Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg business Week Inside from the reporters and
Speaker 1: editors who bring you America's most trusted business magazine, plus
Speaker 1: global business, finance and tech news. The Bloomberg Business Week
Speaker 1: Podcast with Carol Messer and Tim Stenebek from Bloomberg Radio.
Speaker 2: It's another big Dame which we find Boeing once again
Speaker 2: in the spotlight, this time up on Capitol Hill, the
Speaker 2: Federal Aviation Administration's top official pledging to hold Boeing accountable
Speaker 2: for any quality lapses as the agency examines the US
Speaker 2: plane makers manufacturing processes following a near disaster on an
Speaker 2: Alaska Airlines flight last month. Here's FA Administrator Mike Whittaker
Speaker 2: before US lawmakers earlier today.
Speaker 3: The events of January fifth, it really created two issues
Speaker 3: for us, what's wrong with this airplane? But two what's
Speaker 3: going on with the production at Boeing. And there have
Speaker 3: been issues in the past and they don't seem to
Speaker 3: be getting resolved, so we feel like we need to
Speaker 3: have of a heightened level of oversight.
Speaker 4: That's FAA Administrator Mike Whitaker before US lawmakers earlier today.
Speaker 4: Boeing shares they are up now, but are down nearly
Speaker 4: sixteen percent since news of the incident. Meantime, another new
Speaker 4: risk looms, a labor rift ten years in the making,
Speaker 4: and also yesterday news on some misdrilled holes on the
Speaker 4: seven thirty seven. Carol, let's get to the interview.
Speaker 2: Let's do it with us George Ferguson Bloomberg Intelligence senior Aerospace,
Speaker 2: Defense and Airlines analysts out there in OURBI headquarters in Princeton,
Speaker 2: New Jersey. Also back with us Bloomberg News Projects and
Speaker 2: Investigations reporter Peter Robinson. He's also author of Flying Blind,
Speaker 2: the seven thirty seven Max tragedy in the.
Speaker 5: Fall of Boeing.
Speaker 2: He's on Zoom out there in Seattle. All right, FA oversite,
Speaker 2: what more are we learning? And George, let's start with
Speaker 2: you about the tone and tenor of the FAA when
Speaker 2: it comes to Boeing.
Speaker 6: I mean, I think what we heard today was the
Speaker 6: administrator told us that until now it's been largely auditing
Speaker 6: and not a physical presence at Boeing, and now they're
Speaker 6: going to have an he's presence or physical presence at Boeing,
Speaker 6: and it's spirit Arrow systems. I think there's there's still
Speaker 6: a lot more to be learned here, right, there in
Speaker 6: the middle of conducting some surveys and such that I
Speaker 6: think are going to guide what level of oversight they're
Speaker 6: actually physically going to have on the ground. But there's
Speaker 6: absolutely going to be a presence of the FAA again
Speaker 6: at Spirit and Bowing.
Speaker 4: I want to bring in Peter Robinson, the author of
Speaker 4: Flying Blind, the seven thirty seven Max tragedy in the
Speaker 4: fall of Boeing. He joins us on Zoom from Seattle. Hey, Peter,
Speaker 4: just a headline crossing in the last few minutes that
Speaker 4: Boeing's key seven thirty seven supplier, that's Spirit Ero Systems
Speaker 4: to tie CEO pay closer to quality. There's a long
Speaker 4: history of Spirit Aerosystems and Boeing going back many many years.
Speaker 4: Ultimately it was spun off just about twenty years ago,
Speaker 4: close to twenty years ago. At this point, I should say,
Speaker 4: does tying executive pay to quality? Is that the type
Speaker 4: of thing that will move the needle here?
Speaker 7: I mean, it's certainly something that you would hope does
Speaker 7: change CEO behavior. As you pointed out, this is a
Speaker 7: problem that's been many, many years in the making, where
Speaker 7: many of these seven thirty seven production problems are happening
Speaker 7: is at a separate company called Spirit, which Boeing used
Speaker 7: to own, and it was Boeing Wichita and since then,
Speaker 7: Spirit has had a very difficult time keeping costs low
Speaker 7: enough and meeting the pressure to keep costs low as
Speaker 7: part of as it's positioned in a different part of
Speaker 7: the production system.
Speaker 2: Right, we do have another headline from the Spirit Aero
Speaker 2: CEO now behaving as if we were part of Boeing.
Speaker 2: Also that Boeing seven thirty seven MAX nine accident report
Speaker 2: released by US investigators, so we'll look for some more
Speaker 2: headlines on that. Having said that, Peter, this seven thirty
Speaker 2: seven MAX program, why are there so many ongoing issues?
Speaker 2: It's just because it's the dominant program for Boeing right now,
Speaker 2: or what is it?
Speaker 7: I think it does go back all those decades. It's
Speaker 7: Boeing's attempt to change its entire production system and it
Speaker 7: really lost control of the production system. This incredibly important
Speaker 7: part of Boeing that makes the fuselage was no longer
Speaker 7: part of Boeing. So when you're dealing with a different company,
Speaker 7: you have an extra layer of overhead, you have an
Speaker 7: extra layer of management, you have a lot of wrinkles
Speaker 7: in the process. That were there before, And as that
Speaker 7: headline suggests, if this company were part of Boeing, some
Speaker 7: of these issues may not have happened. You had a
Speaker 7: lot of rework happening, arguments over the rework. It created
Speaker 7: a lot of difficult coordination issues that both companies are
Speaker 7: still wrestling with.
Speaker 4: Peter, does it call into question Boeing suppliers with other
Speaker 4: relationships as well, and sort of the whole structure of
Speaker 4: the way that a plane is put together. It's the
Speaker 4: sum of its parts, and Boeing is doing the ultimate manufacturing.
Speaker 4: These parts come from all over the world.
Speaker 8: It does.
Speaker 7: And just referring to another one of those headlines, which
Speaker 7: is a story by my colleage Julie Johnson, where the
Speaker 7: machinists are asking for a forty percent raise in their
Speaker 7: next contract. That's really a result of Boeing squeezing them
Speaker 7: very hard the last time this contract was negotiated in
Speaker 7: twenty fourteen, where those workers had to take a four
Speaker 7: percent increase in pay over essentially a decade. And many
Speaker 7: studies have shown that the experience of your labor workforce
Speaker 7: in aerospace directly affects productivity and there's a strong correlation
Speaker 7: there and at Spirit, especially after the pandemic, they've lost
Speaker 7: a number of workers trying to retrain new workers and
Speaker 7: that's very costly and difficult, and it leads to a
Speaker 7: lot of work being done out of sequence, which increases
Speaker 7: the risk of quality problems.
Speaker 2: All right, we fixed our technical glitch that we had
Speaker 2: with our George Ferguson. Obviously, glitches are much easier sometimes
Speaker 2: for us to fix than Boeing. We understand that there
Speaker 2: are a lot of moving parts and a lot at play. George,
Speaker 2: of course, Bloomberg Intelligence senior Aerospace, Defense and Airlines analysts
Speaker 2: out there at OURBI headquarters in Princeton. You've been listening
Speaker 2: to the conversation here. You do wonder, you know, and
Speaker 2: we've talked with you before, George, and I just want
Speaker 2: to mention NTSB. Now a headline says Alaska Air Bowing
Speaker 2: Max nine door plug was missing the bolts. So obviously
Speaker 2: we're just going to continue to get some headlines here.
Speaker 2: When you think about this program this way forward for Boeing,
Speaker 2: it's so important, you know obviously that they get it right.
Speaker 2: But I also think about the importance as being the
Speaker 2: largest US exporter right of the United you know, how
Speaker 2: important it is for the US as a country, as
Speaker 2: a government that Boeing kind of gets it back together
Speaker 2: as well.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I think it's critically important they are aerospace champion.
Speaker 6: We want to be a competitor in commercial aerospace, commercial
Speaker 6: aircraft manufacturing. There's lots of countries around the world that
Speaker 6: want to be in this business as well. You know,
Speaker 6: the Chinese want to be in the business with Comac.
Speaker 6: They're working on coming up the curve in the business.
Speaker 6: The Japanese do a lot of subcontracting to Boeing. I think,
Speaker 6: you know, they have one of their own airplanes they
Speaker 6: were trying to develop a couple of years ago. They'd
Speaker 6: like to be in the business. The Brazilians have their
Speaker 6: their aircraft. Everybody knows that it's high value manufacturing. It's
Speaker 6: good paying jobs. I think it's good for the you know,
Speaker 6: the economy of these countries build strength in their engineering
Speaker 6: talent pool, and so I think it's critical that the
Speaker 6: US maintains a lead in this business. It's a strong
Speaker 6: source of economic activity.
Speaker 5: George, help me understand a little perspective.
Speaker 2: We're good about doing that here at Bloomberg in terms
Speaker 2: of context, and I think about my dad, who is
Speaker 2: an engineer aerospace, you know, said it's probably safer to
Speaker 2: get in a plane than it is to get in
Speaker 2: your car.
Speaker 5: Having said that.
Speaker 2: When there's an accident, it really and rightfully so gets
Speaker 2: a lot of attention. I mean, how do you think
Speaker 2: about what's happening with Boeing against kind of the broader
Speaker 2: plane industry.
Speaker 5: I mean, is it like, how do you kind of
Speaker 5: put it in its place? If you will so.
Speaker 6: I mean, if you think about sort of the broader
Speaker 6: manufacturing industry. One of the ways I think about about
Speaker 6: Boeing is that, you know, I think going back to
Speaker 6: you know the speaker too, it's you know, it's this
Speaker 6: is one of those industries where people really really matter.
Speaker 6: It's not a it's you know, in the US, I
Speaker 6: think a lot of times we like to build jigs
Speaker 6: or we use capital equipment, you know, tools that help
Speaker 6: the worker build a product and help control the quality
Speaker 6: as they as we make that product. And that works
Speaker 6: really well for things like auto manufacturing, where you're putting
Speaker 6: four hundred thousand units through a factory in a year.
Speaker 6: These are not factories that are that high a volume,
Speaker 6: so it's hard to get you know, machine tools customized
Speaker 6: machine tools to pay for themselves. And sometimes a lot
Speaker 6: of the curves and situation as you're manufacturing and are
Speaker 6: really hard you know, to get access to. So it's
Speaker 6: hard for a machine tool there too. Actually, you know,
Speaker 6: the Spirit CEO talked about that today on the call.
Speaker 6: So it comes down to having really skilled people on
Speaker 6: the line that can do the job, and that means
Speaker 6: you have to build into them, you have to train them.
Speaker 6: You also have to make sure they're strong supervision of them.
Speaker 6: And I think before the pandemic we had enough of
Speaker 6: the older talent pool in aerospace manufacturing that we maybe
Speaker 6: we didn't need as much supervision, Maybe we didn't need
Speaker 6: as much training because they've been there for years and
Speaker 6: years and years. That's turned over since then, and so
Speaker 6: now that old playbook doesn't work anymore. Plus a lot
Speaker 6: more of this supply chain is going international, and now
Speaker 6: you know, these companies have to control for what's coming
Speaker 6: out of out of factories in Malaysia and in Korea
Speaker 6: and in Japan.
Speaker 4: Come a lot more complex. Yeah, it is a lot
Speaker 4: more complex. It's something that we've spoken a lot about,
Speaker 4: especially now that these engineers. If you're interested in this
Speaker 4: type of thing. You're not just going to go look
Speaker 4: at Boeing as a place to work after college. You
Speaker 4: could go work for SpaceX, you could go work for
Speaker 4: Blue Origin, you could go work for many of the
Speaker 4: number of companies down in southern California that are doing
Speaker 4: really interesting stuff. Boeing has a lot of competition for talent. Hey, Peter,
Speaker 4: I want to bring you back in here and just
Speaker 4: talk a little bit about the defense portion of Boeing
Speaker 4: and how that kind of changes the story. Last year,
Speaker 4: Boeing brought in twenty five billion dollars in revenue from defense,
Speaker 4: space and security. It's an absolutely huge government contractor how
Speaker 4: does that change the story about the way lawmakers are
Speaker 4: thinking about Boeing and what it needs to do to
Speaker 4: dig itself out of this hole.
Speaker 7: Well, I mean, you could make an argument that it's
Speaker 7: too big to fail. It's so critical to the military
Speaker 7: and to you know, as George was saying to the
Speaker 7: industrial base of the country, that there needs to be
Speaker 7: a solution of some kind worked out. And it's especially
Speaker 7: telling that Boeing moved its headquarters to Arlington, Virginia, which
Speaker 7: which perhaps shows where it expects to be spending a
Speaker 7: lot of its time and resources in coming years.
Speaker 2: All right, So then the story on the Bloomberg about
Speaker 2: you know kind of one of the next risks for
Speaker 2: Boeing specifically is a fight with its largest union, you know,
Speaker 2: long in the making. So George, you know, they're looking
Speaker 2: for forty percent pay raises. They're willing it sounds like
Speaker 2: to go on strike. They don't want to do it.
Speaker 2: But are they right in these pay demands? And how
Speaker 2: does that kind of squeeze Boeing even more?
Speaker 6: I mean, look, labor is getting these kind of increases,
Speaker 6: you know, at other places besides Boeing, Spirit Aerosystems. Labor
Speaker 6: already got their increase as well. They live in an
Speaker 6: environment that was much more inflationary. They've gone through a
Speaker 6: patch of inflation that's raised prices, you know, compared to
Speaker 6: pre pandemic, and so I do think they deserve it.
Speaker 6: And you know, these contracts only come up every so often.
Speaker 6: Like you said, it's been a decade in the making.
Speaker 6: So their union leaders aren't going to walk away from
Speaker 6: an increase here just because Boeing is having some challenges.
Speaker 6: Those workers can go other places, like you said, there's
Speaker 6: other aerospace manufacturers they can go to there's tech companies
Speaker 6: up in the in the Northwest. You know, those workers
Speaker 6: need to get paid what the you know, what the
Speaker 6: prevailing rate is, and yeah, they deserve it and they're
Speaker 6: they're probably going to get it.
Speaker 2: Peter, come on in on the labor issue and what
Speaker 2: you think that might mean for Boeing going forward.
Speaker 7: You could argue that the leverage is in the union's hands.
Speaker 7: This time in twenty fourteen, it was very low inflation.
Speaker 7: Boeing had the work for the Triple seven X which
Speaker 7: it was threatening to move out of state, and that
Speaker 7: was seen as a real serious risk to many people
Speaker 7: in the union, so they, you know, sort of grudgingly
Speaker 7: went along with the package. Now, you know, Boeing critically
Speaker 7: needs these workers to dig itself out of this hole.
Speaker 7: So it's it's it's hard to see this not leading
Speaker 7: to the union having a lot of leverage in these talks.
Speaker 2: Hey guys, one last question, just got about forty five
Speaker 2: to fifty seconds left here, George, overhang of this when
Speaker 2: I don't know, how are you looking at it? Is
Speaker 2: this going to be six months from now we're still
Speaker 2: talking about this or six months do you think Boeing
Speaker 2: will have turned the corner just quickly.
Speaker 6: Well, I think the costs are going to last for
Speaker 6: a while, and you know, the quality needs to be
Speaker 6: fixed long term. So we'll be talking about this in
Speaker 6: six months, Peter.
Speaker 5: Come on in on that as well.
Speaker 7: I also expect to be talking about this in six
Speaker 7: months that the union contract expires in September.
Speaker 5: Peter, I think there's a second book here.
Speaker 2: I'm just going to say, guys, certainly a story that
Speaker 2: is an important one and one that we continue to
Speaker 2: really appreciate your input. Bloomberg Intelligence Senior Airpit, Space, Events
Speaker 2: and Airlines analyst, George Ferguson out there on BI headquarters
Speaker 2: in Princeton. Peter Robison, Robinson, excuse me, Bloomberg News Projects
Speaker 2: and Investigations reporter, author of Flying Blind.
Speaker 4: And if you are just joining us, we should not
Speaker 4: a headline just crossing the Bloomberg terminal. The Boeing seven
Speaker 4: thirty seven Max in Alaska air accident back on January
Speaker 4: fifth was missing bolts. For bolts that acted as a
Speaker 4: fail safe mechanism to hold a paine in place weren't
Speaker 4: installed on the Boeing seven thirty seven Max nine jet.
Speaker 4: That's according to a preliminary report from the National Transportation
Speaker 4: Safety Board.
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Speaker 4: Well, small businesses the backbone of the US economy. Government
Speaker 4: data shows that these companies account for two of every
Speaker 4: three jobs that have been added in the past twenty
Speaker 4: five years.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's important and the most reading or the most
Speaker 2: recent reading, I should say, on the small business community.
Speaker 2: It found that US small business optimism ticked up to
Speaker 2: a five month high in December, largely reflecting less pessimism
Speaker 2: around sales, earnings trends and economic expectations. That reading just
Speaker 2: about one month ago. We're going to get another read
Speaker 2: a US small business optimism about one week from today.
Speaker 2: But we actually are going to get one in just
Speaker 2: about five seconds.
Speaker 4: That's because our next guest is a member of that
Speaker 4: all important engine of the US economy. Very pleased to
Speaker 4: have back with us, Christina Stemble. She's founder of farm
Speaker 4: Girl Flowers. It's a business that if you're a listener
Speaker 4: of viewer of the program, you certainly know it. Well,
Speaker 4: it's also a business that she bootstrapped some twelve years
Speaker 4: ago and is built into a thirty million dollar business.
Speaker 4: She's joining us here in the Bloomberg Interactive Brokers studio. Christina,
Speaker 4: Welcome back to New York.
Speaker 9: Thanks thanks for having me. I love talking about business,
Speaker 9: the business of flowers.
Speaker 4: Well, how is he here? How is the business of flowers?
Speaker 4: How is your world right now?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 9: I mean we're gearing up for Valentine's Day, which is
Speaker 9: always a lot of pressure. You know, it's the second
Speaker 9: largest holiday of the year for us, so there's a
Speaker 9: lot of anticipation.
Speaker 4: Remind us what percentage of your revenue comes from just
Speaker 4: Valentine's Day.
Speaker 9: It's lower than you think. It's about fifteen percent, but
Speaker 9: Mother's Day goes up to about twenty percent.
Speaker 4: Okay, so that's five thirty five percent of all of
Speaker 4: your revenue from two different days.
Speaker 10: Yes, in two weeks.
Speaker 5: Basically are those the two biggest holidays?
Speaker 8: Yes?
Speaker 5: Absolutely?
Speaker 2: All right, So okay, a favor like back out the
Speaker 2: holiday stuff because right, there's expectations around that.
Speaker 5: But in general, when you look at the US.
Speaker 2: Consumer, how have they been ordering just kind of on
Speaker 2: every other day or just normal days, if you will.
Speaker 9: Normal days are down. I wish I had the optimism
Speaker 9: that the reports are showing right now and that I think.
Speaker 9: I think I'm optimistic about next year, So I think
Speaker 9: maybe that's where something's coming from. Like you know, after COVID,
Speaker 9: post COVID, I think that there's been so much change constantly,
Speaker 9: and like, you know, where are we going to settle out?
Speaker 9: And I think, you know the economy right now, we're
Speaker 9: in a gifting market, so the gifting holidays are especially
Speaker 9: important for us. We have to do really well in
Speaker 9: those gifting holidays because the everyday consumer isn't isn't consuming
Speaker 9: as much, they aren't sending as many gifts since we're
Speaker 9: in the gifting space.
Speaker 4: When did you notice this change?
Speaker 9: I mean twenty twenty one. I mean we've been going
Speaker 9: since twenty twenty one on this, so you know we were.
Speaker 4: Jumping the size finding since twenty twenty.
Speaker 9: One, Yes we have, but intentionally so we could still
Speaker 9: mean intentional intentionally we're focusing.
Speaker 5: You know, I'm really.
Speaker 9: Excited to see the market change a bit from growth
Speaker 9: at all costs, you know, all like small businesses, startups,
Speaker 9: everything they ay was all about growth at all costs.
Speaker 9: Just have those top line revenue numbers grow exceedingly fast.
Speaker 9: And now we're focused on profitability. So and I feel
Speaker 9: like everybody has kind of changed their ways a little
Speaker 9: bit since we're bootstrapped.
Speaker 3: What is it?
Speaker 7: Wait?
Speaker 5: What is it that Zuckerberg says? The Year of efficiency?
Speaker 9: Yeah, but I mean it's carrying, it's bleeding into this
Speaker 9: definitely with layoffs you see still happening, you know, at
Speaker 9: a pretty rapid rate. People are you know, it's it's
Speaker 9: you have to be efficient. You have to run very
Speaker 9: efficiently to make you know, make any profit this year.
Speaker 2: Remind us about your staffing and your supply chain, Like,
Speaker 2: give us an idea of what that picture is.
Speaker 9: Our supply chain has changed four times since twenty twenty,
Speaker 9: so we are constantly changing it to adapt with what
Speaker 9: the market demands are and supply chain availability is. So
Speaker 9: twenty twenty we had a boom. You know, we're over
Speaker 9: sixty million and twenty twenty is you know.
Speaker 2: I said flowers during the pandemic. Yes, yea, yeah, and
Speaker 2: we all probably did. And people to send I know,
Speaker 2: I know you can send flower bread, wait, bake bread.
Speaker 5: Baked bread, drink wine, send flowers.
Speaker 9: Wine, souredough and flowers, sotead of this. That was the year, right,
Speaker 9: So I think you know there was that, but supply
Speaker 9: chain was really hard, so then you have to shift
Speaker 9: and go closer to the flowers. We're buying a lot
Speaker 9: more in North America at that time. Now we still
Speaker 9: are buying more North America closer to home.
Speaker 4: Was that because planes weren't coming so sore they're not.
Speaker 4: These are not planes that are exclusively filled with flowers.
Speaker 4: These are planes that sometimes have people on them, yes,
Speaker 4: And it's hard to shift this stuff if those planes
Speaker 4: aren't flying.
Speaker 9: Absolutely, So unless you're going to charter a plane from Europe,
Speaker 9: you know, when there weren't as many planes going twenty twenty,
Speaker 9: you would have to figure out other ways to get flowers,
Speaker 9: you know too, So we were literally in box trucks
Speaker 9: picking up flowers that time, you know. And then you
Speaker 9: know things have shifted. Supply chain's gotten better, but everything's
Speaker 9: gotten more expensive. So then you're also you know, outbound transportation,
Speaker 9: you know, went from about twenty six percent of our
Speaker 9: revenue to forty one percent, right, spike really just you know,
Speaker 9: I would let you know, I guess I don't know
Speaker 9: if I should say those, but I think it's also
Speaker 9: linked to stock prices for those companies in twenty twenty.
Speaker 9: If you look at those for you can you know.
Speaker 2: Go there, because I've stations with some publicly held companies
Speaker 2: as well, and just talking about prices like why are
Speaker 2: they still so high, and smart people scratching their head
Speaker 2: and just wondering where the folks are keeping prices high
Speaker 2: because they can.
Speaker 9: I mean, I think that things have gotten more expensive.
Speaker 9: Labor is a lot more expensive, so I mean I
Speaker 9: know that personally for with the our company, so I
Speaker 9: can imagine at the transporation companies it's the same when
Speaker 9: you're paying a lot more than you were a couple
Speaker 9: of years ago, where you know, wages have inflated much
Speaker 9: quicker than they did in previous you know, decades, So
Speaker 9: you know that has to be reflected. And I think,
Speaker 9: you know, American consumers have been taught by certain large
Speaker 9: companies that shipping should be free, but it's not free,
Speaker 9: and you know that that good good has to pass
Speaker 9: a lot of people's hands and a lot of trucks
Speaker 9: and auto planes and.
Speaker 4: Aut of gas, especially if you're shipping something that's perishable
Speaker 4: and that has to get to a destination within a
Speaker 4: certain amount of time or else it's not going to
Speaker 4: look or smell as good labor market.
Speaker 5: Can you find all the workers you want?
Speaker 7: No?
Speaker 9: You know I should say yes, But you pay more,
Speaker 9: You pay a lot more for the same same job.
Speaker 2: I have wages gone up as a cost of doing
Speaker 2: business for you guys, I would say about thirty percent.
Speaker 9: Okay, you know, twenty five to thirty.
Speaker 4: Percent since twenty twenty.
Speaker 9: I think, yeah, it started in twenty twenty and it's
Speaker 9: continued to rise. I also think professional labor has gone
Speaker 9: up as well. It's not just wage level that's gone
Speaker 9: up in prices. Also, working from home, I think productivity
Speaker 9: is in question sometimes.
Speaker 10: A little bit.
Speaker 5: It's harder.
Speaker 9: It's just not that you know, people aren't working, it's
Speaker 9: just really it's not efficient. You have to have six
Speaker 9: meetings to get things done that would take one.
Speaker 4: Is that what you're doing at Farm Grow Flowers? Are
Speaker 4: you hybrid? Are you remote?
Speaker 9: We are remote mostly. I mean in facilities people are working,
Speaker 9: but remote for a professional level.
Speaker 4: Okay, oh go ahead.
Speaker 2: I'm just gonna say, while we're talking higher cost, how
Speaker 2: much of pricing or the pricing pressures you are feeling
Speaker 2: as a business owner. How much can you pass on
Speaker 2: to consumers or are you are you kind of swallowing
Speaker 2: a lot of it?
Speaker 10: It both.
Speaker 9: So we have raised our prices in some things, you know,
Speaker 9: our core product offerings. We haven't raised those prices in
Speaker 9: three years. We're probably going to need to because our
Speaker 9: margins are just so tight. But American consumers also know
Speaker 9: they're hurting right now. When you it's eight dollars for
Speaker 9: a dozen eggs, you know they can't spend as much.
Speaker 9: So it's also making sure you don't price yourself.
Speaker 4: Well, Cristis have gone down, have they? Yeah, egg prices.
Speaker 9: Okay, seven ninety nine.
Speaker 4: But oh you got to stop somewhere else.
Speaker 9: Yeah, maybe the free range thing.
Speaker 7: I don't know.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, in the Bay Area.
Speaker 10: I'm in Washington.
Speaker 5: Okay, my eggs that were in prison like that. I'm
Speaker 5: just kidding, quitting job. I don't want the email that
Speaker 5: I'm going to get.
Speaker 4: Okay, now, okay, so let's talk a little bit about
Speaker 4: we were talking about your supply chain here. Fast forward
Speaker 4: to twenty twenty four. Where are you getting your flowers?
Speaker 8: Now?
Speaker 9: All over North America, South America, Europe, mostly I would say,
Speaker 9: I need to do an audit to see what the
Speaker 9: percentage is. I would say it's over fifty percent US,
Speaker 9: but slightly so it's about half and half probably, So you.
Speaker 2: Think just like kind of I mean, we talk about
Speaker 2: this with everybody, this idea of kind of pushing back
Speaker 2: against globalization or just having kind of near shoring unshoring.
Speaker 2: It makes sense and probably will continue. Do you think
Speaker 2: or if all of a sudden it makes sense to
Speaker 2: buy outside.
Speaker 10: You will absolutely.
Speaker 9: I mean, you know, you can't get enough flowers in
Speaker 9: the US of all the type varieties you need, So
Speaker 9: it's just there's a sourcing shortage of certain varieties. Also,
Speaker 9: you know, gas prices heating greenhouses in certain areas, especially
Speaker 9: you know on the East Coast, the heat of greenhouse
Speaker 9: is way more expensive than importing those flowers, and so
Speaker 9: the farmers know that and they just don't heat them
Speaker 9: through you know, certain months, and so you have to
Speaker 9: subsidize certain.
Speaker 10: Times of year.
Speaker 4: Hey, real quick, you bootstrapped this company. You have funded
Speaker 4: it yourself, partly because a lot of vcs passed on
Speaker 4: this company. What's the exit plan for you?
Speaker 10: That's a good question.
Speaker 9: We should talk about that for a long time. You know,
Speaker 9: I built it to sell. I don't know that that's the
Speaker 9: trajectory anymore for us. So we'll see, you know, building
Speaker 9: a long term sustainable business. There's nothing wrong with that though,
Speaker 9: and we don't talk about that. It's not like the sexy,
Speaker 9: cool thing to talk about in all the magazines.
Speaker 4: But that's I think that's because so many of these
Speaker 4: businesses are venture backed and they have investors breathing down
Speaker 4: their neck saying, you know, we need our return absolutely.
Speaker 9: I actually feel like we're extremely fortunate right now to
Speaker 9: not have that happening. You know a lot of my
Speaker 9: friends that are CEOs that have that same story. You know,
Speaker 9: they are being forced to show some growth numbers or
Speaker 9: at least a flat year, and our goal is a
Speaker 9: flat year this year with profit, you know, but there's
Speaker 9: no path to profitability. Like overnight, they were like expected
Speaker 9: to make mom jeans and the low writers again like right,
Speaker 9: you can't do that, right, and so like they're like,
Speaker 9: you know, growth at all costs, growth at all costs.
Speaker 5: Now profitability?
Speaker 10: Well, you know, we've always had to be profit was.
Speaker 2: It the owner of froone that we talked about that
Speaker 2: kin've had investor money come in and then kind of
Speaker 2: the business got away, and then he got back from
Speaker 2: nay check. It's more involved in it. So well, when
Speaker 2: you know or whatever or whatever the next.
Speaker 5: Stage to just come back, ye, come back in New York.
Speaker 9: I mean we might be a long term business.
Speaker 10: I might get here from I would say.
Speaker 2: Your workers and your supply chain would appreciate that, no
Speaker 2: doubt about it.
Speaker 5: Good luck on this Valentine's Day.
Speaker 9: Thank you, thank you so much, so appreciate it having me.
Speaker 2: Christina's Denbel, founder and CEO of farm Girl Flowers.
Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Business. Wait inside from the reporters and
Speaker 1: editors who bring you America's most trusted business magazine plus
Speaker 1: global business finance and tech news. As it happened Bloomberg
Speaker 1: Business Week with Carol Messer and Tim Stenebek on Bloomberg Radio.
Speaker 2: All Right, we've got a new stock on our mind
Speaker 2: on this Tuesday, February six, and that's Forward four chairs
Speaker 2: off their highs in the aftermarket, but still up about
Speaker 2: seven point three percent. This as the company beats profit expectations.
Speaker 2: He's more earnings growth ahead. And listen, they gave an outlook, right,
Speaker 2: they didn't say we're backing off of it. They gave it,
Speaker 2: and it was well above with the street was expecting.
Speaker 4: Yeah, ten to twelve billion dollars before interest in taxes.
Speaker 4: That compares with ten point four billion on that basis
Speaker 4: in twenty twenty three. The result was on the high
Speaker 4: end of the ten to ten point five billion dollars
Speaker 4: that the company predicted back in November that Carol was
Speaker 4: when at lowered guidance following a six week strike by
Speaker 4: the UAW.
Speaker 2: All right, let's see what Ivan fin Seth has to say,
Speaker 2: Senior partner at CEO over at Tigris Financial Partners.
Speaker 5: He's on Zooba in New York City.
Speaker 2: All right, what say you, I've in terms of what
Speaker 2: we just got from Ford cost investors certainly like it.
Speaker 2: In the aftermarket here, stock still up about seven percent.
Speaker 8: Well, we got a lot of positive macro trends for
Speaker 8: the auto industry. One jobs, jobs, jobs, The job numbers
Speaker 8: continue to be great, which means people are working, and
Speaker 8: when you're working, you need a car to commute to
Speaker 8: work and you have money to buy a car. Number Two,
Speaker 8: we still have a significant pent up demand cycle that
Speaker 8: has come from both the recent UAW strike and the
Speaker 8: shutdown in production that we experienced during the pandemic that
Speaker 8: the industry really has not yet to recover from, but
Speaker 8: is ramping up production. So you got strong demand, you
Speaker 8: got consumers able to buy cars, and you got GM
Speaker 8: and Ford. Yeah, both have a significant cash calms in
Speaker 8: their truck business, which are the best selling vehicles that.
Speaker 4: They make strong demand for. What though strong demand for
Speaker 4: internal combustion engine vehicles like the classic F one fifty,
Speaker 4: like the Ford Bronco, or demand for evs the.
Speaker 8: Ford Brock Broncos still very strong the F one fifty
Speaker 8: And while consumers and the industry does want to make
Speaker 8: the transition to EV, unfortunately we need this middle stepping
Speaker 8: stone of the hybrid cars that are both you know,
Speaker 8: gas EV powered. As the charge the nationwide nationwide charging
Speaker 8: network ramps up.
Speaker 2: I've been hanging on for a second. Just a headline
Speaker 2: Crossing Shares a snapper down about nineteen twenty percent here
Speaker 2: in the aftermarket.
Speaker 4: Coy's meaning crushed.
Speaker 2: The company coming out with an update saying it's he
Speaker 2: his first quarter revenue one point one billion to one
Speaker 2: point fourteen billion. The estimate on the street is one
Speaker 2: point eleven billion. She he's a first quarter just a
Speaker 2: even a loss of fifty five to ninety five million,
Speaker 2: much more than what the street has been thinking about
Speaker 2: the estimate loss of thirty two point seven million. Also
Speaker 2: talking about fourth quarter daily active users four hundred and
Speaker 2: fourteen million versus an estimate of four hundred and eleven
Speaker 2: point fifty nine million, So that's a little bit better
Speaker 2: than forecasts. But that outlook and really that first quarter
Speaker 2: adjusted ebit a loss has got to be worrying investors.
Speaker 4: Yeah, what's interesting though, is it beat on the fourth
Speaker 4: quarter adjusted ebit a significantly one hundred and fifty nine
Speaker 4: point one million versus estimates of one elevenking forward.
Speaker 5: I know it's like, what have you done for me lately?
Speaker 4: And I think the question is what is Snap doing
Speaker 4: or what is meta platforms doing that Snap isn't doing?
Speaker 4: Because these two stocks certainly diverging.
Speaker 1: All right.
Speaker 2: Snapshares down about twenty percent in the aftermarket. They were
Speaker 2: up just slightly on the year, all right, from Snap
Speaker 2: back to four do we go? Because Ford up about
Speaker 2: six and a half percent in the aftermarket following their
Speaker 2: earnings and an upbeat outlook and also a dividend this
Speaker 2: first quarter supplemental dividend of eighteen cents of share. We
Speaker 2: were talking about that with some of our colleagues. Is
Speaker 2: this a one time thing? Is it just to kind
Speaker 2: of appease investors until they kind of get the product
Speaker 2: mixed right?
Speaker 8: Well, I think that they both GM and Ford have
Speaker 8: a now significant amounts of returning of cash to shareholders
Speaker 8: driven by the tremendous cash flow that they have from
Speaker 8: their ice and dropped vehicle business. And that again shows
Speaker 8: the strength of their cash flow and the confidence in
Speaker 8: their cash flow, and as they have enough capital to
Speaker 8: both returned cap money to shareholders and continue to invest
Speaker 8: in their ev transition.
Speaker 2: I will say, looking at the press release, they talk
Speaker 2: operating cash flow fourteen point nine billion for all of
Speaker 2: twenty twenty three. They say solid adjusted free cash flow
Speaker 2: of six point eight billion was significantly better than the
Speaker 2: company's outlook of five to five and a half billion.
Speaker 2: Ford's balance sheet remained strong, with nearly twenty nine billion
Speaker 2: in cash and more than forty six billion in liquidity
Speaker 2: at the end of the year. I'm reading just straight
Speaker 2: tim from Ford's press release.
Speaker 4: Hey, Ivan, do we get to the point in your
Speaker 4: opinion where in the next in any time in the
Speaker 4: next few years, we're going to see the same number
Speaker 4: of evs sold as ice vehicles sold by a company
Speaker 4: like Ford.
Speaker 8: Well, both Ford and GM had predicted that more than
Speaker 8: half of their auto production by twenty twenty five the
Speaker 8: end of twenty twenty five would be ev They both
Speaker 8: kind of walk this back, But we have both the
Speaker 8: auto industry trying to move forward to increasing the mix
Speaker 8: of evs to fifty percent and eventually one hundred percent,
Speaker 8: and then bumping up against government mandates that from in
Speaker 8: many cases by thirty thirty five they will only be
Speaker 8: able to sell evs, and both Ford and GM have
Speaker 8: kind of projected that they wanted to get to that
Speaker 8: level before twenty or by twenty thirty, which both are
Speaker 8: not far that far off. So you have the industry
Speaker 8: wanting to move in that direction, the in theory, consumers
Speaker 8: want to move in that direction, and the companies want
Speaker 8: to move in that direction.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they talk about Ford model at ease wholesale and revenue.
Speaker 2: We're both up at double digit for your rates. They
Speaker 2: also say by the end of twenty twenty four to
Speaker 2: sixty percent of Ford Blues global vehicle lineuple have been
Speaker 2: recently refreshed and they also talk about hybrids and they
Speaker 2: they sold about seven hundred thousand hybrids worldwide over the
Speaker 2: past three years. We're expecting double digit hybrid growth again
Speaker 2: in twenty twenty four.
Speaker 5: You know, Ivan, We've.
Speaker 2: Talked about this on air that in terms of the automakers,
Speaker 2: you know, they're just kind of adjusting. Maybe they're not
Speaker 2: giving up on EV's, it's just the timetable maybe is changing.
Speaker 2: And then they're just kind of addressing the product mix
Speaker 2: that their consumers want.
Speaker 5: And it looks like.
Speaker 2: They are being rather flexible and that's a good thing
Speaker 2: that they can do.
Speaker 5: That Is that fair?
Speaker 8: Yes, And I think maybe that both Ford and GM
Speaker 8: were overly aggressive in their schedule to make the transition
Speaker 8: to evs, and both the market, consumers and the industry
Speaker 8: in general is not ready for full EV so they're
Speaker 8: going to have to increase and even Mary Barra on
Speaker 8: her conference call last week said that they are going
Speaker 8: to ramp up hybrid production has to help with the transition.
Speaker 8: So ideally, I think that really will meet a lot
Speaker 8: of demand because consumers want to go electric, but they're
Speaker 8: not ready to go all electric, and the charging infrastructure
Speaker 8: is not there to support an all electric auto industry.
Speaker 4: What do the what do automakers need to do? What
Speaker 4: does the US government need to do for the charging
Speaker 4: infrastructure to get there? I mean, we have gas stations
Speaker 4: on pretty much every corner in the US that's taken
Speaker 4: generations to build up. What do they need to do
Speaker 4: for the same to have the same thing for evs?
Speaker 8: Well, we need three things. Is one, the availability of
Speaker 8: the charging network, the availability of chargers, and more important,
Speaker 8: the availability of high speed chargers and the technology on
Speaker 8: board the vehicle to charge faster and for the charge
Speaker 8: to last longer and over time, you'll see the batteries
Speaker 8: will you know, go farther on a charge. You'll be
Speaker 8: able to at least get you know, an interim charge.
Speaker 8: In many cases they're talking on a three hundred mile battery,
Speaker 8: you know, one hundred miles within you know, twenty minutes. Uh,
Speaker 8: And you're going to see this network of gas stations
Speaker 8: I believe eventually evolve to a place where you can
Speaker 8: charge and then spend a little bit more time than
Speaker 8: the five minutes it takes to buy a tank of gas.
Speaker 8: You're gonna need you know, fifteen twenty minutes to charge
Speaker 8: your vehicle. That's why a lot of the gas stations
Speaker 8: that have restaurants and convenient stores and places to sit.
Speaker 8: So all this is gonna come together. I believe that
Speaker 8: you see a lot of new gas stations being built
Speaker 8: with convenience stores and more consumer services within them.
Speaker 5: They're gonna become like airports. I can see it, brother, Mack.
Speaker 8: Journal.
Speaker 5: No, but you let me drive?
Speaker 8: Oh no, no, no, no, honey, please, I'll.
Speaker 3: Excuse me.
Speaker 2: I want to drive.
Speaker 10: It's a good question to trying.
Speaker 1: This is the drive to the globe.
Speaker 10: Prong, Tim thing well by around yeld it don on
Speaker 10: Blueberg Radio.
Speaker 2: All right, everybody, just eighteen minutes left in today's trading session.
Speaker 2: It is time for the drive to the clothes.
Speaker 8: You know.
Speaker 2: Speaking of driving crazy, I think what really drives us
Speaker 2: crazy in twenty twenty four so far, Tim, this year
Speaker 2: is not necessarily what's going on the equity side of things,
Speaker 2: but it's the treasury trade.
Speaker 4: I mean, here we are driving you crazy.
Speaker 2: Well, you know we're back what we're at four forty
Speaker 2: on that two year note. We've moved down a little bit,
Speaker 2: but the last two days have just been wild.
Speaker 4: Is that ten year looking.
Speaker 2: Tenure we're looking at fourh eight, So we're staying above
Speaker 2: that four percent mark.
Speaker 4: Yesterday it was four point one five.
Speaker 2: We've been higher, right, And our own Mike mackenzie was
Speaker 2: talking about going to four and a quarter on that
Speaker 2: ten year.
Speaker 4: Yeah, he's Scott folks who he knows the folks for
Speaker 4: ready to buy when it hits When I say, when
Speaker 4: if it hits four and a quarter this cycle?
Speaker 5: And is that ultimately the peak when it comes to
Speaker 5: the tenure?
Speaker 2: All right, lots to get to not just treasuries but
Speaker 2: obviously important, but also on the equity side of things. Really,
Speaker 2: how investors are thinking in general about the investment environment.
Speaker 2: Let's get to it with Liz Young, she's head of
Speaker 2: investment strategy. It's so far she jose Us on Zoom
Speaker 2: in New York City. Hey, Liz, good to be talking
Speaker 2: with you again. How are you and how do you
Speaker 2: think about this environment? What is kind of top of
Speaker 2: mind when you think about investing right now?
Speaker 10: Yeah, well, thank you for having me. Good to be back.
Speaker 11: One of the things that I think is happening right
Speaker 11: now is, you know, we spent most of twenty twenty
Speaker 11: three looking around the corner for a recession that didn't happen,
Speaker 11: and now in twenty twenty four, it seems like the
Speaker 11: market is declaring that it's never coming. And I don't
Speaker 11: think either of them will prove to be correct. Obviously,
Speaker 11: we were already wrong about twenty twenty three having a recession.
Speaker 11: To twenty twenty four, the idea of we've already accomplished
Speaker 11: it and we have the soft landing it's occurring, I
Speaker 11: don't think that that's going to end up necessarily being
Speaker 11: the case, although today that is how it feels and
Speaker 11: that is what the data is suggesting. But the idea
Speaker 11: of the business cycle not really being over yet because
Speaker 11: we haven't started cutting rates, We've just had the hiking cycle,
Speaker 11: and we're still seeing a lot of late cycle behavior.
Speaker 10: In the markets.
Speaker 11: I just don't want investors to declare premature victory soft
Speaker 11: landing and be caught flat footed.
Speaker 3: Well.
Speaker 2: One really smart sign of how investors feel about whether
Speaker 2: or not we've got victory is what's been going on
Speaker 2: with money markets, And I think about the headline we
Speaker 2: got on February first, money market fun assets reached six
Speaker 2: trillion dollars for the first time. It's a very clear
Speaker 2: signal from the investing community, but kind of how they
Speaker 2: feel about taking on risk. What are you seeing on
Speaker 2: the SOFI platform that shows the tolerance the risk tolerance
Speaker 2: among investors.
Speaker 11: Well, you know what's interesting about the money market trade
Speaker 11: is that you can sort of slice it two different ways.
Speaker 11: You could say, in a very straightforward sense, money is
Speaker 11: going into money markets. That must mean people are scared,
Speaker 11: when I really think it's more about a rational investment decision.
Speaker 11: So if you're going to be able to get five
Speaker 11: percent in a money market, and I'll throw things like
Speaker 11: short term treasuries into that too. If you can up
Speaker 11: a five point two percent coupon on a six month treasury,
Speaker 11: why not, right, that's sort of that's a rational investment decision. So,
Speaker 11: while rates are still in this range, and as we've
Speaker 11: seen you talked about at the beginning of the show,
Speaker 11: as we've seen the ten years stay above four percent.
Speaker 11: Now there's a lot of volatility, but it's still pretty high.
Speaker 11: So money markets aren't necessarily right now sending.
Speaker 10: The signal to me, at least that people are scared.
Speaker 11: I think they're sending the signal that people are trying
Speaker 11: to make money in income generating assets.
Speaker 10: And as rates fall.
Speaker 11: Whenever the Fed starts cutting, that's when money markets start
Speaker 11: to become less attractive. But that'll be the telltale sign
Speaker 11: is if people take money out of money markets and
Speaker 11: put it into other income generating assets, or if they
Speaker 11: take it out of money markets and put it into
Speaker 11: really risky assets or growthy stocks in the s and P.
Speaker 10: Five hundred, for example, what do.
Speaker 4: You think happens to those money market funds?
Speaker 11: Well, to be honest, I mean, I'm surprised that it
Speaker 11: continues to run. I'm surprised that the balances continue to
Speaker 11: rise because I don't think that they've necessarily got more
Speaker 11: attractive since the end of last year. But if we
Speaker 11: continue on this path where the soft landing looks evident
Speaker 11: in the sense of okay, the labor market hasn't cracked, inflation.
Speaker 10: Has come down. If we were on a path where
Speaker 10: the FED was.
Speaker 11: Going to start cutting rates in March and this data
Speaker 11: still seemed good, that's where I think money market funds
Speaker 11: lose some assets and it goes into risky assets because
Speaker 11: that would be.
Speaker 10: Supportive in that environment that has changed.
Speaker 11: We have now all but priced out a cut in
Speaker 11: March and expecting a cut maybe in June. Maybe maybe
Speaker 11: it's may, but it continues to get pushed further and
Speaker 11: further out into the future. So I think the longer
Speaker 11: the market expects the FED to wait, the more nervous
Speaker 11: people will get about them waiting too long to start
Speaker 11: the cutting cycle, in which case, if and when money
Speaker 11: does come out of money market funds, it stays in
Speaker 11: some other safe haven asset.
Speaker 2: What other safe haven, though, would you expect it might
Speaker 2: go if people are really nervous.
Speaker 10: Gold.
Speaker 11: I think gold it's obviously seeing quite a big run.
Speaker 11: But if people are worried about the value of the dollar,
Speaker 11: if you see rates come down very quickly and the
Speaker 11: value of the dollar come down very quickly, you want
Speaker 11: something that's a store of value, and gold continues.
Speaker 10: To be that option.
Speaker 11: I think you might also see money still flow into treasuries,
Speaker 11: and you might see money flow into longer term treasuries
Speaker 11: if people start to get worried about the data. You
Speaker 11: might also see things like the really defensive parts of
Speaker 11: the stock market. Utilities has legged quite a bit this year.
Speaker 11: You might see utilities catch a bid. Consumer staples has
Speaker 11: seen some of that, and even parts of healthcare. If
Speaker 11: people aren't quite ready to completely get out of the stock.
Speaker 2: I feel like the world would have to be coming
Speaker 2: undone if everybody was running to the exits and throwing
Speaker 2: stuff into gold or even utilities, right Like, I just
Speaker 2: feel like it would have to be pretty dire.
Speaker 5: Is that fair? I mean, Liz, is that how you
Speaker 5: would see it?
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 11: Well, it doesn't have to necessarily be a rush, right
Speaker 11: It could happen just in sort of a slow fashion
Speaker 11: where people are slowly taking money out of something that
Speaker 11: isn't quite yielding what it used to yield and putting
Speaker 11: it into something else. But they're not ready to go
Speaker 11: all in on the risk table. So I don't think
Speaker 11: it necessarily has to be a big flood. I do
Speaker 11: agree that in order to see some huge rush to
Speaker 11: the exits out of the equity market, especially after a
Speaker 11: time where momentum seems to be pretty strong and there's
Speaker 11: clearly buying appetite out there.
Speaker 10: You would need a catastrophic sort of data.
Speaker 11: Print, or or a few months in a row where things
Speaker 11: went bad, or you would need some kind of headline. Now,
Speaker 11: of course, that's always a risk that continues to be
Speaker 11: a risk. But I don't think we've solved all the
Speaker 11: problems and we have question marks about a lot of
Speaker 11: things still remaining.
Speaker 4: Hey list, we're seeing shares a Palenteer up by thirty
Speaker 4: percent right now. We're reminded by ounmandeep Sing a little
Speaker 4: earlier that Palanteer was a meme stock, and I'm wondering
Speaker 4: if you're seeing any sort of memestock behavior on the
Speaker 4: SOFI platform that reminds you of where things were in
Speaker 4: twenty twenty twenty twenty one one.
Speaker 10: I don't think we're at that point.
Speaker 11: I think, you know, obviously, the market has seen a
Speaker 11: handful of stocks really lead the way, and it's interesting
Speaker 11: that the Magnificent seven has now become sort of the
Speaker 11: Magnificent four, and we've got a news stock in the mix.
Speaker 10: So it continues to narrow.
Speaker 11: And it's just the idea, not necessarily, I wouldn't call
Speaker 11: it meme stocky, but the idea that you've seen double
Speaker 11: digit moves in some of these names over really short
Speaker 11: periods of time.
Speaker 10: Some of those moves have happened over a month.
Speaker 11: Some of those moves happened over a two trading day period.
Speaker 11: When you see moves that big on news, that maybe
Speaker 11: doesn't justify a move that big, it starts to feel
Speaker 11: like excessive risk taking. And the thing about that, though,
Speaker 11: is right. Momentum is strong, it'll continue until it stops.
Speaker 11: And if you can call that time, good for you.
Speaker 10: But most people can't.
Speaker 5: We know the rules or what everyone has always said
Speaker 5: about market timing.
Speaker 2: Hey, Liz, thanks so much. Be while Liz Young, She's
Speaker 2: head of investment Strategy.
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