WEBVTT - Black Duck Revival with Jonathan Wilkins 0:00:00.480 --> 0:00:04.360 Interstate Batteries is a proud supporter of the Sportsman's Nation, 0:00:04.480 --> 0:00:07.880 so if you're looking for high quality batteries, you need 0:00:07.920 --> 0:00:12.000 to check out a local Interstate Batteries retail store, where 0:00:12.080 --> 0:00:16.280 you can visit them online at Interstate Batteries dot com. 0:00:16.320 --> 0:00:27.200 Interstate Batteries outrageously Dependable. My name is Clay Nucleman. I'm 0:00:27.200 --> 0:00:31.000 the host of the Bear Hunting Magazine podcast. I'll also 0:00:31.160 --> 0:00:34.160 be your host into the world of hunting the icon 0:00:34.680 --> 0:00:40.480 of North American wilderness. We'll talk about tactics, gear conservation, 0:00:41.000 --> 0:00:43.280 but will also bring you into some of the wildest 0:00:43.320 --> 0:00:56.200 country on the planet chasing Battery. I usually begin the 0:00:56.240 --> 0:01:00.200 podcast when I introduced someone, I say, this is my 0:01:00.360 --> 0:01:04.560 friend whoever it is, Well, I want to say that 0:01:04.640 --> 0:01:07.720 about this guest and I and I really mean it, 0:01:08.040 --> 0:01:10.640 but I have not known this guy for very long, 0:01:11.440 --> 0:01:13.080 but as soon as I met him, I was like, 0:01:13.160 --> 0:01:15.679 this is a good guy and he's gonna be my friend. 0:01:16.600 --> 0:01:20.759 And so on this podcast with my friend Jonathan Wilkins, 0:01:21.080 --> 0:01:24.520 you're gonna hear a very interesting conversation. Jonathan was raised 0:01:24.560 --> 0:01:27.520 in an urban area and became a hunter later in 0:01:27.600 --> 0:01:32.039 life when he moved to Arkansas. He had a non 0:01:32.120 --> 0:01:35.640 traditional entry into the hunting space. We have a very 0:01:36.000 --> 0:01:42.160 candid conversation about all his early experiences hunting, about race, 0:01:42.720 --> 0:01:45.800 about a bunch of great stuff, and you're going to 0:01:45.920 --> 0:01:54.520 enjoy this podcast, my friend Jonathan Wilkins of Black Duck Revival. Secondly, 0:01:56.040 --> 0:02:00.240 it's not too late to check out Northwood's Fair Pride US. 0:02:00.840 --> 0:02:04.320 There's still quite a bit of bear baiting going on 0:02:05.040 --> 0:02:09.799 and north Woods Bear Products has a full line of products. 0:02:10.120 --> 0:02:13.360 You guys, hear me preach about it about every other podcast. 0:02:13.960 --> 0:02:16.960 But we have been going through the gold rush like crazy. 0:02:17.200 --> 0:02:21.160 As I record the intro to this podcast, we just 0:02:21.320 --> 0:02:24.120 got done bear hunting. I mean I've still my skinning 0:02:24.240 --> 0:02:29.080 knives are still stained with the evidence of a bear 0:02:29.200 --> 0:02:35.440 kill from yesterday that was taken because of north Woods 0:02:35.440 --> 0:02:42.040 Bear Products. Since So check out our friends on Instagram, Facebook, 0:02:42.200 --> 0:02:45.480 and their website north Woods Bear Products. These guys just 0:02:45.520 --> 0:02:48.359 aren't making bear products, but these guys are bear hunters 0:02:48.639 --> 0:02:50.800 that are doing good things for the sport of bear hunting. 0:02:51.080 --> 0:02:58.720 Check them out. So I am here in Northwest Arkansas 0:02:59.200 --> 0:03:05.840 with my new buddy, Jonathan Wilkins. Jonathan and I are tired. 0:03:06.080 --> 0:03:08.800 We're tired, aren't we, Jonathan, I'm a little warm. Damn you. 0:03:09.800 --> 0:03:14.400 We've been at the World Championship Squirrel cook Off all 0:03:14.520 --> 0:03:18.320 day long and you were you were a contestant. You 0:03:18.320 --> 0:03:21.000 you were you were cooking for the for the gold medal. 0:03:22.200 --> 0:03:23.880 I was cooking. I did not get a gold medal, 0:03:23.919 --> 0:03:28.119 but yeah, I gave it a shot. Gave it a shot. Well, 0:03:28.280 --> 0:03:31.000 we're doing a whole other podcast about the World Championship 0:03:31.040 --> 0:03:34.480 Squirrel cook Off, but so tell us what tell me 0:03:34.560 --> 0:03:37.960 what you cooked? So I did a kind of a 0:03:38.040 --> 0:03:43.040 riff on a a plastic kind of British bar food 0:03:43.080 --> 0:03:46.760 called chips and curry. So normally that's just like a 0:03:46.840 --> 0:03:50.160 very simple curry sauce on top of you know, French fries. 0:03:50.320 --> 0:03:52.320 What is curry sauce? Actually, I mean I know what 0:03:52.440 --> 0:03:53.800 it is. I eat it and like it, but I 0:03:54.080 --> 0:03:57.160 honestly don't know what it is. It's like, okay, curry, 0:03:57.200 --> 0:04:01.200 I think I think curry Actually train inslates to sauce, 0:04:01.760 --> 0:04:04.440 and there's a million different varieties of it and it's 0:04:04.600 --> 0:04:11.440 regional specialties. But just to simplify it, it's, uh, it's 0:04:11.440 --> 0:04:14.720 a sauce that can incorporate any number of things. Primarily 0:04:14.760 --> 0:04:16.600 people think of it as that like that yellow color 0:04:16.640 --> 0:04:19.120 which is tumeric based. But you know, coming out of 0:04:19.120 --> 0:04:23.279 Southeast Asia, out of India and Pakistan, and you know tradition, 0:04:23.320 --> 0:04:26.320 I mean, you could pair it with meat, depending on 0:04:26.480 --> 0:04:29.880 the person's uh you know, what religion they practice or whatever. 0:04:29.920 --> 0:04:31.840 They might pair it with goat, they might pair it 0:04:31.880 --> 0:04:35.120 with lentils and do a vegetarian thing. There's a million, 0:04:35.120 --> 0:04:38.720 there's a million different iterations of it. So I didn't 0:04:38.720 --> 0:04:41.840 mean to interrupt you there. So so I did a 0:04:42.200 --> 0:04:46.440 curry over. I did a squirrel curry. It had like 0:04:46.560 --> 0:04:52.000 cardamon water, um, you know, cilantro, fresh ginger, onions, garlic, 0:04:52.960 --> 0:04:56.320 a bunch of gray squirrel in it. Uh, you know, 0:04:56.440 --> 0:05:00.120 just like a curry that I like. Some raisins. You 0:05:00.120 --> 0:05:03.440 put some raisins in your career, yeah, man, Uh, you know, 0:05:03.520 --> 0:05:06.560 especially like in the Middle East, Uh, you know, up 0:05:06.560 --> 0:05:08.360 to like you know, Morocco and stuff like that. They 0:05:08.400 --> 0:05:10.360 do a lot of pairing of sweet and savor. You 0:05:10.440 --> 0:05:14.039 Like in Morocco there's a very classic pigeons stuffed with 0:05:14.160 --> 0:05:17.880 raisin and dates dish. Uh. It compliments well, especially when 0:05:17.920 --> 0:05:22.560 you get that dried fruit that kind of intensified rich uh, 0:05:22.800 --> 0:05:26.400 molasses c kind of flavor. It can go well and strong. 0:05:27.240 --> 0:05:29.520 You save me any I would be able to comment 0:05:29.640 --> 0:05:31.880 now and talk about how good it was. Man, it 0:05:31.920 --> 0:05:34.560 went quick. But like I said, man, if we can 0:05:34.560 --> 0:05:35.919 get you down to duck hunt, man, I'll make you 0:05:35.960 --> 0:05:39.040 some more. So. The World Championship Squirrel cook Off is 0:05:39.040 --> 0:05:42.359 in Bentonville, Arkansas. And so you you cooked like six 0:05:42.440 --> 0:05:46.080 plates for judges, is that right? Yeah? So six servings 0:05:46.080 --> 0:05:47.800 of that and you've got to give that the judges 0:05:47.839 --> 0:05:50.400 and and arrest. You don't have to, but pretty much 0:05:50.400 --> 0:05:52.159 it's like the thing to do is you serve that 0:05:52.240 --> 0:05:55.400 to the general public that comes to this big event. 0:05:55.760 --> 0:05:58.160 And so you had now chips when you say chips, 0:05:58.520 --> 0:06:01.040 French fries, Yeah, that's just fren fried. I fried. You 0:06:01.120 --> 0:06:03.960 poured this like it kind of looked like chilly to me. 0:06:04.000 --> 0:06:05.880 I mean, I was like, it's just kind of it's 0:06:05.920 --> 0:06:10.000 like dark reddish, you know, like sauce. You put that 0:06:10.040 --> 0:06:12.640 over the French fries. Yeah, Fried, I did the French 0:06:12.680 --> 0:06:16.159 fries and rendered duck fat, rendered like a pent rendered 0:06:16.200 --> 0:06:20.720 duck fat. No way, and then uh, and then I 0:06:20.800 --> 0:06:25.440 steeped squirrel in duck fat. And then I strained it 0:06:25.560 --> 0:06:27.680 and then I used that to make a vintegrette, and 0:06:27.720 --> 0:06:30.960 then I just dressed like a cucumber and tomato salad 0:06:31.320 --> 0:06:33.560 because that curry was pretty spicy. You get that cucumber 0:06:33.680 --> 0:06:35.000 kind of cools it down a little bit, and I 0:06:35.040 --> 0:06:37.719 served that on the sude right on. Well it's it 0:06:37.839 --> 0:06:42.520 smelled awesome. I appreciate it. It smelled good, But so 0:06:44.120 --> 0:06:47.440 little introduction of who you are. And and I've i've 0:06:47.680 --> 0:06:50.680 i've we kind of I've known about you for a 0:06:50.760 --> 0:06:59.960 little while, but but you have, well, you you introduce yourself. So. Uh, 0:07:00.080 --> 0:07:02.160 I've been in Arkansas for half my life. I moved 0:07:02.160 --> 0:07:06.720 down here to go to college. I'm originally from St. Louis, UM. 0:07:07.000 --> 0:07:09.760 Just through half instance and whatnot. I ended up meeting 0:07:09.760 --> 0:07:12.080 a guy who taught me how to bow hunt. That 0:07:12.200 --> 0:07:14.920 kind of transformed my life about ten years ago. I 0:07:14.960 --> 0:07:18.880 came to it later in life as an adult, and uh, 0:07:19.240 --> 0:07:21.160 you know, there's a million things that have happened. But 0:07:21.280 --> 0:07:25.800 now I've got a a small business running uh a 0:07:25.840 --> 0:07:28.200 little a little duck lodge in the Arkansas, a delta 0:07:28.800 --> 0:07:32.960 and you know, just trying to find my feet in Uh. 0:07:33.040 --> 0:07:35.240 I guess the outdoor industry. I guess what you would call. 0:07:35.360 --> 0:07:37.080 It's just kind of trying to find my way and 0:07:37.120 --> 0:07:39.920 find my little niche and how I can do the 0:07:39.920 --> 0:07:42.280 stuff that brings me a lot of joy and satisfaction 0:07:42.320 --> 0:07:45.400 and still take care of my family. So you started 0:07:45.480 --> 0:07:50.480 hunting about ten years ago, Yeah, I think I killed. I. 0:07:50.480 --> 0:07:52.080 I was real lucky, and I had a lot of 0:07:52.120 --> 0:07:55.480 success from the beginning. I was living on my at 0:07:55.480 --> 0:07:57.840 the time, my girlfriend's family property. We're just living in 0:07:57.880 --> 0:08:01.480 a little trailer on fifteen acres. And I bought a bow, 0:08:02.280 --> 0:08:06.360 just a compound, and uh, you know, a compound is 0:08:06.400 --> 0:08:09.360 not a difficult thing to use. I feel like just 0:08:09.440 --> 0:08:14.040 basic proficient proficiency is fairly easy to attain. And I 0:08:14.120 --> 0:08:17.560 killed I killed a pretty good book two weeks later, 0:08:18.160 --> 0:08:21.160 really after getting your bow, just right after you getting man. 0:08:21.240 --> 0:08:22.760 I mean that, And that's what I'm saying. I'm not 0:08:22.840 --> 0:08:26.600 a I'm not an awesome bowshot. Uh. I couldn't. I 0:08:26.720 --> 0:08:28.800 probably couldn't hit a pie plate at forty yards, but 0:08:28.840 --> 0:08:32.200 inside of twenty yards or yards, like, I could hit 0:08:32.200 --> 0:08:33.800 a door nine all day long. I think a lot 0:08:33.880 --> 0:08:37.240 of people could. And I was doing that within the 0:08:37.240 --> 0:08:39.520 first couple of hours. I practiced for a week. My 0:08:39.559 --> 0:08:41.120 buddy was like, I think we can take you hunting. 0:08:41.200 --> 0:08:44.760 Did you okay? You just you just stepped over a 0:08:44.880 --> 0:08:49.160 very good line, did you know? Runella gave me a 0:08:49.160 --> 0:08:52.520 hard time about saying that, Uh, somebody couldn't shoot a 0:08:52.520 --> 0:08:55.640 bow within a couple of hours. You may not. It's 0:08:55.720 --> 0:08:57.959 on the Meteor podcast when I was on there, I 0:08:58.000 --> 0:09:01.480 said somebody, I said, somebody can learn to shoot a 0:09:01.480 --> 0:09:04.520 bow in like three hours and be pretty proficient. And 0:09:04.559 --> 0:09:06.920 they they He was like, they were like, no, no, 0:09:07.000 --> 0:09:10.439 they couldn't know. They couldn't. I've had so many people say, Clay, 0:09:10.480 --> 0:09:12.040 we agree with you. So do you agree with me 0:09:12.080 --> 0:09:14.160 that you can get pretty proficient with the bow within 0:09:14.200 --> 0:09:16.200 a couple of hours? Yeah? I think. I think it 0:09:16.320 --> 0:09:18.400 probably has a lot to do with where you're hunting. 0:09:18.800 --> 0:09:21.120 I think Ranella does that Western hunting when he's got 0:09:21.120 --> 0:09:24.080 longer shots. But I mean we live in Arkansas. I 0:09:24.200 --> 0:09:28.840 hunt that Eastern Deciti yard shots most of the time. Yeah, 0:09:28.880 --> 0:09:30.720 I didn't. The first year I killed he was about 0:09:30.720 --> 0:09:34.200 twelve yards. Then later that season I killed one at 0:09:34.200 --> 0:09:36.920 about nine yards. I killed another one with the bow 0:09:36.960 --> 0:09:39.720 the next year at five yards. It was three years 0:09:39.720 --> 0:09:44.440 before I ever shot my bow further than fifteen yards 0:09:44.440 --> 0:09:47.680 in a hunting scenario. I would say that's real congruent 0:09:47.760 --> 0:09:52.720 with my experience bow hunting. I mean, not a lot 0:09:52.720 --> 0:09:55.200 of deer I've killed over thirty yards. I mean some 0:09:55.400 --> 0:09:58.439 I have, but it's but you know, that's twenty five 0:09:58.520 --> 0:10:00.559 years of bow hunting and hunt bow hunting a lot, 0:10:00.640 --> 0:10:04.520 but typically twenty yards inside of twenty yards for Arkansas, 0:10:04.600 --> 0:10:07.560 for our Arkansas stuff. What let me ask you a question. 0:10:07.600 --> 0:10:09.559 What what drew you to hunting? So? I mean you 0:10:09.600 --> 0:10:14.320 were raised in an urban environmentally urban very much. Told 0:10:14.320 --> 0:10:18.040 me you had dreadlocks when you came to Arkansas. Not 0:10:18.160 --> 0:10:22.160 that that makes someone urban, but no, I had you 0:10:22.160 --> 0:10:24.800 you you said that to me to like be like, 0:10:25.080 --> 0:10:27.440 yeah I was. I was in a different I was 0:10:27.440 --> 0:10:30.160 in a different sphere. Yeah I had. I had little 0:10:30.200 --> 0:10:33.199 dreadlocks when I moved to Arkansas. Uh, And I grew 0:10:33.280 --> 0:10:34.840 him for a long time and with like some big, 0:10:34.840 --> 0:10:39.400 gnarly rasta looking ones. But I'll tell you what. I'll 0:10:39.400 --> 0:10:43.600 tell you what I think it really came came down to. Uh. 0:10:43.640 --> 0:10:46.800 When I grew up my dad, my dad raised me 0:10:47.000 --> 0:10:50.600 reading Louis Lamore books and watching Westerns and you know, 0:10:50.720 --> 0:10:53.640 Jeremiah Johnson and all that kind of stuff. Uh. There 0:10:53.679 --> 0:10:54.960 was a book I loved when I was a kid 0:10:55.000 --> 0:10:57.319 called My Side of the Mountain about this kid from 0:10:57.320 --> 0:11:00.160 New York who ends up in the Smoky Mountain and 0:11:00.200 --> 0:11:02.240 hollows out of tree and trains of hawk and all 0:11:02.240 --> 0:11:06.480 this stuff. Uh that sounds like it's a great book, 0:11:06.559 --> 0:11:08.439 and it was. They even made it into a movie 0:11:08.440 --> 0:11:10.720 in the seventies and we watched it like on Friday 0:11:10.800 --> 0:11:17.000 movie night with my family. But there was I feel 0:11:17.040 --> 0:11:20.760 like when I was introduced to hunting and I had 0:11:20.840 --> 0:11:24.240 access to it, it it just made sense. It was 0:11:24.280 --> 0:11:26.640 something that I was missing. And the reason I referenced 0:11:26.640 --> 0:11:28.920 those like Westerns and the Louis La Moore books and 0:11:28.920 --> 0:11:31.160 stuff is because there was something that I was responding 0:11:31.200 --> 0:11:33.520 to in those, but I didn't know how it was 0:11:33.559 --> 0:11:36.280 going to manifest. And I think that what I'm I 0:11:36.280 --> 0:11:39.800 think that what I really respond to with it. I mean, 0:11:39.840 --> 0:11:42.800 it's very multifaceted, but I kind of boil it down 0:11:42.840 --> 0:11:50.000 to it's very much, uh representative of the American dream 0:11:50.040 --> 0:11:52.360 to me because it's the way that I approach it. 0:11:52.360 --> 0:11:56.360 It's about self sufficiency. Uh, you know, when you go 0:11:56.400 --> 0:12:01.880 and hunt what I would quantify as fair chase, and 0:12:01.960 --> 0:12:04.560 you go and you, you know, match wits with an animal, 0:12:04.720 --> 0:12:07.680 and you treat it with respect, and you you're respected 0:12:07.800 --> 0:12:09.680 enough to learn a whole bunch about it so that 0:12:09.720 --> 0:12:12.000 you can try and put yourself in a scenario. And 0:12:12.040 --> 0:12:15.280 then if you are able to be successful with that, 0:12:15.280 --> 0:12:18.960 that's you. You earned it. It's it's like picking up 0:12:18.960 --> 0:12:20.600 a heavy weight. You can either do it or you 0:12:20.679 --> 0:12:24.840 can't do it. Uh. And I respond a lot to that. 0:12:25.040 --> 0:12:28.280 I feel a real sense of accomplishment with it. It Also, 0:12:30.440 --> 0:12:33.400 I feel like when I'm in when I when I 0:12:33.440 --> 0:12:35.560 was in the National Force a couple of weeks ago, 0:12:35.679 --> 0:12:37.240 and it was a chunk of woods I've never been 0:12:37.240 --> 0:12:40.960 in before, but it felt very familiar and appropriate for 0:12:41.000 --> 0:12:42.480 me to be there. I don't think i'd feel that 0:12:42.520 --> 0:12:44.680 way in a desert. I don't feel that way on 0:12:44.679 --> 0:12:49.240 the ocean, but I don't even really feel that way 0:12:49.280 --> 0:12:55.160 on big lakes. But by us swampy stuff, you know, 0:12:55.200 --> 0:12:58.600 the mountains we have here in Arkansas. That's those are 0:12:58.640 --> 0:13:03.480 places that feel like I have some kind of connection 0:13:03.520 --> 0:13:07.760 that to it that's bigger then I can I can 0:13:07.880 --> 0:13:13.000 quantify what what were the challenges of coming into hunting 0:13:13.840 --> 0:13:15.840 without a lot of Now, it sounds like you had 0:13:15.880 --> 0:13:21.280 some you had some place in your in your upbringing, 0:13:21.800 --> 0:13:25.320 in the input that you had a parental input, even 0:13:25.520 --> 0:13:28.400 even your dad have an interest in like now lu 0:13:28.559 --> 0:13:31.320 La Moore, that's not necessarily hunting stuff, but it's it's West. 0:13:31.400 --> 0:13:33.560 I don't know that much about it, but Western stuff 0:13:33.600 --> 0:13:36.720 like connection to the land, kind of like this, uh 0:13:36.800 --> 0:13:40.520 well Western cowboys stuff. But then like Jeremiah Johnson would 0:13:40.520 --> 0:13:43.480 have been like pioneer stuff hunting. So I mean, like, 0:13:43.520 --> 0:13:47.080 so I guess you did have a place inside of 0:13:47.080 --> 0:13:49.680 your mind where it was like this could fit. But 0:13:50.679 --> 0:13:54.600 so what were the what were the challenges of coming 0:13:54.840 --> 0:13:58.240 being a new hunter? I mean, i'd say just a 0:13:58.280 --> 0:14:01.040 reference which you just spoke to, Like I was raised 0:14:01.280 --> 0:14:04.280 to be capable, Like I was raised like my dad 0:14:04.360 --> 0:14:06.280 was fourty years old when I was born. I was 0:14:06.400 --> 0:14:10.640 first kid. And I say that because my dad's older 0:14:10.840 --> 0:14:13.480 and he just has a different mindset. So I was 0:14:13.559 --> 0:14:17.040 raised to fix things first if you could, Like you 0:14:17.080 --> 0:14:19.400 don't call somebody in to fix your washing machine if 0:14:19.400 --> 0:14:22.000 you can fix it, like you work on your own car. 0:14:22.600 --> 0:14:24.160 When I was nine years old. My dad had me 0:14:24.240 --> 0:14:26.480 up on the roof helping him shingle it. You know. 0:14:26.560 --> 0:14:29.400 So I'm just saying there, I think that helped play 0:14:29.440 --> 0:14:31.960 into it. Because did that play into like the like 0:14:32.000 --> 0:14:37.520 the food aspect of it, Like like I want to 0:14:37.520 --> 0:14:40.040 go get food for myself, just like you know, you 0:14:40.200 --> 0:14:43.800 fix your car for yourself. I think yes, partly, But 0:14:43.880 --> 0:14:46.400 I think I think I'd speak more to the fact 0:14:46.440 --> 0:14:50.280 that it gave me enough confidence in myself that I 0:14:50.320 --> 0:14:54.640 felt like I could do things that were physically difficult 0:14:55.720 --> 0:14:59.800 if I tried, you know, uh, that there wasn't something 0:14:59.840 --> 0:15:02.240 I couldn't do if I didn't keep working at it 0:15:02.720 --> 0:15:07.320 kind of deal. Uh, And then I did have Actually 0:15:07.320 --> 0:15:09.200 I lost the point. So what were you asking me 0:15:09.800 --> 0:15:13.520 challenges to hunting? Challenges to be like, so you're like 0:15:14.200 --> 0:15:16.800 mid thirties now, so you started hunting ten years ago, 0:15:17.200 --> 0:15:19.680 so you're in your mid twenties. So he didn't grow 0:15:19.760 --> 0:15:22.080 up doing it, but kind of had this space in 0:15:22.160 --> 0:15:25.480 your you know, you had this pocket of interest and 0:15:25.480 --> 0:15:30.520 curiosity and desire that was that found traction. When something 0:15:30.560 --> 0:15:33.320 you met somebody here in Arkansas that taught you had 0:15:33.320 --> 0:15:36.640 a bow hunt, did you well I'm jumping ahead of myself, 0:15:36.920 --> 0:15:39.840 but maybe this is maybe this is jumping backwards. Did 0:15:39.880 --> 0:15:43.560 you pursue that guy or did he pursue you a mentor? No, 0:15:43.720 --> 0:15:46.240 he's a I mean, he's one of my best friends. Uh. 0:15:46.400 --> 0:15:49.200 We were actually we're working together. We had a little 0:15:49.200 --> 0:15:53.880 business building decks and running fence and just odd jobs. 0:15:55.000 --> 0:15:59.360 And when he we were building the deck out at 0:15:59.400 --> 0:16:02.200 my mother in law trailer, and he was just looking 0:16:02.200 --> 0:16:03.720 at the woods around there. He was like, man, I've 0:16:03.760 --> 0:16:08.280 never seen this many huge white oaks. It's just nothing. 0:16:08.760 --> 0:16:11.040 And that fifteen acres backed up to a thousand acres 0:16:11.080 --> 0:16:14.360 of just beautiful hardwood force and he was just losing 0:16:14.360 --> 0:16:17.080 his mind about it. And so it was really a 0:16:17.160 --> 0:16:21.560 thing where I was just kind of tagging along because 0:16:21.560 --> 0:16:23.280 he wanted to go see if he could what's up 0:16:23.320 --> 0:16:25.760 with this draw over here? Man, look at all this 0:16:25.800 --> 0:16:29.280 greenbrier that's been off here. Uh. And he started checking 0:16:29.280 --> 0:16:31.680 out these woods like from a hunter's perspective. He was 0:16:32.000 --> 0:16:34.400 he was noticing stuff that a hunter would notice that. 0:16:35.360 --> 0:16:38.440 But I had no I mean, and you gotta understand, 0:16:38.480 --> 0:16:43.840 like I I had probably seen too deer from a 0:16:43.880 --> 0:16:46.160 distance in my life at this point like I just 0:16:46.240 --> 0:16:52.320 I didn't have any association with him, uh, but he 0:16:52.400 --> 0:16:55.640 was passionate about it, and you know, it piqued my interest. 0:16:55.920 --> 0:16:59.280 And I remember I remember us walking around this little 0:16:59.280 --> 0:17:01.960 five acre hunk and he was explaining me, like what 0:17:02.000 --> 0:17:04.600 a deer bed looked like, and so I was just 0:17:04.680 --> 0:17:06.840 every depression I find, like you think there's a deer 0:17:06.840 --> 0:17:08.920 living here, You think there's a deer living here. And 0:17:09.240 --> 0:17:11.159 I remember him being like, dude, you're looking at this 0:17:11.200 --> 0:17:13.639 too small, because to me at the time, five acres 0:17:13.640 --> 0:17:16.959 was an enormous chunk of property and I thought there 0:17:17.040 --> 0:17:19.040 was maybe three or four deer that lived on that 0:17:19.080 --> 0:17:23.040 five acres like all the time, I had no idea, uh. 0:17:23.400 --> 0:17:25.959 But so yeah, but I went. I just ended up 0:17:25.960 --> 0:17:28.000 going down the rabbit hole with it, and I went hard. 0:17:29.280 --> 0:17:33.919 Uh And yeah, so he probably we probably went squirrel 0:17:33.960 --> 0:17:40.520 hunting in September that first year. And then November seven 0:17:41.240 --> 0:17:43.920 of two thousand ten, I I killed my first deer though, 0:17:44.359 --> 0:17:46.360 and I killed it with a boat two weeks after 0:17:46.440 --> 0:17:51.360 getting a bow, like I said, And and I understand 0:17:51.359 --> 0:17:53.640 how lucky I was, but I do take a little 0:17:53.640 --> 0:17:56.320 bit of pride because I caught on fairly quickly and 0:17:56.359 --> 0:17:59.199 where I killed that deer. You know, my buddy had 0:17:59.200 --> 0:18:03.479 showed hit shown me, excuse me, he showed me, like 0:18:03.480 --> 0:18:04.960 what a d I didn't know what a draw was. 0:18:05.000 --> 0:18:06.960 I didn't know what the saddle was. And so I 0:18:07.000 --> 0:18:10.000 just walked around until I found this spot where there's 0:18:10.080 --> 0:18:13.639 three draws running together. And if you found the spot 0:18:13.640 --> 0:18:15.159 on your own, I found on my own. And I 0:18:15.160 --> 0:18:18.400 grunted that deer in and he came in and it 0:18:18.440 --> 0:18:20.920 was like TV. He put on a show. He beat 0:18:21.000 --> 0:18:23.439 up a tree, he peeed all down the back of 0:18:23.440 --> 0:18:27.840 his legs and stomped around and then I just thumped 0:18:27.920 --> 0:18:30.960 him at a twelve yards And then I called my 0:18:31.000 --> 0:18:34.720 buddy from the deer stand, shaking and said I just 0:18:34.800 --> 0:18:37.240 killed a deer. I just called it killed a TV deer. 0:18:37.280 --> 0:18:41.080 I come on this deer on TV. Uh So, man, 0:18:41.160 --> 0:18:44.840 that's cool. That's a that's a good first experience. It's 0:18:44.880 --> 0:18:49.400 an awesome one. Yeah, it was. If I had if 0:18:49.400 --> 0:18:51.520 it had taken me six years to kill a deer, 0:18:51.560 --> 0:18:53.600 I'm sure that at some point I would have said 0:18:53.680 --> 0:18:58.680 this is it's not working out. But because I kind 0:18:58.680 --> 0:19:01.160 of saw what it could be very early, it just 0:19:01.200 --> 0:19:04.000 fueled my desire to go further and further into it, 0:19:04.080 --> 0:19:10.440 and and I'm I'm definitely definitely not I'm not hunting 0:19:10.480 --> 0:19:13.919 for antlers. I really, I don't have that much interest 0:19:13.960 --> 0:19:18.560 in killing running bucks anymore because they can get a 0:19:18.560 --> 0:19:21.000 little funky tasting. And I'm looking, I'm looking to put 0:19:21.040 --> 0:19:26.399 four or five deer in the freezer. But uh, it 0:19:26.560 --> 0:19:29.520 just it opened me to be able, or it gave 0:19:29.520 --> 0:19:31.919 me the opportunity to be able to open myself to 0:19:32.000 --> 0:19:36.040 all the other stuff that comes with hunting. So it 0:19:36.080 --> 0:19:40.240 sounds to me like you're you found a good you 0:19:40.320 --> 0:19:44.000 found a good mentor but your passion really helped you 0:19:44.040 --> 0:19:47.000 overcome a lot of the obstacles of knowledge and stuff, 0:19:47.040 --> 0:19:49.760 just because it sounds like you just started sucking up information, 0:19:50.320 --> 0:19:55.120 sucking up knowledge, and just we're able to just kind 0:19:55.160 --> 0:19:57.440 of a self starter in a sense, even though you 0:19:57.520 --> 0:19:59.560 had somebody, I mean, we all had somebody helping us 0:19:59.680 --> 0:20:02.320 do sure, you know, But I mean I was I 0:20:02.400 --> 0:20:05.399 was actively reading every book I could find, even old 0:20:05.400 --> 0:20:09.000 ones I'd find in antique stores. Uh, I was looking 0:20:09.000 --> 0:20:12.159 for stuff on the internet. I was. I mean, this 0:20:12.280 --> 0:20:15.720 was before you kind of had that YouTube, the YouTube 0:20:15.760 --> 0:20:19.160 Hunting Resurgence or not resurgence, but just what's happening now. 0:20:19.280 --> 0:20:21.119 It wasn't what it is today. Yeah, I mean I 0:20:21.119 --> 0:20:24.360 would go I would go to Walmart three times a week, 0:20:24.440 --> 0:20:28.720 starting in September, waiting for there was a there's a 0:20:28.760 --> 0:20:32.280 White Tailed Hunting DVDs to come out. Yeah, you know, 0:20:32.359 --> 0:20:34.600 because I was like, just anything, I can know what 0:20:35.520 --> 0:20:40.920 I actually missed that I did the same years. For years. 0:20:41.040 --> 0:20:45.760 I bought DVDs and they would come out around first 0:20:45.760 --> 0:20:50.000 week of September, second week of September at Walmart, and 0:20:50.119 --> 0:20:52.199 oh man, I would go buy one of those, and 0:20:52.240 --> 0:20:55.040 I would be like giddy, and I would go home 0:20:55.160 --> 0:20:57.080 and I would put it in the I mean in 0:20:57.119 --> 0:20:59.159 the dv we don't even own a DVD player anymore. 0:20:59.480 --> 0:21:01.639 Put in the DVD player and watch it. It's like 0:21:01.680 --> 0:21:03.359 the way it's those the way records used to be. 0:21:03.840 --> 0:21:06.760 Those days are gone. Yeah, it's it's all very immediate. 0:21:06.920 --> 0:21:08.960 And I and even though I've only been doing it 0:21:08.960 --> 0:21:12.439 for ten years, I do feel like I got in 0:21:12.520 --> 0:21:16.080 it early enough to understand references from people who have 0:21:16.160 --> 0:21:19.040 been doing it for thirty or forty years. You know, 0:21:20.840 --> 0:21:24.480 well that's that's cool. So okay, so we we've got 0:21:24.520 --> 0:21:30.680 you into hunting now, and um, now I know that 0:21:30.760 --> 0:21:35.760 you're you're a big duck hunter. Is that? Let's see you? 0:21:35.760 --> 0:21:38.359 You went to college at Hendricks, which is a college 0:21:38.359 --> 0:21:41.280 here in central central Arkansas. And when did you start 0:21:41.320 --> 0:21:48.960 duck hunting? The year after I started deer hunting after that? Yeah, 0:21:48.960 --> 0:21:53.040 the way that went down is so like, I don't 0:21:53.080 --> 0:21:56.639 look like the prototypical Arkansas hunter, you know, like I'm 0:21:56.680 --> 0:21:58.320 a person of color. I got a bunch of weird 0:21:58.320 --> 0:22:02.160 tattoos on me, and those are pretty good looking tattoo. 0:22:02.160 --> 0:22:05.000 I'm looking at the let me see that looking at 0:22:05.040 --> 0:22:08.280 a a mallard duck. Yeah, I got mallards. I got 0:22:08.280 --> 0:22:10.320 my mollard in the hen. You gotta picture of mom 0:22:10.359 --> 0:22:15.080 I got at caravan. I got a Pekinese with a 0:22:15.720 --> 0:22:19.400 you're gonna tell me the story of the ny Caravan tattoo. Man, 0:22:19.440 --> 0:22:21.280 I played music for a long time and that was 0:22:21.320 --> 0:22:24.160 my old tour van. So we used to say, man, 0:22:24.160 --> 0:22:25.840 you gotta get in the van and ride or die. 0:22:26.000 --> 0:22:28.080 So I put it on my arm with ride or 0:22:28.080 --> 0:22:31.919 Die underneath it. You're gonna get a squirrel like World 0:22:32.000 --> 0:22:36.440 Championship Squirrel Contestant cook Off tattoo. No, you know, I 0:22:36.720 --> 0:22:38.920 hold off on that. What about if you ever bring 0:22:38.960 --> 0:22:42.760 home the w you do that, no more tattoos. No, 0:22:42.880 --> 0:22:45.119 I'll probably get more tattoos. I'm probably not going to 0:22:45.240 --> 0:22:49.280 memorialize one of the guys competition, not to not to 0:22:49.880 --> 0:22:52.480 sidetrack too far, but pretty far. One of the guys 0:22:52.520 --> 0:22:54.680 today that I talked to it at the Squirrel cook Off. 0:22:54.760 --> 0:22:56.600 He asked him what he's gonna do if he won, 0:22:57.119 --> 0:22:59.720