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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 2: A distraught mother says, who snatched my girl? Just five

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Speaker 2: from the playground? Where is Dulce? Good evening, I'm Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 2: This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us.

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Speaker 3: Five year old Dulce Maria Alparez mysteriously vanishes from a

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Speaker 3: playground and bridged in New Jersey while mommy is only

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Speaker 3: yards away. Dulce's family pleads with the public to help.

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Speaker 2: Joining us tonight is Dulce's mother begging for help? How

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Speaker 2: does a little girl get snatched from the playground basically

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Speaker 2: under mommy's nose? This is not the first time a

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Speaker 2: child has been snatched from a playground? Can witnesses be believed?

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Speaker 2: Where is Dulce? Everyone? I want to give you right

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Speaker 2: off the top, a tip line, a toll free tip line,

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Speaker 2: and a search for Dulce one eight hundred two two

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Speaker 2: five five three two four. There is a fifty two

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Speaker 2: thousand dollar reward for information leading to the discovery of

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Speaker 2: what happened to this five year old beautiful little girl.

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Speaker 2: Repeat eight hundred two two five five three two four.

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Speaker 2: Joining me an all star panel to make sense of

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Speaker 2: what we know regarding Dulce's disappearance, including Dulce's mother. But

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Speaker 2: first I'm going to go to a special guest joining

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Speaker 2: us who has been on the case since the beginning.

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Speaker 2: Many people say the story, but this is not a story.

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Speaker 2: This is a real family suffering real pain without their daughter.

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Speaker 2: To all of you moms and dads, grandparents out there,

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Speaker 2: a five year old little girl snatched from a public playground.

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Speaker 2: Straight out to Cloria Vargas, investigative reporter in let me

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Speaker 2: see Philly, who is the star of a documentary. Somebody

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Speaker 2: knows something the disappearance of Dulce, and it's streaming on Peacock. Claudia,

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Speaker 2: thank you for being with us. Tell me what you

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Speaker 2: understand happened the day that Dulce goes missing.

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Speaker 4: Right, Well, Dulce had just gotten out of school that

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Speaker 4: day and her and her little brother were asking mom,

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Speaker 4: you know, they wanted to go to the playground like

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Speaker 4: any little kid, And so that afternoon they headed off

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Speaker 4: to their local playground.

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Speaker 5: Mom was sitting in the car and they went with technically,

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Speaker 5: it's Dulsa's aunt, it's noema, who's the mom. Her little sister,

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Speaker 5: who was actually closer in age to dulcet So Camilla,

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Speaker 5: who is Dulsa's aunt, was doing her homework in the car.

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Speaker 5: Mom was sitting there as well, playing a lottery scratch

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Speaker 5: off while the kids were kind of in her line

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Speaker 5: of view, but you know, the playground is a little

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Speaker 5: further out.

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Speaker 1: They're playing.

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Speaker 5: All of a sudden, Mom looks up, doesn't see them,

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Speaker 5: so she goes to check on them and finds Dulsa's

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Speaker 5: little brother, three year old Manuel, crying and dul says,

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Speaker 5: nowhere to be found. So immediately Mom starts looking around.

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Speaker 5: She's thinking, dul says, playing hide and seek. After about

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Speaker 5: forty minutes, realizes I can't find my daughter. So that's

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Speaker 5: when she places the nine to one one call.

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Speaker 1: Guys joining me.

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Speaker 2: In addition to Claudia Vargus, is Dulcey's mother, Dulce Maria

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Speaker 2: no Maya Olavez nameya, thank you for being with us.

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Speaker 2: This is Dulcey's mother, Noema. So many times since Dulce

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Speaker 2: went missing, you have been attacked. You have been attacked

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Speaker 2: because you were sitting in the car helping with homework.

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Speaker 2: And you know what, I've done it myself, I who

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Speaker 2: have literally written a book including child safety at playgrounds.

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Speaker 2: I had to bring one of my twins back to

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Speaker 2: the car. She wanted bottled water. Then that was in

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Speaker 2: the cooler. My daughter was red in the face and flushed,

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Speaker 2: so we go back to the car. It was about,

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Speaker 2: oh gosh, thirty forty yards from my son.

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Speaker 1: I could see him.

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Speaker 2: I could see him going up the slide and coming down,

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Speaker 2: and I opened up the trunk of the car. I

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Speaker 2: couldn't see him at that time. I got out of

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Speaker 2: the water, I gave it to my daughter, I shut

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Speaker 2: the trunk, I got something out side of the car,

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Speaker 2: and we walked back to where my son was. I've

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Speaker 2: done it more than once because I believed I could

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Speaker 2: see him. You were not that far away from Dulce.

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Speaker 2: Your attention, true was diverted, but you were not that

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Speaker 2: far away from Dulce. You could see her and her

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Speaker 2: little brother. Manny no way, But tell me what happened

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Speaker 2: the day your five year old daughter vanished.

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Speaker 6: It was a Monday, September sixteen. I remember that I

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Speaker 6: wasn't working at that time. My mom wasn't working either.

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Speaker 6: She had her day off and the kids were getting

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Speaker 6: ready to go to school. So I want to go

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Speaker 6: get coffee and donuts, fugging donuts, And while gul said

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Speaker 6: was getting ready, she already knew that I was going

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Speaker 6: to get donuts. And I went and I was coming,

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Speaker 6: I was coming back and I was I was about

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Speaker 6: I ran over someone and I was getting delayed. So

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Speaker 6: as soon as I got home, Hu said was already

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Speaker 6: on the bus and my mom had told me that

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Speaker 6: she was crying because she didn't want to get on

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Speaker 6: the bus and my mom told her she has to

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Speaker 6: go in the bus.

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Speaker 7: She has to go to school.

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Speaker 6: My mom said that she returned back before she went

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Speaker 6: inside the US.

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Speaker 7: She came in, went and talked my mom and then

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Speaker 7: she left.

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Speaker 6: After that, we went to mynu's appointment and we had

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Speaker 6: went out to eat. After that, we had came home.

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Speaker 6: It was already time for the kids to come home.

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Speaker 6: So I had went to Luisa's post up with her

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Speaker 6: dusing Kamila get off and I went and got them off.

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Speaker 6: We got home and Dulca tells me they want to go.

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Speaker 6: They wanted to go play. Then I told them okay,

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Speaker 6: but it was hot that day, and then I just

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Speaker 6: didn't want her to go no more, and I told

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Speaker 6: her we're not going to go no more and then

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Speaker 6: I still remember that she started crying. She started jumping

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Speaker 6: up and down. Then she said, I want to go.

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Speaker 6: She said, I want to go to the park. You

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Speaker 6: said we were going, and now you're saying no, and

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Speaker 6: as I because I told her that we were going

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Speaker 6: to go, but we.

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Speaker 7: Then I was telling her that we weren't going to

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Speaker 7: go on more.

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Speaker 6: But then at the end we did win and we

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Speaker 6: were going to the park again, like it was hot.

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Speaker 6: I asked them if they wanted ice cream, and they

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Speaker 6: said yes. We stopped and ice cream shop, but as

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Speaker 6: soon as I noticed that ice cream shop was close,

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Speaker 6: and so we went to a nearby gas station and

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Speaker 6: that's where the kids were getting their ice cream and

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Speaker 6: they got their ice cream and I got a lot

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Speaker 6: of lottery ticket.

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Speaker 7: After there, we went to the park.

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Speaker 6: As soon as we got down, we got in the park,

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Speaker 6: Luisa started opening her ice cream manual two and they

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Speaker 6: were so excited that they were already they wanted to

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Speaker 6: get down from the park. I told him to wait,

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Speaker 6: but they were already they were excited. I'm like, okay,

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Speaker 6: you guys can go. And my Cameilla. At that time,

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Speaker 6: she was doing bad at school and I had a

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Speaker 6: helper with her homework so she could get better, and

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Speaker 6: I told her to stay in the car and until

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Speaker 6: she finishes homework, and I stayed with her inside the

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Speaker 6: car and I led my two kids, Manuo and Blusa

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Speaker 6: Maria go play in the playground. But I could see

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Speaker 6: the playground where was I parked at, But the only

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Speaker 6: thing I couldn't see was the swings.

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Speaker 7: And my mom.

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Speaker 6: I thought they needed my help to get in the

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Speaker 6: swings in order for me to push them.

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Speaker 7: So they were in the slide and I was scratching

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Speaker 7: a lot of ticket.

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Speaker 6: I put my head down and I saw last thing

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Speaker 6: I saw was Lousemanuo going down for the slide. And

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Speaker 6: when I was in the lottery ticket, then I had

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Speaker 6: received a message and just a few minutes I really

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Speaker 6: don't remember how many minutes were they When I looked

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Speaker 6: my head up, I didn't sell them no more. I

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Speaker 6: didn't tell them Lusa or Manum. That's when I had

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Speaker 6: told Amilive she could go track, and she did. She went,

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Speaker 6: but she only came with Manu and I told her

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Speaker 6: worst loosen and she told me she couldn't find her.

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Speaker 6: So I got down and went checked on myself and

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Speaker 6: there was no one at the park except some girls

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Speaker 6: in the basketball court, and I was looking for her,

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Speaker 6: screaming her name, and it was weird to me at first,

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Speaker 6: like why is she coming out? She never does this. Then,

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Speaker 6: at first, the first thing I came to mom like

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Speaker 6: she's probably playing hide and seek. She just wanted to play.

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Speaker 6: So I started looking for her everywhere and I couldn't

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Speaker 6: find her player, So I went behind some shots that

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Speaker 6: they were there. As soon as I went back there,

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Speaker 6: I didn't seen nothing, and I seen a trash can, like,

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Speaker 6: probably she's inside the trash can hiding.

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Speaker 7: As soon I.

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Speaker 6: Was already back at the buildings, I was already mad,

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Speaker 6: like she's already playing too hard that I didn't want

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Speaker 6: to think the worst at that time. I just wanted

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Speaker 6: to think that she was around and that she was

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Speaker 6: paying minutes past. But I went around the park two

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Speaker 6: times and I couldn't find her. And that's when I

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Speaker 6: had called the police, and I was on the phone

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Speaker 6: with them until they got there. And they got there,

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Speaker 6: they closed the park, a lot of ambulance, firefighters came, police.

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Speaker 7: Everyone started going inside the woods.

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Speaker 6: They started searching, like over two weeks in the park.

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Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace Guys.

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Speaker 2: Joining us is Dulsein, Maria's mother describing what happened when

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Speaker 2: her little five year old girl is kidnapped. Snatched from

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Speaker 2: a park. Many detectives called it an old school kidnapping.

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Speaker 2: Listen to our friend, doctor Phil.

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Speaker 6: I'll just walked towards the park and I found myself crying,

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Speaker 6: just standing there.

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Speaker 7: I thought that she was playing hide and seek.

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Speaker 6: I didn't want to believe that somebody took her.

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Speaker 7: You just pointed behind some building.

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Speaker 6: I looked behind these buildings and.

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Speaker 7: I couldn't find her.

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Speaker 6: I came down the path looking for her, you knowing

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Speaker 6: her name, and she wasn't an answering.

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Speaker 2: The ice cream video is of Dulce Maria going into

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Speaker 2: a little store the day she disappears. The day she disappears,

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Speaker 2: Brenda Trinidad joining us, a very close family friend and advocate. Brenda,

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Speaker 2: thank you for being with us and helping Naima through this.

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Speaker 2: That's how quickly everything happened. The ice cream hadn't even

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Speaker 2: melted yet. They get the ice cream at the little store,

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Speaker 2: they go to the playground. Mom is in the car

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Speaker 2: helping with homework. She sees Manny crying and goes out there.

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Speaker 2: She thinks he dropped his ice cream. The ice cream

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Speaker 2: hadn't even melted yet, Brenda, that's how quickly everything occurred.

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Speaker 7: Yes, I agree with you, Nancy on that.

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Speaker 8: Strangely, it seems like maybe the abductor was already lurking

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Speaker 8: in the park, because you can't be a rookie and

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Speaker 8: just take a child from apart that you necessarily don't

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Speaker 8: know the ends or the outside the park. That is

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Speaker 8: a real complicated part to come in and a real

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Speaker 8: complicated part to get out, and your chances of getting

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Speaker 8: caught with a child in the car are very extremely

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Speaker 8: high someone who doesn't know how to case area.

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Speaker 2: You know what's interesting, Brenda, trendid Dad. I write about

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Speaker 2: that in my book, Don't be a victim. When you're

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Speaker 2: taking your children to playgrounds or parks, Exactly what Noeima

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Speaker 2: did is what you should do. I don't mean sitting

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Speaker 2: in the car park. I mean taking a child to

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Speaker 2: a park where there is very limited in and out.

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Speaker 2: In other words, go to a playground or a park

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Speaker 2: that has a fence around it, and then you position

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Speaker 2: yourself either with your child or at that opening where

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Speaker 2: someone would have to go in and out, not an

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Speaker 2: open playground where there's a three hundred and sixty degree

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Speaker 2: entry and exit access. Now, what do you mean, Brenda

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Speaker 2: when you say this is a very difficult park for

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Speaker 2: an abduct or a kidnapped a kid after to get

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Speaker 2: in and out.

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Speaker 8: Well, Nancy, you have many ways to get inside the park,

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Speaker 8: and then two of the entrance ways are located besides

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Speaker 8: two schools, So you have two schools that are right

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Speaker 8: in front of where the park where she went missing.

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Speaker 8: So you have Cherry Elementary schools at West Avenue High

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Speaker 8: School I'm sorry, West Avenue School, and then you have

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Speaker 8: Bristian High School, which both are on each different ends

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Speaker 8: of a road, So you have Burt Avenue, you have

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Speaker 8: West Avenue School, and then on Scholastic Drive you have

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Speaker 8: the Britian High School. Now, if you leave from there,

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Speaker 8: you're possibly going to be caught on camera, and one

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Speaker 8: of the other exits you go in front of a

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Speaker 8: zoo as well, and.

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Speaker 7: Courthouses and everything like that.

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Speaker 8: So it's kind of strange to know that they were

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Speaker 8: able to leave with a child in broad daylight and

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Speaker 8: not be caught in any of the cameras nearby.

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Speaker 2: What happened to Dulce just five years old, joining me IRV. Brandt,

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Speaker 2: former US Marshall Service and author of a series of

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Speaker 2: books on Amazon about Jack Solo. One being Flying Solo

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Speaker 2: Top of the World, orv thank you so much for

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Speaker 2: being with US. Police immediately flood the area. They're searching

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Speaker 2: high and low. This has been referred to as a

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Speaker 2: quote old school kidnapping. What does that mean?

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Speaker 9: Well, Nancy, what they're mean by old school is just

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Speaker 9: snatching a kid up from a park, from out in

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Speaker 9: front of a school, or from a parking lot of

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Speaker 9: What immediately comes to your mind is a van coming

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Speaker 9: by with a sliding door and someone snatches it up

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Speaker 9: a kid and drives away. So I believe that's what

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Speaker 9: the police are talking about when they talk about old school.

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Speaker 9: It was a snatching graph.

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Speaker 2: Well, you heard Dolce's mother Neueima describing and her friend

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Speaker 2: Brenda Trinidad, who's helping, describing that this was a predator's dream. Okay,

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Speaker 2: because they're describing the fact that the predator had to

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Speaker 2: already be in there based on the ends and outs,

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Speaker 2: the entrances and exits of the playground. It makes perfect sense,

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Speaker 2: of Brandt because you've got multiple schools around there. This

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Speaker 2: is a kid's playground. It's not like it's an out

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Speaker 2: of the way place. This was exactly where a predator

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Speaker 2: would go to snatch a little girl.

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Speaker 9: I agree, Nancy, and I listened to the mother and

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Speaker 9: how she described it, and I think the same thing.

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Speaker 9: You could be in that park. That park is huge,

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Speaker 9: it has schools, it has a zoo, it has a playground,

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Speaker 9: and you could be in there without drawing notice, and

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Speaker 9: you could be, as you said, lurking around and looking

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Speaker 9: for an opportunity to do just what had happened, is

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Speaker 9: to snatch a kid up and drive off, and before

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Speaker 9: anybody realizes what has happened, that person would be gone.

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Speaker 9: The police wouldn't have a chance to and that park

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Speaker 9: is massive, and they wouldn't have a chance to lock

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Speaker 9: down the area. And so once you're out of the park,

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Speaker 9: you could be anywhere in the city or the state

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Speaker 9: before the police really had a chance to start their

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Speaker 9: investigation and start a search.

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Speaker 1: Guys, let's listen to more of than nine on one call.

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Speaker 10: Okay, so you're at the Basabell course behind high school here, Okay,

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Speaker 10: and what was she she left wearing?

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Speaker 11: She was wearing I remember what clothes she was wearing.

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Speaker 11: But she was wearing. I just remember what fans she

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Speaker 11: was wearing, like a slowery fans and some heels, some

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Speaker 11: my heels.

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Speaker 2: Back to mom Nuaima olive us joining us Neweima. Thank

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Speaker 2: you again for telling your story. And I know it's

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Speaker 2: painful to relive what happened when you got to little brother.

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Speaker 1: What did Manny say?

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Speaker 7: Manuel?

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Speaker 6: At that time, he was non verbal, he had speech

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Speaker 6: delay at three years old. And I asked him and

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Speaker 6: all he could say was just point behind the buildings,

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Speaker 6: and said that's all he could said, just point behind

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Speaker 6: the buildings because he wasn't talking.

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Speaker 2: And I've seen the video of you showing exactly where

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Speaker 2: you went behind the buildings. Tell me what you did

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Speaker 2: after man was pointed behind the buildings?

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Speaker 1: What did you do?

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Speaker 7: I was going.

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Speaker 6: Behind the buildings searching for a nice because Manuel said

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Speaker 6: that she had went over there, and I was looking

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Speaker 6: everywhere behind the buildings instead of trash cans, and I

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Speaker 6: couldn't find her. I was screaming her name, and that's

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Speaker 6: when I noticed that I couldn't find her.

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Speaker 10: Okay, my name fan line, which I here to the police. Okay,

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Speaker 10: and you asi correct.

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Speaker 11: Yes, all right, Hello ma'am Hello, did you see which

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Speaker 11: direction your child went? You know, we were in the car.

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Speaker 11: She came down with my son. They were running for

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Speaker 11: the park and then I mean sister, we came down.

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Speaker 11: When we got here at the park, she was in years.

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Speaker 11: They said, my son was just trying with issume because

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Speaker 11: somebody I'm through his issume in the four and my

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Speaker 11: daughter just run away.

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Speaker 3: Over thirty police officers searched the surrounding areas, but Dulja

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Speaker 3: has seemingly disappeared into thin air. New Jersey Police released

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Speaker 3: a sketch of a possible witness who may be able

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Speaker 3: to crack open Dulce's case.

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Speaker 2: Where is five year old Dulce? Joining us her mom

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Speaker 2: asking for your help. I want to give you the

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Speaker 2: toll free tip line again. Eight hundred two two five

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Speaker 2: five three two four repeat eight hundred two two five

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Speaker 2: five three two four. There was a fifty two thousand

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Speaker 2: dollars reward in the search for Dulce. Straight out to

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Speaker 2: Kathleen Murphy joining us from Triangle Divorce Lawyers dot com,

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Speaker 2: who has handled an investigative. So many children that go missing,

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Speaker 2: typically in custodial situations, Kathleen Murphy, that is not the

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Speaker 2: case here. Dad at the time was out of the country.

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Speaker 2: He did not have anything to do with this. Way

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Speaker 2: in on your thoughts about the disappearance.

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Speaker 12: I'm concerned that it is a stranger abduction. It seems

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Speaker 12: also that the child who is remaining would have said

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Speaker 12: something that they saw somebody that they knew, or was

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Speaker 12: able to communicate that they saw somebody knew.

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Speaker 2: But what do we learn witnesses say at this scene. Listen,

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Speaker 2: when we.

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Speaker 11: Came in and looked for her, we were looking everywhere.

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Speaker 6: For her, and then was at the basketball court with

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Speaker 6: her daughter that there was two black males that took her.

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Speaker 13: Son's ice cream and threw it on the ground and

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Speaker 13: left with her daughter.

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Speaker 7: Okay, well, we have the officers.

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Speaker 10: To pass works from Mayor Aigan.

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Speaker 11: Are you on, Mayor Aikin, I already have an officer here. Okay,

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Speaker 11: all right, well speak with the police.

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Speaker 1: Mail okay, okay.

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Speaker 2: Out to Claudia Vargas joining US investigative reporter or NBC

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Speaker 2: ten Philly, who has also created the documentary Somebody Knows

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Speaker 2: something the disappearance of Dulcey. Claudia, again, thank you for

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Speaker 2: being with us. So at the time, witnesses say two mails,

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Speaker 2: take Manuel's ice cream, throw it down and snatch Dulceay,

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Speaker 2: what if anything have you learned about those witness statements.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, so we asked police about that, and if you'll

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Speaker 5: hear the beginning of the nine to one call, Noema

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Speaker 5: actually describes that she was told it was a Hispanic

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Speaker 5: mail and a blackmail. So the nine one one operator

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Speaker 5: repeated it a little differently, but the initial witness description

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Speaker 5: was a Hispanic mail and a blackmail.

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Speaker 1: What we know is that police did.

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Speaker 5: Eventually identify who they believed the blackmail and data determined

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Speaker 5: he was not involved in any kidnapping or anything. They

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Speaker 5: have not yet identified a Hispanic mail that matches that description,

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Speaker 5: and that's the composite sketch that was released to the public,

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Speaker 5: and you guys had that up a little while ago,

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Speaker 5: so that person still has not been identified to this day,

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Speaker 5: but that's essentially what the witness has described, and based

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Speaker 5: on those witness descriptions, they will to come up with

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Speaker 5: that sketch. And to this day, please say there's still

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Speaker 5: interested in speaking to that man.

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Speaker 1: Guys.

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Speaker 2: A fifty two thousand dollars reward is on the line

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Speaker 2: fifty two thousand dollars in information related to the disappearance

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Speaker 2: of Dulce. You know, IRV Brandt, a former US Marshalls

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Speaker 2: Service and now author. You have looked for people all

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Speaker 2: around the world successfully, I might add, So you've seen

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Speaker 2: the sketch, You've heard what happened according to witnesses, and

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Speaker 2: these are This is not just Mommy saying this. These

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Speaker 2: are witness is there on the scene. What do you

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Speaker 2: make of it?

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Speaker 9: Well, Nancy, you use every resource that you have available

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Speaker 9: and within the Department of Justice. I know the FBI

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Speaker 9: is involved in the case, and the FBI has a

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Speaker 9: presence at US embassies all around the world and especially

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Speaker 9: south of the border, particularly Mexico, they have a very

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Speaker 9: large presence. So any leads that they get, you know,

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Speaker 9: with someone calling in with a possible ID, they would

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Speaker 9: be able to track down, even if it was in

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Speaker 9: another country, they would be able to track these leads down.

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Speaker 9: And I've worked multiple investigations doing just that using all

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Speaker 9: the resources that we have at hand, which is substantial,

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Speaker 9: especially in WNU factor an inner pol and able to

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Speaker 9: communicate with law enforcement agencies all around the world.

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Speaker 2: Lets get real or Brant do you really think someone

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Speaker 2: took dul Say from a playground, a local playground and

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Speaker 2: took her out of the country, Because I do not.

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Speaker 2: I don't think that's what happened.

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Speaker 9: I don't think it's likely, Nancy. But you can't overlook

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Speaker 9: anything when you're doing this type of investigation. You follow

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Speaker 9: the investigations where the leads take you. Even if it's

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Speaker 9: a long shot, You're going to investigate every possible.

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Speaker 1: You don't want to overlook.

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Speaker 9: Something or say, well, you know, I'm not going to

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Speaker 9: spend the time not looking into this because it's highly unlikely.

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Speaker 9: Some it's highly unlikely, it's not impossible, so every lead

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Speaker 9: has to be followed.

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Speaker 3: Duljay's family fights to keep her name and her story alive,

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Speaker 3: of hoping more witnesses will come forward. The five year

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Speaker 3: old's mom believes Dulja is still out there and can

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Speaker 3: be brought home.

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Speaker 1: Is that true?

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Speaker 2: Noema Alavez joining us, This is Dulce's mother. Do you

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Speaker 2: believe in your heart and soul and mind, Dulcey is

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Speaker 2: still alive?

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Speaker 7: Yes, I still feel that she's still out there.

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Speaker 1: Why do you say that?

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Speaker 6: Because there's sometimes that my heart feels so heavy that

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Speaker 6: I feel that she thinks about us and that she

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Speaker 6: misses us and inside of me because I know that

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Speaker 6: she misses us.

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Speaker 2: On Kathleen Murphy joining us A veteran trial lawyer, Kathleen Murphy,

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Speaker 2: There's so many possibilities about what may have happened to Dulcey,

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Speaker 2: and it is possible that she is alive. It is possible, Kathleen.

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Speaker 12: I pray it as Nancy, because the problem that we

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Speaker 12: have here is a mother's missing her baby. That's insurmountable,

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Speaker 12: and we have an Amber alert that's been issued in

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Speaker 12: this case. We have our reward, we have some things

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Speaker 12: that are being done correctly, we have stories coming out.

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Speaker 12: Let's find this little girl.

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Speaker 1: Guys, I want to go to IRV.

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Speaker 2: Brandt joining us out of Vegas, Senior Inspector US Marshall Service,

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Speaker 2: International Branch and author of Solo Shot, Curse of the Bluestone,

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Speaker 2: all of his series on Amazon RV.

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Speaker 1: Again, thank you for being with us. What do we

439
00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:17,320
Speaker 1: need to do now.

440
00:26:17,400 --> 00:26:20,680
Speaker 2: To find out what happened to Dulcy and where if

441
00:26:20,720 --> 00:26:22,760
Speaker 2: she is still alive, can we find her?

442
00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:23,680
Speaker 1: What do we do earth?

443
00:26:23,760 --> 00:26:27,520
Speaker 9: Well, Nancy, you're doing just what needs to be done.

444
00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:32,200
Speaker 9: You're bringing it to the public's attention, and you're highlighting

445
00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:35,080
Speaker 9: this and the more the people see it, the more

446
00:26:35,119 --> 00:26:38,640
Speaker 9: the people will call in with possible leads and give

447
00:26:38,680 --> 00:26:44,359
Speaker 9: these investigators something to go on. You know probably better

448
00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:48,840
Speaker 9: than anyone when you're investigating cases of this age, that

449
00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:53,520
Speaker 9: the number one thing you need is new leads. You

450
00:26:53,520 --> 00:26:56,600
Speaker 9: can only go over old leads so many times, and

451
00:26:56,640 --> 00:27:01,199
Speaker 9: you can only pound that turf so many times. You

452
00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:03,399
Speaker 9: need something else, And the only way that's going to

453
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:07,159
Speaker 9: happen is by bringing up the visibility of this case

454
00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:10,959
Speaker 9: and having people look at the photos, look at the video,

455
00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:14,760
Speaker 9: think about what they were doing at the time and

456
00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:17,679
Speaker 9: what they may have seen, and picking up the phone

457
00:27:18,080 --> 00:27:23,400
Speaker 9: and calling in with new information and giving these investigators

458
00:27:23,440 --> 00:27:25,480
Speaker 9: a chance to do their job too.

459
00:27:25,600 --> 00:27:28,959
Speaker 2: Claudia Art is joining US investigative reporter NBC ten Philly

460
00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:33,439
Speaker 2: and responsible for the documentary Somebody Knows Something the disappearance

461
00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:38,360
Speaker 2: of Dulce streaming on Peacock. It's an incredible documentary. Claudia,

462
00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:39,400
Speaker 2: thank you for being with us.

463
00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:40,080
Speaker 1: Claudia.

464
00:27:40,119 --> 00:27:44,040
Speaker 2: Are they saying she was running from two mails or

465
00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:47,359
Speaker 2: just running with two males, which doesn't make any sense?

466
00:27:47,600 --> 00:27:48,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's unclear.

467
00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:50,919
Speaker 5: The description was that she was seen running behind the

468
00:27:50,960 --> 00:27:53,400
Speaker 5: sheds at the same time that there were these two males,

469
00:27:53,880 --> 00:27:56,720
Speaker 5: and so the theory from the witnesses was perhaps she

470
00:27:57,000 --> 00:28:00,600
Speaker 5: went with those males, and so that was the initial

471
00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:04,520
Speaker 5: tip that came in, and that's where that sketch came from. Now,

472
00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:07,119
Speaker 5: I will say, and we go through this in our documentary,

473
00:28:07,119 --> 00:28:09,960
Speaker 5: though somebody knows something the disappearance of Dulce, which is

474
00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:13,639
Speaker 5: streaming on Peacock, The Amber alert was not issued until

475
00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:17,800
Speaker 5: twenty nine hours after Dulsa went missing, and the reason

476
00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:20,960
Speaker 5: being because some of those witnesses were children, and so

477
00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:23,800
Speaker 5: police say they had to take their time interviewing them

478
00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:27,080
Speaker 5: and getting you know, what they would consider an accurate

479
00:28:27,119 --> 00:28:30,200
Speaker 5: description of what they saw, and do it a little

480
00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:32,840
Speaker 5: bit more carefully because there was and I think Noema

481
00:28:33,040 --> 00:28:34,840
Speaker 5: can talk a little bit about this, but she was

482
00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:37,560
Speaker 5: upset that they hadn't issued an amber alert. Even the

483
00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:40,160
Speaker 5: next day, she was begging them please put.

484
00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:40,920
Speaker 7: Out an amber alert.

485
00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:45,560
Speaker 5: And it was twenty nine hours later that they finally

486
00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:47,600
Speaker 5: issued that Amber alert. And so, of course, you know,

487
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:49,880
Speaker 5: as the other experts had spoken about by that time,

488
00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:50,920
Speaker 5: if she was kidnapped, she.

489
00:28:50,880 --> 00:28:52,600
Speaker 7: Would have been way gone from there.

490
00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:54,840
Speaker 5: So that was one of the issues that came up

491
00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:56,680
Speaker 5: in this case and that we go through and speak

492
00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:59,280
Speaker 5: to police about why it took so long to issue

493
00:28:59,280 --> 00:28:59,960
Speaker 5: that amber alert.

494
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:07,280
Speaker 2: That is total b s Claudia Vargas twenty nine hours.

495
00:29:07,560 --> 00:29:10,680
Speaker 2: I mean, the whole point of an amber alert is

496
00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:16,440
Speaker 2: for it to be quick immediate, so people can spot

497
00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:20,040
Speaker 2: the child or the kidnappers or the vehicle in which

498
00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:25,040
Speaker 2: they are riding as they're getting away to Neweima of

499
00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:29,920
Speaker 2: Az joining us. This is Dulce's mother, Neema explained to

500
00:29:29,960 --> 00:29:33,959
Speaker 2: me what took so long and what did you do

501
00:29:34,040 --> 00:29:36,880
Speaker 2: to try to get police to issue that amber alert.

502
00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:42,280
Speaker 6: They had thought that probably she was with a family

503
00:29:42,360 --> 00:29:45,720
Speaker 6: member or I don't know. That's why they had too long,

504
00:29:46,440 --> 00:29:50,120
Speaker 6: especially because the witness that gave the sketch was a minor,

505
00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:53,360
Speaker 6: and they were saying that they wanted to get more

506
00:29:53,440 --> 00:29:58,760
Speaker 6: information in order to put an amberner, but they the

507
00:29:58,800 --> 00:30:01,240
Speaker 6: hours were passing by, a lot of people were coming backly.

508
00:30:01,880 --> 00:30:04,920
Speaker 6: You show a pro pressure on them that Amberler needs

509
00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:06,360
Speaker 6: to go if they can't find her.

510
00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:07,880
Speaker 7: It's a little girl, they.

511
00:30:07,760 --> 00:30:12,920
Speaker 6: Told me, and we were telling them until twenty nine

512
00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:16,040
Speaker 6: hour past that we saw I got a message from

513
00:30:16,080 --> 00:30:17,440
Speaker 6: my phone about the ambler.

514
00:30:17,760 --> 00:30:20,920
Speaker 1: You know, so you Kathleen Murphy, high profile lawyer joining us.

515
00:30:21,240 --> 00:30:22,400
Speaker 1: Does it never end?

516
00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:26,560
Speaker 2: Do you remember so many cases that we have covered

517
00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:32,320
Speaker 2: where for some reason police refuse to issue the Amber

518
00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:36,000
Speaker 2: alert in a timely manner, And this case is just

519
00:30:36,200 --> 00:30:40,480
Speaker 2: like these that time is of the essence. Every minute counts.

520
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:42,280
Speaker 2: It's a critical mistake, Nancy.

521
00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:44,160
Speaker 1: You know it. I know it.

522
00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:50,320
Speaker 12: This individual could have been located in this town with

523
00:30:50,440 --> 00:30:54,000
Speaker 12: an Amber alert that had been issued within ten thirty

524
00:30:54,320 --> 00:30:57,000
Speaker 12: fifty minutes, and I think it's a critical mistake that

525
00:30:57,160 --> 00:30:59,560
Speaker 12: was made by this police department.

526
00:31:07,720 --> 00:31:13,680
Speaker 2: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, you know, I want to

527
00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:17,880
Speaker 2: understand something or a brand why to delay in issuing

528
00:31:18,840 --> 00:31:19,960
Speaker 2: the Amber alert.

529
00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:25,560
Speaker 9: I understand the frustration, Nancy. The procedures that are in

530
00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:30,400
Speaker 9: place that have to be followed, the types of information

531
00:31:30,600 --> 00:31:34,400
Speaker 9: that has to be in for certain alerts to be

532
00:31:34,440 --> 00:31:40,280
Speaker 9: published to outsiders looking in, it can be extremely frustrating.

533
00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:46,000
Speaker 9: I've run into this at Interpol, where you're issuing an

534
00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:50,880
Speaker 9: Interpol alert and there's a procedure. I'd want to issue

535
00:31:51,600 --> 00:31:55,840
Speaker 9: green notice or red notice or yellow notice just immediately,

536
00:31:56,360 --> 00:32:01,720
Speaker 9: but these things have to be reviewed by people higher up,

537
00:32:02,040 --> 00:32:05,080
Speaker 9: and they have to meet certain crist Dear Lord.

538
00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:08,040
Speaker 2: In Heaven, just hearing you saying all that is driving

539
00:32:08,080 --> 00:32:10,360
Speaker 2: me over the edge. Do I have to say the

540
00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:16,480
Speaker 2: name Cherish Perry Winkle. Do we all remember little Cherish?

541
00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:23,840
Speaker 2: She was swiped at a giant Walmart superstore in Florida.

542
00:32:24,320 --> 00:32:29,120
Speaker 1: Long story short. By the time police interviewed and interviewed

543
00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:31,320
Speaker 1: and interviewed the mom, Rain.

544
00:32:33,160 --> 00:32:36,200
Speaker 2: Convinced that somehow this was part of a custody to

545
00:32:36,200 --> 00:32:40,160
Speaker 2: sput which it was not. They didn't issue the Amber

546
00:32:40,200 --> 00:32:44,719
Speaker 2: alert in time. She could have totally been saved. And

547
00:32:44,760 --> 00:32:48,880
Speaker 2: the whole time the perps vehicle, the van in which

548
00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:51,800
Speaker 2: he raped and sodomized and murdered Little Cherish, was.

549
00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:54,040
Speaker 1: Sitting right outside of the parking lot.

550
00:32:55,080 --> 00:32:59,280
Speaker 2: In fact, that vehicle was reported immediately after the Amber

551
00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:05,960
Speaker 2: alert was finally issued. Cherish Periwingle's life could have been safe.

552
00:33:06,160 --> 00:33:08,600
Speaker 2: And I'm hearing you go on and on and on.

553
00:33:08,800 --> 00:33:12,720
Speaker 2: No offense or a brand, but really you have to

554
00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:18,080
Speaker 2: interview all the children before you issue an Amber alert.

555
00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:22,600
Speaker 1: My rear and herv speaks in truth. Man.

556
00:33:24,120 --> 00:33:28,480
Speaker 9: Yes, Nancy, I understand your outrage and I'm telling you

557
00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:33,640
Speaker 9: right now, I've felt it as an investigator, and sometimes,

558
00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:39,200
Speaker 9: you know, an investigation, they start looking in the wrong direction,

559
00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:41,640
Speaker 9: just like you said, maybe you're looking for a family

560
00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:45,600
Speaker 9: member when it wasn't a family member, and it can

561
00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:47,960
Speaker 9: be a mistake, and it can be a critical mistake

562
00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:51,600
Speaker 9: because time is of the essence in cases like this,

563
00:33:52,120 --> 00:33:56,640
Speaker 9: and action needs to be immediate, and when it's not,

564
00:33:57,680 --> 00:33:58,640
Speaker 9: the case goes cold.

565
00:33:58,960 --> 00:34:03,160
Speaker 3: Five year old Dutch Maria Alvarez mysteriously vanishes from a

566
00:34:03,280 --> 00:34:07,080
Speaker 3: playground and bridged in New Jersey while mommy is only

567
00:34:07,280 --> 00:34:11,759
Speaker 3: yards away. Dulce's family pleads with the public to help.

568
00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:15,760
Speaker 2: Still pleading, the mom is joining us today with family

569
00:34:15,840 --> 00:34:19,480
Speaker 2: friend begging for your help. There is a fifty two

570
00:34:19,719 --> 00:34:24,920
Speaker 2: thousand dollar reward and the search for five year old Dulce.

571
00:34:26,360 --> 00:34:28,280
Speaker 1: I want to go through one more time.

572
00:34:28,920 --> 00:34:32,080
Speaker 2: The fact that an amber alert was not issued immediately,

573
00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:33,560
Speaker 2: major fail.

574
00:34:34,120 --> 00:34:36,680
Speaker 1: But what can we do now?

575
00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:41,319
Speaker 2: Claudia Varges joining US investigative reporter NBC ten Philly and

576
00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:45,480
Speaker 2: creator of Somebody Knows Something The Disappearance of Dulce. It's

577
00:34:45,520 --> 00:34:50,120
Speaker 2: an incredible documentary that is streaming on Peacock right now.

578
00:34:50,320 --> 00:34:55,759
Speaker 2: Where does it stand right now, Claudia, what is being done?

579
00:34:55,880 --> 00:34:59,920
Speaker 2: I've seen an age progression photo of Dulce on NICKMA

580
00:35:00,280 --> 00:35:04,160
Speaker 2: National Center Missing Emploited Children. But tell me what is

581
00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:06,839
Speaker 2: being done and what can we do to help bring

582
00:35:06,920 --> 00:35:07,680
Speaker 2: Dulce home.

583
00:35:07,880 --> 00:35:09,960
Speaker 7: Yeah, I was just gonna mention the age progression.

584
00:35:10,080 --> 00:35:14,840
Speaker 5: So Dulce is now ten years old, and with the

585
00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:18,360
Speaker 5: age progression composite ideas that people might recognize her, you know,

586
00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:21,719
Speaker 5: she's a little older now, looking a little different. And

587
00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:24,759
Speaker 5: so police say they're still investigating this. After that new

588
00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:29,680
Speaker 5: age progression sketch was released, they received about a dozen tips. Unfortunately,

589
00:35:29,680 --> 00:35:30,839
Speaker 5: none of them really panned out.

590
00:35:30,920 --> 00:35:32,800
Speaker 7: Obviously, we still don't have Dulsay home.

591
00:35:33,320 --> 00:35:36,080
Speaker 5: But they are still looking into any tips that come

592
00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:39,359
Speaker 5: in and they say they're actively investigating it. But it's

593
00:35:39,440 --> 00:35:42,959
Speaker 5: really going to take somebody. And as their documentary says,

594
00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:46,359
Speaker 5: somebody knows something. So whoever knows something, they just need

595
00:35:46,360 --> 00:35:48,439
Speaker 5: that one clue, that one tip that's going to break

596
00:35:48,440 --> 00:35:49,960
Speaker 5: the case and bring Dulsay home.

597
00:35:50,040 --> 00:35:52,399
Speaker 2: You know a lot of people have claimed rewards don't work.

598
00:35:52,440 --> 00:35:55,960
Speaker 2: I disagree. I think they do work if the right

599
00:35:56,000 --> 00:35:59,520
Speaker 2: person hears about the reward. A fifty two thousand dollars

600
00:35:59,520 --> 00:36:03,120
Speaker 2: reward in the search for Dulce, you know to your

601
00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:07,160
Speaker 2: brandt joining US former US Marshall Service and DOJ Department

602
00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:07,960
Speaker 2: of Justice.

603
00:36:08,239 --> 00:36:12,680
Speaker 1: The FBI is in the case. What does that mean, Nancy?

604
00:36:12,760 --> 00:36:16,880
Speaker 9: That means the case has expanded, that they consider it

605
00:36:17,160 --> 00:36:19,440
Speaker 9: a kidnapping, not just a disappearance.

606
00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:21,080
Speaker 10: I know.

607
00:36:22,200 --> 00:36:27,200
Speaker 9: Local law enforcement, of course searched the area extensively, going

608
00:36:27,239 --> 00:36:31,120
Speaker 9: through the woods, putting divers in the river, bringing in

609
00:36:31,160 --> 00:36:35,279
Speaker 9: a helicopter the search if the child is lost, But

610
00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:39,160
Speaker 9: when the child is believed to be abducted, the FBI

611
00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:43,560
Speaker 9: has a missing Person's unit and they will be brought

612
00:36:43,560 --> 00:36:46,440
Speaker 9: in for the case, and it expands the amount of

613
00:36:46,520 --> 00:36:49,200
Speaker 9: resources that investigators have.

614
00:36:49,520 --> 00:36:53,839
Speaker 2: Dulcie's family has not given up hope she will be

615
00:36:53,920 --> 00:37:00,839
Speaker 2: brought home alive. Noweima Alavez, this is Dulce's mother. How

616
00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:05,200
Speaker 2: has this affected you and your family? I don't know

617
00:37:05,239 --> 00:37:07,239
Speaker 2: how you put one foot in front of the other.

618
00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:12,080
Speaker 2: You are so much stronger than I could be. Tell

619
00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:15,200
Speaker 2: me what is going through your mind every night when

620
00:37:15,239 --> 00:37:16,080
Speaker 2: you fall asleep.

621
00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:20,880
Speaker 6: Well, since that day, my family hasn't been the same.

622
00:37:21,120 --> 00:37:28,560
Speaker 6: We doom celebrate parties or our birthdays or festivals becomes

623
00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:32,839
Speaker 6: it's not the same without her, because I remember last

624
00:37:32,920 --> 00:37:35,839
Speaker 6: Christmas we were with her. She was happy, we were

625
00:37:35,920 --> 00:37:39,720
Speaker 6: we're family, we were all together, and then the first

626
00:37:39,800 --> 00:37:43,600
Speaker 6: Christmas came in it was like, I don't know, I

627
00:37:43,719 --> 00:37:47,360
Speaker 6: was sad because we just felt incomplete.

628
00:37:48,040 --> 00:37:52,000
Speaker 7: And every day is like I sometimes I get scared.

629
00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:57,520
Speaker 6: I get anxiety sometimes taking out my kids because sometimes

630
00:37:57,520 --> 00:37:59,400
Speaker 6: I'm scared that I'm.

631
00:37:59,239 --> 00:38:04,040
Speaker 7: Gonna lose one of them again. I don't know, it

632
00:38:04,160 --> 00:38:07,279
Speaker 7: did mean anxiety.

633
00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:11,640
Speaker 2: You know, doctor Chloe Carmichael. If even one twin is

634
00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:16,799
Speaker 2: away at night or at supper time, there's just this

635
00:38:16,960 --> 00:38:21,160
Speaker 2: big empty hole. You know, there's the empty chair at

636
00:38:21,200 --> 00:38:27,480
Speaker 2: the table, There's this huge presence that's missing. I just

637
00:38:28,080 --> 00:38:33,680
Speaker 2: can't imagine what Dulce's mother is living through, plus having

638
00:38:34,120 --> 00:38:39,319
Speaker 2: people attacking her claiming it's her fault because she was

639
00:38:39,360 --> 00:38:41,840
Speaker 2: in the car helping with homework.

640
00:38:42,120 --> 00:38:44,160
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, I wish she had not been in the car.

641
00:38:44,320 --> 00:38:44,840
Speaker 1: Was that wrong?

642
00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:48,479
Speaker 2: Yes it was wrong for Pete's sake, But that does

643
00:38:48,520 --> 00:38:54,120
Speaker 2: not mean this is her fault. The person that took Dulce,

644
00:38:54,640 --> 00:39:00,880
Speaker 2: it's their fault. How to moms and dads move forward

645
00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:02,640
Speaker 2: or do they ever move forward.

646
00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:04,799
Speaker 1: I don't know that I could ever move forward.

647
00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:08,400
Speaker 13: As was just stated, there's naturally anxiety about something like

648
00:39:08,440 --> 00:39:11,399
Speaker 13: this ever happening again. And of course, the point of

649
00:39:11,440 --> 00:39:14,960
Speaker 13: my book Nervous Energy Harness the Power of your anxiety,

650
00:39:15,120 --> 00:39:19,239
Speaker 13: is that the healthy function of anxiety is to stimulate

651
00:39:19,280 --> 00:39:24,360
Speaker 13: preparation behaviors. So parents who are anxious about a child abduction,

652
00:39:24,480 --> 00:39:29,040
Speaker 13: for example, would definitely want to take this as a

653
00:39:29,080 --> 00:39:33,720
Speaker 13: cautionary tale when it comes to keeping eyes on your children,

654
00:39:33,800 --> 00:39:37,000
Speaker 13: for example, at a playground, and other ways that you

655
00:39:37,040 --> 00:39:41,680
Speaker 13: can think about channeling that anxiety into protective behaviors.

656
00:39:42,080 --> 00:39:46,240
Speaker 2: I'm just thinking what can be done for Noeima who

657
00:39:46,320 --> 00:39:50,800
Speaker 2: is missing her child Dulcay. Every day take a look

658
00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:55,680
Speaker 2: at Dulcey. If you know or think you know anything

659
00:39:56,280 --> 00:40:00,239
Speaker 2: about her disappearance, please dial toll free eight hundred two

660
00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:05,640
Speaker 2: two five five three two four again, over fifty thousand

661
00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:07,040
Speaker 2: dollars in reward.

662
00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:09,840
Speaker 1: We wait for justice. Two unfold.

663
00:40:10,480 --> 00:40:17,880
Speaker 2: Nancy Grace signing off, Goodbye friend,