Speaker 1: Welcome to off the cop with me, SI cop. What
Speaker 1: a week it was before we get to the biggest
Speaker 1: news of the week, and it is huge, you guys.
Speaker 2: Let's just recount some of.
Speaker 1: The other things that happened, because there were some doozies
Speaker 1: in there. Let's start with Nancy Mace, Republican House member
Speaker 1: from South Carolina. She's made her entire career on policing
Speaker 1: congressional bathrooms for trans people. Sorry for one trans member
Speaker 1: of Congress, Sarah McBride. Anyway, she was running for governor.
Speaker 1: I don't know if you realized that, but she was.
Speaker 1: And this week she not only lost her primary, she
Speaker 1: came in fifth.
Speaker 2: She came in fifth.
Speaker 1: That's right, she was beat by four other people in
Speaker 1: a primary.
Speaker 2: Here is what Sarah.
Speaker 1: McBride said, which is like better than anything I could
Speaker 1: say about this. She said, Congress's top bathroom sheriff, Nancy
Speaker 1: Mace is on the ballot, and while not all of
Speaker 1: the votes have been counted yet, she is in a
Speaker 1: respectful fifth place. I don't like punching down, and I
Speaker 1: believe in the politics of grace, so I will say
Speaker 1: happy pride, Nancy boom perfect. The internet is also of
Speaker 1: course making memes about Nancy Mace and Riley Gaines, the
Speaker 1: college swimmer who's made her entire career opposing trans athletes.
Speaker 1: Mace and Gaines, the meme goes, are two conservative women
Speaker 1: who finished in fifth place. Okay, I'm not usually one
Speaker 1: to gloat, but today we're just so used to bad
Speaker 1: people being rewarded for bad behavior, so when one isn't,
Speaker 1: it's a beautiful thing. So pour one out for Nancy
Speaker 1: Mace soon coming to a Newsmax near you.
Speaker 2: I'm sure see what else happened this week?
Speaker 3: Oh?
Speaker 1: Yes, Trump backed off his absolutely insane.
Speaker 2: Pick of Bill Pulty for D and I for Director
Speaker 2: of National Intelligence. Another win for the good guys.
Speaker 1: Trump raised eyebrows even among Republicans with that pick, as
Speaker 1: Pulty has absolutely no qualifications or relevant experience to lead
Speaker 1: our intelligence agencies none. All he's qualified to do is
Speaker 1: what he was doing, which was go after Trump's political enemies.
Speaker 1: He wasn't even doing that well, but it's clear that's
Speaker 1: what Trump wants in the position. Republicans were not going
Speaker 1: to confirm Pulty, and so Trump had to reverse course. Instead,
Speaker 1: he has nominated Jay Clayton. Now, he also has no
Speaker 1: relevant experience in intelligence, but he's got a slightly better
Speaker 1: pedigree as a Wall Street lawyer, and just like Pulty,
Speaker 1: he's more than happy to push election fraud lies on television.
Speaker 1: So again, clearly that's what Trump cares about. We'll see
Speaker 1: if that one can get through. But uh, the big
Speaker 1: news of the week, Okay, the big news. And I
Speaker 1: kind of hope you haven't heard it already, because nothing
Speaker 1: pleases me more than breaking news to you find folks.
Speaker 1: And I don't know, maybe you don't tell too many
Speaker 1: people either, because we don't want to jinx it. We
Speaker 1: don't want to spook anyone. But this is big, this
Speaker 1: is huge, It's monumental. Drum roll please. Yesterday President of
Speaker 1: the United States Donald Trump announced we just made a
Speaker 1: great settlement of the war with Iran. That's right, it's over.
Speaker 1: Call off the war, send the troops home, open the
Speaker 1: straight of horror moves. Get ready to fill up your
Speaker 1: gas tanks with three dollars gas.
Speaker 2: The war is finally over. That's right, that's right.
Speaker 1: Trump even said a deal might be signed to this weekend.
Speaker 2: Really excited.
Speaker 3: It took a.
Speaker 1: While, over one hundred days, even though Trump said it
Speaker 1: would just last a few weeks. Finally it's done. We
Speaker 1: could all breathe a sigh of relief. Our long national
Speaker 1: nightmare is over.
Speaker 2: We can all go.
Speaker 1: Back to our hold on, Wait a second, sorry, hold
Speaker 1: on a minute. I get I'm getting some guidance. It
Speaker 1: seems Iran has responded to Trump's declaration, and well, let
Speaker 1: me just read it. Spokesman for Iran's Foreign Ministry is
Speaker 1: saying no such agreement exists and that it's currently under
Speaker 1: review by.
Speaker 2: The relevant decision making institutions.
Speaker 1: It's curious because President says it's over, prison says the
Speaker 1: deal has been reached, Present says a deal is coming
Speaker 1: this weekend, and I know him to be truthful, so
Speaker 1: I don't know what is going on. Well, hm, yes, okay,
Speaker 1: My producers are pointing out something that's true.
Speaker 2: That's true. Trump has said this before. How many times
Speaker 2: has he said? Thirty eight? Thirty eight times? Okay, wow,
Speaker 2: thirty eight times.
Speaker 1: Trump has apparently said this war is over or a
Speaker 1: deal has been reached. So I guess it's not a
Speaker 1: great track record. But listen, it's been a while, silver lining,
Speaker 1: it's been a while since there's been any real hostilities, right,
Speaker 1: because we're in a ceasefire that much?
Speaker 2: That much?
Speaker 1: I know the President called for a ceasefire. We're in
Speaker 1: a ceasefire. That's good news. At least there's been no
Speaker 1: hold on.
Speaker 2: That's not correct. Sorry, let me checking my notes on Wednesday. Shoot.
Speaker 1: On Wednesday, the US bomb de Ron for the second
Speaker 1: straight day after Ron struck hour Apache helicopter over the
Speaker 1: strait of her moves.
Speaker 2: I forgot about that, damn it. So I guess we're
Speaker 2: not really in a ceasefire.
Speaker 1: Well, here's what Trump had to say about this important
Speaker 1: business this week from the Oval Office.
Speaker 4: This is going to support millions and millions of people,
Speaker 4: America's fishermen. Of just there's special people and as special
Speaker 4: men and fisher women. So tell me how do they
Speaker 4: define that? Because in most industries, like you have policemen policewomen.
Speaker 4: Do you call them fishermen and fisher women? I haven't
Speaker 4: heard of that one before. But if are we, how
Speaker 4: are the women? Do they want to be designated as
Speaker 4: fisher women? Does anybody want to answer that question? Hm?
Speaker 1: Well, I guess I have egg on my face.
Speaker 2: My bad.
Speaker 1: That was Trump talking about the other important item of
Speaker 1: business this week. What to call women who fish? Okay,
Speaker 1: back to Iran. The war may or may not be over.
Speaker 1: I guess we'll have to wait and see if thirty
Speaker 1: ninth time is the charm. But at least the good
Speaker 1: news is it's not taking quite as bad of a
Speaker 1: hit on our economy as it was in the beginning.
Speaker 1: We're all feeling a little relief, right Wait a second,
Speaker 1: hold on more notes from my producers. Man, they're on
Speaker 1: one today. There's such sticklers for you know, the truth.
Speaker 1: I keep telling them it doesn't matter. Okay, I guess. Supposedly,
Speaker 1: according to experts, UH Producer Price Index, a gauge of
Speaker 1: wholesale inflation. Well, it's up six point five percent. It's
Speaker 1: it's highest since November twenty twenty two. So Americans are
Speaker 1: facing the fastest priced inflation they've seen in years, and
Speaker 1: it likely hasn't even peaked yet.
Speaker 2: Oof. That's bad. That's really bad.
Speaker 1: Well let's see what the President had to say about this,
Speaker 1: the rise in inflation. I'm sure he's sympathetic.
Speaker 3: You can serve, mister President about the latest inflation number which.
Speaker 5: Came out this morning.
Speaker 3: Could that be a no?
Speaker 5: I love plumage triumph?
Speaker 4: You know what I really love? I love the inflation.
Speaker 2: Yikes, he loves the inflation. Well, I guess I don't know.
Speaker 1: He must know something that we don't about why inflation
Speaker 1: is good for us, right, Like, I'm not an economist,
Speaker 1: I must not know inflation's great. Actually, I had it backwards.
Speaker 1: I thought inflation was bad.
Speaker 2: I guess. I guess. Hm, we should focus on the positive,
Speaker 2: the positive. Trump.
Speaker 1: Well, Trump's a tough guy, and I'm sure he'll get
Speaker 1: us all a good deal in a war we didn't
Speaker 1: ask for and has only hurt us. I'm sure he
Speaker 1: can walk us through this and tough talk his way.
Speaker 1: After all, the world fears him, so when he threatens,
Speaker 1: people listen, right. Well, I guess, except, well, that's not
Speaker 1: totally true. There was that time he threatened Putin not
Speaker 1: to invade Ukraine or he'd bombed the shit out of Moscow.
Speaker 2: That's a quote. I guess.
Speaker 1: I guess Putin wasn't scared at that time. He's been
Speaker 1: threatening Iran for nearly a decade. He threatened to bomb
Speaker 1: fifty two cultural sites in Iran during his first term.
Speaker 1: He backed off of that. He threatened to obliterate Iran,
Speaker 1: backed off that. He threatened to end the civilization overnight,
Speaker 1: he backed off that. Just this week, he threatened to
Speaker 1: bomb the shit out of Iran if they failed to
Speaker 1: reach a piece deal. Looks like he might just have
Speaker 1: to go ahead and do that though. Oh and today,
Speaker 1: in response to iran statement that they have not reached
Speaker 1: a deal, he posted, they better get their act together
Speaker 1: and fast. Yikes to be on the receiving end of
Speaker 1: those threats. Let's talk about shaking in my boots. Look
Speaker 1: out a Roan, get your act together or else. So
Speaker 1: I guess, uh, I guess I don't have any news
Speaker 1: for you on Iran. But I'm crossing my fingers and
Speaker 1: holding my breath. It feels like a deal is right
Speaker 1: around the corner. Okay, when we come back, I talked
Speaker 1: to an old pal about what all this means.
Speaker 2: Don't go anywhere.
Speaker 1: Hey, we're back and I'm joined now by my old
Speaker 1: friend Kevin Madden. He's a Republican strategist who worked on
Speaker 1: the Romney campaign.
Speaker 2: Welcome, Kevin.
Speaker 5: Great to be with you, Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I wanted to have you on this week in
Speaker 1: particular to talk about the midterm election year. You've run campaigns,
Speaker 1: You've run them at the highest level. You know the
Speaker 1: ins and outs, you know what good campaign practices are.
Speaker 1: I just want to know what you make of where
Speaker 1: Republicans are right now going into the mid terms, with
Speaker 1: the president who seems hell bent on making their chances
Speaker 1: of keeping a majority like impossible, telling Americans he loves inflation,
Speaker 1: he doesn't care about their finances affordability as a hoax,
Speaker 1: spending his time on ballrooms and reflecting pools, putting his
Speaker 1: name on buildings and his face on money, getting rich
Speaker 1: off cronyism and corruption and self dealing while many Americans
Speaker 1: are struggling to buy food and gas, holding UFC fights
Speaker 1: at the White House, tossing out fun ideas like billion
Speaker 1: dollar slush funds to pay off insurrectionists and fake electors
Speaker 1: primary safe seats like for the fun of it, forcing
Speaker 1: Republicans to spend millions more than they need to. I mean,
Speaker 1: just from your perch, how is this all going to
Speaker 1: shake out for Republicans come November?
Speaker 3: Well, look, I think the best strategists and the best
Speaker 3: campaign managers, the best campaign staffers all the way down
Speaker 3: the line have to take a very clinical view of
Speaker 3: the environment that you're operating in, and so I put
Speaker 3: a lot of the kind of you know, what fuels
Speaker 3: the sort of like what fuels a lot of the
Speaker 3: sort of chatter and what feels like the cable.
Speaker 2: News stuff, Yeah, the noise.
Speaker 3: And I just try to think, like, okay, what's driving
Speaker 3: the electorate out there? And I think the best strategies
Speaker 3: do recognize and we have there's are really good ones
Speaker 3: that are that are running the campaign committees and running
Speaker 3: like the big races. They know that they have some
Speaker 3: headwinds right now. They know that this is an environment
Speaker 3: that is driven very much by the idea of affordability
Speaker 3: and a softening of the economy right now, right like
Speaker 3: that is what that's creating some of the headwinds. And
Speaker 3: then like you have the historical headwinds, you have the
Speaker 3: fact that anytime you have an incumbent in the White House, Yeah,
Speaker 3: the party in power does sort of face a little
Speaker 3: bit of a backlash and say they know that like
Speaker 3: the average you know, uh, the average midterm losses for
Speaker 3: a party is probably.
Speaker 5: Somewhere in the mid twenties.
Speaker 3: Right in the Senate, it's probably around two to three seats. Now,
Speaker 3: they have also some advantages.
Speaker 5: They've they recognize that.
Speaker 3: They've done very well on the fundraising, They recognize that
Speaker 3: they've done very well with candidate recruitment. They also recognize,
Speaker 3: like a lot of Republicans right now, recognize that Democrats
Speaker 3: are not while they as much as they dislike President Trump,
Speaker 3: they're not exactly thrilled with their own party leadership.
Speaker 5: Yeah, right now, some of that is changing.
Speaker 3: I think, you know, Democrats are now starting to see
Speaker 3: that the that the environment out there is starting to
Speaker 3: work in their favor. So they may not love their candidates,
Speaker 3: they are sure as going to show up and register
Speaker 3: their votes. So those are kind of the big picture
Speaker 3: trends that I think the best strategists looking at the
Speaker 3: environment clinically, I think that they've that they've come to
Speaker 3: terms with a lot of that.
Speaker 1: But you yeah, and I hear that, right like, these
Speaker 1: are professionals in most cases.
Speaker 2: In some cases they're not.
Speaker 1: But those cases they're professionals, and they've been here before,
Speaker 1: and they know how to separate the principal Donald Trump
Speaker 1: from you know, they're candidate. But there's so much noise,
Speaker 1: and there's so much incoming.
Speaker 4: And.
Speaker 1: All the traditional headwinds are there, and there's more on top.
Speaker 2: Right, We've got a war that no one really asked for.
Speaker 1: Like, no one's bought into this war, even in the magaside.
Speaker 1: Like I'm sure they want to win and they want
Speaker 1: Trump to do well, but like, no one's bought in
Speaker 1: on this war.
Speaker 2: And I don't know when this is going to end.
Speaker 1: We've got months before the midterms, but it's really become
Speaker 1: the story like how do you manage all the incoming
Speaker 1: And if you're a vulnerable Republican, you're.
Speaker 2: Going home, They're going.
Speaker 1: Home right now, and you're going to hear from your
Speaker 1: constituents about things like ballrooms and reflecting pools and slush funds,
Speaker 1: and you know, how do you how do you message
Speaker 1: that well?
Speaker 5: I think, Look, I think the bought in on the
Speaker 5: war thing.
Speaker 3: I would say at the beginning of the military conflict,
Speaker 3: there were a lot of Republicans that were very strong
Speaker 3: in their support for the White House.
Speaker 5: Taking taking action.
Speaker 3: I mean, like, yeah, confronting a nuclear Iran has been
Speaker 3: a big has been an important part of the Republican
Speaker 3: playing for previous candidate, for previous presidents, and I think
Speaker 3: even previous sort of Republican nominees. The thing that I
Speaker 3: think is changing is that the clarity that they need
Speaker 3: to really force fully defend the president's actions and the
Speaker 3: objectives of the military objectives. That's been somewhat elusive, I think,
Speaker 3: to say to put the game, to put like a
Speaker 3: clinical analysis on it.
Speaker 5: They could use more of that.
Speaker 3: I think one of the things that they're going to
Speaker 3: have to do is reinforce what they think the White
Speaker 3: House needs to do about making very clear the military objectives,
Speaker 3: making very clear what they what they're hoping to achieve,
Speaker 3: and why it's important to Americans that that's what I
Speaker 3: really think at certain point, many of these candidates have
Speaker 3: to bring take away from any umbrella strategy from the
Speaker 3: White House, can get out of the national jet stream
Speaker 3: and focus relentlessly on tailoring their message to their unique constituency,
Speaker 3: in their district, in their state, and so on the
Speaker 3: Iran issue, they're going to have to do that.
Speaker 5: They're also going to.
Speaker 3: Have to talk about housing, How they're going to talk
Speaker 3: about food prices, gas prices, and what the administration and
Speaker 3: their congressional allies could should are doing to bring down
Speaker 3: to address those costs. I mean that is I mean,
Speaker 3: it's I mean when you look when you look at
Speaker 3: the big challenge that Linny's candidates facing it's the everyday
Speaker 3: presence of rising prices. When they go to the grocery store,
Speaker 3: they're seeing high food prices, They're seeing it when they
Speaker 3: fill up their guest tank. They're also seeing it in
Speaker 3: things like healthcare costs, rent housing.
Speaker 5: Right, so they really have to.
Speaker 3: Kind of localize and personalize to your unique your unique district,
Speaker 3: constituency and state what it is that they're doing to
Speaker 3: address those costs. Right now, I'd say the most important
Speaker 3: sort of demographic is working class. That's like the battlefield
Speaker 3: for twenty twenty party twenty six. Yeah, for both parties,
Speaker 3: Like Democrats know that they've lost the last couple of
Speaker 3: elections because they lost working class support. Republicans have to focus,
Speaker 3: I think, relentlessly on them. And they also have to
Speaker 3: get a lot of like if you're looking at the
Speaker 3: partisan breakdown, you've got to get a lot of independent
Speaker 3: voters back.
Speaker 5: They did very well with.
Speaker 3: Independence in twenty twenty, to be tough, in the sixteen
Speaker 3: months since, like they Independence have migrated back away into
Speaker 3: a sort of like unhappiness, undecided, but we need and
Speaker 3: a no man's land.
Speaker 1: Yeah, right, And I think what I have been seeing
Speaker 1: most from both parties is and this isn't surprising we've
Speaker 1: been in primaries, but both parties really trying to shore
Speaker 1: up the base and kind of not really going after independence.
Speaker 1: They'll of course have to do that in the general.
Speaker 1: It's going to be a tough switch when you're going
Speaker 1: from you know, far left progressivism and those kinds of
Speaker 1: ideas on the left and you're going for like Ken
Speaker 1: Paxton's maga stuff on the right.
Speaker 2: Real tough to come back to the middle in a general.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think this is a mistake that you know,
Speaker 3: bad strategists make, which is they say all all midterms
Speaker 3: are base elections. There is a lot of truth to
Speaker 3: really getting out and energizing your base. It's very different
Speaker 3: from like, you know, from a presidential year, but the
Speaker 3: support that you're sort of losing from independence right now,
Speaker 3: even if you got your base back, you'd still be
Speaker 3: in a very you'd still be short of being able
Speaker 3: to win a majority in a lot of these these
Speaker 3: you know, thirty to forty battleground states and some of
Speaker 3: these five to six Senate toss ups, you really do
Speaker 3: have to get the big middle of the elector right.
Speaker 3: Even this effective Republicans who are not necessarily hardcore MAGA enthusiasts.
Speaker 5: You need to get them back on the on the
Speaker 5: in order to win.
Speaker 1: Yep, we're also ramping up for a presidential in twenty
Speaker 1: twenty eight. I'm ing to get your thoughts what Trump's
Speaker 1: doing right now? How does this impact twenty twenty eight
Speaker 1: for someone like JD. Vance or Marco Rubio or are
Speaker 1: they like clean slate candidates. They're both deeply in the administration,
Speaker 1: deeply involved in a lot of the decisions that are
Speaker 1: being made. Will they be tainted by whatever's going on
Speaker 1: right now or will they benefit from whatever's going on
Speaker 1: right now?
Speaker 3: Well, look, we're in a political environment that is always Trump.
Speaker 3: It's just something that people have to come to terms with.
Speaker 3: And I think any really good, smart campaign is going
Speaker 3: to recognize that we're not going to be quote able
Speaker 3: to break from the president in the next election. You're
Speaker 3: going to have to have a campaign that recognizes that
Speaker 3: he is going to cast that the Trump effect will
Speaker 3: cast a long shadow over the twenty twenty eight environment.
Speaker 3: The analogy I always use, and I'm dating myself here
Speaker 3: in the sense that it's one of my favorite movies,
Speaker 3: but it's from a long time ago Is se Hinton
Speaker 3: and Francis four Coppola is the Outsiders.
Speaker 5: Yeah, now there's a.
Speaker 2: Big vie my namesake by the way, Yeah.
Speaker 5: Oh really, I did not know that. That's uh, that's incredible.
Speaker 5: Not many sees so there you go.
Speaker 3: Right, But there's the one of the like one of
Speaker 3: the most important parts of the of the movie is
Speaker 3: there's the rumble scene, right, and one of my favorite
Speaker 3: parts of that scene was where Dallas Winston, the Matt
Speaker 3: Dillon character, comes running out of the hospital that he
Speaker 3: was in to join the rumble at the minute, and
Speaker 3: he says, ain't nobody.
Speaker 5: Having a rumble without me?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 5: Right?
Speaker 3: Yeah? Donald Trump is basically Dallas Winston here, and it's like,
Speaker 3: ain't nobody having an election without me? Even if I'm
Speaker 3: not on the ballot, I am going to shape the
Speaker 3: outcomes of this election. Say both, I mean, the Democrats
Speaker 3: want that and Republican candidates that are getting ready to run.
Speaker 5: It are going to have to come to terms with that.
Speaker 3: Right, There's no running away from Donald Trump in this
Speaker 3: is it is a Trump defined party as long as
Speaker 3: he's on the scene.
Speaker 1: I think you're one hundred percent right, that's inarguable and
Speaker 1: we haven't had a Republican nominee for president not named Trump, Sincett, Romney,
Speaker 1: your old principle. But I'm wondering what you think. So
Speaker 1: I've been watching Tucker Carlson, you know, who I used
Speaker 1: to work for and know really well. It seems to
Speaker 1: me he is trying to create a Trump alternative Lane
Speaker 1: to run for president in twenty twenty eight, where he
Speaker 1: will be like, well, I'm the real America first candidate.
Speaker 1: Trump made all these promises, promise not to get into
Speaker 1: us into a war. I'm the guy that's not going
Speaker 1: to get us into a war. And I'm the real
Speaker 1: you know, muscular Christian, And I'm the real.
Speaker 2: Guy that you thought you got with Trump.
Speaker 1: Marjorie Taylor Green might be doing something similar, you know,
Speaker 1: trying to carve out like that Trump alternative Maga Lane.
Speaker 1: What do you make of that project? Will that have
Speaker 1: any impacts or legs?
Speaker 5: I think possibly. I think it's all how.
Speaker 2: How how much?
Speaker 5: The question a lot of these candidates are going.
Speaker 3: To ask, are going to have to ask themselves, is
Speaker 3: do I really want to run against something?
Speaker 5: Do I want to run for something? Am I running
Speaker 5: for this job?
Speaker 3: Because I believe it is I am the best person
Speaker 3: in the world to take on this position? Or am
Speaker 3: I running just for the sake of like building up
Speaker 3: an email list? Where I'm running because somebody told me
Speaker 3: that it's my time, Like Yeah. There are so many
Speaker 3: campaigns that started out with promise and ended in failure
Speaker 3: because they didn't ask themselves these central questions like what
Speaker 3: is it that I want to do with the most
Speaker 3: powerful position in the world?
Speaker 5: Right.
Speaker 3: I also think fundamentally every single election is a contest
Speaker 3: for the future.
Speaker 5: The system itself.
Speaker 3: Other candidates, you know, the respective political campaign parties are
Speaker 3: all going to try and define this election as what
Speaker 3: was wrong with Trump?
Speaker 5: Or what would you have done differently from Trump?
Speaker 3: I think the way to win one of these elections
Speaker 3: is to constantly remind yourself that you're never going to
Speaker 3: be punished for what happened in the past as much
Speaker 3: as you will be rewarded for what you can promise
Speaker 3: voters for the future. And if you can anchor a
Speaker 3: campaign around that, I think it's going to be a
Speaker 3: successful campaign.
Speaker 5: You may not win, but you'll.
Speaker 3: Do better than expected, and you'll have learned a lot,
Speaker 3: and you'll ultimately have built a political profile that's more
Speaker 3: aligned with voter sentiment than not. And then I think,
Speaker 3: I think ultimately these things are are also campaigns where
Speaker 3: you have to sort of align yourself, like like we
Speaker 3: always say, like the campaign that always wins if you
Speaker 3: go back and look at any of these contests, the
Speaker 3: campaign that always wins is the one that affirmatively answers
Speaker 3: the question is this person on my side?
Speaker 5: Do they understand the problems of people like me? Right?
Speaker 5: I always joke. I mean, this is one of the
Speaker 5: things with our self.
Speaker 3: Criticism of the Romney campaign was we had a fifty
Speaker 3: nine point economic plan that we presented to voters.
Speaker 5: We lost to a guy with a three point economic plan.
Speaker 3: Yeah, right, Like and at three point economic plan I
Speaker 3: can remember to this day, I cannot remember many of
Speaker 3: the points from the thirty nine point one right, yeah,
Speaker 3: And it was we need an economy built the last weaning,
Speaker 3: the economy built from the middle out and I'm on
Speaker 3: your side, yeah, and the next the winner of the
Speaker 3: of the twenty twenty eight election, and I think will
Speaker 3: answer all of those kind of like what I would
Speaker 3: describe as kind of big existential questions more affirmatively than
Speaker 3: the one that they that loses.
Speaker 1: So on that what kind of candidate on the left
Speaker 1: do you think would have the best chance. I'm not
Speaker 1: asking who, but like the kind of candidate, like what
Speaker 1: should the Democrat running in twenty twenty eight have or
Speaker 1: not have to be competitive against whatever MAGA puts up.
Speaker 3: I think they're gonna have to present themselves as a
Speaker 3: fighter first and foremost. They're going to have to sort
Speaker 3: of like kind of break the mold of like the
Speaker 3: wonky Democrat, yeah right, where they're also like a Democrat
Speaker 3: who is building coalition by coalition, a micro targeted campaign,
Speaker 3: and they're gonna have to be sort of bigger, bold
Speaker 3: or fighter, right, yeah, Like is that like.
Speaker 2: A rama manual?
Speaker 5: Like I think you know, so that that's right.
Speaker 3: So I was gonna say, I think of some of
Speaker 3: the candidates that could potentially do that, and I think
Speaker 3: there's there is some coalition politics though that makes it
Speaker 3: somewhat problematic for certain candidates to maybe to maybe to
Speaker 3: maybe win in a Democrat primary.
Speaker 5: But it's like JB.
Speaker 3: Pritzker, uh, Josh Shapiro, Wes Moore to a certain degree,
Speaker 3: you know, I think those are some of the candidates
Speaker 3: that I think that that that that might emerge. I
Speaker 3: always thought one of the best candidates in the Democratic
Speaker 3: primary that I think had the most potential and probably
Speaker 3: would have learned the most from their last run and
Speaker 3: could present well in another run would have been Amy Klobachar.
Speaker 2: Huh interesting.
Speaker 5: Yeah, So those are.
Speaker 3: Some of the some of the players that I think
Speaker 3: might be able to might be able to kind of
Speaker 3: break out of that mold.
Speaker 1: You know, I covered the Romney campaign. You obviously we're
Speaker 1: in it, but so I don't have to tell you,
Speaker 1: but it was incredibly frustrating to hear Democrats paint him
Speaker 1: as a literal monster, right, he was like a sexist,
Speaker 1: dog killing asshole.
Speaker 2: We knew that wasn't true, and it was such bullshit.
Speaker 1: And I speak to a lot of Democrats today who
Speaker 1: say that they regret doing that. But like, if someone
Speaker 1: like Adam Kinsinger or Liz Cheney were to run, I
Speaker 1: feel like Democrats would also call them monsters, right, Like
Speaker 1: they were heroes when they were standing up to Trump,
Speaker 1: but if they ran because of their conservative.
Speaker 2: Credentials, they'd be monsters.
Speaker 1: So, like, what are moderate principled conservatives who are been
Speaker 1: kicked out of the Republican Party but are only good
Speaker 1: to the Democratic Party when they're standing up to Trump, Like,
Speaker 1: where are they to go?
Speaker 5: I don't know.
Speaker 3: I mean, I don't know if there will be that
Speaker 3: kind of like test inside a Republican primary where one
Speaker 3: of these candidates feels like they can develop a platform
Speaker 3: and give people an alternative to the sort of Trump.
Speaker 5: And Maga approach.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I just don't I don't see that there's enough
Speaker 3: elasticity right now in the party or really.
Speaker 5: Even a focus.
Speaker 3: Like I think one of the mistakes that a lot
Speaker 3: of those like Kinzinger and Cheney's made was was was
Speaker 3: focusing on this idea of of being a moderate and
Speaker 3: I think almost in some regards like playing foot see
Speaker 3: with like the worst elements of the Democratic Party in
Speaker 3: order just in order to just be a critic of
Speaker 3: the Republican Party versus really sort of like defending this
Speaker 3: conservative credentials and really trying to offer a bit more
Speaker 3: of a holistic national security, uh economic and uh sort
Speaker 3: of social conservatism mantle, right, Because like, in many ways,
Speaker 3: those are the folks that I think we were ill
Speaker 3: served by like a Trump presidency which kind of challenged
Speaker 3: the sort of traditional Reagan man Reagan three legged stool
Speaker 3: approach to power.
Speaker 1: See yeah, okay, before we let you go, we always
Speaker 1: finished with an exit poll. It's a series of questions
Speaker 1: of varying degrees of seriousness. So first question is what
Speaker 1: is your favorite movie about politics?
Speaker 3: Oh, favorite movie about politics the I'd say The March,
Speaker 3: the Eyes of March. I really liked that one.
Speaker 5: My thoughts great.
Speaker 3: I thought Eyes of March captured what it's like to be,
Speaker 3: you know, sitting in a hotel lobby in Iowa at
Speaker 3: you know, fifteen below zero on account. Also just like
Speaker 3: how much work is done in the back seats of
Speaker 3: like Chevy suburbans, and how many decisions are made on
Speaker 3: the way.
Speaker 5: To the next event, like that type of thing.
Speaker 3: I actually thought it was as authentic a portrayal of
Speaker 3: what campaign.
Speaker 5: Life was about. I also love Robert Redford's The Candidate.
Speaker 3: Yeah, just kind of an old school version of campaign politics.
Speaker 2: So but also very true to life.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, The Candidate.
Speaker 1: That's a that's a real good look at what a
Speaker 1: campaign is like. Okay, if you were advising a student
Speaker 1: who wanted to get into politics to study one campaign
Speaker 1: from history, recent or past, what campaign would you tell
Speaker 1: them to study?
Speaker 5: Oh, that's a good one. I would say.
Speaker 3: The nineteen seventy two campaign, Yeah, I think just like
Speaker 3: the Democratic primary on that side, was I think particularly
Speaker 3: illustrative of how the like an internal party fight would
Speaker 3: produce a nominee to ultimately go against like Auch, a
Speaker 3: much more well funded candidate.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: But it was also such an incredible time in American
Speaker 3: history where we were transitioning from the volatle sixties into
Speaker 3: the seventies, and I think a lot of the changes
Speaker 3: in political coalitions, a lot of the changes in tactics.
Speaker 3: It was one of the one of the campaigns it
Speaker 3: was more of like a post TV into a post
Speaker 3: sort of introduction of TV to campaigns, and TV is
Speaker 3: becoming much more prevalent, and the sort of presenting and
Speaker 3: packageming a candidate was much more sure was new to campaigns.
Speaker 5: I think that would be one that'd be interesting to study.
Speaker 2: Great World Cup or NBA Finals.
Speaker 3: World Cup. I have become Yes, here's here's the here's
Speaker 3: the thing. I used to be the biggest basketball fan
Speaker 3: I was. You're from Yonkers, I know, like St. Saint
Speaker 3: John's college basketball. I watched every single Knicks game from
Speaker 3: nineteen eighty five.
Speaker 5: The nineteen ninety seven.
Speaker 3: The game has changed so much, traveling, moving picks, no defense,
Speaker 3: three points, three point shots, NonStop.
Speaker 5: I have not seen an NBA game since Xavier McDaniels
Speaker 5: was on the Knicks.
Speaker 4: Wow.
Speaker 3: So I would actually and I find the learning of
Speaker 3: and the strateg g of world of soccer right now,
Speaker 3: particularly when you, I mean the difference between like what
Speaker 3: we watch on like Major League soccer or even college soccer,
Speaker 3: to World Cup soccer with teams like Spain and Holland,
Speaker 3: like it is just mastery. And so I'm perfectly willing
Speaker 3: to admit that I would much rather watch the World
Speaker 3: Cup than watch the next I haven't watched the second of.
Speaker 5: The NBA finals.
Speaker 1: Wow, I'm shocked, But I know, I know, I love that.
Speaker 1: Speaking of Younkers, you're from Younkers. What's something about Yonkers
Speaker 1: people may not know?
Speaker 3: The waterfront is probably one of the most beautiful views
Speaker 3: you'll find anywhere in the New York area. It is
Speaker 3: uh if you go down to like the Yonkers Pier
Speaker 3: and you look at the palisades and you look look
Speaker 3: up north to what is essentially Rockland County, and the
Speaker 3: UH and the the Cuomo Bridge, which we used to
Speaker 3: call the tap and Z yeah south and usually look
Speaker 3: just so yeah, and you look south, you can just
Speaker 3: you can see the Manhattan skyline. It's one of the
Speaker 3: things that makes it the greatest about Yonkers, New York
Speaker 3: is that a lot of people in west Chester think
Speaker 3: it's part of the Bronx and everybody in New York,
Speaker 3: everybody in New York City thinks it's upstate. And we
Speaker 3: have this like incredible identity crisis, but we have the
Speaker 3: biggest two by four on our shoulder as a result
Speaker 3: of that, Like we think we're great. We think we
Speaker 3: love where we live. And you know, you look at
Speaker 3: the the gateway to to upstate New York and Westchester
Speaker 3: and you're you're you're can literally see the New York
Speaker 3: skyline to your left, and it's just a unique I started.
Speaker 3: I think it kind of uniquely captures what's great about Yonkers.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's great. And if people are visiting New York,
Speaker 1: they should go they should go to y Younkers.
Speaker 3: It's really fun, great restaurants and down there in the
Speaker 3: like the Main Street area, the Getty Square area. And actually,
Speaker 3: one thing about Yonkers, and you probably see this all
Speaker 3: the time on my social media feed. A lot of
Speaker 3: movie scenes were filmed in Yonkers. Yes, lots of different movies,
Speaker 3: like the movie It Could Happen to You, the movie Sleepers.
Speaker 3: There were a lot of scenes that that that catch
Speaker 3: me if you can. That's the scene where he's running
Speaker 3: down the street. That's Warboard and Avenue in Yonkers. So like, yeah,
Speaker 3: there's a lot of scenes that are from New York
Speaker 3: that that Yonkers still has this easy. Uh. We always
Speaker 3: need to make it easy for them to film there.
Speaker 3: And it looks like New York. It looks like parts
Speaker 3: of New York City, it does.
Speaker 1: Yeah, what are you watching on TV these days?
Speaker 3: College baseball? Both my I have three sons. Two of
Speaker 3: my sons are very big baseball players. One my son, Collins,
Speaker 3: going into going into college next year and he's gonna
Speaker 3: be pitching for Hamilton College and D three, And we're
Speaker 3: just obsessed with watching college baseball.
Speaker 5: It's a really pure version of the sport. It's a
Speaker 5: very fun version of the sport.
Speaker 3: And I also think like the College World Series is
Speaker 3: very It's one of the hardest championships to win because
Speaker 3: of how the seedings and the bracketing and the format
Speaker 3: is and it's just extremely it's exciting. Like right now,
Speaker 3: we don't know who's going to win this College World
Speaker 3: Series amongst the teams that are in it. So I
Speaker 3: just watch so much. Our whole family watches NonStop college
Speaker 3: baseball at home.
Speaker 2: Fun.
Speaker 1: Okay, if someone's visiting DC and they want to feel
Speaker 1: like a real power player, where do they go for lunch?
Speaker 3: Bobby Vans on Fifteenth Street, where me and a certain
Speaker 3: John Goodwin used to hang out all the time.
Speaker 2: Your husband, I've never heard of him. Yeah, you know.
Speaker 1: I always used to make fun because John, my husband Goody,
Speaker 1: would be like I'd come down to visit him in
Speaker 1: DC and he'd be like, we're going to Bobby Vance
Speaker 1: or we're going to Rosa Mexicano, and I'd be like,
Speaker 1: you know, we have those in New York, all.
Speaker 5: The restaurants in DC.
Speaker 3: Right, Like, everybody's like, why are we going to Bobby
Speaker 3: Vance for the fifthieth time? But everybody like the owners
Speaker 3: of Bobby Vans are the greatest people we've ever met.
Speaker 5: They they shoot their customers great.
Speaker 3: The other thing, it's got a really cool patio where
Speaker 3: anybody walking up and down that street you'll see you
Speaker 3: could sit there on that patio outside and you could
Speaker 3: see members of Cabinet, members of the White House, You'll
Speaker 3: see people from you know that are that are in
Speaker 3: TV and media, like it's just a great it's a
Speaker 3: great pace watching spot.
Speaker 2: It is. I would I would add Cafe Milano to that.
Speaker 2: I love Cafe.
Speaker 3: Cafe Milano is very good, but that for me, that's
Speaker 3: kind of on the other side of Georgetown.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, Okay.
Speaker 1: The last question is very important to me. We ask
Speaker 1: it at the end of every podcast. It's part of
Speaker 1: my cultural and spiritual identity. When is it iced coffee season?
Speaker 3: Ice coffee season, I'd say starts around Memorial Day, right,
Speaker 3: I'm not an ice coffee guy. I will say that
Speaker 3: when that's I'm a hot cop I'm a hot coffee guy,
Speaker 3: and ice coffee when I get it, it's so good.
Speaker 5: It's almost like a treat that I just liked so good.
Speaker 5: And this almost had.
Speaker 3: Like the shakes from the amount of caffeine.
Speaker 1: And well, the correct answer is it's year round.
Speaker 2: This is year round.
Speaker 1: But I appreciate that at least you are a coffee
Speaker 1: drinker and that you do have ice coffee once in
Speaker 1: a while, you know.
Speaker 5: My the Capitol Hill Starbucks.
Speaker 3: My wife and I had our first date there, and
Speaker 3: I had never really been as much of a coffee
Speaker 3: drinker as Jacqueline will like have a Venti coffee before
Speaker 3: she even brushes her teeth in the morning.
Speaker 5: But we just to keep talking to her.
Speaker 3: I had three venty iced mochas, and I do like
Speaker 3: the next day, like my heart was still racing like
Speaker 3: a day and a.
Speaker 5: Half afterwards from that first day.
Speaker 3: And she's so many she still laughs about how talkative
Speaker 3: I was during nap. But mild thing is like, I
Speaker 3: just gotta keep this thing going. Let's keep ordering vent
Speaker 3: the ice cop iced mocha Starbucks.
Speaker 2: So that's adorable.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it is adorable.
Speaker 2: It is.
Speaker 5: I wish it was romantic behind the political strategies here.
Speaker 2: It's Starbucks. That's fine. I wish it were Duncan.
Speaker 1: But I'm happy for you guys that you that your
Speaker 1: love affair began over coffee.
Speaker 2: Thanks Kevin Madden.
Speaker 5: So great to see you, always great to see you
Speaker 5: as well.
Speaker 1: Give my best to John Well and thanks to you
Speaker 1: for tuning in. We'll see you next time. Off the
Speaker 1: cop is a production of iHeart Podcast as part of
Speaker 1: the Reason Choice Network. If you want more, check out
Speaker 1: the Other Reason Choice podcast Spolitics with Jamel Hill and
Speaker 1: Native Plan Pod. For Off the Cup, I'm your host
Speaker 1: Si Cupp. Editing and sound design by Derek Clements. Our
Speaker 1: executive producers are Me Sie Cup and Lauren Hanson. Rate
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