1 00:00:04,920 --> 00:00:08,039 Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha and welcome to Stephan 2 00:00:08,160 --> 00:00:19,439 Speaker 1: Never Told You production of I Heart Radio. It is 3 00:00:19,600 --> 00:00:22,919 Speaker 1: time for another edition of Female First, which means we 4 00:00:22,960 --> 00:00:25,599 Speaker 1: are once again joined by our good friend and co 5 00:00:25,680 --> 00:00:29,760 Speaker 1: worker Eves Hello. Eves Hello Hello. Told her the executive 6 00:00:29,760 --> 00:00:32,280 Speaker 1: producer now our boss, because I don't think we've mentioned 7 00:00:32,520 --> 00:00:39,199 Speaker 1: she is nobody. I don't love that going to be 8 00:00:39,520 --> 00:00:42,160 Speaker 1: She's out for real, for real, a part of the team. 9 00:00:42,280 --> 00:00:44,920 Speaker 1: She's the boss of the team. I love it. Yeah, 10 00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:48,519 Speaker 1: so these Female First have taken a different term. Look 11 00:00:48,520 --> 00:00:51,360 Speaker 1: at that. Look what's that? I'm just kidding. I'm just 12 00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:57,560 Speaker 1: We're yeah, we're thrilled to have you officially on the team. 13 00:00:57,760 --> 00:00:59,960 Speaker 1: Uh and also thrilled to have you on the show 14 00:01:00,240 --> 00:01:03,840 Speaker 1: as always. I'm excited to be here as always as well. 15 00:01:05,240 --> 00:01:09,920 Speaker 1: What's that beefs um? I'm drinking. I'm currently drinking green 16 00:01:09,959 --> 00:01:17,759 Speaker 1: tea with much in it. And that's the talk about 17 00:01:17,840 --> 00:01:20,120 Speaker 1: drinking tea like tea with the macho They're ready for 18 00:01:20,160 --> 00:01:22,640 Speaker 1: the day, like they're really kind of private, you know, 19 00:01:22,959 --> 00:01:25,880 Speaker 1: I mean, I've been up for a minute now, Um 20 00:01:25,880 --> 00:01:31,280 Speaker 1: it's the morning. But it's cool, you know. I love 21 00:01:31,319 --> 00:01:35,280 Speaker 1: when people say that because it feels like it's not cool. 22 00:01:35,400 --> 00:01:38,200 Speaker 1: Perhaps do I sound like I'm on fire? I mean 23 00:01:38,480 --> 00:01:40,440 Speaker 1: I was trying to be as I was trying to 24 00:01:40,480 --> 00:01:42,640 Speaker 1: hut that. Usually I'm pretty good at not showing when 25 00:01:42,680 --> 00:01:47,080 Speaker 1: like everything. I would agree with that easy. He's just 26 00:01:47,120 --> 00:01:53,000 Speaker 1: making a gesture of like explosion, like the fire. Everything's fine, 27 00:01:53,160 --> 00:01:56,000 Speaker 1: just fine. When I saw you take a sip, I 28 00:01:56,000 --> 00:01:57,680 Speaker 1: would had the moment of like she's doing the cover 29 00:01:57,800 --> 00:02:02,560 Speaker 1: with the frog tea moment. No, I really just do 30 00:02:02,680 --> 00:02:05,640 Speaker 1: like like drinking tea. So it's nice to have something, 31 00:02:06,200 --> 00:02:11,640 Speaker 1: something warm in my body while we're while we're talking. Yes, 32 00:02:12,040 --> 00:02:16,079 Speaker 1: and today you have once again bought someone who has 33 00:02:16,120 --> 00:02:21,359 Speaker 1: a fascinating story, absolutely fascinating. Can you tell us what 34 00:02:21,680 --> 00:02:24,880 Speaker 1: a woman we will be discussing today. Yeah, so we'll 35 00:02:24,919 --> 00:02:27,800 Speaker 1: be talking about Norah Holt, And yes, her life is 36 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:30,040 Speaker 1: super fascinating. I feel like she's got one of those 37 00:02:30,080 --> 00:02:34,680 Speaker 1: lives that feels larger than life, like so glamorous. So 38 00:02:35,639 --> 00:02:37,720 Speaker 1: I think one thing I was reading described her as 39 00:02:37,760 --> 00:02:40,840 Speaker 1: a quote unquote film fatale, you know, during a big 40 00:02:40,880 --> 00:02:44,200 Speaker 1: part of her life. But she was a composer, music critic, 41 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:47,480 Speaker 1: and a singer, and she was possibly the first Black 42 00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:50,360 Speaker 1: American to get a master's in music, and that's the 43 00:02:50,400 --> 00:02:52,480 Speaker 1: first that we're going to be talking about today. So 44 00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:57,800 Speaker 1: her history is really intertwined with the Harlem Renaissance and 45 00:02:57,960 --> 00:03:00,560 Speaker 1: the explosion and the arts and music at the time, 46 00:03:00,600 --> 00:03:03,520 Speaker 1: and she kind of moved in those circles, which if 47 00:03:03,560 --> 00:03:06,360 Speaker 1: you're not familiar with the Harlem Renaissance, um, it was 48 00:03:06,400 --> 00:03:09,040 Speaker 1: a time when black arts were really thriving. UM in 49 00:03:09,080 --> 00:03:12,239 Speaker 1: this case centered on Harlem in New York, but there 50 00:03:12,320 --> 00:03:14,840 Speaker 1: was also a lot of other black art scenes that 51 00:03:14,880 --> 00:03:17,440 Speaker 1: were exploding in the United States at the time. UM. 52 00:03:17,440 --> 00:03:19,560 Speaker 1: And this was this was like roughly at the end 53 00:03:19,560 --> 00:03:23,280 Speaker 1: of World War One. So Nora Holt herself was born 54 00:03:23,320 --> 00:03:26,240 Speaker 1: before that. But when she was moving in those circles, 55 00:03:26,400 --> 00:03:30,080 Speaker 1: you know, she was steeped in it. She was steeped 56 00:03:30,080 --> 00:03:32,679 Speaker 1: in her music, she was steeped in other writers work. 57 00:03:32,760 --> 00:03:35,320 Speaker 1: She was steeped in her own writing as well, because 58 00:03:35,320 --> 00:03:38,680 Speaker 1: she was also like I said, of music critic, and yeah, 59 00:03:38,720 --> 00:03:41,880 Speaker 1: it was it did seem glamorous. She traveled all across 60 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:46,119 Speaker 1: the world, as we'll talk about a little later. But yeah, 61 00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:50,040 Speaker 1: Nora Holt, she's she's somebody who is definitely really worthy 62 00:03:50,040 --> 00:03:52,600 Speaker 1: of us remembering. I feel like, you know, when I've 63 00:03:52,640 --> 00:03:55,360 Speaker 1: been reading about people who were in the Harlem Renaissance 64 00:03:55,440 --> 00:03:58,240 Speaker 1: and who people like you know, Langston Hughes and County 65 00:03:58,280 --> 00:04:00,000 Speaker 1: Cullen and some of the people that will talk about 66 00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:02,280 Speaker 1: who are also involved in the Harlem Renaissance and also 67 00:04:02,680 --> 00:04:06,400 Speaker 1: had some proximity to neural Hole. Other women musicians names 68 00:04:06,400 --> 00:04:08,880 Speaker 1: are brought up, but I don't really see, you know, 69 00:04:08,960 --> 00:04:13,240 Speaker 1: neural Hole in a lot of those collections, like gatherings 70 00:04:13,320 --> 00:04:16,440 Speaker 1: of of names of women musicians who really did a 71 00:04:16,440 --> 00:04:18,680 Speaker 1: lot at the time, which you know, has a lot 72 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:20,360 Speaker 1: to do with the fact that a lot of her 73 00:04:21,560 --> 00:04:23,120 Speaker 1: work isn't We don't We don't know a lot of 74 00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:25,560 Speaker 1: her work. Um, we just know a lot about what 75 00:04:25,560 --> 00:04:27,839 Speaker 1: other people said about her and what she said about herself. 76 00:04:27,880 --> 00:04:31,440 Speaker 1: But yeah, so very I'm excited to get into into 77 00:04:31,520 --> 00:04:34,279 Speaker 1: her story today. Yeah, just reviewing some of her story, 78 00:04:34,400 --> 00:04:37,320 Speaker 1: I feel like she would be what I imagined the 79 00:04:37,360 --> 00:04:40,359 Speaker 1: twenties to be, the Roaring twenties and the collective and 80 00:04:40,400 --> 00:04:42,760 Speaker 1: the beauty and the and the glamor of it all. 81 00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:45,559 Speaker 1: Like I'm like, oh, yeah, this is she Her life 82 00:04:45,600 --> 00:04:50,360 Speaker 1: is what I've pictured and this was that fascination with art, music, uh, 83 00:04:50,400 --> 00:04:52,920 Speaker 1: and the culture and itself. I'm like, oh, this is exciting. 84 00:04:53,160 --> 00:04:56,880 Speaker 1: Why why am I not watching more of this? Yeah? 85 00:04:56,920 --> 00:04:59,520 Speaker 1: I know, like reading about her story, she just seemed 86 00:04:59,560 --> 00:05:02,200 Speaker 1: so like like a person I feel like I would 87 00:05:02,240 --> 00:05:04,480 Speaker 1: really aspire to be and want to be, but like 88 00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:07,280 Speaker 1: never be able to be the person that she was, 89 00:05:07,360 --> 00:05:09,560 Speaker 1: Like the way that she seemed like she just so 90 00:05:09,640 --> 00:05:12,800 Speaker 1: seamlessly moved in and out of circles and was at 91 00:05:12,839 --> 00:05:18,400 Speaker 1: private parties. And also obviously it was like very talented. Um. Yeah, 92 00:05:18,480 --> 00:05:23,719 Speaker 1: so definitely somebody who seems so glamorous in such a 93 00:05:23,920 --> 00:05:27,240 Speaker 1: like a model of what that era seemed like it 94 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:31,160 Speaker 1: would have been. Yeah. And it was another one out 95 00:05:31,160 --> 00:05:35,360 Speaker 1: where I was um reading through some of the articles 96 00:05:35,360 --> 00:05:36,880 Speaker 1: about her and I was like, this is a crime. 97 00:05:36,960 --> 00:05:41,520 Speaker 1: I've never heard of her before. This is ridiculous. This 98 00:05:41,600 --> 00:05:44,719 Speaker 1: is so good. So like I want to know more, 99 00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:48,880 Speaker 1: just intrigued by her whole story. So why don't we 100 00:05:49,200 --> 00:05:53,040 Speaker 1: get into it? Okay? Um? Yeah, So she was born 101 00:05:53,120 --> 00:05:57,000 Speaker 1: Lena Douglas in Kansas City and Kansas So there is 102 00:05:57,120 --> 00:05:59,440 Speaker 1: some discrepancy over the date that she was born, but 103 00:05:59,480 --> 00:06:02,640 Speaker 1: most people go with eighteen eighty five. It's sometimes listed 104 00:06:02,680 --> 00:06:07,400 Speaker 1: as eighteen ninety. Her parents were Gracie Douglas and Calvin Douglas. 105 00:06:07,440 --> 00:06:11,359 Speaker 1: He was a minister in the African Methodist Episcopal Church, 106 00:06:11,560 --> 00:06:14,599 Speaker 1: and you know she been. She began taking piano lessons 107 00:06:14,640 --> 00:06:18,919 Speaker 1: pretty early on. She also played the organ um and 108 00:06:19,520 --> 00:06:21,880 Speaker 1: pretty early on in her life as we started to 109 00:06:21,880 --> 00:06:25,280 Speaker 1: get to her marriages, which people like often like to 110 00:06:25,279 --> 00:06:27,919 Speaker 1: focus on in the press that surrounded her. So she 111 00:06:28,080 --> 00:06:31,080 Speaker 1: married an aged fifteen to a guy named Sky James 112 00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:34,640 Speaker 1: who was a musician. Um. Not long after that she 113 00:06:34,760 --> 00:06:40,479 Speaker 1: divorced him and she married politician Philip Scroggins Um. And 114 00:06:40,520 --> 00:06:43,560 Speaker 1: then after that she divorced him and she married a 115 00:06:43,600 --> 00:06:46,400 Speaker 1: barber named Bruce Jones. It was around this time she 116 00:06:46,480 --> 00:06:52,160 Speaker 1: graduated from Western University, which was a school in Quinn Darryl, Kansas. 117 00:06:52,800 --> 00:06:55,840 Speaker 1: So that school was really known for his excellent music department. 118 00:06:56,200 --> 00:06:59,120 Speaker 1: She went on to get her bachelor's degree in music 119 00:06:59,160 --> 00:07:02,760 Speaker 1: in nineteen seven ten, and then she enrolled at Chicago 120 00:07:02,880 --> 00:07:06,000 Speaker 1: Music College, and that is where she gets her first 121 00:07:06,160 --> 00:07:09,440 Speaker 1: so that's where she got her masters in music um. 122 00:07:09,480 --> 00:07:12,559 Speaker 1: So that school had a faculty with people like Louis 123 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:17,600 Speaker 1: Victor Starr. When she was in Chicago. She got some 124 00:07:17,640 --> 00:07:20,360 Speaker 1: of the money to pay for her tuition by singing 125 00:07:20,360 --> 00:07:24,960 Speaker 1: at dinner parties, becoming familiar with wealthy white locals, so 126 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:28,360 Speaker 1: she was already starting to move in those circles. Um. 127 00:07:28,440 --> 00:07:31,640 Speaker 1: She also performed at clubs in the Red Light district, 128 00:07:31,760 --> 00:07:36,000 Speaker 1: so that included singing and playing piano at this brothel 129 00:07:36,040 --> 00:07:42,160 Speaker 1: in Chicago that was operated by the Everly Sisters. Wow. Yeah, yes, 130 00:07:42,280 --> 00:07:47,160 Speaker 1: so she was already like this, you know. Of course, 131 00:07:47,280 --> 00:07:49,640 Speaker 1: like her music was very important to her, and it 132 00:07:49,720 --> 00:07:52,480 Speaker 1: was also something that a lot of people were drawn 133 00:07:52,520 --> 00:07:56,640 Speaker 1: to and she was recognized for. But her personal life 134 00:07:56,680 --> 00:07:59,160 Speaker 1: was also something that people were interested in, and in 135 00:07:59,280 --> 00:08:02,440 Speaker 1: looking back at her story is something that, you know, 136 00:08:02,560 --> 00:08:06,720 Speaker 1: it's very shiny to look at because of this kind 137 00:08:06,720 --> 00:08:10,360 Speaker 1: of socialite life that she had. So yeah, like I said, 138 00:08:10,440 --> 00:08:13,239 Speaker 1: she got her master's degree from the Chicago Musical College, 139 00:08:13,880 --> 00:08:18,760 Speaker 1: and her thesis for her master's degree was a piece 140 00:08:18,800 --> 00:08:22,239 Speaker 1: for symphony orchestra that was called Rapsody on Negro themes. 141 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:25,800 Speaker 1: Delving back into her her marriage life, it was in 142 00:08:25,920 --> 00:08:29,840 Speaker 1: nineteen seventeen that she married George Holt, a hotel owner, 143 00:08:30,360 --> 00:08:33,560 Speaker 1: and that's where the last name Holt came in and 144 00:08:33,720 --> 00:08:35,760 Speaker 1: also went around the time that she took the first 145 00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:39,240 Speaker 1: name Nora, so you'll see her and you know the 146 00:08:39,280 --> 00:08:41,960 Speaker 1: thing that they do um in terms of last names, 147 00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:46,240 Speaker 1: like they're like Nora, Lena, Lena, Nora, Douglas, Ray Holt. 148 00:08:46,320 --> 00:08:48,920 Speaker 1: You know, for all the guys that she made mean 149 00:08:49,040 --> 00:08:51,240 Speaker 1: real extra with the last names. It's like, okay, her 150 00:08:51,320 --> 00:08:53,120 Speaker 1: name is. You know, we're gonna refer to her as 151 00:08:53,160 --> 00:08:55,120 Speaker 1: Norah Holt. But you know if here back at some 152 00:08:55,160 --> 00:08:57,520 Speaker 1: of the press around her, they'll do that kind of 153 00:08:57,559 --> 00:09:00,120 Speaker 1: thing just to attach all of the guys that she 154 00:09:00,240 --> 00:09:03,120 Speaker 1: married um to her name, so she needed to carry 155 00:09:03,160 --> 00:09:06,200 Speaker 1: them around with her her whole life. Um. But yeah, 156 00:09:06,200 --> 00:09:08,520 Speaker 1: it was it was around that time she took the 157 00:09:08,600 --> 00:09:12,120 Speaker 1: name Nora Um And from nineteen seventeen to nineteen one 158 00:09:12,200 --> 00:09:14,960 Speaker 1: she was a music critic and she wrote a column 159 00:09:15,040 --> 00:09:18,280 Speaker 1: for The Chicago Defender, which was a black daily in 160 00:09:18,320 --> 00:09:22,240 Speaker 1: the city, and in her music criticism, she really did 161 00:09:22,320 --> 00:09:25,800 Speaker 1: focus a lot on being able to uplift other black 162 00:09:25,880 --> 00:09:28,840 Speaker 1: musicians and black artists and really encourage other people to 163 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:32,520 Speaker 1: patronize them and to support their work and to encourage 164 00:09:32,559 --> 00:09:35,080 Speaker 1: them and to you know, listen, to listen to their 165 00:09:35,160 --> 00:09:38,800 Speaker 1: music and appreciate their art, and you know she was. 166 00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:42,120 Speaker 1: She worked on the Defender staff um. She would also 167 00:09:42,120 --> 00:09:45,400 Speaker 1: write about all of the things that black musicians around 168 00:09:45,400 --> 00:09:49,320 Speaker 1: the US were doing, like Hazel Harrison, and like Clarence 169 00:09:49,360 --> 00:09:52,520 Speaker 1: Cameron White, who was a really big musician. And she 170 00:09:52,640 --> 00:09:55,600 Speaker 1: also edited and published a journal called Music and Poetry, 171 00:09:55,679 --> 00:09:59,920 Speaker 1: which its subtitle was a monthly magazine of high standard 172 00:10:00,200 --> 00:10:03,520 Speaker 1: for musicians and music lovers. And so in every issue 173 00:10:03,640 --> 00:10:06,480 Speaker 1: she would urge subscribers to take this pledge. It was 174 00:10:06,960 --> 00:10:10,440 Speaker 1: I will use something of Negro origin on every program. 175 00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:13,760 Speaker 1: And so in all the magazine issues she would print 176 00:10:13,920 --> 00:10:18,240 Speaker 1: a composition by a black composer. So that was a 177 00:10:18,280 --> 00:10:22,840 Speaker 1: way in which she continued to spotlight and introduce other 178 00:10:22,920 --> 00:10:27,840 Speaker 1: people to the work of black musicians. We have some 179 00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:29,840 Speaker 1: more of our conversation, but first we have a quick 180 00:10:29,840 --> 00:10:45,920 Speaker 1: break for word from our sponsor, and we're back. Thank 181 00:10:45,920 --> 00:10:50,520 Speaker 1: you sponsored. So another way that she would support other 182 00:10:50,679 --> 00:10:53,200 Speaker 1: black musicians who were working at the time was by 183 00:10:53,320 --> 00:10:57,240 Speaker 1: involving herself in like organizations that had to do with music, 184 00:10:57,280 --> 00:10:59,920 Speaker 1: and one of them was once You co founded, which 185 00:11:00,120 --> 00:11:04,800 Speaker 1: was the National Association of Negro Musicians, which I'll just 186 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:08,280 Speaker 1: called the association or in a n m UM. So 187 00:11:08,320 --> 00:11:10,760 Speaker 1: she wasn't the first one to bring up putting together 188 00:11:10,880 --> 00:11:15,800 Speaker 1: that kind of association, But in nineteen eighteen she was 189 00:11:16,120 --> 00:11:19,240 Speaker 1: milling the idea around in her head and she issued 190 00:11:19,280 --> 00:11:22,640 Speaker 1: a call for an association in the Chicago Defender. So 191 00:11:22,720 --> 00:11:26,640 Speaker 1: she began to work with other Chicago musicians um to 192 00:11:26,720 --> 00:11:30,040 Speaker 1: make plans to create the association, And in May of 193 00:11:30,080 --> 00:11:33,719 Speaker 1: nineteen nineteen in d C. There was a preliminary conference 194 00:11:34,240 --> 00:11:38,760 Speaker 1: of Black musicians that was led by Nora herself and 195 00:11:38,840 --> 00:11:43,440 Speaker 1: also by musician Henry Grant, And so the association's first 196 00:11:43,760 --> 00:11:46,920 Speaker 1: national convention was held in Chicago just a couple of 197 00:11:46,960 --> 00:11:49,400 Speaker 1: months later, at the end of July to the beginning 198 00:11:49,440 --> 00:11:53,720 Speaker 1: of August, which was happened to be the same time 199 00:11:53,720 --> 00:11:56,960 Speaker 1: that riots were happening in Chicago, because this was the 200 00:11:57,000 --> 00:12:01,680 Speaker 1: Red Summer, which was a period it of several months 201 00:12:01,720 --> 00:12:05,959 Speaker 1: throughout the year of nineteen nineteen when riots and terrorism 202 00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:08,920 Speaker 1: and racial violence was happening all around the US. So 203 00:12:09,080 --> 00:12:12,680 Speaker 1: this was literally all around the US, and it's notable 204 00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:15,319 Speaker 1: for the amount of white supremacy violence that was happening. 205 00:12:15,960 --> 00:12:19,120 Speaker 1: Of course the whole era. This was also prominent in 206 00:12:19,200 --> 00:12:21,720 Speaker 1: the time, but this was a specific time when things 207 00:12:21,760 --> 00:12:26,240 Speaker 1: were very charged and riots were happening big ones UM 208 00:12:26,320 --> 00:12:29,120 Speaker 1: in different locations across the US, and this was the 209 00:12:29,120 --> 00:12:32,400 Speaker 1: case in Chicago that same weekend of the conference. That 210 00:12:32,480 --> 00:12:35,800 Speaker 1: affected the schedules and the venues that were a part 211 00:12:35,800 --> 00:12:39,560 Speaker 1: of the convention. So there was a concert there and 212 00:12:40,440 --> 00:12:43,839 Speaker 1: you know, Holt did talk about the events of the 213 00:12:43,960 --> 00:12:47,200 Speaker 1: day and she noted that one of the standout performances 214 00:12:47,400 --> 00:12:49,800 Speaker 1: was that by Control Tell Marian Anderson, who went on 215 00:12:49,880 --> 00:12:54,680 Speaker 1: to have a great career UM. And Nora was also 216 00:12:54,840 --> 00:12:58,480 Speaker 1: vice president of the association for a few years. So 217 00:12:58,920 --> 00:13:03,800 Speaker 1: in nineteen twenty one, her husband, George Holt died UM 218 00:13:03,840 --> 00:13:07,360 Speaker 1: and at that point she became wealthier. She didn't really 219 00:13:07,440 --> 00:13:11,920 Speaker 1: need to perform for money anymore UM, and she closed 220 00:13:11,960 --> 00:13:14,760 Speaker 1: the magazine Music and Poetry. She left her post at 221 00:13:14,760 --> 00:13:18,160 Speaker 1: in a n M, and she stopped writing her column 222 00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:24,160 Speaker 1: for the Chicago Defender. So she did create her own 223 00:13:24,360 --> 00:13:27,400 Speaker 1: classical compositions, and she created a lot of them. So 224 00:13:27,520 --> 00:13:31,920 Speaker 1: by the mid nineteen twenties she had created around somewhere 225 00:13:31,920 --> 00:13:36,600 Speaker 1: around two hundred compositions. And she married her fifth husband, 226 00:13:36,840 --> 00:13:40,080 Speaker 1: who was Joseph Ray um and he was an assistant 227 00:13:40,080 --> 00:13:44,560 Speaker 1: to Charles Schwab. Their marriage was not amicable and it 228 00:13:44,600 --> 00:13:47,520 Speaker 1: didn't last that long. Um. They lived in Pennsylvania where 229 00:13:47,640 --> 00:13:51,320 Speaker 1: when they were together for a bit. And yeah, so 230 00:13:51,440 --> 00:13:54,640 Speaker 1: newspapers printed stories about her love life and about her 231 00:13:54,679 --> 00:13:58,480 Speaker 1: relationships and really focused on all the drama and the 232 00:13:58,600 --> 00:14:02,400 Speaker 1: conflict that they perceived to be happening in her life 233 00:14:02,440 --> 00:14:05,920 Speaker 1: and her marriage to him. Um. So, even though she 234 00:14:06,040 --> 00:14:10,560 Speaker 1: was successful and people were paying attention to her music, 235 00:14:10,679 --> 00:14:12,600 Speaker 1: you know, a lot of which was at private parties, 236 00:14:12,640 --> 00:14:15,800 Speaker 1: but you know, she was a lot of what the 237 00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:18,199 Speaker 1: press did focus on was like her love life and 238 00:14:18,240 --> 00:14:22,080 Speaker 1: the things that were happening there. Um. She was kind 239 00:14:22,080 --> 00:14:26,240 Speaker 1: of portrayed as Nora the socialite and Nora the rich 240 00:14:26,320 --> 00:14:29,200 Speaker 1: woman who attended a lot of parties, rather than Nor 241 00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:33,120 Speaker 1: the musician and Nor the composer. So they wrote about 242 00:14:33,160 --> 00:14:37,360 Speaker 1: her wedding with this Joseph Rey guy saying that she 243 00:14:37,400 --> 00:14:42,240 Speaker 1: wore six carrot diamond earrings in each ear and gossiping 244 00:14:42,360 --> 00:14:45,200 Speaker 1: that her veil concealed a black eye that she had 245 00:14:45,240 --> 00:14:50,080 Speaker 1: gotten from a lover. Um. So play playing things up 246 00:14:50,240 --> 00:14:53,440 Speaker 1: as they want to do. The Chicago Defender covered Ray 247 00:14:53,520 --> 00:14:57,560 Speaker 1: suits against Nora and the countersuits that she had and 248 00:14:57,560 --> 00:14:59,920 Speaker 1: and for instance, she was accused of having an affair 249 00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:04,800 Speaker 1: with a guy named Leroy Wilkins and he Ray also 250 00:15:04,880 --> 00:15:08,040 Speaker 1: sued her over thousands of dollars of real estate and 251 00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:11,160 Speaker 1: jewels that he put in her name, And there was 252 00:15:11,200 --> 00:15:14,120 Speaker 1: a point where he claimed that their marriage was invalid 253 00:15:14,200 --> 00:15:20,320 Speaker 1: because of an improper divorce from one of her previous husbands. Um, 254 00:15:20,360 --> 00:15:23,280 Speaker 1: but she said Ray was really jealous. So all of 255 00:15:23,320 --> 00:15:26,640 Speaker 1: this was, this back and forth was covered in the press, 256 00:15:27,400 --> 00:15:31,160 Speaker 1: and you know people you know, soaked that up. So 257 00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:35,360 Speaker 1: I can you say, yeah, he's a good reading, right M. 258 00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:39,520 Speaker 1: I feel like this still happens though, where like I 259 00:15:39,560 --> 00:15:42,320 Speaker 1: remember recently there was that recently as in like three 260 00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:44,360 Speaker 1: or four years ago, there was that article about Taylor 261 00:15:44,440 --> 00:15:47,840 Speaker 1: Swift and they referred to her as like somebody's girlfriend, 262 00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:52,640 Speaker 1: and she was like, hold on, I'm like, I'm bigger 263 00:15:52,680 --> 00:15:56,000 Speaker 1: than this dude. Don't refer to me by him. Just 264 00:15:56,080 --> 00:16:01,360 Speaker 1: like being remembered more for your especially women. I feel 265 00:16:01,360 --> 00:16:03,800 Speaker 1: like whatever is your your personal life and who are 266 00:16:03,800 --> 00:16:11,160 Speaker 1: you dating and all that stuff rather than what you achieve. Yeah, yes, 267 00:16:11,800 --> 00:16:15,280 Speaker 1: don't get me starting on that, because like the climate 268 00:16:15,320 --> 00:16:17,680 Speaker 1: of like gossip is just so strange to me, celebrity 269 00:16:17,680 --> 00:16:19,720 Speaker 1: gossip in the and the amount of intensity that people 270 00:16:19,760 --> 00:16:22,320 Speaker 1: have when they're following people's lives they know nothing about 271 00:16:22,880 --> 00:16:25,760 Speaker 1: um is very strange to me. But it does remind 272 00:16:25,800 --> 00:16:28,200 Speaker 1: me of one thing that you know, when we're like 273 00:16:28,240 --> 00:16:30,360 Speaker 1: all these women that were covering on female first, and 274 00:16:30,360 --> 00:16:31,600 Speaker 1: I know all the ones that you come across. I 275 00:16:31,640 --> 00:16:34,200 Speaker 1: don't know if we talked about this before, we might have, 276 00:16:34,360 --> 00:16:37,560 Speaker 1: but it is something that consistently bothers me is that 277 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:43,120 Speaker 1: when a lot of times in people's stories and in 278 00:16:43,160 --> 00:16:48,200 Speaker 1: their biographies, they don't mention they leave with the occupation 279 00:16:48,240 --> 00:16:52,280 Speaker 1: of the man and don't say anything about the woman 280 00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:54,840 Speaker 1: and like how she lived her life even if it's 281 00:16:54,880 --> 00:16:57,080 Speaker 1: not an occupation, you know what I'm saying, and if 282 00:16:57,120 --> 00:16:59,800 Speaker 1: it is, like if it is you know, if it's domestic, 283 00:17:00,320 --> 00:17:02,640 Speaker 1: or if it's you know, whatever the thing might be, 284 00:17:02,720 --> 00:17:05,320 Speaker 1: but that the woman, like how she lived her life, 285 00:17:05,440 --> 00:17:07,240 Speaker 1: like I don't know, like maybe she spent times she 286 00:17:07,280 --> 00:17:09,480 Speaker 1: really enjoyed being a part of the church, like you know, 287 00:17:10,080 --> 00:17:14,199 Speaker 1: they don't there's always a forefronting of like what the 288 00:17:14,240 --> 00:17:17,320 Speaker 1: guy did, this was that was the parent of this person, 289 00:17:17,400 --> 00:17:20,000 Speaker 1: and and the mother just kind of like she's the mother, 290 00:17:20,119 --> 00:17:22,800 Speaker 1: which is fine, Like that's perfectly great, but it's just 291 00:17:22,880 --> 00:17:27,040 Speaker 1: always situated that way, and it's it's irritating. No, Yeah, 292 00:17:27,119 --> 00:17:29,720 Speaker 1: I think that's so safe because I often think even 293 00:17:29,720 --> 00:17:33,440 Speaker 1: for women who who didn't marry or who didn't have 294 00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:35,520 Speaker 1: a family or a big family whatever whatnot, that's one 295 00:17:35,560 --> 00:17:38,320 Speaker 1: of the things they actually mentioned, not necessarily that you know, 296 00:17:38,440 --> 00:17:40,280 Speaker 1: she had this career and this is why, but oh 297 00:17:40,359 --> 00:17:42,880 Speaker 1: she was you know, she didn't marry because and then 298 00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:45,560 Speaker 1: they speculate us to why, whether it's she talked too 299 00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:48,240 Speaker 1: much about her job or she wasn't you know, and 300 00:17:48,440 --> 00:17:50,919 Speaker 1: into all these things, and it's always they have to 301 00:17:50,920 --> 00:17:53,040 Speaker 1: find a reason for it. I don't feel like it 302 00:17:53,080 --> 00:17:55,840 Speaker 1: happens as much within that it's obviously if he's famous 303 00:17:55,920 --> 00:17:58,920 Speaker 1: and if he's done something significant, that's why he's not married, duh. 304 00:17:59,119 --> 00:18:02,119 Speaker 1: Like they kind of leave it alone. That's where they 305 00:18:02,160 --> 00:18:06,439 Speaker 1: have to have an actual explanation for why the relationship 306 00:18:06,520 --> 00:18:08,879 Speaker 1: is what it is, whether it's in their opinion, they 307 00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:11,119 Speaker 1: married too many people, or they didn't marry enough people, 308 00:18:11,200 --> 00:18:13,080 Speaker 1: or they weren't happy enough, or they were to you know, 309 00:18:13,119 --> 00:18:16,920 Speaker 1: any of these things is very speculatory, especially for women, 310 00:18:16,960 --> 00:18:20,000 Speaker 1: and there has to be a reason for that relationship 311 00:18:20,080 --> 00:18:29,600 Speaker 1: or non relationship. Yeah. Yeah, people feel very very uh 312 00:18:30,040 --> 00:18:32,720 Speaker 1: open open isn't the right word. They feel like they're 313 00:18:32,760 --> 00:18:36,800 Speaker 1: allowed to judge women, uh for for for most things, 314 00:18:36,800 --> 00:18:40,159 Speaker 1: but particularly for like relationship stuff and like weighing in 315 00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:44,800 Speaker 1: on what's going on there, whereas whatever the man's doing 316 00:18:45,080 --> 00:18:52,280 Speaker 1: is good, he's fine. Yeah, definitely a double standard. M hm. 317 00:18:53,520 --> 00:18:58,919 Speaker 1: So they eventually divorced her, and right did um. But 318 00:18:59,600 --> 00:19:03,400 Speaker 1: there is like a lot of what's known about her. 319 00:19:03,720 --> 00:19:06,800 Speaker 1: Norah's life in the nineteen twenties and in the nineteen 320 00:19:06,840 --> 00:19:09,760 Speaker 1: thirties is based on what her friend Carl von Victim 321 00:19:10,480 --> 00:19:12,159 Speaker 1: wrote about her in the letters that the two of 322 00:19:12,200 --> 00:19:15,880 Speaker 1: them exchanged, and they met in Harlem in the early 323 00:19:15,960 --> 00:19:19,399 Speaker 1: nineteen twenties and they were friends until he died. Um 324 00:19:19,440 --> 00:19:23,439 Speaker 1: So von Vechten was a white cultural critic and a novelist, 325 00:19:23,840 --> 00:19:26,720 Speaker 1: and one of his well known novels is Heaven and 326 00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:30,280 Speaker 1: Nora was said to be a model for one of 327 00:19:30,359 --> 00:19:34,640 Speaker 1: the characters in that story, Alaska star tourists. Um And 328 00:19:35,119 --> 00:19:39,040 Speaker 1: von Vechten himself was a pretty controversial figure in both 329 00:19:39,119 --> 00:19:44,040 Speaker 1: black and white circles, you know, for for different reasons. 330 00:19:44,080 --> 00:19:46,720 Speaker 1: You know, because of the types of work that he wrote, 331 00:19:47,080 --> 00:19:50,600 Speaker 1: but you know, was also respected in black circles as 332 00:19:50,600 --> 00:19:52,399 Speaker 1: well because of the people who he did run with 333 00:19:52,600 --> 00:19:56,720 Speaker 1: and um, the stories that he wrote, and for the 334 00:19:56,760 --> 00:19:59,280 Speaker 1: same reason, the fact that he was such a support 335 00:19:59,320 --> 00:20:03,399 Speaker 1: of black art in so involved in that way. A 336 00:20:03,400 --> 00:20:06,600 Speaker 1: lot of white folks did not like him. Um. But yeah, 337 00:20:06,880 --> 00:20:09,240 Speaker 1: the point is like he was a controversial figure and 338 00:20:09,880 --> 00:20:14,360 Speaker 1: Nora was good friends with him, and Halt began traveling 339 00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:17,960 Speaker 1: around Europe, and she stayed overseas for a good minute 340 00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:21,919 Speaker 1: and for long periods in the nineteen twenties. She learned French, 341 00:20:22,119 --> 00:20:26,760 Speaker 1: she performed in Paris, she performed in Shanghai. Um. And 342 00:20:26,880 --> 00:20:31,159 Speaker 1: there are plenty of articles about her appearances in Europe, 343 00:20:31,520 --> 00:20:35,760 Speaker 1: so also very played up. Like UM mentioned her being 344 00:20:35,760 --> 00:20:39,560 Speaker 1: a blond. Um. They mentioned that the Prince of Wales 345 00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:43,000 Speaker 1: was that one of her performances in London and congratulated 346 00:20:43,040 --> 00:20:45,560 Speaker 1: her on the show afterward, and she said this is well. 347 00:20:46,200 --> 00:20:49,280 Speaker 1: And there was a writer in the London Daily Express 348 00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:53,159 Speaker 1: that described her as a blonde creole, saying that she 349 00:20:53,240 --> 00:20:56,160 Speaker 1: quote has a presence and a manner similar in many 350 00:20:56,160 --> 00:20:59,240 Speaker 1: ways to those of Sophie Tucker. And Sophie Tucker was 351 00:20:59,280 --> 00:21:02,280 Speaker 1: a Russian born an American singer and entertainer, which you 352 00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:03,960 Speaker 1: can look at pictures of her and also pictures of 353 00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:06,200 Speaker 1: Nora and see what you what you think about the 354 00:21:06,240 --> 00:21:09,080 Speaker 1: two of them looking like each other. So the writer 355 00:21:09,160 --> 00:21:11,760 Speaker 1: said about her singing quote, she can produce sounds not 356 00:21:11,880 --> 00:21:16,359 Speaker 1: comparable to orthodox singing, ranging from deepest low voice to 357 00:21:16,520 --> 00:21:21,399 Speaker 1: shrilling high, often unaccompanied by words. There are no existing 358 00:21:21,720 --> 00:21:26,120 Speaker 1: records recordings of Nora singing, so we don't really know 359 00:21:26,760 --> 00:21:28,960 Speaker 1: what she sounded like, but we just have to kind 360 00:21:28,960 --> 00:21:33,920 Speaker 1: of surmise based off of people's descriptions of her. There 361 00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:39,000 Speaker 1: were you know, there's descriptions in the articles that people wrote, 362 00:21:39,040 --> 00:21:41,320 Speaker 1: and then there's a little bit that we can surmis 363 00:21:41,320 --> 00:21:45,240 Speaker 1: from the letters between her and confecting about the her 364 00:21:45,280 --> 00:21:48,280 Speaker 1: appearances and how she felt about her performances and how 365 00:21:48,280 --> 00:21:51,840 Speaker 1: other people did. There was one when she wrote about 366 00:21:51,840 --> 00:21:55,240 Speaker 1: her French audiences and this is what she said. She said, 367 00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:58,480 Speaker 1: imagine them liking me and they don't know a word 368 00:21:58,520 --> 00:22:01,080 Speaker 1: I am singing or what it's all out. The real 369 00:22:01,119 --> 00:22:06,120 Speaker 1: truth is I'm selling my hair in personality, so she 370 00:22:06,280 --> 00:22:10,040 Speaker 1: was described as having blonde hair. Um, yeah, so that 371 00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:11,880 Speaker 1: close is really funny to me that I like how 372 00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:14,880 Speaker 1: upfront she is about like, hey, y'all, I'm doing a job. 373 00:22:15,160 --> 00:22:19,439 Speaker 1: It's a gig, and it's like, you know, I know 374 00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:21,040 Speaker 1: what I have and i know my strengths and I'm 375 00:22:21,040 --> 00:22:25,760 Speaker 1: going to play to them. That. When I was reading 376 00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:27,720 Speaker 1: the articles about her, it did kind of make me 377 00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:30,680 Speaker 1: laugh at almost everyone was like, she had platinum blond hair, 378 00:22:30,840 --> 00:22:34,920 Speaker 1: and I was like, yeah, okay, they were fascinating. I mean, 379 00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:37,440 Speaker 1: the proximity to whiteness, you know, you know, the whole 380 00:22:37,480 --> 00:22:40,639 Speaker 1: creole thing, and her looking like Suffie Tucker is like, Wow, 381 00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:44,080 Speaker 1: she has the essence of blackness but also the essence 382 00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:47,239 Speaker 1: of whiteness, which makes her so much more intriguing, you know, 383 00:22:47,880 --> 00:22:51,360 Speaker 1: which you know, it is what it is. But yeah, 384 00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:53,880 Speaker 1: they did tend to like talk about her hair being 385 00:22:53,920 --> 00:22:57,720 Speaker 1: read or being blind and how that was just so fascinating. Yeah. 386 00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:02,280 Speaker 1: I've been in one article that she had a hair salon. 387 00:23:02,440 --> 00:23:05,960 Speaker 1: Is that correct, And that someone noted that oh no, 388 00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:09,000 Speaker 1: now there's gonna be so many Oh no, but oh 389 00:23:09,080 --> 00:23:11,080 Speaker 1: now we're gonna see so many women with blonde hair, 390 00:23:11,119 --> 00:23:13,439 Speaker 1: because that's our thing and that's what she's trying to 391 00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:16,800 Speaker 1: make everyone do, or something that her influence in itself. 392 00:23:16,840 --> 00:23:18,240 Speaker 1: I thought it was kind of funny that they needed 393 00:23:18,240 --> 00:23:22,119 Speaker 1: to talk about that as well. Yeah, well not for nothing. 394 00:23:22,160 --> 00:23:24,119 Speaker 1: Blood here on black people is still a topic of 395 00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:29,760 Speaker 1: conversation this many years later. Some things don't change or 396 00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:34,240 Speaker 1: don't change enough. Um. Yes, she did have a salon 397 00:23:34,359 --> 00:23:37,879 Speaker 1: later in life though. Um. Yeah. So before she left 398 00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:40,800 Speaker 1: for Europe in nineteen six, she did store all of 399 00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:43,879 Speaker 1: her manuscripts, and when she got back from her travels 400 00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:47,040 Speaker 1: in Europe and Asia, she found out that they haven't stolen. 401 00:23:47,680 --> 00:23:51,560 Speaker 1: The works that are left are Negro Dance, which was 402 00:23:52,080 --> 00:23:55,520 Speaker 1: work Or which is work for solo piano, and also 403 00:23:55,880 --> 00:23:58,520 Speaker 1: The Sandman. So those are the only two extent works 404 00:23:58,520 --> 00:24:01,280 Speaker 1: that she has, so she didn't publish those. So it's 405 00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:03,760 Speaker 1: fortunate that she published those and that we have that 406 00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:07,879 Speaker 1: to be able to refer to. But that's what you 407 00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:12,960 Speaker 1: know remains of her compositions. That's I mean two hundred 408 00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:18,159 Speaker 1: things like my computer crash recently and I've lost like 409 00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:21,040 Speaker 1: a silly fan fiction I wrote and I was devastated. 410 00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:26,680 Speaker 1: That's devastating. Thank you, Eves. But it's not two hundred 411 00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:32,920 Speaker 1: pieces that are just gone right, Like, yeah, that would 412 00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:37,159 Speaker 1: make me have a panic attack for a real Yeah, yeah, 413 00:24:37,240 --> 00:24:39,679 Speaker 1: yeah I do. I do wonder you know how she 414 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:47,360 Speaker 1: happened to them? What happened? Right? The world may never know. Yeah, Yeah, 415 00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:50,240 Speaker 1: that's the question is who actually stole them and why 416 00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:52,919 Speaker 1: and where is it? And did people just publish her 417 00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:55,240 Speaker 1: works with that with taking credit or I would have 418 00:24:55,240 --> 00:24:57,120 Speaker 1: thought she would have called them out pretty quickly those 419 00:24:57,160 --> 00:25:02,280 Speaker 1: our songs, But what was the motive behind the Yeah, 420 00:25:02,520 --> 00:25:06,159 Speaker 1: these are no joke that histories of mysteries of history 421 00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:09,640 Speaker 1: that keep me up at night. I want to know 422 00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:13,359 Speaker 1: it's another job for you, Annie, Like, maybe that can 423 00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:17,760 Speaker 1: be history detective added to the resume. I would be 424 00:25:17,920 --> 00:25:21,720 Speaker 1: so bad at it. That should be a show in itself, 425 00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:26,760 Speaker 1: me doing a terrible job trying to solve mysteries of history. Hey, 426 00:25:27,320 --> 00:25:35,560 Speaker 1: quarantine projects you gotta have, That's what I was like. Yeah. 427 00:25:35,920 --> 00:25:39,240 Speaker 1: So she did spend a lot of time traveling around 428 00:25:39,280 --> 00:25:42,400 Speaker 1: the world and traveling in Europe and Asia, but World 429 00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:45,960 Speaker 1: War two was approaching when she was in Asia, and 430 00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:48,800 Speaker 1: by the end of the thirties, as it were, what 431 00:25:48,920 --> 00:25:50,720 Speaker 1: two was gearing up. She was back in the US, 432 00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:55,600 Speaker 1: and she wasn't hard. She had been in Harlem for 433 00:25:55,640 --> 00:25:59,200 Speaker 1: a while, but she moved to California and she began 434 00:25:59,280 --> 00:26:03,120 Speaker 1: teaching music in public high schools in the late nineteen thirties. 435 00:26:03,280 --> 00:26:06,080 Speaker 1: And like you said, Samantha, she owned a salon around 436 00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:08,680 Speaker 1: this time when she went to California. Um she went. 437 00:26:08,720 --> 00:26:10,560 Speaker 1: But she did go back to New York in the 438 00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:14,879 Speaker 1: early nineteen forties and was still doing music criticism basically 439 00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:18,000 Speaker 1: up until the time that she she died. Um. So 440 00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:20,880 Speaker 1: she was a music editor and critic at the Amsterdam News, 441 00:26:20,920 --> 00:26:23,800 Speaker 1: which was a black newspaper. She served as the critic 442 00:26:23,840 --> 00:26:27,280 Speaker 1: there until nineteen fifty six. The Amsterdam News was a 443 00:26:27,280 --> 00:26:29,840 Speaker 1: black newspaper that was first published in nineteen o nine. 444 00:26:30,240 --> 00:26:33,440 Speaker 1: So she continued and it it also like included over 445 00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:36,080 Speaker 1: the years you know, um that it was in existence, 446 00:26:36,160 --> 00:26:42,000 Speaker 1: included a lot of notable writers in its pages. Um. Yes. 447 00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:44,960 Speaker 1: So she continued to encourage people to support black artists 448 00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:48,000 Speaker 1: through her own writing, and she became the first Black 449 00:26:48,040 --> 00:26:51,240 Speaker 1: American member of the Music Critics Circle of New York. UM. 450 00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:54,920 Speaker 1: And she also organized a radio concert series UM that 451 00:26:55,040 --> 00:27:00,000 Speaker 1: Randal W NYC in n so she you know, continue 452 00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:02,800 Speaker 1: need to work in radio, continue to do her music criticism. 453 00:27:02,920 --> 00:27:05,760 Speaker 1: From nineteen fifty three to sixty four, she began to 454 00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:09,119 Speaker 1: host and produce a concert series on w l i 455 00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:14,280 Speaker 1: B in New York and was writing as well in 456 00:27:14,359 --> 00:27:18,399 Speaker 1: nineteen fifty six for the New York Courier. But as 457 00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:21,919 Speaker 1: you know, the great traveler that she was, by nineteen 458 00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:26,560 Speaker 1: sixty four she was back in California and continue to 459 00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:32,119 Speaker 1: spend her time supporting music and supporting black artists. We 460 00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:34,399 Speaker 1: have a little bit more for you, listeners, but first 461 00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:35,919 Speaker 1: we have one more quick break for a word from 462 00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:54,400 Speaker 1: our sponsor, and we're back. She died in nineteen seventy 463 00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:59,600 Speaker 1: four at a nursing home in Los Angeles and had 464 00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:03,280 Speaker 1: lived to very full life up until that point. Um, 465 00:28:03,320 --> 00:28:06,679 Speaker 1: she as a person who traveled throughout Europe and did 466 00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:08,639 Speaker 1: a lot of private parties there, did a lot of 467 00:28:08,640 --> 00:28:12,640 Speaker 1: private parties here in the US as well. Spent time 468 00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:17,720 Speaker 1: in China and Shanghai and Japan, and China was a 469 00:28:17,760 --> 00:28:22,119 Speaker 1: big place for black jazz musicians. Um, maybe even in 470 00:28:22,119 --> 00:28:24,320 Speaker 1: the nineteen thirties, a little bit bigger than Paris was 471 00:28:24,400 --> 00:28:28,800 Speaker 1: for black jazz musicians. So um, definitely tapped into those 472 00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:32,960 Speaker 1: circles and into the the the heat that that had 473 00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:36,520 Speaker 1: at that point in time. So yeah, Unfortunately, you know, 474 00:28:36,600 --> 00:28:40,120 Speaker 1: you can go online and watch a performance of Negro 475 00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:43,000 Speaker 1: Dance that's you know, not by Nora herself, but you 476 00:28:43,040 --> 00:28:45,560 Speaker 1: can find that online if you want to hear what 477 00:28:45,680 --> 00:28:48,920 Speaker 1: her music sounded like, just just a little sneak peak 478 00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:53,560 Speaker 1: of the massive wealth of music that she did compose 479 00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:57,960 Speaker 1: in her time. But yeah, no recordings, so we can't 480 00:28:57,960 --> 00:29:01,920 Speaker 1: really hear her voice, which would be nice. But um, yeah, 481 00:29:02,080 --> 00:29:04,040 Speaker 1: she lived a full life and I think her story 482 00:29:04,080 --> 00:29:06,680 Speaker 1: speaks for itself, even though I think it could have 483 00:29:07,160 --> 00:29:09,320 Speaker 1: more shine as always as any of these people that 484 00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:16,560 Speaker 1: we talk about could. Yeah. Yeah, I would highly recommend 485 00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:20,640 Speaker 1: any listeners to look look up her story because it's 486 00:29:20,680 --> 00:29:26,720 Speaker 1: full of amazing quotes and I just was like, who 487 00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:32,160 Speaker 1: was this person? I wonder if anybody's ever written in 488 00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:35,520 Speaker 1: a letter about me like her trail is strewed with bones. 489 00:29:37,480 --> 00:29:40,760 Speaker 1: I mean, that's amazing. There was an element of like fear, 490 00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:43,800 Speaker 1: I don't like fear, as in like fear and awe, 491 00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:46,960 Speaker 1: that kind of that I think surrounded her and like 492 00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:49,840 Speaker 1: her presence and her the effect that she had on guys. 493 00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:55,000 Speaker 1: I think as well, Yeah, I did love also, like 494 00:29:55,080 --> 00:29:58,320 Speaker 1: when we're talking about her as a co founder of 495 00:29:58,400 --> 00:30:00,520 Speaker 1: the n A and M and which she was talking 496 00:30:00,520 --> 00:30:04,400 Speaker 1: about the fact that she actually wrote a chronical history 497 00:30:04,440 --> 00:30:05,920 Speaker 1: of an A and M, and I think we wane. 498 00:30:05,920 --> 00:30:08,160 Speaker 1: I guess that's when she was leaving the organization, that 499 00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:12,800 Speaker 1: she made sure that her role in that organization was recorded, 500 00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:14,600 Speaker 1: and she did in our day themselves. She was like, no, 501 00:30:14,720 --> 00:30:17,520 Speaker 1: you're not going to erase me. And I feel like, yeah, 502 00:30:17,560 --> 00:30:20,240 Speaker 1: that's the kind of courage we really really needed from 503 00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:21,680 Speaker 1: a lot of people, because that's how we miss out 504 00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:23,720 Speaker 1: in histories. No one's willing to record it. And she's like, no, 505 00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:26,520 Speaker 1: you're not going to forget the contributions that I made. 506 00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:29,000 Speaker 1: And though it may have been acknowledged by others, the 507 00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:30,640 Speaker 1: fact no matter that she took it into her own 508 00:30:31,040 --> 00:30:33,320 Speaker 1: hands so that she would not be a race or dismissed. 509 00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:35,680 Speaker 1: And I was like, yes, yes, And the fact that 510 00:30:35,720 --> 00:30:37,280 Speaker 1: she had to do that on its own, it's like 511 00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:40,960 Speaker 1: really telling of what we want to acknowledge as a 512 00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:44,120 Speaker 1: part of history and who made that history. Yeah, well, 513 00:30:44,120 --> 00:30:46,040 Speaker 1: it does kind of seem like the ironic part of 514 00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:48,560 Speaker 1: her story that she spent so much time concerned about 515 00:30:48,600 --> 00:30:52,400 Speaker 1: documenting other people's work, like putting it, publishing it in 516 00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:55,920 Speaker 1: her in her magazines and talking about it and telling 517 00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:57,560 Speaker 1: other people about it and telling other people to go 518 00:30:57,600 --> 00:30:59,880 Speaker 1: see and listen to it. And then we don't have 519 00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:01,800 Speaker 1: for hers to go see you listened to like it's 520 00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:06,640 Speaker 1: not documented, um, which is you know, how the world works. 521 00:31:06,640 --> 00:31:11,520 Speaker 1: I guess gives some and it takes some. But yeah, 522 00:31:11,560 --> 00:31:15,080 Speaker 1: I mean it's great that we do know something about 523 00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:17,560 Speaker 1: her story and that right we know, we know that 524 00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:20,200 Speaker 1: the work that she did to be able to uplift 525 00:31:20,280 --> 00:31:23,320 Speaker 1: other people and also continue to do her own work 526 00:31:23,360 --> 00:31:30,040 Speaker 1: that was also very well well recognize any knowledged for 527 00:31:30,040 --> 00:31:37,520 Speaker 1: for its strength. Yeah, and I do love to um. 528 00:31:37,560 --> 00:31:39,760 Speaker 1: I just love hearing stories that people are so passionate 529 00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:43,360 Speaker 1: about something and she was. She seems like she was 530 00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:48,280 Speaker 1: so passionate about music and like that was just her 531 00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:51,840 Speaker 1: calling and she knew it. And then as part of 532 00:31:51,880 --> 00:31:58,560 Speaker 1: that passion, she also was uplifting and was just focusing 533 00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:04,240 Speaker 1: on other people and like genuinely really just loved music 534 00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:07,040 Speaker 1: and wanted other people to love it and have chances 535 00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:11,240 Speaker 1: and opportunities in it too, Um. I just I love 536 00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:15,200 Speaker 1: stuff like that. Yeah, And then and the joy and 537 00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:18,040 Speaker 1: fun that she seemed to be having at the same time, Like, 538 00:32:18,720 --> 00:32:21,120 Speaker 1: you know, this is serious stuff. You know, I care 539 00:32:21,120 --> 00:32:26,080 Speaker 1: about I care about black culture and uplifting blackness, and 540 00:32:26,240 --> 00:32:28,880 Speaker 1: you know that is the work, the purpose and the 541 00:32:28,880 --> 00:32:30,520 Speaker 1: mission of the work that I do. But like, at 542 00:32:30,520 --> 00:32:33,040 Speaker 1: the same time, I'm just having a good time. I'm 543 00:32:33,080 --> 00:32:35,960 Speaker 1: just having a good time, you know. Yeah, sometimes I'm serious, 544 00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:40,360 Speaker 1: sometimes I'm partying. Um. And I do like that a 545 00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:45,480 Speaker 1: lot about her life. Like I feel like, despite the 546 00:32:45,480 --> 00:32:48,160 Speaker 1: the sensationalism of the way that people talk about her 547 00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:50,480 Speaker 1: social lie life it is, it does feel nice to 548 00:32:50,520 --> 00:32:54,360 Speaker 1: be able to see that convergence of paying attention to 549 00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:56,720 Speaker 1: movement and what was happening in activism at the time, 550 00:32:56,760 --> 00:33:00,400 Speaker 1: and also like the the glamour and the glitz Sinda 551 00:33:01,240 --> 00:33:03,200 Speaker 1: and the fun that was had at the same time. 552 00:33:03,880 --> 00:33:05,760 Speaker 1: She lived her life with a full and she did 553 00:33:05,800 --> 00:33:10,440 Speaker 1: not hesitate to love and I appreciate that, Like that's 554 00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:13,000 Speaker 1: a thing, you know, instead of being scarred by or 555 00:33:13,360 --> 00:33:16,440 Speaker 1: being in a part of being in mourning, She's like, 556 00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:19,400 Speaker 1: I'm gonna I'm gonna keep loving people. And I'm like Yeah, 557 00:33:19,960 --> 00:33:22,000 Speaker 1: that's hard to do. That's hard to do when you 558 00:33:22,040 --> 00:33:24,720 Speaker 1: get banked up in a relationship to pick yourself back 559 00:33:24,800 --> 00:33:28,080 Speaker 1: up and to continue forward and to really beliecause to 560 00:33:28,160 --> 00:33:30,400 Speaker 1: be married, to really think this is it, this is 561 00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:34,080 Speaker 1: It's like, Wow, that's a lot of hope. But I 562 00:33:34,120 --> 00:33:40,680 Speaker 1: don't have that's telling me. I guess I like that though. 563 00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:43,080 Speaker 1: That's a that's a that's a pool quote. But somebody 564 00:33:43,080 --> 00:33:46,120 Speaker 1: can put that in their wall next to live laugh love. Yes, 565 00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:56,920 Speaker 1: don't hesitate to love. Somebody please make this first of answer. 566 00:33:57,880 --> 00:34:01,320 Speaker 1: She can sleep on it, please you might well like 567 00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:03,920 Speaker 1: this is like the quote at the end of Practical Magic, 568 00:34:03,920 --> 00:34:05,880 Speaker 1: Which will we do? I just watched the First Time 569 00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:14,439 Speaker 1: Fall in Love as often as you can see all together. Yes, yes, 570 00:34:14,680 --> 00:34:17,080 Speaker 1: she seems like a Norah Holt. Seems like she was 571 00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:19,359 Speaker 1: the embody of it of work hard, play hard, and 572 00:34:19,400 --> 00:34:26,160 Speaker 1: also like she was the life of the party. So yeah, 573 00:34:26,200 --> 00:34:29,279 Speaker 1: anything else you want to add before we close out? No, 574 00:34:29,800 --> 00:34:33,560 Speaker 1: that is all that's all for me. All right, Well, 575 00:34:33,680 --> 00:34:36,239 Speaker 1: thanks as always for being with us. Eves. Where can 576 00:34:36,360 --> 00:34:40,000 Speaker 1: the good listeners find you? You can find me online 577 00:34:40,040 --> 00:34:43,799 Speaker 1: at Eves jeffco on Twitter. I met not apologizing on Instagram. 578 00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:45,680 Speaker 1: You can also listen to some of the shows that 579 00:34:45,719 --> 00:34:48,360 Speaker 1: I've been on, like Unpopular, which is a show about 580 00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:52,000 Speaker 1: history and the cool things that people did and how 581 00:34:52,040 --> 00:34:54,760 Speaker 1: they got persecuted forward and hearing more about their stories. 582 00:34:54,960 --> 00:34:57,160 Speaker 1: Also on This Day in History Class, which is a 583 00:34:57,200 --> 00:35:00,919 Speaker 1: daily podcast about people in history and about the things 584 00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:04,560 Speaker 1: that happened in history. That can give you a little 585 00:35:04,600 --> 00:35:13,399 Speaker 1: offering of other historical happenings. And that is all for me, 586 00:35:14,360 --> 00:35:20,680 Speaker 1: and that is all I said. Good day. I said, 587 00:35:20,800 --> 00:35:25,200 Speaker 1: good day. If you listeners are like the contact us 588 00:35:25,400 --> 00:35:27,640 Speaker 1: you can or email is Stuff Media mom Stuff at 589 00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:29,799 Speaker 1: i heeart media dot com. You can also find us 590 00:35:29,800 --> 00:35:31,640 Speaker 1: on Instagram at Stuff I've Never Told You are on 591 00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:34,160 Speaker 1: Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast. Thanks as always to our 592 00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:37,520 Speaker 1: super producer Andrew Howard. Thanks and thanks to you for 593 00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:39,759 Speaker 1: listening Stuff I Never Told You to protection of I 594 00:35:39,840 --> 00:35:42,120 Speaker 1: Heart Radio. For more podcasts from my Heart Radio, visit 595 00:35:42,160 --> 00:35:44,360 Speaker 1: that i heeart radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever he 596 00:35:44,400 --> 00:35:45,560 Speaker 1: listened to your favorite shows.