518
Speaker 3: even Buck felt that this year, and Buck, of all

230
00:10:49,558 --> 00:10:52,318
Speaker 3: people in New York felt that. I don't even know

231
00:10:52,318 --> 00:10:54,318
Speaker 3: to what extent gab, but Gabe is definitely on board

232
00:10:54,358 --> 00:10:56,118
Speaker 3: with that. And then with Nev, I know what happened

233
00:10:56,118 --> 00:10:59,198
Speaker 3: with Nev in Anaheim. I just know that's just what's

234
00:10:59,238 --> 00:11:01,838
Speaker 3: going on. So when you get let Go or fire

235
00:11:01,958 --> 00:11:07,078
Speaker 3: or whatever, you're trying to help this group incorporate their

236
00:11:07,118 --> 00:11:09,398
Speaker 3: philosophy into the game, and then you pay the price

237
00:11:09,398 --> 00:11:13,238
Speaker 3: for it. It's very difficult to not difficult to understand,

238
00:11:13,238 --> 00:11:14,318
Speaker 3: but very difficult to take.

239
00:11:14,678 --> 00:11:17,598
Speaker 1: Yeah, listen, if you haven't read our book, The Book

240
00:11:17,598 --> 00:11:20,038
Speaker 1: of Joe, you got to read it because it's chapter

241
00:11:20,078 --> 00:11:22,158
Speaker 1: and verse of how we got here, and it's only

242
00:11:22,598 --> 00:11:25,838
Speaker 1: become the influence of how games are run even more

243
00:11:26,638 --> 00:11:30,198
Speaker 1: heavy since the book came out last year, and it

244
00:11:30,278 --> 00:11:32,878
Speaker 1: goes back and Sandy Alderson admitted this when he was

245
00:11:33,798 --> 00:11:36,558
Speaker 1: running the Oakland A's and he hired Art Howe.

246
00:11:36,598 --> 00:11:39,398
Speaker 2: He told him, I'm not hiring.

247
00:11:38,998 --> 00:11:42,238
Speaker 1: You because of your baseball acumen and your ideas or

248
00:11:42,278 --> 00:11:45,558
Speaker 1: your philosophy. I'm hiring you to implement ours in the

249
00:11:45,558 --> 00:11:49,078
Speaker 1: front office. And that's when the game turned. And Joe,

250
00:11:49,118 --> 00:11:51,158
Speaker 1: I know you went through this with the Angels, but

251
00:11:51,198 --> 00:11:53,118
Speaker 1: there was a really good story. You mentioned some of

252
00:11:53,118 --> 00:11:55,678
Speaker 1: the other ball clubs story in The Athletic by Andrew

253
00:11:55,718 --> 00:11:58,438
Speaker 1: Baggerley about the Giants. You know, Mike Murphy was a

254
00:11:58,478 --> 00:12:03,358
Speaker 1: long time, longtime clubhouse attendant manager with the Giants, and

255
00:12:03,358 --> 00:12:06,078
Speaker 1: the home club house players would hang out there. It

256
00:12:06,118 --> 00:12:09,318
Speaker 1: was kind of like where they had their little Algonquin roundtable, right,

257
00:12:09,478 --> 00:12:12,798
Speaker 1: just go in there and have a drink and talk baseball.

258
00:12:12,838 --> 00:12:15,398
Speaker 1: Willie Mays would sit in there and would talk baseball

259
00:12:15,438 --> 00:12:16,758
Speaker 1: with whoever walked in there.

260
00:12:16,918 --> 00:12:18,078
Speaker 2: It was just an awesome place.

261
00:12:18,438 --> 00:12:22,958
Speaker 1: Well that's gone now because the front office analytics group

262
00:12:22,998 --> 00:12:25,998
Speaker 1: has taken over that office, so they had to move

263
00:12:26,038 --> 00:12:29,158
Speaker 1: the clubhouse attendance into the interview room.

264
00:12:29,358 --> 00:12:33,398
Speaker 2: So there's literally no interview room at the Giants ballpark.

265
00:12:33,438 --> 00:12:36,358
Speaker 1: Now, and we're talking about in terms of the analytics group,

266
00:12:36,478 --> 00:12:40,918
Speaker 1: at least a senior data scientist, two senior analyst for

267
00:12:41,118 --> 00:12:45,598
Speaker 1: associate analysts, another associated analyst, eight sophtomare engineers. And that's

268
00:12:45,638 --> 00:12:49,278
Speaker 1: not including the performance science team, which has a biomechanist,

269
00:12:49,358 --> 00:12:53,238
Speaker 1: all kinds of different coaches that are called analysts. They

270
00:12:53,358 --> 00:12:57,878
Speaker 1: have the run of the clubhouse. They help run the

271
00:12:57,958 --> 00:13:01,918
Speaker 1: hitting and pitching meetings. They are embedded not just in

272
00:13:01,998 --> 00:13:04,438
Speaker 1: terms of the philosophy of the team, but physical in

273
00:13:04,478 --> 00:13:08,838
Speaker 1: the space of the players who actually play the game

274
00:13:08,998 --> 00:13:14,198
Speaker 1: of baseball. They'll forget about a firewall. There is no wall.

275
00:13:14,518 --> 00:13:17,678
Speaker 1: It is seamless. Now when you think about the people

276
00:13:17,758 --> 00:13:21,518
Speaker 1: who are running the teams, and I'm talking about not

277
00:13:21,598 --> 00:13:25,838
Speaker 1: just information but the strategy of a team, they are

278
00:13:25,878 --> 00:13:30,598
Speaker 1: physically embedded in the teams now. So you talk about influence.

279
00:13:30,638 --> 00:13:32,798
Speaker 1: If you're a manager these days and a team like that,

280
00:13:32,878 --> 00:13:34,838
Speaker 1: how could you not have those thoughts.

281
00:13:34,518 --> 00:13:34,998
Speaker 2: In your head?

282
00:13:35,438 --> 00:13:38,278
Speaker 3: You do? And the same thing was with the Angels.

283
00:13:38,278 --> 00:13:41,358
Speaker 3: There was a room meeting room right next to the

284
00:13:41,478 --> 00:13:44,758
Speaker 3: adjacent with the coaches room. And I know for a

285
00:13:44,798 --> 00:13:47,758
Speaker 3: fact that coaches are very uncomfortable just to have open

286
00:13:47,798 --> 00:13:51,638
Speaker 3: conversations among themselves because they were concerned about their voices

287
00:13:51,678 --> 00:13:54,398
Speaker 3: carrying too far and people hearing what they had to

288
00:13:54,398 --> 00:13:56,958
Speaker 3: say and would not like it. You can't have that.

289
00:13:57,038 --> 00:14:00,118
Speaker 3: You cannot have that. Coaches, real major league coaches, real

290
00:14:00,158 --> 00:14:02,558
Speaker 3: baseball coaches, have to be able to vent. They have

291
00:14:02,598 --> 00:14:03,798
Speaker 3: to be able to say what they say. They have

292
00:14:03,958 --> 00:14:06,198
Speaker 3: to be able to be angry among each other and

293
00:14:06,198 --> 00:14:07,998
Speaker 3: get things off their chest, and they have to be

294
00:14:07,998 --> 00:14:10,718
Speaker 3: able to discuss this without holding back. That's part of

295
00:14:10,758 --> 00:14:13,478
Speaker 3: what happens when you get in an environment like this.

296
00:14:14,198 --> 00:14:16,678
Speaker 3: People don't necessarily or they don't say what they mean.

297
00:14:16,998 --> 00:14:21,678
Speaker 3: They're always being guarded. They just withholding kind of a situation.

298
00:14:22,078 --> 00:14:23,918
Speaker 3: And I know, I mean even I'll say his name,

299
00:14:23,918 --> 00:14:26,518
Speaker 3: Brian Butterfield, one of the best coaches I've ever been around.

300
00:14:27,198 --> 00:14:30,358
Speaker 3: Butter was really upset about the process there and it

301
00:14:30,438 --> 00:14:31,958
Speaker 3: bothered him a lot, and he would come to me

302
00:14:31,998 --> 00:14:33,678
Speaker 3: and we would talk about it, and I understood it

303
00:14:33,678 --> 00:14:35,918
Speaker 3: completely because I know I would not want to be

304
00:14:35,998 --> 00:14:38,358
Speaker 3: in that coach's room. I had my own separate manager's office,

305
00:14:38,678 --> 00:14:42,038
Speaker 3: which then permits you to some kind of a freedom

306
00:14:42,078 --> 00:14:46,038
Speaker 3: in regarding to just to the day itself. But this again.

307
00:14:46,118 --> 00:14:49,478
Speaker 3: It's happening. It's happened there, it's happening everywhere. And it's

308
00:14:49,518 --> 00:14:54,238
Speaker 3: true the fact that presenters are really becoming more involved

309
00:14:54,278 --> 00:14:56,918
Speaker 3: in a daily routine of the game, in the accumulation

310
00:14:56,998 --> 00:14:59,318
Speaker 3: of the information, which I'll say this, I want them

311
00:14:59,358 --> 00:15:02,038
Speaker 3: to do that. Yes, I need that help. I need

312
00:15:02,038 --> 00:15:04,478
Speaker 3: that kind of help. I need somebody to bring all

313
00:15:04,558 --> 00:15:06,558
Speaker 3: of this stuff together because quite frankly, you don't have

314
00:15:06,598 --> 00:15:08,958
Speaker 3: the time to sit and do this. When I first

315
00:15:08,958 --> 00:15:11,078
Speaker 3: started with the Rays, I had my own process and

316
00:15:11,118 --> 00:15:14,118
Speaker 3: I did accumulate my own information. And Andrews saw that

317
00:15:14,438 --> 00:15:15,758
Speaker 3: and he says, man, you don't have to do that.

318
00:15:16,118 --> 00:15:18,078
Speaker 3: Let me, We'll get somebody to do that for you.

319
00:15:18,238 --> 00:15:21,078
Speaker 3: And eventually that little sheet in my back pocket that

320
00:15:21,598 --> 00:15:24,238
Speaker 3: the matrix and everything else and all these numbers, was

321
00:15:25,238 --> 00:15:28,558
Speaker 3: Andrew noticing what I needed and then having somebody else

322
00:15:28,638 --> 00:15:30,438
Speaker 3: do it. And I'm just, quite frankly, it might have

323
00:15:30,478 --> 00:15:33,278
Speaker 3: grown out of that one moment in that office that day.

324
00:15:33,558 --> 00:15:36,038
Speaker 3: So you need that because you don't really have the

325
00:15:36,078 --> 00:15:38,678
Speaker 3: time to accumulate all of that. I want those guys

326
00:15:38,678 --> 00:15:40,958
Speaker 3: on board. But then once they've given me what they have,

327
00:15:41,678 --> 00:15:44,598
Speaker 3: let me then present it to my coaching staff and

328
00:15:44,638 --> 00:15:47,878
Speaker 3: my players. The fact that you have presenters in the

329
00:15:47,878 --> 00:15:53,238
Speaker 3: clubhouse confusing all of this stuff, and actually, quite frankly,

330
00:15:53,278 --> 00:15:55,238
Speaker 3: there's way too much stuff. There's way too much information.

331
00:15:55,278 --> 00:15:57,718
Speaker 3: You don't need that before a game. We've talked about

332
00:15:57,718 --> 00:15:59,958
Speaker 3: this before and I'll just jump on it here. It's

333
00:15:59,958 --> 00:16:03,238
Speaker 3: more of an off season kind of a gig. Analytically speaking,

334
00:16:04,038 --> 00:16:06,918
Speaker 3: you're going to acquire large globs of information in order

335
00:16:06,958 --> 00:16:08,758
Speaker 3: to make the right decisions. Who do I bring into

336
00:16:08,798 --> 00:16:11,278
Speaker 3: the organization or not before the game. I need to

337
00:16:11,318 --> 00:16:15,038
Speaker 3: know where my defense sets up. Absolutely, from the pitching perspective,

338
00:16:15,118 --> 00:16:16,718
Speaker 3: I do need to know where to go when I

339
00:16:16,758 --> 00:16:19,358
Speaker 3: need it out against this particular hitter. And absolutely where

340
00:16:19,358 --> 00:16:20,998
Speaker 3: do I not want to go? Where's this sky hot

341
00:16:21,038 --> 00:16:25,118
Speaker 3: at things like that. But that doesn't require all these dissertations.

342
00:16:25,838 --> 00:16:27,798
Speaker 3: If you're an analyst, Tom, and if you have your

343
00:16:27,878 --> 00:16:31,118
Speaker 3: job is to analyze and acquire information, you're going to

344
00:16:31,158 --> 00:16:33,158
Speaker 3: sit there all day and bring up a whole bunch

345
00:16:33,198 --> 00:16:34,798
Speaker 3: of stuff, and then you're going to think it's pertinent

346
00:16:35,078 --> 00:16:37,598
Speaker 3: to present it to the group. I'm here to tell you, man,

347
00:16:37,638 --> 00:16:40,438
Speaker 3: it just serves to confuse I know, show hate doesn't

348
00:16:40,478 --> 00:16:42,918
Speaker 3: need a whole bunch of nuggets. I know Shurezer doesn't

349
00:16:42,918 --> 00:16:45,118
Speaker 3: need a whole bunch of stuff, and neither does the rookie.

350
00:16:45,158 --> 00:16:47,158
Speaker 3: But they're the guys that you could really infiltrate with

351
00:16:47,238 --> 00:16:49,958
Speaker 3: this stuff. They're so used to looking at their phones

352
00:16:50,038 --> 00:16:54,278
Speaker 3: and their devices and they think all this information is

353
00:16:54,318 --> 00:16:56,998
Speaker 3: going to make them better. It's the moment. It's being

354
00:16:57,038 --> 00:16:58,998
Speaker 3: able to think in the moment clearly and rely on

355
00:16:59,038 --> 00:17:01,478
Speaker 3: your athletic ability that sets teams apart.

356
00:17:02,398 --> 00:17:04,238
Speaker 1: You know, how about if we add some more people

357
00:17:04,278 --> 00:17:07,798
Speaker 1: who actually played the game of baseball and have coaching experience.

358
00:17:07,998 --> 00:17:09,038
Speaker 2: How about that idea.

359
00:17:09,198 --> 00:17:12,118
Speaker 1: Sure there's one team where a veteran nudge the guy

360
00:17:12,158 --> 00:17:13,998
Speaker 1: next to him during the national anthem. He said, look

361
00:17:13,998 --> 00:17:16,118
Speaker 1: at the top step where the coaches were. He said,

362
00:17:16,158 --> 00:17:17,998
Speaker 1: not a day in the big leagues right there.

363
00:17:18,318 --> 00:17:21,118
Speaker 2: Players. Notice, I do think it's starting to turn back

364
00:17:21,198 --> 00:17:22,198
Speaker 2: a little bit. Joe.

365
00:17:22,918 --> 00:17:26,198
Speaker 1: You know, comments like the one Meryfield made is dead

366
00:17:26,238 --> 00:17:29,918
Speaker 1: on and listen, he went home having to watch that

367
00:17:29,958 --> 00:17:30,958
Speaker 1: at the end of their season.

368
00:17:31,038 --> 00:17:32,638
Speaker 2: So I don't blame him for speaking up.

369
00:17:32,998 --> 00:17:35,198
Speaker 1: You had Aaron Judge with the Yankee saying, you know,

370
00:17:35,278 --> 00:17:37,638
Speaker 1: we really have to look at this analytics department, and

371
00:17:37,918 --> 00:17:40,238
Speaker 1: I think we're getting the wrong numbers from these people.

372
00:17:40,478 --> 00:17:41,758
Speaker 2: And even Farheard admitted.

373
00:17:41,758 --> 00:17:43,918
Speaker 1: Far On Zaidi with the Giants admitted he needs to

374
00:17:43,958 --> 00:17:47,238
Speaker 1: be more flexible, and they're looking for a manager who

375
00:17:47,278 --> 00:17:51,518
Speaker 1: maybe does have some different ideas and more importantly, he

376
00:17:51,558 --> 00:17:55,278
Speaker 1: is looking for a leader, someone with charisma. That's especially

377
00:17:55,278 --> 00:17:57,398
Speaker 1: important if you're the team like the Giants and you're

378
00:17:57,438 --> 00:18:01,398
Speaker 1: looking to sign free agents, that's your one of your

379
00:18:01,438 --> 00:18:04,358
Speaker 1: biggest recruiting tools is the face of your French As

380
00:18:04,358 --> 00:18:07,238
Speaker 1: the manager, he does represent your franchise on a daily

381
00:18:07,278 --> 00:18:09,838
Speaker 1: basis in front of the media, in front of the players.

382
00:18:10,518 --> 00:18:11,198
Speaker 2: It's important.

383
00:18:11,238 --> 00:18:15,358
Speaker 1: So I think let the leaders lead put an emphasis

384
00:18:15,478 --> 00:18:18,318
Speaker 1: on leadership, and I know in Boston they're doing that

385
00:18:18,358 --> 00:18:21,238
Speaker 1: in their search for a president of Baseball Operations. They're

386
00:18:21,238 --> 00:18:24,398
Speaker 1: putting an emphasis on leadership. I think we've lost that

387
00:18:24,598 --> 00:18:27,118
Speaker 1: around the game. And there's nothing wrong with it. There's

388
00:18:27,118 --> 00:18:29,878
Speaker 1: nothing wrong with the manager like Bruce Bouchier and Dusty

389
00:18:29,958 --> 00:18:33,278
Speaker 1: Baker saying I made this move and here's why I

390
00:18:33,518 --> 00:18:33,878
Speaker 1: made it.

391
00:18:34,158 --> 00:18:37,158
Speaker 3: Yeah. And just to further that a little bit, when

392
00:18:37,198 --> 00:18:40,518
Speaker 3: you're talking about the major league coaches being more former

393
00:18:40,558 --> 00:18:42,718
Speaker 3: major League players or guys that have at least put

394
00:18:42,718 --> 00:18:45,118
Speaker 3: some time into minor leagues. Who is going to coach

395
00:18:45,158 --> 00:18:47,438
Speaker 3: the coaches in the minor leagues to pass this game along.

396
00:18:47,478 --> 00:18:50,478
Speaker 3: This is a conversation I've had with you. Also, if

397
00:18:50,518 --> 00:18:53,198
Speaker 3: we're going to rely just purely on the analytical world

398
00:18:53,718 --> 00:18:56,878
Speaker 3: to frame the game of baseball and moving forward, then

399
00:18:56,878 --> 00:18:58,798
Speaker 3: the game as we have known it is really going

400
00:18:58,838 --> 00:19:02,198
Speaker 3: to die slow death actually, in order to have all

401
00:19:02,238 --> 00:19:04,358
Speaker 3: the things you just mentioned right there to get the game,

402
00:19:04,638 --> 00:19:06,878
Speaker 3: whether it's cut off in relays, whether it's the bunt

403
00:19:06,958 --> 00:19:10,718
Speaker 3: buns and bunch defenses, stealing bases, how to advance on

404
00:19:10,758 --> 00:19:13,438
Speaker 3: a ball in the dirt first, whatever, the game itself

405
00:19:13,518 --> 00:19:17,078
Speaker 3: not just launch angles and spin rates. Who are coaching

406
00:19:17,118 --> 00:19:20,638
Speaker 3: the coaches that are passing the game along to the players? Now,

407
00:19:20,758 --> 00:19:22,518
Speaker 3: I mean, I, like I've talked about, I've had I

408
00:19:22,518 --> 00:19:27,158
Speaker 3: had wonderful mentors coming up to the Angel organization, tremendous

409
00:19:27,198 --> 00:19:29,238
Speaker 3: among the best. And these are the guys that taught me.

410
00:19:29,838 --> 00:19:32,878
Speaker 3: And from that, you take that and you apply all

411
00:19:32,958 --> 00:19:35,198
Speaker 3: that information, all that knowledge, and then you develop your

412
00:19:35,198 --> 00:19:37,958
Speaker 3: own method, your own system of teaching the game of baseball,

413
00:19:38,238 --> 00:19:40,238
Speaker 3: and then you get to the point of leadership and

414
00:19:40,278 --> 00:19:44,198
Speaker 3: where leadership is empowerment and it's not control. And that's

415
00:19:44,358 --> 00:19:49,918
Speaker 3: that's again it baffles me in it it bothers me. Yes,

416
00:19:50,558 --> 00:19:53,758
Speaker 3: if you want leadership, you empower the person to be

417
00:19:53,998 --> 00:19:57,158
Speaker 3: able to lead. He doesn't have to ask you in

418
00:19:57,238 --> 00:19:59,838
Speaker 3: advance of wanting to say something to an entire group

419
00:20:00,238 --> 00:20:03,158
Speaker 3: or something that he may want to unilaterally employ. It's

420
00:20:03,198 --> 00:20:05,438
Speaker 3: got there's an empowerment component to this.

421
00:20:05,478 --> 00:20:09,678
Speaker 4: And if you you as the owner or the GM

422
00:20:09,798 --> 00:20:12,518
Speaker 4: or the president of ops, whatever, if you're unwilling to

423
00:20:12,558 --> 00:20:14,438
Speaker 4: do that, you're not going to get the leadership you're

424
00:20:14,438 --> 00:20:17,958
Speaker 4: looking for because you're quite frankly, causing this person to

425
00:20:18,038 --> 00:20:21,678
Speaker 4: constantly look over his shoulder for acquiescence.

426
00:20:21,678 --> 00:20:23,838
Speaker 3: And if he doesn't get it, he's not going to lead.

427
00:20:24,318 --> 00:20:26,718
Speaker 1: Well, listen, we could do a whole podcast just on

428
00:20:26,718 --> 00:20:28,838
Speaker 1: that move. It's the worst move I've seen by a

429
00:20:28,878 --> 00:20:31,558
Speaker 1: manager since you mentioned it, Kevin Cash in the twenty

430
00:20:31,598 --> 00:20:34,358
Speaker 1: twenty World Series taking out a dominant Lake Snell. But

431
00:20:34,838 --> 00:20:37,358
Speaker 1: we do need to move on to the next round.

432
00:20:37,438 --> 00:20:40,678
Speaker 1: Division Series Baseball coming up, folks. For series, we will

433
00:20:40,758 --> 00:20:54,198
Speaker 1: dive into a preview right after this. Hey, Joe, by

434
00:20:54,238 --> 00:20:57,038
Speaker 1: the way, before we get to our preview. Did you

435
00:20:57,198 --> 00:21:00,838
Speaker 1: see the bunt attempt by Jose Siri. It was the

436
00:21:00,958 --> 00:21:04,518
Speaker 1: Don Zimmer Special for the Tampa Bay Rays first than third,

437
00:21:06,078 --> 00:21:09,278
Speaker 1: and it was set up perfectly against the Texas Rangers

438
00:21:09,558 --> 00:21:12,478
Speaker 1: because you watched the first baseman, Nathaniel Lowe start to

439
00:21:12,598 --> 00:21:15,838
Speaker 1: charge Marcus Simeon went to go cover second base. If

440
00:21:15,838 --> 00:21:19,238
Speaker 1: he gets that bunt down, it's a base hit and

441
00:21:19,278 --> 00:21:22,918
Speaker 1: the Rays get a run, and maybe that series is different. Instead,

442
00:21:23,438 --> 00:21:26,838
Speaker 1: Siri just did a very poor job fundamentally, didn't get

443
00:21:26,878 --> 00:21:28,678
Speaker 1: the bat out in front of him, popped it up.

444
00:21:28,998 --> 00:21:32,478
Speaker 1: Montgomery made a great play, and listen, maybe the Rangers

445
00:21:32,478 --> 00:21:34,798
Speaker 1: win that series anyway, because the Rays were so bad,

446
00:21:34,838 --> 00:21:37,558
Speaker 1: but that was the one best chance for Tampa to

447
00:21:37,558 --> 00:21:39,918
Speaker 1: get back in the series, the Zim Special, and they

448
00:21:39,958 --> 00:21:40,838
Speaker 1: blew it at home.

449
00:21:41,198 --> 00:21:43,238
Speaker 3: Well, I actually understood. I didn't see that. Again, I

450
00:21:43,278 --> 00:21:45,838
Speaker 3: was driving, so I missed that. But you're describing it

451
00:21:45,878 --> 00:21:48,838
Speaker 3: really well. The one thing about that play, and you

452
00:21:48,838 --> 00:21:50,638
Speaker 3: may have noticed it or not, did the runner at

453
00:21:50,678 --> 00:21:52,918
Speaker 3: first base do like a false break like he was

454
00:21:52,958 --> 00:21:55,078
Speaker 3: going to steal, Because that was the one thing we

455
00:21:55,118 --> 00:21:57,438
Speaker 3: added to that play, and when we added that to

456
00:21:57,478 --> 00:22:00,238
Speaker 3: the play, exactly what you said. The second basement cover

457
00:22:00,358 --> 00:22:03,838
Speaker 3: second base, his responsibilities to go there if the run

458
00:22:04,038 --> 00:22:05,918
Speaker 3: is stealing or if it's a hit and run. So

459
00:22:06,118 --> 00:22:07,878
Speaker 3: it clears it up. You put the bunt down like

460
00:22:07,918 --> 00:22:11,398
Speaker 3: you just suggest that nobody's covering first base. And part

461
00:22:11,478 --> 00:22:13,958
Speaker 3: of that play like Zim described, is with runners on

462
00:22:14,998 --> 00:22:17,878
Speaker 3: first and third like that. Normally the first move by

463
00:22:17,918 --> 00:22:19,678
Speaker 3: the first baseman is going to be to cover the

464
00:22:19,758 --> 00:22:22,478
Speaker 3: hole and not charge straight in. But that's been a

465
00:22:22,478 --> 00:22:25,278
Speaker 3: part of the evolution of that playoff pensively, defensively. Now

466
00:22:25,318 --> 00:22:28,358
Speaker 3: first baseman just charged straight in. I'm telling you, man,

467
00:22:28,558 --> 00:22:31,118
Speaker 3: when that thing works, and I've had it work often.

468
00:22:31,438 --> 00:22:34,758
Speaker 3: And then the playoffs doubled up against Jimi Garcia and

469
00:22:34,798 --> 00:22:37,518
Speaker 3: Saint Louis doubled up back to back, kind of like

470
00:22:37,558 --> 00:22:40,038
Speaker 3: blew up that whole series in our favor. It's the

471
00:22:40,118 --> 00:22:43,398
Speaker 3: kind of thing that really, it really bothers you on

472
00:22:43,438 --> 00:22:45,158
Speaker 3: the other team. That bothers you, It bothers you in

473
00:22:45,158 --> 00:22:47,678
Speaker 3: the digout. Why didn't I see that? You feel inept?

474
00:22:47,918 --> 00:22:49,598
Speaker 3: I should have been more prepared for that. Why didn't

475
00:22:49,598 --> 00:22:51,958
Speaker 3: remind anybody? Why do we work on this some more?

476
00:22:51,998 --> 00:22:54,238
Speaker 3: I mean, you hear you think all these crazy things

477
00:22:54,238 --> 00:22:57,398
Speaker 3: in that one particular moment. So just a simple bunt,

478
00:22:57,478 --> 00:23:00,758
Speaker 3: a simple fifteen to twenty foot ball in play, you know,

479
00:23:00,878 --> 00:23:03,358
Speaker 3: placed in the proper place, which should be down the

480
00:23:03,398 --> 00:23:05,998
Speaker 3: first base side, because that really sets it up. All

481
00:23:06,038 --> 00:23:08,878
Speaker 3: of a sudden, the other team does it does kind

482
00:23:08,878 --> 00:23:11,878
Speaker 3: of get It causes smoke to come out of their ears,

483
00:23:12,038 --> 00:23:13,518
Speaker 3: and you know you're in a pretty good shape.

484
00:23:13,798 --> 00:23:15,078
Speaker 2: Yeah, listen to the Rays.

485
00:23:15,158 --> 00:23:17,158
Speaker 1: I mean that they just laid an egg in that series,

486
00:23:17,158 --> 00:23:18,278
Speaker 1: played poorly, didn't hit.

487
00:23:18,318 --> 00:23:20,678
Speaker 2: But I give the Texas Rangers a ton of credit.

488
00:23:21,238 --> 00:23:23,358
Speaker 1: I was a little worried about them because they did

489
00:23:23,518 --> 00:23:25,678
Speaker 1: lose the chance to win the division and have a

490
00:23:25,718 --> 00:23:28,438
Speaker 1: bye by losing that last day, got shut out in Seattle,

491
00:23:28,798 --> 00:23:30,598
Speaker 1: get on a plane, fly all the way across the

492
00:23:30,598 --> 00:23:32,958
Speaker 1: country to Tampa Bay. And you know what, they played

493
00:23:32,998 --> 00:23:35,518
Speaker 1: really well, Joe. It's another surprise. Bruce Bochi had his

494
00:23:35,558 --> 00:23:38,718
Speaker 1: team ready in that situation. And now maybe they're better

495
00:23:38,758 --> 00:23:41,958
Speaker 1: off by having played those couple of games, because they

496
00:23:41,998 --> 00:23:44,558
Speaker 1: look like a team that's rolling right now. This kid,

497
00:23:44,598 --> 00:23:47,918
Speaker 1: Evan Carter, at the bottom of their lineup is just spectacular.

498
00:23:47,958 --> 00:23:50,638
Speaker 1: Twenty one year old kid, the youngest ever to make

499
00:23:50,678 --> 00:23:53,078
Speaker 1: his postseason debut and get on base four times.

500
00:23:53,158 --> 00:23:56,158
Speaker 2: Next day he hits a home run, just lengthens that

501
00:23:56,278 --> 00:23:58,118
Speaker 2: lineup that's already so deep.

502
00:23:58,638 --> 00:24:00,798
Speaker 1: So give me your take now, because Texas now is

503
00:24:00,838 --> 00:24:03,598
Speaker 1: going to go into Baltimore be a hostile environment that

504
00:24:03,598 --> 00:24:08,358
Speaker 1: plays will be rocking Camden Yards, and Texas is going

505
00:24:08,398 --> 00:24:10,958
Speaker 1: in after having already used the two best pictures to

506
00:24:11,038 --> 00:24:11,918
Speaker 1: start the series.

507
00:24:12,838 --> 00:24:15,478
Speaker 2: We'll have to wait to use them getting into Camden Yards.

508
00:24:15,478 --> 00:24:17,638
Speaker 1: But give me your take on this setup now with

509
00:24:17,758 --> 00:24:20,878
Speaker 1: Texas coming in with a little bit of momentum against Baltimore.

510
00:24:21,318 --> 00:24:23,678
Speaker 3: Yeah, but again it's always about the starting picture. He

511
00:24:23,758 --> 00:24:26,998
Speaker 3: creates the momentum having had to use their two best

512
00:24:26,998 --> 00:24:30,358
Speaker 3: pictures to get there. That's the benefit of winning the division.

513
00:24:30,398 --> 00:24:33,918
Speaker 3: That's the negative about not winning the division ending up

514
00:24:33,958 --> 00:24:37,118
Speaker 3: in a possible best two out of three wild card situation,

515
00:24:37,638 --> 00:24:38,998
Speaker 3: as it should be. I mean, there's got to be

516
00:24:39,038 --> 00:24:42,358
Speaker 3: some reward for winning your division, and I like the

517
00:24:42,358 --> 00:24:44,958
Speaker 3: fact that the reward is pretty significant right now. Although

518
00:24:44,998 --> 00:24:46,878
Speaker 3: when it comes down the seating, we could talk about

519
00:24:46,878 --> 00:24:50,838
Speaker 3: that later. But I think still Baltimore as the Edgless

520
00:24:50,878 --> 00:24:54,118
Speaker 3: I could just describe they arrested, I know, it's like

521
00:24:54,118 --> 00:24:56,278
Speaker 3: you're saying, sometimes you want to keep playing. You think

522
00:24:56,278 --> 00:24:59,598
Speaker 3: that may build a momentum necessary, But then again, fatigue

523
00:24:59,638 --> 00:25:01,998
Speaker 3: can't sit in. It's tough. It's tough to do what

524
00:25:02,078 --> 00:25:04,958
Speaker 3: they did flying from Seattle in having to get into

525
00:25:05,678 --> 00:25:07,318
Speaker 3: this thing two out of three. They went two in

526
00:25:07,358 --> 00:25:09,718
Speaker 3: a row in Tampa Bay. But still there's a lot

527
00:25:09,758 --> 00:25:11,958
Speaker 3: of stuff going on there physically and mentally, and now

528
00:25:11,998 --> 00:25:14,918
Speaker 3: they got to fly again to Baltimore, so there's there's

529
00:25:14,958 --> 00:25:19,158
Speaker 3: a lot of movement there and time zones to interact with.

530
00:25:19,238 --> 00:25:22,998
Speaker 3: So I still think, I believe strongly that this this

531
00:25:23,158 --> 00:25:26,078
Speaker 3: definitely sets well for Baltimore right now, and the fact

532
00:25:26,118 --> 00:25:27,638
Speaker 3: that they have to wait to get back to I

533
00:25:27,678 --> 00:25:29,918
Speaker 3: listened Jordan Montgomery. That was I thought that was one

534
00:25:29,958 --> 00:25:32,998
Speaker 3: of the best moves when it got to the trade

535
00:25:33,038 --> 00:25:35,798
Speaker 3: deadline situation. He was fantastic. The other day I was

536
00:25:35,838 --> 00:25:38,118
Speaker 3: watching that, I did was able to see that and

537
00:25:38,158 --> 00:25:41,038
Speaker 3: how he carved them up really well. And then the

538
00:25:41,078 --> 00:25:43,998
Speaker 3: next day of all the doing kind of the same thing.

539
00:25:44,078 --> 00:25:46,958
Speaker 3: But they gotta wait. You gotta wait on those two guys.

540
00:25:47,038 --> 00:25:49,998
Speaker 3: So Baltimore is hungry man. Baltimore is going to play

541
00:25:50,038 --> 00:25:51,878
Speaker 3: just like they did in the In the regular season,

542
00:25:52,758 --> 00:25:55,598
Speaker 3: Texas a little bit up and down kind of. I

543
00:25:55,638 --> 00:25:58,038
Speaker 3: know they were kind of hot right now, but Baltimore

544
00:25:58,078 --> 00:26:00,078
Speaker 3: one hundred games for reasons, so I think the rest

545
00:26:00,118 --> 00:26:02,958
Speaker 3: is actually going to help them, and having had to

546
00:26:02,958 --> 00:26:05,798
Speaker 3: play the wildcare is gonna hurt Texas.

547
00:26:06,118 --> 00:26:06,918
Speaker 2: Yeah, we'll see.

548
00:26:07,118 --> 00:26:09,158
Speaker 1: I kind of like the fact that Texas now is

549
00:26:09,198 --> 00:26:10,998
Speaker 1: on something of a mission. I do agree make a

550
00:26:11,078 --> 00:26:13,078
Speaker 1: good point that maybe it catches up to them at

551
00:26:13,118 --> 00:26:16,638
Speaker 1: some point, but I just like the look about them

552
00:26:16,758 --> 00:26:19,198
Speaker 1: right now. You know, I think they got their backup

553
00:26:19,238 --> 00:26:21,478
Speaker 1: here if they're having to play this, and it reminds

554
00:26:21,518 --> 00:26:23,238
Speaker 1: me a little bit of Philly last year. Gained some

555
00:26:23,318 --> 00:26:27,118
Speaker 1: momentum by taking out Saint Louis in the wild card

556
00:26:27,158 --> 00:26:28,998
Speaker 1: and then went in and took out Atlanta and just

557
00:26:29,118 --> 00:26:33,238
Speaker 1: kept that ball rolling. So fascinating series. We'll see about that.

558
00:26:33,318 --> 00:26:35,998
Speaker 1: By the way, Montgomery was a perfect matchup against the Rays.

559
00:26:35,998 --> 00:26:38,358
Speaker 1: I'm with you, that was a great pickup winds up

560
00:26:38,398 --> 00:26:40,718
Speaker 1: being their Game one starter with all the injuries to

561
00:26:40,838 --> 00:26:43,278
Speaker 1: de Gram and Scherzer and you name it. But the

562
00:26:43,358 --> 00:26:45,838
Speaker 1: Rays are a team, let's face it, the fourth highest

563
00:26:45,918 --> 00:26:48,278
Speaker 1: chase rate in the major leagues, the most of any

564
00:26:48,318 --> 00:26:49,038
Speaker 1: playoff team.

565
00:26:49,358 --> 00:26:51,278
Speaker 2: Montgomery was a terrible matchup for them.

566
00:26:51,478 --> 00:26:54,038
Speaker 1: He prays upon guys chasing his soft stuff out of

567
00:26:54,038 --> 00:26:56,638
Speaker 1: his own so I think Baltimore will give him a

568
00:26:56,678 --> 00:27:00,318
Speaker 1: tougher time. I just like the way Baltimore plays offensive baseball.

569
00:27:00,558 --> 00:27:03,038
Speaker 1: They remind me of Arizona as well. They just don't chase.

570
00:27:03,078 --> 00:27:04,958
Speaker 1: They put the ball in play, they run the bases.

571
00:27:05,238 --> 00:27:07,198
Speaker 3: One more thing, the umpire was a little bit generous

572
00:27:07,198 --> 00:27:09,158
Speaker 3: for Montgomery two. I thought, yes, he was, you know,

573
00:27:09,198 --> 00:27:11,958
Speaker 3: and that you can't underestimate that with the style of

574
00:27:11,958 --> 00:27:14,558
Speaker 3: pitcher that Montgomery is, that's that's a bit that's a

575
00:27:14,558 --> 00:27:17,238
Speaker 3: more physical version of Tommy John and jeff'son out. There

576
00:27:17,598 --> 00:27:19,558
Speaker 3: was the ability to pitch right off the edges. He's

577
00:27:19,998 --> 00:27:21,918
Speaker 3: he's that good. He's that good, and if he gets

578
00:27:21,958 --> 00:27:24,998
Speaker 3: a benevolent umpire, he's going to really kick. But the

579
00:27:24,558 --> 00:27:26,238
Speaker 3: whole time to the playoffs.

580
00:27:26,398 --> 00:27:30,038
Speaker 1: Yeah, the American League Division Series has Minnesota starting off

581
00:27:30,318 --> 00:27:32,318
Speaker 1: in Houston against the Astros.

582
00:27:32,998 --> 00:27:34,518
Speaker 2: It's the Carlos Correa Series.

583
00:27:34,558 --> 00:27:36,478
Speaker 1: Carlos has a way of kind of being in the

584
00:27:36,518 --> 00:27:39,838
Speaker 1: picture in the postseason. I mean, this dude is one

585
00:27:39,878 --> 00:27:42,918
Speaker 1: of the best clutch hitters, at least in this generation.

586
00:27:43,158 --> 00:27:44,718
Speaker 2: Just look at his track record, folks.

587
00:27:44,798 --> 00:27:47,158
Speaker 1: You know, he's got sixty one RBIs in about eighty

588
00:27:47,238 --> 00:27:49,958
Speaker 1: games in the postseason and just has a way of

589
00:27:49,958 --> 00:27:52,718
Speaker 1: coming up big. He did that with the big Bass

590
00:27:52,838 --> 00:27:56,558
Speaker 1: hit to get them into this second round here. Minnesota

591
00:27:56,598 --> 00:27:59,798
Speaker 1: is an interesting team, Joe. I mean, they've totally changed

592
00:27:59,838 --> 00:28:02,318
Speaker 1: my opinion about them. They've played so well in the

593
00:28:02,358 --> 00:28:05,198
Speaker 1: second half of the season. Have more swing and miss

594
00:28:05,318 --> 00:28:07,758
Speaker 1: than any team in the major leagues. I'm talking about

595
00:28:07,798 --> 00:28:09,318
Speaker 1: from the front of the rotation to the back of

596
00:28:09,318 --> 00:28:12,118
Speaker 1: the rotation. He might not know all the names, but

597
00:28:12,198 --> 00:28:16,358
Speaker 1: my goodness, stuff wise, it's off the charts now. Houston

598
00:28:16,398 --> 00:28:19,238
Speaker 1: again is a team we all know that they're great

599
00:28:19,278 --> 00:28:21,318
Speaker 1: postseason team because they do put the ball in play.

600
00:28:21,318 --> 00:28:24,398
Speaker 1: They're a great situational hitting team. This looks to me, Joe,

601
00:28:24,398 --> 00:28:25,558
Speaker 1: like a five game series.

602
00:28:26,078 --> 00:28:28,358
Speaker 3: Very well could be. I'm still curious. I know we

603
00:28:28,398 --> 00:28:30,558
Speaker 3: talked about it the other day and there's no real

604
00:28:30,638 --> 00:28:34,998
Speaker 3: quantifiable information, but why has Houston been so bad at home?

605
00:28:35,038 --> 00:28:38,358
Speaker 3: I'm really eager to watch this just to see, you know,

606
00:28:38,678 --> 00:28:41,038
Speaker 3: the Twins coming in. They had a nice series, and

607
00:28:41,038 --> 00:28:43,918
Speaker 3: of course they they're pitching dominated and the pitchers that

608
00:28:43,958 --> 00:28:47,198
Speaker 3: they threw were really very good. That's both starters that

609
00:28:47,238 --> 00:28:51,398
Speaker 3: they had thrown in that series, so and their closer.

610
00:28:51,518 --> 00:28:55,558
Speaker 3: God dang, that's some dynamic stuff. Wow, but that's dynamic.

611
00:28:56,278 --> 00:28:58,638
Speaker 3: But yeah, I want to see that. I want to

612
00:28:58,678 --> 00:29:01,398
Speaker 3: see if Houston beat them at home. That's what I

613
00:29:01,398 --> 00:29:03,278
Speaker 3: think they're going to have to do to really make

614
00:29:03,318 --> 00:29:06,078
Speaker 3: this whole thing work. Houston pedigree, there's something to be

615
00:29:06,118 --> 00:29:09,478
Speaker 3: said for that. They've done it for several years now

616
00:29:09,558 --> 00:29:13,118
Speaker 3: in a row, and they do believe. And they're definitely

617
00:29:13,878 --> 00:29:17,118
Speaker 3: not going to be a wide eyed for at any

618
00:29:17,118 --> 00:29:19,158
Speaker 3: moment during the course of this series, and definitely not

619
00:29:19,718 --> 00:29:21,278
Speaker 3: on the first game. I think the first game is

620
00:29:21,318 --> 00:29:23,398
Speaker 3: really important, like it always is, but in this one,

621
00:29:23,798 --> 00:29:25,238
Speaker 3: if you just think to get on top of them

622
00:29:25,278 --> 00:29:27,958
Speaker 3: and win that game at home and whatever that is,

623
00:29:27,998 --> 00:29:30,838
Speaker 3: like they got internally about not having a good record

624
00:29:30,878 --> 00:29:32,878
Speaker 3: at only just get over it, then it can be

625
00:29:32,998 --> 00:29:36,838
Speaker 3: very quick. But I do like the Twins attitude. I

626
00:29:36,878 --> 00:29:38,798
Speaker 3: do like the way they play. I think Rocco and

627
00:29:38,878 --> 00:29:40,878
Speaker 3: this group has done a really nice job up job

628
00:29:40,958 --> 00:29:43,958
Speaker 3: up there. Like you said, Korea, Man, I you know

629
00:29:43,998 --> 00:29:46,278
Speaker 3: there's times he could these two different guys. He could

630
00:29:46,278 --> 00:29:50,118
Speaker 3: be a chameleon, especially offensively, and then all of a sudden,

631
00:29:50,158 --> 00:29:52,518
Speaker 3: the guy can turn it on and he's got that thing.

632
00:29:52,558 --> 00:29:54,518
Speaker 3: He's got that switch, he's got that dimmer switch that

633
00:29:54,558 --> 00:29:57,958
Speaker 3: he turns up. So he could be if he comes

634
00:29:57,958 --> 00:29:59,838
Speaker 3: out hot and he does something big early, he can

635
00:29:59,918 --> 00:30:03,518
Speaker 3: mean all the difference. In a will from Minnesota.

636
00:30:03,118 --> 00:30:05,518
Speaker 1: That reminds me of mentioned the Astros home record. Here's

637
00:30:05,558 --> 00:30:08,878
Speaker 1: a question for you as a manager home road records.

638
00:30:08,878 --> 00:30:12,078
Speaker 1: How much attention, how much validity do you put in

639
00:30:12,118 --> 00:30:14,798
Speaker 1: something like that. I remember one year where lou Panella started.

640
00:30:14,838 --> 00:30:16,878
Speaker 1: I think it was Ryan Dempster in the first game

641
00:30:16,918 --> 00:30:21,078
Speaker 1: of a playoff series rather than Carlos Sombrono is better pitcher,

642
00:30:21,118 --> 00:30:22,918
Speaker 1: and he did it based on home road splits.

643
00:30:23,318 --> 00:30:25,798
Speaker 2: I think that's a junk stat, Joe, I really do.

644
00:30:25,918 --> 00:30:29,958
Speaker 1: I look at the Houston Astros and Okay, they're under

645
00:30:29,998 --> 00:30:33,038
Speaker 1: five hundred for the season at home. They are only

646
00:30:33,078 --> 00:30:35,198
Speaker 1: the second team in a full season to make the

647
00:30:35,518 --> 00:30:37,878
Speaker 1: win a division with a losing record at home. The

648
00:30:37,878 --> 00:30:40,438
Speaker 1: Old One Braves were the other team. I think just

649
00:30:40,438 --> 00:30:42,278
Speaker 1: just an anomaly. It's just the way it worked out.

650
00:30:42,278 --> 00:30:44,518
Speaker 1: Maybe you weren't playing that time and playing well at

651
00:30:44,518 --> 00:30:46,718
Speaker 1: the time. You were a home during a homestand this

652
00:30:46,758 --> 00:30:47,118
Speaker 1: is what.

653
00:30:47,118 --> 00:30:47,718
Speaker 2: Matters to me.

654
00:30:48,278 --> 00:30:50,598
Speaker 1: The Houston Astros at min It Made Park have the

655
00:30:50,718 --> 00:30:55,878
Speaker 1: fourth highest postseason winning percentage of any team. Philadelphia, by

656
00:30:55,918 --> 00:30:59,478
Speaker 1: the way, is number one at the Bank. So in

657
00:30:59,518 --> 00:31:02,678
Speaker 1: the postseason, do I want to play the Astros at

658
00:31:02,718 --> 00:31:04,918
Speaker 1: Minute Made Park because they have a losing record in

659
00:31:04,918 --> 00:31:06,118
Speaker 1: the regular season this year?

660
00:31:06,438 --> 00:31:06,638
Speaker 3: No.

661
00:31:06,918 --> 00:31:09,558
Speaker 1: I've seen it too many times. That is a home

662
00:31:09,558 --> 00:31:12,198
Speaker 1: field advantage, So no, I think it's a junk stat.

663
00:31:12,558 --> 00:31:14,518
Speaker 1: I don't put any faith in a number like that.

664
00:31:14,718 --> 00:31:16,838
Speaker 1: If you can give me a reason why the Astros

665
00:31:16,838 --> 00:31:19,718
Speaker 1: stink at home in the regular season this year, I

666
00:31:19,798 --> 00:31:20,358
Speaker 1: might buy it.

667
00:31:20,438 --> 00:31:23,198
Speaker 2: But there's not a reason to explain something like that.

668
00:31:23,438 --> 00:31:26,038
Speaker 3: I agree with that. I with the Cubs, we were

669
00:31:26,078 --> 00:31:28,598
Speaker 3: down three games to two. We went to Cleveland and

670
00:31:28,638 --> 00:31:31,118
Speaker 3: we went two games, and the next thing, Bob's runkle,

671
00:31:31,118 --> 00:31:34,918
Speaker 3: we win the World Series. I never felt in baseball,

672
00:31:35,398 --> 00:31:37,558
Speaker 3: you know, a large crowd, like with the Rays in

673
00:31:37,558 --> 00:31:40,638
Speaker 3: two thousand and eight, we go into Chicago in the

674
00:31:40,638 --> 00:31:44,678
Speaker 3: alds and beat the White Sox during these blackouts. We

675
00:31:44,878 --> 00:31:46,838
Speaker 3: beat them before the first game is a blackout. You

676
00:31:46,878 --> 00:31:49,918
Speaker 3: stand on the line and everybody there has got black

677
00:31:49,958 --> 00:31:52,838
Speaker 3: and there's actually lint coming off the towels floating all

678
00:31:52,878 --> 00:31:57,998
Speaker 3: over the ballpark. Because it was incredibly you could be

679
00:31:57,998 --> 00:32:00,318
Speaker 3: intimidated by this, but we were not. We were not

680
00:32:00,398 --> 00:32:03,558
Speaker 3: a baseball somehow. I don't even know. I think part

681
00:32:03,598 --> 00:32:05,598
Speaker 3: of it was I'm just jumping a little bit. The

682
00:32:05,598 --> 00:32:08,118
Speaker 3: fact that the Rays we had to beat New York,

683
00:32:08,118 --> 00:32:09,798
Speaker 3: and New York we had to beat Boston and Boston.

684
00:32:09,838 --> 00:32:13,198
Speaker 3: It kind of prepares you for moments like that, so

685
00:32:13,398 --> 00:32:15,998
Speaker 3: I've always put that behind me. I could not agree

686
00:32:15,998 --> 00:32:18,318
Speaker 3: with you more. The only thing I'm saying right now

687
00:32:18,558 --> 00:32:23,438
Speaker 3: is I'm curious, because again, what is the reason? And

688
00:32:23,878 --> 00:32:25,958
Speaker 3: maybe it is serendipitous, like you're saying, I don't know,

689
00:32:25,998 --> 00:32:27,958
Speaker 3: but I want to I want to see this, I

690
00:32:27,958 --> 00:32:29,838
Speaker 3: want to see what's going on. I want to watch

691
00:32:29,878 --> 00:32:31,678
Speaker 3: these games more closely. Haven't watched a whole lot of

692
00:32:31,718 --> 00:32:34,318
Speaker 3: Houston and Houston this year, but it's it's kind of

693
00:32:34,398 --> 00:32:36,798
Speaker 3: it's kind of curious to me. It'd be the Tanemount

694
00:32:36,838 --> 00:32:40,078
Speaker 3: to the race, having a losing record at the Trump

695
00:32:40,078 --> 00:32:44,158
Speaker 3: and then this tremendous record of the road. Are they

696
00:32:44,198 --> 00:32:47,438
Speaker 3: talking about it is something that's bothering who knows. So anyway,

697
00:32:47,758 --> 00:32:50,798
Speaker 3: I'm curious. I'm curious to see this. You're probably right,

698
00:32:51,638 --> 00:32:55,198
Speaker 3: I don't have I've never held any grudge of going

699
00:32:55,198 --> 00:32:57,278
Speaker 3: on the road during the playoffs at all. And actually

700
00:32:57,318 --> 00:32:59,198
Speaker 3: I kind of liked it. We did well. The teams

701
00:32:59,158 --> 00:33:01,878
Speaker 3: that I've had have done well with that. But the

702
00:33:01,958 --> 00:33:05,478
Speaker 3: Houston Astros to have a losing record at home, I'm

703
00:33:05,558 --> 00:33:06,398
Speaker 3: kind of curious.

704
00:33:06,798 --> 00:33:09,198
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just the pedigree of this team. I've just

705
00:33:09,238 --> 00:33:12,038
Speaker 1: seen them step up time after time after time. By

706
00:33:12,038 --> 00:33:13,878
Speaker 1: the way, I can't get this image out of my

707
00:33:13,918 --> 00:33:15,878
Speaker 1: head of what you brought up of the lint coming

708
00:33:15,918 --> 00:33:18,398
Speaker 1: off the towels, lint on the I mean, I guess

709
00:33:18,398 --> 00:33:22,558
Speaker 1: what you're saying is they got these rally towels very cheaply.

710
00:33:22,838 --> 00:33:25,398
Speaker 3: Yeah. Correct, of course, of course they were. They were

711
00:33:25,838 --> 00:33:28,118
Speaker 3: definitely definitely imported. They weren't made in the USA.

712
00:33:29,718 --> 00:33:32,158
Speaker 1: Hey, one matchup to keep your eye on in that series,

713
00:33:32,318 --> 00:33:35,678
Speaker 1: Royce Lewis, He's now is a guy you have to

714
00:33:35,758 --> 00:33:38,518
Speaker 1: account for when the game starts. When you know you

715
00:33:38,558 --> 00:33:40,798
Speaker 1: know this, Joe, you go into a series and you say,

716
00:33:40,838 --> 00:33:44,358
Speaker 1: we can't let this guy beat us. I know Correa's pedigree,

717
00:33:44,518 --> 00:33:46,478
Speaker 1: it gets your attention. But right now, the way he's

718
00:33:46,478 --> 00:33:49,278
Speaker 1: swinging the bat, ryce Lewis is the man. I mean,

719
00:33:49,318 --> 00:33:52,638
Speaker 1: He's going to influence some decisions. I'm sure Dusty Baker

720
00:33:52,758 --> 00:33:56,878
Speaker 1: already is thinking, Okay, here's my best matchup on'm Ryce

721
00:33:56,958 --> 00:33:59,158
Speaker 1: Lewis in the seventh inning with a runner on base

722
00:33:59,198 --> 00:34:02,638
Speaker 1: and one run game So, and Dusty's got plenty of

723
00:34:02,678 --> 00:34:05,598
Speaker 1: good options there with his his right handed power bullpen.

724
00:34:06,158 --> 00:34:09,558
Speaker 1: Think about this Statu Joe on fastballs in the zone.

725
00:34:09,958 --> 00:34:13,358
Speaker 1: There's only two hitters who slugged higher than Royce Lewis

726
00:34:13,398 --> 00:34:17,798
Speaker 1: this year, and those two are Aaron Judge and Shohei Otani.

727
00:34:18,598 --> 00:34:21,518
Speaker 2: So the book is pretty simple on Royce Lewis.

728
00:34:21,558 --> 00:34:23,998
Speaker 1: If you throw him a fastball in the zone, you

729
00:34:24,078 --> 00:34:25,798
Speaker 1: do so at your own peril. You can get him

730
00:34:25,798 --> 00:34:29,278
Speaker 1: out with breaking stuff, but you cannot challenge him. I

731
00:34:29,318 --> 00:34:31,558
Speaker 1: don't care if it's he usually takes three to zero,

732
00:34:31,558 --> 00:34:34,518
Speaker 1: but there's no point in the game unless the base

733
00:34:34,598 --> 00:34:37,238
Speaker 1: is loaded, obviously where you should be challenging him with

734
00:34:37,238 --> 00:34:38,478
Speaker 1: a fastball in the zone.

735
00:34:38,558 --> 00:34:39,958
Speaker 2: So keep your eye on net.

736
00:34:39,878 --> 00:34:41,598
Speaker 3: Well, especially in today's game. If you get at a

737
00:34:41,638 --> 00:34:44,998
Speaker 3: fastball with the way velocity is that definitely works your advantage,

738
00:34:45,078 --> 00:34:46,718
Speaker 3: especially when he gets the latter part of the game

739
00:34:46,718 --> 00:34:49,758
Speaker 3: with bullpen guys that maybe are more suited for fastball

740
00:34:49,758 --> 00:34:52,758
Speaker 3: over breaking ball. But the thing about him that I like,

741
00:34:52,798 --> 00:34:54,958
Speaker 3: only again limited at bats, but I saw him pop

742
00:34:54,998 --> 00:34:57,918
Speaker 3: win the right center in Minnesota, and that ballpark in

743
00:34:57,958 --> 00:35:00,358
Speaker 3: Houston is really susceptible to that side of the field,

744
00:35:00,438 --> 00:35:03,318
Speaker 3: right in that slot. Yes, I've seen Bregman do really

745
00:35:03,398 --> 00:35:06,318
Speaker 3: nice job there in the past against the Cubs. So

746
00:35:06,358 --> 00:35:10,198
Speaker 3: that's that's curious to me. And apparently again from just

747
00:35:10,318 --> 00:35:12,878
Speaker 3: watching the games we're listening a little bit, sounds like

748
00:35:12,918 --> 00:35:14,598
Speaker 3: he likes the ball middle in a little bit, but

749
00:35:14,718 --> 00:35:16,678
Speaker 3: he stays inside the ball and drives it the other way,

750
00:35:16,718 --> 00:35:20,198
Speaker 3: which is that's that's where he's catching up to these fastballs.

751
00:35:20,198 --> 00:35:22,958
Speaker 3: I mean a lot of times, and again I don't

752
00:35:22,958 --> 00:35:25,558
Speaker 3: know heat chart whatever, but to go elevate it in

753
00:35:25,558 --> 00:35:29,318
Speaker 3: with the fastballs normally a safe spot, especially against the righty.

754
00:35:29,318 --> 00:35:31,958
Speaker 3: But if he's getting to that pitch and he's driving

755
00:35:31,958 --> 00:35:34,678
Speaker 3: it the other way, that's that's kind of interesting to see.

756
00:35:34,998 --> 00:35:37,118
Speaker 3: So I watch this very closely. I'm going to watch

757
00:35:37,158 --> 00:35:41,038
Speaker 3: him very close. Him eager to see this, and yeah,

758
00:35:41,518 --> 00:35:44,078
Speaker 3: when a guy, when a young hitter, it's the opposite

759
00:35:44,078 --> 00:35:47,278
Speaker 3: field gap. Well and for power. He always intrigues me.

760
00:35:47,638 --> 00:35:48,358
Speaker 2: All good stuff.

761
00:35:48,398 --> 00:35:51,318
Speaker 1: Hey, let's talk about when we get back the National

762
00:35:51,398 --> 00:35:54,558
Speaker 1: League Division Series, two great series in that league as well.

763
00:35:54,758 --> 00:36:08,918
Speaker 2: Right after this, Joe, let's start with the Atlanta Braves.

764
00:36:08,958 --> 00:36:11,438
Speaker 1: They are the team to beat. You know, I don't

765
00:36:11,438 --> 00:36:13,638
Speaker 1: know if you ever were in this situation. You go in,

766
00:36:13,718 --> 00:36:15,838
Speaker 1: I guess in sixteen you were. You go in as

767
00:36:16,078 --> 00:36:18,878
Speaker 1: the team to beat across the Major League Baseball landscape.

768
00:36:18,918 --> 00:36:22,038
Speaker 1: They're the best team in baseball all year, very consistent,

769
00:36:22,438 --> 00:36:26,918
Speaker 1: the best slugging team of all time. That's not a hyperbole.

770
00:36:26,918 --> 00:36:30,078
Speaker 1: They slugged over five hundred. They change a game with

771
00:36:30,118 --> 00:36:32,758
Speaker 1: one swing more than any other team, and that's what

772
00:36:32,798 --> 00:36:34,998
Speaker 1: you do in the postseason to win some games. But

773
00:36:35,038 --> 00:36:37,958
Speaker 1: I just get this sense, Joe, that the Philadelphia Phillies

774
00:36:37,958 --> 00:36:41,278
Speaker 1: can take them out. And I thought going into this

775
00:36:41,358 --> 00:36:44,798
Speaker 1: postseason I had the Phillies winning at all, especially if

776
00:36:44,918 --> 00:36:48,678
Speaker 1: Aaron Nola got back on track. Well, guess what, he

777
00:36:48,798 --> 00:36:51,718
Speaker 1: threw the ball great against Miami. And I know that

778
00:36:51,838 --> 00:36:54,918
Speaker 1: Caleb Cotham, the pitching coach, made an adjustment with him

779
00:36:54,918 --> 00:36:56,998
Speaker 1: in his last two starts of the regular season. They

780
00:36:57,038 --> 00:36:59,998
Speaker 1: have him over the rubber a little bit more, and

781
00:37:00,078 --> 00:37:02,118
Speaker 1: my goodness, he's been lights out in the three starts

782
00:37:02,118 --> 00:37:05,838
Speaker 1: since they've made that. So if you've got Wheeler and Nola,

783
00:37:05,918 --> 00:37:07,598
Speaker 1: and I know they can't pitch games one and two

784
00:37:07,598 --> 00:37:10,118
Speaker 1: to start out, but in a five game series, given

785
00:37:10,078 --> 00:37:12,278
Speaker 1: the ball to those two against the Braves with some

786
00:37:12,398 --> 00:37:15,878
Speaker 1: questions with their pitching in September, I like the Phillies.

787
00:37:15,918 --> 00:37:16,558
Speaker 2: Who you got?

788
00:37:16,798 --> 00:37:19,438
Speaker 3: Yeah, yes, because I have the Phillies going to the

789
00:37:19,438 --> 00:37:23,118
Speaker 3: World Series with the Orioles. The thing about Philadelphia and

790
00:37:23,158 --> 00:37:24,598
Speaker 3: I think we could all agree on this, They're not

791
00:37:24,598 --> 00:37:27,358
Speaker 3: going to be intimidated. I think they're gonna I know

792
00:37:27,398 --> 00:37:31,358
Speaker 3: Schwarves really well. I've got to know Harp a little bit.

793
00:37:31,558 --> 00:37:34,678
Speaker 3: Also a young Brandon marsha I know what he's all about.

794
00:37:34,678 --> 00:37:37,638
Speaker 3: I love Stott. There's a lot to like within that

795
00:37:37,678 --> 00:37:40,198
Speaker 3: group in a real mudo. I mean when he when

796
00:37:40,238 --> 00:37:43,358
Speaker 3: he popped that ball against robertson the other day, that

797
00:37:43,918 --> 00:37:46,558
Speaker 3: I really that's just that one at bat that could

798
00:37:46,598 --> 00:37:49,518
Speaker 3: really get this guy flowing a little bit, so up

799
00:37:49,518 --> 00:37:51,198
Speaker 3: and down lineup, I like I do like the Phlays

800
00:37:51,198 --> 00:37:53,118
Speaker 3: and I of course you like the bras everybody likes

801
00:37:53,118 --> 00:37:56,918
Speaker 3: the Braves, of course they do. But Philly I think

802
00:37:56,998 --> 00:38:01,758
Speaker 3: is really hungry. I think they're so inspired. I mean,

803
00:38:02,518 --> 00:38:05,238
Speaker 3: what's going on down there, fan base, the city itself,

804
00:38:05,678 --> 00:38:08,358
Speaker 3: and again there's this accumulation of players that really feed

805
00:38:08,358 --> 00:38:10,598
Speaker 3: off that kind of energy, and they're not going to

806
00:38:10,598 --> 00:38:13,798
Speaker 3: be intimidated. Actually, like relish the opportunity to prove people wrong.

807
00:38:14,398 --> 00:38:17,758
Speaker 3: I think you're going to see the best version of

808
00:38:17,758 --> 00:38:21,038
Speaker 3: the Phillies in the series. I do believe they're gonna win. Yes,

809
00:38:21,078 --> 00:38:22,838
Speaker 3: the Braves are really good. They do rely a lot

810
00:38:22,878 --> 00:38:26,878
Speaker 3: on the home run. The part of the Phillies pitching

811
00:38:26,958 --> 00:38:29,918
Speaker 3: order that they may be facing may help or contribute

812
00:38:29,918 --> 00:38:32,598
Speaker 3: to that. Also, it's gonna you know, it really comes

813
00:38:32,638 --> 00:38:35,158
Speaker 3: down to again, I have not had the game plan

814
00:38:35,198 --> 00:38:38,718
Speaker 3: for Atlanta in a while, but looking at their lineup

815
00:38:38,758 --> 00:38:40,278
Speaker 3: and how it sets up, they're gonna have to pick

816
00:38:40,318 --> 00:38:43,758
Speaker 3: their poison right there, and of course a Kuna Olsen whatever,

817
00:38:43,878 --> 00:38:45,758
Speaker 3: But you have to pick your poison and you've got

818
00:38:45,798 --> 00:38:47,878
Speaker 3: to really try to filter your way through. Remember with

819
00:38:47,918 --> 00:38:50,478
Speaker 3: Olsen too, man guy hits lefties. I don't care what

820
00:38:50,598 --> 00:38:52,998
Speaker 3: lefty is the guy can hit a lefty. There's no

821
00:38:53,038 --> 00:38:55,998
Speaker 3: advantage there. It's like Tucker with the Astros. There is

822
00:38:55,998 --> 00:38:58,638
Speaker 3: no advantage there by bringing lefty or Alvarez. There's no

823
00:38:58,718 --> 00:39:02,038
Speaker 3: advantage by bringing in a lefty. And especially in today's game.

824
00:39:02,038 --> 00:39:04,958
Speaker 3: I was thinking about this too. There may have been

825
00:39:05,798 --> 00:39:08,238
Speaker 3: that this is really where with the three batter minimum

826
00:39:08,318 --> 00:39:13,238
Speaker 3: hurts from the perspective of bringing matching up. You might

827
00:39:13,278 --> 00:39:15,558
Speaker 3: have just been able to hire a real good lefty

828
00:39:15,598 --> 00:39:18,998
Speaker 3: that just kills lefties, that just annihilates left handed hitters.

829
00:39:19,038 --> 00:39:20,958
Speaker 3: But now you've got guys that have to be cognizant

830
00:39:20,998 --> 00:39:22,878
Speaker 3: of getting both rightis and lefties on. They may have

831
00:39:22,918 --> 00:39:25,118
Speaker 3: lost a little bit of an edge left on left,

832
00:39:25,118 --> 00:39:28,318
Speaker 3: but there's these there's some guys in this playoff situation,

833
00:39:28,438 --> 00:39:30,718
Speaker 3: left handed hitters that you just can't think it's a

834
00:39:30,718 --> 00:39:33,438
Speaker 3: safety net to put a left hander on them. So,

835
00:39:33,798 --> 00:39:37,158
Speaker 3: having said all that, I just like the Phillies where

836
00:39:37,198 --> 00:39:39,478
Speaker 3: they're at right now. I know some of the guys,

837
00:39:40,358 --> 00:39:42,798
Speaker 3: they're not going to be intimidated. I think they got

838
00:39:42,798 --> 00:39:44,798
Speaker 3: it going on and we eventually get to the World

839
00:39:44,838 --> 00:39:46,118
Speaker 3: Series and lose to Baltimore.

840
00:39:46,358 --> 00:39:48,958
Speaker 1: Yeah, everything you said about the Phillies, I'd agree with,

841
00:39:48,998 --> 00:39:51,278
Speaker 1: and it starts with Bryce Harper. And to me, maybe

842
00:39:51,278 --> 00:39:53,758
Speaker 1: you want one example, it's him running through the stop

843
00:39:53,798 --> 00:39:56,438
Speaker 1: sign of Dusty Wattham, scoring from first base. If you

844
00:39:56,598 --> 00:39:59,838
Speaker 1: break down that play, it's everything about who Harper and

845
00:39:59,878 --> 00:40:02,558
Speaker 1: the Phillies are. First of all, he had a great

846
00:40:02,758 --> 00:40:06,158
Speaker 1: secondary leadoff space plays in front of him. He knows

847
00:40:06,198 --> 00:40:09,198
Speaker 1: that John Birdie, who's basically an infielder is playing left field,

848
00:40:09,238 --> 00:40:10,318
Speaker 1: doesn't have a great arm.

849
00:40:10,798 --> 00:40:12,838
Speaker 2: He made a decision between second and third.

850
00:40:12,878 --> 00:40:15,238
Speaker 1: He was scoring and he wasn't going to be stopped,

851
00:40:15,398 --> 00:40:18,758
Speaker 1: and that's a baseball decision. That's not a reckless decision.

852
00:40:18,798 --> 00:40:21,318
Speaker 1: And again I'll go back to his secondary lead this game.

853
00:40:21,398 --> 00:40:24,598
Speaker 1: This guy plays the game at a high level, smartly,

854
00:40:25,158 --> 00:40:27,838
Speaker 1: and that describes how the Philadelphia Phillies played. Now, I

855
00:40:27,878 --> 00:40:31,118
Speaker 1: still think the Braves could hit enough home runs that

856
00:40:31,718 --> 00:40:34,318
Speaker 1: all of that doesn't matter. You know, the advantage at

857
00:40:34,318 --> 00:40:37,358
Speaker 1: home for Philadelphia, how tough they are. I do think

858
00:40:37,438 --> 00:40:41,758
Speaker 1: that their lineup is that dangerous. I think they hit velocity. Well,

859
00:40:41,798 --> 00:40:43,838
Speaker 1: he hit everything as well as anybody in baseball, but

860
00:40:43,878 --> 00:40:47,198
Speaker 1: they kill velocity except balls above their hands. I think

861
00:40:47,198 --> 00:40:49,278
Speaker 1: that's a one place Philadelphie's going to have to go

862
00:40:49,718 --> 00:40:54,478
Speaker 1: Riley Olsen. Ozuna not great on fastballs up and there's

863
00:40:54,638 --> 00:40:57,278
Speaker 1: very few places you can go against this Atlanta team.

864
00:40:57,358 --> 00:41:00,958
Speaker 1: So one place you can have some success, you just

865
00:41:00,998 --> 00:41:01,878
Speaker 1: better not miss.

866
00:41:02,118 --> 00:41:04,598
Speaker 3: Yeah. When you say good secondary leader, I've always a

867
00:41:04,678 --> 00:41:07,118
Speaker 3: nice to teach Spase running with the Angels in the eighties.

868
00:41:07,518 --> 00:41:10,798
Speaker 3: A good secondary equals a good teammate. Period. If you

869
00:41:10,838 --> 00:41:13,398
Speaker 3: take good secondary leads, that means you're a good teammate.

870
00:41:13,838 --> 00:41:15,558
Speaker 3: You're there to score runs, You're there to get an

871
00:41:15,638 --> 00:41:20,958
Speaker 3: RBI for your buddy. It just speaks to your concentration,

872
00:41:21,038 --> 00:41:22,918
Speaker 3: your focus on the field during the course of the game.

873
00:41:22,918 --> 00:41:26,798
Speaker 3: To me, that's where players really revealed themselves regarding their

874
00:41:27,598 --> 00:41:30,118
Speaker 3: baseball acumen as a lot of it's just on the

875
00:41:30,158 --> 00:41:33,398
Speaker 3: basis the other day, Guerrero gets picked off in a

876
00:41:33,438 --> 00:41:35,878
Speaker 3: huge situation right there. He needs to be taking a

877
00:41:35,918 --> 00:41:38,198
Speaker 3: safe max. In other words, you just you don't get

878
00:41:38,198 --> 00:41:40,838
Speaker 3: way off. You relign your secondary lead to get way

879
00:41:40,838 --> 00:41:43,598
Speaker 3: off right there, because he's not of that quickness to

880
00:41:43,638 --> 00:41:45,358
Speaker 3: get off far. And if I know he wants to score,

881
00:41:45,398 --> 00:41:47,118
Speaker 3: I know all this, I get it. But that's where

882
00:41:47,158 --> 00:41:50,518
Speaker 3: a good strong secondary lead needs to be incorporated with

883
00:41:50,598 --> 00:41:55,198
Speaker 3: a more of a safe maximum lead, so that absolutely

884
00:41:55,238 --> 00:41:58,718
Speaker 3: good secondary equals a good teammate. Last point, I think

885
00:41:58,758 --> 00:42:03,358
Speaker 3: that part of Harper having that mindset was where Dusty

886
00:42:03,358 --> 00:42:05,478
Speaker 3: had held up earlier in a game on that pop

887
00:42:05,558 --> 00:42:07,398
Speaker 3: up the right field right, So I think there was

888
00:42:07,438 --> 00:42:09,998
Speaker 3: like all kinds of things in play right there. And

889
00:42:10,078 --> 00:42:12,318
Speaker 3: that's how you work, man, That's how players work, especially

890
00:42:12,358 --> 00:42:16,078
Speaker 3: guys like a Harper, a lot of cachet, big time player.

891
00:42:17,038 --> 00:42:18,958
Speaker 3: He's gonna, he's gonna, he's gonna take that moment to

892
00:42:19,358 --> 00:42:21,438
Speaker 3: really set a tone for the rest of the group,

893
00:42:21,478 --> 00:42:22,998
Speaker 3: and that's what I saw. So I think there was

894
00:42:23,038 --> 00:42:26,118
Speaker 3: a lot of factors involved in that good secondary, though,

895
00:42:26,238 --> 00:42:27,558
Speaker 3: equals good teammate.

896
00:42:27,438 --> 00:42:30,558
Speaker 1: By the way that Guerrero pickoff and obviously it can't

897
00:42:30,598 --> 00:42:33,358
Speaker 1: happen you're the trail runner, not even the lead runner.

898
00:42:33,358 --> 00:42:35,358
Speaker 1: You shouldn't it shouldn't have a non lead runner. But ye,

899
00:42:35,798 --> 00:42:39,518
Speaker 1: people should understand though that's only possible or made more

900
00:42:39,558 --> 00:42:42,478
Speaker 1: possible by the fact that they have the PitchCom device.

901
00:42:42,918 --> 00:42:46,438
Speaker 1: You can call a timing play at second base with

902
00:42:46,518 --> 00:42:49,278
Speaker 1: the PitchCom device, and we've seen more of those than

903
00:42:49,318 --> 00:42:52,638
Speaker 1: ever before because you don't have to go by counting

904
00:42:52,678 --> 00:42:55,958
Speaker 1: in your head or signaling to the infielder. The catcher,

905
00:42:56,038 --> 00:42:59,238
Speaker 1: the middle infielder, the pitcher are all in on it electronically.

906
00:42:59,718 --> 00:43:00,638
Speaker 2: It's fascinating.

907
00:43:00,878 --> 00:43:02,398
Speaker 3: Well, then you should be able to give signs to

908
00:43:02,438 --> 00:43:04,198
Speaker 3: the hitter from the dugout. You should be able to

909
00:43:04,198 --> 00:43:06,678
Speaker 3: go a sign from the third base coach to the runner.

910
00:43:06,718 --> 00:43:08,118
Speaker 3: I mean, I I don't know if I like that

911
00:43:08,198 --> 00:43:11,638
Speaker 3: as much. The fact that you could relay signs through

912
00:43:11,838 --> 00:43:15,758
Speaker 3: other than just fastball curve or whatever. I get it.

913
00:43:15,918 --> 00:43:17,678
Speaker 3: I get it, but that that really comes down to

914
00:43:17,998 --> 00:43:21,398
Speaker 3: paying attention, you know, the kesher and the middlelandfielders having

915
00:43:21,438 --> 00:43:24,398
Speaker 3: to be on the same page. It has nothing to

916
00:43:24,438 --> 00:43:27,238
Speaker 3: do with time, nothing to do with the pace of

917
00:43:27,278 --> 00:43:29,318
Speaker 3: the game. I don't know, I have to consider I

918
00:43:29,318 --> 00:43:32,238
Speaker 3: didn't even realize that i'd have to consider all that,

919
00:43:32,558 --> 00:43:34,638
Speaker 3: because that was a big thing. When you had a

920
00:43:34,678 --> 00:43:38,278
Speaker 3: situation that you thought might be ripe, you would talk

921
00:43:38,318 --> 00:43:39,918
Speaker 3: about it before the game. Listen, when so and so

922
00:43:40,038 --> 00:43:42,798
Speaker 3: gets on second base, heads up, he falls asleep out there.

923
00:43:42,838 --> 00:43:44,838
Speaker 3: We're going to try to take advantage of this. And then,

924
00:43:44,838 --> 00:43:47,838
Speaker 3: like you said, this is going to require some kind

925
00:43:47,878 --> 00:43:51,438
Speaker 3: of a sign from the shortstop to the picture. Normally,

926
00:43:51,478 --> 00:43:52,878
Speaker 3: the shortstop is going to put it on before the

927
00:43:52,918 --> 00:43:55,798
Speaker 3: picture puts it on normally, and then and then the answer.

928
00:43:55,958 --> 00:43:58,838
Speaker 3: So that's again I don't know. I hope I'm not

929
00:43:58,878 --> 00:44:00,518
Speaker 3: revealing just the fact that I've been doing this for

930
00:44:00,558 --> 00:44:02,798
Speaker 3: a long time, but part of it, part of that

931
00:44:02,918 --> 00:44:06,118
Speaker 3: to me, that's where should still remain signs, And I

932
00:44:06,158 --> 00:44:09,398
Speaker 3: don't know that that technology should technology should take that

933
00:44:09,558 --> 00:44:12,398
Speaker 3: over or like I said, eventually all signs should be

934
00:44:12,398 --> 00:44:15,958
Speaker 3: eliminated for the with technology ruling the roost.

935
00:44:16,318 --> 00:44:17,238
Speaker 2: It's a good question.

936
00:44:17,918 --> 00:44:20,598
Speaker 1: I'm not sure what the answer is myself, but why

937
00:44:20,678 --> 00:44:24,118
Speaker 1: PitchCom has a button for a timing pickoff play, Yeah,

938
00:44:24,278 --> 00:44:26,918
Speaker 1: is a question that I think the committee should take

939
00:44:26,918 --> 00:44:29,278
Speaker 1: a look at. And by the way, again, give Carlos

940
00:44:29,398 --> 00:44:32,638
Speaker 1: Kore a credit. I mean, yeah, it's a baseball IQ.

941
00:44:32,878 --> 00:44:35,398
Speaker 1: He had told Sonny Gray as early as the first

942
00:44:35,438 --> 00:44:39,078
Speaker 1: inning that that ballpark was so loud that a runner

943
00:44:39,158 --> 00:44:41,478
Speaker 1: on second base would not be able to hear the

944
00:44:41,518 --> 00:44:44,078
Speaker 1: third base coach tell him to get back or to

945
00:44:44,118 --> 00:44:47,278
Speaker 1: shorten his lead. I mean, think about that awareness, that

946
00:44:47,438 --> 00:44:50,278
Speaker 1: court awareness, if you will, and you wonder why this

947
00:44:50,358 --> 00:44:52,758
Speaker 1: guy's a really good big game player.

948
00:44:53,038 --> 00:44:54,198
Speaker 2: I just love that story.

949
00:44:54,558 --> 00:44:56,238
Speaker 3: I do love that, and that would be enough to

950
00:44:56,358 --> 00:44:58,798
Speaker 3: just say, listen, give me a look, give me a look.

951
00:44:58,998 --> 00:45:01,078
Speaker 3: These guys are allowed out here. The place is loud,

952
00:45:01,798 --> 00:45:04,998
Speaker 3: and then I'm I have certain that they spoke about

953
00:45:04,998 --> 00:45:07,638
Speaker 3: certain hit runners. Did they get in that second situation

954
00:45:07,678 --> 00:45:10,518
Speaker 3: at second base? That'd be more ripe, like I said,

955
00:45:10,518 --> 00:45:13,638
Speaker 3: to be able to pick. I would bet that Flattie

956
00:45:13,758 --> 00:45:15,198
Speaker 3: might have been one of those guys. I'd have to

957
00:45:15,198 --> 00:45:17,918
Speaker 3: believe that, and then here it came. So anyway, I'd

958
00:45:17,958 --> 00:45:19,518
Speaker 3: want to blavor this point. But I just think that

959
00:45:19,518 --> 00:45:23,798
Speaker 3: that's something that may require old school technologies of post

960
00:45:23,798 --> 00:45:24,318
Speaker 3: of buttons.

961
00:45:24,678 --> 00:45:26,318
Speaker 2: One more series to get to Joe.

962
00:45:26,318 --> 00:45:30,398
Speaker 1: It's the Dodgers and the Arizona Diamondbacks. Now this is

963
00:45:30,398 --> 00:45:33,518
Speaker 1: a good example for me, Joe, of I want to

964
00:45:33,518 --> 00:45:35,638
Speaker 1: know what's going on right now with a team. We

965
00:45:35,678 --> 00:45:38,718
Speaker 1: can dive into regular season stats all that we want

966
00:45:39,038 --> 00:45:42,038
Speaker 1: right and if you look at this series, you would say, well,

967
00:45:42,078 --> 00:45:44,238
Speaker 1: the Dodgers are going to dominate. They want eight and

968
00:45:44,358 --> 00:45:48,318
Speaker 1: five against Arizona. They outscored Arizona in the head to

969
00:45:48,358 --> 00:45:51,278
Speaker 1: head matchups this year seventy two to forty seven really

970
00:45:51,318 --> 00:45:55,198
Speaker 1: not that competitive. That the best home field record in

971
00:45:55,198 --> 00:45:58,998
Speaker 1: the National League fifty three to twenty eight. Arizona had

972
00:45:58,998 --> 00:46:01,838
Speaker 1: to use Zach Gallon just to get through Milwaukee, so

973
00:46:01,918 --> 00:46:03,718
Speaker 1: he won't be available in the first couple of games.

974
00:46:03,718 --> 00:46:04,678
Speaker 2: He's their best pitcher.

975
00:46:04,958 --> 00:46:07,718
Speaker 1: So regular season numbers, the way we're set up here

976
00:46:07,918 --> 00:46:11,718
Speaker 1: looks like Dodgers. But if you watched Arizona play against Milwaukee,

977
00:46:12,118 --> 00:46:14,958
Speaker 1: you saw a team that went down on the road

978
00:46:14,958 --> 00:46:18,918
Speaker 1: in both games by multiple runs, came back with a

979
00:46:18,958 --> 00:46:22,198
Speaker 1: young team pretty much and won that series and won

980
00:46:22,198 --> 00:46:22,958
Speaker 1: it pretty easily.

981
00:46:23,958 --> 00:46:25,358
Speaker 2: I was really impressed by it.

982
00:46:25,398 --> 00:46:28,118
Speaker 1: If you looked at Arizona's chase rate in those two

983
00:46:28,158 --> 00:46:31,118
Speaker 1: games against Milwaukee, you would think you were looking at

984
00:46:31,118 --> 00:46:32,798
Speaker 1: a battle tested veteran team.

985
00:46:32,798 --> 00:46:35,838
Speaker 2: In the postseason, they just don't chase Corbyn Carroll.

986
00:46:35,918 --> 00:46:37,598
Speaker 1: I don't know what he's got in his veins, but

987
00:46:38,398 --> 00:46:41,238
Speaker 1: he looks like he's been playing baseball for ten years.

988
00:46:41,958 --> 00:46:44,078
Speaker 1: I think this is going to be a more competitive

989
00:46:44,198 --> 00:46:48,958
Speaker 1: series than what the regular season series lead you to believe.

990
00:46:49,238 --> 00:46:51,918
Speaker 3: Everything you just talked about there, yeh, it all makes sense.

991
00:46:51,958 --> 00:46:54,598
Speaker 3: But the thing that's most impressive to me is that

992
00:46:54,638 --> 00:46:56,598
Speaker 3: they were down twice and came back and won. That

993
00:46:57,118 --> 00:46:58,238
Speaker 3: really screams at me.

994
00:46:58,478 --> 00:47:00,718
Speaker 2: On the road in a hostile environment.

995
00:47:00,398 --> 00:47:03,878
Speaker 3: Absolutely on the thing that I really tried to impressive

996
00:47:03,998 --> 00:47:06,678
Speaker 3: on my teams before playoffs I have. That's one of

997
00:47:06,678 --> 00:47:09,278
Speaker 3: the few meetings I have all year, and in that

998
00:47:09,358 --> 00:47:12,038
Speaker 3: one of the one of the main topics I bring

999
00:47:12,158 --> 00:47:14,758
Speaker 3: up is that listen, at some point, things are going

1000
00:47:14,798 --> 00:47:16,718
Speaker 3: to go badly. It's going to go wrong, but we

1001
00:47:16,798 --> 00:47:19,878
Speaker 3: cannot permit that to overcome us. We have to fight

1002
00:47:19,958 --> 00:47:22,398
Speaker 3: back from those from those moments. So just be aware

1003
00:47:22,438 --> 00:47:24,798
Speaker 3: of that because too many times I've seen and even

1004
00:47:24,838 --> 00:47:27,718
Speaker 3: watching the rays yesterday, my goodness, I saw some I

1005
00:47:27,758 --> 00:47:30,798
Speaker 3: was watching a replay actually last night. You can see

1006
00:47:30,798 --> 00:47:32,918
Speaker 3: their faces. You can see in their faces they were resigned.

1007
00:47:32,958 --> 00:47:35,078
Speaker 3: Even early in that game. It was not a good look.

1008
00:47:35,398 --> 00:47:38,398
Speaker 3: It was not there was no believability. That also speaks to, like,

1009
00:47:38,438 --> 00:47:40,758
Speaker 3: in a short series like that, why it's so important

1010
00:47:40,758 --> 00:47:43,638
Speaker 3: to get on top winning that first game, but to

1011
00:47:43,718 --> 00:47:45,998
Speaker 3: be able to come back and win games, like you said,

1012
00:47:46,038 --> 00:47:47,718
Speaker 3: on the road and in the playoffs. It's one thing

1013
00:47:47,758 --> 00:47:50,158
Speaker 3: to do it during the regular season, because when teams

1014
00:47:50,198 --> 00:47:52,998
Speaker 3: get up in the playoffs, man, there's a thing that happens,

1015
00:47:52,998 --> 00:47:55,598
Speaker 3: and all of a sudden, you start getting into that

1016
00:47:55,678 --> 00:47:57,398
Speaker 3: vibe and you're feeling even a little bit stronger and

1017
00:47:57,518 --> 00:48:00,198
Speaker 3: better or sexier than the other team, and the other

1018
00:48:00,198 --> 00:48:02,958
Speaker 3: team is feeling the exact opposite. So that to me

1019
00:48:03,358 --> 00:48:05,838
Speaker 3: is screaming at me right there. And that's why I

1020
00:48:05,838 --> 00:48:07,838
Speaker 3: really want to pay attention and watch more of this.

1021
00:48:08,358 --> 00:48:10,718
Speaker 3: I really haven't seen the Diamondbacks a whole lot this year,

1022
00:48:11,358 --> 00:48:15,118
Speaker 3: but that one point, in and of itself, that is

1023
00:48:15,158 --> 00:48:17,398
Speaker 3: the mark of a really good team, a good playoff team,

1024
00:48:17,398 --> 00:48:19,758
Speaker 3: And it also speaks to whoever the leaders are in

1025
00:48:19,798 --> 00:48:23,478
Speaker 3: that clubhouse, the group in itself, that they don't quit. Man,

1026
00:48:23,758 --> 00:48:27,318
Speaker 3: they don't quit, and they probably like one another, and

1027
00:48:26,758 --> 00:48:30,558
Speaker 3: they play well and they have this strong belief system.

1028
00:48:30,478 --> 00:48:32,918
Speaker 1: And mark this down for better or for worse. Dave

1029
00:48:32,998 --> 00:48:36,198
Speaker 1: Roberts is going to be a story in that series.

1030
00:48:36,238 --> 00:48:39,238
Speaker 1: He has to be because he doesn't have length from

1031
00:48:39,238 --> 00:48:42,638
Speaker 1: his starting pitchers. I mean, normally the Dodgers in the postseason,

1032
00:48:42,638 --> 00:48:45,918
Speaker 1: that's kind of the mo anyway, right, they played twelve

1033
00:48:45,958 --> 00:48:50,278
Speaker 1: straight postseason games without their starter going past the fifth inning.

1034
00:48:50,718 --> 00:48:52,998
Speaker 1: But he has to do it by necessity now because

1035
00:48:52,998 --> 00:48:56,078
Speaker 1: he's got Clayton Kershaw is basically a seventy pitch guy

1036
00:48:56,198 --> 00:49:00,238
Speaker 1: right now. He's got Bobby Miller, young pitcher, lights out stuff.

1037
00:49:00,438 --> 00:49:02,478
Speaker 1: It's just at a point in his career where he's

1038
00:49:02,518 --> 00:49:07,238
Speaker 1: beyond his innings previously and he's got a really good bullpen.

1039
00:49:07,878 --> 00:49:09,798
Speaker 2: So he's going to have to mix and match.

1040
00:49:09,838 --> 00:49:12,078
Speaker 1: When you do that, there's going to be times when

1041
00:49:12,118 --> 00:49:15,278
Speaker 1: the matchup doesn't turn out in your favor.

1042
00:49:16,478 --> 00:49:18,038
Speaker 2: It's gonna be an interesting series.

1043
00:49:18,118 --> 00:49:20,838
Speaker 1: Now, what's interesting both in these National League series, Joe,

1044
00:49:21,358 --> 00:49:24,158
Speaker 1: they play Game one, they have an off day, they

1045
00:49:24,158 --> 00:49:27,278
Speaker 1: play Game two, they have an off day. If the

1046
00:49:27,318 --> 00:49:31,838
Speaker 1: series goes five games, Dave Roberts in advance, the Dodgers

1047
00:49:31,878 --> 00:49:34,878
Speaker 1: will have i think it's six of their first eight

1048
00:49:34,958 --> 00:49:39,478
Speaker 1: postseason games after days off, so he will have rested

1049
00:49:39,518 --> 00:49:42,198
Speaker 1: relievers at his ready. So you're going to see a

1050
00:49:42,238 --> 00:49:45,478
Speaker 1: lot of pitching changes. And we just opened this podcast

1051
00:49:45,518 --> 00:49:48,478
Speaker 1: by talking about, you know, making boneheaded moves based on

1052
00:49:48,518 --> 00:49:51,558
Speaker 1: a script. In this case, I think it has to

1053
00:49:51,598 --> 00:49:55,398
Speaker 1: be the Dodgers path forward. Now it's not scripted, but

1054
00:49:55,598 --> 00:49:58,558
Speaker 1: when you see Dave Roberts making a lot of pitching moves,

1055
00:49:58,678 --> 00:50:00,958
Speaker 1: I think in this case it's going to be done

1056
00:50:00,998 --> 00:50:02,718
Speaker 1: out of necessity, no question.

1057
00:50:02,878 --> 00:50:05,078
Speaker 3: And I actually have one of my lineup cards here.

1058
00:50:05,398 --> 00:50:07,918
Speaker 3: I don't know from Pittsburgh and twenty nineteen, but what

1059
00:50:07,958 --> 00:50:10,438
Speaker 3: I do and what he's going to do is good

1060
00:50:10,478 --> 00:50:12,318
Speaker 3: on the opposition lineup, and I would write down my

1061
00:50:12,398 --> 00:50:16,278
Speaker 3: relief pitchers names in blocks, especially with the three batter minimum,

1062
00:50:16,678 --> 00:50:19,118
Speaker 3: and he's gonna have in his head the number of

1063
00:50:19,118 --> 00:50:21,198
Speaker 3: pitches whoever the picture is in the game, how many

1064
00:50:21,198 --> 00:50:23,958
Speaker 3: pitches or innings he thinks he may get out of

1065
00:50:23,998 --> 00:50:26,518
Speaker 3: this guy. So this is the time, absolutely that you

1066
00:50:26,558 --> 00:50:29,478
Speaker 3: want to prescript things. I did it every game, but

1067
00:50:30,238 --> 00:50:33,518
Speaker 3: under these circumstances like you're describing, it's going to become

1068
00:50:33,518 --> 00:50:35,678
Speaker 3: even more pertinent because you really you want to have

1069
00:50:35,758 --> 00:50:37,438
Speaker 3: a clear vision of what you want to do before

1070
00:50:37,478 --> 00:50:39,798
Speaker 3: the game begins, and especially now with the day off.

1071
00:50:40,078 --> 00:50:42,198
Speaker 3: My goodness, you could be so aggressive with these guys.

1072
00:50:42,918 --> 00:50:45,158
Speaker 3: There's times that there might be they might be down

1073
00:50:45,158 --> 00:50:48,158
Speaker 3: on one run or two runs, and normally they would

1074
00:50:48,198 --> 00:50:49,798
Speaker 3: never bring so many into the game, but now they

1075
00:50:49,838 --> 00:50:52,758
Speaker 3: would because they know tomorrow is off. There's a definite

1076
00:50:52,798 --> 00:50:57,518
Speaker 3: advantage in those days off regarding how aggressive you could

1077
00:50:57,598 --> 00:51:00,438
Speaker 3: use somebody in a small deficit, because of course, in

1078
00:51:00,438 --> 00:51:02,318
Speaker 3: a small deficit, would never want to use your better

1079
00:51:02,358 --> 00:51:04,638
Speaker 3: guys because we're playing tomorrow night and we got to

1080
00:51:04,678 --> 00:51:08,438
Speaker 3: win three out of five. So there's a different strategy

1081
00:51:08,478 --> 00:51:11,518
Speaker 3: involved in this, and utilization of pictures and when you

1082
00:51:11,518 --> 00:51:13,958
Speaker 3: could actually employ them. All these things matter, All this

1083
00:51:13,998 --> 00:51:17,558
Speaker 3: stuff matters, but this is a time absolutely I would

1084
00:51:17,558 --> 00:51:20,758
Speaker 3: have the names written after my brief picture's names written

1085
00:51:20,878 --> 00:51:25,158
Speaker 3: after their hitters' names in A one through nine, and

1086
00:51:25,198 --> 00:51:26,758
Speaker 3: I put the guy's names. I would put like that

1087
00:51:26,838 --> 00:51:29,198
Speaker 3: when I did with Johnny Lester, I had Lester on

1088
00:51:29,318 --> 00:51:31,438
Speaker 3: Kipnessen and I drew a straight line down from there

1089
00:51:31,478 --> 00:51:33,438
Speaker 3: and wrapped around, meaning I wanted to go, you know,

1090
00:51:33,438 --> 00:51:35,798
Speaker 3: more than one time through if it's possible. So this

1091
00:51:36,158 --> 00:51:37,958
Speaker 3: is what you do and you stick to that, and

1092
00:51:37,998 --> 00:51:40,958
Speaker 3: that's when it's really helpful when you do that before

1093
00:51:41,038 --> 00:51:43,238
Speaker 3: the game, because you want to be able to make

1094
00:51:43,278 --> 00:51:46,158
Speaker 3: adaptations during the game, but you have to have something

1095
00:51:46,398 --> 00:51:49,838
Speaker 3: solitude to work from going into it. That really helps you.

1096
00:51:50,118 --> 00:51:53,438
Speaker 1: Two UCLA guys going out, Dave Roberts and Tory Leavello.

1097
00:51:53,558 --> 00:51:55,278
Speaker 2: That's going to be a fascinating series.

1098
00:51:55,438 --> 00:51:58,678
Speaker 1: I just hope Joe that I listen I love when

1099
00:51:58,718 --> 00:52:00,558
Speaker 1: series go to the maximum number of games.

1100
00:52:00,598 --> 00:52:02,398
Speaker 2: A little disappointed we didn't get a game.

1101
00:52:02,238 --> 00:52:05,918
Speaker 1: Three at all in the Wildcards series, so hopefully these

1102
00:52:05,958 --> 00:52:09,398
Speaker 1: four division series will bring us to at least a

1103
00:52:09,438 --> 00:52:11,438
Speaker 1: couple of game fives.

1104
00:52:11,358 --> 00:52:14,438
Speaker 3: No doubt. I mean the intensity of those of those

1105
00:52:14,438 --> 00:52:17,798
Speaker 3: elimination games. I mean, although the second game was elimination

1106
00:52:17,918 --> 00:52:19,678
Speaker 3: game for some guys, but to really get to the

1107
00:52:19,718 --> 00:52:22,758
Speaker 3: point where it's either or it's absolutely wonderful. You know,

1108
00:52:22,798 --> 00:52:26,198
Speaker 3: you're alive in a baseball sense, and it should bring

1109
00:52:26,238 --> 00:52:28,278
Speaker 3: out the best in you. I think for me it's

1110
00:52:28,278 --> 00:52:30,838
Speaker 3: not wasn't a nerve wracking experience. I would go through

1111
00:52:30,878 --> 00:52:33,598
Speaker 3: my normal routine. I'm just talking as a manager, not

1112
00:52:33,678 --> 00:52:36,798
Speaker 3: as a player. But you again, like I said, if

1113
00:52:36,838 --> 00:52:40,518
Speaker 3: you prep this in your head, and again to emphasize

1114
00:52:40,518 --> 00:52:43,758
Speaker 3: you're right, we should always, should always be prescripted. Absolutely.

1115
00:52:43,998 --> 00:52:46,118
Speaker 3: Gene Mock played the game before, during, and after the game.

1116
00:52:46,198 --> 00:52:48,438
Speaker 3: Gene taught me that said that to me, and I

1117
00:52:48,438 --> 00:52:50,638
Speaker 3: don't know nineteen eighty four or five, whatever that was,

1118
00:52:51,078 --> 00:52:53,038
Speaker 3: and I always did that ever since as a manager.

1119
00:52:53,078 --> 00:52:57,118
Speaker 3: I played three times before, during, and after, and I

1120
00:52:57,158 --> 00:53:00,518
Speaker 3: think the before component of it, that prep work really

1121
00:53:00,758 --> 00:53:04,318
Speaker 3: helps you slow things down, because what happens some times

1122
00:53:04,358 --> 00:53:07,118
Speaker 3: if you don't do that naturally, would be that the

1123
00:53:07,158 --> 00:53:09,838
Speaker 3: game gets quick and things just pop up that you

1124
00:53:09,878 --> 00:53:13,118
Speaker 3: did not anticipate, and all of a sudden you're scrambling

1125
00:53:13,118 --> 00:53:15,118
Speaker 3: for a thought. And I'll tell you what. That happens

1126
00:53:15,118 --> 00:53:16,998
Speaker 3: more in a National League game than an American League game,

1127
00:53:16,998 --> 00:53:19,398
Speaker 3: because we had to be really cognizant of that picture.

1128
00:53:19,478 --> 00:53:22,038
Speaker 3: Trust me, it gets kind of crazy. I'd say, Davy,

1129
00:53:22,158 --> 00:53:24,038
Speaker 3: talk to me talking, what do I I would say

1130
00:53:24,038 --> 00:53:25,718
Speaker 3: things out loud to him, where Brandon Heide, I would

1131
00:53:25,718 --> 00:53:27,158
Speaker 3: say it out loud to them, I'll say it back

1132
00:53:27,198 --> 00:53:30,078
Speaker 3: to me. So I got this thing right. It's true.

1133
00:53:30,198 --> 00:53:33,358
Speaker 3: It's all true. So under the circumstances you want to

1134
00:53:33,358 --> 00:53:36,438
Speaker 3: have a predetermination which you want to do. That's theory,

1135
00:53:36,598 --> 00:53:38,718
Speaker 3: and then reality becomes something completely different.

1136
00:53:38,878 --> 00:53:40,038
Speaker 2: All good stuff, Joe.

1137
00:53:40,198 --> 00:53:42,678
Speaker 1: It reminds me of what Pablo Lopez, the picture for

1138
00:53:42,718 --> 00:53:44,918
Speaker 1: the Minnesota Twins said at this time.

1139
00:53:44,798 --> 00:53:48,158
Speaker 2: Of the year. Pressure is a privilege. That's right, love

1140
00:53:48,198 --> 00:53:48,958
Speaker 2: that line.

1141
00:53:49,558 --> 00:53:52,678
Speaker 1: I'm sure you have something else even better to take

1142
00:53:52,758 --> 00:53:55,558
Speaker 1: us out here on this latest edition of the Book

1143
00:53:55,558 --> 00:53:55,918
Speaker 1: of Joe.

1144
00:53:56,238 --> 00:53:58,598
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know it. I was actually let me said,

1145
00:53:58,598 --> 00:54:00,918
Speaker 3: I could frame this little bit I was. I read

1146
00:54:00,998 --> 00:54:04,758
Speaker 3: or heard Jerry Depoto's line about the fifty percent.

1147
00:54:05,158 --> 00:54:07,838
Speaker 1: Yeah, which he quickly walked back the next Yeah. By

1148
00:54:07,878 --> 00:54:09,958
Speaker 1: the way, I think he realized, not too smart.

1149
00:54:10,118 --> 00:54:12,118
Speaker 3: Yeah, it doesn't sound good. I understand what he was saying.

1150
00:54:12,358 --> 00:54:15,598
Speaker 3: I guess you're just talking about consistency. And that led

1151
00:54:15,638 --> 00:54:18,678
Speaker 3: to this first quote by Michelangelo. But then I'm going

1152
00:54:18,678 --> 00:54:20,638
Speaker 3: to go out the second one that so I had

1153
00:54:20,678 --> 00:54:22,798
Speaker 3: to rethink this a little bit. But what he's talking

1154
00:54:22,838 --> 00:54:27,998
Speaker 3: about is this patient approach, and Michelangelo said genius is

1155
00:54:28,038 --> 00:54:31,078
Speaker 3: eternal patience. So at that point I think that Jerry

1156
00:54:31,198 --> 00:54:34,678
Speaker 3: was practicing internal patients in a sense. But also you

1157
00:54:34,718 --> 00:54:37,038
Speaker 3: and I have talked about this one, and I think

1158
00:54:37,038 --> 00:54:40,438
Speaker 3: it really this is the one I prefer. The greater

1159
00:54:40,518 --> 00:54:43,318
Speaker 3: danger for most of us lies in not setting our

1160
00:54:43,358 --> 00:54:46,318
Speaker 3: aim too high and falling short, but in setting our

1161
00:54:46,358 --> 00:54:49,278
Speaker 3: aim too low and achieving our mark. So I think

1162
00:54:49,318 --> 00:54:51,118
Speaker 3: in a sense, I mean that's what you're talking about there.

1163
00:54:51,158 --> 00:54:54,598
Speaker 3: If you don't set it high enough, the threat is

1164
00:54:54,638 --> 00:54:56,758
Speaker 3: that you're going to hit your mark. But then again,

1165
00:54:57,158 --> 00:55:00,638
Speaker 3: there's a genius component to eternal patients. I know when

1166
00:55:00,638 --> 00:55:02,678
Speaker 3: I came to the to the Cubs. In that first

1167
00:55:02,678 --> 00:55:05,558
Speaker 3: press conference the Cup Bear, I said, I'm going to

1168
00:55:05,598 --> 00:55:08,798
Speaker 3: talk about playoffs this year and I'm expecting to be

1169
00:55:08,878 --> 00:55:11,118
Speaker 3: in the playoffs, said, I'm gonna talk World Series, et cetera.

1170
00:55:12,038 --> 00:55:14,198
Speaker 3: I think you have to you have to stay there.

1171
00:55:14,198 --> 00:55:18,158
Speaker 3: You can't. You can't always concede to what may go wrong.

1172
00:55:18,238 --> 00:55:20,598
Speaker 3: You have to you have to anticipate something going good

1173
00:55:20,918 --> 00:55:22,678
Speaker 3: and well. And your players have to believe that. They

1174
00:55:22,718 --> 00:55:24,878
Speaker 3: have to hear you say that all the time. Everything

1175
00:55:24,918 --> 00:55:27,558
Speaker 3: you do, everything you talk about, everything you say has

1176
00:55:27,598 --> 00:55:30,638
Speaker 3: got to have that that component to it that we

1177
00:55:30,718 --> 00:55:33,118
Speaker 3: are the best. In order to be the best, you

1178
00:55:33,198 --> 00:55:34,998
Speaker 3: got to beat the best. All this. They have to

1179
00:55:35,078 --> 00:55:39,718
Speaker 3: keep hearing this stuff every day and so that's that's

1180
00:55:39,758 --> 00:55:42,318
Speaker 3: what motivated me to go to Michelangelo today was with

1181
00:55:42,398 --> 00:55:44,638
Speaker 3: the clip I heard from Jerry a couple of days ago.

1182
00:55:45,038 --> 00:55:45,598
Speaker 2: Good stuff.

1183
00:55:45,598 --> 00:55:48,198
Speaker 1: And by the way, those people in Seattle, they must

1184
00:55:48,238 --> 00:55:50,918
Speaker 1: be geniuses because they've been paid in a long time

1185
00:55:51,238 --> 00:55:52,798
Speaker 1: waiting to win a World Series.

1186
00:55:53,118 --> 00:55:53,918
Speaker 2: They didn't make it.

1187
00:55:54,118 --> 00:55:57,878
Speaker 1: The Rays are out, the Texas Rangers are still in it, though,

1188
00:55:57,998 --> 00:56:02,398
Speaker 1: will they win their first World Series? Well, we got

1189
00:56:02,398 --> 00:56:04,998
Speaker 1: a ways to go, but we got toiting Division series

1190
00:56:05,038 --> 00:56:07,438
Speaker 1: coming up and can't wait till we talk about them

1191
00:56:07,478 --> 00:56:08,478
Speaker 1: the next time we meet here.

1192
00:56:08,478 --> 00:56:09,678
Speaker 2: On the Book of Joe, You.

1193
00:56:09,718 --> 00:56:11,718
Speaker 3: Got it, brother, And I think Michaelangel was talking about

1194
00:56:11,758 --> 00:56:13,998
Speaker 3: the Statue of David and the Sistine chap I think

1195
00:56:14,238 --> 00:56:22,958
Speaker 3: he wasn't talking about the the al or nlds.

1196
00:56:25,118 --> 00:56:28,358
Speaker 1: The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.

1197
00:56:28,598 --> 00:56:33,558
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

1198
00:56:33,678 --> 00:56:35,438
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts.