1 00:00:05,360 --> 00:00:09,320 Speaker 1: Climb Stories with Nancy Grace on Sirius XM Triumph Channel 2 00:00:09,400 --> 00:00:13,000 Speaker 1: one thirty two. The boy was found here on the beach. 3 00:00:13,039 --> 00:00:15,160 Speaker 1: How he ended up here and what happened to him 4 00:00:15,200 --> 00:00:17,520 Speaker 1: still a mystery. That a child is approximately three to 5 00:00:17,560 --> 00:00:19,880 Speaker 1: five years old. He's about three feet tall. He has 6 00:00:19,920 --> 00:00:23,560 Speaker 1: brown eyes and dark black hair. Investigators still can't say 7 00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:26,560 Speaker 1: what happened to him, who he is, or how he 8 00:00:26,680 --> 00:00:28,360 Speaker 1: got here. But he knows this kid, whether it's a 9 00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:31,880 Speaker 1: family member, a friend, daycare provider, a teacher, a next 10 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:34,600 Speaker 1: door neighbor, guide, the grocery store that's seen this kid 11 00:00:34,600 --> 00:00:37,360 Speaker 1: come in. Somebody somewhere here has seen this child. He 12 00:00:37,520 --> 00:00:40,239 Speaker 1: was found naked. What's unusual is that no one has 13 00:00:40,280 --> 00:00:42,680 Speaker 1: reported him miss missing, at least not that they've been 14 00:00:42,720 --> 00:00:44,760 Speaker 1: able to determine at this point. They've been talking to 15 00:00:44,800 --> 00:00:47,080 Speaker 1: the Center for Missing and Exploited Children and they have 16 00:00:47,200 --> 00:00:50,800 Speaker 1: no reports of a child gone missing that matches this description. 17 00:00:52,000 --> 00:00:56,960 Speaker 1: At this hour, police desperately trying to identify a child 18 00:00:57,200 --> 00:01:02,400 Speaker 1: who has washed up dead on the beach. Repeat. A 19 00:01:02,440 --> 00:01:06,840 Speaker 1: little boy between three and five years old, naked body 20 00:01:06,959 --> 00:01:12,240 Speaker 1: has washed up on Stewart Beach in Texas. I Meancy Grace. 21 00:01:12,440 --> 00:01:15,679 Speaker 1: This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us. 22 00:01:16,400 --> 00:01:21,200 Speaker 1: The child's body was discovered naked and already decomposing on Friday, 23 00:01:21,240 --> 00:01:26,040 Speaker 1: but as of right now, no identity on this little boy. 24 00:01:26,120 --> 00:01:28,920 Speaker 1: How can that be? How can a child, a little 25 00:01:28,959 --> 00:01:33,880 Speaker 1: boy between ages three and five, be missing and nobody 26 00:01:33,920 --> 00:01:37,759 Speaker 1: knows about it, be dead and no one knows about it? 27 00:01:38,280 --> 00:01:40,400 Speaker 1: Can we get a cause of death? Can we get 28 00:01:40,400 --> 00:01:43,240 Speaker 1: an identity on this child? How bad is the decomposure? 29 00:01:43,640 --> 00:01:46,760 Speaker 1: Will it make it impossible to determine who this child is? 30 00:01:47,080 --> 00:01:48,920 Speaker 1: If you can get d n A, you've got to 31 00:01:48,960 --> 00:01:52,360 Speaker 1: have something to match it too, in order to figure 32 00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:57,440 Speaker 1: out who is this boy and what happened to him? 33 00:01:57,520 --> 00:02:02,680 Speaker 1: Joining me is Joseph Scott Morgan, death investigator and professor 34 00:02:02,680 --> 00:02:07,280 Speaker 1: of forensics at Jacksonville State University. Also with me, Crime 35 00:02:07,400 --> 00:02:13,119 Speaker 1: Online editor and reporter Lee Egan, writer Crime Online, Jody Jamieson, 36 00:02:13,280 --> 00:02:16,399 Speaker 1: and Alan Duke joining me from l A straight out 37 00:02:16,400 --> 00:02:20,040 Speaker 1: to Jody Jamison, I want to first start with how 38 00:02:20,080 --> 00:02:23,280 Speaker 1: the body was found. For those of you just joining us, 39 00:02:23,560 --> 00:02:27,120 Speaker 1: a little boy's body has just washed ashore on a 40 00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:30,840 Speaker 1: Texas beach. We want to help identify this child and 41 00:02:30,880 --> 00:02:33,680 Speaker 1: find out what happened to him, Jody, what do we 42 00:02:33,720 --> 00:02:35,880 Speaker 1: know about how the body was found? So all we 43 00:02:35,919 --> 00:02:39,040 Speaker 1: know right now is that he was found about twenty 44 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:43,040 Speaker 1: ft from the water. He was naked, but he wasn't 45 00:02:43,120 --> 00:02:46,600 Speaker 1: very decomposed. Um they said the most trauma to the 46 00:02:46,639 --> 00:02:49,240 Speaker 1: body was from the surf from the sand, so there 47 00:02:49,280 --> 00:02:51,720 Speaker 1: wasn't that much trauma. Not that much trauma. But the 48 00:02:51,840 --> 00:02:56,880 Speaker 1: child is dead. Where the trauma come from? Was the 49 00:02:56,960 --> 00:03:00,000 Speaker 1: child killed and thrown into the water. Did the child 50 00:03:00,240 --> 00:03:02,720 Speaker 1: drowned somewhere? And it was, But that doesn't make sense 51 00:03:02,720 --> 00:03:07,000 Speaker 1: to me, to Alandu, Why would a child drown under 52 00:03:07,120 --> 00:03:11,640 Speaker 1: innocent reasons? And no one ever reported. The boy is 53 00:03:11,680 --> 00:03:15,160 Speaker 1: thought to be no older than five years old. To 54 00:03:15,480 --> 00:03:19,240 Speaker 1: Joseph Scott Morgan, I was trying to figure out how 55 00:03:19,280 --> 00:03:22,280 Speaker 1: he was found. He was actually found around five thirty 56 00:03:22,360 --> 00:03:26,800 Speaker 1: in the afternoon. A forensic sketch artist has been brought 57 00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:29,640 Speaker 1: on board to try and do a recreation of what 58 00:03:29,720 --> 00:03:32,720 Speaker 1: the boy may look like. I want to talk to you, 59 00:03:32,840 --> 00:03:35,960 Speaker 1: Joseph Scott Morgan, you're the death investigator. What we can 60 00:03:36,080 --> 00:03:39,280 Speaker 1: learn from this body? Can I just talk to you 61 00:03:39,320 --> 00:03:42,640 Speaker 1: one moment, Joe Scott about what we already know. We 62 00:03:42,800 --> 00:03:46,920 Speaker 1: know that if a child has drowned innocently fell off 63 00:03:46,920 --> 00:03:50,240 Speaker 1: a cruise ship, fell off a family boat into the water, 64 00:03:50,560 --> 00:03:52,960 Speaker 1: and they couldn't save him, there would be a coast 65 00:03:53,000 --> 00:03:56,280 Speaker 1: guard announcement, there would be a search for the child. 66 00:03:56,920 --> 00:04:00,720 Speaker 1: That is not what happened. The circumstances are are troubling 67 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:05,160 Speaker 1: at best, Nancy. We've got, uh, not just the body 68 00:04:05,640 --> 00:04:08,040 Speaker 1: of a small child, but we've got the naked body 69 00:04:08,120 --> 00:04:10,000 Speaker 1: of a small child. What in the world is a 70 00:04:10,080 --> 00:04:12,440 Speaker 1: child doing floating around the water out there without clothes on? 71 00:04:13,200 --> 00:04:16,880 Speaker 1: Uh and uh in kind of a kind of an 72 00:04:16,880 --> 00:04:21,440 Speaker 1: isolated area by himself. Uh. And there's there's really no 73 00:04:21,520 --> 00:04:25,680 Speaker 1: evidence around. What's really gonna be a major clue here 74 00:04:26,160 --> 00:04:28,200 Speaker 1: is what is the medical examiner going to come back 75 00:04:28,279 --> 00:04:30,799 Speaker 1: with on this particular case. There's all kinds of things 76 00:04:30,839 --> 00:04:34,760 Speaker 1: that could have happened, Uh, a kind of head trauma. 77 00:04:34,880 --> 00:04:37,080 Speaker 1: Maybe we would look for things like a prompt injury 78 00:04:37,120 --> 00:04:39,600 Speaker 1: from a boat. Uh. Lord only knows what's going on. 79 00:04:39,640 --> 00:04:42,640 Speaker 1: And I think that as time goes by, medical examiner 80 00:04:42,680 --> 00:04:44,880 Speaker 1: is going to give us more information. You know, no offense, 81 00:04:45,040 --> 00:04:48,440 Speaker 1: Joe Scott Morrigan, but I'm looking for more from you beside, 82 00:04:48,839 --> 00:04:52,480 Speaker 1: the Lord only knows what's going on. That is true, 83 00:04:52,600 --> 00:04:56,320 Speaker 1: and that's a given in every scenario. But we have 84 00:04:56,440 --> 00:04:59,320 Speaker 1: been given the brains to figure out a few things 85 00:04:59,360 --> 00:05:01,640 Speaker 1: on our own, Joe Scott. And let's start with the 86 00:05:01,680 --> 00:05:04,560 Speaker 1: fact that this child has not reported missing. Let's start 87 00:05:04,600 --> 00:05:08,400 Speaker 1: with the fact that no drowning has been reported. Okay, 88 00:05:08,520 --> 00:05:11,680 Speaker 1: Let's start with the fact that the body it's already decomposing, 89 00:05:11,760 --> 00:05:14,440 Speaker 1: so that gives me a timeline. Let's go with the 90 00:05:14,480 --> 00:05:18,039 Speaker 1: fact that he's naked, as you pointed out. So all 91 00:05:18,200 --> 00:05:23,760 Speaker 1: that together is telling me homicide. A child doesn't fall 92 00:05:23,800 --> 00:05:29,320 Speaker 1: into the water naked, not get reported missing or at sea, 93 00:05:29,800 --> 00:05:34,719 Speaker 1: and then wash up by innocent reasons. Now, is anybody 94 00:05:34,760 --> 00:05:37,800 Speaker 1: on this serious program right now that disagrees with that? 95 00:05:38,360 --> 00:05:43,840 Speaker 1: Can you think of any scenario, any innocent scenario, Joe 96 00:05:43,880 --> 00:05:48,760 Speaker 1: Scott Morgan that says innocent scenario? No, No, And I 97 00:05:48,800 --> 00:05:51,000 Speaker 1: think one of one of the things that my mind 98 00:05:51,040 --> 00:05:52,919 Speaker 1: kind of flies to with this is this, is this 99 00:05:52,960 --> 00:05:55,599 Speaker 1: a body of a child that has been dumped? Uh, 100 00:05:55,640 --> 00:05:57,920 Speaker 1: you know, and why would why would the child be new? 101 00:05:58,000 --> 00:05:59,560 Speaker 1: This is one of the things that's death investigators we 102 00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:01,880 Speaker 1: would look for if someone could have stripped the body 103 00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:04,560 Speaker 1: and dumped the body as a result of some kind 104 00:06:04,560 --> 00:06:08,120 Speaker 1: of homicidal event. Taking the taking the clothing, because this 105 00:06:08,160 --> 00:06:11,000 Speaker 1: whole's evidence, doesn't it where the child is from, what 106 00:06:11,120 --> 00:06:13,960 Speaker 1: the child endured? Uh? What? What? What was the child 107 00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:16,760 Speaker 1: subject to? They've attempted to strip away any layer of 108 00:06:16,760 --> 00:06:19,520 Speaker 1: evidence or identifications that the child might have on the Remember, 109 00:06:19,600 --> 00:06:22,440 Speaker 1: you know, small child is not going to be easily identifiable. 110 00:06:22,720 --> 00:06:25,560 Speaker 1: They don't have permanent teeth, particularly at this age. There's 111 00:06:25,600 --> 00:06:27,040 Speaker 1: a real good chance that we're not gonna be able 112 00:06:27,040 --> 00:06:30,080 Speaker 1: to do fingerprints. Let me go to Jody Jamison, Jody 113 00:06:30,120 --> 00:06:33,120 Speaker 1: a for music. Sketch artist has created an image of 114 00:06:33,120 --> 00:06:35,560 Speaker 1: the boy and police are hoping to use this to 115 00:06:35,680 --> 00:06:38,599 Speaker 1: try to ide him. What do we know about the sketch? 116 00:06:39,080 --> 00:06:41,880 Speaker 1: He's about um, three or five years old. He's about 117 00:06:41,880 --> 00:06:45,280 Speaker 1: three feet tall. Um. They say he might be Hispanic. 118 00:06:45,320 --> 00:06:48,600 Speaker 1: He has black hair and brown eyes, full up eyelashes. 119 00:06:48,680 --> 00:06:51,320 Speaker 1: He's cute little thing. But that's about all they help 120 00:06:51,360 --> 00:06:52,880 Speaker 1: on him so far. What do we know about the 121 00:06:53,040 --> 00:06:56,080 Speaker 1: area where he was found? To you leave egan joining 122 00:06:56,120 --> 00:06:58,760 Speaker 1: me from crime online? What do we know about that area? 123 00:06:59,040 --> 00:07:02,480 Speaker 1: Nothing else found, No evidence whatsoever except for this little boy. 124 00:07:02,720 --> 00:07:07,440 Speaker 1: He was found off of Seawall Boulevard, Galveston Island. It's 125 00:07:07,480 --> 00:07:10,720 Speaker 1: kind of a remote area. Um, that's pretty much all 126 00:07:10,760 --> 00:07:13,600 Speaker 1: we know. There was no evidence found with him, just 127 00:07:13,600 --> 00:07:16,200 Speaker 1: just his little body that washed the shore. To Allen Duke, 128 00:07:16,320 --> 00:07:19,640 Speaker 1: I want to go over the discovery of his body. 129 00:07:19,680 --> 00:07:23,320 Speaker 1: I'm still not clear on who found the child's body. 130 00:07:23,880 --> 00:07:26,160 Speaker 1: Galveston police say it was somebody just walking down the 131 00:07:26,160 --> 00:07:29,880 Speaker 1: beach on Friday evening, just taking an evening stroll on 132 00:07:29,920 --> 00:07:33,320 Speaker 1: the beach in an area that's not heavily trafficked. Spotted 133 00:07:33,360 --> 00:07:35,560 Speaker 1: the body floating in the surfing called nine one one. 134 00:07:35,880 --> 00:07:39,400 Speaker 1: And this is what a police detective in Galveston told 135 00:07:39,560 --> 00:07:43,320 Speaker 1: reporters over the weekend as they released this sketch that 136 00:07:43,400 --> 00:07:45,840 Speaker 1: they put out to the public hoping that someone would 137 00:07:45,880 --> 00:07:49,560 Speaker 1: identify this boy. Absolutely so. The child is approximately three 138 00:07:49,600 --> 00:07:52,080 Speaker 1: to five years old. He's about three feet tall. He 139 00:07:52,160 --> 00:07:55,000 Speaker 1: has brown eyes and dark black hair. Hair is about 140 00:07:55,000 --> 00:07:57,640 Speaker 1: three to four inches in length. Um. The child weighed 141 00:07:57,640 --> 00:08:00,480 Speaker 1: about if we had to, There's a slender build, probably 142 00:08:00,480 --> 00:08:04,360 Speaker 1: about thirty pounds. He's a pretty skinny kid. Um, but 143 00:08:04,440 --> 00:08:07,040 Speaker 1: that's that's what I as farn As description he's currently 144 00:08:07,680 --> 00:08:10,320 Speaker 1: he does appear to be of Hispanic origin. UM. So 145 00:08:10,440 --> 00:08:13,120 Speaker 1: we're not exactly sure exactly where, but there definitely is 146 00:08:13,160 --> 00:08:17,440 Speaker 1: some Hispanic within know influx or influence rather um in 147 00:08:17,480 --> 00:08:26,520 Speaker 1: there for missing children and boat uh that overturned through everything. 148 00:08:27,080 --> 00:08:30,400 Speaker 1: Absolutely yeah, absolutely, I mean as soon as as we 149 00:08:30,440 --> 00:08:33,360 Speaker 1: got out there, we started searching our own missing person database. 150 00:08:33,400 --> 00:08:36,000 Speaker 1: We contacted every agency in the surrounding county, in this 151 00:08:36,080 --> 00:08:38,959 Speaker 1: county and surrounding counties, We talked to every federal agency 152 00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:41,760 Speaker 1: we could. We talked to the Center for Missing and 153 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:44,440 Speaker 1: Exploited Children to see if their database could show up anything. 154 00:08:44,480 --> 00:08:46,240 Speaker 1: And of course we contacted the Coast Guard to see 155 00:08:46,240 --> 00:08:48,600 Speaker 1: if one that they had had any reports of missing 156 00:08:48,600 --> 00:08:50,400 Speaker 1: people and to to alert them so that if they 157 00:08:50,440 --> 00:08:53,400 Speaker 1: did get any reports of any overturned boats and overboards, 158 00:08:53,400 --> 00:08:56,320 Speaker 1: any missing people, um, that they would they would key 159 00:08:56,320 --> 00:08:59,000 Speaker 1: in on on any any kind of child that might 160 00:08:59,120 --> 00:09:01,679 Speaker 1: might fit that description. Body knows this kid, whether it's 161 00:09:01,720 --> 00:09:05,839 Speaker 1: a family member, a friend, daycare provider, a teacher, a 162 00:09:05,960 --> 00:09:09,040 Speaker 1: next door neighbor, got at the grocery store that's seen 163 00:09:09,040 --> 00:09:11,840 Speaker 1: this kid come in. Somebody somewhere here is seeing this 164 00:09:11,960 --> 00:09:18,160 Speaker 1: child to Jody Jamison joining us. Jody, I'm looking at 165 00:09:18,200 --> 00:09:22,000 Speaker 1: the police sketch and they've done it in color. Now 166 00:09:22,559 --> 00:09:27,280 Speaker 1: what we're seeing is a little boy with brown hair 167 00:09:27,360 --> 00:09:31,880 Speaker 1: and brown eyes. But yet, Jody, that doesn't miss match 168 00:09:32,120 --> 00:09:37,920 Speaker 1: anyone that is missing in Texas or the US. We've 169 00:09:37,920 --> 00:09:40,840 Speaker 1: seen this in the past, when bodies are found and 170 00:09:40,960 --> 00:09:44,599 Speaker 1: the child has been murdered, the parents don't report the 171 00:09:44,679 --> 00:09:49,520 Speaker 1: child missing for obvious reasons. What are police saying about 172 00:09:49,520 --> 00:09:53,240 Speaker 1: who this child might be? At this point, all they're 173 00:09:53,240 --> 00:09:57,000 Speaker 1: saying is that they are um looking at every possibility. 174 00:09:57,360 --> 00:10:00,360 Speaker 1: The fact that he was twenty miles from the surf, 175 00:10:00,360 --> 00:10:02,600 Speaker 1: that doesn't mean anything to them because the tide rises 176 00:10:02,600 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 1: and faults. The fact that he was naked doesn't mean 177 00:10:04,760 --> 00:10:07,880 Speaker 1: anything to him because they've seen drowning victims thrown up 178 00:10:07,920 --> 00:10:11,199 Speaker 1: on the beach naked. How they're clothes pulled off of 179 00:10:11,280 --> 00:10:14,160 Speaker 1: them within ten minutes. So at this point they're they're 180 00:10:14,200 --> 00:10:17,360 Speaker 1: saying nothing. They're being very vague as they're continuing to 181 00:10:17,440 --> 00:10:21,080 Speaker 1: look for what could possibly have happened. We know that 182 00:10:21,120 --> 00:10:24,080 Speaker 1: the boy's little body was found lying in the sand 183 00:10:24,160 --> 00:10:28,080 Speaker 1: on Galveston Island around five thirty in the afternoon. This 184 00:10:28,240 --> 00:10:33,120 Speaker 1: is according to police, an unidentified caller contact to police 185 00:10:33,160 --> 00:10:37,720 Speaker 1: after seeing quote an object near the water and discovered 186 00:10:37,760 --> 00:10:40,199 Speaker 1: it was the body of a small child when they 187 00:10:40,200 --> 00:10:44,240 Speaker 1: got closer to inspect it. Now we know the Galveston 188 00:10:44,320 --> 00:10:47,920 Speaker 1: p D has contacted one of the most experienced forensics 189 00:10:48,040 --> 00:10:51,240 Speaker 1: artists in the nation and that is how they came 190 00:10:51,320 --> 00:10:55,720 Speaker 1: up with this drawing. It's by Lois Gibson, and many 191 00:10:55,760 --> 00:10:58,320 Speaker 1: people in the let me just say crime finding community 192 00:10:58,360 --> 00:11:01,320 Speaker 1: know her name very well. She rented the sketch of 193 00:11:01,360 --> 00:11:04,800 Speaker 1: the child. The little boy is three ft paul. He's 194 00:11:04,800 --> 00:11:10,160 Speaker 1: got a very slender bill with dark brown hair, brown eyes. Again, 195 00:11:10,240 --> 00:11:13,800 Speaker 1: he's between three and five years old. Now, the Galveston 196 00:11:13,880 --> 00:11:18,480 Speaker 1: p D have searched databases for missing children through local 197 00:11:18,559 --> 00:11:22,560 Speaker 1: and federal agencies, but have found nothing. Joe Scott, what 198 00:11:22,640 --> 00:11:25,760 Speaker 1: does that mean? That means that no one is looking 199 00:11:26,040 --> 00:11:29,400 Speaker 1: for a child that fits this description. Uh. The other 200 00:11:29,480 --> 00:11:32,640 Speaker 1: issue is how are they going to get this child identified? 201 00:11:33,240 --> 00:11:36,000 Speaker 1: If there's no dental records and there's no fingerprints to 202 00:11:36,040 --> 00:11:39,000 Speaker 1: be done, that's gonna lead us back to d n A. 203 00:11:39,880 --> 00:11:43,080 Speaker 1: But still, if they can, which I don't doubt that 204 00:11:43,120 --> 00:11:46,559 Speaker 1: they can. Uh. If they can harvest some d DNA 205 00:11:46,640 --> 00:11:52,440 Speaker 1: from this child's remains, and they successfully uh create a 206 00:11:52,559 --> 00:11:54,960 Speaker 1: chain that they can examine. Who are they going to 207 00:11:55,000 --> 00:11:58,040 Speaker 1: compare it to? So it's it's incumbent that the public 208 00:11:58,080 --> 00:12:01,000 Speaker 1: come forward in state that they know of a child 209 00:12:01,000 --> 00:12:03,840 Speaker 1: that is missing or this child actually resembles somebody that 210 00:12:03,880 --> 00:12:08,240 Speaker 1: they know. Anyone who is familiar with this child, please 211 00:12:08,320 --> 00:12:12,199 Speaker 1: call the tip line four zero nine seven six five 212 00:12:12,679 --> 00:12:16,960 Speaker 1: three seven seven six four oh nine seven six five 213 00:12:17,040 --> 00:12:21,040 Speaker 1: three seven seven six or four oh nine seven six 214 00:12:21,120 --> 00:12:25,760 Speaker 1: three tips T I P S. I want to pause 215 00:12:25,880 --> 00:12:29,880 Speaker 1: and thank our partners in today's program that make it 216 00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:33,400 Speaker 1: possible for us to search for answers. I want to 217 00:12:33,440 --> 00:12:37,880 Speaker 1: thank link A k C. Guys. You know how much 218 00:12:37,960 --> 00:12:41,760 Speaker 1: I love Nitro a k A fat Boy, our pound puppy. 219 00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:44,240 Speaker 1: I'm always on the lookout for fun new things to 220 00:12:44,320 --> 00:12:46,959 Speaker 1: try with fat Boy. Well, I found this incredible new 221 00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:50,120 Speaker 1: collar and it is called link a k C and 222 00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:52,960 Speaker 1: has so much more than a caller. It's backed by 223 00:12:52,960 --> 00:12:55,880 Speaker 1: the American Kennel Club. 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Save on your order with free shipping 245 00:14:05,000 --> 00:14:08,640 Speaker 1: at link a k C dot com. Leak a k 246 00:14:08,720 --> 00:14:13,240 Speaker 1: C dot com code Nancy link a k C. Thank 247 00:14:13,280 --> 00:14:17,000 Speaker 1: you for making a difference in fat Boy and my life. 248 00:14:17,520 --> 00:14:22,240 Speaker 1: A three year old little girl absolutely gorgeous. As a 249 00:14:22,240 --> 00:14:25,040 Speaker 1: matter of fact, the photo of her, I'm pretty sure 250 00:14:25,440 --> 00:14:28,360 Speaker 1: she's wearing a little dress that I had for Lucy 251 00:14:28,360 --> 00:14:32,640 Speaker 1: on Palm Sunday about three years ago. This little girl 252 00:14:33,560 --> 00:14:37,240 Speaker 1: is so precious. The moment I saw her, I felt 253 00:14:37,280 --> 00:14:40,720 Speaker 1: that she was just looking out at us, asking for help. 254 00:14:41,320 --> 00:14:44,120 Speaker 1: The little girl's name is Sharon spelled s h E 255 00:14:44,320 --> 00:14:48,480 Speaker 1: r i N, and she went missing. This is a 256 00:14:48,600 --> 00:14:53,640 Speaker 1: story her father tells. He says that at three a m. 257 00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:58,320 Speaker 1: Sharon wakes up and she refuses to drink her milk. 258 00:14:59,160 --> 00:15:02,720 Speaker 1: To punish his three year old child for not drinking 259 00:15:02,760 --> 00:15:07,000 Speaker 1: her milk, according to him, he sends her outside on 260 00:15:07,040 --> 00:15:09,840 Speaker 1: the other side of the fence to stand under a 261 00:15:09,920 --> 00:15:15,440 Speaker 1: large tree in an alley. Um The alley is known 262 00:15:15,880 --> 00:15:19,360 Speaker 1: to be infested with coyotes. Now I've looked at their home, 263 00:15:20,080 --> 00:15:24,040 Speaker 1: their home, the whole neighborhood looks like a lot of 264 00:15:24,120 --> 00:15:26,960 Speaker 1: rich people live there. This is not out in the 265 00:15:26,960 --> 00:15:31,440 Speaker 1: middle of nowhere. This is a spot in Texas where 266 00:15:32,400 --> 00:15:35,280 Speaker 1: it looks like a gated community on a cul de sac, 267 00:15:35,640 --> 00:15:38,640 Speaker 1: and then there are trees around it. If you look 268 00:15:38,680 --> 00:15:41,360 Speaker 1: at it from above, like an aerial view. When I 269 00:15:41,400 --> 00:15:44,160 Speaker 1: first saw it, I'm like, no way or their coyotes 270 00:15:44,200 --> 00:15:47,640 Speaker 1: around this crib, around this McMansion. But when I look 271 00:15:47,680 --> 00:15:51,880 Speaker 1: at it aerial style, I can see that there are 272 00:15:52,040 --> 00:15:56,840 Speaker 1: trees and other undeveloped areas where the coyotes might live. Okay, 273 00:15:56,880 --> 00:15:59,720 Speaker 1: back to what the father says. He says he sends 274 00:15:59,760 --> 00:16:02,840 Speaker 1: them be out there to stand alone at three a m. 275 00:16:02,960 --> 00:16:07,720 Speaker 1: As punishment for not drinking milk. He then decides to 276 00:16:07,920 --> 00:16:12,280 Speaker 1: do the laundry. He turns neat neck at three am, 277 00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:14,760 Speaker 1: he says, He goes back out to see Sharon in 278 00:16:14,880 --> 00:16:19,920 Speaker 1: fifteen minutes, and when he goes back out, she's gone 279 00:16:20,920 --> 00:16:24,720 Speaker 1: a frantic search in sues. I want to go now 280 00:16:24,800 --> 00:16:28,480 Speaker 1: to Dave mac joining me, Syndicated talk show host Dave, 281 00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:33,400 Speaker 1: it's taken a sudden turn the search for the missing body, 282 00:16:33,520 --> 00:16:37,960 Speaker 1: hasn't it. It has um. They have yet to confirm 283 00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:41,200 Speaker 1: that they have found the girl, but they're certainly serious 284 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:43,240 Speaker 1: thoughts in that direct. Okay, let me just break it down, 285 00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:45,760 Speaker 1: because I don't know what you just said. A toad's 286 00:16:45,880 --> 00:16:49,440 Speaker 1: body has just been found down a culvert not too 287 00:16:49,440 --> 00:16:52,920 Speaker 1: far away from this now, Unless you guys know of 288 00:16:53,000 --> 00:16:56,600 Speaker 1: another missing little girl. If I were a betting woman, 289 00:16:56,600 --> 00:16:59,400 Speaker 1: I would put money on her body has been found. 290 00:17:00,040 --> 00:17:03,200 Speaker 1: That's what I know. Lee Egan. Where was the body found? 291 00:17:03,440 --> 00:17:06,720 Speaker 1: She was standing in half a mile away from family home. 292 00:17:07,480 --> 00:17:09,399 Speaker 1: I thought, sure if they found anything else with her. 293 00:17:09,480 --> 00:17:14,600 Speaker 1: Police about saying yet obviously, Um, it's her. I mean, 294 00:17:14,600 --> 00:17:16,080 Speaker 1: I'm just gonna put it out there. They're waiting for 295 00:17:16,080 --> 00:17:18,280 Speaker 1: the off topic. Let's go into the facts as we 296 00:17:18,400 --> 00:17:21,600 Speaker 1: know them. Justice got more good death investigators joining me. 297 00:17:22,520 --> 00:17:24,240 Speaker 1: Joe Scott, what do we know about the discovery of 298 00:17:24,280 --> 00:17:27,600 Speaker 1: this body? I mean, it's her, Joe Scott. Yeah, I'd 299 00:17:27,600 --> 00:17:29,879 Speaker 1: have to think that it is Nancy. And this is 300 00:17:29,920 --> 00:17:33,360 Speaker 1: what I do know. Uh, the body, the body as 301 00:17:33,520 --> 00:17:37,920 Speaker 1: yet has been unidentified, but into my way of thinking 302 00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:40,640 Speaker 1: as a as a form of death investigator, uh, this 303 00:17:40,680 --> 00:17:44,760 Speaker 1: body has been taken and hidden. Uh you know this, 304 00:17:44,760 --> 00:17:47,840 Speaker 1: This child's body did not just accidentally wind up in 305 00:17:47,880 --> 00:17:52,320 Speaker 1: the culvert and in this in this hidden area out 306 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:54,919 Speaker 1: of sight, and it took someone to come along and 307 00:17:54,960 --> 00:17:57,480 Speaker 1: actually seek this body out and find the body in 308 00:17:57,560 --> 00:18:01,040 Speaker 1: that specific location. Right now, we don't know what the 309 00:18:01,040 --> 00:18:03,800 Speaker 1: cause of death is. That's not being released, and this 310 00:18:03,880 --> 00:18:05,800 Speaker 1: is going to be a key piece of information to 311 00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:09,600 Speaker 1: find out how this little child was brought to their end. 312 00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:15,240 Speaker 1: When you hear culvert, Justice Scott Morgan, what what do 313 00:18:15,359 --> 00:18:18,760 Speaker 1: you take that to mean? It means to me, Nancy, 314 00:18:19,040 --> 00:18:22,960 Speaker 1: that this is out of sight, it's secluded, it's blocked 315 00:18:22,960 --> 00:18:25,680 Speaker 1: away from common vision. It's not something that you would 316 00:18:25,720 --> 00:18:29,479 Speaker 1: just see walking down the road. Somehow this child wound 317 00:18:29,600 --> 00:18:32,800 Speaker 1: up in this location where they were hidden from view. 318 00:18:33,200 --> 00:18:35,520 Speaker 1: And this is gonna be key if the investigators are 319 00:18:35,520 --> 00:18:39,040 Speaker 1: gonna be pressing hard on this particular point because something 320 00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:41,160 Speaker 1: has happened to this child to bring her to this end. 321 00:18:41,480 --> 00:18:42,959 Speaker 1: I don't think that this is gonna have so much 322 00:18:43,000 --> 00:18:47,920 Speaker 1: to do with Code's as it does other people. A covert, guys, 323 00:18:48,200 --> 00:18:51,080 Speaker 1: is like a pipe, one of those big round pipes. 324 00:18:51,119 --> 00:18:55,240 Speaker 1: They go under the road, so water will go under 325 00:18:55,280 --> 00:18:58,040 Speaker 1: the road, as opposed to over the road, a tunnel 326 00:18:58,160 --> 00:19:03,880 Speaker 1: carrying a stream or open dry under a road or railroad. Um, 327 00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:07,280 Speaker 1: a watercol a watercourse, a conduit. It's a stream or 328 00:19:07,320 --> 00:19:11,679 Speaker 1: a drain. That's what a culvert is. Now tell me something. 329 00:19:12,119 --> 00:19:16,919 Speaker 1: Dave Max, indicated talk show host, I doubt very seriously 330 00:19:17,119 --> 00:19:20,879 Speaker 1: that coyotes and that fifteen minute window. The father's telling 331 00:19:21,000 --> 00:19:24,239 Speaker 1: us would have taken her and dragged her to a 332 00:19:24,280 --> 00:19:30,240 Speaker 1: watery underground pipe. That did not happen. That is not 333 00:19:30,400 --> 00:19:34,600 Speaker 1: what happened in this case. And this child was murdered. 334 00:19:35,040 --> 00:19:38,119 Speaker 1: She did not get dragged off by coyotes. Nancy. The 335 00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:40,119 Speaker 1: story that the dad tells from the very or the 336 00:19:40,119 --> 00:19:42,879 Speaker 1: adoptive father tells from the very beginning, is one that 337 00:19:42,920 --> 00:19:45,760 Speaker 1: makes it out for of course, for all benefiting him 338 00:19:45,800 --> 00:19:48,359 Speaker 1: and what he's trying to sell, the bill of goods. 339 00:19:48,400 --> 00:19:51,520 Speaker 1: The bottom line is none of what he says makes sense. 340 00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:53,280 Speaker 1: None of us as a parent would do what he 341 00:19:53,320 --> 00:19:56,159 Speaker 1: did or could justify it in any way, shape or form. 342 00:19:56,240 --> 00:19:59,040 Speaker 1: And the reason her body was found two weeks later 343 00:19:59,080 --> 00:20:01,560 Speaker 1: in a culvert is because she was stashed there so 344 00:20:01,640 --> 00:20:05,200 Speaker 1: she couldn't be found. Another thing we know. Following up 345 00:20:05,200 --> 00:20:08,200 Speaker 1: on what Dave McK is saying, Joe Scott Morrigan, what 346 00:20:08,280 --> 00:20:11,480 Speaker 1: can you tell me about a mystery trip somebody in 347 00:20:11,560 --> 00:20:14,760 Speaker 1: that home goes on. They take a trip at around 348 00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:18,480 Speaker 1: three to four o'clock in the morning. And I think 349 00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:21,520 Speaker 1: the way they're proving this, Joseph Scott Morrigan is through 350 00:20:21,560 --> 00:20:26,520 Speaker 1: surveillance video from other homes in that high class neighborhood. 351 00:20:26,720 --> 00:20:30,119 Speaker 1: The cameras are catching, uh, this vehicle that belonged at 352 00:20:30,119 --> 00:20:33,840 Speaker 1: this home traveling away from the home, and what they 353 00:20:33,840 --> 00:20:36,320 Speaker 1: believe is the car may have been gone for an 354 00:20:36,320 --> 00:20:39,199 Speaker 1: extended period of time and then returned back. If you 355 00:20:39,240 --> 00:20:42,399 Speaker 1: remember from our earlier conversation, our good friend Karen Smith 356 00:20:42,400 --> 00:20:44,399 Speaker 1: had mentioned that one of the things the police might 357 00:20:44,440 --> 00:20:46,800 Speaker 1: be looking at here is that they're going in after 358 00:20:46,840 --> 00:20:49,639 Speaker 1: the chip, the chip in the car that will actually 359 00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:52,399 Speaker 1: tell the police where this car was going, what was 360 00:20:52,440 --> 00:20:54,840 Speaker 1: going on this sort of thing as far as tracking 361 00:20:55,080 --> 00:20:58,040 Speaker 1: tracking of this vehicle, This is a big question for me. 362 00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:02,240 Speaker 1: Where was the car going? Is Sharon's body inside of 363 00:21:02,240 --> 00:21:05,200 Speaker 1: this car? Was she still alive at that time or 364 00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:07,480 Speaker 1: at some point in time was she killed? Maybe she 365 00:21:07,560 --> 00:21:09,520 Speaker 1: was killed in the vehicle and then placed in the 366 00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:12,600 Speaker 1: secluded area inside of this culbrit As you previously mentioned, 367 00:21:12,680 --> 00:21:18,040 Speaker 1: it was a maroon Accura SUV. We believe may have 368 00:21:18,119 --> 00:21:23,480 Speaker 1: been owned by the Matthews family. That's Sharon Matthews family. 369 00:21:23,960 --> 00:21:27,159 Speaker 1: I want to talk about this maroon Accura. I guarantee 370 00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:32,680 Speaker 1: you in this neighborhood, Alan Duke, everybody on that street 371 00:21:32,720 --> 00:21:37,800 Speaker 1: has got surveillance cameras and burglary alarms, burglar alarms, the works, 372 00:21:38,040 --> 00:21:41,080 Speaker 1: and if they have one camera trained on the front 373 00:21:41,080 --> 00:21:44,280 Speaker 1: porch or the front yard, it's gonna catch very easily 374 00:21:44,320 --> 00:21:47,920 Speaker 1: an suv going by four o'clock in the morning. Alan, Yes, 375 00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:51,080 Speaker 1: but as we've seen in other situations, you can have 376 00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:54,720 Speaker 1: really good security camera video, yet you're unable to see 377 00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:58,119 Speaker 1: who is actually inside of those vehicles. I'm thinking of 378 00:21:58,119 --> 00:22:01,040 Speaker 1: the miss Wait, wait, let me get it. Let me 379 00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:04,440 Speaker 1: understand that she did somebody report the Family Accurate missing, 380 00:22:04,760 --> 00:22:07,719 Speaker 1: because I haven't heard that. So are you saying somebody 381 00:22:07,720 --> 00:22:12,320 Speaker 1: else could have can stolen the Family Accurate suv, used 382 00:22:12,320 --> 00:22:15,000 Speaker 1: it for one hour and brought it back secretly. Is 383 00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:17,280 Speaker 1: that your theory? Ally, No, it's not my theory. But 384 00:22:17,359 --> 00:22:20,200 Speaker 1: you don't know who's in there, the wife, the husband, 385 00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:25,080 Speaker 1: or or maybe don't wife was asleep, right, so we 386 00:22:25,119 --> 00:22:27,280 Speaker 1: don't know. But my point is the security camera video. 387 00:22:27,880 --> 00:22:31,639 Speaker 1: Security camera video can raise questions, but doesn't necessarily show 388 00:22:31,960 --> 00:22:34,880 Speaker 1: that the father was the one driving that car. It's 389 00:22:35,160 --> 00:22:37,560 Speaker 1: you can only look at it and and and just 390 00:22:37,600 --> 00:22:40,520 Speaker 1: surmise what it is. It's kind of a guess. Joe 391 00:22:40,520 --> 00:22:44,359 Speaker 1: Scott am I either crazy one or is it Alan Duke? 392 00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:48,720 Speaker 1: Because out of that family, the children can't drive. One 393 00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:50,560 Speaker 1: of them is three and one of them is four. 394 00:22:51,160 --> 00:22:53,920 Speaker 1: All right. The mother says she's asleep the whole time. 395 00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:57,600 Speaker 1: The father agrees. That leaves one person that can drive 396 00:22:57,600 --> 00:22:59,600 Speaker 1: the car and the father unless the coyotes did it. 397 00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:02,679 Speaker 1: Some interesting conversations going in between the police and the 398 00:23:02,720 --> 00:23:05,760 Speaker 1: parents right now. Somebody got in that Maroon Accurate that 399 00:23:05,800 --> 00:23:09,080 Speaker 1: belongs to that family at four a m. Now, how 400 00:23:09,080 --> 00:23:11,639 Speaker 1: do they know that, Joe Scott, I don't know that yet, 401 00:23:11,960 --> 00:23:15,680 Speaker 1: but that's what police are saying. Somebody drove the family 402 00:23:15,760 --> 00:23:19,920 Speaker 1: Accurate and police are asking for neighbors and area businesses 403 00:23:19,920 --> 00:23:22,720 Speaker 1: to check their video to see footage of a Maroon 404 00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:27,080 Speaker 1: Accurate SUV the one owned by the Matthews family. They 405 00:23:27,280 --> 00:23:30,200 Speaker 1: police believe left the home between four and five am 406 00:23:30,440 --> 00:23:33,720 Speaker 1: the day the little girl goes missing. I think they're 407 00:23:33,760 --> 00:23:36,960 Speaker 1: gonna get digital information, and they probably already have it 408 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:39,560 Speaker 1: because if the person who took her body to where 409 00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:42,720 Speaker 1: it went had a cell phone with them, I mean, 410 00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:45,000 Speaker 1: like the air in Hernandez case, they were able to 411 00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:48,679 Speaker 1: follow his exact footsteps because of the pings on the 412 00:23:48,720 --> 00:23:51,760 Speaker 1: cell towers. They probably already have that information and they're 413 00:23:51,760 --> 00:23:56,160 Speaker 1: probably closing in to Dave Max, indicated talk show host, 414 00:23:56,240 --> 00:24:00,560 Speaker 1: joining me, did the family go to the vigil for 415 00:24:00,560 --> 00:24:04,160 Speaker 1: a little Sharon? No? And the entire community came out, 416 00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:08,159 Speaker 1: but they didn't. Why did I misunderstand these so called punishment? 417 00:24:08,560 --> 00:24:10,679 Speaker 1: Why would you order a three year old child to 418 00:24:10,720 --> 00:24:13,679 Speaker 1: stand outside by a tree at four o'clock in the morning. 419 00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:16,359 Speaker 1: Three o'clock in the morning. He was just trying to 420 00:24:16,359 --> 00:24:18,480 Speaker 1: come up with something, Nancy, that sounded right to him. 421 00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:20,639 Speaker 1: You gotta remember, he didn't report her for five hours, 422 00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:23,440 Speaker 1: and somehow, in his jacked up brain, it made sense 423 00:24:23,480 --> 00:24:25,560 Speaker 1: for him to say that at three o'clock in the 424 00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:27,320 Speaker 1: morning he tied her to a tree and then did 425 00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:31,239 Speaker 1: laundry and didn't think to notify anybody that coyotes might 426 00:24:31,280 --> 00:24:34,200 Speaker 1: have taken her away five hours earlier. Dave mac this 427 00:24:34,280 --> 00:24:40,360 Speaker 1: is their adoptive child, and Sharon has had a very 428 00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:44,560 Speaker 1: difficult life in those three short years. What do we know? Well, 429 00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:46,800 Speaker 1: we know that that when she came to this family, 430 00:24:46,880 --> 00:24:51,119 Speaker 1: she was malnourished severely. She had some mental handicap of 431 00:24:51,200 --> 00:24:53,600 Speaker 1: some type. I don't know the extent. We know that 432 00:24:53,640 --> 00:24:56,119 Speaker 1: she was not her first or her thirty six months 433 00:24:56,119 --> 00:24:59,440 Speaker 1: of life were tortured and tiring, exhausting, and led to her. 434 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:03,080 Speaker 1: We know that she was malnourished, and we know that 435 00:25:03,119 --> 00:25:07,879 Speaker 1: she had all sorts of developmental problems because of the 436 00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:11,680 Speaker 1: way she was treated in India. Her birth parents left her. 437 00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:16,000 Speaker 1: Her second set of parents abandoned her as well. She 438 00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:19,359 Speaker 1: came to the US and she would sit at the 439 00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:22,560 Speaker 1: adoption agency and there was an employee there, and when 440 00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:25,439 Speaker 1: the little girl would see the employee show up for work, 441 00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:28,800 Speaker 1: she would be waiting for hours on the steps and 442 00:25:28,880 --> 00:25:31,359 Speaker 1: she'd run to that employee and call her nanny. She 443 00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:36,080 Speaker 1: was so desperate for love. She came to America to 444 00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:39,680 Speaker 1: have a better life, to find a family that loved her. 445 00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:44,520 Speaker 1: And now she's dead. And I will absolutely not rest 446 00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:50,159 Speaker 1: until I see justice in the death of Sharon Matthews Nancy. 447 00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:53,280 Speaker 1: In the last few hours, a major development on this story. 448 00:25:53,359 --> 00:25:57,480 Speaker 1: It seems Wesley Matthews is changing what he's told police, 449 00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:02,399 Speaker 1: and according to Richardson Police Sergeant Kevin Perlick, that change 450 00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:06,679 Speaker 1: has resulted in a new felony charge against Matthews, a 451 00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:11,480 Speaker 1: charge of injury to a child, and he has now 452 00:26:11,560 --> 00:26:15,639 Speaker 1: been arrested. Let's listen to Richardson, Texas Police Sergeant Kevin. 453 00:26:17,040 --> 00:26:19,879 Speaker 1: This afternoon, we were contacted by Mr Matthews along with 454 00:26:19,960 --> 00:26:22,080 Speaker 1: his attorney. They had agreed to come in and speak 455 00:26:22,080 --> 00:26:26,600 Speaker 1: with us regarding our Sharon Matthews case. When they came in, 456 00:26:26,960 --> 00:26:30,199 Speaker 1: they provided us with some information that was contrary to 457 00:26:30,280 --> 00:26:34,440 Speaker 1: what we had previously been told regarding her disappearance. Once 458 00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:36,720 Speaker 1: we were finished, the decision was made that we would 459 00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:39,120 Speaker 1: elect but I'm sorry, decision was made that we would 460 00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:43,280 Speaker 1: arrest Mr Matthews on the charge of injury to a child. 461 00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:46,680 Speaker 1: It's a first degree felony punishable by five to ninety 462 00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:51,119 Speaker 1: nine years. How this came about just for him calling 463 00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:54,159 Speaker 1: you all agree? Yes, for the most part, it was 464 00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:56,320 Speaker 1: voluntary on his part where they offered to come in 465 00:26:56,320 --> 00:26:58,320 Speaker 1: and speak with us, and that's what they did. They 466 00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:00,440 Speaker 1: came in and spoke with our investigators and sat for noon, 467 00:27:00,640 --> 00:27:03,360 Speaker 1: and it's been an ongoing conversation for quite some part 468 00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:07,640 Speaker 1: of the day. Because it is still a continuing, ongoing investigation. 469 00:27:07,880 --> 00:27:10,240 Speaker 1: I can't get into the exact details as far as 470 00:27:10,280 --> 00:27:12,479 Speaker 1: what he told us, but what he did tell us 471 00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:15,240 Speaker 1: was contrary to what we had been previously told back 472 00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:18,520 Speaker 1: on October seven, when Sharon first came up missing. Okay, 473 00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:20,959 Speaker 1: so this milk story not true anymore? Is that not 474 00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:23,080 Speaker 1: the same story that he gave you to day? Well, 475 00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:26,439 Speaker 1: there was some contradictions to what he told us, And 476 00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:28,560 Speaker 1: again I can't go into the exact details of what 477 00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:33,560 Speaker 1: it is because it's still an ongoing investigation, but it 478 00:27:33,600 --> 00:27:36,000 Speaker 1: was not what he had told us originally. Its injury 479 00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:38,240 Speaker 1: to a child. That means any injured this role. It 480 00:27:38,359 --> 00:27:40,640 Speaker 1: is your believed, yes, but we have not made any 481 00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:44,200 Speaker 1: type of positive identification of the body that we found yesterday. 482 00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:46,879 Speaker 1: We're still waiting to get word back from the m 483 00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:49,600 Speaker 1: e's office, and once we get word from them, we'll 484 00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:55,159 Speaker 1: have a positive identification. Yes, the first charge that he 485 00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:58,919 Speaker 1: had was endangerment and this one is now actually injury 486 00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:02,640 Speaker 1: to a child. The first one was a second degree felony. 487 00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:07,320 Speaker 1: This one is now a first degree felony. Miss Matthews 488 00:28:07,359 --> 00:28:10,680 Speaker 1: was not with him. Um, we have been in touch 489 00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:14,480 Speaker 1: with her. That contact has been to try to make 490 00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:19,200 Speaker 1: identification of the body that we found yesterday. UH look 491 00:28:19,200 --> 00:28:22,360 Speaker 1: at some of the clothing, UH provide the dental records. 492 00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:24,800 Speaker 1: But as far as answering any questions about what may 493 00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:28,160 Speaker 1: have taken place or what she had told us previously. 494 00:28:28,520 --> 00:28:31,600 Speaker 1: We have not had any type of cooperation in that 495 00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:34,960 Speaker 1: regard actually been cooperating with the tear where you were 496 00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:39,000 Speaker 1: just trying to reach out to get that. They have 497 00:28:39,160 --> 00:28:41,920 Speaker 1: been in touch with us and they are working on 498 00:28:41,960 --> 00:28:46,320 Speaker 1: the dental records and right but no further details have 499 00:28:46,360 --> 00:28:48,960 Speaker 1: been provided to us regarding what may have happened on 500 00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:54,760 Speaker 1: His bond has been said at one million dollars, so 501 00:28:54,800 --> 00:28:57,680 Speaker 1: it is possible that he could bond out again. He 502 00:28:57,800 --> 00:28:59,960 Speaker 1: is in custody here at our Richard City jail right now. 503 00:29:00,840 --> 00:29:03,200 Speaker 1: I do not know when he will be booked in, 504 00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:06,720 Speaker 1: but we're awaiting that. In today's difference in in the 505 00:29:06,760 --> 00:29:09,560 Speaker 1: account of some differences, is there any change to what 506 00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:13,000 Speaker 1: Cinny was doing sleeping at the time, Well, again, that 507 00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:15,520 Speaker 1: would be some details that we really can't get into, 508 00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:17,880 Speaker 1: but I can tell you that because this is an 509 00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:21,720 Speaker 1: ongoing investigation, you're likely to see some some additional work 510 00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:24,200 Speaker 1: being done on it. There's the possibility that there may 511 00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:27,600 Speaker 1: be additional arrests, and there may be some modifications to 512 00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:29,760 Speaker 1: some of the charges that you see right now. Does 513 00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:33,000 Speaker 1: this new information from a sleep nut up with some 514 00:29:33,080 --> 00:29:36,400 Speaker 1: of the investigation. Even right, we have been able to 515 00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:38,920 Speaker 1: kind of go through what we've what we know as fact, 516 00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:41,400 Speaker 1: match that up to some of the stuff that we're 517 00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:44,560 Speaker 1: now being told. And in that regard, yes, we've been 518 00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:46,560 Speaker 1: kind of able to connect some of the dots, but 519 00:29:46,600 --> 00:29:48,680 Speaker 1: there's a lot more work to be done yet before 520 00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:50,760 Speaker 1: we can say we have a good grasp of everything 521 00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:55,880 Speaker 1: that took place. And now, in a stunning twist, the 522 00:29:55,960 --> 00:29:59,880 Speaker 1: latest in the search for American teen beauty and honor 523 00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:05,280 Speaker 1: grad Natalie Holloway where we last left off and the 524 00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:10,960 Speaker 1: search for Natalie Holloway is that bones human remains had 525 00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:15,120 Speaker 1: been found at a dig based on information received from 526 00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:20,440 Speaker 1: a confidential informant there in Aruba. Take a listen to 527 00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:25,680 Speaker 1: a renowned DNA expert, Dodger Kolkowski. When we actually took 528 00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:29,320 Speaker 1: the DNA extract and ran it through this screening process, 529 00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:32,880 Speaker 1: it came back positive. It came back human. You gotta 530 00:30:32,880 --> 00:30:35,800 Speaker 1: be kidding, No, I'm not. You say those are human bones. 531 00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:39,240 Speaker 1: There's human DNA and these bone samples. Yes, as to 532 00:30:39,320 --> 00:30:42,520 Speaker 1: which one of the four is human? Are all of them? 533 00:30:42,600 --> 00:30:44,400 Speaker 1: That's where some additional testing is going to need to 534 00:30:44,400 --> 00:30:49,280 Speaker 1: be done. So these are human bones. Human there's human 535 00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:52,520 Speaker 1: mitochondrial DNA and these bones, and that I think is 536 00:30:52,840 --> 00:30:57,760 Speaker 1: fairly significant. Yeah, I wouldn't expect the nation. And there's 537 00:30:57,800 --> 00:31:00,960 Speaker 1: even a more interesting aspect here. The test we ran 538 00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:04,280 Speaker 1: right now is designed to screen in a very broadway 539 00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:07,080 Speaker 1: just look to see if there's any human mitochondria there. 540 00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:10,880 Speaker 1: It's really interesting because not only does it align perfectly 541 00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:13,680 Speaker 1: to our standard reference sequence that we use in MITO, 542 00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:17,200 Speaker 1: there are no differences to the reference sequence. The reference 543 00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:21,880 Speaker 1: sequence was actually built on a European Caucasian DNA sequence. 544 00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:25,400 Speaker 1: Of the fact here is that that's the that's the 545 00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:34,240 Speaker 1: ancestry that we're questioning. Yeah, you caught me, boss, I 546 00:31:34,320 --> 00:31:37,320 Speaker 1: never expected all of these dominoes are tipping over the 547 00:31:37,400 --> 00:31:40,520 Speaker 1: right way, telling us that we need to proceed forward 548 00:31:40,560 --> 00:31:43,520 Speaker 1: with some testing. There's a possibility though, that there could 549 00:31:43,560 --> 00:31:46,400 Speaker 1: be somebody else there is we have a potential to 550 00:31:46,560 --> 00:31:50,800 Speaker 1: now test these this bone sequence, the mitochondrial DNA sequence 551 00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:54,560 Speaker 1: against Natalie's mother and perhaps even make a match there. 552 00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:57,280 Speaker 1: There are still avenues in which this testing is going 553 00:31:57,320 --> 00:32:00,440 Speaker 1: to yield a result that may not be Natalie, but 554 00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:03,440 Speaker 1: there's definitely pointers in the direction right now that tell 555 00:32:03,520 --> 00:32:05,400 Speaker 1: us that there is a possibility it could be heard. 556 00:32:05,760 --> 00:32:09,920 Speaker 1: Everyone's hopes were raised that this could finally be the 557 00:32:10,240 --> 00:32:15,200 Speaker 1: end of the search for Natalie Holloway. Until this, as 558 00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:20,120 Speaker 1: you're well aware, Beth submitted a DNA swab for comparative testing. 559 00:32:22,320 --> 00:32:26,000 Speaker 1: This is a graphic representation of the sequencing work that 560 00:32:26,040 --> 00:32:29,960 Speaker 1: we did on Beth's sample, and so what we're looking 561 00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:33,720 Speaker 1: at here is the comparison of Beth's profile against the 562 00:32:33,760 --> 00:32:37,160 Speaker 1: profile that we already had from the combined bones. As 563 00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:39,480 Speaker 1: of right now, we have the results of that sample. 564 00:32:40,120 --> 00:32:43,720 Speaker 1: But this profile right here, it's not a match to Beth. 565 00:32:44,480 --> 00:32:49,719 Speaker 1: It's somebody else. So we're not at the Tobolows investigation. 566 00:32:49,800 --> 00:32:53,440 Speaker 1: We notice somebody human. One of these bones is definitely human. 567 00:32:53,640 --> 00:32:57,000 Speaker 1: We know that, and if not three four of the bones, 568 00:32:57,120 --> 00:32:58,800 Speaker 1: you know they all could be. We just have to 569 00:32:58,840 --> 00:33:01,520 Speaker 1: have a couple more pieces of information and then I 570 00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:04,200 Speaker 1: can give you the truth of the matter. Out to 571 00:33:04,520 --> 00:33:09,040 Speaker 1: Dave Mack, syndicated talk show host, You and I covered 572 00:33:10,040 --> 00:33:18,200 Speaker 1: the case of a missing American tourist, Robin Gardner in Aruba. 573 00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:23,200 Speaker 1: She had gone down there in a friend capacity with 574 00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:26,360 Speaker 1: the guy she met on the internet. He wanted to travel, 575 00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:29,040 Speaker 1: she wanted to travel. So they go down there together, 576 00:33:29,600 --> 00:33:33,000 Speaker 1: not romantically linked, but they went down there to spend 577 00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:36,480 Speaker 1: time together and to just get out of town to 578 00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:40,280 Speaker 1: go have a good time together as friends. She was 579 00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:44,040 Speaker 1: never seen alive. Now, how does that factor into the 580 00:33:44,040 --> 00:33:48,560 Speaker 1: search for Natalie Holloway, Dave mac Nancy. The bones that 581 00:33:48,600 --> 00:33:53,560 Speaker 1: were found that were determined to be female European descent 582 00:33:53,800 --> 00:33:57,920 Speaker 1: that ended up not being that of Natalie Holloway could 583 00:33:58,120 --> 00:34:01,800 Speaker 1: very well be the bones of Robin Gardner. So her 584 00:34:01,880 --> 00:34:05,120 Speaker 1: sister has agreed to a DNA test to try to 585 00:34:05,240 --> 00:34:08,120 Speaker 1: prove or show whether or not what has been found 586 00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:11,120 Speaker 1: actually belonged to the thirty five year old went missing 587 00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:15,560 Speaker 1: in two thousand and eleven. You know, I know that 588 00:34:15,680 --> 00:34:19,080 Speaker 1: Robin went missing in two thousand eleven. I know that 589 00:34:19,120 --> 00:34:25,239 Speaker 1: I remember when it all occurred. And her family has 590 00:34:25,320 --> 00:34:31,879 Speaker 1: been tortured ever since she went missing. It's one thing 591 00:34:31,920 --> 00:34:34,839 Speaker 1: to read about it, it's one thing to hear about it, 592 00:34:35,600 --> 00:34:39,160 Speaker 1: But take a listen to Dave Holloway. Well, if it's 593 00:34:39,160 --> 00:34:41,560 Speaker 1: not Natalie, it's somebody else. And I think that um 594 00:34:41,920 --> 00:34:45,720 Speaker 1: and I've said this before, John has had somebody's bones 595 00:34:45,800 --> 00:34:48,640 Speaker 1: on that island, and either the a Reuben Police or 596 00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:51,200 Speaker 1: the FBI has got to get involved. I mean, something's 597 00:34:51,200 --> 00:34:54,160 Speaker 1: got to give. I mean, you just can't just have 598 00:34:54,360 --> 00:34:58,760 Speaker 1: human remains and no one do anything. I mean, I'm 599 00:34:59,080 --> 00:35:01,160 Speaker 1: I wish I could do more, but I mean one 600 00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:03,239 Speaker 1: of those two agencies have gotten get him, got to 601 00:35:03,239 --> 00:35:06,080 Speaker 1: get involved, or either the Dutch have got to get 602 00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:10,040 Speaker 1: control of the situation that somebody's got to investigate it. 603 00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:13,400 Speaker 1: There very well could be another family out there that 604 00:35:13,560 --> 00:35:18,160 Speaker 1: is missing a loved one whose bones that those belonged it. 605 00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:24,080 Speaker 1: It's very very important for somebody to do an investigation 606 00:35:24,480 --> 00:35:26,920 Speaker 1: to get down to the bottom of how did you 607 00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:29,480 Speaker 1: come up with these human remains and whose are they? 608 00:35:29,880 --> 00:35:35,160 Speaker 1: They're gonna have to man up and um they're to stop. 609 00:35:37,520 --> 00:35:45,520 Speaker 1: What do you mean stop just stop stop on looking 610 00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:54,200 Speaker 1: for Nataline? I think are I think this is probably um, 611 00:35:54,560 --> 00:36:01,319 Speaker 1: probably the end. Um. I mean, we've searched all over 612 00:36:01,360 --> 00:36:04,080 Speaker 1: the island. We just about ever ready to every lead 613 00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:08,360 Speaker 1: that's possible. I don't know that there's anything else we 614 00:36:08,400 --> 00:36:14,759 Speaker 1: can physically didn't Again, this human bone found in a 615 00:36:14,840 --> 00:36:18,640 Speaker 1: Ruba during an investigation into the disappearance of American teen 616 00:36:19,200 --> 00:36:24,520 Speaker 1: Natalie Holloway on her senior trip was tested and although 617 00:36:24,640 --> 00:36:27,799 Speaker 1: it is of a woman of European descent, it is 618 00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:36,279 Speaker 1: not Natalie Holloway. New DNA testing, however, could conceivably link 619 00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:41,000 Speaker 1: this bone to a missing Maryland woman. Robin Gardner. Her sister, 620 00:36:41,640 --> 00:36:46,480 Speaker 1: as Day just told you, Danielle says she's willing to 621 00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:50,200 Speaker 1: submit DNA for the test to just Scott Morgan. How 622 00:36:50,239 --> 00:36:53,520 Speaker 1: would that work? Well, you know, it's interesting that the sister, 623 00:36:54,080 --> 00:36:56,520 Speaker 1: as soon as this came out that this was not 624 00:36:56,600 --> 00:36:59,640 Speaker 1: Natalie Holloway, the sister says, look, I'm here, I'm ready 625 00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:01,080 Speaker 1: to falling to her. One of the things they're gonna 626 00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:04,400 Speaker 1: do is do what's referred to as a buckle mucostal swab, 627 00:37:05,120 --> 00:37:07,760 Speaker 1: and that means, in simple terms, they're just gonna swab 628 00:37:07,800 --> 00:37:10,360 Speaker 1: her gum to get a sample of her DNA, and 629 00:37:10,400 --> 00:37:12,759 Speaker 1: then they're gonna do what's referred to as a familial 630 00:37:12,920 --> 00:37:16,920 Speaker 1: DNA testing. My biggest problem with this case and Nancy 631 00:37:17,160 --> 00:37:20,440 Speaker 1: is that this bone sample, which we've seen pictures of 632 00:37:20,520 --> 00:37:24,480 Speaker 1: that was allegedly provided by Gabriel. This bone sample, just 633 00:37:24,600 --> 00:37:29,319 Speaker 1: the physical appearance of it is old. It's decayed, and 634 00:37:29,600 --> 00:37:32,839 Speaker 1: I'm really curious as to how this bone has been 635 00:37:32,920 --> 00:37:36,960 Speaker 1: treated in the laboratory when they were attempting to harvest 636 00:37:37,320 --> 00:37:41,200 Speaker 1: Natalie Holloway's DNA or alleged DNA that turned out not 637 00:37:41,320 --> 00:37:44,360 Speaker 1: to be her. Is there enough sample left to compare 638 00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:47,319 Speaker 1: and that's gonna be very compelling in this case moving forward. Well, 639 00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:51,080 Speaker 1: they had enough to extract to determine it wasn't Natalie Holloway. 640 00:37:51,120 --> 00:37:53,560 Speaker 1: What makes you think they wouldn't have enough to compare 641 00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:57,799 Speaker 1: to robbing Gardner's DNA through her sister. Well, this is 642 00:37:57,840 --> 00:38:00,600 Speaker 1: the problem sometimes, Uh, These tes us that they can 643 00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:04,440 Speaker 1: conduct on an unknown sample can be rather destructive in 644 00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:06,759 Speaker 1: the lab. And there wasn't a lot of bone to 645 00:38:06,800 --> 00:38:08,520 Speaker 1: work with in the first place, Nancy. I am just 646 00:38:08,600 --> 00:38:11,760 Speaker 1: hoping that special care was taken with the initial sample, 647 00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:14,239 Speaker 1: with that initial piece, that bone fragment that they had. 648 00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:16,600 Speaker 1: We're not talking about a huge piece of bone here, Nancy. 649 00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:19,320 Speaker 1: We're talking about a small area, and I'm just hoping 650 00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:21,719 Speaker 1: that it was handled appropriately and that they're going to 651 00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:25,400 Speaker 1: be able to harvest DNA that's in there for this 652 00:38:25,480 --> 00:38:28,560 Speaker 1: particular case, Jo Scott, Isn't it true that when you're 653 00:38:28,640 --> 00:38:34,520 Speaker 1: testing DNA that you can extrapolate, Like I know, you 654 00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:38,680 Speaker 1: can't recreate it, but somehow in the lab that can extrapolate. 655 00:38:38,880 --> 00:38:41,359 Speaker 1: If you have a small amount of DNA, they can 656 00:38:41,520 --> 00:38:44,400 Speaker 1: use that very small amount. But is it is it 657 00:38:44,560 --> 00:38:48,720 Speaker 1: in fact possible that the DNA can be used up 658 00:38:48,880 --> 00:38:52,040 Speaker 1: in testing. It's it's not so much that it can 659 00:38:52,080 --> 00:38:54,839 Speaker 1: be used up as much as it can be compromised 660 00:38:54,840 --> 00:38:57,239 Speaker 1: to a great degree. And you're right about this, this 661 00:38:57,320 --> 00:39:00,200 Speaker 1: magnification that takes place. What they're gonna do is it's 662 00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:02,839 Speaker 1: a it's a replication that they'll do. They'll take one 663 00:39:02,880 --> 00:39:06,160 Speaker 1: strand and then they'll begin to replicate it in multiple 664 00:39:06,239 --> 00:39:10,240 Speaker 1: times and will create an entire testable strand. But again, 665 00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:12,680 Speaker 1: back to what I was saying, I'm just hoping that 666 00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:15,560 Speaker 1: they haven't completely compromised a sample. And that's what this 667 00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:19,080 Speaker 1: whole thing is gonna hinge on Nancy. Uh. And it's 668 00:39:19,120 --> 00:39:23,120 Speaker 1: it's just it's it's uh, it's heartbreaking that that both 669 00:39:23,120 --> 00:39:25,680 Speaker 1: of these families are having to endure this. I just 670 00:39:25,719 --> 00:39:27,720 Speaker 1: hope that the sample will have been treated with care. 671 00:39:28,239 --> 00:39:32,600 Speaker 1: Uh that that that that it deems necessary to Dave Max, 672 00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:36,120 Speaker 1: indicated talk show host, explained to me the circumstances under 673 00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:40,480 Speaker 1: which Gardener, Robin Gardner went missing in Aruba, and to 674 00:39:40,560 --> 00:39:43,160 Speaker 1: my understanding, she is one of four Americans to go 675 00:39:43,320 --> 00:39:47,239 Speaker 1: missing there and just very recent years what happened with 676 00:39:47,320 --> 00:39:52,000 Speaker 1: Robin Gardner. Robin Gardner went to uh Aruba with her 677 00:39:52,040 --> 00:39:55,000 Speaker 1: friend on a vacation. They were last she was seen 678 00:39:55,080 --> 00:39:58,760 Speaker 1: leaving a hotel or a restaurant rather at four o'clock 679 00:39:58,760 --> 00:40:02,759 Speaker 1: in the afternoon. A court into her companion Mr Jordan Oh. 680 00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:05,920 Speaker 1: They were going to go snarkeling, and that's where he 681 00:40:06,040 --> 00:40:08,880 Speaker 1: claims that she got caught up in a stronger current 682 00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:12,000 Speaker 1: underwater and was drug out to see He then made 683 00:40:12,040 --> 00:40:14,800 Speaker 1: his way back to shore, where he reported her missing 684 00:40:14,960 --> 00:40:17,520 Speaker 1: at six pm. So four pm they leave the restaurant. 685 00:40:17,520 --> 00:40:20,719 Speaker 1: Six pm he and asks that she's missing. You know, 686 00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:24,600 Speaker 1: the whole thing doesn't hold together for me, his whole story. 687 00:40:24,640 --> 00:40:27,759 Speaker 1: But again, he is not a suspect. He has not 688 00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:31,040 Speaker 1: a person of interest. Let me make that clear. I 689 00:40:31,040 --> 00:40:34,799 Speaker 1: want to go back to a Reuben police. Do we 690 00:40:34,920 --> 00:40:39,520 Speaker 1: really think they can solve anything Joseph Scott Morgan anything 691 00:40:39,560 --> 00:40:43,759 Speaker 1: at all? No, I wouldn't. I wouldn't trust him to. 692 00:40:44,680 --> 00:40:47,080 Speaker 1: I wouldn't trust him with anything. To be quite honest 693 00:40:47,120 --> 00:40:50,480 Speaker 1: with you, and the way they're they're not that sophisticated 694 00:40:50,760 --> 00:40:53,160 Speaker 1: their ability to handle crime scenes and the process of 695 00:40:53,160 --> 00:40:56,200 Speaker 1: the evidence and where does that evidence go to be processed. 696 00:40:56,480 --> 00:40:58,839 Speaker 1: I have a lot of questions about their capabilities. So 697 00:40:59,320 --> 00:41:01,919 Speaker 1: moving forward, now they're gonna get slammed with one more 698 00:41:02,000 --> 00:41:04,480 Speaker 1: big case. I don't know how this is gonna be handled. 699 00:41:04,840 --> 00:41:07,000 Speaker 1: And I agree with you, Nancy, this idea that she's 700 00:41:07,040 --> 00:41:09,799 Speaker 1: been washed out to see it doesn't hold water from 701 00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:13,920 Speaker 1: me either, uh, and that that she would be washed 702 00:41:13,920 --> 00:41:16,360 Speaker 1: out and suddenly there would be these other remains that 703 00:41:16,400 --> 00:41:19,120 Speaker 1: are found. As we have said in the earlier conversations 704 00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:22,040 Speaker 1: between you and I, there were other missing people on 705 00:41:22,080 --> 00:41:25,640 Speaker 1: that island. It's it wasn't just Natalie Holloway. It was 706 00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:28,560 Speaker 1: other missing people that are out there. And it's really 707 00:41:28,560 --> 00:41:32,080 Speaker 1: curious that we found or that they found other human 708 00:41:32,120 --> 00:41:36,640 Speaker 1: remains at that site that did not belong to Natalie Holloway. Yeah. 709 00:41:36,680 --> 00:41:38,520 Speaker 1: I mean it begs the question, Joe Scott, it is 710 00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:41,600 Speaker 1: not Natalie, who is it? I mean, take a listen, 711 00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:45,360 Speaker 1: this is what a Reuben police have to add to 712 00:41:45,440 --> 00:41:50,280 Speaker 1: the whole scenario. Listen to them now, what about the bones, 713 00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:53,640 Speaker 1: the animal bones? What kind of animal was it? Do 714 00:41:53,719 --> 00:41:58,400 Speaker 1: you know? Just animal bombs? Okay, not human books. Is 715 00:41:58,400 --> 00:42:00,280 Speaker 1: there any reports or anythling you can give us about 716 00:42:00,280 --> 00:42:03,959 Speaker 1: the bones, No, you have nothing. That enforcement we don't 717 00:42:04,000 --> 00:42:08,359 Speaker 1: desk give reports of the third party. Can we look 718 00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:14,520 Speaker 1: at them the bones. We've got to get any question 719 00:42:14,560 --> 00:42:18,440 Speaker 1: of doubt and we got up the bulls. We we 720 00:42:18,440 --> 00:42:23,440 Speaker 1: go us. Okay, this is what's what's happened. That was 721 00:42:23,760 --> 00:42:27,120 Speaker 1: the Aribon police are saying these bones are animal bones, 722 00:42:28,280 --> 00:42:30,040 Speaker 1: but they haven't had those bones long enough to have 723 00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:33,440 Speaker 1: them properly tested. So you know, I have my doubts, 724 00:42:33,960 --> 00:42:35,920 Speaker 1: and I think what I will do is have the 725 00:42:35,920 --> 00:42:38,960 Speaker 1: bones tested myself to make sure that they are non 726 00:42:39,080 --> 00:42:42,520 Speaker 1: human or exactly what they are. I mean, Alan Duke. 727 00:42:42,640 --> 00:42:46,040 Speaker 1: That's all they've got to add. Hey, guys, after you 728 00:42:46,280 --> 00:42:50,279 Speaker 1: found a human body and you figured out it is 729 00:42:50,280 --> 00:42:54,319 Speaker 1: a one of European descent, and you figured out it 730 00:42:54,400 --> 00:42:57,439 Speaker 1: wasn't Natalie, Hey, I bet you messed up the chain 731 00:42:57,440 --> 00:43:01,439 Speaker 1: of custody. You really screwed up. That's basically what they're saying. 732 00:43:01,480 --> 00:43:06,200 Speaker 1: They've done nothing. They've been sitting with their thumbs. Well, okay, 733 00:43:06,239 --> 00:43:08,919 Speaker 1: never mind about where their thumbs are. But they've done 734 00:43:08,960 --> 00:43:13,640 Speaker 1: nothing except throwing taking pot shots at people that are 735 00:43:13,760 --> 00:43:17,560 Speaker 1: trying to solve the case. Well, the police chief in 736 00:43:17,600 --> 00:43:20,080 Speaker 1: a Ruba seemed like a perfectly nice man, but he 737 00:43:20,239 --> 00:43:23,040 Speaker 1: never bought that it was anything other than dog bones, 738 00:43:23,160 --> 00:43:26,440 Speaker 1: or at least animal bones. And so he had them 739 00:43:26,440 --> 00:43:30,080 Speaker 1: in a baggy and he handed them back to Dave 740 00:43:30,120 --> 00:43:33,480 Speaker 1: Holloway and said, look, I'll give you these their dog bones, 741 00:43:33,640 --> 00:43:35,759 Speaker 1: but keep in mind if you take them, they can 742 00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:37,560 Speaker 1: never be used in a ruby in a court of 743 00:43:37,600 --> 00:43:40,799 Speaker 1: law because you've broken the chain of custody, as if 744 00:43:40,840 --> 00:43:43,560 Speaker 1: they ever would be used in ruben a court of law. 745 00:43:44,040 --> 00:43:47,120 Speaker 1: I mean they've done nothing. I mean, help me out, 746 00:43:47,320 --> 00:43:50,920 Speaker 1: Dave mac. They put this guy in jail for five 747 00:43:50,960 --> 00:43:54,000 Speaker 1: months trying to build a case they actually could build nothing, 748 00:43:54,360 --> 00:43:57,759 Speaker 1: even though every account of Robin Gardener is that she 749 00:43:57,840 --> 00:44:01,080 Speaker 1: was a woman who would not even go underwater. She 750 00:44:01,080 --> 00:44:03,080 Speaker 1: didn't want to mess with her hair and her makeup. 751 00:44:03,520 --> 00:44:06,000 Speaker 1: And on top of that, I mentioned earlier off the year, 752 00:44:06,200 --> 00:44:08,600 Speaker 1: this guy wears a tupee. He wears so many different 753 00:44:08,600 --> 00:44:11,239 Speaker 1: types of tupa's that it's tough to identify him on 754 00:44:11,280 --> 00:44:14,239 Speaker 1: CCTV because he's constantly changing them. But you know what, 755 00:44:14,760 --> 00:44:17,239 Speaker 1: his tupai was still in place after he claims that 756 00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:19,600 Speaker 1: he had been snorkeling with her and he was panicked 757 00:44:19,600 --> 00:44:22,000 Speaker 1: because she got drug out to see a woman who 758 00:44:22,000 --> 00:44:24,799 Speaker 1: wouldn't go underwater all of a sudden is snorkeling and 759 00:44:24,800 --> 00:44:27,600 Speaker 1: a dude that wears a tupe and it's perfectly on 760 00:44:27,600 --> 00:44:30,399 Speaker 1: on his head like and perfectly dry. A little problem there, 761 00:44:31,840 --> 00:44:35,640 Speaker 1: as if I remember the case correctly, she had had 762 00:44:35,640 --> 00:44:40,359 Speaker 1: her hair done um and it had cost a lot 763 00:44:40,400 --> 00:44:42,480 Speaker 1: of money and she did not want to get her 764 00:44:42,520 --> 00:44:44,880 Speaker 1: hair wet. Do you remember that, Dave mac I do? 765 00:44:45,080 --> 00:44:47,839 Speaker 1: She had extensions and it was a big deal. Her 766 00:44:48,040 --> 00:44:50,840 Speaker 1: longtime boyfriend actually talked about that. That was one of 767 00:44:50,880 --> 00:44:53,759 Speaker 1: his biggest suspicions because she not that she was vain. 768 00:44:53,880 --> 00:44:55,960 Speaker 1: She was just proud of the amount of time that 769 00:44:56,000 --> 00:44:58,759 Speaker 1: went into the extensions in her hair. Um. She was 770 00:44:58,880 --> 00:45:01,640 Speaker 1: very particular about the a way she looked about her makeup, 771 00:45:01,680 --> 00:45:04,240 Speaker 1: her hair and everything being just the way she wanted 772 00:45:04,239 --> 00:45:06,920 Speaker 1: it to be. That's why she didn't even go below 773 00:45:06,960 --> 00:45:09,960 Speaker 1: the waist. You know, she did not go underwater. That's 774 00:45:09,960 --> 00:45:14,120 Speaker 1: why this is such a big deal. Back to Alan, Alan, 775 00:45:14,200 --> 00:45:16,799 Speaker 1: what more do we know about the testing that's going 776 00:45:16,840 --> 00:45:21,200 Speaker 1: to go down on these bones that were found in Aruba. Well, 777 00:45:21,520 --> 00:45:26,319 Speaker 1: the doctor in the US did as modern testing as 778 00:45:26,320 --> 00:45:30,680 Speaker 1: you can, the microchondrial, DNA testing, everything that could be done, 779 00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:35,000 Speaker 1: and concluded that it wasn't Natalie Holloway. So I would think, now, 780 00:45:35,880 --> 00:45:38,720 Speaker 1: Joe Scott correct me, But isn't that all digital stuff? 781 00:45:38,760 --> 00:45:41,320 Speaker 1: So if they've already done the test once on those bones, 782 00:45:41,520 --> 00:45:44,239 Speaker 1: they've got the digital profile built, so they don't have 783 00:45:44,280 --> 00:45:46,000 Speaker 1: to do more testing. Let's just have to see if 784 00:45:46,000 --> 00:45:49,120 Speaker 1: it matches this woman's family, right. I would hope that 785 00:45:49,160 --> 00:45:51,799 Speaker 1: they that they would, and I would hope that that 786 00:45:51,920 --> 00:45:54,160 Speaker 1: the fellow that was doing the testing on behalf of 787 00:45:54,200 --> 00:45:57,120 Speaker 1: the Holloway family would would see that would see the 788 00:45:57,120 --> 00:46:00,680 Speaker 1: benefit uh in in trying to help solve another case, 789 00:46:00,760 --> 00:46:03,520 Speaker 1: and that he would render this over to to someone 790 00:46:03,560 --> 00:46:05,759 Speaker 1: else to test it or to at least examine it. 791 00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:08,280 Speaker 1: I think that that's gonna be very important as opposed 792 00:46:08,320 --> 00:46:11,160 Speaker 1: to trying to go back and harvest another sample from 793 00:46:11,160 --> 00:46:14,800 Speaker 1: a bone tissue, from denuded bone tissue that's that's already 794 00:46:14,800 --> 00:46:20,000 Speaker 1: pretty well compromised. Nancy Grace signing off goodbye friend,