WEBVTT - YOUR LIFE'S GOING DOWN THE TOILET! 0:00:03.000 --> 0:00:06.920 Brain blast. Do you're what's Jimmy Neutron? Mm hmm, there's 0:00:07.000 --> 0:00:10.400 dummy thick mom, the mom with a dumb trunk ass 0:00:13.920 --> 0:00:17.480 she does. Have you seen Jimmy Neutra's mom. Jimmy Neutra's 0:00:17.520 --> 0:00:19.759 mom is his mom, the mom from the Fairly Odd 0:00:19.800 --> 0:00:23.880 Parents too. Oh yeah, they are packing these women are. 0:00:24.760 --> 0:00:34.120 I love the wagons they dragon. I have two favorite 0:00:34.120 --> 0:00:36.680 movies of all time that are kind of nugga nut. Okay, 0:00:36.720 --> 0:00:38.279 I think I know what they are. One of them 0:00:38.360 --> 0:00:42.000 is Marie Antoinette. Was Marie Antoinette, And the other one 0:00:42.080 --> 0:00:46.559 is Rear Window, the Hitchcock movie. Right, extremely boring, boring, 0:00:48.280 --> 0:00:51.520 Already we are. We are less than a minute into 0:00:51.520 --> 0:00:54.840 this podcast, and you're already coming for me, coming in 0:00:54.920 --> 0:00:58.120 hot with bad takes about Alfred Hitchcock. I was a 0:00:58.200 --> 0:01:00.440 kid with a d h D. I couldn't muscle my 0:01:00.480 --> 0:01:04.039 way through most fold movies. Okay, well, I think that's 0:01:05.040 --> 0:01:08.240 that's a you thing, not a Hitchcock thing. Okay, sure, okay, 0:01:08.480 --> 0:01:12.120 those have been my favorite movies for years. But I 0:01:12.200 --> 0:01:18.959 think a third option presented itself somewhat recently, and I 0:01:19.000 --> 0:01:23.040 believe it is also your favorite movie. It is not 0:01:23.280 --> 0:01:28.760 one of my favorite movies. Moonstruck is uncontestedly my favorite movie, 0:01:29.080 --> 0:01:32.440 point blank period and I have it tattooed on my leg. 0:01:32.720 --> 0:01:35.680 We'll get into that. Today. We were talking about Moonstruck 0:01:37.120 --> 0:01:42.479 film starring Share Nicholas Cage, Olympu du Cacus, that one 0:01:42.480 --> 0:01:46.320 guy from Frasier. Yes, before that, we're going to talk 0:01:46.319 --> 0:01:49.480 about what's going on in pop culture. It's the end 0:01:49.520 --> 0:01:52.120 of the year, so maybe we'll like take a look 0:01:52.120 --> 0:01:55.800 back on some of our favorite pieces of pop culture 0:01:55.920 --> 0:01:59.840 from We will toxically around up the best of the year, 0:02:00.280 --> 0:02:02.560 create hierarchy. Yeah, we might do them against you. We 0:02:02.640 --> 0:02:05.720 might do some lists. Uh. This is like a Virgin 0:02:05.880 --> 0:02:08.560 the podcast where we talk about yesterday's pop culture and 0:02:08.600 --> 0:02:11.320 give it today's takes. I'm ros damn you, I'm fan 0:02:11.400 --> 0:02:17.480 Toronto and that's a more a. I'm excited that we're 0:02:17.480 --> 0:02:20.200 gonna talk about all of this stuff that we really 0:02:20.240 --> 0:02:22.680 loved from this year and nothing that we didn't like, 0:02:22.800 --> 0:02:25.760 because we only we want to go forward into two 0:02:26.160 --> 0:02:29.919 with positivity. That's right. This is our year in review, 0:02:29.960 --> 0:02:34.240 our queer in review. If you will love that. I 0:02:34.280 --> 0:02:36.480 guess we should start with TV because I don't know 0:02:36.480 --> 0:02:38.399 about you. But that's like the thing that I consumed 0:02:38.440 --> 0:02:41.760 the most of this year. A lot of my faves 0:02:41.800 --> 0:02:46.040 where everybody else's faves, like loved Wan Division, loved sex Education. 0:02:46.680 --> 0:02:50.360 I was there for White Lotus and Hacks like every week. 0:02:50.840 --> 0:02:53.040 I think if I were to think about what my 0:02:53.320 --> 0:02:57.359 like standout shows of the year were, Legendary the season 0:02:57.360 --> 0:03:00.680 two of Legendary was definitely one of them. I watched 0:03:01.000 --> 0:03:06.320 every episode multiple times. I was so invested in every 0:03:06.360 --> 0:03:10.160 single team. For those of you that don't know, Legendary 0:03:10.200 --> 0:03:13.840 is like a ballroom culture competition reality series on HBO 0:03:13.919 --> 0:03:17.920 Max that is just some of the best reality TV 0:03:18.120 --> 0:03:22.720 storytelling I've heard in ages, combined with dance sequences that 0:03:22.880 --> 0:03:26.160 are mind blowing. Another show, Well, actually, what what were 0:03:26.240 --> 0:03:30.000 What was one of your favorites from one Division? Definitely, 0:03:30.440 --> 0:03:32.080 you know, that was a big moment for us. We 0:03:32.120 --> 0:03:35.800 watched it together every week. It was event television in 0:03:35.840 --> 0:03:37.800 a way that we haven't had in a while. It 0:03:37.880 --> 0:03:41.920 felt like truly everyone was watching it and it was 0:03:41.960 --> 0:03:45.120 really compelling. It was, like, I think, one of the 0:03:45.160 --> 0:03:47.960 best things the m c U has done in years. 0:03:48.280 --> 0:03:51.559 But I guess if I'm thinking of a standout episode 0:03:51.680 --> 0:03:55.200 of a show. This one's pretty recent, but the final 0:03:55.280 --> 0:03:58.480 season of Pen fifteen just came out on Hulu, and 0:03:58.680 --> 0:04:02.400 there's an episode Yuki that's about one of the character's moms, 0:04:02.440 --> 0:04:04.680 And it's like one of those episodes of a TV 0:04:04.720 --> 0:04:07.760 show where it focuses on a character who's not the lead, 0:04:08.320 --> 0:04:11.360 and it gives this woman who is just like a mother. 0:04:11.600 --> 0:04:15.200 There's interior life, and like she meets up with her 0:04:15.240 --> 0:04:18.160 ex husband and they have this whole day together and 0:04:18.240 --> 0:04:25.560 it's so like beautiful and sad and sweet, and I 0:04:25.640 --> 0:04:28.320 just really loved it and it has stuck with me 0:04:28.560 --> 0:04:30.480 since I watched it. I think I think it's one 0:04:30.480 --> 0:04:33.239 of the best episodes of TV I've seen in years. 0:04:34.040 --> 0:04:36.520 I am still making my way through season two. I 0:04:36.600 --> 0:04:39.159 can't wait to watch that episode. If we're talking about 0:04:39.200 --> 0:04:43.120 fave episodes of the year, I will reserve my thoughts 0:04:43.240 --> 0:04:48.160 for Pose as a whole. However, the Electra episode of 0:04:48.279 --> 0:04:51.080 Pose and Her Argent Story, which I think is episode 0:04:51.160 --> 0:04:54.880 three of this last season, is maybe the best episode 0:04:54.920 --> 0:04:58.880 of the entire show. It was so compelling and beautiful 0:04:59.160 --> 0:05:03.360 and original and thoughtful. Um. I also really really loved 0:05:04.120 --> 0:05:07.640 Hunter Schaefer's special episode of Euphoria that came out at 0:05:07.640 --> 0:05:10.240 the beginning of this year. It's one that, like I 0:05:10.279 --> 0:05:14.360 talked about in therapy multiple times. It like haunted me. 0:05:14.400 --> 0:05:18.320 I thought it was like exquisite writing, um I I. 0:05:18.680 --> 0:05:21.719 But also something that you and I both enjoyed is 0:05:21.800 --> 0:05:26.120 the episode of Schmiga Dun that involves both an amazing 0:05:26.160 --> 0:05:30.960 Ariana Debo's performance and a four and a half minute 0:05:31.279 --> 0:05:37.039 song by Kristin Chenowith wherein she's like spitting rhymes and 0:05:37.320 --> 0:05:39.279 she does it all in one take. That was a 0:05:39.279 --> 0:05:42.080 great episode. I do think though, that the Schmicka Dune 0:05:42.120 --> 0:05:46.280 episode I liked more was the one with Jane Kurkowski 0:05:46.600 --> 0:05:49.880 where she does that that number. Well, she's she's standing 0:05:49.880 --> 0:05:52.360 on top of the car. I feel like people really slip. 0:05:53.040 --> 0:05:55.880 I was gonna say slept. People are really slept on 0:05:55.960 --> 0:05:58.760 Schmiga Dun year. It really did. But if you're not 0:05:58.839 --> 0:06:03.279 familiar with Schmigadoon and um, it's like basically this rom 0:06:03.320 --> 0:06:06.800 com sitcom. We're in a couple stumbles upon a town 0:06:06.880 --> 0:06:10.440 that is basically a Rogers and Hammerstein musical, and it 0:06:10.640 --> 0:06:14.360 kind of pokes fun at various tropes within musicals. It's 0:06:14.400 --> 0:06:18.479 super funny, very ingenious. I also wanted to quickly touch 0:06:18.560 --> 0:06:21.720 on maybe my other favorite TV show of the year. 0:06:21.839 --> 0:06:24.600 I really loved this show sort Of, which is an 0:06:24.760 --> 0:06:29.560 HBO Max original. It's about a trans non binary Pakistani 0:06:29.720 --> 0:06:33.000 nanny bartender who is at kind of this like pivotal 0:06:33.040 --> 0:06:35.839 moment in their life. I'm not gonna lie I I 0:06:35.920 --> 0:06:38.960 really judged the show before I went into it, like 0:06:39.200 --> 0:06:42.159 the people that were recommending it to me were, i'll 0:06:42.160 --> 0:06:45.320 say it siss and to me like quite frankly, I 0:06:45.360 --> 0:06:47.719 think a lot of like media portrayals of non binary 0:06:47.720 --> 0:06:51.960 people specifically are are in a post them dot us 0:06:52.000 --> 0:06:56.240 world are like very manufactured, like they're very for like 0:06:56.320 --> 0:06:58.800 CIS consumption, And that's kind of what I thought I 0:06:58.880 --> 0:07:02.640 was getting into because like a lot of like portrayals 0:07:02.680 --> 0:07:06.200 of non binary people have this very like self serious, 0:07:06.320 --> 0:07:09.359 like over rotten nous. You know, it's like triumph porn, 0:07:09.640 --> 0:07:13.560 but sort of was so disinterested in the question of 0:07:13.600 --> 0:07:16.200 non binary identity and was really more of like a 0:07:16.280 --> 0:07:18.880 queer brown like Daria. If I were to give it 0:07:18.920 --> 0:07:21.960 like a comparison, I love that so much, dead pan 0:07:22.400 --> 0:07:25.080 and like floating through life like they're high stakes things 0:07:25.120 --> 0:07:27.800 that happened. There's a lot of like hijinks, but the 0:07:27.840 --> 0:07:32.560 show doesn't revel in conversations about pronouns, right, Like for 0:07:32.640 --> 0:07:35.640 me personally, like if if stories about pronouns are important 0:07:35.680 --> 0:07:38.240 and impactful for you to consume, that's cool. For me, 0:07:38.560 --> 0:07:41.640 they are overplayed and they're boring and they're just not 0:07:41.760 --> 0:07:45.680 what a general conforming experience is about. And like, I 0:07:45.720 --> 0:07:47.840 personally don't talk about this a lot, but like my 0:07:48.000 --> 0:07:50.520 gender has been like an ongoing project since I was 0:07:50.560 --> 0:07:52.680 a kid, but like most of the last two years 0:07:52.680 --> 0:07:55.640 have been looking at like where I belong on the 0:07:55.760 --> 0:07:58.560 trans spectrum and like what my gender means to me. 0:07:58.760 --> 0:08:01.400 And the promise of the show sort of is like 0:08:01.920 --> 0:08:05.400 that it's okay to still be evolving and that we 0:08:05.400 --> 0:08:08.880 should create space for that to be okay. So this 0:08:08.920 --> 0:08:11.760 show was like such a must watch. I was talking 0:08:11.800 --> 0:08:14.320 to my dad the other day and he like we 0:08:14.440 --> 0:08:17.360 kind of got into something about how like I don't 0:08:17.400 --> 0:08:19.720 like tell him things, and he was like, oh, and 0:08:19.720 --> 0:08:21.960 you like never talk to me about your transition anymore, 0:08:22.240 --> 0:08:23.880 And I was like, I don't talk to anyone about 0:08:23.920 --> 0:08:27.239 it because it's not interesting. And I mean, it's great 0:08:27.280 --> 0:08:31.080 to have an offering that like is presenting the life 0:08:31.120 --> 0:08:34.560 of someone who is trans and like, of course that's 0:08:34.760 --> 0:08:37.080 I'm sure that's part of the story and there lived experience, 0:08:37.440 --> 0:08:43.000 but like the story is about a story exactly. Speaking 0:08:43.000 --> 0:08:47.120 of representation, get getting into the best of movies of 0:08:47.160 --> 0:08:51.480 the year. Finally, bad bitch as are represented in Cruelay 0:08:51.880 --> 0:08:55.440 Corella was I will okay, my my top three movies 0:08:55.480 --> 0:08:59.240 of the year were definitely The Green Night, Corrella and 0:08:59.360 --> 0:09:02.600 Spencer Krella was the first movie I saw back in 0:09:02.679 --> 0:09:06.320 theaters after I got vaccinated. It was so good, you know, 0:09:06.360 --> 0:09:08.640 I think we had been teased for so long about 0:09:08.679 --> 0:09:13.439 the Emma Stone Corrella movie, which like is, um, someone's 0:09:13.480 --> 0:09:16.360 made this joke before that like it's it's a movie 0:09:16.440 --> 0:09:20.160 that sounds like the premise came from a tweet that 0:09:20.320 --> 0:09:23.960 like Emma Stone should play young Cruella and like it 0:09:24.040 --> 0:09:28.440 actually happened. Yeah that is actually true. But it was 0:09:28.440 --> 0:09:31.240 a really fun movie. She was great in it. The 0:09:31.360 --> 0:09:35.040 looks were amazing, It had a killer soundtrack of all 0:09:35.160 --> 0:09:38.280 this like great like sixteas and seventies like rock and Punk. 0:09:38.559 --> 0:09:42.200 I honestly looked at the year end movies and I 0:09:42.280 --> 0:09:46.200 cannot really say that I had a faith. I'm not 0:09:46.240 --> 0:09:48.160 gonna lie. I think that there were a lot of 0:09:48.200 --> 0:09:50.600 movies that came out where I was like, I love that, 0:09:50.640 --> 0:09:52.880 but I had a huge problem with it. I mean, 0:09:52.920 --> 0:09:54.839 even with like something like in Conto, It's like that 0:09:54.880 --> 0:09:56.400 would have been a favor of the year, but like 0:09:56.440 --> 0:10:00.480 the music was really so so not it for me. 0:10:00.920 --> 0:10:05.199 Maybe shuan Chi was like the most fun I had 0:10:05.440 --> 0:10:08.480 while watching a movie this year. I also really loved 0:10:08.480 --> 0:10:12.319 the Tina Turner documentary on HBO Max. But other than that, 0:10:12.440 --> 0:10:14.600 I mean, movies were a flop for me this year. 0:10:14.800 --> 0:10:18.160 Should we get into music, Yeah, I'm looking on our notes. 0:10:18.200 --> 0:10:20.520 You have a very extensive list of your favorites. I 0:10:20.559 --> 0:10:23.760 only put one song, which was which was Message in 0:10:23.800 --> 0:10:28.040 a Bottle by Taylor Swift from Red Taylor's version. This 0:10:28.160 --> 0:10:30.480 is both like kind of a joke and also serious 0:10:31.000 --> 0:10:32.960 I Message in a Bottle. I think this is the 0:10:33.000 --> 0:10:36.720 best song of I honestly don't think it's a joke 0:10:36.760 --> 0:10:38.480 at all. I think that we should hold space for 0:10:38.559 --> 0:10:41.280 that to be a legitimate critique of the year in music. 0:10:41.360 --> 0:10:43.600 I totally agree with that. I'm on on board with it. 0:10:43.720 --> 0:10:46.559 Thank you so much. I really appreciate it. A lot 0:10:46.600 --> 0:10:49.600 of my favorite songs of the year where like everybody 0:10:49.600 --> 0:10:53.679 else's favorites, at least in queer world, like the Gasoline 0:10:54.160 --> 0:10:57.280 Him remix with Taylor I thought was amazing. We all 0:10:57.360 --> 0:10:59.920 loved like Please by Jesse Ware Bunny as a Right, 0:11:00.080 --> 0:11:04.959 or Silk Chiffon by Muna. I really loved the Dealer 0:11:05.280 --> 0:11:07.839 off of the new Lana del Rey album. Dealer was 0:11:07.920 --> 0:11:11.720 great Brutal. I don't think that the album was like 0:11:11.960 --> 0:11:14.360 a hit, but I thought Brutal was, like, so you didn't. 0:11:14.720 --> 0:11:19.760 I think Sour is my favorite album, and of all 0:11:19.800 --> 0:11:23.280 of the songs on it, good for You what Like, 0:11:23.400 --> 0:11:26.040 I had such a moment with good for You, Like 0:11:26.160 --> 0:11:29.400 that was one of my most listened to songs this 0:11:29.480 --> 0:11:33.440 year on Spotify, And I think the pop punk thing 0:11:33.600 --> 0:11:37.440 she was doing just really resonated um with me. And 0:11:37.520 --> 0:11:41.160 that is why Sour is my favorite new album of 0:11:41.200 --> 0:11:44.320 the year for sure. So I'm at a crossroads with 0:11:44.360 --> 0:11:48.560 Sour specifically because part of me feels like if it 0:11:48.640 --> 0:11:53.040 had just been an EP and it had been Brutal, 0:11:53.440 --> 0:11:57.640 Driver's License, good for You and like Jealousy, jealousy, you know, 0:11:57.679 --> 0:12:00.120 like those bangers like that absolutely would have been and 0:12:00.200 --> 0:12:02.920 like quote unquote album or like compilation of the year, 0:12:02.960 --> 0:12:04.400 but at the same time she had released an EP, 0:12:04.559 --> 0:12:07.800 it never would have been like this cult sensation. Obviously 0:12:07.800 --> 0:12:09.240 it had to be an album. So it's kind of 0:12:09.240 --> 0:12:11.280 stupid to say, but for me, there were a lot 0:12:11.320 --> 0:12:14.480 of skips on the album. There's some fill for sure. Yeah, 0:12:14.559 --> 0:12:16.640 there there's some filler queens, which is why it's not 0:12:16.720 --> 0:12:19.559 Album of the Year for me, but brutal undeniable. Um. 0:12:19.600 --> 0:12:23.439 In terms of my number ones for tracks. Um. There 0:12:23.520 --> 0:12:27.199 is an unreleased Scissor song that she herself put out 0:12:27.240 --> 0:12:30.760 on SoundCloud called Janie that It's like a minute and 0:12:30.800 --> 0:12:34.440 a half and features Scissor's whistle tone. I also loved 0:12:34.679 --> 0:12:37.560 Billie Eilish is Happier than ever, the title track on 0:12:37.600 --> 0:12:41.200 that album. If you are not a little eyelash, that 0:12:41.440 --> 0:12:45.120 song We'll set you Free. Um. And then I also 0:12:45.240 --> 0:12:49.160 loved Into the Count of It by Ocean Kelly, which 0:12:49.320 --> 0:12:52.719 is this kind of TikTok sound that remixes a song 0:12:52.760 --> 0:12:55.560 from the backyard agains that I think it's really amazing, 0:12:55.600 --> 0:12:58.280 and I think Ocean Kelly, who you know, there's kind 0:12:58.280 --> 0:13:00.840 of like some Azalea Banks Comparius Ends, but she made 0:13:00.840 --> 0:13:04.040 that one division remix. Her stuff is so good. She 0:13:04.080 --> 0:13:07.040 also did the song um can I get that Vegan Vegan? 0:13:10.320 --> 0:13:12.360 But she like that was one of the tracks of 0:13:12.400 --> 0:13:14.120 the year for me. I thought it was so good 0:13:14.160 --> 0:13:17.560 and so fun. This really was the year of TikTok 0:13:17.720 --> 0:13:23.240 Sounds that Willow song Mimi at our Spot what. I 0:13:23.280 --> 0:13:26.120 did listen to that a lot this year because of TikTok. 0:13:26.480 --> 0:13:27.840 It did come out like a year or two ago, 0:13:27.880 --> 0:13:31.480 but it was kind of a song of I liked 0:13:31.480 --> 0:13:33.040 a lot of the stuff she put out this year. 0:13:33.080 --> 0:13:36.400 I really liked her song with Avril Levine. It's like, 0:13:36.480 --> 0:13:39.000 it's only like two minutes long. I need. I need 0:13:39.040 --> 0:13:42.840 the girls to start making longer songs. It's not I 0:13:42.880 --> 0:13:45.800 need more than three minutes, babe. Obviously you and I 0:13:45.840 --> 0:13:50.120 loved Red and Solar Power, Yes and Soil of Pow. 0:13:50.800 --> 0:13:53.079 I guess like, when I'm thinking about my favorite album 0:13:53.120 --> 0:13:55.640 of the year, it's like, not even necessarily what did 0:13:55.679 --> 0:13:59.360 I love the most? Front to back? It's like, what 0:13:59.520 --> 0:14:02.720 is the album that like really was the vibe of 0:14:03.840 --> 0:14:06.880 for me? And it definitely was sour, which I mean 0:14:07.000 --> 0:14:09.360 like obviously makes me feel feel weird because I'm thirty 0:14:09.400 --> 0:14:14.720 three in the liberal labricos is eight, um, but I 0:14:14.800 --> 0:14:17.160 do kind of still give credence to the idea that 0:14:17.200 --> 0:14:20.160 she's like an industry plant who's making like music for 0:14:20.280 --> 0:14:24.680 millennials while like pretending that it's for gen Z. She 0:14:24.840 --> 0:14:28.680 was manufactured in a a gen Z laboratory. Should we 0:14:28.720 --> 0:14:32.600 go into books. I read a lot this year because, 0:14:32.920 --> 0:14:36.240 like I hate to say this, but it kind of 0:14:36.400 --> 0:14:40.600 is because of TikTok, because I like got really into 0:14:40.640 --> 0:14:45.760 TikTok this spring, and um like got really into book talk, 0:14:45.800 --> 0:14:48.680 and so I got a lot of really good book recommendations. 0:14:49.280 --> 0:14:52.360 And I would say my favorites are not really things 0:14:52.440 --> 0:14:55.880 that came out this year. Well, definitely, De Transition Baby 0:14:56.160 --> 0:14:57.560 was one of my favorite books of the year, and 0:14:57.560 --> 0:15:00.440 it was released this year and I think is an 0:15:00.480 --> 0:15:05.440 incredible novel by Tory Peters. But my favorite books that 0:15:05.600 --> 0:15:09.480 I read this year, Number one was A Certain Hunger 0:15:09.800 --> 0:15:13.520 by Chelsea G. Summers, which is sort of like a 0:15:13.720 --> 0:15:18.480 female American psycho. It's like a fake memoir of this 0:15:18.960 --> 0:15:23.800 food critic who is a serial killer cannibalist. It's super 0:15:23.880 --> 0:15:28.240 funny the way that she talks about food and sex 0:15:28.520 --> 0:15:33.760 is like so like beautifully grotesque. Definitely like if you 0:15:33.880 --> 0:15:39.280 enjoy that like sort of unreliable narrator, like evil protagonist, 0:15:39.480 --> 0:15:42.600 I would definitely check that out. And then I don't 0:15:42.600 --> 0:15:44.400 know if it's my favorite of the year, but kind 0:15:44.440 --> 0:15:49.160 of like an influential book through through which I became 0:15:49.200 --> 0:15:52.240 like a book influencer and made several people in my 0:15:52.320 --> 0:15:55.840 life read something was Red White and Royal Blue by 0:15:55.880 --> 0:16:00.680 Casey mcquinston. We're giggling because one this this book came 0:16:00.680 --> 0:16:03.520 out like a few years ago to like it's just 0:16:03.560 --> 0:16:07.320 like the quintessential like queer young adult, like it's not 0:16:07.360 --> 0:16:09.600 a young adult novel, but like new adult is like 0:16:09.640 --> 0:16:13.680 the categorization of what it is. And it was easily 0:16:13.920 --> 0:16:17.120 my book of the year, Like I I can't remember 0:16:17.160 --> 0:16:20.880 the last time I had such a emotional reaction to 0:16:21.000 --> 0:16:23.360 a book and how I really tore through a book. 0:16:23.400 --> 0:16:26.000 But if anyone who doesn't know what Red White and 0:16:26.080 --> 0:16:30.920 Royal Blue is, it's about the bisexual first son of 0:16:30.960 --> 0:16:35.240 the United States falling in love with the gay Prince 0:16:35.320 --> 0:16:38.080 of England and they have like a love affair and 0:16:38.120 --> 0:16:41.720 it's it's a rom com. It's like it has like 0:16:41.800 --> 0:16:44.120 all the tropes that you want, and it's like enemies 0:16:44.160 --> 0:16:48.640 to lovers. There's a fake not relationship, but like they're 0:16:48.680 --> 0:16:51.200 forced together because they have to pretend to be friends 0:16:51.280 --> 0:16:56.160 because of a cake incident. It is just really so many, 0:16:56.280 --> 0:16:59.200 so many components of it should be on paper like 0:16:59.280 --> 0:17:02.200 a bad book, and it is an incredible book all 0:17:02.240 --> 0:17:05.560 the way through. Fran What were your other favorite books 0:17:05.560 --> 0:17:09.760 of the year. I really loved Cleanness by Garth Greenwell, 0:17:09.840 --> 0:17:12.800 which is like an erotic novel that has a really 0:17:12.800 --> 0:17:15.400 gorgeous prose. I think Arth Greenwell writes like the best 0:17:15.400 --> 0:17:18.560 sex scenes on the planet. I also really loved Little 0:17:18.600 --> 0:17:22.119 Devil in America by Heneif Abdura Cybe, which is a 0:17:22.200 --> 0:17:27.920 collection of criticism on black culture in America, starting from 0:17:27.960 --> 0:17:31.600 like things like Soul Train or Michael Jackson or you know, 0:17:31.680 --> 0:17:34.840 a Wreath of Franklin to like, you know, things happening 0:17:34.840 --> 0:17:37.600 in the modern day. I just think that Hennie's writing 0:17:37.600 --> 0:17:40.840 as like a poet is a really beautiful lens on 0:17:41.160 --> 0:17:45.080 cultural criticism. Another book I've I forgot to mention that 0:17:45.119 --> 0:17:47.240 I really loved this year. I don't think that this 0:17:47.280 --> 0:17:48.800 came out this year, but it was one of my 0:17:48.880 --> 0:17:52.920 faves a Dowry of Blood by S. T. Gibson. It's 0:17:52.960 --> 0:17:58.760 about Dracula's brides and it's like super saffic and really 0:17:58.880 --> 0:18:07.680 like beautiful lyrical writing. So if you're into vampires and lesbians, 0:18:08.040 --> 0:18:11.080 which why wouldn't you be? Why wouldn't you check it out? 0:18:11.119 --> 0:18:13.719 It's a it's a nice like little novella. It's probably 0:18:13.760 --> 0:18:17.000 like two pages. The virgins listening. We want to hear 0:18:17.040 --> 0:18:20.159 what your best of was this year. You should like 0:18:20.240 --> 0:18:23.440 tweet at us are getting our Instagram stories about like 0:18:23.920 --> 0:18:26.480 what you were your faiths of the year, Like, I'm 0:18:26.520 --> 0:18:29.560 just curious to see what else is out there? Yeah, 0:18:29.400 --> 0:18:43.760 to tell us we want to know, don't don't don't 0:18:43.800 --> 0:18:50.000 do googled moon Struck to find out what year it is, 0:18:50.440 --> 0:18:53.600 and there you know the section where says people also 0:18:53.680 --> 0:18:56.359 ask the first question is why is moon Struck a 0:18:56.400 --> 0:18:59.480 good movie? Uh? So, I guess that's a that's a 0:18:59.480 --> 0:19:01.880 good way to are our discussion for an excellent primise 0:19:01.920 --> 0:19:05.399 why is moon Struck a good movie? So? The thing 0:19:05.480 --> 0:19:09.920 about Moonstruck, at least upon first watch, is that it 0:19:10.080 --> 0:19:13.600 has all of the ingredients of what you think will 0:19:13.640 --> 0:19:18.600 be a bad movie. It has a kind of bizarre premise. 0:19:18.840 --> 0:19:21.439 It has Share, who you think is not an actress 0:19:21.480 --> 0:19:23.119 if you've never watched Share before, and then you have 0:19:23.160 --> 0:19:27.200 Nicholas Cage, who's kind of like a meme in pop culture. Now, well, 0:19:27.280 --> 0:19:29.200 I don't let's not talk about why people think it's 0:19:29.200 --> 0:19:31.679 a bad movie. Why is it a good movie? Well, 0:19:31.680 --> 0:19:36.080 because it's like maybe one of the most beautiful like 0:19:36.200 --> 0:19:40.080 meditations on like love and fate and like the messiness 0:19:40.119 --> 0:19:42.560 of romance that like I've ever watched in my entire life. 0:19:42.600 --> 0:19:46.000 Why do you think it's a good movie. It's really funny. 0:19:46.320 --> 0:19:51.880 It's a really great slice of life movie, which I love. 0:19:52.280 --> 0:19:55.320 It's kind of structured like a play in a way. 0:19:55.520 --> 0:20:00.520 It's it's a very tight glimpse into a really short 0:20:00.560 --> 0:20:05.720 period of time in one family's life. Very John Patrick Chinley, right, 0:20:06.119 --> 0:20:10.080 I think Moonstruck is definitely remembered as one of the 0:20:10.160 --> 0:20:14.320 greatest films of our lifetimes. And it's a romantic comedy, 0:20:14.320 --> 0:20:17.199 which I don't think, like are not usually elevated in 0:20:17.240 --> 0:20:20.320 the kind of way that moon Struck is. Plus, you've 0:20:20.359 --> 0:20:22.880 never seen Nick Cage in like a Ram Camp. Well, 0:20:22.920 --> 0:20:25.640 actually National Treasure, you know, is kind of a rom 0:20:25.720 --> 0:20:28.720 calm it's a what is the romance between him and 0:20:28.800 --> 0:20:31.119 Treasure Hunt? No, there's a there's a woman in it. 0:20:31.320 --> 0:20:32.800 I don't know, I saw ages ago, but there's a 0:20:32.800 --> 0:20:34.399 woman in it that he like kind of falls in 0:20:34.400 --> 0:20:36.159 love with while as they're like, you know, you know, 0:20:36.240 --> 0:20:41.320 pillaging for Treasure. And I wouldn't call it a romantic comedy. 0:20:41.640 --> 0:20:43.960 I would, I would, I would. I would say National 0:20:43.960 --> 0:20:46.719 Treasure is a romantic comedy for those of you listening 0:20:46.720 --> 0:20:48.919 that maybe haven't watched yet, which is you didn't do 0:20:48.960 --> 0:20:51.160 your homework. But that's okay, that's why you're here. Um, 0:20:51.400 --> 0:20:55.719 should we like loosely go over the plot? Sure? Loretta Casserini, 0:20:56.040 --> 0:20:59.359 she is a widow. She is supposed to be, like 0:20:59.680 --> 0:21:02.760 I guess saw a homely version of share. They like, 0:21:02.920 --> 0:21:08.280 give her gray hair, they's account. She's a woman who, 0:21:08.640 --> 0:21:10.600 you know, kind of feels that life has passed her by, 0:21:10.680 --> 0:21:13.600 so she's not really taking care of herself. Yeah, exactly. 0:21:13.880 --> 0:21:16.119 She lives. She lives at home with her family in 0:21:16.160 --> 0:21:22.720 this frankly incredible house that probably costs millions and millions 0:21:22.720 --> 0:21:24.480 of dollars. I'm so glad you brought it up, because 0:21:24.600 --> 0:21:27.439 it is in fact for sale for the nominal price 0:21:27.520 --> 0:21:31.040 of twelve point three million dollars. And and if any 0:21:31.359 --> 0:21:34.440 daddy's out there listening to this podcast, want to know, 0:21:34.920 --> 0:21:39.359 these turned into like a virgin headquarters part of Brooklyn Heights. 0:21:39.359 --> 0:21:42.159 It's like an a gorgeous location. You're right on the water, 0:21:42.600 --> 0:21:45.600 like it's just it would be so beautiful. Also a 0:21:45.680 --> 0:21:48.639 very important part of the movie is that Share is 0:21:48.680 --> 0:21:50.919 Italian and her family is Italian. I would say that 0:21:51.080 --> 0:21:54.639 is maybe the most important thematic thing about the movie. 0:21:54.760 --> 0:21:57.119 I would disagree by I get what. I would get 0:21:57.119 --> 0:21:59.679 what you're saying. It is about and it is about 0:21:59.680 --> 0:22:02.600 and its Hallians family. Yes, this is about you know, 0:22:02.880 --> 0:22:06.960 Italian culture. So Share is a widow. She is in 0:22:06.960 --> 0:22:12.959 a relationship with Johnny Ary who proposes to her. But 0:22:13.040 --> 0:22:17.159 I'm the worst way, yeah, and the horrible um rotted 0:22:17.480 --> 0:22:19.159 and definitely not how I want to be proposed to, 0:22:19.240 --> 0:22:20.920 even though I don't want to be proposed to. You 0:22:20.960 --> 0:22:24.040 can watch the movie, but like it's painting this picture 0:22:24.080 --> 0:22:27.080 of a woman who has basically conceded to life. Her 0:22:27.359 --> 0:22:30.440 previous husband got hit by a bus, she doesn't really 0:22:30.520 --> 0:22:33.520 kind of believe in love anymore. She's in her thirties, 0:22:33.560 --> 0:22:36.080 which like in this era, like in the eighties, it's like, 0:22:36.440 --> 0:22:38.240 you know, you might as well be dead if you're 0:22:38.320 --> 0:22:40.199 like a woman in your thirty and you're not married. 0:22:40.280 --> 0:22:42.800 Like it's it's just like there's so many different I mean, 0:22:43.000 --> 0:22:46.240 that's also like an Italian American thing. Like she's like 0:22:46.280 --> 0:22:50.000 a failed woman, and so she's found the nearest possible guy, 0:22:50.480 --> 0:22:54.640 this guy Johnny Camerary, who is like a shlub and terrible. Yes, 0:22:54.760 --> 0:22:57.560 but he is a family man, and so he proposes 0:22:57.560 --> 0:22:59.439 to her and then has to go to Italy because 0:22:59.440 --> 0:23:01.600 his mother is dying, and he says, I can't, like 0:23:01.640 --> 0:23:03.800 I need my mother needs to be a part of 0:23:03.880 --> 0:23:06.359 this this well, he says, I can't get married until 0:23:06.920 --> 0:23:11.040 like until my mother is okay, until she dies. Um. 0:23:11.080 --> 0:23:15.240 But before he leaves to Italy, he tells Loretta that 0:23:15.320 --> 0:23:19.160 he needs to reconcile with his brother played by Nicholas 0:23:19.200 --> 0:23:25.280 Cage Ronnie so hot Um before they get married. So 0:23:25.359 --> 0:23:29.800 Loretta has to go and you know, try to help 0:23:30.359 --> 0:23:34.280 mend this rift between the brothers, someone she's never met, 0:23:34.400 --> 0:23:38.200 never met, and spoiler alert, she and Ronnie fall in love. 0:23:38.280 --> 0:23:42.119 They don't just fall in love, they fuck. They have 0:23:42.240 --> 0:23:44.880 like great tack they have. It's well, we will get 0:23:44.920 --> 0:23:47.120 into it. But also while all this is going on, 0:23:47.480 --> 0:23:51.840 we also see Loretta's family life and her mother played 0:23:51.840 --> 0:23:55.320 by olymp You Ducaccus, is feeling you know, slighted by 0:23:55.320 --> 0:23:57.680 her father, which she should because her father is having 0:23:57.680 --> 0:24:00.280 an affair of course. Um it feels like a lot 0:24:00.280 --> 0:24:03.200 of there's a lot of themes of like infidelity, loving 0:24:03.240 --> 0:24:06.400 the wrong people, stuff like that. Yes, and then there's 0:24:06.440 --> 0:24:10.520 also a moon, right, the moon of the primary characters, 0:24:10.560 --> 0:24:14.320 one of the yes as played by the Moon as 0:24:14.320 --> 0:24:17.520 played by um Ariana Grande. No as played by the Moon. 0:24:17.680 --> 0:24:21.040 Oh yeah, the Moon appearing as herself. I just always imagine, 0:24:21.080 --> 0:24:24.560 you know how are like loves the moon. She's a cancer, Yes, 0:24:24.640 --> 0:24:26.880 she's a cancer, and she just you know, the moon 0:24:27.000 --> 0:24:28.680 is like a part of her set or everything. I 0:24:28.680 --> 0:24:30.440 can just see her like little face popping out of 0:24:30.440 --> 0:24:33.040 the moon when like they go, oh look it's Cosmos 0:24:33.080 --> 0:24:34.960 Cosmos moon, and then you just see Ari and she's 0:24:35.000 --> 0:24:42.679 like Unfortunately. I do think that in twenty years someone 0:24:42.680 --> 0:24:45.720 will try to remake Moonstruck, and like probably will cast 0:24:45.720 --> 0:24:49.439 Ariana Grande No. It's gonna be like Beanie Feldstiner something 0:24:49.440 --> 0:24:52.840 like that. But Arianna's Italian, I know, but ari cannot 0:24:52.880 --> 0:24:56.200 pull well. I'm not saying she can do it. I'm 0:24:56.240 --> 0:24:58.920 saying they will probably try to make her do it, 0:24:58.920 --> 0:25:03.760 and no one could possibly ladder up to what Share gives. However, 0:25:03.840 --> 0:25:06.879 I can give camp I think that she would be fine. 0:25:07.960 --> 0:25:09.880 She would have. We have we given a good enough 0:25:09.920 --> 0:25:13.080 explanation of the plot of moonstruct the setup, which I 0:25:13.080 --> 0:25:15.280 think is all shots needed because we can, you know, 0:25:15.400 --> 0:25:19.120 meander through these other parts. It must be said that, um, 0:25:19.160 --> 0:25:22.320 when Johnny, not Ronnie, not Nicolas Cage, but Nicolas Cage's 0:25:22.320 --> 0:25:26.119 brother is taking off on the airport, there's an old 0:25:26.160 --> 0:25:30.080 woman as played by Rose Damn you. Um it is 0:25:30.359 --> 0:25:32.879 literally literally you and there's a old woman. She's like 0:25:32.920 --> 0:25:34.680 looking at the plane as it's leaving. This is back 0:25:34.680 --> 0:25:37.000 in the day pre ninal event, when you could like 0:25:37.040 --> 0:25:39.480 go and like watch people like take flight, you know, 0:25:39.520 --> 0:25:41.560 watch their flights take off or whatever. Watch them to 0:25:41.600 --> 0:25:44.080 five gravity, watch them to via gravity. Yeah, there's an 0:25:44.080 --> 0:25:46.240 old woman that's like, I put a coach on that 0:25:46.359 --> 0:25:49.600 plane on my sister who cheated on me, and she 0:25:49.680 --> 0:25:52.920 her sister and cheat on her sister married the man 0:25:53.040 --> 0:25:55.119 that she had wanted to marry exactly. It's not important. 0:25:55.160 --> 0:25:57.040 It's like a kind of like throw away no, but 0:25:57.080 --> 0:25:59.920 it's a great like the movie is filled with these 0:26:00.160 --> 0:26:03.240 small moments that just stick with you like that they're 0:26:03.280 --> 0:26:08.880 so specific yes and unexpected, and this movie has one 0:26:08.920 --> 0:26:12.280 of the best glow ups of all time. Share, who 0:26:12.320 --> 0:26:15.959 starts the movie looking kind of dowdy, which like for 0:26:16.000 --> 0:26:18.399 any other woman, would be the most glamorous they ever looked, 0:26:18.480 --> 0:26:23.679 and she still looks amazing. Yeah um she So Share 0:26:24.480 --> 0:26:28.320 hooks up with Ronnie and they go to the opera 0:26:28.400 --> 0:26:30.880 together and before that she gets a makeover. Well there's 0:26:30.920 --> 0:26:34.200 some steaks in that too. Basically, Ronnie says, She says, 0:26:34.880 --> 0:26:37.960 this is a cheating We're cheating right now. This will 0:26:38.000 --> 0:26:40.399 never work. We can never speak to each other again. 0:26:40.720 --> 0:26:43.640 And Ronnie says, okay, fine, We're never going to speak 0:26:43.640 --> 0:26:46.280 to each other again one basically like one more time 0:26:46.280 --> 0:26:49.800 with feeling like let's do one last cheaty thing and 0:26:49.880 --> 0:26:52.520 let me take you to the opera. It's like this 0:26:52.680 --> 0:26:56.840 kind of like there's this emotional steak to it where 0:26:56.960 --> 0:26:59.439 Ronnie's like, I'm never going to be happy without you 0:26:59.520 --> 0:27:02.400 in my life and I can't have you, but can 0:27:02.440 --> 0:27:04.760 I have you just for this one night? And so 0:27:05.119 --> 0:27:08.400 Share gives us what is the makeover montage of all 0:27:08.480 --> 0:27:11.480 makeover montages? I mean not of all, but like it's 0:27:11.520 --> 0:27:14.680 a really good makeover. It's not even really like that 0:27:14.760 --> 0:27:17.679 much of a montage. Like you do see her, you know, 0:27:17.760 --> 0:27:19.800 in the chair getting her hair done, her makeup done, 0:27:20.119 --> 0:27:26.520 but it's about the moment when she emerges and is Share. 0:27:26.920 --> 0:27:30.239 She's Share, she is and sheher says in interviews that 0:27:30.280 --> 0:27:33.679 she preferred playing like the dowdier version of Loretta. Like 0:27:33.720 --> 0:27:36.520 she she you know, after the glow up. She you know, 0:27:36.800 --> 0:27:39.200 was having a harder time. She really can inhabit a 0:27:39.280 --> 0:27:42.600 character like That's something that is really beautiful about her 0:27:42.600 --> 0:27:45.640 portrayal of Loretta is even though she has her sherry 0:27:45.720 --> 0:27:47.920 kind of snap out of it like things in it, 0:27:47.960 --> 0:27:51.760 Like it still is not her distinctly. Yeah. I do 0:27:51.920 --> 0:27:54.640 love the scene right after she gets made over where 0:27:54.680 --> 0:27:57.000 she goes home and she's like sitting in front of 0:27:57.000 --> 0:28:01.800 the fire and getting ready. Um, that is my favorite 0:28:01.800 --> 0:28:05.240 scene too. I have to say, like it is essentially 0:28:06.240 --> 0:28:10.480 a sex scene with no one else. She comes home, 0:28:10.560 --> 0:28:13.600 she turns on the fireplace, she pours herself a glass 0:28:13.640 --> 0:28:16.680 of wine like some like you know, sexy like shod 0:28:16.800 --> 0:28:20.680 Day kind of jazz plays she and she's like, literally, 0:28:20.760 --> 0:28:24.280 it's literally us after Black Friday, like opening up her 0:28:24.760 --> 0:28:27.159 all the things she bought for herself. She's a dragon 0:28:27.359 --> 0:28:29.439 looking at all the wealth that she's hoarded, and you 0:28:29.480 --> 0:28:31.800 know not to go to earnest too quickly. But like 0:28:31.920 --> 0:28:36.240 that scene actually I think encapsulates like my favorite element 0:28:36.320 --> 0:28:39.360 of the film, which is like a story that is 0:28:39.400 --> 0:28:43.160 actually about coming into your own and falling in love 0:28:43.240 --> 0:28:46.959 with yourself again. Like the Portrait of Loretta is like 0:28:47.040 --> 0:28:50.040 this woman who has she's a wolf, as they say 0:28:50.040 --> 0:28:52.640 in the film, like she has like she's been down 0:28:52.640 --> 0:28:55.200 on her luck. She doesn't really believe in magic or 0:28:55.280 --> 0:28:58.360 love anymore. She doesn't really think that she deserves nice things. 0:28:58.680 --> 0:29:01.400 And now a decade after her lover has died, she 0:29:01.520 --> 0:29:04.120 finally has this like hot guy that's really into her, 0:29:04.160 --> 0:29:06.360 that's swept her off her feet in an unexpected way, 0:29:06.360 --> 0:29:09.480 and she's like, oh, I am actually desirable. There's this 0:29:09.600 --> 0:29:12.200 very funny scene as she just is exiting the make 0:29:12.240 --> 0:29:14.880 of her montage where a bunch of construction workers like 0:29:14.920 --> 0:29:17.960 kind of cat call her and she goes like who me, 0:29:18.240 --> 0:29:21.719 Like like, are you sure? Like it's kind of this like, oh, 0:29:21.840 --> 0:29:24.880 I forgot what it feels like to be attractive. So 0:29:24.920 --> 0:29:26.880 when she sits down with her like you know, Chanel 0:29:27.000 --> 0:29:31.240 shoes or whatever the her Revlon like it's so beautiful. Yeah, 0:29:31.400 --> 0:29:34.600 I really want to have that kind of share a 0:29:34.640 --> 0:29:39.240 moment like not even like a makeover or like buying 0:29:39.320 --> 0:29:41.320 something that makes me feel better about myself, but like 0:29:41.720 --> 0:29:45.800 that moment where you realize that you are a like 0:29:45.960 --> 0:29:51.000 embodied sexual being. I really want that for myself this 0:29:51.240 --> 0:29:53.960 um like holiday season, that's what that's the energy I'm 0:29:53.960 --> 0:29:58.080 bringing into Yes, that is that is And there's even 0:29:58.120 --> 0:30:00.920 after like when you know, she turns on the fireplace 0:30:00.920 --> 0:30:03.200 and she pours herself a glass of point, she goes 0:30:03.320 --> 0:30:06.680 over to the mirror and she looks at herself like 0:30:07.360 --> 0:30:10.120 like it's like sex. It did kind of remind me 0:30:10.240 --> 0:30:12.880 of the scene in the House of Gucci as Mauriceo 0:30:12.880 --> 0:30:15.760 Gucci is getting killed when Gaga's in the bath, and 0:30:15.800 --> 0:30:20.040 it kind of reads as if she's like masturbating to 0:30:20.200 --> 0:30:24.040 the thought of her estranged husband being murdered. There are 0:30:24.360 --> 0:30:28.480 actually a lot of side by sides between like House 0:30:28.520 --> 0:30:30.480 of Gucci and Moonstruck. Did you notice, I mean you 0:30:30.560 --> 0:30:32.680 you're kind of alluding to these, like, yeah, well, I 0:30:32.720 --> 0:30:37.080 do think like Gaga and Share doing similar things in 0:30:37.120 --> 0:30:40.000 these roles, or like I do think the House of 0:30:40.040 --> 0:30:44.680 Gucci is kind of like Gaga's Moonstruck. Yeah, okay, we'll 0:30:44.680 --> 0:30:48.440 get into the movie comparisons, but on that actually, I mean, 0:30:48.520 --> 0:30:51.760 obviously I'm not saying like Gaga's copying Shure, but Gaga 0:30:51.920 --> 0:30:55.040 is in shares lineage when she goes from the pop 0:30:55.080 --> 0:31:00.160 star to award winning actress, you know, elevation like that 0:31:00.320 --> 0:31:03.520 is like absolutely you see those you know how those 0:31:03.520 --> 0:31:06.280 are blossoming together and they're both doing like Gaga is 0:31:06.320 --> 0:31:09.720 doing it I think beautifully. But like with this movie specifically, 0:31:10.480 --> 0:31:14.280 when the trailer dropped, everyone's making fun of Gaga, you 0:31:14.280 --> 0:31:16.800 know what I mean, Everyone's like, you know, dragging the accent. 0:31:16.840 --> 0:31:19.520 They're like, this is gonna be so camp. When Moonstruck, 0:31:19.560 --> 0:31:23.680 like the premier of Moonstruck was like happening, Like SHARE's 0:31:23.800 --> 0:31:26.640 name would come on the credit scene and the audience 0:31:26.680 --> 0:31:29.440 would laugh at her, and then who had the last laugh? 0:31:30.000 --> 0:31:34.480 She did exactly. It's this moment where you've been a caricature, 0:31:34.560 --> 0:31:36.360 because to be a pop star, to be a woman 0:31:36.400 --> 0:31:38.200 and a pop star, is to be a character. You 0:31:38.200 --> 0:31:41.520 have to constantly force this, like you know, archetype of yourself, 0:31:41.640 --> 0:31:43.920 often changing your identity over and over again just to 0:31:44.000 --> 0:31:47.960 like stay in the business. But like people you know 0:31:48.000 --> 0:31:50.560 don't want to take those archetypes seriously, like Madonna or 0:31:50.640 --> 0:31:53.240 Share or Gaga, And so when they decigned to do 0:31:53.320 --> 0:31:55.280 something serious, all of a sudden, everyone's like, no, you 0:31:55.320 --> 0:31:58.120 can't do that. Yeah, well okay, so you, of the 0:31:58.160 --> 0:32:01.080 two of us, you are the share her Storian. I 0:32:01.120 --> 0:32:03.240 love Share, but you love Share on a on a 0:32:03.480 --> 0:32:07.440 level that I cannot even like think of as sending to. 0:32:07.920 --> 0:32:11.960 So where where was Share in her life and her 0:32:12.000 --> 0:32:16.960 career when Moonstruck came along? Okay, so basically it had 0:32:17.000 --> 0:32:21.560 been Oh, I guess her and Sunny broke up seventy nine, 0:32:21.720 --> 0:32:24.760 I think, and this movie took place in eight seven, 0:32:25.360 --> 0:32:30.880 um between seventy nine and early eighties. She re emerged 0:32:30.960 --> 0:32:33.960 as a solo pop star pretty quickly. Um or actually 0:32:34.040 --> 0:32:36.800 not quickly. She had a few flops and then everyone 0:32:36.880 --> 0:32:39.160 was like, oh, no, Share is just share. We forgot 0:32:39.200 --> 0:32:43.480 about Sonny. Sonny dies. I think a year or two 0:32:43.520 --> 0:32:47.160 before Moonstruck comes out, and it actually should be said, 0:32:47.200 --> 0:32:52.600 I was reading recently that this movie was very hot 0:32:52.640 --> 0:32:56.720 off the tails of shares appearance on The Letterman Show, 0:32:56.760 --> 0:32:59.320 the very iconic one that has like I think, recirculated 0:32:59.360 --> 0:33:02.720 a lot on share Twitter, which I am on, wherein 0:33:02.880 --> 0:33:06.280 she calls Letterman an asshole because he's being a fucking 0:33:06.280 --> 0:33:08.440 asshole and doing what Letterman always does, which is ask 0:33:08.520 --> 0:33:11.560 women about people they've slept with or plastic surgery or 0:33:11.600 --> 0:33:14.080 like whatever. You know. It was kind of a viral 0:33:14.120 --> 0:33:18.920 moment proceeding viral media, and so this version of share 0:33:18.960 --> 0:33:22.120 where she's kind of like, never gonna let men do 0:33:22.200 --> 0:33:26.040 that to her in a public place. I hesitant, hesitate 0:33:26.080 --> 0:33:28.520 to say like feminist, but like that kind of component 0:33:28.560 --> 0:33:30.840 of like I'm not going to let you say that 0:33:30.880 --> 0:33:33.480 to me. Kind of share, this share that you know, 0:33:33.520 --> 0:33:35.959 we'll never let you live it down is coming out 0:33:36.040 --> 0:33:37.800 right at this time. Everyone's seeing this side of So 0:33:38.040 --> 0:33:41.120 is this does this predate the mom I am a 0:33:41.240 --> 0:33:44.680 rich Man moment? It does predate the mom I am 0:33:44.720 --> 0:33:47.320 a rich So this is really like the genesis of 0:33:47.400 --> 0:33:50.760 share kind of becoming the share we know today. She 0:33:50.840 --> 0:33:54.320 did already have anom for silk Wood, where she played 0:33:54.360 --> 0:33:58.720 Meryl Streep's lesbian roommate. I have never seen Silkwood. I 0:33:58.720 --> 0:34:01.640 will have to really need it on it um. Then 0:34:01.840 --> 0:34:03.960 she had been in a few other flop movies silk 0:34:04.000 --> 0:34:05.720 What she got an arm And this was the year 0:34:05.720 --> 0:34:08.200 it was, which is of Eastwick? It was also eight seven? 0:34:08.480 --> 0:34:11.120 Oh wow, so which is it? Eastwick and Moonstrauck came 0:34:11.120 --> 0:34:14.319 out in the same year. Yeah, I guess probably the 0:34:14.360 --> 0:34:16.680 two film roles that Share is best known for. And 0:34:16.760 --> 0:34:21.319 so with this movie specifically, they really didn't think it 0:34:21.400 --> 0:34:23.759 was going to transcend, Like they only spent fifteen mill 0:34:23.920 --> 0:34:27.160 on it. Olympia Ducoccus said in interviews later, she was like, 0:34:27.160 --> 0:34:29.120 this movie is going to be a flop. She thought 0:34:29.120 --> 0:34:30.400 this movie was going to be a flop, and she 0:34:30.440 --> 0:34:33.520 talked about it with actors on set. Um And the 0:34:33.520 --> 0:34:36.239 movie was one of the highest grossing films of the year, 0:34:36.600 --> 0:34:39.080 and Share won an Oscar for it, and it didn't 0:34:39.080 --> 0:34:42.120 win Best Picture. It won Best Screenplay. Okay, I don't 0:34:42.120 --> 0:34:45.040 think it was nominated for Best Picture, which, like it 0:34:45.080 --> 0:34:48.440 makes sense because I think the writing is part of 0:34:48.480 --> 0:34:51.799 what mad like. Obviously, the performances are what we remember, 0:34:52.120 --> 0:34:54.520 but the writing and the story, Like when I say 0:34:54.560 --> 0:34:57.160 that it has the same kind of structure as a play, 0:34:57.280 --> 0:35:00.120 I do think like it comes down to like the 0:35:00.200 --> 0:35:03.040 language and the way the story is told, and how 0:35:03.160 --> 0:35:05.200 One thing that really struck me when I saw it 0:35:05.239 --> 0:35:11.480 is how these really dramatic things are happening, but people 0:35:11.680 --> 0:35:15.000 are not reacting to them in melodramatic ways. Like it 0:35:15.120 --> 0:35:20.320 really it feels so lived in and so real. Um 0:35:20.360 --> 0:35:24.439 Like at the end when um Olympiodococcus says to Share, 0:35:24.520 --> 0:35:26.360 like do you love him, Loretta, and she says I do, 0:35:26.400 --> 0:35:29.359 and she says like what did she feel? Like, it's like, 0:35:29.400 --> 0:35:31.839 oh that's too bad. Yeah, you know, like it's so 0:35:32.920 --> 0:35:52.800 it's so grounded in this family feels real. It also 0:35:52.880 --> 0:35:55.279 has to be said that another thing that you and 0:35:55.320 --> 0:35:57.560 I respond to in the in the in the vein 0:35:57.600 --> 0:36:01.360 of what you're talking about is the wolf feness of 0:36:01.400 --> 0:36:04.680 all of the characters, Like there's this inside you. There 0:36:04.680 --> 0:36:07.480 are two wolves. One of them is Share and the 0:36:07.520 --> 0:36:11.520 other one is also Share. Yeah. Yeah, Well the film 0:36:11.600 --> 0:36:13.640 used to be called it was called The Bride and 0:36:13.680 --> 0:36:16.120 the Wolf or whatever, before it was called Moonstruck, And 0:36:16.160 --> 0:36:18.040 it comes from this conversation in the sex scene that 0:36:18.120 --> 0:36:20.760 Rose was talking about earlier, where they say you're a wolf, 0:36:21.280 --> 0:36:24.960 and um, there's this iconic line where she says, not Loretta, 0:36:25.040 --> 0:36:28.360 but Loretta's I guess. Aunt says I've seen a wolf 0:36:28.440 --> 0:36:31.200 and every man I ever met, and I say, a 0:36:31.280 --> 0:36:34.120 wolf in me you, and like the motif of the 0:36:34.160 --> 0:36:38.600 wolf is used as this downtrodden person, like someone who 0:36:38.880 --> 0:36:42.640 has been so kind of like hardened by life that 0:36:42.840 --> 0:36:47.880 they have these underwhelmed like this kind of like monotony 0:36:48.040 --> 0:36:50.759 reaction to anything that happens, even if it is like 0:36:51.040 --> 0:36:54.400 mystical and magical and and love like because I don't know, 0:36:54.400 --> 0:36:55.719 I would warrant to say that you and I are 0:36:55.800 --> 0:36:58.440 kind of jaded by life a little bit, like I 0:36:58.480 --> 0:37:01.400 think that you and I are, you know, always like 0:37:01.520 --> 0:37:04.880 in a very stupid way, being like love doesn't exist 0:37:05.000 --> 0:37:08.200 like man suck blah blah blah, but like it comes 0:37:08.520 --> 0:37:11.719 it comes from a place, a specific place of like 0:37:12.040 --> 0:37:14.520 how you or I grew up. And I guess in 0:37:14.600 --> 0:37:17.919 this moment, like how Shares character came to Fruition. Before 0:37:17.920 --> 0:37:22.760 we met the character herself, I did um as someone 0:37:22.800 --> 0:37:25.680 who had heard about this movie and seen the way 0:37:25.719 --> 0:37:28.279 that it permeated pop culture for so long, but never 0:37:28.320 --> 0:37:31.560 actually sat down and watched it. When I did watch it, 0:37:31.560 --> 0:37:37.120 it felt like it slotted itself into like my identity 0:37:37.360 --> 0:37:41.840 so quickly. So the first time you ever watched the movie, 0:37:42.520 --> 0:37:45.040 what what was the thing that you kind of immediately 0:37:45.160 --> 0:37:47.680 latched onto, Like what component of it where you were like, 0:37:47.680 --> 0:37:50.560 aside from obviously share which takes up a lot of space, 0:37:50.600 --> 0:37:53.799 and like the reasons that someone might watch Moonstruck, Like 0:37:54.520 --> 0:37:57.000 what did you come away with that affected it, that 0:37:57.080 --> 0:38:00.680 made it? I just I don't know I can break 0:38:00.680 --> 0:38:02.960 it down to one thing. I really do think it's 0:38:02.960 --> 0:38:09.520 a perfect movie. Um, and it feels so warm. I 0:38:09.560 --> 0:38:12.360 agree it's a perfect movie. I'm obviously very prone to 0:38:12.440 --> 0:38:16.440 exaggeration and hyperbole, but I do think that it's perfect. 0:38:16.640 --> 0:38:19.480 And when I made me laugh, it made me cry. 0:38:19.920 --> 0:38:23.120 It feels like it's like that that video of Gwyneth Paltrow. 0:38:23.520 --> 0:38:26.440 I laughed, I cried, I had a shot, you know, 0:38:26.600 --> 0:38:30.640 like it is. It is the full range of human 0:38:30.640 --> 0:38:35.120 emotions in one film. Generally speaking, I I do love 0:38:35.200 --> 0:38:39.800 things that strike that balance between like absurdist and camp 0:38:40.080 --> 0:38:44.359 and like kind of even quote unquote bad when someone 0:38:44.400 --> 0:38:46.640 says is like, why is this movie good? Why this 0:38:46.680 --> 0:38:49.799 movie bad? Whatever? Um, And also happens to be like 0:38:49.920 --> 0:38:52.600 very emotionally resonant at the end, like I think that 0:38:52.719 --> 0:38:54.880 the thing that it teaches you is really beautiful. But 0:38:54.920 --> 0:38:56.920 I which we'll get into, But I have to say, 0:38:56.920 --> 0:38:58.440 when I first watched this movie, I was like a 0:38:58.440 --> 0:39:01.480 freshman in college, had no idea what to expect. Was 0:39:01.520 --> 0:39:03.920 blown away by the idea that share In Nicolas Cage 0:39:03.960 --> 0:39:05.799 are in a movie together. I think that's the most 0:39:05.840 --> 0:39:09.160 common reaction, at least now. Well, this is at such 0:39:09.200 --> 0:39:14.600 an early stage of Nicolas Cage's career, and like I guess, 0:39:14.600 --> 0:39:17.480 from what you're saying, a kind of weird midway point 0:39:17.640 --> 0:39:22.239 in shares or like a transitional point. Um. I do 0:39:22.280 --> 0:39:24.839 think this is the one time Nicolas Cage has ever 0:39:24.880 --> 0:39:27.960 been hot, absolutely, and he is very hot. He is 0:39:28.000 --> 0:39:30.840 like if he had to peek and only be hot once, 0:39:31.520 --> 0:39:35.759 this was it. Because he is so fucking sexy in 0:39:35.800 --> 0:39:39.480 a way that is like still kind of gross. Like 0:39:39.600 --> 0:39:41.960 the first scene where she goes into the basement of 0:39:42.000 --> 0:39:44.560 the bakery. You know that Chrissie gave me the big 0:39:44.560 --> 0:39:50.600 bring me the Big night, Ronnie the sexual chemistry they have. 0:39:52.040 --> 0:39:54.839 I mean, of course, like how could you not have 0:39:54.920 --> 0:39:59.520 that with share Um? But I really do think that 0:39:59.680 --> 0:40:06.880 this their their love scene is the best romantic, sexy 0:40:07.120 --> 0:40:10.879 love scene I've ever seen. And it's bizarre as well. Yeah, 0:40:10.880 --> 0:40:14.960 it's weird, it's weird her cooking him the steak, and 0:40:16.320 --> 0:40:19.640 it's just and and like the melodrama of it, the 0:40:20.080 --> 0:40:23.640 uh I don't care, take me, take me the movie 0:40:23.719 --> 0:40:29.040 likes to the thing about I guess talking about like 0:40:29.280 --> 0:40:32.000 camp in this film or like John Patrick Shanley's kind 0:40:32.040 --> 0:40:37.160 of love for exaggeration is that so many he takes 0:40:37.239 --> 0:40:40.400 all these tropes from rom coms and romances we've already 0:40:40.520 --> 0:40:43.919 seen and you kind of like inflates them a little 0:40:43.960 --> 0:40:46.640 bit and makes them like bizarre and weird. And so 0:40:47.000 --> 0:40:49.160 you know, in that sex scene, like Nick Cage like 0:40:49.440 --> 0:40:51.640 swoops her off her feet in a way that feels 0:40:51.680 --> 0:40:54.880 like almost like the scene was like overblocked, like or 0:40:54.920 --> 0:40:58.080 like they were doing it. And again it is like play. 0:40:58.160 --> 0:41:00.279 It feels like it feels like it feels like they 0:41:00.320 --> 0:41:03.880 are playing to the back of the house and in 0:41:03.880 --> 0:41:06.759 in a scene that is shot very intimately. And then 0:41:06.760 --> 0:41:09.439 it also like the script also loves like these ham 0:41:09.520 --> 0:41:12.399 fisted metaphors, like in the scene in the Bakery where 0:41:12.440 --> 0:41:17.000 like Nick Cage goes, He's like, and I big bread, bread, bread, 0:41:17.040 --> 0:41:18.840 and I still get in it out of this hot 0:41:18.880 --> 0:41:21.960 hole every day, like he says that, And like John 0:41:22.000 --> 0:41:24.239 Petrick Chanley knows what he's doing when he said, like 0:41:24.440 --> 0:41:27.880 when he when they say, like, you're a bride without 0:41:27.880 --> 0:41:30.239 a head, a wolf without a foot, and then he 0:41:30.280 --> 0:41:32.799 sweeps her off her feet for no reason, like he 0:41:32.880 --> 0:41:35.520 knows that that's weird. And I think that part of 0:41:35.560 --> 0:41:38.959 the reason that people say, wait, this is a bad 0:41:39.000 --> 0:41:42.040 movie is because they don't understand how self aware of 0:41:42.040 --> 0:41:45.719 the script actually do people say it's a bad movie, Yes, absolutely. 0:41:45.760 --> 0:41:48.560 I think a lot of people don't understand that this 0:41:48.600 --> 0:41:51.400 film is legitimately good. There's a kind of, you know, 0:41:51.480 --> 0:41:54.440 a whole caravan of people, especially like gay gays, that 0:41:54.480 --> 0:41:56.239 are like, oh my god, it's so bad it's good, 0:41:56.280 --> 0:41:58.160 which I love things that are so bad it's good. 0:41:58.160 --> 0:42:00.040 But that's not I guess I just like, how have 0:42:00.080 --> 0:42:02.799 been engaged with that part of it. I have only 0:42:02.840 --> 0:42:09.799 interacted with people who genuinely love this movie. I think 0:42:09.800 --> 0:42:13.160 the movie has like a like some beautiful like lessons 0:42:13.160 --> 0:42:16.080 and themes that kind of come from what are there 0:42:16.120 --> 0:42:20.880 the idea of being a wolf without a foot? Like 0:42:20.960 --> 0:42:26.120 the monologue comes through because Share makes some presumptions about 0:42:26.200 --> 0:42:28.799 like Nick Cage's former former romantic life, which in the 0:42:28.800 --> 0:42:31.640 movie it's like his hand got chopped off by a 0:42:31.680 --> 0:42:34.680 bread slicer and then his wife left him because he 0:42:34.760 --> 0:42:37.720 wasn't paying attention because he was distracted by his brother, 0:42:37.800 --> 0:42:41.000 which is like why there's a rift between them, right 0:42:41.080 --> 0:42:43.319 and she kind of like pull She kind of says 0:42:43.400 --> 0:42:46.080 right away, look like you're jaded by life. You've done 0:42:46.080 --> 0:42:48.399 this to yourself, Like it's not about your hand, This 0:42:48.440 --> 0:42:50.879 isn't about your hand, this is about you. And Nick 0:42:50.920 --> 0:42:53.319 Cage spins it around. He's like, you're doing the exact 0:42:53.400 --> 0:42:55.920 same thing since you your husband died a decade ago. 0:42:56.480 --> 0:42:59.040 You know, they kind of like see each other's like 0:43:00.080 --> 0:43:03.160 hurt or like they're kind of like tortured romantic past lives, 0:43:03.520 --> 0:43:06.640 and that is like what makes them decide to have sex, 0:43:06.719 --> 0:43:08.440 you know what I mean. It's like the fact that 0:43:08.960 --> 0:43:11.760 Share couldn't Share didn't have anything in common with Johnny 0:43:11.760 --> 0:43:15.399 because her actual fiance because he's an idiot and he's 0:43:15.400 --> 0:43:18.680 lived a charmed life, but she also seems to be 0:43:18.760 --> 0:43:23.000 like a marriage of not convenience. But she's settling, yeah, 0:43:23.120 --> 0:43:26.360 you know, definitely settling. Yeah yeah, but that's I think. 0:43:26.480 --> 0:43:31.240 My favorite thing about this film is like, um, Sharon 0:43:31.320 --> 0:43:34.360 Nicolas Cage, like they get spoiler, they get together in 0:43:34.400 --> 0:43:36.200 the end and they get they said they're going to 0:43:36.239 --> 0:43:40.200 get married. Um, they're probably not a great match for marriage, 0:43:40.360 --> 0:43:42.719 you know what I mean? Like they may not. Actually 0:43:43.040 --> 0:43:44.880 if you think about, like if there were a sequel, 0:43:45.080 --> 0:43:46.840 like I don't think they would last as a couple. 0:43:47.120 --> 0:43:50.040 I do. Well, Okay, we should get into that. But 0:43:50.320 --> 0:43:53.000 my point is it's it actually the London. Whether the 0:43:53.080 --> 0:43:57.279 relationship works or not has nothing to do with to me, 0:43:57.600 --> 0:43:59.880 the key lesson, of the crucial lesson of the film, 0:44:00.000 --> 0:44:03.319 which is that Share is falling in love with herself 0:44:03.440 --> 0:44:07.320 and Ronnie happens to be a vehicle for that because 0:44:07.320 --> 0:44:10.439 she's finally doing something that she just wants to do 0:44:10.760 --> 0:44:13.640 instead of settling for something she has to. I also 0:44:13.760 --> 0:44:18.480 think that if we're gonna like fan fictionify Moonstruck and 0:44:18.520 --> 0:44:22.000 think about what would happen next, Like there is something 0:44:22.000 --> 0:44:27.000 about like the cycle of what happens in families, and 0:44:27.120 --> 0:44:32.000 maybe like after Moonstruck, like she and Ronnie will end 0:44:32.080 --> 0:44:34.520 up in this situation that her parents are in where 0:44:34.520 --> 0:44:37.560 her dad's cheating on her mom, and like eventually she's like, 0:44:37.800 --> 0:44:40.440 knock it off and they come back together because they 0:44:40.440 --> 0:44:45.239 do think there's a tension in Moonstruck between responsibility and 0:44:45.280 --> 0:44:50.440 passion and how those things play out in families, because 0:44:50.480 --> 0:44:53.720 you know, the father is having this affair with this woman, 0:44:54.520 --> 0:44:58.880 and you know his wife like doesn't leave him. Um, 0:44:58.960 --> 0:45:02.200 she just kind of remind him like you you know, 0:45:02.520 --> 0:45:05.160 you're my husband, like, you know, knock it off. Well, 0:45:05.200 --> 0:45:09.960 she says, well, first of all, she um Olympia Ducoccus. 0:45:10.200 --> 0:45:12.560 After we're finding out that her husband is cheating on her, 0:45:12.600 --> 0:45:15.160 goes on like a very innocent kind of dinner date 0:45:15.239 --> 0:45:18.440 with the Fraser guy or whatever. And in this conversation 0:45:19.160 --> 0:45:22.080 the dad from the dad from Fraser um And in 0:45:22.160 --> 0:45:25.439 this conversation she goes, she's thinking about her husband cheating 0:45:25.440 --> 0:45:27.920 on he and she goes, why do men chase women? 0:45:28.520 --> 0:45:30.520 And he has this like kind of long like me 0:45:30.600 --> 0:45:33.360 and you're an answer about like you know whatever, something stupid, 0:45:33.400 --> 0:45:35.560 and she goes, I think it's because they fear death 0:45:36.239 --> 0:45:39.920 and like, which is so true. It is absolutely true, 0:45:40.120 --> 0:45:46.200 you know, I think about it's so true. The thrill 0:45:46.239 --> 0:45:51.520 of the chase is it's literally a production of testosterone 0:45:51.680 --> 0:45:54.960 because before I transitioned, the way I thought about sex 0:45:55.080 --> 0:45:59.480 was just about hunting it down and finding it, and 0:45:59.520 --> 0:46:04.800 then the actual act itself was always like kind of anticlimactic, 0:46:05.040 --> 0:46:08.280 considering it's a climax every time. Um, it was really 0:46:08.320 --> 0:46:12.440 about the hunt, and like I was so much more 0:46:13.160 --> 0:46:17.920 of a predator not a predator. Um, I mean that 0:46:18.040 --> 0:46:20.480 is why when men the actual answer to why men 0:46:20.560 --> 0:46:23.520 chase women is because they're all predators. Like yeah, but 0:46:23.840 --> 0:46:28.560 it's it's true, like there is this like biological imperative 0:46:28.719 --> 0:46:34.120 in men two hunt for sex like a wolf, and 0:46:34.400 --> 0:46:40.640 I like that Share in this movie like finds that 0:46:40.800 --> 0:46:44.760 impulse within her to like be the wolf. Despite being 0:46:44.840 --> 0:46:48.480 so much about like this traditional Italian American family. It 0:46:48.600 --> 0:46:52.000 subverts this idea of fidelity and in the end, like 0:46:52.080 --> 0:46:55.319 cheaters actually do prosper you know what I mean. I 0:46:55.400 --> 0:46:59.759 love about it and it's really like, um, that's like 0:47:00.239 --> 0:47:05.200 you know, like the film ends with the man who 0:47:05.280 --> 0:47:09.200 Share has cheated on being welcomed into the family. Because 0:47:09.200 --> 0:47:11.560 she is now in love with his brother. And the 0:47:11.880 --> 0:47:16.800 end the movie is like as one big, happy, dysfunctional family, 0:47:16.920 --> 0:47:21.520 and that feels really realistic. You know, families are complicated 0:47:21.560 --> 0:47:24.760 and fucked up and people make bad decisions and life 0:47:24.760 --> 0:47:28.279 goes on, which brings me to my favorite moment in 0:47:28.320 --> 0:47:31.279 the entire film and the scene that I do have 0:47:31.440 --> 0:47:35.400 tattooed on my leg, which is when Share and Nicolas 0:47:35.480 --> 0:47:38.320 Cage have this. Basically, they've gone to the opera together. 0:47:38.760 --> 0:47:41.839 Share is very moved by the opera. She catches her 0:47:41.920 --> 0:47:44.920 dad cheating with this woman that kind of puts her 0:47:44.920 --> 0:47:47.160 on a mental spin about her own infidelity and what 0:47:47.280 --> 0:47:50.839 she's doing with Nicolas Cage, and so they have this 0:47:50.960 --> 0:47:54.239 argument about love and why and Share is kind of 0:47:54.280 --> 0:47:57.600 being like, we shouldn't be doing this, and Nicholas Cage 0:47:57.680 --> 0:48:02.480 says love isn't perfect like stars are perfect, snowflakes are perfect, 0:48:02.560 --> 0:48:07.000 Like love is not supposed to be this like perfect 0:48:07.040 --> 0:48:09.160 picture that you see at the end of a rom com. 0:48:09.200 --> 0:48:12.239 It's supposed to be messy and we're supposed to love 0:48:12.400 --> 0:48:16.279 the wrong people. And that's why I love this movie, 0:48:16.360 --> 0:48:19.680 is like there is something to take away from the 0:48:19.840 --> 0:48:22.759 ways and the kind of molds that we fit our 0:48:22.800 --> 0:48:25.960 own stories into because that's what you're supposed to do. 0:48:26.040 --> 0:48:29.520 You're not supposed to cheat on your partner. But they 0:48:29.560 --> 0:48:34.280 are actually so many reasons, like for specific people's specific 0:48:34.320 --> 0:48:37.680 lives why actually would be very legitimately rational to like 0:48:37.719 --> 0:48:39.920 cheat on your partner or to fall in love with 0:48:39.960 --> 0:48:43.120 someone new. That is, that could be the actual better 0:48:43.239 --> 0:48:46.160 route for you. You could have a better partner by cheating, 0:48:46.520 --> 0:48:49.719 And that doesn't make it right, but that does make 0:48:49.719 --> 0:48:52.399 it an essential part of your destiny, which I think 0:48:52.520 --> 0:48:55.279 is like the motif of the moon is like the 0:48:55.280 --> 0:48:59.440 moon is about mysticism and serendipity and things just kind 0:48:59.480 --> 0:49:27.360 of happening and being beautiful. Have you ever been cheated 0:49:27.360 --> 0:49:31.240 on or been a cheater? I've never been cheated on. However, 0:49:31.440 --> 0:49:36.040 I have been the other woman seven times. That's a 0:49:36.080 --> 0:49:40.240 lot of times. But I you know, that's it wasn't 0:49:40.680 --> 0:49:42.759 I mean, I would say a lot of it was 0:49:42.800 --> 0:49:45.239 when I was in college, and some of it was 0:49:45.280 --> 0:49:47.839 with the same They were at least two of these 0:49:47.880 --> 0:49:53.080 people where they cheated on multiple boyfriends with me, which 0:49:53.120 --> 0:49:55.040 is I mean, I'm not like proud as I but 0:49:55.120 --> 0:49:57.320 at the time I was like very like that's on them, 0:49:57.320 --> 0:49:59.680 like this is about them, this is about you. Absolutely 0:49:59.719 --> 0:50:05.960 are have also been the other woman, yeah, to to 0:50:07.520 --> 0:50:11.280 married men. I've been the other woman to one married 0:50:11.280 --> 0:50:15.400 man in situations where both like I knew what was 0:50:15.440 --> 0:50:18.600 going on or like phone out after the fact, or 0:50:18.680 --> 0:50:25.600 like it was just kind of implied and it's it's 0:50:25.640 --> 0:50:29.640 really complicated, and you know you you I have certainly 0:50:29.680 --> 0:50:32.560 never asked about it. Yeah, I don't either. You kind 0:50:32.560 --> 0:50:34.640 of avoid it to like because you don't. You don't 0:50:34.800 --> 0:50:38.280 you don't know what people's situations are. Although I certainly 0:50:38.320 --> 0:50:40.960 think I don't think in any of the scenarios I've 0:50:41.000 --> 0:50:44.080 been in, like these people were in an open relationship. 0:50:44.719 --> 0:50:48.000 I think as as you know, queer people in one, 0:50:48.800 --> 0:50:52.880 hopefully we're not getting into situations where anyone's cheating because 0:50:53.400 --> 0:50:58.200 we are, you know, in open relationships or have partners 0:50:58.239 --> 0:51:01.160 who are like polyamorous or you know, whatever the situation is. 0:51:01.560 --> 0:51:07.160 But even in open relationships, like there can still be 0:51:07.960 --> 0:51:10.560 in fidelity. And I think really what it comes down 0:51:10.560 --> 0:51:14.799 to is is lying to your partner. It is and 0:51:14.840 --> 0:51:17.760 that is like the crucial it's kind of a loophole 0:51:17.760 --> 0:51:21.800 in the film is that like sure doesn't necessarily lie 0:51:22.200 --> 0:51:24.600 to Johnny to get to where she is. She's just 0:51:24.680 --> 0:51:28.120 kind of like circumnavigated, I guess the truth to get 0:51:28.160 --> 0:51:31.920 to that moment, the full circle of that old woman 0:51:31.960 --> 0:51:34.120 as played by you Rose Doamu casting the curse on 0:51:34.120 --> 0:51:37.799 the plane that Johnny is on. She basically like says, 0:51:37.800 --> 0:51:39.600 I put across on that plane, it's going to crash 0:51:39.600 --> 0:51:41.720 and burn or whatever, and shares like I don't believe 0:51:41.760 --> 0:51:45.320 in curses. Um, the fact that she cursed the plane, 0:51:45.360 --> 0:51:48.719 that the curse came true, Johnny's wife basically cheated on 0:51:48.800 --> 0:51:51.680 him and left him. It's like the curse kind of manifested, 0:51:51.680 --> 0:51:54.400 and what is the perfect ending? So full circle is 0:51:54.440 --> 0:51:58.360 so full circle? Well, I've never been in a monogamous 0:51:58.400 --> 0:52:04.319 relationship before, so I've never been a cheater. I've had 0:52:04.400 --> 0:52:07.799 partners who I've been dishonest too, and I think that 0:52:07.880 --> 0:52:13.800 can be as devastating in relationships as infidelity, if not worse. Honestly, 0:52:14.239 --> 0:52:16.560 I think that a lot of like especially in like 0:52:16.680 --> 0:52:21.560 sis hetero relationships, like infidelity is like this like a okay, 0:52:21.560 --> 0:52:24.560 it's over, like fuck you, Like that's a final straw, 0:52:24.680 --> 0:52:26.400 Like there's no way you can stay together after the 0:52:26.480 --> 0:52:29.399 cheating happens, and like that's just, like, to me, such 0:52:29.400 --> 0:52:32.960 a limiting way to think about your relationship. It's also 0:52:33.040 --> 0:52:37.520 not realistic. I think, like I would imagine that most 0:52:38.719 --> 0:52:45.160 monogamous couples have there has been some kind of infidelity 0:52:45.320 --> 0:52:48.360 and whether they've talked about it or not, like they've 0:52:48.400 --> 0:52:51.080 moved past it. I think probably the best example is 0:52:51.400 --> 0:52:53.840 the Sex and City movie when Steve cheats on Miranda 0:52:54.440 --> 0:52:58.600 and like it almost ends their marriage, but they you know, 0:52:58.880 --> 0:53:04.000 decide mutually to move past it stay together. Wow, Esther 0:53:04.200 --> 0:53:08.160 Perel found dead. Um, I feel like Esther Perel, I 0:53:08.200 --> 0:53:11.000 don't know how that is. Oh my god. The producer 0:53:11.000 --> 0:53:12.759 Phoebe is freaking out as much as I am. Okay, 0:53:12.760 --> 0:53:16.719 So Esther Perel is this relationships expert. She's Jewish and 0:53:16.840 --> 0:53:19.080 she's like literally a genius, and she has a lot 0:53:19.160 --> 0:53:24.080 of like teachings about like romance, especially like monogamous relationship romance. 0:53:24.360 --> 0:53:27.200 But she has you know, whole book a doubt like 0:53:27.280 --> 0:53:31.080 the artifice of infidelity as we've created it in Western culture, 0:53:31.200 --> 0:53:35.960 and like how movies like rom coms have painted this 0:53:36.000 --> 0:53:39.359 picture of cheating being the thing that you will never 0:53:39.400 --> 0:53:42.160 get away with and everything else you can work through, 0:53:42.480 --> 0:53:45.360 you know what I mean, which is so absurd, and 0:53:45.400 --> 0:53:48.000 so that's again another beautiful thing about this movie is 0:53:48.080 --> 0:53:53.520 like just painting a picture wherein infidelity actually is the 0:53:53.600 --> 0:53:57.200 best fate for these protagonists, you know what I mean. 0:53:57.480 --> 0:54:00.160 Do you ever see yourself wanting to be in a 0:54:00.160 --> 0:54:06.120 monogamous relationship, a Monoga Mish relationship, Yes, for sure. I 0:54:06.160 --> 0:54:08.480 think honestly, if we were painting the fan fick of 0:54:08.680 --> 0:54:11.400 share in Knick Cage, they probably are gonna. If they 0:54:11.400 --> 0:54:13.360 were to work, it would have to be like Monoga 0:54:13.440 --> 0:54:17.320 Mish or like an open relationship or something. For me personally, 0:54:18.000 --> 0:54:20.480 I feel like I believe in love cycles, you know 0:54:20.480 --> 0:54:23.960 what I mean. I think I go through like moments 0:54:24.000 --> 0:54:27.160 with people or in it's like really deep, really passionate, 0:54:27.239 --> 0:54:30.240 really intimate and can be for a long long time, 0:54:30.760 --> 0:54:34.440 but that those cycles have endings. And if that includes 0:54:34.520 --> 0:54:36.319 like me being with a long term partner and then 0:54:36.520 --> 0:54:38.960 maybe falling for a short term partner or something like that, 0:54:39.040 --> 0:54:41.440 like I don't know, I think that's much more realistic 0:54:41.480 --> 0:54:44.960 than an idea of monogamy. What about you, I would 0:54:45.000 --> 0:54:48.680 like to say that I don't think I'll ever want 0:54:48.719 --> 0:54:51.960 to be in a monogamous relationship because it hasn't happened. 0:54:52.400 --> 0:54:54.600 But I also know myself well enough to know that 0:54:54.680 --> 0:55:01.080 I am secretly a romantic, and I if I was 0:55:02.080 --> 0:55:06.160 in love with someone deeply enough that I wanted to 0:55:06.200 --> 0:55:10.520 commit myself to them, I don't know if I could, 0:55:10.880 --> 0:55:15.000 like be in an open relationship. Yeah, you don't think, 0:55:15.719 --> 0:55:20.279 I don't know. I really don't know. But for as 0:55:20.440 --> 0:55:24.160 as jaded and cynical as I am and always have been, 0:55:24.600 --> 0:55:27.720 especially in a way that's been applied to my relationships, 0:55:28.520 --> 0:55:34.360 I really am a romantic and like believe in I 0:55:34.400 --> 0:55:38.600 don't know true love. I don't know if I believe 0:55:38.600 --> 0:55:41.880 in it for myself. We'll see, we'll see if it happens, 0:55:42.120 --> 0:55:47.239 um But you know, like if who who knows? Like 0:55:48.239 --> 0:55:50.000 if I will fall in love with someone in a 0:55:50.040 --> 0:55:52.880 way so deeply where I can't imagine wanting to be 0:55:52.920 --> 0:55:57.160 with someone else, and where I would be devastated if 0:55:57.239 --> 0:56:00.600 they wanted someone else. I know that it's not fair 0:56:00.719 --> 0:56:04.520 or realistic to expect that, you know, one person will 0:56:04.600 --> 0:56:09.600 only want to be intimate with one person for the 0:56:09.640 --> 0:56:13.680 rest of their lives. But I don't know. I do 0:56:14.080 --> 0:56:16.719 feel like there's part of me that like wouldn't be 0:56:16.800 --> 0:56:19.719 okay with it. You know. It's so funny though, is 0:56:19.760 --> 0:56:23.000 that like the premise of that question that we hear 0:56:23.000 --> 0:56:25.759 a lot of, like do you believe in love? Do 0:56:25.800 --> 0:56:29.440 you believe in that kind of romance? Is really predicated 0:56:29.600 --> 0:56:33.600 on this picture of this mainstream depiction of love that 0:56:33.680 --> 0:56:36.200 we see in movies and books and whatever since the 0:56:36.239 --> 0:56:38.919 dawn of time. It's like we have when we are 0:56:39.000 --> 0:56:42.640 asked do you believe in love? They're actually asking do 0:56:42.719 --> 0:56:46.040 you believe in this fairy tale kind of Oh? Absolutely? 0:56:46.080 --> 0:56:50.279 I know that my romanticism comes from the media I 0:56:50.360 --> 0:56:53.960 consumed at a formative age, which is why this like 0:56:54.000 --> 0:56:56.520 moon Strike is amazing. But like that's like our answers 0:56:56.520 --> 0:56:59.239 should be like I don't believe in that version of love, 0:56:59.600 --> 0:57:02.719 but like there's a version of perfect romance that maybe 0:57:02.760 --> 0:57:05.120 doesn't check all the boxes that you think it needs 0:57:05.160 --> 0:57:10.200 to check, that is still true love. Yes, absolutely. That's 0:57:10.239 --> 0:57:14.600 one of the beautiful things about Moonstruck is it provides 0:57:15.000 --> 0:57:19.480 a lens to like look at your life and your 0:57:19.480 --> 0:57:24.080 relationships in like there is something for everyone in it. 0:57:24.320 --> 0:57:26.200 It does the best thing art can do, which is 0:57:26.240 --> 0:57:31.640 like tell a really specific story that also is extremely universal, 0:57:32.280 --> 0:57:37.040 and it breaks down this like the dichotomy of the 0:57:37.080 --> 0:57:40.760 bride and the wolf, the person who believes in love, 0:57:40.800 --> 0:57:43.000 believes in the fantasy, and the person who's like jaded 0:57:43.040 --> 0:57:45.560 by life and won't you know, accept it in It's like, 0:57:45.920 --> 0:57:48.760 it's basically saying that there is like a medium between 0:57:48.760 --> 0:57:52.000 these two things that can make you a perfectly well 0:57:52.120 --> 0:57:54.400 rounded person. Honestly, this is like you and me. It's 0:57:54.440 --> 0:57:57.080 like you're the wolf, I guess, and I'm the am 0:57:57.120 --> 0:58:00.640 I the bride. Yeah, you're You're the bride and also believe, 0:58:00.680 --> 0:58:03.320 but also like I'm secretly the bride. Yeah, you are, 0:58:03.560 --> 0:58:06.440 and I'm secretly the wolf. Yeah, inside you there are 0:58:06.480 --> 0:58:18.040 two wolves. One is one is Yes. Well, this is 0:58:18.080 --> 0:58:21.240 our last episode of the year. I know we started 0:58:21.280 --> 0:58:23.400 this kind of towards the end of the year, but 0:58:23.680 --> 0:58:26.080 you us and the listeners are we're new friends. Yes, 0:58:26.280 --> 0:58:29.240 And even though we've only done a few months of episodes. 0:58:29.640 --> 0:58:32.560 Fran and I started working on this podcast almost a 0:58:32.640 --> 0:58:36.240 year ago at this point, basically in the new year. Yeah, 0:58:36.320 --> 0:58:42.080 and it has been really beautiful to see y'all listen 0:58:42.120 --> 0:58:45.840 to it and respond to it and engage with it, 0:58:45.920 --> 0:58:49.520 and I'm so grateful for everyone who listens to this podcast. 0:58:49.840 --> 0:58:54.800 I'm so grateful to our producer Phoebe, everyone at I hear, 0:58:55.080 --> 0:58:57.040 our team and I heart who are so amazing. And 0:58:57.360 --> 0:59:00.720 I'm so grateful to Fran my co host, the Sister 0:59:01.160 --> 0:59:06.280 a rare on the record moment of genuine affection. It 0:59:06.320 --> 0:59:08.440 won't last. I'm grateful for you too, Rose, And I'm 0:59:08.480 --> 0:59:11.520 thankful for all the Virgins. We love you, virgin, Grateful 0:59:11.560 --> 0:59:14.320 for what you're introducing to me next week. Oh yeah, 0:59:14.400 --> 0:59:19.040 So next up on our first episode of two, we 0:59:19.080 --> 0:59:24.440 will be talking about Twilight, which, to be totally honest, 0:59:24.600 --> 0:59:28.200 is maybe the purest like um kind of can see 0:59:28.200 --> 0:59:31.480 of this podcast in general. It's like something Rose genuinely 0:59:31.680 --> 0:59:33.920 showed me for the first time. Yes, and we will 0:59:33.960 --> 0:59:38.440 be discussing it with the like number one Twilight stand 0:59:38.560 --> 0:59:42.600 I know other than myself. Peyton dix Um leave us 0:59:42.640 --> 0:59:45.800 a review, please if you love us also tweeted us, 0:59:45.840 --> 0:59:48.360 posting your Instagram story, tell us are you a wolf 0:59:48.520 --> 0:59:50.920 or are you a bride? And don't forget if you 0:59:50.960 --> 0:59:52.920 want to call in and let us know the thing 0:59:52.960 --> 0:59:55.160 that you are so obsessed with cable, leave us a 0:59:55.160 --> 0:59:59.240 message little Confession if you will at three to three 0:59:59.240 --> 1:00:02.880 pennants that's three to three seven three six two six 1:00:03.040 --> 1:00:05.440 two three. I'm friend Ratto. You can find me at 1:00:05.440 --> 1:00:08.520 Friends squish co on Instagram and Twitter. And I'm Rost 1:00:08.560 --> 1:00:11.040 Damn You. You can find me at Rose Damn You 1:00:11.160 --> 1:00:13.240 on Instagram and Twitter. You can subscribe to Like a 1:00:13.320 --> 1:00:16.920 Virgin anywhere you listen to podcasts. Our producer is Phoebe 1:00:16.960 --> 1:00:20.320 you inter v PU inter We Love you dB with 1:00:20.360 --> 1:00:23.920 support from Lindsay Hoffman, Julian Weller, Jess Cranechitch and Nikki 1:00:24.000 --> 1:00:28.080 Vtour Until next week, see you later, Virgin until next year. 1:00:28.240 --> 1:00:36.640 Until next year in two virgins, We love you so much. Bye,