1 00:00:02,520 --> 00:00:07,080 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. 2 00:00:07,320 --> 00:00:09,400 Speaker 2: This is my message to the Financial Time. So you 3 00:00:09,400 --> 00:00:12,080 Speaker 2: put out an article about the White House snubbing Brian moynihan. 4 00:00:12,320 --> 00:00:14,520 Speaker 2: If they've seen the embrace between Brian and the COMMAS 5 00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:16,200 Speaker 2: secretary just moments ago, and I think they would have 6 00:00:16,200 --> 00:00:17,239 Speaker 2: written the article, would they? 7 00:00:17,280 --> 00:00:19,360 Speaker 1: You know, they were talking about saw you last night. 8 00:00:19,480 --> 00:00:20,080 Speaker 3: It was great. 9 00:00:20,200 --> 00:00:23,040 Speaker 1: How were exactly exactly what they. 10 00:00:22,920 --> 00:00:24,919 Speaker 2: Had to shut down a studio from m It wasn't. 11 00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:28,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, they needed to reconcile or discuss all of their previous, 12 00:00:28,680 --> 00:00:29,800 Speaker 1: you know, experiences together. 13 00:00:29,800 --> 00:00:30,639 Speaker 4: But they're all positive. 14 00:00:30,760 --> 00:00:31,880 Speaker 3: Let's stick with the economy. 15 00:00:32,080 --> 00:00:34,000 Speaker 2: Positive outlet joining us now is the Bank of America 16 00:00:34,080 --> 00:00:36,159 Speaker 2: Chairman and see from moynihan, Brian, good to see. 17 00:00:35,960 --> 00:00:38,479 Speaker 5: You, Good to see Howard and I were on a 18 00:00:38,479 --> 00:00:40,800 Speaker 5: panel yesterday and then yesterday. 19 00:00:40,880 --> 00:00:43,080 Speaker 4: Yeah, they made a day before yesterday, the lunch to. 20 00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:45,640 Speaker 5: Day and actually we're going to do another public venue 21 00:00:45,640 --> 00:00:47,400 Speaker 5: where we're talking about how you raise the money to 22 00:00:47,400 --> 00:00:50,360 Speaker 5: do all this investment he was talking about, so he's 23 00:00:51,080 --> 00:00:54,560 Speaker 5: he's bullish on America and he watched part of the interview. 24 00:00:54,680 --> 00:00:55,760 Speaker 4: Sounds like I said that. 25 00:00:55,640 --> 00:00:58,800 Speaker 3: You guys are tea Yes, so let's stop the GDP forecast. 26 00:00:59,120 --> 00:01:02,640 Speaker 5: So our research see that our research turn is one 27 00:01:02,680 --> 00:01:04,520 Speaker 5: of the best in the world, led by a woman 28 00:01:04,560 --> 00:01:06,720 Speaker 5: named Cannis Browning Platt, and they all come out and 29 00:01:07,120 --> 00:01:10,640 Speaker 5: they raised their GDP for US to two point eight 30 00:01:10,800 --> 00:01:14,039 Speaker 5: percent growth for the twenty six right before we came 31 00:01:14,080 --> 00:01:16,280 Speaker 5: to Davos, the world about three and a half they 32 00:01:16,319 --> 00:01:19,320 Speaker 5: raised a point one. And the important things I think 33 00:01:19,319 --> 00:01:21,280 Speaker 5: to think about the US as you think about the 34 00:01:21,280 --> 00:01:23,759 Speaker 5: travel last time from the last time you're here, last 35 00:01:23,760 --> 00:01:25,680 Speaker 5: time we're here, we probably had two and a half 36 00:01:25,680 --> 00:01:29,520 Speaker 5: percent four twenty six. Then Liberation Day it drops all 37 00:01:29,520 --> 00:01:31,520 Speaker 5: the way to one and a half. And then as 38 00:01:31,560 --> 00:01:34,160 Speaker 5: a settling in of there's the four primary policies of 39 00:01:34,160 --> 00:01:40,640 Speaker 5: the Trump administration, trade and tariff, tax, immigration and deregulation 40 00:01:40,720 --> 00:01:42,959 Speaker 5: starts settling in. We've raised it back to two six 41 00:01:43,360 --> 00:01:46,640 Speaker 5: and out two point eight, and so that's spolish. And 42 00:01:47,400 --> 00:01:49,280 Speaker 5: then underneath it we see what the consumer really does. 43 00:01:49,360 --> 00:01:51,840 Speaker 5: And if we could talk about that, you know, the 44 00:01:51,840 --> 00:01:53,840 Speaker 5: consumer spending was strong in the fourth quarter. When I've 45 00:01:53,840 --> 00:01:55,640 Speaker 5: talked about that, it's four and a half trillion dollars 46 00:01:55,680 --> 00:01:58,360 Speaker 5: our seventy million consumers which were blessed to have put 47 00:01:58,400 --> 00:02:01,560 Speaker 5: into the economy a year for the fourth quarter that 48 00:02:01,600 --> 00:02:04,040 Speaker 5: grew about five percent of the twenty four's fourth quarter 49 00:02:04,280 --> 00:02:06,520 Speaker 5: in so far in January, it's growing a little faster that. 50 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:08,120 Speaker 5: Now you've got to be careful about two weeks don't 51 00:02:08,120 --> 00:02:09,640 Speaker 5: make a quarter. But let's staying up. 52 00:02:09,639 --> 00:02:10,080 Speaker 4: They're strong. 53 00:02:10,160 --> 00:02:12,040 Speaker 2: Well, let's pair that GDP forecast with the bank and 54 00:02:12,080 --> 00:02:14,600 Speaker 2: the business lines. Then what position are you in to 55 00:02:14,600 --> 00:02:16,840 Speaker 2: take advantage of that better growth story in America? 56 00:02:16,880 --> 00:02:18,200 Speaker 3: And what are you expected to show up? 57 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:18,600 Speaker 4: Well? 58 00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:22,240 Speaker 5: Because who you are, and you know, we've been part 59 00:02:22,240 --> 00:02:23,960 Speaker 5: owners of this company a long long time ago, and 60 00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:26,000 Speaker 5: Mike's fuien a good thing around the market's business. That's 61 00:02:26,000 --> 00:02:28,440 Speaker 5: which you're always interested even though there's all this other stuff. 62 00:02:28,160 --> 00:02:29,000 Speaker 4: That makes a lot of money. 63 00:02:29,040 --> 00:02:31,880 Speaker 5: But look, if you look at Jim DeMar's now co 64 00:02:31,960 --> 00:02:35,639 Speaker 5: Prasident the company, but his team and markets this year 65 00:02:35,680 --> 00:02:38,079 Speaker 5: had their last quarter, had their fifteenth consecutive quarter of 66 00:02:38,160 --> 00:02:40,240 Speaker 5: year over year growth, and they just keep walking up 67 00:02:40,280 --> 00:02:42,520 Speaker 5: ten percent up for the fourth quarter. If you look 68 00:02:42,520 --> 00:02:45,760 Speaker 5: at investment banking, which is kind of interesting. So Matthew 69 00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:48,320 Speaker 5: Coder a team, you know, early in December we thought 70 00:02:48,360 --> 00:02:49,520 Speaker 5: we were about a billion and a half, and I 71 00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:51,400 Speaker 5: went out at a conference and told people that in 72 00:02:51,520 --> 00:02:54,560 Speaker 5: lo and Behore we ended a billion six five and 73 00:02:54,600 --> 00:02:58,359 Speaker 5: that made twenty twenty five's the second best year of 74 00:02:58,440 --> 00:03:02,359 Speaker 5: investment banking fees in our company his history in the 75 00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:04,200 Speaker 5: only other one that was pandemic when everybody did a 76 00:03:04,240 --> 00:03:06,040 Speaker 5: lot of financing. And next year we think we're bullish 77 00:03:06,040 --> 00:03:08,320 Speaker 5: because the pipelines are full, and the broadening out of 78 00:03:08,360 --> 00:03:11,200 Speaker 5: the revenue stream into the IPO markets and other things 79 00:03:11,240 --> 00:03:13,480 Speaker 5: which are got to started a little bit this year 80 00:03:13,480 --> 00:03:15,800 Speaker 5: but have been pretty depressed for a while, so that's 81 00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:17,840 Speaker 5: coming in and deals, you know, just the deal flow. 82 00:03:17,880 --> 00:03:21,120 Speaker 5: People can get deals done. When I was here a 83 00:03:21,200 --> 00:03:23,920 Speaker 5: couple of davas ago, you know, the regulatory burdens were 84 00:03:23,960 --> 00:03:26,280 Speaker 5: getting so high that you couldn't honestly tell a client 85 00:03:26,320 --> 00:03:28,040 Speaker 5: who's trying to do a five billion dollar deal to 86 00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:30,480 Speaker 5: do it, because you said, if you can to stabilize 87 00:03:30,480 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 5: your company for six months a year trying to get 88 00:03:32,880 --> 00:03:35,200 Speaker 5: this through and you don't get it through, is that 89 00:03:35,320 --> 00:03:37,560 Speaker 5: worth it? And that's sort off the table, and even 90 00:03:37,640 --> 00:03:39,760 Speaker 5: our industry, even though we can't do anything six months, 91 00:03:39,960 --> 00:03:41,840 Speaker 5: approval of timelines are back to where they should be. 92 00:03:42,120 --> 00:03:44,200 Speaker 1: It seems like there is an incredible amount of polishness 93 00:03:44,200 --> 00:03:47,640 Speaker 1: here at Davos about deals, about IPOs, about all sorts 94 00:03:47,680 --> 00:03:51,800 Speaker 1: of transactions and some of the issuances of debt inequity. 95 00:03:52,280 --> 00:03:54,880 Speaker 1: At the same time, there's a real concern about affordability. 96 00:03:54,920 --> 00:03:57,680 Speaker 1: There's a concern about how well the consumer is going 97 00:03:57,720 --> 00:04:00,440 Speaker 1: to be able to face off with inflation. I'm just 98 00:04:00,520 --> 00:04:02,040 Speaker 1: wondering if this is the year that we see the 99 00:04:02,080 --> 00:04:04,440 Speaker 1: two come together, because last year they didn't come together. 100 00:04:04,520 --> 00:04:07,200 Speaker 1: We saw the same kind of joblessness in terms of 101 00:04:07,240 --> 00:04:09,320 Speaker 1: the growth, and we saw the same kind of lack 102 00:04:09,360 --> 00:04:11,160 Speaker 1: of enthusiasm and sentiment surveys. 103 00:04:11,360 --> 00:04:13,800 Speaker 5: Yeah, so if you look through the if you think 104 00:04:13,840 --> 00:04:16,280 Speaker 5: about last year and think about how bullish people were 105 00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:18,720 Speaker 5: last year because about the United States and the change 106 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:21,640 Speaker 5: of regatory regime and things like that. You know, in 107 00:04:21,680 --> 00:04:23,480 Speaker 5: April things change and then by the end of the 108 00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:25,800 Speaker 5: year it changed back, and so I think that had 109 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:26,800 Speaker 5: a lot to do with it. If you look at 110 00:04:26,800 --> 00:04:29,839 Speaker 5: the consumer and what we see that spending level is 111 00:04:29,880 --> 00:04:34,400 Speaker 5: not consistent with people who feel they're threatened in the future, 112 00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:37,640 Speaker 5: and they're spending on all kinds of things now. If 113 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:40,200 Speaker 5: you look at the research team the Bank of America Institute, 114 00:04:40,200 --> 00:04:42,040 Speaker 5: if you look at the work they've done. If you 115 00:04:42,160 --> 00:04:46,000 Speaker 5: put three groups of customers lower income, third middle and 116 00:04:46,000 --> 00:04:48,120 Speaker 5: come third, upper and come third, they're all growing at 117 00:04:48,120 --> 00:04:50,800 Speaker 5: the middle and upper growing a faster rate. And frankly, 118 00:04:50,839 --> 00:04:52,680 Speaker 5: that drives a lot of the growth. But if you 119 00:04:52,680 --> 00:04:54,680 Speaker 5: look at whateverybody's spending on. They're spending on going out, 120 00:04:54,680 --> 00:04:57,919 Speaker 5: they're spending on booking vacations, are spending on essential So 121 00:04:57,960 --> 00:05:01,600 Speaker 5: what's the affordability? It's the inflation that people remember, and 122 00:05:01,640 --> 00:05:03,360 Speaker 5: that is going to take a while for people to 123 00:05:03,400 --> 00:05:05,280 Speaker 5: kind of put in the rearview mirror, because people can 124 00:05:05,360 --> 00:05:07,080 Speaker 5: remember it's not too hard to remember. 125 00:05:06,760 --> 00:05:10,400 Speaker 4: Five pre COVID where X was cost you, you. 126 00:05:10,400 --> 00:05:13,000 Speaker 5: Know, to mail customers a gata gas cost you that 127 00:05:13,200 --> 00:05:16,279 Speaker 5: your rent was this. And with that explosion and prices 128 00:05:16,600 --> 00:05:19,640 Speaker 5: wages also went up. But the consumer thinks more about 129 00:05:19,680 --> 00:05:21,880 Speaker 5: the price side and then the question of we'll turn 130 00:05:21,920 --> 00:05:24,039 Speaker 5: over and get back and sink. And that's what's in 131 00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:26,240 Speaker 5: those surveys. But if you watch your activity, and I'm 132 00:05:26,240 --> 00:05:28,960 Speaker 5: a big believer, they'll tell you one thing, watch what 133 00:05:29,000 --> 00:05:30,719 Speaker 5: they do, and that's what they're doing as of last 134 00:05:30,760 --> 00:05:33,360 Speaker 5: Friday in the consumer base across seventy million people, which 135 00:05:33,360 --> 00:05:34,360 Speaker 5: is a pretty good sample size. 136 00:05:34,360 --> 00:05:35,080 Speaker 4: They're spending a lot. 137 00:05:35,160 --> 00:05:36,520 Speaker 1: Maybe they would spend even more if there was a 138 00:05:36,600 --> 00:05:38,600 Speaker 1: ten percent cap on credit card rates. I mean, look, 139 00:05:38,640 --> 00:05:41,279 Speaker 1: this proposal got a lot of attention about a week ago, 140 00:05:41,320 --> 00:05:43,520 Speaker 1: it feels like three years ago, and people push back 141 00:05:43,560 --> 00:05:45,720 Speaker 1: and said it wasn't realistic, it wasn't feasible. We had 142 00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:48,840 Speaker 1: Jimmie Diven come out and discuss about how try it 143 00:05:48,839 --> 00:05:49,719 Speaker 1: and see what happens. 144 00:05:49,760 --> 00:05:50,600 Speaker 4: What's your take on that? 145 00:05:50,640 --> 00:05:55,160 Speaker 1: How realistic are you seeing those proposals as being So if. 146 00:05:55,080 --> 00:05:57,640 Speaker 5: You step back, you know we're all for affordability and 147 00:05:57,680 --> 00:06:00,719 Speaker 5: financial products. So you got the fault over the years 148 00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:03,320 Speaker 5: of what we did on overdraft fees taking down by 149 00:06:03,400 --> 00:06:05,479 Speaker 5: ninety percent over a course of fifteen years, what we 150 00:06:05,480 --> 00:06:07,680 Speaker 5: did on having a five hundred dollars loan account of 151 00:06:07,920 --> 00:06:10,080 Speaker 5: five dollars no interst rate, you could borrow emergency loan 152 00:06:10,120 --> 00:06:13,080 Speaker 5: of five hundred dollars. Eight million customers have used that 153 00:06:13,160 --> 00:06:14,800 Speaker 5: over the last several years to give you a cent. 154 00:06:14,920 --> 00:06:18,039 Speaker 5: So and then we have no fraals, credit card, no rewards, 155 00:06:18,040 --> 00:06:20,880 Speaker 5: and other stuff that people might attribute that is lower rate, 156 00:06:20,920 --> 00:06:22,120 Speaker 5: It's not all the way down at that rate. 157 00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:23,520 Speaker 4: So I think the question is, can we. 158 00:06:23,480 --> 00:06:27,520 Speaker 5: Figure out a solution where you can avoid the equal 159 00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:28,279 Speaker 5: opposite reaction? 160 00:06:28,760 --> 00:06:30,719 Speaker 4: As our friend. 161 00:06:30,560 --> 00:06:32,960 Speaker 5: Lafayette said the Hamilton song, you know, every action has 162 00:06:32,960 --> 00:06:35,520 Speaker 5: an econopics reaction, So the equal opposite reaction we all 163 00:06:35,640 --> 00:06:37,880 Speaker 5: talked about last week. If you actually make this a policy, 164 00:06:38,120 --> 00:06:41,040 Speaker 5: it can reallocate credit. That will slow down spending. It 165 00:06:41,080 --> 00:06:43,320 Speaker 5: will slow down credit availability, and that might not be 166 00:06:43,400 --> 00:06:45,120 Speaker 5: what you're trying to achieve. So can you do something 167 00:06:45,480 --> 00:06:47,839 Speaker 5: on a go forward basis on the limited things and 168 00:06:47,920 --> 00:06:50,200 Speaker 5: even one year if you had go reshuffle the whole deck, 169 00:06:50,400 --> 00:06:52,920 Speaker 5: that would be pretty pretty interesting and to cause a 170 00:06:52,960 --> 00:06:55,880 Speaker 5: lot of change in people's views of what they have. 171 00:06:55,880 --> 00:06:56,760 Speaker 4: Available for credit. 172 00:06:56,800 --> 00:06:58,400 Speaker 5: You want people to have available for credit because that 173 00:06:58,400 --> 00:06:59,520 Speaker 5: gives them the courage to spend. 174 00:06:59,839 --> 00:07:02,200 Speaker 4: So we're trying to figure out we're all. 175 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:04,360 Speaker 5: Working trying to figure out, okay, given the affordability, given 176 00:07:04,360 --> 00:07:06,080 Speaker 5: the thought process, is a way that we can do 177 00:07:06,160 --> 00:07:09,400 Speaker 5: something that might help without having an equal and opposite reaction, 178 00:07:09,440 --> 00:07:12,360 Speaker 5: because that would not be good. Our point is to 179 00:07:12,840 --> 00:07:15,240 Speaker 5: get the credit losses down to the point you could 180 00:07:15,240 --> 00:07:17,440 Speaker 5: afford that rate. You actually can never have a charge 181 00:07:17,480 --> 00:07:19,440 Speaker 5: off and you start to think about who can get credit. 182 00:07:19,800 --> 00:07:21,280 Speaker 4: That's thing. So we're working hard. 183 00:07:21,280 --> 00:07:22,880 Speaker 5: We're trying to cope with solutions like we are on 184 00:07:22,880 --> 00:07:24,960 Speaker 5: some of the fore the profoles around mortgage and for 185 00:07:25,080 --> 00:07:27,360 Speaker 5: one K usage and trying to think of how you 186 00:07:27,400 --> 00:07:32,320 Speaker 5: maybe can move the transfer wealth faster by giving people 187 00:07:32,440 --> 00:07:34,640 Speaker 5: in my age bracket the ability to move a forum 188 00:07:34,680 --> 00:07:36,560 Speaker 5: and K balance to pay help their kid buy a 189 00:07:36,560 --> 00:07:37,520 Speaker 5: house or something like that. 190 00:07:38,040 --> 00:07:40,400 Speaker 4: We threw that out to Howard yesterday. 191 00:07:40,520 --> 00:07:42,800 Speaker 5: There's these ideas of letting people use their own form 192 00:07:42,880 --> 00:07:45,880 Speaker 5: and K with less they can borrow from today. But 193 00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:47,680 Speaker 5: there's a way you can actually just take a draw 194 00:07:47,760 --> 00:07:50,200 Speaker 5: so they don't have the added depth burden. And then 195 00:07:50,200 --> 00:07:52,000 Speaker 5: you've got to work on the supply side of housing. 196 00:07:52,160 --> 00:07:54,400 Speaker 5: And you know, the President was interesting, Yes, you sense 197 00:07:54,480 --> 00:07:56,200 Speaker 5: it to the issue. If you bring down house prices 198 00:07:56,200 --> 00:07:58,360 Speaker 5: to make it affordable, is that the right answer for everybody? 199 00:07:58,360 --> 00:08:01,680 Speaker 5: But on the other hand, have the kind of over 200 00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:03,720 Speaker 5: demanded some of the cities who work in thirty thousand 201 00:08:03,800 --> 00:08:07,520 Speaker 5: units in Charlotte twenty thousand, Boston with thirty forty thousand, 202 00:08:07,760 --> 00:08:10,080 Speaker 5: one hundred thousand whatever in New York, you could build 203 00:08:10,120 --> 00:08:11,640 Speaker 5: a lot before. I think you have a major impact 204 00:08:11,720 --> 00:08:12,920 Speaker 5: on the downward trend of prices. 205 00:08:12,960 --> 00:08:16,960 Speaker 6: Well, the DJT imposed deadline of January twenty has come 206 00:08:17,000 --> 00:08:18,720 Speaker 6: and gone for the credit card caps. Have you spoken 207 00:08:18,760 --> 00:08:21,400 Speaker 6: to the administration about this issue and talk to them 208 00:08:21,480 --> 00:08:25,960 Speaker 6: about the potential counterintuitive problem with a ten percent cap? 209 00:08:27,880 --> 00:08:29,640 Speaker 5: The team and I talked to administration all the time 210 00:08:29,640 --> 00:08:32,880 Speaker 5: about these policies and stuff, and they listen and they're 211 00:08:32,880 --> 00:08:34,920 Speaker 5: trying to figure out the same issue from their side, 212 00:08:34,920 --> 00:08:37,880 Speaker 5: how can they make America more affordable? And I think 213 00:08:37,920 --> 00:08:39,880 Speaker 5: the number one thing we can do to make America 214 00:08:39,920 --> 00:08:43,319 Speaker 5: more affordable is keep everybody employed. And Ernie's growth in 215 00:08:43,800 --> 00:08:47,240 Speaker 5: our in our client base across seventy million people, we 216 00:08:47,280 --> 00:08:48,840 Speaker 5: see a lot of paychecks come in and that's growing 217 00:08:48,880 --> 00:08:52,120 Speaker 5: at three percent four percent, and that's a good number. 218 00:08:52,440 --> 00:08:58,079 Speaker 5: And so know that wage growth continuity will ultimately make 219 00:08:58,120 --> 00:09:01,520 Speaker 5: people feel different about it, letely understandable why they feel 220 00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:03,520 Speaker 5: the sort of unem as of how these things came 221 00:09:03,559 --> 00:09:05,520 Speaker 5: into their household, and then what they want to do 222 00:09:05,559 --> 00:09:08,040 Speaker 5: about it. And then rent affordability. We've given them the 223 00:09:08,080 --> 00:09:09,280 Speaker 5: types of ideas I talked about. 224 00:09:09,360 --> 00:09:11,120 Speaker 2: We need to see some bit of hiring as well. 225 00:09:11,200 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 2: Can we talk about hiring the AI story. It's difficult 226 00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:16,599 Speaker 2: to understand what's happened with hiring in this country in 227 00:09:16,640 --> 00:09:19,480 Speaker 2: America over the last twelve months. What do you think 228 00:09:19,480 --> 00:09:21,920 Speaker 2: has happened? What's your understanding of this drop off in hiring. 229 00:09:22,040 --> 00:09:23,760 Speaker 2: Is it a supply side story? What do you think 230 00:09:23,760 --> 00:09:24,080 Speaker 2: it is? 231 00:09:24,679 --> 00:09:28,760 Speaker 5: I think I think there's a concern of availability at 232 00:09:28,800 --> 00:09:32,280 Speaker 5: labor because of the population growth, immigration dynamics that I 233 00:09:32,360 --> 00:09:34,280 Speaker 5: think again, the administration is trying to get. 234 00:09:34,160 --> 00:09:36,880 Speaker 4: Much more fine around exactly what they're. 235 00:09:36,679 --> 00:09:40,520 Speaker 5: Doing and not threatening people who've been in naturalized citizens 236 00:09:40,520 --> 00:09:41,920 Speaker 5: and things like that, and that was never what they're 237 00:09:42,320 --> 00:09:44,640 Speaker 5: intended to do, but people started reading it, so I think, 238 00:09:44,920 --> 00:09:46,720 Speaker 5: And now if you've looked at our small business surveys, 239 00:09:46,840 --> 00:09:50,000 Speaker 5: labor availability became an issue again and hadn't been for 240 00:09:50,000 --> 00:09:52,880 Speaker 5: a good while. And so so I think that that's 241 00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:55,600 Speaker 5: something we've advised administration sho be mindful of because you 242 00:09:55,600 --> 00:09:57,560 Speaker 5: don't want that to become a constraint on people's views 243 00:09:57,559 --> 00:10:01,520 Speaker 5: of growing. Now, the big hiring story here we're Davos 244 00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:03,160 Speaker 5: that make you saying this year is about AI. Last 245 00:10:03,200 --> 00:10:04,840 Speaker 5: year is about AI. The year form was out AA. 246 00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:08,720 Speaker 5: The form is out in twenty nineteen. The premise was 247 00:10:08,840 --> 00:10:11,400 Speaker 5: the Fourth Industrial Revolution, which was AI without just saying it. 248 00:10:11,440 --> 00:10:12,640 Speaker 4: And so it's not a new theme. 249 00:10:13,400 --> 00:10:15,720 Speaker 5: And so I give you since the first time you 250 00:10:15,760 --> 00:10:18,600 Speaker 5: probably asked somebody who decided to pandemic, say post pandemic 251 00:10:18,679 --> 00:10:21,680 Speaker 5: about is AI going to cause you to change your 252 00:10:21,760 --> 00:10:25,360 Speaker 5: hiring Let's call it four years, it's called three years. 253 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:27,239 Speaker 4: We hired sixty five. 254 00:10:27,200 --> 00:10:30,800 Speaker 5: Thousand people Bank of America, two thousand year kids out 255 00:10:30,800 --> 00:10:33,440 Speaker 5: of school plus Saudi in school every year now and 256 00:10:33,480 --> 00:10:35,200 Speaker 5: that's for the turn of rate eight percent we got 257 00:10:35,240 --> 00:10:37,640 Speaker 5: to hire. In the month of January, we'll hire like 258 00:10:37,679 --> 00:10:39,600 Speaker 5: thirteen hundred people and will have the same head count 259 00:10:39,640 --> 00:10:42,040 Speaker 5: we had the month of December. Are these people doing 260 00:10:42,080 --> 00:10:45,240 Speaker 5: exactly what the people left? Sometimes sometimes those jobs got limited. 261 00:10:45,440 --> 00:10:48,040 Speaker 5: But that's what management is challenged, is how do you 262 00:10:48,080 --> 00:10:50,760 Speaker 5: think to make the changes. We've got to make the 263 00:10:50,800 --> 00:10:55,440 Speaker 5: transformations to make the customer experience the best it can be, 264 00:10:55,920 --> 00:10:58,400 Speaker 5: to grow the company and to manage expense. And that 265 00:10:58,440 --> 00:10:59,960 Speaker 5: means you have to really pay attention to the head 266 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:02,360 Speaker 5: account movement. And that's why we watch it carefully. 267 00:11:02,440 --> 00:11:03,480 Speaker 3: That's why the tension is though. 268 00:11:03,559 --> 00:11:04,840 Speaker 2: I think for a lot of people, you've got the 269 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:06,920 Speaker 2: societal problem on the one hand, and on the other hand, 270 00:11:07,000 --> 00:11:09,640 Speaker 2: you've got the opportunity. And the opportunity is to do 271 00:11:09,760 --> 00:11:12,560 Speaker 2: even more with what you've already got. And that's the 272 00:11:12,559 --> 00:11:14,920 Speaker 2: productivity story, and that's what you're selling to invest is 273 00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:16,360 Speaker 2: that's the picture of the moment, isn't it. 274 00:11:16,440 --> 00:11:19,240 Speaker 5: So we had twenty eighty five thousand people in twenty 275 00:11:19,360 --> 00:11:21,520 Speaker 5: ten when I took when the team took over, we 276 00:11:21,520 --> 00:11:24,120 Speaker 5: have two hundred twelve thousand people today. And you never 277 00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:27,959 Speaker 5: heard anything about labor dislocation because we just kept planning ahead. 278 00:11:28,040 --> 00:11:30,400 Speaker 5: But that's the application of technology. Just take the consumer 279 00:11:30,480 --> 00:11:33,120 Speaker 5: business and I showed an investor date one hundred thousand 280 00:11:33,160 --> 00:11:35,240 Speaker 5: people to fifty and make it simple. If you look 281 00:11:35,280 --> 00:11:37,800 Speaker 5: at that, the business is three times as big in 282 00:11:37,880 --> 00:11:41,040 Speaker 5: terms of transactions activity. But that's the power of all 283 00:11:41,080 --> 00:11:43,520 Speaker 5: You've got eight devices sitting on the tables in front of. 284 00:11:43,480 --> 00:11:46,440 Speaker 4: You and the interact activity of what you'll do two. 285 00:11:46,880 --> 00:11:49,640 Speaker 5: It's a combination of AI plus alerts and things like that. 286 00:11:49,679 --> 00:11:51,840 Speaker 5: People that get focused on just you know, erica growth. 287 00:11:51,880 --> 00:11:54,520 Speaker 5: In our case, you say no, there's literally a billion 288 00:11:54,559 --> 00:11:57,400 Speaker 5: alerts that go out, which is basically artificial intelligence people 289 00:11:57,400 --> 00:11:59,040 Speaker 5: set up in advance to tell them things go on. 290 00:11:59,240 --> 00:12:00,880 Speaker 4: You don't need them to go. And Eric could ask 291 00:12:01,200 --> 00:12:03,000 Speaker 4: if this, if a check went through. 292 00:12:02,840 --> 00:12:04,600 Speaker 5: My account above twenty five hundred dollars, if you set 293 00:12:04,600 --> 00:12:05,720 Speaker 5: the alerts, you said. 294 00:12:05,559 --> 00:12:08,080 Speaker 1: Something that we reflect on a lot on our show. 295 00:12:08,160 --> 00:12:10,040 Speaker 1: You said a lot of things, but one thing in particular, 296 00:12:10,160 --> 00:12:13,440 Speaker 1: that the business would grow, but that your staff would 297 00:12:13,440 --> 00:12:15,320 Speaker 1: stay about the same size. And you said that about 298 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:18,000 Speaker 1: a year ago, maybe two years ago. That's a near 299 00:12:18,120 --> 00:12:21,880 Speaker 1: term phenomenon. In five to ten years, will it be 300 00:12:21,920 --> 00:12:24,680 Speaker 1: the same or will it start to change in terms 301 00:12:24,760 --> 00:12:26,400 Speaker 1: of actual shrinkage. 302 00:12:26,520 --> 00:12:30,079 Speaker 4: Well, if Havard's writers, if view of growth, will need 303 00:12:30,120 --> 00:12:32,000 Speaker 4: a lot more human content to keep up with it. 304 00:12:32,400 --> 00:12:35,040 Speaker 4: And I'll give you this. I'll give you the historical context. 305 00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:38,040 Speaker 5: In twenty nineteen, I was in a room downstairs and 306 00:12:38,200 --> 00:12:40,480 Speaker 5: the people were bringing their hands and as. 307 00:12:40,360 --> 00:12:40,920 Speaker 4: The way they do it. 308 00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:43,959 Speaker 5: Davos said, all this technology going to take away the jobs. 309 00:12:44,080 --> 00:12:46,240 Speaker 5: And so in preparation, I said, I've got to give 310 00:12:46,320 --> 00:12:47,840 Speaker 5: some hope here. So I went and did the research. 311 00:12:47,840 --> 00:12:50,840 Speaker 5: In nineteen sixty nine, American employed eighty million people in 312 00:12:50,880 --> 00:12:53,840 Speaker 5: twenty nineteen eployed one hundred and sixty million people. I 313 00:12:53,840 --> 00:12:55,800 Speaker 5: think there was a lot of technology and change. It 314 00:12:55,840 --> 00:13:00,280 Speaker 5: came from nineteen sixty nine to twenty nineteen. Under that 315 00:13:00,320 --> 00:13:02,080 Speaker 5: stuff in front of you was available, you wouldn't have 316 00:13:02,120 --> 00:13:04,200 Speaker 5: a computer at work, you wouldn't have an email accounts. 317 00:13:04,200 --> 00:13:06,560 Speaker 5: You're still getting charged by the minute for phone calls. 318 00:13:06,600 --> 00:13:09,640 Speaker 5: And think about that change, and think about we absorbed 319 00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:12,800 Speaker 5: eighty million more people working. So I don't want to 320 00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:14,559 Speaker 5: be Pollyanna about it, but I think you have to 321 00:13:14,600 --> 00:13:16,760 Speaker 5: be optimistic that if we can grow the economy and 322 00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:19,040 Speaker 5: grow the thing, we will absorb. And by the way, 323 00:13:19,120 --> 00:13:23,960 Speaker 5: the population to grow US is very modest without immigration, 324 00:13:24,080 --> 00:13:26,880 Speaker 5: and there's a natural two plus percent of the people 325 00:13:26,960 --> 00:13:28,920 Speaker 5: or whatever it is die every year. It's morbid, but 326 00:13:28,960 --> 00:13:31,520 Speaker 5: that's what happens, and so and so you have burst 327 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:34,319 Speaker 5: that kind of replace it, and you know, and people retire, 328 00:13:34,360 --> 00:13:37,280 Speaker 5: and so that's why I think management's core challenges and 329 00:13:37,360 --> 00:13:39,880 Speaker 5: manage us through and get employees to take the spirit 330 00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:41,720 Speaker 5: and help drive the growth in the company and be 331 00:13:41,760 --> 00:13:44,079 Speaker 5: a part of the solution and help us make it happen. 332 00:13:44,200 --> 00:13:46,679 Speaker 5: And my guess is, yeah, it might incrementally move headcount, 333 00:13:46,760 --> 00:13:49,080 Speaker 5: but if we manage it to attrition and retirements and stuff, 334 00:13:49,440 --> 00:13:50,680 Speaker 5: we ought to be able to manage the outcome. 335 00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:52,240 Speaker 3: How did we ever live without the bloombog sound? 336 00:13:52,840 --> 00:13:53,160 Speaker 4: What was that? 337 00:13:53,200 --> 00:13:53,760 Speaker 3: Have a like count? 338 00:13:53,760 --> 00:13:54,760 Speaker 4: I don't think I did. 339 00:13:55,200 --> 00:13:57,600 Speaker 2: We'ren just the final question. Yes, you mentioned how it. 340 00:13:58,080 --> 00:13:59,559 Speaker 2: We tolked about it, we jogged about it. That'stile that 341 00:13:59,559 --> 00:14:01,400 Speaker 2: the COMA saying the relationship with the White House, how 342 00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:03,040 Speaker 2: would you characterize it in your own opinion? 343 00:14:03,120 --> 00:14:03,520 Speaker 3: Right now? 344 00:14:03,840 --> 00:14:06,040 Speaker 4: Oh, look, I got you always want to get invitation. 345 00:14:06,120 --> 00:14:08,240 Speaker 5: This is dabas a place invitation, So we invite you 346 00:14:08,320 --> 00:14:12,160 Speaker 5: guys someplace you want that invitation. So the rationships good. 347 00:14:12,160 --> 00:14:14,520 Speaker 5: We do continue to give lots of ideas. And it 348 00:14:14,960 --> 00:14:17,200 Speaker 5: was ironic that what was fun. We had a client 349 00:14:17,200 --> 00:14:19,000 Speaker 5: diner last night and Howard came to taught to clients. 350 00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:22,400 Speaker 5: It was late as they finished up the news on Greenland, 351 00:14:22,400 --> 00:14:23,720 Speaker 5: and he was able to come in. 352 00:14:23,640 --> 00:14:24,880 Speaker 4: And talk about what happened. 353 00:14:24,920 --> 00:14:28,200 Speaker 5: And those were international clients who admittedly were confused for 354 00:14:28,200 --> 00:14:30,880 Speaker 5: forty eight hours, you know, and what I've tried to 355 00:14:30,920 --> 00:14:34,440 Speaker 5: do with the administration's policies and talk, especially people outside 356 00:14:34,520 --> 00:14:36,920 Speaker 5: nine States, to say, listen to what they're saying. You 357 00:14:36,920 --> 00:14:39,960 Speaker 5: can figure out what's going to happen. Don't confuse security 358 00:14:40,200 --> 00:14:42,280 Speaker 5: with a trade policy. They wanted to get action and 359 00:14:42,320 --> 00:14:44,320 Speaker 5: they did and that's a great thing. And you saw 360 00:14:44,760 --> 00:14:47,160 Speaker 5: you leave aside the market reaction, which can go up 361 00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:48,480 Speaker 5: and down on a day, well you saw is the 362 00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:51,480 Speaker 5: clients say okay, I got it. Now let's go set 363 00:14:51,480 --> 00:14:53,800 Speaker 5: the business plans that will help have that growth in 364 00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:54,240 Speaker 5: the future. 365 00:14:54,400 --> 00:14:56,480 Speaker 3: Ron, it's going to see you looking forward to covering 366 00:14:56,480 --> 00:14:57,040 Speaker 3: the World Cup. 367 00:14:56,920 --> 00:14:59,000 Speaker 2: With you as well. Thanks for your months. Thank you, sir, 368 00:14:59,040 --> 00:15:00,680 Speaker 2: Thank you very much. Bro one and a half the 369 00:15:00,680 --> 00:15:02,880 Speaker 2: Bank of America Chairman and c e O.