1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:04,680 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:09,080 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,079 Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A 4 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:25,320 Speaker 1: production of My Heart Radio Welcome back to the show. 5 00:00:25,440 --> 00:00:28,160 Speaker 1: My name is Matt, my name is Noel. They called 6 00:00:28,160 --> 00:00:31,360 Speaker 1: me Ben. We're joined as always with our super producer Paul. 7 00:00:31,440 --> 00:00:35,600 Speaker 1: Mission Control deconds. Most importantly, you are you, You are here, 8 00:00:35,800 --> 00:00:38,720 Speaker 1: and that makes this stuff they don't want you to 9 00:00:38,840 --> 00:00:45,839 Speaker 1: know a better way to begin war? Uh good? Is 10 00:00:46,000 --> 00:00:52,400 Speaker 1: it good for? Uh? Some stuff? Yeah? Absolutely, well, a 11 00:00:52,440 --> 00:00:56,480 Speaker 1: lot of things depending on who you ask. History hinges 12 00:00:56,640 --> 00:01:00,960 Speaker 1: on the outcome of global and regional con flicks. The 13 00:01:01,000 --> 00:01:05,080 Speaker 1: world in which you exist today, no matter where you live, 14 00:01:05,760 --> 00:01:09,560 Speaker 1: is the way it is because of some conflict in 15 00:01:09,600 --> 00:01:13,640 Speaker 1: the past, whether ancient or whether recent or indeed ongoing. 16 00:01:14,080 --> 00:01:18,399 Speaker 1: We know war drives innovation, along with misery, degradation, and death, 17 00:01:18,720 --> 00:01:22,280 Speaker 1: and wars themselves as long time listeners will know, our 18 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:26,760 Speaker 1: rife with conspiracies and conspiracy theories. War generates and it 19 00:01:26,920 --> 00:01:31,480 Speaker 1: cost billions upon billions of dollars every year. We actually 20 00:01:31,560 --> 00:01:34,000 Speaker 1: do not know how much because there's a lot of 21 00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:38,080 Speaker 1: dirty money involved. Shout out to the Department of Defenses 22 00:01:38,680 --> 00:01:43,559 Speaker 1: disappearing palettes of cash in the billions. We remember that story, uh, 23 00:01:43,920 --> 00:01:47,319 Speaker 1: fading from the news, but we we have snapshots, like, 24 00:01:47,400 --> 00:01:50,520 Speaker 1: for example, when you look at World War two, Congress 25 00:01:50,680 --> 00:01:55,600 Speaker 1: estimates that war alone costs the US four point one 26 00:01:55,800 --> 00:02:00,200 Speaker 1: trillion dollars, which I promise you is a number of 27 00:02:00,280 --> 00:02:04,080 Speaker 1: us listening to the show today can truly comprehend, right, Like, 28 00:02:04,120 --> 00:02:06,240 Speaker 1: we don't even know what a billion dollars is. Really, 29 00:02:06,400 --> 00:02:09,080 Speaker 1: it's pretty hard to wrap your head around it. Uh. 30 00:02:09,120 --> 00:02:12,160 Speaker 1: And like you said, that's for the US alone, right, Yeah, 31 00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:15,720 Speaker 1: that's not a country that had its entire infrastructure or 32 00:02:15,720 --> 00:02:18,800 Speaker 1: of large swans of it wiped out by bombs. Yeah, 33 00:02:18,840 --> 00:02:22,520 Speaker 1: one of the few that did not. So the motivation 34 00:02:23,080 --> 00:02:26,120 Speaker 1: for war can come in any number of guys. And 35 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:28,320 Speaker 1: we've said this on the show before, and I know 36 00:02:28,360 --> 00:02:32,239 Speaker 1: it can be a controversial opinion for some, but historically, 37 00:02:32,720 --> 00:02:36,440 Speaker 1: at the core, no matter what the rationale is, war 38 00:02:36,600 --> 00:02:41,360 Speaker 1: has always been resource driven. In very simple terms, that 39 00:02:41,480 --> 00:02:45,040 Speaker 1: other tribe has stuff we want, or we have stuff 40 00:02:45,080 --> 00:02:47,960 Speaker 1: they want, and we're worried they're just gonna stop talking 41 00:02:48,000 --> 00:02:51,560 Speaker 1: to us one day and take it. Humans historically are 42 00:02:51,760 --> 00:02:56,680 Speaker 1: terrible at sharing. That's also true. Uh So today's question, 43 00:02:56,840 --> 00:02:59,919 Speaker 1: I think, Matt Noll, it's it's been on our collect 44 00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:03,680 Speaker 1: of minds for a long long time. Is war more 45 00:03:03,760 --> 00:03:09,440 Speaker 1: than just a breakdown of communication and diplomacy and alternative strategies? 46 00:03:10,320 --> 00:03:16,239 Speaker 1: Has war in the US especially become an economic necessity? 47 00:03:16,280 --> 00:03:21,760 Speaker 1: Is the US addicted to war? Here are the facts. Also, 48 00:03:21,840 --> 00:03:24,960 Speaker 1: we're going to say war a lot in today's show, 49 00:03:25,240 --> 00:03:29,280 Speaker 1: So don't worry if you encounter what's called uh semantic 50 00:03:29,320 --> 00:03:32,760 Speaker 1: safety world war war, war, war, war war, it only 51 00:03:32,800 --> 00:03:35,560 Speaker 1: takes and then it just sounds like a like a 52 00:03:35,640 --> 00:03:39,200 Speaker 1: synthesizer noise um. And so generally for this show, we're 53 00:03:39,200 --> 00:03:44,920 Speaker 1: talking about actual warfare, not necessarily cold war things. But 54 00:03:45,040 --> 00:03:48,240 Speaker 1: although the build up for a cold war situation can 55 00:03:48,280 --> 00:03:52,160 Speaker 1: be very economically viable for a country, right well, and 56 00:03:52,520 --> 00:03:54,960 Speaker 1: it involves many of the same things to the lead 57 00:03:55,040 --> 00:03:57,800 Speaker 1: up right then a regular warwood it's all about preparation 58 00:03:57,880 --> 00:04:01,280 Speaker 1: and gathering, infrastructure and all that stuff. Yes, so I 59 00:04:01,320 --> 00:04:03,360 Speaker 1: guess it is kind of both of those things bend whatdy. 60 00:04:03,480 --> 00:04:06,920 Speaker 1: But in in many cases throughout this episode, I'm assuming 61 00:04:06,920 --> 00:04:10,160 Speaker 1: we're going to be discussing a hot war where there 62 00:04:10,160 --> 00:04:14,200 Speaker 1: there are missiles flying and weapons being fired when we're 63 00:04:14,320 --> 00:04:16,920 Speaker 1: using this stuff we've been building for so long. That's 64 00:04:16,960 --> 00:04:20,400 Speaker 1: an excellent point because you still have a lot of 65 00:04:20,440 --> 00:04:24,600 Speaker 1: militarization in a cold war. You're just you're preparing in advance. 66 00:04:24,680 --> 00:04:26,840 Speaker 1: You're getting that what they call it in cooking your 67 00:04:26,839 --> 00:04:30,159 Speaker 1: misses in place where you cut up all the ingredients 68 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:32,520 Speaker 1: in advance so you can cook right when it's time 69 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:35,240 Speaker 1: to cook. Also, it's the best way to go about it. 70 00:04:35,240 --> 00:04:38,480 Speaker 1: It is, it is, It's totally worth it. But uh, 71 00:04:38,520 --> 00:04:41,800 Speaker 1: we're talking about cooking at this point, not cold wars. 72 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:43,800 Speaker 1: Just to be clear. Also, it's gonna bug me if 73 00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:46,640 Speaker 1: I don't point it out. I said semantic sayity, but 74 00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:53,960 Speaker 1: I think it's semantic satiation, right, yeah, Okay, who what what? What? What? What? Well? 75 00:04:54,000 --> 00:04:57,080 Speaker 1: In many ways, the best way to explain what we 76 00:04:57,160 --> 00:04:59,960 Speaker 1: mean when we say addicted to war or an econom 77 00:05:00,120 --> 00:05:05,000 Speaker 1: make necessity is to explore it through an analogy. A nation, 78 00:05:05,600 --> 00:05:09,279 Speaker 1: any nation, is kind of like a household, their bills 79 00:05:09,320 --> 00:05:12,359 Speaker 1: to pay their mouths. Defeat is work to do. And 80 00:05:12,360 --> 00:05:14,760 Speaker 1: it might be surprising to some of us to realize 81 00:05:14,800 --> 00:05:19,520 Speaker 1: that the annual activities of nations often obey a cycle. 82 00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:22,599 Speaker 1: Similar to the cycle maybe in your own home, you 83 00:05:22,640 --> 00:05:27,240 Speaker 1: know you have planned expenses, you unfortunately will have unexpected expenses, 84 00:05:27,480 --> 00:05:30,320 Speaker 1: and then hopefully you have planned income or profit, like 85 00:05:30,400 --> 00:05:33,800 Speaker 1: you know when your paycheck is coming or if you're 86 00:05:33,800 --> 00:05:36,400 Speaker 1: well to do you know when you're I don't know, 87 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:40,520 Speaker 1: dividends come in, or when you get fully vested in 88 00:05:40,600 --> 00:05:46,360 Speaker 1: your tiger farm or your dirigible dirigible dealership. All right, 89 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:49,200 Speaker 1: well it's not perfect analogy, but you see what you're saying. 90 00:05:49,360 --> 00:05:53,280 Speaker 1: You know, the money indirigibles is really in the service section, 91 00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:56,520 Speaker 1: you know, so totally. You can only sell so many dirigibles, 92 00:05:56,520 --> 00:05:59,800 Speaker 1: but you can repair dirigibles like all year long, and 93 00:05:59,800 --> 00:06:03,520 Speaker 1: aparently you can patch them using sausage skin or sausage casings. 94 00:06:04,200 --> 00:06:07,920 Speaker 1: That's a weird history nugget for you. That's awesome and 95 00:06:08,080 --> 00:06:10,920 Speaker 1: prescient because I think we all know that's gonna come 96 00:06:10,920 --> 00:06:14,360 Speaker 1: into play in a bigger way in today's episode. We're 97 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:18,800 Speaker 1: we're referencing our episode of ridiculous history that we did. 98 00:06:19,760 --> 00:06:23,200 Speaker 1: There's a weird undercurrent to being very pro dirigible in 99 00:06:23,240 --> 00:06:26,400 Speaker 1: our world. It's true. I think it's just because it's 100 00:06:26,440 --> 00:06:29,200 Speaker 1: like a it's it feels like such a transportation of 101 00:06:29,240 --> 00:06:32,440 Speaker 1: the future that actually makes absolutely no sense because they're 102 00:06:32,520 --> 00:06:35,200 Speaker 1: very limited. They can only fly and like medium to 103 00:06:35,360 --> 00:06:39,599 Speaker 1: low altitudes and not hold that many people, and they're 104 00:06:39,680 --> 00:06:42,359 Speaker 1: kind of hard to board, and they spring leaks all 105 00:06:42,400 --> 00:06:44,159 Speaker 1: the time, and you know, some of them explode in 106 00:06:44,160 --> 00:06:46,560 Speaker 1: a cloud of fire and destruction, you know, when you 107 00:06:46,640 --> 00:06:49,039 Speaker 1: fill in with the wrong stuff. Anyway, the point is 108 00:06:49,120 --> 00:06:54,760 Speaker 1: here that even nations have to have gigs, they have 109 00:06:54,960 --> 00:06:58,960 Speaker 1: to be sustainable, they have to make money. The rules 110 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:01,800 Speaker 1: for nations are are very very different from the rules 111 00:07:02,000 --> 00:07:05,000 Speaker 1: for individuals. That's where we get into things like deficits 112 00:07:05,240 --> 00:07:09,600 Speaker 1: and trade deficits and the idea of national debt. But 113 00:07:10,760 --> 00:07:14,680 Speaker 1: at the basis, nations, countries, as well as the corporations 114 00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:18,440 Speaker 1: and individuals existing within them, make money in any number 115 00:07:18,520 --> 00:07:25,040 Speaker 1: of ways. We're talking manufacturing and exports, taxation, agriculture, technology, 116 00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:29,000 Speaker 1: and stuff like that. Most nations try to have a 117 00:07:29,040 --> 00:07:33,760 Speaker 1: diversified collection of profit streams, and that's because nobody on 118 00:07:33,800 --> 00:07:38,520 Speaker 1: the geopolitical level trust anybody else, and absolutely should not. 119 00:07:39,040 --> 00:07:42,360 Speaker 1: If you find yourself painted into a corner and your 120 00:07:42,360 --> 00:07:45,400 Speaker 1: economy is too dependent on a single type of thing 121 00:07:45,520 --> 00:07:50,560 Speaker 1: or a single genre, then you are extremely vulnerable to 122 00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:54,440 Speaker 1: economic warfare. That's true. So let's take the earlier case 123 00:07:54,480 --> 00:07:58,560 Speaker 1: of operations Satanic. We talked about this recently with the 124 00:07:58,800 --> 00:08:04,080 Speaker 1: amazingly named Rainbow Warrior trawler Green Piece outfitted and France 125 00:08:04,200 --> 00:08:08,240 Speaker 1: bombed the ever loving out of I'm saying that those 126 00:08:08,240 --> 00:08:10,720 Speaker 1: are your words, Ben, I cannot claim credit. That is 127 00:08:10,760 --> 00:08:12,720 Speaker 1: absolutely accurate, but I had to say because it's a 128 00:08:12,760 --> 00:08:15,400 Speaker 1: lot of fun. It's a technical term, right, we figured 129 00:08:15,440 --> 00:08:21,280 Speaker 1: that out. Ben invented the phrase bomb. No, it's some 130 00:08:21,400 --> 00:08:25,080 Speaker 1: guy at a taco bell invented that. Uh. Shortly after 131 00:08:25,080 --> 00:08:31,720 Speaker 1: he went a chloopa, too far? Oh no, well, okay, wow. Well, 132 00:08:32,520 --> 00:08:35,720 Speaker 1: in the case of the Rainbow Warrior, we discussed this 133 00:08:35,800 --> 00:08:38,480 Speaker 1: not long ago. Listen to the episode if you haven't yet. 134 00:08:38,480 --> 00:08:43,760 Speaker 1: But France, a team of secret operatives from France went 135 00:08:43,840 --> 00:08:46,680 Speaker 1: on over to New Zealand where the Green Pieces ship 136 00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:51,760 Speaker 1: was was stationed the Rainbow Warrior, and they dove down 137 00:08:51,880 --> 00:08:55,880 Speaker 1: into the water, planted explosives on the side and it 138 00:08:55,960 --> 00:09:02,080 Speaker 1: exploded in ever loving stuff and uh twice, they hit 139 00:09:02,120 --> 00:09:04,880 Speaker 1: it twice and unfortunately a photographer passed away when they 140 00:09:04,920 --> 00:09:09,680 Speaker 1: did that. But it was weird because at first it 141 00:09:09,760 --> 00:09:11,920 Speaker 1: was thought, you know, it could be enemies from anywhere 142 00:09:12,000 --> 00:09:14,000 Speaker 1: that came and hit this thing, but it turns out 143 00:09:14,000 --> 00:09:16,880 Speaker 1: it was France, and New Zealand learned pretty quickly. Yeah. 144 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:20,640 Speaker 1: New Zealand knew almost immediately that France was the hidden 145 00:09:20,720 --> 00:09:24,480 Speaker 1: hand behind this acted terrorism and they confronted them. It's 146 00:09:24,480 --> 00:09:29,120 Speaker 1: a very tense situation, but France had leverage over New 147 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:31,840 Speaker 1: Zealand in a very dangerous way because New Zealand was 148 00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:36,760 Speaker 1: extremely dependent on exports to Europe. The United Kingdom in particular, 149 00:09:37,240 --> 00:09:41,240 Speaker 1: and Europe in this regard was moving as a posse right, 150 00:09:41,280 --> 00:09:45,560 Speaker 1: they were a supergroup, and France then was able to 151 00:09:45,720 --> 00:09:50,000 Speaker 1: strong arm New Zealand by saying, look, if you don't 152 00:09:50,320 --> 00:09:52,600 Speaker 1: play ball the way we want you to and give 153 00:09:52,679 --> 00:09:55,440 Speaker 1: us back some of our operatives, we're going to cut 154 00:09:55,440 --> 00:09:59,080 Speaker 1: off your trade relations with Europe. This would have wrecked 155 00:09:59,120 --> 00:10:04,120 Speaker 1: their economy, and there's no arguing about it. That is 156 00:10:04,160 --> 00:10:07,000 Speaker 1: the threat of economic warfare. If New Zealand had a 157 00:10:07,040 --> 00:10:10,040 Speaker 1: more diverse economy at the time, the conversation would have 158 00:10:10,080 --> 00:10:14,320 Speaker 1: gone differently. Yeah, they could have. They could have, um 159 00:10:14,800 --> 00:10:18,400 Speaker 1: I think pursued different courses of action. So that's what 160 00:10:18,440 --> 00:10:21,280 Speaker 1: we mean when we talk about being dependent on something. 161 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:23,640 Speaker 1: And just the other thing to take into account here 162 00:10:23,720 --> 00:10:27,840 Speaker 1: is that Green Peace was not a New Zealand based organization. 163 00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:30,240 Speaker 1: They just happened to be there while they were on 164 00:10:30,280 --> 00:10:33,439 Speaker 1: their way to France controlled waters in the Pacific, so 165 00:10:34,160 --> 00:10:36,760 Speaker 1: they it wasn't as you know, it wasn't as though 166 00:10:36,800 --> 00:10:39,559 Speaker 1: it was two countries coming head to head in an 167 00:10:39,559 --> 00:10:42,920 Speaker 1: act of aggression directly against the country, but it did occur, 168 00:10:43,320 --> 00:10:46,880 Speaker 1: you know, in their country. So it's just a weird 169 00:10:46,920 --> 00:10:48,800 Speaker 1: situation all around. But it's a really good point then 170 00:10:48,840 --> 00:10:54,280 Speaker 1: that having that leverage is really what changed the scenario there. Yeah, 171 00:10:54,360 --> 00:10:57,720 Speaker 1: and for another example, just that story is wild. Please 172 00:10:57,760 --> 00:11:00,680 Speaker 1: do as as you were saying, match account the episode. 173 00:11:00,679 --> 00:11:02,440 Speaker 1: If you haven't heard it yet, it is a it 174 00:11:02,559 --> 00:11:07,480 Speaker 1: is a bizarre ride. And maybe another way to think 175 00:11:07,520 --> 00:11:09,839 Speaker 1: of it if you're wondering why that seemed to be 176 00:11:09,880 --> 00:11:15,280 Speaker 1: a big deal to New Zealand, um, imagine imagine what 177 00:11:15,720 --> 00:11:20,640 Speaker 1: the current US administration would do if it was proven 178 00:11:21,440 --> 00:11:27,360 Speaker 1: that Iran bombed bombed a Green Piece ship that was 179 00:11:27,520 --> 00:11:33,240 Speaker 1: docked you know, in Baltimore or something. Right, right, So 180 00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:37,520 Speaker 1: here's our other question, you know, economic necessity. It's kind 181 00:11:37,520 --> 00:11:40,880 Speaker 1: of a dry term. It's kind of boring, right, you don't. 182 00:11:41,160 --> 00:11:44,680 Speaker 1: You don't hear people use that phrase too often in 183 00:11:44,760 --> 00:11:48,240 Speaker 1: casual conversation. But let's think of it in less blood 184 00:11:48,240 --> 00:11:50,960 Speaker 1: soaked terms in a way that's kind of fun. Actually, 185 00:11:52,520 --> 00:11:57,120 Speaker 1: we are of the age, all all of us on 186 00:11:57,120 --> 00:11:59,800 Speaker 1: on the show today, and maybe you're listening along with us. 187 00:12:00,080 --> 00:12:03,960 Speaker 1: We're old enough to remember the reign of department stores, 188 00:12:04,320 --> 00:12:06,520 Speaker 1: the old big box stores. A lot of them are 189 00:12:06,559 --> 00:12:09,600 Speaker 1: still around, but there used to be many, many more riches. 190 00:12:10,720 --> 00:12:13,640 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, and some of them had just the 191 00:12:13,679 --> 00:12:17,040 Speaker 1: weirdest names, like Dillard's. How would you spend that much 192 00:12:17,080 --> 00:12:19,200 Speaker 1: money on a business and call it Dillards? Feel like 193 00:12:19,320 --> 00:12:22,839 Speaker 1: Dillard It must have been somebody's name, because that seems 194 00:12:22,840 --> 00:12:24,559 Speaker 1: like the kind of thing you'd call somebody like as 195 00:12:24,559 --> 00:12:27,760 Speaker 1: a slight, you know, like you Dillard play something Beavis 196 00:12:27,760 --> 00:12:33,360 Speaker 1: and butd Head would say, I mean, come on, Phyllis, uh, Phyllis. Yeah, 197 00:12:33,480 --> 00:12:39,840 Speaker 1: But that's old school, that's just Dillard. It sounds like Dullard, 198 00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:41,600 Speaker 1: you know. It just sounds like a term of abuse. 199 00:12:41,880 --> 00:12:44,880 Speaker 1: It does. But they did pretty well for for quite 200 00:12:44,920 --> 00:12:50,080 Speaker 1: a while now. They've been supplanted to a great degree 201 00:12:50,120 --> 00:12:54,439 Speaker 1: by online businesses uh, such as, uh, you know Jeff. 202 00:12:54,760 --> 00:12:57,520 Speaker 1: We all know Jeff, Jeff from Amazon. He might be 203 00:12:57,520 --> 00:13:01,000 Speaker 1: in your house right now as we're recording, So tell 204 00:13:01,080 --> 00:13:04,320 Speaker 1: them we said hello. But here's where we're going with 205 00:13:04,360 --> 00:13:08,760 Speaker 1: this example. Since the rise of shopping malls and department stores, 206 00:13:08,920 --> 00:13:13,480 Speaker 1: especially post World War Two, there's been one period of 207 00:13:13,480 --> 00:13:17,760 Speaker 1: time that all of those retail businesses prayed for and 208 00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:21,720 Speaker 1: feared and relied upon, and that is the period between 209 00:13:21,760 --> 00:13:26,679 Speaker 1: Thanksgiving and Christmas here in the US that that was, 210 00:13:26,800 --> 00:13:29,920 Speaker 1: historically and probably still is today the most profitable and 211 00:13:30,040 --> 00:13:33,760 Speaker 1: stressful time of the calendar year for businesses for a 212 00:13:33,800 --> 00:13:36,880 Speaker 1: couple of reasons. I mean profitable, that's easy to guess. 213 00:13:37,520 --> 00:13:41,320 Speaker 1: Tons of people are spending billions of dollars, sometimes money 214 00:13:41,400 --> 00:13:43,760 Speaker 1: they don't have. Sometimes it's all on credit cards to 215 00:13:43,840 --> 00:13:48,559 Speaker 1: buy gifts, to go on trips, etcetera, etcetera. But it's 216 00:13:48,600 --> 00:13:51,559 Speaker 1: also really stressful because for a lot of businesses, this 217 00:13:51,679 --> 00:13:55,040 Speaker 1: was their one shot at getting back into the black 218 00:13:55,480 --> 00:13:57,800 Speaker 1: if the rest of the year hadn't gone so well. 219 00:13:58,200 --> 00:14:03,200 Speaker 1: And businesses in the US assure you, retail businesses continually 220 00:14:03,320 --> 00:14:06,600 Speaker 1: think about this period at some point every single day 221 00:14:06,679 --> 00:14:09,600 Speaker 1: of the year, and they should because their future may 222 00:14:09,640 --> 00:14:13,600 Speaker 1: depend on it. They are economically dependent on that period 223 00:14:13,640 --> 00:14:16,880 Speaker 1: of time. That's a great example, Ben, And it's not 224 00:14:17,280 --> 00:14:21,880 Speaker 1: It's not just department stores and you know, online sellers 225 00:14:21,920 --> 00:14:25,360 Speaker 1: and everything like that. It's everything. If you think just 226 00:14:25,440 --> 00:14:29,760 Speaker 1: about the advertising industry, the thing that supports most most 227 00:14:29,880 --> 00:14:32,560 Speaker 1: podcasts out there, unless they use Patreon or some other 228 00:14:32,640 --> 00:14:36,920 Speaker 1: donation system, ads pay for things, and in the ad business, 229 00:14:36,920 --> 00:14:40,200 Speaker 1: it's that same exact period they call it Q four. 230 00:14:40,920 --> 00:14:43,640 Speaker 1: That's where you that's where you make or break your 231 00:14:43,720 --> 00:14:46,680 Speaker 1: calendar year. Oh man. And just a peep behind the curtain, 232 00:14:46,720 --> 00:14:50,360 Speaker 1: that's where if you're if you're someone like us, that's 233 00:14:50,440 --> 00:14:53,400 Speaker 1: that's where you'll get a lot of weird stuff. At 234 00:14:53,400 --> 00:14:57,560 Speaker 1: the very end of the year. People say like, hey, um, 235 00:14:57,680 --> 00:15:02,240 Speaker 1: do any of you have personally perience with Dr Pepper 236 00:15:02,400 --> 00:15:08,480 Speaker 1: zero sugar or cave cave diving? Dang, that's good. Looks good, Matt. 237 00:15:08,840 --> 00:15:11,480 Speaker 1: I guess see the droplets glistening on the outside of 238 00:15:11,480 --> 00:15:13,600 Speaker 1: the bottle. Uh. I kind of wish you could see 239 00:15:13,640 --> 00:15:16,040 Speaker 1: that on the podcast land. But either way, she'd go, 240 00:15:16,120 --> 00:15:19,320 Speaker 1: get yourself refreshing Dr Pepper. Um. But you know, it's 241 00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:20,840 Speaker 1: like It's like it's not only make it a break 242 00:15:20,840 --> 00:15:22,600 Speaker 1: of time, it's use it or lose it time for 243 00:15:22,880 --> 00:15:25,520 Speaker 1: a you know, for brands, because they literally have this 244 00:15:25,560 --> 00:15:28,560 Speaker 1: money remaining they have to use or like rolls over 245 00:15:28,560 --> 00:15:30,640 Speaker 1: into the next fiscal year or whatever. So a lot 246 00:15:30,680 --> 00:15:34,920 Speaker 1: of mad money feeding frenzy spending going on in Q four. Yeah, 247 00:15:35,080 --> 00:15:38,480 Speaker 1: that reminds me, Matt, I forgot to send you the email. 248 00:15:38,680 --> 00:15:42,720 Speaker 1: Would you be willing to cave dive into um a 249 00:15:42,720 --> 00:15:46,400 Speaker 1: cavern system that was filled with Dr Pepper zero as 250 00:15:46,480 --> 00:15:50,280 Speaker 1: like an extended mid roll. Yeah, yeah, we'll get you. Well, 251 00:15:50,720 --> 00:15:56,320 Speaker 1: we'll probably be able to get you out of there. Okay, great, So, 252 00:15:56,800 --> 00:16:00,000 Speaker 1: uh no, I gotta show you out that that is enormous. 253 00:16:00,040 --> 00:16:04,240 Speaker 1: The President, you were killing it today because uh you're 254 00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:08,400 Speaker 1: you're right. The ad industry does have that cycle. People 255 00:16:08,480 --> 00:16:10,720 Speaker 1: might be surprised to learn. I think we mentioned on 256 00:16:10,800 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 1: air in the past. The defense industry has that cycle too. 257 00:16:14,320 --> 00:16:17,400 Speaker 1: It's the well we're cursing on today's show. So it's 258 00:16:17,440 --> 00:16:22,400 Speaker 1: the weirdest day in the Defense department. Because they have 259 00:16:22,560 --> 00:16:25,560 Speaker 1: a cut off for times that funds can be allocated, 260 00:16:25,640 --> 00:16:27,840 Speaker 1: they have to spend all that money, so their budget 261 00:16:27,880 --> 00:16:30,040 Speaker 1: doesn't get cut the next year, you know, whatever their 262 00:16:30,160 --> 00:16:35,160 Speaker 1: little uh, whatever their fiefdom may be. And so you'll 263 00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:40,160 Speaker 1: see these increasingly desperate calls going by time zones. And 264 00:16:40,240 --> 00:16:44,360 Speaker 1: the very last one, of course is like the furthest West. 265 00:16:44,960 --> 00:16:48,400 Speaker 1: That's those are the final approvals, and everybody is trying 266 00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:51,360 Speaker 1: to spend money because if they don't, like you said'll 267 00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:54,560 Speaker 1: they'll use it or they'll lose it. And this economic 268 00:16:54,600 --> 00:16:59,880 Speaker 1: example in retail holds true to a degree for others 269 00:17:00,040 --> 00:17:04,960 Speaker 1: swaths of the economy. This is, if you are uh 270 00:17:05,040 --> 00:17:08,200 Speaker 1: high mucky muck at a department store, or if you're 271 00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:10,920 Speaker 1: a high mighty might get a big online business, then 272 00:17:11,119 --> 00:17:15,760 Speaker 1: you know very well that profit projections around this period 273 00:17:15,760 --> 00:17:18,879 Speaker 1: of time are baked into your yearly estimates of profit 274 00:17:18,920 --> 00:17:24,280 Speaker 1: and loss. Your supply chain is oriented toward working at 275 00:17:24,320 --> 00:17:27,600 Speaker 1: its peak during this time. And then there's an army, 276 00:17:28,080 --> 00:17:31,800 Speaker 1: an army size amount of temporary workers that are hired 277 00:17:31,880 --> 00:17:34,720 Speaker 1: just to be warm bodies on the job. Is also 278 00:17:34,760 --> 00:17:40,280 Speaker 1: applies this shippy and production, etcetera, etcetera. But over the years, 279 00:17:40,400 --> 00:17:43,760 Speaker 1: over the decades, especially after the horrors of World War Two, 280 00:17:43,800 --> 00:17:46,919 Speaker 1: that are still very much with us today, scholars began 281 00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:51,800 Speaker 1: to ask, have the US, the former USSR, and other 282 00:17:51,920 --> 00:17:56,960 Speaker 1: nations haught themselves in a trap like that Elvis song, 283 00:17:57,720 --> 00:18:03,760 Speaker 1: suspicious eye, suspicious line, us, suspicious minds, minds. We can go, yeah, 284 00:18:03,880 --> 00:18:06,760 Speaker 1: like that one. All right, thank you you guys safe 285 00:18:06,880 --> 00:18:10,800 Speaker 1: on that one. But have have we become not a 286 00:18:10,840 --> 00:18:14,680 Speaker 1: country that is capable of waging war, but a country 287 00:18:14,720 --> 00:18:19,240 Speaker 1: that relies upon the act of war as a means 288 00:18:19,280 --> 00:18:23,000 Speaker 1: of financial stability? And is it just us? And does 289 00:18:23,040 --> 00:18:26,160 Speaker 1: it just us? We'll pause for a word from our 290 00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:29,520 Speaker 1: sponsor uh AS as our pal Robert Evans likes to 291 00:18:29,560 --> 00:18:34,400 Speaker 1: say goods and services, you know, maybe Raytheon or Illumination 292 00:18:34,400 --> 00:18:36,840 Speaker 1: Global and limited O pop by, and then we'll be 293 00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:47,680 Speaker 1: back to dive in to some disturbing things. Here's where 294 00:18:47,680 --> 00:18:52,800 Speaker 1: it gets crazy, Matt Noel, let's just cut the podcast short. 295 00:18:52,840 --> 00:18:56,360 Speaker 1: What's the answer. Is the US addicted to war? Hi? 296 00:18:56,880 --> 00:19:01,760 Speaker 1: It's complicated. I mean they're addicted to war in the 297 00:19:01,800 --> 00:19:06,080 Speaker 1: same way that Robert Palmer is addicted to love. Right, 298 00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:11,360 Speaker 1: it might also be an economic necessity for him. We're 299 00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:14,800 Speaker 1: we're on a just referenced roller coaster here, guys. I'm 300 00:19:14,840 --> 00:19:20,960 Speaker 1: loving it. Um. It's been a weird day for us. Uh. Yeah, 301 00:19:21,000 --> 00:19:24,359 Speaker 1: you're right, it dives into the realm of conspiracy and Matt, 302 00:19:24,840 --> 00:19:27,760 Speaker 1: you're absolutely I agree with you. Absolutely. The answer does 303 00:19:27,800 --> 00:19:31,199 Speaker 1: feel complicated, but maybe not complicated in some of the 304 00:19:31,200 --> 00:19:34,840 Speaker 1: ways we might assume. During World War Two, which was 305 00:19:34,920 --> 00:19:39,919 Speaker 1: the last hot global conflict, ouch as we record this, 306 00:19:39,960 --> 00:19:43,720 Speaker 1: has anybody checked the news? Guys global, it's posible. Quick, 307 00:19:43,800 --> 00:19:48,720 Speaker 1: somebody google, So Vietnam's out, viet is out? Yeah, war 308 00:19:48,760 --> 00:19:51,560 Speaker 1: and terror and does that count? It never ended. It's 309 00:19:51,600 --> 00:19:54,840 Speaker 1: like lobster Fest. It's not global. I guess. Yeah, I 310 00:19:54,880 --> 00:19:56,840 Speaker 1: guess the whole isist thing too. Yeah, I guess that's 311 00:19:56,840 --> 00:20:01,439 Speaker 1: the last global conflict and now we are in and 312 00:20:01,800 --> 00:20:05,639 Speaker 1: endless wars like promotions at Red Lobster I don't know. 313 00:20:05,720 --> 00:20:08,560 Speaker 1: I'm so obsessed with lobster Fest. But anyway, Yeah, during 314 00:20:08,560 --> 00:20:15,120 Speaker 1: World War Two, multiple nations became what we call war economies. 315 00:20:15,359 --> 00:20:18,399 Speaker 1: This is not necessarily a bad thing, but it is 316 00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:22,080 Speaker 1: very much a move. Yeah. This is when an economy 317 00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:27,760 Speaker 1: prioritizes creating weapons of war, things that are necessary for war, 318 00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:33,800 Speaker 1: everything from uniforms to food supplies to the ammunition to 319 00:20:34,000 --> 00:20:38,119 Speaker 1: the actual machines of war. Anything you may need to 320 00:20:38,320 --> 00:20:43,360 Speaker 1: actually wage war. Even even things like concrete manufacturing concrete 321 00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:46,239 Speaker 1: and other things will be needed to build while in 322 00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:49,879 Speaker 1: some other country or you know, while engaged in a 323 00:20:49,880 --> 00:20:53,880 Speaker 1: battle in some other area, so all those support systems too. 324 00:20:54,359 --> 00:20:58,920 Speaker 1: And this usually happens again, like we talked about, when 325 00:20:59,080 --> 00:21:02,280 Speaker 1: there's open conflict, when it's a hot war, when uh, 326 00:21:02,640 --> 00:21:05,760 Speaker 1: when governments are fighting against each other, essentially, even if 327 00:21:05,800 --> 00:21:10,199 Speaker 1: it's through proxies, and the governments of the each individual 328 00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:15,640 Speaker 1: actor that's involved there, dude, they just they they open 329 00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:18,520 Speaker 1: up that bank vault, they get all their wallets out collectively. 330 00:21:18,520 --> 00:21:20,560 Speaker 1: Everybody's like, all right, well, let's see, I see what 331 00:21:20,600 --> 00:21:22,560 Speaker 1: we can do here. How can we contribute? Oh? I 332 00:21:22,600 --> 00:21:26,520 Speaker 1: know for sure that factory over there was making Volkswagens 333 00:21:26,800 --> 00:21:30,040 Speaker 1: for a while. We're gonna need to then make tanks there. Okay, great, 334 00:21:30,440 --> 00:21:35,280 Speaker 1: And they just start allocating new even like existing infrastructure 335 00:21:35,480 --> 00:21:41,120 Speaker 1: to war. Make it rain, make it rain, picture picture 336 00:21:42,080 --> 00:21:44,879 Speaker 1: picture governments, like picture of the US government during World 337 00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:48,560 Speaker 1: War two, kind of like Tom Cruise his character and 338 00:21:48,600 --> 00:21:52,040 Speaker 1: Tropic Thunder when he's doing the dance and he's like, 339 00:21:52,080 --> 00:21:55,199 Speaker 1: oh yeah, it's time, right, Like you can have as 340 00:21:55,320 --> 00:21:58,719 Speaker 1: much funding as you want. There is no limit in 341 00:21:58,840 --> 00:22:02,160 Speaker 1: terms of finance. There is a harsh limit in terms 342 00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:06,560 Speaker 1: of timeline. So like just a made up example and say, 343 00:22:06,640 --> 00:22:11,440 Speaker 1: all right, we want you to you have a clothing factory. 344 00:22:11,760 --> 00:22:14,800 Speaker 1: Now we want you to shift from making dresses and trousers. 345 00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:18,560 Speaker 1: You're only making uniforms. Now you're like, all right, that's fine, 346 00:22:18,720 --> 00:22:22,679 Speaker 1: we need X millions of dollars to to retrofit and 347 00:22:22,760 --> 00:22:24,920 Speaker 1: to get up to speed. And they're like, okay, well, 348 00:22:24,920 --> 00:22:27,160 Speaker 1: how about we give you twice that and you get 349 00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:30,679 Speaker 1: it done. Now, that's that's how it happens. And well, 350 00:22:30,720 --> 00:22:34,879 Speaker 1: there's the other thing here that simultaneously while that's occurring, 351 00:22:35,800 --> 00:22:38,040 Speaker 1: because really what you're doing is, if you're a government 352 00:22:38,040 --> 00:22:41,800 Speaker 1: and you're making all of these things, well, at least 353 00:22:41,800 --> 00:22:43,800 Speaker 1: in the case of the United States, you're shipping all 354 00:22:43,840 --> 00:22:46,240 Speaker 1: of that stuff somewhere else. You're loading it onto ships 355 00:22:46,240 --> 00:22:49,320 Speaker 1: and onto planes and things, so all of that money 356 00:22:49,359 --> 00:22:53,080 Speaker 1: is essentially going away from the country the interior of 357 00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:56,840 Speaker 1: the country. What's happening simultaneously is that there's a tightening 358 00:22:56,840 --> 00:22:59,400 Speaker 1: of the belt of a lot of other spending that's 359 00:22:59,400 --> 00:23:02,520 Speaker 1: occurring inside the country, and there's a rationing of food, 360 00:23:02,680 --> 00:23:06,320 Speaker 1: which which we saw here and many other countries where foods, 361 00:23:06,400 --> 00:23:09,280 Speaker 1: food supplies had to be rationed for a regular old citizens. 362 00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:14,480 Speaker 1: And again, since manufacturing is shifted, kind of the the 363 00:23:14,560 --> 00:23:18,639 Speaker 1: perceived prosperity of each individual citizen kind of goes down 364 00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:21,000 Speaker 1: a little bit because you're not getting new goods. You're 365 00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:23,600 Speaker 1: not getting you know, you maybe not have the funds 366 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:25,560 Speaker 1: even to make those new goods, but they're definitely not 367 00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:29,680 Speaker 1: being manufactured, right. Yeah, And and there are pretty robust 368 00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:34,920 Speaker 1: studies that show on an individual level there there can 369 00:23:35,000 --> 00:23:39,119 Speaker 1: be a profound negative impact right because of the things 370 00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:43,000 Speaker 1: that you're naming as the government becomes more like a 371 00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:47,240 Speaker 1: purpose built machine, an engine with one task than things 372 00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:50,000 Speaker 1: that do not help the task of that engine quickly 373 00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:53,280 Speaker 1: fall to the wayside. They become backburner ideas. Will work 374 00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:56,640 Speaker 1: on education later, you know what I mean. Uh, we 375 00:23:57,040 --> 00:23:59,800 Speaker 1: need to make sure our country will still exist before 376 00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:03,600 Speaker 1: we throw money at school building projects. So you can 377 00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:06,639 Speaker 1: see the logic there, but you getting surreal situations. I 378 00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:10,080 Speaker 1: love that you mentioned the car industry. It's fascinating. Uh. 379 00:24:10,320 --> 00:24:13,000 Speaker 1: The car industry went through plot twists that would make 380 00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:16,800 Speaker 1: m Night Shamlan like lose his mind. He even couldn't 381 00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:20,439 Speaker 1: handle it because like just for a perspective of how profound, 382 00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:24,680 Speaker 1: like how serious war economies are, how much money has involved, 383 00:24:24,840 --> 00:24:28,920 Speaker 1: how much power and influence. One the year right before 384 00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:33,280 Speaker 1: the war began, the US automotive industry and that year 385 00:24:33,280 --> 00:24:40,240 Speaker 1: alone made more than three million cars, and then two 386 00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:44,440 Speaker 1: war happens during the course of the war. Like you said, Matt, 387 00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:49,399 Speaker 1: the US auto industry, Corporate America would call it a pivot. 388 00:24:50,040 --> 00:24:56,480 Speaker 1: Throughout the entirety of World War Two. The US auto industry, 389 00:24:56,600 --> 00:24:58,920 Speaker 1: the whole thing, the whole kit and caboodle, the whole shebang. 390 00:24:59,720 --> 00:25:03,879 Speaker 1: May get this a grand total of one hundred and 391 00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:07,280 Speaker 1: thirty nine cars. For years it went from three million 392 00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:13,720 Speaker 1: to one hundred and thirty nine total instead, yeah right, 393 00:25:13,760 --> 00:25:20,280 Speaker 1: it's that low. Um. So instead they were building tanks, airplanes, jeeps, torpedoes, 394 00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:26,800 Speaker 1: you name it, right for one customer, Uncle Sam, that's 395 00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:30,520 Speaker 1: all they were doing. And uh, people were paying more 396 00:25:30,560 --> 00:25:35,320 Speaker 1: in taxes as well. You if you made over uh 397 00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:40,040 Speaker 1: two hundred thousand dollars for a time, your income was 398 00:25:40,119 --> 00:25:43,840 Speaker 1: taxed like over. Yeah, but you know that's that's for 399 00:25:43,960 --> 00:25:47,480 Speaker 1: the people outside of the real system. I would argue, 400 00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:50,200 Speaker 1: what right, I mean, it's like we're in that different 401 00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:52,440 Speaker 1: of a situation now. I just feel like, you know, 402 00:25:52,480 --> 00:25:54,479 Speaker 1: I hear I go again on my soapbox about taxes, 403 00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:56,200 Speaker 1: but I feel like so much of my tax money 404 00:25:56,240 --> 00:25:58,760 Speaker 1: goes towards these types of programs and things that I 405 00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:01,280 Speaker 1: don't directly see, uh in my day to day, But 406 00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:04,840 Speaker 1: this was a time when it was obviously crucial, uh. 407 00:26:04,880 --> 00:26:07,600 Speaker 1: And I get it, I definitely do. I'm not saying 408 00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:12,200 Speaker 1: we don't need to contribute tax to defense, but tax dollars, 409 00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:14,240 Speaker 1: I think, over the years have become overwhelmingly more and 410 00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:17,959 Speaker 1: more allocated towards defense. UM. And if the country is 411 00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:21,520 Speaker 1: borrowing all that money, then the cash overwhelmingly as well 412 00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:26,600 Speaker 1: goes toward national security and growing the military. And again 413 00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:30,840 Speaker 1: something we're seeing today, things like education and infrastructure improvements 414 00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:34,639 Speaker 1: UM tend to fall by the wayside in favor of 415 00:26:34,760 --> 00:26:40,000 Speaker 1: building a bigger, better, more intimidating military. Right yeah, yeah, exactly, 416 00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:43,960 Speaker 1: And then it becomes enormously difficult for the public and 417 00:26:44,119 --> 00:26:49,959 Speaker 1: politicians to justify those non sexy needed expenses, like hey, 418 00:26:50,080 --> 00:26:54,320 Speaker 1: let's let's fix that bridge before it collapses. Let's make 419 00:26:54,359 --> 00:26:57,919 Speaker 1: sure to take care of the non war expenses that 420 00:26:58,000 --> 00:27:03,680 Speaker 1: we all know we can't sorry, it's we can do that. 421 00:27:04,920 --> 00:27:06,840 Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, right, we could blow up a bridge. 422 00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:11,600 Speaker 1: Check this out. The Interstate Highway System, which was created 423 00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:18,160 Speaker 1: to the Highway Act of n was definitely informed by 424 00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:21,480 Speaker 1: difficulties that the US faced in World War Two because 425 00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:25,200 Speaker 1: they didn't have a very efficient way other than rail 426 00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:29,760 Speaker 1: to get soldiers, you know, from the interior of America 427 00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:31,800 Speaker 1: to a coast where they would be shipped off to war. 428 00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:35,480 Speaker 1: So that's how they were able to justify it. The look, 429 00:27:35,560 --> 00:27:42,080 Speaker 1: the unethical life hack that we are implying here is 430 00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:45,880 Speaker 1: probably best to set aloud and bluntly. If you want 431 00:27:45,960 --> 00:27:50,880 Speaker 1: to get support for anything from a from a large 432 00:27:50,920 --> 00:27:53,560 Speaker 1: amount of the U. S. Public, just somehow make it 433 00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:59,280 Speaker 1: about national security or national defense. It can be like, um, 434 00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:03,040 Speaker 1: it can be having if you're if your rhetoric is 435 00:28:03,040 --> 00:28:05,840 Speaker 1: sharp enough, I bet you could pull off something like 436 00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:11,240 Speaker 1: there needs to be an ice cream store in every 437 00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:14,359 Speaker 1: town with a population of more than a thousand for 438 00:28:14,600 --> 00:28:19,200 Speaker 1: national security. Somehow pull that off. Then people would be like, yeah, 439 00:28:19,200 --> 00:28:23,680 Speaker 1: I'm patriotic, Yeah it's not. It's bigger than me liking 440 00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:25,800 Speaker 1: ice cream. You guys, that's what you would say, and 441 00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:30,199 Speaker 1: that's that's how the system works. You can think of. So, 442 00:28:30,240 --> 00:28:34,840 Speaker 1: I think we've outlined the drawbacks and the benefits of 443 00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:38,320 Speaker 1: a war economy. You can picture it like um in 444 00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:42,160 Speaker 1: a in a fighting game, like in Street Fighter or something. 445 00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:46,640 Speaker 1: You choose characters based on their attributes. Right, So a 446 00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:51,840 Speaker 1: war economy has a lot of offensive powers, right, and 447 00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:57,640 Speaker 1: it has. It has tremendous agility in some ways. But 448 00:28:57,720 --> 00:29:01,840 Speaker 1: then it also has some really clear weak spots, you know, 449 00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:05,320 Speaker 1: especially on the microcosmic level, for the life of the 450 00:29:05,360 --> 00:29:08,000 Speaker 1: average person living in that country. But you can think 451 00:29:08,040 --> 00:29:11,080 Speaker 1: of it as a necessary evil. I mean, no matter 452 00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:14,920 Speaker 1: how you feel about war, if you consider yourself a hawk, 453 00:29:15,440 --> 00:29:20,840 Speaker 1: if you consider yourself like a conscientious subjector the truth 454 00:29:21,040 --> 00:29:26,640 Speaker 1: is this, the US war economy saved Europe during World 455 00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:29,320 Speaker 1: War Two set a lot of other things in motion. 456 00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:34,080 Speaker 1: We're not saying that we're all good, but that is true. 457 00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:39,120 Speaker 1: The war economy and World War two worked for a time. 458 00:29:40,400 --> 00:29:43,120 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, well, I guess I guess it comes to 459 00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:47,320 Speaker 1: that other question. You know, if it did work so 460 00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:53,280 Speaker 1: well and it was profitable for many sectors, how do 461 00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:56,880 Speaker 1: you then stop doing that? How do you go back 462 00:29:56,920 --> 00:30:00,160 Speaker 1: to what it used to be to a peacetime economy, Like, 463 00:30:00,160 --> 00:30:02,840 Speaker 1: how did those car manufacturers then shift back to just 464 00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:06,560 Speaker 1: you know, making f one fifties again? It seems it 465 00:30:06,600 --> 00:30:08,960 Speaker 1: seems like it would be difficult. Well, yeah, I mean, 466 00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:11,600 Speaker 1: to quote Dave Chappelle, war is a hell of a drug, 467 00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:14,840 Speaker 1: you know. I mean, once you once you got that 468 00:30:15,080 --> 00:30:18,160 Speaker 1: taste for it, um, and you are dependent on it, 469 00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:19,920 Speaker 1: and you really it's really hard to wean yourself off 470 00:30:19,920 --> 00:30:22,760 Speaker 1: of it as a as a whole, like in terms 471 00:30:22,760 --> 00:30:26,640 Speaker 1: of rhetoric, because it gets people elected, right in terms 472 00:30:26,760 --> 00:30:30,480 Speaker 1: of the actual infrastructure and the actual you know, um economy, 473 00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:35,720 Speaker 1: the economic drivers that are giant corporations like Lockheed, etcetera, um, 474 00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:37,680 Speaker 1: that are such a huge part of the economy, and 475 00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:40,720 Speaker 1: of course they do create jobs, um and and these 476 00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:43,920 Speaker 1: are all tied into political rhetoric where people like, well, 477 00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:46,280 Speaker 1: we can't ease off of this because then everyone's gonna 478 00:30:46,320 --> 00:30:49,720 Speaker 1: lose their jobs, everyone's gonna be homeless and destitute and 479 00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:52,480 Speaker 1: starving in the streets. We need this. This is who 480 00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:54,400 Speaker 1: we are, you know. And it's just true. It has 481 00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:57,400 Speaker 1: become almost as part of like our identity is We've 482 00:30:57,400 --> 00:31:00,040 Speaker 1: got to go bigger and harder, faster, and stronger with 483 00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:03,480 Speaker 1: all this, like you know, war manufacturing. Yeah, what we're 484 00:31:03,480 --> 00:31:07,760 Speaker 1: talking about has gone to such an extreme degree. Again, 485 00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:11,440 Speaker 1: we're not making value judgments. This is simply the situation. Uh. 486 00:31:11,480 --> 00:31:14,600 Speaker 1: The effects of the war economy in the US and 487 00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:18,680 Speaker 1: abroad reached a threshold where now it might be better 488 00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:23,040 Speaker 1: to ask whether it is even possible to h to 489 00:31:23,280 --> 00:31:27,479 Speaker 1: wean ourselves off of this strategy or this policy. And 490 00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:31,240 Speaker 1: that's a huge subject of debate in the modern day, 491 00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:35,640 Speaker 1: you know. And Uh, to be fair, I think we 492 00:31:35,680 --> 00:31:39,640 Speaker 1: should look at the argument for war after you hear 493 00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:42,320 Speaker 1: these facts. It might be surprising to learn this, but 494 00:31:42,400 --> 00:31:46,040 Speaker 1: there is absolutely no shortage of scholars who argue that 495 00:31:46,160 --> 00:31:51,840 Speaker 1: war is, on a grand scale, a good thing overall 496 00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:57,000 Speaker 1: for humanity. It's great article, uh from Forbes, which actually 497 00:31:57,080 --> 00:32:01,000 Speaker 1: book review of a pretty interesting book that I don't 498 00:32:01,040 --> 00:32:04,080 Speaker 1: completely agree with by a guy named Ian Morris. The 499 00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:06,880 Speaker 1: title he nailed the title though, it's war. What is 500 00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:10,080 Speaker 1: it good for? Conflict in the progress of civilization from 501 00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:14,480 Speaker 1: primates to robots? WHOA Okay, yeah, let's see there's a 502 00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:17,840 Speaker 1: lots unpacked. Well, let's let's look get some excerpts here. 503 00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:21,640 Speaker 1: Hard as it maybe to believe in general, imperialism has 504 00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:26,480 Speaker 1: advanced humanity by making it safer and wealthier, and by 505 00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:34,200 Speaker 1: aspiring to a universalism beyond tribe and ethnicity. Okay, all right, okay, 506 00:32:34,280 --> 00:32:38,480 Speaker 1: we'll play these reindeer games. Uh really quickly. You know 507 00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:40,280 Speaker 1: what makes me think of I mean it's it's uh 508 00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:43,360 Speaker 1: sort of pop culture reference, I guess. But uh, there 509 00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:47,600 Speaker 1: is a very well known um in certain circles, I guess. 510 00:32:47,760 --> 00:32:51,040 Speaker 1: Quote from the Fallout video games as war. War never changes, 511 00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:53,360 Speaker 1: and in each game there's a different follow up, and 512 00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:55,719 Speaker 1: they all are serving the same thesis. The first one 513 00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:58,440 Speaker 1: is the Romans waged war to gather slaves and wealth. 514 00:32:58,760 --> 00:33:02,640 Speaker 1: Spain built an empire for from its lust for golden territory. 515 00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:06,440 Speaker 1: Hitler shaped a battered Germany into an economic superpower. But 516 00:33:06,520 --> 00:33:10,920 Speaker 1: war never changes. It's true, It's true. And when we 517 00:33:11,000 --> 00:33:18,040 Speaker 1: look at when when we look objectively at strategies like this, 518 00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:21,360 Speaker 1: even if they can be horrific, you know, the reason 519 00:33:21,440 --> 00:33:25,800 Speaker 1: that they keep being used is because they work. They 520 00:33:25,840 --> 00:33:31,600 Speaker 1: accomplish what the people who push for them want to accomplish. This, Uh, 521 00:33:31,680 --> 00:33:34,880 Speaker 1: this Forbes article really stood out to me. The writer 522 00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:39,600 Speaker 1: Robert D. Kaplan agrees with the author Ian Morris, and 523 00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:42,680 Speaker 1: he goes on to say the following this is this 524 00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:44,840 Speaker 1: quotes a little bit longer, So I'm hoping maybe we 525 00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:47,360 Speaker 1: can both troy and up on it, guys. He says, 526 00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:52,480 Speaker 1: imperialism has led ultimately to what Morris calls a global 527 00:33:52,600 --> 00:33:57,000 Speaker 1: cop a role that the US has played, however imperfectly 528 00:33:57,320 --> 00:34:00,840 Speaker 1: since the collapse of the Soviet Empire. America may get 529 00:34:00,840 --> 00:34:03,600 Speaker 1: into Middle Eastern quagmires, but it's navy and air force, 530 00:34:03,720 --> 00:34:05,840 Speaker 1: not to mention, the reputation of its land forces and 531 00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:10,440 Speaker 1: intelligence apparatus project power sufficiently throughout the world so as 532 00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:13,280 Speaker 1: to reduce the level of conflict and so far eliminate 533 00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:17,279 Speaker 1: major interstate war. And that reviewer there also goes on 534 00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:21,680 Speaker 1: to say, or at least he expresses that he believes 535 00:34:22,080 --> 00:34:25,880 Speaker 1: the national unity that occurs when you know there's a 536 00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:29,000 Speaker 1: time of of hot conflicts like that, it can lead 537 00:34:29,040 --> 00:34:31,080 Speaker 1: a country, such as it did for the United States, 538 00:34:31,160 --> 00:34:36,120 Speaker 1: towards a quote mass college education, which is really interesting, 539 00:34:36,120 --> 00:34:40,240 Speaker 1: and the explosion of suburban life and civil rights for minorities. 540 00:34:41,160 --> 00:34:43,319 Speaker 1: You can kind of think about this if you look 541 00:34:43,400 --> 00:34:49,000 Speaker 1: to the boomer generation, right, the greatest generation, the baby 542 00:34:49,000 --> 00:34:52,600 Speaker 1: boomers and all that good stuff. Um, that's really where 543 00:34:52,640 --> 00:34:55,960 Speaker 1: you can see what happens when there's a large expansion 544 00:34:56,120 --> 00:35:00,239 Speaker 1: for for military and military use like this, and then 545 00:35:00,280 --> 00:35:04,600 Speaker 1: it kind of comes back to an inward facing economy. Um, 546 00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:08,440 Speaker 1: you can kind of see the the positives there. Yeah, 547 00:35:08,480 --> 00:35:14,320 Speaker 1: but those positive I the idea there is that that unification, 548 00:35:14,680 --> 00:35:17,920 Speaker 1: maybe also through something like serving alongside people in the 549 00:35:17,960 --> 00:35:22,840 Speaker 1: military that you wouldn't normally meet, that engendered this these 550 00:35:22,920 --> 00:35:26,279 Speaker 1: ideas of equality, and it made pushes for a more 551 00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:32,399 Speaker 1: equitable society more plausible, more viable. But I it still 552 00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:37,520 Speaker 1: feels a little rose colored. Just honestly, it feels like 553 00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:41,920 Speaker 1: they might have a horse in the race influencing their opinions. 554 00:35:41,960 --> 00:35:46,200 Speaker 1: But there is no question that war, well, conflict in 555 00:35:46,239 --> 00:35:51,600 Speaker 1: general is enormously profitable for private entities, depending on which 556 00:35:51,640 --> 00:35:55,239 Speaker 1: side they're odd. Like we said, Uncle Sam's got his 557 00:35:55,320 --> 00:35:59,000 Speaker 1: wallet out. He's he's a little drunk on global conflict. 558 00:35:59,280 --> 00:36:01,960 Speaker 1: The sky's the limit, you know what I mean. He'll 559 00:36:02,040 --> 00:36:06,400 Speaker 1: he'll reassess how much you spent when he when he 560 00:36:06,520 --> 00:36:12,240 Speaker 1: sobers up after after the war. Uh, defense contractors already 561 00:36:12,280 --> 00:36:17,719 Speaker 1: make billions in a normal year and a conflict, especially 562 00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:21,399 Speaker 1: an ongoing one, is you can see why it would 563 00:36:21,400 --> 00:36:25,640 Speaker 1: be handled the way that pharmaceutical companies look at a 564 00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:29,279 Speaker 1: treatment regiment. It's not a pill to cure you, but 565 00:36:29,360 --> 00:36:31,520 Speaker 1: there is a pill that will treat the symptoms so 566 00:36:31,560 --> 00:36:34,440 Speaker 1: long as you take it every day. Wow. And you 567 00:36:34,760 --> 00:36:38,919 Speaker 1: can see why flags were raised when the war on 568 00:36:39,160 --> 00:36:42,239 Speaker 1: a concept, the War on terror was announced back in 569 00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:45,560 Speaker 1: the day, because it felt like perhaps this was just 570 00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:49,319 Speaker 1: something that would be unending and would is a lever 571 00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:52,680 Speaker 1: that essentially got pulled somewhere that caused the United States 572 00:36:52,760 --> 00:36:56,560 Speaker 1: to have a consistent need for new weapons, new manufacturing, 573 00:36:56,719 --> 00:37:02,000 Speaker 1: and knew a new semi war economy. Basically. Yeah, yeah, 574 00:37:02,239 --> 00:37:06,239 Speaker 1: that's I think that's especially a student, because a conflict, 575 00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:10,120 Speaker 1: especially an ongoing one, gives you things that businesses love. 576 00:37:10,680 --> 00:37:16,279 Speaker 1: Guaranteed income delivered on a predictable cycle. Right, there's you 577 00:37:16,360 --> 00:37:19,359 Speaker 1: know what will be happening and allows you to plan, uh, 578 00:37:19,719 --> 00:37:22,600 Speaker 1: plan in advance. And there's a lot of patriotism too, 579 00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:26,040 Speaker 1: because you can also say, well, look, we have to 580 00:37:26,080 --> 00:37:30,560 Speaker 1: do this research so that we remain the pre eminent military. Right. 581 00:37:30,840 --> 00:37:34,960 Speaker 1: I have a distinct memory. It's a pretty naive, childlike 582 00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:37,279 Speaker 1: thing that I thought when I guess I must have 583 00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:39,719 Speaker 1: been in like early high school or maybe even late 584 00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:43,280 Speaker 1: middle school. But when we quote unquote went to war 585 00:37:43,440 --> 00:37:47,279 Speaker 1: with Iraq, right, I remember this distinct feeling of, oh 586 00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:51,920 Speaker 1: that we're at war and we hadn't been right prior 587 00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:53,560 Speaker 1: to that, or there have been like desert storm and 588 00:37:53,640 --> 00:37:55,520 Speaker 1: all of that. But that was maybe like a little 589 00:37:55,520 --> 00:37:57,839 Speaker 1: before my time, or it was. It didn't feel quite 590 00:37:57,840 --> 00:37:59,440 Speaker 1: the same. But then all of a sudden, it's like 591 00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:02,479 Speaker 1: we are going going to war. Um, And in my mind, 592 00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:04,920 Speaker 1: it's like I think of war, and I think of 593 00:38:04,960 --> 00:38:07,160 Speaker 1: like war at home, like war, you know, on our 594 00:38:07,160 --> 00:38:10,080 Speaker 1: own soil, And that just doesn't happen anymore in the 595 00:38:10,160 --> 00:38:12,719 Speaker 1: United States. Not to say that it couldn't write, Uh, 596 00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:15,719 Speaker 1: it always could. That's the that's the naive part I think, 597 00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:18,839 Speaker 1: and and it works both ways. But it's we've been 598 00:38:18,920 --> 00:38:23,799 Speaker 1: in constant conflict ever since, ever since, and I just 599 00:38:24,120 --> 00:38:27,560 Speaker 1: I think there's no other reason than for the economic stuff. 600 00:38:27,719 --> 00:38:30,120 Speaker 1: You guys. It's not like we're benevolent, not like we're 601 00:38:30,160 --> 00:38:33,000 Speaker 1: trying to help people out. We have a dog in 602 00:38:33,040 --> 00:38:36,120 Speaker 1: the race every time we put our troops on the 603 00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:38,480 Speaker 1: line like that, And I think it's a lot of 604 00:38:38,520 --> 00:38:41,920 Speaker 1: times a little bit obscured um by rhetoric and all 605 00:38:41,960 --> 00:38:44,360 Speaker 1: of that. But I truly believe that it is because 606 00:38:44,400 --> 00:38:47,920 Speaker 1: of this addiction to all of the things that we're 607 00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:51,960 Speaker 1: talking about, and then the idea of like somehow being 608 00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:55,279 Speaker 1: a new imperialist kind of era. You know, Yeah, I 609 00:38:55,320 --> 00:38:57,920 Speaker 1: don't want it to rail is too much. But this 610 00:38:57,920 --> 00:39:00,040 Speaker 1: this brings up a question that's been on my and 611 00:39:00,600 --> 00:39:05,759 Speaker 1: for a very long time post World War two, or 612 00:39:05,800 --> 00:39:09,360 Speaker 1: even be generous and say post Vietnam. Does it ultimately 613 00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:12,759 Speaker 1: matter if the US wins these conflicts like to the 614 00:39:12,920 --> 00:39:18,720 Speaker 1: to the corporations, doesn't matter. No, I don't mean unless 615 00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:23,120 Speaker 1: losing means like I was saying, war at home, you know, 616 00:39:23,239 --> 00:39:26,480 Speaker 1: war that keeps US from producing. I don't think they 617 00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:28,160 Speaker 1: care at all. I don't think they care who the 618 00:39:28,160 --> 00:39:30,040 Speaker 1: weapons go to. We we know all the time we 619 00:39:30,080 --> 00:39:34,920 Speaker 1: sell weapons to folks that are not quote unquote good 620 00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:38,359 Speaker 1: you know, or have the moral high ground, um, like 621 00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:40,840 Speaker 1: what's going on in uh in Israel right now and 622 00:39:40,960 --> 00:39:43,400 Speaker 1: Gaza rather right now. It's like we I think there's 623 00:39:43,520 --> 00:39:46,879 Speaker 1: a big effort in Congress from the legislature to not 624 00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:50,880 Speaker 1: sell weapons that are going to be used for inhumane purposes, 625 00:39:50,920 --> 00:39:53,920 Speaker 1: but it happens all the time. Well that also, that 626 00:39:54,040 --> 00:39:58,840 Speaker 1: also is a regardless of political opinions. There that that 627 00:39:58,960 --> 00:40:05,960 Speaker 1: also that funding cycle is a subsidization of the U. S. 628 00:40:06,040 --> 00:40:11,200 Speaker 1: Defense industry. It's it's a weird it's a weird loophole system. 629 00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:14,080 Speaker 1: But you're you know, you're writing cynical as it is 630 00:40:14,239 --> 00:40:20,480 Speaker 1: to say. I to also wonder, uh whether or not 631 00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:25,600 Speaker 1: I wonder how these corporations define victory, right is victory? 632 00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:29,120 Speaker 1: Is victory a better life for the bystandards and the 633 00:40:29,160 --> 00:40:33,600 Speaker 1: innocence who live in these countries abroad? Or is victory 634 00:40:34,080 --> 00:40:36,520 Speaker 1: a great Q four? I was literally about to say 635 00:40:36,560 --> 00:40:39,239 Speaker 1: the same thing. I mean, so we know that that's 636 00:40:39,280 --> 00:40:42,120 Speaker 1: what it is. I don't think people in positions of 637 00:40:42,120 --> 00:40:44,719 Speaker 1: power within a company and an organization like that have 638 00:40:44,880 --> 00:40:48,560 Speaker 1: the luxury of being able to be humanitarians. We see 639 00:40:48,600 --> 00:40:50,239 Speaker 1: it all the time. You know. It's at the end 640 00:40:50,239 --> 00:40:52,320 Speaker 1: of the day, you can put up a good talk 641 00:40:52,719 --> 00:40:55,839 Speaker 1: about how, oh all we care about is protecting our 642 00:40:55,880 --> 00:40:57,600 Speaker 1: our citizens in this town and the other. But I 643 00:40:57,640 --> 00:40:59,920 Speaker 1: think we also know from history that at the end 644 00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:04,360 Speaker 1: the day, most people who are beholden to shareholders and 645 00:41:04,360 --> 00:41:07,120 Speaker 1: and all of that are just looking to please them 646 00:41:07,200 --> 00:41:09,799 Speaker 1: and to continue to make more money because companies like 647 00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:15,279 Speaker 1: this require year over year growth like forever, you know 648 00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:18,040 Speaker 1: what I mean, you can't ever stagnate or your shareholders 649 00:41:18,040 --> 00:41:21,280 Speaker 1: are gonna be like what wtf? You know, like everyone 650 00:41:21,640 --> 00:41:25,160 Speaker 1: that invests is expecting constant growth all the time. And 651 00:41:25,200 --> 00:41:26,960 Speaker 1: the only way you can do that for the global 652 00:41:27,000 --> 00:41:30,360 Speaker 1: economy and the U. S economy, you know, wide and 653 00:41:30,400 --> 00:41:33,279 Speaker 1: all of that. Um. Yeah, I want to I want 654 00:41:33,320 --> 00:41:35,600 Speaker 1: to make one comment. Sorry, I kind of I just 655 00:41:35,680 --> 00:41:37,319 Speaker 1: kind of held it for a minute, but I just 656 00:41:37,320 --> 00:41:40,960 Speaker 1: want to backtrack for two seconds. We're discussing this concept 657 00:41:41,000 --> 00:41:42,440 Speaker 1: of all of a sudden, we were at war in 658 00:41:42,480 --> 00:41:44,600 Speaker 1: two thousand three, I think it was two thousand three 659 00:41:44,640 --> 00:41:48,480 Speaker 1: when we invaded I Rock Um under false pretenses. By 660 00:41:48,480 --> 00:41:51,960 Speaker 1: the way, well you just got to remember the United 661 00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:56,120 Speaker 1: States has been involved with so many conflicts that would 662 00:41:56,360 --> 00:41:58,680 Speaker 1: perhaps not be considered war, would be more like a 663 00:41:58,800 --> 00:42:03,239 Speaker 1: national emergency like when Bill Clinton declared one while you know, 664 00:42:03,440 --> 00:42:06,360 Speaker 1: just before that when you were a little bit younger, 665 00:42:06,480 --> 00:42:10,759 Speaker 1: for an intervention yea or or yeah, or for an 666 00:42:10,800 --> 00:42:13,080 Speaker 1: intervention like in the coast of a war or in 667 00:42:13,120 --> 00:42:14,960 Speaker 1: a lot of these other conflicts where the U. S. 668 00:42:15,000 --> 00:42:20,200 Speaker 1: Military ends up taking part in some smaller, large way. Um, 669 00:42:20,239 --> 00:42:24,799 Speaker 1: it's just you're correct about being at Capital W War, 670 00:42:25,280 --> 00:42:28,880 Speaker 1: but it's just weird to think that it's it. We 671 00:42:29,040 --> 00:42:35,879 Speaker 1: have been the global police, Globo cops. Oh god, that's good, 672 00:42:35,920 --> 00:42:40,040 Speaker 1: but that was the other guy. Okay, well it's excellent. Um, 673 00:42:40,040 --> 00:42:42,279 Speaker 1: but no, it's just true. You're you're you're both absolutely right, 674 00:42:42,280 --> 00:42:45,279 Speaker 1: and I was. I was only pointing out that memory 675 00:42:45,320 --> 00:42:48,920 Speaker 1: because of its naivety, and also because we really have 676 00:42:49,480 --> 00:42:51,560 Speaker 1: always kind of been at war, but they're sort of 677 00:42:51,560 --> 00:42:54,399 Speaker 1: above board war and there's like belowboard war, and it's 678 00:42:54,440 --> 00:42:58,040 Speaker 1: like we always have to have something to service this addiction. 679 00:42:58,440 --> 00:43:01,800 Speaker 1: And once we went to a Capital W war, it 680 00:43:01,960 --> 00:43:04,480 Speaker 1: was kind of like payday, you know, it was kind 681 00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:05,960 Speaker 1: of like all bets are off, So why would we 682 00:43:06,000 --> 00:43:07,719 Speaker 1: ever want to change? Why would we ever want to 683 00:43:07,760 --> 00:43:10,239 Speaker 1: not be in this situation. I'm giving the perspective of 684 00:43:10,280 --> 00:43:14,360 Speaker 1: the CEO of you know, Globo bomb, right right, Yeah, 685 00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:17,000 Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's true, and there are millions of 686 00:43:17,040 --> 00:43:24,239 Speaker 1: people who have laid down their lives in pursuit of 687 00:43:24,239 --> 00:43:27,640 Speaker 1: of doing what we believe and what we were taught 688 00:43:27,719 --> 00:43:30,960 Speaker 1: is the right things to do. You know, like the 689 00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:35,320 Speaker 1: access powers of World War two, we're an existential threat. 690 00:43:36,239 --> 00:43:40,000 Speaker 1: There would have been a war regardless of what the 691 00:43:40,080 --> 00:43:45,360 Speaker 1: US did. The question is how are the waters muddied 692 00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:48,200 Speaker 1: now in the modern day. And you have to wonder, 693 00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:51,160 Speaker 1: you know, it's exercise empathy. You have to wonder whether 694 00:43:51,160 --> 00:43:54,600 Speaker 1: it feels awkward in those boardrooms you're sitting there, and 695 00:43:55,040 --> 00:43:59,120 Speaker 1: you can you can easily predict now after your last meeting, 696 00:43:59,560 --> 00:44:02,239 Speaker 1: just how much money you will make, but you are 697 00:44:02,360 --> 00:44:05,839 Speaker 1: unable to predict just how many people will die as 698 00:44:05,840 --> 00:44:10,600 Speaker 1: a result. People who are your fellow citizens, and people 699 00:44:10,719 --> 00:44:13,239 Speaker 1: who live oceans away that you will never meet. This 700 00:44:13,320 --> 00:44:15,080 Speaker 1: is not meant to paint with too broad or to 701 00:44:15,239 --> 00:44:18,319 Speaker 1: brutal a brush. There are a lot of defense contractors 702 00:44:18,480 --> 00:44:22,080 Speaker 1: who will, in good faith, sincerely argue, you know, hey, look, 703 00:44:22,200 --> 00:44:26,000 Speaker 1: I'm working toward a greater good. Sure, business is business, 704 00:44:26,440 --> 00:44:29,080 Speaker 1: but I'm not out here trying to kill people. I'm 705 00:44:29,120 --> 00:44:34,239 Speaker 1: out here trying to build better ways to protect lives 706 00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:37,640 Speaker 1: of citizens of people who are from my country who 707 00:44:37,640 --> 00:44:41,600 Speaker 1: are in the arms services. And this defense contractors in 708 00:44:41,680 --> 00:44:44,000 Speaker 1: other countries will argue this as well. This is not 709 00:44:44,080 --> 00:44:47,800 Speaker 1: just us rationale. But there's no way around it. Though, 710 00:44:47,880 --> 00:44:50,120 Speaker 1: I mean, like that can be true, you can believe it, 711 00:44:50,160 --> 00:44:52,439 Speaker 1: but there's no way around it. You are also making 712 00:44:52,480 --> 00:44:55,680 Speaker 1: a ton of money in the process. The defense budget 713 00:44:55,960 --> 00:44:59,280 Speaker 1: is the capital s spice, and just like in doom, 714 00:44:59,520 --> 00:45:03,440 Speaker 1: the spy ice has to flow the shadow of orwell 715 00:45:03,520 --> 00:45:08,920 Speaker 1: in eternal war looms for good reason. Let's take a 716 00:45:08,960 --> 00:45:11,879 Speaker 1: moment for a word from our sponsor, and then let's 717 00:45:11,920 --> 00:45:13,879 Speaker 1: look at the math. Like, just for a second, we're 718 00:45:13,880 --> 00:45:17,000 Speaker 1: gonna look at the math just for a sex trap in. 719 00:45:17,719 --> 00:45:27,240 Speaker 1: We're going mathematics, all right, and we're back. Here are 720 00:45:27,520 --> 00:45:31,400 Speaker 1: the maths. It was that you're not that was your idea. 721 00:45:33,080 --> 00:45:37,080 Speaker 1: So so the next part might not make all of 722 00:45:37,120 --> 00:45:41,760 Speaker 1: us so happy. Military spending right now, as we record 723 00:45:41,920 --> 00:45:46,680 Speaker 1: from October one to the end of September this year 724 00:45:47,239 --> 00:45:49,840 Speaker 1: is going to ring in at around nine hundred and 725 00:45:49,920 --> 00:45:53,520 Speaker 1: thirty four billion dollars that we know of, so that 726 00:45:53,560 --> 00:45:58,200 Speaker 1: doesn't count black bag stuff, which is inevitable. This means 727 00:45:58,280 --> 00:46:02,440 Speaker 1: that military spending is the second largest expense in the 728 00:46:02,600 --> 00:46:05,240 Speaker 1: entirety of the federal budget. The only thing that beats 729 00:46:05,280 --> 00:46:09,160 Speaker 1: it the Social security. With that much money involved, that 730 00:46:09,280 --> 00:46:13,720 Speaker 1: many people involved. It's really difficult to articulate the full 731 00:46:14,120 --> 00:46:17,880 Speaker 1: extent of the ripple effects here, especially when you consider 732 00:46:18,000 --> 00:46:20,480 Speaker 1: that the d O d that the Department of Defense 733 00:46:20,600 --> 00:46:25,040 Speaker 1: is the single largest employer inside the United States, and 734 00:46:25,160 --> 00:46:27,600 Speaker 1: it makes sense depending if you think about its size. 735 00:46:27,800 --> 00:46:32,320 Speaker 1: There over one point four million human beings on active duty, 736 00:46:32,520 --> 00:46:36,400 Speaker 1: and that's around seven hundred and eighteen thousand civilian personnel, 737 00:46:37,040 --> 00:46:41,000 Speaker 1: so that that's two separate groups. Just so we're understanding this, 738 00:46:41,800 --> 00:46:45,319 Speaker 1: there's another one point one million people who are in 739 00:46:45,360 --> 00:46:49,600 Speaker 1: the National Guard, which is another separate thing, National Garden 740 00:46:49,640 --> 00:46:52,080 Speaker 1: Reserve are being grouped together there. And that's not even 741 00:46:52,160 --> 00:46:55,120 Speaker 1: counting the other millions of people who are employed in 742 00:46:55,160 --> 00:46:58,360 Speaker 1: those other related industries that we've been describing here, your Raytheon's, 743 00:46:58,400 --> 00:47:03,319 Speaker 1: your Lockyeds, your other giant manufacturers. It's it's crazy to 744 00:47:03,400 --> 00:47:07,359 Speaker 1: think that there are so many people working for this 745 00:47:07,920 --> 00:47:11,279 Speaker 1: single industry. Really yeah, because it's kind of like a 746 00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:16,640 Speaker 1: a meta industry and uber industry. It's an industry of industries. 747 00:47:17,160 --> 00:47:20,960 Speaker 1: There's a very complicated Venn diagram there that I don't 748 00:47:21,600 --> 00:47:23,680 Speaker 1: I don't want us to have to draw it, but 749 00:47:23,760 --> 00:47:26,720 Speaker 1: if you want to, please do draw the ven diagram. 750 00:47:26,840 --> 00:47:29,799 Speaker 1: What you see is this meta industry and send it 751 00:47:29,840 --> 00:47:33,799 Speaker 1: to us uh conspiracy I Heart radio dot com. The 752 00:47:33,880 --> 00:47:39,240 Speaker 1: thing is, Matt, you're you're absolutely right, just for a small, 753 00:47:39,320 --> 00:47:45,319 Speaker 1: small snapshot aerospace and defense, that industry alone. That that 754 00:47:45,360 --> 00:47:49,719 Speaker 1: doesn't count as the military budget. That's a separate three 755 00:47:50,160 --> 00:47:53,719 Speaker 1: and ninety six billion dollars. It's an event diagram, you know, 756 00:47:53,760 --> 00:47:56,600 Speaker 1: because there they work hand in hand. But that figure 757 00:47:56,719 --> 00:48:00,640 Speaker 1: there are nice six billion. It's about one the GDP 758 00:48:01,120 --> 00:48:03,759 Speaker 1: of the US, which doesn't sound like a lot until 759 00:48:03,800 --> 00:48:06,000 Speaker 1: you realize we're talking about the g d P of 760 00:48:06,040 --> 00:48:08,400 Speaker 1: the U S, which is one of the biggest numbers. 761 00:48:08,920 --> 00:48:13,880 Speaker 1: So while people might want not want to say, hey, 762 00:48:13,960 --> 00:48:17,759 Speaker 1: let's keep up those foreign interventions, they definitely don't want 763 00:48:17,760 --> 00:48:21,360 Speaker 1: to stop building the weapons and the hardware that inherently 764 00:48:21,440 --> 00:48:25,839 Speaker 1: makes those interventions possible. If the budget and the need 765 00:48:25,960 --> 00:48:27,640 Speaker 1: this is a very ugly truth and a lot of 766 00:48:27,680 --> 00:48:29,799 Speaker 1: people don't like to hear it. If the budget and 767 00:48:29,840 --> 00:48:34,919 Speaker 1: the need for these things evaporated overnight, it would be 768 00:48:34,960 --> 00:48:41,759 Speaker 1: an unprecedented economic catastrophe. The Great Depression would have its 769 00:48:41,880 --> 00:48:45,839 Speaker 1: name changed. It would just be the first one you know, 770 00:48:46,080 --> 00:48:48,080 Speaker 1: or something like that, or it would be the old 771 00:48:48,160 --> 00:48:51,759 Speaker 1: depression now or in the new depression, because millions of 772 00:48:51,800 --> 00:48:55,040 Speaker 1: people are out of work. Everything is closing down with 773 00:48:55,480 --> 00:48:58,799 Speaker 1: like we can't even project the ripple effects. It's like, 774 00:48:58,840 --> 00:49:03,120 Speaker 1: if you talk about the oil industry ending overnight, does 775 00:49:03,160 --> 00:49:05,919 Speaker 1: that mean that there's a certain callousness at play here? 776 00:49:06,320 --> 00:49:09,239 Speaker 1: Like shouldn't we be able to predict or model this 777 00:49:09,280 --> 00:49:12,000 Speaker 1: type of stuff? Or like what this type of behavior 778 00:49:12,680 --> 00:49:16,080 Speaker 1: kind of creates the ripple effects? We should know and 779 00:49:16,120 --> 00:49:18,320 Speaker 1: we should know that we're too dependent on it. But 780 00:49:18,400 --> 00:49:20,000 Speaker 1: but I feel like there's a certain kind of like 781 00:49:20,080 --> 00:49:26,560 Speaker 1: wilful ignorance towards that by citizens, by lawmakers, and by 782 00:49:26,600 --> 00:49:29,000 Speaker 1: the CEOs of these companies, or maybe the CEOs are 783 00:49:29,040 --> 00:49:31,080 Speaker 1: the ones that know the most but just give the 784 00:49:31,160 --> 00:49:35,640 Speaker 1: least amount of maybe like I don't know, I'm sorry 785 00:49:35,680 --> 00:49:38,600 Speaker 1: if I'm breaching here. I just feel like there should 786 00:49:38,640 --> 00:49:40,960 Speaker 1: be a scenario where we should be able to model 787 00:49:41,160 --> 00:49:45,560 Speaker 1: this stuff out and and not be completely surprised when hey, 788 00:49:45,640 --> 00:49:49,399 Speaker 1: so look go it turns out we're all war junkies now. 789 00:49:49,880 --> 00:49:54,279 Speaker 1: But you see, the companies able to create such models 790 00:49:54,360 --> 00:49:58,200 Speaker 1: and world simulations are all in the defense industry, So 791 00:49:58,560 --> 00:50:02,959 Speaker 1: there's no incentive to create one that would prevent it. Well, 792 00:50:03,000 --> 00:50:06,919 Speaker 1: I mean, that's that's the thing, right, like why why 793 00:50:07,000 --> 00:50:10,480 Speaker 1: be the architect of your own demise? Which is a 794 00:50:10,520 --> 00:50:12,920 Speaker 1: pretentious way to put it, but it is something to 795 00:50:12,960 --> 00:50:19,200 Speaker 1: think about and it's very valid concerned. I mean this, 796 00:50:19,200 --> 00:50:23,200 Speaker 1: this is an argument that goes across the world, defense industries, 797 00:50:23,200 --> 00:50:26,040 Speaker 1: across the world, and I think it is very good point. 798 00:50:26,200 --> 00:50:30,879 Speaker 1: I see it as the no you first problem. Won't 799 00:50:30,920 --> 00:50:34,040 Speaker 1: explain what we mean in a second. But there's this 800 00:50:34,120 --> 00:50:38,640 Speaker 1: belief that the US, as a global superpower, has been 801 00:50:38,680 --> 00:50:44,040 Speaker 1: able to project force in a way that prevents larger conflicts, 802 00:50:44,640 --> 00:50:49,600 Speaker 1: so you're you're having smaller conflicts to prevent future disaster. 803 00:50:49,760 --> 00:50:52,840 Speaker 1: And the argument says that without the US as global 804 00:50:52,960 --> 00:50:57,080 Speaker 1: cop whereas the world's policeman, the human species would enter 805 00:50:57,239 --> 00:51:00,799 Speaker 1: a chaotic era of unrestrained power graphs. You know what 806 00:51:00,840 --> 00:51:04,560 Speaker 1: I mean, Your your Russia, you want Crimea, you want 807 00:51:04,600 --> 00:51:08,680 Speaker 1: the rest of Ukraine, He's gonna stop you. The US 808 00:51:08,760 --> 00:51:11,920 Speaker 1: is out of the game. So is that possible? Is 809 00:51:11,920 --> 00:51:16,680 Speaker 1: that real rationale that not having this power, not having 810 00:51:16,719 --> 00:51:21,920 Speaker 1: this friendliness towards or this openness towards global conflict, is 811 00:51:22,000 --> 00:51:26,440 Speaker 1: that on balance a good thing. Some argue yes, and 812 00:51:26,520 --> 00:51:30,560 Speaker 1: that last point often is one of the primary arguments 813 00:51:30,800 --> 00:51:36,080 Speaker 1: for maintaining at least some vestiges of a wartime economy. So, 814 00:51:36,800 --> 00:51:40,560 Speaker 1: in short, is the US addicted to war? Is the 815 00:51:40,640 --> 00:51:47,600 Speaker 1: US economically dependent on the conflict business? The answer is yes, 816 00:51:47,680 --> 00:51:51,799 Speaker 1: but which is kind of irritating. But it's true the 817 00:51:51,920 --> 00:52:02,400 Speaker 1: US yes, But yes, yes Dillard, But the uh, it 818 00:52:02,440 --> 00:52:04,920 Speaker 1: appears that this country is in a very real way 819 00:52:05,320 --> 00:52:09,839 Speaker 1: partially dependent on global conflicts continuing, or at least the 820 00:52:09,920 --> 00:52:14,000 Speaker 1: threat of that conflict occurring. But there's a matter of perspective. 821 00:52:14,000 --> 00:52:17,720 Speaker 1: It's cost benefit. Or is the US straight up dependent 822 00:52:17,840 --> 00:52:21,040 Speaker 1: on war because so so much of the economy profits 823 00:52:21,080 --> 00:52:23,440 Speaker 1: from it? You can call that the war monger argument. 824 00:52:24,000 --> 00:52:27,320 Speaker 1: Or is the US dependent on war because not creating 825 00:52:27,440 --> 00:52:31,640 Speaker 1: and not maintaining these capabilities leads to a greater problem, 826 00:52:31,640 --> 00:52:34,880 Speaker 1: more conflict, more disaster, more death. We could call that 827 00:52:35,200 --> 00:52:39,719 Speaker 1: the peacekeeper argument. Are we to quote rust Coal, the 828 00:52:39,840 --> 00:52:42,760 Speaker 1: bad man who keeps the other bad man from the door. 829 00:52:43,920 --> 00:52:46,040 Speaker 1: I haven't seen that in a long time. That's the 830 00:52:46,080 --> 00:52:49,279 Speaker 1: sound of him carving up his lone star cans takes 831 00:52:49,520 --> 00:52:51,759 Speaker 1: takes him the whole season for you to know what 832 00:52:51,840 --> 00:52:55,719 Speaker 1: he's carving such a good really is a great show. 833 00:52:56,640 --> 00:52:59,279 Speaker 1: The rest of him couldn't come close. Second season sucked, 834 00:52:59,320 --> 00:53:02,239 Speaker 1: Third season was good. First season was singularly great in 835 00:53:02,280 --> 00:53:06,040 Speaker 1: my opinion. But no, it's is that what this is about? 836 00:53:06,680 --> 00:53:08,839 Speaker 1: Are we who? What bad men? Are we even keeping 837 00:53:08,880 --> 00:53:11,799 Speaker 1: from the door, you know, the other ones? That's the 838 00:53:11,840 --> 00:53:14,640 Speaker 1: thing I mean, is it is it an illusion? Is 839 00:53:14,680 --> 00:53:17,680 Speaker 1: it an it? Four ask kind of manipulation of all 840 00:53:17,719 --> 00:53:20,560 Speaker 1: of our like our attention to say, oh, we're we're 841 00:53:20,600 --> 00:53:22,560 Speaker 1: under threat. It seems to me like the threat that 842 00:53:22,600 --> 00:53:25,959 Speaker 1: we're under stuff that that this large scale warfare stuff 843 00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:28,480 Speaker 1: has a hard time even dealing with, you know, like 844 00:53:28,719 --> 00:53:30,839 Speaker 1: suicide bombers and like things that we have a hard 845 00:53:30,880 --> 00:53:33,480 Speaker 1: time predicting, and that you can't just nuke out of 846 00:53:33,520 --> 00:53:38,040 Speaker 1: existence because the moment you do that, then another crop 847 00:53:38,080 --> 00:53:40,759 Speaker 1: pops up. Or the way they're organized, like it's hard 848 00:53:40,800 --> 00:53:42,719 Speaker 1: to you know, kind of nip it in the butt 849 00:53:42,719 --> 00:53:45,640 Speaker 1: in that way. Right. Yeah, it's a good point. I mean, 850 00:53:45,680 --> 00:53:50,040 Speaker 1: the the logical problem with war as a policy is 851 00:53:50,080 --> 00:53:53,319 Speaker 1: one of is really one of prejudice or maybe pre 852 00:53:53,400 --> 00:53:56,880 Speaker 1: existing perspective or framework. Is a good way to put it. 853 00:53:56,880 --> 00:53:59,319 Speaker 1: It's a little nerdy, But you guys who are saying, 854 00:53:59,480 --> 00:54:02,840 Speaker 1: if we to find something as a war more countries 855 00:54:02,840 --> 00:54:07,279 Speaker 1: than we are automatically dictating, certain policies were also triggering 856 00:54:07,320 --> 00:54:11,440 Speaker 1: some legal mechanisms. Those policies mean that our go toos 857 00:54:11,680 --> 00:54:15,080 Speaker 1: for resolving things are going to be coercive forces. Whether 858 00:54:15,120 --> 00:54:20,040 Speaker 1: that's sending a military force actual hot conflict, whether that's 859 00:54:20,520 --> 00:54:24,960 Speaker 1: helping a country militarize its police, whether it's the prison system. 860 00:54:25,080 --> 00:54:29,760 Speaker 1: The list goes on. And I heard once war called 861 00:54:30,120 --> 00:54:34,000 Speaker 1: the great simplifier, and it wasn't a compliment, to be clear. 862 00:54:34,400 --> 00:54:38,640 Speaker 1: It's a simplifier because it makes your choices and your 863 00:54:38,680 --> 00:54:43,120 Speaker 1: strategies uh a lot more clear cut, even if they 864 00:54:43,120 --> 00:54:46,279 Speaker 1: are not the best approach. If your immediate policy is 865 00:54:46,600 --> 00:54:50,480 Speaker 1: use the hammer, then it becomes incredibly easy to treat 866 00:54:50,560 --> 00:54:54,319 Speaker 1: every disagreement as a nail, ignoring the complex facts that 867 00:54:54,400 --> 00:54:56,920 Speaker 1: led us to that situation in the first place. It 868 00:54:56,960 --> 00:55:01,000 Speaker 1: becomes even more tricky when profits get involved. Someone is saying, well, 869 00:55:01,040 --> 00:55:02,800 Speaker 1: what are we supposed to do with all these habits 870 00:55:02,920 --> 00:55:05,239 Speaker 1: We're just gonna not use The next you're gonna say 871 00:55:05,239 --> 00:55:07,719 Speaker 1: we have to stop making hammers. God, we're a hamm 872 00:55:07,719 --> 00:55:12,120 Speaker 1: a factory. We're gonna need more nails, guys, We're gonna 873 00:55:12,120 --> 00:55:14,239 Speaker 1: need more nails. And it's also the kind of thing 874 00:55:14,239 --> 00:55:18,600 Speaker 1: where we've been part of different sized companies, and I 875 00:55:18,640 --> 00:55:20,880 Speaker 1: think what happens when you have a large enough sized 876 00:55:20,920 --> 00:55:26,040 Speaker 1: company is nuance gets lost in the shuffle constantly. Uh, 877 00:55:26,080 --> 00:55:28,759 Speaker 1: And you have to have a blunt instrument approach to 878 00:55:28,840 --> 00:55:30,919 Speaker 1: all of these things. And that's what happens with war 879 00:55:31,280 --> 00:55:34,000 Speaker 1: and and and instead where maybe like we might you know, 880 00:55:34,400 --> 00:55:37,560 Speaker 1: miss a podcast episode or lose a couple of doubt, whatever, 881 00:55:37,880 --> 00:55:40,440 Speaker 1: you know, And in the government scenario version of this, 882 00:55:40,800 --> 00:55:44,319 Speaker 1: people die because of that blunt instrument approach. And because 883 00:55:44,320 --> 00:55:46,440 Speaker 1: of that lack of nuance and that lack of empathy 884 00:55:46,640 --> 00:55:49,600 Speaker 1: and that lack of seeing you know, the collateral damage 885 00:55:49,640 --> 00:55:52,520 Speaker 1: of of the choices that lead to these economic booms, 886 00:55:52,600 --> 00:55:55,520 Speaker 1: right yeah, And and again it's like the old proverb, 887 00:55:55,600 --> 00:55:57,920 Speaker 1: you know, when elephants wage war, the grass it's the 888 00:55:57,920 --> 00:56:05,120 Speaker 1: grass that suffers, you guys. And that scenario where the grass, 889 00:56:05,160 --> 00:56:08,560 Speaker 1: I think, Matt, no, wait wait, wait, hold on the 890 00:56:08,600 --> 00:56:15,680 Speaker 1: hammer factory scenario, we're one scenario past, okay, got it, Okay, 891 00:56:16,040 --> 00:56:20,560 Speaker 1: So it just lends it lends itself to another whole 892 00:56:21,480 --> 00:56:24,400 Speaker 1: uh section of conspiracy theory that we aren't even touching 893 00:56:24,400 --> 00:56:27,640 Speaker 1: on this episode. But this concept of we've got all 894 00:56:27,680 --> 00:56:31,040 Speaker 1: these hammers and we're a hammer factory. We can't stop 895 00:56:31,120 --> 00:56:34,080 Speaker 1: making hammers right now, and we we've got this surplus 896 00:56:34,080 --> 00:56:37,440 Speaker 1: of inventory. We gotta find nails for these hammers to 897 00:56:37,480 --> 00:56:40,680 Speaker 1: be needed for. This is the concept that then the 898 00:56:40,800 --> 00:56:44,440 Speaker 1: interests in the factory, or the factory itself or whoever 899 00:56:44,480 --> 00:56:50,400 Speaker 1: owns the factory, then has an economic interest in creating 900 00:56:50,560 --> 00:57:00,960 Speaker 1: problems for those hammers to be used for so i e. Conflicts, militants, disasters. Uh. 901 00:57:01,200 --> 00:57:03,400 Speaker 1: That's a scary concept and it doesn't mean it's a 902 00:57:03,400 --> 00:57:06,080 Speaker 1: happening or it's real or anyone would ever do that, 903 00:57:06,239 --> 00:57:09,080 Speaker 1: but it does mean there would be an economic incentive 904 00:57:09,320 --> 00:57:12,600 Speaker 1: to do it. Yeah. Yeah, if that if that can 905 00:57:12,719 --> 00:57:17,160 Speaker 1: If that observation is confusing or makes anybody a little 906 00:57:17,160 --> 00:57:21,520 Speaker 1: bit uncomfortable, consider that. Consider the sheer amount of time 907 00:57:21,560 --> 00:57:29,560 Speaker 1: and energy that prison industry lobbyists spend on writing on 908 00:57:29,800 --> 00:57:35,160 Speaker 1: having inputs on incarceration laws right like mandatory sentencing, things 909 00:57:35,200 --> 00:57:41,000 Speaker 1: like that. There there are conflicting motivations, but they add 910 00:57:41,040 --> 00:57:45,160 Speaker 1: to this the unfortunate truth that again, war regardless of 911 00:57:45,200 --> 00:57:48,880 Speaker 1: the ideologies it's dressed up, it regardless of whether or 912 00:57:48,960 --> 00:57:53,160 Speaker 1: not the politicians believe what they are telling you. Wars 913 00:57:53,280 --> 00:57:56,959 Speaker 1: ultimately and will always be about the control of resources. 914 00:57:57,280 --> 00:58:01,840 Speaker 1: National security has never been as simple as let's make 915 00:58:01,840 --> 00:58:05,440 Speaker 1: sure the enemy forces, you know, don't bomb Pascagoula or 916 00:58:05,520 --> 00:58:11,360 Speaker 1: Pittsburgh or Keepsie or whatever. I'm just thinking of p towns. Um, 917 00:58:11,440 --> 00:58:13,440 Speaker 1: that came out weird, but you know what I mean, Like, 918 00:58:13,480 --> 00:58:20,360 Speaker 1: it's not just about protecting these physical assets. It can Providence. Yeah, 919 00:58:20,480 --> 00:58:24,800 Speaker 1: actually they actually actually call Providence p Town. Really that's 920 00:58:24,800 --> 00:58:28,880 Speaker 1: a weird flex. Okay, good to know, good to know us. 921 00:58:29,600 --> 00:58:33,560 Speaker 1: So it's also national security is also stuff like let's 922 00:58:33,720 --> 00:58:38,680 Speaker 1: ensure that our important businesses continue to function as normal. 923 00:58:38,880 --> 00:58:40,880 Speaker 1: That's why so much attention is put on the straight 924 00:58:40,920 --> 00:58:43,800 Speaker 1: of hoar moves in the past. Uh, they you know, 925 00:58:43,840 --> 00:58:48,000 Speaker 1: they're countless war games. It's always under surveillance because people 926 00:58:48,120 --> 00:58:52,120 Speaker 1: don't want that straight to get blocked, to worry about 927 00:58:52,160 --> 00:58:55,280 Speaker 1: it messing with oil prices. Sure, it's also why it 928 00:58:55,360 --> 00:58:58,160 Speaker 1: was such a you know, um, I mean, obviously there 929 00:58:58,160 --> 00:59:00,400 Speaker 1: are very real reasons that this was the case, but um, 930 00:59:00,520 --> 00:59:05,200 Speaker 1: political uh divisiveness over shutting down businesses during COVID, over 931 00:59:05,200 --> 00:59:08,520 Speaker 1: when businesses would return, because it's a political stance that 932 00:59:08,640 --> 00:59:11,840 Speaker 1: like no businesses everything it must maintain. And I know 933 00:59:11,880 --> 00:59:15,160 Speaker 1: that that literally connects back to people's livelihoods and people's 934 00:59:15,320 --> 00:59:18,320 Speaker 1: lives and um, you know it's all that. But I 935 00:59:18,680 --> 00:59:22,040 Speaker 1: do feel like it was made to be a political stance, 936 00:59:22,480 --> 00:59:24,880 Speaker 1: and I think that's because it sort of goes into 937 00:59:24,920 --> 00:59:29,320 Speaker 1: that sort of hawkishness, that mentality of businesses. Everything all 938 00:59:29,400 --> 00:59:34,000 Speaker 1: else is secondary. We must continue making our GDP grow. 939 00:59:34,960 --> 00:59:38,720 Speaker 1: I mean, that's why national defense maybe in uh Guatemala 940 00:59:38,800 --> 00:59:41,760 Speaker 1: the nineteen fifties was something more like, let's make sure 941 00:59:41,800 --> 00:59:45,040 Speaker 1: agricultural policies are in our favor, you know what I mean, 942 00:59:45,120 --> 00:59:48,160 Speaker 1: and if the current government isn't cool with that, let's 943 00:59:48,240 --> 00:59:50,760 Speaker 1: let's make a new government. Or that's why you know, 944 00:59:51,480 --> 00:59:54,600 Speaker 1: at one point, well at two points in history, the 945 00:59:54,680 --> 00:59:58,400 Speaker 1: United Kingdom said, let's make sure China knows they need 946 00:59:58,480 --> 01:00:01,320 Speaker 1: to buy our opium like they have to do it, 947 01:00:02,800 --> 01:00:04,320 Speaker 1: and we'll go to war for it if we have to, 948 01:00:04,560 --> 01:00:07,640 Speaker 1: We'll do it twice. The list, the list goes on. 949 01:00:07,920 --> 01:00:11,400 Speaker 1: National security is one of those words, that has a 950 01:00:11,480 --> 01:00:14,720 Speaker 1: lot of ambiguous meanings. There's a lot of wiggle room, 951 01:00:14,800 --> 01:00:18,720 Speaker 1: and it would be nice if more politicians and pundits 952 01:00:18,800 --> 01:00:21,800 Speaker 1: were honest about that problem. But I want to go 953 01:00:21,880 --> 01:00:24,800 Speaker 1: back to something, uh real quick before we close up. 954 01:00:25,720 --> 01:00:30,040 Speaker 1: Two things, really, the the idea of unwinnable wars and 955 01:00:30,480 --> 01:00:34,320 Speaker 1: the question of what what next? You know, how to 956 01:00:34,360 --> 01:00:39,400 Speaker 1: address this dependency or this addiction, whatever you wanna call it. First, 957 01:00:40,360 --> 01:00:43,040 Speaker 1: absolutely right, one of us said earlier, there was a 958 01:00:43,080 --> 01:00:47,800 Speaker 1: big shift when the US began fighting wars against ideas, 959 01:00:48,640 --> 01:00:53,040 Speaker 1: a war on drugs, a war on terrorism. Oddly enough, 960 01:00:53,920 --> 01:00:57,520 Speaker 1: I think for a second declared war on poverty, but 961 01:00:57,640 --> 01:01:01,480 Speaker 1: that that went to the wayside very quickly. These are 962 01:01:01,560 --> 01:01:04,560 Speaker 1: unwinnable wars. And when we say winnable, we're not saying 963 01:01:04,600 --> 01:01:07,680 Speaker 1: that they are automatically waged in bad faith. And we're 964 01:01:07,720 --> 01:01:12,880 Speaker 1: absolutely not alleging that independent that individual people involved in 965 01:01:12,920 --> 01:01:16,720 Speaker 1: these conflicts or people who join the armed forces are 966 01:01:16,800 --> 01:01:22,400 Speaker 1: somehow inherently bad, absolutely not. Instead, a problem with these 967 01:01:22,440 --> 01:01:26,560 Speaker 1: wars on ideas, the thing that makes them unwinnable is 968 01:01:26,640 --> 01:01:31,840 Speaker 1: that they have no definitive, discernible end point. You can 969 01:01:31,880 --> 01:01:34,200 Speaker 1: never you know, go on an aircraft carrier with a 970 01:01:34,240 --> 01:01:37,640 Speaker 1: giant banner and declare victory over something like Terry. I mean, 971 01:01:37,720 --> 01:01:40,280 Speaker 1: you could do it, but it would be a symbolic 972 01:01:40,400 --> 01:01:44,440 Speaker 1: gesture at best. You know, um, And it's like, what 973 01:01:44,440 --> 01:01:46,040 Speaker 1: what is I mean? I know this is sort of 974 01:01:46,040 --> 01:01:47,720 Speaker 1: different than we're talking about, but the war on drugs 975 01:01:47,720 --> 01:01:50,000 Speaker 1: is one that's always stuck in my cross, like what 976 01:01:50,080 --> 01:01:52,760 Speaker 1: does that look like? What does winning the war on 977 01:01:52,840 --> 01:01:55,640 Speaker 1: drug look like? Does that mean eradicating all drugs forever 978 01:01:55,720 --> 01:01:58,400 Speaker 1: and all time? Does that mean? I mean, do you 979 01:01:58,440 --> 01:02:01,360 Speaker 1: not acknowledge that by waging this war, people are gonna 980 01:02:01,400 --> 01:02:03,160 Speaker 1: find more creative ways of doing the thing that you 981 01:02:03,360 --> 01:02:06,640 Speaker 1: look at prohibition? I mean it literally created a whole 982 01:02:06,680 --> 01:02:09,920 Speaker 1: sector of crime because you're trying to force people to 983 01:02:09,960 --> 01:02:13,160 Speaker 1: do a thing. It does doesn't work. It doesn't And 984 01:02:13,200 --> 01:02:15,240 Speaker 1: I think to your point, then it points to the 985 01:02:15,280 --> 01:02:17,760 Speaker 1: idea that they knew that it wouldn't work. It is 986 01:02:17,800 --> 01:02:21,640 Speaker 1: not about working, it's not about winning. It's about creating 987 01:02:21,640 --> 01:02:24,520 Speaker 1: the need that you can then fill by selling stuff, 988 01:02:24,840 --> 01:02:27,880 Speaker 1: whether it's new ideas or whether it's products. It's a 989 01:02:27,960 --> 01:02:32,000 Speaker 1: nail factory, it's a nail factor. Oh well, and these 990 01:02:32,080 --> 01:02:35,600 Speaker 1: these unwinnable wars go on and on and on, and 991 01:02:35,760 --> 01:02:40,720 Speaker 1: the defense spending that so much of our economy relies 992 01:02:40,840 --> 01:02:45,160 Speaker 1: upon that spice, Oh it flows, and we have always 993 01:02:45,160 --> 01:02:48,600 Speaker 1: been at war with East Asia, etcetera, etcetera. But like 994 01:02:48,800 --> 01:02:52,600 Speaker 1: with just this brief, you know, we're going long here, Sorry, Paul, 995 01:02:52,960 --> 01:02:55,840 Speaker 1: But with just this brief exploration of the many, many, 996 01:02:56,000 --> 01:03:01,080 Speaker 1: many factors that intertwined the US economy will conflict on 997 01:03:01,080 --> 01:03:05,360 Speaker 1: one level or another, it is sadly, tragically clear that 998 01:03:05,440 --> 01:03:09,040 Speaker 1: there is no answer right now. There's no answer that 999 01:03:09,120 --> 01:03:14,760 Speaker 1: is simultaneously realistic, simple and achievable. Because this is this 1000 01:03:14,840 --> 01:03:17,160 Speaker 1: is what it meant when I said no you first, 1001 01:03:18,080 --> 01:03:21,840 Speaker 1: This is the problem. The world's great powers are in 1002 01:03:21,920 --> 01:03:26,560 Speaker 1: a standoff corporate as well as state level. The first 1003 01:03:26,600 --> 01:03:28,800 Speaker 1: ones to fold, the first ones to get you know, 1004 01:03:29,640 --> 01:03:33,920 Speaker 1: clean from war, are going to suffer enormous consequences. Like 1005 01:03:33,960 --> 01:03:37,640 Speaker 1: you're like like Matt, Let's say you're your defense contractor 1006 01:03:37,720 --> 01:03:44,920 Speaker 1: a get a name? Is it like Mad Industries, Metallic Mattheon? Alright, No, 1007 01:03:45,200 --> 01:03:50,040 Speaker 1: your defense, your your defense corporation? Be you got a 1008 01:03:50,040 --> 01:03:57,280 Speaker 1: cool name? Oh how about Brown, Tron Brown and these 1009 01:03:57,440 --> 01:04:02,240 Speaker 1: these Matthiod and Brown Tron are neck and neck right. Uh, 1010 01:04:02,280 --> 01:04:06,840 Speaker 1: they're kind of like a Boeing air bus thing. Come 1011 01:04:06,880 --> 01:04:10,400 Speaker 1: on out right there the two two giants that can 1012 01:04:10,440 --> 01:04:15,960 Speaker 1: build stuff. Well, let's say Mattheon says, we're gonna stop 1013 01:04:16,000 --> 01:04:19,479 Speaker 1: associating ourselves with military contracts. We want to do sort 1014 01:04:19,520 --> 01:04:27,240 Speaker 1: of a swords the plowshares thing police robots from now on, right, Yeah, 1015 01:04:27,320 --> 01:04:33,960 Speaker 1: something harmless domestic. Yes, so so uh Mattheon pivots. And 1016 01:04:34,080 --> 01:04:38,880 Speaker 1: this makes Brown Tron's uh day because Mattheon stocks plummet. 1017 01:04:39,400 --> 01:04:43,160 Speaker 1: Brown Tron snatches up all these contracts, all this newly 1018 01:04:43,200 --> 01:04:49,400 Speaker 1: available funding, their stocks explode. It's amazing. Uh. And there 1019 01:04:49,440 --> 01:04:52,400 Speaker 1: you know, the Wall Street is publishing articles like is 1020 01:04:52,400 --> 01:04:55,760 Speaker 1: there anything Brown Tron can't do? And the answer appears 1021 01:04:55,760 --> 01:04:58,680 Speaker 1: to be no. Actually they are nailing it. That's what 1022 01:04:58,720 --> 01:05:00,360 Speaker 1: I would be at least saying in my beach to 1023 01:05:00,400 --> 01:05:04,720 Speaker 1: my shareholders. I would mean it, you know, from the 1024 01:05:04,760 --> 01:05:08,080 Speaker 1: heart when I said it. But the joke's on you 1025 01:05:08,600 --> 01:05:13,120 Speaker 1: because in in fifteen years, law enforcement robots are going 1026 01:05:13,200 --> 01:05:16,280 Speaker 1: to be all the rage, and nobody's gonna need weapons 1027 01:05:16,280 --> 01:05:20,919 Speaker 1: of ore anymore because of the nano, the nanites and 1028 01:05:20,960 --> 01:05:25,640 Speaker 1: all that. So yeah, whatever, Uh, we're gonna be fine 1029 01:05:25,680 --> 01:05:29,000 Speaker 1: over here. Whatever my company was called, Wait Wait, Wait 1030 01:05:29,040 --> 01:05:33,120 Speaker 1: to play the long game. I love it. This happens 1031 01:05:33,120 --> 01:05:36,480 Speaker 1: with countries too. I mean a country. We talked about 1032 01:05:36,520 --> 01:05:40,320 Speaker 1: this with nuclear disarmament. A country that dismantles its military 1033 01:05:40,360 --> 01:05:44,240 Speaker 1: capabilities may well see itself become a vassal state of 1034 01:05:44,280 --> 01:05:48,200 Speaker 1: another nation that wasn't so quick to give up the 1035 01:05:48,200 --> 01:05:51,640 Speaker 1: bloody game. And it's it's a problem. It's the nuclear 1036 01:05:51,680 --> 01:05:56,600 Speaker 1: problem writ large. It's the movie moment. It's the standoff. 1037 01:05:56,680 --> 01:05:59,640 Speaker 1: Someone always says, put down your gun, and someone else 1038 01:05:59,680 --> 01:06:04,680 Speaker 1: always says you first. That is where this species is at. 1039 01:06:05,240 --> 01:06:07,920 Speaker 1: And oftentimes when the other person actually does put down 1040 01:06:07,920 --> 01:06:09,720 Speaker 1: their gun, the other party just picks it up and 1041 01:06:09,720 --> 01:06:12,680 Speaker 1: shoots them in the face with it. And you know, 1042 01:06:12,760 --> 01:06:16,240 Speaker 1: it's it's a it's a lesson from fiction, but it 1043 01:06:16,360 --> 01:06:19,920 Speaker 1: has its basis in the real world. And that should 1044 01:06:20,320 --> 01:06:23,680 Speaker 1: that should disturb people, quite honestly. And that's where we 1045 01:06:23,760 --> 01:06:27,240 Speaker 1: leave it today. Folks. What do you think is war 1046 01:06:27,320 --> 01:06:31,080 Speaker 1: and economic necessity for the US? What about other countries? 1047 01:06:31,640 --> 01:06:35,080 Speaker 1: And if we are indeed in a war economy or 1048 01:06:35,480 --> 01:06:39,800 Speaker 1: like a hybrid war economy, should we try as a 1049 01:06:39,920 --> 01:06:44,360 Speaker 1: nation to move towards a different system. What what would 1050 01:06:44,360 --> 01:06:46,800 Speaker 1: that be? You know what I mean? I I don't, 1051 01:06:47,560 --> 01:06:52,120 Speaker 1: I don't know. Uh, there's there was one example. I 1052 01:06:52,200 --> 01:06:56,320 Speaker 1: was looking at examples of unorthodox kind of economic prioritization 1053 01:06:56,360 --> 01:06:59,760 Speaker 1: and systems, and probably one of the most interesting is 1054 01:06:59,760 --> 01:07:04,040 Speaker 1: but TN, which rates itself not on g d P 1055 01:07:04,840 --> 01:07:09,800 Speaker 1: but on g d H gross domestic happiness something like that. Uh, 1056 01:07:09,840 --> 01:07:12,680 Speaker 1: and they still have that sounds nice, right, yeah it does, 1057 01:07:12,920 --> 01:07:16,200 Speaker 1: and they still have their problems with you know, persecution 1058 01:07:16,240 --> 01:07:20,960 Speaker 1: of ethnic minorities and so on. But how what what 1059 01:07:21,120 --> 01:07:24,880 Speaker 1: is the answer? Conspiracies and conspiracy theories abound here. We've 1060 01:07:25,080 --> 01:07:30,960 Speaker 1: I think clearly proven that to yes, to some degree, Uh, 1061 01:07:31,160 --> 01:07:35,120 Speaker 1: conflict does function as an economic necessity for different sectors 1062 01:07:35,120 --> 01:07:38,040 Speaker 1: of the US. What's the alternative? How do you get there? 1063 01:07:39,360 --> 01:07:42,680 Speaker 1: Do we want to get there in the first place? 1064 01:07:42,880 --> 01:07:46,480 Speaker 1: I mean, the inner flower child in me says, yes, please, 1065 01:07:46,560 --> 01:07:50,520 Speaker 1: let's let's get past war. But it doesn't doesn't seem possible. 1066 01:07:50,600 --> 01:07:53,120 Speaker 1: But we'd love to hear your ideas for sure, So 1067 01:07:53,160 --> 01:07:56,400 Speaker 1: go ahead and uh pick up the gun and reach 1068 01:07:56,440 --> 01:08:00,080 Speaker 1: out to us on Twitter, Facebook, where we're conspiracy stuff 1069 01:08:00,240 --> 01:08:03,880 Speaker 1: or conspiracy stuff show over there on Instagram. We also 1070 01:08:04,040 --> 01:08:06,600 Speaker 1: have a phone number. That's right. You can pick up 1071 01:08:06,600 --> 01:08:10,120 Speaker 1: the horn, which is, in my opinion, uh, superior to 1072 01:08:10,160 --> 01:08:12,000 Speaker 1: the gun uh. And you can give us a call 1073 01:08:12,040 --> 01:08:13,960 Speaker 1: at one eight three three S T d W y 1074 01:08:14,040 --> 01:08:16,679 Speaker 1: t K. Leave your message at the sound of Ben's 1075 01:08:16,760 --> 01:08:19,320 Speaker 1: dulcet tones. Three minutes is the time. That is your 1076 01:08:19,360 --> 01:08:21,320 Speaker 1: time to do with what you will. If you need 1077 01:08:21,360 --> 01:08:23,559 Speaker 1: more than three minutes, we have some other means of 1078 01:08:23,600 --> 01:08:26,320 Speaker 1: communication that might be a little better suited to your needs. 1079 01:08:26,479 --> 01:08:29,120 Speaker 1: That's right. You can send us a good old fashioned 1080 01:08:29,200 --> 01:08:51,960 Speaker 1: email where we are conspiracy at i heeart radio dot com. 1081 01:08:52,080 --> 01:08:54,200 Speaker 1: Stuff they don't want you to know is a production 1082 01:08:54,240 --> 01:08:57,320 Speaker 1: of I heart Radio. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, 1083 01:08:57,479 --> 01:09:00,519 Speaker 1: visit the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you 1084 01:09:00,560 --> 01:09:01,719 Speaker 1: listen to your favorite shows.