1 00:00:24,160 --> 00:00:27,080 Speaker 1: Well, well, well, no ole old friend. Here we are 2 00:00:27,960 --> 00:00:32,640 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History about too h about to dive into a 3 00:00:32,720 --> 00:00:36,120 Speaker 1: topic that I find endlessly fascinating. Yeah, we're going to 4 00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:38,880 Speaker 1: dive into a sea hoole. What is a sea hole 5 00:00:38,920 --> 00:00:42,480 Speaker 1: like cut cold hole? Yes? Or a cave hole? Right? Yeah? 6 00:00:42,680 --> 00:00:44,159 Speaker 1: When I say a sea hoole, it's more of a 7 00:00:44,320 --> 00:00:48,240 Speaker 1: ce rectangle. Really, yeah, because it's a it's a cave, 8 00:00:48,320 --> 00:00:52,000 Speaker 1: a man made cave with a rectangular door that was 9 00:00:52,159 --> 00:00:56,840 Speaker 1: one of the first ever homes to America's like original 10 00:00:56,880 --> 00:01:01,560 Speaker 1: doomsday cult. My name is Ben. Uh. This ridiculous history, 11 00:01:01,560 --> 00:01:03,840 Speaker 1: as I think I just mentioned, And of course we 12 00:01:03,880 --> 00:01:09,480 Speaker 1: are joined as always with our superproducer, Casey Pegram. So no, 13 00:01:09,760 --> 00:01:15,880 Speaker 1: the rumors are true. We're talking about a legitimate doomsday cult. 14 00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:19,000 Speaker 1: And you know, in another show that you and I 15 00:01:19,080 --> 00:01:22,720 Speaker 1: do together, we run into cults on a on a 16 00:01:22,840 --> 00:01:26,400 Speaker 1: like bi monthly basis, semi regular. But in Ridiculous History, man, 17 00:01:26,440 --> 00:01:30,959 Speaker 1: we don't deal in rumors. What's the brass tacks, my man? Yes, 18 00:01:31,080 --> 00:01:34,880 Speaker 1: the brass tacks take us to a place very familiar 19 00:01:34,880 --> 00:01:39,560 Speaker 1: with everyone here, known as Philadelphia. See the Cave of 20 00:01:39,640 --> 00:01:44,760 Speaker 1: Kelpius is tucked away in a remote section of the 21 00:01:44,840 --> 00:01:50,440 Speaker 1: modern day Fairmont Park in Philadelphia. But it's it's very old. 22 00:01:50,640 --> 00:01:54,040 Speaker 1: You could you could walk past it and not really 23 00:01:54,120 --> 00:01:58,080 Speaker 1: notice the history now unless you went inside, right, that's right. 24 00:01:58,120 --> 00:02:00,680 Speaker 1: In fact, a lot of places that describe it say, 25 00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:03,720 Speaker 1: even if you know where you're going, you're probably a 26 00:02:03,760 --> 00:02:06,560 Speaker 1: lot less likely to find it rather than just stumble 27 00:02:06,680 --> 00:02:09,360 Speaker 1: upon it, because it is in like a heavily wooded, 28 00:02:09,480 --> 00:02:13,320 Speaker 1: kind of blair witch kind of environment. Right. Uh, it's 29 00:02:13,360 --> 00:02:17,440 Speaker 1: along the banks of the Wissahickon Creek. Um. And in 30 00:02:17,600 --> 00:02:23,919 Speaker 1: sixteen ninety four, a very smart fellow, a scholar, something 31 00:02:23,960 --> 00:02:27,160 Speaker 1: of a of a New Age mystic type, right by 32 00:02:27,160 --> 00:02:32,760 Speaker 1: the name of Johannes Kelpius. He brought forty of his followers, 33 00:02:32,840 --> 00:02:38,040 Speaker 1: all learned men, from their home in Transylvania, to the 34 00:02:38,160 --> 00:02:44,240 Speaker 1: newly settled Germantown, Pennsylvania, because they were escaping religious persecution, 35 00:02:44,360 --> 00:02:49,000 Speaker 1: because they were they weren't playing by the book book. Yeah, yeah, 36 00:02:49,040 --> 00:02:53,880 Speaker 1: they had their own playbook spiritually, and they believed that 37 00:02:53,960 --> 00:02:59,480 Speaker 1: the end was nigh. Uh. Johannes Kelpius was born Johann 38 00:02:59,600 --> 00:03:03,680 Speaker 1: kelp in Transylvania, as you said, in sixteen sixty seven, 39 00:03:03,760 --> 00:03:06,120 Speaker 1: is that nominative determinism. Do you think his family like, 40 00:03:06,280 --> 00:03:10,720 Speaker 1: we're we're maritime folk. I wonder that's a good question. 41 00:03:11,080 --> 00:03:13,960 Speaker 1: You know. Also, what I noticed is given the timeline, 42 00:03:14,280 --> 00:03:18,760 Speaker 1: this is way before Graham Stoker made Transylvania a scary place. 43 00:03:18,919 --> 00:03:21,040 Speaker 1: That's true. Is that weird? It's going to come up 44 00:03:21,040 --> 00:03:23,919 Speaker 1: in the next episode. We're gonna do I think, Oh 45 00:03:24,000 --> 00:03:27,920 Speaker 1: it is it is, stay tuned spoiler alert. But yeah, 46 00:03:27,960 --> 00:03:30,880 Speaker 1: so he brought these forty they had I think he 47 00:03:30,960 --> 00:03:35,000 Speaker 1: himself had. Well, what you were starting his chronology? Um, 48 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:39,920 Speaker 1: he was he was born, yeah, and then he was educated. Yeah. 49 00:03:39,920 --> 00:03:45,840 Speaker 1: He completed his education at Bavaria's University of Altdorf, and 50 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:49,200 Speaker 1: at the time it was a very respected high flutant 51 00:03:49,280 --> 00:03:53,320 Speaker 1: institution there in Europe. Uh. And his name change occurred 52 00:03:53,880 --> 00:03:57,920 Speaker 1: not because of vanity so much as because the common 53 00:03:58,040 --> 00:04:01,440 Speaker 1: practice for scholars at this day and age was to 54 00:04:01,680 --> 00:04:05,640 Speaker 1: latinize your name. So kelp became Kelpius. What would mind 55 00:04:05,680 --> 00:04:14,760 Speaker 1: become brownie us? That's interesting, Millennius Brownius pegrams. That sounds good. 56 00:04:15,680 --> 00:04:21,359 Speaker 1: So while he's at university, he becomes attracted to, acquainted with, 57 00:04:21,600 --> 00:04:26,240 Speaker 1: enamored of a religious movement known as Pietism. This was 58 00:04:26,360 --> 00:04:30,760 Speaker 1: a reaction against the orthodox Lutheranism of the time, and 59 00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:34,400 Speaker 1: then it later expanded to include beliefs that, you know, 60 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:39,240 Speaker 1: as you said, with his followers, beliefs that were considered heretical, strange, 61 00:04:39,760 --> 00:04:45,360 Speaker 1: forbidden knowledge, possibly a cult. And as he became more 62 00:04:45,480 --> 00:04:49,880 Speaker 1: and more immersed in this world, he also began to 63 00:04:50,240 --> 00:04:53,960 Speaker 1: gather different people around him. He was a follower of 64 00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:57,920 Speaker 1: a guy named Johann Jacob Zimmerman, and Zimmerman formed a 65 00:04:58,000 --> 00:05:02,840 Speaker 1: small group of like minded pe called the Chapter of Perfection. 66 00:05:03,000 --> 00:05:05,400 Speaker 1: It's true and actually I saw him described as such 67 00:05:05,440 --> 00:05:10,240 Speaker 1: as a noted German mathematician, astronomer and defract Lutheran minister. 68 00:05:10,920 --> 00:05:13,640 Speaker 1: And you know what happens when they defrock you, right, 69 00:05:13,760 --> 00:05:15,400 Speaker 1: That's like when you pull all the metals off the 70 00:05:15,440 --> 00:05:18,480 Speaker 1: general's chest, you know, and send him with his tail 71 00:05:18,520 --> 00:05:21,720 Speaker 1: between his legs. You were no longer allowed to practice 72 00:05:22,200 --> 00:05:25,200 Speaker 1: the spiritual beliefs or giving me your badge and gun 73 00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:31,800 Speaker 1: detective exactly. And this group led by Zimmerman that Kelpius 74 00:05:31,839 --> 00:05:34,599 Speaker 1: as a member of. He right right around this time. 75 00:05:34,720 --> 00:05:37,560 Speaker 1: He's maybe twenty years old, and most of the people 76 00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:40,560 Speaker 1: in the group around his age and the group believed 77 00:05:40,680 --> 00:05:45,479 Speaker 1: that there was a new spiritual age imminent, uh, their 78 00:05:45,600 --> 00:05:50,200 Speaker 1: version of the one thousand year idea of Christ returning, 79 00:05:50,480 --> 00:05:53,440 Speaker 1: and that they had to prepare for this. And I 80 00:05:53,520 --> 00:05:57,000 Speaker 1: love that you mentioned Zimmerman being an astronomer, because that 81 00:05:57,240 --> 00:06:01,039 Speaker 1: was the quantitative basis for a lot of his arguments. 82 00:06:01,080 --> 00:06:02,839 Speaker 1: That's right, And I just want to say to Zimmerman 83 00:06:02,960 --> 00:06:05,880 Speaker 1: was kind of the one who initially, unless I'm reading 84 00:06:05,880 --> 00:06:09,400 Speaker 1: this increctly, initially put together this expedition. You know, it 85 00:06:09,480 --> 00:06:14,040 Speaker 1: was like a six month boat trip yea from yeah, 86 00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:18,240 Speaker 1: from from there from Europe to Germantown or Philadelphia area. Um. 87 00:06:18,279 --> 00:06:22,360 Speaker 1: But he passed away before it could take off. So 88 00:06:22,720 --> 00:06:25,680 Speaker 1: Kelpius kind of became the new de facto leader of 89 00:06:25,680 --> 00:06:29,279 Speaker 1: the group, the neo Zimmerman. Right, Yeah, this is an 90 00:06:29,320 --> 00:06:32,760 Speaker 1: interesting part of the story that I could not I 91 00:06:32,800 --> 00:06:35,000 Speaker 1: don't know if you found anything, but I couldn't solve 92 00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:39,839 Speaker 1: one mystery about this. Estimates say that around this group, 93 00:06:39,920 --> 00:06:44,040 Speaker 1: the Chapter of Perfection received an offer of free land 94 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:47,920 Speaker 1: in Pennsylvania, in Germantown where you mentioned, and a free 95 00:06:47,920 --> 00:06:51,640 Speaker 1: boat ride over, but they received it anonymously. Now I 96 00:06:51,640 --> 00:06:55,400 Speaker 1: had read somewhere that it was from the governor of Pennsylvania, 97 00:06:55,560 --> 00:06:59,280 Speaker 1: was trying to, you know, encourage new settlers to come in, 98 00:06:59,480 --> 00:07:02,960 Speaker 1: and offers of religious tolerance was a big part of 99 00:07:03,000 --> 00:07:06,200 Speaker 1: early Pennsylvania settlements, right, Okay, that makes a lot of 100 00:07:06,360 --> 00:07:08,159 Speaker 1: Maybe it wasn't the government, but I know there definitely 101 00:07:08,279 --> 00:07:11,200 Speaker 1: was an effort from the powers that be in this 102 00:07:11,320 --> 00:07:17,880 Speaker 1: particular part of the colonies to attract more religiously freethinking 103 00:07:18,000 --> 00:07:22,640 Speaker 1: types and to populate the land with Europeans of course too. Yeah, 104 00:07:22,720 --> 00:07:25,760 Speaker 1: I think you must be spot on, you know. I 105 00:07:25,760 --> 00:07:29,520 Speaker 1: I love the tantilizing hint of an anonymous person, but 106 00:07:29,760 --> 00:07:33,840 Speaker 1: I bet you are correct that it was the governing 107 00:07:33,880 --> 00:07:37,360 Speaker 1: structure of the time. But as you said, Zimmerman ride 108 00:07:37,360 --> 00:07:40,000 Speaker 1: around the time they're about to leave for what would 109 00:07:40,040 --> 00:07:44,080 Speaker 1: become the United States. Zimmerman dies in August of six. 110 00:07:45,400 --> 00:07:51,480 Speaker 1: Kelpius becomes the commander. He leads them. He leads his 111 00:07:51,560 --> 00:07:55,320 Speaker 1: group of forty people to a ridge there above the 112 00:07:55,440 --> 00:07:59,920 Speaker 1: Wissahicken Gorge. That's such a fun word to say to uh. 113 00:07:59,720 --> 00:08:05,840 Speaker 1: And there along the fort parallel, Kelpius builds a forty 114 00:08:05,920 --> 00:08:12,200 Speaker 1: foot square tabernacle because in their philosophy and their understanding, 115 00:08:12,520 --> 00:08:15,920 Speaker 1: forty is like the best number. It's the most important 116 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:19,640 Speaker 1: magical number. I did just find. It was William Penn 117 00:08:19,920 --> 00:08:23,320 Speaker 1: who apparently invited the group, and William Penn was the governor, 118 00:08:23,800 --> 00:08:29,000 Speaker 1: and I think kind of governed Pennsylvania like its own tear, 119 00:08:29,120 --> 00:08:33,480 Speaker 1: like its own entire autonomous, autonomous thing. Yeah, that's right, Um, 120 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:38,360 Speaker 1: so Bendy notte. Millennialism is millennialism, from what I understand, 121 00:08:38,559 --> 00:08:42,480 Speaker 1: is the belief that the world will expire at a 122 00:08:42,520 --> 00:08:47,320 Speaker 1: significant date, either either completely end or some great change 123 00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:49,800 Speaker 1: will occur. As that correct. That it's big time correct, 124 00:08:49,840 --> 00:08:53,760 Speaker 1: and that is what these folks were all about. Um. 125 00:08:53,840 --> 00:08:56,400 Speaker 1: You may have seen the Fox television show kind of 126 00:08:56,400 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 1: a bit of an X Files rip off called Millennium, 127 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:01,760 Speaker 1: but it was all about like the end times, in 128 00:09:01,800 --> 00:09:03,840 Speaker 1: the end of days and stuff. But there's a couple 129 00:09:03,840 --> 00:09:07,000 Speaker 1: of different interpretations of millennialism, and I'm taking this from 130 00:09:07,040 --> 00:09:10,440 Speaker 1: the New World Encyclopedia. Um. One of them is this 131 00:09:10,480 --> 00:09:14,520 Speaker 1: notion that Christ will come back to Earth and establish 132 00:09:14,600 --> 00:09:18,720 Speaker 1: himself an entire new kingdom and rule for one thousand years, 133 00:09:19,080 --> 00:09:21,320 Speaker 1: at which point will come the reckoning, you know, or 134 00:09:21,360 --> 00:09:23,840 Speaker 1: some kind of calling of those that deserve to stick 135 00:09:23,840 --> 00:09:26,960 Speaker 1: around and those that have to go. Then there's another 136 00:09:27,480 --> 00:09:31,760 Speaker 1: version of it where the second Coming occurs with an 137 00:09:31,760 --> 00:09:36,720 Speaker 1: immediate culling of the wicked through some sort of cataclysmic 138 00:09:36,760 --> 00:09:39,959 Speaker 1: event to you know, trigger a new world order kind 139 00:09:39,960 --> 00:09:43,720 Speaker 1: of thing. But whichever one they believed in, the fact is, 140 00:09:43,800 --> 00:09:47,320 Speaker 1: there was a very specific part of the Bible that 141 00:09:47,840 --> 00:09:50,120 Speaker 1: was a foundation of this belief system in general, and 142 00:09:50,160 --> 00:09:53,000 Speaker 1: it's obviously the Book of Revelations UM. And there's a 143 00:09:53,040 --> 00:09:58,719 Speaker 1: particular passage that gave this group one of their many monikers. 144 00:09:58,720 --> 00:10:01,079 Speaker 1: They had a handful UM and the passages called the 145 00:10:01,120 --> 00:10:04,640 Speaker 1: Woman and the Dragon, and it's from Revelations twelve through sixteens. 146 00:10:04,720 --> 00:10:06,480 Speaker 1: Gonna read you a little bit of it. A great 147 00:10:06,520 --> 00:10:09,360 Speaker 1: sign appeared in heaven, a woman clothed with the sun, 148 00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:11,720 Speaker 1: with the moon under her feet and a crown of 149 00:10:11,800 --> 00:10:14,920 Speaker 1: twelve stars on her head. She was pregnant and cried 150 00:10:14,960 --> 00:10:17,000 Speaker 1: out in pain as she was about to give birth. 151 00:10:17,280 --> 00:10:20,720 Speaker 1: Then another sign appeared in heaven, an enormous red dragon 152 00:10:20,840 --> 00:10:25,000 Speaker 1: with seven heads and ten horns and seven crowns on 153 00:10:25,080 --> 00:10:28,400 Speaker 1: its head. Skip a little bit. Then war broke out 154 00:10:28,440 --> 00:10:31,360 Speaker 1: in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon 155 00:10:31,640 --> 00:10:33,960 Speaker 1: and the dragon and his angels fought back, but he 156 00:10:34,000 --> 00:10:36,480 Speaker 1: was not strong enough, and they lost their place in heaven. 157 00:10:36,760 --> 00:10:39,280 Speaker 1: The great Dragon was hurled down that ancient serpent called 158 00:10:39,280 --> 00:10:41,840 Speaker 1: the devil or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. 159 00:10:42,360 --> 00:10:44,760 Speaker 1: He was hurled to the earth and his angels with him. 160 00:10:45,160 --> 00:10:47,679 Speaker 1: So it's this idea of hell on earth kind of 161 00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:49,520 Speaker 1: And what was What were some of the names of 162 00:10:49,559 --> 00:10:51,960 Speaker 1: their group, starting with the one that was taken from 163 00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:54,920 Speaker 1: this passage that they so held so dear. They were 164 00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:58,280 Speaker 1: collectively known by several names. The weirdest one was the 165 00:10:58,400 --> 00:11:03,040 Speaker 1: Woman of the Wilderness. Forty guys calling themselves the Woman 166 00:11:03,240 --> 00:11:06,360 Speaker 1: of the wildern. It wasn't even like the women collective 167 00:11:06,440 --> 00:11:09,760 Speaker 1: of the Woman of the Wilderness, society of the just 168 00:11:09,840 --> 00:11:12,360 Speaker 1: the woman. Yeah, that's the weird That's the weird thing 169 00:11:12,400 --> 00:11:15,320 Speaker 1: about it is history doesn't seem to completely agree. Some 170 00:11:15,360 --> 00:11:17,360 Speaker 1: people will tell you they were just collectively called the 171 00:11:17,360 --> 00:11:20,200 Speaker 1: Woman in the Wilderness, and then you'll find a couple 172 00:11:20,200 --> 00:11:23,239 Speaker 1: of other places where they say they were the Society 173 00:11:23,240 --> 00:11:25,480 Speaker 1: of the Woman of the Wilderness, which makes more sense. 174 00:11:25,520 --> 00:11:28,880 Speaker 1: But my favorite though, is that they were the Hermits 175 00:11:28,920 --> 00:11:33,000 Speaker 1: of the Ridge. Yeah, it's like a the name of 176 00:11:33,040 --> 00:11:36,240 Speaker 1: a D and D party, you know, or the name 177 00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:40,120 Speaker 1: of the name of like a good old folksy prairie 178 00:11:40,160 --> 00:11:43,720 Speaker 1: home companion story. That's true, the old Hermit of the Ridge, 179 00:11:43,880 --> 00:11:48,240 Speaker 1: because the place we're talking about today the Cave of Kelpius. 180 00:11:48,760 --> 00:11:53,440 Speaker 1: Folks in Philadelphia area just call it the Hermit's Cave, Yeah, yep. 181 00:11:54,280 --> 00:11:59,640 Speaker 1: And the legend has it that Kelpius lived and meditated 182 00:11:59,760 --> 00:12:02,680 Speaker 1: in this cave built in the hillside of the ravine, 183 00:12:03,960 --> 00:12:06,840 Speaker 1: and that it was you'll hear some people say that 184 00:12:06,920 --> 00:12:10,680 Speaker 1: it was just an old spring house where occasionally Kelpius 185 00:12:10,760 --> 00:12:13,760 Speaker 1: where some other person would spend the night, yeah, and 186 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:15,880 Speaker 1: then he would return to his summer house, you know, 187 00:12:15,960 --> 00:12:19,160 Speaker 1: in warmer No, I'm kidding, the springhouse like a well 188 00:12:19,160 --> 00:12:22,679 Speaker 1: house or something like some sort of enclosure where there 189 00:12:22,720 --> 00:12:26,000 Speaker 1: would be a well and a source of fresh water, right, yeah, yeah. Yeah. 190 00:12:26,360 --> 00:12:30,480 Speaker 1: So while they established themselves and what became known as 191 00:12:31,400 --> 00:12:34,400 Speaker 1: Hermit's Glenn or the Hermit's Cave and the Hermit's Glen, 192 00:12:35,040 --> 00:12:37,960 Speaker 1: they also made an impression on the town. There's a 193 00:12:38,120 --> 00:12:41,800 Speaker 1: nearby road you can find today, we believe, called Hermit Lane. 194 00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:45,600 Speaker 1: So this is established. It's not very well known i'd 195 00:12:45,640 --> 00:12:50,040 Speaker 1: say outside of Philadelphia, but it has left a physical 196 00:12:50,080 --> 00:12:53,280 Speaker 1: trace on the on the city, that's right. And there's 197 00:12:53,280 --> 00:12:55,560 Speaker 1: actually a fantastic article from out with Thiss Obscura called 198 00:12:55,679 --> 00:12:58,440 Speaker 1: Cave of Kelpius where America's first doomsday called awaited the 199 00:12:58,520 --> 00:13:01,840 Speaker 1: End of the World, and there's a little um sidebar 200 00:13:01,880 --> 00:13:05,000 Speaker 1: on it that has the uh coordinates of the cave 201 00:13:05,120 --> 00:13:07,520 Speaker 1: because it's not exactly something you can Google map too, 202 00:13:07,760 --> 00:13:09,400 Speaker 1: because again, like we said, you kind of just have 203 00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:12,160 Speaker 1: to wander around and find it yourself. But it is 204 00:13:12,559 --> 00:13:16,960 Speaker 1: technically on Hermit Lane. Yeah, yeah, it's you'll have a 205 00:13:16,960 --> 00:13:19,880 Speaker 1: hard time getting mail sent there, but you can find 206 00:13:19,880 --> 00:13:24,440 Speaker 1: it with the coordinates and the space from what we understand, 207 00:13:24,520 --> 00:13:27,840 Speaker 1: the meeting space of the hermits, or the society or 208 00:13:27,920 --> 00:13:30,200 Speaker 1: the just the woman in the Wilder of the Wilderness 209 00:13:30,240 --> 00:13:35,080 Speaker 1: included the following things. At a rudimentary observatory where the 210 00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:38,319 Speaker 1: monks would practice astronomy, and this is thought to be 211 00:13:38,440 --> 00:13:43,040 Speaker 1: the first observatory built in the New World, the quote 212 00:13:43,080 --> 00:13:46,280 Speaker 1: unquote New World. Yeah, and astronomy was a huge deal 213 00:13:46,520 --> 00:13:49,719 Speaker 1: for these folks, and there's a there's a sense that 214 00:13:49,840 --> 00:13:53,319 Speaker 1: it was because they were on the lookout for I'm 215 00:13:53,320 --> 00:13:55,880 Speaker 1: gonna call them extraterrestrials, but I almost want to say 216 00:13:55,920 --> 00:14:00,199 Speaker 1: like heavenly like angels or something. Signs and wonder same 217 00:14:00,240 --> 00:14:02,720 Speaker 1: signs in wonders, because they really did believe that, you know, 218 00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:05,599 Speaker 1: like that passes that maybe the devils were going to 219 00:14:05,679 --> 00:14:08,959 Speaker 1: come flying down from the sky. What's that? What's that line? 220 00:14:09,160 --> 00:14:11,719 Speaker 1: And uh, I think it's Batman v. Superman where it 221 00:14:11,760 --> 00:14:14,600 Speaker 1: says turns out the devils don't come from below, they 222 00:14:14,760 --> 00:14:18,200 Speaker 1: come from above. Yeah, you know, he seemed to have 223 00:14:18,240 --> 00:14:19,640 Speaker 1: that in mind when he was looking, and it was 224 00:14:19,640 --> 00:14:23,760 Speaker 1: a very for the time advanced telescope, right, absolutely, Yeah, 225 00:14:23,800 --> 00:14:28,680 Speaker 1: they were able to have um a very clear view 226 00:14:28,840 --> 00:14:31,760 Speaker 1: because we have we have to remember, it's very easy 227 00:14:31,880 --> 00:14:36,479 Speaker 1: for us nowadays as a species to see a mystical 228 00:14:36,520 --> 00:14:40,240 Speaker 1: belief that one group or person has and take that 229 00:14:40,280 --> 00:14:44,360 Speaker 1: to mean that we should dismiss their scientific beliefs. It's 230 00:14:44,360 --> 00:14:47,520 Speaker 1: not the case. These things exist hand in hand, and 231 00:14:47,600 --> 00:14:50,240 Speaker 1: to these people, they were not contradictory, sort of the 232 00:14:50,280 --> 00:14:53,040 Speaker 1: same way that Isaac Newton had some really out there 233 00:14:53,160 --> 00:14:55,760 Speaker 1: esoteric beliefs, yeah, or that Redyard Kipling was kind of 234 00:14:55,800 --> 00:15:00,800 Speaker 1: a racist. I was absolutely right. Oh god, what a 235 00:15:00,960 --> 00:15:09,960 Speaker 1: terrible person. The interesting thing too about Kelpius is that 236 00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:12,680 Speaker 1: we don't know. We don't have a lot of primary 237 00:15:12,760 --> 00:15:16,160 Speaker 1: sources on him, so there's a lot of conjecture. And 238 00:15:16,240 --> 00:15:18,840 Speaker 1: when you go to the cave of Kelpius, it's there's 239 00:15:18,880 --> 00:15:22,480 Speaker 1: no artifacts left behind, there's no furniture, it's just out there. 240 00:15:22,520 --> 00:15:25,320 Speaker 1: There is a marker, right, I was put there by 241 00:15:26,040 --> 00:15:29,640 Speaker 1: a little society. We know a bit about their philosophy, 242 00:15:29,640 --> 00:15:31,720 Speaker 1: don't we been the Rosicruction in the Order of the 243 00:15:31,800 --> 00:15:34,720 Speaker 1: Rosicrucians for the Rose Cross. That's right, and all the 244 00:15:34,840 --> 00:15:38,360 Speaker 1: Order of the Rosy Cross built a marker for this. 245 00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:40,920 Speaker 1: And you know, if you went back in the forties, 246 00:15:40,960 --> 00:15:42,920 Speaker 1: you would see some stuff in the cave, Like you'd 247 00:15:42,920 --> 00:15:45,200 Speaker 1: see a chimney that was there for a while, and 248 00:15:45,320 --> 00:15:49,000 Speaker 1: I think it got vandalized or damage beyond repair, and 249 00:15:49,040 --> 00:15:51,640 Speaker 1: so they moved it. But um, I saw this cool 250 00:15:51,800 --> 00:15:53,760 Speaker 1: video that it was cool for a minute and then 251 00:15:53,800 --> 00:15:56,800 Speaker 1: it started to lean a little heavily into some not 252 00:15:56,960 --> 00:15:59,840 Speaker 1: true stuff. But it did have a really cool walk 253 00:16:00,000 --> 00:16:02,240 Speaker 1: through of the cave. And I don't know if this 254 00:16:02,360 --> 00:16:05,200 Speaker 1: was added later. I mean, I it's certainly possible, but 255 00:16:05,400 --> 00:16:08,240 Speaker 1: there's a there's a cross and then an upside down 256 00:16:08,280 --> 00:16:10,720 Speaker 1: cross right next to it, and the idea being that, 257 00:16:10,800 --> 00:16:12,200 Speaker 1: like you know, one is a sign of Christ, the 258 00:16:12,240 --> 00:16:14,680 Speaker 1: other is the sign of the devil. And then throughout 259 00:16:15,000 --> 00:16:19,600 Speaker 1: the space there are some other kind of strange coded messages. 260 00:16:19,680 --> 00:16:23,240 Speaker 1: But one thing we do know um is real and 261 00:16:23,320 --> 00:16:26,440 Speaker 1: not just you know, passers by having a laugh. Is 262 00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:30,880 Speaker 1: this Rosicrucian marker that identifies Kelpius as being the first 263 00:16:31,160 --> 00:16:35,960 Speaker 1: Rosicrucian in the New World. Yeah, it's it's legit, and 264 00:16:36,080 --> 00:16:41,440 Speaker 1: the chronology works out. The thing about these semi secret orders, 265 00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:46,800 Speaker 1: these mysterious esoteric groups, is that they can often just 266 00:16:47,040 --> 00:16:52,800 Speaker 1: appoint themselves in you know, a point authority to themselves. 267 00:16:52,840 --> 00:16:56,000 Speaker 1: But according to the tradition, he's not only the first 268 00:16:56,080 --> 00:17:00,160 Speaker 1: ruse Crucian, he's the first rouse Crucian master. Right. Uh, 269 00:17:00,280 --> 00:17:04,520 Speaker 1: there's there's some neat articles about this, Like you can 270 00:17:04,560 --> 00:17:09,120 Speaker 1: find a lot of local Pennsylvania history places. I really 271 00:17:09,160 --> 00:17:13,280 Speaker 1: enjoyed the explore p a history dot com story about 272 00:17:13,400 --> 00:17:17,359 Speaker 1: the marker, and you can read both the modern marker 273 00:17:17,680 --> 00:17:19,840 Speaker 1: that is in place that tells you about the Kelpist 274 00:17:19,840 --> 00:17:23,439 Speaker 1: community that's the newer one, and then you can see 275 00:17:23,480 --> 00:17:27,000 Speaker 1: the the other older stuff that's also spread around there. 276 00:17:27,200 --> 00:17:29,720 Speaker 1: It's a shame about the vandalism, you know what I mean, 277 00:17:29,760 --> 00:17:32,639 Speaker 1: that really that really broke my heart. But we forgot 278 00:17:32,640 --> 00:17:37,119 Speaker 1: to we forgot to mention. Okay, so they are millennials, milleniarians. 279 00:17:38,480 --> 00:17:43,280 Speaker 1: Here we go, and uh, they had a very specific 280 00:17:43,880 --> 00:17:48,520 Speaker 1: time frame for this last judgment, and it was six four, 281 00:17:48,720 --> 00:17:52,840 Speaker 1: the year that they all got together in this area, right, 282 00:17:53,200 --> 00:17:56,880 Speaker 1: or when they really doubled down. But that time came 283 00:17:56,920 --> 00:17:59,359 Speaker 1: and went. See, that's the problem with a lot of 284 00:17:59,400 --> 00:18:04,960 Speaker 1: doomsday cults. They'll predict something and then that moment will 285 00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:08,159 Speaker 1: pass and the world will spin on as as it will, 286 00:18:08,720 --> 00:18:10,919 Speaker 1: and then they have to find a new way to 287 00:18:11,080 --> 00:18:16,639 Speaker 1: understand this. So, according to the Chestnut Hill Local with 288 00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:19,280 Speaker 1: the title the Rapture that Never Came, the story of 289 00:18:19,320 --> 00:18:22,320 Speaker 1: the Hermits of the Whissa Hicken. According to them, when 290 00:18:22,520 --> 00:18:26,520 Speaker 1: six came and went without a last judgment, Kelpius and 291 00:18:27,119 --> 00:18:30,560 Speaker 1: the society said, you know what, we're gonna look towards 292 00:18:30,600 --> 00:18:34,720 Speaker 1: the year seventeen hundred. Certainly the advent of this new 293 00:18:34,800 --> 00:18:39,560 Speaker 1: century will bring about the end of mankind and the 294 00:18:39,600 --> 00:18:43,160 Speaker 1: return of Jesus Christ. Got to hope you know, hope 295 00:18:43,160 --> 00:18:46,840 Speaker 1: for something better, right, and the year arrived there was not, 296 00:18:47,400 --> 00:18:51,640 Speaker 1: from their perspective, a return of a Messiah. And then 297 00:18:52,640 --> 00:18:57,119 Speaker 1: they started to, I don't know, the members began to 298 00:18:57,760 --> 00:19:01,760 Speaker 1: get tired of these continue whole claims. Well, if you 299 00:19:01,800 --> 00:19:04,200 Speaker 1: hear the Church of the SubGenius ben, yes, it's sort 300 00:19:04,200 --> 00:19:08,040 Speaker 1: of a joke cult kind of. I mean, yes, I'm 301 00:19:08,320 --> 00:19:09,600 Speaker 1: gonna leave it that it's it's sort of a joke 302 00:19:09,640 --> 00:19:13,320 Speaker 1: call where they worship supposedly this like fifties clip art 303 00:19:13,400 --> 00:19:16,159 Speaker 1: like Dad looking Ahead and with the pipe called j 304 00:19:16,520 --> 00:19:22,200 Speaker 1: Reverend Jr. Bob dobbs uh. And the fundamental concept of 305 00:19:22,520 --> 00:19:26,000 Speaker 1: Um SubGenius is slack. But a big part of them 306 00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:28,200 Speaker 1: is they have this thing called X Day, or supposedly 307 00:19:28,280 --> 00:19:30,800 Speaker 1: these aliens are gonna come and do very much a 308 00:19:30,840 --> 00:19:33,480 Speaker 1: thing that I think the the order of the Hermits 309 00:19:33,560 --> 00:19:35,200 Speaker 1: or whenever you want to call them, we're hoping for. 310 00:19:35,560 --> 00:19:37,439 Speaker 1: But they got the day wrong because they looked at 311 00:19:37,480 --> 00:19:40,160 Speaker 1: it upside down, the big dummies, you know. And that's 312 00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:41,840 Speaker 1: just sort of like a little bit thumbing of the 313 00:19:41,880 --> 00:19:44,080 Speaker 1: nose that a lot of these death cults where they 314 00:19:44,080 --> 00:19:47,000 Speaker 1: always get something a little off and then you know, oh, 315 00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:50,160 Speaker 1: it'll be next time. Just keep keep stick with us, 316 00:19:50,200 --> 00:19:53,920 Speaker 1: you know. And again in in the defense of this 317 00:19:54,119 --> 00:19:59,920 Speaker 1: group of Kelpius community, they were not super aggressive, crazy, vile, 318 00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:02,920 Speaker 1: lent agro people like you said. The community even kind 319 00:20:02,920 --> 00:20:07,480 Speaker 1: of enjoyed their presence, very gentle types. It would seem, yeah, 320 00:20:07,520 --> 00:20:10,080 Speaker 1: it would seem so. And then as they began to 321 00:20:10,280 --> 00:20:14,720 Speaker 1: as enthusiasm at least began to taper off, they saw 322 00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:19,280 Speaker 1: the end of the cult becoming more and more immediate. 323 00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:24,600 Speaker 1: Because Kelpius, it turns out that living in caves with 324 00:20:24,800 --> 00:20:29,439 Speaker 1: uh with crushing low temperatures, especially in the winter months, 325 00:20:29,480 --> 00:20:31,719 Speaker 1: it turns out it's not good for you, even no 326 00:20:31,760 --> 00:20:34,480 Speaker 1: matter how well informed you are, and no matter how 327 00:20:34,600 --> 00:20:37,240 Speaker 1: talented of an astronomer you are. That's the fun that 328 00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:39,520 Speaker 1: a lot of times people that are like really driven 329 00:20:39,560 --> 00:20:43,040 Speaker 1: and obsessed with the quest for knowledge sometimes don't take 330 00:20:43,080 --> 00:20:46,479 Speaker 1: the best care of their physical vessels because they're so 331 00:20:46,560 --> 00:20:49,280 Speaker 1: busy doing all the maths and stuff, you know, that 332 00:20:49,320 --> 00:20:51,880 Speaker 1: they just got time to eat or you know, put 333 00:20:51,880 --> 00:20:56,440 Speaker 1: on a blanket. And Kelpius became ill with tuberculosis. It's 334 00:20:56,480 --> 00:20:59,440 Speaker 1: around seventeen o five. He had to go away from 335 00:20:59,480 --> 00:21:02,719 Speaker 1: the tavern actal area and move into the home of 336 00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:06,480 Speaker 1: a former member who had already left the organization in 337 00:21:06,560 --> 00:21:11,879 Speaker 1: Germantown proper. And he lived, Uh, he lived for about 338 00:21:11,960 --> 00:21:14,919 Speaker 1: three more years. I believe he was early forties when 339 00:21:14,920 --> 00:21:19,520 Speaker 1: he passed away. Seems seemed quite quite unfortunate and young. Yeah. Yeah, 340 00:21:19,600 --> 00:21:24,560 Speaker 1: he never really recovered from that bout of tuberculosis, and 341 00:21:24,720 --> 00:21:28,920 Speaker 1: he died in seventeen o eight. His followers returned. They 342 00:21:28,920 --> 00:21:31,399 Speaker 1: took his body to the tabernacle. They buried him in 343 00:21:31,440 --> 00:21:35,119 Speaker 1: the garden, and they had a ceremony where they released 344 00:21:35,119 --> 00:21:37,800 Speaker 1: a dove as they were lowering him into the ground. 345 00:21:37,840 --> 00:21:42,680 Speaker 1: The society itself survive for about another ten years or so, 346 00:21:42,760 --> 00:21:47,040 Speaker 1: but without the same drive or enthusiasm it was. At 347 00:21:47,119 --> 00:21:50,280 Speaker 1: some point it got down to just six hardcore believers. 348 00:21:50,320 --> 00:21:53,960 Speaker 1: But here we end some of the facts and we 349 00:21:54,040 --> 00:21:56,600 Speaker 1: get to some of the real juicy stuff, the legends. 350 00:21:56,680 --> 00:21:58,680 Speaker 1: Oh man, this is fun stuff. This is much more 351 00:21:58,680 --> 00:22:01,119 Speaker 1: in the realm of our other pro him stuff. They 352 00:22:01,119 --> 00:22:04,120 Speaker 1: don't want you to know, but it is just uh 353 00:22:04,160 --> 00:22:08,520 Speaker 1: so much fun, so great so. One of Kelpius's most 354 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:12,800 Speaker 1: trusted confidants and followers was a guy by the name 355 00:22:12,800 --> 00:22:17,639 Speaker 1: of Geisler was his first name, Daniel Daniel Geisler, and 356 00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:22,880 Speaker 1: he was kind of trying to adhere to the mystical 357 00:22:22,960 --> 00:22:26,600 Speaker 1: guru's last wishes as he was on his deathbed, right 358 00:22:27,840 --> 00:22:35,960 Speaker 1: because Kelpius gave Geisler a very particular artifact. It was 359 00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:39,359 Speaker 1: a box, but it was locked. Yeah. I like to 360 00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:41,560 Speaker 1: refer to it as this the mystery box. I think 361 00:22:41,600 --> 00:22:44,840 Speaker 1: of that thing in Mulholland Drive, you know, where they 362 00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:46,679 Speaker 1: pull out the box and the cameras zoom is in 363 00:22:46,720 --> 00:22:50,960 Speaker 1: and then everything gets real weird. It's like that, you know, um, 364 00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:52,960 Speaker 1: no one knows what's in the box, but there's a 365 00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:56,840 Speaker 1: fantastic article from the Voice, The Philly Voice in fact, 366 00:22:56,840 --> 00:23:01,240 Speaker 1: called did with a Hicken hermit have fabled Philosopher's Stone? 367 00:23:02,280 --> 00:23:07,240 Speaker 1: Huh yeah, Ben, remind us what's the philosopher's stone? Yes? Well, 368 00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:11,600 Speaker 1: in the the most common way to put it without 369 00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:15,440 Speaker 1: making it a crazy metaphor for something, is that it's 370 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:18,520 Speaker 1: a legendary substance that you hear a lot about an 371 00:23:18,600 --> 00:23:23,240 Speaker 1: alchemical writings that can turn things into other things. It 372 00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:26,680 Speaker 1: can transmute substances, so you'll hear stuff like turning lead 373 00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:29,679 Speaker 1: into gold, for instance, Right, that sounds cool. Yeah, it 374 00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:32,840 Speaker 1: sounds like a great stone to have, right. It may 375 00:23:32,880 --> 00:23:35,680 Speaker 1: not be a physical stone, and all the stories. Sometimes 376 00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:39,520 Speaker 1: it's just the substance, and sometimes it's thought to be 377 00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:46,440 Speaker 1: more of a symbol of a mystical term for the 378 00:23:46,600 --> 00:23:51,800 Speaker 1: great work in every effort by alchemist too discover this 379 00:23:51,880 --> 00:23:56,280 Speaker 1: substance or created or reproduce it, where those efforts were 380 00:23:56,280 --> 00:24:01,880 Speaker 1: collectively known as the great Work. So the idea that 381 00:24:02,560 --> 00:24:08,879 Speaker 1: a mystic like Kelpius would possess this philosopher's stone is 382 00:24:09,040 --> 00:24:12,760 Speaker 1: amazing and astonishing to anybody who was still searching for it. No, 383 00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:14,879 Speaker 1: we have to keep in mind. You know, this is 384 00:24:15,359 --> 00:24:20,880 Speaker 1: the early early eighteen century, so belief in alchemy is still, 385 00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:24,680 Speaker 1: you know, much more widespread than it is in I 386 00:24:24,720 --> 00:24:27,840 Speaker 1: would say. So Kelpius is on his deathbed um in 387 00:24:27,920 --> 00:24:31,720 Speaker 1: the throes of the dreaded tuberculosis. This is the early 388 00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:37,440 Speaker 1: seven sev sev eight, and his confidante there Geisler geislers Is. 389 00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:40,760 Speaker 1: I'm just paying a picture here kneeling by his bedside 390 00:24:40,920 --> 00:24:44,080 Speaker 1: and say, masta, masta, what can I do for you too? 391 00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:47,760 Speaker 1: Easier suffering anything? This is totally how it went down, 392 00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:50,440 Speaker 1: and to that Kelpius says, well, there is one thing, 393 00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:52,760 Speaker 1: my son, Come closer. You know how they always do 394 00:24:52,800 --> 00:24:55,040 Speaker 1: that when they're dead. Then come closer. I don't have 395 00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:58,919 Speaker 1: this straight. I'm closer. I want you to take hence 396 00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:03,960 Speaker 1: this box, my arcanum, and I want you to throw 397 00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:08,280 Speaker 1: it in the river, the the sho Kill river. Would 398 00:25:08,320 --> 00:25:11,639 Speaker 1: you say that schwi kill? Yeah, I want you to 399 00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:14,520 Speaker 1: throw it in the watery depths of the showy Kill. 400 00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:19,639 Speaker 1: And you know, to this um our boy Geestler, he 401 00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:23,040 Speaker 1: said sure, yeah, well of course and then and then 402 00:25:23,040 --> 00:25:26,639 Speaker 1: promptly didn't didn't didn't do it. And the the great 403 00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:30,159 Speaker 1: part of that legend is um when when he comes 404 00:25:30,200 --> 00:25:34,359 Speaker 1: back and he's like all done, Boss Kelpius, he says, 405 00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:39,159 Speaker 1: come closer. Yeah. He raises himself up and he expands 406 00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:43,200 Speaker 1: what little energy as pointed him and say, Daniel, thou 407 00:25:43,280 --> 00:25:46,280 Speaker 1: hast not done as I bid thee. Nor hast thou 408 00:25:46,400 --> 00:25:49,600 Speaker 1: cast the casket into the river, but hast he diden 409 00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:52,240 Speaker 1: it near the shore. And then he was like, oh 410 00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:57,120 Speaker 1: you got me, boss, I was gonna try to pick 411 00:25:57,200 --> 00:26:00,440 Speaker 1: that lock. And so now he's convinced that his mass her. Yeah, 412 00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:03,840 Speaker 1: he's definitely, he's definitely convinced, and so he you know, 413 00:26:03,880 --> 00:26:06,840 Speaker 1: he finally does it, and what a disappointment though he 414 00:26:06,920 --> 00:26:09,679 Speaker 1: this guy was, Yeah, what kind of follow are you 415 00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:12,840 Speaker 1: if you can't just follow simple instructions of a dying mystic? 416 00:26:13,160 --> 00:26:16,760 Speaker 1: Is a dying wish? Seriously, So what happens when he 417 00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:21,120 Speaker 1: actually does throw it away? Well, according to this account, 418 00:26:21,359 --> 00:26:26,879 Speaker 1: which was given by Geisler to a guy by the 419 00:26:26,960 --> 00:26:34,240 Speaker 1: name of Henry Muhlenberg, who in the Muhlenberg College in Allentown, Pennsylvania, 420 00:26:34,720 --> 00:26:38,800 Speaker 1: um was named after. And also he I think he's 421 00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:41,280 Speaker 1: he started the North American Lutheran Church or he was 422 00:26:41,280 --> 00:26:44,240 Speaker 1: a big force and establishing the North American Lutheran Church. 423 00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:47,159 Speaker 1: This is again from this Philly Voice article. It's a 424 00:26:47,280 --> 00:26:52,800 Speaker 1: very uh fabulous account because he says, and this is 425 00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:55,720 Speaker 1: this is all you know written down that as soon 426 00:26:55,720 --> 00:27:01,240 Speaker 1: as he threw it in the river exploded. Yes, yeah, 427 00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:04,320 Speaker 1: like is it so help help we get this street? 428 00:27:04,520 --> 00:27:07,680 Speaker 1: Did it explode? Was it a flash of lightning? Did 429 00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:11,320 Speaker 1: it come from the box? That's what it almost sounds like, Yeah, 430 00:27:11,320 --> 00:27:14,560 Speaker 1: it's it's it's it's a little weird, um it it's 431 00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:19,240 Speaker 1: it's it's written as though it produced some kind of 432 00:27:19,760 --> 00:27:23,679 Speaker 1: alchemical reaction, some sort of elemental that's the way I'm 433 00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:28,360 Speaker 1: looking for reaction. Because it's described as producing quote producing 434 00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:32,159 Speaker 1: flashes of lightning and peals of thunder. It made me 435 00:27:32,160 --> 00:27:34,240 Speaker 1: think when we first were reading about this of Indiana 436 00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:37,160 Speaker 1: Jones and the readers of the Lost Arc, remember where 437 00:27:37,200 --> 00:27:41,120 Speaker 1: they find somebody ignores the advice and they open the 438 00:27:41,320 --> 00:27:46,040 Speaker 1: arc and people melt and it's all this strange at 439 00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:49,040 Speaker 1: the time, amazing special effects. It's it's also been um 440 00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:52,919 Speaker 1: forever memorialized in an amazing gift that you can drop 441 00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:57,520 Speaker 1: whenever someone says something crazy. That third down the one 442 00:27:57,520 --> 00:27:59,960 Speaker 1: of the Nazis face melting off and its eyes bugging out. 443 00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:03,120 Speaker 1: There we go this account. We should also mention I'm 444 00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:07,000 Speaker 1: glad you brought up Henry Muhlenberg because Geisler didn't tell 445 00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:09,879 Speaker 1: the pastor about this immediately after, right, it was a 446 00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:13,600 Speaker 1: number of years. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Um. But this, 447 00:28:13,600 --> 00:28:15,960 Speaker 1: this Philly Voice article does a really good job of 448 00:28:16,400 --> 00:28:19,160 Speaker 1: pointing out how this sounds a whole lot more like 449 00:28:19,880 --> 00:28:24,960 Speaker 1: a kind of literary device rather than an actual account. 450 00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:30,560 Speaker 1: You know. They compare it to um King Arthur asking 451 00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:34,000 Speaker 1: his follower to throw excalibur into the lake and then 452 00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:37,840 Speaker 1: the lady of the lake reaches aloft and grabs Excalibur. 453 00:28:38,040 --> 00:28:40,200 Speaker 1: You know what I mean, Like they would have known 454 00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:44,600 Speaker 1: about those stories. Yeah, but it's like, it's it's very 455 00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:47,680 Speaker 1: odd that that he would tell this very specific and 456 00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:52,200 Speaker 1: quite incredible account that to what end, to help spread 457 00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:57,240 Speaker 1: the mythos of of of this this mystic. Yeah, that's 458 00:28:57,360 --> 00:29:01,160 Speaker 1: that's the interesting question. Because of as Lee, they would 459 00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:04,120 Speaker 1: have they were quite educated for the time, they were 460 00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:08,600 Speaker 1: aware of folklore. They would understand the connections. Oh, and 461 00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:12,440 Speaker 1: I can't believe we forgot the fun fact there. These 462 00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:17,840 Speaker 1: guys are famous for another reason because Christopher wit in 463 00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:21,200 Speaker 1: Seive painted Kelpius. It is believed to be the oldest 464 00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:24,240 Speaker 1: oil painting in the US. Oh, I didn't catch that. 465 00:29:25,040 --> 00:29:28,280 Speaker 1: It has nothing to do with magic or allegations thereof Now, 466 00:29:28,440 --> 00:29:30,400 Speaker 1: art art is its own kind of magic and its 467 00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:33,000 Speaker 1: own reward. That's awesome. That's a good way to look 468 00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:41,640 Speaker 1: at it. So this account maybe fictitious, It may be 469 00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:44,480 Speaker 1: solely a legend. Yeah. And this this speculation is coming 470 00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:48,760 Speaker 1: from a historian from the Historical Society of Pennsylvania by 471 00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:51,000 Speaker 1: the name of Dan Roth, who was interviewed for this 472 00:29:51,040 --> 00:29:54,760 Speaker 1: piece on Philly Voice dot com that was written by 473 00:29:55,120 --> 00:29:58,240 Speaker 1: John Copp was a staff writer for Philly Voice. So 474 00:29:58,320 --> 00:30:00,800 Speaker 1: where does that leave us today? Um? Oh, I do 475 00:30:00,880 --> 00:30:02,800 Speaker 1: have one of the things I did see this video 476 00:30:03,360 --> 00:30:05,560 Speaker 1: that I was talking about earlier, that it's kind of 477 00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:07,400 Speaker 1: cool for a for a point and then it really 478 00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:10,680 Speaker 1: starts to get into like and he was totally looking 479 00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:14,320 Speaker 1: for aliens and Ben Franklin like it was believed in 480 00:30:14,360 --> 00:30:19,200 Speaker 1: aliens too, and Ben Franklin supposedly got possession of all 481 00:30:19,280 --> 00:30:22,880 Speaker 1: of the relics and remaining materials that were ever in 482 00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:25,960 Speaker 1: this cave. But I found no mention of that anywhere 483 00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:29,000 Speaker 1: with any connection between Ben Franklin, other than the fact 484 00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:34,280 Speaker 1: that the Um American Philosophical Society, which was founded by 485 00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:39,600 Speaker 1: Ben Franklin, does have two books of Kelpius is in 486 00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:42,600 Speaker 1: in their library. One of them is the Diar Rheum 487 00:30:42,600 --> 00:30:48,880 Speaker 1: of Magister Johannes Kelpius Um, and that is from nineteen 488 00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:52,360 Speaker 1: seventeen reprinted, so it's not even an original. And then 489 00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:55,240 Speaker 1: they also have the Journal of Johannes's Kelpius, Magister of 490 00:30:55,280 --> 00:30:59,360 Speaker 1: the Hermits on the Ridge in Pennsylvania seven or eight. 491 00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:03,840 Speaker 1: So those two I think are the only surviving um 492 00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:07,880 Speaker 1: actual accounts from Kelpius himself. Yeah, a lot of them. 493 00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:10,720 Speaker 1: There maybe was another correspondence or something like that, but 494 00:31:10,760 --> 00:31:12,640 Speaker 1: it was not a whole lot. None of his actual 495 00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:18,920 Speaker 1: philosophy is codified in any kind of like expansive works, 496 00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:21,480 Speaker 1: you know, right right, it's those. Those are the two 497 00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:25,040 Speaker 1: books that we're aware of. There is one other, I thought, 498 00:31:25,120 --> 00:31:31,480 Speaker 1: fascinating paranormal story if we want to continue getting works. Okay, 499 00:31:31,560 --> 00:31:36,240 Speaker 1: so we said that after his death, the Brotherhood, the 500 00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:40,920 Speaker 1: society dwindles down. At one point, they're just six let's 501 00:31:40,920 --> 00:31:44,440 Speaker 1: call him hardcore monks, zealots, ardent believers, and they were 502 00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:49,280 Speaker 1: led by a guy named Conrad Mathi. Mathi, let's go 503 00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:51,920 Speaker 1: with that. Yeah, like my Thi. There we go perfect. 504 00:31:52,400 --> 00:31:57,280 Speaker 1: But eventually the group starts breaking down further and further 505 00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:01,160 Speaker 1: and further. And that guy we mentioned and Christopher Witt 506 00:32:01,320 --> 00:32:06,080 Speaker 1: who moved to Germantown, he also quit the the group, 507 00:32:06,160 --> 00:32:08,200 Speaker 1: but he continued a lot of his hobbies that he 508 00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:11,120 Speaker 1: had from his time in the group, and he did 509 00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:14,880 Speaker 1: pretty well. By seventeen eighteen, he was a wealthy man. 510 00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:17,920 Speaker 1: He had bought over a d twenty acres of land, 511 00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:22,520 Speaker 1: but he was always under suspicion in town of being 512 00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:28,360 Speaker 1: get this knoll hexan meister. Is it like a witchy dude? Yeah? 513 00:32:28,640 --> 00:32:33,520 Speaker 1: Uh so. People thought he was maybe using his magic. 514 00:32:34,040 --> 00:32:37,840 Speaker 1: His magical abilities were his esoteric wisdom to get ahead 515 00:32:37,880 --> 00:32:42,480 Speaker 1: in the secular world, and they also continued to provide 516 00:32:42,520 --> 00:32:47,400 Speaker 1: services of a paranormal or spiritual type to the community. 517 00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:52,360 Speaker 1: This guy I just mentioned, Conrad Matthai cast horoscopes, he 518 00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:55,480 Speaker 1: performed exorcisms. He said he could travel outside of his 519 00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:58,520 Speaker 1: own body. There was a book called The Pietists of 520 00:32:58,600 --> 00:33:05,320 Speaker 1: Provincial Pennsylvania written yes, written by a guy named Julius 521 00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:10,320 Speaker 1: Sach who says the following about Conrad. A captain's wife 522 00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:15,360 Speaker 1: allegedly asked Conrad in seventeen forty when he could expect 523 00:33:15,400 --> 00:33:18,800 Speaker 1: her husband's ship to return. So the guy goes into 524 00:33:19,160 --> 00:33:22,440 Speaker 1: his chamber, lays down in a trance for an hour, 525 00:33:22,760 --> 00:33:24,760 Speaker 1: then he wakes up. He comes back in and he 526 00:33:24,800 --> 00:33:28,000 Speaker 1: tells this lady her husband is at a London coffee 527 00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:32,040 Speaker 1: house and he's preparing to set sail for the New World. 528 00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:36,240 Speaker 1: And when the captain returns, you know, several months later 529 00:33:36,440 --> 00:33:40,480 Speaker 1: whatever he meets Conrad, and then the first thing he says, again, 530 00:33:40,520 --> 00:33:42,520 Speaker 1: according to this story, is that he was in a 531 00:33:42,600 --> 00:33:47,360 Speaker 1: London coffee house and saw the dude Conrad himself, staring 532 00:33:47,400 --> 00:33:51,479 Speaker 1: at him, and he said he remembered the encounter because 533 00:33:51,520 --> 00:33:54,680 Speaker 1: apparently the old man Conrad had come up and yelled 534 00:33:54,720 --> 00:33:57,640 Speaker 1: to him about not writing to his wife. That's got 535 00:33:57,640 --> 00:34:01,080 Speaker 1: to be total malarkey, rude. But what a G eight story. Yeah, 536 00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:03,000 Speaker 1: that's a good one. Good way to cap this one off. 537 00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:05,680 Speaker 1: Do you got anything else? You know what? I think 538 00:34:05,760 --> 00:34:08,839 Speaker 1: we can call it? Oh? No, do you hear that? 539 00:34:08,960 --> 00:34:11,799 Speaker 1: It's really Oh man, it's been so long. We had 540 00:34:11,800 --> 00:34:18,720 Speaker 1: such a street guy. It's strick. It's been so long. 541 00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:23,680 Speaker 1: Jonathan Strickland. The question you've been working on that laugh, 542 00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:29,319 Speaker 1: I've been celebrating, gentlemen. Missing seven. It's weird. It's like 543 00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:34,360 Speaker 1: the way you miss a like a sharp pain. It 544 00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:36,080 Speaker 1: was suddenly you wake up one morning and you think 545 00:34:36,280 --> 00:34:39,759 Speaker 1: that's different. Yeah, I kind of miss it now. That's 546 00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:43,880 Speaker 1: very sweet of you. Day after the chiropractor kind of longing. Well, 547 00:34:44,120 --> 00:34:46,880 Speaker 1: just consider me your spinal adjustment of love. Here. I 548 00:34:46,920 --> 00:34:52,200 Speaker 1: am all right to give you yet another a bilexing scenario, 549 00:34:52,800 --> 00:34:54,919 Speaker 1: whereupon you must decide whether or not in this truth 550 00:34:55,000 --> 00:34:57,799 Speaker 1: or fiction within the span of thirty minutes. You know, 551 00:34:57,840 --> 00:35:01,640 Speaker 1: I put forth a perplexing scenario or a notion that 552 00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:04,040 Speaker 1: my theory is that you we haven't seen you for 553 00:35:04,080 --> 00:35:06,439 Speaker 1: so long because you're going around and messing with other 554 00:35:06,520 --> 00:35:10,520 Speaker 1: podcasts that we don't know about. That true. I can 555 00:35:10,600 --> 00:35:14,480 Speaker 1: neither confirm nor deny have you been podcast cheating on us? Man? 556 00:35:14,640 --> 00:35:21,279 Speaker 1: I listen, Ben, listen, listen, Hey, listen Ben. Things are 557 00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:25,319 Speaker 1: complicated right now. Check my Facebook status. O. Man. It's 558 00:35:25,360 --> 00:35:28,680 Speaker 1: just you never know when someone needs to be, you know, 559 00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:34,880 Speaker 1: shown up by wow, having to prove their ability. I 560 00:35:35,040 --> 00:35:40,400 Speaker 1: had proposed strength. I have defended you on this show. Listen, Ben, 561 00:35:40,600 --> 00:35:48,000 Speaker 1: listen listen. Mortgages don't pay themselves, Ben Alquist, Caves don't 562 00:35:48,000 --> 00:35:51,000 Speaker 1: come cheat the most. It's the most cringe worthy segmented 563 00:35:51,040 --> 00:35:53,759 Speaker 1: all the podcasting. Yet again, and of course here we 564 00:35:53,880 --> 00:35:59,320 Speaker 1: have recently celebrated the fourth of July. That is true, 565 00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:02,400 Speaker 1: that is in fact today is the fifth of July, 566 00:36:03,280 --> 00:36:05,640 Speaker 1: in fact, as we record this in July. And so 567 00:36:06,040 --> 00:36:09,520 Speaker 1: the question today, our scenario today has to do with 568 00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:17,040 Speaker 1: someone who was very much connected to the declaration of independence, 569 00:36:18,680 --> 00:36:21,359 Speaker 1: and so you'll you will get your scenario the time 570 00:36:21,400 --> 00:36:23,040 Speaker 1: I will start a three minutes. You will, of course 571 00:36:23,120 --> 00:36:27,000 Speaker 1: have to ask questions of me, and I just confused 572 00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:28,560 Speaker 1: that one with the constitution. Is that going to be 573 00:36:28,600 --> 00:36:32,759 Speaker 1: a problem We will see. But in order in order 574 00:36:32,760 --> 00:36:34,799 Speaker 1: to ask a question this time, I always give you 575 00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:37,160 Speaker 1: an arbitrary rule this time, if you wish to ask 576 00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:40,840 Speaker 1: a question me, you must first say, sit down, John 577 00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:46,120 Speaker 1: alright reference to a musical called seventeen seventy six. Go 578 00:36:46,239 --> 00:36:51,480 Speaker 1: watch it. Nor alright. Here, here's your scenario. Prepare yourself 579 00:36:51,520 --> 00:36:53,680 Speaker 1: and start the time or when I am done, let 580 00:36:53,680 --> 00:36:56,239 Speaker 1: me warm up, because as long time listeners know, I 581 00:36:56,280 --> 00:36:58,560 Speaker 1: have to get a running start to jump and hit 582 00:36:58,600 --> 00:37:01,839 Speaker 1: the hit the second. And this Grandfather clock we spent 583 00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:03,759 Speaker 1: so much money on. If you could get the touch 584 00:37:03,800 --> 00:37:07,279 Speaker 1: screen on that Grandfather clock activated and just unlock it 585 00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:09,960 Speaker 1: now so that you can type in the numb here 586 00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:14,440 Speaker 1: we go. We're working live Man. Along with doctor Lyman 587 00:37:14,600 --> 00:37:19,880 Speaker 1: Hall and George Walton Button, Gwynnette signed the Declaration of 588 00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:24,279 Speaker 1: Independence representing the colony of Georgia. He would return to 589 00:37:24,360 --> 00:37:28,800 Speaker 1: Georgia to serve as president. He also maintained a rivalry 590 00:37:28,880 --> 00:37:32,920 Speaker 1: with Lachlan Macintosh, a Scotsman who served in the American 591 00:37:33,040 --> 00:37:35,680 Speaker 1: Army as a brigadier general, which was a position that 592 00:37:35,760 --> 00:37:40,400 Speaker 1: Gwynette had coveted. Gwinnette commanded McIntosh to conduct an invasion 593 00:37:40,480 --> 00:37:44,319 Speaker 1: of East Florida during the Revolution. The invasion was a 594 00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:48,080 Speaker 1: terrible failure. The two men blamed one another for the fiasco, 595 00:37:48,400 --> 00:37:52,000 Speaker 1: and it all resulted in a duel. However, on the 596 00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:56,160 Speaker 1: morning the duel was to take place in southern Georgia, 597 00:37:56,239 --> 00:38:00,120 Speaker 1: near the border of Florida. As Button Gwinnette walked his 598 00:38:00,160 --> 00:38:04,320 Speaker 1: way to Lachlan Macintosh, he was bitten by a venomous 599 00:38:04,320 --> 00:38:07,560 Speaker 1: snake suspected by historians to be a coral snake. And 600 00:38:07,600 --> 00:38:10,120 Speaker 1: while the bite itself might not have been fatal, the 601 00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:13,000 Speaker 1: medical attention that was given to him certainly was, and 602 00:38:13,040 --> 00:38:16,040 Speaker 1: he died of infection a week and a half later. 603 00:38:17,000 --> 00:38:21,280 Speaker 1: Start the clock, all right, we are start giving running 604 00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:27,239 Speaker 1: start boom. Okay, sit down, John y R. Could you 605 00:38:27,239 --> 00:38:31,240 Speaker 1: tell us again where this duel allegedly took place. Southern 606 00:38:31,280 --> 00:38:35,239 Speaker 1: Georgia's too far from the border of Florida. Okay, you 607 00:38:35,320 --> 00:38:38,120 Speaker 1: know what is now known as Fort McIntosh as a 608 00:38:38,120 --> 00:38:41,120 Speaker 1: As it turns out, and Button Gwynette. So we know 609 00:38:41,160 --> 00:38:43,840 Speaker 1: there's a Gwynette county. We know about Button. I remember 610 00:38:43,920 --> 00:38:47,640 Speaker 1: him from Georgia history as a lay you know, and uh, 611 00:38:48,120 --> 00:38:51,560 Speaker 1: Macintosh is a is a common name for institutions here 612 00:38:51,560 --> 00:38:55,000 Speaker 1: in Georgia. Was confused Button Gwynette with Oglethorpe though, just 613 00:38:55,040 --> 00:38:56,960 Speaker 1: like I do, the declaration of independs with the Constitution. 614 00:38:57,000 --> 00:39:01,480 Speaker 1: I am a really bad historian. You know. We're not bad. No, 615 00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:05,680 Speaker 1: we're ridiculous. That's our whole So uh yeah. One thing 616 00:39:05,719 --> 00:39:08,080 Speaker 1: I don't remember from Georgia history is hearing anything about 617 00:39:08,280 --> 00:39:13,120 Speaker 1: a snake bitten but also coral snakes. That's standing out 618 00:39:13,160 --> 00:39:16,439 Speaker 1: to me. I am very tempted to just go false. Yeah, 619 00:39:16,840 --> 00:39:21,319 Speaker 1: you just well, do we sit down? John is the 620 00:39:22,080 --> 00:39:25,640 Speaker 1: is the kicker that he died from poor medical like 621 00:39:25,719 --> 00:39:28,080 Speaker 1: we we are, we've it's been so long. Are we 622 00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:30,840 Speaker 1: trying to discern if like any detail of the story 623 00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:33,279 Speaker 1: is true, the whole thing is not true. If if 624 00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:36,319 Speaker 1: if you're saying he died from poor medical attention, but 625 00:39:36,360 --> 00:39:39,360 Speaker 1: then there was a detail in there that wasn't any 626 00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:43,799 Speaker 1: one detail there could make this statement that's false that works. 627 00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:49,080 Speaker 1: So so it is either all true or all false 628 00:39:49,320 --> 00:39:51,640 Speaker 1: or there's some falsehood in it. But if there's just 629 00:39:51,760 --> 00:39:55,280 Speaker 1: some falsehood in it, it's still inherently it is inherently okay, 630 00:39:56,080 --> 00:39:59,600 Speaker 1: all unlocking in false babies. Alright me personally, I'm I'm 631 00:39:59,680 --> 00:40:02,160 Speaker 1: looking you did. Let's yeah, yeah, let's let's count it 632 00:40:02,200 --> 00:40:07,680 Speaker 1: down and make it official. Grow three do what false gentlemen? 633 00:40:08,760 --> 00:40:17,319 Speaker 1: You have defeated me. Finally, I believe now I'm only 634 00:40:17,400 --> 00:40:20,879 Speaker 1: three ahead, you know, one day at a time. Man. Yeah, Hey, 635 00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:24,760 Speaker 1: Casey que place of victory, music naked nake it a dirge, 636 00:40:24,840 --> 00:40:29,080 Speaker 1: Casey dirge. So they here here are the actual Yes, 637 00:40:29,320 --> 00:40:31,480 Speaker 1: there was a duel. There was a duel. I remember that. 638 00:40:31,600 --> 00:40:34,759 Speaker 1: Button Gwinnette did wish to be brigadier general at the 639 00:40:34,760 --> 00:40:39,080 Speaker 1: American Revolutionary War. Lachlan Macintosh, his political rival, got that, 640 00:40:39,520 --> 00:40:42,319 Speaker 1: and then when he returned to Georgia, he was first 641 00:40:42,320 --> 00:40:45,479 Speaker 1: elected Speaker of the House of Georgia as well as 642 00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:48,120 Speaker 1: a Commander in chief of the of the Georgia Forces, 643 00:40:48,239 --> 00:40:53,240 Speaker 1: and he did in fact order McIntosh to invade East Florida, 644 00:40:53,480 --> 00:40:58,080 Speaker 1: British colony. It did not go well because McIntosh did 645 00:40:58,080 --> 00:41:01,160 Speaker 1: not have the resources needed. He returned to Georgia and 646 00:41:01,200 --> 00:41:04,279 Speaker 1: then he proceeded to bad mouth Button Gwynette in front 647 00:41:04,280 --> 00:41:06,800 Speaker 1: of the Georgia Assembly. You go bad mouth and Button 648 00:41:06,800 --> 00:41:09,600 Speaker 1: in front of an assembly man. A duel was arranged. 649 00:41:10,200 --> 00:41:15,920 Speaker 1: McIntosh totally shot Button Gwynette, and Button Gwynette died about 650 00:41:15,920 --> 00:41:19,480 Speaker 1: three days later on May nineteenth, seventeen seventy seven, a 651 00:41:19,719 --> 00:41:24,840 Speaker 1: signer of the Declaration of Independence shot by a soldier 652 00:41:24,920 --> 00:41:30,160 Speaker 1: who served in the Revolutionary Army. So no, no coral snakes, 653 00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:33,440 Speaker 1: No coral snakes. He was not bitten by a snake. 654 00:41:33,440 --> 00:41:36,400 Speaker 1: He was merely shot by a Scotsman. Shot by a Scotsman, 655 00:41:36,560 --> 00:41:40,000 Speaker 1: just as fatal as it turns out, Maybe I missed this. 656 00:41:40,080 --> 00:41:43,120 Speaker 1: How did the scotsman end up fighting for the American cause? 657 00:41:43,600 --> 00:41:47,240 Speaker 1: He was? He was given the position of brigadier general, 658 00:41:47,360 --> 00:41:51,200 Speaker 1: so they were both up for consideration for brigadier general, 659 00:41:51,520 --> 00:41:55,080 Speaker 1: and Button Gwynette was passed over. Button Gwynette's closest ally 660 00:41:55,239 --> 00:41:57,520 Speaker 1: was Dr Lyman Hall. And as you mentioned, we have 661 00:41:57,520 --> 00:42:00,920 Speaker 1: a Gwynette County, we also have a whole count Yeah, yeah, 662 00:42:00,960 --> 00:42:04,080 Speaker 1: that is where I am from, Hall County. Okay. Getting 663 00:42:04,120 --> 00:42:06,319 Speaker 1: to know you, is that where your layer is in 664 00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:10,200 Speaker 1: Hall County? Heavens no are you have an old fourth 665 00:42:10,280 --> 00:42:16,600 Speaker 1: ward man? Now? Well, Jonathan, what a tremendous pleasure to 666 00:42:17,000 --> 00:42:19,880 Speaker 1: have finally started winning some of these, right, noll. I know, 667 00:42:19,960 --> 00:42:22,960 Speaker 1: but I'm not I'm not getting enough remorse from you. 668 00:42:23,000 --> 00:42:25,920 Speaker 1: I'm not seen something still three ahead. Well, I know, 669 00:42:26,080 --> 00:42:27,959 Speaker 1: but I almost feel like you threw us a little 670 00:42:27,960 --> 00:42:29,600 Speaker 1: bit of a softball with this one. And while I 671 00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:34,160 Speaker 1: appreciate it, I also somewhat resent it. So then I'll 672 00:42:34,280 --> 00:42:38,040 Speaker 1: come at you extra hard next time. So what will 673 00:42:38,080 --> 00:42:42,720 Speaker 1: happen next, ridiculous historians? Will the tension continue to simmer? 674 00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:45,880 Speaker 1: Will we get closer and closer to an even score? 675 00:42:46,080 --> 00:42:49,359 Speaker 1: Or fall further into the hole. There's only one way 676 00:42:49,400 --> 00:42:51,319 Speaker 1: to find out. Well, there are several, but there's one 677 00:42:51,320 --> 00:42:53,319 Speaker 1: way we would like you to find out. You know, 678 00:42:53,360 --> 00:42:56,839 Speaker 1: listen to the show, continue to subscribe to my Twitter feed. 679 00:42:56,840 --> 00:42:59,400 Speaker 1: You'll find out about Hey. Now, yeah, hey, what's this 680 00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:03,799 Speaker 1: other show? I'm not at liberty to say, no, what's 681 00:43:03,840 --> 00:43:06,399 Speaker 1: the other show? I have no idea. Oh, you guys 682 00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:09,360 Speaker 1: making me so paranoid. That's fine, that's part of the 683 00:43:09,360 --> 00:43:12,560 Speaker 1: whole interaction. Here's paranoia. But seriously, thank you for coming again. 684 00:43:12,640 --> 00:43:18,400 Speaker 1: Jonathan Strickland, The devious quister. We appreciate it, Slash resent 685 00:43:18,680 --> 00:43:22,399 Speaker 1: it heavily. Thanks for helping us learn stuff man, that's 686 00:43:22,400 --> 00:43:24,959 Speaker 1: true love YouTube, and thank you folks for tuning into 687 00:43:24,960 --> 00:43:27,319 Speaker 1: the show. We hope you'll join us next time where 688 00:43:27,360 --> 00:43:30,640 Speaker 1: we talk about a bunch of states that never were 689 00:43:31,480 --> 00:43:34,120 Speaker 1: that that have a lot of fun names and stories 690 00:43:34,200 --> 00:43:36,399 Speaker 1: and just just listen to the episode will be good. 691 00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:38,759 Speaker 1: In the meantime, you can write to us at Ridiculous 692 00:43:38,800 --> 00:43:41,040 Speaker 1: at how stuff works dot com. You can check us 693 00:43:41,080 --> 00:43:44,520 Speaker 1: out on the typical social media channels. UM are preferred 694 00:43:44,880 --> 00:43:48,839 Speaker 1: method of communication with our ridiculous historian communities through our 695 00:43:48,920 --> 00:43:52,239 Speaker 1: Facebook group of that very name, Ridiculous Historians, And we 696 00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:55,080 Speaker 1: actually just come out with an episode that featured some 697 00:43:55,239 --> 00:43:57,319 Speaker 1: stuff from that very community and we had a really 698 00:43:57,320 --> 00:43:58,959 Speaker 1: good time doing it and we'll probably do it again. 699 00:43:59,000 --> 00:44:02,759 Speaker 1: So check that out and UM drop some memes or 700 00:44:02,960 --> 00:44:05,520 Speaker 1: stories or questions or ideas on there. You might hear 701 00:44:05,560 --> 00:44:08,640 Speaker 1: it in an episode, yes, and you may well hear 702 00:44:08,760 --> 00:44:12,759 Speaker 1: from us from Casey Nolan myself. A big thanks of course, 703 00:44:12,800 --> 00:44:15,680 Speaker 1: as always too super producer Casey Pegro, big thanks to 704 00:44:15,719 --> 00:44:18,600 Speaker 1: Alex Williams who composed the track. You know what, big 705 00:44:18,600 --> 00:44:23,880 Speaker 1: thanks to everybody except Jonathan. Thanks to Christopher hassi Otis. Jonathan, 706 00:44:23,920 --> 00:44:26,799 Speaker 1: You've got You're making a stink face with I love 707 00:44:26,920 --> 00:44:31,480 Speaker 1: you do know, guys, I'm feeling the emanations of affection here. 708 00:44:31,560 --> 00:44:34,400 Speaker 1: That is, is what you're feeling. Well, the course of 709 00:44:34,440 --> 00:44:44,200 Speaker 1: true love never did run smoothly. Thanks for tuning in everyone. Goodbye,