WEBVTT - From Great Resignation to Great Aspiration

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<v Speaker 1>This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg

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<v Speaker 1>Quick Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. Well, we mentioned

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<v Speaker 1>earlier are Bloomberg Business Week story and how kids are

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<v Speaker 1>going into the office actually office daycare while their parents

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<v Speaker 1>continue to work remotely from him, I find would you imagine, yes,

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<v Speaker 1>all of our kids running around here. I'm just trying

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<v Speaker 1>to think of all the expensive art my son would

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<v Speaker 1>break exactly, playing on the fish to the core piant

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<v Speaker 1>don't touch. Well, it's interesting. What we're seeing is the

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<v Speaker 1>workforce innovating, adapting, changing. Workers are increasingly picking where they

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<v Speaker 1>want to work based on the flexibility they get. Tim,

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<v Speaker 1>A lot of that's going on. Well, let's talk a

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<v Speaker 1>little bit more about this with Whitney Johnson, the CEO

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<v Speaker 1>of Disruption Advisors. She joins us on the phone from Lexington, Virginia. Whitney,

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<v Speaker 1>how are you. I'm fine and nice to be with you.

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<v Speaker 1>Tim and Carol, Well, happy New Year. You're also the

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<v Speaker 1>author of Smart Growth, How to Grow your People to

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<v Speaker 1>grow your company. Into Carol's point, you know, we we

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<v Speaker 1>we There have been a lot of stories about returning

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<v Speaker 1>to work and what the new normal looks like, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>when we finally do get there. What is the right

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<v Speaker 1>way for companies to think about tapping into either human

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<v Speaker 1>capital right now to make sure that they're growing in

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<v Speaker 1>the right way. Yeah. I think one of the most

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<v Speaker 1>important things for companies to remember is that growth, for

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<v Speaker 1>all human beings is our default setting. And one of

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<v Speaker 1>the things that we're seeing coming out of the pandemic,

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<v Speaker 1>and psychologists have seen this. The research is that when

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<v Speaker 1>you undergo your stress, it can lead to personal transformation

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<v Speaker 1>or post traumatic growth. And so people not only wanted

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<v Speaker 1>to grow, but now they're ready to grow as a

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<v Speaker 1>consequence of the pandemic. We've been disrupted, We've dealt with it,

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<v Speaker 1>we know how to disrupt ourselves, and so this, this

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<v Speaker 1>is so called great resignation. Actually, in many respects, is

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<v Speaker 1>the great aspiration. People want to grow. What wait, wait,

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<v Speaker 1>what do you mean people want to grow? And why

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<v Speaker 1>is it all of a sudden They're like, okay, we

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<v Speaker 1>want to do it, like explain it a little bit. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>So so again it's our default set. But the psychologists

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<v Speaker 1>have seen that when people undergo tremendous stress, one of

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<v Speaker 1>the things that happens is there as Oftentimes we talk

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<v Speaker 1>about post traumatic stress, but there's also post traumatic growth.

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<v Speaker 1>And so there's this sense of people now know how

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<v Speaker 1>to do it even better, and they've seen that they

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<v Speaker 1>were capable of doing it much more resilient than they

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<v Speaker 1>even expected. And so because of the pandemic, all this

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<v Speaker 1>movement happened whether we wanted it or not. And so

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<v Speaker 1>now people are saying, oh, I can move, I can change,

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<v Speaker 1>I can grow. Now I want to take charge of it.

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<v Speaker 1>And so coming out of the pandemic, I want I'm

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<v Speaker 1>not necessarily resigning from I'm aspiring to something more, which

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<v Speaker 1>is maybe why we've seen some people leave the great

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<v Speaker 1>resignation is that? Why? What's the connection there? Sorry, Carol, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>So so I think you know there's a sense of Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>people are leaving, Yes they are leaving, but what they're

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<v Speaker 1>really saying is I am aspiring to some thing more.

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<v Speaker 1>And so this so to your question of what employers

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<v Speaker 1>can do, is they can recognize that if they bring,

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<v Speaker 1>if they make it possible for people to grow, then

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<v Speaker 1>they're going to not only be able to get great

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<v Speaker 1>recruit great talent, but they're also going to be able

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<v Speaker 1>to retain them because whether or not a person stays

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<v Speaker 1>in an organization. Working for a boss, working for a

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<v Speaker 1>company is very much dependent on do I perceive that

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<v Speaker 1>there is growth upside for me? And so if you

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<v Speaker 1>will make it possible and very um explicit that yes,

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<v Speaker 1>if you come here and you work for me, you

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<v Speaker 1>will have the opportunity to grow, then they're going to

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<v Speaker 1>be able to both recruit and retain people. I do

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<v Speaker 1>think you're spot on. I've had a lot of conversations

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<v Speaker 1>with people who have actually left a place and sometimes

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<v Speaker 1>they're going back to school because they're like, Okay, because

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<v Speaker 1>I'm not growing anymore. I don't see the opportunities. I

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<v Speaker 1>don't see the path, like where do I go next

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<v Speaker 1>within an internal organization? Or they're switching departments because they

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<v Speaker 1>don't see the growth or there aren't the growth opportunities.

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<v Speaker 1>There always a case to be made, um we need

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<v Speaker 1>that leaders and companies can always find new growth pathways

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<v Speaker 1>for employees. Are there in some cases like maybe an

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<v Speaker 1>Amazon distribution warehouse there maybe there is no path that

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<v Speaker 1>you can go from from you know what I'm saying like,

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<v Speaker 1>is there certain parts within an organization that maybe the

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<v Speaker 1>growth path just stops? Yeah? Sometimes there isn't a path

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<v Speaker 1>in that particular department or even in that particular organization.

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<v Speaker 1>But one of the reasons that um the s cravel

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<v Speaker 1>learning that we talked about, which is this very simple

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<v Speaker 1>visual model that allows you to think about what growth

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<v Speaker 1>looks like, and that's what we've talked about in our

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<v Speaker 1>our book Smart Growth, is that it gives you this

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<v Speaker 1>artifact or this this model, this way to start a

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<v Speaker 1>conversation with people on your team, so that if you

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<v Speaker 1>are in Amazon Distribution Services and there isn't an opportunity

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<v Speaker 1>to grow there, they can then say to their boss,

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<v Speaker 1>it's not that I don't like Amazon, it's not that

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<v Speaker 1>I don't like looking for you. It's just that I

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<v Speaker 1>need to grow. I'm not getting any more dopamine that

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<v Speaker 1>comes with a challenge. And so then the boss doesn't

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<v Speaker 1>feel like, well, it's not that they don't like me,

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<v Speaker 1>it's just that their brain says, give me growth, please.

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<v Speaker 1>And so then you can have this conversation, so what

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<v Speaker 1>will growth look like for you? Maybe it's somewhere else,

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<v Speaker 1>But then if it's somewhere else, you become the boss

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<v Speaker 1>that the person remembers ten twenty years later because you

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<v Speaker 1>made it possible for them to grow, and they they

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<v Speaker 1>become an ambassador for you and for your organization. You know, Whitney,

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<v Speaker 1>you work with a lot of companies that are very

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<v Speaker 1>well known to our audience, Morgan Stanley, s d Lawder,

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<v Speaker 1>Citizens Bank, hub Spot, a lot more. Do you feel

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<v Speaker 1>like companies in general get it that things have changed

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<v Speaker 1>forever or do you believe that things have changed forever

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<v Speaker 1>when it comes to the relationship between employee and employer

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<v Speaker 1>because of COVID. I do think they get it. It's

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<v Speaker 1>really interesting. There was a study put out by agon

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<v Speaker 1>Zender just a couple of months ago where they had

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<v Speaker 1>surveyed at thousand CEOs and they ask them a question

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<v Speaker 1>about transformation and they said of them strongly agreed that

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<v Speaker 1>they needed to transform themselves, and the organization agreed. What's

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<v Speaker 1>interesting about that is that prior to the pandemic that

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<v Speaker 1>number was only so it went from So I do

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<v Speaker 1>believe that CEOs are now aware, Oh, if I want

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<v Speaker 1>to transform my organization, I need to transform myself. I

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<v Speaker 1>need to make it possible for myself to grow, and

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<v Speaker 1>I need to make it possible for my people to grow.

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<v Speaker 1>So yes, people are starting to get it. What does

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<v Speaker 1>that look like, What does that actually look like? How

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<v Speaker 1>does that manifest itself at companies? Well, it starts the

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<v Speaker 1>fundamental unit of growth, and every organization is the individual.

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<v Speaker 1>And so it looks like, UM manager. You know, you

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<v Speaker 1>Tim as a manager, you UM Carol as a manager,

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<v Speaker 1>sit down and have a conversation with someone on your

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<v Speaker 1>team and you say, where do you think you are

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<v Speaker 1>in your growth? Here's where I think you are in

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<v Speaker 1>this particular role. Let's come up with the plans so

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<v Speaker 1>that you can get to the top of your s

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<v Speaker 1>curve of learning and you can grow. Because what will

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<v Speaker 1>happen is as you aggregate the growth of five and

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<v Speaker 1>then ten, and then a thousand and then fifty th people,

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<v Speaker 1>all of those people are growing, all of those people

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<v Speaker 1>are reaching their potential. Then they, working together, are going

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<v Speaker 1>to be able to transform the organization. It's just starting

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<v Speaker 1>with that fundamental building block of the individual. It's interesting.

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<v Speaker 1>Are there certain industries, certain companies, certain leaders that you've

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<v Speaker 1>said that are like man, they just get it spot

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<v Speaker 1>on and they have figured out um how to help

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<v Speaker 1>grow their people and it's really had an impact on

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<v Speaker 1>their company. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. In fact, I just um

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<v Speaker 1>interviewed a company, and we just highly highlighted them in

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<v Speaker 1>the Harvard Business Review this month. Um, it's the Sixers,

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<v Speaker 1>the Philadelphia Sixers and the NBA t they they get it. Um.

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<v Speaker 1>There were four years where they were the losingest team

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<v Speaker 1>in the n b A and yet um, because they

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<v Speaker 1>were focused on developing their people Scott O'Neil, Jake Reynolds,

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<v Speaker 1>Jill Snodgrass. They focused on helping their new recruits, um,

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<v Speaker 1>straight out of college, learn how to sell, how to

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<v Speaker 1>develop them. And as a consequence, in four years when

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<v Speaker 1>they were losing all of their games, they were number

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<v Speaker 1>five in terms of new season ticket sales, and the

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<v Speaker 1>number three, and the number one and the number one.

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<v Speaker 1>So you had a team that was not winning, and

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<v Speaker 1>yet because they were willing to develop their people, they

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<v Speaker 1>were able to sell tickets. That to me is a

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<v Speaker 1>classic case of if you grow your people, you will

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<v Speaker 1>be able to grow your organization. Okay, so here we are,

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<v Speaker 1>what is a day three of two? A lot of

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<v Speaker 1>people are thinking of thinking about themselves in terms of Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>what are the changes that I can personally make to

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<v Speaker 1>feel better to have a better year. Um, what are

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<v Speaker 1>the some of the things that that you can offer

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<v Speaker 1>our listeners from from your own practice of working with

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<v Speaker 1>some of the biggest companies out there to transform individuals. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>I think the first thing that I would do is

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<v Speaker 1>just recognize that each one of us, um as I

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<v Speaker 1>said earlier, growth is our default setting. We all want

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<v Speaker 1>to grow. And if you recognize that as a leader,

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<v Speaker 1>as a manager, and say to yourself, how am I

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<v Speaker 1>going to help the people on my team grow? That

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<v Speaker 1>is a great starting point. Um. The second thing I

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<v Speaker 1>would say is that whenever we're starting something new and

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<v Speaker 1>post pandemic, we're all starting something new. Um, we have

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<v Speaker 1>to deal with a drop in dopamine. So one of

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<v Speaker 1>the ways that you can counter that is to allow

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<v Speaker 1>people to set very small, ridiculously small goals so that

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<v Speaker 1>they can build momentum going into the year. And the

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<v Speaker 1>third hack that I would suggest is for you, um,

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<v Speaker 1>every day, once you make a list of things you

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<v Speaker 1>want to get done, make a list of five things,

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<v Speaker 1>and if you're pacing well by noon, don't add to

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<v Speaker 1>the list just to say, good job, I got those

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<v Speaker 1>five things done and those three things put together. Focusing

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<v Speaker 1>on growth building momentum will allow you to again retain

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<v Speaker 1>that locus of control, which is you build momentum in

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<v Speaker 1>too the year and and start to feel like you're

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<v Speaker 1>you're going to have some traction as you move throughout

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<v Speaker 1>the throughout the year, um and moving up that curve

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<v Speaker 1>of your career and in your current role. Any book

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<v Speaker 1>that includes Star Wars and Yoda is uh, definitely good

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<v Speaker 1>in my case. But what's interesting, and I'm thinking about Whitney,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, employees who are listening to you right now.

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<v Speaker 1>Leaders which this is our audience are listening to you.

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<v Speaker 1>So what's the first step and employee can take in

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<v Speaker 1>this growth process? And what can a leader do to

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<v Speaker 1>encourage its employees in this growth process? Yeah, okay, I'll

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<v Speaker 1>give you a quick example. So a company called chat Books, Um,

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<v Speaker 1>they turn Instagram photos into books. They the CEO, Nate

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<v Speaker 1>quickly came to us and said, you know, we've got

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of people. They're fantastic, they've been here a

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<v Speaker 1>long time. I'm worried that they're they're not going to

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<v Speaker 1>feel like there's opportunities for them to grow. And so

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<v Speaker 1>we administered s curb insight tool. Found that many of

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<v Speaker 1>them were in mastery along the curve, but they now

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<v Speaker 1>had a language to be able to have that conversation.

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<v Speaker 1>In one case, one of the people said, Oh, there

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<v Speaker 1>aren't any more growth opportunities for me in this particular organization.

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<v Speaker 1>So they figured out a way for her to go

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<v Speaker 1>somewhere else, which may feel like in the short term

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<v Speaker 1>isn't a good thing, but long term, as we said earlier,

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<v Speaker 1>they become an ambassador for you and your organization. The

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<v Speaker 1>second thing I would say is that when you have

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<v Speaker 1>this artifact of what growth looks like, it gives people

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<v Speaker 1>permission to say, I am about to start something new.

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<v Speaker 1>I have this language to talk about something new, and

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<v Speaker 1>that something new is going to be awkward and uncomfortable,

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<v Speaker 1>and I'm going to feel impatient and discouraged, but everybody

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<v Speaker 1>knows that. So you've now normalized people doing new things.

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<v Speaker 1>And so by having this language to talk about when

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<v Speaker 1>things are new and uncomfortable, by having a language to

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<v Speaker 1>talk about when people are feeling a sense of I

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<v Speaker 1>need a new challenge, Um, there's this way to talk

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<v Speaker 1>about it normalize the experience this emotional arc of growth.

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<v Speaker 1>And that is something that you, as a leader can instigate,

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<v Speaker 1>and you, as a person working for that leader, can

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<v Speaker 1>do as well. Yeah, I figure out how to have

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<v Speaker 1>the conversation makes sense. Hey, Whitney, thank you so much.

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<v Speaker 1>I really appreciate Whitney Johnson's CEO of Disruption Advisors for

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<v Speaker 1>new book. It's called Smart Growth