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Speaker 1: Yeah, my name is Clay Nukeleman. This is a production

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Speaker 1: of the bear Grease podcast called the bear Grease Render

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Speaker 1: where we render down, dive deeper, and look behind the

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Speaker 1: scenes of the actual bear Grease podcast presented by f

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Speaker 1: HF Gear, American made, purpose built hunting and fishing gear

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Speaker 1: that's designed to be as rugged as the places we explore. Guys,

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Speaker 1: We've got an exclusive bear Grease discount code for f

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Speaker 1: h F Gear that's fish Hunt Fight Gear. I've been

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Speaker 1: using their products for the last year and I love

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Speaker 1: carrying my gear in a chest rig or my binos

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Speaker 1: and their bino harness. It's easier and more accessible than

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Speaker 1: a backpack and it doesn't get in the way when

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Speaker 1: I'm riding my mule. For a limited time, you can

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Speaker 1: head over to f h F gear dot com forward

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Speaker 1: slash bear Grease and listeners to this yere podcast get

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Speaker 1: a discount on purchases for your f h F Gear

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Speaker 1: system and you can see how I build my gear system.

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Speaker 1: So go to f h F gear dot com forward

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Speaker 1: slash bear Grease for a special code. If you're buying

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Speaker 1: stuff from f h F Gear, check it out fish

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Speaker 1: Hunt Fight f h F Gear just for the record,

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Speaker 1: now that we're not producing a show for Mark Kenyon,

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Speaker 1: I would like to just establish with a group that

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Speaker 1: now Clays in charge, Clays the producer. Okay, so no

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Speaker 1: longer there's no need to look back to Andreas anymore.

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Speaker 1: Thank goodness, you few. This is this is really an experiment,

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Speaker 1: and I don't really want to put like a lot

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Speaker 1: of pressure on you guys, but you know, there was

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Speaker 1: there are groups of people over time that have done

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Speaker 1: things that were monumental, and when you're swinging for the fence,

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Speaker 1: like you're either gonna strike out or you might hit

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Speaker 1: it over the fence. And so this is this is

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Speaker 1: the first time in the Bear Grease Surrender history that

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Speaker 1: we have had an entirely new crew of bear Grease guests. Essentially,

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Speaker 1: you guys are like the astronauts that went to the

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Speaker 1: moon first, and people are like, man, I don't know

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Speaker 1: if they ever come back or not. This is wild.

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Speaker 1: So congratulations won't air. Okay, If this goes really bad,

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Speaker 1: I'll just call in the regulars, you know, for a

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Speaker 1: quick bear grea surrender. No, welcome to the Bear Grease Surrender. Welcome. No,

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Speaker 1: I'm thrilled, apps solutely thrilled to have a new cast

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Speaker 1: of characters which I which I will introduce. So we

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Speaker 1: make a big deal out of out of introductions on

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Speaker 1: the burgers frender. Okay, we are we're in the field,

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Speaker 1: so we're not in the typical burgery studio at my office.

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Speaker 1: We are in the field. Loose definition of in the field,

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Speaker 1: let's say in the field, meaning we're not where we

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Speaker 1: usually are. But I have many many guests with me today,

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Speaker 1: Mark Kenyon of Wired to Hunt. Yeah, Mark, Mark and

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Speaker 1: I have been hunting together this week. With Mark is

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Speaker 1: his crew, of his production crew. So I'm gonna start

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Speaker 1: to my right and we have Matt gang Yon. How

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Speaker 1: close was that matter? You know what? That's a perfect

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Speaker 1: mix of the both of the correct So we say

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Speaker 1: Gagnon or it could be it could be Gagon if

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Speaker 1: you're from the old country Gang, but we'll go with Gagnon.

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Speaker 1: That's like the Okay, so tell me what you do

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Speaker 1: for meat. Either I am officially an associate producer and

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Speaker 1: in the field, I am the go get me this guy,

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Speaker 1: the glue guy. Yeah. Did you guys know that the

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Speaker 1: first video that Matt ever produced for me, he was

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Speaker 1: the were you the director? On that there was multi officially, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it was. It was a team effort. But yeah, I

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Speaker 1: put in a lot of the first time I worked

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Speaker 1: with Matt with the media, we did this bare pistol

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Speaker 1: defense video and it has two point seven million views

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Speaker 1: on YouTube right now, smashing success by Matt. Yeah, so

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Speaker 1: I set the bar high initially. So I feel like

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Speaker 1: I I peaked in my first effort. To your right, Andreas,

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Speaker 1: good job did your persian now? Yeah, so Andrea said,

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Speaker 1: tell us what you do for me here? I produced

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Speaker 1: for me either. So you're a producer producer? What does

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Speaker 1: that mean? I didn't. I wouldn't have known what that

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Speaker 1: meant before. So my wife likes to think that it's

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Speaker 1: like wedding planning, Okay, for a TV show. You get

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Speaker 1: all the pieces to the puzzle together and you have

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Speaker 1: an event. Okay, I'm happy. It's a good way to

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Speaker 1: put it. Shout out to Jane. Yeah, she must, she

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Speaker 1: must be an angel. I think she's she's the real

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Speaker 1: trooper of the crew completely. So you've been on the

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Speaker 1: shoot with us this week, and we'll talk about our

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Speaker 1: hunting what we did. You've you've done this kind of

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Speaker 1: stuff and other for other companies though other capacities. Yes,

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Speaker 1: this is my first event with or gig with docuseries

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Speaker 1: of this sort. Docuseries is that what we're calling these?

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Speaker 1: I imagine it is. It's a it's a series of documenting.

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Speaker 1: Mark Kennyan slaying it to your right, Tyler, Emmett Tyler,

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Speaker 1: welcome man, Hello, thanks for having me. Where are you from?

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Speaker 1: Originally from Carpenteria, California, but I live in Bend, Oregon. Now, oh,

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Speaker 1: that reminds me. Andrea's is from l AT, I'm from

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Speaker 1: I'm from We'll come back to you, Tyler. We're gonna

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Speaker 1: spend a lot of time with you. Um. I would

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Speaker 1: like to point out that Andreas is from l A.

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Speaker 1: People might have already insinuated that just by hearing him,

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Speaker 1: though they might have already caught on. Did y'all notice

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Speaker 1: that James Lawrence gave him some grief from being from

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Speaker 1: CALIFORNI I loved it this so quickly he was able

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Speaker 1: to already he picked up the andres is and should

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Speaker 1: be the target of jebs. I feel like I'm James Lorton.

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Speaker 1: It's his favorite. Now. He gave me a big old hug.

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Speaker 1: He didn't hug you, Clay, not the way he hugged me. Jealous.

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Speaker 1: I've known this man for a week. You've known this

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Speaker 1: man your entire life, and he gave me a better

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Speaker 1: hug than he gave you. Child. You have a very

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Speaker 1: very good skill at connecting with people quickly. I will

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Speaker 1: say that you and Juju were like this, like quickly,

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Speaker 1: James Lawrence, I like to know everyone, man. Maybe that's

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Speaker 1: something about guys from California. Tyler Okay, back to Tyler, Man.

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Speaker 1: You do a lot of work for so you're a

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Speaker 1: videographer and do a lot of work for Meat Eater

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Speaker 1: and all a bunch of different capacities. Love kind of

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Speaker 1: all the shows across the gamut from cal in the

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Speaker 1: field to meet your hunts to now this first time

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Speaker 1: with Mark and sometimes on the main show with Steve

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Speaker 1: and I don't know, they just wherever they tell me

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Speaker 1: to go, I go. What Meat Eater shows have you

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Speaker 1: on with Steve Well? I first worked on Stars in

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Speaker 1: the Sky, which was not the show, but that was

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Speaker 1: back in I don't know when we filmed that, went

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Speaker 1: to the Fish Shack, and then did the Wyoming Mule

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Speaker 1: Deer episode. I think it was in season nine where

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Speaker 1: we went with on horseback up to Wyoming and and

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Speaker 1: then did the Texas episode with Jesse Griffiths and JT. Fans.

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Speaker 1: This year in February we did the Square which was Yeah,

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Speaker 1: during that snow did you know that? So the guy

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Speaker 1: that y'all hunted with and Wyoming the guide and his

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Speaker 1: son what was his name? Stewart and Landon Peterson. Stewart

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Speaker 1: was the dad, Landon was the sun. So Stewart Peterson Mark,

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Speaker 1: did you know that Stewart Peterson that was on that

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Speaker 1: season on Back Country Wyoming hunt is the boy from

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Speaker 1: Where the Red Fern Grows? Somebody just told me that

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Speaker 1: this one, but maybe it was him was Utah, Yeah

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Speaker 1: you told me that. Yeah. So it's a great, great,

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Speaker 1: great movie and book. Do you ever watch him movie

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Speaker 1: like that or read a book like Where the Red

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Speaker 1: Front Grows and just be like, why didn't I think

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Speaker 1: of that? Because it's such a classic American story that

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Speaker 1: is just so simple and so rich, and people who

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Speaker 1: aren't coon hunters, people who aren't even necessarily rural people

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Speaker 1: can like watch Where the Red Fern Grows and identify

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Speaker 1: with it. I thought it was fascinating that this old

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Speaker 1: outfitter was Billy Coleman in the movie. Yeah, that's pretty cool.

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Speaker 1: That movie was shot over here in their Tallquah, Oklahoma,

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Speaker 1: which is like a couple hours from here. Yeah, they

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Speaker 1: were great, great guys. Yeah, they really seemed like yeah,

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Speaker 1: genuine article. I think he did the child actor thing

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Speaker 1: for a while and then realized it wasn't for him

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Speaker 1: and just you know, started living a different life. You

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Speaker 1: can tell when Billy Coleman and Where the Red Fernt

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Speaker 1: Grows runs like down a gravel road and with bare feet,

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Speaker 1: You're like, this dude's a real outdoors kid. But he

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Speaker 1: was from wy Woman. He played a pretty good Southerner. Yes, yeah,

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Speaker 1: he was from Miami, but yeah he does. I think

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Speaker 1: he's a general contractor and a outfit or no, and

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Speaker 1: his son is a cattle rancher. Yeah they seem like

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Speaker 1: the real deal. Yeah, they're definitely the real deal. Really

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Speaker 1: nice guys. Yeah, so you do a lot of videography

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Speaker 1: of all kinds for meat either, that's cool man, to

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Speaker 1: your right, Mark Kenyone, you're making me French. Just we're

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Speaker 1: going around and like danyone Tae e met and mental Meto.

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Speaker 1: Mark Kenyone, Mark, Welcome to Burgaries. Man is a big deal.

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Speaker 1: Glad to be here so everybody. Most people will know

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Speaker 1: who Mark Kenny is. Mark Kenyon has wired to Hunt,

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Speaker 1: which is inside of the meat eater, the meat eater world.

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Speaker 1: It's a it's sometimes I think it's hard for people

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Speaker 1: to understand kind of meat either. They might know wired

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Speaker 1: to Hunt and not realize unless they're paying attention that

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Speaker 1: that that is a meat eater brand. But it's your

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Speaker 1: brand and who you are. I think of meat eaters

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Speaker 1: is the umbrella, and then there's all these sub brands

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Speaker 1: and personalities and folks underneath it and wired hunts of thing.

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Speaker 1: I started on my own men of years ago, and

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Speaker 1: and then uh, when meat eater became a new thing,

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Speaker 1: me and Steve merged it all together. And he were

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Speaker 1: one of the first guys that came into meat Eater,

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Speaker 1: were you not? You have one of the very very first,

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Speaker 1: like number three or something like that. Okay, so he

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Speaker 1: sought you out, he did. He called me one day,

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Speaker 1: do you know Steve before that I did. We weren't

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Speaker 1: like close buddies or anything. We drank a beer once

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Speaker 1: and talked about books, and we've exchanged a few emails.

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Speaker 1: And then one day I was sitting in Grand Teatime

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Speaker 1: National Park with my wife, camped out living in our camper,

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Speaker 1: and I got a phone call from Steve Ronellen, Like

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Speaker 1: what in the world he called me about the rest

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Speaker 1: of history. So that was what year two thousand seventeen

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Speaker 1: seems like a long time ago. It did. So we're

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Speaker 1: gonna come back to Mark because we were gonna talk

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Speaker 1: about our hunt. Ultimately, by the end of this, we're

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Speaker 1: gonna talk about the Warner Glenn podcast number two. To

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Speaker 1: Mark's right my left Joe, also known as Big Joe.

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Speaker 1: Big Joe is not He's not big like volume wise,

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Speaker 1: they're like mass wise, but is very tall. Joe vanneck Out. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is your so your videographer cinematographer? Can you can

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Speaker 1: you describe the difference for me? For real? I mean,

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Speaker 1: I mean to most people in the world that there's

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Speaker 1: no difference, But within production, I would say cinematographers have

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Speaker 1: like a little bit, you know, a little bit. Uh

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Speaker 1: is this a self proclaimed title? I mean you get

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Speaker 1: credit credited as a cinematographer. Well, what would the guy

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Speaker 1: do that was a videographer? I mean, I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to throw it. Come this was like

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Speaker 1: an ego thing. Here is what I'm catching. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I don't know. Yeah, it's it's more artistic. Maybe a

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Speaker 1: certain level of bigger paycheck, certain level of production maybe

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Speaker 1: reflects the cinematographer. I don't know, Okay, certain cameras maybe

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Speaker 1: I don't know. Okay, we have an l a producer

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Speaker 1: here that could chine in on what what what's what's

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Speaker 1: the difference. So since digital cameras become a thing and

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Speaker 1: brands have brought in folks to shoot, this role has

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Speaker 1: become a videographer where their shooting video of content and

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Speaker 1: they're also editing or directing. There like a jack of

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Speaker 1: all trades or Jane of all trades, where cinematographers just

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Speaker 1: specializes in making cinema images, so they operate on a

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Speaker 1: different scale. Typically, to the general public, the term videographer

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Speaker 1: is more familiar than a cinetographer or director of photography

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Speaker 1: or camera operator. It's a cinematographer on our time card.

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Speaker 1: So there you go. How does filmmaker fit into this?

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Speaker 1: Just skipping, just jumping above all of it. And you

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Speaker 1: know I'm a filmmaker. Well this this, this is like

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Speaker 1: not my film, Like I'm producing images and making things

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Speaker 1: look good. But if I was, like, for instance, I'm

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Speaker 1: making my own film, like as an independent cinematographer, like

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Speaker 1: my own documentary film. So that's I guess qualifies me

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Speaker 1: as a filmmaker. But for this show, just a cinematographer,

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Speaker 1: do you guys as as videographers as excuse me, as

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Speaker 1: cinematographers and as uh. It's kind of like the difference

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Speaker 1: than being a someone saying, oh, you're a raccoon hunter

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Speaker 1: and you go, no, I'm a coon hunter. I don't know,

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Speaker 1: and it'd be like, what's what's the difference a joke? Okay, okay,

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Speaker 1: as cinematographers as producers, like four of you are and

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Speaker 1: that do you do? You watch a lot of films, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: for sure, like for style examples and inspiration and lighting

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Speaker 1: and colors. So when you're watching a movie, you're thinking

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Speaker 1: about all those things. Oh yeah, I mean people some

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Speaker 1: people can't stand watching films with me. There's things just

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Speaker 1: because I'm like interpreting it a little bit different maybe,

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Speaker 1: or something You're paying attention to certain things. But sometimes

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Speaker 1: they appreciate it. They're like, oh, I didn't think about

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Speaker 1: that way. My wife has become better at doing that

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Speaker 1: than I am. So she'll be just predict shows right

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Speaker 1: off the bat. It's fun. She's we've switched switch sides.

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Speaker 1: What do you think about do you think there is

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Speaker 1: more advantage in uh, which watching other people's work. I

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Speaker 1: think there's an argument argument to be made for somebody

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Speaker 1: that maybe never watched anybody else's work and just went

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Speaker 1: off like raw just their interpretation as opposed to be

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Speaker 1: an influence, because I think we're heavily influenced in anything.

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Speaker 1: Like if you turned me loose in the mountains of

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Speaker 1: Arkansas to go kill a deer with a bow, and

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Speaker 1: I had never had any instruction, but I understood the

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Speaker 1: patterns of deer, and like, I think I would probably

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Speaker 1: do it way different than the way I do it now.

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Speaker 1: It's just been ingrained and me. I mean, part of

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Speaker 1: the whole stick of what we're doing this week is

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Speaker 1: that we're hunting a particular way because it's the way

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Speaker 1: that it's a traditional way to hunt. It's not necessarily

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Speaker 1: the most efficient way. Do you see what I'm saying? So,

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Speaker 1: and I realized we gained so much by watching how

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Speaker 1: other people do things, But sometimes I wonder if that

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Speaker 1: inhibits us more than it helps us sometimes, what are

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Speaker 1: your thoughts on films? And then Mark will go back

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Speaker 1: to deer hunting. You know, I think, like you know,

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Speaker 1: get he was saying, getting inspiration from other stuff. I think,

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Speaker 1: you know, mimicry is the best form of flattery kind

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Speaker 1: of thing, or if you're you're kind of learning from

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Speaker 1: people that you admire and applying that to your yourself

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Speaker 1: and your own cinematic process and as Jesus sounds, but yeah,

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I feel like it's it's hard and

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Speaker 1: a vacuum that doesn't exist, right, You're always going to

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Speaker 1: be influenced by everything you watch and assume. So, but

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Speaker 1: you know, there's off a lot of stuff, different rules

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Speaker 1: of shooting that you need to know because you know,

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Speaker 1: you can't cross the line and shoot. You know, it's

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Speaker 1: hard for the editor, so you kind of have to

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Speaker 1: have a basic understanding of of coverage of a scene too.

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Speaker 1: So I think if you just kind of came out

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Speaker 1: of the box about any of that, it could be

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Speaker 1: a little bit challenging for an editor or whatever. So

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Speaker 1: especially because the language of film has evolved over a century,

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Speaker 1: and so we are accustomed to a certain language and

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Speaker 1: once you become a master of that craft. You can

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Speaker 1: change the rules that language. But you know something that

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Speaker 1: your parents brought up last night when we were talking.

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Speaker 1: It was the same idea of how much do you

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Speaker 1: watch or how much you pay attention. Our art, or

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Speaker 1: art in general, is all about sensory understanding. So if

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Speaker 1: you had no hearing, no site, you know, no touch,

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Speaker 1: could you could you make anything? You know? Like, what

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Speaker 1: would you do? You wouldn't know that that existed. So

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Speaker 1: even if we just look at a tree, we can

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Speaker 1: be inspired by that and somehow capture that in our paintings.

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Speaker 1: Are are are there's inspiration no matter what. You don't have

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Speaker 1: a choice, you just you are only able to build

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Speaker 1: on experiences you've had in a sensory world. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: realized it's probably kind of a romantic, unrealistic idea to

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Speaker 1: think you would be not influenced by other people. But

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Speaker 1: what if we took a paleolithic Native American who would

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Speaker 1: have the full capacity for learning as us, and you

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Speaker 1: could take him out of that world and put him

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Speaker 1: into our world, train him on a video camera the

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Speaker 1: most creative of all the bunch. You could do some

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Speaker 1: tests and figure out which one was most creative. He

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Speaker 1: would know the video, he would know the equipment, and

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Speaker 1: he could make a video. What would it look like?

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Speaker 1: How would it be different than ours? We're getting deep

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Speaker 1: in the weeds boys, This is great. I could have

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Speaker 1: thought on that, just in terms of we've chosen to

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Speaker 1: work within a really set like set confines. We have

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Speaker 1: a episode length like where we have a time limit.

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Speaker 1: So you know, if you take someone in that situation,

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Speaker 1: they may think that the full sunrise is the most

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Speaker 1: incredible thing in film it and it's a you know,

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Speaker 1: a three hour segment that doesn't translate to you know,

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Speaker 1: what we're trying to do. You're we're We've chosen to

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Speaker 1: work within this really like strict set of rules, so

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Speaker 1: there's I think that limits capacity a little bit. You know,

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Speaker 1: you gotta get everything done in twenty two minutes. It

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Speaker 1: has to be a cohesive story. There has to be

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Speaker 1: a start in an end, in an arc, and whatever

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Speaker 1: it was they produced, I just don't think it would

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Speaker 1: do well on YouTube. I I actually think that the

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Speaker 1: Caveman would have a really good chance because we all,

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Speaker 1: we've all evolved with similar understanding of beauty, even across

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Speaker 1: different cultures. Right like the indigenous Americans versus the European Americans,

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Speaker 1: like they understood art in a very similar format we've

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Speaker 1: I think they'd have a good chance of making something

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Speaker 1: really sick. I think I think it would be surprised

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Speaker 1: at how similar are intrigue would be. I think they

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Speaker 1: would make a like an hour long documentary about fire,

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Speaker 1: That's what I think they would do, and Buffalo Fire,

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Speaker 1: Buffalo and the sun rest that I want fantastic. Throw

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Speaker 1: some Kevin Costner in there and a felt cowboy hat perfectly.

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Speaker 1: Are you saying what we do is so easy a

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Speaker 1: Cayman could do it, like I? So, Hey, so Mark,

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Speaker 1: why don't you tell everybody kind of what we've been

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Speaker 1: doing this week? Yeah? Well, the gist of this show

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Speaker 1: that we're producing is that I travel across the country

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Speaker 1: to meet up with interesting characters, interesting deer hunters that

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Speaker 1: represent a unique style, tradition, or culture within the white

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Speaker 1: tail hunting world. And I'm tasked with meeting with this

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Speaker 1: person and mentoring under them, studying them for a day

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Speaker 1: or so to get the gist of their area, their place,

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Speaker 1: and how they do what they do. And then I

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Speaker 1: need to go out and try to pull it off. Myself.

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Speaker 1: So I gotta try to replicate I gotta try to

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Speaker 1: guinea pig their style in their terrain and there stomping grounds.

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Speaker 1: So this time we came to visit you and James

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Speaker 1: Lawrence to learn about Arkansas deer hunting, hunting in the mountains,

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Speaker 1: hunting in big timber, big forests, public land, and doing

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Speaker 1: it the traditional way, packing in with a mule, staying

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Speaker 1: out there a while, camping in the back country. And

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Speaker 1: uh so that's what we did. We came out here,

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Speaker 1: I met with you guys and tried to hunt. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: everybody that it has followed along with the Burgar's podcast

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Speaker 1: would have would know James Lawrence. He was on the

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Speaker 1: second or third episode, so we did a a full

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Speaker 1: episode with him the shed Hornbuck. Yeah yeah, what what

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Speaker 1: what were your impressions of James. James was even better

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Speaker 1: than I expected, you know, I think that, you know,

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Speaker 1: having listened to him on the on the podcast and

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Speaker 1: heard of stories from you about him, I knew he

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Speaker 1: would be a great deer hunter. I knew he'd be

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Speaker 1: a character. But what I didn't expect fully was just

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Speaker 1: how warm and welcoming he was. You know, how quick

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Speaker 1: he was to open his arms to you and be

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Speaker 1: excited for you and share with with us everything he could.

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Speaker 1: And the genuine excitement he had to be a part

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Speaker 1: of this with us was just it was really nice.

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Speaker 1: And uh, I'll tell you, obviously a heck of a

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Speaker 1: deer hunter to kill the deer he has in the

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Speaker 1: places he's done it. I mean, I could tell I

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Speaker 1: was impressive when I went and saw the antlers on

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Speaker 1: his wall at the beginning of the trip, but it's

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Speaker 1: even more impressive now at the end of the trip.

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Speaker 1: We so the first day we went to James house,

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Speaker 1: we spent hour two with him talking with him, and

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Speaker 1: then we went out into the Mountains National Forest here

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Speaker 1: in Arkansas, and there was a whole gaggle of us.

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Speaker 1: There's six of us here, so we all we packed

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Speaker 1: in on the mule. And so the way that the

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Speaker 1: way that James, you know, he did all kind of hunting,

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Speaker 1: but his favorite way to hunt was the packing with

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Speaker 1: a mule or a horse. He's a horse packing with

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Speaker 1: a horse and carry enough stuff that he could hunt

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Speaker 1: for an extended period of time and stay way back

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Speaker 1: in the woods. And it basically it's kind of like

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Speaker 1: a modern version of a long hunt, you know, and

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Speaker 1: so that's what we did. And you know, there's different

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Speaker 1: layers of national forests. You know, there's, uh, there's some

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Speaker 1: national forest that is abudding private land that has a

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Speaker 1: lot of clear cuts and a lot of you know,

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Speaker 1: man made alterations to the landscape, which typically means more deer.

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Speaker 1: Then there's what I would call like interior mountain hunting,

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Speaker 1: which would be these mountain ranges in areas that just

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Speaker 1: kind of have it's all gonna have some timber, timber

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Speaker 1: improvement in different things, but kind of this interior areas

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Speaker 1: that probably have less deer to steason anywhere else. And

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Speaker 1: that's where we tried to go. We camped, you guys camped.

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Speaker 1: I actually left because I wasn't really apart. I was

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Speaker 1: just a part of the film getting Mark back in here,

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Speaker 1: and then Mark was on his own, so I didn't

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Speaker 1: camp with you guys. But how many days did you hunt, Mark? Well,

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Speaker 1: we had budgeted four hunt days, the first of which

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Speaker 1: would be a morning with you where you'd be showing

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Speaker 1: me around and giving me your perspective on how you

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Speaker 1: would approach you know, just basically how you and James

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Speaker 1: and hunt in air like this. I was picking your brain.

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Speaker 1: Bought all that, and then we would have I would

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Speaker 1: have three and a half days solo after that. So

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Speaker 1: that's how much time we had. We didn't end up

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Speaker 1: using all that time, but that's how much time we

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Speaker 1: had available. And we got a late starts. We're supposed

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Speaker 1: to camp in and get in there the night before,

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Speaker 1: but because of all sorts of outside of our hands circumstances,

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Speaker 1: we got a late starts. We got in a day late,

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Speaker 1: and we left a little early. So short it was

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Speaker 1: a short, long hunt. Yeah. Yeah, Well do you want

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Speaker 1: to do we want to tell that clearly, I mean

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Speaker 1: talking to me, just kind of describe the terrain and

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Speaker 1: kind of what we did and then just your hunt. Well,

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Speaker 1: if you're willing to spill the beans, oh why not? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: The Bear Grease Render podcast is a good places any

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Speaker 1: all right. So we, like you mentioned, we packed in

425
00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:18,720
Speaker 1: our stuff on Izzie on your mule, and that was

426
00:23:18,760 --> 00:23:21,119
Speaker 1: definitely the easiest hike in I've ever had for a

427
00:23:21,160 --> 00:23:23,399
Speaker 1: bad country hunt. Because she carried my backpack too. I

428
00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:27,400
Speaker 1: felt guilty, um, but it was nice, and I never

429
00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:30,119
Speaker 1: feel guilty loading a mule down to the hilt. I

430
00:23:30,160 --> 00:23:33,399
Speaker 1: think of every what I whisper under my breath or

431
00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:35,439
Speaker 1: when i'm if I'm by myself, I actually say it

432
00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:38,119
Speaker 1: out loud to the mule. I say, I feed you

433
00:23:38,160 --> 00:23:40,000
Speaker 1: every day of your life. You can do this for

434
00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:43,439
Speaker 1: me today and not throw a bit. Well, you know,

435
00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:45,520
Speaker 1: it was funny though. We we talked about this while

436
00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:48,560
Speaker 1: we were filming the other day, but watching her walk on,

437
00:23:48,680 --> 00:23:51,040
Speaker 1: I got to thinking, like, is she like a hunt dog?

438
00:23:51,520 --> 00:23:53,960
Speaker 1: Like is this her super Bowl? Has she been sitting

439
00:23:54,000 --> 00:23:56,760
Speaker 1: in her you know, sitting in the pasture, sitting in

440
00:23:56,760 --> 00:23:59,359
Speaker 1: the barn for weeks, just waiting for this chance to

441
00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:03,000
Speaker 1: get out and do or work. He said, Nope, she's

442
00:24:03,040 --> 00:24:05,560
Speaker 1: she's not excited about this at all. Yeah, Now that

443
00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:08,359
Speaker 1: that was an insightful question that I've never heard it

444
00:24:08,600 --> 00:24:11,840
Speaker 1: asked like that. People have asked, you know, do you

445
00:24:11,840 --> 00:24:16,120
Speaker 1: think they like doing this? And my and it will

446
00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:19,000
Speaker 1: go through it again because it's an interesting thought. You know,

447
00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:21,720
Speaker 1: does this is this animal pumped when I put it

448
00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:23,639
Speaker 1: in the trailer because it knows it's gonna go out

449
00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:25,959
Speaker 1: in the back country and get out of the you know,

450
00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:28,399
Speaker 1: the pasture for a couple of days. And I believe

451
00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:31,080
Speaker 1: the answer is no. And that is partly because I

452
00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:34,560
Speaker 1: read a book years ago called Evidence Based Horsemanship where

453
00:24:34,560 --> 00:24:37,960
Speaker 1: a neurologist and a horse trainer got together and wrote

454
00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:41,600
Speaker 1: a book that changed the equine training world because for years,

455
00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:47,919
Speaker 1: people anthropomorphized horses and mules, because a horse might treat

456
00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:52,280
Speaker 1: Tyler different than they treat Joe, just like he would,

457
00:24:52,560 --> 00:24:57,320
Speaker 1: and people would would presume that, well, that horse doesn't

458
00:24:57,359 --> 00:25:02,080
Speaker 1: like me, or that horse, you know, doesn't it's mean

459
00:25:02,119 --> 00:25:06,080
Speaker 1: to me and not to him, And basically it affected

460
00:25:06,119 --> 00:25:09,240
Speaker 1: the way people trained and handled their horses. Well, these

461
00:25:09,320 --> 00:25:13,439
Speaker 1: neurologyist came in and really studied the science, the brain

462
00:25:13,640 --> 00:25:19,600
Speaker 1: science of an equine animal, and basically they have they

463
00:25:19,680 --> 00:25:22,840
Speaker 1: don't have a place in their brain to like you

464
00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:26,440
Speaker 1: or not like you, like it is not there. They

465
00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:30,280
Speaker 1: have an extremely big part of the brain that governs

466
00:25:30,560 --> 00:25:32,760
Speaker 1: the physical movement of their body. Like basically, if the

467
00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:36,359
Speaker 1: brain were an engine, like a big chunk of that

468
00:25:36,480 --> 00:25:42,439
Speaker 1: engine would be dedicated to actually driving their body, you know,

469
00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:45,840
Speaker 1: this thousand pound body. Even more so than like the

470
00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:50,560
Speaker 1: human body, a very small part of that brain would

471
00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:56,440
Speaker 1: be dedicated to the ability to reason and think, which

472
00:25:56,440 --> 00:25:59,040
Speaker 1: they basically don't have the ability to do. Like you

473
00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:02,360
Speaker 1: can put out. The best example was like you put

474
00:26:02,359 --> 00:26:05,439
Speaker 1: out a hay bell for a horse. He is not

475
00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:10,159
Speaker 1: thinking I'm gonna stash some of that hey away for

476
00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:14,040
Speaker 1: next week when I won't have hey, like he just

477
00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:19,320
Speaker 1: he thought hey. Point being that animal, the main things

478
00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:23,879
Speaker 1: that animal is worried about is the main flight response.

479
00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:27,000
Speaker 1: The main response that animal has this flight response to

480
00:26:27,160 --> 00:26:30,520
Speaker 1: predation that is a massive factor in their life is

481
00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:34,679
Speaker 1: staying safe and breeding and then having a full belly.

482
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:38,960
Speaker 1: And so like a kind of like Matt, Matt pointing

483
00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:45,800
Speaker 1: to himself, I didn't breeding. So a dog though, a

484
00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:48,960
Speaker 1: primary instinct in that dog is a prey drive to

485
00:26:49,080 --> 00:26:51,440
Speaker 1: go get something, And so we're on the same page

486
00:26:51,440 --> 00:26:53,560
Speaker 1: of that animal. We want to go get a coil,

487
00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:56,720
Speaker 1: we want to go get a bear or whatever. So

488
00:26:57,359 --> 00:27:01,360
Speaker 1: anyway I think that is he is happy. The other

489
00:27:01,400 --> 00:27:05,120
Speaker 1: thing is that they fit into a a a dominance.

490
00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:09,399
Speaker 1: Everything about training mules and horses is about dominance. And

491
00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:13,080
Speaker 1: by dominance, I don't mean like physically dominating the animal.

492
00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:17,520
Speaker 1: But that animal when it views you andreas All, the

493
00:27:17,560 --> 00:27:20,240
Speaker 1: only way it knows how to register you is am

494
00:27:20,280 --> 00:27:23,480
Speaker 1: I in charger? Is he in charge? Who's in charge? Here?

495
00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:26,320
Speaker 1: And so if you established that you're in charge, then

496
00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:30,160
Speaker 1: that animal will do what you want. If it figures

497
00:27:30,160 --> 00:27:33,200
Speaker 1: out that you're intimidated buy it, or that it can

498
00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:36,399
Speaker 1: bully you, it absolutely will. We used to read our

499
00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:38,560
Speaker 1: kids a book called if you give a Moose a muffin?

500
00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:41,040
Speaker 1: Do you can read that? So, if you give a

501
00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:43,880
Speaker 1: moose a muffin, he'll come in your house and want

502
00:27:43,880 --> 00:27:46,480
Speaker 1: to drink of water. If you give him a glass

503
00:27:46,520 --> 00:27:48,360
Speaker 1: of water, then he'll come in your house and he'll

504
00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:50,359
Speaker 1: want to sit on the couch. It's a cute little

505
00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:53,240
Speaker 1: kid's book. So if you give a mule a muffin,

506
00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:56,000
Speaker 1: you're in trouble. So you always got to keep him

507
00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:58,879
Speaker 1: in line. So you know there's a future for you

508
00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:02,240
Speaker 1: and children's books. You do the Arkansas version of that,

509
00:28:04,200 --> 00:28:09,360
Speaker 1: give a mule u? Do you regret giving Issy and Apple? Now? No,

510
00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:15,080
Speaker 1: not at all for me. Yeah, so yeah, mules. Yeah.

511
00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:17,200
Speaker 1: I don't give the cliff Notes version of this because

512
00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:20,320
Speaker 1: I know we want to get to other things. Um, basically,

513
00:28:20,359 --> 00:28:22,840
Speaker 1: just we packed in there a few miles, we set

514
00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:25,399
Speaker 1: up a base camp, and then you and I struck

515
00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:28,400
Speaker 1: out for a morning of kind of still hunting through

516
00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:31,680
Speaker 1: the mountains, And basically I was just picking your brain

517
00:28:31,720 --> 00:28:33,520
Speaker 1: and all the things. I want to know, what's the

518
00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:35,439
Speaker 1: kind of stuff you think you're they're feeding on out here,

519
00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:37,800
Speaker 1: what kind of habitat are they key and in on?

520
00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:40,000
Speaker 1: What are the terrain features of these deer are using.

521
00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:42,880
Speaker 1: You were pointing out a lot of differences to me.

522
00:28:43,520 --> 00:28:44,959
Speaker 1: I'd say one of the things that stood out the

523
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:49,560
Speaker 1: most to me was how you should interpret sign in

524
00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:52,400
Speaker 1: a place like this compared to how you might interpret

525
00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:55,080
Speaker 1: a sign or observations in a place in the Midwest

526
00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:57,480
Speaker 1: where there's much higher deer densities, because very low deer

527
00:28:57,520 --> 00:29:00,240
Speaker 1: density here. And so you talked about making a chart,

528
00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:01,640
Speaker 1: which I think we should make, and I think we

529
00:29:01,640 --> 00:29:04,600
Speaker 1: should sell it on the mediator store. This would be

530
00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:09,400
Speaker 1: one rub in Arkansas equals fifteen rubs in Iowa. One

531
00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:13,600
Speaker 1: dear sighting in Arkansas equals twenty deer in Iowa. Whatever

532
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 1: it was um because there's so little sign of of

533
00:29:17,600 --> 00:29:20,360
Speaker 1: any life out there. When it came to white tails,

534
00:29:20,360 --> 00:29:22,440
Speaker 1: at least we saw it. We fought, excuse me, we

535
00:29:22,560 --> 00:29:29,560
Speaker 1: saw zero droppings. Just the the several small tracks we

536
00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:31,880
Speaker 1: saw when you and I were together, we found one

537
00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:38,000
Speaker 1: little dinky rub and we saw one just half I

538
00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:40,640
Speaker 1: can't cuss in this podcast, kind of one one real

539
00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:45,200
Speaker 1: small little scrape. Uh So it wasn't terribly encouraging from

540
00:29:45,200 --> 00:29:47,040
Speaker 1: a sign perspective, but you were telling me, oh, this

541
00:29:47,120 --> 00:29:51,880
Speaker 1: is pretty great. So so that was eye opening to me. Um.

542
00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:53,400
Speaker 1: So I got the lay of the landing and just

543
00:29:53,480 --> 00:29:55,320
Speaker 1: kind of saw how you would do it and how

544
00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:57,760
Speaker 1: James taught you to do it, and and try to

545
00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:00,560
Speaker 1: get enough of an understanding to be head out there

546
00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:04,080
Speaker 1: in my own that was that was the beginning. Yeah, yeah,

547
00:30:04,280 --> 00:30:07,520
Speaker 1: and then walk us through the hunts. You had four hunts, ye,

548
00:30:08,040 --> 00:30:12,000
Speaker 1: so you you Clay took off, You took off, went home,

549
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:15,160
Speaker 1: and we were hunting high saddles. Yeah, this is one

550
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:18,760
Speaker 1: big mountain that had a few saddles in it. And

551
00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:21,480
Speaker 1: and both you and James had reiterated to me multiple

552
00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:24,360
Speaker 1: times saddles were really the name of the game. It

553
00:30:24,440 --> 00:30:26,720
Speaker 1: was a terrain feature and these big ridges that deer

554
00:30:26,760 --> 00:30:30,720
Speaker 1: would use to cross the big ridge. And while there's

555
00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:34,200
Speaker 1: a number of different ways deer use these mountains, a

556
00:30:34,280 --> 00:30:37,520
Speaker 1: number of different terrain features, they might relate to saddles

557
00:30:37,760 --> 00:30:39,920
Speaker 1: where we're the most huntable. I think that was a

558
00:30:40,000 --> 00:30:42,080
Speaker 1: key thing, Like you could try different things, but this

559
00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:44,880
Speaker 1: was a way that was particularly hunting, and it had

560
00:30:45,080 --> 00:30:47,080
Speaker 1: has a lot to do with the wind higher up

561
00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:49,480
Speaker 1: on the mountains. If you gotta if you got a

562
00:30:49,480 --> 00:30:52,720
Speaker 1: south wind, you actually get a south wind. If you're

563
00:30:52,720 --> 00:30:54,880
Speaker 1: on the side of the mountain with a south wind,

564
00:30:55,280 --> 00:30:57,640
Speaker 1: it's gonna swirl, it's gonna hit this mountain and do

565
00:30:57,680 --> 00:31:00,640
Speaker 1: all kind of weird stuff. So the saddles are huntable.

566
00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:04,560
Speaker 1: And what I said to you, and what I wanted

567
00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:07,360
Speaker 1: to reiterate, because there's a lot of guys that kill

568
00:31:07,840 --> 00:31:10,080
Speaker 1: good deer in this part of the world that probably

569
00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:13,800
Speaker 1: would be like, well, I don't hunt that many high saddles.

570
00:31:14,120 --> 00:31:16,200
Speaker 1: There's other ways to do it, you know, in the

571
00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:19,640
Speaker 1: deer's world in in this part of the country, Like

572
00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:24,600
Speaker 1: he's probably doing eight things really consistently. This is one

573
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:26,440
Speaker 1: of them, you know. I mean, he's going to bed

574
00:31:26,800 --> 00:31:30,720
Speaker 1: probably in similar areas on the mountain, he's traveling benches

575
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:33,880
Speaker 1: in similar as, he's feeding in similar areas, he's getting

576
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:38,600
Speaker 1: water every day somewhere. But basically it's just like you

577
00:31:38,640 --> 00:31:41,360
Speaker 1: can kill him in saddles because in the saddle is

578
00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:44,200
Speaker 1: a low spot on a long ridge, and so that's

579
00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:47,240
Speaker 1: just kind of what we keyed in on. Yes, we're

580
00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:52,320
Speaker 1: looking for saddles, some little bit assigned, just confirmative deer

581
00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:54,640
Speaker 1: coming through though. And then we wanted to find those

582
00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:57,120
Speaker 1: things close to acorns because we figured that's that's what

583
00:31:57,120 --> 00:32:00,280
Speaker 1: they're kid in on feeding. So that first night, what

584
00:32:00,360 --> 00:32:06,200
Speaker 1: did you say, what kind of Oh yeah, acorns, acorns, Oh, acorns.

585
00:32:06,240 --> 00:32:12,440
Speaker 1: That's so we found We found all those things in

586
00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:15,200
Speaker 1: a couple of spots. And so that first night I

587
00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:18,080
Speaker 1: went into the first saddle. It was nice, thick, brushy saddle.

588
00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:23,840
Speaker 1: Brought my uh incredible cameraman Tyler and Joe with me.

589
00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:26,520
Speaker 1: We climbed up in trees and we decided we'd sit

590
00:32:26,600 --> 00:32:28,640
Speaker 1: up high that first night because it kind of seemed

591
00:32:28,640 --> 00:32:30,240
Speaker 1: to like a destination that you need to get a

592
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:32,880
Speaker 1: good advantage point of. So we did the tree thing

593
00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:36,040
Speaker 1: that night. We saw one dough out of range. We

594
00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:39,920
Speaker 1: went back the next morning, which I was thrilled about. Yeah,

595
00:32:40,120 --> 00:32:41,880
Speaker 1: when I you came back to camp, I was like, oh,

596
00:32:41,920 --> 00:32:44,800
Speaker 1: you saw a deer yep, good yep. So that was

597
00:32:45,560 --> 00:32:50,160
Speaker 1: somewhat encouraging. Next day saw nothing. So that afternoon I

598
00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:53,480
Speaker 1: decided you know what, it's time to take another page

599
00:32:53,720 --> 00:32:56,480
Speaker 1: James book and do the still hunting thing. So that

600
00:32:56,680 --> 00:33:00,240
Speaker 1: evening I still hunted my way through an acre. Weren't

601
00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:03,200
Speaker 1: flat through that first saddle, up another knob to this

602
00:33:03,280 --> 00:33:05,480
Speaker 1: other ridge, and I came across another spot with with

603
00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:07,880
Speaker 1: a bunch of acorns that weren't there the first day

604
00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:10,040
Speaker 1: when you and I walked through, because they weren't as

605
00:33:10,040 --> 00:33:11,600
Speaker 1: thick in this spot. So I saw that, It's like,

606
00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:14,200
Speaker 1: oh interesting. And then I glanced over to my left

607
00:33:14,200 --> 00:33:16,720
Speaker 1: and I saw this brushy point coming off the main ridge,

608
00:33:17,000 --> 00:33:18,680
Speaker 1: and it caught my eye. Hadn't noticed it when you

609
00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:20,200
Speaker 1: and I were out there, and I caught I just

610
00:33:20,280 --> 00:33:22,920
Speaker 1: caught a glimpse into that cheese. That looks like something

611
00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:24,880
Speaker 1: should be bedding in that. So I just stood in

612
00:33:24,920 --> 00:33:27,080
Speaker 1: glass for a while, and I edged my way off

613
00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:29,600
Speaker 1: the little trail and I just started sidehilling toward that,

614
00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:31,400
Speaker 1: just to get a better look. And as I'm heading

615
00:33:31,400 --> 00:33:35,800
Speaker 1: towards that, I find a rub multiple saplings all rubbed up.

616
00:33:36,800 --> 00:33:38,320
Speaker 1: So I thought, well, this looks good, and I sat

617
00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:40,719
Speaker 1: and I watched that brushy point for a while and

618
00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:43,440
Speaker 1: then slipped on past that around the knob and on

619
00:33:43,480 --> 00:33:45,360
Speaker 1: the other side, and I have another ripped up tree.

620
00:33:45,840 --> 00:33:48,240
Speaker 1: So now I found two rubs in the same little knob.

621
00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:50,520
Speaker 1: And then I looked at on X and I noted

622
00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:52,880
Speaker 1: that little tiny scrape we found the day before it

623
00:33:52,920 --> 00:33:55,000
Speaker 1: was just on the other side of this too. So

624
00:33:55,040 --> 00:33:57,960
Speaker 1: all this sign, which now is the most sign we've

625
00:33:58,000 --> 00:34:00,400
Speaker 1: seen anywhere on this trip, is right around a snob,

626
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:03,520
Speaker 1: and there's a second saddle that drops off that nub.

627
00:34:03,880 --> 00:34:06,080
Speaker 1: And so I thought to myself, as I'm seeing all

628
00:34:06,080 --> 00:34:08,160
Speaker 1: this and these things are looking good, better and better,

629
00:34:08,560 --> 00:34:10,000
Speaker 1: I thought, why don't just sitting the side of this

630
00:34:10,080 --> 00:34:13,359
Speaker 1: knob and watch that saddle and see if this kind

631
00:34:13,400 --> 00:34:17,359
Speaker 1: of combination of factors pans out. Did that? Saw three

632
00:34:17,400 --> 00:34:21,520
Speaker 1: doors that night come across that saddle out of range.

633
00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:23,920
Speaker 1: So the next morning my plan was head back in

634
00:34:24,000 --> 00:34:27,240
Speaker 1: there first light, slip into that saddle, and get closer

635
00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:31,000
Speaker 1: to where they crossed. And to make a long story short,

636
00:34:31,719 --> 00:34:34,240
Speaker 1: we ended up seeing several deer moved through that saddle,

637
00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:40,359
Speaker 1: and one of them around late in the morning. Late

638
00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:44,000
Speaker 1: in the morning, one of them came crunch crunching just

639
00:34:44,120 --> 00:34:47,759
Speaker 1: over my right shoulder. I'm sitting on the ground and

640
00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:51,120
Speaker 1: I heard a twig snap. Turn my head to the right,

641
00:34:51,160 --> 00:34:54,120
Speaker 1: look past my cameraman here, Mr Tyler, and I just

642
00:34:54,160 --> 00:34:57,839
Speaker 1: see antlers coming down the ridge, not far not far

643
00:34:57,840 --> 00:35:02,080
Speaker 1: away at all. And um eight point buck was walking

644
00:35:02,120 --> 00:35:07,280
Speaker 1: straight past this quarter in a way and lo and behold,

645
00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:10,080
Speaker 1: we got the camera on him. I got the gun history.

646
00:35:10,520 --> 00:35:15,320
Speaker 1: Let let let a shot buzzle loader huntinguzuzz could have

647
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:18,520
Speaker 1: killed him with a bow. It was was bow range

648
00:35:18,560 --> 00:35:22,000
Speaker 1: probably when I shot him. And um, yeah, killed me

649
00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:26,400
Speaker 1: an eight point Arkansas buck. Awesome, man, it was wild.

650
00:35:27,040 --> 00:35:29,239
Speaker 1: It was not. I didn't expect that to happen the

651
00:35:29,239 --> 00:35:32,600
Speaker 1: way the way things are going. You haven't a You don't.

652
00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:35,560
Speaker 1: You don't realize how much pressure is on something like this.

653
00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:38,279
Speaker 1: And not not from the even the video perspective. But

654
00:35:38,320 --> 00:35:40,120
Speaker 1: if you had come to Arkansas and he said, Claire,

655
00:35:40,120 --> 00:35:42,160
Speaker 1: I got three and a half days, I don't want

656
00:35:42,200 --> 00:35:44,680
Speaker 1: to kill a buck. I mean that's a pretty short

657
00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:47,319
Speaker 1: amount of time really anywhere to go hunt. I mean

658
00:35:47,320 --> 00:35:49,640
Speaker 1: you could hunt and some of the best places in

659
00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:51,480
Speaker 1: the country and say you got three and a half

660
00:35:51,600 --> 00:35:56,480
Speaker 1: days to kill a representative de your here, so and

661
00:35:56,560 --> 00:35:59,120
Speaker 1: to do it here, I'd say it was we were

662
00:35:59,160 --> 00:36:02,640
Speaker 1: all really happy that I think this is your one

663
00:36:02,680 --> 00:36:05,799
Speaker 1: of the two top hardest hunts. I happy this season. Yeah,

664
00:36:05,800 --> 00:36:08,520
Speaker 1: so there's a series of hunts that Mark's doing. I

665
00:36:08,600 --> 00:36:11,320
Speaker 1: don't envy you for this, Mark, It's a tricky endeavor.

666
00:36:11,360 --> 00:36:14,040
Speaker 1: It's funny, you know, me and Ben, we're the ones

667
00:36:14,040 --> 00:36:16,160
Speaker 1: who came up with this idea and planned out the

668
00:36:16,239 --> 00:36:18,360
Speaker 1: hunts and planned out what we're gonna do. And you

669
00:36:18,400 --> 00:36:20,239
Speaker 1: know a year ago when we were first spitballing this

670
00:36:20,239 --> 00:36:22,719
Speaker 1: whole idea, like, man, this is a great concept. This

671
00:36:22,760 --> 00:36:24,719
Speaker 1: is gonna be fun, this is gonna be really interesting,

672
00:36:25,360 --> 00:36:28,200
Speaker 1: and it never really somehow, I'm some kind of idiot

673
00:36:28,200 --> 00:36:30,440
Speaker 1: for not really thinking this through, but it didn't really

674
00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:33,040
Speaker 1: cross my mind until I was actually going out in

675
00:36:33,080 --> 00:36:35,680
Speaker 1: these hunts, just how crazy it was to try to

676
00:36:35,719 --> 00:36:37,839
Speaker 1: pull this kind of thing off and make a TV show.

677
00:36:38,080 --> 00:36:41,799
Speaker 1: Like most all hunting TV shows, especially White Tail. Are

678
00:36:42,040 --> 00:36:44,560
Speaker 1: you know, going to some big, managed, fancy property and

679
00:36:44,560 --> 00:36:46,560
Speaker 1: you've got seven days and it's already preset for you.

680
00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:49,239
Speaker 1: We're going to some outfitter and it's all ready to

681
00:36:49,320 --> 00:36:51,040
Speaker 1: rock and roll those big bucks all over the place.

682
00:36:51,480 --> 00:36:55,360
Speaker 1: Nobody goes to some random place spends a day talking

683
00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:57,960
Speaker 1: to someone learn about the area and then tries to

684
00:36:57,960 --> 00:36:59,880
Speaker 1: go figure it out all on their own with just

685
00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:03,399
Speaker 1: three days to hunt. It's not a recipe for success.

686
00:37:03,880 --> 00:37:07,000
Speaker 1: It is a very interesting concept, and I can't wait

687
00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:08,960
Speaker 1: to see to see them all and see it all

688
00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:12,120
Speaker 1: put together. It's it's it's gonna be interesting, and we

689
00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:14,799
Speaker 1: were very fortunate that this one worked out it very well.

690
00:37:14,840 --> 00:37:19,360
Speaker 1: Couldn't have the increased pressure of time such a mental

691
00:37:19,600 --> 00:37:22,160
Speaker 1: mental game. Tell Mark, if he was here for seven

692
00:37:22,200 --> 00:37:25,040
Speaker 1: full days, like I would have thought, Man, well, well

693
00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:28,440
Speaker 1: he'll get on a good buck and seven full days.

694
00:37:28,520 --> 00:37:31,360
Speaker 1: But three and a half days is way different than seven.

695
00:37:31,640 --> 00:37:33,720
Speaker 1: And with the muzzle litter, which you don't hunt muzzle

696
00:37:33,760 --> 00:37:37,120
Speaker 1: litter because like as consistently as somebody out here withou like,

697
00:37:37,200 --> 00:37:41,080
Speaker 1: you're a bow hunter primarily, and those muzzle litters are difficult.

698
00:37:41,320 --> 00:37:43,680
Speaker 1: There's always something going wrong. There's yeah, there really is.

699
00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:46,160
Speaker 1: The more I messed with muzzloters, the more I realized

700
00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:48,160
Speaker 1: there's so many things that can go wrong with them.

701
00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:51,200
Speaker 1: I'd rather shoot any day of the the week. I would

702
00:37:51,560 --> 00:38:01,719
Speaker 1: trust a bowl a lot more in the muzzlow. Yeah, Mark,

703
00:38:01,719 --> 00:38:03,839
Speaker 1: you're you're an uppa guy. Pretty much all the time.

704
00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:06,400
Speaker 1: How are you feeling at like nine am that morning,

705
00:38:06,560 --> 00:38:09,480
Speaker 1: so you fired the shot at where was your head

706
00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:11,879
Speaker 1: at it like nine? Yeah, that's a great question. And

707
00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:14,640
Speaker 1: and in my very speedy recollection of the hunt right there,

708
00:38:14,680 --> 00:38:16,640
Speaker 1: I made it sound like it was action packed and quick,

709
00:38:16,680 --> 00:38:19,359
Speaker 1: and yeah, that sounded pretty action packed. I saw deer

710
00:38:19,440 --> 00:38:21,120
Speaker 1: and then nothing, and then a couple of deer and

711
00:38:21,120 --> 00:38:23,800
Speaker 1: then nothing. But you gotta understand that those deer settings,

712
00:38:23,840 --> 00:38:25,839
Speaker 1: you know, the one deer that was like a four

713
00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:28,759
Speaker 1: second deer encounter the first night, and the next night

714
00:38:28,760 --> 00:38:31,399
Speaker 1: it was five seconds of them very quickly passing through

715
00:38:31,760 --> 00:38:34,719
Speaker 1: and then then I killed. But that was over the

716
00:38:34,719 --> 00:38:39,440
Speaker 1: course of you know, four days, many long hours, um,

717
00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:44,120
Speaker 1: so of the hunt was filled with Man, we are

718
00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:47,480
Speaker 1: not seeing anything. I've got very little signed to work with,

719
00:38:47,640 --> 00:38:50,600
Speaker 1: you know, I am really a What I love about

720
00:38:50,680 --> 00:38:54,080
Speaker 1: deer hunting in a lot of ways is the analytical Uh.

721
00:38:54,960 --> 00:38:57,279
Speaker 1: It's the chess match. It's trying to understand all the

722
00:38:57,280 --> 00:39:00,239
Speaker 1: different pieces. It's studying the playing, studying the bull ward

723
00:39:00,560 --> 00:39:02,680
Speaker 1: and figure out how to move these pieces around and

724
00:39:02,719 --> 00:39:05,200
Speaker 1: where these pieces are and what they mean and and

725
00:39:05,239 --> 00:39:08,239
Speaker 1: all that. And I kept as we're going through this hunt,

726
00:39:08,320 --> 00:39:10,800
Speaker 1: I felt like I was hunting blind. There's so little

727
00:39:11,120 --> 00:39:15,160
Speaker 1: new data to work with. There's almost no sign at all.

728
00:39:15,360 --> 00:39:17,200
Speaker 1: So it's not like I could scout until I find

729
00:39:17,239 --> 00:39:20,200
Speaker 1: hot sign because one little rub might be the best

730
00:39:20,239 --> 00:39:23,359
Speaker 1: we're gonna find. And how do you interpret that. I

731
00:39:23,400 --> 00:39:25,360
Speaker 1: wasn't going to be able to scout around until I

732
00:39:25,400 --> 00:39:27,520
Speaker 1: bumped a bunch of deer. I wasn't gonna see four

733
00:39:27,600 --> 00:39:29,719
Speaker 1: or five, six, seven deer doing different things and be

734
00:39:29,800 --> 00:39:32,240
Speaker 1: a pattern what they're doing like you might in other places.

735
00:39:33,000 --> 00:39:35,440
Speaker 1: So much of this time I was sitting here just

736
00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:39,120
Speaker 1: going back and forth in my head about you know,

737
00:39:39,360 --> 00:39:41,040
Speaker 1: what to do and how to do and how we're

738
00:39:41,040 --> 00:39:42,760
Speaker 1: gonna make the most of this and how it somehow

739
00:39:42,800 --> 00:39:44,680
Speaker 1: going to come together and what it came down to

740
00:39:44,719 --> 00:39:46,960
Speaker 1: in the end, And basically where my head was at

741
00:39:46,960 --> 00:39:50,440
Speaker 1: at nine am on that fourth day was I'm not

742
00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:54,279
Speaker 1: really in control here. I can do a few things right.

743
00:39:54,360 --> 00:39:56,319
Speaker 1: There's a few things that I can trust, and I'm

744
00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:59,239
Speaker 1: gonna trust the terrain, trust the saddle. I'm going to,

745
00:40:00,040 --> 00:40:03,239
Speaker 1: you know, trust my basic instincts as a hunter to

746
00:40:03,239 --> 00:40:04,960
Speaker 1: to be in the right place with the right vantage

747
00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:06,520
Speaker 1: point and make sure we're doing the right thing in

748
00:40:06,560 --> 00:40:09,200
Speaker 1: the moment so that if some opportunity did come along,

749
00:40:09,239 --> 00:40:12,600
Speaker 1: would be ready for it. But what I was telling myself,

750
00:40:12,680 --> 00:40:15,759
Speaker 1: literally the words in my mind, We're just wait and

751
00:40:15,800 --> 00:40:17,879
Speaker 1: see what the mountain gives you. I'm just gonna see

752
00:40:17,880 --> 00:40:20,000
Speaker 1: what the mountain gives you. And it might be a dough,

753
00:40:20,200 --> 00:40:21,879
Speaker 1: it might be nothing at all, and we're just gonna

754
00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:24,839
Speaker 1: have an experience out here and just gonna enjoy this

755
00:40:24,920 --> 00:40:27,040
Speaker 1: trip for what it was. But we're not gonna kill anything.

756
00:40:27,400 --> 00:40:30,640
Speaker 1: I just had done an interview to camera talking about

757
00:40:30,640 --> 00:40:33,640
Speaker 1: this very thing, talking about how my dad was always

758
00:40:33,680 --> 00:40:35,800
Speaker 1: really good at this, and that when I was a

759
00:40:35,880 --> 00:40:38,759
Speaker 1: kid sitting with my dad, I just always remember him

760
00:40:38,760 --> 00:40:41,239
Speaker 1: and I would find him like annoyingly upbeat about it,

761
00:40:41,239 --> 00:40:44,600
Speaker 1: because he would be, man, this is the most beautiful sky, Godly,

762
00:40:44,680 --> 00:40:47,840
Speaker 1: look at these leaves. This is just terrific weather. And

763
00:40:47,880 --> 00:40:49,319
Speaker 1: it would be sitting out there, we hadn't seen a

764
00:40:49,320 --> 00:40:51,680
Speaker 1: deer for six hours or something, and I'm thinking we

765
00:40:51,719 --> 00:40:53,960
Speaker 1: should be seeing more, Dear, why isn't this going better?

766
00:40:53,960 --> 00:40:56,279
Speaker 1: And Dad would just be john about you know what

767
00:40:56,320 --> 00:40:59,279
Speaker 1: a great maple candy this was or whatever. He was

768
00:40:59,360 --> 00:41:03,840
Speaker 1: just always enjoying it, joined the experience and the surroundings.

769
00:41:04,120 --> 00:41:08,880
Speaker 1: And I've always been very goal oriented, very uh achievement oriented,

770
00:41:09,520 --> 00:41:12,720
Speaker 1: and so I naturally have I have to work hard

771
00:41:12,840 --> 00:41:16,200
Speaker 1: to take a step back and just soaking things for

772
00:41:16,320 --> 00:41:18,520
Speaker 1: what they are without like striving for the next thing.

773
00:41:18,920 --> 00:41:21,120
Speaker 1: And so I was speaking to camera just about how

774
00:41:21,160 --> 00:41:22,640
Speaker 1: I need to be a little more like my dad

775
00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:25,000
Speaker 1: in this moment, because this seems like the kind of

776
00:41:25,040 --> 00:41:28,279
Speaker 1: place that requires that, and and really this is the

777
00:41:28,360 --> 00:41:32,359
Speaker 1: kind of place that helps, uh teach you to to

778
00:41:32,600 --> 00:41:34,560
Speaker 1: live like that a little bit. And I was kind

779
00:41:34,560 --> 00:41:37,359
Speaker 1: of accepting of that and thinking to myself, Man, we

780
00:41:37,360 --> 00:41:40,200
Speaker 1: were down to just one more day or less half

781
00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:42,800
Speaker 1: day or whatever it was, and in my hard hearts,

782
00:41:43,200 --> 00:41:44,680
Speaker 1: I knew it was gonna be a real long shot

783
00:41:44,760 --> 00:41:48,920
Speaker 1: to get something killed. And just moments after that, minutes

784
00:41:48,960 --> 00:41:52,480
Speaker 1: after that, here comes that buck. So you know, I

785
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:55,040
Speaker 1: don't know what you want to call it, but I

786
00:41:55,840 --> 00:41:58,680
Speaker 1: kind of looked that buck is a gift. You know,

787
00:41:59,480 --> 00:42:02,120
Speaker 1: in this out of hunting, you can't be validated by

788
00:42:02,320 --> 00:42:04,719
Speaker 1: seeing game. I say that all the time, even with

789
00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:07,600
Speaker 1: bear hunting in national forest, deer hunting in national forest,

790
00:42:08,040 --> 00:42:11,160
Speaker 1: and part of hunting is. It's so fun to hunt

791
00:42:11,200 --> 00:42:14,600
Speaker 1: in game rich areas, so like there's not it's so

792
00:42:14,640 --> 00:42:18,399
Speaker 1: fun to sit and watch a lot of deer. But

793
00:42:18,719 --> 00:42:22,279
Speaker 1: you have to go way backwards to be successful in

794
00:42:22,360 --> 00:42:24,799
Speaker 1: the in the mountains, you're just not gonna see a

795
00:42:24,800 --> 00:42:26,920
Speaker 1: lot of deer, you know. But I think that's a

796
00:42:26,920 --> 00:42:29,319
Speaker 1: good thing. I like to be able to go from

797
00:42:29,320 --> 00:42:31,680
Speaker 1: both worlds because there's places I hunt in Arkansas where

798
00:42:31,719 --> 00:42:33,680
Speaker 1: we do see. If I don't see a deer when

799
00:42:33,719 --> 00:42:36,319
Speaker 1: I'm hunting, I'm in the wrong spot. Just because you

800
00:42:36,360 --> 00:42:39,720
Speaker 1: ought to be seeing deer every day, you know, every

801
00:42:39,800 --> 00:42:42,200
Speaker 1: every sit, you know, every couple of hours, you know,

802
00:42:42,560 --> 00:42:45,520
Speaker 1: in the mountains not so you know, you're just looking

803
00:42:45,560 --> 00:42:50,080
Speaker 1: for that one chance of a a deer. So anyway, good job, man.

804
00:42:50,400 --> 00:42:53,920
Speaker 1: I can't thank you enough. And then we hauled the

805
00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:57,920
Speaker 1: deer out on Izzie's back. We pulled the old ribs

806
00:42:57,960 --> 00:43:00,760
Speaker 1: slip behind the shoulder, put the deer over the saddle

807
00:43:00,800 --> 00:43:03,000
Speaker 1: horn is he hauled the deer out. He said to me,

808
00:43:03,040 --> 00:43:04,839
Speaker 1: this is how they hauled dead people out of here too,

809
00:43:07,120 --> 00:43:14,120
Speaker 1: stripe him over the saddle. Yeah, um, what did you say?

810
00:43:14,680 --> 00:43:17,359
Speaker 1: You skinned it with James Lawrence? Yeah? And then we went,

811
00:43:17,440 --> 00:43:20,319
Speaker 1: we took it back to James's house. Oh yeah, we

812
00:43:20,320 --> 00:43:23,640
Speaker 1: we got We gotta say something, man, James Lawrence, of

813
00:43:23,680 --> 00:43:27,759
Speaker 1: all the people hunt with, he is the best at

814
00:43:28,400 --> 00:43:33,080
Speaker 1: very genuinely convincing you that he is more excited than

815
00:43:33,160 --> 00:43:37,200
Speaker 1: you are about the thing that you've done. And he's no,

816
00:43:37,840 --> 00:43:40,600
Speaker 1: he's no. I wanted to say respector of persons, but

817
00:43:40,680 --> 00:43:44,600
Speaker 1: like he doesn't really even know Mark, and he genuinely

818
00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:47,480
Speaker 1: was pumped from he was giving you a hug. He

819
00:43:47,640 --> 00:43:50,200
Speaker 1: shook your hand and gave you a big hug. I

820
00:43:50,239 --> 00:43:53,560
Speaker 1: think I'm more excited the new lar, bigger smile. Yeah,

821
00:43:54,080 --> 00:43:57,960
Speaker 1: he's a perfect mentor in that sense. He'll always be

822
00:43:58,000 --> 00:44:00,960
Speaker 1: excited for you when you need it. Yeah, man, that's

823
00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:04,239
Speaker 1: a that's something that I aspire to be like because

824
00:44:04,280 --> 00:44:07,600
Speaker 1: you can't fabricate it. You can't. It's not just like

825
00:44:07,640 --> 00:44:11,480
Speaker 1: I said in this Warner Glen podcast. Here boy, he's

826
00:44:11,480 --> 00:44:14,960
Speaker 1: a pro. Well, he's a pro gentleman that you you

827
00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:19,640
Speaker 1: can string words together in English and say sentences that

828
00:44:20,480 --> 00:44:24,200
Speaker 1: maybe the right words, but if those words aren't connected

829
00:44:24,200 --> 00:44:27,960
Speaker 1: to something really authentic, we all know it. I want

830
00:44:28,000 --> 00:44:33,279
Speaker 1: to work on being that supportive and genuine inside of

831
00:44:33,320 --> 00:44:36,719
Speaker 1: my interest in what other people are doing. And and boy,

832
00:44:36,719 --> 00:44:39,720
Speaker 1: you can't fabricate it's got to really be. Like James,

833
00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:42,920
Speaker 1: I believe was really pumped that Mark came killed a

834
00:44:42,960 --> 00:44:46,080
Speaker 1: deer here. And you know, because he could have said,

835
00:44:46,120 --> 00:44:49,680
Speaker 1: oh wow, Mark, I'm proud of you. That's great, good job.

836
00:44:49,880 --> 00:44:52,880
Speaker 1: He ended his hunt early, knowing we were driving up

837
00:44:52,880 --> 00:44:55,200
Speaker 1: to his drive away. He got out of his stand

838
00:44:55,640 --> 00:44:58,120
Speaker 1: came to see us. He was like Jones in because

839
00:44:58,160 --> 00:45:00,680
Speaker 1: he knew Mark killed something. Yeah, you know how I

840
00:45:00,760 --> 00:45:04,000
Speaker 1: know that you are genuinely interested and excited about what

841
00:45:04,040 --> 00:45:07,920
Speaker 1: somebody has to say. What you do this and anybody

842
00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:10,080
Speaker 1: that listens to your podcast will know this. You go

843
00:45:10,560 --> 00:45:16,840
Speaker 1: mm hmmm, that's you gotta you gotta real salad sound

844
00:45:16,840 --> 00:45:20,759
Speaker 1: that you use a lot Mark, if you listen to me.

845
00:45:20,840 --> 00:45:22,440
Speaker 1: I think I need to tone this back a little bit.

846
00:45:22,560 --> 00:45:25,200
Speaker 1: It's good, it's your thing that's prerecorded. It just hits

847
00:45:25,200 --> 00:45:34,080
Speaker 1: the button. I try to teach my kids to be

848
00:45:34,760 --> 00:45:38,080
Speaker 1: it's important in communication to be to give feedback to

849
00:45:38,080 --> 00:45:41,760
Speaker 1: people firm. I'm not talking to that rock on the wall.

850
00:45:41,840 --> 00:45:46,360
Speaker 1: You know there's I want to I want to I

851
00:45:46,400 --> 00:45:49,600
Speaker 1: want some I want some feedback. So I like to go. Yeah,

852
00:45:49,800 --> 00:45:53,440
Speaker 1: Warner Glenn. This is the second podcast in our series,

853
00:45:54,239 --> 00:45:58,600
Speaker 1: and I love highlighting people like Warner Glenn, Mark asked

854
00:45:58,640 --> 00:46:02,239
Speaker 1: me yesterday. He is like, so give me a general

855
00:46:02,320 --> 00:46:04,799
Speaker 1: sense of like why Warrener Glenn would be a well

856
00:46:04,840 --> 00:46:08,800
Speaker 1: known guy. And it's not like he's done like one

857
00:46:08,960 --> 00:46:12,239
Speaker 1: thing that made him who he is. It's more just

858
00:46:12,280 --> 00:46:15,239
Speaker 1: the totality of who he is and what he represents.

859
00:46:16,000 --> 00:46:18,279
Speaker 1: Part of it is his age to me that he's

860
00:46:18,320 --> 00:46:22,200
Speaker 1: so special, like in today's time, like the older that

861
00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:27,400
Speaker 1: somebody gets, the further back that there that their perspectives go,

862
00:46:28,239 --> 00:46:31,560
Speaker 1: and is the modern world continues to progress it like

863
00:46:31,640 --> 00:46:35,600
Speaker 1: this incredibly rapid pace. I feel like some of these

864
00:46:36,040 --> 00:46:38,760
Speaker 1: some of these people that really have a time stamp

865
00:46:38,800 --> 00:46:41,799
Speaker 1: on their life in the earth for the kind of

866
00:46:41,880 --> 00:46:47,120
Speaker 1: view that they have of this planet. It we we

867
00:46:47,800 --> 00:46:51,160
Speaker 1: every day we lose these people. And so I do

868
00:46:51,320 --> 00:46:55,719
Speaker 1: feel a burden almost too to talk to some of

869
00:46:55,760 --> 00:46:59,560
Speaker 1: these guys just to see. I mean, like, how do

870
00:46:59,600 --> 00:47:02,839
Speaker 1: you view the world? You know, what what is it

871
00:47:02,920 --> 00:47:05,680
Speaker 1: like inside of your life? And an interview Mr Warner

872
00:47:06,480 --> 00:47:12,000
Speaker 1: was like that for me, and uh, He's he represents

873
00:47:12,040 --> 00:47:14,960
Speaker 1: so much. But Andrea's you've listened to both the podcast.

874
00:47:15,280 --> 00:47:18,160
Speaker 1: What did you think of? So you just said something interesting.

875
00:47:18,800 --> 00:47:21,440
Speaker 1: He's lived a very authentic life close to the land,

876
00:47:22,000 --> 00:47:26,600
Speaker 1: and historically success has been around how well you can

877
00:47:26,640 --> 00:47:29,560
Speaker 1: live with in your resources. As time moves forward and

878
00:47:29,600 --> 00:47:33,000
Speaker 1: we modernize, that success has shifted away from like being

879
00:47:33,040 --> 00:47:35,120
Speaker 1: close to the land, to all the other things we've

880
00:47:35,160 --> 00:47:40,120
Speaker 1: fabricated to have a successful excuse me, a successful society.

881
00:47:40,280 --> 00:47:43,080
Speaker 1: And so I think that's why he's so special, because

882
00:47:43,120 --> 00:47:47,880
Speaker 1: his success is around his survival and his authenticity, where

883
00:47:48,239 --> 00:47:51,479
Speaker 1: monitoring success doesn't fall within that. So I think that's

884
00:47:51,480 --> 00:47:55,160
Speaker 1: why I feel strongly about these stories as well, because

885
00:47:55,160 --> 00:47:59,879
Speaker 1: it's so contrast to what has evolved in the pain

886
00:48:00,320 --> 00:48:03,799
Speaker 1: existing in the consumption. And someone like Warner Glenn has

887
00:48:03,880 --> 00:48:09,840
Speaker 1: self created. Obviously, he fell into that ranch because of

888
00:48:09,880 --> 00:48:13,920
Speaker 1: his ancestors, but he has perpetuated his existence, and that's

889
00:48:13,960 --> 00:48:17,120
Speaker 1: what's important. I think that's something interesting that everybody here

890
00:48:17,160 --> 00:48:19,759
Speaker 1: has also done. Now we're all sitting here because we

891
00:48:19,800 --> 00:48:25,560
Speaker 1: have perpetuatedly pursued our existence to be shooting a film

892
00:48:25,680 --> 00:48:30,160
Speaker 1: or to be creating a brand around bear hunting or

893
00:48:30,320 --> 00:48:33,080
Speaker 1: white tailed deer, and so it's a little bit more

894
00:48:33,120 --> 00:48:36,879
Speaker 1: modern what we do. Guys like Warner Glenn have our

895
00:48:36,920 --> 00:48:40,880
Speaker 1: inspirational in that sense. That's my take. Yeah, I like

896
00:48:41,200 --> 00:48:43,840
Speaker 1: what really what really stood out is that he he

897
00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:45,880
Speaker 1: does something unique that I think is kind of lost

898
00:48:45,920 --> 00:48:49,920
Speaker 1: in modern culture, and that's being like tied to his property,

899
00:48:49,960 --> 00:48:52,200
Speaker 1: his animals, so that you know, he wakes up and

900
00:48:52,239 --> 00:48:54,319
Speaker 1: sort of repeats the same thing, being waken up at

901
00:48:54,320 --> 00:48:57,280
Speaker 1: four am and saddling the mules and running the dogs.

902
00:48:57,320 --> 00:48:59,799
Speaker 1: Like he's really tied to his place and he's been

903
00:48:59,840 --> 00:49:02,799
Speaker 1: doing that. You know, it seems repetitious. He does that

904
00:49:02,840 --> 00:49:04,960
Speaker 1: every day. You've got to run the dogs, you've got

905
00:49:04,960 --> 00:49:06,920
Speaker 1: to feed your animals, you've got to tend your land,

906
00:49:07,440 --> 00:49:10,439
Speaker 1: and uh, but it's obviously given him like a deep

907
00:49:10,480 --> 00:49:12,600
Speaker 1: sense of peace and longevity. He's been doing it for

908
00:49:12,640 --> 00:49:16,120
Speaker 1: eight eight decades, right, and you know, I think folks

909
00:49:16,160 --> 00:49:18,759
Speaker 1: now every it's that rush to you know, work hard,

910
00:49:18,760 --> 00:49:22,080
Speaker 1: work hard, retire and then it's leisure time. But he's

911
00:49:22,200 --> 00:49:24,239
Speaker 1: you know, it's obvious it seems like it's extended his

912
00:49:24,320 --> 00:49:26,960
Speaker 1: life and his well being by just simply repeating that

913
00:49:27,000 --> 00:49:29,920
Speaker 1: every day and having that connection to his property and

914
00:49:29,920 --> 00:49:32,520
Speaker 1: his animals. And you know, he's tied to his land.

915
00:49:32,560 --> 00:49:35,759
Speaker 1: And that's where when he said he was talking about

916
00:49:35,800 --> 00:49:38,040
Speaker 1: the reward of doing the kind of work that he does,

917
00:49:38,960 --> 00:49:42,840
Speaker 1: and he said, if you're interested in monetary type rewards,

918
00:49:43,080 --> 00:49:46,280
Speaker 1: that was the phrase that he used. Remember that, then

919
00:49:46,440 --> 00:49:48,479
Speaker 1: you probably don't want to be a dry ground line

920
00:49:48,520 --> 00:49:53,000
Speaker 1: hunter in a rancher. I like that because in today's world,

921
00:49:53,239 --> 00:49:57,680
Speaker 1: it's almost as if there's only one option for what

922
00:49:58,160 --> 00:50:04,040
Speaker 1: most people are thinking about, which would be monetary type rewards.

923
00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:07,400
Speaker 1: And I'm not saying everybody thinks like that, but I

924
00:50:07,400 --> 00:50:09,960
Speaker 1: would say the vast majority of people of their lives

925
00:50:10,000 --> 00:50:14,400
Speaker 1: are dominated by this idea that money is going is

926
00:50:14,440 --> 00:50:17,120
Speaker 1: the end goal, and that money is gonna be what

927
00:50:17,320 --> 00:50:20,480
Speaker 1: gives them the freedom that they want. And that is

928
00:50:20,520 --> 00:50:24,719
Speaker 1: the American way. That is the that is the Western philosophy.

929
00:50:24,800 --> 00:50:28,319
Speaker 1: That is deep, deep, deep. Even if you think you

930
00:50:28,360 --> 00:50:34,239
Speaker 1: don't do it, you probably that's somewhere. And I like

931
00:50:34,360 --> 00:50:37,319
Speaker 1: it that Warner was just like, if that's the way,

932
00:50:37,360 --> 00:50:39,160
Speaker 1: you know, He's like, they're there are two ways to

933
00:50:39,200 --> 00:50:41,480
Speaker 1: look at life. You could you could look at the

934
00:50:41,560 --> 00:50:46,160
Speaker 1: monetary type reward system, or you could and and I

935
00:50:46,160 --> 00:50:48,760
Speaker 1: asked him, I said, what what is the reward for

936
00:50:49,080 --> 00:50:51,920
Speaker 1: your style lifestyle, because he he said, he's not doing

937
00:50:51,960 --> 00:50:54,200
Speaker 1: it for the money, so like, what what's your reward?

938
00:50:54,520 --> 00:50:58,360
Speaker 1: And that's when he went into talking about the beauty

939
00:50:58,400 --> 00:51:01,920
Speaker 1: of the land, and he talked about the creator, and

940
00:51:01,920 --> 00:51:06,040
Speaker 1: he talked about seeing the complexity of nature. He talked

941
00:51:06,080 --> 00:51:08,560
Speaker 1: about things connected to the tides and the moons and

942
00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:11,239
Speaker 1: went a little fawn, it's born, you know, he kind

943
00:51:11,239 --> 00:51:13,799
Speaker 1: of he kind of got poetic there for a minute. Well,

944
00:51:13,840 --> 00:51:17,480
Speaker 1: don't you feel that the monetary pursuit is a very

945
00:51:17,520 --> 00:51:23,560
Speaker 1: post industrial revolution, post war cultural effect, Like it's because

946
00:51:23,600 --> 00:51:26,520
Speaker 1: we've become so productive that we have that luxury of

947
00:51:26,600 --> 00:51:32,000
Speaker 1: creating another form of survival game. But he doesn't have

948
00:51:32,040 --> 00:51:35,920
Speaker 1: that luxury, or he didn't choose to take on that lifestyle.

949
00:51:36,640 --> 00:51:40,719
Speaker 1: So in a sense, he has found small rewards every

950
00:51:40,840 --> 00:51:43,680
Speaker 1: day and throughout time, and he's built his own reward

951
00:51:43,719 --> 00:51:46,480
Speaker 1: system that you kind of need that when you're surviving

952
00:51:46,520 --> 00:51:48,719
Speaker 1: off the land in Arizona. What did you guys think

953
00:51:48,760 --> 00:51:52,360
Speaker 1: about Kelly Kelly Glenn camberro with her being in movies

954
00:51:52,560 --> 00:51:55,200
Speaker 1: and being the ruder girl. That was pretty cool when yeah,

955
00:51:55,239 --> 00:51:59,320
Speaker 1: just a wild set of circumstances though that families found

956
00:51:59,320 --> 00:52:02,960
Speaker 1: themselves in. You know, you wouldn't necessarily expect that this

957
00:52:03,080 --> 00:52:06,760
Speaker 1: ranching family from down on the border would get tangled

958
00:52:06,800 --> 00:52:09,240
Speaker 1: up in that kind of stuff. But there more Hollywood

959
00:52:09,280 --> 00:52:14,080
Speaker 1: and Andreas and some ways, wow, more Hollywood than Andreas.

960
00:52:14,320 --> 00:52:16,520
Speaker 1: Thank God. I think she just she said, yes, the

961
00:52:16,600 --> 00:52:19,880
Speaker 1: unique opportunities that maybe other folks wouldn't have the tenacity

962
00:52:19,880 --> 00:52:21,680
Speaker 1: to do so, like at the time, like her getting

963
00:52:21,680 --> 00:52:24,000
Speaker 1: involved with Ruger when it was a really like you know,

964
00:52:24,080 --> 00:52:26,919
Speaker 1: male dominating industry and just taking that chance and being like, yeah, yeah,

965
00:52:26,920 --> 00:52:28,960
Speaker 1: I'll go for it, and and being really successful at it.

966
00:52:28,960 --> 00:52:32,200
Speaker 1: I think that's admirable. Absolutely. I agree with who Matt said,

967
00:52:32,200 --> 00:52:35,279
Speaker 1: the opportunity, the season, the opportunity. I imagine that they

968
00:52:35,320 --> 00:52:38,400
Speaker 1: had become very good at that. She stayed though, even

969
00:52:38,440 --> 00:52:40,399
Speaker 1: through the Hollywood thing. It was cool that she still

970
00:52:40,600 --> 00:52:42,799
Speaker 1: was just come back and drag around lion hunting, and

971
00:52:42,960 --> 00:52:45,600
Speaker 1: you know, she didn't move to Hollywood and flapping us,

972
00:52:45,640 --> 00:52:47,160
Speaker 1: you know, right off into the sunset. She kind of

973
00:52:47,239 --> 00:52:49,279
Speaker 1: kept her roots through it all. I thought it was

974
00:52:49,360 --> 00:52:52,200
Speaker 1: kind of cool. You can't take time off. There's always

975
00:52:52,200 --> 00:52:55,520
Speaker 1: work to do, especially in that environment. They teach you

976
00:52:55,560 --> 00:52:58,359
Speaker 1: that in l a, No, they teach you that. I mean,

977
00:52:58,360 --> 00:53:01,560
Speaker 1: I have a bunch of pens and ranchers, So I

978
00:53:01,600 --> 00:53:04,840
Speaker 1: admire the work effort and the I mean I like working.

979
00:53:05,040 --> 00:53:08,720
Speaker 1: I think it's admirable to how to pursuit and become

980
00:53:08,719 --> 00:53:11,680
Speaker 1: good at it and be very consistent. Consistency is everything

981
00:53:11,680 --> 00:53:14,000
Speaker 1: in life. If you're consistent, you'll find your own success.

982
00:53:14,360 --> 00:53:18,040
Speaker 1: Success is such a perverse word now, I mean we

983
00:53:18,040 --> 00:53:20,480
Speaker 1: we should be able to find success in everything, even small,

984
00:53:20,560 --> 00:53:22,960
Speaker 1: even big, And we shouldn't compare our success to others

985
00:53:23,280 --> 00:53:26,719
Speaker 1: because then you'll never understand true happiness. I fall the

986
00:53:26,800 --> 00:53:28,719
Speaker 1: victim to that too, right, I think we all do

987
00:53:28,920 --> 00:53:32,200
Speaker 1: in the sense of the modern environment. But however, I

988
00:53:32,200 --> 00:53:35,040
Speaker 1: think they know to be successful every day they need

989
00:53:35,080 --> 00:53:37,240
Speaker 1: to get up all right. This well needs to be fixed,

990
00:53:37,239 --> 00:53:39,080
Speaker 1: that fence needs to be fixed. I need to get

991
00:53:39,080 --> 00:53:40,920
Speaker 1: my mules out here, or whatever they need to do.

992
00:53:41,000 --> 00:53:43,040
Speaker 1: It's not a lifestyle I would want to live, but

993
00:53:43,080 --> 00:53:46,680
Speaker 1: I admire it greatly. You know what Warner said that

994
00:53:46,840 --> 00:53:49,640
Speaker 1: stuck with me more than anything. It was right at

995
00:53:49,680 --> 00:53:52,000
Speaker 1: the end of the episode, and it hit me like

996
00:53:52,040 --> 00:53:55,600
Speaker 1: a pile of rocks. It spoke to me, probably because

997
00:53:55,640 --> 00:53:58,799
Speaker 1: of the headspace I've been in lately. But you said

998
00:53:58,840 --> 00:54:01,280
Speaker 1: something along the lines, you know, what's what's the secret

999
00:54:01,360 --> 00:54:04,239
Speaker 1: to the good life or something like that. And he

1000
00:54:04,320 --> 00:54:06,560
Speaker 1: sat there, I think he chuckled, and he said, you

1001
00:54:06,600 --> 00:54:09,720
Speaker 1: know what, it's just to not worry about so many things.

1002
00:54:10,080 --> 00:54:12,279
Speaker 1: There's just not a lot of things worth worrying too

1003
00:54:12,360 --> 00:54:15,680
Speaker 1: much about in life, you know. He went on a

1004
00:54:15,680 --> 00:54:19,320
Speaker 1: little bit from there about the simple things are often

1005
00:54:19,360 --> 00:54:21,960
Speaker 1: what matter the most, and getting all wound up about

1006
00:54:21,960 --> 00:54:24,759
Speaker 1: all the others it's just a quick way to get

1007
00:54:25,160 --> 00:54:27,920
Speaker 1: stressed out and and worried and lose sight of the

1008
00:54:27,960 --> 00:54:30,759
Speaker 1: good stuff. And I'm, you know, so guilty of that

1009
00:54:30,920 --> 00:54:35,520
Speaker 1: so often, over worrying, overthinking, etcetera, etcetera. And it was

1010
00:54:35,640 --> 00:54:37,680
Speaker 1: just it was just like the thing that I needed

1011
00:54:37,680 --> 00:54:39,879
Speaker 1: to hear after you have six days of stressing about

1012
00:54:39,880 --> 00:54:43,239
Speaker 1: this thing, stressing about that thing, and uh, and yeah,

1013
00:54:43,239 --> 00:54:45,040
Speaker 1: I mean so much of our lives, whether we worry

1014
00:54:45,080 --> 00:54:48,879
Speaker 1: about financial success, worrying about career success, worrying about how

1015
00:54:48,880 --> 00:54:51,600
Speaker 1: many points are kids gonna score in the basketball game,

1016
00:54:51,719 --> 00:54:53,840
Speaker 1: or worry about am I gonna do this in a

1017
00:54:53,880 --> 00:54:55,960
Speaker 1: way that these people will thinks right, or that these

1018
00:54:55,960 --> 00:54:59,160
Speaker 1: people will will like or whatever, and so much of

1019
00:54:59,200 --> 00:55:01,600
Speaker 1: it's so trivial, and people don't care about most of

1020
00:55:01,600 --> 00:55:04,239
Speaker 1: the other things. We build these these false idols in

1021
00:55:04,239 --> 00:55:06,799
Speaker 1: our mind of of what matters or what other people

1022
00:55:06,800 --> 00:55:09,560
Speaker 1: will think about us, and and all we're doing is

1023
00:55:09,560 --> 00:55:14,080
Speaker 1: is perpetuating our own misery. And Uh, if we could

1024
00:55:14,080 --> 00:55:16,720
Speaker 1: all live like Warner a little bit more, not worry

1025
00:55:16,719 --> 00:55:19,840
Speaker 1: about as much, focus on a few important things, do

1026
00:55:19,920 --> 00:55:22,560
Speaker 1: them well, do them right, be there with your family,

1027
00:55:23,040 --> 00:55:26,919
Speaker 1: and enjoy it all for what it is. Man. That's

1028
00:55:26,960 --> 00:55:30,080
Speaker 1: that's how you get to eighty five and be riding

1029
00:55:30,520 --> 00:55:33,680
Speaker 1: hundred and seventy five thousand miles in a lifetime and

1030
00:55:33,800 --> 00:55:36,640
Speaker 1: killing lions and just finding what you love and doing

1031
00:55:36,640 --> 00:55:38,960
Speaker 1: it and doing it well, and let the chips fall

1032
00:55:38,960 --> 00:55:41,760
Speaker 1: where they may on everything else. You know that statement

1033
00:55:41,800 --> 00:55:43,760
Speaker 1: that Warner made. I'm glad you brought that up, because

1034
00:55:43,760 --> 00:55:45,759
Speaker 1: I've thought about that a lot since I was there

1035
00:55:45,800 --> 00:55:49,480
Speaker 1: with him, because somebody else could have said that and

1036
00:55:49,880 --> 00:55:52,880
Speaker 1: it would have just been like a cliche answer. But

1037
00:55:52,960 --> 00:55:55,920
Speaker 1: I knew when he said it he meant and he

1038
00:55:55,960 --> 00:55:57,680
Speaker 1: even said that, he said, it's really hard to do.

1039
00:55:57,840 --> 00:56:00,520
Speaker 1: He said, it's hard not to worry about stuff. Yeah,

1040
00:56:00,560 --> 00:56:04,480
Speaker 1: and I've analyze that because it's it's it is very hard.

1041
00:56:04,840 --> 00:56:06,719
Speaker 1: I think everybody worries. I mean like I have a

1042
00:56:06,719 --> 00:56:08,560
Speaker 1: really good life. I feel like I have a really

1043
00:56:08,600 --> 00:56:11,640
Speaker 1: stable life. I worry about stuff. I mean that would

1044
00:56:11,680 --> 00:56:14,560
Speaker 1: be like something and somebody could be like, what are

1045
00:56:14,560 --> 00:56:16,680
Speaker 1: you worrying about? You know, you got a good family,

1046
00:56:16,719 --> 00:56:19,680
Speaker 1: you got a good job, you got this We human nature.

1047
00:56:20,520 --> 00:56:24,759
Speaker 1: Human nature is to worry about stuff. And I think

1048
00:56:24,800 --> 00:56:27,040
Speaker 1: it's point, and I think it would be backed by

1049
00:56:27,320 --> 00:56:31,640
Speaker 1: modern science, is that anxiety and worry is probably one

1050
00:56:31,680 --> 00:56:35,560
Speaker 1: of the biggest health risks that we have long term.

1051
00:56:35,800 --> 00:56:39,480
Speaker 1: It's just this weight on us that is about us

1052
00:56:39,719 --> 00:56:42,480
Speaker 1: all the time. It definitely does not help you live

1053
00:56:42,560 --> 00:56:45,880
Speaker 1: long time. The anxiety will take years off your life.

1054
00:56:46,400 --> 00:56:48,799
Speaker 1: What I what I've thought about how to deal with

1055
00:56:48,800 --> 00:56:50,680
Speaker 1: that stuff is like, think about all the stuff you

1056
00:56:50,719 --> 00:56:54,239
Speaker 1: worry about and then think about the resolution of that thing,

1057
00:56:54,440 --> 00:56:56,720
Speaker 1: whether he would it would even be like a year later,

1058
00:56:56,960 --> 00:57:00,279
Speaker 1: do you a year from now, will you remember the

1059
00:57:00,400 --> 00:57:04,480
Speaker 1: worry about the Deer Culture film? You know what I mean? Like,

1060
00:57:04,560 --> 00:57:07,239
Speaker 1: so it's like, can you skip the middleman and just say,

1061
00:57:07,280 --> 00:57:09,239
Speaker 1: you know what, I'm just gonna try the best I can.

1062
00:57:09,719 --> 00:57:11,920
Speaker 1: I'm gonna hunt as hard as I can for the

1063
00:57:12,040 --> 00:57:14,880
Speaker 1: three days every place I've got and like skip the

1064
00:57:14,880 --> 00:57:18,200
Speaker 1: middleman of worry. Yeah, you know there's two. There's yet

1065
00:57:18,280 --> 00:57:21,240
Speaker 1: it's hard. There's two things that I've I've found picked

1066
00:57:21,280 --> 00:57:23,919
Speaker 1: up from folks that I've found helpful kind of exercises

1067
00:57:23,920 --> 00:57:25,840
Speaker 1: of sorts that can kind of help snap you out

1068
00:57:25,880 --> 00:57:29,120
Speaker 1: of that thinking. So one thing's known as fear setting.

1069
00:57:29,520 --> 00:57:31,920
Speaker 1: You ever heard of fear setting? So you look at

1070
00:57:31,920 --> 00:57:33,920
Speaker 1: a situation. Let's say I'm stressed out because I don't

1071
00:57:33,920 --> 00:57:36,360
Speaker 1: think I'm gonna kill a buck on this hunt, and

1072
00:57:36,440 --> 00:57:38,240
Speaker 1: this episode is gonna suck and my show is not

1073
00:57:38,240 --> 00:57:40,720
Speaker 1: gonna do all of that. So fear setting would be

1074
00:57:40,760 --> 00:57:42,960
Speaker 1: where you think, Okay, there's this thing you're worried about.

1075
00:57:43,440 --> 00:57:45,720
Speaker 1: What's the worst case scenario, Like you've played all the

1076
00:57:45,720 --> 00:57:47,760
Speaker 1: potential scenarios of what could happen here, Like, what's the

1077
00:57:47,760 --> 00:57:49,360
Speaker 1: worst thing that could happen? All? Right, So let's say

1078
00:57:49,360 --> 00:57:51,120
Speaker 1: I don't kill a buck and I'm allows the TV

1079
00:57:51,200 --> 00:57:53,720
Speaker 1: show host and the show doesn't do good and nobody

1080
00:57:53,720 --> 00:57:56,800
Speaker 1: likes it. What's the worst thing that happens? Well, maybe

1081
00:57:56,800 --> 00:57:59,560
Speaker 1: the show tanks and I don't do shows anymore, and

1082
00:58:00,080 --> 00:58:01,920
Speaker 1: I have to go do some other stuff. I do podcasts,

1083
00:58:01,960 --> 00:58:04,160
Speaker 1: or I write books or I whatever is that that

1084
00:58:04,200 --> 00:58:06,160
Speaker 1: bad is at the end of the world. Still got

1085
00:58:06,200 --> 00:58:08,560
Speaker 1: amazing family, still got a job, still get to do

1086
00:58:08,640 --> 00:58:11,680
Speaker 1: fun things. Like you just look and oftentimes the things

1087
00:58:11,720 --> 00:58:14,360
Speaker 1: you worry about are so silly and trivial, and the

1088
00:58:14,440 --> 00:58:17,520
Speaker 1: absolute worst case scenario isn't even that bad. So all

1089
00:58:17,560 --> 00:58:19,080
Speaker 1: of a sudden you say, Okay, can I live with

1090
00:58:19,120 --> 00:58:21,800
Speaker 1: that outcome? Yeah, I'd be fine. It's not that big

1091
00:58:21,800 --> 00:58:24,120
Speaker 1: of a deal. The other thing is the perspective shifting,

1092
00:58:24,120 --> 00:58:26,760
Speaker 1: where I just think about something that actually matters. So

1093
00:58:26,800 --> 00:58:29,000
Speaker 1: anytime I'm stressed out or worried about something, or if

1094
00:58:29,000 --> 00:58:31,440
Speaker 1: I make a dumb mistake, the quickest way I've found

1095
00:58:31,440 --> 00:58:33,760
Speaker 1: to snap myself out of it is all right, let's

1096
00:58:33,760 --> 00:58:36,360
Speaker 1: say I miss a deer or a wounded deer, or

1097
00:58:36,440 --> 00:58:40,320
Speaker 1: I don't kill a deer, I flunk of whatever, And

1098
00:58:40,400 --> 00:58:43,480
Speaker 1: that bitter pill is hard to swallow. I'm sitting there

1099
00:58:43,480 --> 00:58:46,400
Speaker 1: wallowing in it. If I can remember to just like

1100
00:58:46,480 --> 00:58:48,920
Speaker 1: look at a picture of my kids or just call

1101
00:58:49,040 --> 00:58:51,880
Speaker 1: the boys like something like that, Right, there's like, man,

1102
00:58:51,920 --> 00:58:55,240
Speaker 1: all the other stuff is nothing compared to this. And

1103
00:58:55,240 --> 00:58:57,480
Speaker 1: if you can just shift your perspective to to the

1104
00:58:57,600 --> 00:59:01,200
Speaker 1: core the very most important things, you realize, Wow, I

1105
00:59:01,200 --> 00:59:05,800
Speaker 1: would sacrifice everything else, just as he'll have that, my sons,

1106
00:59:05,840 --> 00:59:10,200
Speaker 1: my family. So those two things are little tools that

1107
00:59:10,240 --> 00:59:12,840
Speaker 1: have helped me a lot, because I would be so

1108
00:59:12,960 --> 00:59:16,960
Speaker 1: susceptible to I am just like my natural personality type.

1109
00:59:17,160 --> 00:59:19,840
Speaker 1: I think success. I'm sorry, failure is not an option

1110
00:59:19,880 --> 00:59:21,920
Speaker 1: for you. I think, no matter what, you will find

1111
00:59:22,600 --> 00:59:25,000
Speaker 1: how to turn some into success. You've been doing this

1112
00:59:25,040 --> 00:59:28,400
Speaker 1: for a long time. You have that mentality. I think

1113
00:59:28,440 --> 00:59:30,960
Speaker 1: a lot of us here do we. We don't allow

1114
00:59:31,440 --> 00:59:34,680
Speaker 1: this idea of failure to be an exit point, because

1115
00:59:34,680 --> 00:59:41,560
Speaker 1: that's giving up is a terminal illness, you know. So yes,

1116
00:59:41,800 --> 00:59:43,360
Speaker 1: not planning, it will be planned B. If not B,

1117
00:59:43,520 --> 00:59:46,440
Speaker 1: we'll find us see adapted, see then D. I think

1118
00:59:46,480 --> 00:59:49,000
Speaker 1: you're very good at adapting. And it's there's nothing wrong

1119
00:59:49,040 --> 00:59:52,800
Speaker 1: with feeling bad. It's helpful to feel bad. Otherwise how

1120
00:59:52,800 --> 00:59:55,320
Speaker 1: do you gauge what feels good? As long as you

1121
00:59:55,320 --> 00:59:57,840
Speaker 1: can turn that bad feeling into a problem solving, And

1122
00:59:57,880 --> 01:00:02,240
Speaker 1: you're a really good problem solvering, Mark, I mean you too, Clay.

1123
01:00:02,880 --> 01:00:05,600
Speaker 1: I think everybody here's the otherwise who wouldn't be here.

1124
01:00:05,640 --> 01:00:07,600
Speaker 1: I get a question for you, So you got to

1125
01:00:07,640 --> 01:00:09,200
Speaker 1: spend some time with him and his family. You were

1126
01:00:09,200 --> 01:00:11,680
Speaker 1: there in person. Is there anything you took away from

1127
01:00:11,720 --> 01:00:13,600
Speaker 1: that spending time with him, learning from him that you

1128
01:00:13,600 --> 01:00:15,240
Speaker 1: would apply to your own life? Was there like a

1129
01:00:15,320 --> 01:00:19,960
Speaker 1: nugget or a lesson that you and I said this

1130
01:00:20,400 --> 01:00:24,240
Speaker 1: in less words on the on the podcast, I was

1131
01:00:24,360 --> 01:00:31,040
Speaker 1: impacted by by the demeanor of Warner Glenn's humility, and

1132
01:00:31,080 --> 01:00:33,919
Speaker 1: I think it partly was my expectation. I've never met

1133
01:00:33,920 --> 01:00:37,520
Speaker 1: the man before, western cowboy, dry ground, lion hunter, tough

1134
01:00:37,560 --> 01:00:41,960
Speaker 1: guy I expected, and I said this. I expected a

1135
01:00:42,960 --> 01:00:47,000
Speaker 1: proud man, not a bad man, not a pride full man,

1136
01:00:47,600 --> 01:00:50,440
Speaker 1: but just a guy that just was like I am

1137
01:00:50,440 --> 01:00:53,240
Speaker 1: who I am, and and what I saw was a

1138
01:00:53,320 --> 01:00:57,000
Speaker 1: humble man. And there were multiple things that happened, even

1139
01:00:57,120 --> 01:01:03,240
Speaker 1: off when we weren't recording, that made me think, like

1140
01:01:03,360 --> 01:01:05,760
Speaker 1: what I have responded that way one of them. And

1141
01:01:05,800 --> 01:01:10,760
Speaker 1: this sounds so small, but sometimes small stuff impact you.

1142
01:01:11,320 --> 01:01:13,480
Speaker 1: I asked him what color one of his mules were

1143
01:01:14,440 --> 01:01:17,280
Speaker 1: and he said, I'd call it strawberry run. And then

1144
01:01:17,280 --> 01:01:20,240
Speaker 1: he said, you're a mule man, what would you call her?

1145
01:01:20,480 --> 01:01:23,440
Speaker 1: And I just thought, that's a dumb question. I'm not

1146
01:01:23,480 --> 01:01:26,480
Speaker 1: a mule man. You're the mule man. And he was

1147
01:01:26,640 --> 01:01:31,240
Speaker 1: genuinely interested in what my interpretation of the color of

1148
01:01:31,280 --> 01:01:33,120
Speaker 1: this mule that he'd had on his farm for the

1149
01:01:33,200 --> 01:01:36,440
Speaker 1: last fifteen years. And I guess just right where I'm

1150
01:01:36,480 --> 01:01:40,640
Speaker 1: at in my life, I was I have worked on

1151
01:01:41,600 --> 01:01:46,200
Speaker 1: boldness and confidence as a as a thing, moving out

1152
01:01:46,200 --> 01:01:50,840
Speaker 1: of insecurity and fear, movement towards boldness and confidence, which

1153
01:01:50,880 --> 01:01:53,920
Speaker 1: if you swing the pendulum too far, you become arrogant

1154
01:01:54,680 --> 01:01:56,920
Speaker 1: and think you know it all. Here's this guy that

1155
01:01:57,120 --> 01:02:01,480
Speaker 1: should have did have boldness and confidence, but also had

1156
01:02:01,600 --> 01:02:04,800
Speaker 1: no problem with me, this young guy who doesn't know

1157
01:02:04,840 --> 01:02:08,400
Speaker 1: anything like telling him what color his mule was, that

1158
01:02:09,320 --> 01:02:12,840
Speaker 1: his humility impact the way carried himself. He deflected praise

1159
01:02:13,240 --> 01:02:16,400
Speaker 1: like I would say, hey, Malpi Borderland's group, you started this,

1160
01:02:16,520 --> 01:02:19,160
Speaker 1: you were this main guy, which he was. He totally

1161
01:02:19,200 --> 01:02:22,520
Speaker 1: deflected that. And and I see places in my life

1162
01:02:22,520 --> 01:02:27,040
Speaker 1: where I'm I'm not wanting to deflect praise. And that's

1163
01:02:27,040 --> 01:02:32,040
Speaker 1: the stuff that'll get inside of your heart and screw

1164
01:02:32,080 --> 01:02:35,720
Speaker 1: you over because it it you building a case for

1165
01:02:35,800 --> 01:02:40,160
Speaker 1: yourself that like I am something special, I mean, I

1166
01:02:40,560 --> 01:02:43,200
Speaker 1: am good at that, and and it's it's it's okay

1167
01:02:43,280 --> 01:02:44,760
Speaker 1: to be good at stuff, and it's okay to know

1168
01:02:44,880 --> 01:02:47,480
Speaker 1: your capacity and have that confidence of you know, I'm

1169
01:02:47,520 --> 01:02:50,880
Speaker 1: competent in this. But pride and confidence there's a fine

1170
01:02:50,920 --> 01:02:53,560
Speaker 1: line between it and I think, I think we can

1171
01:02:53,600 --> 01:02:56,680
Speaker 1: go we can go the wrong way. And what I

1172
01:02:56,680 --> 01:03:01,040
Speaker 1: saw in Warner Glenn was great Boltenson confidence, but also

1173
01:03:01,080 --> 01:03:03,080
Speaker 1: a deep humility. And again it goes It's one of

1174
01:03:03,120 --> 01:03:05,760
Speaker 1: those things that you could say the words that he said,

1175
01:03:06,240 --> 01:03:08,720
Speaker 1: and if it was connected back to a guy that really,

1176
01:03:08,800 --> 01:03:11,560
Speaker 1: deep in his heart was prideful, it wouldn't have impacted me.

1177
01:03:11,840 --> 01:03:15,880
Speaker 1: But I saw a humility inside of him. The real

1178
01:03:16,000 --> 01:03:19,920
Speaker 1: question is, Clay, what color did you think that mule was?

1179
01:03:20,520 --> 01:03:22,520
Speaker 1: I had no idea, and I told him, I said,

1180
01:03:22,560 --> 01:03:26,760
Speaker 1: I don't know, uh it was? He called a straw

1181
01:03:26,840 --> 01:03:30,480
Speaker 1: dre and I agreed with him, But I would not

1182
01:03:30,600 --> 01:03:36,120
Speaker 1: have Probably somebody more versed in the equine world would

1183
01:03:36,120 --> 01:03:37,880
Speaker 1: have been able to it was. It was kind of

1184
01:03:37,920 --> 01:03:41,320
Speaker 1: a reddish base color, but a lot of white dappled

1185
01:03:41,360 --> 01:03:43,840
Speaker 1: into it. So, yeah, do you have a photo of

1186
01:03:43,880 --> 01:03:46,640
Speaker 1: that mule, Yeah you should post it on Instagram and

1187
01:03:46,600 --> 01:03:50,040
Speaker 1: asked the world, Well, there's no need to, Warner told

1188
01:03:50,080 --> 01:03:52,800
Speaker 1: me it's strawberry rowan man. Well, I'm just curious. It's

1189
01:03:52,800 --> 01:03:55,600
Speaker 1: like their blue dress, black dress. Yeah, yeah, maybe people

1190
01:03:55,640 --> 01:03:59,360
Speaker 1: see different rays of color. Hey, um, what did you

1191
01:03:59,400 --> 01:04:02,960
Speaker 1: guys think of out Warner getting in the fight with

1192
01:04:03,000 --> 01:04:06,400
Speaker 1: a border patrol agent. I think that is a amazing

1193
01:04:06,440 --> 01:04:09,280
Speaker 1: story and that that happens now that person would never

1194
01:04:09,280 --> 01:04:12,080
Speaker 1: see a lot of date again. And and that's kind

1195
01:04:12,080 --> 01:04:15,480
Speaker 1: of sad because it was a personal, interpersonal conflict between

1196
01:04:15,480 --> 01:04:19,480
Speaker 1: two people who had had history together. And sometimes something

1197
01:04:19,560 --> 01:04:22,080
Speaker 1: so simple like that could could just relieve a bunch

1198
01:04:22,120 --> 01:04:25,280
Speaker 1: of stress or de escalate in a weird sense, in

1199
01:04:25,280 --> 01:04:28,120
Speaker 1: in in a different environment, it could be a disc

1200
01:04:28,160 --> 01:04:32,360
Speaker 1: deescalating scenario instead of an escalating one, you know, where

1201
01:04:32,440 --> 01:04:35,240
Speaker 1: verbally they could have been assaulting each other, and maybe

1202
01:04:35,240 --> 01:04:37,640
Speaker 1: for the type of people they were, it would have

1203
01:04:37,640 --> 01:04:40,600
Speaker 1: been much worse. So you're saying like this like solved

1204
01:04:40,640 --> 01:04:45,160
Speaker 1: the problem they had. I think it should have been Okay, okay,

1205
01:04:45,320 --> 01:04:47,560
Speaker 1: like no, no, no, I'm not saying that's said. It

1206
01:04:47,680 --> 01:04:51,280
Speaker 1: sounds like they had a relationship that was escalating towards that,

1207
01:04:52,080 --> 01:04:54,880
Speaker 1: and I think they were both consenting to that kind

1208
01:04:54,880 --> 01:04:58,200
Speaker 1: of relationship. They could have definitely solved it just by

1209
01:04:58,400 --> 01:05:02,120
Speaker 1: behaving differently, but neither of them at that time wanted to.

1210
01:05:02,760 --> 01:05:05,560
Speaker 1: So that's what I perceived that the details of the

1211
01:05:05,600 --> 01:05:07,720
Speaker 1: story were this we we didn't get into the actual

1212
01:05:07,760 --> 01:05:11,600
Speaker 1: details of the story. So this is like big open country.

1213
01:05:12,520 --> 01:05:14,400
Speaker 1: They use that phrase, but it's true, it's just big

1214
01:05:14,440 --> 01:05:17,640
Speaker 1: open country. Well, they have roads through the farm, and

1215
01:05:17,880 --> 01:05:20,720
Speaker 1: one of these roads had a gate on it that

1216
01:05:20,920 --> 01:05:25,720
Speaker 1: just inhibited vehicular traffic on the road, just so somebody

1217
01:05:25,720 --> 01:05:28,160
Speaker 1: that's not supposed to be there could just drive down

1218
01:05:28,200 --> 01:05:30,400
Speaker 1: the road. So it wasn't keeping cattle out at what

1219
01:05:30,400 --> 01:05:33,440
Speaker 1: wasn't doing anything. Well, Warner goes to his gate and

1220
01:05:33,480 --> 01:05:36,920
Speaker 1: he sees that someone has driven around the gate and

1221
01:05:37,000 --> 01:05:41,160
Speaker 1: driven on the road, and he sees tire tracks on

1222
01:05:41,200 --> 01:05:43,880
Speaker 1: his grass, and out there, grass is a very valued

1223
01:05:43,920 --> 01:05:47,360
Speaker 1: commodity for cattle, and so he's like, somebody drove on

1224
01:05:47,440 --> 01:05:51,200
Speaker 1: my grass. And he had actually, like some time before,

1225
01:05:51,800 --> 01:05:54,160
Speaker 1: had talked to the border patrol because they come on

1226
01:05:54,280 --> 01:05:56,920
Speaker 1: his land freely constantly because of where he lives on

1227
01:05:56,960 --> 01:06:00,120
Speaker 1: the border, and he had told he had seen so

1228
01:06:00,480 --> 01:06:03,120
Speaker 1: two or three much prior, he'd seen tracks. Just driving

1229
01:06:03,120 --> 01:06:06,040
Speaker 1: through one of his fields, he sees a Border patrol

1230
01:06:06,080 --> 01:06:08,720
Speaker 1: agent and he says, hey, I saw some strange tracks

1231
01:06:08,720 --> 01:06:11,600
Speaker 1: in my field. And the guy goes it was me,

1232
01:06:11,840 --> 01:06:15,720
Speaker 1: and Warner goes, hey, no problem. Do you mind next

1233
01:06:15,760 --> 01:06:18,520
Speaker 1: time trying to stay on the road, and the guy

1234
01:06:18,560 --> 01:06:20,919
Speaker 1: this is a different guy than he fought. The guy says,

1235
01:06:20,960 --> 01:06:24,320
Speaker 1: no problem, I'm sorry, it was a mistake. Two months later,

1236
01:06:24,520 --> 01:06:27,360
Speaker 1: Warner goes to this gate. He sees tracks going around

1237
01:06:27,360 --> 01:06:30,360
Speaker 1: the gate, which they had a key to the gate,

1238
01:06:30,680 --> 01:06:32,360
Speaker 1: so they could have just unlocked the gate and went

1239
01:06:32,400 --> 01:06:37,400
Speaker 1: through it. This new Border patrol agent says, yeah, it

1240
01:06:37,480 --> 01:06:40,920
Speaker 1: was me. I drove around the gate. That's how it started.

1241
01:06:41,000 --> 01:06:44,760
Speaker 1: And then Warner's like, well, sir, you have a key.

1242
01:06:44,960 --> 01:06:46,720
Speaker 1: I have given you permission to come on my land.

1243
01:06:47,040 --> 01:06:49,600
Speaker 1: As the cattle rancher, I've asked you not to drive

1244
01:06:49,640 --> 01:06:51,440
Speaker 1: on my grass. That's the way I make a living.

1245
01:06:52,280 --> 01:06:54,280
Speaker 1: And then the guy spouts off and goes, I can

1246
01:06:54,320 --> 01:06:57,080
Speaker 1: do whatever I want. I misunderstood that story. I thought

1247
01:06:57,080 --> 01:06:59,480
Speaker 1: it was the same guy. I thought it was a

1248
01:07:00,280 --> 01:07:04,160
Speaker 1: conflict that had It's a conflict, was just with the

1249
01:07:04,280 --> 01:07:07,960
Speaker 1: agency driving on his land. But so there was a

1250
01:07:08,000 --> 01:07:10,800
Speaker 1: couple of guys that were like no, just like absolutely, sir,

1251
01:07:11,240 --> 01:07:14,480
Speaker 1: our fault are bad. This guy came in with an

1252
01:07:14,520 --> 01:07:17,680
Speaker 1: attitude and was like, I can do whatever I want

1253
01:07:17,760 --> 01:07:20,120
Speaker 1: on your land because I'm who I am and I

1254
01:07:20,240 --> 01:07:23,720
Speaker 1: wear this uniform. And that's that's what made Warner mad. Okay,

1255
01:07:23,720 --> 01:07:26,640
Speaker 1: I miss interest to the story. I retract my statement. Well,

1256
01:07:26,720 --> 01:07:29,680
Speaker 1: I think I think it could your statements still made

1257
01:07:29,680 --> 01:07:31,480
Speaker 1: sense to me. Well, I just feel like it's it's

1258
01:07:31,560 --> 01:07:37,520
Speaker 1: dangerous because what happened is Warner had conflict with organization

1259
01:07:37,560 --> 01:07:41,439
Speaker 1: of people, and this man, for whatever reason, triggered that

1260
01:07:41,840 --> 01:07:44,720
Speaker 1: nagative energy. I don't think you should be disrespectful when

1261
01:07:44,720 --> 01:07:47,200
Speaker 1: he's allowing you it's private land, he's allowing you to

1262
01:07:47,240 --> 01:07:50,800
Speaker 1: take access, and he's been so generous to you. I

1263
01:07:50,840 --> 01:07:53,120
Speaker 1: think there's there's other ways of doing things, and I

1264
01:07:53,120 --> 01:07:54,720
Speaker 1: don't want to hate somebody. I don't think that's a

1265
01:07:54,840 --> 01:07:56,400
Speaker 1: very nice thing. I don't think he thought it was

1266
01:07:56,400 --> 01:07:58,440
Speaker 1: a nice thing either, but he he could just been

1267
01:07:58,480 --> 01:08:00,840
Speaker 1: having a bad day. I struggle a little bit with

1268
01:08:00,880 --> 01:08:02,600
Speaker 1: putting it in there because it's it's not like we

1269
01:08:02,680 --> 01:08:05,200
Speaker 1: want to like highlight and say someone's a hero for

1270
01:08:05,320 --> 01:08:08,480
Speaker 1: beating up a law enforcement guy. That's actually the opposite.

1271
01:08:08,640 --> 01:08:11,680
Speaker 1: It's the opposite of everything. It's the opposite of what

1272
01:08:11,720 --> 01:08:14,880
Speaker 1: I'm saying about Warner Glenn being a humble man. That

1273
01:08:15,000 --> 01:08:18,519
Speaker 1: is the opposite of humility. It's also the opposite of

1274
01:08:18,960 --> 01:08:22,000
Speaker 1: just in general. You're not gonna want to do that

1275
01:08:22,040 --> 01:08:24,120
Speaker 1: in your life. I don't mean interrupt, but I was

1276
01:08:24,120 --> 01:08:27,240
Speaker 1: gonna say what I think showcase. What you're speaking of, though,

1277
01:08:27,560 --> 01:08:30,320
Speaker 1: is how he processed what happened and how he spoke

1278
01:08:30,360 --> 01:08:32,679
Speaker 1: to you about it afterwards, and the fact that he said,

1279
01:08:32,680 --> 01:08:34,920
Speaker 1: you know what, Yeah, I gotta I had to own it.

1280
01:08:35,120 --> 01:08:37,639
Speaker 1: I took my I took my lumps. I made a mistake.

1281
01:08:38,760 --> 01:08:41,439
Speaker 1: I became better for it. You know knows he shouldn't

1282
01:08:41,439 --> 01:08:43,479
Speaker 1: have done it. Now he's hot in the moment. Think

1283
01:08:43,520 --> 01:08:47,400
Speaker 1: about all the different options I think, really in your

1284
01:08:47,400 --> 01:08:50,280
Speaker 1: life with the people that you know and somebody, let

1285
01:08:50,360 --> 01:08:52,960
Speaker 1: me just get okay. Option like, there's different endings for

1286
01:08:53,000 --> 01:08:55,479
Speaker 1: this book. The book to this point goes to Warner

1287
01:08:55,479 --> 01:08:59,000
Speaker 1: Glenn getting in the fist fight and sure enough, rubbing

1288
01:08:59,040 --> 01:09:00,960
Speaker 1: his face in the dirt. Did you like do you

1289
01:09:01,000 --> 01:09:02,439
Speaker 1: like how he said that. I thought it was real

1290
01:09:02,479 --> 01:09:04,920
Speaker 1: cowboy way to say it. He was just like I

1291
01:09:05,000 --> 01:09:07,960
Speaker 1: put his face in the dirt. He's he so Option

1292
01:09:08,080 --> 01:09:12,559
Speaker 1: one is he gets in trouble, he defends himself to

1293
01:09:12,640 --> 01:09:15,320
Speaker 1: the point of like I was justified in this. I

1294
01:09:15,320 --> 01:09:18,559
Speaker 1: don't care what you say, and he becomes bitter the

1295
01:09:18,640 --> 01:09:22,040
Speaker 1: rest of his life at the at the Feds, and

1296
01:09:22,360 --> 01:09:25,640
Speaker 1: that bitterness would translate into him giving them trouble for

1297
01:09:25,680 --> 01:09:28,439
Speaker 1: the next eighty years of his life. He stays up

1298
01:09:28,479 --> 01:09:30,960
Speaker 1: at night thinking about ways that he's gonna stick it

1299
01:09:31,000 --> 01:09:34,560
Speaker 1: to the Border Patrol. That would be a very likely response.

1300
01:09:34,760 --> 01:09:37,160
Speaker 1: I mean, think about it, some old cowboy out in

1301
01:09:37,160 --> 01:09:41,160
Speaker 1: the desert. That is a very real possibility. And then

1302
01:09:41,680 --> 01:09:44,559
Speaker 1: maybe there's just two endings. The other ending is the

1303
01:09:44,600 --> 01:09:47,640
Speaker 1: guy going, I made a mistake. This guy was you know,

1304
01:09:47,760 --> 01:09:50,120
Speaker 1: the guy was in the wrong. Sure in this individual

1305
01:09:50,200 --> 01:09:53,080
Speaker 1: little sector. This guy, yeah, I was probably a punk,

1306
01:09:53,479 --> 01:09:56,880
Speaker 1: but it was a mistake and he wasn't embittered against

1307
01:09:56,880 --> 01:09:59,360
Speaker 1: the Border Patrol. He has a great relationship with the

1308
01:09:59,400 --> 01:10:02,040
Speaker 1: Border Patrol. But his ability to bounce back from doing

1309
01:10:02,080 --> 01:10:05,120
Speaker 1: something wrong, which that is a human trait that is

1310
01:10:05,760 --> 01:10:09,360
Speaker 1: highly is a very valuable trait because everybody's gonna mess

1311
01:10:09,360 --> 01:10:11,360
Speaker 1: stuff up so much. Your life is not getting it

1312
01:10:11,439 --> 01:10:13,320
Speaker 1: right every time, But how you're gonna respond when you

1313
01:10:13,360 --> 01:10:18,600
Speaker 1: do something wrong, because man, bitterness is like the And

1314
01:10:18,640 --> 01:10:22,320
Speaker 1: I think that's part of what maybe Warner was insinuating

1315
01:10:22,439 --> 01:10:24,200
Speaker 1: talking about when the first thing that came out of

1316
01:10:24,200 --> 01:10:25,960
Speaker 1: his mouth when I asked him what's the secret to

1317
01:10:26,000 --> 01:10:28,679
Speaker 1: having a good life, he said, don't worry about stuff.

1318
01:10:28,960 --> 01:10:32,000
Speaker 1: I think that could be. I think people sometimes become

1319
01:10:32,080 --> 01:10:36,760
Speaker 1: embittered or fearful or hurt in some way by real

1320
01:10:36,840 --> 01:10:40,320
Speaker 1: negative interactions. But to be able to take that, grow

1321
01:10:40,400 --> 01:10:43,639
Speaker 1: from it, learn from it. And then sometimes I think

1322
01:10:43,680 --> 01:10:47,800
Speaker 1: in somebody's life, maybe the conclusion that you come to

1323
01:10:48,240 --> 01:10:52,240
Speaker 1: isn't always as direct in the person's mind. But in

1324
01:10:52,320 --> 01:10:55,439
Speaker 1: the book there's a book written about Warner Glind called

1325
01:10:55,680 --> 01:10:58,200
Speaker 1: Warner Glind The Life and Times of an American Cowboy,

1326
01:10:58,240 --> 01:11:01,960
Speaker 1: I think is what it is called. The author, Ed Ashurst,

1327
01:11:02,120 --> 01:11:06,400
Speaker 1: is the one who made the conclusion that that interaction

1328
01:11:07,000 --> 01:11:11,360
Speaker 1: when Warrener was forty seven years old, scripted the next well,

1329
01:11:11,400 --> 01:11:14,280
Speaker 1: you know now almost forty years later in his life.

1330
01:11:14,400 --> 01:11:18,880
Speaker 1: Because he became very skillful at dealing with people that

1331
01:11:18,920 --> 01:11:21,160
Speaker 1: were in opposition to him, which he said he used

1332
01:11:21,200 --> 01:11:23,439
Speaker 1: to have a really volatile temper. It was an inflection

1333
01:11:23,479 --> 01:11:27,160
Speaker 1: point for him, and I think maybe in Warner's you know,

1334
01:11:27,200 --> 01:11:30,439
Speaker 1: I mean, if you talk to him, you know, it's

1335
01:11:30,439 --> 01:11:33,080
Speaker 1: not like he probably was just like I will now

1336
01:11:33,240 --> 01:11:36,240
Speaker 1: change and become a great diplomat to the federal government.

1337
01:11:36,520 --> 01:11:42,200
Speaker 1: Like but it but it impacted him, and he he

1338
01:11:42,200 --> 01:11:45,439
Speaker 1: he became somebody that was very influential in that part

1339
01:11:45,439 --> 01:11:48,439
Speaker 1: of the world. And they were known for bringing together

1340
01:11:48,560 --> 01:11:52,280
Speaker 1: groups that hated each other and we're at odds with

1341
01:11:52,320 --> 01:11:57,120
Speaker 1: each other, bringing them in Manu. Guys like Warner, wherever

1342
01:11:57,400 --> 01:12:00,200
Speaker 1: they go, it seems like they bring stabil a the

1343
01:12:01,000 --> 01:12:05,320
Speaker 1: in peace just like just just just an ability to

1344
01:12:05,439 --> 01:12:07,639
Speaker 1: just like walking through it. Just like Warner, Glenn riding

1345
01:12:07,720 --> 01:12:12,400
Speaker 1: up on his you know, banditos carrying drugs across the border.

1346
01:12:13,320 --> 01:12:16,120
Speaker 1: Like he didn't get killed, He didn't the situation. You know,

1347
01:12:16,560 --> 01:12:19,240
Speaker 1: somebody could have gone to that and blew that situation up,

1348
01:12:19,600 --> 01:12:21,800
Speaker 1: pull their gun. What do you guys doing You got drugs? Er,

1349
01:12:21,840 --> 01:12:24,320
Speaker 1: I mean you freaked out or something or ran away

1350
01:12:24,400 --> 01:12:26,880
Speaker 1: or Warner just rides up on his meal and just

1351
01:12:26,920 --> 01:12:32,960
Speaker 1: like hey, you know, a lom. He goes got some drugs. Okay,

1352
01:12:33,040 --> 01:12:36,760
Speaker 1: well we're just lying hunting any line tracks ride past.

1353
01:12:36,800 --> 01:12:40,320
Speaker 1: It just just to deescalate the situation. So that's what

1354
01:12:40,400 --> 01:12:42,960
Speaker 1: he learned to do, which before maybe his his thing

1355
01:12:43,120 --> 01:12:45,080
Speaker 1: was to escalate it. It sounds to me like he's

1356
01:12:45,080 --> 01:12:47,320
Speaker 1: a really good leader, and it sounds like his daughter

1357
01:12:47,360 --> 01:12:51,200
Speaker 1: has acquired those skills from him. Did you get that

1358
01:12:51,280 --> 01:12:54,200
Speaker 1: impression when you were around them? Sure, Yeah, for sure,

1359
01:12:54,479 --> 01:12:57,320
Speaker 1: just hearing her talk about her father, or talking about

1360
01:12:57,520 --> 01:13:00,599
Speaker 1: the work or the activity s. They just felt like

1361
01:13:01,280 --> 01:13:07,720
Speaker 1: she really benefited from his his state of mind and

1362
01:13:07,720 --> 01:13:10,280
Speaker 1: it has learned a lot, And I think that's super attractive.

1363
01:13:10,360 --> 01:13:11,920
Speaker 1: I imagine he had a lot of miles in the

1364
01:13:11,920 --> 01:13:15,240
Speaker 1: saddle to think about and replay that whole experience, like

1365
01:13:15,320 --> 01:13:17,280
Speaker 1: with the agent, Like he's you know, when he's out

1366
01:13:17,400 --> 01:13:20,840
Speaker 1: riding the range and looking for lions, and I doubt

1367
01:13:20,840 --> 01:13:23,160
Speaker 1: he's got headphones on listening to the podcast. He's probably

1368
01:13:23,240 --> 01:13:28,000
Speaker 1: just reflecting on his life. Of course, he's obviously right

1369
01:13:28,000 --> 01:13:30,400
Speaker 1: now he's saying that, But yeah, I imagine he had

1370
01:13:30,439 --> 01:13:33,200
Speaker 1: a lot of alone time to really think about that,

1371
01:13:33,560 --> 01:13:35,560
Speaker 1: what impact that had on his life and how that

1372
01:13:35,600 --> 01:13:38,000
Speaker 1: could have gone in a lot of different ways, like

1373
01:13:38,080 --> 01:13:41,200
Speaker 1: just being able to sit quietly with yourself and reflect

1374
01:13:41,240 --> 01:13:44,200
Speaker 1: on that they're probably yeah, helped him come to that conclusion.

1375
01:13:44,760 --> 01:13:46,760
Speaker 1: I gotta kick out of how when he told his

1376
01:13:46,800 --> 01:13:50,040
Speaker 1: old man about the experience, So I can't do that

1377
01:13:50,080 --> 01:13:52,519
Speaker 1: to a law enforcement office. Yeah, yeah, you wonder you

1378
01:13:52,560 --> 01:13:54,960
Speaker 1: wonder where, like where that came from. He's like, wait,

1379
01:13:55,000 --> 01:13:59,080
Speaker 1: you can't, Like I thought that was I kept that

1380
01:13:59,120 --> 01:14:03,280
Speaker 1: in there so much. But I liked it because his

1381
01:14:03,400 --> 01:14:05,240
Speaker 1: dad took his side. You know, his dad could have

1382
01:14:05,280 --> 01:14:07,960
Speaker 1: been mad at him. Dad could have been like, Warner,

1383
01:14:08,120 --> 01:14:12,040
Speaker 1: you're jeopardizing our whole life. You could you know, he

1384
01:14:12,040 --> 01:14:13,880
Speaker 1: could have been he could have scolded it, and he

1385
01:14:13,880 --> 01:14:16,960
Speaker 1: could have. But his first response was to take the

1386
01:14:17,000 --> 01:14:20,120
Speaker 1: side of his son, which that could have gone either

1387
01:14:20,160 --> 01:14:22,400
Speaker 1: way too. I mean, it seems natural that you take

1388
01:14:22,439 --> 01:14:25,160
Speaker 1: the side of your son, but not necessarily. I thought

1389
01:14:25,160 --> 01:14:27,400
Speaker 1: it was his way of explaining to his son that

1390
01:14:27,479 --> 01:14:32,439
Speaker 1: it's okay. Yeah, in a very very nice, relaxed manner. Man,

1391
01:14:32,479 --> 01:14:34,880
Speaker 1: do you think there's some old retired Border Patrol agents

1392
01:14:34,880 --> 01:14:37,519
Speaker 1: It's like, oh, man, like father like son, Like Marvin's

1393
01:14:37,520 --> 01:14:40,200
Speaker 1: had a dust up before and he's like, probably not

1394
01:14:40,280 --> 01:14:43,759
Speaker 1: to throw shade on Marvin. I doubt that happened. But yeah, well, guys,

1395
01:14:44,160 --> 01:14:47,479
Speaker 1: thanks for thanks for being guests on the Burgers podcast.

1396
01:14:48,280 --> 01:14:50,800
Speaker 1: This has been good. You guys are like the astronauts

1397
01:14:50,800 --> 01:14:53,519
Speaker 1: gone to the moon. Thank you for having us. Thank

1398
01:14:53,520 --> 01:14:56,040
Speaker 1: you a million times for not only having us on

1399
01:14:56,040 --> 01:14:59,880
Speaker 1: the show, but having a secure family home, taking us

1400
01:15:00,000 --> 01:15:02,840
Speaker 1: out to your mountains, showing us the ropes. It's been

1401
01:15:02,880 --> 01:15:05,559
Speaker 1: a it's been a treat. Yeah, well, it's been a

1402
01:15:05,560 --> 01:15:10,400
Speaker 1: lot of fun. True shout out to Gary and Judy. Yeah,

1403
01:15:10,439 --> 01:15:14,559
Speaker 1: thanks as well. Yep, yep. If we'd had a seventh

1404
01:15:14,680 --> 01:15:17,679
Speaker 1: Mike or a night Mike, we'd had Judy and Gary

1405
01:15:17,800 --> 01:15:20,599
Speaker 1: on here with us. But next time, next time you

1406
01:15:20,640 --> 01:15:22,640
Speaker 1: really need to maybe you there to have because I

1407
01:15:22,640 --> 01:15:24,720
Speaker 1: haven't got to listen to all the render episodes, but

1408
01:15:25,800 --> 01:15:30,360
Speaker 1: the world needs to know about Gary's detail oriented white tail.

1409
01:15:30,479 --> 01:15:34,800
Speaker 1: Were you impressed? I was really impressed. Your dad is

1410
01:15:34,880 --> 01:15:37,599
Speaker 1: way more white tailed gear savvy than you are. Clay,

1411
01:15:37,880 --> 01:15:44,200
Speaker 1: Oh he's he's in it nuanced. Yeah yeah yeah, and say,

1412
01:15:44,280 --> 01:15:46,639
Speaker 1: oh man, we've we've now started a whole another segment

1413
01:15:46,680 --> 01:15:49,320
Speaker 1: of the podcast. I am the way I am because

1414
01:15:49,360 --> 01:15:51,200
Speaker 1: he's the way he is. You went the opposite direction,

1415
01:15:51,280 --> 01:15:54,680
Speaker 1: I really did. I will just lay out this illustration.

1416
01:15:54,760 --> 01:15:58,040
Speaker 1: This one simple thing told me so much about Clay.

1417
01:15:58,120 --> 01:16:00,559
Speaker 1: When we packed up camp to head into go hunting

1418
01:16:00,600 --> 01:16:03,759
Speaker 1: the mountains and he had his climbing sticks, they were loose,

1419
01:16:03,840 --> 01:16:06,720
Speaker 1: there were ropes everywhere, and he was just shoving individual

1420
01:16:06,800 --> 01:16:10,120
Speaker 1: single sticks into the pant hears of the horse. I'm thinking, man,

1421
01:16:10,600 --> 01:16:15,200
Speaker 1: is this how you operate? And so yeah, different strokes

1422
01:16:15,200 --> 01:16:17,040
Speaker 1: for different folks. And your dad as though, talking about

1423
01:16:17,040 --> 01:16:19,240
Speaker 1: how he's drilling his climbing sticks to reduce weight and

1424
01:16:19,280 --> 01:16:22,040
Speaker 1: he's using am steel ropes to be as quiet as possible,

1425
01:16:22,080 --> 01:16:24,559
Speaker 1: and discussing how he saw a photo of how I

1426
01:16:24,600 --> 01:16:26,559
Speaker 1: stacked my sticks on the back of my backpack and

1427
01:16:26,560 --> 01:16:28,400
Speaker 1: how envious it made him, and how he wanted to

1428
01:16:28,400 --> 01:16:33,439
Speaker 1: find new ways to organize his stack. Hey, yeah, I

1429
01:16:33,439 --> 01:16:35,400
Speaker 1: would say this in front of my dad. So this

1430
01:16:35,400 --> 01:16:39,439
Speaker 1: this is not like hiding something, but like his The

1431
01:16:39,520 --> 01:16:43,639
Speaker 1: way he handled hunting stressed me out as a kid

1432
01:16:44,000 --> 01:16:46,280
Speaker 1: because we we had to I mean it's classic father

1433
01:16:46,439 --> 01:16:49,639
Speaker 1: son stuff. We had to, you know, try to meet

1434
01:16:49,720 --> 01:16:52,840
Speaker 1: his standards for stuff, and it it stressed me out

1435
01:16:53,360 --> 01:16:56,240
Speaker 1: and So when I left the coupe, when I went

1436
01:16:56,280 --> 01:16:59,759
Speaker 1: to college and started hunting the own, I went into

1437
01:16:59,760 --> 01:17:03,000
Speaker 1: a season of life that my hunting was very shortened

1438
01:17:03,160 --> 01:17:05,360
Speaker 1: because I had a family and was trying to build

1439
01:17:05,400 --> 01:17:09,200
Speaker 1: a career in life. And I had to determine what

1440
01:17:09,240 --> 01:17:12,040
Speaker 1: were the limiting fact true limiting factors of my hunting.

1441
01:17:12,080 --> 01:17:14,320
Speaker 1: And I cut off a bunch of stuff. And I

1442
01:17:14,360 --> 01:17:16,880
Speaker 1: don't tell anybody, but I actually killed way more deer.

1443
01:17:17,680 --> 01:17:24,320
Speaker 1: All right, No one gets a rebuttal. Thank you guys,

1444
01:17:24,400 --> 01:17:27,599
Speaker 1: very good. Appreciate great week. Keep the wild place as

1445
01:17:27,600 --> 01:17:30,759
Speaker 1: wild because that's where the deer go through the saddles.