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Speaker 1: On the morning of September ninth, nineteen eighty five, Paul Hildwin,

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Speaker 1: low on money and out of gas, was hitchhiking along

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Speaker 1: US nineteen when a squabbling couple, Fronzetti Cox and William Haveerty,

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Speaker 1: picked him up. As their argument reached a fever pitch,

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Speaker 1: the couple pulled over and got out of the car.

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Speaker 1: Paul used this opportunity to take a few things for

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Speaker 1: the car, including miss Cox's checkbook, before leaving the couple

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Speaker 1: in their roadside scuffle. Four days later, on September thirteenth,

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Speaker 1: mis Cox's nude body was found stuffed in the trunk

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Speaker 1: of her car, tucked into some woods. Initially, Haveberty became

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Speaker 1: the obvious suspect, until the investigation led to one of

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Speaker 1: her checks having been cashed by Paul Hildwin, and a

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Speaker 1: search of his house turned up the stolen items from

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Speaker 1: the car. Paul's trial council was woefully inadequate, and was

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Speaker 1: further handicapped by a team of prosecutors who buried witness

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Speaker 1: statements that claimed miss Cox had been alive up to

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Speaker 1: forty eight hours after Paul had seen her, Among many

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Speaker 1: other pieces of misleading testimony, junk science and outright lies.

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Speaker 1: An FBI zerology expert falsely stated that fluids bounded the

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Speaker 1: scene matched Paul, which led to a thirty four year

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Speaker 1: fight to free him from death row. This is Wrongful

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Speaker 1: Conviction with Jason Blamm. Welcome back to Wrongful Conviction with

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Speaker 1: Jason Flamm. That's me, of course, I'm your host, and

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Speaker 1: today I'm really excited because we have a woman who

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Speaker 1: is in our wrongful conviction community considered a legal legend.

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Speaker 1: Her name is Leanne Goudie, a renowned defense attorney who

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Speaker 1: has done phenomenal work on this case. So Leanne, welcome

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Speaker 1: to Wrongful Conviction. And with her is her client, Paul Hildewin.

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Speaker 1: Paul served thirty five years on death row in Florida

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Speaker 1: for a crime everyone should have known from the outset

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Speaker 1: he didn't commit. They may have known he didn't commit it,

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Speaker 1: but one way or another, he survived thirty five years

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Speaker 1: on death row. He survived cancer, he survived, and he's

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Speaker 1: here today to share his.

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Speaker 2: Story with us. So Paul, welcome to rafel Conviction.

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Speaker 3: Thank you, Jason. I'm glad to be here.

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Speaker 1: And Paul just informed us that he's sitting on his porch,

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Speaker 1: breathing some fresh air and looking at some green grass

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Speaker 1: and stuff. So I'm glad to hear that you're living

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Speaker 1: your best life to whatever extent is possible. So let's

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Speaker 1: go back. Where did you grow up and what was

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Speaker 1: your upbringing like? And if you can bring us right

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Speaker 1: up to the time that this whole tragedy occurred.

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Speaker 3: Now, I was born in a small town called Poughkeepsie,

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Speaker 3: New York. I never really got to know my mother.

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Speaker 3: She passed away when I was two years old. When

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Speaker 3: I turned five, my father just decided he didn't want me,

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Speaker 3: so he would put me wherever he could. And there

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Speaker 3: was some good place that I was at, and there

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Speaker 3: was some bad places. Into my teen years, you know,

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Speaker 3: like all most teenagers, you know, you experiment with drinking,

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Speaker 3: and it was all it's all kind of a haze,

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Speaker 3: you know. I was drunk so much. But when I

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Speaker 3: turned eighteen, you know, I got in a little trouble,

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Speaker 3: ended up doing a little prison time in New York.

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Speaker 3: And when I got out, it was nineteen eighty four.

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Speaker 3: I was twenty four years old, and I come down

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Speaker 3: here to Florida to live with my father. One of

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Speaker 3: the families that I lived with. Always taught me it

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Speaker 3: doesn't matter what a parent does, you always have that

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Speaker 3: respect because they are your parent. And I always respected

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Speaker 3: my father. I didn't really love him, but I respected

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Speaker 3: him because he was my dad. So September twenty first,

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Speaker 3: nineteen eighty five is when I was arrested for the

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Speaker 3: crime that put me on death row for a crime

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Speaker 3: that I did not commit.

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Speaker 1: And Leanne, can you walk us through this awful crime

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Speaker 1: and how they managed to go off of the who

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Speaker 1: would have seemed to be the obvious aspect in target Paul?

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Speaker 4: Sure. So the victim allegedly went missing on September ninth

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Speaker 4: of nineteen eighty five, which would have been a Monday.

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Speaker 4: And the reason why they zeroed in on that particular

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Speaker 4: day is because well, her sister and her would speak

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Speaker 4: practically every day. Well, the sister had gone two or

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Speaker 4: three days without hearing from the victim. So the sister

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Speaker 4: went over to the trailer where her sister had lived

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Speaker 4: with this boyfriend, William Haverty, the living boyfriend said, Hey,

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Speaker 4: she left on Mondays. She was going to go do

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Speaker 4: laundry at the coin laundry. She was going to deposit

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Speaker 4: her SSI check that had come in over the weekend

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Speaker 4: at the bank. The victim had a little bit of

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Speaker 4: a reputation for being somebody that would frequent bars and

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Speaker 4: might randomly go home with a guy, so at first

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Speaker 4: the sister won to see if maybe something like that

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Speaker 4: had happened. When she still hadn't heard from the victim

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Speaker 4: the next day, she went back to the trailer and

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Speaker 4: insisted that the boyfriend go with her to the police

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Speaker 4: department to report her missing. And so on Thursday, September twelfth,

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Speaker 4: in the evening, they go to the Hernando County Sheriff's office.

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Speaker 4: They report the victim, whose name was ron Setti Cox, missing,

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Speaker 4: and then the very next day, which was Friday, September thirteenth,

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Speaker 4: a group of boys find a deserted car with a

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Speaker 4: really bad smell. Police respond and they find the victim nude,

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Speaker 4: stuffed in the trunk of the car with a ligature

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Speaker 4: around her neck. The immediate suspect is the living boyfriend,

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Speaker 4: William Haveerty, who was about twenty years younger than the victim,

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Speaker 4: and he just appeared kind of scurly to the police,

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Speaker 4: and so they focused in on him. What ended up

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Speaker 4: happening was they wanted to see when she had gone

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Speaker 4: to the bank to deposit the social Security check. And

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Speaker 4: so they discovered that the last check that came in

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Speaker 4: on the victim's bank account was cashed by an individual

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Speaker 4: named Paul Hildwin, and that he had come through the

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Speaker 4: drive through of the bank on September ninth at approximately

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Speaker 4: twelve thirty in the afternoon. At that point in time,

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Speaker 4: now law enforcement shifts their suspicion from the boyfriend, William Haverity,

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Speaker 4: over to Paul and basically become extremely myopic and focused

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Speaker 4: in with a tunnel vision only on Paul.

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Speaker 1: Right, And there was a lot of circumstantial evidence right,

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Speaker 1: that was really just the result of an unfortunate coincidence,

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Speaker 1: which goes back to the night of September.

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Speaker 3: Eighth, myself and three friends went to a drive in

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Speaker 3: movie and I think it was a Clon Eastwood movie,

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Speaker 3: Pale Rider. We left there and I dropped the young

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Speaker 3: man that was I dropped him off at his house

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Speaker 3: and then I started heading home. The two girls that

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Speaker 3: were with me, they lived, you know, just down the

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Speaker 3: street from me, so I was taking them home as well,

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Speaker 3: and I ran out of gas, and I got like

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Speaker 3: a dollar or something worth of gas put it in

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Speaker 3: the car. I put a little bit in the car

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Speaker 3: bead to try to get a start, but the way

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Speaker 3: the car was setting it was on an angle, like

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Speaker 3: almost in a ditch, and the gas wasn't getting pulled

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Speaker 3: up into the engine. So I went to my house,

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Speaker 3: my father's house, and I had to get a battery

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Speaker 3: because I wore a battery down in the car trying

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Speaker 3: to start it. So I got the battery and I

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Speaker 3: got a ride back from a friend. Anyway, he got

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Speaker 3: back to the car still wouldn't start, so I wasn't

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Speaker 3: going to run that battery down, so we got in

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Speaker 3: the car and we ended up just falling asleep.

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Speaker 4: So when he's en route to take the girls home,

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Speaker 4: the car runs out of gas and stalls in front

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Speaker 4: of a bar called the Lone Star Bar. It's right

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Speaker 4: off of US nineteen. Paul wakes up somewhere between eight

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Speaker 4: thirty and nine am. Girls are still sleeping. He decides,

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Speaker 4: I'm going to walk home and see if I can

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Speaker 4: either borrow my dad's truck or get some money to

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Speaker 4: try to put some more gas in those cars. So

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Speaker 4: he's walking north on US nineteen and the victim and

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Speaker 4: her boyfriend William Haveerty are driving north on US nineteen.

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Speaker 5: They pull over.

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Speaker 4: He tells them, Hey, I'm trying to get up to

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Speaker 4: my dad's house. He gets in the back seat. They're

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Speaker 4: driving to the dad's house. She and the boyfriend start

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Speaker 4: arguing about he's sick of her going out with other men.

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Speaker 4: She's basically telling him off. The fight is getting pretty

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Speaker 4: loud and hostile Paul sitting in the back seat. In

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Speaker 4: the back seat is the victim's purse. Within her purse

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Speaker 4: is like a separate checkbook holder, and the victim says,

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Speaker 4: I've had enough of you. She stops the car. She says,

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Speaker 4: get out. Boyfriend says I'm not getting out. Victim says

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Speaker 4: she's getting out. The two of them end up getting out.

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Speaker 4: They slap each other around the lift little bit. All

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Speaker 4: of this is going on. At this Paul's not that

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Speaker 4: far from his house, so he grabs the checkbook thing

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Speaker 4: and leaves, and the last thing he sees is that

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Speaker 4: the boyfriend is on top of the victim and his

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Speaker 4: hands around her neck. He's like, I'm not getting in

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Speaker 4: the middle of this because the boyfriend has threatened him,

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Speaker 4: and he walks home. Once he gets home, his Dad's

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Speaker 4: not there, gets some leftover money, hitches a ride back

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Speaker 4: to where the girls are. He buys another two dollars

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Speaker 4: worth of gas. They level out the car, He puts

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Speaker 4: the gas in the car, drops the girls off at

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Speaker 4: home in his car. He then forges one of the

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Speaker 4: victims checks, goes to the bank, cashes the check, giving

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Speaker 4: his ID the checks for seventy five dollars.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 1: So, ultimately, because Paul, you know, foolishly, let's call it

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Speaker 1: what it is, took a few items from the car,

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Speaker 1: a radio, a ring, and of course the that we

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Speaker 1: talked about. When the attention of the authorities shifts to him,

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Speaker 1: they probably had some sort of eureka moment like, oh,

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Speaker 1: look at this, we got sort of, for lack of

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Speaker 1: a better word, the smoking gun. And at that point,

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Speaker 1: like you said, the tunnel vision sets in. He really

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Speaker 1: needs a great lawyer. And that's not at all how

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Speaker 1: this played out.

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Speaker 4: Right, So on November twenty first, they get a grand

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Speaker 4: jury to indict him with first degree murder and they

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Speaker 4: announced that they're seeking death. So this particular attorney, Dan Lewin,

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Speaker 4: had just graduated from Florida State Law School. He had

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Speaker 4: never done a murder case. He had never done even

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Speaker 4: a serious robbery case. So on April twenty fourth of

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Speaker 4: nineteen eighty six, he gets appointed to this death penalty

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Speaker 4: case and they pick a jury four months later on

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Speaker 4: August twenty fifth. In between that time period, he conducted

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Speaker 4: absolutely no investigation. This defense lawyer took depositions, and the

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Speaker 4: significance of that is the lack of thoroughness. In addition

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Speaker 4: to that, it is also clear when you review those

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Speaker 4: depositions that the prosecution was not giving him all the

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Speaker 4: police reports. In addition to that, the Hillsborough County Sheriff's

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Speaker 4: office decide, you know what, We're not going to use

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Speaker 4: the Florida Department of Law Enforcement, which was the state

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Speaker 4: agency that would do the lab work for the police

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Speaker 4: agencies in Florida. We're going to send this stuff to

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Speaker 4: the FBI. And it's at the FBI where they're doing

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Speaker 4: the so called roology, hair examination and tool mark examinations

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Speaker 4: on some chrome strips that they believe came off of

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Speaker 4: the alleged victims car.

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Speaker 1: You've just identified several of the key elements of junk

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Speaker 1: science that we talk about in our podcast Raflicviction Junk Science.

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Speaker 2: But there's so much more to this.

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Speaker 1: You have circumstantial evidence, you have tunnel vision, tons of

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Speaker 1: junk science, and then you have incumbent defense attorney, and

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Speaker 1: you also have experts that are willing to lie on

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Speaker 1: behalf of the prosecution. And we know that the prosecutor

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Speaker 1: at the present to the soroology report from an FBI's

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Speaker 1: forensics expert who falsely claimed that bodily fluids found on

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Speaker 1: two pieces of crime scene evidence, the underwear the woman's

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Speaker 1: underwear and a washcloth, both matched Paul Hildwin. The expert

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Speaker 1: also claimed that Paul was among only eleven percent of

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Speaker 1: the world's white male population who could have deposited the fluids,

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Speaker 1: and that the fluids could not have come from the

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Speaker 1: victim's a strange boyfriend. So this is a mountain of shit,

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Speaker 1: I mean.

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Speaker 4: Paul, shit is the appropriate word.

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Speaker 2: Thank you. I chose that carefully.

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Speaker 4: In defense of mister Lewan on this part. They sprung

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Speaker 4: on the soroology evidence that did not come out until

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Speaker 4: opening statements, and he immediately objected and when they approached

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Speaker 4: the bench, he said, this can't come in. I was

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Speaker 4: told that the zerology evidence was of no value, everything

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Speaker 4: was too degraded. They couldn't get anything of it, and

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Speaker 4: now they're telling the jury that it links my client

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Speaker 4: and they can't use that, and the prosecution and goes,

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Speaker 4: you want to bet that's on the record, and the

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Speaker 4: judge says, yeah, no, this is opening. They can do it,

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Speaker 4: and we'll address it during the trial. And then when

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Speaker 4: they come to the point where he objects again during

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Speaker 4: the trial, it's the friday before Labor Day weekend, and

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Speaker 4: the judge says, well, you've got till Tuesday to be ready.

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Speaker 4: Three days. And remember what we had to work with

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Speaker 4: in nineteen eighty five. There wasn't internet research. When we

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Speaker 4: researched case law. We went the old fashioned way into

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Speaker 4: the law library, which took a lot of time. So

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Speaker 4: he basically gives us inexperience, unqualified lawyer three days to

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Speaker 4: familiarize himself with roology, evidence and secretor and nonsecretor. You

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Speaker 4: have got to be kidding me.

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Speaker 1: So September fourth, nineteen eighty six, you were found guilty,

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Speaker 1: and September seventeenth, the jury, by a unanimous vote of

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Speaker 1: twelfth to nothing, sentence you to death.

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Speaker 3: Even though the defense was what it was. I didn't

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Speaker 3: expect that when they sentenced me to death. I just

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Speaker 3: I don't know. I think my mind just shut down.

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Speaker 3: After that, what I call the real living hell started.

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Speaker 3: You're basically in that cell twenty four hours a day.

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Speaker 3: You get three shours a week. You get to go

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Speaker 3: to the yard twice a week, and it's a little

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Speaker 3: tiny yard. And if you don't go to the yard,

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Speaker 3: you're just in that cell twenty four hours a day,

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Speaker 3: and you become desensitized.

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Speaker 5: Really.

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Speaker 3: After like the first four years, I just disconnected myself.

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Speaker 3: I didn't care about time, I didn't care about holidays.

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Speaker 3: I didn't you know, none of that stuff mattered. What

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Speaker 3: was important to me was just surviving. After my dad

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Speaker 3: passed in nineteen ninety, I didn't have a visit until

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Speaker 3: two thousand and six. My life was in that cell.

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Speaker 3: I did everything I ate in there. I washed all

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Speaker 3: my clothes and there. I mean, my whole life was

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Speaker 3: in that little box. In nineteen eighty eight eighty nine,

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Speaker 3: a very good friend of mine, Kenny Hardwick, he gave

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Speaker 3: up and he was in the cell next to me,

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Speaker 3: and I could see him. The windows were not in

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Speaker 3: the cell. They were like eight to ten feet away

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Speaker 3: from the front of the cell. The cell fronts were

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Speaker 3: all open. We could talk, we could pass things back

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Speaker 3: and forth. And I watched them hang himself. I couldn't

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Speaker 3: stop them. I couldn't help them.

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Speaker 5: You know. I went to screaming for the police.

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Speaker 3: They come and tell me to shut my fort mouth.

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Speaker 1: This episode is underwritten by the AIG pro Bono Program.

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Speaker 1: AIG is a leading global insurance company, and for over

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Speaker 1: a decade, the AIG pro Bono Program has provided thousands

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Speaker 1: of hours of free legal services and other support to

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Speaker 1: nonprofit organizations and individuals most in need. More recently, the

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Speaker 1: program added criminal and social justice reform as a key

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Speaker 1: pillar of its mission.

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Speaker 2: This episode is brought to you by Stand Together.

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Speaker 1: Stand Together is a philanthropic community dedicated to helping people

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Speaker 1: improve their lives. For more than twenty years, Stand Together

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Speaker 1: and its partners have been on the front lines of

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Speaker 1: criminal justice reform. By empowering people to take action, supporting nonprofits,

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Speaker 1: of problems in our communities and empowers those closest to

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Speaker 1: the problems to drive solutions. Solutions like reducing unjust prison

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Speaker 1: sentences through the First Step Act, empowering community based programs

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Speaker 1: and help people re enter society and now working to

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Speaker 1: bridge divides in our communities. To learn how you may

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Speaker 1: get involved, visit Standtogether dot org slash conviction.

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Speaker 4: I believe it was either nineteen eighty nine or nineteen ninety.

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Speaker 4: Governor Martinez signed Paul's death worn and Paul has the

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Speaker 4: fortuitous opportunity to have a terrific lawyer named Marty McClain,

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Speaker 4: and so Marty begins to investigate. And at that point,

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Speaker 4: the state attorney is different. And so when Marty McLain

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Speaker 4: issues the requests for Paul's file and all the police

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Speaker 4: reports and whatever, they actually turn it over, and that's

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Speaker 4: when he discovers all these things that either were not

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Speaker 4: disclosed to mister Lewin or that mister Lewin just didn't

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Speaker 4: bother to use, like the victim's nephew that says that

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Speaker 4: he was having drinks with the victim on Monday night,

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Speaker 4: September ninth until eleven fifteen pm. Meanwhile, according to the

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Speaker 4: state's theory at trial, Paul had allegedly killed her somewhere

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Speaker 4: between nine point fifteen and ten in the morning. But

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Speaker 4: yet the nephew is having drinks with her as the

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Speaker 4: boyfriend was mad and sulking in a corner well. That

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Speaker 4: never came out in trial. That nephew was never deposed

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Speaker 4: by mister Lewin. The boyfriend was allowed to represent this

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Speaker 4: really fabulous relationship with Throng. So Marty McLain discovers that

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Speaker 4: when law enforcement searched the victim and her boyfriend's house,

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Speaker 4: there was a note in the garbage can that said

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Speaker 4: if you don't like living here, you can fuck off

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Speaker 4: and die. That never came out during trial. I mean

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Speaker 4: it just went on and on and on. So he

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Speaker 4: discovered all this stuff. He found what's called the thirty

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Speaker 4: eight to fifty motion, which is a motion to find

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Speaker 4: the defense lawyer ineffective of counsel and that if Paul

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Speaker 4: had had effective assistance of counsel or had received this

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Speaker 4: Brady information and it had been used, it would have

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Speaker 4: changed the outcome of the trial. And the judge denies

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Speaker 4: both and says that Paul had effective assistance of counsel.

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Speaker 4: It goes up on appeal to the Florida Supreme Court Court.

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Speaker 4: The Florida Supreme Court hangs her hat on the soroology

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Speaker 4: evidence to say, no, it wouldn't have affected the outcome

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Speaker 4: of the trial. In first phase. But we do find

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Speaker 4: that the penalty phase was ineffective, and they grant Paul

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Speaker 4: the opportunity to have a second penalty phase, and so

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Speaker 4: that happens in nineteen ninety seven and the jury comes

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Speaker 4: back eight to four for death. Remember at the time

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Speaker 4: in Florida, it only required a majority of jurors to

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Speaker 4: vote for death. So Paul gets death again and so CCRC,

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Speaker 4: the group that Marty McClain worked for, contacts the Innocence

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Speaker 4: Project they get involved in. During all that investigation, they

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Speaker 4: also discover another witness that said she had had a

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Speaker 4: conversation with the victim at three o'clock in the afternoon

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Speaker 4: on the Wednesday after she supposedly died. They also started

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Speaker 4: attacking the soerology and they seek for it to get

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Speaker 4: into they tested. When they do, at this point, DNA

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Speaker 4: is in existence. They discover that the DNA on the

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Speaker 4: panties and on the washrag, which is what was sold

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Speaker 4: to the jury in nineteen eighty six and what the

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Speaker 4: Supreme Court relied upon in sustaining his guilty verdict both

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Speaker 4: the first time and during the thirty eight to fifty hearing,

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Speaker 4: do not match Paul.

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Speaker 3: It was February of two thousand and three, we went

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Speaker 3: to the Circuit Court with the test results.

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Speaker 4: So that ends up happening that they discover, Okay, it's

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Speaker 4: not Paul's biological material on this, we want you to

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Speaker 4: run it through the CODA system, and they start getting

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Speaker 4: pushed back from the state and the Attorney General's office.

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Speaker 4: And this continues and continues to get litigated until two

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Speaker 4: thousand and eleven, where finally the Supreme Court says, put

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Speaker 4: it in the CODA system. When they run the DNA

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Speaker 4: into the CODA system, it matches William Haveerty, the victim's

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Speaker 4: living boyfriend, and at the time he was incarcerated for

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Speaker 4: sixteen counts of sexual battery for sexually molesting his stepdaughter.

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Speaker 1: And here we go again. I'm so sick of these

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Speaker 1: stories where the wrong person gets locked up the actual

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Speaker 1: perpetrator remains free and goes on to commit these unspeakable

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Speaker 1: acts against people who never should have been victimized in

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Speaker 1: the first place if the system had worked the way.

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Speaker 4: It should so then at that point Nina Morrison and

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Speaker 4: Morty maclain are pushing the Supreme Court to give Paul,

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Speaker 4: based on this newly discovered evidence, a new trial, with

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Speaker 4: the state giving pushback under the grounds, hey, this was

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Speaker 4: the sex crimes case. And finally, in June of twenty fourteen,

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Speaker 4: the Florida Supreme Court grants Paul on new trial.

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Speaker 1: Okay, but now, how did this case, of all the

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Speaker 1: cases end up on your desk?

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Speaker 4: Nina Morrison called me and asked, could I fly down

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Speaker 4: to Tampa and meet with you and talk to you

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Speaker 4: about this case. Anybody that knows Nina Morrison, she's like, Sam,

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Speaker 4: I am, don't let her in your house because she's

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Speaker 4: going to convince you to do whatever she wants you

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Speaker 4: to do. And so she came into the office and

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Speaker 4: persuaded me to agree to do this case pro bono

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Speaker 4: beginning in August of twenty fourteen until it concluded on

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Speaker 4: March ninth of twenty twenty.

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Speaker 2: Two, thousand and three.

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Speaker 1: The DNA proves DNA we're talking about right, was produced

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Speaker 1: that proved that Paul didn't do it, or at a minimum,

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Speaker 1: that the state's case was completely wrong, and that the

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Speaker 1: main piece of evidence that they basedid I was proven false.

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Speaker 1: And yet it took seventeen more years to bring Paul home.

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Speaker 1: And then even that comes with an asterisk right.

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Speaker 4: You know, I get appointed to the case in twenty fourteen,

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Speaker 4: and so the stay they still stood on the position

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Speaker 4: that they felt that Paul was guilty, and so to them,

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Speaker 4: the quote fair end quote option was to let him

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Speaker 4: plead to second degree murder, get credit for time served,

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Speaker 4: and put him on lifetime probation. So Paul's big mandate

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Speaker 4: to me from the beginning was I would like to

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Speaker 4: feel grass underneath my feet before I die. And so

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Speaker 4: I would talk to him about these offers the state

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Speaker 4: was making and you know, explain to him why it

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Speaker 4: was basically a no brainer for us to say no

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Speaker 4: to that and continue forward. But we did talk about

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Speaker 4: would you take anything to guarantee that you would get out?

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Speaker 4: And we have kind of talked about, well, I would

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Speaker 4: plead reluctantly, but I would plead no contest to a

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Speaker 4: second degree murder and time served, and I'll even take

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Speaker 4: some probation afterwards, because i know I'm not going to

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Speaker 4: commit any crimes, and so I'll do that. So fast

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Speaker 4: forward to Friday morning before trial, March sixth, and the

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Speaker 4: prosecution says to me, would he still plead to a

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Speaker 4: second and time served? But we're going to want probation,

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Speaker 4: and Paul was like, yes, he goes, you know, I

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Speaker 4: want the bird in the hand. I want to know

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Speaker 4: I'm going to get out. I don't want to take

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Speaker 4: any risks, so he pled. You know, it was totally

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Speaker 4: Paul's decision. We were one hundred percent ready to proceed

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Speaker 4: forward with the trial.

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Speaker 1: Paul March ninth, twenty twenty. I've watched the video of

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Speaker 1: you walking out more times than I want to admit.

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Speaker 1: It's so incredible. What was that like?

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Speaker 3: And when I walked out the door of the jail,

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Speaker 3: I was met by Lean Goudie and kate O'Shea. I

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Speaker 3: actually couldn't believe that it was really happening. And that

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Speaker 3: day when we left the jail and there was the

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Speaker 3: first thing I wanted to do was feel grass under

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Speaker 3: my feet, my bare feet, just to walk on grass.

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Speaker 3: He goes inside the jail, Well, then the prisons. I

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Speaker 3: mean it's all concrete and steel.

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Speaker 5: That's it. You don't get the walk on the grass.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's just the simplest thing. That was a big

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Speaker 3: thing for me. I wanted to walk on the grass,

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Speaker 3: and as the video shows, that's exactly what they did.

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Speaker 3: They took me to a nearby park, and that was

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Speaker 3: the most special part about it.

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Speaker 2: Really walking on grass.

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Speaker 3: People don't understand what we take for granted every single

435
00:25:28,400 --> 00:25:31,640
Speaker 3: day of our life. Closing the door by yourself, stepping

436
00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:37,520
Speaker 3: on grass, smelling fresh cut grass. It made me realize

437
00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:43,200
Speaker 3: just what myself included everybody takes for granted. Then Miss

438
00:25:43,200 --> 00:25:48,119
Speaker 3: Goudie and her partner Kim Kahn Kato'sha and Anthony Scott,

439
00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:50,800
Speaker 3: they took me to Cracker Barrel on the way down

440
00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:54,240
Speaker 3: to Tampa, and I had never been to the Cracker

441
00:25:54,280 --> 00:25:57,960
Speaker 3: Barrel and that was my very first that was my

442
00:25:58,200 --> 00:25:59,840
Speaker 3: very first freedom.

443
00:26:01,480 --> 00:26:04,520
Speaker 4: I just want to interrupt so nobody thinks I'm at cheapskate.

444
00:26:04,720 --> 00:26:07,560
Speaker 4: It was the best restaurant in Hernando County.

445
00:26:07,960 --> 00:26:09,639
Speaker 2: Thank you for clarifying that.

446
00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:24,120
Speaker 1: Now, Paul, this was touched on a bit, but I mean,

447
00:26:24,760 --> 00:26:27,320
Speaker 1: it wasn't bad enough that the state was trying to

448
00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:28,560
Speaker 1: kill you, but cancer.

449
00:26:29,040 --> 00:26:31,399
Speaker 3: At first, it was just recognized that I had a

450
00:26:31,520 --> 00:26:34,520
Speaker 3: lump in front of my left ear and the gland

451
00:26:34,560 --> 00:26:37,840
Speaker 3: in my throat on the left side was swollen up.

452
00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:40,520
Speaker 3: And I went and I saw an ear, nose, and

453
00:26:40,560 --> 00:26:46,000
Speaker 3: throat doctor and so he did a biopsy on both

454
00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:50,000
Speaker 3: the lump and the swollen gland, and it came back

455
00:26:50,080 --> 00:26:55,679
Speaker 3: to be non Hotchkins lymphoma. So I went through surgery,

456
00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:59,200
Speaker 3: through radiation, then I started chemo.

457
00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:02,520
Speaker 1: You know, and thankfully you made it, but cancer wasn't done.

458
00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:06,119
Speaker 1: You still had to go through it two more fucking times.

459
00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:10,960
Speaker 3: In twenty eleven or twenty twelve is when it showed

460
00:27:11,040 --> 00:27:11,520
Speaker 3: up again.

461
00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:14,160
Speaker 5: The next time I believe it was.

462
00:27:14,280 --> 00:27:20,240
Speaker 3: In twenty sixteen twenty seventeen. By that time, I was

463
00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:23,160
Speaker 3: used to the weight loss, the sickness, and.

464
00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:25,440
Speaker 5: No hair.

465
00:27:25,520 --> 00:27:27,919
Speaker 3: I lost every single piece of hair on my body.

466
00:27:27,960 --> 00:27:30,400
Speaker 3: I looked like Uncle fester On.

467
00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:34,440
Speaker 1: Jesus Paul, You're just really fucking hard to kill y.

468
00:27:34,560 --> 00:27:36,800
Speaker 1: I don't know how else I think. Yeah, I mean

469
00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:38,960
Speaker 1: the state can't. Cancer can't.

470
00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:44,760
Speaker 4: He survived cancer on death row, so clearly you know

471
00:27:44,840 --> 00:27:47,240
Speaker 4: God didn't want to kill him. If he was supposed

472
00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:48,960
Speaker 4: to be dead, he would be dead.

473
00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:52,440
Speaker 1: Speaking of the magic of the universe, I must take

474
00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:56,159
Speaker 1: this opportunity to congratulate lean on her election to the

475
00:27:56,280 --> 00:28:00,080
Speaker 1: Thirteenth Circuit Court Judge Leanne GODDI.

476
00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:01,199
Speaker 5: Thank you, thank you.

477
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:07,640
Speaker 4: Typically when you're a new judge, you do rotations through

478
00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:11,879
Speaker 4: family law or one of the other areas prior to

479
00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:16,320
Speaker 4: going over to criminal, but I'm being placed right in criminal,

480
00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:20,920
Speaker 4: so i will be taking over a circuit criminal division.

481
00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:22,440
Speaker 4: So I'm very excited.

482
00:28:22,760 --> 00:28:25,960
Speaker 1: That's amazing and it makes me so happy both for

483
00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:29,480
Speaker 1: you and also knowing that someone from the defense side

484
00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:31,280
Speaker 1: of the bar will be sitting on the bench.

485
00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:32,399
Speaker 2: So all the best.

486
00:28:32,560 --> 00:28:35,000
Speaker 1: And on that note, we're now going to go to

487
00:28:35,040 --> 00:28:37,879
Speaker 1: the segment of our show called Closing Arguments. It's the

488
00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:40,440
Speaker 1: part where I first of all thank both of you

489
00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:42,600
Speaker 1: from the bottom of my heart for being here and

490
00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:46,840
Speaker 1: sharing your story and of course your spirit with us.

491
00:28:46,920 --> 00:28:50,400
Speaker 1: And then now I am going to shut off my microphone,

492
00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:53,800
Speaker 1: kick back in my chair, close my eyes, and just

493
00:28:53,920 --> 00:28:57,680
Speaker 1: listen to whatever you want to say. We'll start with you,

494
00:28:57,800 --> 00:28:59,920
Speaker 1: Leanne and then finish with Paul.

495
00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:05,040
Speaker 4: You know, it was my privilege to represent Paul. I'm

496
00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:09,960
Speaker 4: so grateful that Nina Morrison entrusted his case to me,

497
00:29:10,320 --> 00:29:13,960
Speaker 4: and I'm grateful that Paul trusted me to represent him.

498
00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:17,880
Speaker 4: I think that it's always an honor when somebody that's

499
00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:21,040
Speaker 4: accused of a crime puts their trust in you as

500
00:29:21,040 --> 00:29:23,760
Speaker 4: a lawyer to do the best you can for them,

501
00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:29,040
Speaker 4: and I'm just very, very grateful to God, frankly, that

502
00:29:30,120 --> 00:29:34,120
Speaker 4: I was able to deliver on Paul's request to be

503
00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:38,080
Speaker 4: able to let him feel grass underneath his feet before

504
00:29:38,160 --> 00:29:41,320
Speaker 4: he died. And hopefully he'll have many, many more years

505
00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:44,840
Speaker 4: to live and continue smelling grass and cut grass and

506
00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:50,760
Speaker 4: feeling it and living peacefully and happily out in society

507
00:29:50,880 --> 00:29:51,640
Speaker 4: like he should be.

508
00:29:52,240 --> 00:29:53,560
Speaker 2: Paul over to you.

509
00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:57,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, Leanne and I have talked several times, you know,

510
00:29:57,120 --> 00:30:01,480
Speaker 3: about my belief in God. I believe that that's what

511
00:30:01,680 --> 00:30:05,120
Speaker 3: got me through thirty five years. I also believe it

512
00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:09,520
Speaker 3: be the reason why Nina Morrison was put on my case,

513
00:30:09,720 --> 00:30:13,479
Speaker 3: why Leanne Goudi was put on my case. It was

514
00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:17,320
Speaker 3: by the grace of God. I've been blessed so much

515
00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:20,800
Speaker 3: since I've been out because of the Innocent Project in

516
00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:24,240
Speaker 3: New York, the Innocent Project in Florida. They are a

517
00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:30,040
Speaker 3: nonprofit organization and because of the donations. It's one reason

518
00:30:30,320 --> 00:30:33,240
Speaker 3: a big region why I'm sitting here where I live now.

519
00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:37,360
Speaker 3: There's an organization that helped me find this place, and

520
00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:40,800
Speaker 3: it's called the Sunny Center. They are a non profit

521
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:44,600
Speaker 3: organization and they are the ones that have helped me

522
00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:47,840
Speaker 3: since I've been out. They have been there every day,

523
00:30:48,120 --> 00:30:51,720
Speaker 3: every step of the way. They also need donations in

524
00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:55,600
Speaker 3: order to help people in my position and exonnaies.

525
00:30:55,840 --> 00:30:57,320
Speaker 5: And you know.

526
00:30:57,200 --> 00:31:01,040
Speaker 3: They've gotten me health insurance, They've helped me get my

527
00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:04,640
Speaker 3: driver's license. They're there, I mean, but they won't be

528
00:31:04,760 --> 00:31:07,760
Speaker 3: there if people don't make donations.

529
00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:09,480
Speaker 5: And I believe they they.

530
00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:11,600
Speaker 3: Were put there by God as well, you know, in

531
00:31:11,640 --> 00:31:12,320
Speaker 3: my life.

532
00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:13,160
Speaker 5: And I want to.

533
00:31:13,080 --> 00:31:19,040
Speaker 3: Say thank you, leek LeAnn. The freedom is so sweet.

534
00:31:19,440 --> 00:31:22,320
Speaker 3: You know, you gave me back my life and I

535
00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:23,760
Speaker 3: thank you with all my heart.

536
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:34,880
Speaker 1: Always, Paul always, thank you for listening to Wrongful Conviction

537
00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:38,920
Speaker 1: with Jason Flamm. Please support your local innocence projects and

538
00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:40,760
Speaker 1: go to the link in our bio to see how

539
00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:43,480
Speaker 1: you can help. I'd like to thank our production team,

540
00:31:43,760 --> 00:31:47,560
Speaker 1: Connor Hall, Jeff Cliburn and Kevin Warnis. The music on

541
00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:50,680
Speaker 1: the show, as always, is by three time OSCAR nominated

542
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:54,200
Speaker 1: composer Jay Ralph. Be sure to follow us on Instagram

543
00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:58,320
Speaker 1: at Wrongful Conviction and on Facebook at Wrongful Conviction Podcast.

544
00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:01,560
Speaker 1: Wrongful Conviction with Jason Flam is a production of Lava

545
00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:11,280
Speaker 1: for Good Podcasts in association with Signal Company Number one