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Speaker 1: Hey, we welcome and I'm Doug Gili. This is all ball.

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Speaker 1: Dusty May is our guest today for Atlantic's head coach.

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Speaker 1: They're thirteen to one of the year. They beat Florida,

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Speaker 1: they just beat UAB and they're kind of the talk

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Speaker 1: of the college basketball world. Could they get an at

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Speaker 1: large from Conference USA as Florid Atlantic. I will tell

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Speaker 1: my unique Florida Atlantic tie story to Dusty in this

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Speaker 1: pod two partner. I think you'll enjoy it because he's

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Speaker 1: had an incredible journey. That's that's led him to this

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Speaker 1: place and very likely to lead him to another place

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Speaker 1: in the very near future. But let me give you

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Speaker 1: a couple of thoughts. I have a chance to see

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Speaker 1: Alabama and Kentucky this weekend, and I'll give you more

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Speaker 1: on on Alabama upcoming, UCLA and USC as well. I'll

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Speaker 1: give you some more on those those guys probably in

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Speaker 1: part two of the pod. But but first I'm Kentucky

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Speaker 1: because they got their noses rubbed in it, right, the

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Speaker 1: bullies got bullied, And obviously it's different when you're at Kentucky.

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Speaker 1: Everybody knows that the Kentucky's in the Kansas is the

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Speaker 1: second that you're down even a little bit. Everybody's going

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Speaker 1: to try and take advantage of everybody can try and

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Speaker 1: frankly kick your ass. And that's exactly what happened with Alabama.

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Speaker 1: But but why look, I think there's there's there's a

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Speaker 1: couple levels to it. The first and maybe most important

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Speaker 1: part of the Kentucky discussion is people think, well, John

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Speaker 1: Calipari can't coach. I'll fight you to the death on

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Speaker 1: that one, because I think John calpary' is an outstanding coach.

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Speaker 1: I think there is a there's a portion of what

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Speaker 1: they're doing there which is lacking, and I'll get to that.

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Speaker 1: And again this is outsider more than insider, but I've

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Speaker 1: been doing this a while, as you guys know. And

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Speaker 1: the other the other element to it is that sometimes

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Speaker 1: players don't get better. But I think the first element

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Speaker 1: is Oscar Sheeway right, National Player of the Year and

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Speaker 1: I'm telling you, in the Alabama game, you couldn't play him.

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Speaker 1: They attacked him on ball string coverage, attack, attack, attack

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Speaker 1: on ball string coverage again and again, and he's just lost.

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Speaker 1: You know, he's he's not an athletic headger, so he

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Speaker 1: doesn't he couldn't get back. He can't he can't protect

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Speaker 1: the rim. He's not crazy long arms. He looks heavy

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Speaker 1: and slow footed. He looks like a he looks like

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Speaker 1: powerful words look And I did their game last year

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Speaker 1: against Kansas where he was great and he dominated them.

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Speaker 1: But again part of that was Kansas did not have

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Speaker 1: a kid like Betty Ako, who's a seven flitch shop

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Speaker 1: locker athlete, you know, true kind of rim protector two

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Speaker 1: twenty three big guy. That's what they That's what a

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Speaker 1: five looks like, right, either a small ball five or

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Speaker 1: a rim protector five. And he's a rim protector five.

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Speaker 1: He couldn't do anything with him. Betty average is five

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Speaker 1: a game, and he had you know, five points before

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Speaker 1: you could blink an eye. So defensively they got to

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Speaker 1: figure out a way because now everybody's gonna throw in

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Speaker 1: that tape if they haven't already, and going, well, just

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Speaker 1: if we have a legit big, we just spread out

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Speaker 1: high ball screen and there's nothing he can do. He

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Speaker 1: can't contain the dribbler, and he can't really defend the big,

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Speaker 1: and he can't play him in the drop. So it's

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Speaker 1: really hard to play him against Teams are going to

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Speaker 1: attack with a good ball screen ball screen guard or

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Speaker 1: ball screen guards in this case, so that it's a

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Speaker 1: big and then offensively, again, the length bothers him. And

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Speaker 1: if you put a two hundred pounds seven footer, he

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Speaker 1: can just bullyball him underneath the basket. But many of these,

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Speaker 1: you know, and now you're getting bigger, thicker dudes, and

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Speaker 1: he just struggled. And the other part is he gets

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Speaker 1: the ball, he puts them on the deck and they

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Speaker 1: were going on the bounds to come and dig the

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Speaker 1: basketball out. And he in the first half would not

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Speaker 1: pass the ball at all. In the second half he

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Speaker 1: was thrown it out on the double but one they

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Speaker 1: didn't shoot it well. They're not as bad as shoot

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Speaker 1: team as they shot, but they're not a very good

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Speaker 1: shooting team, and that that hurts them mentally. I think

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Speaker 1: that of the things that are missing, I don't think

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Speaker 1: there's good enough player development at Kentucky. I know, you

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Speaker 1: change your staff. I think that that does a little.

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Speaker 1: But I also think that part of it is they've

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Speaker 1: never had to do deep player development, you know, because

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Speaker 1: they went a decade and hot, They went a decade

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Speaker 1: where they had one and done. So Hey, we can't

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Speaker 1: really change a guy's shot We're not going to change

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Speaker 1: a guy's game. We're going to get him and do

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Speaker 1: the best we can with him in a short period

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Speaker 1: of time. Well, yeah, now they're playing. You know, they

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Speaker 1: have as much as you could be critical of Kentucky

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Speaker 1: saying well, they're not getting the top level guys anymore.

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Speaker 1: And I'll get to that in a second. And I

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Speaker 1: know help is on the way, and they have an

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Speaker 1: outstanding recruiting class coming next year and Wagner's come in,

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Speaker 1: and I get all that, but they have a group.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you have Wheeler backs, you got sheep way back,

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Speaker 1: so you have retention of two of your most if

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Speaker 1: not your most important pieces. So I think it's really interesting.

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Speaker 1: And then you have they probably have five or six

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Speaker 1: other dudes that it's not their first year at Kentucky.

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Speaker 1: Those players should be better, They should be better, they

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Speaker 1: should have been developed more. But I think part of

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Speaker 1: it is their culture has been so one and done

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Speaker 1: based that now when you have guys that you're attaining,

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Speaker 1: I think it's really they haven't made that switch. They

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Speaker 1: haven't developed them all enough. Guys haven't become that much

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Speaker 1: better shooters. And then and then the quite obvious element

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Speaker 1: outside of not getting as many top five, top ten,

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Speaker 1: top fifteen guys, and we'll get to that in a second,

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Speaker 1: is that they clearly haven't recurred enough shooting, you know.

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Speaker 1: And that's there's a lot of teams like this where

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Speaker 1: you go into a gym and you go and you

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Speaker 1: get the best dude in the gym, and I gotta

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Speaker 1: I gotta do great. Can you actually shoot the basketball?

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Speaker 1: You know? Because what the two skills outside of you know,

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Speaker 1: being a point guard, being able to handle a ball

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Speaker 1: street and handle pressure, whatever, but the two skills that

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Speaker 1: are needed the most in basketball today, can you can

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Speaker 1: you guard the ball and guard multiple positions to ball street.

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Speaker 1: They had that. They got dudes that can guard, But

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Speaker 1: can you shoot the basketball? Because there's just not space?

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Speaker 1: And especially when I like Severe Wheeler, I do not

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Speaker 1: a great shooter obviously, And then I mean Oscar has

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Speaker 1: been an outstanding player. He's a National Player of the Year.

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Speaker 1: So if those two guys aren't shooters, you gotta have

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Speaker 1: three that just lace it all around them. They don't

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Speaker 1: have Jacob Toppins, not really a stretch four five. He

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Speaker 1: can shoot, but not a shooter. And then who else

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Speaker 1: on their roster and that's big. They can shoot the basketball,

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Speaker 1: they don't have one, and their wings don't shoot well enough.

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Speaker 1: So I think that that's the very obvious flaw. And

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Speaker 1: what happens is when you the things that will make

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Speaker 1: you look like a bad coach is way, we can't

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Speaker 1: guard ball scream. You don't have a point guard. They

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Speaker 1: have a point guard. They can't guard ball stream they have.

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Speaker 1: And if you can't shoot the ball, because you know,

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Speaker 1: you get comments about his offense, and I would agree

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Speaker 1: that some of the stuff, you know, running floppy over

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Speaker 1: and over and over again, it wasn't working. They put

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Speaker 1: in some new things. You know, he's got to evolve

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Speaker 1: a little bit in terms of his coaching style. But

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Speaker 1: they had plenty of good looks they used to make them.

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Speaker 1: I mean plenty of good looks that they didn't make.

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Speaker 1: And if that's player development and recruiting combined, and I

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Speaker 1: think that's that's missing now in terms of not getting

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Speaker 1: the top guys. And I know they have an outstanding

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Speaker 1: recruiting class coming in and one would think that with

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Speaker 1: the passion from from Big Blue Nation, you would think

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Speaker 1: that nil they would kill it. The problem is that

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Speaker 1: there's similar passion coming from Alabama and Arkansas and Auburn

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Speaker 1: and they everybody's got dudes. That league has probably the

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Speaker 1: best collection of dudes. And honestly, the coaching is outstanding too, Like,

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Speaker 1: in my mind the two best leagues, the Big twelve

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Speaker 1: has been the best league, and I think the SEC

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Speaker 1: will continue to push in terms of maybe the most

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Speaker 1: talentably because the investment of the nil and the investment

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Speaker 1: in some of these coaches. It's a really really good league.

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Speaker 1: But you know when you have when now Arkansas and

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Speaker 1: Alabama are also getting top fifty kids and then you

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Speaker 1: combined ignite stud Henderson would be maybe in college somewhere,

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Speaker 1: and that's that would have been you know, ten years ago,

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Speaker 1: he would have been in Kentucky. You know, same thing

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Speaker 1: with the Twins, the Thompson Twins, over time of league, right,

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Speaker 1: they would have been in Kentucky, Kentucky or dude, that's

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Speaker 1: where they would have gone. So what's interesting is it's

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Speaker 1: harder to win with young players now they don't play.

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Speaker 1: I mean, like, I'm not giving them a path because

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Speaker 1: you know, you gotta you gotta atrom point guard, a veteran,

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Speaker 1: big guy, toppins, a veteran You've got plenty of experience there.

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Speaker 1: You're not one of these old twenty four year old

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Speaker 1: teams with fifth year transfers and COVID year guys. But

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Speaker 1: you're not that far off. Okay, you're not. You're not

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Speaker 1: losing because you're young. That one doesn't fly with me.

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Speaker 1: But what does fly with me is the idea that

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Speaker 1: the recruiting world has changed. You know, I don't know

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Speaker 1: how long the overtime elite thing goes. I don't know

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Speaker 1: how long the ignite thing last. You know, there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of people talking about why are they doing the

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Speaker 1: ignite thing now that college players are getting paid, So

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of questions. But in the short term,

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Speaker 1: obviously you're not rolling out with dudes that are just

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Speaker 1: better than everybody else, so it's harder to win with them,

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Speaker 1: and the evails are more difficult, and you're taking guys

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Speaker 1: that have need a little bit more development, which, as

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Speaker 1: you point out, is not necessarily the focus of the program.

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Speaker 1: So there's there's kind of my take on Kentucky. I

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Speaker 1: don't think all is dead. I do think that there's

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Speaker 1: you know, with some tweaks, they can they'll still be

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Speaker 1: I think they'll still be an NCAA tournament team, because

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Speaker 1: I still I think Cal figures it out. Like one

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Speaker 1: of the things when you watch him coach, he figures

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Speaker 1: it out. He's got his fighting senses are very very good.

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Speaker 1: He's coached a lot of ball. He knows who. I

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Speaker 1: think he's actually underrated in terms of in game coaching

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Speaker 1: now he does. He is kind of the old school

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Speaker 1: variety where he's not drawn up these ornate atos and sets.

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Speaker 1: You know, they usually do one or two things really

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Speaker 1: really well and find a couple of players really really well.

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Speaker 1: But I do think that he has great feel for

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Speaker 1: what his team needs in individual games and how to

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Speaker 1: evolve them. And generally, you know, when the mojo's decent,

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Speaker 1: they get better as the year goes on because of

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Speaker 1: his field. And last year I called the Kansas Kentucky

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Speaker 1: game on radio Kansas, Kansas, Kentucky. And if you would

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Speaker 1: have told me on February first that Kansas was going

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Speaker 1: in the National Championship and Kentucky was gonna lose in

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Speaker 1: the first round, I would have told you you're nuts, right. Instead,

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Speaker 1: Kentucky Peters Cansam in National Championship. Remember that game, Kentucky

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Speaker 1: ran Kansas off the floor. So things can change over

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Speaker 1: time as guys figure out their roles and players improve

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Speaker 1: and coaches figure out what works. But there are a

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Speaker 1: lot of flaws to Kentucky and it's going to be

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Speaker 1: interesting to see how they dig themselves out of this

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Speaker 1: hole and if they can use Oscar Sheepway in some

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Speaker 1: of these games against matchups which he suddenly struggles with.

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Speaker 1: Really interesting. All right, let's let's catch up with Dusty May.

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Speaker 1: I've hung out with Dusty twice. It did one of

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Speaker 1: his Floria Atlanta games a couple of years ago for Stadium,

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Speaker 1: and then when I was a CBS, I did a Florida.

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Speaker 1: I've done a couple of Florida games of theirs. I

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Speaker 1: did Florida or miss and I think I did Florida

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Speaker 1: maybe Florida, Georgia, Florida, Georgia. And I know Dusty because

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Speaker 1: Mike White's guys they play pickupball every day and it

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Speaker 1: was like thirty minutes straight NonStop, you know nobs and

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Speaker 1: great great Cardio, the Marquette guys. Back when Wojo was there,

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Speaker 1: they used to do pick up all to one hundred.

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Speaker 1: I think they played to a hundred every day, which

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Speaker 1: is incredible. Cardio. Not a lot of defense, but man,

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Speaker 1: did they have a staff that could go anyway. Let's

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Speaker 1: catch up with Dusky May's head coach of flor Atlantic.

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Speaker 1: They're playing great. He's got FIU upcoming. Has also planned well,

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Speaker 1: but fresh off a couple of big wins in Coferate, USA.

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Speaker 1: Here's the head coach of one of the hottest teams

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Speaker 1: in America. Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk

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Speaker 1: lineup in the nation. Catch all of our shows at

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Speaker 1: Fox sports Radio dot com and within the iHeart Radio app.

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Speaker 1: Search f SR to listen live. Okay, so I know

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Speaker 1: you went to IU, but where did you go to

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Speaker 1: high school? Oh? To high school Eastern Green then Southern

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Speaker 1: Indiana and played for actually a legendary coach named Mark

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Speaker 1: Barneiser who played collegially at Perdun and transferred to Auburn.

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Speaker 1: But he's one about a million games and I was

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Speaker 1: about as much respect for him as I do it

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Speaker 1: as anyone in coaching. How know, Indiana high school basketball,

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Speaker 1: it's all about the gym. What was your guys gym like?

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Speaker 1: It was a huge went to small school. The teams

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Speaker 1: in our sexual we were always nineteen two, nineteen and

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Speaker 1: one going into the secual and it was one class

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Speaker 1: and then we'd go against Bloomington South and Bloomington North,

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Speaker 1: and if you know hoops in Indiana, those Bloomington South

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Speaker 1: teams with Chrismsical and Nil Reid and all them. We

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Speaker 1: never could get past the what are now four A schools.

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Speaker 1: But we had a very good run as a small school.

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Speaker 1: We'd win our county, we'd win our conference, all that.

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Speaker 1: But once we got into the state level with the

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Speaker 1: big boys, we weren't. We were never able to get

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Speaker 1: over the hump. Did you have the whole bandwagon thing?

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Speaker 1: Like when you got to go to those games, you

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Speaker 1: get like you see on who you jersey they well

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Speaker 1: believe or not. Yeah, there was somewhat a carpool, but

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Speaker 1: the gyms were packed. I mean, it was a big deal.

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Speaker 1: And I don't know how it is now. I've been

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Speaker 1: gone so long, but every game then it seems like

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Speaker 1: it is now. I get. You know, my sons go

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Speaker 1: back for Christmas and they usually try to catch a

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Speaker 1: holiday tournament and they can't believe the energy and excitement

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Speaker 1: for high school games in that state. So I don't

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Speaker 1: think it's it is what it was, but it's still

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Speaker 1: pretty dark if it was up to you one one

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Speaker 1: tournament or like to have it now, or they have

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Speaker 1: a bunch of a bunch of different sections. I like

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Speaker 1: the one tournament. It's it's one of those things where

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Speaker 1: the sectional for us, because of the scenario, was like

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Speaker 1: a state championship. So all the small schools, if you

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Speaker 1: could win your sexual and then you could win the regional,

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Speaker 1: it was almost as if you you won a national championship.

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Speaker 1: So you know, I've been gone so long, so I

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Speaker 1: don't know how the people the small schools feel about

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Speaker 1: the one class. But are the four classes? But I

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Speaker 1: enjoyed the one But it's I mean, it's like it

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Speaker 1: doesn't My question is not really you know how other

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Speaker 1: people feel. It's like as a guy who is at

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Speaker 1: a small school that couldn't get over the big school,

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Speaker 1: you know, because it's really I mean, it's it's just

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Speaker 1: basically it's about it's like, hey, how many teams can

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Speaker 1: we get a chance to say they want to want

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Speaker 1: to compete it for a championship. And I understand the

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Speaker 1: logic behind it, but I think that most of us

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Speaker 1: as competitors, like, you know, why not, I mean, it

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Speaker 1: doesn't usually work out, but especially in basketball, it can

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Speaker 1: What was so special about him? You said you have

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Speaker 1: a lot of respect from as a coach. What do

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Speaker 1: you what do you remember? What do you remember about

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Speaker 1: him that like now it's a coach day, you kind

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Speaker 1: of still kind of drawn. Well, he I had no

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Speaker 1: background in hoops. I grew up with my mom and

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Speaker 1: she signed me up for elementary basketball, and I played

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Speaker 1: so aggressively and fell in love with it that she

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Speaker 1: made me wear sweatpants. So from day one I would

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Speaker 1: whatever it was. I was nuts. I was fanatical about it.

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Speaker 1: And then when he took over the I went to

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Speaker 1: the same It's k through twelve. So when when coach

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Speaker 1: Barneiser got the job, he would start pickup games at

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Speaker 1: five thirty or six in the morning, and he at

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Speaker 1: that time, high school kids couldn't play in open gym,

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Speaker 1: so I was in junior high and I lived on

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Speaker 1: the way to the school, so he would stop and

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Speaker 1: pick me up every morning. And just his love and

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Speaker 1: passion for the game, I mean he was is was

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Speaker 1: obsessed with the sport, and so I think that definitely

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Speaker 1: had an impact on me. And then he shaped me

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Speaker 1: as far as the work ethic and all those things

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Speaker 1: that coaches do. So very very grateful to play for him.

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Speaker 1: My grandparents didn't get my dad's almost fanaticism for basketball.

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Speaker 1: Your mom, how did she? How did she handle You're like,

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Speaker 1: you're in love with this sport just and you're getting up,

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Speaker 1: you know, you're a middle school kid and you're getting

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Speaker 1: up to play at five thirty in the morning. How

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Speaker 1: did she handle it? She handled it great. She was

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Speaker 1: always up getting ready for work. And I remember one

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Speaker 1: time I tried to say that I wasn't feeling well.

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Speaker 1: I had the sniffles are cold, and my mom went

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Speaker 1: out and told coach bartne Eiser, Hey, Dusty sick, and

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Speaker 1: he said, go tell Dusty. He's got five minutes. I'll wait.

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Speaker 1: That was the standards that he had. But note, and

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Speaker 1: when you grew up in Indiana, the Hoosiers at that

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Speaker 1: time was a religion, and so we didn't have cable

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Speaker 1: TV or satellite TV. So we would go for the

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Speaker 1: nine thirty Tuesday games, I remember, and maybe in Monday

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Speaker 1: or Tuesday we would go to friends that she worked with,

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Speaker 1: and I'm in elementary school and we would go stay

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Speaker 1: out till midnight. And I think the only time I

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Speaker 1: could stay at past nine is when I played. So

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Speaker 1: that's the culture and the era that I was raised

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Speaker 1: where there were your high school teams. They got the

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Speaker 1: Indiana schedule before they scheduled their game. So now my

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Speaker 1: son's play on the same nights as us, and I

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Speaker 1: think back like we never had a game at the

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Speaker 1: same night as I you because it was such a spectacle.

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Speaker 1: Who is your guy at IU? Who when you grew up?

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Speaker 1: But who's who's your favorite player? I always loved Greg Graham,

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Speaker 1: the Colbert Cheney teams, those were those were my favorite

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Speaker 1: when I was young, and obviously Steve Alford was a

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Speaker 1: cold hero. But I loved Keith Smart, who's now assistant

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Speaker 1: at Arkansas. He was probably my favorite player on those teams.

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Speaker 1: But and then when I went to Indiana and an

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Speaker 1: aj guyde and was was the guy then, So, uh

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Speaker 1: he's one that I still keep in close contact with.

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Speaker 1: It you know, he was he was. He was special.

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Speaker 1: Nothing like those Kenny stripe pants. Okay, so, uh so

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Speaker 1: what made you decide to walk on? Could you? Could

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Speaker 1: you have played in college? No? I actually played Division two.

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Speaker 1: I ran across country and played one year and it

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Speaker 1: wasn't the situation for me at the time, I wanted

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Speaker 1: to be a high school coach, and so I went

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Speaker 1: there and I was there a couple of weeks and

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Speaker 1: I knew I made a mistake. I called my mom

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Speaker 1: and at Oakland City in southern Indiana, I was gonna

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Speaker 1: go be a manager. It's it's a long story about

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Speaker 1: doctor Rink, who was Coach's close friend, close friend. I

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Speaker 1: had a mutual friend with him, and I did some

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Speaker 1: yard work and odd jobs for him when I was

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Speaker 1: in high school, and so he started coming to my

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Speaker 1: some of my games, and I developed a relationship with him,

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Speaker 1: and he always pushed me, Hey, come be a manager

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Speaker 1: for coach Night. You'll get a varsity job by the

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Speaker 1: time you're twenty three or twenty four. So that was

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Speaker 1: always That's all I ever dreamed of, was being how

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Speaker 1: quickly can I become a varsity high school coach in Indiana?

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Speaker 1: And so at the last minute, I decided to keep playing.

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Speaker 1: I went to Oakland City and didn't play well. I

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Speaker 1: got really sick and just didn't have a great experience overall.

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Speaker 1: So I decided to go back and be a manager.

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Speaker 1: And that was before walk On's at Indiana. So there

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Speaker 1: were over fourteen of us managers, and it was ran

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Speaker 1: like a well oiled machine, and so you know, you

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Speaker 1: got to do a little bit of everything, but it

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Speaker 1: was it was a learning experience and I did it

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Speaker 1: just so I could get a RC job. Okay, so

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Speaker 1: you show up and I you you've played a year,

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Speaker 1: you're sophomore, You're you're how old did you graduate? Seventeen?

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Speaker 1: Probably seventeen eighteen, I don't remember, but yeah, I was

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Speaker 1: probably eighteen when when I nineteen, when I got to Indiana,

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Speaker 1: first time you meet Bob Knight, coach Night, But do

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Speaker 1: you remember how big and imposing and intimidating he is.

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Speaker 1: It's it's I mean, it's like when when Bill Parcels

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Speaker 1: would come in. I mean it was like they're giants,

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Speaker 1: uh in person, and they're also giants you know on TV,

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Speaker 1: so uh figuratively in literally, so you know, every time

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Speaker 1: I would walk in there for the first couple of months,

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Speaker 1: I would I would have goosebumps. Because I didn't go

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Speaker 1: to very many games growing up. If if someone Christmas

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Speaker 1: break and there were tickets loose, then then I would,

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Speaker 1: you know, go with someone. But rarely was I able

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Speaker 1: to even go to the games. Growing up. So just

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Speaker 1: being an assembly hall a place that's you know, like

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Speaker 1: the Vatican, uh, Catholics was, you know, you have goosebumps

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Speaker 1: for several months. So so here's my background. Coach Night.

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Speaker 1: So my dad was a walk on during his Ohio

396
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Speaker 1: State teams. Okay, and and then when my dad was

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Speaker 1: a high school coach, became a college coach and he

398
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Speaker 1: would tell them about how and he has I can

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Speaker 1: still find him somewhere. He's copious notes. And he considered

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Speaker 1: Coach Night the greatest clinician ever, and he said he's

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Speaker 1: a west point to everyone, but he went to his clinics.

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Speaker 1: So I had met him a couple of times at

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Speaker 1: the Final four's. But my freshman year, I'm at Notre Dame.

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Speaker 1: This is ninety five, so I think you're still in

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Speaker 1: high school ninety six. So we we go in the

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Speaker 1: year before, Notre Dame had beaten Indiana at home and

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Speaker 1: they'd hit a bunch of threes, and you know, at

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Speaker 1: that time, he did not like the three point shot

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Speaker 1: at all. Basically basically he thought it was bullshit. And uh,

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Speaker 1: you see, you combine the fact that they had lost

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Speaker 1: to Notre Dame at Notre Dame the year before on

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Speaker 1: a bunch of threes, and they had just played up

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Speaker 1: in Alaska and lost by like forty two. Yukon. Yukon

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Speaker 1: was amazing that year, Rayal, And I mean they came

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Speaker 1: out with they had the look in their eyes like

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Speaker 1: if they could win by a hundred, they would win

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Speaker 1: by a hundred. And I remember we're warming up and

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Speaker 1: then all of a sudden, he comes marching out, and

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Speaker 1: you know, he's got a couple of guys with him,

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Speaker 1: and he's in front, he's got that big red sweater,

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Speaker 1: and you forget how big a dude he is too,

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Speaker 1: That's what you're talking about. And and I just remember

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Speaker 1: like warming up and all of a sudden he walks by,

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Speaker 1: and he literally took the air out of Assembly Hall,

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Speaker 1: like everything stopped. All eyes were on it was and

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Speaker 1: all he did was walk out. He didn't say anything,

427
00:21:44,640 --> 00:21:46,280
Speaker 1: and shaking out of his hands, he just kind of

428
00:21:46,320 --> 00:21:50,000
Speaker 1: stomped over to the sideline. He was the presence was amazing.

429
00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:57,479
Speaker 1: So we're so so we're that that year. And I

430
00:21:57,560 --> 00:22:00,199
Speaker 1: think that game was the first game they'd installed the

431
00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:02,879
Speaker 1: new hardwood floor. And if you play, you know a

432
00:22:02,880 --> 00:22:06,159
Speaker 1: new floor is bouncy as hell. So we're you know,

433
00:22:06,359 --> 00:22:10,320
Speaker 1: throwing down, we're bouncing like we got We were getting

434
00:22:10,320 --> 00:22:13,560
Speaker 1: beat so bad. At halftime it was forty five fourteen

435
00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:16,600
Speaker 1: go look, I remember because we're walking in. We're walking

436
00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:19,080
Speaker 1: in and you walk past the band to walk into

437
00:22:19,080 --> 00:22:20,800
Speaker 1: the little visitors locker room, which is kind of like

438
00:22:20,920 --> 00:22:25,639
Speaker 1: underneath where the band is, and they're yelling, don't come out,

439
00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:28,840
Speaker 1: don't come out. And I'm thinking to myself, you know,

440
00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:30,959
Speaker 1: if we didn't have to, we would be cool not

441
00:22:31,040 --> 00:22:34,600
Speaker 1: coming out. This is not fun. So what was the

442
00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:40,320
Speaker 1: big guy from Texas? Why am I forgetting Yes? Yeah, okay,

443
00:22:40,520 --> 00:22:44,879
Speaker 1: so it was. I mean we kept it to like thirty,

444
00:22:45,119 --> 00:22:48,080
Speaker 1: you know, kept it around the twenty five. So at

445
00:22:48,119 --> 00:22:50,240
Speaker 1: one point in time, I shoot a floater and Andre

446
00:22:50,359 --> 00:22:53,119
Speaker 1: Patterson blocked it. And you know an assembly hall, they

447
00:22:53,119 --> 00:22:54,919
Speaker 1: have those three rows of stands and then there's the

448
00:22:54,960 --> 00:22:57,919
Speaker 1: wall and then there's the other stands whatever, and he

449
00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:02,520
Speaker 1: blocked it so hard it hit that wall. So so

450
00:23:02,680 --> 00:23:05,040
Speaker 1: we we get beat. You know, you get, you shower up,

451
00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:06,920
Speaker 1: you get you get pizzas you have on the bus.

452
00:23:07,040 --> 00:23:10,359
Speaker 1: You go back to South Bend and you go to

453
00:23:10,359 --> 00:23:12,320
Speaker 1: your dorm room and this is that this is like

454
00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:14,840
Speaker 1: my first game where the highlight would be on Sports Center,

455
00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:17,840
Speaker 1: And this is when Sports Center was everything, And so

456
00:23:18,040 --> 00:23:20,720
Speaker 1: I turned on I'll Never Forget, and they used to

457
00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:23,399
Speaker 1: have like a highlight before the it's called the Sports

458
00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:26,479
Speaker 1: Niverse and then they go Dan right, So it's like,

459
00:23:26,520 --> 00:23:31,280
Speaker 1: are you ready for Sports Center? And there's Andre Patterson

460
00:23:31,440 --> 00:23:34,160
Speaker 1: sitting there and I shoot a floater and he basically

461
00:23:34,160 --> 00:23:42,560
Speaker 1: grabbed the ball and throws it and says that yes, yes,

462
00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:48,920
Speaker 1: So okay, so you're you're your first year. Well, so like, look,

463
00:23:48,960 --> 00:23:53,800
Speaker 1: this became a well spring for coaches. What was it? What? What?

464
00:23:53,800 --> 00:23:57,040
Speaker 1: What do you call on today? Draw on today that

465
00:23:57,200 --> 00:24:00,080
Speaker 1: this is what Bob Knight did. Coach Knight did, and

466
00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:03,280
Speaker 1: it was you have to do it in every practice.

467
00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:07,280
Speaker 1: Oh well, well, as you spoke of earlier, his ability

468
00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:10,080
Speaker 1: to elevate the intensity of any room he ever entered,

469
00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:12,960
Speaker 1: whether it's a restaurant, a shopping mall, an opposing arena,

470
00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:17,800
Speaker 1: when he walks in the entire I guess, focus and attentions,

471
00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:20,800
Speaker 1: whatever it is, goes on him. So I just remember,

472
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:22,919
Speaker 1: even pre practice, the coaches will be doing the drills

473
00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:25,080
Speaker 1: and then as soon as he would walk out the door.

474
00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:28,119
Speaker 1: It was almost like, you know, you went from playing

475
00:24:28,119 --> 00:24:30,240
Speaker 1: the three hundred kin Pom team to playing a top

476
00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:32,280
Speaker 1: five ki Pom team. In your player's eyes, I mean,

477
00:24:32,280 --> 00:24:35,359
Speaker 1: he just had that presence all the time. But his preparation,

478
00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:38,240
Speaker 1: the ability to think ahead, especially being around young people

479
00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:41,720
Speaker 1: and you have kids now, and like the problem solving

480
00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:44,280
Speaker 1: ability and always thinking ahead and figuring out solutions before

481
00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:47,200
Speaker 1: they happen. You're on your toes twenty four to seven.

482
00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:49,000
Speaker 1: So I think those are the things that I learned

483
00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:51,600
Speaker 1: that I carry with me more than anything else. And

484
00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:56,320
Speaker 1: then his ability to teach and take complex basketball terms

485
00:24:56,359 --> 00:25:00,439
Speaker 1: and concepts and make them really simple. And you know,

486
00:25:00,480 --> 00:25:03,320
Speaker 1: I didn't lean on near as many as an assistant coach,

487
00:25:03,359 --> 00:25:05,119
Speaker 1: and now I'm a head coach. I think back to

488
00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:07,360
Speaker 1: so many things that I learned that I didn't even

489
00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:12,199
Speaker 1: know that I was learning at the time. What was

490
00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:15,000
Speaker 1: your what did you do like? And I know it

491
00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:17,720
Speaker 1: changed prob a year to year, yeah, right, but but

492
00:25:17,720 --> 00:25:21,040
Speaker 1: but managers get assigned different things. What was based upon year?

493
00:25:21,119 --> 00:25:23,239
Speaker 1: What did you do when you're fresh, when you come

494
00:25:23,280 --> 00:25:26,360
Speaker 1: in and you're wiping the floor, you're handing out water bottles,

495
00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:28,840
Speaker 1: you're doing all the menial tasks. And then once you

496
00:25:28,880 --> 00:25:31,640
Speaker 1: get it as a shomore, because at that time, there's

497
00:25:31,680 --> 00:25:34,800
Speaker 1: no video coordinator, there's no graduate assistant, there's no walk on.

498
00:25:35,119 --> 00:25:38,000
Speaker 1: There's just a hierarchy of managers. You know, there's three

499
00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:40,560
Speaker 1: assistant coaches and a trainer, you know, and now you

500
00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:42,560
Speaker 1: look at I mean, the benches aren't big enough for

501
00:25:42,600 --> 00:25:45,040
Speaker 1: all the suits we have now and staff. So that

502
00:25:45,160 --> 00:25:47,480
Speaker 1: basically at that time was you were in training to

503
00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:49,520
Speaker 1: do whatever it was that you were good at. So

504
00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:51,919
Speaker 1: get the guys that have played ball. We were the

505
00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:54,119
Speaker 1: defenders in practice, or we were the you know whatever,

506
00:25:54,160 --> 00:25:57,240
Speaker 1: the passers, the screeners, whatever the case. There was others

507
00:25:57,240 --> 00:25:59,600
Speaker 1: that they're in charge of filming every day. There there's

508
00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:02,919
Speaker 1: four there's five people doing stats every single practice, and

509
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:05,360
Speaker 1: it was we kept so many stats. There'd be four

510
00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:07,600
Speaker 1: people sitting at a desk like mine, and there'd be

511
00:26:07,640 --> 00:26:10,800
Speaker 1: one guy standing above him and he would be calling

512
00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:13,199
Speaker 1: out every single thing that should be statted. And the

513
00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:16,359
Speaker 1: guy's statting never looked up at practice. They just wrote

514
00:26:16,520 --> 00:26:19,639
Speaker 1: because there was so much information being logged in real time,

515
00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:22,800
Speaker 1: and within five minutes after practice, you had all those

516
00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:26,000
Speaker 1: stats in coach Knight's office or as dungeon down on

517
00:26:26,040 --> 00:26:29,439
Speaker 1: the floor level for him. But every year it's something different.

518
00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:31,479
Speaker 1: And you know, the video room at that time, there

519
00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:33,879
Speaker 1: was no synergy the film exchange. I mean we had

520
00:26:33,920 --> 00:26:36,840
Speaker 1: a library that you know, people came from four or

521
00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:39,320
Speaker 1: five hours. We filmed every single game that was on

522
00:26:40,160 --> 00:26:43,200
Speaker 1: satellite TV. And not only did we have to film them,

523
00:26:43,240 --> 00:26:45,560
Speaker 1: we had to condense it to forty minutes of live

524
00:26:45,560 --> 00:26:48,000
Speaker 1: action for Coach Night and then each of those games

525
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:50,520
Speaker 1: had to be cut into offense and defensive possessions. So

526
00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:52,399
Speaker 1: that was just so when we go on the row

527
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:55,199
Speaker 1: for Coach Knight's room, it looked like, uh, you know,

528
00:26:55,760 --> 00:26:58,200
Speaker 1: a library where there was so many you know, everything

529
00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:00,879
Speaker 1: was set up and it was so meticulous. But so

530
00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:03,719
Speaker 1: everyone had a different role, different job, but you just

531
00:27:03,840 --> 00:27:08,399
Speaker 1: just you know, you gradually move up and have more responsibility.

532
00:27:09,359 --> 00:27:13,800
Speaker 1: I was told by Brian Evans that there was a tape.

533
00:27:14,440 --> 00:27:16,439
Speaker 1: This is not the Neil Read tape. There was a

534
00:27:16,520 --> 00:27:19,879
Speaker 1: tape where he got caught up in the middle of

535
00:27:19,880 --> 00:27:23,879
Speaker 1: the court and transition and got run over like running

536
00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:27,560
Speaker 1: of the bulls and just got again. Uh, and that

537
00:27:27,840 --> 00:27:29,800
Speaker 1: you know, there's like always like once a year where

538
00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:31,440
Speaker 1: he would throw them out of practice for a couple

539
00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:34,639
Speaker 1: of days and empty out the locker room, and and

540
00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:37,840
Speaker 1: and do something like that and that. In order to

541
00:27:37,920 --> 00:27:41,840
Speaker 1: cheer everybody up. One of the veterans would have the tape.

542
00:27:41,880 --> 00:27:43,320
Speaker 1: They'd throw in the tape and they'd go have a

543
00:27:43,320 --> 00:27:46,399
Speaker 1: good laugh at Coach Night's expense. Can you confirm or

544
00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:48,840
Speaker 1: deny that such a tape today, I've heard so many

545
00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:52,040
Speaker 1: tapes and stories. And I was there the Neil Read Day,

546
00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:56,359
Speaker 1: and I think anything, if you pause a film at

547
00:27:56,400 --> 00:27:58,600
Speaker 1: any point, you could find some things that look different

548
00:27:58,600 --> 00:28:01,040
Speaker 1: than what they are in real time. So I don't

549
00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:02,800
Speaker 1: know if I've ever heard that story, but I believe it.

550
00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:04,600
Speaker 1: I know I got ran over it in a practice

551
00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:06,800
Speaker 1: a few years ago by one of our six nine guys.

552
00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:09,560
Speaker 1: It happens, yeah, And I'm sure that made its rounds

553
00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:12,160
Speaker 1: and they were laughing behind my back. So, without a doubt,

554
00:28:12,160 --> 00:28:13,960
Speaker 1: if a head coach gets ran over in a drill,

555
00:28:14,040 --> 00:28:16,440
Speaker 1: you're going to be the butt of some jokes. What

556
00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:18,800
Speaker 1: what what did you remember the Neil Read Day? Like

557
00:28:19,640 --> 00:28:22,040
Speaker 1: I was there, I was in I don't remember that

558
00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:25,119
Speaker 1: particularly because it was Neil was walking towards him he stuck.

559
00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:26,840
Speaker 1: You know, Neil had his head down. He would walk

560
00:28:26,880 --> 00:28:29,200
Speaker 1: and and and coach, and I kind of stopped him.

561
00:28:29,240 --> 00:28:31,879
Speaker 1: And you know, I didn't remember anything other than just

562
00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:34,800
Speaker 1: him stopping him and then saying whatever he said, and

563
00:28:34,800 --> 00:28:37,880
Speaker 1: then everything moved on. I didn't remember it being anything

564
00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:43,200
Speaker 1: where even people noticed it your last game as manager,

565
00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:46,720
Speaker 1: I believe was his last game, right, and I was.

566
00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:49,080
Speaker 1: We were supposed to play Indiana. I was at Oaklham

567
00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:52,680
Speaker 1: State and we were supposed, like Mike Lewis and I

568
00:28:52,960 --> 00:28:55,640
Speaker 1: dear friends because I was like, man, we were going

569
00:28:55,680 --> 00:28:57,920
Speaker 1: to smash you guys, and you guys get beat by

570
00:28:58,040 --> 00:29:01,640
Speaker 1: by Pepperdine, by Pepperdine. What do you remember? What do

571
00:29:01,680 --> 00:29:04,960
Speaker 1: you remember about about that that game? That trip? It

572
00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:08,160
Speaker 1: was the person. Yeah, I remember thinking, man, you've got

573
00:29:08,240 --> 00:29:09,640
Speaker 1: to have a guy that can catch in the high

574
00:29:09,720 --> 00:29:13,120
Speaker 1: post and make plays. We got to the middle of

575
00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:15,160
Speaker 1: that zone and we we we weren't able to hit

576
00:29:15,200 --> 00:29:17,840
Speaker 1: the mid range shot. We weren't able to to to

577
00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:19,920
Speaker 1: hit high low or hit opposite. So that's what I

578
00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:21,680
Speaker 1: remember about that game. Just and then obviously that Pepper

579
00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:23,360
Speaker 1: nine team was special. And then I moved to LA

580
00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:26,520
Speaker 1: right after and worked with with Damon Archibald who was

581
00:29:26,560 --> 00:29:28,960
Speaker 1: on that staff. So we talked about those games and

582
00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:31,680
Speaker 1: then Scyla Brandy played with the Armstrong with the Nets,

583
00:29:31,680 --> 00:29:34,640
Speaker 1: so I followed that group closely. Is that the same group,

584
00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:39,200
Speaker 1: am I? Yeah? Okay, yeah, just how talent nineteen brand

585
00:29:39,320 --> 00:29:42,480
Speaker 1: Brandon Armstrong. Yeah, it was the best players first round

586
00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:46,200
Speaker 1: draft pick. Yeah. He said he was twenty third for

587
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:49,200
Speaker 1: the Nets that year with correct Yeah, correct, So that

588
00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:52,360
Speaker 1: team was how good that team was. But also like, man,

589
00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:54,080
Speaker 1: when you play a zone, you better have a guy

590
00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:55,760
Speaker 1: that can make some plays in the middle of it

591
00:29:55,760 --> 00:29:57,120
Speaker 1: if you're going to continue to throw it in there.

592
00:29:57,120 --> 00:29:58,840
Speaker 1: And we just didn't have those guys at that time.

593
00:29:59,600 --> 00:30:03,240
Speaker 1: Did feel like when because all that stuff if people

594
00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:05,920
Speaker 1: forget went down in the off season, right right, that

595
00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:09,360
Speaker 1: was the zero tolerance And then Kids says something to him,

596
00:30:09,440 --> 00:30:11,800
Speaker 1: Did it did like you realize you were there for

597
00:30:12,040 --> 00:30:15,520
Speaker 1: his last game? Was there? Was there? Did it feel

598
00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:20,520
Speaker 1: like something was amiss in any way? You know, we

599
00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:23,040
Speaker 1: hadn't been going to sweet sixteens and final fours. You know,

600
00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:26,000
Speaker 1: we were getting beaten the second round and finishing you know,

601
00:30:26,040 --> 00:30:28,080
Speaker 1: second or third in the Big ten and all that.

602
00:30:28,200 --> 00:30:30,400
Speaker 1: You know, it just wasn't We weren't winning Big Ten

603
00:30:30,480 --> 00:30:32,600
Speaker 1: championships and weren't going to Sweet sixteens and leade dates

604
00:30:32,600 --> 00:30:35,400
Speaker 1: and final fours and whatnot. So it felt a little

605
00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:38,000
Speaker 1: bit different where people were anxious to for Indiana be

606
00:30:38,080 --> 00:30:40,800
Speaker 1: back on top, but it wasn't anything where you would

607
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:43,680
Speaker 1: ever dream of Coach Night having an issue or anything

608
00:30:43,720 --> 00:30:45,760
Speaker 1: like that. Because I left and actually was going to

609
00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:48,920
Speaker 1: go be basically a volunteer GA at Memphis when Calipari

610
00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:51,120
Speaker 1: got the job, and I was there a couple of

611
00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:54,720
Speaker 1: weeks working camp and all that, and Coach tree Lord,

612
00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:56,960
Speaker 1: who was coach I assistant, called and said, hey, we

613
00:30:57,000 --> 00:30:58,600
Speaker 1: can pay for your grad school and apartment if you

614
00:30:58,640 --> 00:31:00,280
Speaker 1: want to come back and work here, if you're going

615
00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:02,360
Speaker 1: to do that, because at that time everyone was getting

616
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:05,520
Speaker 1: video coordinator jobs and director of operations jobs, so he said,

617
00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:06,640
Speaker 1: if you're going to do that, you might as well

618
00:31:06,640 --> 00:31:08,600
Speaker 1: come back here. I'll take care of your your apartment

619
00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:12,720
Speaker 1: and whatnot. So I was on my way transitioning back

620
00:31:12,760 --> 00:31:16,640
Speaker 1: to Indiana to go be a graduate assistant, and then

621
00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:19,160
Speaker 1: I got offered the full time position under Coach Bibby

622
00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:22,400
Speaker 1: at USC doing video and operations in camp and all

623
00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:25,800
Speaker 1: that stuff. So I left, and then all the stuff

624
00:31:25,800 --> 00:31:28,080
Speaker 1: went down after I left, So I was I was,

625
00:31:28,320 --> 00:31:30,120
Speaker 1: you know, across the country when it was all happening,

626
00:31:30,120 --> 00:31:32,680
Speaker 1: So I wasn't in it, but it was still it's

627
00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:34,720
Speaker 1: still surreal. I mean, I still remember the feeling when

628
00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:37,840
Speaker 1: you heard the news of what all happened. Well, it's

629
00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:41,200
Speaker 1: it's interesting because I think you and I are aligned

630
00:31:41,240 --> 00:31:43,080
Speaker 1: on this and part of it, i'd just being a

631
00:31:43,080 --> 00:31:45,600
Speaker 1: coach's son. Is now, if you bring up the name

632
00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:48,960
Speaker 1: Bob Knight, I mean he was he could run for

633
00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:52,200
Speaker 1: governor and one you know, but he was. He was.

634
00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:57,920
Speaker 1: He was the foremost college basketball voice in terms of clinician,

635
00:31:58,160 --> 00:32:01,800
Speaker 1: how to play like. He was the guy. And I

636
00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:03,920
Speaker 1: think he went to TV too late had he gone

637
00:32:03,920 --> 00:32:07,760
Speaker 1: to TV then, because also people saw some the bad

638
00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:10,000
Speaker 1: side of his personality. But he was and again you

639
00:32:10,040 --> 00:32:13,280
Speaker 1: were around him on a daily basis when he wanted

640
00:32:13,320 --> 00:32:19,160
Speaker 1: to be incredibly engaging, like unbelievably bright and engaging. Yes,

641
00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:22,440
Speaker 1: But again, now this is you know, thirty years later,

642
00:32:23,040 --> 00:32:25,120
Speaker 1: the narrow or twenty years later, the narrative is so

643
00:32:25,240 --> 00:32:28,600
Speaker 1: different because the last couple of years of his career

644
00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:31,840
Speaker 1: at ESPN, he was just he was past the point

645
00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:33,960
Speaker 1: where he should have been doing it. Is that a

646
00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:36,959
Speaker 1: fair depiction of Coach Night? Yeah? I only heard him

647
00:32:36,960 --> 00:32:38,840
Speaker 1: do a couple of games, to be honest, and I

648
00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:41,840
Speaker 1: watched his teams of Texas Tech closely afterwards, because you know,

649
00:32:41,920 --> 00:32:45,040
Speaker 1: you're do his curious house. Coaches evolve and change and everything,

650
00:32:45,120 --> 00:32:48,320
Speaker 1: and so I didn't watch many of his games. I mean,

651
00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:50,120
Speaker 1: when you go back to the state of Indiana and

652
00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:52,360
Speaker 1: you say his name, it's it's almost like you're talking

653
00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:54,600
Speaker 1: about the Pope. I mean, it's it's still that level

654
00:32:54,640 --> 00:32:58,360
Speaker 1: in that state. So you go out to work for

655
00:32:58,760 --> 00:33:05,160
Speaker 1: Henry Bibby, what's it like, kid from southern Indiana? And right,

656
00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:07,000
Speaker 1: so you show up, you show up in La. You

657
00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:11,240
Speaker 1: mentioned Damon Archibald. How did that relationship, how that relationship blossom? Well,

658
00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:15,000
Speaker 1: just arch is a basketball junkie and I was I've

659
00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:17,840
Speaker 1: always been just really curious in a sponge. So when

660
00:33:17,840 --> 00:33:20,160
Speaker 1: Coach Bibby officially I thought I had the job in

661
00:33:20,200 --> 00:33:22,320
Speaker 1: the spring, and it didn't. Really it didn't work out.

662
00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:25,280
Speaker 1: That's the story for another day. And then two months

663
00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:27,120
Speaker 1: later it comes for no, no no, no, this is this

664
00:33:27,160 --> 00:33:30,720
Speaker 1: is the day. It's the story for Desmond Farber. I

665
00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:33,200
Speaker 1: thought I had the director of operations job at USC.

666
00:33:33,320 --> 00:33:34,920
Speaker 1: I was told because I had a couple other things

667
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:36,600
Speaker 1: I was interviewing for and coach Maybe said, no, I'm

668
00:33:36,640 --> 00:33:38,960
Speaker 1: hiring you, blah blah blah, gonna bring you out. And

669
00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:41,640
Speaker 1: then Desmond Farmer was on the fence, so they end

670
00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:43,680
Speaker 1: up hiring his brother Tim, who's a close friend. That's

671
00:33:43,680 --> 00:33:46,200
Speaker 1: the director of basketball operations. It was a different time then,

672
00:33:46,880 --> 00:33:49,040
Speaker 1: and no, that's the same time. That's hey, that's how

673
00:33:49,040 --> 00:33:52,160
Speaker 1: we get a player. I got and Desmond had about

674
00:33:52,160 --> 00:33:54,000
Speaker 1: fifty or sixty and a couple of games and got

675
00:33:54,000 --> 00:33:55,320
Speaker 1: a couple of coffee in the NBA, so it was

676
00:33:55,360 --> 00:33:58,120
Speaker 1: worth it. But so after a couple of months, coach

677
00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:00,760
Speaker 1: Bibby's I think it's a secretary retire or something along

678
00:34:00,760 --> 00:34:03,000
Speaker 1: the lines, and so a pot of money freed up.

679
00:34:03,040 --> 00:34:05,239
Speaker 1: So he hired a student secretary and he brought me

680
00:34:05,320 --> 00:34:11,840
Speaker 1: on in addition to Tim, and so travel camp, the scouting,

681
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:15,120
Speaker 1: the video, all that stuff was and Arch would just, hey,

682
00:34:15,480 --> 00:34:17,120
Speaker 1: tell coach baby, you want to do everything so you

683
00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:19,120
Speaker 1: can become more valuable, and that's how you're growing this muss.

684
00:34:19,239 --> 00:34:21,240
Speaker 1: So he was a good mentor for me because he

685
00:34:21,239 --> 00:34:23,759
Speaker 1: he has a lot of people's skills and a lot

686
00:34:23,800 --> 00:34:26,000
Speaker 1: of you know, just just real savvy in this game.

687
00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:29,799
Speaker 1: But he offered me the job. I flew out and

688
00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:32,440
Speaker 1: the interview was I get off the plane, Dave Miller

689
00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:34,720
Speaker 1: and and Coach Bibby picked me up at the airport

690
00:34:34,840 --> 00:34:37,719
Speaker 1: and we're walking out and he says, hey, here here's

691
00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:39,439
Speaker 1: the plan. We're gonna go grab some lunch, we're gonna

692
00:34:39,440 --> 00:34:40,719
Speaker 1: go back to office. I'm gonna give you a couple

693
00:34:40,719 --> 00:34:42,680
Speaker 1: of projects. As long as you can do the work

694
00:34:43,719 --> 00:34:45,799
Speaker 1: and you're not the village idiot, then the job is yours.

695
00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:48,000
Speaker 1: We're gonna have we're gonna have a good weekend. So

696
00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:50,560
Speaker 1: I'm there twenty four forty eight hours. And he also said,

697
00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:52,080
Speaker 1: if you can work for Coach Night, if you can

698
00:34:52,120 --> 00:34:54,400
Speaker 1: do that, then you can work for anyone. So you know,

699
00:34:55,000 --> 00:34:57,080
Speaker 1: that was kind of basically, you work for him, so

700
00:34:57,120 --> 00:34:59,560
Speaker 1: I'd love to have you. We go back to the

701
00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:03,239
Speaker 1: office of the deal and then he says, hey, the

702
00:35:03,320 --> 00:35:05,359
Speaker 1: jobs yours. When could you be back? And I said, well,

703
00:35:05,400 --> 00:35:08,520
Speaker 1: I land tomorrow. I think around noon or two. I said,

704
00:35:08,520 --> 00:35:10,319
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go see some family. I could be back

705
00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:12,920
Speaker 1: on the road by five. I literally left everything I

706
00:35:12,920 --> 00:35:16,480
Speaker 1: owned in the house I lived in in college, my furniture,

707
00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:19,560
Speaker 1: my television, everything, I got, all my clothes. I drove

708
00:35:19,560 --> 00:35:21,920
Speaker 1: straight to Phoenix, I think it was twenty four straight hours,

709
00:35:22,040 --> 00:35:24,960
Speaker 1: stayed with a family member, and then drove into LA

710
00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:27,040
Speaker 1: the next morning and slept on the coach for a

711
00:35:27,040 --> 00:35:28,960
Speaker 1: couple of weeks, and then Sylvie Dominguez let me stay

712
00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:31,680
Speaker 1: at his house. I spent a week or two in

713
00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:34,239
Speaker 1: the Manhattan Beach Maryott and then, uh, you know, the

714
00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:37,959
Speaker 1: rest is a blur, amazing. All these are all names

715
00:35:38,000 --> 00:35:40,560
Speaker 1: that I grew up around. What kind of car? Did

716
00:35:40,600 --> 00:35:46,399
Speaker 1: you drive? A Toyota Camry. That first year, I made

717
00:35:46,520 --> 00:35:50,279
Speaker 1: less than my rent. My now wife moved out with

718
00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:53,399
Speaker 1: me to support me. She was occupational therapist. So yeah,

719
00:35:53,520 --> 00:35:55,520
Speaker 1: I don't think I'm mad. I'm made enough to buy

720
00:35:55,520 --> 00:35:58,399
Speaker 1: a car. I think I had it. So you met

721
00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:00,040
Speaker 1: you met her in college. She's my high school we

722
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:03,839
Speaker 1: elementary school, junior high, all through high school, and then

723
00:36:04,360 --> 00:36:06,840
Speaker 1: we went our separate ways in college, and then she

724
00:36:06,960 --> 00:36:09,160
Speaker 1: ended back in Indianapolis when I was in Bloomington our

725
00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:12,799
Speaker 1: last year, and we kind of you know, at that point,

726
00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:14,279
Speaker 1: we were growing enough to know that it was going

727
00:36:14,320 --> 00:36:16,160
Speaker 1: to go forward. She moved to Texas to do her clinicals.

728
00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:17,839
Speaker 1: I moved to LA and then she joined me later.

729
00:36:17,880 --> 00:36:19,120
Speaker 1: And at that point I could I could afford to

730
00:36:19,200 --> 00:36:24,400
Speaker 1: run an apartment. That's amazing. That's amazing. Okay, so you

731
00:36:24,520 --> 00:36:27,120
Speaker 1: roll in now. The thing about USC basketball in early

732
00:36:27,160 --> 00:36:31,160
Speaker 1: two thousands is really talented teams, really talented, good team.

733
00:36:31,200 --> 00:36:33,080
Speaker 1: They kicked the crap out of Oakland State one year.

734
00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:36,479
Speaker 1: One kicked the crap out of Oakland State. That plane

735
00:36:36,520 --> 00:36:39,359
Speaker 1: crist Ship. That was a super talented team. Yeah, but

736
00:36:39,920 --> 00:36:43,480
Speaker 1: you go from Indiana, where if they opened up practice

737
00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:46,719
Speaker 1: it would be a sellout to USC could throw five

738
00:36:46,760 --> 00:36:48,640
Speaker 1: pros out there and then the sports are in a

739
00:36:48,719 --> 00:36:52,080
Speaker 1: day's good luck drawn a crowd. But what was you know,

740
00:36:52,120 --> 00:36:54,600
Speaker 1: what's that like for a kid from Indiana to understand, like,

741
00:36:54,640 --> 00:36:57,760
Speaker 1: we actually have a great team. But at that time,

742
00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:01,160
Speaker 1: nobody cared. Well. I remember the first game we well,

743
00:37:01,280 --> 00:37:03,319
Speaker 1: the exhibition game. I think it was our first year.

744
00:37:03,320 --> 00:37:06,160
Speaker 1: We played in the Galen Center, which was I wouldn't

745
00:37:06,160 --> 00:37:08,680
Speaker 1: know what it is. You know, we practiced. If you

746
00:37:08,680 --> 00:37:10,919
Speaker 1: ever remember the practice gym at USC, it was where

747
00:37:10,920 --> 00:37:13,880
Speaker 1: they filmed Cocoon and it's also I think where they

748
00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:16,520
Speaker 1: filmed Blue Chips when Shaq was in the bayou, I

749
00:37:16,560 --> 00:37:19,120
Speaker 1: mean it was it was there's chain links on the windows,

750
00:37:19,160 --> 00:37:21,319
Speaker 1: it's dark, it's dirty, I mean it's it was as

751
00:37:21,360 --> 00:37:23,080
Speaker 1: bad as of a gym as I've ever been in.

752
00:37:23,800 --> 00:37:26,560
Speaker 1: And so it was all foreign just seeing that. And

753
00:37:26,600 --> 00:37:29,600
Speaker 1: then the first game we played Bradley and we I

754
00:37:29,600 --> 00:37:31,520
Speaker 1: think were ranked twenty third or twenty fourth in the country.

755
00:37:31,560 --> 00:37:33,600
Speaker 1: There was a football game that day, maybe at noon,

756
00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:35,919
Speaker 1: and then we played at six and I'm thinking, wow,

757
00:37:35,920 --> 00:37:37,480
Speaker 1: with the football game, these people are going to go

758
00:37:37,520 --> 00:37:39,279
Speaker 1: straight from the football game. And because that's the way

759
00:37:39,280 --> 00:37:41,799
Speaker 1: it was it Indiana, we practiced on Saturdays and we

760
00:37:41,840 --> 00:37:44,040
Speaker 1: had about as many fans as the football game did

761
00:37:44,120 --> 00:37:46,640
Speaker 1: for practice or workouts on Saturday morning. Something. It's gonna

762
00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:48,799
Speaker 1: be huge. I think we had eight hundred and eighty

763
00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:50,960
Speaker 1: fans the first game and we were ranked top twenty

764
00:37:50,960 --> 00:37:53,040
Speaker 1: five in the country, the best team since Harold Minor,

765
00:37:53,600 --> 00:37:56,960
Speaker 1: and it was it was eye opening just the you know,

766
00:37:56,960 --> 00:38:00,200
Speaker 1: I learned quickly there's a lot going on in La. Yeah,

767
00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:03,880
Speaker 1: there's a lot going on. What did you take from

768
00:38:04,120 --> 00:38:08,440
Speaker 1: Coach Bibby in terms of coaching that you you you

769
00:38:08,480 --> 00:38:11,239
Speaker 1: think people should know about, people should echo maybe even

770
00:38:11,320 --> 00:38:14,160
Speaker 1: used today. Well, Number one, it couldn't have been a

771
00:38:14,200 --> 00:38:16,839
Speaker 1: better learning experience for me to go from what I

772
00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:19,080
Speaker 1: was used to and what I grew up with to

773
00:38:19,200 --> 00:38:23,680
Speaker 1: coach Bibby. And he's a pro coach, so uh. The

774
00:38:23,719 --> 00:38:26,480
Speaker 1: style of play was different offensively, defensively, the way he

775
00:38:26,520 --> 00:38:28,960
Speaker 1: dealt with players was was completely different. It was it

776
00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:31,879
Speaker 1: was more of today where it was almost like this

777
00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:34,880
Speaker 1: is this is business, this is we're all here to

778
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:37,640
Speaker 1: make money and and and do the best we can.

779
00:38:37,760 --> 00:38:41,040
Speaker 1: So it was much different than what I was growing

780
00:38:41,080 --> 00:38:42,560
Speaker 1: but I learned so much and it was what I

781
00:38:42,640 --> 00:38:44,839
Speaker 1: needed at the time. And even you know you talk

782
00:38:44,880 --> 00:38:47,440
Speaker 1: about individual workouts. When I was working coach Baby, I

783
00:38:47,520 --> 00:38:51,040
Speaker 1: go shagballs for gerg Over at Saint Monica or go

784
00:38:51,360 --> 00:38:53,240
Speaker 1: Rick Carlisle was out of coach of working out pros

785
00:38:53,280 --> 00:38:55,680
Speaker 1: and led him in the gym with Jason Richardson those

786
00:38:55,719 --> 00:38:58,319
Speaker 1: guys and reap. So like for my development, it was

787
00:38:58,360 --> 00:39:01,759
Speaker 1: great because before that player development was learning how to

788
00:39:01,760 --> 00:39:03,480
Speaker 1: set up a flair screen or learn how to set

789
00:39:03,560 --> 00:39:06,080
Speaker 1: up a wide down and so now you go across

790
00:39:06,120 --> 00:39:08,440
Speaker 1: the country, and then you just learn a whole different

791
00:39:08,440 --> 00:39:10,279
Speaker 1: brand of basketball with the pick and roll, with the

792
00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:12,480
Speaker 1: space scene, with the sets. And then the guys on

793
00:39:12,520 --> 00:39:14,840
Speaker 1: our team were I mean, what a special group with

794
00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:17,840
Speaker 1: Scala Brady and Brandon Grandville and Sam Clancy and Trapagnie

795
00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:20,040
Speaker 1: and David Bluthenthal, all those guys. I mean, they were

796
00:39:20,080 --> 00:39:24,120
Speaker 1: all incredibly bright, great dudes. So I fell into an

797
00:39:24,120 --> 00:39:30,799
Speaker 1: amazing learning environment just just by luck. Quick aside, what

798
00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:35,759
Speaker 1: happened to motion basketball, My theory is it's it's so

799
00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:39,080
Speaker 1: hard to teach. It's you know, it takes a while.

800
00:39:39,200 --> 00:39:41,160
Speaker 1: It's it's almost like, you know, our law tech teams

801
00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:43,240
Speaker 1: we pressed and and we wanted that to be our culture.

802
00:39:43,280 --> 00:39:46,160
Speaker 1: So the first year you're just you're giving up lay ups,

803
00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:48,239
Speaker 1: you're giving up this. Your guys just don't see the

804
00:39:48,280 --> 00:39:50,879
Speaker 1: patterns and all that. So I just think it takes

805
00:39:50,920 --> 00:39:53,680
Speaker 1: so long to teach. It's so foreign. Where even when

806
00:39:53,719 --> 00:39:55,680
Speaker 1: I was growing up, when I was in probably third grade,

807
00:39:55,680 --> 00:39:58,120
Speaker 1: we learned the flex offense, so we learned how to

808
00:39:58,160 --> 00:39:59,880
Speaker 1: wait wait on a screen, learned how to set us,

809
00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:03,000
Speaker 1: learn how to reject a screen. So I think back then,

810
00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:05,680
Speaker 1: there's always a foundation of knowing how to use a

811
00:40:05,719 --> 00:40:09,800
Speaker 1: screen off the ball. And so everyone had everyone that

812
00:40:09,840 --> 00:40:12,880
Speaker 1: we grew up with had a foundation of motion basketball,

813
00:40:12,920 --> 00:40:16,480
Speaker 1: whether you knew true motion or not. Now there's no

814
00:40:16,520 --> 00:40:18,960
Speaker 1: one doing it, so there's no background, there's no foundation.

815
00:40:19,040 --> 00:40:22,960
Speaker 1: So you're starting from scratch and it's it's it's complex

816
00:40:23,040 --> 00:40:25,880
Speaker 1: to teach without a doubt. You know, you don't know

817
00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:28,680
Speaker 1: the time with guys transfer portal, but plus all their

818
00:40:28,719 --> 00:40:31,360
Speaker 1: individual workouts. Like you said, instead of learning how to

819
00:40:31,400 --> 00:40:34,200
Speaker 1: read without the ball, now everything is with the ball, right,

820
00:40:34,239 --> 00:40:37,440
Speaker 1: everybody's gonna train. Everything's with the ball, and that's the

821
00:40:37,480 --> 00:40:40,319
Speaker 1: opposite of how motion works. Yeah. So again here, so

822
00:40:40,440 --> 00:40:45,440
Speaker 1: here's the question. Because in football, okay, option football was dying,

823
00:40:45,920 --> 00:40:48,000
Speaker 1: and people would say died with the cup, with the

824
00:40:48,280 --> 00:40:51,319
Speaker 1: with the service academies. Maybe it's the exception, but if

825
00:40:51,320 --> 00:40:53,200
Speaker 1: you talk to football guys, they'll tell you that the

826
00:40:53,320 --> 00:40:57,280
Speaker 1: read option is really the veer. It's really option football

827
00:40:57,320 --> 00:40:59,919
Speaker 1: in terms of blocking and then except you have guys

828
00:41:00,000 --> 00:41:02,120
Speaker 1: outside the numbers and now you can throw the ball

829
00:41:02,120 --> 00:41:05,080
Speaker 1: out of it. Yeah. My question is do you think

830
00:41:05,080 --> 00:41:08,520
Speaker 1: it's gone to never return or is there is there

831
00:41:08,520 --> 00:41:11,560
Speaker 1: a world where it can make a research. No, I

832
00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:15,040
Speaker 1: think now it's it's in that combination of ball screens

833
00:41:15,120 --> 00:41:17,920
Speaker 1: and motion and drive and kick, because you see a

834
00:41:17,960 --> 00:41:20,480
Speaker 1: lot of teams now that the screener doesn't always dive

835
00:41:20,560 --> 00:41:22,520
Speaker 1: to the rim. He sets a ball screen, then he

836
00:41:22,560 --> 00:41:25,680
Speaker 1: becomes a wide down screen or so. I do think

837
00:41:25,719 --> 00:41:28,719
Speaker 1: that a lot of coaches are combining the two and

838
00:41:28,760 --> 00:41:31,399
Speaker 1: there is a little bit of a resurgence now even

839
00:41:31,440 --> 00:41:33,200
Speaker 1: the stuff we run, we just don't hold our guys

840
00:41:33,200 --> 00:41:35,600
Speaker 1: accountable to reading the screens as we did back then.

841
00:41:35,640 --> 00:41:38,800
Speaker 1: I just remember every day as a manager, you're jumping

842
00:41:38,800 --> 00:41:40,319
Speaker 1: out in your garden a guy and you're just trying

843
00:41:40,360 --> 00:41:42,520
Speaker 1: to give him different looks so he can read whether

844
00:41:42,560 --> 00:41:45,839
Speaker 1: the curl to fade, whatever it is. And I think

845
00:41:45,880 --> 00:41:48,560
Speaker 1: now it's just you know, you you run that action

846
00:41:48,600 --> 00:41:50,239
Speaker 1: to get a guy in space and then let him

847
00:41:50,239 --> 00:41:52,520
Speaker 1: do what he's done his entire life. So I do

848
00:41:52,600 --> 00:41:56,320
Speaker 1: think their background coming into college is very important and

849
00:41:56,760 --> 00:41:59,960
Speaker 1: how you play, because you know it's hard to learn

850
00:42:00,280 --> 00:42:02,600
Speaker 1: a way to play in a short period. Just like

851
00:42:02,640 --> 00:42:05,839
Speaker 1: you said with the transferportal. Okay, so how'd you make

852
00:42:05,840 --> 00:42:10,759
Speaker 1: the way to Eastern mission? Oh? Well, I don't want to.

853
00:42:11,480 --> 00:42:13,120
Speaker 1: Here's how I got the USC job. First of all,

854
00:42:13,239 --> 00:42:14,880
Speaker 1: just for all these young guys that are trying to

855
00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:17,799
Speaker 1: break into the profession. Mike Davis and John Tree Lord

856
00:42:17,880 --> 00:42:21,120
Speaker 1: coach against Henry Bibby and the CBA, and they're they're

857
00:42:21,120 --> 00:42:23,520
Speaker 1: on the road recruiting. They see each other in a gym,

858
00:42:23,520 --> 00:42:25,680
Speaker 1: and Coach Bibby was to himself. He never talked to anyone,

859
00:42:25,719 --> 00:42:27,040
Speaker 1: but he talked to the guys who are the old

860
00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:29,680
Speaker 1: school guys that he respected. So he sit into Jim

861
00:42:29,719 --> 00:42:30,920
Speaker 1: and he said, man, I need it. I need an

862
00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:33,000
Speaker 1: operations guy. You know, I had to let a guy go.

863
00:42:33,080 --> 00:42:34,799
Speaker 1: I just need someone that will work. I don't he

864
00:42:34,840 --> 00:42:36,759
Speaker 1: doesn't have to be an NBA guy, doesn't. I just

865
00:42:36,800 --> 00:42:39,359
Speaker 1: need someone that will work. And Tree Lord Davis both said, oh,

866
00:42:39,360 --> 00:42:41,520
Speaker 1: we got a guy for you. And so that's just

867
00:42:41,560 --> 00:42:44,560
Speaker 1: the luck of chance of them coaching against him for

868
00:42:44,719 --> 00:42:48,200
Speaker 1: years and then him respecting them, and then them putting

869
00:42:48,200 --> 00:42:50,960
Speaker 1: in a good word for me as assistant coaches. But

870
00:42:51,000 --> 00:42:53,640
Speaker 1: then Coach Davis got the full time job and created

871
00:42:53,640 --> 00:42:56,080
Speaker 1: a position and brought me back to Indiana when when

872
00:42:56,120 --> 00:42:58,600
Speaker 1: I had my oldest son, Jack, so I went back

873
00:42:58,640 --> 00:43:00,719
Speaker 1: from Mike Davis for a couple of year years and

874
00:43:00,800 --> 00:43:03,480
Speaker 1: he actually put me on the road twice in April

875
00:43:03,520 --> 00:43:05,799
Speaker 1: to August when I was probably twenty four to twenty five.

876
00:43:06,160 --> 00:43:08,200
Speaker 1: So I'm walking around with an Indiana shirt on and

877
00:43:08,480 --> 00:43:11,000
Speaker 1: everyone in the business is like, who is it? Who

878
00:43:11,080 --> 00:43:15,400
Speaker 1: is this guy? Is he? You know? So he really

879
00:43:15,440 --> 00:43:18,240
Speaker 1: helped me because that I was able to meet people

880
00:43:18,320 --> 00:43:20,000
Speaker 1: and be out and all that kind of stuff. And

881
00:43:20,000 --> 00:43:24,200
Speaker 1: then I got bumped back down because of circumstances in

882
00:43:24,640 --> 00:43:27,960
Speaker 1: late August, my last year there. And at that point

883
00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:29,919
Speaker 1: I decided, I love I love being on the floor,

884
00:43:29,960 --> 00:43:31,840
Speaker 1: I love Recurty, and I'm gonna coach next year. I

885
00:43:31,840 --> 00:43:33,799
Speaker 1: don't care if it's Naia D two. I had some

886
00:43:33,880 --> 00:43:36,400
Speaker 1: n Ai buddies I had. I called Joe Claro at

887
00:43:36,400 --> 00:43:38,759
Speaker 1: Seattle when he was a D two coach and said, hey,

888
00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:42,759
Speaker 1: I loved you know. I was going from Indiana to

889
00:43:43,040 --> 00:43:44,680
Speaker 1: trying to just get on the floor and on the

890
00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:48,000
Speaker 1: road anywhere I could. And Charles Ramsey was an assistant

891
00:43:48,040 --> 00:43:50,720
Speaker 1: at cal Berkeley and I went out to work camps

892
00:43:50,760 --> 00:43:53,799
Speaker 1: when Pastor Naka got the video job. So once again,

893
00:43:53,880 --> 00:43:56,120
Speaker 1: a small town kid from southern Indiana gets on an

894
00:43:56,120 --> 00:43:59,600
Speaker 1: airplane in Indianapolis flies to the San Francisco gets out

895
00:43:59,600 --> 00:44:00,880
Speaker 1: with his bad bag and says, all right, how do

896
00:44:00,920 --> 00:44:03,960
Speaker 1: I get to Berkeley? You take the under the under

897
00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:07,120
Speaker 1: the part under, you get off and then you realize

898
00:44:07,120 --> 00:44:09,040
Speaker 1: you got to walk about a mile up up a

899
00:44:09,120 --> 00:44:11,720
Speaker 1: hill to get to the dorms. So but I developed

900
00:44:11,719 --> 00:44:15,080
Speaker 1: a relationship coach Ramsey. He gets the Eastern Michigan job

901
00:44:15,120 --> 00:44:18,759
Speaker 1: for Michigan and he offered me a job, so that

902
00:44:18,880 --> 00:44:21,080
Speaker 1: that's kind of that was my first true, true on

903
00:44:21,160 --> 00:44:24,719
Speaker 1: floor coaching position. People still go to work camp? Is

904
00:44:24,760 --> 00:44:27,200
Speaker 1: that still way in which guys could rarely well, we

905
00:44:27,239 --> 00:44:29,799
Speaker 1: couldn't even have high school coaches that were affiliated with

906
00:44:29,840 --> 00:44:34,160
Speaker 1: prospects to work our camp up until basically you limited

907
00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:36,239
Speaker 1: all working of camp for high school coaches, and then

908
00:44:36,239 --> 00:44:38,200
Speaker 1: just recently they've loosened it up a little bit where

909
00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:40,879
Speaker 1: you can but camp. There are no overnight camps because

910
00:44:40,920 --> 00:44:42,960
Speaker 1: of the liability and all that stuff. In day camps,

911
00:44:42,960 --> 00:44:44,839
Speaker 1: people aren't you know, you don't have the dorms, so

912
00:44:44,840 --> 00:44:47,959
Speaker 1: people aren't flying in to make a couple hundred bucks

913
00:44:47,960 --> 00:44:50,440
Speaker 1: from eight to four, and it's turned into babysitting camps

914
00:44:50,440 --> 00:44:54,080
Speaker 1: instead of teaching camps. Anyway. Yeah, no, I have a

915
00:44:54,160 --> 00:44:57,040
Speaker 1: son thirteen. I've tried to there's just no you know,

916
00:44:57,040 --> 00:44:59,600
Speaker 1: there's snow Valley still exists. But outside of that, there's

917
00:44:59,640 --> 00:45:02,400
Speaker 1: just a lot of options in terms of teaching camps

918
00:45:02,440 --> 00:45:05,359
Speaker 1: and and like you said, you know, the Final four

919
00:45:05,400 --> 00:45:07,399
Speaker 1: is even different in terms of connections than it used

920
00:45:07,440 --> 00:45:10,120
Speaker 1: to be. And and and guys used to guys used

921
00:45:10,120 --> 00:45:13,759
Speaker 1: to really uh, I mean the Kansas camps are legendary

922
00:45:13,840 --> 00:45:18,080
Speaker 1: for developing relationships and then kind of growing into jobs.

923
00:45:18,560 --> 00:45:21,600
Speaker 1: So this whole time, when you're bouncing back and forth,

924
00:45:22,520 --> 00:45:24,040
Speaker 1: what'd your wife say about because you're not making a

925
00:45:24,080 --> 00:45:28,000
Speaker 1: lot of money, right, you know, so what what would

926
00:45:28,000 --> 00:45:30,160
Speaker 1: she says? Like? We got can we get a real

927
00:45:30,239 --> 00:45:35,080
Speaker 1: job here? It's it's I guess I always try to

928
00:45:35,120 --> 00:45:37,520
Speaker 1: figure out because obviously coaching there's a lot of there's

929
00:45:37,520 --> 00:45:41,440
Speaker 1: a high divorce rate, especially when your husband's obsessed and

930
00:45:42,360 --> 00:45:45,120
Speaker 1: the job consumes him about ninety nine percent of his time,

931
00:45:45,880 --> 00:45:47,400
Speaker 1: and because it's a labor of love and it's a

932
00:45:47,400 --> 00:45:50,000
Speaker 1: passion more than than the workpiece. But her dad was

933
00:45:50,040 --> 00:45:52,319
Speaker 1: an extremely hard worker, blue collar guy, so he was

934
00:45:52,400 --> 00:45:54,719
Speaker 1: he worked a lot, and then working for coach Night

935
00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:57,520
Speaker 1: when when we dated in college and and all that,

936
00:45:58,120 --> 00:45:59,880
Speaker 1: and then working for coach Baby. He was very dim

937
00:46:00,040 --> 00:46:02,080
Speaker 1: and so I think when I was young, I was

938
00:46:02,160 --> 00:46:04,520
Speaker 1: always working, so it just became kind of part of

939
00:46:04,560 --> 00:46:07,440
Speaker 1: the deal. And then we started having kids, so she

940
00:46:07,560 --> 00:46:11,680
Speaker 1: worked and had the boys, so you know, she just

941
00:46:11,719 --> 00:46:16,239
Speaker 1: always understood and was very very supportive, and she she

942
00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:19,759
Speaker 1: was the Nesta winner for she probably up until about

943
00:46:19,760 --> 00:46:24,160
Speaker 1: six or eight years ago, so very very thankful. Okay,

944
00:46:24,200 --> 00:46:27,520
Speaker 1: So what was what was Eastern Lake? I was there

945
00:46:27,560 --> 00:46:29,840
Speaker 1: a very brief period of time, and it was crazy

946
00:46:29,840 --> 00:46:31,600
Speaker 1: because as soon as I got there, I took the job,

947
00:46:31,640 --> 00:46:34,000
Speaker 1: I bought a house, and about three weeks later, Coach

948
00:46:34,080 --> 00:46:35,960
Speaker 1: Davis had a change on the staff and says, do

949
00:46:36,000 --> 00:46:38,160
Speaker 1: you want to come back? And I said, Coach, I

950
00:46:38,200 --> 00:46:42,040
Speaker 1: just bought a house. I really I'm enjoying this, something different,

951
00:46:42,040 --> 00:46:46,319
Speaker 1: I'm learning. And then we didn't. We started out really well,

952
00:46:46,360 --> 00:46:48,439
Speaker 1: didn't have a great year, and then I was only

953
00:46:48,440 --> 00:46:50,480
Speaker 1: there eight or nine months and got offered the job

954
00:46:51,080 --> 00:46:53,239
Speaker 1: at Murray State under Billy Kennedy. And I had known

955
00:46:53,280 --> 00:46:55,680
Speaker 1: Coach Kennedy. He came in to watch practices at Indiana

956
00:46:56,239 --> 00:46:58,520
Speaker 1: and Coach Davis would just when coaches would come in,

957
00:46:58,560 --> 00:47:00,560
Speaker 1: he'd say hey, here's Dusty. He's going to drive you,

958
00:47:00,640 --> 00:47:02,879
Speaker 1: he's gonna open up the video room, he's gonna sit

959
00:47:02,920 --> 00:47:06,440
Speaker 1: with you during practice. So there was a really new

960
00:47:06,800 --> 00:47:08,759
Speaker 1: experience where when these coaches would come in. I remember

961
00:47:08,840 --> 00:47:11,000
Speaker 1: roblin Ear came in, Like all these coaches would come

962
00:47:11,040 --> 00:47:13,719
Speaker 1: in and Coach Davis say hey, for whatever reason, he

963
00:47:14,040 --> 00:47:15,319
Speaker 1: liked me and took care of me, and he'd say,

964
00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:17,839
Speaker 1: Dusty's gotcha. So I would spend two or three days

965
00:47:17,880 --> 00:47:20,040
Speaker 1: with these coaches, and Coach Kennedy that came in and

966
00:47:20,080 --> 00:47:22,840
Speaker 1: I drove him around this hotel and all this other stuff.

967
00:47:22,880 --> 00:47:24,360
Speaker 1: So I had known him, and when he got the

968
00:47:24,400 --> 00:47:27,000
Speaker 1: Murray State job, he hired me was closer to home,

969
00:47:27,040 --> 00:47:29,760
Speaker 1: and then obviously the tradition of Murray State was very intriguing.

970
00:47:30,640 --> 00:47:32,200
Speaker 1: That's a great it's a question that I have. I

971
00:47:32,239 --> 00:47:34,840
Speaker 1: mean I've had I've had Seve Prome, who, by the way,

972
00:47:34,840 --> 00:47:37,560
Speaker 1: like this is interesting. I was just in Tuscaloosa. Steve

973
00:47:37,600 --> 00:47:40,920
Speaker 1: Prome actually was my host on my visit. He told me,

974
00:47:41,280 --> 00:47:44,239
Speaker 1: I remember that store, yea yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So

975
00:47:45,000 --> 00:47:48,160
Speaker 1: h Murray's been good. I mean, you name the coach

976
00:47:48,160 --> 00:47:50,840
Speaker 1: who's been there, they've been good. Why what is it

977
00:47:50,880 --> 00:47:54,680
Speaker 1: about that place that allows Murray to be successful? The

978
00:47:55,600 --> 00:47:57,640
Speaker 1: passion for the game. It's a lot like Indiana and

979
00:47:57,719 --> 00:47:59,840
Speaker 1: on a smaller scale, the passion for the game. Everyone

980
00:47:59,840 --> 00:48:03,680
Speaker 1: in that town supports the players. They're they're treated like royalty.

981
00:48:03,880 --> 00:48:08,080
Speaker 1: It's just a really big deal, and they take care

982
00:48:08,120 --> 00:48:10,120
Speaker 1: of each other. It's just it's a it's a tight

983
00:48:10,280 --> 00:48:13,880
Speaker 1: it's a fraternity, and they've won forever. And our first year,

984
00:48:14,160 --> 00:48:17,120
Speaker 1: we had I think two returning players from coach Cronin's

985
00:48:17,400 --> 00:48:19,200
Speaker 1: tournament team. A couple of guys got kicked out, a

986
00:48:19,239 --> 00:48:23,279
Speaker 1: couple of guys whatever transferred, whatever happened, and so they

987
00:48:23,320 --> 00:48:26,480
Speaker 1: had had twenty five or thirty winning seasons. So we

988
00:48:26,520 --> 00:48:28,520
Speaker 1: have two returners. We bring in I think we signed

989
00:48:28,600 --> 00:48:30,760
Speaker 1: ten or eleven guys most of time we'd never seen.

990
00:48:31,560 --> 00:48:34,080
Speaker 1: And so our whole goal was we're not gonna we're

991
00:48:34,120 --> 00:48:36,080
Speaker 1: not going under five hundred. We're gonna make sure and

992
00:48:36,080 --> 00:48:37,560
Speaker 1: we ended up having a good year. It was like

993
00:48:37,600 --> 00:48:40,719
Speaker 1: eighteen and sixteen, but it laid the foundation for what

994
00:48:40,840 --> 00:48:43,439
Speaker 1: coach Kennedy did going forward with that first team, because

995
00:48:43,440 --> 00:48:46,040
Speaker 1: he's a he's a very very good basketball coach. But yeah,

996
00:48:46,080 --> 00:48:48,160
Speaker 1: prom was my roommate on road trips all that stuff,

997
00:48:48,200 --> 00:48:51,839
Speaker 1: so he and I are very close, okay. And then

998
00:48:52,080 --> 00:48:53,680
Speaker 1: how long were you there before you went to UAB.

999
00:48:53,840 --> 00:48:55,560
Speaker 1: I was there one year and then Mike Davis offered

1000
00:48:55,600 --> 00:48:58,640
Speaker 1: me a position back at UAB and I was extremely happy.

1001
00:48:58,760 --> 00:49:02,080
Speaker 1: Murray loved it. But you have a wife and three

1002
00:49:02,160 --> 00:49:04,480
Speaker 1: kids five and under, and you can triple your salary,

1003
00:49:04,520 --> 00:49:07,000
Speaker 1: you have to make a move. And obviously being familiar

1004
00:49:07,040 --> 00:49:09,120
Speaker 1: with Coach Davis and his staff, carry Up and Donnie

1005
00:49:09,120 --> 00:49:13,080
Speaker 1: marsh those were my guys, so it made sense. Okay.

1006
00:49:13,120 --> 00:49:15,399
Speaker 1: So when were at Eastern? Was that the first house

1007
00:49:15,400 --> 00:49:17,120
Speaker 1: she had ever bought? Was that Eastern? Now I bought?

1008
00:49:17,160 --> 00:49:19,840
Speaker 1: I bought one in Bloomington as well, and made a

1009
00:49:19,880 --> 00:49:21,799
Speaker 1: lot of money. Is one of those booms. I made

1010
00:49:21,800 --> 00:49:23,120
Speaker 1: a lot of money and thought we had to figure

1011
00:49:23,120 --> 00:49:24,839
Speaker 1: it out, and then gave all the money back when

1012
00:49:24,880 --> 00:49:29,000
Speaker 1: we moved to Michigan, so I could teach the real

1013
00:49:29,080 --> 00:49:32,200
Speaker 1: estate class much better. I could teach, honestly that like

1014
00:49:32,600 --> 00:49:35,960
Speaker 1: that part of it like kind of fascinates me. Did

1015
00:49:35,960 --> 00:49:38,360
Speaker 1: you buy it, Murray? Well? I bought at Eastern, Michigan,

1016
00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:40,040
Speaker 1: and then the market dropped. I couldn't sell us, so

1017
00:49:40,080 --> 00:49:41,960
Speaker 1: I rented it for Carl Thomas, who I worked with.

1018
00:49:41,960 --> 00:49:44,120
Speaker 1: I ended up renting it for ten years and then

1019
00:49:44,160 --> 00:49:47,200
Speaker 1: finally the market rose enough where I wouldn't have to

1020
00:49:47,200 --> 00:49:49,120
Speaker 1: take a bath on it, and I sold it. I

1021
00:49:49,200 --> 00:49:52,200
Speaker 1: bought in Murray. We completely renovated. My wife is she's

1022
00:49:52,360 --> 00:49:56,319
Speaker 1: hd HGTV legend. We renovated a house in Michigan. We

1023
00:49:56,360 --> 00:49:59,040
Speaker 1: renovated a house in Murray. We sold that when A

1024
00:49:59,120 --> 00:50:01,600
Speaker 1: Murray bought one in burbe Ham, which I still owned today.

1025
00:50:02,160 --> 00:50:04,320
Speaker 1: When we moved to Louisiana, we couldn't afford to sell events,

1026
00:50:04,320 --> 00:50:06,040
Speaker 1: so we started renting and it's actually turned into a

1027
00:50:06,080 --> 00:50:08,760
Speaker 1: great investment property. So yeah, we bought in Birmingham, bought

1028
00:50:08,760 --> 00:50:14,319
Speaker 1: in Ruston, bought in Gainesville, bought it Boca. Okay, so

1029
00:50:14,400 --> 00:50:16,840
Speaker 1: you get you get to Birmingham, bok for coach Davis's

1030
00:50:16,920 --> 00:50:22,759
Speaker 1: familiarity there, but uh, different area, different level. What's it

1031
00:50:22,840 --> 00:50:25,600
Speaker 1: like in terms of player evows? As you said at Murray,

1032
00:50:25,680 --> 00:50:27,560
Speaker 1: hey we need to see some of these guys we took.

1033
00:50:28,520 --> 00:50:30,439
Speaker 1: So now you've been on the road for a couple

1034
00:50:30,440 --> 00:50:33,200
Speaker 1: of years. Now, what was it like to then go

1035
00:50:33,320 --> 00:50:36,200
Speaker 1: recruit at UAB It was tough because Coach Davis wanted

1036
00:50:36,200 --> 00:50:38,759
Speaker 1: to recruit top fifty players at UAB and we were

1037
00:50:38,800 --> 00:50:40,680
Speaker 1: on the cusp of a breakthrough. We had a really

1038
00:50:40,719 --> 00:50:41,920
Speaker 1: good team. We made the n I T a couple

1039
00:50:42,040 --> 00:50:44,000
Speaker 1: years in a row and had Robert Vaden and Paul

1040
00:50:44,080 --> 00:50:46,200
Speaker 1: Delaney and I mean Walter Sharp played for the Pistons.

1041
00:50:46,239 --> 00:50:49,680
Speaker 1: We had really good players, and we had DeMarcus Cousins

1042
00:50:49,680 --> 00:50:52,880
Speaker 1: in a big group committed and when everything went south,

1043
00:50:53,000 --> 00:50:56,359
Speaker 1: so it was a lot of player management. We had

1044
00:50:56,480 --> 00:50:59,440
Speaker 1: extremely talented players that were that had a lot of

1045
00:51:00,000 --> 00:51:01,759
Speaker 1: off court issues and some other things. So there's a

1046
00:51:01,760 --> 00:51:05,480
Speaker 1: lot of player management. And so it's a whole different

1047
00:51:05,560 --> 00:51:07,560
Speaker 1: role where Coach Davis is doing a lot of the

1048
00:51:07,560 --> 00:51:10,160
Speaker 1: heavy lifting recruiting wise, You're you're kind of just filling

1049
00:51:10,200 --> 00:51:11,839
Speaker 1: in around him with the high school coaches and AU

1050
00:51:11,880 --> 00:51:13,880
Speaker 1: coaches and all that. But he was so involved at

1051
00:51:13,920 --> 00:51:16,160
Speaker 1: that time in recruiting, and like Coach Night, he's so

1052
00:51:16,200 --> 00:51:19,160
Speaker 1: magnetic that people liked him. So you're just really trying

1053
00:51:19,160 --> 00:51:21,280
Speaker 1: to fill in the holes as as a young assistant.

1054
00:51:21,280 --> 00:51:24,239
Speaker 1: But I kind of helped the niche there of being

1055
00:51:24,239 --> 00:51:26,239
Speaker 1: obsessed with the with the workouts, being in the gym,

1056
00:51:26,280 --> 00:51:27,920
Speaker 1: with the guys, so that kind of became like my

1057
00:51:28,080 --> 00:51:33,080
Speaker 1: niche on that staff. And then what Carry went to.

1058
00:51:33,239 --> 00:51:37,320
Speaker 1: Carry went to law Tech. Yeah, Carrie, I actually replaced

1059
00:51:37,440 --> 00:51:41,120
Speaker 1: Carry at UAB. He went to Lattech. He's a Lattech

1060
00:51:41,440 --> 00:51:45,239
Speaker 1: I guess probably his first two years and we lose

1061
00:51:45,360 --> 00:51:47,400
Speaker 1: to Notre Dame in the in the in the U

1062
00:51:47,840 --> 00:51:49,759
Speaker 1: n I T when they had Haron goading those guys,

1063
00:51:49,800 --> 00:51:51,520
Speaker 1: and Carry called and just said, hey, I have a

1064
00:51:51,560 --> 00:51:54,200
Speaker 1: spot open. I'd love to have you come join us.

1065
00:51:54,239 --> 00:51:57,160
Speaker 1: And and you know, he made it a very very

1066
00:51:57,880 --> 00:52:00,400
Speaker 1: enticing package. And we'd had some things happened at you

1067
00:52:00,440 --> 00:52:03,560
Speaker 1: AB where it was there was some relationship fallouts and

1068
00:52:03,600 --> 00:52:06,359
Speaker 1: whatnot on campus, so it felt like it's a good

1069
00:52:06,360 --> 00:52:09,080
Speaker 1: time just to start over and refresh and went to

1070
00:52:09,080 --> 00:52:11,000
Speaker 1: work for Carry. Had a really good year first year,

1071
00:52:11,040 --> 00:52:13,560
Speaker 1: and then the next year we had some injuries and

1072
00:52:13,640 --> 00:52:16,800
Speaker 1: some suspensions and ended up taking down the stretch and

1073
00:52:17,000 --> 00:52:19,560
Speaker 1: they let him go and Mike White gets a job

1074
00:52:19,600 --> 00:52:25,120
Speaker 1: and you know, somehow keeps me on on staff. So

1075
00:52:25,520 --> 00:52:27,360
Speaker 1: that's that part is fascinating because that happened to my

1076
00:52:27,360 --> 00:52:29,759
Speaker 1: brother once. You know, he went to actually went to

1077
00:52:29,760 --> 00:52:34,959
Speaker 1: where cal and for Ben Braun and Ben had Ben

1078
00:52:35,000 --> 00:52:36,480
Speaker 1: had been on him for a couple of years. He

1079
00:52:36,560 --> 00:52:38,120
Speaker 1: was at San Diego State, and at that time, you

1080
00:52:38,120 --> 00:52:39,799
Speaker 1: know at Sandey State, you couldn't get a head job

1081
00:52:39,800 --> 00:52:41,000
Speaker 1: out of Sandey you state, you had to go to

1082
00:52:41,040 --> 00:52:43,800
Speaker 1: the pack. You packed ten, right, and he goes to

1083
00:52:43,800 --> 00:52:45,520
Speaker 1: work for Ben and seven months and he gets fired.

1084
00:52:45,560 --> 00:52:50,359
Speaker 1: And as they have a boy, right, so carry carry,

1085
00:52:50,440 --> 00:52:55,440
Speaker 1: get carry gets fired? What do what like? What's your

1086
00:52:55,480 --> 00:52:59,120
Speaker 1: advice to coaches where you're on staff, there's a staff change,

1087
00:52:59,200 --> 00:53:01,560
Speaker 1: What did you do? How did you handle it? Well? Doug,

1088
00:53:01,719 --> 00:53:03,960
Speaker 1: I think and I'm I don't want say I'm different

1089
00:53:03,960 --> 00:53:05,839
Speaker 1: most coaches, but I was never. I was always kind

1090
00:53:05,840 --> 00:53:08,200
Speaker 1: of along the I have a degree, I have a

1091
00:53:08,239 --> 00:53:10,120
Speaker 1: work ethic, I have a brain. I'm gonna be fine.

1092
00:53:10,160 --> 00:53:11,920
Speaker 1: I don't do this to provide for my family. I

1093
00:53:11,960 --> 00:53:13,640
Speaker 1: always said I could. I think I could make more

1094
00:53:13,640 --> 00:53:15,799
Speaker 1: money doing other things. I do this because I love

1095
00:53:15,880 --> 00:53:18,240
Speaker 1: to coach, love being in a gym. It's an awesome

1096
00:53:18,360 --> 00:53:21,680
Speaker 1: job and and and lifestyle. So I was kind of like,

1097
00:53:21,719 --> 00:53:23,400
Speaker 1: you know, if I have to go back to D

1098
00:53:23,520 --> 00:53:25,759
Speaker 1: two or low major, whatever the case, I just want

1099
00:53:25,760 --> 00:53:27,719
Speaker 1: to coach ball. So I was I was interviewing, and

1100
00:53:28,120 --> 00:53:31,319
Speaker 1: Coach White had told me, like my confidence and me

1101
00:53:31,480 --> 00:53:34,520
Speaker 1: not being stressed about not having a job made him

1102
00:53:34,560 --> 00:53:36,520
Speaker 1: want to hire me. Almost when a recruit wants to

1103
00:53:36,560 --> 00:53:39,400
Speaker 1: go someplace else, it you know, you get that competitive

1104
00:53:39,440 --> 00:53:42,040
Speaker 1: juices flowing. So I was being sincere, but he said

1105
00:53:42,080 --> 00:53:43,920
Speaker 1: that was probably the thing that that drew him to

1106
00:53:43,960 --> 00:53:46,759
Speaker 1: me the most was was my confidence and just not

1107
00:53:46,840 --> 00:53:49,239
Speaker 1: being stressed about being fired. I mean, the day afore

1108
00:53:49,239 --> 00:53:52,080
Speaker 1: you get fired, I said, all right, Uh, my wife's

1109
00:53:52,080 --> 00:53:54,200
Speaker 1: grandmother was in Fort Myers area, and I said, all right,

1110
00:53:54,200 --> 00:53:55,920
Speaker 1: I'm gonna drop you guys off with your grandma and

1111
00:53:55,920 --> 00:53:58,719
Speaker 1: I'm gonna hit the IMGs and the you know, all

1112
00:53:58,719 --> 00:54:01,080
Speaker 1: the prep schools in Florida and get my hands on

1113
00:54:01,120 --> 00:54:03,640
Speaker 1: some guys that are out there available for when when

1114
00:54:03,719 --> 00:54:06,160
Speaker 1: when the coaching carousel it. So I did a week

1115
00:54:06,200 --> 00:54:08,879
Speaker 1: recruiting tour on my own and got back and coach

1116
00:54:09,000 --> 00:54:10,439
Speaker 1: you know, I was actually still in Florida. Coach White

1117
00:54:10,440 --> 00:54:11,640
Speaker 1: called and said, hey, I want to talk to you.

1118
00:54:11,800 --> 00:54:13,399
Speaker 1: And I think it was Houston at the Final four

1119
00:54:13,680 --> 00:54:16,640
Speaker 1: when we be there and we had lunch and I

1120
00:54:16,760 --> 00:54:18,560
Speaker 1: just started going and he told me keep coming into

1121
00:54:18,600 --> 00:54:20,120
Speaker 1: office and I didn't know. I had the job for

1122
00:54:20,280 --> 00:54:21,760
Speaker 1: a couple of weeks. He was getting a lot of resistance.

1123
00:54:21,800 --> 00:54:25,440
Speaker 1: Why would you retain people from the previous staff? That's crazy?

1124
00:54:25,480 --> 00:54:28,000
Speaker 1: Why would you do it? And I don't know why

1125
00:54:28,040 --> 00:54:31,200
Speaker 1: he had the courage to do it, but he retained me,

1126
00:54:31,239 --> 00:54:33,440
Speaker 1: and he's, you know, one of my best friends to

1127
00:54:33,480 --> 00:54:38,120
Speaker 1: this day. Yeah. Now, when you guys were at Florida,

1128
00:54:39,040 --> 00:54:40,799
Speaker 1: did you guys did you play new in ball? But yeah?

1129
00:54:40,800 --> 00:54:44,400
Speaker 1: Would you play? Yeah? You get yeah? Yeah, So now

1130
00:54:44,480 --> 00:54:47,279
Speaker 1: how did you did other staffs do that? Where you

1131
00:54:47,280 --> 00:54:50,200
Speaker 1: guys would play well, not the coaches and the head coaches.

1132
00:54:50,360 --> 00:54:52,799
Speaker 1: It was like we always played. Like in Indiana five

1133
00:54:52,960 --> 00:54:55,359
Speaker 1: was a ga. Eric Jackson was on staff and view

1134
00:54:55,760 --> 00:54:58,000
Speaker 1: and so all the young guys we played every day.

1135
00:54:58,840 --> 00:55:01,239
Speaker 1: And then everywhere we've and we played every day. And

1136
00:55:01,239 --> 00:55:02,680
Speaker 1: then when we got to a Lot of Tech, coach

1137
00:55:02,760 --> 00:55:04,480
Speaker 1: White was still young enough to play. So our staff

1138
00:55:04,480 --> 00:55:06,680
Speaker 1: we play the gas of managers at lot Tech just

1139
00:55:06,760 --> 00:55:09,360
Speaker 1: about every day. And then we carried it on to

1140
00:55:09,440 --> 00:55:12,360
Speaker 1: Florida where it's just you finish practice, you work a

1141
00:55:12,440 --> 00:55:14,520
Speaker 1: couple of guys out, and then you put thirty minutes

1142
00:55:14,600 --> 00:55:17,000
Speaker 1: up and you go full court. For thirty minutes. So

1143
00:55:17,000 --> 00:55:20,040
Speaker 1: it's just the most efficient way to work out, and

1144
00:55:20,719 --> 00:55:23,319
Speaker 1: it's it's a lot of fun and it's a lot

1145
00:55:23,360 --> 00:55:26,040
Speaker 1: of fun. But I also I also think guys players,

1146
00:55:26,080 --> 00:55:29,120
Speaker 1: respected players like it, right. They do like like the

1147
00:55:29,160 --> 00:55:30,839
Speaker 1: fact that you can you can still hoop. They peek

1148
00:55:30,840 --> 00:55:32,560
Speaker 1: in the gym and you can hoop a little bit. Like,

1149
00:55:32,680 --> 00:55:34,799
Speaker 1: all right, you know he's not just he's not just

1150
00:55:35,040 --> 00:55:40,160
Speaker 1: not just not just on my ass. Yeah, all right,

1151
00:55:40,160 --> 00:55:42,960
Speaker 1: that's it for part one of Dusty May. We'll drop

1152
00:55:43,040 --> 00:55:46,120
Speaker 1: part two in a couple of days in the meantime.

1153
00:55:46,400 --> 00:55:49,440
Speaker 1: Really appreciate your feedback, Love how many of downloaded, and

1154
00:55:49,680 --> 00:55:53,480
Speaker 1: love some of these pods. I'm Doug Gottlieb. This is

1155
00:55:53,480 --> 00:55:53,839
Speaker 1: all ball