1
00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:04,880
Speaker 1: Cool Zone Media.

2
00:00:05,040 --> 00:00:07,280
Speaker 2: Hello and welcome to Cool People who did cool stuff.

3
00:00:07,320 --> 00:00:09,639
Speaker 2: You're a weekly reminder that we live in hell. No wait,

4
00:00:10,000 --> 00:00:11,840
Speaker 2: that's unrelated the fact that we live in hell world.

5
00:00:11,920 --> 00:00:14,480
Speaker 2: You're a weekly reminder that when bad things are happening,

6
00:00:14,680 --> 00:00:19,599
Speaker 2: you could do good things because it's bad otherwise. Yes,

7
00:00:19,720 --> 00:00:22,919
Speaker 2: I'm your host, Margaret Kiljoy, and my guest today is

8
00:00:22,960 --> 00:00:25,360
Speaker 2: prop How are you hey man?

9
00:00:26,280 --> 00:00:29,440
Speaker 3: Uh well, where do we begin?

10
00:00:29,920 --> 00:00:30,080
Speaker 4: Yeah.

11
00:00:30,120 --> 00:00:32,480
Speaker 2: We're recording this at the end of January twenty twenty five,

12
00:00:32,680 --> 00:00:34,800
Speaker 2: so if you're listening in the future, this is either

13
00:00:34,800 --> 00:00:37,559
Speaker 2: a blissful time to look back at or just obviously

14
00:00:37,560 --> 00:00:38,560
Speaker 2: where everything went wrong.

15
00:00:38,760 --> 00:00:42,919
Speaker 3: I just don't know how many months January has. Why is.

16
00:00:44,360 --> 00:00:44,880
Speaker 4: Yeah?

17
00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:48,360
Speaker 5: I mean I'm excited for this because it's going to

18
00:00:48,400 --> 00:00:52,320
Speaker 5: be a sign that, like you said, in this hell

19
00:00:52,440 --> 00:00:54,560
Speaker 5: we live in, every once in a while there are

20
00:00:54,560 --> 00:00:56,440
Speaker 5: people that are tall drinks of water.

21
00:00:57,080 --> 00:01:01,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, people, people get shited done. In real bad times,

22
00:01:01,880 --> 00:01:05,279
Speaker 2: people get shit done like this month where your city

23
00:01:05,360 --> 00:01:09,319
Speaker 2: caught on fire and uh, nothing else bad happened.

24
00:01:10,560 --> 00:01:16,440
Speaker 5: I will say in spirit of cool people like from

25
00:01:16,680 --> 00:01:22,280
Speaker 5: street level to like even our government, like civics, like

26
00:01:22,959 --> 00:01:27,319
Speaker 5: people snapped into snapped into work. One thing we will

27
00:01:27,360 --> 00:01:33,360
Speaker 5: always say is La loves La and like we got busy,

28
00:01:34,160 --> 00:01:37,720
Speaker 5: Like we got busy. I am very impressed at how

29
00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:41,720
Speaker 5: fast we were already ready to go. But when by

30
00:01:41,760 --> 00:01:46,360
Speaker 5: the time the city bureocracy was able to like you know,

31
00:01:46,440 --> 00:01:48,080
Speaker 5: stand up all the stuff they needed to stand up,

32
00:01:48,120 --> 00:01:51,200
Speaker 5: we was already ready and like, yeah, there hasn't been

33
00:01:51,880 --> 00:01:54,440
Speaker 5: except for the rent price gouging.

34
00:01:54,160 --> 00:01:57,240
Speaker 2: But it's the people coming in after that do all

35
00:01:57,280 --> 00:01:57,760
Speaker 2: the damage.

36
00:01:57,760 --> 00:01:59,360
Speaker 3: It's the people coming in after. Yeah.

37
00:01:59,400 --> 00:02:03,800
Speaker 5: But like I've been like just so impressed dude, people,

38
00:02:03,880 --> 00:02:06,280
Speaker 5: Like I was in a spot where somebody learned Spanish

39
00:02:06,520 --> 00:02:09,440
Speaker 5: just so that they can communicate. Like it was super dope,

40
00:02:09,480 --> 00:02:10,880
Speaker 5: Like I was translating for a little bit, but then

41
00:02:10,919 --> 00:02:12,520
Speaker 5: after a while he was like, oh wait, I'm gonna learn,

42
00:02:12,639 --> 00:02:14,160
Speaker 5: So it was pretty dope.

43
00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:19,520
Speaker 2: Yeah fuck yeah yeah. Our producer is Sophie, who's also here.

44
00:02:19,600 --> 00:02:20,239
Speaker 2: Hi Sophie.

45
00:02:20,400 --> 00:02:20,560
Speaker 4: Hi.

46
00:02:21,520 --> 00:02:23,440
Speaker 1: Do you remember on our Q and A when somebody

47
00:02:23,520 --> 00:02:26,560
Speaker 1: was like asking us about sourdough bread and we were like,

48
00:02:26,639 --> 00:02:31,959
Speaker 1: we don't do that. I made sourdough bread. Boom.

49
00:02:32,080 --> 00:02:36,120
Speaker 2: Do you think the QA was part of your nod?

50
00:02:36,360 --> 00:02:39,120
Speaker 1: My wonderful friend Molly also Molly for listening. Hi Molly,

51
00:02:39,720 --> 00:02:42,440
Speaker 1: not Molly who works on cools. On different Molly. Also

52
00:02:42,480 --> 00:02:44,800
Speaker 1: great Molly. Oh, there's good Molly's.

53
00:02:44,360 --> 00:02:45,120
Speaker 3: A lot of Molly's.

54
00:02:45,240 --> 00:02:46,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, Molly's a pretty good Yeah.

55
00:02:46,919 --> 00:02:49,359
Speaker 3: I don't mind him. Molly crazy drug though.

56
00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:50,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, as I say, I've had a little bit of

57
00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:51,440
Speaker 2: fun on Molly.

58
00:02:51,440 --> 00:02:56,800
Speaker 1: But Molly Trefacta was like, take this cooking class with me,

59
00:02:56,840 --> 00:02:59,440
Speaker 1: and we signed up like two months ago and we

60
00:02:59,480 --> 00:03:00,760
Speaker 1: took this class.

61
00:03:01,280 --> 00:03:02,760
Speaker 5: There are a lot of things you can make fun

62
00:03:02,800 --> 00:03:05,519
Speaker 5: of about Portland, and then there's other stuff that like, yeah,

63
00:03:05,560 --> 00:03:06,440
Speaker 5: but that's kind of dope.

64
00:03:06,800 --> 00:03:09,240
Speaker 1: No, it was very charm It was like very lovely,

65
00:03:10,000 --> 00:03:13,800
Speaker 1: but it was it was peak Portland, but in a

66
00:03:13,800 --> 00:03:14,240
Speaker 1: good way.

67
00:03:15,080 --> 00:03:17,000
Speaker 5: Yeah, you can make fun of Portland as much. Oh

68
00:03:17,040 --> 00:03:18,840
Speaker 5: my god, you're take a salarial class. It's like, actually,

69
00:03:18,919 --> 00:03:20,679
Speaker 5: sour dough is pretty delicious and it's pretty cool that

70
00:03:20,720 --> 00:03:22,280
Speaker 5: you could make it because we have gluten issues.

71
00:03:22,320 --> 00:03:27,280
Speaker 1: So yeah, exactly. And I took this class. I got

72
00:03:27,360 --> 00:03:30,560
Speaker 1: my starter, I got my dough, and I made soured

73
00:03:30,560 --> 00:03:33,760
Speaker 1: nough bread and I waited the like cool down period.

74
00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:36,080
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, it looks like bread. Is it bread?

75
00:03:36,080 --> 00:03:37,760
Speaker 1: Because it looked like bread. But I was like, does

76
00:03:37,800 --> 00:03:39,320
Speaker 1: it taste delicious?

77
00:03:39,560 --> 00:03:42,520
Speaker 2: So it looked real good. I got to see it.

78
00:03:42,680 --> 00:03:45,560
Speaker 2: None of you all can, only the three of us can.

79
00:03:45,920 --> 00:03:48,600
Speaker 5: It looks amazing. I ain't gonna hold you got the

80
00:03:48,680 --> 00:03:50,000
Speaker 5: nice crisp on top man.

81
00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:50,839
Speaker 3: Yeah it looks good.

82
00:03:50,960 --> 00:03:51,440
Speaker 4: Yeah.

83
00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:52,080
Speaker 6: Yeah.

84
00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:55,840
Speaker 1: So if anybody wants to message me to talk about bread, cool,

85
00:03:56,720 --> 00:03:58,360
Speaker 1: that's my that's my plug.

86
00:03:58,680 --> 00:04:02,240
Speaker 2: Which is saying a lot because normally Sophie doesn't want

87
00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:04,320
Speaker 2: to be messaged about whatever random thing you think. I've

88
00:04:04,320 --> 00:04:05,280
Speaker 2: all listening to this show.

89
00:04:05,560 --> 00:04:06,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, but I really like.

90
00:04:06,640 --> 00:04:09,240
Speaker 1: But I really like when people are like, no, like

91
00:04:09,440 --> 00:04:13,400
Speaker 1: I know this shit, this is my take, and I'm like, okay, yeah, I.

92
00:04:13,320 --> 00:04:15,120
Speaker 3: Can appreciate that when you know what you're talking.

93
00:04:15,000 --> 00:04:17,520
Speaker 1: About, because I took one class and I made bread

94
00:04:17,560 --> 00:04:19,680
Speaker 1: once and I was like, wow, I'm amazing.

95
00:04:20,480 --> 00:04:23,080
Speaker 3: I am a baker, you know what.

96
00:04:23,120 --> 00:04:26,800
Speaker 5: Actually, somebody DMed me on some like correcting some history

97
00:04:26,839 --> 00:04:30,040
Speaker 5: stuff that I like, appreciate it.

98
00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:32,719
Speaker 3: Most of the time. I'm like, I have a degree

99
00:04:32,720 --> 00:04:33,680
Speaker 3: in this stuff.

100
00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:36,040
Speaker 5: So like, uh, you want to you want to pick

101
00:04:36,520 --> 00:04:39,039
Speaker 5: a write off camera one of the nine books on

102
00:04:39,080 --> 00:04:41,200
Speaker 5: the topic that you talk about, But this time I

103
00:04:41,279 --> 00:04:45,200
Speaker 5: was like, shit, actually, am I stay corrected?

104
00:04:45,279 --> 00:04:45,679
Speaker 4: Okay?

105
00:04:46,279 --> 00:04:48,320
Speaker 3: You know, so I appreciate what somebody knows what they're

106
00:04:48,320 --> 00:04:49,200
Speaker 3: talking about, you know.

107
00:04:49,960 --> 00:04:52,200
Speaker 2: I really like because I cover things all the time

108
00:04:52,240 --> 00:04:56,279
Speaker 2: that are like not my background or experience, right, you know,

109
00:04:56,360 --> 00:04:59,120
Speaker 2: and I'm like, I hope I'm doing right by the

110
00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:01,119
Speaker 2: people of the play. So I'm talking about the history

111
00:05:01,160 --> 00:05:03,000
Speaker 2: of because that's all I can hope to do and

112
00:05:03,040 --> 00:05:06,080
Speaker 2: hearing from people and sometimes they're like, hey, you got

113
00:05:06,080 --> 00:05:07,600
Speaker 2: it like ninety percent right, and I'm like, you know what,

114
00:05:07,640 --> 00:05:08,280
Speaker 2: I'll take it.

115
00:05:08,440 --> 00:05:09,960
Speaker 3: You know, yeah, totally.

116
00:05:10,400 --> 00:05:13,040
Speaker 2: And usually it's a it's more of a like, oh,

117
00:05:13,040 --> 00:05:14,760
Speaker 2: that's one way that people usually talk about it, but

118
00:05:14,800 --> 00:05:16,360
Speaker 2: it's actually kind of like this, and I'm like, well

119
00:05:16,440 --> 00:05:17,440
Speaker 2: that's amazing, you know.

120
00:05:18,040 --> 00:05:19,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, makes you want to do it again, huh.

121
00:05:19,680 --> 00:05:19,880
Speaker 4: I know.

122
00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:21,480
Speaker 3: For me, I'm like, damn, I want to record again,

123
00:05:21,600 --> 00:05:21,800
Speaker 3: I know.

124
00:05:21,839 --> 00:05:23,279
Speaker 2: And it makes me like wish I could just kind

125
00:05:23,279 --> 00:05:26,600
Speaker 2: of stay in a topic for like months, but I

126
00:05:26,640 --> 00:05:28,680
Speaker 2: would actually get bored. My brain doesn't work that way.

127
00:05:28,720 --> 00:05:31,600
Speaker 3: We all would, Yeah, it'd be the worst. Speaking of which,

128
00:05:32,200 --> 00:05:34,520
Speaker 3: I might have left the stove on give me a second.

129
00:05:37,000 --> 00:05:38,080
Speaker 2: La burns down again.

130
00:05:39,560 --> 00:05:43,640
Speaker 3: Nope, cool. Everything's fine. Please keep this in.

131
00:05:44,360 --> 00:05:50,160
Speaker 2: All right, all right, So let's see our audio engineer

132
00:05:50,240 --> 00:05:52,440
Speaker 2: is Rory. Everyone wants to say hi to Rory. Hi Rory.

133
00:05:52,720 --> 00:05:56,680
Speaker 3: So Rory. I never met Rory.

134
00:05:57,560 --> 00:05:59,919
Speaker 1: Rory is so cool? Sorry, Hi Roy. I was like,

135
00:06:00,080 --> 00:06:04,640
Speaker 1: Rory's really cool guy. Ory has a very good looking dog, okay,

136
00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:08,200
Speaker 1: and Rory has has a cool beard AFFECTA.

137
00:06:08,320 --> 00:06:10,480
Speaker 2: That's that's my that's good things.

138
00:06:10,600 --> 00:06:12,960
Speaker 1: That's all the Internet gets to know about Rory.

139
00:06:13,560 --> 00:06:15,640
Speaker 2: Where Yeah, that's that might even be more than the

140
00:06:15,680 --> 00:06:16,680
Speaker 2: Internet should now, but.

141
00:06:17,080 --> 00:06:19,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, I agree, but you would like him, prop.

142
00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:21,160
Speaker 3: I like that.

143
00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:24,360
Speaker 2: Our theme musical was written for us by un woman

144
00:06:25,000 --> 00:06:26,520
Speaker 2: and prop.

145
00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:27,279
Speaker 4: Yeah.

146
00:06:27,320 --> 00:06:29,120
Speaker 2: You know, I saw among the things that the government

147
00:06:29,160 --> 00:06:33,440
Speaker 2: decided to shut down, besides everything else, was the celebration

148
00:06:33,520 --> 00:06:38,680
Speaker 2: of DEI holidays like Black History Month. Oh yeah, what's

149
00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:43,240
Speaker 2: your opinion about Black History Month? A?

150
00:06:45,480 --> 00:06:47,600
Speaker 5: Well, first of all, yeah, I remember jun teenth wasn't

151
00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:50,800
Speaker 5: a holiday until two years ago. And it's not like

152
00:06:50,839 --> 00:06:58,400
Speaker 5: we wasn't celebrating it. I feel like I feel about it.

153
00:06:58,400 --> 00:07:01,360
Speaker 5: It's historical importance. You know, I'm the child of the

154
00:07:01,400 --> 00:07:03,960
Speaker 5: Black panther, so we always go hard on Black History Month.

155
00:07:04,040 --> 00:07:06,640
Speaker 5: So like there's a part of me that will always

156
00:07:06,680 --> 00:07:10,720
Speaker 5: appreciate it. I love anytime that as corny as it

157
00:07:11,000 --> 00:07:13,440
Speaker 5: or as like vapid as it might be, it's still

158
00:07:13,520 --> 00:07:17,119
Speaker 5: pushing to the front things the stuff that I've swam

159
00:07:17,160 --> 00:07:19,880
Speaker 5: in my whole life, and you know, understandings of obviously

160
00:07:19,880 --> 00:07:22,120
Speaker 5: it could stand to be deeper. I don't get into

161
00:07:22,120 --> 00:07:23,880
Speaker 5: the whole like why I got to be the shortest

162
00:07:23,880 --> 00:07:26,200
Speaker 5: month or a year, you know what I'm saying. But

163
00:07:28,720 --> 00:07:33,400
Speaker 5: I know I, as a black child, benefited from having

164
00:07:34,360 --> 00:07:36,080
Speaker 5: this month happened, you know.

165
00:07:36,680 --> 00:07:41,280
Speaker 3: But at the end of the day, like I don't whatever,

166
00:07:42,000 --> 00:07:44,720
Speaker 3: you know, like yeah, whatever, like you're not.

167
00:07:44,800 --> 00:07:46,560
Speaker 5: What are you gonna You're gonna hang your kin take

168
00:07:46,600 --> 00:07:53,520
Speaker 5: cloths at at you know, at the Southwest Airlines, like

169
00:07:53,520 --> 00:07:55,120
Speaker 5: like at the gate, Like you go to the gate,

170
00:07:55,160 --> 00:07:57,000
Speaker 5: they got a can't take cloth on it, you know

171
00:07:57,040 --> 00:08:00,480
Speaker 5: what I'm saying, Like I'm like, cool, thanks exist.

172
00:08:00,800 --> 00:08:03,560
Speaker 2: You know, I didn't forget we exist.

173
00:08:03,640 --> 00:08:05,080
Speaker 3: But yeah, I didn't forget we existed.

174
00:08:05,200 --> 00:08:07,600
Speaker 5: I'm glad that you took a second to you know,

175
00:08:08,800 --> 00:08:12,560
Speaker 5: design your I don't know, it's like it's you get

176
00:08:12,560 --> 00:08:15,560
Speaker 5: so many years away from it, Like it's hard, right

177
00:08:15,560 --> 00:08:18,160
Speaker 5: because in its inception, You're like, this was amazing, even

178
00:08:18,200 --> 00:08:21,120
Speaker 5: just June teams becoming a national holiday. It's like, well,

179
00:08:21,120 --> 00:08:24,720
Speaker 5: how about some healthcare and some reparations, But at the

180
00:08:24,760 --> 00:08:26,880
Speaker 5: same time it's important.

181
00:08:26,920 --> 00:08:28,400
Speaker 3: It's like, you know what I'm saying, But like you.

182
00:08:28,320 --> 00:08:29,880
Speaker 5: Can once you get a few years away from it,

183
00:08:29,960 --> 00:08:31,840
Speaker 5: You're like, I hate to be. What I'm trying to

184
00:08:31,840 --> 00:08:35,199
Speaker 5: say is I hate to be the like privileged generation

185
00:08:35,880 --> 00:08:38,440
Speaker 5: that didn't have to fight for it, that don't see

186
00:08:38,440 --> 00:08:40,839
Speaker 5: its importance now, you know what I'm saying. Like that's

187
00:08:40,840 --> 00:08:43,880
Speaker 5: always like the hard part for me because it's like whatever.

188
00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:48,040
Speaker 5: But like if I were, you know, with Abernathy on

189
00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:50,280
Speaker 5: the Bridge, you know what I'm saying, I would be like,

190
00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:55,439
Speaker 5: nigg you go celebrate this like it's I mean, yeah, yeah.

191
00:08:55,040 --> 00:08:57,040
Speaker 2: No, it makes sense to me because I've always like,

192
00:08:57,040 --> 00:08:58,679
Speaker 2: like with this podcast, I was like, well, I'm not

193
00:08:58,679 --> 00:09:01,559
Speaker 2: going to specifically set asp and do black history in

194
00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:04,120
Speaker 2: February because I'm trying to cover black history. Because because

195
00:09:04,120 --> 00:09:06,560
Speaker 2: if you try and cover radical history in the Western

196
00:09:06,559 --> 00:09:09,160
Speaker 2: hemisphere and you don't talk about black history an awful lot,

197
00:09:09,200 --> 00:09:11,120
Speaker 2: you're failing, right.

198
00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:12,200
Speaker 3: Not covering radical history.

199
00:09:12,240 --> 00:09:14,559
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And so like and so that was the

200
00:09:14,640 --> 00:09:16,400
Speaker 2: kind of my attitude going into it. But I was

201
00:09:16,960 --> 00:09:19,160
Speaker 2: I was thinking about how because you know, I asked

202
00:09:19,160 --> 00:09:21,800
Speaker 2: you a while ago about today's topic, and I was

203
00:09:21,800 --> 00:09:24,040
Speaker 2: thinking about Black History Month, where I was like, now

204
00:09:24,040 --> 00:09:26,360
Speaker 2: they're trying to take it away, and now I'm like, well,

205
00:09:26,400 --> 00:09:27,400
Speaker 2: never mind.

206
00:09:27,520 --> 00:09:29,240
Speaker 3: Well now we got to crank that soldier boy. You

207
00:09:29,240 --> 00:09:32,920
Speaker 3: know what I'm saying. Now it's different. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

208
00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:35,000
Speaker 3: I didn't care until you tried to take it. Yeah.

209
00:09:35,320 --> 00:09:37,880
Speaker 3: Now like oh okay, well now I'm never leaving.

210
00:09:38,360 --> 00:09:41,880
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, And like you know, because I mean, you know,

211
00:09:41,880 --> 00:09:44,480
Speaker 2: I was also afraid of like being corny by being

212
00:09:44,559 --> 00:09:46,320
Speaker 2: like a white girl being like all right, I'm gonna

213
00:09:46,360 --> 00:09:48,040
Speaker 2: make sure that February is this, and then I just

214
00:09:48,080 --> 00:09:50,319
Speaker 2: sort of figure like again, like as long as I

215
00:09:50,400 --> 00:09:52,040
Speaker 2: cover Black history, like.

216
00:09:52,400 --> 00:09:56,079
Speaker 5: Yeah, you know, it's also like to your point as like, oh,

217
00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:59,360
Speaker 5: white girl's doing the black history thing. Like the thing

218
00:09:59,400 --> 00:10:02,400
Speaker 5: about our culture and I'm gonna say specifically like Black

219
00:10:02,400 --> 00:10:06,960
Speaker 5: American culture is like we're very much alike once you

220
00:10:07,040 --> 00:10:09,360
Speaker 5: give us a reason to once you're in your in

221
00:10:10,040 --> 00:10:12,240
Speaker 5: like when we love you, we love you, you know,

222
00:10:12,440 --> 00:10:14,240
Speaker 5: and it's just you're one of us, you're part of

223
00:10:14,280 --> 00:10:16,120
Speaker 5: the squad. You have to go out of your way

224
00:10:16,280 --> 00:10:19,959
Speaker 5: for us to be like all right, nah, you good,

225
00:10:20,000 --> 00:10:22,120
Speaker 5: Like you have to you have to really be out

226
00:10:22,160 --> 00:10:26,600
Speaker 5: of pocket for black community to stop like showing you grace,

227
00:10:26,800 --> 00:10:27,400
Speaker 5: you know what I mean.

228
00:10:28,600 --> 00:10:30,199
Speaker 3: So for somebody like.

229
00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:34,760
Speaker 5: Yourself who's like continuously has shown proven that you part

230
00:10:34,800 --> 00:10:36,439
Speaker 5: of part of the solution, you know what I mean?

231
00:10:36,440 --> 00:10:38,520
Speaker 5: Saying same I say with like Robert and Sophie like

232
00:10:38,559 --> 00:10:41,760
Speaker 5: they've you've proven it already, you know what I mean. So, like,

233
00:10:42,360 --> 00:10:44,600
Speaker 5: you know, for you to slip up here and there

234
00:10:44,720 --> 00:10:47,679
Speaker 5: forget this reference not knowing whatever, dog like nah, they

235
00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:49,760
Speaker 5: you know, they solid, you know what I mean. So

236
00:10:49,840 --> 00:10:52,800
Speaker 5: I feel like if you, like I would trust that

237
00:10:52,880 --> 00:10:55,280
Speaker 5: you're reasoning to being like, we're gonna make this Black

238
00:10:55,360 --> 00:10:58,360
Speaker 5: History Month is because of what you just said.

239
00:10:58,400 --> 00:11:01,280
Speaker 3: Well, since y'all trying to take it, watch this, you

240
00:11:01,320 --> 00:11:02,319
Speaker 3: know what I mean? Right?

241
00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:04,240
Speaker 2: And I was planning on doing this, and then I

242
00:11:04,280 --> 00:11:05,480
Speaker 2: was like, oh, I guess this is gonna be the

243
00:11:05,480 --> 00:11:07,400
Speaker 2: first thing that's going to come out in February. And

244
00:11:07,440 --> 00:11:09,240
Speaker 2: it still wasn't a like Black History Month thing. But

245
00:11:09,280 --> 00:11:11,280
Speaker 2: then I was just looking at that Executive order and

246
00:11:11,280 --> 00:11:12,680
Speaker 2: I'm like, what are you talking about?

247
00:11:12,720 --> 00:11:14,560
Speaker 3: You can't take that away? What do you like?

248
00:11:14,600 --> 00:11:18,559
Speaker 5: And no one's gonna like why do we get days

249
00:11:18,600 --> 00:11:19,720
Speaker 5: off in Black History Month?

250
00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:21,320
Speaker 3: Like what what did you go?

251
00:11:21,559 --> 00:11:21,640
Speaker 5: Like?

252
00:11:21,679 --> 00:11:22,680
Speaker 3: How you go and force this?

253
00:11:23,240 --> 00:11:26,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it doesn't it doesn't cost anything, like you

254
00:11:26,720 --> 00:11:30,520
Speaker 2: dont all like you just get to I mean my

255
00:11:30,600 --> 00:11:32,240
Speaker 2: problem with it. It had always been like, oh, it's like

256
00:11:32,240 --> 00:11:34,280
Speaker 2: an easy way for people to feel better about the

257
00:11:34,280 --> 00:11:37,280
Speaker 2: fact that eleven months are White History Month, you know, yeah,

258
00:11:37,400 --> 00:11:41,240
Speaker 2: totally like but this topic, which you know what I'm

259
00:11:41,240 --> 00:11:42,640
Speaker 2: going to talk about, but the audience still, well, no,

260
00:11:42,679 --> 00:11:43,640
Speaker 2: that's not true. They know what it is.

261
00:11:43,640 --> 00:11:46,079
Speaker 3: They read the title description the thing already.

262
00:11:46,240 --> 00:11:46,920
Speaker 6: Yeah.

263
00:11:47,040 --> 00:11:48,840
Speaker 2: There's been a couple of topics that since I first

264
00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:50,760
Speaker 2: pitched this show, I knew I wanted to talk about

265
00:11:50,760 --> 00:11:52,400
Speaker 2: I want to talk about the Russian Civil War, I

266
00:11:52,400 --> 00:11:54,000
Speaker 2: want to talk about the Spanish Civil War. And I

267
00:11:54,040 --> 00:11:59,040
Speaker 2: wanted to talk about the Haitian Revolution. Yeah, because as

268
00:11:59,040 --> 00:12:03,160
Speaker 2: soon as I started doing episodes about abolitionism in the US,

269
00:12:04,320 --> 00:12:07,440
Speaker 2: I was like, oh, the Haitian Revolution scared the shit

270
00:12:07,480 --> 00:12:09,240
Speaker 2: out of all of the racists.

271
00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:16,000
Speaker 5: Yes, yeah, Oh, they was like, oh boy, we better Yeah,

272
00:12:16,200 --> 00:12:17,000
Speaker 5: because it worked.

273
00:12:17,280 --> 00:12:17,520
Speaker 3: Yeah.

274
00:12:18,240 --> 00:12:22,080
Speaker 2: Yeah. It cast a shadow across the minds of slavers everywhere.

275
00:12:22,400 --> 00:12:25,480
Speaker 2: It was perhaps the first glimpse of what the future

276
00:12:25,559 --> 00:12:29,680
Speaker 2: held in store for them. One day, slavers everywhere would

277
00:12:29,679 --> 00:12:33,360
Speaker 2: be strung up and killed. Yeah, and uh it scared

278
00:12:33,360 --> 00:12:35,719
Speaker 2: the shit out of kings and presidents, and politics in

279
00:12:35,760 --> 00:12:37,560
Speaker 2: the Western world would never be the same.

280
00:12:38,080 --> 00:12:38,360
Speaker 3: Yep.

281
00:12:39,720 --> 00:12:42,160
Speaker 2: Unfortunately, one major effect of it is that we'll talk

282
00:12:42,200 --> 00:12:43,480
Speaker 2: about the effects of it later at the end of

283
00:12:43,520 --> 00:12:46,480
Speaker 2: this four parter, but all the slave empires like shored

284
00:12:46,559 --> 00:12:49,800
Speaker 2: up their defenses and cracked down on enslaved people and abolitionists.

285
00:12:50,120 --> 00:12:53,400
Speaker 2: Yeah and uh fay quite famously, the entire Western world

286
00:12:53,440 --> 00:12:57,560
Speaker 2: is still out to destroy and punish shady and it's

287
00:12:57,640 --> 00:12:58,559
Speaker 2: not forgotten.

288
00:12:58,160 --> 00:13:00,680
Speaker 3: It to this day. Yeah. Yeah.

289
00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:03,200
Speaker 5: Like I was like, you'll probably talk about it, but

290
00:13:03,280 --> 00:13:06,319
Speaker 5: like we like they're still getting sanctions from that, right.

291
00:13:06,320 --> 00:13:10,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. That the the destruction, the the

292
00:13:11,080 --> 00:13:15,079
Speaker 2: economic punishment is just such a like it's even proof

293
00:13:15,120 --> 00:13:19,280
Speaker 2: that they like, well, they don't care about like capitalism

294
00:13:19,360 --> 00:13:23,200
Speaker 2: as a ideal of like yeah, once everyone's equal and

295
00:13:23,280 --> 00:13:25,959
Speaker 2: we all have markets, it's like, no, it's a tool

296
00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:30,280
Speaker 2: with which to punish people who they don't like. Yeah,

297
00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:33,079
Speaker 2: I'm curious coming into it. Okay, okay, do you have

298
00:13:33,240 --> 00:13:35,920
Speaker 2: like a what you know of the Haitian Revolution or

299
00:13:35,960 --> 00:13:37,439
Speaker 2: like battle standout things or.

300
00:13:38,000 --> 00:13:41,800
Speaker 3: Big yeah, big picture. I know the narrative. I know

301
00:13:41,840 --> 00:13:44,240
Speaker 3: the high points, a few names here and there.

302
00:13:44,720 --> 00:13:49,360
Speaker 5: Yeah, a few like sparse points, like the word zombie

303
00:13:50,040 --> 00:13:52,440
Speaker 5: you know comes from Haitian slaves, you know what I mean?

304
00:13:53,520 --> 00:13:58,920
Speaker 5: The history of voodoo as resistance, which really really baked

305
00:13:58,960 --> 00:14:02,280
Speaker 5: my noodle once. I like kind of it came out

306
00:14:02,280 --> 00:14:05,360
Speaker 5: of just the old traditional Baptist Black people's story to

307
00:14:05,480 --> 00:14:09,760
Speaker 5: be like, oh wait, this was resistance like kind.

308
00:14:09,559 --> 00:14:10,839
Speaker 3: Of changes everything, you know what I mean?

309
00:14:11,160 --> 00:14:14,440
Speaker 5: Yeah, and yeah, and just some of the like work

310
00:14:14,520 --> 00:14:17,600
Speaker 5: to continually destable. So like a lot of high points,

311
00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:20,280
Speaker 5: a few random facts, but I got to just at

312
00:14:20,280 --> 00:14:23,440
Speaker 5: a narrative. But I'm excited for to go through this specifically.

313
00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:24,440
Speaker 3: No, me too.

314
00:14:24,480 --> 00:14:27,560
Speaker 2: And what's funny is I know because I haven't finished

315
00:14:27,560 --> 00:14:30,080
Speaker 2: writing all four parts yet, So I know everything that

316
00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:33,080
Speaker 2: leads up to the revolution right now, and then I

317
00:14:33,080 --> 00:14:35,360
Speaker 2: know a lot of the middle stuff and the end stuff,

318
00:14:35,400 --> 00:14:37,720
Speaker 2: but I don't know all of it yet because there's

319
00:14:37,800 --> 00:14:39,160
Speaker 2: a big fucking topic.

320
00:14:39,800 --> 00:14:43,280
Speaker 5: Yeah, there's a strange I've talked about on one of

321
00:14:43,320 --> 00:14:47,600
Speaker 5: our shows, just this sort of thing around just like

322
00:14:47,640 --> 00:14:52,680
Speaker 5: the African diaspora around like the pride some of the

323
00:14:52,680 --> 00:14:56,600
Speaker 5: Central American black people feel, Caribbean black people feel, and

324
00:14:56,600 --> 00:15:00,640
Speaker 5: then African black people feel. That's different than like the

325
00:15:00,920 --> 00:15:03,600
Speaker 5: black people of the United States in the sense that

326
00:15:04,200 --> 00:15:06,040
Speaker 5: in a lot of ways, like they looked at us

327
00:15:06,120 --> 00:15:10,600
Speaker 5: like you didn't throw off your yeah, your owners, so

328
00:15:10,680 --> 00:15:12,520
Speaker 5: they kind of looked at us like, well, y'all a

329
00:15:12,560 --> 00:15:14,680
Speaker 5: little weak, you know what I'm saying, Like we we

330
00:15:14,720 --> 00:15:16,000
Speaker 5: got free, you know.

331
00:15:16,680 --> 00:15:19,000
Speaker 3: So there's there's there has.

332
00:15:18,920 --> 00:15:22,240
Speaker 5: Been sort of a historical kind of like little thing

333
00:15:22,440 --> 00:15:26,440
Speaker 5: like inside of sort of those communities, and then when

334
00:15:26,480 --> 00:15:30,880
Speaker 5: they come here us kind of being like, well, you

335
00:15:30,960 --> 00:15:32,360
Speaker 5: kind of didn't go through what you went through.

336
00:15:32,520 --> 00:15:35,480
Speaker 3: You speak patois, you know what I'm saying.

337
00:15:35,520 --> 00:15:39,200
Speaker 5: It's kind of French, you know, like you're not you're

338
00:15:39,200 --> 00:15:40,880
Speaker 5: not black people like we black people, you know what

339
00:15:40,920 --> 00:15:43,440
Speaker 5: I'm saying, which is foolish, you know what I'm saying.

340
00:15:43,480 --> 00:15:46,000
Speaker 3: But but that became kind of a.

341
00:15:45,960 --> 00:15:48,640
Speaker 5: Thing of just like American black people like y'all didn't

342
00:15:48,640 --> 00:15:49,600
Speaker 5: throw off y'all captors.

343
00:15:49,800 --> 00:15:55,560
Speaker 3: So yeah, you're not like us. You know, it's very subtle.

344
00:15:56,320 --> 00:15:58,400
Speaker 5: You know, a lot of that stuff's been worked out since,

345
00:15:58,560 --> 00:16:00,120
Speaker 5: but that's always kind of been a thing.

346
00:16:00,560 --> 00:16:03,120
Speaker 2: It's funny because I have this like defensiveness where I'm like,

347
00:16:04,200 --> 00:16:07,720
Speaker 2: but y'all tried, like it's like very much at least

348
00:16:07,760 --> 00:16:09,720
Speaker 2: as hard as anyone else. And there's a lot of dude,

349
00:16:09,840 --> 00:16:13,400
Speaker 2: there's a lot of luck in the Haitian Revolution. Yeah,

350
00:16:13,440 --> 00:16:16,520
Speaker 2: and like infinite amounts of sacrifice and work, don't get

351
00:16:16,520 --> 00:16:17,960
Speaker 2: me wrong, totally.

352
00:16:18,080 --> 00:16:21,120
Speaker 5: Yeah, being much more mature now, it's like you can't.

353
00:16:21,160 --> 00:16:22,720
Speaker 3: First of all, they are us.

354
00:16:23,160 --> 00:16:25,480
Speaker 5: You just got off the bus, you know, you just

355
00:16:25,560 --> 00:16:27,640
Speaker 5: bought up on a on a train stop earlier than us.

356
00:16:27,640 --> 00:16:31,280
Speaker 5: It's you are us, So it's foolish to have divisions

357
00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:33,840
Speaker 5: among us. Anyway, that division was given to us by

358
00:16:33,920 --> 00:16:36,200
Speaker 5: our captors. So there's that, you know what I mean.

359
00:16:36,360 --> 00:16:38,720
Speaker 5: And then secondly it's like, yeah, it's just they're two

360
00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:40,920
Speaker 5: different worlds. It's two different times, it's two different things.

361
00:16:40,960 --> 00:16:43,600
Speaker 5: Like you can't you can't really compare the two anyway.

362
00:16:43,840 --> 00:16:46,840
Speaker 2: No, No, it makes sense. Yeah, I am guessing that

363
00:16:46,880 --> 00:16:49,600
Speaker 2: if people have heard of one figure of the Haitian Revolution.

364
00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:51,120
Speaker 2: It's too soon of a tour.

365
00:16:51,720 --> 00:16:52,080
Speaker 3: M hm.

366
00:16:52,320 --> 00:16:54,280
Speaker 2: He was this unlikely enough hero. We're not really going

367
00:16:54,320 --> 00:16:57,040
Speaker 2: to supergendom this week. He's more of next week. He's

368
00:16:57,120 --> 00:16:59,520
Speaker 2: unlikely hero because he's sort of may or may not

369
00:16:59,560 --> 00:17:01,840
Speaker 2: have been a Catholic. People like to argue about it.

370
00:17:01,840 --> 00:17:04,600
Speaker 2: He was born enslaved. Eventually he's going to be a

371
00:17:04,640 --> 00:17:08,640
Speaker 2: freed overseer and potentially kind of a slaver himself, depending

372
00:17:08,680 --> 00:17:12,000
Speaker 2: on which version of the history you read. And he

373
00:17:12,160 --> 00:17:16,000
Speaker 2: is actually a really conservative figure, but he's not who

374
00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:18,000
Speaker 2: we're going to start with. We'll talk more about him,

375
00:17:18,000 --> 00:17:19,359
Speaker 2: but we're gonna talk about a bunch of other people

376
00:17:19,359 --> 00:17:22,000
Speaker 2: that I find super interesting, and Vodu is going to

377
00:17:22,040 --> 00:17:25,560
Speaker 2: be one of the main pieces of context that we're

378
00:17:25,560 --> 00:17:29,280
Speaker 2: going to talk about today. Yeah, but first we're going

379
00:17:29,320 --> 00:17:32,880
Speaker 2: to talk about Hispaniola, which is not what it should

380
00:17:32,880 --> 00:17:35,000
Speaker 2: be called. It actually should be called Haiti in the

381
00:17:35,359 --> 00:17:39,879
Speaker 2: Taino language. But there's an island called Hispaniola. It's the

382
00:17:39,960 --> 00:17:43,680
Speaker 2: second largest island in the Caribbean after Cuba, and it's

383
00:17:43,720 --> 00:17:47,760
Speaker 2: the most populous right now. It is divided into two countries.

384
00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:50,280
Speaker 2: Haiti is the western third of the country. The Dominican

385
00:17:50,280 --> 00:17:54,119
Speaker 2: Republic is the eastern two thirds. The Dominican Republic speaks

386
00:17:54,119 --> 00:17:58,879
Speaker 2: Spanish primarily, Haiti speaks French and Creole. People have been

387
00:17:58,920 --> 00:18:02,480
Speaker 2: living there for several thousand years. At least the Tano

388
00:18:02,520 --> 00:18:05,040
Speaker 2: people lived there, and they had a bunch of different

389
00:18:05,119 --> 00:18:07,359
Speaker 2: names for the island. One of them was Iedi, And

390
00:18:07,400 --> 00:18:11,639
Speaker 2: then there's like we don't really know. There's like there's

391
00:18:11,680 --> 00:18:15,359
Speaker 2: three people saying what the original indigenous name of this

392
00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:17,359
Speaker 2: island is. They're all white people, and there's like so

393
00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:19,119
Speaker 2: there's like three people saying it, and one of them

394
00:18:19,200 --> 00:18:21,480
Speaker 2: like ID was just the western half, and one person

395
00:18:21,560 --> 00:18:23,159
Speaker 2: was like AD was just the eastern half, and one

396
00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:25,439
Speaker 2: person is like eighty was all of it. Yeah, but

397
00:18:25,920 --> 00:18:29,440
Speaker 2: to save us the trouble, we're gonna call it aid

398
00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:33,560
Speaker 2: the Land of High Mountains. There were thousands of people

399
00:18:33,640 --> 00:18:36,840
Speaker 2: living there, tens of thousands or nearly a million, depending

400
00:18:36,840 --> 00:18:41,119
Speaker 2: on your sources, living in five different kingdoms. And I

401
00:18:41,160 --> 00:18:42,800
Speaker 2: always feel like it's like, I mean, one, it's alway

402
00:18:42,800 --> 00:18:44,720
Speaker 2: worthking about indigenous people anywhere, But also you just have

403
00:18:44,760 --> 00:18:48,600
Speaker 2: this like fucking Tara Nalis idea of like, uh huh,

404
00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:50,520
Speaker 2: this place is empty or there's just like a couple

405
00:18:50,560 --> 00:18:52,959
Speaker 2: people living there and they don't have a society, and

406
00:18:53,040 --> 00:18:55,040
Speaker 2: like that's not fucking true.

407
00:18:55,640 --> 00:18:57,200
Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, a million people.

408
00:18:57,359 --> 00:19:00,320
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, five different fucking kingdoms.

409
00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:03,760
Speaker 3: Like yeah, very long history, guys, Yeah, so funny.

410
00:19:03,840 --> 00:19:07,320
Speaker 5: You're just like, well, they've existed as long as y'all

411
00:19:07,400 --> 00:19:08,040
Speaker 5: have existed.

412
00:19:08,560 --> 00:19:11,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, Like what the hell you mean? A new world?

413
00:19:11,280 --> 00:19:17,040
Speaker 5: Like, yeah, been here as long as you have Yeah.

414
00:19:15,359 --> 00:19:17,119
Speaker 2: Oh you know what else has been here the whole time.

415
00:19:18,400 --> 00:19:22,960
Speaker 2: Ads just waiting over our shoulder, waiting to show up

416
00:19:23,119 --> 00:19:24,680
Speaker 2: and to try and convince you to gamble, which you

417
00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:25,639
Speaker 2: probably shouldn't do.

418
00:19:26,280 --> 00:19:36,720
Speaker 6: Yes, here's the ads, and we're.

419
00:19:36,600 --> 00:19:40,040
Speaker 2: Back if you want to have fun gambling. I'm not

420
00:19:40,119 --> 00:19:42,760
Speaker 2: mad at you. It's just on the long enough timeline.

421
00:19:42,800 --> 00:19:44,360
Speaker 2: It's not a way to get rich.

422
00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:46,679
Speaker 5: If you make it just a line item, Like, make

423
00:19:46,720 --> 00:19:49,840
Speaker 5: it a line item in your we're budgeting, you got

424
00:19:49,880 --> 00:19:53,560
Speaker 5: five hundred bucks that you're okay with spending, Just do that.

425
00:19:53,720 --> 00:19:55,399
Speaker 3: I'm sorry. My hands raised.

426
00:19:58,760 --> 00:20:02,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, a little h hand icon has appeared in props

427
00:20:02,600 --> 00:20:03,760
Speaker 2: windows or is it?

428
00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:04,840
Speaker 3: Hey, guys, can I talk?

429
00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:07,119
Speaker 1: I have no idea how to get rid of that,

430
00:20:07,560 --> 00:20:09,160
Speaker 1: And so it just looks like you're going.

431
00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:12,199
Speaker 5: Ex me and then my shining says, it looks like

432
00:20:12,200 --> 00:20:16,240
Speaker 5: you're done talking. We'll lower your hand in three seconds.

433
00:20:16,280 --> 00:20:19,160
Speaker 2: One, okay, it's gone. Now okay, so I could talk again.

434
00:20:19,160 --> 00:20:20,520
Speaker 2: I had to wait a right, I at least.

435
00:20:20,280 --> 00:20:21,080
Speaker 3: It didn't lie.

436
00:20:21,359 --> 00:20:21,639
Speaker 2: Yeah.

437
00:20:21,840 --> 00:20:24,119
Speaker 4: Yeah.

438
00:20:24,480 --> 00:20:28,880
Speaker 2: On December sixth, fourteen ninety two, a white slaver arrived

439
00:20:28,920 --> 00:20:32,120
Speaker 2: on the shore of ied. He's a guy you might

440
00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:35,040
Speaker 2: have heard of. His name was Christopher Columbus.

441
00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:37,120
Speaker 3: Maybe you heard of.

442
00:20:37,080 --> 00:20:41,880
Speaker 2: Him, Yeah, And Europeans just started pouring into the place

443
00:20:41,920 --> 00:20:44,520
Speaker 2: that they called Insula Hispana and Latin because they were

444
00:20:44,520 --> 00:20:48,280
Speaker 2: still speaking Latin and then which was Spanish Island shortened

445
00:20:48,280 --> 00:20:52,040
Speaker 2: to Hispaniola. They were less concerned with naming the place

446
00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:55,440
Speaker 2: and more concerned with exploiting it. They started enslaving people

447
00:20:55,480 --> 00:20:57,600
Speaker 2: on basically day one. I think it was day six,

448
00:20:57,640 --> 00:21:00,639
Speaker 2: I can't remember exactly, but it was like everyone was

449
00:21:00,680 --> 00:21:02,320
Speaker 2: like really nice to them when they arrived, and then

450
00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:04,400
Speaker 2: within a couple days they were like, what the fuck

451
00:21:04,400 --> 00:21:04,760
Speaker 2: are you doing?

452
00:21:04,920 --> 00:21:05,120
Speaker 4: Right?

453
00:21:05,160 --> 00:21:08,440
Speaker 3: So yeah, yeah.

454
00:21:08,480 --> 00:21:12,119
Speaker 2: Disease just wrecked the indigenous people. More than ninety percent

455
00:21:12,119 --> 00:21:15,399
Speaker 2: of the population was dead within two decades of Columbus's arrival,

456
00:21:15,920 --> 00:21:19,720
Speaker 2: and it. It's never quite acknowledged that when Europeans like

457
00:21:19,800 --> 00:21:23,720
Speaker 2: quote unquote conquered North America, it was them conquering like

458
00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:25,600
Speaker 2: a post apocalyptic wasteland.

459
00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:28,879
Speaker 3: Yeah, like, yeah.

460
00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:30,600
Speaker 2: They brought the apocalypse with them in the form of

461
00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:32,359
Speaker 2: disease because.

462
00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:35,520
Speaker 5: When they like to not derail this convo, but when

463
00:21:35,560 --> 00:21:38,080
Speaker 5: they did go a head up against some of these

464
00:21:38,520 --> 00:21:40,960
Speaker 5: Meso American empires, they got their ass kicked.

465
00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:42,040
Speaker 3: Yeah.

466
00:21:42,160 --> 00:21:45,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, And like I think all the time about I

467
00:21:45,119 --> 00:21:47,399
Speaker 2: haven't totally wrapped my head around it. When I was

468
00:21:47,440 --> 00:21:49,640
Speaker 2: a kid, I always assumed that Africa was like sort

469
00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:52,920
Speaker 2: of colonized first, you know, because it's closer and europe

470
00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:56,399
Speaker 2: knew it existed, right, And then you're actually like, oh no,

471
00:21:56,480 --> 00:22:01,080
Speaker 2: it went internal European colonization like Ireland and shit. Yeah,

472
00:22:01,160 --> 00:22:05,320
Speaker 2: then the America's then Africa in Africa, And part of

473
00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:08,640
Speaker 2: that was that, like Europeans would get their fucking asses kicked.

474
00:22:08,720 --> 00:22:12,000
Speaker 3: It was whooping a ass. Yeah.

475
00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:15,679
Speaker 2: You can see fights that were like spear versus gun,

476
00:22:15,800 --> 00:22:17,840
Speaker 2: and the spears were sometimes pulling it off.

477
00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:20,520
Speaker 3: You know, dude. Book recommendation.

478
00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:25,560
Speaker 5: I'm reading this book called African History of Africa. Oh sick,

479
00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:28,600
Speaker 5: all right, it's like Africans talking about Africa.

480
00:22:28,680 --> 00:22:29,760
Speaker 3: It's super good.

481
00:22:29,760 --> 00:22:33,520
Speaker 5: But they talked about one of the Ashanti tribes when

482
00:22:33,960 --> 00:22:36,320
Speaker 5: hang my stupid hand again when Britain.

483
00:22:36,040 --> 00:22:40,640
Speaker 3: Came, and they're like, yeah, yeah, the first the first.

484
00:22:40,359 --> 00:22:44,320
Speaker 5: General they sent down there, like the Ashanti king like

485
00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:46,840
Speaker 5: turned his skull into a cup, so it was like

486
00:22:46,840 --> 00:22:51,280
Speaker 5: a like a ceremonial cup for like decades, like he

487
00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:53,520
Speaker 5: just drank out of the drank out of the guy's skull.

488
00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:58,679
Speaker 2: Like it was like, hey, whooped Joe ass Yeah, And

489
00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:01,880
Speaker 2: so European show yeh fourteen ninety two and they're actually

490
00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:04,119
Speaker 2: kind of bummed about the genocide. They sort of it

491
00:23:04,160 --> 00:23:06,280
Speaker 2: accidentally did They wanted to do a genocide, but they

492
00:23:06,280 --> 00:23:09,680
Speaker 2: wanted on their terms because their plan was they wanted

493
00:23:09,680 --> 00:23:12,520
Speaker 2: a genocide via slavery. They wanted to enslave everyone on

494
00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:15,520
Speaker 2: the island and then ship them over to Europe. But

495
00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:19,240
Speaker 2: they couldn't enslave most of the people because they were

496
00:23:19,760 --> 00:23:20,880
Speaker 2: dead because of.

497
00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:22,560
Speaker 3: Disease, because they killed them.

498
00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:27,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, of course the Tano people weren't completely destroyed, and

499
00:23:27,040 --> 00:23:30,119
Speaker 2: there's still Tano people today and they've had to like

500
00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:32,600
Speaker 2: do the like proving like people are like no no, no, no,

501
00:23:32,640 --> 00:23:34,359
Speaker 2: that you've all been destroyed. You're just making it up.

502
00:23:34,400 --> 00:23:36,840
Speaker 2: And then they're like, fine, we'll do the genetics shit.

503
00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:39,240
Speaker 2: And then they're like yeah, okay, yeah, I no, you're right. Sorry, yeah,

504
00:23:39,240 --> 00:23:40,080
Speaker 2: I fucking told too.

505
00:23:40,600 --> 00:23:43,240
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah we don't. Yeah yeah, you.

506
00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:44,680
Speaker 2: Don't actually have to tell us our history.

507
00:23:44,800 --> 00:23:45,399
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah we do.

508
00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:46,240
Speaker 6: Yeah.

509
00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:48,879
Speaker 2: So, with the potential source of slave labor dead, the

510
00:23:48,920 --> 00:23:54,520
Speaker 2: Europeans were like, well, let's import Africans. And this very

511
00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:59,320
Speaker 2: first step is like potentially mythologized, but there's no reason

512
00:23:59,320 --> 00:24:02,800
Speaker 2: to doubt it. The very first enslaved Africans when they

513
00:24:02,840 --> 00:24:04,720
Speaker 2: arrived in the New World, either fifteen oh two or

514
00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:08,080
Speaker 2: fifteen oh three, I've read both. You had the very

515
00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:12,880
Speaker 2: first Maroons. The book The Encyclopedia of African Religion suggests

516
00:24:12,880 --> 00:24:15,760
Speaker 2: that a single black man escaped from the first slave

517
00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:19,320
Speaker 2: ship to dock in the Americas. He disappeared into the jungle,

518
00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:22,119
Speaker 2: and whether or not he lived or died himself, he

519
00:24:22,240 --> 00:24:28,320
Speaker 2: blazed a trail that so many people followed afterwards. We

520
00:24:28,400 --> 00:24:30,560
Speaker 2: have talked about Maroon communities on the show time and

521
00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:33,880
Speaker 2: time again, because they're kind of the quintessential cool people

522
00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:36,800
Speaker 2: who did cool stuff thing you know, yea, but for

523
00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:39,159
Speaker 2: people who only got the same history education I did,

524
00:24:39,240 --> 00:24:41,800
Speaker 2: and did not hear the word maroon until I was

525
00:24:41,840 --> 00:24:46,359
Speaker 2: an adult. Maroon communities are communities of people escaping enslavement

526
00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:49,000
Speaker 2: within a slave empire, like those run by Europeans in

527
00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:53,680
Speaker 2: the Americas. Mostly these are self emancipated black people, whether

528
00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:55,760
Speaker 2: they were born in Africa or whether whether they were

529
00:24:55,760 --> 00:24:59,760
Speaker 2: born into slavery, but indigenous people were often vital to

530
00:24:59,760 --> 00:25:02,480
Speaker 2: these communities. The first Maroons were likely people who just

531
00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:06,040
Speaker 2: ran off and were accepted into indigenous societies, and they

532
00:25:06,080 --> 00:25:08,240
Speaker 2: were also the occasional but it gets kind of played

533
00:25:08,280 --> 00:25:10,119
Speaker 2: up by white people who like to have ourselves and

534
00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:14,360
Speaker 2: we want our representation in every story, there were occasional

535
00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:17,840
Speaker 2: poor white people escaping indentured servitude or other like debts

536
00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:24,040
Speaker 2: who joined marion societies. Yeah, wherever you had slavery, you

537
00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:27,720
Speaker 2: had maroon communities. One story that I want to tell

538
00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:30,720
Speaker 2: eventually because I just only read the super quick version

539
00:25:30,720 --> 00:25:32,680
Speaker 2: of it, and I want to do probably whole episodes

540
00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:36,040
Speaker 2: about it. The first ever revolt against the colonizers in

541
00:25:36,080 --> 00:25:39,320
Speaker 2: the New World that I found is the revolt of Enriquillo.

542
00:25:39,840 --> 00:25:43,160
Speaker 2: He's a Tano chief and this revolt started in fifteen

543
00:25:43,280 --> 00:25:47,720
Speaker 2: nineteen and lasted thirteen years. His father had been killed

544
00:25:47,720 --> 00:25:50,720
Speaker 2: by I've run across this particular story so many times

545
00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:52,840
Speaker 2: when I read about colonization that I almost am like,

546
00:25:53,600 --> 00:25:55,840
Speaker 2: is this this literally the only thing that white people

547
00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:59,840
Speaker 2: know how to do, which is that in order to

548
00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:04,320
Speaker 2: conquer all the people, the fucking Spanish were like, all right,

549
00:26:04,680 --> 00:26:06,960
Speaker 2: all the chiefs, come here, we'll talk it out, we'll

550
00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:10,040
Speaker 2: sign some treaties. We'll have a little piece thing. Get

551
00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:12,200
Speaker 2: them all in one building, lock the door and set

552
00:26:12,240 --> 00:26:12,720
Speaker 2: it on fire.

553
00:26:13,040 --> 00:26:14,200
Speaker 4: Yeah.

554
00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:17,640
Speaker 2: Uh like, I think they did this in fucking Brave.

555
00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:20,240
Speaker 3: Heart, Like totally did it in Braveheart.

556
00:26:20,440 --> 00:26:20,720
Speaker 4: That's it.

557
00:26:20,880 --> 00:26:24,800
Speaker 3: That's day one. Yeah.

558
00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:30,320
Speaker 2: And so sometimes his name is Enrique, sometimes it's Enriquio, Enriqueo.

559
00:26:31,320 --> 00:26:34,880
Speaker 2: His dad was one of the chiefs who died this way, okay,

560
00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:37,520
Speaker 2: And then he was basically raised by this Catholic friar

561
00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:40,679
Speaker 2: as a result, who was actually a hardcore abolitionist who

562
00:26:40,720 --> 00:26:43,560
Speaker 2: wrote a history book called A Short Account of the

563
00:26:43,600 --> 00:26:47,200
Speaker 2: Destruction of the Indies about how bad the white people

564
00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:50,879
Speaker 2: were there. And he's white himself. Yeah, this isn't to

565
00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:53,000
Speaker 2: say that the Catholics were on the side of the oppressed.

566
00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:55,160
Speaker 2: This is the opposite of the truth.

567
00:26:55,680 --> 00:26:58,080
Speaker 3: This is one guy saying, are y'all crazy?

568
00:26:58,480 --> 00:26:58,840
Speaker 6: Yeah?

569
00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:02,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And he's kind of important to hold up,

570
00:27:02,119 --> 00:27:04,520
Speaker 2: not so that you can say, like, not all Catholic friars,

571
00:27:04,560 --> 00:27:06,600
Speaker 2: but instead that you can be like, we kind of

572
00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:10,120
Speaker 2: can't let historical people off the hook, because there were

573
00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:12,840
Speaker 2: people who because he showed up as a colonizer. He

574
00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:14,880
Speaker 2: showed up like I want a place to go live.

575
00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:17,119
Speaker 2: I'm gonna go live on Hispaniola. And then within like

576
00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:19,440
Speaker 2: a couple of years he's like, wait, what the hell

577
00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:23,960
Speaker 2: are we doing here? You know? Yeah, And so this

578
00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:27,560
Speaker 2: is the mentor of the kid of the Chief who

579
00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:33,320
Speaker 2: was murdered, and so Enriquio led this Tano revolt, fought

580
00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:37,359
Speaker 2: the Spanish to a standstill despite living and basically an apocalypse.

581
00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:41,560
Speaker 2: This is after the ninety percent destruction, right wow, and

582
00:27:41,840 --> 00:27:44,840
Speaker 2: forced new treaties to be signed. But I think that

583
00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:47,440
Speaker 2: the reason that one day I'll do a whole two parter.

584
00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:49,080
Speaker 2: But like, I think the reason the treaties fell apart

585
00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:50,639
Speaker 2: is that just like every all the time of people

586
00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:52,120
Speaker 2: just kept dying, Like.

587
00:27:53,600 --> 00:28:00,479
Speaker 5: I just the really living color of I don't know

588
00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:07,200
Speaker 5: if I can. I can't wrap my mind around ninety percent. Yeah,

589
00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:09,800
Speaker 5: that's that's everyone you know is dead.

590
00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:11,679
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's what that is.

591
00:28:11,720 --> 00:28:17,400
Speaker 5: That's everyone you know and everyone who's alive, everyone they

592
00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:21,760
Speaker 5: know is dead. Like just I don't I don't know

593
00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:26,840
Speaker 5: if Yeah, I just don't that reality. And then the

594
00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:30,159
Speaker 5: color of like I really wish we could just go

595
00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:33,480
Speaker 5: back into history and just drop people in very easy

596
00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:35,800
Speaker 5: boxes and say, well they felt like this, they felt

597
00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:38,040
Speaker 5: like this, they felt like this, but and just it's

598
00:28:38,040 --> 00:28:40,400
Speaker 5: as messy as it is now, like us in our

599
00:28:41,280 --> 00:28:45,760
Speaker 5: you know, extreme left anarchists still somewhere in your house

600
00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:49,320
Speaker 5: have a single use plastic, you know, and like just

601
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:54,040
Speaker 5: the complication of that. I enjoy that part of history

602
00:28:54,160 --> 00:28:56,880
Speaker 5: of you know, hearing this dude, that's like, well, you're

603
00:28:57,800 --> 00:29:01,280
Speaker 5: you're still a you're still a co You're still here

604
00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:03,400
Speaker 5: in a land that you shouldn't be in the first place.

605
00:29:03,600 --> 00:29:06,480
Speaker 2: Yeah. Oh, and he he wrote a book, he wrote

606
00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:09,160
Speaker 2: a bunch of stuff being like he actually he did

607
00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:11,680
Speaker 2: not come off great. He did not start great. He

608
00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:13,480
Speaker 2: was like, oh, we're treating the indigenous people bad. We

609
00:29:13,480 --> 00:29:16,240
Speaker 2: should stop enslaving them and instead import Africans was the

610
00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:20,680
Speaker 2: first thing he wrote, and then really quickly he was like, wait, no,

611
00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:21,800
Speaker 2: never mind.

612
00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:24,360
Speaker 3: Bah, God, forget that one. Let's try it out.

613
00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:26,680
Speaker 2: But he definitely went to his grave believing that it

614
00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:29,080
Speaker 2: is a very good and useful thing for Catholics to

615
00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:31,000
Speaker 2: go all over the New World and convert everyone to

616
00:29:31,040 --> 00:29:35,000
Speaker 2: Catholicism and like wanted like better kinder colonization.

617
00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:37,200
Speaker 3: Even though he.

618
00:29:36,400 --> 00:29:38,760
Speaker 2: Helped inspire one of the main anti the first anti

619
00:29:38,760 --> 00:29:43,400
Speaker 2: colonial revolt. Yeah so complicated, yea, yeah, which is more

620
00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:47,360
Speaker 2: anti colonial revolting than I've done. I've gone to some protests, I've.

621
00:29:47,200 --> 00:29:52,320
Speaker 3: They were yeah yeah, right, Yeah.

622
00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:54,440
Speaker 2: And as far as I can tell, Maroon Africans joined

623
00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:56,320
Speaker 2: that revolt the first time I ran across it. Literally

624
00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:58,280
Speaker 2: it was represented as a Maroon revolt, but I think

625
00:29:58,320 --> 00:30:02,480
Speaker 2: that that's an exaggeration, but I don't know. But it

626
00:30:02,520 --> 00:30:06,080
Speaker 2: also showed Enslave people that there was a way to

627
00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:08,719
Speaker 2: fight colonization. You can go to the mountains and then

628
00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:11,560
Speaker 2: use guerrilla warfare to kill Europeans and it is an

629
00:30:11,560 --> 00:30:15,520
Speaker 2: effective strategy. Yeah, and it will continue to be ineffective

630
00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:17,080
Speaker 2: probably into the future.

631
00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:18,760
Speaker 4: Yeah.

632
00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:22,680
Speaker 2: However, Maroon communities were slowly wiped out on the smaller

633
00:30:22,680 --> 00:30:26,680
Speaker 2: islands of the Indies because white settlers cleared and burned

634
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:29,360
Speaker 2: the wilderness basically, so by the seventeen hundreds they were

635
00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:33,160
Speaker 2: mostly gone from everywhere except these larger islands. Some of

636
00:30:33,160 --> 00:30:35,960
Speaker 2: these Maroon communities were absolutely huge. You and I talked

637
00:30:36,200 --> 00:30:39,040
Speaker 2: years ago on this show about the Maroon community in

638
00:30:39,080 --> 00:30:44,160
Speaker 2: Brazil Coulombo di Plomars, which was an independent nation in

639
00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:47,240
Speaker 2: the seventeenth century with thirty thousand people. I think you

640
00:30:47,240 --> 00:30:49,040
Speaker 2: can listen to Chico Mendes episodes for that.

641
00:30:49,080 --> 00:30:51,640
Speaker 3: I think, yeah, yeah, when it's in is chicodes Yeah.

642
00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:57,440
Speaker 2: Yeah. Before the Haitian Revolution, the real standout Maroon warriors

643
00:30:57,440 --> 00:31:01,880
Speaker 2: were in Jamaica. As the Encyclopedia of African Religion put it, quote,

644
00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:04,280
Speaker 2: it is the Jamaicans, however, who hold the distinction of

645
00:31:04,320 --> 00:31:07,160
Speaker 2: waging the most slave rebellions in the West per capita.

646
00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:09,000
Speaker 4: Yeah.

647
00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:11,560
Speaker 2: And one day I'm just like, this is almost like

648
00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:13,320
Speaker 2: my list of notes of things that I'm going to

649
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:16,760
Speaker 2: come back to. If you heard a Queen Nannie, I hadn't. Yes,

650
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:21,560
Speaker 2: Queen Nannie is fucking cool. She united all the Maroons

651
00:31:21,560 --> 00:31:24,880
Speaker 2: in Jamaica. She was born and what's now Ghana. Yeah,

652
00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:29,120
Speaker 2: she practiced Obeah, which is a syncretic African diaspec religion.

653
00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:32,800
Speaker 2: Fucking for fifteen years, united all the Maroons into a

654
00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:35,800
Speaker 2: war against the British, which was the world's greatest military

655
00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:39,880
Speaker 2: power and who outnumbered them even on the island greatly. Yeah,

656
00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:42,520
Speaker 2: and like forced them to their knees multiple times.

657
00:31:43,000 --> 00:31:45,360
Speaker 5: Dude, her like her, she's in that book. I was

658
00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:49,160
Speaker 5: telling about her origin story even before she did that,

659
00:31:49,240 --> 00:31:52,200
Speaker 5: Like she was always about that life. Yeah, like just

660
00:31:52,560 --> 00:31:55,120
Speaker 5: not a game about that life.

661
00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:56,800
Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah.

662
00:31:56,840 --> 00:32:00,640
Speaker 5: And as a note for like I don't I might

663
00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:03,240
Speaker 5: be talking out my neck as far as like drawing

664
00:32:03,280 --> 00:32:06,600
Speaker 5: this connection, but like no, like Mexico's kind of like

665
00:32:06,680 --> 00:32:08,760
Speaker 5: known for the like machismo, like the way that like

666
00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:10,840
Speaker 5: the men kind of like a really macho thing. Like

667
00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:14,400
Speaker 5: it's it's really the same in Jamaica, Like the Jamaican

668
00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:18,840
Speaker 5: concept of manhood is like very much you need to

669
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:21,960
Speaker 5: have a million kids, and also like you just can't.

670
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,520
Speaker 5: You don't take shit, like you know what I'm saying,

671
00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:27,400
Speaker 5: And like some of it is back to being like

672
00:32:27,800 --> 00:32:32,760
Speaker 5: we will not we will not comply, like that is

673
00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:35,800
Speaker 5: like in there even just like I said, just the

674
00:32:35,840 --> 00:32:37,960
Speaker 5: construction of what it means to be a Jamaican man.

675
00:32:38,080 --> 00:32:40,760
Speaker 3: Like, yeah, we don't comply, you know what.

676
00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:43,320
Speaker 5: I'm saying, So I don't like I said, I might

677
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:45,160
Speaker 5: be talking out of my neck, but like that's another

678
00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:47,640
Speaker 5: one of those things. It's just I feel like has

679
00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:52,400
Speaker 5: gone through their sort of like sense of self is

680
00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:55,880
Speaker 5: like nah, bro, yeah we revolt.

681
00:32:56,080 --> 00:32:59,479
Speaker 2: Yeah no, it makes sense, and it's some of that

682
00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:02,880
Speaker 2: energy is what's gonna is how Haiti's gonna end up free?

683
00:33:03,200 --> 00:33:03,520
Speaker 4: Yeah?

684
00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:07,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, And so the Maroons are fucking cool. On the

685
00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:10,680
Speaker 2: Island of a eighty. The Spanish were sort of ignoring

686
00:33:10,720 --> 00:33:12,960
Speaker 2: the western coast of the island for a while. French

687
00:33:13,000 --> 00:33:15,520
Speaker 2: pirates started hanging out there. We did a whole pirate's

688
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:17,200
Speaker 2: episode talking about how they were not as cool as

689
00:33:17,240 --> 00:33:19,400
Speaker 2: people think, but also more cool than sometimes people think.

690
00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:24,960
Speaker 2: They're more interesting in different ways than people might expect. Eventually,

691
00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:27,560
Speaker 2: in sixteen ninety seven, after some wars and shit in Europe,

692
00:33:27,920 --> 00:33:30,560
Speaker 2: Spain formally seeded the western part of the island of

693
00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:34,240
Speaker 2: the French. This new colony was called San Dumong, which

694
00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:36,680
Speaker 2: is French. So it doesn't look like Sandumong, it looks

695
00:33:36,720 --> 00:33:39,920
Speaker 2: like Saints don't I don't know whatever.

696
00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:41,880
Speaker 3: All kind of letters that shouldn't be in network.

697
00:33:42,160 --> 00:33:45,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a lot of vowels in the city and

698
00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:49,360
Speaker 2: the French. The reason there weren't a ton of enslaved

699
00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:51,320
Speaker 2: people over there wasn't because the Spanish were nice, but

700
00:33:51,360 --> 00:33:53,440
Speaker 2: because the Spanish weren't really hanging out there, and the

701
00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:55,920
Speaker 2: pirates were slavers, but not on the same kind of

702
00:33:55,960 --> 00:33:59,360
Speaker 2: scale because they didn't have a plantation economy. M the

703
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:04,640
Speaker 2: French over so so many enslaved African people as fast

704
00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:08,640
Speaker 2: as they possibly fucking could. In the short term, this

705
00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:11,520
Speaker 2: worked out really well for the French. All of the

706
00:34:11,560 --> 00:34:14,239
Speaker 2: people who came over, they're like life expectancy was like

707
00:34:14,680 --> 00:34:16,680
Speaker 2: two or three years. It was like fifty percent of

708
00:34:16,719 --> 00:34:17,719
Speaker 2: them die within a year.

709
00:34:18,320 --> 00:34:19,240
Speaker 3: Sheesh.

710
00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:21,000
Speaker 2: And then it's like, it's kind of interesting because I

711
00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:23,239
Speaker 2: want to know more about this. Obviously I've read about

712
00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:24,719
Speaker 2: in various books, but I feel like I'd have to

713
00:34:24,760 --> 00:34:27,399
Speaker 2: like get a degree in exactly this to totally understand it.

714
00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:30,680
Speaker 2: It's kind of interesting to me because like, economically, in

715
00:34:30,719 --> 00:34:35,960
Speaker 2: the US South, enslave people were so expensive, yeah, but

716
00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:40,799
Speaker 2: here life was cheap, so it was cheaper and easier

717
00:34:40,960 --> 00:34:43,960
Speaker 2: to work people to death and just replace them.

718
00:34:44,640 --> 00:34:46,640
Speaker 3: Wow, I never thought about that.

719
00:34:47,719 --> 00:34:50,720
Speaker 2: It seems like the conditions were even worse than elsewhere

720
00:34:50,719 --> 00:34:52,279
Speaker 2: in the America's. But I have a feeling that, like,

721
00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:54,880
Speaker 2: if I read a book about Haitian slavery, it's going

722
00:34:54,920 --> 00:34:56,120
Speaker 2: to be the worst possible. And then if I read

723
00:34:56,120 --> 00:34:58,360
Speaker 2: a book but Jamaica slavery's be because it's just awful.

724
00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:00,719
Speaker 2: Everywhere slavery is one of the most things that's ever

725
00:35:00,719 --> 00:35:03,120
Speaker 2: happened in the history of humanity. Is chattel slavery, Like.

726
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:07,280
Speaker 5: Yeah, I would vote, if you're right, I would vote Haiti,

727
00:35:07,280 --> 00:35:10,040
Speaker 5: though the conditions I wouldn't vote.

728
00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:12,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would vote. I mean, if you're going to

729
00:35:12,520 --> 00:35:13,680
Speaker 3: have to vote for something.

730
00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:17,040
Speaker 2: As awful, we're going to do a little pole.

731
00:35:17,440 --> 00:35:19,120
Speaker 3: Yeah who had it worse?

732
00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:23,680
Speaker 2: Yeah what? Yeah the slavery oppression Olympics.

733
00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:24,360
Speaker 3: But it it.

734
00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:28,399
Speaker 2: But yeah, it is fucking awful. It's also like the

735
00:35:28,440 --> 00:35:31,120
Speaker 2: scale of bad. I actually think it is kind of

736
00:35:31,120 --> 00:35:34,520
Speaker 2: important for people to understand because, like any ethical position

737
00:35:34,600 --> 00:35:38,080
Speaker 2: says slavery wrong, right, yes, But when you have that

738
00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:43,960
Speaker 2: oversimplified moral position, you can then start blaming like the

739
00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:48,120
Speaker 2: Africans themselves who do enslaving and like how like not

740
00:35:48,280 --> 00:35:50,759
Speaker 2: every but like a real large number of cultures all

741
00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:53,040
Speaker 2: over the world had slavery, right yeah, and so then

742
00:35:53,080 --> 00:35:55,640
Speaker 2: you're like, well it's all equally bad and you're like, well,

743
00:35:56,480 --> 00:36:00,520
Speaker 2: racialized chattel slavery, bringing people from a different continent was worse.

744
00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:04,719
Speaker 5: Like there's just another way around it. Like you know,

745
00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:08,960
Speaker 5: you owe somebody money, you work until it's gone. Okay,

746
00:36:09,480 --> 00:36:12,480
Speaker 5: that's one thing. It is a horrible condition. Serfdom is

747
00:36:12,520 --> 00:36:14,880
Speaker 5: a type of slavery, that's but it's something totally different.

748
00:36:14,920 --> 00:36:19,839
Speaker 5: But yeah, the idea that you are subhuman, Yeah right,

749
00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:21,480
Speaker 5: we're not the same species.

750
00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:23,280
Speaker 3: I am a superior race.

751
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:27,080
Speaker 5: And when you talk specifically, like you said about Haiti,

752
00:36:27,160 --> 00:36:34,840
Speaker 5: like I again, it's like, remove all hyperbole or slang

753
00:36:34,920 --> 00:36:39,880
Speaker 5: from this sentence. They worked them to death, yeah, like

754
00:36:40,760 --> 00:36:43,160
Speaker 5: they they dropped dead.

755
00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:47,200
Speaker 3: They worked them to death, like I.

756
00:36:47,239 --> 00:36:51,560
Speaker 5: Just I don't know how else this yeah literal, not

757
00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:56,799
Speaker 5: like literally no, like yeah literally like they worked.

758
00:36:56,840 --> 00:36:57,879
Speaker 2: Half of them died in the air.

759
00:36:58,000 --> 00:36:59,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, yes, that's why I say.

760
00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:02,000
Speaker 5: That's why I say Haiti was different because like to

761
00:37:02,040 --> 00:37:04,920
Speaker 5: your point, it was like they were so fungible, you know,

762
00:37:05,239 --> 00:37:06,600
Speaker 5: in Haiti, in America.

763
00:37:06,719 --> 00:37:09,000
Speaker 3: It costs so much. Yeah, so it's like, we don't

764
00:37:09,040 --> 00:37:09,359
Speaker 3: want your.

765
00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:12,120
Speaker 5: Slave to die like you just you just wasted three

766
00:37:12,160 --> 00:37:12,880
Speaker 5: thousand dollars.

767
00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:14,319
Speaker 2: You know, it costs as much as your house.

768
00:37:14,360 --> 00:37:16,640
Speaker 5: If you've got as much as your house, this guy dies,

769
00:37:16,800 --> 00:37:19,960
Speaker 5: you know. So they're like paper plates. They're paper plates.

770
00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:22,640
Speaker 5: You just yeah, yeah, it's bonkers.

771
00:37:22,680 --> 00:37:24,760
Speaker 2: It was cheaper to just bring more and more people

772
00:37:24,760 --> 00:37:26,320
Speaker 2: over than try to keep them alive.

773
00:37:26,520 --> 00:37:27,799
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, just go get more.

774
00:37:29,280 --> 00:37:31,680
Speaker 2: But it worked out well in the short term to

775
00:37:31,719 --> 00:37:34,240
Speaker 2: treat them like paper plates. But it turns out people

776
00:37:34,320 --> 00:37:39,000
Speaker 2: aren't machines. People have opinions, they have desires, They are

777
00:37:39,040 --> 00:37:42,040
Speaker 2: smart as shit, and they are as fiery as shit.

778
00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:44,920
Speaker 2: And uh, it didn't work out well for the French

779
00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:47,480
Speaker 2: in the long term. And one of the things that

780
00:37:47,560 --> 00:37:51,000
Speaker 2: enslaved people brought over, something that more or less destroyed

781
00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:54,520
Speaker 2: the French government's control on their most profitable colony was

782
00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:59,560
Speaker 2: African religion. So most of the people who are stolen

783
00:37:59,640 --> 00:38:02,160
Speaker 2: or brought to sand among came from the southern coast

784
00:38:02,200 --> 00:38:04,960
Speaker 2: to West Africa, especially what's now been in and western

785
00:38:05,000 --> 00:38:09,120
Speaker 2: parts of Nigeria, especially kind of originally later it's going

786
00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:11,120
Speaker 2: to be more people from what's now the Republic of

787
00:38:11,160 --> 00:38:14,239
Speaker 2: Congo and was the Kingdom of Congo at the time.

788
00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:16,600
Speaker 2: Sort of all the all the lines have been redrawn

789
00:38:16,600 --> 00:38:20,799
Speaker 2: by colonizers, but like you know, yeah, in particular in

790
00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:24,160
Speaker 2: the beginning, it was fond people and Aa people, so

791
00:38:24,600 --> 00:38:28,320
Speaker 2: just for people who are bad at geography, the southern

792
00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:31,160
Speaker 2: part of the western part of Africa, that coast, and

793
00:38:31,160 --> 00:38:33,719
Speaker 2: then also Central Africa like kind of right around the

794
00:38:33,719 --> 00:38:36,560
Speaker 2: corner from it is where most of the folks who

795
00:38:36,640 --> 00:38:39,759
Speaker 2: ended up there came from. And the places that these

796
00:38:39,760 --> 00:38:43,239
Speaker 2: people are from influences a bunch about later history, and

797
00:38:43,239 --> 00:38:46,680
Speaker 2: that's kind of another part of the Like I'm gonna

798
00:38:46,719 --> 00:38:48,279
Speaker 2: go on a limb and say, it's probably harder for

799
00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:50,719
Speaker 2: you to discover your family heritage than it is for me.

800
00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:54,400
Speaker 3: That's a good guess. Get out, it's a good guess.

801
00:38:54,600 --> 00:38:57,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, But there's still kind of this like a rature

802
00:38:57,880 --> 00:39:00,600
Speaker 2: of like I don't know, they're just from Africa, as

803
00:39:00,600 --> 00:39:04,320
Speaker 2: if there's not like different people there with different beliefs

804
00:39:04,360 --> 00:39:08,719
Speaker 2: and different cultures and different languages who brought things with them, you.

805
00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:11,520
Speaker 5: Know, yeah, and they and like here's what's crazy is

806
00:39:11,560 --> 00:39:14,080
Speaker 5: like I even fell victim to some of this, I'm like,

807
00:39:15,280 --> 00:39:18,400
Speaker 5: they don't even look alike. Like you put a you

808
00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:23,160
Speaker 5: put an Ethiopian next to somebody from Beneen, and you're like, wait,

809
00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:27,240
Speaker 5: are y'all the same? Like no, they look very different

810
00:39:27,600 --> 00:39:34,320
Speaker 5: because the distance between Ethiopia and Benin is a continent,

811
00:39:34,880 --> 00:39:37,640
Speaker 5: you know, And yeah, yeah, and the practices are different,

812
00:39:37,840 --> 00:39:42,320
Speaker 5: and like the even what you like, which will probably

813
00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:45,200
Speaker 5: get into later, and obviously for me this is like

814
00:39:45,280 --> 00:39:47,960
Speaker 5: really friend of mine because I'm like again reading this book,

815
00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:54,200
Speaker 5: but like even what they mean by religion, yeah, you're

816
00:39:54,239 --> 00:39:56,960
Speaker 5: like the Europeans were like, well, they worshiped their ancestors,

817
00:39:57,080 --> 00:40:00,279
Speaker 5: because that's there. There's no word for God or worship

818
00:40:00,520 --> 00:40:02,640
Speaker 5: and a lot of these tribes, you know what I'm saying.

819
00:40:03,080 --> 00:40:06,319
Speaker 5: And it's because well they were looking at it from

820
00:40:06,400 --> 00:40:10,600
Speaker 5: the lens that they did, from these monotheistic lenses, whereas

821
00:40:10,600 --> 00:40:12,960
Speaker 5: you go to East Africa, which has been monotheistic for

822
00:40:13,000 --> 00:40:14,600
Speaker 5: a while, you know what I'm saying. So like what

823
00:40:14,719 --> 00:40:16,880
Speaker 5: made sense if you was already trading with Sudan and

824
00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:18,880
Speaker 5: stuff like that, They're like, oh, okay, so y'all are

825
00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:23,839
Speaker 5: a little different. Axoms like first Christian City in like

826
00:40:24,239 --> 00:40:26,239
Speaker 5: the year one hundred, you know what I'm saying. But

827
00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:28,360
Speaker 5: by the time you could, but that didn't make it

828
00:40:28,400 --> 00:40:31,400
Speaker 5: west so west. It was like, we just don't we

829
00:40:31,400 --> 00:40:33,440
Speaker 5: don't know what you mean by that, you know what

830
00:40:33,440 --> 00:40:33,839
Speaker 5: I'm saying.

831
00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:38,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, And the synchronization got more and more, even more. Yeah,

832
00:40:38,400 --> 00:40:41,400
Speaker 2: and it was so it was so blurry. And so

833
00:40:42,560 --> 00:40:44,759
Speaker 2: I love synchrotization. It's one of my favorite things in

834
00:40:44,800 --> 00:40:48,640
Speaker 2: the world because it's so messy and complicated and like, yeah,

835
00:40:48,680 --> 00:40:50,800
Speaker 2: you can't really draw moral lines around.

836
00:40:50,600 --> 00:40:53,280
Speaker 3: That to untangle it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

837
00:40:53,320 --> 00:40:57,600
Speaker 2: And what's interesting is then a lot of early Pan Africanism,

838
00:40:57,760 --> 00:41:01,839
Speaker 2: you know, the idea that like, well more complicated I'm

839
00:41:01,840 --> 00:41:03,960
Speaker 2: gonna easily say, but like, you know, the idea that

840
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:08,000
Speaker 2: Africa should unite with itself to defend itself against yeah,

841
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:12,680
Speaker 2: its own destruction. A lot of the like getting over

842
00:41:12,760 --> 00:41:17,440
Speaker 2: cultural differences happened from the diaspora because people are like, well,

843
00:41:17,880 --> 00:41:19,879
Speaker 2: we all spoke different languages than used to be at

844
00:41:20,360 --> 00:41:25,040
Speaker 2: war with each other back home, but we just got stolen, you.

845
00:41:25,040 --> 00:41:29,120
Speaker 3: Know, we're just on a boat. Yeah, and like and

846
00:41:29,160 --> 00:41:32,200
Speaker 3: now we're here and now this is my family. Yeah,

847
00:41:32,239 --> 00:41:35,200
Speaker 3: and it's like and yeah, and it just it did it. Definitely.

848
00:41:35,239 --> 00:41:36,360
Speaker 3: That's a great point, Margat.

849
00:41:36,400 --> 00:41:39,320
Speaker 5: I'm glad you brought that up, because that does fold

850
00:41:39,480 --> 00:41:42,480
Speaker 5: back to that Pan Africanism to where it was, like

851
00:41:42,800 --> 00:41:45,440
Speaker 5: they're even talking about it now with like you know,

852
00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:47,960
Speaker 5: obviously with the with the land grab of Africa and

853
00:41:48,000 --> 00:41:51,640
Speaker 5: that the borders are made up and yeah, you slice

854
00:41:51,719 --> 00:41:54,640
Speaker 5: right through a village, so a lot of the indigenous

855
00:41:54,640 --> 00:41:59,840
Speaker 5: and like native sort of ethnic differences are like separated

856
00:41:59,840 --> 00:42:00,920
Speaker 5: by a country.

857
00:42:01,200 --> 00:42:01,399
Speaker 2: Yeah.

858
00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:04,080
Speaker 5: So like but now it's like, okay, here's where we are.

859
00:42:04,120 --> 00:42:08,480
Speaker 5: So you're like, I'm Ghanaian and Ashanti, yeah, but I'm African.

860
00:42:09,239 --> 00:42:14,520
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, and what I am is stuck pivoting to ads.

861
00:42:15,120 --> 00:42:17,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, yes, you are here, they are.

862
00:42:25,320 --> 00:42:25,839
Speaker 2: And we're back.

863
00:42:27,160 --> 00:42:29,920
Speaker 3: And so Vodu is the main religion we're.

864
00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:32,880
Speaker 2: Gonna be talking about this week and next week. And

865
00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:38,080
Speaker 2: one of the main places it's syncretized with is Catholicism. Right.

866
00:42:38,160 --> 00:42:41,280
Speaker 2: It is a combination of a bunch of different mostly

867
00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:45,560
Speaker 2: West African religions with some stuff more from Congo and

868
00:42:45,560 --> 00:42:48,279
Speaker 2: then Catholicism and then also some Islam and some hindu is.

869
00:42:48,320 --> 00:42:49,480
Speaker 2: It does lots of stuff.

870
00:42:49,600 --> 00:42:50,240
Speaker 3: It's amazing.

871
00:42:50,480 --> 00:42:55,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I had gone into it, assuming that the

872
00:42:55,400 --> 00:42:57,799
Speaker 2: Catholicism was like, well, they ended up in you know,

873
00:42:58,000 --> 00:43:00,359
Speaker 2: Spain and then France Island, and so they're befo. They

874
00:43:00,360 --> 00:43:03,000
Speaker 2: had to convert to Catholicism, and there was a forced

875
00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:05,720
Speaker 2: conversion of Catholicism that's going to happen later in this story.

876
00:43:06,280 --> 00:43:09,520
Speaker 2: But actually the synchronization with Catholicism started in Africa in

877
00:43:09,520 --> 00:43:13,200
Speaker 2: the Kingdom of Congo, h in the year fourteen ninety one,

878
00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:16,319
Speaker 2: the year before Columbus sailed the Ocean Blue on his

879
00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:20,080
Speaker 2: death ship. The king of Congo, king and Zinga and Nakwum,

880
00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:24,320
Speaker 2: converted to Catholicism, presumably to get closer ties to the

881
00:43:24,320 --> 00:43:27,040
Speaker 2: Portuguese and get better access to trade and firearms. It

882
00:43:27,120 --> 00:43:29,080
Speaker 2: depends on what source you read. Unfortunately, a lot of

883
00:43:29,080 --> 00:43:31,799
Speaker 2: the sources about the Catholicization of Western Africa are in

884
00:43:31,880 --> 00:43:34,319
Speaker 2: Central Africa, are like Catholic propaganda.

885
00:43:34,920 --> 00:43:38,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, so I don't know, but he didn't.

886
00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:41,839
Speaker 2: Last too long as a Catholic because Catholicism was like,

887
00:43:42,000 --> 00:43:44,720
Speaker 2: well you can only have one wife.

888
00:43:45,680 --> 00:43:45,960
Speaker 3: Listen.

889
00:43:46,120 --> 00:43:49,640
Speaker 5: I know missionaries now who like have gone to like

890
00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:51,880
Speaker 5: South Africa, they'd be like, wow, we do these outreaches

891
00:43:51,920 --> 00:43:55,239
Speaker 5: out there and they go, well, your Bible Moses had

892
00:43:55,280 --> 00:43:56,239
Speaker 5: a lot of wise.

893
00:43:57,560 --> 00:43:58,919
Speaker 3: Why can't I have a lot of whites.

894
00:43:59,440 --> 00:44:00,960
Speaker 2: There's a lot of Christians. You think you can have

895
00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:01,960
Speaker 2: a lot of wives. Yeah.

896
00:44:02,080 --> 00:44:06,320
Speaker 5: Yeah, And then they would say this, okay, like this, listen, Margaret,

897
00:44:06,360 --> 00:44:08,720
Speaker 5: if I'm lying on flying this is a true story.

898
00:44:08,760 --> 00:44:10,719
Speaker 5: I was doing this show us South Africa and his

899
00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:13,520
Speaker 5: brother was telling me about he was out there trying to.

900
00:44:13,520 --> 00:44:16,400
Speaker 3: Preach the gospel to the to the to the natives

901
00:44:16,400 --> 00:44:16,680
Speaker 3: out there.

902
00:44:16,680 --> 00:44:18,200
Speaker 5: And they said, okay, well, let me ask you this,

903
00:44:18,960 --> 00:44:20,920
Speaker 5: Like you said, you say, I can only have one wife,

904
00:44:21,200 --> 00:44:25,040
Speaker 5: all right, So which one of these should have divorced?

905
00:44:25,040 --> 00:44:27,799
Speaker 5: Because you told me that divorce was wrong too, So

906
00:44:28,200 --> 00:44:29,759
Speaker 5: is it what about the first one? Well, the first

907
00:44:29,760 --> 00:44:31,839
Speaker 5: one ain't got kids. Well that one got chillen. Well

908
00:44:31,840 --> 00:44:34,439
Speaker 5: this one got two children, So which one? Which one

909
00:44:34,480 --> 00:44:35,000
Speaker 5: is my wife?

910
00:44:35,040 --> 00:44:35,200
Speaker 1: Then?

911
00:44:35,560 --> 00:44:37,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm just supposed to abandon the rest of them.

912
00:44:38,080 --> 00:44:40,840
Speaker 3: I was like, did you answer me? He was like,

913
00:44:41,000 --> 00:44:41,960
Speaker 3: I didn't have an answer.

914
00:44:42,520 --> 00:44:45,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, like I can't put a moral like

915
00:44:46,480 --> 00:44:48,480
Speaker 2: you know, there's a lot of different ways societies have

916
00:44:48,480 --> 00:44:51,400
Speaker 2: been built. There are societies where men can have multiple

917
00:44:51,400 --> 00:44:54,680
Speaker 2: wives or societies where women can have multiple husbands there.

918
00:44:55,680 --> 00:44:59,360
Speaker 2: I mean, I live in a very polyamorous society, so like, yeah,

919
00:44:59,560 --> 00:45:02,279
Speaker 2: we can only marry one of because of the law,

920
00:45:02,320 --> 00:45:03,279
Speaker 2: but like whatever, you know.

921
00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:07,280
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, yeah, the queen that you mentioned earlier, Yeah,

922
00:45:07,560 --> 00:45:10,319
Speaker 5: she they come from a matriarchal society. The women have

923
00:45:10,400 --> 00:45:12,920
Speaker 5: multiple you know what I'm saying, Like, so they're even different.

924
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:13,680
Speaker 3: Yeah.

925
00:45:13,719 --> 00:45:15,960
Speaker 2: Well, and then the King of Congo, part of his

926
00:45:16,000 --> 00:45:18,320
Speaker 2: whole I want to have multiple wives thing was actually

927
00:45:18,400 --> 00:45:21,120
Speaker 2: because of how women had power in his society. Yes,

928
00:45:21,200 --> 00:45:25,239
Speaker 2: it was maturallineal. Yeah, and it was also an elective monarchy.

929
00:45:25,400 --> 00:45:28,240
Speaker 2: So once again like we have this like oh, Europe

930
00:45:28,280 --> 00:45:31,799
Speaker 2: is clearly more advanced about Like look, monarchy is like

931
00:45:31,800 --> 00:45:34,239
Speaker 2: not my favorite way of its structuring society, but it's

932
00:45:34,280 --> 00:45:36,640
Speaker 2: an elective monarchy instead of a like you know, ye

933
00:45:36,640 --> 00:45:39,640
Speaker 2: the oldest son is immediately in charge society.

934
00:45:39,920 --> 00:45:42,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, mom chooses, Mom goes that kid.

935
00:45:42,360 --> 00:45:43,279
Speaker 4: Yeah yeah.

936
00:45:43,280 --> 00:45:46,200
Speaker 2: And so it was since his eldest son wasn't guaranteed,

937
00:45:46,520 --> 00:45:48,080
Speaker 2: it was like something where he was like, look, I

938
00:45:48,080 --> 00:45:49,759
Speaker 2: can't I need to have my multiple wives because I

939
00:45:49,760 --> 00:45:52,000
Speaker 2: have multiple sons for multiple wives and it's natural lineal

940
00:45:52,120 --> 00:45:55,160
Speaker 2: society and like, yeah, and he wasn't as fully in charge,

941
00:45:55,239 --> 00:45:57,040
Speaker 2: so he converted back to I think it was more

942
00:45:57,040 --> 00:45:57,919
Speaker 2: of an animist faith.

943
00:45:57,920 --> 00:46:00,600
Speaker 3: But I like again like a rishi, but that was

944
00:46:00,600 --> 00:46:02,920
Speaker 3: more aeshi was a little further north. But anyway, on.

945
00:46:03,200 --> 00:46:04,880
Speaker 2: No, no, I mean you know, I actually I actually

946
00:46:04,880 --> 00:46:07,560
Speaker 2: tried to find the name of what his traditional practice was,

947
00:46:07,600 --> 00:46:10,560
Speaker 2: and I checked multiple sources and none of them said.

948
00:46:10,440 --> 00:46:12,440
Speaker 5: Yeah, I might be wrong because like orishi is more

949
00:46:12,560 --> 00:46:13,840
Speaker 5: like Ghanaian benig.

950
00:46:14,200 --> 00:46:15,480
Speaker 3: That's not necessarily Congo.

951
00:46:15,760 --> 00:46:17,520
Speaker 5: So a lot of the Africans that made it to

952
00:46:17,600 --> 00:46:21,280
Speaker 5: America were like that was that was some of the practices.

953
00:46:21,320 --> 00:46:25,959
Speaker 2: Anyway, Okay, so he dies, he converts back to quote

954
00:46:26,040 --> 00:46:29,239
Speaker 2: unquote paganism. He dies, and two of his sons have

955
00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:32,120
Speaker 2: a war. One was an animist and one was a Catholic.

956
00:46:32,520 --> 00:46:34,560
Speaker 2: The Catholic son won and he was the one that

957
00:46:34,719 --> 00:46:38,920
Speaker 2: the mom picked and he became King Afonso the first

958
00:46:39,160 --> 00:46:42,640
Speaker 2: And if you read Catholic Education dot orgs article about this,

959
00:46:43,040 --> 00:46:46,240
Speaker 2: he was an anti slavery crusader who just wasn't able

960
00:46:46,280 --> 00:46:49,520
Speaker 2: to stop the slave trade, which combined traditional West African

961
00:46:49,600 --> 00:46:52,600
Speaker 2: slavery traditions, which is just this part's true. If you

962
00:46:52,640 --> 00:46:54,400
Speaker 2: capture people in battle, you can.

963
00:46:54,360 --> 00:46:56,439
Speaker 3: Own that or whatever, right oldest time.

964
00:46:56,880 --> 00:46:59,560
Speaker 2: I combined that with the more raw, exploitive chattel slavery

965
00:46:59,560 --> 00:47:02,920
Speaker 2: that the Porte wanted to impose. The idea that he

966
00:47:03,000 --> 00:47:06,960
Speaker 2: fought slavery is there is the tiniest bit of truth.

967
00:47:07,080 --> 00:47:10,480
Speaker 2: It is a lie. It is absolutely a lie. Afonso

968
00:47:10,640 --> 00:47:13,799
Speaker 2: centralized power, He conquered neighboring territories, and he sold all

969
00:47:13,800 --> 00:47:18,040
Speaker 2: the prisoners of war into slavery for export. Under his reign,

970
00:47:18,200 --> 00:47:21,120
Speaker 2: Congo became a Catholic country and an important center for

971
00:47:21,160 --> 00:47:24,440
Speaker 2: the Transatlantic slave trade. He built roads into the interior

972
00:47:24,600 --> 00:47:27,040
Speaker 2: to better allow people to go capture people to go sell.

973
00:47:27,840 --> 00:47:31,920
Speaker 2: He did fight against slavery in that the Portuguese were like,

974
00:47:32,600 --> 00:47:34,000
Speaker 2: all you black people are the same, We're going to

975
00:47:34,080 --> 00:47:36,200
Speaker 2: capture Congo people too, And he was like, no, no, no, no,

976
00:47:36,320 --> 00:47:37,200
Speaker 2: you can't capture.

977
00:47:37,000 --> 00:47:38,440
Speaker 3: Us and capture us. Yeah.

978
00:47:39,239 --> 00:47:43,960
Speaker 5: You hear all the time from like very bad faith arguments,

979
00:47:44,040 --> 00:47:48,080
Speaker 5: yeah about this era in time, you know, and the

980
00:47:48,120 --> 00:47:51,680
Speaker 5: coloring of the idea that like, well, well, since we're

981
00:47:51,760 --> 00:47:56,160
Speaker 5: humans like everybody else, and we all come from tribal struggles,

982
00:47:56,760 --> 00:48:01,520
Speaker 5: you're like you're thinking that they're thinking about it the

983
00:48:01,560 --> 00:48:04,520
Speaker 5: way we think about it, you know. So like when

984
00:48:04,560 --> 00:48:10,480
Speaker 5: I say I'm I'm warring with this neighborhood tribe, it's like, oh, bro,

985
00:48:10,680 --> 00:48:13,640
Speaker 5: like I could defeat this tribe and make a little

986
00:48:13,680 --> 00:48:14,279
Speaker 5: money off it.

987
00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:15,799
Speaker 3: And then you know what I'm saying, like.

988
00:48:15,760 --> 00:48:18,919
Speaker 5: Okay, word, so like you said earlier, it's like we're

989
00:48:18,920 --> 00:48:20,640
Speaker 5: all using the same word slavery.

990
00:48:21,080 --> 00:48:22,680
Speaker 3: But man, I don't know, you.

991
00:48:22,680 --> 00:48:24,840
Speaker 5: Think I'm subhuman and you're gonna take me across the

992
00:48:25,000 --> 00:48:26,520
Speaker 5: you know what I'm saying, like it worked me to do.

993
00:48:26,640 --> 00:48:29,560
Speaker 5: I don't know, I'm thinking like I'm just making money

994
00:48:29,560 --> 00:48:32,239
Speaker 5: for the country, like you know, and then you're gonna

995
00:48:32,239 --> 00:48:34,200
Speaker 5: set them free the way that we set slaves free

996
00:48:34,239 --> 00:48:37,440
Speaker 5: after we're done with them, Like you don't own them,

997
00:48:38,080 --> 00:48:41,480
Speaker 5: Like what are you I'm saying, like, yeah, ain't know

998
00:48:41,840 --> 00:48:45,279
Speaker 5: they if your children, Like that's uniquely chattow slavery, that

999
00:48:45,400 --> 00:48:49,040
Speaker 5: your children of slaves are slaves, Like that's not I

1000
00:48:49,040 --> 00:48:51,000
Speaker 5: ain't know you meant that. I thought you was just

1001
00:48:51,040 --> 00:48:54,160
Speaker 5: gonna help me with the kingo you know. Yeah, yeah, no, totally.

1002
00:48:54,200 --> 00:48:56,160
Speaker 5: That's such a good way to put it, is that. Yeah,

1003
00:48:56,160 --> 00:48:58,960
Speaker 5: like people are using the same word and they're describing

1004
00:48:58,960 --> 00:49:00,800
Speaker 5: two very different things. And then yeah, you hear people

1005
00:49:01,440 --> 00:49:04,719
Speaker 5: like because you have to if you talk about transatlantic

1006
00:49:04,760 --> 00:49:07,239
Speaker 5: slave trade, you have to talk about the fact that

1007
00:49:07,280 --> 00:49:10,920
Speaker 5: like Africans participated in it, right, But you can't do

1008
00:49:11,040 --> 00:49:14,320
Speaker 5: it to then be like so it's all samey saby.

1009
00:49:14,360 --> 00:49:18,799
Speaker 3: Yeah, like therefore it's okay, yeah, yeah.

1010
00:49:18,320 --> 00:49:20,360
Speaker 2: No, the Portuguese showed up and we're like, we're going

1011
00:49:20,440 --> 00:49:24,560
Speaker 2: to turn this into a machine of stealing people. Yeah,

1012
00:49:24,640 --> 00:49:28,680
Speaker 2: you know, so important our stories that the Catholicization of

1013
00:49:28,680 --> 00:49:32,080
Speaker 2: African religion had already begun even before people were sold

1014
00:49:32,120 --> 00:49:35,120
Speaker 2: to Haiti. All of these African people are suddenly in

1015
00:49:35,160 --> 00:49:38,120
Speaker 2: sand among and they're being worked to death in sugar fields.

1016
00:49:38,160 --> 00:49:39,719
Speaker 2: A lot of them don't speak the same language, a

1017
00:49:39,760 --> 00:49:41,520
Speaker 2: lot of them don't see themselves as part of the

1018
00:49:41,560 --> 00:49:44,720
Speaker 2: same culture at all. Slowly they start building a culture

1019
00:49:44,760 --> 00:49:46,839
Speaker 2: that united them. And as best as I can tell,

1020
00:49:46,880 --> 00:49:49,560
Speaker 2: the thing that united them was the syncretic religion that

1021
00:49:49,680 --> 00:49:53,160
Speaker 2: they built in this new world, the religion of Vodu.

1022
00:49:54,080 --> 00:49:58,160
Speaker 2: And you probably you said you've deep dived this stuff before.

1023
00:49:59,440 --> 00:50:01,320
Speaker 2: Speaking of word words that people use all kinds of

1024
00:50:01,320 --> 00:50:04,480
Speaker 2: different ways, to mean different things. There is a lot

1025
00:50:04,480 --> 00:50:07,480
Speaker 2: of confusion around the name of this religion. It does

1026
00:50:07,520 --> 00:50:12,360
Speaker 2: not have the sharpest of boundaries. Vodu, Voodoo, Voodon, and

1027
00:50:12,440 --> 00:50:16,120
Speaker 2: who Doo are four separate things that are not always

1028
00:50:16,160 --> 00:50:20,759
Speaker 2: seen as separate things, including sometimes by practitioners. Yeah, as

1029
00:50:20,800 --> 00:50:23,120
Speaker 2: best as I am able to figure out by cross

1030
00:50:23,160 --> 00:50:24,960
Speaker 2: reverence in a million sources and talking to one of

1031
00:50:25,000 --> 00:50:26,319
Speaker 2: my friends and knows a little bit more about this

1032
00:50:26,360 --> 00:50:29,840
Speaker 2: than I do. Vodu, the main subject of this episode

1033
00:50:29,920 --> 00:50:32,960
Speaker 2: is a religion that originated in sand among in Haiti

1034
00:50:33,560 --> 00:50:35,919
Speaker 2: that combine the religious and spiritual practices of a bunch

1035
00:50:36,000 --> 00:50:39,000
Speaker 2: of people there. Voudon is the name used to describe

1036
00:50:39,040 --> 00:50:43,840
Speaker 2: the religion practice in Western Africa. Voodoo is the Louisiana version.

1037
00:50:44,719 --> 00:50:48,160
Speaker 2: Whodoo is a closely related kind of folk religion that

1038
00:50:48,280 --> 00:50:50,480
Speaker 2: is a bit less formalized and sometimes is just a

1039
00:50:50,520 --> 00:50:53,480
Speaker 2: word for the ritual practices rather than the religion in general,

1040
00:50:53,960 --> 00:50:57,520
Speaker 2: and its spread further throughout the Southern US. Each of

1041
00:50:57,560 --> 00:51:00,680
Speaker 2: these draws from different amounts of different regions of Africa

1042
00:51:00,800 --> 00:51:04,919
Speaker 2: and syncretize slightly differently. For example, also with Islam, which

1043
00:51:04,960 --> 00:51:07,879
Speaker 2: is also heavily syncretized with African religions by that point too,

1044
00:51:07,880 --> 00:51:11,000
Speaker 2: because Islam was also very present in Africa.

1045
00:51:11,160 --> 00:51:14,000
Speaker 5: Yeah, I often think of it as like the way

1046
00:51:14,040 --> 00:51:17,759
Speaker 5: you it's I think of it like gumbo, like the

1047
00:51:17,800 --> 00:51:20,720
Speaker 5: way you would describe gumbo to where it's like what's

1048
00:51:20,840 --> 00:51:24,640
Speaker 5: what is it? And you're like, yeah, well it's I mean,

1049
00:51:25,200 --> 00:51:27,600
Speaker 5: do you have a you can't? Is there a gumbo recipe?

1050
00:51:27,640 --> 00:51:30,680
Speaker 5: Like you know, he's like, I don't know, it's jumbalaya,

1051
00:51:30,719 --> 00:51:32,680
Speaker 5: it's you know what I mean, Like there's so and

1052
00:51:32,840 --> 00:51:36,240
Speaker 5: especially with i Jab, have always felt like that's because

1053
00:51:36,400 --> 00:51:38,520
Speaker 5: my lord, I'm married a first gen Mexican. Like there's

1054
00:51:38,520 --> 00:51:41,359
Speaker 5: Santa Ria, which is like I was like, this sound

1055
00:51:41,400 --> 00:51:42,040
Speaker 5: like voodoo to me.

1056
00:51:42,120 --> 00:51:42,680
Speaker 3: You know what I'm saying.

1057
00:51:42,800 --> 00:51:45,640
Speaker 2: So uh and it's slightly different, but it's coming from them.

1058
00:51:45,680 --> 00:51:47,759
Speaker 3: Yeah, yes, slightly different, you know.

1059
00:51:48,000 --> 00:51:52,120
Speaker 5: So I always it's like the edges of it, that's

1060
00:51:52,120 --> 00:51:52,920
Speaker 5: what we were saying earlier.

1061
00:51:52,960 --> 00:51:53,920
Speaker 3: It's like I know you, I know.

1062
00:51:53,880 --> 00:51:58,080
Speaker 5: You're saying religion because that's the lens you have. But

1063
00:51:58,160 --> 00:52:01,080
Speaker 5: it's like it's it's not the like the way you

1064
00:52:01,160 --> 00:52:04,560
Speaker 5: mean it not you mark, No, Yeah, like yeah, you

1065
00:52:04,560 --> 00:52:05,120
Speaker 5: know what I'm saying.

1066
00:52:05,440 --> 00:52:06,800
Speaker 3: That's why you that's why we can't.

1067
00:52:06,840 --> 00:52:08,200
Speaker 5: Like, like you said, it's like you can read a

1068
00:52:08,280 --> 00:52:12,680
Speaker 5: trillion books, and I'm like, just like ask seventeen grandma's Yeah,

1069
00:52:12,880 --> 00:52:13,720
Speaker 5: how to make gumbo?

1070
00:52:15,440 --> 00:52:17,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, you need to get your rule right.

1071
00:52:17,120 --> 00:52:19,120
Speaker 5: And you know, you boil up your shrimp and you

1072
00:52:19,200 --> 00:52:21,080
Speaker 5: know what I'm saying. It's like, okay, so it's a

1073
00:52:21,200 --> 00:52:25,560
Speaker 5: shrimp soup. Well, no, it's perhaps sausage. Do I gotta

1074
00:52:25,600 --> 00:52:26,080
Speaker 5: have seafood?

1075
00:52:26,120 --> 00:52:26,160
Speaker 1: No?

1076
00:52:26,200 --> 00:52:28,239
Speaker 5: I don't have to seafood. Well then okay, so it's

1077
00:52:28,280 --> 00:52:30,560
Speaker 5: just can you be vegetarian? Well I guess, I guess

1078
00:52:30,560 --> 00:52:32,960
Speaker 5: it's still gumbo, and mean, well, what makes it gumbo?

1079
00:52:33,000 --> 00:52:35,520
Speaker 5: It's gumbo because it's gumbo. Like I don't, I don't

1080
00:52:35,560 --> 00:52:36,960
Speaker 5: know what to tell you.

1081
00:52:37,080 --> 00:52:40,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, you for anyone who doesn't listen to hood politics

1082
00:52:40,440 --> 00:52:42,759
Speaker 2: with Prop, you need to listen to it because Prop

1083
00:52:42,880 --> 00:52:47,520
Speaker 2: is the master of explaining things in exactly this way.

1084
00:52:47,960 --> 00:52:50,000
Speaker 2: That is, that is the way to describe it, that is, yeah,

1085
00:52:50,719 --> 00:52:54,080
Speaker 2: you know it when you see it. Yeah, so'st We're

1086
00:52:54,280 --> 00:52:57,800
Speaker 2: gonna focus on Haitian voting because it is the religion.

1087
00:52:58,200 --> 00:53:00,440
Speaker 2: And yeah, when we say like the religion, most of

1088
00:53:00,480 --> 00:53:05,240
Speaker 2: these people will call themselves Catholic and go to Catholic mass, absolutely,

1089
00:53:05,600 --> 00:53:07,359
Speaker 2: and like you could, you could be more than one

1090
00:53:07,400 --> 00:53:07,839
Speaker 2: thing here.

1091
00:53:07,920 --> 00:53:12,120
Speaker 5: You know, I say, if I say my actual relation

1092
00:53:12,239 --> 00:53:14,359
Speaker 5: to this person, it'll be very obvious just the case

1093
00:53:14,400 --> 00:53:17,000
Speaker 5: this person listens to or people that know these people

1094
00:53:17,040 --> 00:53:19,319
Speaker 5: listen to this. But I was very close to a

1095
00:53:19,320 --> 00:53:25,280
Speaker 5: Haitian family for a while whose elders were deeply stooped

1096
00:53:25,520 --> 00:53:28,480
Speaker 5: and you know, and very to the points of where

1097
00:53:28,520 --> 00:53:32,520
Speaker 5: like this person's parents were. Our dad was like, you

1098
00:53:32,600 --> 00:53:35,800
Speaker 5: are not allowed to be around them.

1099
00:53:35,640 --> 00:53:37,960
Speaker 2: Like like oh shit, okay, yeah, I'm saying.

1100
00:53:38,040 --> 00:53:39,600
Speaker 3: But if you talk to them, they were like.

1101
00:53:40,920 --> 00:53:43,120
Speaker 2: Or Catholic, we're Christians.

1102
00:53:43,239 --> 00:53:45,560
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, Like we're Christians, you know what I'm saying.

1103
00:53:45,880 --> 00:53:49,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, No. And as I read about it now,

1104
00:53:49,760 --> 00:53:52,920
Speaker 2: there's like arguments going on in Haiti between evangelicals and

1105
00:53:53,200 --> 00:53:58,000
Speaker 2: practitioners voodoo or voodoo and Catholics literally about the origins

1106
00:53:58,000 --> 00:53:59,680
Speaker 2: of Haiti as a nation. Because it's going to come

1107
00:53:59,719 --> 00:54:02,440
Speaker 2: down to spoiler for probably part three, it's gonna come

1108
00:54:02,440 --> 00:54:05,200
Speaker 2: down to it's gonna get kicked off by a Vodou

1109
00:54:05,560 --> 00:54:09,839
Speaker 2: ceremony in the woods. And so the evangelical position is

1110
00:54:10,440 --> 00:54:14,239
Speaker 2: that was a deal with the devil, right yeah, and

1111
00:54:14,280 --> 00:54:17,160
Speaker 2: then the like well yeah, yeah, we're like, what are

1112
00:54:17,160 --> 00:54:19,400
Speaker 2: you talking about? We just we did a thing, like

1113
00:54:19,440 --> 00:54:22,880
Speaker 2: we do the thing and it's fine, you know, yeah,

1114
00:54:23,280 --> 00:54:27,600
Speaker 2: But to talk about w voodoo is all these enslaved

1115
00:54:27,600 --> 00:54:29,640
Speaker 2: people are showing up. Soon enough, the King of France

1116
00:54:29,680 --> 00:54:32,480
Speaker 2: demands they all convert to Catholicism. And the most Catholic

1117
00:54:32,560 --> 00:54:34,239
Speaker 2: thing you can do of all is to say, sure,

1118
00:54:34,280 --> 00:54:36,719
Speaker 2: I guess I'm Catholic whatever, without actually changing what you

1119
00:54:36,760 --> 00:54:41,240
Speaker 2: believe in already, and then call it Catholicism. My argument

1120
00:54:41,280 --> 00:54:44,880
Speaker 2: for this, my grandfather was like born and raised an atheist,

1121
00:54:45,320 --> 00:54:47,080
Speaker 2: but in order to marry my grandmother, he had to

1122
00:54:47,080 --> 00:54:49,200
Speaker 2: get baptized Catholic. So he just crossed his fingers and

1123
00:54:49,239 --> 00:54:50,240
Speaker 2: got baptized Catholic.

1124
00:54:50,520 --> 00:54:52,920
Speaker 3: Doesn't count because he crossed his fingers, But it's cool.

1125
00:54:53,000 --> 00:54:55,560
Speaker 2: And I would argue that makes him the most Catholic

1126
00:54:55,600 --> 00:54:56,520
Speaker 2: person in the family.

1127
00:54:57,239 --> 00:54:58,200
Speaker 3: That's hilarious.

1128
00:54:58,719 --> 00:55:01,000
Speaker 5: I had another friend who really got involved in like

1129
00:55:02,280 --> 00:55:05,759
Speaker 5: just in his own sort of journey and reclaiming his

1130
00:55:06,440 --> 00:55:08,960
Speaker 5: africanness and stuff like that, like really got involved in

1131
00:55:09,000 --> 00:55:12,400
Speaker 5: a lot of like West African animists, like traditions. His

1132
00:55:12,560 --> 00:55:15,200
Speaker 5: argument was like, I don't understand how this is any

1133
00:55:15,320 --> 00:55:18,719
Speaker 5: different than he's like, have you you read Leviticus? Like

1134
00:55:19,200 --> 00:55:21,760
Speaker 5: like you you know, you chopping up birds and splitting

1135
00:55:21,760 --> 00:55:24,439
Speaker 5: them in half, and the priest walked through them, y'all.

1136
00:55:24,440 --> 00:55:28,719
Speaker 5: Whole y'all religion is based on penal substitutionary atonement that

1137
00:55:28,800 --> 00:55:33,359
Speaker 5: God became a human and died and the blood of

1138
00:55:33,400 --> 00:55:35,880
Speaker 5: your savior, Like, I don't have that any weirder than

1139
00:55:35,920 --> 00:55:37,960
Speaker 5: what we do it, like, you know, So that's why

1140
00:55:38,000 --> 00:55:40,319
Speaker 5: he was, like, I mean, probably why they ain't see

1141
00:55:40,360 --> 00:55:45,399
Speaker 5: no problems. He didn't understand why y'all didn't understand why

1142
00:55:45,520 --> 00:55:46,879
Speaker 5: what we was doing, you know what I'm saying.

1143
00:55:46,960 --> 00:55:50,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I literally bring up Leviticus in the script

1144
00:55:50,320 --> 00:55:52,160
Speaker 2: because of that exact thing.

1145
00:55:53,840 --> 00:55:56,120
Speaker 5: And then people go, no, no, no, the Leviticus was that

1146
00:55:56,239 --> 00:55:58,240
Speaker 5: was the old it was there was an ancient practice,

1147
00:55:58,280 --> 00:56:00,480
Speaker 5: and it was the symbol of what's coming. It was like,

1148
00:56:00,520 --> 00:56:03,719
Speaker 5: oh so it was, it was the symbol. It's what

1149
00:56:03,760 --> 00:56:05,040
Speaker 5: it symbolizes.

1150
00:56:05,880 --> 00:56:08,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh yeah, can anyone else do that?

1151
00:56:08,520 --> 00:56:08,719
Speaker 6: No?

1152
00:56:08,719 --> 00:56:11,520
Speaker 3: No, only us, Only only we can do to symbol Yeah. Yeah,

1153
00:56:12,000 --> 00:56:12,160
Speaker 3: ye know.

1154
00:56:14,280 --> 00:56:17,400
Speaker 2: The belief structures of Vodu and Catholicism are fairly compatible

1155
00:56:17,800 --> 00:56:22,200
Speaker 2: and Vodu. There's a single monotheistic creator, God Bandier, and

1156
00:56:22,840 --> 00:56:25,520
Speaker 2: he is too distant to be interacted with directly, and

1157
00:56:25,560 --> 00:56:28,120
Speaker 2: he doesn't interfere with human affairs, so you have to

1158
00:56:28,160 --> 00:56:31,239
Speaker 2: go through the spirits, the laah. These are referred to

1159
00:56:31,280 --> 00:56:35,360
Speaker 2: in all kinds of different ways, saints, spirits, the invisible ones,

1160
00:56:35,480 --> 00:56:41,080
Speaker 2: the mysteries, angels, geniuses. Yep, and there's a ton of

1161
00:56:41,080 --> 00:56:43,719
Speaker 2: these laa. They're all doing their own thing. They all

1162
00:56:43,760 --> 00:56:45,880
Speaker 2: have their own personalities and colors and days of the

1163
00:56:45,880 --> 00:56:49,600
Speaker 2: week and favorite gifts and shit. And again, raised Catholic,

1164
00:56:49,719 --> 00:56:52,520
Speaker 2: my family cares so much more about Guardian angels and

1165
00:56:52,600 --> 00:56:55,240
Speaker 2: cares more about saints than it does about God. Yeah,

1166
00:56:55,320 --> 00:56:59,200
Speaker 2: you know, yeah, the la wah can be nature spirits,

1167
00:56:59,320 --> 00:57:01,799
Speaker 2: some are ants. We're gonna talk about a woman who

1168
00:57:01,800 --> 00:57:03,680
Speaker 2: became a la who's one of the people kicked off

1169
00:57:03,680 --> 00:57:07,239
Speaker 2: the Haitian Revolution. They're divided up into different non shan

1170
00:57:07,600 --> 00:57:12,600
Speaker 2: or nations. These are different pantheons. Basically, there's seventeen of

1171
00:57:12,640 --> 00:57:15,799
Speaker 2: them or twenty one of them. More like, it just

1172
00:57:15,800 --> 00:57:17,560
Speaker 2: depends on who you talk to, who you ask.

1173
00:57:17,680 --> 00:57:17,880
Speaker 4: Yep.

1174
00:57:18,240 --> 00:57:22,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's no central there's no like pope of voting. Yeah,

1175
00:57:22,920 --> 00:57:24,080
Speaker 2: and it's kind of part of the deal that no

1176
00:57:24,080 --> 00:57:26,720
Speaker 2: one can like name all of them. These map a

1177
00:57:26,760 --> 00:57:29,880
Speaker 2: little bit to different African nations sort of as a

1178
00:57:29,880 --> 00:57:32,280
Speaker 2: way for everyone to bring the spirits they care about

1179
00:57:32,320 --> 00:57:36,440
Speaker 2: into the religion while still like maintaining like Pan Africanism

1180
00:57:36,520 --> 00:57:41,080
Speaker 2: isn't the destruction of the national identity, the ethnic identity,

1181
00:57:41,120 --> 00:57:45,200
Speaker 2: the same way that internationalism is not the destruction of ethnicity.

1182
00:57:45,240 --> 00:57:47,480
Speaker 2: It is the all of us coming together of it.

1183
00:57:47,600 --> 00:57:50,000
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's not a creama mushroom soup here. It's like,

1184
00:57:50,160 --> 00:57:52,120
Speaker 5: you know, you're not just like it's a gumbo dowsting

1185
00:57:52,160 --> 00:57:55,080
Speaker 5: it with mayonnaise. Yeah, it's yeah, it's gumbo.

1186
00:57:55,200 --> 00:57:56,040
Speaker 4: Yeah.

1187
00:57:56,080 --> 00:57:58,720
Speaker 2: And so they all can bring their own Lua to

1188
00:57:58,840 --> 00:58:02,240
Speaker 2: this thing. There's two main nations or three depending on

1189
00:58:02,280 --> 00:58:04,640
Speaker 2: who you ask, the gooday or the ancestor spirits the

1190
00:58:04,680 --> 00:58:06,800
Speaker 2: spirits of the dead, but they're not what we're going

1191
00:58:06,840 --> 00:58:09,400
Speaker 2: to be talking about today. The two main nations are

1192
00:58:09,400 --> 00:58:12,360
Speaker 2: the Rata and the Petro. The Rata are the nation

1193
00:58:12,440 --> 00:58:15,600
Speaker 2: of Lua that come more from West Africa, specifically from

1194
00:58:15,600 --> 00:58:19,400
Speaker 2: the Vudan tradition, and these are like more serene they're

1195
00:58:19,400 --> 00:58:23,480
Speaker 2: more like water. Right. Then there's the Petro. The Petro

1196
00:58:23,640 --> 00:58:26,800
Speaker 2: are the mean ones. They are the ones who know

1197
00:58:26,840 --> 00:58:29,480
Speaker 2: how to get shit done and do not ask nicely.

1198
00:58:29,960 --> 00:58:33,240
Speaker 2: They are the fiery Lua. And I find this really fascinating.

1199
00:58:33,360 --> 00:58:37,280
Speaker 2: They come more from Haiti itself and also from Congo,

1200
00:58:37,680 --> 00:58:40,800
Speaker 2: and as I was saying earlier, the folks from Congo

1201
00:58:40,880 --> 00:58:44,360
Speaker 2: who were stolen and taken, there are the later arrivals.

1202
00:58:44,840 --> 00:58:49,120
Speaker 2: And so it's more like this makes sense to me

1203
00:58:49,160 --> 00:58:51,200
Speaker 2: that the Luah of Africa or over all, the ones

1204
00:58:51,200 --> 00:58:53,320
Speaker 2: who are like, oh, we're like chill, are doing our thing,

1205
00:58:53,400 --> 00:58:56,320
Speaker 2: Everything's all right, yeah, you know, and then the people

1206
00:58:56,320 --> 00:58:59,200
Speaker 2: who are like, oh, I'm on Death Island where I've

1207
00:58:59,280 --> 00:58:59,840
Speaker 2: been brought to.

1208
00:59:00,440 --> 00:59:02,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, nah, fam, I need to mean angels.

1209
00:59:02,760 --> 00:59:06,600
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, Like you're basically in the move I've never

1210
00:59:06,640 --> 00:59:08,520
Speaker 2: seen the movie Saw. I can't handle it, but you're

1211
00:59:08,560 --> 00:59:12,000
Speaker 2: basically in the movie Saw. If you are an enslave person.

1212
00:59:12,120 --> 00:59:15,160
Speaker 3: Yeah right, yeah, it's all bad.

1213
00:59:15,040 --> 00:59:19,200
Speaker 2: Like you're gonna have some mean fucking guardian spirits. Yes,

1214
00:59:20,560 --> 00:59:22,920
Speaker 2: you will be shocked to know that it was by

1215
00:59:23,000 --> 00:59:26,760
Speaker 2: calling in the Petro Lawa, the fiery ones, that they

1216
00:59:26,800 --> 00:59:31,800
Speaker 2: set Haiti free and humans serve the Lawah, that's the

1217
00:59:31,800 --> 00:59:33,640
Speaker 2: word that usually gets used. But this isn't like a

1218
00:59:33,640 --> 00:59:37,360
Speaker 2: servant and a master. This isn't an enslavement relationship. It

1219
00:59:37,440 --> 00:59:41,680
Speaker 2: is a reciprocal arrangement. People offer gifts and sacrifices to

1220
00:59:41,680 --> 00:59:44,040
Speaker 2: the laaw and expect to be taken care of in return,

1221
00:59:44,120 --> 00:59:45,080
Speaker 2: and they will not leave you.

1222
00:59:46,000 --> 00:59:46,960
Speaker 4: Yeah.

1223
00:59:47,000 --> 00:59:50,120
Speaker 2: There are two practices in vodou that in particular are

1224
00:59:50,200 --> 00:59:54,640
Speaker 2: branded as like devil warship by the evangelical assholes. And

1225
00:59:55,240 --> 00:59:57,680
Speaker 2: it's like the whole reason that like it gets used

1226
00:59:57,680 --> 01:00:00,600
Speaker 2: as there's a lot of blackxpoy taste that goes on

1227
01:00:00,640 --> 01:00:01,800
Speaker 2: when you talk about voodoo.

1228
01:00:02,000 --> 01:00:04,800
Speaker 3: Oh my god, yeah, you know, yes.

1229
01:00:05,240 --> 01:00:08,800
Speaker 2: But like two of the things that people talk about

1230
01:00:09,160 --> 01:00:11,360
Speaker 2: is they talk about the sacrifice of animals and the

1231
01:00:11,400 --> 01:00:13,680
Speaker 2: possession of people. I promise you would bring up. I

1232
01:00:13,720 --> 01:00:15,240
Speaker 2: promise you i'd make the same point you've already made,

1233
01:00:15,280 --> 01:00:18,600
Speaker 2: so I'm gonna make it. Yeah, animals are sometimes sacrificed

1234
01:00:18,600 --> 01:00:22,760
Speaker 2: in vodoo. That is to say, animals are prayed over, anointed,

1235
01:00:23,000 --> 01:00:25,440
Speaker 2: and then humanely slaughtered before being cooked and served of

1236
01:00:25,480 --> 01:00:26,400
Speaker 2: the entire community.

1237
01:00:27,000 --> 01:00:27,200
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1238
01:00:27,680 --> 01:00:30,840
Speaker 2: Uh, this is not particularly different from kosher or her

1239
01:00:30,920 --> 01:00:34,120
Speaker 2: law practices, and it is still better than like factory farming,

1240
01:00:34,200 --> 01:00:36,240
Speaker 2: and like the way that most people eat meat, and.

1241
01:00:36,200 --> 01:00:39,880
Speaker 5: Like it is farm to table. Yeah, with the spirit

1242
01:00:39,880 --> 01:00:43,720
Speaker 5: of thankfulness. Yep, you know, yeah, I would even push

1243
01:00:43,760 --> 01:00:46,360
Speaker 5: the evangelicals. Now I'm about to get evangelical on you.

1244
01:00:46,480 --> 01:00:48,200
Speaker 2: No, no, fair enough, fair enough, I might be throwing

1245
01:00:48,320 --> 01:00:49,880
Speaker 2: I might be using that too loosely.

1246
01:00:50,040 --> 01:00:51,560
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, no, no, no, I'm good.

1247
01:00:51,640 --> 01:00:54,280
Speaker 5: I'm just saying I'm agreeing with you in the sense that,

1248
01:00:54,440 --> 01:00:58,000
Speaker 5: like I wonder which of your listeners, any of the

1249
01:00:58,000 --> 01:01:00,720
Speaker 5: exvangelicals who are still a part of this, like okay,

1250
01:01:00,760 --> 01:01:02,920
Speaker 5: go back to your go back to your uh your

1251
01:01:03,040 --> 01:01:06,920
Speaker 5: your summer camp Lessons of Romans of the Book of

1252
01:01:07,000 --> 01:01:11,160
Speaker 5: Romans and Paul talking about meat sacrifice to idols and

1253
01:01:11,160 --> 01:01:13,600
Speaker 5: that where are you or are you not supposed to

1254
01:01:13,600 --> 01:01:16,040
Speaker 5: eat this meat? And what Paul said the writer of

1255
01:01:16,120 --> 01:01:21,320
Speaker 5: Romans was like, shoot, I eat it, like it's fine.

1256
01:01:21,480 --> 01:01:24,680
Speaker 5: Like he's like, they're not. He's basically what he says

1257
01:01:24,800 --> 01:01:29,120
Speaker 5: is like, well they're not. Really, God's right, Like you

1258
01:01:29,160 --> 01:01:31,000
Speaker 5: know what I'm saying, Like, and he's like it's just

1259
01:01:32,000 --> 01:01:34,919
Speaker 5: it's fine. Yeah, Like it's like kind of is auDA.

1260
01:01:35,080 --> 01:01:39,440
Speaker 5: He's like, look, if it's if it's a problem for you, yeah, fine,

1261
01:01:39,720 --> 01:01:41,600
Speaker 5: but I'll be eating it.

1262
01:01:41,920 --> 01:01:44,320
Speaker 2: Joseph, No, it's kind of like aw For for like

1263
01:01:44,360 --> 01:01:47,520
Speaker 2: a thousand years, the Catholic Church didn't bother like burning

1264
01:01:47,520 --> 01:01:50,760
Speaker 2: witches because witchcraft wasn't real. They were like, yeah, yeah, yeah,

1265
01:01:50,800 --> 01:01:52,320
Speaker 2: that person says they're a witch, but it doesn't matter.

1266
01:01:52,360 --> 01:01:55,920
Speaker 2: That's not real thing we believe in science or you know.

1267
01:01:56,320 --> 01:01:58,400
Speaker 2: And it was only later that they were like, oh,

1268
01:01:58,400 --> 01:01:59,880
Speaker 2: we gotta burn everyone.

1269
01:02:00,080 --> 01:02:01,320
Speaker 6: Uh but yeah.

1270
01:02:01,600 --> 01:02:03,960
Speaker 2: In Leviticus from the Old Testament, it says basically the

1271
01:02:03,960 --> 01:02:05,840
Speaker 2: same thing. You sacrifice an animal and then it is

1272
01:02:05,880 --> 01:02:09,280
Speaker 2: eaten by everyone in the community. Yeah, people eat animals.

1273
01:02:09,320 --> 01:02:12,280
Speaker 2: I don't, Almost everyone I know does. It's fine.

1274
01:02:13,040 --> 01:02:14,200
Speaker 4: Yeah.

1275
01:02:14,360 --> 01:02:18,400
Speaker 2: As for possession, that's a mistranslation. The more direct translation

1276
01:02:18,480 --> 01:02:22,280
Speaker 2: of what happens is ritual mounting. You are like a

1277
01:02:22,320 --> 01:02:25,520
Speaker 2: horse who is mounted and ridden by a lawa you

1278
01:02:25,640 --> 01:02:29,560
Speaker 2: channel the spirit. So many faiths have versions of this.

1279
01:02:29,800 --> 01:02:33,160
Speaker 2: It also doesn't seem particularly ethically different from like speaking

1280
01:02:33,240 --> 01:02:37,240
Speaker 2: in tongues or whatever. Yeah, ecstatic states are part of religion.

1281
01:02:37,480 --> 01:02:39,520
Speaker 2: They're part of why people like religion.

1282
01:02:40,280 --> 01:02:43,720
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, you're supposed to be, but that's an evil spirit.

1283
01:02:43,720 --> 01:02:45,960
Speaker 5: You supposed to only had a holy spirit, only supposed

1284
01:02:45,960 --> 01:02:47,120
Speaker 5: to be possession with the Holy One.

1285
01:02:47,200 --> 01:02:49,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, no, only the one that I like, you know,

1286
01:02:50,440 --> 01:02:53,680
Speaker 2: there's no there's no devil in Vodu like.

1287
01:02:54,240 --> 01:02:56,920
Speaker 5: Which is like if if you're gonna move the camera

1288
01:02:56,960 --> 01:02:59,280
Speaker 5: out and look at this as as aliens, I would

1289
01:02:59,280 --> 01:03:03,360
Speaker 5: be like, oh, well I want that one. That one

1290
01:03:03,360 --> 01:03:05,439
Speaker 5: ain't got a debt, Like why would I want Why

1291
01:03:05,440 --> 01:03:07,040
Speaker 5: would I want to be one brought it a debt?

1292
01:03:07,240 --> 01:03:09,640
Speaker 3: I want a devil. I want to go with them. Yeah.

1293
01:03:09,760 --> 01:03:12,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. They're like, oh, people just do different things

1294
01:03:12,080 --> 01:03:13,840
Speaker 2: and like I'll just be doing stuff.

1295
01:03:14,080 --> 01:03:17,520
Speaker 3: Yeah all right. Yeah.

1296
01:03:17,600 --> 01:03:21,800
Speaker 2: So the fact that Haiti had the most successful slaver

1297
01:03:21,880 --> 01:03:24,200
Speaker 2: vault in the America's was not something people would have

1298
01:03:24,200 --> 01:03:27,760
Speaker 2: seen coming. It was, in some ways a quieter place

1299
01:03:27,800 --> 01:03:30,360
Speaker 2: than other places. Jamaica had a ton of Maroon wars.

1300
01:03:30,400 --> 01:03:34,320
Speaker 2: For example, when the French king passed La Code Noir

1301
01:03:34,520 --> 01:03:37,760
Speaker 2: the Black Code in sixteen eighty five, it demanded that

1302
01:03:37,800 --> 01:03:42,280
Speaker 2: the enslaved people get converted to Catholicism. It also to

1303
01:03:42,320 --> 01:03:43,840
Speaker 2: be clear, this is one of the most evil documents

1304
01:03:43,880 --> 01:03:45,760
Speaker 2: in the world. It's just a very clear like laying

1305
01:03:45,800 --> 01:03:47,760
Speaker 2: out like here's how we're going to do slavery, right.

1306
01:03:47,840 --> 01:03:50,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, but it.

1307
01:03:49,720 --> 01:03:51,800
Speaker 2: It was way too nice for the actual slavers. The

1308
01:03:51,840 --> 01:03:54,880
Speaker 2: slavers themselves wouldn't go along with it. It said that

1309
01:03:54,920 --> 01:03:57,560
Speaker 2: while these people were property, they're also still kind of people.

1310
01:03:57,800 --> 01:04:01,080
Speaker 3: They're still image bears. Yeah, yeah, exactly, Yeah, yeah, you're

1311
01:04:01,080 --> 01:04:02,400
Speaker 3: still but anyway, go on.

1312
01:04:02,760 --> 01:04:05,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, they could not be forced to work on Sundays

1313
01:04:05,160 --> 01:04:07,760
Speaker 2: or religious holidays. They had to be clothed and fed

1314
01:04:07,800 --> 01:04:11,560
Speaker 2: and cared for. You can't like extra abuse them. And

1315
01:04:11,600 --> 01:04:14,440
Speaker 2: there's even a specific way that they can seek redress

1316
01:04:14,440 --> 01:04:18,280
Speaker 2: of grievances through the court system. To be clear, it

1317
01:04:18,320 --> 01:04:21,400
Speaker 2: also prohibited slaves from owning property or having any legal

1318
01:04:21,440 --> 01:04:25,720
Speaker 2: existence besides those like specific redresses. There's a vile document.

1319
01:04:26,000 --> 01:04:31,480
Speaker 2: It is far too nice for the French slavers. Yeah,

1320
01:04:32,000 --> 01:04:34,480
Speaker 2: the king is far away and the slavers in the

1321
01:04:34,520 --> 01:04:36,960
Speaker 2: colony had no interest in obeying the Black codes, so

1322
01:04:36,960 --> 01:04:41,560
Speaker 2: they didn't. They forced them to become Catholics. But over

1323
01:04:41,600 --> 01:04:44,800
Speaker 2: one hundred years, only five court cases were successfully I

1324
01:04:44,840 --> 01:04:49,640
Speaker 2: think filed against slavers by slaves, Like, I don't even

1325
01:04:49,680 --> 01:04:52,240
Speaker 2: think they won. I could have been reading the source wrong.

1326
01:04:53,200 --> 01:04:54,600
Speaker 2: I think only five were filed.

1327
01:04:55,120 --> 01:04:58,680
Speaker 5: If you listen, Oh okay, if like, let me put

1328
01:04:58,760 --> 01:05:04,320
Speaker 5: myself into a slave shoes to be like really, homie,

1329
01:05:04,440 --> 01:05:07,000
Speaker 5: you like you think the court's gonna help you?

1330
01:05:07,480 --> 01:05:11,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly the word yeah.

1331
01:05:10,560 --> 01:05:14,840
Speaker 5: Whoa, I'm gonna tell the police all right.

1332
01:05:15,320 --> 01:05:16,920
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1333
01:05:17,240 --> 01:05:20,440
Speaker 2: This had a strange knock on effect. The fact that

1334
01:05:20,480 --> 01:05:23,000
Speaker 2: the courts were like supposed to do this thing but

1335
01:05:23,040 --> 01:05:28,439
Speaker 2: didn't want to in erased Sandemong's history. We don't have

1336
01:05:29,080 --> 01:05:31,440
Speaker 2: a ton of documents because a lot of the like

1337
01:05:31,920 --> 01:05:34,640
Speaker 2: early modern documents, we have our court documents, right, Like

1338
01:05:34,680 --> 01:05:37,360
Speaker 2: a lot of the like testimonies of people in court

1339
01:05:37,400 --> 01:05:39,200
Speaker 2: are like some of the only records we have, Like

1340
01:05:39,200 --> 01:05:41,600
Speaker 2: like why we know anything about Joan of Arc right, yeah,

1341
01:05:41,720 --> 01:05:45,920
Speaker 2: is because of the extensive trials. Word okay, Sandomong doesn't

1342
01:05:45,960 --> 01:05:50,320
Speaker 2: have that. The colonial courts basically didn't keep records since

1343
01:05:50,320 --> 01:05:54,200
Speaker 2: it any like, anytime a black person was captured, like

1344
01:05:54,240 --> 01:05:57,800
Speaker 2: recaptured and then taken to court, he might say things like, well,

1345
01:05:57,800 --> 01:05:59,320
Speaker 2: that white guy beat the shit out of me all

1346
01:05:59,360 --> 01:05:59,720
Speaker 2: the time.

1347
01:06:00,320 --> 01:06:01,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, and the white.

1348
01:06:01,240 --> 01:06:03,160
Speaker 2: Guy wasn't supposed to beat the shit out of him,

1349
01:06:03,480 --> 01:06:05,080
Speaker 2: so why write it?

1350
01:06:05,120 --> 01:06:07,040
Speaker 3: Down, you can't have a record.

1351
01:06:07,760 --> 01:06:11,640
Speaker 2: The courts kept very poor records, often purging quote old

1352
01:06:11,680 --> 01:06:15,000
Speaker 2: criminal trials of blacks and other useless items.

1353
01:06:15,480 --> 01:06:18,600
Speaker 3: There is nothing new, yeah, I know.

1354
01:06:21,040 --> 01:06:21,440
Speaker 6: Wow.

1355
01:06:21,880 --> 01:06:24,440
Speaker 2: And then in seventeen thirty four all the court records

1356
01:06:24,440 --> 01:06:27,400
Speaker 2: were destroyed by a fire anyway, and then like fifty

1357
01:06:27,520 --> 01:06:30,720
Speaker 2: years later a bunch more were lost during a paperwork shuffle,

1358
01:06:30,760 --> 01:06:33,120
Speaker 2: like two courts merged and then ah, whoops, we lost

1359
01:06:33,160 --> 01:06:33,480
Speaker 2: them all.

1360
01:06:35,080 --> 01:06:39,400
Speaker 5: I'm pretty sure there was a surveillance camera well appreciated

1361
01:06:39,440 --> 01:06:43,520
Speaker 5: this footage of this cop beating this person it dead. Yeah,

1362
01:06:43,600 --> 01:06:45,320
Speaker 5: I don't know what happened to it, Like I don't

1363
01:06:45,320 --> 01:06:46,400
Speaker 5: know the camera blinked out.

1364
01:06:46,640 --> 01:06:49,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, there's nothing nothing new.

1365
01:06:49,200 --> 01:06:51,440
Speaker 2: I remember watching this video recently about like it's a

1366
01:06:51,480 --> 01:06:54,200
Speaker 2: lawyer talking about like, are the cops allowed to destroy

1367
01:06:54,200 --> 01:06:56,880
Speaker 2: your personal like ring camera when they come to your house?

1368
01:06:57,200 --> 01:06:59,320
Speaker 2: And the answer is no, right, Like, of course not.

1369
01:06:59,640 --> 01:07:02,040
Speaker 2: There's like basically no condition in which they're allowed to

1370
01:07:02,040 --> 01:07:03,760
Speaker 2: cover up or destroy your camera, even if they're like

1371
01:07:03,760 --> 01:07:06,240
Speaker 2: serving a legal warn or whatever. But it's like one

1372
01:07:06,240 --> 01:07:07,640
Speaker 2: of the things you're like watching that and they're like, yeah,

1373
01:07:07,640 --> 01:07:11,040
Speaker 2: they're not allowed to. Well, they also have guns. In

1374
01:07:11,080 --> 01:07:12,360
Speaker 2: the court, Like, what am I gonna do with that?

1375
01:07:13,040 --> 01:07:14,080
Speaker 3: What are you gonna do about it?

1376
01:07:14,200 --> 01:07:17,880
Speaker 5: Yeah, dude, no, they're you're you're right, they're not allowed

1377
01:07:17,920 --> 01:07:18,960
Speaker 5: to destroy our cameras.

1378
01:07:19,040 --> 01:07:20,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I guess they won't.

1379
01:07:20,840 --> 01:07:22,240
Speaker 3: I guess I guess that'll stop them.

1380
01:07:22,320 --> 01:07:28,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, anyway, in send among Soon enough, rebellion is gonna start.

1381
01:07:29,240 --> 01:07:32,760
Speaker 2: And maybe it started, or at least people think it started,

1382
01:07:32,840 --> 01:07:35,080
Speaker 2: or they used to think it started with a bold

1383
01:07:35,120 --> 01:07:38,480
Speaker 2: new plot, a plot to poison every single white person

1384
01:07:38,560 --> 01:07:41,880
Speaker 2: on the island. And they even got pretty far along

1385
01:07:41,920 --> 01:07:45,000
Speaker 2: with that plot. But as for how it went down,

1386
01:07:45,320 --> 01:07:47,200
Speaker 2: you're gonna have to wait for our first named hero

1387
01:07:47,280 --> 01:07:49,919
Speaker 2: of the series on Wednesday in part two.

1388
01:07:50,440 --> 01:07:53,280
Speaker 3: You don't get to know who the poisoner in chief is.

1389
01:07:53,720 --> 01:07:57,680
Speaker 2: I know, unless you turn to Google and you can look.

1390
01:07:57,520 --> 01:07:58,440
Speaker 3: At all this up yourself.

1391
01:07:58,760 --> 01:08:01,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the secret of all podcasting.

1392
01:08:02,120 --> 01:08:04,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was like, I mean, it's all we just

1393
01:08:04,520 --> 01:08:05,080
Speaker 3: looked it up.

1394
01:08:05,240 --> 01:08:07,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, all my sources are in the show notes.

1395
01:08:08,200 --> 01:08:10,960
Speaker 1: He really took the allure out of the cliffhanger.

1396
01:08:11,400 --> 01:08:13,919
Speaker 2: Oh, I mean no, there's no way to know. Well,

1397
01:08:13,960 --> 01:08:17,160
Speaker 2: actually there is something that I'll tell you this also

1398
01:08:17,240 --> 01:08:20,879
Speaker 2: before for as a Cliffhanger. I wrote the entire script

1399
01:08:21,400 --> 01:08:24,479
Speaker 2: thinking the story went a certain way, and then two

1400
01:08:24,520 --> 01:08:28,000
Speaker 2: hours before we had to hit record, I found another

1401
01:08:28,040 --> 01:08:31,400
Speaker 2: more recent source that disagreed with like the ten other

1402
01:08:31,439 --> 01:08:32,639
Speaker 2: accounts that I had read.

1403
01:08:32,439 --> 01:08:36,920
Speaker 5: Of it that keep happening to you man, happening to me, oh, Margaret,

1404
01:08:37,000 --> 01:08:40,639
Speaker 5: my favorite of my favorite was the Buena Chao yeh

1405
01:08:40,640 --> 01:08:43,160
Speaker 5: you know and you that happened to you on now.

1406
01:08:43,200 --> 01:08:46,120
Speaker 3: He was like, actually I was done and then I wasn't.

1407
01:08:46,320 --> 01:08:46,920
Speaker 4: Yeah.

1408
01:08:46,960 --> 01:08:51,439
Speaker 1: She doesn't have luck when it comes. She's like, all right,

1409
01:08:51,479 --> 01:08:53,439
Speaker 1: I've done my job. I did not do it.

1410
01:08:54,080 --> 01:08:55,840
Speaker 6: I did not I do not know.

1411
01:08:56,080 --> 01:08:58,000
Speaker 2: Because I always want to know more than the like

1412
01:08:58,640 --> 01:09:01,040
Speaker 2: there's always the pop version of the history that's a

1413
01:09:01,080 --> 01:09:02,880
Speaker 2: little too clean, you know.

1414
01:09:03,439 --> 01:09:06,200
Speaker 5: And now you know your antennas are like your antennas

1415
01:09:06,200 --> 01:09:06,960
Speaker 5: are super sharp.

1416
01:09:07,080 --> 01:09:07,360
Speaker 6: Yeah.

1417
01:09:07,439 --> 01:09:11,640
Speaker 5: So she'd be like, wait a minute, yeah, do this

1418
01:09:11,760 --> 01:09:14,479
Speaker 5: feel this? This this resolves too easily.

1419
01:09:15,280 --> 01:09:20,439
Speaker 2: Yeah. But as for how it all went down, well,

1420
01:09:20,560 --> 01:09:22,719
Speaker 2: two of you are only have to wait about five minutes,

1421
01:09:22,760 --> 01:09:24,679
Speaker 2: but everyone else is gonna have to wait till Wednesday.

1422
01:09:25,200 --> 01:09:28,280
Speaker 2: Yuh ha ha ha, Propa, you got anything you.

1423
01:09:28,200 --> 01:09:28,639
Speaker 6: Want to plug?

1424
01:09:29,600 --> 01:09:32,639
Speaker 5: Yeah, man, we're cooking over at the Politics with prop

1425
01:09:33,800 --> 01:09:38,320
Speaker 5: You know, I'm on the same glorious network and we've

1426
01:09:38,920 --> 01:09:41,800
Speaker 5: added the video element because you know, you have to

1427
01:09:42,280 --> 01:09:46,720
Speaker 5: upgraded my camera, as you guys can see. Yeah, so

1428
01:09:46,760 --> 01:09:49,600
Speaker 5: there's that if you're in the LA area. Got some

1429
01:09:49,680 --> 01:09:54,280
Speaker 5: gigs come in the Sunset Rooftop me and artist named

1430
01:09:54,320 --> 01:09:57,960
Speaker 5: saw Rock. She's one of the dopest rappers on Earth.

1431
01:09:58,439 --> 01:10:03,679
Speaker 5: So yeah, Sunset Rooftop twenty second of February. And yeah,

1432
01:10:03,720 --> 01:10:05,760
Speaker 5: and just following along with us on the show Man

1433
01:10:05,960 --> 01:10:07,519
Speaker 5: like I'm having a great time over here.

1434
01:10:07,720 --> 01:10:10,880
Speaker 2: Hell yeah. My sister didn't ask for a lot of

1435
01:10:10,920 --> 01:10:13,599
Speaker 2: things for Christmas, but she asked for a terraform book

1436
01:10:13,640 --> 01:10:15,559
Speaker 2: by Problem, So people should check it out.

1437
01:10:16,080 --> 01:10:17,639
Speaker 3: Please please check out the book.

1438
01:10:17,760 --> 01:10:18,559
Speaker 6: That's so sweet.

1439
01:10:18,920 --> 01:10:21,760
Speaker 3: That is precious. I would have signed it.

1440
01:10:22,280 --> 01:10:25,200
Speaker 2: Oh shit, well I'll probably hit you up for that too.

1441
01:10:25,560 --> 01:10:25,760
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1442
01:10:25,840 --> 01:10:27,599
Speaker 4: Yeah, cool, all.

1443
01:10:27,560 --> 01:10:28,679
Speaker 2: Right, see everyone onnestime.

1444
01:10:28,840 --> 01:10:33,760
Speaker 4: All right.

1445
01:10:34,760 --> 01:10:37,280
Speaker 1: Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff is a production of

1446
01:10:37,320 --> 01:10:40,800
Speaker 1: cool Zone Media. More podcasts on cool Zone Media, visit

1447
01:10:40,840 --> 01:10:44,080
Speaker 1: our website Coolzonemedia dot com, or check us out on

1448
01:10:44,120 --> 01:10:48,520
Speaker 1: the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.