WEBVTT - Are Aid Cuts Making Ebola Outbreak Worse?

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<v Speaker 1>Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.

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<v Speaker 2>Eastern Democratic Republic of Congo seems to go from one

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<v Speaker 2>crisis to another. It's faced natural disasters and is in

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<v Speaker 2>an ongoing war, but now it's facing an outbreak of abola,

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<v Speaker 2>a deadly virus that strikes fear across the world. It's

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<v Speaker 2>one that the World Health Organization has already declared an emergency.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm deeply concerned about the scale and the speed of

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<v Speaker 3>the epidemic.

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<v Speaker 4>Cases have been.

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<v Speaker 3>Reported in urban areas, including Kampala and the city of

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<v Speaker 3>Goma in the DRC. Business have been reported among health workers,

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<v Speaker 3>indicating healthcare associated transmission. There is significant population movement in

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<v Speaker 3>the area now.

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<v Speaker 2>The DRC has faced many abola outbreaks over the years,

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<v Speaker 2>helping it to build expertise in how to manage the virus.

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<v Speaker 2>But with cases spreading in a conflict zone against a

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<v Speaker 2>backdrop of shrinking international aid budgets, could this outbreak be

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<v Speaker 2>a harder one to control? And citizens in Eastern Congo

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<v Speaker 2>are having to face yet another disaster.

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<v Speaker 5>This disease that has appeared in our community is causing

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<v Speaker 5>great concern. At this point, we do not really know

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<v Speaker 5>what kind of disease it is every day people are

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<v Speaker 5>dying in Rumpara, and this has been happening for about

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<v Speaker 5>a week. In a single day we bury two, three

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<v Speaker 5>or even more people.

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<v Speaker 2>On today's Next Africa Podcast, we're looking at this latest

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<v Speaker 2>outbreak of a bowl up in the DRC, how cuts

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<v Speaker 2>to international aid, including USAID, have affected the response, and

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<v Speaker 2>how serious things are on the ground. Right now, I'm

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<v Speaker 2>Jennifer Zabasaja, and this is the Next Africa Podcast, bringing

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<v Speaker 2>you one story each week from the continent, driving the

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<v Speaker 2>future of global growth with the context only Bloomberg can provide.

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<v Speaker 2>So joining me today is our senior healthcare reporter that

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<v Speaker 2>is Janis q and also Caitlin Brady. She is the

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<v Speaker 2>Democratic Republic of Congo country director for the NGO, the

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<v Speaker 2>Danish Refugee Council, and she's currently in Goman near the

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<v Speaker 2>Rwandan border right now. Janis, maybe we just start with you,

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<v Speaker 2>because this outbreak is fast moving. Things are changing quite rapidly.

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<v Speaker 2>Maybe you can give us a lay of the land.

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<v Speaker 2>What do we know about where things stand at this

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<v Speaker 2>current moment.

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<v Speaker 1>Jen, As you say, things are moving very quickly. At

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<v Speaker 1>the moment, we are seeing five hundred and forty suspected

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<v Speaker 1>cases and one hundred and thirty one deaths, but researchers

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<v Speaker 1>are concerned that the estimate of the true number of

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<v Speaker 1>infections is probably already larger than eight hundred cases, just

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<v Speaker 1>as a point of reference. We only had the notification

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<v Speaker 1>of this come through let on Thursday, so less than

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<v Speaker 1>a week ago we had the notification come through. And

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<v Speaker 1>one of the initial big concerns was that there were

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<v Speaker 1>healthcare workers that were infected. And the reason that is

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<v Speaker 1>a big concern is that they're obviously working with a

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<v Speaker 1>whole lot of people. And so when you at the

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<v Speaker 1>point of health care workers being infected, people have come

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<v Speaker 1>into facilities where the infection has lightly occurred, and then

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<v Speaker 1>those healthcare workers have worked with other people, and if

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<v Speaker 1>that had been going on for some time before anyone

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<v Speaker 1>realized that it was ebola, the options on contact tracing

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<v Speaker 1>become far more complicated. It's also concerning that they've been travelers.

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<v Speaker 1>We've seen that the first dath in Uganda was from

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<v Speaker 1>someone who'd come over the border from Congo, and when

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<v Speaker 1>you have infection spreading amongst people traveling, that also raises concerns.

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<v Speaker 2>Caitlin, maybe we go to you as well, because this

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<v Speaker 2>outbreak is really concentrated in the DRC. You're on the

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<v Speaker 2>ground there, can you give us the sense of what

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<v Speaker 2>you're seeing, what you've been hearing over the past few

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<v Speaker 2>days and maybe even weeks.

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<v Speaker 4>I'm in Goma, as Janis was saying, we have had

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<v Speaker 4>travelers come here from Aturi and unfortunately, one of them

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<v Speaker 4>did fall ill while in Goma and has been hospitalized

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<v Speaker 4>and the local health workers are doing contract tracing for

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<v Speaker 4>that individual, so that obviously complicates matters. We also have

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<v Speaker 4>two positive cases in Boutembo. North Kivu has been the

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<v Speaker 4>site of several epidemics. This is the seventeenth epidemic and

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<v Speaker 4>response that the DORC has dealt with, and the most

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<v Speaker 4>ferocious response was the tenth in North Kivu. Itturi is

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<v Speaker 4>the epicenter of this crisis. It Touri is the province

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<v Speaker 4>in the far northeast on the border with Uganda and

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<v Speaker 4>South Sudan, and unfortunately where this started is It's a

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<v Speaker 4>mining town in a territory that is heavily conflict affected,

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<v Speaker 4>an area that potentially doesn't have a lo a lot

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<v Speaker 4>of humanitarian access, that isn't very stable, and potentially where

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<v Speaker 4>education and exposure to modern medicine is potentially less so

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<v Speaker 4>for at least two weeks, it would seem there were

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<v Speaker 4>some cases, some deaths before the alert was raised, and

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<v Speaker 4>as Johnas said, when health workers started dying. What we've

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<v Speaker 4>seen now is a very rapid response by the government

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<v Speaker 4>and also by the health agencies like MSF and medic

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<v Speaker 4>for example, who are doing the very best to do

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<v Speaker 4>the contact tracing and to identify among those contacts who

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<v Speaker 4>shows preliminary symptoms make sure those people are isolating. Obviously,

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<v Speaker 4>as we've seen in the past, this is a very

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<v Speaker 4>scary thing for the community to face. They don't necessarily

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<v Speaker 4>understand abola. This is a very closed These are closed communities,

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<v Speaker 4>and in particular in this area, they haven't dealt with

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<v Speaker 4>abola before. If this was North Kivu, everybody would be

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<v Speaker 4>sort of okay, we know how to do this, we

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<v Speaker 4>know how to do this. But it's not. It's a

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<v Speaker 4>toury and it's Jugu and its conflict affected. The access

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<v Speaker 4>is very very poor in this area, or at least

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<v Speaker 4>it has been. Just last week, last Thursday, we were

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<v Speaker 4>celebrating the announcement of a ceasefire by one of the

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<v Speaker 4>arm groups who voluntarily declared a unilateral ceasefire starting Friday morning. Excellent,

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<v Speaker 4>excellent news. Unfortunately, at the same time we had the

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<v Speaker 4>news of the outbreak and we had to shift gears

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<v Speaker 4>immediately into a public health response.

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<v Speaker 2>What has that looked like, Caitlin, Because as you mentioned,

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<v Speaker 2>this country has seen quite a few outbreaks in the past,

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<v Speaker 2>but this region, I mean you speak to how this

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<v Speaker 2>is a bit new for a lot of this community.

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<v Speaker 2>What does it look like differently than previous outbreaks that

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<v Speaker 2>you've been on the ground for.

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<v Speaker 4>So I've been on the ground to the West Africa

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<v Speaker 4>bowler crisis in Myberia and also for the twenty eighteen

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<v Speaker 4>to twenty twenty tenth the Boler response here. Actually, there

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<v Speaker 4>are a lot of similarities in that initially we heard

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<v Speaker 4>rumors that people thought this was blackmatic, they thought that

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<v Speaker 4>family was cursed. We've also already started hearing harmful rumors

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<v Speaker 4>about the origin of this outbreak, that it was malicious.

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<v Speaker 4>For example, Doing risk communications and community engagement and in

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<v Speaker 4>particular countering some of these rumors is absolutely critical, and

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<v Speaker 4>we need to educate people about how they can protect themselves.

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<v Speaker 4>These are some of the most vulnerable people in the world.

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<v Speaker 4>Utturi hosts almost a million IDPs and Jugu has a

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<v Speaker 4>lot of IDP camps. So these are camps where internally

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<v Speaker 4>displaced persons, people who have fled conflict take refuge from violence,

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<v Speaker 4>some of which host over one hundred thousand people. These

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<v Speaker 4>are literally some of the most vulnerable people in the world,

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<v Speaker 4>and they've faced violence and conflict and displacement and now

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<v Speaker 4>they could face a bold So it's a terrible situation

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<v Speaker 4>and we really need to act quickly and along with

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<v Speaker 4>the nuts and bolts of the response, so the isolation

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<v Speaker 4>of suspected cases, care of confirmed cases, the contact tracing,

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<v Speaker 4>along with all of that, we really need to bring

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<v Speaker 4>the community along with us. And I know that the

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<v Speaker 4>WHO has already deployed some anthropologists to support the risk

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<v Speaker 4>communications and community engagement work that the entire community will

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<v Speaker 4>be doing to ensure that people do come to health facilities,

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<v Speaker 4>that they do follow the advice, that they do call

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<v Speaker 4>the hotline that the Ministry of Health has set up

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<v Speaker 4>to report, Hey, I'm not feeling well and these are

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<v Speaker 4>my symptoms. Could it be a bola? But they need

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<v Speaker 4>to trust the health care system and they need to

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<v Speaker 4>trust the responders and they've had a really hard time.

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<v Speaker 4>This area has been conflict affected since twenty eighteen quite intensively,

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<v Speaker 4>and then obviously previously during the first and second Congose wars.

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<v Speaker 4>So it's a vulnerable area and we're very worried about

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<v Speaker 4>the situation.

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<v Speaker 2>Absolutely, Janie, maybe you can come in with some of

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<v Speaker 2>the facts as well. Caitlin was speaking to what people

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<v Speaker 2>may or may not think about what is currently going on.

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<v Speaker 2>A lot of the discussion over the past few days

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<v Speaker 2>has been about just how different this strain of ebola

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<v Speaker 2>is than previous ones. Can you just talk about how

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<v Speaker 2>this bundebugio strain what we need to know about it

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<v Speaker 2>right now?

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<v Speaker 1>Congo is very experienced actually with Eberta art breaks. This

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<v Speaker 1>is their seventeenth Eberta artbreak, but only two previous artbreaks

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<v Speaker 1>have been this specific strain that we see now, and

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<v Speaker 1>already this artbreak has exceeded in terms of case numbers

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<v Speaker 1>and deaths the previous two outbreaks of that strain. That

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<v Speaker 1>is a difference. The Zaia strain is formal researched and

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<v Speaker 1>it already has an approv vaccine in therapeutics, which this

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<v Speaker 1>strain does not. So that is a concern because even

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<v Speaker 1>if tools can be deployed successfully, which as Caitlin's already

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<v Speaker 1>described as challenging and of itself, whether or not they're

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<v Speaker 1>actually going to be effective against this particular strain is

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<v Speaker 1>not yet known, and so that is concerning. The other

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<v Speaker 1>big concern rarely is just how extensive it may already be.

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<v Speaker 1>We got reports of the weekend that we were also

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<v Speaker 1>seeing ebola cases in Kinshasa. Now Conshassa is very far away.

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<v Speaker 1>That may be that we've had transmission, but it could

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<v Speaker 1>also be that there was actually outbursts or hot spots

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<v Speaker 1>in a lot of different places, and that is even

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<v Speaker 1>more concerning in many ways because it shows that it's

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<v Speaker 1>probably been going on undetected for a very long time.

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<v Speaker 1>And the reason that could be is that the initial

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<v Speaker 1>symptoms are quite confusing. They could be symptoms of diseases

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<v Speaker 1>like malaria or typhoid, and that is deeply concerning the

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<v Speaker 1>outbreak of twenty fourteen to twenty sixteen, which really devastated

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<v Speaker 1>West Africa, that inflicted more than twenty eight thousand people.

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<v Speaker 1>That's a lot of people.

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<v Speaker 2>Stick with us. We're going to take a short break

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<v Speaker 2>and when we come back we'll have more on the

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<v Speaker 2>international response to this latest outbreak. We'll be right back.

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<v Speaker 2>Welcome back today on the podcast, we're looking at the

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<v Speaker 2>evolving situation in the DRC as the who have declared

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<v Speaker 2>the abola outbreak a public emergency of international concern. I

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<v Speaker 2>have jenis Q and Caitlin Brady still with me. Can

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<v Speaker 2>we talk about the people who are maybe coming in

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<v Speaker 2>to support and I'm talking about the international community, and

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<v Speaker 2>in particular, there's been quite a bit of discussion over

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<v Speaker 2>the past few days about USAID and potentially what impacts

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<v Speaker 2>that could or couldn't have had on detecting earlier cases. Jennie,

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<v Speaker 2>I want to start with you and then Caitlin I'll

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<v Speaker 2>get your opinion as well. Where does that fit into

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<v Speaker 2>this conversation, Jennie.

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<v Speaker 1>It's difficult to pinpoint exactly how much of USAID funds

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<v Speaker 1>exactly would have improved surveillance, but in very bold breaststrokes,

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<v Speaker 1>funding internationally and not just from America, actually from many

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<v Speaker 1>other partners fail for Cliff last year, and that no

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<v Speaker 1>doubt has an impact because clinics close virologists who were

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<v Speaker 1>looking at samples and doing trials, etc. A lot of

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<v Speaker 1>that shuts down when there is no funding. There is

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<v Speaker 1>an obvious repercussion to that. Again, how to pinpoint that

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<v Speaker 1>to this specific outbreak is a little bit difficult, but

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<v Speaker 1>bi logic of the fact that there is less surveillance

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<v Speaker 1>generally and less research being done on possible vaccines and

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<v Speaker 1>other therapeutics makes it difficult to say that it hasn't

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<v Speaker 1>had an impact. It has had an impact. The response

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<v Speaker 1>has been swift. As soon as the DRC identified that

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<v Speaker 1>this was ebola, the WHO, Africa CDC have sent people in.

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<v Speaker 1>We have had a lot of other organizations like Doctors

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<v Speaker 1>with Our Borders, etc. Who have said that they've deployed people.

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<v Speaker 1>The US has offered funding specifically for this outbreak. The

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<v Speaker 1>USCDC is also involved at this point. So there has

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<v Speaker 1>been a response. But in the bigger broad breast strokes,

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<v Speaker 1>when you've got the US pulling out of the WHO,

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<v Speaker 1>for example, which is what they did last year, and

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<v Speaker 1>there are other countries that have been talking about it

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<v Speaker 1>as well, it really does leave the WHO in a

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<v Speaker 1>weakened position and that definitely has ramifications. The WHO said

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<v Speaker 1>that they've got quite a bit of funding I think

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<v Speaker 1>about ninety percent for the current year, but that ten

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<v Speaker 1>percent is going to be incredibly difficult to Marshal. And

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<v Speaker 1>one of the reasons that they called this global health

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<v Speaker 1>emergency so early was in an effort to martial resources.

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<v Speaker 1>That was really what's the main objective of that at

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<v Speaker 1>that moment in time was.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and we heard the Director General talking about that. Caitlyn,

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<v Speaker 2>can you speak to how it's that the international response

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<v Speaker 2>and also the receding of some of the aid from

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<v Speaker 2>the international community has manifested in your work and what

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<v Speaker 2>you've been seeing.

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<v Speaker 4>As honest as saying, we're a lot dinner on the

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<v Speaker 4>ground than we used to be. And that's not just

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<v Speaker 4>the wisdowal of USAID funding. It's also frankly reductions of

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<v Speaker 4>funding coming from European capitals as well as priority shift

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<v Speaker 4>to security. And while one might be sympathetic with their interests,

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<v Speaker 4>the result is that there's just a lot less funding

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<v Speaker 4>for humanitarian assistance. In terms of our work, yet we've

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<v Speaker 4>definitely contracted and so DRC would have had large scale

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<v Speaker 4>programming supporting disc persons funded by USAID, which we no

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<v Speaker 4>longer have, and normally we would have been working in

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<v Speaker 4>some of these camps in water and sanitation and hygiene,

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<v Speaker 4>so would other people, because there's hundreds of thousands of

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<v Speaker 4>people in these camps and there's a ton of need.

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<v Speaker 4>Having said that these camps, the access was bad. We

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<v Speaker 4>didn't have the funding and so we weren't present on

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<v Speaker 4>the ground, for example, for the past couple months, and

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<v Speaker 4>so people are living in really unsanitary conditions, cheek by jowl,

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<v Speaker 4>with shelters that are collapsing. They don't have latrines. What

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<v Speaker 4>latrens that may have had are full, and so you

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<v Speaker 4>will see open defecation and really just horrific sanitary conditions.

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<v Speaker 4>The basic advice that we give to people about wash

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<v Speaker 4>your hands, wash your arms frequently, they just can't do that.

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<v Speaker 4>They don't have the means to do that. So if

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<v Speaker 4>a bull of rye in these camps, it's going to

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<v Speaker 4>be a really horrific situation. Coming back to USAID, the

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<v Speaker 4>US government and the Department of State has announced the

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<v Speaker 4>mobilization of funding and that's fantastic and right now myself,

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<v Speaker 4>my colleagues here at the Danish Refugee Council, and all

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<v Speaker 4>of my colleagues in the UNIMMY and the NGOs are

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<v Speaker 4>looking for resources to respond. It's really critical that we

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<v Speaker 4>move fast. This is a situation where waiting a week

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<v Speaker 4>is not acceptable.

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<v Speaker 2>Caitlin, maybe i'll give you the final word. As you're

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<v Speaker 2>on the front line. What is it that you are

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<v Speaker 2>watching closely outside of the humanitarian aspect of it.

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<v Speaker 4>Maybe hard to put my humanitarian self aside, but what

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<v Speaker 4>we're in addition to the deployment of vaccines, and I

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<v Speaker 4>presume testing of vaccines against this strain to see if

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<v Speaker 4>they're at all effective, we're looking at movements of population

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<v Speaker 4>and the spread. We obviously need to keep our staff safe.

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<v Speaker 4>That's our first propriority so that they can continue to work,

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<v Speaker 4>but we need to move very fast either. Again, some

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<v Speaker 4>of the most vulnerable people on the planet and they

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<v Speaker 4>aren't facing a very deadly virus, so they need our help.

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<v Speaker 2>Which is why we have to say thank you to

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<v Speaker 2>you Caitlin and your team, Kaitlin Brady and also jenis

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<v Speaker 2>Q you as well for the work that you are

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<v Speaker 2>doing to bring the message of what is happening currently

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<v Speaker 2>with this outbreak. Kaitlyn Brady and jenis Q, thank you

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<v Speaker 2>guys THO so much. You can read all of our

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<v Speaker 2>coverage right now on the Abola outbreak on Bloomberg platforms.

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<v Speaker 2>Here's some of the other stories we've been following across

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<v Speaker 2>the region. This week, South African trade authorities proposed wide

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<v Speaker 2>ranging increases in tariffs on seal imports in an attempt

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<v Speaker 2>to provide safeguards as a quote unprecedented emergency batters the

0:17:57.560 --> 0:18:02.679
<v Speaker 2>nation's industry, and the Arab Bank for Economic Development in

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<v Speaker 2>Africa told investors last week that Senegal is in arrears

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<v Speaker 2>with the lender, according to people familiar with the matter,

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<v Speaker 2>adding to signs of mounting financial strain on the government.

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<v Speaker 2>You can follow these stories across Bloomberg, including the Next

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<v Speaker 2>African Newsletter. Will put a link to that in the

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<v Speaker 2>show notes. This program was produced by Adrian Bradley and

0:18:24.840 --> 0:18:27.879
<v Speaker 2>tiwa Adebayo. Don't forget to follow and review the show

0:18:28.160 --> 0:18:31.240
<v Speaker 2>wherever you usually get your podcasts. But for now, I'm

0:18:31.320 --> 0:18:34.280
<v Speaker 2>Jennifer z Abasaja. Thanks as always for listening.