1 00:00:08,640 --> 00:00:12,719 Speaker 1: Welcome, Welcome, Welcome back to the Bob Left Set podcast. 2 00:00:13,320 --> 00:00:19,480 Speaker 1: My guest today's guitarist, mandolinist, singer, songwriter Dan Timinski. 3 00:00:20,160 --> 00:00:21,960 Speaker 2: Dan, good to have you on the podcast. 4 00:00:23,120 --> 00:00:24,160 Speaker 3: Very happy to be here. 5 00:00:24,320 --> 00:00:27,480 Speaker 2: Okay, you were born in Rutland, Vermont. 6 00:00:28,920 --> 00:00:31,240 Speaker 3: Yes, indeed in nineteen sixty seven. 7 00:00:31,440 --> 00:00:33,000 Speaker 2: And did you grow up in Vermont? 8 00:00:34,240 --> 00:00:38,400 Speaker 3: I grew up in Vermont. Yeah, the sprawling metropolis of 9 00:00:38,440 --> 00:00:43,720 Speaker 3: West Rutland, Vermont, I say jokingly. Yeah, it was a 10 00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:46,480 Speaker 3: home for me up until you know, the mid late 11 00:00:46,520 --> 00:00:48,560 Speaker 3: eighties before I moved south. 12 00:00:49,400 --> 00:00:52,600 Speaker 2: Well, I mean, I spent a lot of time in Vermont. 13 00:00:52,640 --> 00:00:54,880 Speaker 2: We had a house in Manchester, and I went to 14 00:00:54,920 --> 00:00:57,320 Speaker 2: college in Middlebury, which are like a half hour in 15 00:00:57,360 --> 00:01:00,520 Speaker 2: either direction, or forty five minutes from Rutland. What was 16 00:01:00,560 --> 00:01:02,840 Speaker 2: the music scene like for you growing up? 17 00:01:03,960 --> 00:01:05,880 Speaker 3: That's funny, you'd say, man, I used to deliver Coca 18 00:01:05,920 --> 00:01:10,440 Speaker 3: Cola to Manchester. The music scene for me was something 19 00:01:10,480 --> 00:01:12,000 Speaker 3: you had to search for a little bit. I was. 20 00:01:12,120 --> 00:01:14,240 Speaker 3: I was lucky enough to have parents who liked the 21 00:01:14,319 --> 00:01:18,480 Speaker 3: music enough to go somewhere every weekend for you know, 22 00:01:18,520 --> 00:01:21,160 Speaker 3: to hear some live music, and they dragged me along. 23 00:01:21,240 --> 00:01:22,720 Speaker 3: You know, a lot of it. You know, it might 24 00:01:22,760 --> 00:01:24,240 Speaker 3: have been a country bar, it might have been a 25 00:01:24,240 --> 00:01:29,080 Speaker 3: square dance, fiddle contest, bluegrass festival, in an array of 26 00:01:29,080 --> 00:01:31,959 Speaker 3: whatever live music there was. I got. Uh, I got 27 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:34,160 Speaker 3: all the access we could. But we had to drive, 28 00:01:34,240 --> 00:01:35,679 Speaker 3: you know, we had to We had to seek it out. 29 00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:41,280 Speaker 2: Okay. Were your parents musicians or do they play a 30 00:01:41,360 --> 00:01:42,479 Speaker 2: lot of music in the house. 31 00:01:44,560 --> 00:01:48,760 Speaker 3: My parents were not musicians. My mother did, uh did 32 00:01:48,800 --> 00:01:51,960 Speaker 3: sing a little bit. And way back in the day, 33 00:01:52,040 --> 00:01:55,440 Speaker 3: my first memories of seeing anyone player sing was was 34 00:01:55,480 --> 00:01:59,560 Speaker 3: my mom singing. And uh so she was you know, 35 00:01:59,640 --> 00:02:03,280 Speaker 3: definitely lies in my influences. And uh, but there were 36 00:02:03,280 --> 00:02:05,760 Speaker 3: more music fans. I mean, we didn't go for for 37 00:02:05,840 --> 00:02:07,880 Speaker 3: her to perform anywhere, you know, we went out to 38 00:02:07,920 --> 00:02:11,760 Speaker 3: hear whatever music was playing. And uh, I got a 39 00:02:11,760 --> 00:02:15,040 Speaker 3: lot of access early in my life to live music. 40 00:02:15,800 --> 00:02:18,160 Speaker 2: Okay, but how about playing records at home or listening 41 00:02:18,240 --> 00:02:18,799 Speaker 2: to the radio. 42 00:02:22,440 --> 00:02:26,040 Speaker 3: There was some playing of music at at my house, 43 00:02:26,080 --> 00:02:28,000 Speaker 3: but it was not I wouldn't say it was a 44 00:02:28,080 --> 00:02:29,920 Speaker 3: music filled house. It was not. It was a it 45 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:33,600 Speaker 3: was a television field house. It was it was there 46 00:02:33,680 --> 00:02:37,400 Speaker 3: was I remember like on Sundays my dad would would 47 00:02:38,840 --> 00:02:41,640 Speaker 3: religiously play the Polish Poka Hour. There was a radio 48 00:02:41,680 --> 00:02:44,680 Speaker 3: program where I listened to Polish Poka music for an 49 00:02:44,720 --> 00:02:48,919 Speaker 3: hour on Sundays. It was actually funny. It was called 50 00:02:48,919 --> 00:02:51,320 Speaker 3: the Polish Poka Hour and it was two hours of music, 51 00:02:51,800 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 3: very very strange, but so there was that there. I 52 00:02:55,960 --> 00:02:58,679 Speaker 3: never had a music collection. I was never a listener 53 00:02:59,520 --> 00:03:02,639 Speaker 3: of music. Account of recorded music, I don't. I can 54 00:03:02,680 --> 00:03:05,799 Speaker 3: still count all the recordings I have ever purchased on 55 00:03:05,840 --> 00:03:11,399 Speaker 3: my on my fingers. I've never I've never really never 56 00:03:11,480 --> 00:03:14,120 Speaker 3: had any recorded music and and didn't grow up with it. 57 00:03:14,160 --> 00:03:16,440 Speaker 3: My brother back in the day had some. And I 58 00:03:16,480 --> 00:03:19,040 Speaker 3: can name a few albums. The few albums that I 59 00:03:19,080 --> 00:03:23,000 Speaker 3: have listened to, I've listened to religiously, and I've studied them, 60 00:03:23,040 --> 00:03:24,919 Speaker 3: and I can I can tell you all the parts 61 00:03:24,960 --> 00:03:27,360 Speaker 3: of all the players on all those records. But that's 62 00:03:27,440 --> 00:03:29,960 Speaker 3: just a very small handful of recordings. 63 00:03:30,680 --> 00:03:33,160 Speaker 2: Okay, So what records did your brother have that you remember? 64 00:03:35,400 --> 00:03:37,560 Speaker 3: Well? The Double O forty four record was the reason 65 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:39,640 Speaker 3: I'm playing music right now. The JD Crow in the 66 00:03:39,680 --> 00:03:44,200 Speaker 3: New South Uh with Jerry Douglas and Ricky Skaggs and 67 00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:47,160 Speaker 3: Tony Rice and Bobby Sloan. That was the record that 68 00:03:47,320 --> 00:03:50,960 Speaker 3: was my by far, far and above every other thing, 69 00:03:51,200 --> 00:03:53,440 Speaker 3: my biggest influence. That was the record I listened to 70 00:03:54,560 --> 00:03:57,920 Speaker 3: over and over and over again. That was back when 71 00:03:57,960 --> 00:04:00,680 Speaker 3: I wanted to, when I thought I was a AO player. 72 00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:04,800 Speaker 2: Okay, I mean I lived in Vermont in the era 73 00:04:04,840 --> 00:04:10,720 Speaker 2: when you're growing up and basically was AM radio and 74 00:04:10,760 --> 00:04:14,560 Speaker 2: there might be a small FM station, but you heard 75 00:04:14,600 --> 00:04:18,080 Speaker 2: a lot of pop hits and occasionally you would hear 76 00:04:18,080 --> 00:04:21,240 Speaker 2: a country song. I remember flipping the dial on my 77 00:04:21,360 --> 00:04:24,680 Speaker 2: sixty three Chevy convertible and hearing Joe Lean for the 78 00:04:24,760 --> 00:04:29,599 Speaker 2: very first time. So in terms of your environment, A, 79 00:04:29,720 --> 00:04:32,640 Speaker 2: were you listening to the radio or B were you 80 00:04:32,640 --> 00:04:35,240 Speaker 2: were growing up? Was it really more of this country stuff? Er? 81 00:04:35,360 --> 00:04:36,719 Speaker 2: Was everybody listening to pop? 82 00:04:39,279 --> 00:04:41,520 Speaker 3: All my friends growing up listen to rock and roll? 83 00:04:42,040 --> 00:04:47,279 Speaker 3: It was they were. They were all rockers, Boston Journey 84 00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:51,880 Speaker 3: and ac DC and def Leppard and stuff like that. 85 00:04:53,520 --> 00:04:56,200 Speaker 3: The radio stuff. My parents when they did listen to music, 86 00:04:56,200 --> 00:04:58,240 Speaker 3: they listened to a lot of old time country music. 87 00:04:58,320 --> 00:05:00,640 Speaker 3: So I got a lot of you know, everything from 88 00:05:00,720 --> 00:05:04,440 Speaker 3: Kitty Wells to Hank Williams too, you know a lot 89 00:05:04,440 --> 00:05:07,039 Speaker 3: of a lot of the old time country music was 90 00:05:07,040 --> 00:05:11,279 Speaker 3: was part of their thing. They loved to, uh, to 91 00:05:11,320 --> 00:05:13,360 Speaker 3: listen to the Opry. You know, they talked to you 92 00:05:13,360 --> 00:05:16,400 Speaker 3: know dearly about the Grand Old Opry was their their 93 00:05:16,440 --> 00:05:19,760 Speaker 3: their high mark of of all of music. But they 94 00:05:19,839 --> 00:05:22,960 Speaker 3: liked old time country music. And I got a little 95 00:05:22,960 --> 00:05:25,080 Speaker 3: bit of that, but I got just a lot more 96 00:05:25,760 --> 00:05:28,760 Speaker 3: live old time country music. We would go listening to 97 00:05:28,880 --> 00:05:32,000 Speaker 3: whatever bar bands that were around. And you know, my 98 00:05:32,000 --> 00:05:35,840 Speaker 3: my very first influences were was a man named Smoky 99 00:05:35,920 --> 00:05:39,200 Speaker 3: Green in upstate, New York, and he was my first 100 00:05:39,240 --> 00:05:42,320 Speaker 3: time performing with anyone on a stage was with Smokey. 101 00:05:42,400 --> 00:05:44,640 Speaker 3: I think I was six years old at a little 102 00:05:44,680 --> 00:05:45,080 Speaker 3: club and. 103 00:05:45,240 --> 00:05:48,000 Speaker 2: Uh wait, wait wait, wait wait wait wait, you were 104 00:05:48,040 --> 00:05:50,760 Speaker 2: six years old and you were performing. What were you doing. 105 00:05:53,440 --> 00:05:56,840 Speaker 3: That the very first time? Uh? I just I remember 106 00:05:56,880 --> 00:05:58,919 Speaker 3: I was with my parents who were listening to a band, 107 00:05:58,960 --> 00:06:01,520 Speaker 3: and I asked my mother if she would ask the 108 00:06:01,520 --> 00:06:03,800 Speaker 3: band if I could sing a song with the band, 109 00:06:04,480 --> 00:06:08,280 Speaker 3: and I think, to shut me up, she said, if 110 00:06:08,320 --> 00:06:09,719 Speaker 3: you want to sing a song with him, you go 111 00:06:09,800 --> 00:06:15,680 Speaker 3: up and ask him somewhere. And I was pretty shy kid. 112 00:06:15,720 --> 00:06:18,480 Speaker 3: I really didn't speak much. I didn't I wasn't very outgoing, 113 00:06:19,360 --> 00:06:21,400 Speaker 3: but somewhere I found the courage to walk down that 114 00:06:21,520 --> 00:06:24,839 Speaker 3: aisleway and I went up to Smoky Green and I 115 00:06:24,839 --> 00:06:26,800 Speaker 3: tugged down his pant leg and he turned around and 116 00:06:27,120 --> 00:06:28,680 Speaker 3: looked for me and then had to turn his head 117 00:06:28,720 --> 00:06:32,160 Speaker 3: down to realize it was a little kid. And I said, 118 00:06:32,160 --> 00:06:33,640 Speaker 3: can I sing a song with you? And he said 119 00:06:33,640 --> 00:06:40,080 Speaker 3: why sure? And I sang. I sang, please Daddy, don't 120 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:45,400 Speaker 3: get drunk this Christmas John Denver song. And I remember 121 00:06:45,480 --> 00:06:48,440 Speaker 3: standing up there with my knees knocking together, literally scared 122 00:06:48,440 --> 00:06:51,040 Speaker 3: to death. But I sang the song, and when I 123 00:06:51,080 --> 00:06:53,200 Speaker 3: was done, everyone applauded, you know, and made a big 124 00:06:53,200 --> 00:06:57,440 Speaker 3: deal of it. And that feeling, that excitement, that nervous 125 00:06:57,560 --> 00:07:02,000 Speaker 3: energy has stayed with me, you know, for the you know, 126 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:03,480 Speaker 3: the next fifty years. 127 00:07:03,920 --> 00:07:06,560 Speaker 2: Okay, let's set the stage a little bit more. Would 128 00:07:06,600 --> 00:07:07,839 Speaker 2: your parents do for a living? 129 00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:14,120 Speaker 3: My dad was a mechanic. He was a a transmission 130 00:07:14,120 --> 00:07:17,880 Speaker 3: and rear end specialist, and in his uh later years 131 00:07:17,880 --> 00:07:20,800 Speaker 3: of his his work, he was a fleet mechanic for 132 00:07:20,920 --> 00:07:23,720 Speaker 3: Coca Cola. He was the guy in charge of keeping 133 00:07:23,760 --> 00:07:26,559 Speaker 3: all of the the vehicles running for the Coca Cola 134 00:07:26,560 --> 00:07:32,320 Speaker 3: company there in Rutland. And my mother she she didn't 135 00:07:32,360 --> 00:07:36,200 Speaker 3: really work my whole life growing up, but I remember 136 00:07:36,200 --> 00:07:38,120 Speaker 3: her having a job as a cashier. She was a 137 00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:42,600 Speaker 3: head cashier at a department store. You know, middle class. 138 00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:50,080 Speaker 3: Uh nothing nothing real real exciting and lines of work. 139 00:07:50,120 --> 00:07:52,400 Speaker 3: At least as I saw it, music was I was. 140 00:07:52,480 --> 00:07:55,840 Speaker 3: I was kind of the first one to well my brother, 141 00:07:55,920 --> 00:07:57,520 Speaker 3: I'll i'll say it was much older than me. So 142 00:07:57,560 --> 00:07:59,000 Speaker 3: my brother and I we were the first ones to 143 00:07:59,160 --> 00:08:02,800 Speaker 3: uh had any other direction than mechanics. 144 00:08:03,360 --> 00:08:06,680 Speaker 2: Okay, so just you and your brother only two kids? 145 00:08:07,640 --> 00:08:10,440 Speaker 3: No, we have a sister. My brother was the only 146 00:08:10,480 --> 00:08:14,040 Speaker 3: other child that that was was musical, although if you 147 00:08:14,040 --> 00:08:16,000 Speaker 3: were to have to, you know, she won't admit it 148 00:08:16,040 --> 00:08:18,440 Speaker 3: to anyone. My sister actually has a beautiful singing voice, 149 00:08:18,760 --> 00:08:21,720 Speaker 3: she just will not let anyone hear it. My brother 150 00:08:21,760 --> 00:08:23,840 Speaker 3: and I played some music together out with for for 151 00:08:23,880 --> 00:08:24,400 Speaker 3: other people. 152 00:08:24,600 --> 00:08:28,000 Speaker 2: Okay, so where are you in the hierarchy? Are you're 153 00:08:28,040 --> 00:08:29,640 Speaker 2: the middle kid, the youngest kid. 154 00:08:30,760 --> 00:08:33,400 Speaker 3: I'm the baby by a lot. My my brother and 155 00:08:33,440 --> 00:08:36,800 Speaker 3: sister are nine and eleven years older than I am. 156 00:08:38,160 --> 00:08:41,000 Speaker 3: And I came along. I was, I was the I 157 00:08:41,040 --> 00:08:45,000 Speaker 3: was the surprise. You know a dozen years later, and. 158 00:08:45,480 --> 00:08:49,400 Speaker 2: How did your brother and sisters lives play out. 159 00:08:52,000 --> 00:08:55,880 Speaker 3: My sister still lives in in Vermont, in in the 160 00:08:55,880 --> 00:08:59,560 Speaker 3: house that that I grew up in actually, and uh 161 00:08:59,679 --> 00:09:05,640 Speaker 3: and my brother we played music together and we're close 162 00:09:05,720 --> 00:09:08,520 Speaker 3: for for a lot of the years growing up, but 163 00:09:09,120 --> 00:09:12,760 Speaker 3: grew apart. I haven't haven't had a close relationship with 164 00:09:12,800 --> 00:09:16,360 Speaker 3: my brother in years. So I know he's still up 165 00:09:16,400 --> 00:09:20,880 Speaker 3: in the New Hampshire area, and my sister is in Vermont, 166 00:09:21,000 --> 00:09:24,520 Speaker 3: and I made my way to eventually Tennessee. 167 00:09:25,880 --> 00:09:28,320 Speaker 2: When you say you don't have a close relationship, do 168 00:09:28,360 --> 00:09:30,480 Speaker 2: you have any contact at all or not for a 169 00:09:30,480 --> 00:09:31,040 Speaker 2: long time. 170 00:09:32,600 --> 00:09:36,400 Speaker 3: No, it's a it's a difficult situation as sometimes siblings 171 00:09:36,400 --> 00:09:40,320 Speaker 3: do or brothers do. They they fall apart, and I 172 00:09:40,320 --> 00:09:46,040 Speaker 3: won't go into deep circumstance, but yeah, none of my 173 00:09:47,280 --> 00:09:49,560 Speaker 3: none of my family have a relationship with with my 174 00:09:49,559 --> 00:09:53,960 Speaker 3: brother anymore. He kind of decided that he was gonna 175 00:09:54,679 --> 00:09:57,520 Speaker 3: sever all paths to to basically everyone. So I don't 176 00:09:57,559 --> 00:10:00,200 Speaker 3: know anyone in my family who has a relationship ship 177 00:10:00,280 --> 00:10:02,959 Speaker 3: with my brother anymore. He kind of just went am 178 00:10:03,000 --> 00:10:08,400 Speaker 3: I A for me many years ago? The well everyone 179 00:10:08,400 --> 00:10:08,840 Speaker 3: else as. 180 00:10:08,760 --> 00:10:10,920 Speaker 2: Well, Okay, so you're growing up in Rutland, you have 181 00:10:11,000 --> 00:10:14,079 Speaker 2: this experience over the state line singing. At age six, 182 00:10:14,600 --> 00:10:17,600 Speaker 2: you go to school. Are you in the school plays? 183 00:10:17,760 --> 00:10:20,560 Speaker 2: Do you start to perform? 184 00:10:20,600 --> 00:10:23,480 Speaker 3: Not even a little bit. No, it was there was 185 00:10:23,520 --> 00:10:26,480 Speaker 3: a clear line draw man. That was my escape life 186 00:10:26,520 --> 00:10:30,199 Speaker 3: that I got on the weekends in school. Had nothing 187 00:10:30,240 --> 00:10:34,720 Speaker 3: to do with any of the arts. No. No. In 188 00:10:34,800 --> 00:10:37,520 Speaker 3: high school, I eventually, you know, for vocational I took 189 00:10:37,559 --> 00:10:39,000 Speaker 3: welding and metal fabrication. 190 00:10:41,000 --> 00:10:43,480 Speaker 2: Okay, so what kind of kid were you? 191 00:10:43,520 --> 00:10:43,800 Speaker 3: Were you? 192 00:10:44,559 --> 00:10:48,640 Speaker 2: Good at school, good at sports, bad loaner, spark of 193 00:10:48,679 --> 00:10:49,160 Speaker 2: the party. 194 00:10:52,480 --> 00:10:56,560 Speaker 3: As a kid, Let's see, it's hard to describe yourself 195 00:10:56,600 --> 00:10:57,880 Speaker 3: as a kid. I mean I've heard a lot of 196 00:10:57,920 --> 00:11:01,240 Speaker 3: other people describe me as kids, and some people's opinions vary. 197 00:11:02,000 --> 00:11:09,560 Speaker 3: As a kid, I was, I was I was very quiet. 198 00:11:09,640 --> 00:11:13,840 Speaker 3: I was very to myself. I was very I wasn't 199 00:11:13,920 --> 00:11:17,400 Speaker 3: quick to engage, you know, I mean to you know, 200 00:11:17,480 --> 00:11:19,520 Speaker 3: to to really open it up. I mean, I had 201 00:11:19,559 --> 00:11:22,880 Speaker 3: parents that, though they traveled and you know, did a 202 00:11:22,880 --> 00:11:28,199 Speaker 3: lot of things together, my parents fought a lot every week. 203 00:11:28,480 --> 00:11:32,240 Speaker 3: Really of my life, I've seen a lot of violence, 204 00:11:33,160 --> 00:11:36,160 Speaker 3: and I and and I just I didn't engage with 205 00:11:36,240 --> 00:11:38,880 Speaker 3: anyone I really tried to. That's like at school, I 206 00:11:39,040 --> 00:11:41,640 Speaker 3: was like in my own little bubble I was. I 207 00:11:41,679 --> 00:11:44,960 Speaker 3: didn't really I only had a couple of friends. And 208 00:11:45,040 --> 00:11:47,280 Speaker 3: as it, you know, turned into high school. You know, 209 00:11:47,320 --> 00:11:49,480 Speaker 3: I would say more on the outcast part of school. 210 00:11:49,520 --> 00:11:52,640 Speaker 3: I mean I was intelligent. I was able to make 211 00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:55,760 Speaker 3: any grade I wanted in any of the classes. But 212 00:11:56,000 --> 00:11:59,400 Speaker 3: I gave about enough effort to make my see and 213 00:11:59,480 --> 00:12:02,120 Speaker 3: pass and got out of school as quickly as I could. 214 00:12:02,559 --> 00:12:04,160 Speaker 3: Didn't didn't care for school. 215 00:12:04,520 --> 00:12:07,200 Speaker 2: It was a different era. My parents fought a lot, 216 00:12:07,520 --> 00:12:10,360 Speaker 2: and they hit us a lot, but they stayed together. 217 00:12:10,720 --> 00:12:13,800 Speaker 3: So what was your situation, Well, my parents stayed together. 218 00:12:13,880 --> 00:12:16,320 Speaker 3: My parents didn't hit me, They didn't hit the kids. 219 00:12:16,320 --> 00:12:19,400 Speaker 3: They hit each other. That My parents were brawlers. You know. 220 00:12:19,480 --> 00:12:21,720 Speaker 3: My mom was a fighter. She could she could whip 221 00:12:21,800 --> 00:12:24,160 Speaker 3: a man's butt. I mean you you wouldn't want to 222 00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:27,280 Speaker 3: tangle with with either one of them. Really. They both 223 00:12:27,320 --> 00:12:29,680 Speaker 3: came from really big families. Dad had ten brothers and 224 00:12:29,720 --> 00:12:34,360 Speaker 3: sisters and my mom had sixteen brothers and sisters, and 225 00:12:34,440 --> 00:12:36,719 Speaker 3: they all grew up having to fight. They all grew 226 00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:38,880 Speaker 3: up having to fight for everything. With each other. And 227 00:12:38,960 --> 00:12:42,559 Speaker 3: you know the families were were close, yet not close. 228 00:12:42,600 --> 00:12:45,280 Speaker 3: They fought amongst each other. I mean, two boys and 229 00:12:45,480 --> 00:12:48,320 Speaker 3: a girl from one family married two girls and a 230 00:12:48,320 --> 00:12:50,760 Speaker 3: boy from the other family. Wow. So we had a 231 00:12:50,760 --> 00:12:55,400 Speaker 3: lot of family turmoil. And you know there was there was, 232 00:12:55,640 --> 00:12:57,280 Speaker 3: There was a lot going on growing up. You know, 233 00:12:57,400 --> 00:13:01,760 Speaker 3: some some stayed close, drifted apart. It was just you know, 234 00:13:02,120 --> 00:13:05,840 Speaker 3: I I I couldn't deal with the with with the 235 00:13:05,840 --> 00:13:10,800 Speaker 3: fighting and the the what I felt was was it 236 00:13:10,840 --> 00:13:12,760 Speaker 3: was a lot of it was very negative. I was 237 00:13:13,000 --> 00:13:15,920 Speaker 3: I really was looking for for a way out from 238 00:13:16,280 --> 00:13:18,200 Speaker 3: day one. You know, from when I was a little kid. 239 00:13:18,240 --> 00:13:20,880 Speaker 3: I knew I couldn't wait to get away and play music. 240 00:13:20,960 --> 00:13:23,600 Speaker 3: I knew I was a musician when I was very small. 241 00:13:24,120 --> 00:13:28,960 Speaker 2: Oh okay. Was everybody in that same area of West Rutland. 242 00:13:29,640 --> 00:13:32,080 Speaker 3: Very close Yeah, West Rutland and Rutland, A lot of 243 00:13:32,080 --> 00:13:36,120 Speaker 3: them were, I mean in the surrounding towns. Yeah. 244 00:13:36,160 --> 00:13:38,160 Speaker 2: And so was it like on the weekends they would 245 00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:38,960 Speaker 2: all get together. 246 00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:42,080 Speaker 3: No, that wasn't. You know, we had we would go 247 00:13:42,120 --> 00:13:44,800 Speaker 3: and visit some family. It wasn't. It wasn't like that 248 00:13:44,960 --> 00:13:47,120 Speaker 3: type of family. There were just two big families that 249 00:13:47,200 --> 00:13:50,000 Speaker 3: happened to have some you know, some marriages that went, 250 00:13:50,080 --> 00:13:52,280 Speaker 3: you know to two boys and a girl married two 251 00:13:52,280 --> 00:13:54,760 Speaker 3: girls and a boy. So we had some connections there 252 00:13:54,880 --> 00:13:56,560 Speaker 3: for a while. There were a row of us on 253 00:13:56,600 --> 00:13:59,280 Speaker 3: Clarendon Avenue where I lived. There were a bunch of 254 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:01,440 Speaker 3: a line of Timen, you know, in five or six 255 00:14:01,520 --> 00:14:06,160 Speaker 3: houses in a row were Timinsky's and the Timinski's and 256 00:14:06,200 --> 00:14:09,719 Speaker 3: the Woodies. It was go back in the day. Man. 257 00:14:09,760 --> 00:14:12,360 Speaker 3: There were just there were There were a lot of them. 258 00:14:12,760 --> 00:14:17,920 Speaker 2: Okay, So how many generations was your family in America? 259 00:14:18,840 --> 00:14:24,160 Speaker 3: My grandfather, my dad's father, came over from Poland, and 260 00:14:24,280 --> 00:14:27,720 Speaker 3: my mom's parents were here for generations. 261 00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:31,840 Speaker 2: Okay, So at what point do you start to play 262 00:14:31,840 --> 00:14:32,480 Speaker 2: an instrument. 263 00:14:34,480 --> 00:14:39,520 Speaker 3: I started playing when I was five or six. I 264 00:14:39,560 --> 00:14:43,120 Speaker 3: started playing a mandolin and I played and because I 265 00:14:43,240 --> 00:14:45,440 Speaker 3: was you know, I I I was good at it, 266 00:14:45,520 --> 00:14:48,040 Speaker 3: and you know, everyone told me I was good at it, 267 00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:51,040 Speaker 3: and you know, I just I kind of played around 268 00:14:51,040 --> 00:14:54,520 Speaker 3: with it until I was probably twelve. It wasn't you know, 269 00:14:54,560 --> 00:14:57,400 Speaker 3: I really say my music started. I got bit by 270 00:14:57,400 --> 00:15:00,840 Speaker 3: the bug when I was twelve. I that JD. Crow 271 00:15:00,880 --> 00:15:06,480 Speaker 3: record and it was like a beacon from the sky 272 00:15:06,840 --> 00:15:09,440 Speaker 3: just came down and sucked me up. I couldn't think 273 00:15:09,480 --> 00:15:12,680 Speaker 3: about anything else but that, the sound of that banjo. 274 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:15,000 Speaker 3: And it turns out, I discovered years later it was 275 00:15:15,040 --> 00:15:19,119 Speaker 3: really the relationship the banjo had with the other instruments, 276 00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:21,960 Speaker 3: particularly the guitar, that I really fell in love with. 277 00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:24,080 Speaker 3: But in my mind, all I could think about was 278 00:15:24,080 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 3: that banjo. 279 00:15:32,240 --> 00:15:35,720 Speaker 2: So you pick up the mandolin. Was there a mandolin 280 00:15:35,800 --> 00:15:37,840 Speaker 2: in the house or did you ask your appearance to 281 00:15:37,840 --> 00:15:38,440 Speaker 2: buy you one. 282 00:15:40,280 --> 00:15:45,320 Speaker 3: My brother was in the military. He was stationed in Virginia, 283 00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:51,320 Speaker 3: and he came home on leave one weekend with a mandolin, 284 00:15:52,200 --> 00:15:54,640 Speaker 3: and he just happened to leave the mandolin at the 285 00:15:54,760 --> 00:15:56,680 Speaker 3: at the house with me. He saw that I liked it, 286 00:15:56,720 --> 00:15:59,400 Speaker 3: and he left the mandolin and I and I just 287 00:15:59,560 --> 00:16:04,120 Speaker 3: tinkered around on the on on that little little harmony mandolin, 288 00:16:04,200 --> 00:16:10,560 Speaker 3: little round teardrop style mandolin. That. Uh, that was my 289 00:16:10,600 --> 00:16:11,680 Speaker 3: first my first answer. 290 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:13,320 Speaker 2: Okay, so you didn't have any lessons. 291 00:16:14,280 --> 00:16:16,800 Speaker 3: Oh heck no, there were no. There were no lessons. 292 00:16:16,800 --> 00:16:22,080 Speaker 3: There was no There was not even there was. There 293 00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:24,880 Speaker 3: was me in a bedroom and and you know, trying 294 00:16:24,880 --> 00:16:27,360 Speaker 3: to make more noise than was being made outside of 295 00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:28,160 Speaker 3: the bedroom, you know. 296 00:16:28,880 --> 00:16:32,400 Speaker 2: So how did you know how to tune it? 297 00:16:32,400 --> 00:16:34,840 Speaker 3: It was in two I mean when I got it, 298 00:16:34,840 --> 00:16:39,160 Speaker 3: it was in tune. I mean basically in tune. And 299 00:16:39,240 --> 00:16:41,560 Speaker 3: I I always had an ear for tuning. I didn't, 300 00:16:41,600 --> 00:16:43,880 Speaker 3: you know, we there were no tuners. We just you know, 301 00:16:43,960 --> 00:16:45,720 Speaker 3: I could tell if it was a little too high 302 00:16:45,760 --> 00:16:48,080 Speaker 3: or a little too low. And I could tune it 303 00:16:48,160 --> 00:16:50,400 Speaker 3: right from the very right from the very start, I think. 304 00:16:50,480 --> 00:16:54,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, So from age six when you pick up the 305 00:16:54,200 --> 00:16:57,920 Speaker 2: mandolin to age twelve, when you get inspiration hearing the 306 00:16:58,000 --> 00:17:03,120 Speaker 2: krone and stuff, are you playing country songs on the mandolin? 307 00:17:03,200 --> 00:17:04,439 Speaker 2: What are you actually doing? 308 00:17:06,359 --> 00:17:10,520 Speaker 3: I'm playing songs on the mandolin and traveling to bluegrass 309 00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:13,880 Speaker 3: festivals and playing in jam sessions and playing a little 310 00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:16,720 Speaker 3: bit with my brother. My brother played the guitar and 311 00:17:16,760 --> 00:17:19,960 Speaker 3: sang and I would sing. Really the only reason I 312 00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:23,199 Speaker 3: sing at all is was to sing with, you know, 313 00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:25,520 Speaker 3: with my brother. I didn't really ever care to sing. 314 00:17:26,320 --> 00:17:30,680 Speaker 3: I always like to play. And there was just there 315 00:17:30,720 --> 00:17:33,360 Speaker 3: were spar shows and my parents would take me places. 316 00:17:33,359 --> 00:17:36,080 Speaker 3: I did radio shows when they were spots, you know, 317 00:17:36,119 --> 00:17:38,320 Speaker 3: Smoky Green had a radio show. My parents would take 318 00:17:38,359 --> 00:17:41,080 Speaker 3: me there, I would play and just sing anything I could. 319 00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:44,280 Speaker 3: I mean, it wasn't particularly bluegrass until I was a teenager. 320 00:17:45,640 --> 00:17:49,960 Speaker 2: Okay, So from six to twelve you were doing all this, 321 00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:51,080 Speaker 2: or after twelve. 322 00:17:52,600 --> 00:17:55,640 Speaker 3: From six to twelve, I was still going to shows 323 00:17:55,720 --> 00:17:59,280 Speaker 3: and concerts and festivals and anything that my parents could 324 00:17:59,280 --> 00:18:03,919 Speaker 3: get to. I went some somewhere most weekends. You know, 325 00:18:03,960 --> 00:18:07,320 Speaker 3: there was some music somewhere. We would travel to it, 326 00:18:07,520 --> 00:18:09,720 Speaker 3: and then I would go home and try to you know, 327 00:18:09,760 --> 00:18:12,199 Speaker 3: I would more than anything. When I was playing manteline, 328 00:18:12,200 --> 00:18:15,080 Speaker 3: I would sit and watch television and play whatever the 329 00:18:15,160 --> 00:18:17,080 Speaker 3: music I heard on the television was all the theme 330 00:18:17,119 --> 00:18:20,679 Speaker 3: songs to all the shows, the commercials, whatever little jingle 331 00:18:20,720 --> 00:18:22,840 Speaker 3: would come on. I would just you know, I would 332 00:18:22,920 --> 00:18:25,359 Speaker 3: just learn how to mimic, you know, whatever I heard. 333 00:18:25,560 --> 00:18:28,520 Speaker 3: I wasn't really interested in. I never really learned a 334 00:18:28,520 --> 00:18:31,640 Speaker 3: bunch of songs. I just it was a toy. From 335 00:18:31,680 --> 00:18:33,639 Speaker 3: when I was six to twelve. It was just something 336 00:18:33,680 --> 00:18:38,360 Speaker 3: I played with. I never really really tried to learn anything. 337 00:18:38,520 --> 00:18:40,280 Speaker 3: It was just I played it because I could. 338 00:18:41,920 --> 00:18:44,440 Speaker 2: Okay, So now you're twelve, you get this great inspiration. 339 00:18:44,920 --> 00:18:46,119 Speaker 2: How does your life change? 340 00:18:47,680 --> 00:18:49,960 Speaker 3: Well, I tell my parents that I want a banjo, 341 00:18:50,160 --> 00:18:55,160 Speaker 3: and they they looked at me, to quote the line 342 00:18:55,160 --> 00:18:56,520 Speaker 3: from that movie, they looked at me like I had 343 00:18:56,560 --> 00:19:00,280 Speaker 3: lobsters crawling out of my ears. They said, there are 344 00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:03,280 Speaker 3: no banjo players around here. There are no music stores 345 00:19:03,280 --> 00:19:05,760 Speaker 3: that we know of. I mean, where would we even 346 00:19:05,760 --> 00:19:08,720 Speaker 3: get a banjo? And I was adamant. I said, I 347 00:19:08,760 --> 00:19:13,960 Speaker 3: want a banjo. And we found a music store in Castleton, 348 00:19:14,200 --> 00:19:18,879 Speaker 3: Vermont that had banjo's, a couple of banjo's hanging on 349 00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:21,600 Speaker 3: the wall, not very expensive, pretty, you know, very very 350 00:19:21,760 --> 00:19:27,479 Speaker 3: entry level instruments. And they they got me a banjo 351 00:19:27,720 --> 00:19:33,440 Speaker 3: like two months before my thirteenth birthday. And I took 352 00:19:33,480 --> 00:19:38,720 Speaker 3: that banjo and I did everything wrong you can do. 353 00:19:38,960 --> 00:19:43,520 Speaker 3: I I knew what it sounded like. I was. I was. 354 00:19:43,680 --> 00:19:46,360 Speaker 3: I was quick enough to be able to decipher these 355 00:19:46,359 --> 00:19:49,119 Speaker 3: are the notes I want to hear, but somehow was 356 00:19:49,200 --> 00:19:53,600 Speaker 3: not smart enough to figure out how the finger pattern went, 357 00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:57,800 Speaker 3: so my fingers are crossed. Compared to other banjo players, 358 00:19:57,880 --> 00:20:01,600 Speaker 3: my h The main technique in a banjo is your 359 00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:04,640 Speaker 3: thumb would cover the fifth string and the fourth string predominantly. 360 00:20:04,760 --> 00:20:08,119 Speaker 3: Your middle finger would cover the first and second string, 361 00:20:08,200 --> 00:20:11,199 Speaker 3: and your first index finger would cover the third, you know, 362 00:20:11,280 --> 00:20:13,000 Speaker 3: the third and the second string, it kind of stays 363 00:20:13,000 --> 00:20:16,960 Speaker 3: in the middle. Somehow I learned to have my index 364 00:20:17,000 --> 00:20:20,639 Speaker 3: finger covering that that you know, D and B string, 365 00:20:20,680 --> 00:20:22,439 Speaker 3: and I learned my my middle finger was in the 366 00:20:22,480 --> 00:20:24,719 Speaker 3: middle on the G string. My fingers are just crossed 367 00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:27,879 Speaker 3: around backwards from everybody else's. And I did that for 368 00:20:27,920 --> 00:20:29,960 Speaker 3: a couple of years before anybody noticed. By the time 369 00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:36,280 Speaker 3: anyone noticed, I'd already developed a unchangeable pattern I could play, 370 00:20:36,840 --> 00:20:39,320 Speaker 3: so I never I never went back. So I have 371 00:20:39,560 --> 00:20:44,920 Speaker 3: one of the more unique banjo right hands from teaching myself, 372 00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:48,639 Speaker 3: you know, I I tell everyone, if you have it 373 00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:51,879 Speaker 3: when you're getting started, take some early lessons, learn some 374 00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:55,240 Speaker 3: technique out of the gate. It would it'll so help 375 00:20:55,359 --> 00:20:58,880 Speaker 3: the new musicians out there who want to learn, because 376 00:20:58,920 --> 00:21:00,240 Speaker 3: I found that. For me, it was out of a 377 00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:03,480 Speaker 3: stumbling block with the banjo. And then, of of course 378 00:21:04,600 --> 00:21:06,400 Speaker 3: I didn't know at the time my career was really 379 00:21:06,440 --> 00:21:09,040 Speaker 3: going to be on a guitar, you know, mandolin and 380 00:21:09,080 --> 00:21:13,520 Speaker 3: guitar mostly, so the mandolin and the guitar were pretty translatable. 381 00:21:13,560 --> 00:21:14,960 Speaker 3: I played that mandolin early on. 382 00:21:15,359 --> 00:21:18,000 Speaker 2: Let's just stay with the banjo. What was your inspiration 383 00:21:18,240 --> 00:21:19,960 Speaker 2: for saying you wanted to play the banjo. 384 00:21:20,720 --> 00:21:23,359 Speaker 3: I heard JD. Crow in the New South. I heard J. D. 385 00:21:23,480 --> 00:21:27,600 Speaker 3: Crow play I'm Walking, Yes, indeed, I heard him play 386 00:21:27,680 --> 00:21:31,639 Speaker 3: Old Home Place. And when I heard that, there was 387 00:21:31,680 --> 00:21:35,240 Speaker 3: something about that music, particularly the double O forty four record. 388 00:21:35,240 --> 00:21:37,520 Speaker 3: That's the record that I studied that I listened to 389 00:21:37,760 --> 00:21:40,720 Speaker 3: that I can you know, I can play every note 390 00:21:40,720 --> 00:21:43,640 Speaker 3: of every instrument, of every solo on the whole red 391 00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:47,600 Speaker 3: you know, I've studied that record inside and out. It's 392 00:21:47,640 --> 00:21:50,440 Speaker 3: the one that spoke to me. Who knows why any 393 00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:53,120 Speaker 3: particular piece of music speaks to anyone person, but that 394 00:21:53,160 --> 00:21:56,640 Speaker 3: one grab me right to the right to the core. 395 00:21:57,920 --> 00:22:02,879 Speaker 2: Okay, So now you're playing the banjo. Are you playing 396 00:22:02,920 --> 00:22:04,560 Speaker 2: the banjo with anybody else? 397 00:22:07,320 --> 00:22:10,639 Speaker 3: Now? I'm playing the banjo with again with my brother 398 00:22:11,600 --> 00:22:14,280 Speaker 3: uh Stan, and we we ended up starting a band 399 00:22:14,359 --> 00:22:18,439 Speaker 3: called Green Mountain Bluegrass. And we we held that together 400 00:22:18,480 --> 00:22:21,240 Speaker 3: for about five years, and we ultimately played up and 401 00:22:21,280 --> 00:22:23,439 Speaker 3: down the East Coast. You know, by the by the 402 00:22:23,480 --> 00:22:25,240 Speaker 3: time we were you know, had played a few years. 403 00:22:25,240 --> 00:22:29,520 Speaker 3: We played from Maine to Florida, anywhere we could, any 404 00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:32,240 Speaker 3: bluegrass festival. I mean, you know, we were we weren't 405 00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:34,119 Speaker 3: making any money. We were just we were just so 406 00:22:34,280 --> 00:22:37,159 Speaker 3: gung ho to go and play. And yeah, anytime I 407 00:22:37,200 --> 00:22:40,600 Speaker 3: could get in any jam session at any bluegrass festival, 408 00:22:42,119 --> 00:22:44,159 Speaker 3: I was the guy that walked around with a with 409 00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:47,040 Speaker 3: a banjo out of the case on, you know, strapped 410 00:22:47,080 --> 00:22:50,440 Speaker 3: on walking around looking for jam sessions. I just it's 411 00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:55,560 Speaker 3: I lived it every every every moment of every day. 412 00:22:56,080 --> 00:22:57,240 Speaker 3: That was what was in my head. 413 00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:01,600 Speaker 2: So it was not matter like with a rock band 414 00:23:01,600 --> 00:23:03,840 Speaker 2: that you were playing with the kids in school. 415 00:23:05,520 --> 00:23:07,960 Speaker 3: No, not at all. In fact, there was the kids 416 00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:11,840 Speaker 3: in school had no idea what I did. They eventually 417 00:23:11,880 --> 00:23:16,160 Speaker 3: found out that I that I played a banjo, and uh, 418 00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:20,639 Speaker 3: and I really took you know, that was from the 419 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:22,959 Speaker 3: school aspect and my my, the friends that I had 420 00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:24,960 Speaker 3: growing up, you know, that was more. I was more 421 00:23:25,040 --> 00:23:28,800 Speaker 3: probably ashamed of that, or I was hiding it. You know, 422 00:23:28,880 --> 00:23:32,000 Speaker 3: I didn't Uh, they didn't think bluegrass music was cool. 423 00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:35,720 Speaker 3: They were rock and rollers. So you know, I didn't 424 00:23:35,720 --> 00:23:38,359 Speaker 3: tell them I was out playing banjos. I just I 425 00:23:38,400 --> 00:23:41,520 Speaker 3: went on the weekends and did my thing and then 426 00:23:41,560 --> 00:23:43,600 Speaker 3: had a different life while I was while I was home. 427 00:23:44,280 --> 00:23:46,680 Speaker 2: So at these festivals, you just showed up. These were 428 00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:49,600 Speaker 2: not paying gigs where there was somebody booking the gig, 429 00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:51,600 Speaker 2: whether it be an agent or yourself or whatever. 430 00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:55,760 Speaker 3: Correct though it was a little bit of both. I mean, 431 00:23:55,800 --> 00:23:57,880 Speaker 3: when we had the band Green Mountain Bluegrass, we would 432 00:23:57,880 --> 00:23:59,880 Speaker 3: book any festival that we could, and then we would 433 00:23:59,880 --> 00:24:01,920 Speaker 3: go there and camp out for the weekend. We would 434 00:24:01,920 --> 00:24:04,159 Speaker 3: go and we would play our show whenever our show was, 435 00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:08,320 Speaker 3: but we were really there to drink and party and 436 00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:10,320 Speaker 3: pick and have the best time we could. We just 437 00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:13,320 Speaker 3: camped out and you know, it was like vacation every week. 438 00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:18,560 Speaker 2: And does that scene exist at all today. 439 00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:23,840 Speaker 3: The bluegrass festival scene. I mean, I still like to 440 00:24:23,840 --> 00:24:25,879 Speaker 3: go to the bluegrass festivals for the same reason I 441 00:24:25,880 --> 00:24:29,560 Speaker 3: don't have the freedom I once had to go and 442 00:24:29,600 --> 00:24:32,240 Speaker 3: walk around and you know, jam bust with with a 443 00:24:32,240 --> 00:24:35,399 Speaker 3: banjo on my on my shoulder. But I still like 444 00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:37,760 Speaker 3: festivals for the same reason. I still walk around. I 445 00:24:37,800 --> 00:24:42,520 Speaker 3: still enjoy watching everybody get together and it's an amazing 446 00:24:44,760 --> 00:24:47,600 Speaker 3: it's an amazing sense of community. Man. The bluegrass festivals 447 00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:50,520 Speaker 3: are what ultimately won me over and why I stuck 448 00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:52,240 Speaker 3: with this this music. 449 00:24:53,560 --> 00:24:57,119 Speaker 2: Okay, for those people not in this world, can you 450 00:24:57,200 --> 00:24:58,560 Speaker 2: define bluegrass. 451 00:25:01,600 --> 00:25:03,639 Speaker 3: You know, it's that's a question I have heard so 452 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:06,439 Speaker 3: many times, and I've heard so many people ask it. 453 00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:09,920 Speaker 3: You asked that question. It's a it's a difficult question 454 00:25:09,960 --> 00:25:16,640 Speaker 3: to answer. I mean bluegrass music. To me, it's it's 455 00:25:16,720 --> 00:25:19,639 Speaker 3: the evolution of mountain music. It's it's it's the music 456 00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:22,760 Speaker 3: that that people played with the simplest instruments they could find. 457 00:25:23,560 --> 00:25:25,440 Speaker 3: You know, they played what you would early call that. 458 00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:28,280 Speaker 3: Some might call it country music or old time country music. 459 00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:31,360 Speaker 3: It was not too unlike bluegrass music. I think when 460 00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:36,120 Speaker 3: bluegrass kind of got its its niche was simply Earl Scruggs, 461 00:25:36,119 --> 00:25:38,679 Speaker 3: you know, three finger banjo, and then of course you 462 00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:40,800 Speaker 3: had Bill Monroe with some high harmonies, and you had 463 00:25:40,800 --> 00:25:45,080 Speaker 3: some influential bands that played that style of music. But 464 00:25:45,240 --> 00:25:47,080 Speaker 3: you know, everyone there are a lot of opinions of 465 00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:50,280 Speaker 3: what bluegrass music actually is. You know, it's it's a 466 00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:54,000 Speaker 3: typically it's a guitar, bass, a banjo, and a mandolin 467 00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:59,240 Speaker 3: and a fiddle. That's if you play that and sing 468 00:25:59,280 --> 00:26:03,479 Speaker 3: certain songs, I think, well you have bluegrass music. But 469 00:26:04,440 --> 00:26:09,160 Speaker 3: opinions vary a lot on what bluegrass actually is. It's 470 00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:12,600 Speaker 3: fun to hear the different interpretations. I've spent a lifetime 471 00:26:12,960 --> 00:26:16,919 Speaker 3: trying to explain it and also trying to interpret other people's, 472 00:26:17,520 --> 00:26:20,840 Speaker 3: you know, opinion of what bluegrass music is. Not everyone agrees, 473 00:26:20,880 --> 00:26:25,880 Speaker 3: and that's even within hardcore bluegrass bands. Lifers can still 474 00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:28,760 Speaker 3: argue about what bluegrass music actually is. You know, it's 475 00:26:28,760 --> 00:26:31,240 Speaker 3: funny to me. I mean, I like all types of music, 476 00:26:31,280 --> 00:26:34,720 Speaker 3: and bluegrass music is the core. It's the heart of 477 00:26:34,800 --> 00:26:37,840 Speaker 3: what I do. And if you identified as bluegrass, then 478 00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:39,160 Speaker 3: there it is bluegrass music. 479 00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:42,360 Speaker 2: So what point did you pick up the guitar. 480 00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:45,760 Speaker 3: When I joined Alison Krause Union Station. 481 00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:49,120 Speaker 2: So you weren't playing the guitar before that, you were 482 00:26:49,119 --> 00:26:50,920 Speaker 2: just playing banjo and mandolin. 483 00:26:53,320 --> 00:26:56,320 Speaker 3: Correct, I mean I had access to a guitar, like 484 00:26:56,400 --> 00:26:58,400 Speaker 3: I knew how to play a you know, I could 485 00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:00,800 Speaker 3: play GC and D. I could play the court, you know, 486 00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:03,639 Speaker 3: of course, but I never no, I never had a 487 00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:06,880 Speaker 3: guitar of my own. I never had no. I didn't 488 00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:08,920 Speaker 3: really the guitar was was not my thing. I spent 489 00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:11,800 Speaker 3: all my time those formative years trying to play a banjo. Again. 490 00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:14,040 Speaker 3: I played mandolin just because it was like a toy. 491 00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:16,920 Speaker 3: It was fun. I played the mandolin, but I spent 492 00:27:16,960 --> 00:27:19,080 Speaker 3: all my years, you know, playing the banjo, and I 493 00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:21,639 Speaker 3: honestly I wanted to join Alison Krause's band as the 494 00:27:21,680 --> 00:27:24,800 Speaker 3: banjo player. I was. I was mortified the day I 495 00:27:24,800 --> 00:27:27,879 Speaker 3: found out ron Block got the job and and I 496 00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:30,720 Speaker 3: didn't have a shot at that anymore. I never dreamed 497 00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:35,000 Speaker 3: I would get asked to be the guitar player. And uh, 498 00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:39,159 Speaker 3: when I was, I immediately went shopping for a guitar 499 00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:42,640 Speaker 3: and and you know, sat in the sat in the woodshed, 500 00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:45,960 Speaker 3: as as they would say, and uh, and tried to 501 00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:50,240 Speaker 3: play ketchup, you know. And I spent a hell most 502 00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:52,280 Speaker 3: of my career playing ketchup because that was that was 503 00:27:52,400 --> 00:27:55,119 Speaker 3: kind of my last instrument. But turns out it was 504 00:27:55,160 --> 00:27:58,640 Speaker 3: the instrument I was meant to play. It's the instrument 505 00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:02,199 Speaker 3: I enjoy playing, you know, the most. It was. You know, 506 00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:04,280 Speaker 3: I didn't realize the love I had for a guitar 507 00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:07,679 Speaker 3: until late in my career, I mean until after I 508 00:28:07,720 --> 00:28:08,520 Speaker 3: was a guitar player. 509 00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:14,879 Speaker 2: You know, some musicians can pick up any instrument and 510 00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:17,760 Speaker 2: within a short period of time play it is that 511 00:28:17,800 --> 00:28:18,400 Speaker 2: who you are. 512 00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:24,639 Speaker 3: That's how people would describe me. Probably that knew me 513 00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:26,600 Speaker 3: growing up, I mean that was part of our stick 514 00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:28,480 Speaker 3: in the Green Mountain blue grass days. I would play 515 00:28:28,520 --> 00:28:30,879 Speaker 3: a song where I would, you know, run around and 516 00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:36,639 Speaker 3: play all the different instruments on the stage. I was 517 00:28:36,720 --> 00:28:39,480 Speaker 3: never a deep catalog on any one instrument, but it 518 00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:41,560 Speaker 3: was easy enough for me. Yeah, I mean, there's there's 519 00:28:41,560 --> 00:28:43,640 Speaker 3: a relationship. Once you can play one, you kind of 520 00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:45,960 Speaker 3: have an understanding of the next one. And I think 521 00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:48,600 Speaker 3: a lot of the players that play bluegrass music that 522 00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:52,920 Speaker 3: are really that can really play any one instrument well, 523 00:28:52,960 --> 00:28:55,320 Speaker 3: can probably pick up most of them and play, you know, 524 00:28:55,400 --> 00:28:59,480 Speaker 3: the ones that you know, most people that can play 525 00:28:59,480 --> 00:29:01,720 Speaker 3: anything with a pick can play anything with a pick. 526 00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:05,200 Speaker 3: You know. Fiddle is a different category altogether. I think 527 00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:07,040 Speaker 3: you have to be a totally weird person to play 528 00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:10,080 Speaker 3: a fiddle, which is I'm that weird person. I mean, 529 00:29:10,080 --> 00:29:11,880 Speaker 3: when I'm home, that's the only thing I really pick 530 00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:14,800 Speaker 3: up here around the house anymore for my own enjoyment. 531 00:29:15,360 --> 00:29:19,040 Speaker 3: I like playing the fiddle, but again as a toy 532 00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:21,400 Speaker 3: because it's just fun to pick up and play. I 533 00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:24,800 Speaker 3: don't I don't try to make any money play in 534 00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:25,200 Speaker 3: a fiddle. 535 00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:27,840 Speaker 2: Well, let's say I dropped a clarinet at your house 536 00:29:27,880 --> 00:29:29,960 Speaker 2: and I came back a week later. Would you be 537 00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:30,760 Speaker 2: able to play it? 538 00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:35,479 Speaker 3: I would probably be able to play something you wouldn't 539 00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:38,440 Speaker 3: want to hear. Yeah, I mean it's uh yeah, I'll 540 00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:41,160 Speaker 3: I'll pick up anything and try to make music out 541 00:29:41,200 --> 00:29:43,480 Speaker 3: of it. Yeah, I've. I've always kind of been that 542 00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:44,600 Speaker 3: type of a tinkerer. 543 00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:57,200 Speaker 2: So you graduate from high school, you get your direloma, Yes, 544 00:29:57,640 --> 00:30:01,040 Speaker 2: but you get your diploma. How do you see your 545 00:30:01,160 --> 00:30:03,640 Speaker 2: life playing out? What do you what do you want 546 00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:03,960 Speaker 2: to do? 547 00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:11,440 Speaker 3: Boy? At the at the point of graduating. I mean, I, 548 00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:17,240 Speaker 3: like I said, I I wanted to play music gosh forever. 549 00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:20,880 Speaker 3: Like I I couldn't wait to go and play music. 550 00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:23,000 Speaker 3: But I mean, I think I spent I spent a 551 00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:26,240 Speaker 3: little point as a teenager thinking I wanted to play baseball. 552 00:30:27,040 --> 00:30:29,720 Speaker 3: You know, I was. I was a pretty decent baseball player. 553 00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:33,720 Speaker 3: I thought to myself, I could probably play baseball. It's 554 00:30:33,720 --> 00:30:36,040 Speaker 3: gonna sound silly, but there was a point past that, 555 00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:38,320 Speaker 3: you know, the years leading up to graduation, I wanted 556 00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:42,840 Speaker 3: to play foosball. I wanted to uh, I wanted to 557 00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:45,280 Speaker 3: be a professional football player. I thought that would have 558 00:30:45,360 --> 00:30:47,240 Speaker 3: been an amazing Okay. 559 00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:50,720 Speaker 2: Wait wait wait, I was always a shitty foosball player. 560 00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:54,200 Speaker 2: But the people put a lot of time in. You know, 561 00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:56,600 Speaker 2: they could work it, et cetera. You gotta put a 562 00:30:56,680 --> 00:30:59,560 Speaker 2: lot of time in to be a good foosball player. 563 00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:03,280 Speaker 3: I may have more time on a foosball table than 564 00:31:03,320 --> 00:31:08,120 Speaker 3: I have on instruments. Growing up, there was a foosball 565 00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:10,160 Speaker 3: my brother had. I had a foosball table from the 566 00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:12,320 Speaker 3: time I could see over the edge of it. There 567 00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:15,040 Speaker 3: was a foosball table in the rec center that we 568 00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:17,160 Speaker 3: you know, the place where the kids hung out at school. 569 00:31:17,240 --> 00:31:20,120 Speaker 3: I've always played foosball and I got I got my 570 00:31:20,160 --> 00:31:22,800 Speaker 3: ten thousand hours in. You can't see this on the podcast, 571 00:31:22,840 --> 00:31:25,160 Speaker 3: but I'm wearing this is my foosball shirt. 572 00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:27,600 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, this is my foosball shirt. 573 00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:31,280 Speaker 3: It says, that's yeah. The shirt I'm wearing literally is 574 00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:34,560 Speaker 3: a foosball shirt. No I am. I'm all about the 575 00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:36,800 Speaker 3: game of foosball. So there was a like I said, okay, 576 00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:39,000 Speaker 3: you know, there was a point I wanted to play foosball. 577 00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:43,280 Speaker 3: But when I by the time I actually graduated, I 578 00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:46,120 Speaker 3: knew that I was going to, you know, play music somehow, 579 00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:49,600 Speaker 3: some way, somewhere, I didn't know where, I didn't care 580 00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:52,920 Speaker 3: where I just I knew I was a musician. 581 00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:59,520 Speaker 2: Okay, let's stop for one second. Is there some sort 582 00:31:59,560 --> 00:32:01,560 Speaker 2: of profe foosball. 583 00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:05,040 Speaker 3: League, now, ye know, there is, of course there is there. Well, 584 00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:08,800 Speaker 3: so let's back up back in the day now, when 585 00:32:08,840 --> 00:32:11,360 Speaker 3: I was playing foosball and hearing about these people in 586 00:32:11,400 --> 00:32:14,600 Speaker 3: the in the you know, mid late seventies and early eighties, 587 00:32:14,720 --> 00:32:17,040 Speaker 3: foosball was actually quite a big deal. There were million 588 00:32:17,080 --> 00:32:20,400 Speaker 3: dollar tournaments. There's a million dollar tour. People were winning 589 00:32:20,520 --> 00:32:22,480 Speaker 3: huge prizes. I mean, this is gonna be hard to believe, 590 00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:26,240 Speaker 3: but it was the sixth biggest money sport that you 591 00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:29,960 Speaker 3: could get into. If you were Wow, if you go 592 00:32:30,080 --> 00:32:33,080 Speaker 3: back to the you know, mid late seventies, it was huge, right, 593 00:32:33,440 --> 00:32:35,160 Speaker 3: you were stars, you were on talk shows. You know, 594 00:32:35,240 --> 00:32:38,320 Speaker 3: you were doing the Tonight Show, if you were a 595 00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:42,320 Speaker 3: big foosball Well, anyway, I loved the game. I always 596 00:32:42,320 --> 00:32:44,600 Speaker 3: love to gain. So still now you skip ahead, now, 597 00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:48,440 Speaker 3: all these years later, it is reduced down to very very, 598 00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:51,000 Speaker 3: very very small compared to what it used to be. 599 00:32:51,080 --> 00:32:58,440 Speaker 3: The There are only, to my knowledge, two professional foosball players, 600 00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:00,600 Speaker 3: and by that I mean people who act actually make 601 00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:06,080 Speaker 3: their living playing foosball. Only there are a couple guys 602 00:33:06,120 --> 00:33:09,680 Speaker 3: todd Ler, Fredo, Tony Spraderman, not necessarily in that order, 603 00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:12,160 Speaker 3: but there are a couple guys that make their living. 604 00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:14,840 Speaker 3: And there's still a foosball tour that travels all over 605 00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:17,120 Speaker 3: the country, all over the world. Really yeah, I still 606 00:33:17,120 --> 00:33:22,160 Speaker 3: go to tournaments everywhere. I'm from here to Colorado to California, Texas, 607 00:33:22,520 --> 00:33:27,000 Speaker 3: the Northeast. There are foosball tournaments everywhere. I play music, 608 00:33:27,280 --> 00:33:28,920 Speaker 3: so it's really hard to catch a lot of them 609 00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:33,720 Speaker 3: for a lifetime. I took thirty two years of my 610 00:33:33,800 --> 00:33:37,520 Speaker 3: life off of foosball. The last major foosball tournament that 611 00:33:37,560 --> 00:33:41,040 Speaker 3: I played was in nineteen eighty nine. Okay before a 612 00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:45,200 Speaker 3: couple of years ago. Two years ago, two and a half, 613 00:33:45,280 --> 00:33:49,640 Speaker 3: I guess now, I got back into foosball. I randomly 614 00:33:49,840 --> 00:33:52,680 Speaker 3: saw it on the internet. Got me thinking about some 615 00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:54,440 Speaker 3: guys that I used to know. I looked them up 616 00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:57,160 Speaker 3: online and lo and behold, I start getting the speeds 617 00:33:57,160 --> 00:34:01,600 Speaker 3: of Come to the foosball tournament in Lexington the tour kickoff, 618 00:34:01,600 --> 00:34:04,880 Speaker 3: and I thought, well, that sounds like me. So I 619 00:34:04,880 --> 00:34:08,640 Speaker 3: I show up thinking I'm gonna, you know, step right 620 00:34:08,680 --> 00:34:10,160 Speaker 3: back in the way I was and I realized, you know, 621 00:34:10,200 --> 00:34:12,680 Speaker 3: the foosball players got really good between when I was 622 00:34:13,440 --> 00:34:16,000 Speaker 3: when they are now. Right, But I'm still a decent 623 00:34:16,040 --> 00:34:18,640 Speaker 3: you know, Like I went my first tournament back, I 624 00:34:19,280 --> 00:34:22,320 Speaker 3: meddled in a couple of different events, won a little bling, 625 00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:24,719 Speaker 3: and I and I drove home with table number eight 626 00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:28,279 Speaker 3: in my trunk and put it in the garage. And 627 00:34:28,480 --> 00:34:30,879 Speaker 3: you know, for you know, the past close to three years, 628 00:34:30,920 --> 00:34:33,960 Speaker 3: I've been I've been leaning over a foosball table, trying 629 00:34:34,000 --> 00:34:35,600 Speaker 3: to get the trying to get my chops back. 630 00:34:37,600 --> 00:34:42,080 Speaker 2: Okay, but isn't foosball a little bit like tennis that 631 00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:45,520 Speaker 2: to really be good you have to practice against someone 632 00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:47,520 Speaker 2: who's pretty good themselves. 633 00:34:48,120 --> 00:34:52,360 Speaker 3: Okay, this is absolutely wow. Okay, this is what people 634 00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:57,680 Speaker 3: don't consider is and you have nailed it, absolutely nailed it. 635 00:34:57,680 --> 00:35:00,840 Speaker 3: To be at the highest level of well anything, you 636 00:35:00,880 --> 00:35:04,880 Speaker 3: have to play against the highest level players. So foosball, 637 00:35:05,040 --> 00:35:09,400 Speaker 3: absolutely you have to be able to play against great players. 638 00:35:09,600 --> 00:35:13,600 Speaker 3: But we have an advantage now that I didn't have 639 00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:16,640 Speaker 3: when I played all that foosball in the eighties, seventies 640 00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:20,160 Speaker 3: and eighties. There was no Internet, there was no YouTube, 641 00:35:20,200 --> 00:35:22,080 Speaker 3: there was no If I wanted to watch a master 642 00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:25,280 Speaker 3: play foosball, I had to drive for hours and stand 643 00:35:25,320 --> 00:35:28,600 Speaker 3: over a row of rows of people and try to 644 00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:31,680 Speaker 3: catch what little information I could. Now I can pull 645 00:35:31,760 --> 00:35:34,719 Speaker 3: up any of the top players in the world on 646 00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:38,319 Speaker 3: YouTube and study their every move. Watch everything they do, 647 00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:41,520 Speaker 3: Watch how they react to certain shots, Watch how they defend, 648 00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:44,799 Speaker 3: watch what There's just so much information that you can 649 00:35:44,840 --> 00:35:50,640 Speaker 3: glean now from watching that. I'm fascinated with it. So I, 650 00:35:50,880 --> 00:35:53,200 Speaker 3: you know, I spend my I spend my time studying 651 00:35:53,239 --> 00:35:54,759 Speaker 3: so that I know the players. When I show up 652 00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:58,000 Speaker 3: to the tournaments and and I've done well, I've you know, 653 00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:04,600 Speaker 3: I I'm uh, I'm still a formidable competitor when it 654 00:36:04,600 --> 00:36:07,359 Speaker 3: comes to foosball. I've played enough against the time I mean, 655 00:36:07,360 --> 00:36:09,440 Speaker 3: I've played against the world champion. I've played I've been 656 00:36:09,440 --> 00:36:12,000 Speaker 3: in the pits with the best players in the world 657 00:36:12,760 --> 00:36:14,040 Speaker 3: and held my own. 658 00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:18,319 Speaker 2: You know, it's okay. As I say, I was never 659 00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:22,600 Speaker 2: a good foosball player, but when foosball became a big 660 00:36:22,640 --> 00:36:25,399 Speaker 2: deal in my life, it was the machine you put 661 00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:28,359 Speaker 2: money in, and then they had tables you could take 662 00:36:28,360 --> 00:36:31,440 Speaker 2: it home, but they were not of the same level. 663 00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:36,359 Speaker 2: Is there a standard foosball table like did every all 664 00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:37,360 Speaker 2: the tournaments are on. 665 00:36:38,640 --> 00:36:41,120 Speaker 3: There is and it depends on where you are in 666 00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:43,120 Speaker 3: the world as to what table it is. Right now, 667 00:36:43,160 --> 00:36:48,640 Speaker 3: in America, the current league table is called the Tornado Table, 668 00:36:49,719 --> 00:36:51,239 Speaker 3: but it has changed through the years. When I first 669 00:36:51,280 --> 00:36:54,520 Speaker 3: started playing, it was a ts tournament soccer table. They 670 00:36:54,520 --> 00:36:56,759 Speaker 3: called it the Million Dollar table Ts table, and then 671 00:36:56,800 --> 00:36:59,920 Speaker 3: it switched to the Dynamo Table, and then it switched 672 00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:03,520 Speaker 3: to there's still there's still some other branches. There's a 673 00:37:03,520 --> 00:37:06,680 Speaker 3: Warrior table, there's a Warrior tournament series, or at least 674 00:37:06,719 --> 00:37:08,840 Speaker 3: there used to be, but now it's Tornado. 675 00:37:10,280 --> 00:37:15,080 Speaker 2: And is there any real difference between these professional level tables? 676 00:37:16,040 --> 00:37:18,719 Speaker 3: Huge difference if you're good on a let's say there's 677 00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:21,240 Speaker 3: a there's a Bonzini circuit, Like if you play in Europe, 678 00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:23,799 Speaker 3: you'll play a lot on Bonzini tables. And if you're 679 00:37:23,800 --> 00:37:26,000 Speaker 3: a good Bonzini player, that does not mean you're a 680 00:37:26,040 --> 00:37:30,320 Speaker 3: good Tornado player, and vice versa. They're completely different skills. 681 00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:32,239 Speaker 3: I mean, it takes it takes a while to really 682 00:37:32,239 --> 00:37:34,239 Speaker 3: develop the touch. I mean it's it's like if you're 683 00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:36,240 Speaker 3: a guitar player and you're gonna all of a sudden, 684 00:37:36,600 --> 00:37:38,680 Speaker 3: say you're gonna switch to a different instrument. Well, you 685 00:37:38,719 --> 00:37:40,160 Speaker 3: know how to hold a pick and you know how 686 00:37:40,160 --> 00:37:43,880 Speaker 3: to press a string down, but there's a whole different 687 00:37:43,920 --> 00:37:46,320 Speaker 3: set of variables that you have to learn to be 688 00:37:46,360 --> 00:37:48,440 Speaker 3: able to play from table to table. And there are 689 00:37:48,480 --> 00:37:53,520 Speaker 3: tournaments like international tournaments that have multi table tournaments where 690 00:37:53,520 --> 00:37:55,480 Speaker 3: you have to play one match on a Tornado and 691 00:37:55,520 --> 00:37:58,040 Speaker 3: then the next match on a Bonzini and the next 692 00:37:58,080 --> 00:38:02,040 Speaker 3: match on there's. Yeah, it's it's interesting. So there are 693 00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:05,040 Speaker 3: there are people who are great at at each one 694 00:38:05,080 --> 00:38:07,879 Speaker 3: and there's there's only a few players that are really 695 00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:10,520 Speaker 3: masters on all of those tables. You know right now, 696 00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:13,480 Speaker 3: the man his name is Tony Spraderman. He's the guy 697 00:38:13,520 --> 00:38:15,160 Speaker 3: to look you know, He's the guy I watch. He's 698 00:38:15,200 --> 00:38:19,719 Speaker 3: he's he's my foods, my current foosball hero and uh 699 00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:22,279 Speaker 3: I befriended him, met him at a few tournaments and 700 00:38:22,320 --> 00:38:24,120 Speaker 3: got to got to play against him a little bit. 701 00:38:24,719 --> 00:38:27,480 Speaker 3: And it's the most fun I could probably have right 702 00:38:27,520 --> 00:38:29,759 Speaker 3: now at this point in my life, is to stand 703 00:38:29,760 --> 00:38:33,719 Speaker 3: against one of those high level players and play foosball. 704 00:38:33,760 --> 00:38:36,480 Speaker 3: That is the I will not see that level of 705 00:38:36,520 --> 00:38:40,120 Speaker 3: adrenaline and anything else I do at this age in 706 00:38:40,160 --> 00:38:42,280 Speaker 3: my life. No, nothing even close. 707 00:38:44,239 --> 00:38:48,000 Speaker 2: Well, it's exciting. Switching gears back to our narrative. So 708 00:38:48,160 --> 00:38:50,479 Speaker 2: you graduate from high school, do you get a day 709 00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:54,320 Speaker 2: job or you immediately play music? What what happened? 710 00:38:54,440 --> 00:38:57,000 Speaker 3: I did. I graduated from high school and my dad 711 00:38:57,080 --> 00:39:00,240 Speaker 3: was a fleet mechanic for the Coca Cola company, and 712 00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:02,359 Speaker 3: he asked me if I wanted to go to work 713 00:39:02,360 --> 00:39:08,120 Speaker 3: for him as as an assistant mechanics assistant and when 714 00:39:08,160 --> 00:39:11,280 Speaker 3: I worked part time, and I thought that'd be excellent. 715 00:39:11,320 --> 00:39:13,759 Speaker 3: So I went and I took a took this job 716 00:39:13,760 --> 00:39:15,480 Speaker 3: with my dad that if I was smart, if I 717 00:39:15,520 --> 00:39:17,839 Speaker 3: was a smarter kid, I would have stayed right there 718 00:39:17,840 --> 00:39:19,919 Speaker 3: with that job because it was perfect. It was really 719 00:39:19,960 --> 00:39:23,120 Speaker 3: good pay, you know, compared to everyone else. It was 720 00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:27,319 Speaker 3: really good hourly pay. And I could pick my own hours. 721 00:39:27,360 --> 00:39:29,120 Speaker 3: I didn't have to go untill noon if I didn't 722 00:39:29,120 --> 00:39:30,719 Speaker 3: want to, you know, I just I just had to 723 00:39:30,760 --> 00:39:33,319 Speaker 3: work twenty hours a week. It didn't matter what twenty hours. 724 00:39:34,239 --> 00:39:36,239 Speaker 3: But after a few months of doing that with my dad, 725 00:39:36,280 --> 00:39:38,520 Speaker 3: actually not even a few, probably two months I think 726 00:39:38,560 --> 00:39:41,279 Speaker 3: I worked with my dad, they needed a driver and 727 00:39:41,320 --> 00:39:43,680 Speaker 3: they asked my father. They said, can your son drive 728 00:39:43,719 --> 00:39:46,680 Speaker 3: one of these trucks. And of course my dad he says, 729 00:39:46,880 --> 00:39:50,000 Speaker 3: oh yeah, he can drive that thing. Never I'd never 730 00:39:50,040 --> 00:39:51,600 Speaker 3: been behind the wheel of a truck like that in 731 00:39:51,640 --> 00:39:53,440 Speaker 3: my life, right, But he goes, oh, yeah, he can 732 00:39:53,520 --> 00:39:56,359 Speaker 3: drive it. And they said, do you want a job, 733 00:39:56,560 --> 00:39:59,480 Speaker 3: you know, driving? They said it'd be another you know, 734 00:39:59,600 --> 00:40:02,239 Speaker 3: three three more dollars an hour, and you'll get to 735 00:40:02,280 --> 00:40:05,040 Speaker 3: work some overtime and you know a lot more money benefits. 736 00:40:05,040 --> 00:40:08,319 Speaker 3: And they I said, yeah, sure, I took this job 737 00:40:08,400 --> 00:40:14,279 Speaker 3: driving Coca Cola truck delivering down to Manchester. And uh, 738 00:40:15,960 --> 00:40:21,560 Speaker 3: couple things. First of all, I'm really really bad with directions, 739 00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:24,640 Speaker 3: Like I am the poster child for the for the 740 00:40:24,840 --> 00:40:26,680 Speaker 3: you know, the Google Maps. I need to follow that 741 00:40:26,680 --> 00:40:29,439 Speaker 3: blue line wherever I'm going right. Well, back in the day, 742 00:40:29,440 --> 00:40:30,920 Speaker 3: there was you know, we didn't have that. We had 743 00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:33,880 Speaker 3: a sheet full of instructions and it was so I 744 00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:36,320 Speaker 3: was taking an extra two hours a day just spending 745 00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:39,360 Speaker 3: just being lost trying to find places. Right. It was 746 00:40:39,400 --> 00:40:42,120 Speaker 3: the worst job I could have ever had. But during 747 00:40:42,160 --> 00:40:46,080 Speaker 3: the course of that job, that is when I knew, 748 00:40:46,880 --> 00:40:48,920 Speaker 3: be on the shadow of a doubt, that there was 749 00:40:49,080 --> 00:40:52,280 Speaker 3: there was nothing that would keep me from playing music. 750 00:40:52,360 --> 00:40:56,240 Speaker 3: I was looking for literally the first opportunity I could 751 00:40:57,200 --> 00:41:00,560 Speaker 3: for a for a music job. And it turns out 752 00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:03,120 Speaker 3: that after I had that job less than a year, 753 00:41:03,160 --> 00:41:06,640 Speaker 3: I think I maybe eight months, I delivered Coca Cola 754 00:41:06,920 --> 00:41:10,520 Speaker 3: maybe seven months, seven or eight months, and I got 755 00:41:10,520 --> 00:41:13,960 Speaker 3: an offer from the Lonesome River Band and they asked 756 00:41:13,960 --> 00:41:18,759 Speaker 3: if I was interested in and in playing with him, 757 00:41:18,760 --> 00:41:20,799 Speaker 3: and and at the time again I thought I was 758 00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:24,719 Speaker 3: going to be banjo. Turned out it was they really 759 00:41:24,800 --> 00:41:27,640 Speaker 3: wanted the mandolin player more than they wanted the banjo player. 760 00:41:29,400 --> 00:41:32,640 Speaker 3: But at the thought of taking a bluegrass job, I was, 761 00:41:32,960 --> 00:41:36,000 Speaker 3: You've never seen a person happier to walk in and 762 00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:39,080 Speaker 3: give his notice to a company. I was. I walked 763 00:41:39,080 --> 00:41:41,919 Speaker 3: in literally giddy. I said, well, sorry, boss, I said, 764 00:41:41,920 --> 00:41:43,399 Speaker 3: I'm not going to be able to keep this job, 765 00:41:43,800 --> 00:41:46,000 Speaker 3: you know, I was. I was out. And then of 766 00:41:46,040 --> 00:41:50,239 Speaker 3: course that first I think the first three years combined. 767 00:41:50,360 --> 00:41:54,000 Speaker 3: I went back and saw this in my in my records, 768 00:41:54,320 --> 00:41:57,360 Speaker 3: my first three years, my tax record showed a I 769 00:41:57,400 --> 00:42:02,560 Speaker 3: made nine thousand dollars for three years combout three years together, 770 00:42:02,680 --> 00:42:07,640 Speaker 3: nine thousand dollars, and uh, probably one of the happiest 771 00:42:08,040 --> 00:42:11,560 Speaker 3: times in my life. Couldn't. I was. I was on 772 00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:15,400 Speaker 3: top of the world. Man, tell me about it. 773 00:42:16,400 --> 00:42:18,600 Speaker 2: Forgetting the money. What were you doing that made you 774 00:42:18,680 --> 00:42:19,280 Speaker 2: so happy? 775 00:42:20,600 --> 00:42:22,719 Speaker 3: I was. I had moved away from home. I moved 776 00:42:22,760 --> 00:42:24,960 Speaker 3: to Virginia. I was on my own. I was away 777 00:42:25,000 --> 00:42:28,359 Speaker 3: from any stigma that bluegrass wasn't cool. I was now 778 00:42:28,440 --> 00:42:32,560 Speaker 3: in an area where were They honestly didn't take you know, 779 00:42:32,600 --> 00:42:34,000 Speaker 3: the area that I moved to, they didn't take to 780 00:42:34,040 --> 00:42:36,520 Speaker 3: a lot of northern people moving into that area. But 781 00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:41,080 Speaker 3: I was. I excelled in the bluegrass world, and I 782 00:42:41,160 --> 00:42:44,040 Speaker 3: was accepted, you know, just with open arms everywhere I 783 00:42:44,080 --> 00:42:48,880 Speaker 3: went because of the music. And I got to basically 784 00:42:49,520 --> 00:42:52,080 Speaker 3: redefine myself as who I was. I got to I 785 00:42:52,080 --> 00:42:55,840 Speaker 3: got to have a clean slate and say this is 786 00:42:56,080 --> 00:42:59,080 Speaker 3: this is who I am. You know, I I dropped 787 00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:04,040 Speaker 3: some habit that certainly would have killed me or at 788 00:43:04,040 --> 00:43:07,239 Speaker 3: the very least ruined me had I not moved away 789 00:43:07,320 --> 00:43:08,600 Speaker 3: and taken the music job. 790 00:43:08,640 --> 00:43:12,160 Speaker 2: You know, And what kind of habits are we talking about? 791 00:43:12,960 --> 00:43:16,200 Speaker 3: Oh stuff you don't want to go in on into 792 00:43:16,239 --> 00:43:19,840 Speaker 3: this podcast. I'm sure you know, just uh you know. 793 00:43:19,880 --> 00:43:23,920 Speaker 3: I was. I didn't grow up. I didn't have the 794 00:43:23,960 --> 00:43:29,320 Speaker 3: happy fluffy childhood, and I turned to I turned to 795 00:43:29,400 --> 00:43:33,319 Speaker 3: anything I could turn to to mask it, and I 796 00:43:33,360 --> 00:43:37,600 Speaker 3: did any drug I could find until it was gone. 797 00:43:37,719 --> 00:43:40,239 Speaker 3: Didn't matter what it was. You know. Luckily I never 798 00:43:40,280 --> 00:43:45,480 Speaker 3: found anything that was really hard, or I might not 799 00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:47,319 Speaker 3: ever made it out as you know the way that 800 00:43:47,360 --> 00:43:50,640 Speaker 3: I did. But I like I I got an offer 801 00:43:50,680 --> 00:43:53,440 Speaker 3: to move away, and I got to wipe the slate clean. 802 00:43:54,040 --> 00:43:56,239 Speaker 3: I got to say this is who I am now, 803 00:43:56,600 --> 00:44:00,000 Speaker 3: and I let I let some things go. 804 00:44:01,480 --> 00:44:05,800 Speaker 2: Okay. But traditional, I mean, I understand that lifestyle. Drumont 805 00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:08,080 Speaker 2: is a blue state. Now you go back forty or 806 00:44:08,160 --> 00:44:12,279 Speaker 2: fifty years a different state, much more rural, much more red, 807 00:44:12,880 --> 00:44:17,360 Speaker 2: much more local people living on the edge. But traditionally 808 00:44:17,840 --> 00:44:21,040 Speaker 2: one gets in the music business and it's the so 809 00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:24,560 Speaker 2: called sex drugs in rock and roll. You're telling me 810 00:44:24,640 --> 00:44:28,680 Speaker 2: you got into the band and then you went straight. 811 00:44:31,640 --> 00:44:33,920 Speaker 3: Music for me was never the sex drugs in rock 812 00:44:33,920 --> 00:44:37,160 Speaker 3: and roll. So yeah, the type of music I played 813 00:44:37,840 --> 00:44:43,440 Speaker 3: did not. I never found anyone that was doing cocaine 814 00:44:43,840 --> 00:44:48,200 Speaker 3: and acid and mushrooms and taking pills and like, there 815 00:44:48,239 --> 00:44:50,320 Speaker 3: was just none of that and any of the music 816 00:44:50,360 --> 00:44:52,920 Speaker 3: that I was playing. The worst, the worst thing I 817 00:44:53,000 --> 00:44:56,680 Speaker 3: ever saw, basically, really in my whole career of playing music, 818 00:44:56,760 --> 00:44:58,719 Speaker 3: the worst thing I've ever seen with any of the 819 00:44:58,760 --> 00:45:01,640 Speaker 3: musicians that I've ever run. I mean, I've seen you know, 820 00:45:01,680 --> 00:45:05,560 Speaker 3: I've seen weed smokers. That's that's the height of the 821 00:45:06,280 --> 00:45:09,160 Speaker 3: big drugs, you know. And the music that I've played 822 00:45:09,200 --> 00:45:12,360 Speaker 3: there's there's been. It's been a really clean existence. And 823 00:45:12,400 --> 00:45:14,320 Speaker 3: then of course I ended up with Alison Krause and 824 00:45:14,400 --> 00:45:18,360 Speaker 3: Union Station, which arguably one of the cleanest, most moral 825 00:45:18,400 --> 00:45:22,319 Speaker 3: bands that you'll you'll ever you'll ever know of, you know, 826 00:45:22,400 --> 00:45:26,319 Speaker 3: and maybe in history. So I just for me, my path, Yeah, 827 00:45:26,440 --> 00:45:28,960 Speaker 3: it it was a it was a clean up process 828 00:45:28,960 --> 00:45:31,719 Speaker 3: for me. I I was where I I can see 829 00:45:31,760 --> 00:45:33,160 Speaker 3: it is kind of fun. I never thought about it 830 00:45:33,200 --> 00:45:35,320 Speaker 3: that way. Normally you would grow up pretty clean and 831 00:45:35,360 --> 00:45:36,800 Speaker 3: then hit the music and then all of a sudden, 832 00:45:36,840 --> 00:45:40,440 Speaker 3: you know, the debauchery starts. But no, it was the 833 00:45:40,480 --> 00:45:43,040 Speaker 3: other way around. I was. I was close to my 834 00:45:43,200 --> 00:45:47,480 Speaker 3: demise at a at a young age, trying to mask 835 00:45:48,080 --> 00:45:50,400 Speaker 3: who knows what, you know, whatever a kid is trying to, 836 00:45:50,440 --> 00:45:52,920 Speaker 3: you know, hide from. I was hiding from it. And 837 00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:55,960 Speaker 3: I got to start over, man, I got to I 838 00:45:56,000 --> 00:45:59,040 Speaker 3: got to move away from any influence that I had, 839 00:45:59,120 --> 00:46:02,160 Speaker 3: and it was it was an amazing point in my life. 840 00:46:02,200 --> 00:46:03,920 Speaker 3: The only thing I really gave up that you know, 841 00:46:04,400 --> 00:46:05,399 Speaker 3: was was Who's Ball? 842 00:46:13,360 --> 00:46:17,000 Speaker 2: So how did the Lonesome River Band know you to 843 00:46:17,120 --> 00:46:19,280 Speaker 2: find you to ask you to join the act? 844 00:46:21,719 --> 00:46:26,440 Speaker 3: They had played a show in upstate New York in 845 00:46:26,480 --> 00:46:29,480 Speaker 3: the mid eighties that the band that I was had 846 00:46:29,520 --> 00:46:31,879 Speaker 3: with my brother, Green Mountain Bluegrass, was the opening act 847 00:46:31,920 --> 00:46:33,759 Speaker 3: for So we had played the same night in this 848 00:46:34,640 --> 00:46:38,080 Speaker 3: music hall in upstate New York. And after we had 849 00:46:38,719 --> 00:46:41,359 Speaker 3: played the show together, we hung out for a little while, 850 00:46:41,440 --> 00:46:43,480 Speaker 3: had a drink. We're talking because it was it was 851 00:46:43,480 --> 00:46:45,239 Speaker 3: a big deal for us. We were opening up for 852 00:46:45,280 --> 00:46:48,479 Speaker 3: a genuine southern bluegrass band. That was a big deal 853 00:46:48,600 --> 00:46:52,840 Speaker 3: for you know, this this little bluegrass band from from Vermont, 854 00:46:52,960 --> 00:46:54,799 Speaker 3: and uh we just we met him back then, and 855 00:46:55,239 --> 00:46:58,440 Speaker 3: I guess a couple of years had passed and I 856 00:46:58,480 --> 00:47:00,840 Speaker 3: think they were they were looking for a banjo player 857 00:47:00,960 --> 00:47:05,279 Speaker 3: and as the the guy who they had called, they 858 00:47:05,280 --> 00:47:07,680 Speaker 3: wanted to hire this guy named Kevin Church. I know 859 00:47:07,680 --> 00:47:09,640 Speaker 3: that Tim Austin had called Kevin Church and said, Hey, 860 00:47:09,640 --> 00:47:12,440 Speaker 3: would you'd like to play banjo? Kevin said no, I'm 861 00:47:13,000 --> 00:47:14,640 Speaker 3: into the gig that I have right now. He says, 862 00:47:14,680 --> 00:47:17,480 Speaker 3: but have you thought about that kid Dan to Minsky? 863 00:47:18,600 --> 00:47:20,759 Speaker 3: And Tim said, who is Dan? To Minsky? He said, 864 00:47:20,800 --> 00:47:24,160 Speaker 3: remember you played with that band from Vermont. He says, oh, yeah, 865 00:47:24,200 --> 00:47:26,680 Speaker 3: he had remembered me from the show we played. So 866 00:47:26,719 --> 00:47:29,600 Speaker 3: he just he called and asked if I was interested 867 00:47:29,640 --> 00:47:35,680 Speaker 3: in coming down and trying out, And again he really 868 00:47:35,680 --> 00:47:38,440 Speaker 3: didn't make me any offer. In fact, he said, well, 869 00:47:38,520 --> 00:47:41,560 Speaker 3: right now, where we need a couple of musicians, you know, 870 00:47:41,600 --> 00:47:43,640 Speaker 3: where we had two members leave and there's not a 871 00:47:43,640 --> 00:47:46,200 Speaker 3: lot of work. And if you'd have to move here, 872 00:47:46,280 --> 00:47:48,200 Speaker 3: you couldn't take the job and still live in Vermont. 873 00:47:48,200 --> 00:47:50,040 Speaker 3: You'd have to move to Virginia. And if you moved 874 00:47:50,040 --> 00:47:52,200 Speaker 3: to Virginia, you're gonna have to have some other job 875 00:47:52,280 --> 00:47:54,840 Speaker 3: to support yourself because we're not making enough money to 876 00:47:54,840 --> 00:47:57,920 Speaker 3: support you. So just you got to know what you're 877 00:47:57,920 --> 00:48:01,840 Speaker 3: getting into. And man, all I could hear was do 878 00:48:01,920 --> 00:48:04,040 Speaker 3: you want to play bluegrass music? That's the only that's 879 00:48:04,080 --> 00:48:07,080 Speaker 3: the only thing that registered in my mind. And I said, yeah, absolutely, 880 00:48:07,880 --> 00:48:09,560 Speaker 3: And I went there and I was you know, I 881 00:48:09,600 --> 00:48:13,720 Speaker 3: took whatever whatever jobs I could to support myself until 882 00:48:13,760 --> 00:48:17,960 Speaker 3: the music finally got to a point where it supported me. 883 00:48:19,280 --> 00:48:21,960 Speaker 2: So there were three years you with the Lonesome River Band. 884 00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:25,560 Speaker 2: How often did they work and at what point in 885 00:48:25,600 --> 00:48:27,960 Speaker 2: the tenure, if at all, could you give up your 886 00:48:28,000 --> 00:48:28,480 Speaker 2: day job. 887 00:48:30,719 --> 00:48:33,000 Speaker 3: Well, the day job really wasn't much of a job 888 00:48:33,680 --> 00:48:36,839 Speaker 3: anyway to start with. So really the bulk of any 889 00:48:36,880 --> 00:48:39,600 Speaker 3: money I made was was with the band. I mean, 890 00:48:39,640 --> 00:48:41,400 Speaker 3: the first three years that I worked with the Lonesome 891 00:48:41,400 --> 00:48:42,880 Speaker 3: Ever Band, there was no money, but I was with 892 00:48:42,960 --> 00:48:45,600 Speaker 3: them a total of five years. The last couple of 893 00:48:45,680 --> 00:48:52,040 Speaker 3: years we actually got we had redesigned how we had 894 00:48:53,120 --> 00:48:55,279 Speaker 3: done things. I was making a little more of a 895 00:48:55,320 --> 00:48:58,640 Speaker 3: little bigger cut of the money, and we were working more. 896 00:48:58,680 --> 00:49:02,080 Speaker 3: I mean, by the time Ronnie Bowman came in the band, 897 00:49:02,120 --> 00:49:05,960 Speaker 3: we had reconfigured. We actually started to actually take off. 898 00:49:06,000 --> 00:49:08,960 Speaker 3: It was a very It was some turmoil in my 899 00:49:09,040 --> 00:49:13,520 Speaker 3: life because it was a weird timing. When Alison asked 900 00:49:13,520 --> 00:49:16,200 Speaker 3: me if I wanted to join Union Station. I was 901 00:49:16,239 --> 00:49:19,080 Speaker 3: such a huge Union Station fan at that point in time. 902 00:49:19,520 --> 00:49:21,520 Speaker 3: I didn't care if it was on guitar, I didn't care. 903 00:49:21,640 --> 00:49:22,880 Speaker 3: She just said, would you learn how to play a 904 00:49:22,880 --> 00:49:25,080 Speaker 3: flute and join this band? I would have said yes, 905 00:49:25,680 --> 00:49:27,760 Speaker 3: that was where I was at at that point in time. 906 00:49:28,560 --> 00:49:32,080 Speaker 3: But when she asked me to join the Union Station Band, 907 00:49:33,320 --> 00:49:35,680 Speaker 3: we were at the height of what the Lonesome River 908 00:49:35,719 --> 00:49:37,799 Speaker 3: Band had ever done in their career. We had just 909 00:49:37,880 --> 00:49:41,200 Speaker 3: one album of the year with carrying the tradition, we 910 00:49:41,200 --> 00:49:44,200 Speaker 3: were starting to pretty much get to name our festival. 911 00:49:44,239 --> 00:49:47,520 Speaker 3: We could play, you know, places we weren't able to 912 00:49:47,520 --> 00:49:50,920 Speaker 3: play previously. So it was a tough decision to take 913 00:49:50,960 --> 00:49:53,120 Speaker 3: the job with Alison. I ended up taking this job 914 00:49:54,719 --> 00:49:59,400 Speaker 3: and didn't stay with her except maybe four or five months, 915 00:49:59,440 --> 00:50:01,319 Speaker 3: maybe five or six months. I went back to the 916 00:50:01,320 --> 00:50:02,640 Speaker 3: Lonesome River Band. I don't know if a lot of 917 00:50:02,640 --> 00:50:04,840 Speaker 3: people know this. I took the job with Allison and 918 00:50:04,880 --> 00:50:07,360 Speaker 3: didn't stay went back to the Lonesome River Band for 919 00:50:07,400 --> 00:50:10,680 Speaker 3: another year or year and a half before I was 920 00:50:10,719 --> 00:50:12,759 Speaker 3: asked again if I would consider coming back to the 921 00:50:12,840 --> 00:50:15,520 Speaker 3: Union Station and then of course I went back, and 922 00:50:15,920 --> 00:50:17,000 Speaker 3: you know the rest is history. 923 00:50:19,760 --> 00:50:22,759 Speaker 2: Okay, how did Alison find you the first time? 924 00:50:25,640 --> 00:50:27,880 Speaker 3: Through the recording that I had done with the Lonesome 925 00:50:28,000 --> 00:50:30,400 Speaker 3: River Band. The very first thing that I did with 926 00:50:30,440 --> 00:50:34,000 Speaker 3: that band was a record called Looking for Yourself and 927 00:50:34,760 --> 00:50:43,360 Speaker 3: Somewhere or another they had heard that record and she 928 00:50:43,360 --> 00:50:47,400 Speaker 3: she uh that I got my name through through that record. 929 00:50:47,440 --> 00:50:50,160 Speaker 3: I apparently liked it enough to call. I remember the 930 00:50:50,200 --> 00:50:53,360 Speaker 3: first time I got a call from Alison's band. It 931 00:50:53,440 --> 00:50:56,640 Speaker 3: wasn't it wasn't Alison Crouse who called me. It was 932 00:50:56,680 --> 00:50:59,560 Speaker 3: actually Alison Brown, who was playing banjo in the band 933 00:50:59,600 --> 00:51:01,680 Speaker 3: at the time, and they had called and asked if 934 00:51:01,680 --> 00:51:05,960 Speaker 3: I would consider coming aboard, and I gave him a 935 00:51:05,960 --> 00:51:08,399 Speaker 3: hard no. Man. I was at that point in time, 936 00:51:08,440 --> 00:51:11,200 Speaker 3: I was so into the Lonesome Riverband. I had just 937 00:51:11,239 --> 00:51:13,400 Speaker 3: taken the job. It was the early years of the LRB. 938 00:51:13,520 --> 00:51:16,359 Speaker 3: I didn't you know. I wasn't ready to leave before 939 00:51:16,400 --> 00:51:20,080 Speaker 3: I figured out what we had. And it wasn't until 940 00:51:20,080 --> 00:51:22,440 Speaker 3: a couple of years later that I really became infatuated 941 00:51:22,480 --> 00:51:25,200 Speaker 3: with Union Station. And when I got the offer again, 942 00:51:25,280 --> 00:51:26,920 Speaker 3: there was no way to say. 943 00:51:26,719 --> 00:51:32,600 Speaker 2: No, okay, so why did you leave and then come back? 944 00:51:34,760 --> 00:51:36,959 Speaker 3: I felt guilty that I was letting my brothers down. 945 00:51:37,040 --> 00:51:42,040 Speaker 3: I felt like Ronnie and Tim and Sammy were you 946 00:51:42,120 --> 00:51:43,879 Speaker 3: just you have a kinship when you have a band, 947 00:51:44,040 --> 00:51:46,799 Speaker 3: you travel that many miles with people that you're close to. 948 00:51:46,920 --> 00:51:49,759 Speaker 3: You just I felt like I was letting my family down, 949 00:51:49,840 --> 00:51:52,719 Speaker 3: and I felt like there was you know, I was. 950 00:51:52,800 --> 00:51:55,880 Speaker 3: I was well they were first of all, they were relentless. 951 00:51:55,920 --> 00:51:58,360 Speaker 3: They they wanted me back, and they let me know 952 00:51:58,440 --> 00:52:02,239 Speaker 3: in every way, shape and form get me back. You know, 953 00:52:02,440 --> 00:52:04,319 Speaker 3: I'll give you. I'll give you a little I'll give 954 00:52:04,320 --> 00:52:07,000 Speaker 3: you one little gem here that a lot of people 955 00:52:07,040 --> 00:52:11,080 Speaker 3: don't know that this is funny, but the song that 956 00:52:11,160 --> 00:52:14,560 Speaker 3: Ronnie Bowman wrote was actually one of the songs that 957 00:52:14,600 --> 00:52:18,520 Speaker 3: got me back. Ronnie Bowman wrote a song called you 958 00:52:18,600 --> 00:52:20,520 Speaker 3: Gotta Do what you Gotta Do. If you're familiar with 959 00:52:20,560 --> 00:52:23,000 Speaker 3: the Lonesome River Band, you might know this song. It's 960 00:52:23,040 --> 00:52:26,840 Speaker 3: a song about a girl that says when when the 961 00:52:26,880 --> 00:52:29,120 Speaker 3: songs the song reads, I just got a call from 962 00:52:29,120 --> 00:52:31,239 Speaker 3: my good girl today. She said she must be going 963 00:52:31,280 --> 00:52:33,959 Speaker 3: on her way, that there's better things on down the line, 964 00:52:34,000 --> 00:52:36,520 Speaker 3: and I won't try to change her mind. It seems 965 00:52:36,960 --> 00:52:39,880 Speaker 3: she seems to think we're better off this way. But 966 00:52:40,000 --> 00:52:41,920 Speaker 3: my heart it breaks in two. I can't believe we're 967 00:52:41,960 --> 00:52:43,480 Speaker 3: really through. And the song goes on and on and 968 00:52:43,480 --> 00:52:46,280 Speaker 3: it's this man pleading to a woman. But what people 969 00:52:46,320 --> 00:52:49,560 Speaker 3: don't know is Ronnie wrote that song about me going 970 00:52:49,560 --> 00:52:52,959 Speaker 3: to Alison, he says, and though I though I want 971 00:52:53,000 --> 00:52:56,000 Speaker 3: you to stay, you're leaving any way, but you gotta 972 00:52:56,040 --> 00:52:58,080 Speaker 3: do what you gotta do. And that was the song. 973 00:52:58,200 --> 00:53:02,080 Speaker 3: So he sings me this song, you know, and I 974 00:53:02,120 --> 00:53:04,480 Speaker 3: and I cried like a baby. And it was just 975 00:53:04,520 --> 00:53:06,680 Speaker 3: because my heart was already broken that I felt like 976 00:53:06,719 --> 00:53:12,480 Speaker 3: I'd let him down. And yeah, somehow it got the 977 00:53:12,520 --> 00:53:15,400 Speaker 3: best of me and I after about four or five months, 978 00:53:15,440 --> 00:53:19,400 Speaker 3: I think five months maybe with Alison, I explained that 979 00:53:20,320 --> 00:53:21,480 Speaker 3: I couldn't do it. I had to go back to 980 00:53:21,480 --> 00:53:24,960 Speaker 3: the Lonesomeriver Band, and then we went back and recorded 981 00:53:25,960 --> 00:53:30,400 Speaker 3: one or two more things. I forget after, but I 982 00:53:30,440 --> 00:53:32,520 Speaker 3: felt like it was a meat, you know, A year 983 00:53:32,600 --> 00:53:35,080 Speaker 3: back with the Lonesome River Band and I was scratching 984 00:53:35,080 --> 00:53:38,000 Speaker 3: my head wondering what I was doing because in my mind, 985 00:53:38,560 --> 00:53:41,920 Speaker 3: the ultimate music was being made by Alison Crouse and 986 00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:45,520 Speaker 3: Union Station. They were the to me. They had the diversity, 987 00:53:45,560 --> 00:53:51,200 Speaker 3: they had the depth, the multi dimensional sound. Lonesome River 988 00:53:51,239 --> 00:53:53,359 Speaker 3: Band for me, it was a really that was we 989 00:53:53,360 --> 00:53:57,160 Speaker 3: were kind of we had one specialty thing, you know, 990 00:53:57,200 --> 00:54:00,319 Speaker 3: that we did. We weren't as diverse, we weren't as 991 00:54:02,000 --> 00:54:05,080 Speaker 3: multi dimensional with our material. I felt like to me 992 00:54:05,280 --> 00:54:08,520 Speaker 3: as as Union Station was. There was just I was 993 00:54:08,560 --> 00:54:10,640 Speaker 3: fascinated with the way they were just they seemed like 994 00:54:10,680 --> 00:54:13,520 Speaker 3: they were outside of music altogether. They could do anything. 995 00:54:13,560 --> 00:54:15,880 Speaker 3: I don't know, it just it seemed so big to 996 00:54:15,920 --> 00:54:20,279 Speaker 3: me when I got when I got the call to 997 00:54:20,320 --> 00:54:23,280 Speaker 3: go back the second time, I couldn't say I couldn't 998 00:54:23,280 --> 00:54:26,160 Speaker 3: say no. I wanted to be a part of that 999 00:54:26,280 --> 00:54:29,680 Speaker 3: type of music that was not just the same song 1000 00:54:29,760 --> 00:54:32,160 Speaker 3: over and over again that I felt like I was 1001 00:54:32,200 --> 00:54:33,960 Speaker 3: doing with the Lonesome River Band. By that point, I 1002 00:54:34,080 --> 00:54:37,440 Speaker 3: was a little bit over what we were doing and 1003 00:54:37,560 --> 00:54:39,040 Speaker 3: ready to ready to be with Alison. 1004 00:54:39,840 --> 00:54:44,120 Speaker 2: Okay, just to be very specific, because the way you 1005 00:54:44,120 --> 00:54:47,040 Speaker 2: said the story earlier that you wanted to be the 1006 00:54:47,080 --> 00:54:51,040 Speaker 2: banjo player, but somebody else got that role. And then 1007 00:54:51,080 --> 00:54:54,560 Speaker 2: she asked if you could play guitar, So literally, you're 1008 00:54:54,600 --> 00:54:57,640 Speaker 2: playing in the rondsome river band, you're making these records. 1009 00:54:58,239 --> 00:55:00,840 Speaker 2: She got a hold of you and said, did you 1010 00:55:00,840 --> 00:55:03,359 Speaker 2: want to play banjo on a granulartle level? 1011 00:55:03,400 --> 00:55:05,520 Speaker 3: What? No, I never got a I never got a 1012 00:55:05,520 --> 00:55:08,520 Speaker 3: banjo offer for Alison in Union Station. With the times 1013 00:55:08,600 --> 00:55:11,320 Speaker 3: when I when I had befriended that whole bunch. The 1014 00:55:11,360 --> 00:55:13,239 Speaker 3: whole time I was with the Lonesome River Band, I 1015 00:55:13,239 --> 00:55:15,239 Speaker 3: would still go to the Allison shows if I could 1016 00:55:15,239 --> 00:55:18,000 Speaker 3: make one, and sometimes I would jump up on stage 1017 00:55:18,160 --> 00:55:19,600 Speaker 3: and sing a song with her, you know, I would 1018 00:55:19,600 --> 00:55:22,479 Speaker 3: guest up on stage and do a song here there. 1019 00:55:23,960 --> 00:55:26,200 Speaker 3: In my mind, I always wanted to be the banjo 1020 00:55:26,280 --> 00:55:29,160 Speaker 3: player in that band. I always hope that if Alison 1021 00:55:29,239 --> 00:55:32,000 Speaker 3: Brown were ever to leave, that she would ask me 1022 00:55:32,040 --> 00:55:34,680 Speaker 3: to play banjo. And when they got ron Block in 1023 00:55:34,719 --> 00:55:37,520 Speaker 3: that band, it was just settled. You know. I was 1024 00:55:37,560 --> 00:55:40,399 Speaker 3: out of that altogether. Same thing with the Lonesome River Band. 1025 00:55:40,400 --> 00:55:42,319 Speaker 3: When I took that Lonesome River Band job, I thought 1026 00:55:42,320 --> 00:55:45,600 Speaker 3: I was taking the banjo job, and I only played. 1027 00:55:45,640 --> 00:55:47,640 Speaker 3: I only ever played one show on the banjo with 1028 00:55:47,680 --> 00:55:50,560 Speaker 3: the Lonesome River Band because they needed both. And they 1029 00:55:50,600 --> 00:55:52,640 Speaker 3: said we could find a banjo player if you'd be 1030 00:55:52,680 --> 00:55:55,680 Speaker 3: willing to play the mandolin. So I said, sure, I'll 1031 00:55:55,680 --> 00:55:57,880 Speaker 3: play mandolin until we can find the right guy, and 1032 00:55:57,920 --> 00:55:59,640 Speaker 3: then I'll play band. You know, I never did get 1033 00:55:59,640 --> 00:56:02,960 Speaker 3: to play banjo, which was the whole point for me 1034 00:56:03,040 --> 00:56:06,480 Speaker 3: growing up. Playing was all I ever wanted to do 1035 00:56:06,600 --> 00:56:09,040 Speaker 3: was play a banjo for any band, right that was 1036 00:56:09,040 --> 00:56:11,759 Speaker 3: my that was my dream. But no, I got the 1037 00:56:11,800 --> 00:56:15,480 Speaker 3: guitar job with Alison, you know after well wait, just. 1038 00:56:15,640 --> 00:56:17,520 Speaker 2: A little bit slower, you know. 1039 00:56:19,160 --> 00:56:22,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, in order, I took the job with the Lonesome 1040 00:56:22,239 --> 00:56:26,640 Speaker 3: River Band, right. I played with the Lonesome River Band 1041 00:56:27,600 --> 00:56:32,520 Speaker 3: for three or four years before I think close to 1042 00:56:32,600 --> 00:56:36,719 Speaker 3: four years before I moved over to Alison. I moved 1043 00:56:36,760 --> 00:56:39,200 Speaker 3: to Alison Crouse Union Station, played for about four or 1044 00:56:39,239 --> 00:56:41,920 Speaker 3: five months, went back to the Lonesome River Band and 1045 00:56:41,960 --> 00:56:43,279 Speaker 3: played for No, No, No No. 1046 00:56:43,440 --> 00:56:44,319 Speaker 2: I got the order. 1047 00:56:44,360 --> 00:56:45,800 Speaker 3: Oh okay, I'm missing the question. 1048 00:56:46,000 --> 00:56:52,000 Speaker 2: So you go on stage, somebody calls you and says, hey, 1049 00:56:52,239 --> 00:56:53,920 Speaker 2: we want you in the band, but you got to 1050 00:56:53,920 --> 00:56:56,520 Speaker 2: play guitar. How does it literally go down? 1051 00:56:57,920 --> 00:57:01,160 Speaker 3: Oh? How it goes down? Was on April twenty fifth 1052 00:57:01,200 --> 00:57:05,160 Speaker 3: at Merle Watson Memorial Bluegrass Festival. I was getting ready 1053 00:57:05,160 --> 00:57:09,200 Speaker 3: to go and play with Alison, you know, a guest 1054 00:57:09,239 --> 00:57:11,200 Speaker 3: spot and ether she was playing at Merle Fest and 1055 00:57:11,239 --> 00:57:12,919 Speaker 3: I was going to go up and play a guest 1056 00:57:12,960 --> 00:57:15,839 Speaker 3: spot as I normally was, as I was doing at 1057 00:57:15,840 --> 00:57:17,560 Speaker 3: that endy time, I was around him. I was getting 1058 00:57:17,600 --> 00:57:20,840 Speaker 3: up because we were friends. I was jamming with him and 1059 00:57:21,520 --> 00:57:25,760 Speaker 3: Tim Stafford came up to me and said, hey, Dan, 1060 00:57:25,800 --> 00:57:30,080 Speaker 3: I want to talk to you because I'm getting ready 1061 00:57:30,080 --> 00:57:32,240 Speaker 3: to put my notice in with Alison, and I feel 1062 00:57:32,320 --> 00:57:35,360 Speaker 3: like she's going to come running to you directly, so 1063 00:57:35,480 --> 00:57:38,120 Speaker 3: I wanted you to have some time to think about 1064 00:57:38,120 --> 00:57:42,520 Speaker 3: it before she puts you on the spot, just as 1065 00:57:42,560 --> 00:57:46,920 Speaker 3: a courtesy. Right. So, now I'm really nervous, and I'm thinking, well, okay, 1066 00:57:46,960 --> 00:57:48,920 Speaker 3: he's gonna quit. That doesn't mean she's going to come 1067 00:57:48,960 --> 00:57:53,280 Speaker 3: to me, right And then it couldn't have been half 1068 00:57:53,280 --> 00:57:56,760 Speaker 3: an hour later I see her be lining towards me. 1069 00:57:57,240 --> 00:58:00,760 Speaker 3: She goes Dan, She said, I need to ask you 1070 00:58:00,800 --> 00:58:03,439 Speaker 3: a question, and I said, okay, what do you got? 1071 00:58:04,320 --> 00:58:09,120 Speaker 3: She said, Tim Stafford just put in his notice. She said, 1072 00:58:09,400 --> 00:58:15,880 Speaker 3: do you want the job? And I said, I absolutely 1073 00:58:16,400 --> 00:58:18,640 Speaker 3: would would love to, you know, like, oh my god, 1074 00:58:18,640 --> 00:58:21,000 Speaker 3: I would love the job on guitar. I said, yeah, 1075 00:58:21,080 --> 00:58:25,080 Speaker 3: what do I gotta do? And the only thing that 1076 00:58:25,160 --> 00:58:31,240 Speaker 3: she said was I don't want you smoking wheed and 1077 00:58:31,360 --> 00:58:37,439 Speaker 3: I said, no problem, that's a deal. And I took 1078 00:58:37,480 --> 00:58:42,000 Speaker 3: the job and couldn't couldn't imagine what, you know, what 1079 00:58:42,960 --> 00:58:46,080 Speaker 3: that job would ultimately bring to my life. I mean again, 1080 00:58:46,200 --> 00:58:48,400 Speaker 3: that was and then, of course I had that job 1081 00:58:48,440 --> 00:58:51,280 Speaker 3: for about five months until I felt so guilty about 1082 00:58:51,360 --> 00:58:54,360 Speaker 3: leaving the Lonesome Riverband that I went back. But yeah, 1083 00:58:54,360 --> 00:58:57,320 Speaker 3: she came to me at a bluegrass festival and said, well, 1084 00:58:57,320 --> 00:58:59,200 Speaker 3: actually the first thing she said, she says, hey, I'm 1085 00:58:59,200 --> 00:59:00,640 Speaker 3: not going to be able to have you sing with 1086 00:59:00,720 --> 00:59:04,840 Speaker 3: us today, and I said, okay, cool. And then of 1087 00:59:04,880 --> 00:59:06,959 Speaker 3: course she explained why and asked me if I wanted 1088 00:59:06,960 --> 00:59:07,880 Speaker 3: the job, and I said. 1089 00:59:07,720 --> 00:59:15,240 Speaker 2: Sure, Okay, when you join Alison Kraus, you know, she's 1090 00:59:15,320 --> 00:59:20,280 Speaker 2: this teenage phenom. Then she's getting some credibility credit she 1091 00:59:20,320 --> 00:59:24,280 Speaker 2: always had credibility, She's getting more outside of the bluegrass world, 1092 00:59:24,320 --> 00:59:28,440 Speaker 2: getting more acclaim. Then she has a hit with baby 1093 00:59:28,600 --> 00:59:31,680 Speaker 2: Now That I've Found You. Then she has a song 1094 00:59:31,920 --> 00:59:35,400 Speaker 2: moments like this on the Twister soundtrack, the original nineteen 1095 00:59:35,440 --> 00:59:39,560 Speaker 2: ninety six Twister. Have that happened? Where was that relative 1096 00:59:39,600 --> 00:59:40,440 Speaker 2: to your tenure? 1097 00:59:41,400 --> 00:59:44,320 Speaker 3: I was coming on right in the so I jumped 1098 00:59:44,360 --> 00:59:47,560 Speaker 3: on board right in time to be on the Baby 1099 00:59:47,560 --> 00:59:51,720 Speaker 3: Now that I Found You track. That was my entrance 1100 00:59:51,720 --> 00:59:53,760 Speaker 3: into the band. When she was doing the Baby I was, 1101 00:59:53,800 --> 00:59:56,200 Speaker 3: I was on the Twister track, and you know, of 1102 00:59:56,200 --> 00:59:59,120 Speaker 3: course everything from from Baby Now that I Found You on. 1103 01:00:00,800 --> 01:00:03,200 Speaker 2: Just to stop there for a second. I mean that 1104 01:00:03,240 --> 01:00:05,760 Speaker 2: had been a hit in the sixties by the Foundations, 1105 01:00:05,800 --> 01:00:09,560 Speaker 2: I believe. Did anybody there think that, Wow, this is 1106 01:00:09,560 --> 01:00:10,480 Speaker 2: going to be hit record. 1107 01:00:13,280 --> 01:00:17,600 Speaker 3: I have never No, it's my short answer. No. No, 1108 01:00:17,720 --> 01:00:19,840 Speaker 3: I mean at least I sure didn't. I mean, you 1109 01:00:19,880 --> 01:00:22,840 Speaker 3: get you get used to kind of putting bluegrass or 1110 01:00:22,880 --> 01:00:25,680 Speaker 3: anything that's even related to it in this little box 1111 01:00:25,720 --> 01:00:29,080 Speaker 3: of you know, something that's set aside from mainstream or 1112 01:00:29,120 --> 01:00:33,360 Speaker 3: you know, popular music, so you never think hit song, 1113 01:00:34,000 --> 01:00:35,960 Speaker 3: you know, like that. When when we did Baby, you 1114 01:00:36,000 --> 01:00:41,280 Speaker 3: know Baby Now that I found I mean I remember 1115 01:00:42,440 --> 01:00:44,400 Speaker 3: again that was one of the things I loved about 1116 01:00:44,440 --> 01:00:48,560 Speaker 3: the band was that they didn't necessarily tried to conform 1117 01:00:48,600 --> 01:00:52,000 Speaker 3: to a bluegrass mold. They just played music with those 1118 01:00:52,000 --> 01:00:55,000 Speaker 3: bluegrass instruments. Didn't matter what the music was, they just played. 1119 01:00:55,160 --> 01:00:59,880 Speaker 3: They had We were a bluegrass oriented, you know, pop band. 1120 01:01:01,040 --> 01:01:03,000 Speaker 3: She played everything, and I remember Baby Now that I 1121 01:01:03,040 --> 01:01:07,760 Speaker 3: found you. First of all, I think that had drums 1122 01:01:08,160 --> 01:01:10,040 Speaker 3: that had a little bit of percussion on it, and 1123 01:01:10,080 --> 01:01:13,120 Speaker 3: I remember I've always that at that time, I had 1124 01:01:13,120 --> 01:01:15,040 Speaker 3: a little stigma with anything. It's like, man, you know, 1125 01:01:15,040 --> 01:01:17,800 Speaker 3: bluegrass music doesn't have to have the drums. Man, I thought, 1126 01:01:18,160 --> 01:01:19,760 Speaker 3: stepping out. I don't know if that's a good idea, 1127 01:01:19,760 --> 01:01:22,600 Speaker 3: if it's a bad idea. But the truth is that 1128 01:01:22,760 --> 01:01:25,280 Speaker 3: every time, you know, she did something different and that 1129 01:01:25,400 --> 01:01:27,640 Speaker 3: was you know, and stretched in the music it was 1130 01:01:28,280 --> 01:01:30,480 Speaker 3: it was exciting for me. So to get to be 1131 01:01:30,600 --> 01:01:33,200 Speaker 3: on that I didn't know. I didn't I didn't even 1132 01:01:33,320 --> 01:01:36,480 Speaker 3: consider whether a song like that could be a hit 1133 01:01:37,080 --> 01:01:40,680 Speaker 3: or could be you know, looked at in popular music, 1134 01:01:40,720 --> 01:01:45,400 Speaker 3: and then you know, boom, the majority kind of grabbed 1135 01:01:45,440 --> 01:01:45,840 Speaker 3: onto it. 1136 01:01:53,880 --> 01:01:59,400 Speaker 2: Okay, so you joined at that time. Obviously the year 1137 01:01:59,440 --> 01:02:02,440 Speaker 2: two thousand with the Old Brother soundtrack is a turning 1138 01:02:02,480 --> 01:02:06,560 Speaker 2: point for you personally. But in that interim, that five 1139 01:02:06,680 --> 01:02:09,360 Speaker 2: or so years with Alison Krause, tell me about that. 1140 01:02:12,800 --> 01:02:15,720 Speaker 3: Best time in my life, I mean interesting time in 1141 01:02:15,760 --> 01:02:18,280 Speaker 3: my life. We're talking about now I have kids for 1142 01:02:18,320 --> 01:02:20,320 Speaker 3: the first time in my life. So now I'm juggling. 1143 01:02:20,800 --> 01:02:23,320 Speaker 2: Well, let's just stop for the second here. Where and 1144 01:02:23,320 --> 01:02:24,520 Speaker 2: when do you meet your wife? 1145 01:02:26,960 --> 01:02:30,000 Speaker 3: I meet my wife right before I moved to Virginia 1146 01:02:30,040 --> 01:02:33,280 Speaker 3: to join the Lonesome River Band. I met her maybe 1147 01:02:33,440 --> 01:02:38,000 Speaker 3: a month or a month and a half maybe a 1148 01:02:38,000 --> 01:02:39,960 Speaker 3: couple months before I left. I just I had just 1149 01:02:40,040 --> 01:02:41,880 Speaker 3: met her, and then I moved to Virginia. 1150 01:02:43,440 --> 01:02:45,000 Speaker 2: She was in Vermont. 1151 01:02:45,280 --> 01:02:47,720 Speaker 3: She was in Vermont. I met her from Vermont. 1152 01:02:47,760 --> 01:02:51,960 Speaker 2: Okay, Okay, you moved to Virginia. Then what happens with 1153 01:02:52,000 --> 01:02:52,800 Speaker 2: the relationship. 1154 01:02:53,760 --> 01:02:55,640 Speaker 3: Well, so I moved to Virginia with a with a 1155 01:02:55,800 --> 01:02:58,080 Speaker 3: very good friend of mine. His name is Tag Leon, 1156 01:02:58,160 --> 01:03:02,920 Speaker 3: who I really credit with gosh, maybe my whole career, 1157 01:03:03,080 --> 01:03:06,080 Speaker 3: because I would not have moved to Virginia to join 1158 01:03:06,120 --> 01:03:08,680 Speaker 3: the Lonesome River Band if my buddy hadn't said I'll 1159 01:03:08,680 --> 01:03:11,680 Speaker 3: go with you. Because I told them the circumstances. I said, 1160 01:03:11,720 --> 01:03:14,360 Speaker 3: I'd never be able to afford it. It seems impossible, 1161 01:03:14,400 --> 01:03:16,320 Speaker 3: you know. I was. I wanted to take the job, 1162 01:03:16,320 --> 01:03:18,000 Speaker 3: but I didn't know that I could. And Tag was 1163 01:03:18,040 --> 01:03:20,880 Speaker 3: the one who gave me the the push, said hey, 1164 01:03:21,000 --> 01:03:23,640 Speaker 3: I'll go with you. So my buddy moved down with 1165 01:03:23,720 --> 01:03:26,280 Speaker 3: me to Virginia for the first I think four or 1166 01:03:26,280 --> 01:03:29,400 Speaker 3: five months, which, of course, I maintained a long distance 1167 01:03:29,440 --> 01:03:35,320 Speaker 3: relationship with Alisa, my first wife, and ultimately she moved 1168 01:03:35,320 --> 01:03:37,720 Speaker 3: in when Tag moved out, like a half a year later, 1169 01:03:38,360 --> 01:03:41,480 Speaker 3: and I've you know, she moved to Virginia to be 1170 01:03:41,560 --> 01:03:43,600 Speaker 3: with me, and then we got married a couple of 1171 01:03:43,640 --> 01:03:44,120 Speaker 3: years later. 1172 01:03:45,480 --> 01:03:47,760 Speaker 2: So you said she was your first wife. How many 1173 01:03:47,800 --> 01:03:48,880 Speaker 2: times you've been married. 1174 01:03:50,400 --> 01:03:55,080 Speaker 3: Twice? I was twice. I was with Alisa, my first wife, 1175 01:03:55,640 --> 01:04:03,439 Speaker 3: through most most of my career until eleven twelve years ago, 1176 01:04:05,160 --> 01:04:08,280 Speaker 3: and I've been with my new wife now for four years. 1177 01:04:09,560 --> 01:04:14,800 Speaker 2: To what degree did being a traveling musician negatively impact 1178 01:04:14,880 --> 01:04:19,000 Speaker 2: your first marriage and how does one maintain a steady 1179 01:04:19,040 --> 01:04:21,040 Speaker 2: home life being a traveling musician. 1180 01:04:25,120 --> 01:04:27,040 Speaker 3: That's a good question, and I don't think there's any 1181 01:04:27,080 --> 01:04:31,560 Speaker 3: one formula. It depends on the two individuals and how 1182 01:04:31,680 --> 01:04:35,320 Speaker 3: they are compatible with each other. I mean, my wife 1183 01:04:35,400 --> 01:04:37,680 Speaker 3: knew what I did when she moved down. She knew 1184 01:04:37,720 --> 01:04:40,960 Speaker 3: I was a musician. It was always music first. But 1185 01:04:41,240 --> 01:04:44,520 Speaker 3: the truth of the matter is as you spend more. 1186 01:04:44,600 --> 01:04:47,480 Speaker 3: And I mean I had years where I was home 1187 01:04:47,520 --> 01:04:51,120 Speaker 3: a lot. I had years where I was not home 1188 01:04:52,040 --> 01:04:55,480 Speaker 3: at all, just so busy, just gone most of the year. 1189 01:04:57,400 --> 01:04:59,960 Speaker 3: I can't imagine what it's like to be the person 1190 01:05:00,760 --> 01:05:05,640 Speaker 3: left at home while someone else is gone. I can't, 1191 01:05:06,960 --> 01:05:09,440 Speaker 3: you know. I've tried to wrap my mind around that, 1192 01:05:09,560 --> 01:05:11,880 Speaker 3: and I just I think it takes a special person 1193 01:05:11,960 --> 01:05:15,360 Speaker 3: to be able to be married to a musician and 1194 01:05:15,560 --> 01:05:18,240 Speaker 3: allow that much of your time with that person to 1195 01:05:18,320 --> 01:05:21,920 Speaker 3: be away. And again, it's easier to be connected now, 1196 01:05:22,120 --> 01:05:25,080 Speaker 3: I think than it is or than it was in 1197 01:05:25,800 --> 01:05:28,680 Speaker 3: that era where now you have FaceTime and you like, 1198 01:05:28,720 --> 01:05:31,320 Speaker 3: you can feel like you're right there with someone anytime 1199 01:05:31,400 --> 01:05:34,360 Speaker 3: you want. I didn't have that with my first marriage, right, 1200 01:05:34,400 --> 01:05:38,640 Speaker 3: So just different. A lot of time away makes it 1201 01:05:38,760 --> 01:05:41,160 Speaker 3: very difficult, you know, in a host of many ways, 1202 01:05:41,320 --> 01:05:44,720 Speaker 3: for different reasons, for different people. You know, I thought 1203 01:05:44,760 --> 01:05:48,160 Speaker 3: things were were fine right up until the day I 1204 01:05:49,280 --> 01:05:53,880 Speaker 3: discovered that they weren't right I was. I was informed 1205 01:05:53,920 --> 01:05:56,560 Speaker 3: one day that it wasn't fine and that it was 1206 01:05:56,600 --> 01:06:00,560 Speaker 3: going to have to you know, And I never I 1207 01:06:00,600 --> 01:06:02,480 Speaker 3: never dreamed, because in my mind I didn't. If I 1208 01:06:02,520 --> 01:06:06,120 Speaker 3: was home three days a year, that's what I was home. 1209 01:06:06,160 --> 01:06:08,760 Speaker 3: I was. I'm still, I'm married, I'm a dad. This 1210 01:06:08,800 --> 01:06:11,840 Speaker 3: is what I do. You just you just take it, however, 1211 01:06:11,880 --> 01:06:14,520 Speaker 3: you know, you just do whatever you can. I think, 1212 01:06:15,280 --> 01:06:18,400 Speaker 3: you know, who knows if I would have if it 1213 01:06:18,400 --> 01:06:20,480 Speaker 3: would have been a different point in time, or in 1214 01:06:20,560 --> 01:06:24,040 Speaker 3: some ways tried harder, or if just been ultimately closer. 1215 01:06:24,120 --> 01:06:27,800 Speaker 3: You know, I got married to a person when I 1216 01:06:27,880 --> 01:06:30,560 Speaker 3: was when I was young, and I don't think either 1217 01:06:30,600 --> 01:06:33,720 Speaker 3: of us necessarily knew what we wanted long term and 1218 01:06:33,800 --> 01:06:37,680 Speaker 3: a person we just both came from relate from upbringings 1219 01:06:37,720 --> 01:06:41,040 Speaker 3: where we wanted someone that would be peaceful and easy 1220 01:06:41,040 --> 01:06:44,120 Speaker 3: to be around. And that was the common ground that 1221 01:06:44,160 --> 01:06:47,080 Speaker 3: I had with my first wife. We just didn't fight, 1222 01:06:47,560 --> 01:06:52,320 Speaker 3: We didn't argue, we didn't we just we just both 1223 01:06:52,360 --> 01:06:54,720 Speaker 3: had the we're going to get along. If there ever 1224 01:06:54,920 --> 01:06:58,000 Speaker 3: was anything that started to be like turmoil or negative, 1225 01:06:59,280 --> 01:07:01,560 Speaker 3: we just moved and shifted gears and went on to 1226 01:07:01,640 --> 01:07:04,600 Speaker 3: something else and just and just lived. And it worked 1227 01:07:04,640 --> 01:07:06,360 Speaker 3: for me and it didn't work for her. 1228 01:07:08,400 --> 01:07:11,400 Speaker 2: So how many kids do you have in what are 1229 01:07:11,440 --> 01:07:11,880 Speaker 2: they up to? 1230 01:07:12,000 --> 01:07:17,880 Speaker 3: Now? I have three children of my own and now 1231 01:07:17,920 --> 01:07:20,200 Speaker 3: my my new wife has children, so we have we're 1232 01:07:20,240 --> 01:07:22,880 Speaker 3: a brady bunch. Now she has three and I'm a 1233 01:07:22,920 --> 01:07:25,560 Speaker 3: grandpa with three of mine and then have a step 1234 01:07:25,600 --> 01:07:29,200 Speaker 3: grandchild of my my new wife has a grandchild. So 1235 01:07:29,560 --> 01:07:33,080 Speaker 3: my kids are you know, they're they're all grown and 1236 01:07:33,160 --> 01:07:35,080 Speaker 3: doing their own thing now. I mean they're they're I 1237 01:07:35,160 --> 01:07:38,400 Speaker 3: have my daughter hard to believe is now in her thirties, 1238 01:07:38,440 --> 01:07:41,960 Speaker 3: but they're like they're they're twenty seven, twenty nine, and 1239 01:07:42,000 --> 01:07:43,680 Speaker 3: thirty one. So and let you know, I had them 1240 01:07:43,680 --> 01:07:48,920 Speaker 3: every two years. And both my boys are into golf. 1241 01:07:49,040 --> 01:07:54,400 Speaker 3: They are exceptional golfers and are both in caddy program. 1242 01:07:54,400 --> 01:07:59,320 Speaker 3: They're they're they're both golf caddies. And when they're not 1243 01:08:00,080 --> 01:08:02,880 Speaker 3: when they're not caddy, they're on the course playing. They 1244 01:08:02,920 --> 01:08:04,680 Speaker 3: they're on a golf course every day they can be. 1245 01:08:06,000 --> 01:08:09,880 Speaker 3: My daughter lives in uh in, Kentucky with her husband 1246 01:08:10,000 --> 01:08:14,680 Speaker 3: and three children and is one of the most amazing 1247 01:08:14,880 --> 01:08:21,080 Speaker 3: people I know. I could go on, are you get this? 1248 01:08:21,200 --> 01:08:24,200 Speaker 3: You know it's you know, are your kids off the payroll? 1249 01:08:26,040 --> 01:08:28,519 Speaker 3: My kids have been off the payroll for for so man, 1250 01:08:28,600 --> 01:08:32,200 Speaker 3: My kids were not. I had the three easiest kids 1251 01:08:32,360 --> 01:08:36,599 Speaker 3: that literally asked for nothing, wanted nothing, all went their 1252 01:08:36,800 --> 01:08:40,320 Speaker 3: their own way quickly upon growing. I mean they yeah, 1253 01:08:40,400 --> 01:08:44,560 Speaker 3: my kids have been self sustaining most of most of 1254 01:08:44,600 --> 01:08:46,960 Speaker 3: their lives. They were I had three pretty easy ones. 1255 01:08:47,000 --> 01:08:49,080 Speaker 3: I mean, you know, I went through it and in 1256 01:08:49,120 --> 01:08:51,320 Speaker 3: some situations, you know, I went through with my daughter 1257 01:08:51,400 --> 01:08:54,599 Speaker 3: and at at one point in time, my daughter ended 1258 01:08:54,680 --> 01:08:57,920 Speaker 3: up with UH with a drug problem in her late 1259 01:08:58,000 --> 01:09:01,800 Speaker 3: teens and had to seek some some help. And I, 1260 01:09:02,000 --> 01:09:04,799 Speaker 3: you know, I spent some while a while really afraid 1261 01:09:04,800 --> 01:09:08,200 Speaker 3: I was going to lose her. It broke my heart 1262 01:09:08,240 --> 01:09:09,920 Speaker 3: because I felt like it was a point in time 1263 01:09:09,960 --> 01:09:11,720 Speaker 3: that I wasn't there for her in a way that 1264 01:09:11,760 --> 01:09:15,519 Speaker 3: I could have been. And ultimately she she got some 1265 01:09:15,640 --> 01:09:17,800 Speaker 3: help and and I learned some things along the way, 1266 01:09:17,840 --> 01:09:20,800 Speaker 3: and she is in the minority of numbers of people 1267 01:09:20,800 --> 01:09:23,719 Speaker 3: who have the type of problem that that she had 1268 01:09:24,200 --> 01:09:28,000 Speaker 3: and turn it around and is now one of the 1269 01:09:28,040 --> 01:09:30,639 Speaker 3: most Like went back to school and got her high 1270 01:09:30,640 --> 01:09:32,120 Speaker 3: school She had drop out of high school and went 1271 01:09:32,120 --> 01:09:33,680 Speaker 3: back got her high school degree, then went got a 1272 01:09:33,680 --> 01:09:37,320 Speaker 3: college degree, getting a got a nursing degree. She's, uh, 1273 01:09:37,960 --> 01:09:41,280 Speaker 3: she's a powerhouse. She's she's had three kids, you know, 1274 01:09:41,360 --> 01:09:43,840 Speaker 3: and because of the drug problem. Three natural child no 1275 01:09:43,880 --> 01:09:47,519 Speaker 3: two natural child birth, just twins. She had twins naturally. 1276 01:09:49,160 --> 01:09:52,479 Speaker 3: Her husband and her her husband now and her both 1277 01:09:52,520 --> 01:09:55,759 Speaker 3: really they've they devoted their life now to to rehab 1278 01:09:55,800 --> 01:09:58,479 Speaker 3: and getting other people clean. And uh, he has a 1279 01:09:58,520 --> 01:10:00,679 Speaker 3: corporate job in Kentucky at one of the big rehab 1280 01:10:00,720 --> 01:10:04,240 Speaker 3: centers down there, and right now she's at home still 1281 01:10:04,320 --> 01:10:07,760 Speaker 3: somehow going to school and raising three kids. She's like 1282 01:10:08,040 --> 01:10:13,280 Speaker 3: the powerhouse of women that you could ever find. Exceptional person. 1283 01:10:13,720 --> 01:10:17,800 Speaker 2: You said that going through her addiction and rehab, you 1284 01:10:17,960 --> 01:10:21,200 Speaker 2: learned a few things. What did you learn about yourself? 1285 01:10:22,120 --> 01:10:24,599 Speaker 3: You had to go through forty hours as a parent, 1286 01:10:24,680 --> 01:10:27,559 Speaker 3: so she had to do thirty days in this place. 1287 01:10:27,600 --> 01:10:31,120 Speaker 3: Where as a parent and as the person who had 1288 01:10:31,120 --> 01:10:33,840 Speaker 3: to spend like I think it was close to forty 1289 01:10:33,840 --> 01:10:36,240 Speaker 3: five thousand dollars was the check that I had to 1290 01:10:36,280 --> 01:10:39,799 Speaker 3: write for that one. You had to do forty hours 1291 01:10:41,760 --> 01:10:46,720 Speaker 3: of schooling yourself as a parent. And I thought I 1292 01:10:46,800 --> 01:10:50,400 Speaker 3: knew a lot more because I had fought my battle 1293 01:10:50,439 --> 01:10:53,920 Speaker 3: with drugs. Right, I had done everything you could do. Like, Okay, 1294 01:10:54,280 --> 01:10:57,160 Speaker 3: I didn't do heroin. I didn't know what heroin was. 1295 01:10:57,200 --> 01:11:00,360 Speaker 3: That wasn't luckily it was never presented to me. Probably 1296 01:11:00,400 --> 01:11:04,040 Speaker 3: would have done it as a younger person. But when 1297 01:11:04,040 --> 01:11:10,920 Speaker 3: I when I ultimately learned about addiction and learned what 1298 01:11:10,920 --> 01:11:14,120 Speaker 3: what some people have control over others don't have control over, 1299 01:11:14,240 --> 01:11:20,519 Speaker 3: I found that I myself. The lesson for me was 1300 01:11:20,600 --> 01:11:22,559 Speaker 3: I thought I always looked at it as a way 1301 01:11:22,600 --> 01:11:28,240 Speaker 3: where man, if you know it's killing you just say no, right, 1302 01:11:29,200 --> 01:11:32,240 Speaker 3: I just had this this common sense that Okay, enough 1303 01:11:32,280 --> 01:11:35,960 Speaker 3: is enough, you know, if it's hurting you stop it already, right, 1304 01:11:37,439 --> 01:11:39,880 Speaker 3: And it wasn't until I did my my forty hours, 1305 01:11:39,920 --> 01:11:42,680 Speaker 3: you know, in the program, until a doctor put it 1306 01:11:42,680 --> 01:11:45,320 Speaker 3: to me like this, And I wasn't aware of the 1307 01:11:45,360 --> 01:11:49,479 Speaker 3: stat that one out of ten human beings have an 1308 01:11:49,520 --> 01:11:52,320 Speaker 3: attict gene that if they do get addicted to something, 1309 01:11:52,600 --> 01:11:54,800 Speaker 3: they stay addicted to it. Even if they come off it, 1310 01:11:54,840 --> 01:11:58,600 Speaker 3: there's still they're an addict for life. One out of 1311 01:11:58,640 --> 01:12:04,040 Speaker 3: those ten people are unlucky. Right. Well, for me, I 1312 01:12:04,320 --> 01:12:06,840 Speaker 3: fell into the category of someone who could say no. 1313 01:12:07,000 --> 01:12:12,520 Speaker 3: I mean I have been addicted to different things, horrible things, 1314 01:12:14,360 --> 01:12:17,960 Speaker 3: but was able to say enough is enough. I could 1315 01:12:18,000 --> 01:12:21,960 Speaker 3: say no, and a true addict can't say no. And 1316 01:12:22,000 --> 01:12:23,880 Speaker 3: a doctor explained it to me like this. He said, 1317 01:12:23,960 --> 01:12:26,320 Speaker 3: it is it, he says. Try to understand this. If 1318 01:12:26,320 --> 01:12:29,840 Speaker 3: you were a diabetic and you needed insulin to stay 1319 01:12:29,880 --> 01:12:33,960 Speaker 3: alive and someone looked at you and said, damn, it 1320 01:12:34,040 --> 01:12:37,559 Speaker 3: just make more insolent, he said, that's what it's like 1321 01:12:37,640 --> 01:12:40,680 Speaker 3: to be a true addict. You just don't have the 1322 01:12:40,720 --> 01:12:43,519 Speaker 3: ability to say just say no. It's a matter of 1323 01:12:43,640 --> 01:12:47,240 Speaker 3: life or death to an addict in a different way 1324 01:12:47,240 --> 01:12:51,479 Speaker 3: than I saw it, So I never looked at addiction 1325 01:12:52,000 --> 01:12:54,639 Speaker 3: that way. I looked at it as people just making 1326 01:12:54,680 --> 01:12:58,240 Speaker 3: bad choices. And though sometimes it is that, as often 1327 01:12:58,280 --> 01:13:01,640 Speaker 3: as not, it's people introduced to something that they no 1328 01:13:01,720 --> 01:13:04,800 Speaker 3: longer have a power to say no to. And those 1329 01:13:04,800 --> 01:13:08,920 Speaker 3: are the people who need a community around them to 1330 01:13:09,000 --> 01:13:13,000 Speaker 3: help them. And it's it's again I've said for a 1331 01:13:13,040 --> 01:13:15,760 Speaker 3: lifetime that what I love about Bluegrass was the community. 1332 01:13:15,800 --> 01:13:19,599 Speaker 3: It's what saved me. It's where I felt safe. It's 1333 01:13:19,600 --> 01:13:22,519 Speaker 3: the same way through through the rehab process. You know, 1334 01:13:22,640 --> 01:13:27,080 Speaker 3: the community had to change before the habits changed. And 1335 01:13:28,200 --> 01:13:30,000 Speaker 3: she dug her way out of an enormous hole that 1336 01:13:30,040 --> 01:13:33,360 Speaker 3: I'm just so proud of, you know, because she has that. 1337 01:13:33,400 --> 01:13:36,639 Speaker 3: And then in turn, once she started having children, couldn't 1338 01:13:36,640 --> 01:13:39,560 Speaker 3: take any pain medicine to have these have these children, 1339 01:13:39,840 --> 01:13:42,320 Speaker 3: and I just thought, wow, you know, how do you 1340 01:13:42,400 --> 01:13:43,880 Speaker 3: how do you? How do you have twins? How do 1341 01:13:43,920 --> 01:13:48,679 Speaker 3: you have one? You know, forget about twins. So it's 1342 01:13:48,760 --> 01:13:51,439 Speaker 3: it was, you know, it was an experience, but again 1343 01:13:51,880 --> 01:13:54,880 Speaker 3: part of the building block whatever. You know. However, she 1344 01:13:55,080 --> 01:13:57,200 Speaker 3: was being prepared to be the person she needs to 1345 01:13:57,200 --> 01:14:00,479 Speaker 3: be right now. I mean, she's the strongest person that 1346 01:14:00,600 --> 01:14:04,360 Speaker 3: you could probably find. And uh, and I just she 1347 01:14:04,520 --> 01:14:07,120 Speaker 3: just sent me a video too. She just uh she 1348 01:14:07,240 --> 01:14:12,040 Speaker 3: just got baptized, uh a week ago and she sent 1349 01:14:12,040 --> 01:14:14,160 Speaker 3: me a video and I just I just couldn't believe 1350 01:14:14,200 --> 01:14:18,280 Speaker 3: it because she's a stubborn one. And uh, as she 1351 01:14:18,360 --> 01:14:21,800 Speaker 3: put to me, you know, after she says, you know, 1352 01:14:22,000 --> 01:14:23,760 Speaker 3: she says, you know, I'm a stubborn one. She says, 1353 01:14:23,800 --> 01:14:27,960 Speaker 3: it took God a long time with with me. I said, yeah, 1354 01:14:27,960 --> 01:14:32,479 Speaker 3: but uh, she just continues to impress me in every way. 1355 01:14:32,960 --> 01:14:34,200 Speaker 3: I don't know what to say it now. I'm just 1356 01:14:34,640 --> 01:14:37,880 Speaker 3: not bragging about my kiddies, but uh, I have. I 1357 01:14:37,920 --> 01:14:43,599 Speaker 3: have very talented, beautiful, smart kids that hopefully are good people. 1358 01:14:43,640 --> 01:14:45,639 Speaker 3: You know, the what I can say about my kids 1359 01:14:45,720 --> 01:14:48,799 Speaker 3: is all the reports that I have from other peoples 1360 01:14:48,800 --> 01:14:51,600 Speaker 3: who from other people who have met my kids have 1361 01:14:51,720 --> 01:14:55,160 Speaker 3: been glowing. And that's the That's kind of the the 1362 01:14:55,200 --> 01:14:57,360 Speaker 3: biggest thing you could want as a parent is to 1363 01:14:57,400 --> 01:15:00,200 Speaker 3: think that your your kids represent you well and that 1364 01:15:00,320 --> 01:15:02,800 Speaker 3: you know, people see them as good human beings. And 1365 01:15:03,400 --> 01:15:05,800 Speaker 3: I have three precious human beings. 1366 01:15:13,840 --> 01:15:16,640 Speaker 2: Okay, going back to how we got started, on this, 1367 01:15:17,439 --> 01:15:19,120 Speaker 2: you know, in the middle of nineties. Start to play 1368 01:15:19,160 --> 01:15:22,280 Speaker 2: with Alison. You're doing your thing. She's the queen of 1369 01:15:22,320 --> 01:15:26,840 Speaker 2: her world. How does T Bone Burnette come along? How 1370 01:15:26,880 --> 01:15:29,760 Speaker 2: does the old brother thing come along? And how do 1371 01:15:29,840 --> 01:15:32,200 Speaker 2: you end up singing Men of Constant Sorrow? 1372 01:15:33,120 --> 01:15:37,680 Speaker 3: So at the time all that was going down, our 1373 01:15:37,720 --> 01:15:44,160 Speaker 3: manager was Denise Stiff, and I think now Denise Stiff 1374 01:15:44,200 --> 01:15:50,479 Speaker 3: she had and T Bone and the Coen Brothers had 1375 01:15:50,840 --> 01:15:54,640 Speaker 3: had hired Denise to help wrangle talent for the for 1376 01:15:54,760 --> 01:15:56,559 Speaker 3: the movie. You know, she kind of she was one 1377 01:15:56,600 --> 01:15:59,559 Speaker 3: of those people who knew everyone, and they discovered her 1378 01:15:59,600 --> 01:16:02,600 Speaker 3: and employed her to find people. And of course, you 1379 01:16:02,640 --> 01:16:05,759 Speaker 3: know Alison Krause, Union Station one of her main client. 1380 01:16:05,920 --> 01:16:10,439 Speaker 3: And and so when we discovered that they were doing 1381 01:16:10,439 --> 01:16:13,120 Speaker 3: a Coen Brothers movie, the whole band Allison Union Station, 1382 01:16:13,160 --> 01:16:15,000 Speaker 3: we're all big Cohen Brothers fans. We thought, man, if 1383 01:16:15,000 --> 01:16:16,840 Speaker 3: there's any way to be any part of this, please 1384 01:16:16,920 --> 01:16:19,120 Speaker 3: let's do it. So we found out they were having 1385 01:16:19,160 --> 01:16:23,000 Speaker 3: auditions and we went as a band to audition. We 1386 01:16:23,040 --> 01:16:25,720 Speaker 3: didn't even know what for. We just went to play 1387 01:16:25,720 --> 01:16:27,840 Speaker 3: them some music and see if there was anything that 1388 01:16:27,920 --> 01:16:29,760 Speaker 3: was going to line up for the movie, and of 1389 01:16:29,760 --> 01:16:31,400 Speaker 3: course that's all I knew at the time, as we 1390 01:16:31,400 --> 01:16:33,800 Speaker 3: were going in as Alison Krause Union Station and see 1391 01:16:33,800 --> 01:16:35,000 Speaker 3: if we could be a part of this movie. And 1392 01:16:35,000 --> 01:16:38,720 Speaker 3: that was exciting just in and of itself. And we 1393 01:16:38,760 --> 01:16:40,320 Speaker 3: did our thing, and we talked for a while and 1394 01:16:40,439 --> 01:16:43,200 Speaker 3: met Joel and Ethan Cohen, and we met T Bone, 1395 01:16:43,880 --> 01:16:46,040 Speaker 3: and you know, everyone seemed to get along and they 1396 01:16:46,120 --> 01:16:49,400 Speaker 3: liked the music and seemed like we were gonna be 1397 01:16:49,520 --> 01:16:54,360 Speaker 3: involved in some way. So our days finished, and I 1398 01:16:54,400 --> 01:16:56,799 Speaker 3: remember as we were walking out, we were literally walking 1399 01:16:56,840 --> 01:17:01,920 Speaker 3: toward the door, and we got just about to it, 1400 01:17:02,000 --> 01:17:06,880 Speaker 3: and Denise, our manager, turned around to T Bone and said, hey, 1401 01:17:06,920 --> 01:17:14,040 Speaker 3: t Bone, have you cast George Clooney's voice yet, because 1402 01:17:14,160 --> 01:17:16,240 Speaker 3: Dan right here she goes. I just thought, she goes, 1403 01:17:16,280 --> 01:17:22,720 Speaker 3: Dan might be a candidate for George's voice. And he said, well, no, 1404 01:17:22,760 --> 01:17:24,280 Speaker 3: we haven't, and they and they looked at me and 1405 01:17:24,320 --> 01:17:25,720 Speaker 3: they said, well do you want to you want to 1406 01:17:25,760 --> 01:17:29,680 Speaker 3: come back maybe tomorrow on audition. Right now, this is 1407 01:17:29,800 --> 01:17:31,240 Speaker 3: this has dropped out of the sky. I had no 1408 01:17:31,320 --> 01:17:33,559 Speaker 3: idea this was coming. I don't think anyone did until 1409 01:17:33,600 --> 01:17:35,599 Speaker 3: she just happened to think of it and said hey, 1410 01:17:35,680 --> 01:17:37,560 Speaker 3: Dan might be a candidate. So they said, would you 1411 01:17:37,600 --> 01:17:41,320 Speaker 3: come back tomorrow? And I said sure. So I go 1412 01:17:41,400 --> 01:17:45,679 Speaker 3: home and I well, I remember leaving. I remember calling 1413 01:17:45,720 --> 01:17:48,680 Speaker 3: my wife and saying, hey, let's you know, I'm going 1414 01:17:48,720 --> 01:17:50,800 Speaker 3: to do this audition. Looks like this voiceover thing, right, 1415 01:17:50,840 --> 01:17:53,040 Speaker 3: And she goes, oh, a voiceover, that's great? What is that? 1416 01:17:53,760 --> 01:17:56,600 Speaker 3: You know? And I explained, well, in this case, it 1417 01:17:56,640 --> 01:17:58,120 Speaker 3: would work out to where you would go to the 1418 01:17:58,120 --> 01:17:59,720 Speaker 3: movies and you're going to see George Clooney on the 1419 01:17:59,720 --> 01:18:02,240 Speaker 3: big screen and you would hear my voice coming out 1420 01:18:02,600 --> 01:18:06,400 Speaker 3: while he's singing. And she pauses and she goes, damn, 1421 01:18:06,400 --> 01:18:12,920 Speaker 3: that's my fantasy, right, So and I've been telling that 1422 01:18:13,000 --> 01:18:16,600 Speaker 3: joke for you know, for for twenty years now, but 1423 01:18:17,120 --> 01:18:20,519 Speaker 3: it seemed so far fetched to me that, you know, 1424 01:18:20,600 --> 01:18:23,280 Speaker 3: going back the next day, I went as much for 1425 01:18:23,520 --> 01:18:27,880 Speaker 3: the ridiculousness of it as as I ever thought that 1426 01:18:27,920 --> 01:18:30,640 Speaker 3: I would actually get this this part, because it was 1427 01:18:30,720 --> 01:18:34,720 Speaker 3: just too weird. I didn't think I sounded anything like 1428 01:18:34,800 --> 01:18:37,840 Speaker 3: George Clooney when I hear him talk, I hear me. 1429 01:18:37,920 --> 01:18:41,960 Speaker 3: I just didn't hear any anything, right, So I decided 1430 01:18:41,960 --> 01:18:43,600 Speaker 3: to go back and I, you know, asked what to do, 1431 01:18:43,640 --> 01:18:45,439 Speaker 3: and they said, well, either come back, and they said, 1432 01:18:45,479 --> 01:18:47,439 Speaker 3: they gave me two choices of songs. They said, you're 1433 01:18:47,479 --> 01:18:50,879 Speaker 3: either that. We either want you to do Rank Stranger 1434 01:18:51,560 --> 01:18:54,280 Speaker 3: or Man of consten Sorrow. They said, you pick one 1435 01:18:54,680 --> 01:18:57,200 Speaker 3: and do it. So I showed up the next day 1436 01:18:57,560 --> 01:19:00,120 Speaker 3: and I picked Man of Constan Sorrow and I did 1437 01:19:00,160 --> 01:19:02,880 Speaker 3: Man of Constant Sorrow for now, who knows. Now, I'm 1438 01:19:02,920 --> 01:19:04,599 Speaker 3: not saying that it would have been different, but what 1439 01:19:04,640 --> 01:19:06,360 Speaker 3: if I had to pick Rank Stranger? Would the song 1440 01:19:06,400 --> 01:19:08,080 Speaker 3: have been different? About to try it out with a 1441 01:19:08,080 --> 01:19:11,559 Speaker 3: different song? Right, So they give me so anyway, So 1442 01:19:11,680 --> 01:19:13,320 Speaker 3: they tell me do one of these songs. So I 1443 01:19:13,400 --> 01:19:18,040 Speaker 3: do Constant Sorrow and they they say, right when I'm finishing. 1444 01:19:18,080 --> 01:19:19,599 Speaker 3: First of all, it would be really you. You would 1445 01:19:19,600 --> 01:19:21,759 Speaker 3: have loved to have been there, because just as I'm finishing, 1446 01:19:22,040 --> 01:19:24,920 Speaker 3: and now, mind you, I'm doing a version much different 1447 01:19:24,960 --> 01:19:27,320 Speaker 3: than what ultimately made it in the movie, I'm doing 1448 01:19:27,320 --> 01:19:32,960 Speaker 3: a version that was higher, faster, less funky. Right, and 1449 01:19:33,280 --> 01:19:38,439 Speaker 3: just as my song finishes in walks the Fairfield four 1450 01:19:39,240 --> 01:19:42,360 Speaker 3: who everyone knows from you know, from the Old Brother soundtrack, 1451 01:19:42,439 --> 01:19:45,040 Speaker 3: and when they walked through the door, literally my guitar 1452 01:19:45,160 --> 01:19:48,160 Speaker 3: was still ringing, and they came in and started singing, 1453 01:19:48,520 --> 01:19:55,760 Speaker 3: all of them when they filled this hall with a song, 1454 01:19:55,800 --> 01:19:57,840 Speaker 3: and they sang the whole song, and when they got done, 1455 01:19:58,880 --> 01:20:01,280 Speaker 3: everyone was clapping and they were hugging each other, and 1456 01:20:01,360 --> 01:20:03,120 Speaker 3: like it was this whole big thing, right, And I've 1457 01:20:03,120 --> 01:20:05,320 Speaker 3: probably dramatized it in my mind now, but it was. 1458 01:20:05,800 --> 01:20:08,519 Speaker 3: It was so fantastic. And they finished up, and I 1459 01:20:08,640 --> 01:20:11,559 Speaker 3: remember t Bone looking at me and said, hey man, 1460 01:20:11,760 --> 01:20:16,559 Speaker 3: great job. We'll call you, which which was how you 1461 01:20:16,600 --> 01:20:18,479 Speaker 3: know this the same words I've heard, you know, after 1462 01:20:18,560 --> 01:20:20,080 Speaker 3: losing a lot of different gigs. You know that's no 1463 01:20:20,160 --> 01:20:22,400 Speaker 3: big it's no big thing. Just you know, it either 1464 01:20:22,400 --> 01:20:27,479 Speaker 3: works or doesn't. So I leave and I'm just, you know, 1465 01:20:27,560 --> 01:20:30,320 Speaker 3: I'm thinking it was ridiculous in the first place that 1466 01:20:30,360 --> 01:20:33,720 Speaker 3: I even't got an audition and went home. And the 1467 01:20:33,760 --> 01:20:36,840 Speaker 3: next day, pretty early in the day, the phone rang 1468 01:20:37,120 --> 01:20:38,640 Speaker 3: and I picked up the phone and it was t 1469 01:20:38,760 --> 01:20:42,840 Speaker 3: Bone Burnett and he said, Dan, he says, well, he said, 1470 01:20:42,960 --> 01:20:46,400 Speaker 3: I've been talking with Joel and Ethan and listen, when 1471 01:20:46,439 --> 01:20:50,160 Speaker 3: we see George Clooney singing, we hear your voice coming out. 1472 01:20:50,760 --> 01:20:54,519 Speaker 3: Do you want this gig? And of course, of course 1473 01:20:54,560 --> 01:21:00,559 Speaker 3: I said yes, and and and then by your uncle 1474 01:21:00,600 --> 01:21:03,800 Speaker 3: man A's. Then then my world change. You know, I 1475 01:21:04,120 --> 01:21:06,680 Speaker 3: had no idea what was what was to come from this? 1476 01:21:06,840 --> 01:21:09,200 Speaker 3: You had asked before? Did I did I sense if 1477 01:21:09,200 --> 01:21:11,439 Speaker 3: now that I found you was a hit song? Not 1478 01:21:11,600 --> 01:21:14,000 Speaker 3: even even less of this because now we're just we're 1479 01:21:14,000 --> 01:21:16,760 Speaker 3: playing weird bluegrass music movie soundtrack. And I've been a 1480 01:21:16,800 --> 01:21:19,719 Speaker 3: part of a couple of different movie soundtracks that again, 1481 01:21:19,800 --> 01:21:22,720 Speaker 3: didn't you know? They're not nothing? Is that big a 1482 01:21:22,800 --> 01:21:27,720 Speaker 3: deal that oh brother became right, So we're doing this 1483 01:21:27,720 --> 01:21:30,280 Speaker 3: this part. And here's the thing that that people don't know, 1484 01:21:31,479 --> 01:21:33,519 Speaker 3: or a lot of people don't know. We we got 1485 01:21:33,520 --> 01:21:35,840 Speaker 3: to be in the movie. So we're we're filming now. 1486 01:21:36,160 --> 01:21:38,800 Speaker 3: While they're filming the movie in Vicksburg, Mississippi, and t 1487 01:21:38,960 --> 01:21:41,920 Speaker 3: Bone comes up to me and says, hey, George wants 1488 01:21:41,920 --> 01:21:44,760 Speaker 3: a chance at singing this song. Would you go into 1489 01:21:44,840 --> 01:21:48,000 Speaker 3: a recording studio we have booked tomorrow and would you 1490 01:21:48,080 --> 01:21:52,960 Speaker 3: play this song with with Clooney. Now, you have to 1491 01:21:53,040 --> 01:21:56,439 Speaker 3: understand the position in life I'm at at this point 1492 01:21:56,479 --> 01:21:58,280 Speaker 3: in time, and what I know and what I don't know, 1493 01:21:58,400 --> 01:22:00,599 Speaker 3: and and where I am all all of a sudden, 1494 01:22:00,680 --> 01:22:05,160 Speaker 3: out of the sky drops this chance to record with 1495 01:22:05,200 --> 01:22:09,960 Speaker 3: George Clooney. That's ten times bigger deal to me than 1496 01:22:10,000 --> 01:22:12,320 Speaker 3: singing the song myself and doing this weird voiceover right. 1497 01:22:12,400 --> 01:22:14,439 Speaker 3: I actually get to go in the studio with the 1498 01:22:14,479 --> 01:22:18,040 Speaker 3: man and record it. So of course I say yes. 1499 01:22:18,080 --> 01:22:20,080 Speaker 3: And the next day we go into the studio and 1500 01:22:20,120 --> 01:22:22,759 Speaker 3: there's George Clooney and I'm in there and we're running 1501 01:22:22,760 --> 01:22:26,439 Speaker 3: over the song. And now George can sing. People you know, 1502 01:22:26,479 --> 01:22:28,679 Speaker 3: say I did it because George Clooney can't sing. That's 1503 01:22:28,720 --> 01:22:30,960 Speaker 3: not true. George Clooney can sing. He likes to be 1504 01:22:30,960 --> 01:22:33,240 Speaker 3: really I've heard him be really hard on himself right 1505 01:22:33,960 --> 01:22:36,800 Speaker 3: about Well, I just looked up and they weren't digging 1506 01:22:36,800 --> 01:22:38,760 Speaker 3: it right. And that's that was not the case at all. 1507 01:22:39,000 --> 01:22:41,360 Speaker 3: If he could have got through the whole thing without 1508 01:22:41,400 --> 01:22:45,200 Speaker 3: making a mistake, he could have sang it. But we 1509 01:22:45,280 --> 01:22:46,840 Speaker 3: tried the song and we're playing it and all of 1510 01:22:46,880 --> 01:22:49,000 Speaker 3: a sudden he makes it, sings the wrong word, says, ah, 1511 01:22:49,160 --> 01:22:51,439 Speaker 3: dang it, let me start it again. So I start 1512 01:22:51,479 --> 01:22:53,760 Speaker 3: the song again and he tries it again, messes up. 1513 01:22:54,280 --> 01:22:56,400 Speaker 3: We try it again and he messes up. Now meanwhile, 1514 01:22:56,439 --> 01:22:59,439 Speaker 3: he's self conscious because you know, he's not sure that 1515 01:22:59,800 --> 01:23:03,360 Speaker 3: he he a singer himself. Whatever reason, right, he walks 1516 01:23:03,400 --> 01:23:05,800 Speaker 3: out of the room, takes his headphones off and looks. 1517 01:23:05,880 --> 01:23:08,639 Speaker 3: He walks up to me, and he says, Dan, he said, 1518 01:23:08,640 --> 01:23:10,720 Speaker 3: we're in here on a day off. He says, I 1519 01:23:10,720 --> 01:23:12,479 Speaker 3: don't even know what we're doing. He says, this is crazy. 1520 01:23:12,479 --> 01:23:13,920 Speaker 3: He says, I'm going to make He said, I'm going 1521 01:23:14,000 --> 01:23:16,680 Speaker 3: to make you a deal. He said, I'll act and 1522 01:23:16,720 --> 01:23:18,760 Speaker 3: you sing. And he stuck his hand out to shake 1523 01:23:18,840 --> 01:23:21,920 Speaker 3: my hand, and I shook his hand, and I'm thinking, 1524 01:23:22,080 --> 01:23:24,759 Speaker 3: I'll act, you sing. I'm thinking, oh, come on, man, 1525 01:23:25,200 --> 01:23:27,360 Speaker 3: Like my whole world was crumbling right in front of me. 1526 01:23:27,439 --> 01:23:29,800 Speaker 3: Now I've now he doesn't now he's not going to 1527 01:23:29,880 --> 01:23:31,880 Speaker 3: do it, and we're back to this thing that you know, 1528 01:23:31,920 --> 01:23:35,000 Speaker 3: who knows how it's going to be now, right, So 1529 01:23:35,160 --> 01:23:36,760 Speaker 3: I call back home and I tell you know, and 1530 01:23:36,800 --> 01:23:38,439 Speaker 3: I'm explaining to my wife at the time. You know, 1531 01:23:38,479 --> 01:23:40,040 Speaker 3: I'm all bummed out. He didn't want to do it, 1532 01:23:40,040 --> 01:23:42,000 Speaker 3: I said, you know, he said, all act you sing. 1533 01:23:42,000 --> 01:23:48,000 Speaker 3: I said, can you imagine right now, skip ahead a 1534 01:23:48,080 --> 01:23:52,280 Speaker 3: couple of years down the road, had he sang that 1535 01:23:52,439 --> 01:23:55,439 Speaker 3: song which he could have no doubt about it, he 1536 01:23:55,439 --> 01:23:57,960 Speaker 3: could have sang it. Had he sang it, I would 1537 01:23:57,960 --> 01:24:01,519 Speaker 3: have made my three hundred and sixty dollars for the session, 1538 01:24:02,040 --> 01:24:04,400 Speaker 3: like I was used to making for a session of 1539 01:24:04,439 --> 01:24:06,439 Speaker 3: just drumming a guitar for a couple. That's good pay 1540 01:24:06,800 --> 01:24:10,040 Speaker 3: for how I was brought up. Had he sang it, 1541 01:24:10,040 --> 01:24:11,639 Speaker 3: I would have made my three hundred and sixty five 1542 01:24:11,680 --> 01:24:14,040 Speaker 3: dollars and never been any none the wiser, and I'd 1543 01:24:14,080 --> 01:24:17,800 Speaker 3: have moved on. But because he said, all act you sing, 1544 01:24:21,040 --> 01:24:24,040 Speaker 3: I got to pay off my house and buy new cars, 1545 01:24:24,080 --> 01:24:26,200 Speaker 3: and then buy another house, and then put my kids 1546 01:24:26,200 --> 01:24:31,519 Speaker 3: through college and do I got to do more from 1547 01:24:31,600 --> 01:24:35,679 Speaker 3: him saying all act you sing than I ever dreamed 1548 01:24:35,720 --> 01:24:39,280 Speaker 3: in a thousand eons a person who played a banjo 1549 01:24:40,320 --> 01:24:44,920 Speaker 3: could ever ever ever do in music. It was it 1550 01:24:44,960 --> 01:24:48,680 Speaker 3: was the life. It was the thing that absolutely changed 1551 01:24:49,920 --> 01:24:54,559 Speaker 3: everything for me. I mean, I never I mean up 1552 01:24:54,560 --> 01:24:56,479 Speaker 3: to that point, you know, I was I was making 1553 01:24:56,560 --> 01:24:58,880 Speaker 3: musicians pay. I mean, I was getting calls to keep 1554 01:24:58,880 --> 01:25:01,000 Speaker 3: my you know, I was having to wire money to 1555 01:25:01,080 --> 01:25:02,880 Speaker 3: keep my lights on. My lights would get turned off, 1556 01:25:02,920 --> 01:25:07,640 Speaker 3: you know, every couple of months. It seemed right, all 1557 01:25:07,640 --> 01:25:10,360 Speaker 3: of a sudden, my house is paid off, we have 1558 01:25:10,439 --> 01:25:13,840 Speaker 3: new cars, there's money in the bank, no credit card bills, 1559 01:25:13,920 --> 01:25:17,759 Speaker 3: no any It was the life life changer of life changers. 1560 01:25:17,800 --> 01:25:25,559 Speaker 3: You couldn't I couldn't imagine. And then on the spiritual side, 1561 01:25:25,680 --> 01:25:31,200 Speaker 3: it it made me rethink how I listened to music 1562 01:25:31,760 --> 01:25:36,640 Speaker 3: in the first place, because I was not happy with 1563 01:25:36,760 --> 01:25:39,400 Speaker 3: how it had to be recorded. It was one take, 1564 01:25:40,520 --> 01:25:43,320 Speaker 3: there were no fixes. If you did something wrong, you 1565 01:25:43,400 --> 01:25:45,000 Speaker 3: just had to do the song over. It was just 1566 01:25:45,040 --> 01:25:47,760 Speaker 3: there was no I was used to technology. Man, you 1567 01:25:47,800 --> 01:25:49,280 Speaker 3: could go on a stead. Was the beauty of a 1568 01:25:49,320 --> 01:25:53,639 Speaker 3: recording studio is you get to capture the best, very 1569 01:25:53,720 --> 01:25:56,320 Speaker 3: best of your best and if it's not you can 1570 01:25:56,360 --> 01:25:58,719 Speaker 3: do it again. And if this line isn't the best, 1571 01:25:58,720 --> 01:26:00,960 Speaker 3: well you can do that, like you can make a 1572 01:26:01,040 --> 01:26:04,200 Speaker 3: really great representation of what you're able to do in 1573 01:26:04,240 --> 01:26:08,360 Speaker 3: a recording studio. And old brother Art Thou was the 1574 01:26:08,400 --> 01:26:11,400 Speaker 3: complete opposite. It was organic. It had to be one take, 1575 01:26:11,479 --> 01:26:16,920 Speaker 3: one microphone, No, there was no headphones, there was no nothing. Man, 1576 01:26:16,960 --> 01:26:19,519 Speaker 3: You just sat down, literally, I was sitting down playing 1577 01:26:19,520 --> 01:26:22,479 Speaker 3: in that stupid can. Man. It was the weirdest thing 1578 01:26:22,520 --> 01:26:25,559 Speaker 3: for me. It was not I was not satisfied with 1579 01:26:25,640 --> 01:26:29,559 Speaker 3: my performance, but to say, to put it the best 1580 01:26:29,560 --> 01:26:32,160 Speaker 3: way I can. When I was done, I couldn't believe 1581 01:26:32,200 --> 01:26:34,240 Speaker 3: they wouldn't let me go in and fix any lines, 1582 01:26:34,479 --> 01:26:36,960 Speaker 3: or that it had to be one take. I would 1583 01:26:36,960 --> 01:26:38,880 Speaker 3: have much rather. I would have much rather done it 1584 01:26:38,920 --> 01:26:43,320 Speaker 3: in a different in a different way. And then after 1585 01:26:43,360 --> 01:26:46,680 Speaker 3: I learned what the magic of that whole project was, 1586 01:26:47,479 --> 01:26:50,040 Speaker 3: it was it was the beauty of what music actually 1587 01:26:50,080 --> 01:26:52,559 Speaker 3: is and how it's a how why live music is 1588 01:26:52,560 --> 01:26:55,599 Speaker 3: so great, and it's something I've always been an advocate for. 1589 01:26:55,720 --> 01:26:58,880 Speaker 3: I mean, I've always loved live music. But after Old 1590 01:26:58,920 --> 01:27:01,120 Speaker 3: Brother Yeah changed the way I listened to music too. 1591 01:27:01,240 --> 01:27:04,640 Speaker 3: Didn't just change my life financially, changed my life spiritually 1592 01:27:04,680 --> 01:27:07,920 Speaker 3: the way I went after music from that point forward. 1593 01:27:08,320 --> 01:27:10,880 Speaker 2: Okay, just to dial down on this for one second. 1594 01:27:12,000 --> 01:27:15,240 Speaker 2: You literally only sang the song once or you did 1595 01:27:15,320 --> 01:27:18,400 Speaker 2: multiple versions of the song from beginning to end. 1596 01:27:19,960 --> 01:27:22,120 Speaker 3: Oh. I sat in that studio and sang till I 1597 01:27:22,240 --> 01:27:24,840 Speaker 3: was horses. I could be I probably did the song 1598 01:27:26,200 --> 01:27:30,160 Speaker 3: thirty times or more front to back, and then I 1599 01:27:30,200 --> 01:27:32,680 Speaker 3: think we kept the first or second take when it 1600 01:27:32,720 --> 01:27:36,040 Speaker 3: was after I did it, like literally, that's you know, studios. 1601 01:27:36,360 --> 01:27:37,840 Speaker 3: I sat and I did it over and over. And 1602 01:27:38,120 --> 01:27:40,840 Speaker 3: this is the thing, this is what was killing me 1603 01:27:41,000 --> 01:27:46,280 Speaker 3: was I had so many performances that were well, if look, 1604 01:27:46,320 --> 01:27:48,160 Speaker 3: if I just go fix the line that I messed up, 1605 01:27:48,400 --> 01:27:50,840 Speaker 3: that's the perfect performance, right, And it was like, no, no, no, 1606 01:27:51,160 --> 01:27:54,960 Speaker 3: this is this has to be one take pure, had 1607 01:27:54,960 --> 01:27:57,880 Speaker 3: to be organic like this is. And this is a 1608 01:27:57,920 --> 01:28:00,920 Speaker 3: credit to the Cohens into t Bone all the music. 1609 01:28:01,120 --> 01:28:03,600 Speaker 3: I mean, they made sure that instruments we played that 1610 01:28:03,640 --> 01:28:06,880 Speaker 3: we recorded with the microphones that we used. They made 1611 01:28:06,920 --> 01:28:10,600 Speaker 3: sure that everything was that era. We recorded in microphones 1612 01:28:10,640 --> 01:28:13,599 Speaker 3: of that era, with instruments of that era, and we 1613 01:28:13,640 --> 01:28:17,719 Speaker 3: did it one time through from beginning to end, because 1614 01:28:17,800 --> 01:28:19,559 Speaker 3: that's the way they did it in that era. 1615 01:28:21,000 --> 01:28:25,760 Speaker 2: Okay, T Bone is a legendary producer. As I say, 1616 01:28:25,840 --> 01:28:28,280 Speaker 2: this is sort of a real strip down recording thing. 1617 01:28:28,720 --> 01:28:32,799 Speaker 2: But did he do anything as a producer that direct 1618 01:28:32,880 --> 01:28:35,400 Speaker 2: you or give you insight that change your performance? 1619 01:28:38,280 --> 01:28:42,280 Speaker 3: This was absolutely I mean for starters. I mean there 1620 01:28:42,280 --> 01:28:45,560 Speaker 3: were times where when I found myself wondering what is 1621 01:28:45,600 --> 01:28:47,800 Speaker 3: he doing? Because these people are just in there doing 1622 01:28:47,840 --> 01:28:49,479 Speaker 3: whatever they want to do. Like when we did like 1623 01:28:49,520 --> 01:28:52,360 Speaker 3: some of the stuff that we played. He just threw 1624 01:28:52,439 --> 01:28:55,719 Speaker 3: us into a room and said play. He didn't say 1625 01:28:56,240 --> 01:28:58,120 Speaker 3: do this, do this, He didn't, you know, He just 1626 01:28:58,280 --> 01:29:00,680 Speaker 3: said play and we played. And I think part of 1627 01:29:00,720 --> 01:29:05,120 Speaker 3: his genius is understanding what chemistry works, and if it's working, 1628 01:29:05,840 --> 01:29:08,679 Speaker 3: just let it do its thing. If it's not working, 1629 01:29:09,080 --> 01:29:10,680 Speaker 3: then you might have to steer a little bit. And 1630 01:29:10,720 --> 01:29:13,040 Speaker 3: when it came down to the version that I did, 1631 01:29:13,680 --> 01:29:16,240 Speaker 3: particularly the solo version where it was just the guitar 1632 01:29:16,439 --> 01:29:23,320 Speaker 3: and the voice of Manecon's sorrow, there were so many directions. 1633 01:29:23,360 --> 01:29:25,840 Speaker 3: In fact, I had never had to be so conscious 1634 01:29:25,880 --> 01:29:30,800 Speaker 3: of a visual while I played up until that point. 1635 01:29:30,840 --> 01:29:35,360 Speaker 3: Like it was. They kept telling me, you have to understand, 1636 01:29:35,840 --> 01:29:39,400 Speaker 3: if you sing into this can and you knock him dead, 1637 01:29:39,439 --> 01:29:41,559 Speaker 3: you're going to make fifty dollars. Now, this is way 1638 01:29:41,560 --> 01:29:43,640 Speaker 3: back when you're going to make like you're going to 1639 01:29:43,720 --> 01:29:46,800 Speaker 3: be rich. Now. They said, you're hungry. They said, you 1640 01:29:47,000 --> 01:29:49,920 Speaker 3: just stole a chicken so you could eat. You're that hungry. 1641 01:29:49,920 --> 01:29:52,519 Speaker 3: You're so hungry, you just stole a chicken. They said, 1642 01:29:52,560 --> 01:29:54,759 Speaker 3: you just sold your soul to the devil. Your fingers 1643 01:29:54,800 --> 01:29:57,559 Speaker 3: are flying. They said, you're you're trying to play rock 1644 01:29:57,600 --> 01:29:59,280 Speaker 3: and roll, but it hasn't been invented yet. You're just 1645 01:29:59,280 --> 01:30:01,200 Speaker 3: you're trying to knock it so far out of the part. 1646 01:30:01,200 --> 01:30:04,479 Speaker 3: You're just trying to blow them away. Now play a 1647 01:30:04,479 --> 01:30:07,680 Speaker 3: man a consasar And it was you know, it was 1648 01:30:07,760 --> 01:30:12,120 Speaker 3: it was. It was strange. There was so much direction 1649 01:30:12,439 --> 01:30:15,760 Speaker 3: of what was going on visually while that was going 1650 01:30:15,800 --> 01:30:18,559 Speaker 3: down that. Yeah, it was an interesting process to see 1651 01:30:18,560 --> 01:30:23,760 Speaker 3: how they go about making something fit a movie. You 1652 01:30:23,760 --> 01:30:25,960 Speaker 3: know that was because that that that was a that 1653 01:30:26,080 --> 01:30:28,280 Speaker 3: was a strange one. It They made it in such 1654 01:30:28,280 --> 01:30:30,679 Speaker 3: a way where it stood on its own, just as music, 1655 01:30:31,160 --> 01:30:35,000 Speaker 3: but that soundtrack was all very specific to the scenes 1656 01:30:35,040 --> 01:30:36,040 Speaker 3: that they were playing behind. 1657 01:30:37,920 --> 01:30:44,200 Speaker 2: Okay, movies are a long detailed process. You seing the 1658 01:30:44,320 --> 01:30:49,280 Speaker 2: stuff how long til the movie comes out? And listen, people, 1659 01:30:49,360 --> 01:30:52,040 Speaker 2: whenever you're involved in a movie, people are super positive 1660 01:30:52,439 --> 01:30:55,920 Speaker 2: and frequently most times the movie is not successful. So 1661 01:30:56,040 --> 01:30:59,719 Speaker 2: what was your experience of the movie actually being released? 1662 01:31:01,920 --> 01:31:04,040 Speaker 3: So they first announced that they were gonna let us 1663 01:31:04,680 --> 01:31:08,200 Speaker 3: let us see the movie in Nashville, everyone who worked 1664 01:31:08,240 --> 01:31:10,879 Speaker 3: on at all, the people who performed and their families, 1665 01:31:10,880 --> 01:31:14,559 Speaker 3: and they were gonna have a private showing and at 1666 01:31:14,600 --> 01:31:18,439 Speaker 3: the Bellcourt Theater here in Nashville, and so we of 1667 01:31:18,479 --> 01:31:20,600 Speaker 3: course got ready to go see this movie, and we 1668 01:31:20,680 --> 01:31:21,920 Speaker 3: knew it was a big deal and it's a Coen 1669 01:31:21,920 --> 01:31:24,120 Speaker 3: Brothers and I had no idea what to expect, even 1670 01:31:24,160 --> 01:31:26,679 Speaker 3: though I had seen some of the script and read 1671 01:31:26,720 --> 01:31:29,080 Speaker 3: several of the scenes and you know, and been involved 1672 01:31:29,080 --> 01:31:31,920 Speaker 3: in shooting of some of it. Boy, when you're there 1673 01:31:31,960 --> 01:31:34,519 Speaker 3: shooting the movie and you're not actually looking back on 1674 01:31:34,560 --> 01:31:37,639 Speaker 3: the camera to see what they filmed, you still don't 1675 01:31:37,680 --> 01:31:41,400 Speaker 3: have any idea of us going. And I remember sitting 1676 01:31:41,400 --> 01:31:44,559 Speaker 3: down to the movie and it blew like it blew 1677 01:31:44,600 --> 01:31:47,400 Speaker 3: me away. Like though, first of all, I'm a huge 1678 01:31:47,400 --> 01:31:51,120 Speaker 3: Coen Brothers fan, and I got you know, I had 1679 01:31:51,160 --> 01:31:52,840 Speaker 3: a lot of schooling on how it was tied to 1680 01:31:52,880 --> 01:31:54,760 Speaker 3: the Odyssey, you know, going in, so I got a 1681 01:31:54,760 --> 01:31:57,800 Speaker 3: lot of this. Like, the movie to me was fantastic. Right. 1682 01:31:57,880 --> 01:32:01,920 Speaker 3: So I'm sitting there loving the movie, and then comes 1683 01:32:01,960 --> 01:32:05,880 Speaker 3: the song and I hear my voice right come out, 1684 01:32:06,280 --> 01:32:09,320 Speaker 3: and I, for lack of a better way to describe, 1685 01:32:09,360 --> 01:32:12,200 Speaker 3: I've never been more embarrassed in my life. I sunk 1686 01:32:12,360 --> 01:32:14,599 Speaker 3: down in my seat. I sunk down in my seat, 1687 01:32:15,040 --> 01:32:17,960 Speaker 3: and I got I tried to disappear like I was 1688 01:32:18,000 --> 01:32:20,920 Speaker 3: trying as hard as I could to implode and just 1689 01:32:21,080 --> 01:32:24,240 Speaker 3: be and just to to it, just to a singular nothing. 1690 01:32:25,720 --> 01:32:30,800 Speaker 3: It was the strangest I can't hard to explain. I 1691 01:32:30,840 --> 01:32:33,519 Speaker 3: was like it was embarrassing and of course everyone collapsed 1692 01:32:33,520 --> 01:32:35,280 Speaker 3: and everyone's looking and every you know, and it's a 1693 01:32:35,360 --> 01:32:39,800 Speaker 3: big it's a big to do, and it was how 1694 01:32:39,880 --> 01:32:42,800 Speaker 3: was the first time I'd had quite that much attention, right, 1695 01:32:42,840 --> 01:32:46,640 Speaker 3: And it was it's it's weird to be the the 1696 01:32:46,640 --> 01:32:50,360 Speaker 3: the person everyone's looking at, you know, because at this 1697 01:32:50,479 --> 01:32:52,400 Speaker 3: point I've had a career with Alison and I was 1698 01:32:52,439 --> 01:32:55,040 Speaker 3: really good at knowing how to stand beside that the 1699 01:32:55,080 --> 01:32:59,800 Speaker 3: person everyone's looking at. That's an easier job supporting role, 1700 01:33:00,400 --> 01:33:02,879 Speaker 3: was what I felt like. I was, you know, tailored 1701 01:33:02,880 --> 01:33:05,960 Speaker 3: for now to be the guy. You know, it was 1702 01:33:06,040 --> 01:33:09,400 Speaker 3: uncomfortable to just to For no better way to explain it, 1703 01:33:09,400 --> 01:33:13,840 Speaker 3: it was it was extremely uh nerve wracking in the 1704 01:33:14,160 --> 01:33:17,160 Speaker 3: first you know, the first especially the first year, you know, 1705 01:33:17,240 --> 01:33:20,680 Speaker 3: following then after you get that much attention, you know, 1706 01:33:20,920 --> 01:33:23,600 Speaker 3: after after a little while that that attend you know, 1707 01:33:23,640 --> 01:33:28,000 Speaker 3: you you it doesn't feel as strange, it doesn't feel 1708 01:33:28,040 --> 01:33:30,839 Speaker 3: as you know, there there is now there is no embarrassing, 1709 01:33:31,400 --> 01:33:34,639 Speaker 3: you know, now it's pure joy, like the attention from 1710 01:33:34,640 --> 01:33:36,920 Speaker 3: old Brother that I get because it's still now, it's 1711 01:33:37,200 --> 01:33:40,880 Speaker 3: twenty five years later, and when I do Constant Sorrow Live, 1712 01:33:41,880 --> 01:33:46,839 Speaker 3: the cell phones still come out. You just see everyone 1713 01:33:46,880 --> 01:33:50,120 Speaker 3: responded like it's it's amazing. And to think that you 1714 01:33:50,240 --> 01:33:52,280 Speaker 3: get to be a part of everyone's life like that, 1715 01:33:52,320 --> 01:33:55,520 Speaker 3: I mean, you know, it's it's it turned from embarrassment 1716 01:33:55,560 --> 01:33:58,519 Speaker 3: when I first started to pure joy when I when 1717 01:33:58,560 --> 01:34:01,160 Speaker 3: I you know, hear it and see it. Now it's 1718 01:34:01,200 --> 01:34:03,760 Speaker 3: it's come around to where it's you know, the fascination. 1719 01:34:04,800 --> 01:34:09,799 Speaker 3: You know, it's still fascinating, and the fascination continues with people. 1720 01:34:09,840 --> 01:34:15,080 Speaker 3: I mean, I still do interviews about Oh Brother. You know, 1721 01:34:15,120 --> 01:34:17,040 Speaker 3: there's not too many things you can say. Twenty five 1722 01:34:17,080 --> 01:34:21,519 Speaker 3: years later, it's still still on the platform, and Oh 1723 01:34:21,560 --> 01:34:22,880 Speaker 3: Brother is kind of one of those things. 1724 01:34:23,560 --> 01:34:28,200 Speaker 2: Okay, the movie's going to be released. I remember going 1725 01:34:28,240 --> 01:34:31,920 Speaker 2: on Napster or whatever downloading your song. This is a 1726 01:34:32,000 --> 01:34:35,920 Speaker 2: song many people have sung, Rod Stewart saying it, I'm 1727 01:34:35,920 --> 01:34:39,400 Speaker 2: pretty sure, Bob Dylan saying it, etc. Yours is a 1728 01:34:39,520 --> 01:34:47,520 Speaker 2: one listen version, Okay, and it's really amazing and it 1729 01:34:47,520 --> 01:34:52,120 Speaker 2: it was successful. Was there any concept of you and 1730 01:34:52,160 --> 01:34:56,320 Speaker 2: the people you work with saying this is gigantically successful, 1731 01:34:56,840 --> 01:34:58,280 Speaker 2: let's follow it up. 1732 01:35:02,960 --> 01:35:12,920 Speaker 3: Man. So yes, there was of course a thought of 1733 01:35:12,920 --> 01:35:18,120 Speaker 3: of that, and I was I was approached to UH 1734 01:35:18,320 --> 01:35:23,439 Speaker 3: to potentially do a solo record, you know after after that. 1735 01:35:25,439 --> 01:35:27,639 Speaker 3: Now we have to go back and look at where 1736 01:35:27,640 --> 01:35:31,640 Speaker 3: I was at this point in time, and Uh, I 1737 01:35:31,720 --> 01:35:36,559 Speaker 3: had just done I just signed on to do a 1738 01:35:36,600 --> 01:35:41,080 Speaker 3: record with this this record label that my friend Tim 1739 01:35:41,120 --> 01:35:44,200 Speaker 3: Austin and and ex bandmate. He was the guy who 1740 01:35:44,280 --> 01:35:45,880 Speaker 3: ran the Lonesome River band that I played with for 1741 01:35:45,920 --> 01:35:49,720 Speaker 3: those years and UH, and I was scheduled slated to 1742 01:35:49,760 --> 01:35:52,320 Speaker 3: do a record for him, and t Bone asked if 1743 01:35:52,360 --> 01:35:55,479 Speaker 3: I wanted to do some sort of a project, you 1744 01:35:55,520 --> 01:35:58,680 Speaker 3: know after you know, this thing and I and I 1745 01:35:58,720 --> 01:36:01,640 Speaker 3: had to tell him. I said, well, I'm doing this 1746 01:36:01,720 --> 01:36:04,760 Speaker 3: other bluegrass record, you know, I've got to do. And 1747 01:36:04,800 --> 01:36:08,640 Speaker 3: he goes, well, he goes, he goes. It's kind of like, 1748 01:36:08,880 --> 01:36:11,040 Speaker 3: you know, if you're ever going to do anything, you know, 1749 01:36:11,120 --> 01:36:13,240 Speaker 3: let's we either need to do it or you know, 1750 01:36:13,280 --> 01:36:16,200 Speaker 3: if you want to do something else, well then whatever. 1751 01:36:17,840 --> 01:36:19,439 Speaker 3: So I go to you know, I go to Tim 1752 01:36:19,520 --> 01:36:23,320 Speaker 3: and I remember talking to talking to him at the time, saying, Hey, 1753 01:36:23,360 --> 01:36:25,519 Speaker 3: I've got a chance to do this thing with with 1754 01:36:25,640 --> 01:36:28,040 Speaker 3: T Bone, and he goes, Man, he goes, you got 1755 01:36:28,040 --> 01:36:29,840 Speaker 3: to be kidding. He goes, you can't. You can't let 1756 01:36:29,920 --> 01:36:31,880 Speaker 3: me down on this record. I can't have this record. 1757 01:36:31,920 --> 01:36:34,040 Speaker 3: This is this is gonna end. He goes, My label 1758 01:36:34,080 --> 01:36:36,280 Speaker 3: will fold if you don't do this record. He goes, 1759 01:36:36,400 --> 01:36:41,719 Speaker 3: especially now right. So in my mind, now I go back. 1760 01:36:41,800 --> 01:36:45,400 Speaker 3: If if I wanted to be that guy, I could 1761 01:36:45,400 --> 01:36:49,040 Speaker 3: have said, sorry, sue me, whatever you got to do. 1762 01:36:49,439 --> 01:36:50,560 Speaker 3: I got to do that, you know, I got to 1763 01:36:50,600 --> 01:36:55,599 Speaker 3: take advantage of this. Right. Had I not had I 1764 01:36:55,680 --> 01:36:59,840 Speaker 3: not been with Alison Krause and Union Station, there is 1765 01:37:00,439 --> 01:37:04,400 Speaker 3: no doubt in my mind that I would have taken 1766 01:37:05,040 --> 01:37:07,840 Speaker 3: the opportunity to follow that up with whatever T Bone 1767 01:37:07,840 --> 01:37:09,360 Speaker 3: wanted to do. I mean, if he would have said, hey, 1768 01:37:09,400 --> 01:37:11,920 Speaker 3: I want you to do you know this, this way, this, 1769 01:37:11,920 --> 01:37:13,599 Speaker 3: this way, let's just try it, I would have done 1770 01:37:13,640 --> 01:37:18,680 Speaker 3: anything to try it. Right. But I was and I 1771 01:37:18,720 --> 01:37:21,600 Speaker 3: don't know how to really even get people to understand 1772 01:37:22,000 --> 01:37:25,640 Speaker 3: I wasn't just content. I was so content with the 1773 01:37:25,760 --> 01:37:28,960 Speaker 3: job that I had with Alison in Union station that 1774 01:37:29,080 --> 01:37:32,559 Speaker 3: I was even uncomfortable stepping outside of the you know, 1775 01:37:32,920 --> 01:37:35,680 Speaker 3: I was uncomfortable at that point stepping into a spotlight 1776 01:37:35,920 --> 01:37:38,479 Speaker 3: being that guy that everyone was looking at. I thought 1777 01:37:38,479 --> 01:37:41,759 Speaker 3: it was just such an awesome thing that now, of course, 1778 01:37:41,800 --> 01:37:44,639 Speaker 3: after old Brother, even though the Alison job was great 1779 01:37:44,680 --> 01:37:48,759 Speaker 3: before Old Brother, well it was you know, multi multi 1780 01:37:48,800 --> 01:37:52,360 Speaker 3: times greater. After the work picked up, the prices went on, 1781 01:37:52,479 --> 01:37:56,320 Speaker 3: I mean, everything was better. So when it came right 1782 01:37:56,360 --> 01:37:58,800 Speaker 3: down to it, it was just more important to me 1783 01:37:59,479 --> 01:38:02,160 Speaker 3: to see if I couldn't, you know, help my buddy 1784 01:38:03,000 --> 01:38:05,120 Speaker 3: do what do what he needed to do with his mission. 1785 01:38:05,920 --> 01:38:08,800 Speaker 3: And at the end of the day, when I wait, 1786 01:38:08,880 --> 01:38:12,280 Speaker 3: everything in the basket, the only thing that really mattered 1787 01:38:12,280 --> 01:38:14,320 Speaker 3: to me was I was playing with Alison in Union Station, 1788 01:38:14,400 --> 01:38:16,120 Speaker 3: and I've got the greatest job that I you know, 1789 01:38:16,439 --> 01:38:20,920 Speaker 3: what you could look at as a lottery winning type 1790 01:38:20,920 --> 01:38:22,600 Speaker 3: of job, you know, like that was I had the 1791 01:38:22,680 --> 01:38:25,799 Speaker 3: job of jobs. I didn't really have to do anything solo. 1792 01:38:27,080 --> 01:38:31,720 Speaker 3: It wasn't until so many, so many years after that 1793 01:38:31,800 --> 01:38:34,240 Speaker 3: I really found any DESI you know, like I don't 1794 01:38:34,240 --> 01:38:36,240 Speaker 3: know in some ways, I guess late Bloomer. I mean 1795 01:38:36,240 --> 01:38:38,960 Speaker 3: now that I'm doing solo now, you know, I don't 1796 01:38:39,000 --> 01:38:44,479 Speaker 3: see how I I ever conceded to to doing anything 1797 01:38:44,520 --> 01:38:47,720 Speaker 3: else like I love, I love what I do now. 1798 01:38:48,360 --> 01:38:50,479 Speaker 3: It's and when I had the opportunity to, I just 1799 01:38:50,520 --> 01:38:52,320 Speaker 3: didn't see it. I just wanted to be a bandmate. 1800 01:38:52,360 --> 01:38:55,200 Speaker 3: I wanted to step away from that spotlight. It didn't 1801 01:38:55,240 --> 01:38:57,160 Speaker 3: it didn't appeal to me in a way that made 1802 01:38:57,200 --> 01:38:59,280 Speaker 3: me want to want to try to follow it up. 1803 01:38:59,320 --> 01:39:01,960 Speaker 3: But there was an opportunity way back when. 1804 01:39:01,880 --> 01:39:13,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, talking about your greatest kids, how'd you end 1805 01:39:13,240 --> 01:39:14,640 Speaker 2: up working with a vichy. 1806 01:39:16,680 --> 01:39:21,639 Speaker 3: Oh? Getting to so this one, this was another one 1807 01:39:21,680 --> 01:39:24,400 Speaker 3: that that stepped out of left field. I never saw coming. 1808 01:39:24,479 --> 01:39:28,439 Speaker 3: I couldn't have imagined how this would profoundly change my 1809 01:39:28,520 --> 01:39:32,599 Speaker 3: life because this one really this I mean, you know, hey, 1810 01:39:32,640 --> 01:39:38,160 Speaker 3: brother arguably is a bigger hit. Well no, not arguably, 1811 01:39:38,160 --> 01:39:41,960 Speaker 3: I mean it's statistically a such so much of a 1812 01:39:41,960 --> 01:39:44,240 Speaker 3: bigger hit than than Man of consa Sorrow, it's not 1813 01:39:44,280 --> 01:39:48,040 Speaker 3: even funny. I get a call from my assistant one 1814 01:39:48,120 --> 01:39:52,840 Speaker 3: day who says, hey, we just got a reach out 1815 01:39:52,880 --> 01:39:56,160 Speaker 3: from this DJ who wants to know if you will 1816 01:39:56,160 --> 01:39:59,200 Speaker 3: sing a song on his record, And I said, okay, 1817 01:39:59,240 --> 01:40:02,479 Speaker 3: what goes you know he does d M, and I 1818 01:40:02,560 --> 01:40:05,840 Speaker 3: had to ask what EDM was. I did not know 1819 01:40:06,160 --> 01:40:08,599 Speaker 3: what the term ed M stood for. She she tells 1820 01:40:08,640 --> 01:40:11,040 Speaker 3: me electronic dance mix, you know this stuff in clubs 1821 01:40:11,080 --> 01:40:15,479 Speaker 3: that goes and I laughed and I was like, oh 1822 01:40:15,520 --> 01:40:19,040 Speaker 3: my gosh, okay. I said, how about uh, how about 1823 01:40:19,040 --> 01:40:21,280 Speaker 3: thank you but no thank you? This This was my 1824 01:40:21,320 --> 01:40:23,200 Speaker 3: answer just it was just flat I thank you but 1825 01:40:23,240 --> 01:40:25,960 Speaker 3: no thank you. Those are my words. And being the 1826 01:40:26,080 --> 01:40:28,240 Speaker 3: quality person that she is in a shout out to 1827 01:40:28,280 --> 01:40:30,800 Speaker 3: Shelley for this one. Thank you Shelley Calabresi for this one. 1828 01:40:33,080 --> 01:40:37,759 Speaker 3: H She goes, would you like to hear it before 1829 01:40:37,800 --> 01:40:43,519 Speaker 3: we give an official no thank you? Right? So I think, well, sures, 1830 01:40:43,560 --> 01:40:45,960 Speaker 3: you know, if send me the song, that's that's that's 1831 01:40:46,040 --> 01:40:48,640 Speaker 3: fine whatever. So she goes, okay, that's She goes, I 1832 01:40:48,720 --> 01:40:50,599 Speaker 3: figured you would say no thanks, but you know, let's 1833 01:40:50,640 --> 01:40:52,160 Speaker 3: listen to it and then, you know, then we'll give 1834 01:40:52,160 --> 01:40:54,760 Speaker 3: an official no thank you. So she's sending me the 1835 01:40:54,800 --> 01:40:56,760 Speaker 3: song and all I know is she's sending me this 1836 01:40:56,840 --> 01:40:59,479 Speaker 3: song and I and I she told me a vichy, right, 1837 01:40:59,560 --> 01:41:02,519 Speaker 3: So I go through my mind and I think, who 1838 01:41:02,840 --> 01:41:04,880 Speaker 3: do I you know? Who in my world would know 1839 01:41:04,960 --> 01:41:08,519 Speaker 3: this this cat right, And my daughter really was the 1840 01:41:08,560 --> 01:41:10,439 Speaker 3: one who popped into my mind because my girl at 1841 01:41:10,479 --> 01:41:14,120 Speaker 3: the time was nineteen and she listened to everything. I 1842 01:41:14,120 --> 01:41:18,320 Speaker 3: mean she would she would listen. She would follow up 1843 01:41:18,320 --> 01:41:21,040 Speaker 3: a CDC with mel Tormae. I mean she would listen. 1844 01:41:21,600 --> 01:41:24,599 Speaker 3: She listened to the whole spectrum of music. So I 1845 01:41:24,680 --> 01:41:28,800 Speaker 3: texted her right really quickly. Well, because I wanted a 1846 01:41:28,880 --> 01:41:30,800 Speaker 3: quick response, I figured I would text her instead of 1847 01:41:30,840 --> 01:41:32,679 Speaker 3: calling her. You know, she was a teenager. They'll respond 1848 01:41:32,680 --> 01:41:34,360 Speaker 3: to a text immediately. If you call them, they won't 1849 01:41:34,360 --> 01:41:36,160 Speaker 3: pick it up anyway. So I text her. I said, hey, 1850 01:41:36,160 --> 01:41:39,600 Speaker 3: you ever heard of this guy a EGI? And she 1851 01:41:39,840 --> 01:41:43,920 Speaker 3: responds immediately, she goes sweetish DJ. He's a genius. He's 1852 01:41:43,960 --> 01:41:48,519 Speaker 3: probably my favorite artist. Why when I'm thinking, oh wow, 1853 01:41:50,439 --> 01:41:52,679 Speaker 3: so I said, I type up, I think he wants 1854 01:41:52,720 --> 01:41:56,720 Speaker 3: me to do a song on his next record. And 1855 01:41:56,760 --> 01:41:58,960 Speaker 3: I see the bubbles coming up. You know that she's 1856 01:41:59,040 --> 01:42:04,519 Speaker 3: responding to my text and it's one word bullshit. This 1857 01:42:04,640 --> 01:42:07,719 Speaker 3: is what And I can't believe it's my little girl 1858 01:42:07,760 --> 01:42:10,439 Speaker 3: right now in my mind, my little halo wearing, cherub 1859 01:42:10,520 --> 01:42:12,559 Speaker 3: cheeked little angel of a daughter. You know, is cussing 1860 01:42:12,560 --> 01:42:14,920 Speaker 3: at me online. So now I'm thinking, okay, how do 1861 01:42:15,000 --> 01:42:16,680 Speaker 3: I respond to this? What do you what do you know? 1862 01:42:16,960 --> 01:42:19,559 Speaker 3: What are you saying? And as I'm texting now, the 1863 01:42:19,560 --> 01:42:22,800 Speaker 3: phone rings and it's her and I answer. I go hello. 1864 01:42:23,160 --> 01:42:25,000 Speaker 3: She goes, Dad, are you messing with me? Because if 1865 01:42:25,040 --> 01:42:26,240 Speaker 3: you're messing with me, I'm not in a place right 1866 01:42:26,240 --> 01:42:29,200 Speaker 3: now where I can't even handle it. Because she started 1867 01:42:29,240 --> 01:42:33,320 Speaker 3: going higher and faster. She she she went nuts on me, 1868 01:42:33,840 --> 01:42:35,960 Speaker 3: ending up and saying, if this is real, if this 1869 01:42:36,040 --> 01:42:37,800 Speaker 3: is actually happening, and this is real, if this is 1870 01:42:37,840 --> 01:42:41,360 Speaker 3: an offer and you don't do it, I'm out. That's 1871 01:42:41,400 --> 01:42:44,559 Speaker 3: what she says. And I'm thinking to myself, you live 1872 01:42:44,600 --> 01:42:46,280 Speaker 3: on your own. I'm not paying your bills. You're already 1873 01:42:46,360 --> 01:42:47,479 Speaker 3: What do you mean? I said, what do you so? 1874 01:42:47,560 --> 01:42:49,960 Speaker 3: What do you mean you're out? And she goes, just 1875 01:42:50,040 --> 01:42:55,360 Speaker 3: try me, So I thought, wow, this is serious. Just then, 1876 01:42:55,400 --> 01:42:58,360 Speaker 3: as she's saying just try me, my phone buzzes and 1877 01:42:58,400 --> 01:43:01,919 Speaker 3: it's the song that just showed up from my assistant. 1878 01:43:02,400 --> 01:43:04,200 Speaker 3: So I tell her, let me let you go. I 1879 01:43:04,200 --> 01:43:06,080 Speaker 3: got to listen to this song. It just just showed up. 1880 01:43:06,120 --> 01:43:07,960 Speaker 3: I'll let you know how it turns out she goes, 1881 01:43:08,000 --> 01:43:09,479 Speaker 3: oh my god, it doesn't matter what it is to it. 1882 01:43:10,320 --> 01:43:13,280 Speaker 3: So I hang up and I listened to the song. Now, 1883 01:43:13,320 --> 01:43:17,360 Speaker 3: the song is not the big fantastic version everyone knows, 1884 01:43:17,439 --> 01:43:20,080 Speaker 3: you know. The demo of the song was just a guitar. 1885 01:43:20,320 --> 01:43:22,920 Speaker 3: It was two strings on a guitar, just going boo 1886 01:43:23,000 --> 01:43:26,759 Speaker 3: dud do do do do d right, and a vocalist 1887 01:43:27,160 --> 01:43:32,240 Speaker 3: sang the song I for. I don't know how else 1888 01:43:32,280 --> 01:43:34,479 Speaker 3: to put it. I loved it right. It was the 1889 01:43:34,600 --> 01:43:37,559 Speaker 3: right key for me, it was the right tempo for me. 1890 01:43:37,640 --> 01:43:40,920 Speaker 3: The message was was that bringing people to get like 1891 01:43:41,000 --> 01:43:45,160 Speaker 3: everything about that song I did, like I love Now 1892 01:43:45,320 --> 01:43:47,840 Speaker 3: in my mind, I'm envisioning how it sounds to me, 1893 01:43:48,000 --> 01:43:51,120 Speaker 3: like everything I hear upstairs in this this brain of mind, 1894 01:43:51,160 --> 01:43:53,519 Speaker 3: you know, has a banjo in it, right, so I'm 1895 01:43:53,560 --> 01:43:56,480 Speaker 3: hearing like kind of the the bluegrass version. I ultimately 1896 01:43:56,920 --> 01:44:00,400 Speaker 3: ended up doing myself right, but I I can hear 1897 01:44:00,400 --> 01:44:04,760 Speaker 3: myself doing it. So I called back my assistant and 1898 01:44:04,800 --> 01:44:06,840 Speaker 3: I tell her, hey, listen, I said, I just listened 1899 01:44:06,840 --> 01:44:08,519 Speaker 3: to the song. I said, I don't know how to 1900 01:44:09,080 --> 01:44:12,000 Speaker 3: say this, but I love it. It's killer. I said, 1901 01:44:12,080 --> 01:44:14,320 Speaker 3: let's do it. I said, listen. What's the big deal? 1902 01:44:14,360 --> 01:44:16,360 Speaker 3: I said in I said, listen, we do the song. 1903 01:44:16,520 --> 01:44:19,280 Speaker 3: Who cares? No one ever hears it? So what we've 1904 01:44:19,280 --> 01:44:21,040 Speaker 3: done it, it'll make my daughter happy, right, This is 1905 01:44:21,080 --> 01:44:23,280 Speaker 3: all I'm thinking. I'm thinking, we'll do this song, no 1906 01:44:23,320 --> 01:44:24,720 Speaker 3: one will ever hear it, and I'll just move on. 1907 01:44:25,920 --> 01:44:31,040 Speaker 3: And then I do this song. He doesn't have any 1908 01:44:31,120 --> 01:44:32,800 Speaker 3: version of it, he says, can you just do it 1909 01:44:32,840 --> 01:44:37,160 Speaker 3: to a click track? So I sang the song with 1910 01:44:37,200 --> 01:44:39,960 Speaker 3: no music. I just stood in the studio and I 1911 01:44:39,960 --> 01:44:42,880 Speaker 3: took my guitar and I hit a note being I 1912 01:44:42,880 --> 01:44:44,360 Speaker 3: don't even know if I used the guitar. I think 1913 01:44:44,360 --> 01:44:46,400 Speaker 3: you might have hit a note on the piano. Hit 1914 01:44:46,479 --> 01:44:48,519 Speaker 3: the geno, he said, here's the note, here's it is. 1915 01:44:48,520 --> 01:44:50,080 Speaker 3: So I hit the genoe and I just started singing 1916 01:44:50,120 --> 01:44:53,120 Speaker 3: it right to a click And I sang the song 1917 01:44:53,200 --> 01:44:55,800 Speaker 3: and sent it away to Los Angeles where a Vichy was. 1918 01:44:55,840 --> 01:44:58,240 Speaker 3: And you know, i'd never met the man. I just 1919 01:44:58,280 --> 01:45:03,680 Speaker 3: sent him a vocal across the air waves skip ahead, 1920 01:45:04,479 --> 01:45:08,760 Speaker 3: just like not many weeks later, not many weeks like 1921 01:45:08,880 --> 01:45:12,080 Speaker 3: just like a like. A couple few months later, that 1922 01:45:12,240 --> 01:45:15,120 Speaker 3: song was number one in sixteen different countries at the 1923 01:45:15,160 --> 01:45:19,719 Speaker 3: same time. It was a global smash that I couldn't 1924 01:45:19,720 --> 01:45:22,040 Speaker 3: imagine and I and I was unaware of it because 1925 01:45:22,040 --> 01:45:24,400 Speaker 3: I really don't listen to radio. I don't listen to anything. Right. 1926 01:45:24,560 --> 01:45:26,400 Speaker 3: I just got a call from my buddy one day 1927 01:45:26,600 --> 01:45:29,760 Speaker 3: and my buddy caused me. He says Ti Minsky. He goes, man, 1928 01:45:30,000 --> 01:45:31,719 Speaker 3: you got to hear what's going on. He goes, someone's 1929 01:45:31,720 --> 01:45:35,280 Speaker 3: out there. Someone is ripping you off. And I said, 1930 01:45:35,320 --> 01:45:38,599 Speaker 3: what they said? Someone is ripping you off. There's this 1931 01:45:38,720 --> 01:45:41,360 Speaker 3: dude out there and it's it's like it's just like 1932 01:45:41,600 --> 01:45:44,080 Speaker 3: edm stuff. He says, but they are copying you to 1933 01:45:44,200 --> 01:45:47,080 Speaker 3: a t. They said, it's one hundred percent you know, 1934 01:45:47,479 --> 01:45:49,800 Speaker 3: it's one hundred percent a Dan to Minsky rip off. 1935 01:45:50,560 --> 01:45:52,519 Speaker 3: And I said, do you mean a song called Hey Brother? 1936 01:45:52,880 --> 01:45:55,479 Speaker 3: And he goes yeah, And I said, dude, that's me. 1937 01:45:56,080 --> 01:45:57,680 Speaker 3: He goes, how can that be you? He goes, your 1938 01:45:57,760 --> 01:46:01,320 Speaker 3: name's not on anything? And I said, well, I was 1939 01:46:01,400 --> 01:46:03,439 Speaker 3: worked for hire. You know, correct my name. You won't 1940 01:46:03,439 --> 01:46:05,320 Speaker 3: find my name on it. If you look up any 1941 01:46:05,320 --> 01:46:09,519 Speaker 3: of their stuff, you don't see Dan Tominsky. Well turns 1942 01:46:09,560 --> 01:46:12,040 Speaker 3: out I gotta I gotta look back. That's that's one 1943 01:46:12,080 --> 01:46:14,760 Speaker 3: of the biggest things I've ever you talk about the 1944 01:46:14,760 --> 01:46:17,120 Speaker 3: one that got away. If my name could have been 1945 01:46:17,120 --> 01:46:20,639 Speaker 3: attached to that, I can't even imagine what the sound skin. 1946 01:46:20,800 --> 01:46:24,840 Speaker 3: I'm like I it would have dwarfed anything, you know, 1947 01:46:24,880 --> 01:46:27,719 Speaker 3: old brother Wawreth I ever did. It was ridiculous. But instead, 1948 01:46:28,080 --> 01:46:30,120 Speaker 3: you know, that's how I got a one time payment, 1949 01:46:30,160 --> 01:46:32,200 Speaker 3: which was, you know, wonderful. At the time, I thought, 1950 01:46:32,240 --> 01:46:34,519 Speaker 3: you know, great, and then you know, later on I 1951 01:46:34,520 --> 01:46:36,240 Speaker 3: got a writing deal in My publisher said do you 1952 01:46:36,280 --> 01:46:39,559 Speaker 3: have any idea how much money that song made? And 1953 01:46:40,320 --> 01:46:42,200 Speaker 3: he gave me a quick rundown, and it was. It 1954 01:46:42,280 --> 01:46:44,680 Speaker 3: was embarrassing, man. It was a lot of zero's, a 1955 01:46:44,720 --> 01:46:48,800 Speaker 3: lot of commas. That song was was absolutely the most 1956 01:46:48,840 --> 01:46:51,519 Speaker 3: fantastic thing to be a part of in it And 1957 01:46:51,760 --> 01:46:54,160 Speaker 3: though you know I didn't get rich from that one 1958 01:46:54,240 --> 01:46:58,080 Speaker 3: in particular, what it led what it led to in 1959 01:46:58,080 --> 01:47:02,759 Speaker 3: my life, man, And I wouldn't have without it, period. 1960 01:47:03,320 --> 01:47:06,240 Speaker 3: I just simply wouldn't have what I have now. Without it, 1961 01:47:06,240 --> 01:47:09,200 Speaker 3: I wouldn't have had the courage to write the songs 1962 01:47:09,200 --> 01:47:12,639 Speaker 3: that ultimately led to the Southern Gothic record. I wouldn't 1963 01:47:12,640 --> 01:47:16,200 Speaker 3: have had the courage to write any bluegrass stuff, which 1964 01:47:16,200 --> 01:47:19,360 Speaker 3: have has turned into everything that I'm about now. So 1965 01:47:19,560 --> 01:47:23,879 Speaker 3: you know that that getting to work with with Tim Bergling, 1966 01:47:25,160 --> 01:47:27,760 Speaker 3: who the world knows as avicy that was. That was 1967 01:47:27,800 --> 01:47:29,800 Speaker 3: one of the biggest things I could have ever been 1968 01:47:29,840 --> 01:47:32,960 Speaker 3: involved with, and I am so I'm so thankful for 1969 01:47:33,000 --> 01:47:35,320 Speaker 3: the opportunity to get to be involved in that one 1970 01:47:35,320 --> 01:47:38,719 Speaker 3: because it's it's just it's led to an uncountable well 1971 01:47:38,720 --> 01:47:40,040 Speaker 3: of things I wouldn't have without it. 1972 01:47:41,000 --> 01:47:46,519 Speaker 2: So presently, what's your deal with solo and Alison Grause? 1973 01:47:48,800 --> 01:47:51,120 Speaker 3: Uh oh, I am no longer a member of Alison 1974 01:47:51,200 --> 01:47:54,559 Speaker 3: Krause Union Station. They will be touring and putting out 1975 01:47:54,560 --> 01:47:58,160 Speaker 3: some music and it will just be with with someone 1976 01:47:58,200 --> 01:48:03,160 Speaker 3: different than than myself. I'm doing Dan Tominsky. I have 1977 01:48:04,120 --> 01:48:10,439 Speaker 3: got the solo career machine started and couldn't imagine veering 1978 01:48:10,479 --> 01:48:16,280 Speaker 3: away from it. It's taken me, it's taken me fifty 1979 01:48:16,280 --> 01:48:19,479 Speaker 3: plus years now to get to steer this ship, and 1980 01:48:20,479 --> 01:48:22,000 Speaker 3: I can't. I can't lose my grip. 1981 01:48:22,920 --> 01:48:25,960 Speaker 2: You're a very loyal guy. There are two very big 1982 01:48:26,000 --> 01:48:31,040 Speaker 2: stories that you told with loyalty. Ay, how hard was 1983 01:48:31,120 --> 01:48:34,320 Speaker 2: the decision to leave Union Station? And it's like I 1984 01:48:34,320 --> 01:48:36,519 Speaker 2: was talking to Jerry Douglass. He can come and go. 1985 01:48:36,880 --> 01:48:38,240 Speaker 2: Why couldn't you come and go? 1986 01:48:41,160 --> 01:48:43,320 Speaker 3: I could come and go. There there were a lot 1987 01:48:43,320 --> 01:48:47,040 Speaker 3: of circumstances that probably led up to I mean, you know, 1988 01:48:47,160 --> 01:48:50,560 Speaker 3: Jerry has a different situation than I have to be 1989 01:48:50,640 --> 01:48:55,160 Speaker 3: able to to come and go. I mean, I guess 1990 01:48:55,240 --> 01:48:58,360 Speaker 3: I if I wanted to, I think I I mean, well, no, 1991 01:48:58,439 --> 01:49:00,960 Speaker 3: I know I could have ided, you know I had. 1992 01:49:01,040 --> 01:49:04,760 Speaker 3: I made this decision honestly, more last minute than I 1993 01:49:04,920 --> 01:49:07,679 Speaker 3: than I ever thought I would. I didn't. I didn't 1994 01:49:07,680 --> 01:49:11,800 Speaker 3: feel at first when it was first proposed to come 1995 01:49:11,840 --> 01:49:14,080 Speaker 3: back and they were gonna, you know, Allison was gonna 1996 01:49:14,080 --> 01:49:18,760 Speaker 3: have Union you know, do another Union station thing. I 1997 01:49:18,880 --> 01:49:23,480 Speaker 3: was first shocked. I I never I I really thought 1998 01:49:24,040 --> 01:49:27,240 Speaker 3: it was done. I mean, it had been eight eight 1999 01:49:27,280 --> 01:49:31,440 Speaker 3: plus years since, you know, since there was any consideration 2000 01:49:31,520 --> 01:49:36,439 Speaker 3: of anything. So when I first hearted, I didn't. I 2001 01:49:36,439 --> 01:49:38,479 Speaker 3: couldn't believe, you know, that she wanted to do something. 2002 01:49:38,520 --> 01:49:41,320 Speaker 3: So I had to consider it. And my first thoughts were, 2003 01:49:41,360 --> 01:49:43,920 Speaker 3: and I'm and I'm gonna play the loyalty card. It 2004 01:49:43,960 --> 01:49:46,439 Speaker 3: felt like it was something that I had to do. 2005 01:49:46,880 --> 01:49:50,000 Speaker 3: I couldn't see myself saying no, because I felt like 2006 01:49:50,080 --> 01:49:51,920 Speaker 3: there was a world of fans, and there was a 2007 01:49:52,439 --> 01:49:54,400 Speaker 3: band of people, and there was there were too many 2008 01:49:54,439 --> 01:49:57,920 Speaker 3: things that that, you know, too many people. I would 2009 01:49:57,920 --> 01:50:02,639 Speaker 3: be letting down if I didn't do it. And I said, 2010 01:50:02,680 --> 01:50:05,360 Speaker 3: you know, let's you know, let's let's do whatever whatever 2011 01:50:05,360 --> 01:50:07,599 Speaker 3: we're going to do. And I got you know, we 2012 01:50:07,680 --> 01:50:10,000 Speaker 3: spent our time together, we worked up songs. There was 2013 01:50:10,040 --> 01:50:12,879 Speaker 3: I was actually going to do a bunch of probably 2014 01:50:12,920 --> 01:50:14,880 Speaker 3: sing more songs than I would have in the past, 2015 01:50:15,400 --> 01:50:17,599 Speaker 3: on this new thing they were about to put out, 2016 01:50:18,840 --> 01:50:24,120 Speaker 3: and in the process, somewhere in the middle, I couldn't 2017 01:50:24,160 --> 01:50:27,040 Speaker 3: do it. Somewhere somewhere in the middle, I felt like 2018 01:50:27,120 --> 01:50:34,760 Speaker 3: I was letting go of my identity. And it's kind 2019 01:50:34,760 --> 01:50:36,760 Speaker 3: of hard to put in words. I think the best 2020 01:50:36,760 --> 01:50:39,640 Speaker 3: way I could explain it is, I've spent my lifetime 2021 01:50:39,680 --> 01:50:45,200 Speaker 3: being other people's versions of myself. I was first, you 2022 01:50:45,240 --> 01:50:48,240 Speaker 3: know what, I only sang in the first place so 2023 01:50:48,320 --> 01:50:51,000 Speaker 3: I could accent my brother, you know, I was his 2024 01:50:51,160 --> 01:50:53,639 Speaker 3: version of what he needed. Then I joined the Lonesome 2025 01:50:53,680 --> 01:50:55,920 Speaker 3: River Band, and I never got to do what I 2026 01:50:55,960 --> 01:50:57,720 Speaker 3: wanted to do. With the Lonesome River Band, I did 2027 01:50:57,720 --> 01:50:59,880 Speaker 3: whatever they needed me to do, and that was fantastic, 2028 01:51:00,680 --> 01:51:03,280 Speaker 3: So I did it. Then I joined Alison Krause and 2029 01:51:03,360 --> 01:51:05,960 Speaker 3: Union Station, which, don't get me wrong, I loved every 2030 01:51:06,000 --> 01:51:08,640 Speaker 3: aspect of it, but I was what she needed me 2031 01:51:08,680 --> 01:51:11,120 Speaker 3: to be. I wasn't still playing what I wanted to 2032 01:51:11,120 --> 01:51:13,519 Speaker 3: play in the band, you know, I had to adapt 2033 01:51:13,600 --> 01:51:18,280 Speaker 3: and be someone else's version of myself. And I feel like, 2034 01:51:18,320 --> 01:51:20,960 Speaker 3: for the first time in my life, and at this point, 2035 01:51:21,600 --> 01:51:25,479 Speaker 3: I get to be my version of myself for the 2036 01:51:25,520 --> 01:51:28,680 Speaker 3: better or for the worse. When people hear what I'm 2037 01:51:28,720 --> 01:51:33,719 Speaker 3: doing currently, they get decisions that I am making about 2038 01:51:33,760 --> 01:51:37,640 Speaker 3: myself versus decisions someone else was making. And if it 2039 01:51:37,640 --> 01:51:41,000 Speaker 3: came down to doing another Alison Krause project, I didn't 2040 01:51:41,000 --> 01:51:44,080 Speaker 3: feel like I had the control to be me I was, 2041 01:51:44,120 --> 01:51:45,840 Speaker 3: you know, I didn't. I didn't want to be steered 2042 01:51:45,880 --> 01:51:48,360 Speaker 3: as much as I was having to be steered with, 2043 01:51:49,240 --> 01:51:53,080 Speaker 3: whether it be song selection, how I sang those songs, 2044 01:51:54,000 --> 01:51:56,240 Speaker 3: the there you know, a lot of a lot of particulars. 2045 01:51:56,280 --> 01:51:59,680 Speaker 3: I mean, I reached a point in my career where 2046 01:51:59,720 --> 01:52:03,120 Speaker 3: I get to steer the ship and I feel like 2047 01:52:03,200 --> 01:52:05,439 Speaker 3: if I let go of that, I won't get it back, 2048 01:52:05,640 --> 01:52:08,639 Speaker 3: and I'm not willing to do that I'm gonna stick 2049 01:52:08,680 --> 01:52:09,200 Speaker 3: with the solo. 2050 01:52:10,200 --> 01:52:14,479 Speaker 2: Okay, before we wrap it up. How good a golfer are. 2051 01:52:14,360 --> 01:52:19,880 Speaker 3: You depends who I'm golfing against. There are some people 2052 01:52:20,080 --> 01:52:23,280 Speaker 3: I can whip handily. There are some people I would 2053 01:52:23,360 --> 01:52:26,960 Speaker 3: never bet a nickel against. Good as a relative term 2054 01:52:26,960 --> 01:52:30,280 Speaker 3: when it comes to that game. Uh, the game of 2055 01:52:30,320 --> 01:52:33,920 Speaker 3: golf is one of the hardest games that I've ever 2056 01:52:35,040 --> 01:52:37,240 Speaker 3: I've ever took up. And some people would say I'm 2057 01:52:37,280 --> 01:52:39,920 Speaker 3: a very good golfer, and then some people would say, 2058 01:52:39,960 --> 01:52:43,400 Speaker 3: you know, he's a hack. Just depends on who I'm 2059 01:52:43,400 --> 01:52:46,040 Speaker 3: playing next to. Golf took up my foosball void, you know, 2060 01:52:46,080 --> 01:52:50,360 Speaker 3: when I stopped playing foosball in nineteen eighty nine and 2061 01:52:50,439 --> 01:52:52,760 Speaker 3: all through the nineties, and you know, I took up 2062 01:52:52,840 --> 01:52:55,640 Speaker 3: golf kind of fill that void. So I have that 2063 01:52:55,760 --> 01:52:58,679 Speaker 3: OCD personality to where anything I spend my time doing, 2064 01:52:58,760 --> 01:53:00,519 Speaker 3: if I'm not going to be able to do it well, 2065 01:53:00,560 --> 01:53:02,160 Speaker 3: I'm probably not going to do it at all. So 2066 01:53:03,000 --> 01:53:06,559 Speaker 3: golf was the same I I ate, you know, Drank 2067 01:53:06,720 --> 01:53:09,920 Speaker 3: slapt everything was was golf for a for a period 2068 01:53:09,960 --> 01:53:12,679 Speaker 3: of time, and I think at one point in time 2069 01:53:13,360 --> 01:53:15,599 Speaker 3: golf died just had me ranked as the number five 2070 01:53:15,680 --> 01:53:20,599 Speaker 3: musician golfer in the country. Now that being said, there 2071 01:53:20,600 --> 01:53:22,400 Speaker 3: are a bunch of musicians that I would never bet 2072 01:53:22,439 --> 01:53:24,240 Speaker 3: a nickel against because there's a lot of good golfers 2073 01:53:24,240 --> 01:53:27,200 Speaker 3: out there. But Uh, at one time I could hold 2074 01:53:27,200 --> 01:53:30,240 Speaker 3: my own. Now I play a lot more for fun 2075 01:53:30,240 --> 01:53:32,719 Speaker 3: than I do for UH. If I'm serious about anything 2076 01:53:32,720 --> 01:53:35,519 Speaker 3: I play anymore, it's foosball, not golf. 2077 01:53:36,400 --> 01:53:38,439 Speaker 2: Okay, when did you take up golf? 2078 01:53:41,320 --> 01:53:43,920 Speaker 3: Uh? When I moved to Virginia. When I when I 2079 01:53:43,960 --> 01:53:46,599 Speaker 3: moved away from home, when I let foosball go, literally, 2080 01:53:46,640 --> 01:53:49,120 Speaker 3: I that's I. I made a switch because I found 2081 01:53:49,439 --> 01:53:52,000 Speaker 3: a buddy of mine that I moved to Virginia with 2082 01:53:53,240 --> 01:53:55,880 Speaker 3: is Uh is a golf pro, Tag Leon. I got 2083 01:53:55,880 --> 01:53:58,280 Speaker 3: to give Tag a shout out. He's now the head 2084 01:53:58,280 --> 01:54:03,880 Speaker 3: golf pro at at in Southern Pines, North Carolina, at 2085 01:54:04,120 --> 01:54:08,080 Speaker 3: Talamore Golf and Resort. He has a fantastic facility down there. 2086 01:54:08,120 --> 01:54:11,280 Speaker 3: People should go check out Talamore. But Tag moved down 2087 01:54:11,320 --> 01:54:15,160 Speaker 3: with me, and I had a roommate that was a golfer, 2088 01:54:16,680 --> 01:54:18,920 Speaker 3: and I, you know, I remember seeing his clubs and 2089 01:54:18,960 --> 01:54:20,600 Speaker 3: he had a bunch of golf shoes. I remember, like 2090 01:54:21,080 --> 01:54:23,160 Speaker 3: I thought, thought to myself, who would have that many 2091 01:54:23,200 --> 01:54:26,360 Speaker 3: pairs of shoes? It was. It was blew my mind 2092 01:54:26,680 --> 01:54:28,559 Speaker 3: right because he had like eight pairs of golf shoes. 2093 01:54:29,080 --> 01:54:31,160 Speaker 3: And anyway, we went out one day and he was like, yeah, 2094 01:54:31,200 --> 01:54:33,480 Speaker 3: give it a try, and I remember taking a I 2095 01:54:33,520 --> 01:54:35,160 Speaker 3: was big into baseball, right. I wanted to be a 2096 01:54:35,200 --> 01:54:37,840 Speaker 3: baseball player so I could hit it hard. But I 2097 01:54:37,920 --> 01:54:39,680 Speaker 3: was a horrible golfer. But I took it up and 2098 01:54:39,720 --> 01:54:41,960 Speaker 3: I started going to the driving range for fun, and 2099 01:54:42,720 --> 01:54:45,320 Speaker 3: before you knew it, I was trying to keep a 2100 01:54:45,320 --> 01:54:48,360 Speaker 3: score and realized how bad I was, and then decided 2101 01:54:48,400 --> 01:54:50,440 Speaker 3: I was going to have to really get serious in practice. 2102 01:54:50,480 --> 01:54:54,240 Speaker 3: And you know, I spent as here. I got to 2103 01:54:54,240 --> 01:54:57,520 Speaker 3: thank old brother. You know that along with being able 2104 01:54:57,560 --> 01:54:59,720 Speaker 3: to take care of my house payments and everything else 2105 01:54:59,720 --> 01:55:01,560 Speaker 3: that I came along with that, I was able to 2106 01:55:02,440 --> 01:55:04,920 Speaker 3: join a country club and have a place for my 2107 01:55:04,960 --> 01:55:06,880 Speaker 3: family to hang out and play. And I have my 2108 01:55:06,960 --> 01:55:10,840 Speaker 3: two boys. They're definitely into golf right now. Because of 2109 01:55:11,200 --> 01:55:14,840 Speaker 3: you know, it's my fault. I had them around the 2110 01:55:14,840 --> 01:55:17,760 Speaker 3: golf course all while they were growing up, and now 2111 01:55:17,800 --> 01:55:21,400 Speaker 3: they're both I have two fantastic golfers for boys. They're 2112 01:55:21,400 --> 01:55:25,760 Speaker 3: both in the plus handicaps there. They can quit me 2113 01:55:25,800 --> 01:55:27,600 Speaker 3: so easy. They could. They could either one of them 2114 01:55:27,640 --> 01:55:29,200 Speaker 3: could beat me with one hand. And I can't stand 2115 01:55:29,240 --> 01:55:32,960 Speaker 3: it because I'm so competitive. But you know, golf, I 2116 01:55:32,960 --> 01:55:37,200 Speaker 3: took up golf when probably nineteen ninety ish. 2117 01:55:37,400 --> 01:55:39,800 Speaker 2: Okay, your peak, How much were you playing and do 2118 01:55:39,840 --> 01:55:40,560 Speaker 2: you play at all? 2119 01:55:40,640 --> 01:55:44,560 Speaker 3: Now? My peak, I played seven days a week. I 2120 01:55:45,000 --> 01:55:48,200 Speaker 3: played every single day, and I practiced before and after 2121 01:55:48,320 --> 01:55:51,000 Speaker 3: I played. I mean I played every day. And when 2122 01:55:51,000 --> 01:55:53,160 Speaker 3: I did that, I played most days. I mean I 2123 01:55:53,200 --> 01:55:56,400 Speaker 3: played minimum five days a week. Or let's just say 2124 01:55:56,440 --> 01:55:59,240 Speaker 3: every day that I was home. Every day that I 2125 01:55:59,280 --> 01:56:03,280 Speaker 3: was home, I played golf all through my kids going 2126 01:56:03,280 --> 01:56:05,360 Speaker 3: to school. The routine was I would drop them off 2127 01:56:05,400 --> 01:56:08,280 Speaker 3: at school, go play golf all while they were in school, 2128 01:56:08,520 --> 01:56:10,360 Speaker 3: stand on the driving range and hit balls until it 2129 01:56:10,360 --> 01:56:12,280 Speaker 3: was time to pick them up, Go pick them up, 2130 01:56:12,680 --> 01:56:15,160 Speaker 3: and then I was home. So yeah, I played golf 2131 01:56:16,960 --> 01:56:20,520 Speaker 3: every day. You know. In my peak my best scores, 2132 01:56:20,520 --> 01:56:23,280 Speaker 3: I've shot a sixty seven was my best score. I 2133 01:56:23,280 --> 01:56:26,640 Speaker 3: shot a couple of sixty nine's and I never got 2134 01:56:26,680 --> 01:56:29,640 Speaker 3: down to a scratch. I was a one handicap was 2135 01:56:29,680 --> 01:56:33,560 Speaker 3: my best I got to be a a one handicap, 2136 01:56:33,600 --> 01:56:36,920 Speaker 3: where my kids one of them's a plus four, one 2137 01:56:36,920 --> 01:56:39,080 Speaker 3: of them's a plus six. It's grotesque what they do 2138 01:56:39,160 --> 01:56:42,680 Speaker 3: with the game. But I played a lot when I played, 2139 01:56:42,760 --> 01:56:47,880 Speaker 3: now not nearly as much I do not. I enjoy 2140 01:56:47,920 --> 01:56:50,600 Speaker 3: the game so much more now than I enjoyed it 2141 01:56:50,640 --> 01:56:52,320 Speaker 3: when I was trying to be good at it, because, 2142 01:56:53,480 --> 01:56:56,000 Speaker 3: like I said, the OCD thing, I couldn't enjoy it 2143 01:56:56,040 --> 01:56:58,680 Speaker 3: for trying to always improve. And if you're trying, really 2144 01:56:58,680 --> 01:57:03,560 Speaker 3: trying to improve, you simultaneously or frustrated with your performance, 2145 01:57:04,040 --> 01:57:06,840 Speaker 3: you kind of have. You know, improvement comes with not 2146 01:57:06,960 --> 01:57:10,560 Speaker 3: being satisfied with where you're at. So I've taken a 2147 01:57:10,560 --> 01:57:13,920 Speaker 3: shift to the point where I really enjoy playing the game, 2148 01:57:14,400 --> 01:57:18,560 Speaker 3: don't worry about a score as much. Still can probably 2149 01:57:18,560 --> 01:57:20,520 Speaker 3: shoot a goods. You know, I'm my best score of 2150 01:57:20,560 --> 01:57:24,120 Speaker 3: the year. My last year, I shot seventy two one time, 2151 01:57:24,840 --> 01:57:26,880 Speaker 3: so I was one over par. That was my best 2152 01:57:26,880 --> 01:57:29,080 Speaker 3: score of the year. I shot close to par once. 2153 01:57:29,800 --> 01:57:32,040 Speaker 3: I'm like, I'm captain seventy eight. I shoot a lot 2154 01:57:32,040 --> 01:57:34,920 Speaker 3: of seventy eight, so that seems to be my my 2155 01:57:35,040 --> 01:57:37,920 Speaker 3: go to number. I can play well, I shoot seventy eight. 2156 01:57:37,960 --> 01:57:40,680 Speaker 3: I play like crap. I shoot seventy eight. It's my number. 2157 01:57:41,520 --> 01:57:43,720 Speaker 2: Did you take lessons to learn how to play golf? 2158 01:57:45,160 --> 01:57:47,760 Speaker 3: No, I've never taken lessons to learn how to do anything. 2159 01:57:47,800 --> 01:57:50,600 Speaker 3: And again I would say the same thing to golfers. 2160 01:57:50,880 --> 01:57:54,360 Speaker 3: If you are starting out the game, take a couple 2161 01:57:54,400 --> 01:57:56,840 Speaker 3: early lessons, because one of the things that really did 2162 01:57:56,960 --> 01:57:59,120 Speaker 3: hurt me in my golf game is I ingrained a 2163 01:57:59,160 --> 01:58:02,560 Speaker 3: few really bad habits early on that I carried over 2164 01:58:02,600 --> 01:58:06,200 Speaker 3: from baseball that really made me struggle with golf. I 2165 01:58:06,200 --> 01:58:08,520 Speaker 3: had to unlearn a few things that I taught myself 2166 01:58:08,560 --> 01:58:11,600 Speaker 3: that I could have easily avoided had I taken some 2167 01:58:11,680 --> 01:58:14,320 Speaker 3: early lessons. So I don't think you necessarily have to 2168 01:58:14,400 --> 01:58:17,800 Speaker 3: take lessons the whole time you play, unless you're doing 2169 01:58:17,800 --> 01:58:22,400 Speaker 3: it as a profession. But to get the fundamentals down 2170 01:58:22,480 --> 01:58:25,240 Speaker 3: early on so that you can do so that you 2171 01:58:25,280 --> 01:58:29,360 Speaker 3: can practice correctly from the start, I think is a 2172 01:58:29,600 --> 01:58:32,160 Speaker 3: huge bonus. And I would recommend it to anyone that, 2173 01:58:32,760 --> 01:58:35,400 Speaker 3: even if they don't think they need lessons, go ahead 2174 01:58:35,440 --> 01:58:38,280 Speaker 3: and take that lesson and then decide after if you 2175 01:58:38,440 --> 01:58:39,760 Speaker 3: if you want to use that or not. 2176 01:58:41,040 --> 01:58:44,920 Speaker 2: Okay, how often do you play now. 2177 01:58:46,800 --> 01:58:51,520 Speaker 3: Golf. You know, my wife likes to play golf now, 2178 01:58:51,600 --> 01:58:54,440 Speaker 3: so I try to get out once a week, you know, 2179 01:58:54,520 --> 01:58:57,520 Speaker 3: if I if I can. I mean, I'm more fair 2180 01:58:57,560 --> 01:59:00,520 Speaker 3: weather now, if it's if it's cold, or if it's windy, 2181 01:59:00,600 --> 01:59:03,920 Speaker 3: or if I have a hangnail, or if you know, 2182 01:59:04,000 --> 01:59:06,800 Speaker 3: whatever my TV reception isn't good, whatever it is, you know, 2183 01:59:06,840 --> 01:59:08,840 Speaker 3: anything will keep me from playing now. You know, it's 2184 01:59:08,840 --> 01:59:10,880 Speaker 3: got to be all the conditions have to be right. 2185 01:59:10,920 --> 01:59:14,400 Speaker 3: But if the weather's nice and and I have somebody 2186 01:59:14,440 --> 01:59:16,680 Speaker 3: who's willing, I'll still go out and knock it around. 2187 01:59:16,720 --> 01:59:18,840 Speaker 3: I mean, I still love the game. I've been trying 2188 01:59:18,840 --> 01:59:20,640 Speaker 3: to get into it a little bit more as of late. 2189 01:59:21,120 --> 01:59:24,280 Speaker 3: So this this year, I plan on playing more golf 2190 01:59:24,680 --> 01:59:28,720 Speaker 3: than I played last year because I'm I'm determined to 2191 01:59:28,720 --> 01:59:30,720 Speaker 3: get you know, a little bit. You know, it's it's 2192 01:59:31,440 --> 01:59:33,400 Speaker 3: it's fun for me now, but it's not as fun 2193 01:59:33,400 --> 01:59:35,640 Speaker 3: if I'm nowhere near as good as I could be. 2194 01:59:35,680 --> 01:59:37,280 Speaker 3: So I'm gonna practice a little bit this year and 2195 01:59:37,320 --> 01:59:40,120 Speaker 3: try to find that happy balance where I can, you know, 2196 01:59:40,240 --> 01:59:41,920 Speaker 3: play a little more and still have fun with it. 2197 01:59:42,520 --> 01:59:47,560 Speaker 2: Okay, you're playing golf. What's the status of your career now, 2198 01:59:47,640 --> 01:59:50,520 Speaker 2: how much you're working, how much do you want to work, 2199 01:59:51,160 --> 01:59:56,480 Speaker 2: and any specific goals at this point. 2200 01:59:55,840 --> 01:59:57,760 Speaker 3: Well, I still want to work. I mean I'm I'm 2201 01:59:57,800 --> 02:00:00,200 Speaker 3: not you know, I'm at the point now to where well, well, 2202 02:00:00,240 --> 02:00:01,920 Speaker 3: you know, heck, I have to work. I mean, you know, 2203 02:00:02,000 --> 02:00:04,160 Speaker 3: I still got to keep these lights. I still got 2204 02:00:04,160 --> 02:00:06,040 Speaker 3: to keep the light bol paid. So I have to work. 2205 02:00:06,600 --> 02:00:09,839 Speaker 3: Fortunately for me, I love my work. So it's it's 2206 02:00:10,240 --> 02:00:12,640 Speaker 3: it's it's been a it's it's kind of been a 2207 02:00:12,720 --> 02:00:15,680 Speaker 3: nice situation to be able to to go after something 2208 02:00:15,720 --> 02:00:17,680 Speaker 3: that you enjoy doing. I mean, I've never felt like 2209 02:00:18,600 --> 02:00:21,440 Speaker 3: I've worked ever. I mean I've I've traveled to play music. 2210 02:00:21,520 --> 02:00:24,120 Speaker 3: I mean traveling that's the hardest thing that I do. 2211 02:00:24,680 --> 02:00:26,720 Speaker 3: And as far as how much do I want to travel, 2212 02:00:27,200 --> 02:00:31,160 Speaker 3: you know, if I play, if I play fifty, you know, 2213 02:00:31,360 --> 02:00:35,080 Speaker 3: or to sixty dates a year, that is that that's 2214 02:00:35,120 --> 02:00:37,000 Speaker 3: like my high end. That's as much as I would 2215 02:00:37,040 --> 02:00:39,879 Speaker 3: want to go. I mean, I I don't like traveling 2216 02:00:39,960 --> 02:00:42,360 Speaker 3: like I once did. I've said this for a while now. 2217 02:00:42,800 --> 02:00:44,840 Speaker 3: I have played for a long time. I have played 2218 02:00:44,840 --> 02:00:48,280 Speaker 3: for free. I only get paid to travel. You pay 2219 02:00:48,280 --> 02:00:50,040 Speaker 3: me to travel and I'll play for you for free. 2220 02:00:50,040 --> 02:00:52,360 Speaker 3: That's how it works anymore. And uh, I don't want 2221 02:00:52,360 --> 02:00:53,680 Speaker 3: to stay out on the road. I don't want to. 2222 02:00:53,680 --> 02:00:56,560 Speaker 3: I mean, I'm I enjoy my home life. I enjoy 2223 02:00:56,640 --> 02:00:58,920 Speaker 3: my my wife, I enjoy playing golf. I'd like to 2224 02:00:59,040 --> 02:01:02,880 Speaker 3: spend a little more time. I'm, you know, enjoying my 2225 02:01:02,880 --> 02:01:05,360 Speaker 3: my Uh, how do how do I put it? I'm 2226 02:01:05,400 --> 02:01:07,960 Speaker 3: I'm I'm not you know, I'm not anywhere close to 2227 02:01:08,000 --> 02:01:10,200 Speaker 3: giving up yet, but I'm I've started the back nine, 2228 02:01:10,240 --> 02:01:11,560 Speaker 3: so I'm trying to ease into it. 2229 02:01:12,800 --> 02:01:17,600 Speaker 2: Well, I mean, you ultimately had two gigantic successes. Okay, 2230 02:01:18,200 --> 02:01:20,680 Speaker 2: you're doing what you're doing. You gotta work, you got 2231 02:01:20,680 --> 02:01:22,880 Speaker 2: to keep the lights on in the back of your 2232 02:01:22,920 --> 02:01:26,320 Speaker 2: mind everything, and well, you know, i'd like to get 2233 02:01:26,360 --> 02:01:29,920 Speaker 2: back to that spotlight before I go here. 2234 02:01:32,160 --> 02:01:33,880 Speaker 3: Well, I mean this is the I mean, at the 2235 02:01:33,960 --> 02:01:37,680 Speaker 3: at this point, I'm able to you know, it's I'm 2236 02:01:37,720 --> 02:01:41,160 Speaker 3: finding I'm finally and I say finally because i haven't 2237 02:01:41,160 --> 02:01:43,879 Speaker 3: been for a bulk of my career, but I'm finally 2238 02:01:44,720 --> 02:01:47,360 Speaker 3: happy in in the center portion of that stage. Like 2239 02:01:47,560 --> 02:01:51,000 Speaker 3: I I'm enjoying what I get to do now versus 2240 02:01:51,960 --> 02:01:54,400 Speaker 3: what I've done in the past. I mean, I'm I've 2241 02:01:57,160 --> 02:02:01,080 Speaker 3: talking to an audience, getting to tell jokes, getting to 2242 02:02:02,000 --> 02:02:07,280 Speaker 3: steer if you will. Man, it was an acquired taste 2243 02:02:07,320 --> 02:02:11,080 Speaker 3: for me. It wasn't something I started out loving, but 2244 02:02:11,200 --> 02:02:14,360 Speaker 3: once I got a taste for it, I can't see 2245 02:02:14,360 --> 02:02:16,960 Speaker 3: myself ever doing anything else. I mean, I am a 2246 02:02:17,280 --> 02:02:21,600 Speaker 3: I'm a I'm an entertainer. I mean I want to 2247 02:02:21,600 --> 02:02:24,400 Speaker 3: be on that stage. I want to play for the people. 2248 02:02:24,440 --> 02:02:27,280 Speaker 3: I mean again, traveling isn't as easy as it once was. 2249 02:02:27,320 --> 02:02:28,880 Speaker 3: I don't want to I don't want to try to 2250 02:02:28,920 --> 02:02:32,560 Speaker 3: do one hundred dates a year, you know, But I 2251 02:02:32,600 --> 02:02:34,440 Speaker 3: want to make sure that I do dates that you know. 2252 02:02:34,480 --> 02:02:35,800 Speaker 3: I want to make sure that I get to go 2253 02:02:35,880 --> 02:02:38,360 Speaker 3: out and connect with people, because at this stage of 2254 02:02:38,400 --> 02:02:40,680 Speaker 3: the game, when I get to connect to an audience, 2255 02:02:41,320 --> 02:02:44,480 Speaker 3: it's the happiest I can be in the music arena. 2256 02:02:44,720 --> 02:02:47,080 Speaker 3: And I don't see myself ever stopping that. 2257 02:02:48,160 --> 02:02:51,360 Speaker 2: Well, Dan, you tell a great story. You've filled in 2258 02:02:51,400 --> 02:02:54,160 Speaker 2: a lot of details that I've always had questions about. 2259 02:02:54,720 --> 02:02:56,880 Speaker 2: I want to thank you for taking this time with 2260 02:02:56,960 --> 02:02:57,640 Speaker 2: my audience. 2261 02:02:58,600 --> 02:03:00,360 Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, listen, I don't know if I've done 2262 02:03:00,600 --> 02:03:03,480 Speaker 3: if I've done all that. But but I have enjoyed 2263 02:03:03,520 --> 02:03:05,880 Speaker 3: your time and uh and it is get the fun, 2264 02:03:05,960 --> 02:03:07,560 Speaker 3: you know. It's fun to get to talk about the 2265 02:03:07,600 --> 02:03:11,160 Speaker 3: things at length that you don't necessarily get to touch 2266 02:03:11,160 --> 02:03:14,360 Speaker 3: on in other formats. So I really appreciate what you do, 2267 02:03:14,800 --> 02:03:16,800 Speaker 3: and I hope we can do it again sometime. 2268 02:03:18,080 --> 02:03:20,800 Speaker 2: Absolutely, it's a lot of stuff we haven't covered, but 2269 02:03:20,960 --> 02:03:23,040 Speaker 2: we've come to the end of the feeling we've known 2270 02:03:23,160 --> 02:03:27,320 Speaker 2: for today till next time. This is Bob left six