1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:04,680 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:09,080 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,079 Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A 4 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:25,279 Speaker 1: production of I Heart Radio. Hello, and welcome back to 5 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:28,600 Speaker 1: the show. My name is Noel. Our compatriot Matt is 6 00:00:28,640 --> 00:00:32,200 Speaker 1: on adventures but will return soon. They called me Ben. 7 00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:35,440 Speaker 1: You're joined as always with our super producer Alexis code 8 00:00:35,520 --> 00:00:39,599 Speaker 1: named Doc Holiday Jackson. Most importantly, you are you. You 9 00:00:39,680 --> 00:00:42,960 Speaker 1: are here, and that makes this the stuff they don't 10 00:00:43,040 --> 00:00:45,920 Speaker 1: want you to know. It's Thursday. If you're listening to 11 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:50,159 Speaker 1: this the day it comes out, which means, fellow conspiracy realists, 12 00:00:50,400 --> 00:00:54,720 Speaker 1: you may very well make an appearance on today's show. 13 00:00:54,920 --> 00:00:57,640 Speaker 1: And if you happen not to be on today's show, 14 00:00:58,000 --> 00:01:00,720 Speaker 1: no worries will tell you how to get on air 15 00:01:00,760 --> 00:01:05,240 Speaker 1: in the course of this show. So uh, stay tuned. 16 00:01:05,280 --> 00:01:09,120 Speaker 1: We're about to hear from the best part of stuff 17 00:01:09,120 --> 00:01:12,360 Speaker 1: they don't want you to know. As as we say always, 18 00:01:12,520 --> 00:01:16,840 Speaker 1: you know, we spend some time scouring our phone messages 19 00:01:16,880 --> 00:01:19,520 Speaker 1: of one A three, three, std W y t K. 20 00:01:20,200 --> 00:01:23,320 Speaker 1: We also check in with our email conspiracy at I 21 00:01:23,480 --> 00:01:27,919 Speaker 1: Heart radio dot com. Uh, and we have a couple 22 00:01:27,959 --> 00:01:32,399 Speaker 1: of stories for you today, one of which is close 23 00:01:32,480 --> 00:01:36,800 Speaker 1: to home for us and has been garnering a lot 24 00:01:36,840 --> 00:01:41,880 Speaker 1: of speculation here in the Atlanta metropolitan area. This is 25 00:01:42,120 --> 00:01:46,199 Speaker 1: a developing story. It is a disturbing one. It may 26 00:01:46,240 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 1: not be appropriate for all audience members, So if you 27 00:01:50,400 --> 00:01:53,760 Speaker 1: have some kids, UH, if you yourself are sensitive to 28 00:01:53,880 --> 00:01:57,400 Speaker 1: graphic depictions of violence, you may want to fast forward 29 00:01:57,440 --> 00:02:00,640 Speaker 1: about fifteen or twenty minutes. But we do believe this 30 00:02:00,720 --> 00:02:05,880 Speaker 1: is important information and after that will be traveling back 31 00:02:05,960 --> 00:02:10,480 Speaker 1: to the Middle East and to the to the danger 32 00:02:10,560 --> 00:02:14,600 Speaker 1: to journalists and activists around the world because we had 33 00:02:14,680 --> 00:02:19,120 Speaker 1: a follow up to a recent strange news piece. Uh, 34 00:02:19,240 --> 00:02:23,720 Speaker 1: this is an important segment this week, so we do 35 00:02:23,880 --> 00:02:28,079 Speaker 1: hope you tune in well. Without further ado, Noel, let's 36 00:02:28,080 --> 00:02:31,080 Speaker 1: say we begin close to home in more ways than one, 37 00:02:31,639 --> 00:02:33,320 Speaker 1: a little too close to him, if you ask me. 38 00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:35,440 Speaker 1: I actually found out about this one through my mom. 39 00:02:35,560 --> 00:02:37,919 Speaker 1: She sent me a text. And I don't know how 40 00:02:38,080 --> 00:02:40,600 Speaker 1: how your folks text, but my mom tends to text 41 00:02:40,639 --> 00:02:43,600 Speaker 1: and big run on blocks where it's sort of hard 42 00:02:43,639 --> 00:02:47,639 Speaker 1: to separate the different thoughts from that to the flame 43 00:02:47,680 --> 00:02:49,760 Speaker 1: text because I freak out. I've got some friends who 44 00:02:49,880 --> 00:02:51,920 Speaker 1: could have just sent one text as a block, but 45 00:02:52,040 --> 00:02:57,560 Speaker 1: send like ten one sentence. Oh that's me, Ben, that's me. 46 00:02:57,639 --> 00:03:00,600 Speaker 1: Are you sub tweeting me for my text? You're not 47 00:03:00,639 --> 00:03:02,320 Speaker 1: who I was thinking. Okay, Well, I do do that, 48 00:03:02,360 --> 00:03:04,360 Speaker 1: and I tend to find that helpful because then I 49 00:03:04,360 --> 00:03:07,200 Speaker 1: can separate the But it is a little stressful when 50 00:03:07,200 --> 00:03:09,160 Speaker 1: you're seeing them. And if you have, God forbid, you 51 00:03:09,160 --> 00:03:11,000 Speaker 1: have a sound who what monster has this anyway the 52 00:03:11,040 --> 00:03:14,240 Speaker 1: sound effect or not where it's just like believing, believe, belie. 53 00:03:16,240 --> 00:03:19,000 Speaker 1: That seems oppressive, But I do it out of courtesy 54 00:03:19,080 --> 00:03:22,360 Speaker 1: for readability. But my mom doesn't do it. It doesn't 55 00:03:22,400 --> 00:03:24,440 Speaker 1: punctuate either, so I think that's part of the problem. 56 00:03:24,440 --> 00:03:26,840 Speaker 1: So literally is just this giant block of text that 57 00:03:26,880 --> 00:03:28,440 Speaker 1: I look at and I'm like, I don't know. I 58 00:03:28,480 --> 00:03:30,560 Speaker 1: can't make heads or taible this, but this one did. 59 00:03:31,440 --> 00:03:34,400 Speaker 1: For this kind of news I get, I get breaking 60 00:03:34,440 --> 00:03:39,040 Speaker 1: news updates as they happen, which is I think necessary 61 00:03:39,120 --> 00:03:42,920 Speaker 1: to stay informed. But also it's lucky that I have 62 00:03:42,960 --> 00:03:47,880 Speaker 1: a pretty inhuman sleep schedule as per usual, you know, 63 00:03:48,040 --> 00:03:52,280 Speaker 1: because when this news broke, it was rightly terrifying for 64 00:03:52,280 --> 00:03:55,000 Speaker 1: a lot of people. Well, you just out of as 65 00:03:55,040 --> 00:03:58,760 Speaker 1: an example in that a little levity. Um, he goes, 66 00:03:59,560 --> 00:04:01,480 Speaker 1: this is how this text came through from my mom, 67 00:04:01,760 --> 00:04:03,520 Speaker 1: And then we'll talk about the listener who wrote in 68 00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:05,600 Speaker 1: she just goes, have you heard about the murders in 69 00:04:05,680 --> 00:04:08,600 Speaker 1: Piedmont Park just across the street from Preston's house. Lady 70 00:04:08,600 --> 00:04:10,560 Speaker 1: and her dog were stabbed to death. She was a 71 00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:13,880 Speaker 1: bartender and was walking her dog after work. Betsy wasn't kidding. 72 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:15,920 Speaker 1: The box of stuff was at least ten pounds. If 73 00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:17,560 Speaker 1: school is open, I bet the kids will have to 74 00:04:17,560 --> 00:04:21,960 Speaker 1: wear masks, so okay. Anyway, she definitely lead with the 75 00:04:22,040 --> 00:04:24,320 Speaker 1: right story. Uh. And I had not heard about this, 76 00:04:24,440 --> 00:04:26,520 Speaker 1: and that is exactly what this is about. And this 77 00:04:26,560 --> 00:04:28,960 Speaker 1: story did come to us from from my mom initially, 78 00:04:29,000 --> 00:04:31,600 Speaker 1: but also from m a listener who goes, hey, guys, 79 00:04:31,600 --> 00:04:33,479 Speaker 1: I'm sure you're well aware, but there appears to be 80 00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:37,560 Speaker 1: a serial killer in Atlanta. As I was reading this, 81 00:04:37,720 --> 00:04:40,680 Speaker 1: I obviously couldn't help thinking of Wayne Williams and the 82 00:04:40,720 --> 00:04:43,960 Speaker 1: Atlantic child murders. Uh. And hearing the topic of your 83 00:04:44,000 --> 00:04:48,480 Speaker 1: podcast today felt eerie. M is referring to a previous 84 00:04:48,480 --> 00:04:52,440 Speaker 1: Strange News episode. A recent Strange News episode where Matt 85 00:04:52,480 --> 00:04:54,919 Speaker 1: brought in the story about new DNA evidence in the 86 00:04:55,200 --> 00:04:58,279 Speaker 1: William Wayne Williams case, the Atlanta child murders case, and 87 00:04:58,480 --> 00:05:00,719 Speaker 1: then she sent a link to a local TV station, 88 00:05:00,880 --> 00:05:05,719 Speaker 1: w rdw's story on the case. Piedmont Park is a 89 00:05:05,760 --> 00:05:09,760 Speaker 1: big green space here in Atlanta. Um, and it's true 90 00:05:09,760 --> 00:05:12,640 Speaker 1: a young woman was killed by stabbing when she was 91 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:15,520 Speaker 1: out walking her dog. And I don't know, ben am 92 00:05:15,520 --> 00:05:18,320 Speaker 1: I'm incorrect in thinking that's kind of considered to be 93 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:21,559 Speaker 1: a relatively safe part of town. Uh. It goes back 94 00:05:21,600 --> 00:05:28,279 Speaker 1: and forth with syclable crime, but in general, Uh, Piedmont 95 00:05:28,360 --> 00:05:32,080 Speaker 1: Park has hours of operations, so you're not really supposed 96 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:35,120 Speaker 1: to be there after dark. I like many people have 97 00:05:35,920 --> 00:05:40,039 Speaker 1: uh taken advantage of the somewhat lackadaisical security to hang 98 00:05:40,080 --> 00:05:44,520 Speaker 1: out there at night. But there's a reason that these 99 00:05:44,600 --> 00:05:47,880 Speaker 1: parks have specific hours. You know, you would depending on 100 00:05:47,920 --> 00:05:52,200 Speaker 1: where you live, followed conspiracy realist, Your neighborhood parks may 101 00:05:52,240 --> 00:05:56,159 Speaker 1: have sun sun up to sundown rules, which are basically 102 00:05:56,240 --> 00:05:59,200 Speaker 1: they're not you know, nine to five hard hours. They're 103 00:05:59,240 --> 00:06:01,320 Speaker 1: just if the sun is up, the park's open. If 104 00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:05,080 Speaker 1: the sun's down, it's closed. Uh. This this game is 105 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:08,320 Speaker 1: a shock to a lot of people. However, because as 106 00:06:08,320 --> 00:06:12,840 Speaker 1: you said, Noel, Piedmont Park is known as a big 107 00:06:12,920 --> 00:06:15,680 Speaker 1: central gathering space. You know, it's home to a lot 108 00:06:15,680 --> 00:06:18,279 Speaker 1: of big concerts. Uh. There are a lot of people 109 00:06:18,360 --> 00:06:24,200 Speaker 1: who uh celebrate milestone events there. It's the picnic spot 110 00:06:24,560 --> 00:06:27,520 Speaker 1: for a lot of folks. Um to inject some levity. Though, 111 00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:30,800 Speaker 1: when you do go to Atlanta, if you're looking to 112 00:06:30,880 --> 00:06:34,680 Speaker 1: have a picnic without a huge crowd, try the Jimmy 113 00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:37,920 Speaker 1: Carter Center. They have a hidden garden in the back 114 00:06:38,279 --> 00:06:40,840 Speaker 1: and it's free to go. They also have a quoi pod. 115 00:06:41,040 --> 00:06:42,719 Speaker 1: This is the stuff you know if you're a local. 116 00:06:42,760 --> 00:06:45,640 Speaker 1: But to your point, not to derail us, to your point, yeah, 117 00:06:45,760 --> 00:06:48,240 Speaker 1: Piedmont Park is huge. A lot of people use it 118 00:06:48,480 --> 00:06:52,640 Speaker 1: and it was it's generally been considered a safer area. Yeah. 119 00:06:52,680 --> 00:06:54,640 Speaker 1: And I mean not to be too like inside baseball 120 00:06:54,720 --> 00:06:57,880 Speaker 1: or regional, but it is just interesting the way information is. 121 00:06:57,960 --> 00:07:01,120 Speaker 1: The story to me is more about information and disinformation 122 00:07:01,160 --> 00:07:05,320 Speaker 1: spreading because you know, when this story first came out 123 00:07:05,880 --> 00:07:08,080 Speaker 1: there there's some details around it that are quite chilling. 124 00:07:08,120 --> 00:07:12,880 Speaker 1: Again around one am Uh. The woman in question, Katherine Janie, 125 00:07:12,920 --> 00:07:16,800 Speaker 1: who was forty years old. Her body was found um 126 00:07:16,800 --> 00:07:19,920 Speaker 1: slain multiple stab wounds along with her dog. Why are 127 00:07:19,920 --> 00:07:24,120 Speaker 1: you gonna kill the dog? That's just cruel um. And 128 00:07:24,280 --> 00:07:28,320 Speaker 1: there is a ten thousand dollar reward which seems kind 129 00:07:28,320 --> 00:07:32,160 Speaker 1: of low that investigators are offering for identifying the suspect. Uh. 130 00:07:32,200 --> 00:07:34,240 Speaker 1: And we said, sereal, and we're gonna get into this. 131 00:07:34,280 --> 00:07:36,920 Speaker 1: But there there was a second one as well. Woman 132 00:07:37,080 --> 00:07:40,320 Speaker 1: was found shot to death at Yellow River Park in 133 00:07:40,440 --> 00:07:47,119 Speaker 1: Winnette County. And there are some similarities kind of but 134 00:07:47,320 --> 00:07:49,840 Speaker 1: not really And it was really just the I'm not 135 00:07:49,960 --> 00:07:52,800 Speaker 1: not laughing that this is obviously tragic, both of these murders. 136 00:07:52,800 --> 00:07:57,440 Speaker 1: But the only thing that's leading anybody to say this 137 00:07:57,480 --> 00:07:59,840 Speaker 1: is a quote unquote serial killer. First of all, if 138 00:07:59,840 --> 00:08:03,720 Speaker 1: I'm mistaken in two deaths, do not a serial killer? 139 00:08:03,800 --> 00:08:07,240 Speaker 1: Make right? I think it requires at least three. If not, 140 00:08:07,880 --> 00:08:14,240 Speaker 1: you're you're correct. And the original post purporting or proposing 141 00:08:14,240 --> 00:08:18,400 Speaker 1: the idea of a serial killer cited a third homicide 142 00:08:18,520 --> 00:08:24,480 Speaker 1: in Norcross, which is north of the Atlanta area. Law enforcement. 143 00:08:25,000 --> 00:08:29,480 Speaker 1: Law enforcement debunked that third right And and uh, as 144 00:08:29,520 --> 00:08:33,680 Speaker 1: far as I can tell, some of the initial like um, 145 00:08:33,720 --> 00:08:37,400 Speaker 1: a lot of this stuff was spread through viral, you 146 00:08:37,440 --> 00:08:41,439 Speaker 1: know Instagram stories and and and reposts and things like that. 147 00:08:42,040 --> 00:08:45,520 Speaker 1: Twitter user by the name of baby face Killer posted 148 00:08:45,960 --> 00:08:48,840 Speaker 1: a screenshot saying, apparently there's a serial killer on the 149 00:08:48,840 --> 00:08:51,920 Speaker 1: loose in Atlanta. This is so scary. And then um 150 00:08:51,960 --> 00:08:54,839 Speaker 1: like an exclamation mark in a triangle, like a warning sign. 151 00:08:54,920 --> 00:08:57,440 Speaker 1: This is very serious. You've all heard about the Piedmont 152 00:08:57,440 --> 00:09:00,040 Speaker 1: Park murder, surely, but now i FBI is stepping in 153 00:09:00,080 --> 00:09:03,640 Speaker 1: the case, pointing to the possibility of a cereal being 154 00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:05,959 Speaker 1: on the loose and a t L and surrounding areas 155 00:09:06,040 --> 00:09:08,080 Speaker 1: crime and a t L is not in common, but 156 00:09:08,280 --> 00:09:12,280 Speaker 1: these are. She was killed when the killer stayed for 157 00:09:12,320 --> 00:09:17,440 Speaker 1: a while, mutilating the body in very twisted ways. Trigger warning, 158 00:09:18,120 --> 00:09:21,079 Speaker 1: and this is definitely a trigger warning. And then this 159 00:09:21,080 --> 00:09:26,000 Speaker 1: this post goes on to describe some very specific grizzly 160 00:09:26,360 --> 00:09:31,360 Speaker 1: mutilations that supposedly were done to to this corpse, uh, 161 00:09:31,400 --> 00:09:35,240 Speaker 1: including things like slicing off body parts and eyelids and 162 00:09:35,240 --> 00:09:37,640 Speaker 1: and all of that, and then refers to another body 163 00:09:37,679 --> 00:09:39,960 Speaker 1: that was found in Stone Mountain, which is a bedroom 164 00:09:39,960 --> 00:09:42,640 Speaker 1: community of Atlanta. Goes on to say the reason the 165 00:09:42,679 --> 00:09:45,160 Speaker 1: only way of identifying the body of the Piedmont where 166 00:09:45,160 --> 00:09:48,480 Speaker 1: some tattoos is because of the gruesome sick way she 167 00:09:48,559 --> 00:09:52,319 Speaker 1: was mutilated. Reports of another female body are coming in 168 00:09:52,360 --> 00:09:54,880 Speaker 1: this morning from Norcross and that's the one you talked about. 169 00:09:54,960 --> 00:09:59,000 Speaker 1: So we know about multiple stab wounds, you know, in 170 00:09:59,080 --> 00:10:04,680 Speaker 1: the Piedmont Park incidents, but none of the mutilations that 171 00:10:04,720 --> 00:10:07,679 Speaker 1: are being described have been confirmed by police. Ben, what 172 00:10:08,120 --> 00:10:11,160 Speaker 1: else have you read and what if anything are connecting 173 00:10:11,240 --> 00:10:15,120 Speaker 1: these three cases? And is it really just internet hearsay 174 00:10:15,160 --> 00:10:17,040 Speaker 1: and people trying to spread thing, because then there there 175 00:10:17,080 --> 00:10:18,880 Speaker 1: are some other tweets to that are that are saying 176 00:10:18,920 --> 00:10:24,680 Speaker 1: similar things. Again, yes, uh I mentioned on this week's 177 00:10:24,720 --> 00:10:30,040 Speaker 1: Strange News segment. Part of the issue goes to very 178 00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:35,280 Speaker 1: well intentioned tendencies towards pattern recognition, which after after a 179 00:10:35,280 --> 00:10:43,199 Speaker 1: certain threshold, become pattern creation. Obviously, people are frightened. Uh. 180 00:10:43,320 --> 00:10:46,840 Speaker 1: Piedmont Park has had its share of crime over the years, 181 00:10:47,120 --> 00:10:49,720 Speaker 1: but I believe according to official sources, this is the 182 00:10:49,720 --> 00:10:52,720 Speaker 1: first homicide in the park in more than a decade. 183 00:10:53,440 --> 00:10:58,240 Speaker 1: The story itself grabbed a lot of people's attention because 184 00:10:58,720 --> 00:11:01,600 Speaker 1: this is uh, this is a part of the this 185 00:11:01,679 --> 00:11:04,280 Speaker 1: is a part of the city that is considered walkable, 186 00:11:04,360 --> 00:11:07,199 Speaker 1: you know, people pay a premium to live there, and 187 00:11:07,360 --> 00:11:10,439 Speaker 1: walking your dog in a park is something that anybody 188 00:11:10,520 --> 00:11:16,559 Speaker 1: should be able to do safely. The idea of mutilation, 189 00:11:16,800 --> 00:11:20,480 Speaker 1: I haven't been able to confirm yet, but the police 190 00:11:20,800 --> 00:11:24,959 Speaker 1: did describe the scene of the crime as gruesome. They 191 00:11:25,000 --> 00:11:29,160 Speaker 1: did confirm it was a matter of multiple stab wounds 192 00:11:29,200 --> 00:11:37,120 Speaker 1: at least in the case of Katherine Janis. Also also, unfortunately, 193 00:11:37,720 --> 00:11:41,280 Speaker 1: cameras in the area, including cameras at the entrance of 194 00:11:41,360 --> 00:11:46,480 Speaker 1: Piedmont Park, where apparently not working at the time, which 195 00:11:46,760 --> 00:11:51,640 Speaker 1: adds you know, further uh, further speculation here, and people 196 00:11:51,720 --> 00:11:55,720 Speaker 1: are looking for answers at this point. We have to 197 00:11:55,760 --> 00:12:00,520 Speaker 1: admit that multiple homicides per year do a cur in 198 00:12:00,600 --> 00:12:05,000 Speaker 1: Atlanta as well as in many other major metropolitan areas 199 00:12:05,120 --> 00:12:09,959 Speaker 1: in the United States. The family, the survivors of Janis 200 00:12:10,000 --> 00:12:13,559 Speaker 1: and Lane Tory Lang being the person who, as you said, 201 00:12:13,720 --> 00:12:18,119 Speaker 1: was also murdered in Stone Mountain, they find these rumors disheartening, 202 00:12:18,960 --> 00:12:23,360 Speaker 1: if you know, if well intentioned. But what we also 203 00:12:23,440 --> 00:12:27,560 Speaker 1: see here is the there's a part of that post 204 00:12:27,600 --> 00:12:32,360 Speaker 1: that really appreciate your reading. Regarding the FBI's involvement. At 205 00:12:32,400 --> 00:12:36,440 Speaker 1: this point, it looks like it looks like local police 206 00:12:37,720 --> 00:12:41,199 Speaker 1: in Guadette County and in Fulton are saying there's no 207 00:12:41,320 --> 00:12:45,040 Speaker 1: connection between the murders, and it looks like they're also 208 00:12:45,480 --> 00:12:50,959 Speaker 1: um they're also stating that there is no compelling evidence 209 00:12:51,240 --> 00:12:56,600 Speaker 1: of a serial killer operating at this time. But but 210 00:12:56,720 --> 00:13:02,840 Speaker 1: this gets back into the idea of true crime and 211 00:13:02,880 --> 00:13:06,040 Speaker 1: how important it is for us to have as many 212 00:13:06,120 --> 00:13:10,680 Speaker 1: facts at hand as possible before making statements like this, 213 00:13:11,000 --> 00:13:18,160 Speaker 1: because serial killers are a relatively rare phenomena. Despite what 214 00:13:18,280 --> 00:13:24,560 Speaker 1: Hollywood would have us believe, and whether or not there 215 00:13:24,760 --> 00:13:29,080 Speaker 1: was a single assailant involved here, the fact of the 216 00:13:29,120 --> 00:13:35,000 Speaker 1: matter is that these women are dead and there's needs 217 00:13:35,040 --> 00:13:38,280 Speaker 1: to be a move to bring these folks to justice. 218 00:13:39,160 --> 00:13:44,560 Speaker 1: So while it may it may make people more likely 219 00:13:44,720 --> 00:13:47,280 Speaker 1: to pay attention to a story if they believe there's 220 00:13:47,320 --> 00:13:51,120 Speaker 1: a serial killer of foot, the the hard fact of 221 00:13:51,160 --> 00:13:56,920 Speaker 1: the matter is that someone, multiple people, probably committed murder. 222 00:13:57,600 --> 00:14:01,320 Speaker 1: They got away, and we don't know when or how 223 00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:05,000 Speaker 1: they will be apprehended. And there's a good argument to 224 00:14:05,000 --> 00:14:08,360 Speaker 1: be made. I would say all that anything that brings 225 00:14:08,440 --> 00:14:12,679 Speaker 1: more awareness to this is helpful. More people are alert, 226 00:14:13,280 --> 00:14:18,199 Speaker 1: more people are thinking twice about their personal safety. But Also, 227 00:14:19,080 --> 00:14:21,920 Speaker 1: I don't know, man, I'm I'm I'm concerned about this 228 00:14:22,040 --> 00:14:26,000 Speaker 1: because I wonder do you feel like this moves into 229 00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:29,880 Speaker 1: the realm of exploitation or is this just simply people 230 00:14:30,040 --> 00:14:33,400 Speaker 1: reposting news with the best of intentions. Whoever is talking 231 00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:37,760 Speaker 1: about these specific injuries that appear to have been just 232 00:14:37,840 --> 00:14:40,080 Speaker 1: pulled from like in the imagination of someone who's maybe 233 00:14:40,080 --> 00:14:43,520 Speaker 1: watched one too many SAW movies. Uh, that to me 234 00:14:43,680 --> 00:14:48,720 Speaker 1: is exploitative. Is a way of getting off by watching 235 00:14:48,760 --> 00:14:52,400 Speaker 1: people freak out, you know, of of rumormongering and feeling 236 00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:55,000 Speaker 1: like it's some kind of like, you know, power move 237 00:14:55,120 --> 00:14:58,160 Speaker 1: or something. You know, unless unless there's something that they 238 00:14:58,160 --> 00:15:00,840 Speaker 1: don't want us to know at the at the a 239 00:15:00,960 --> 00:15:05,520 Speaker 1: p D. And Okay, the FBI is involved, but that 240 00:15:05,800 --> 00:15:09,240 Speaker 1: can mean a lot of things. Um. I will say 241 00:15:09,280 --> 00:15:11,880 Speaker 1: that is a little bit suspicious because typically we've got 242 00:15:11,880 --> 00:15:14,840 Speaker 1: the Georgia Bureau of Investigation and if it wasn't something 243 00:15:14,840 --> 00:15:19,280 Speaker 1: more serious, the g b I would probably be handling it. Um. 244 00:15:19,320 --> 00:15:22,960 Speaker 1: But again, if unless there really is someone covering up 245 00:15:23,240 --> 00:15:27,160 Speaker 1: any details like about these these mutilations, it surely does 246 00:15:27,200 --> 00:15:28,760 Speaker 1: feel like that's someone that just kind of getting a 247 00:15:28,760 --> 00:15:31,520 Speaker 1: sick thrill out of freaking people out, but who knows, 248 00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:37,200 Speaker 1: you know, I mean it's very similar to posts. Uh. Look, 249 00:15:37,280 --> 00:15:40,280 Speaker 1: I don't want to diminish anybody trying to do good 250 00:15:40,480 --> 00:15:43,600 Speaker 1: by spreading information that they think to be true. But 251 00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:47,440 Speaker 1: you know, there was a big rash of all these 252 00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:51,240 Speaker 1: stories going around about people overdosing on drugs that were 253 00:15:51,280 --> 00:15:55,040 Speaker 1: laced with you know, in contaminants like fentanel and things 254 00:15:55,080 --> 00:15:57,440 Speaker 1: like that, And I know that there's probably some truth 255 00:15:57,480 --> 00:16:00,440 Speaker 1: to that and it probably happened, But then you start 256 00:16:00,440 --> 00:16:02,960 Speaker 1: seeing them pop up in other cities, and it feels 257 00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:05,640 Speaker 1: very much like a copy pasta kind of situation where 258 00:16:05,840 --> 00:16:08,800 Speaker 1: someone sees it and then they start reposting and reposting it. 259 00:16:08,920 --> 00:16:11,520 Speaker 1: And while there might be some layer of truth to it, 260 00:16:11,600 --> 00:16:14,960 Speaker 1: is it the epidemic that people are making it out 261 00:16:15,000 --> 00:16:18,240 Speaker 1: to be um and and and what's the reasoning behind it? 262 00:16:18,400 --> 00:16:20,240 Speaker 1: And I'm not saying those things are directly connected, but 263 00:16:20,240 --> 00:16:22,000 Speaker 1: I just think it's an It's just an example. When 264 00:16:22,240 --> 00:16:24,320 Speaker 1: you see something, you want to be the one to 265 00:16:24,400 --> 00:16:26,400 Speaker 1: share them the news. You want to be the one 266 00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:29,400 Speaker 1: to to give people the scoop and and and help 267 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:32,160 Speaker 1: people like look out for themselves or their friends, so 268 00:16:32,200 --> 00:16:34,880 Speaker 1: you don't really think twice, because if something's grizzly enough 269 00:16:35,440 --> 00:16:38,760 Speaker 1: or scary enough, you're probably gonna post it without fact 270 00:16:38,840 --> 00:16:40,960 Speaker 1: checking it. A lot of the time, I've certainly been 271 00:16:40,960 --> 00:16:43,200 Speaker 1: guilty of it, and I've had to double back and 272 00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:46,120 Speaker 1: make sure that I don't do that without, you know, 273 00:16:46,680 --> 00:16:48,400 Speaker 1: kind of knowing what I'm talking about a little bit more. 274 00:16:48,400 --> 00:16:50,000 Speaker 1: I don't know, Ben, what do you think? I do 275 00:16:50,080 --> 00:16:53,360 Speaker 1: have some thoughts here, Nolan, I suggest we pause for 276 00:16:53,400 --> 00:16:56,560 Speaker 1: a moment for a word from our sponsors and return 277 00:16:56,640 --> 00:17:05,640 Speaker 1: to to dive in just a bit further and we 278 00:17:05,840 --> 00:17:08,520 Speaker 1: are back. I do an issue of quick correction. I 279 00:17:08,600 --> 00:17:12,120 Speaker 1: had misspoken, said Stone Mountain. This was Yellow River Park 280 00:17:12,200 --> 00:17:16,360 Speaker 1: in the case of eighteen year old Tory Land. I 281 00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:20,760 Speaker 1: completely agree with you know. There is something to the 282 00:17:20,880 --> 00:17:26,440 Speaker 1: human personality exacerbated by social media, and it is this. 283 00:17:27,359 --> 00:17:31,600 Speaker 1: Human beings want to be Promethean. They want to breathe 284 00:17:31,640 --> 00:17:35,280 Speaker 1: the bringers of light and knowledge, even if it's even 285 00:17:35,320 --> 00:17:38,520 Speaker 1: if it's them, you know, reposting something. That's why people 286 00:17:38,960 --> 00:17:41,680 Speaker 1: steal ideas and purport that those ideas are their own 287 00:17:41,960 --> 00:17:46,040 Speaker 1: all the time, whether it's a meme, whether it's an aphorism, 288 00:17:46,280 --> 00:17:49,160 Speaker 1: whether it's an invention, whether it's a song, et cetera. 289 00:17:49,359 --> 00:17:52,440 Speaker 1: People want to be the person who brings knowledge, and 290 00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:56,679 Speaker 1: some people are opposed to even admitting that they're learning something. 291 00:17:57,200 --> 00:18:01,320 Speaker 1: This is um an abstract problem with human hardware, but 292 00:18:01,400 --> 00:18:05,119 Speaker 1: we see it writ large again, probably with the best 293 00:18:05,119 --> 00:18:08,679 Speaker 1: of intentions by people on social media. In this case, 294 00:18:09,240 --> 00:18:12,040 Speaker 1: people are trying to warn their friends. Nobody wants to 295 00:18:12,160 --> 00:18:15,840 Speaker 1: lose a stranger. Nobody even wants to lose people they 296 00:18:15,960 --> 00:18:22,239 Speaker 1: dislike to something as horrific as homicide. But you have 297 00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:25,800 Speaker 1: to think of the survivors in the family here, because sure, 298 00:18:26,200 --> 00:18:30,920 Speaker 1: local law enforcement is saying that there's rampant misinformation about 299 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:34,760 Speaker 1: these tragedies right now, and they have they have denied 300 00:18:34,840 --> 00:18:37,959 Speaker 1: that there is any evidence of a serial murderer. Uh. 301 00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:41,359 Speaker 1: And the FBI is involved, as you said. Uh. But 302 00:18:41,640 --> 00:18:43,760 Speaker 1: on the other side, we have when we look at 303 00:18:43,760 --> 00:18:48,239 Speaker 1: the human side of people who have lost you know, 304 00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:52,560 Speaker 1: their life partner, people who have lost their daughter or 305 00:18:52,720 --> 00:18:56,640 Speaker 1: their relative or their close friend. They're on the other 306 00:18:56,720 --> 00:19:00,800 Speaker 1: side of this saying things like this guy had something 307 00:19:01,000 --> 00:19:03,840 Speaker 1: I thought insightful and important to say during the vigil 308 00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:08,560 Speaker 1: for Janice UH that occurred this past Sunday night. He says, quote, 309 00:19:08,600 --> 00:19:11,399 Speaker 1: she was a wonderful spirit, and I don't want that 310 00:19:11,440 --> 00:19:13,800 Speaker 1: to be stained with things that you're hearing now. I 311 00:19:13,840 --> 00:19:16,480 Speaker 1: want you to focus on the joy and love of 312 00:19:16,680 --> 00:19:20,879 Speaker 1: Katie so you can imagine how how dramatic it can be, 313 00:19:21,800 --> 00:19:25,440 Speaker 1: you know, to have lost someone in such a heartbreaking 314 00:19:25,480 --> 00:19:28,200 Speaker 1: way and then to hop on your phone or your 315 00:19:28,240 --> 00:19:33,840 Speaker 1: social media of choice and find lurid unverified reports. Right 316 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:38,000 Speaker 1: that that sounds like well, frankly, that could that could 317 00:19:38,040 --> 00:19:42,400 Speaker 1: be interpreted as pitches for some episode and true crime series. 318 00:19:42,440 --> 00:19:47,320 Speaker 1: There's something almost humanizing about that. And again, you know, 319 00:19:47,920 --> 00:19:52,399 Speaker 1: we have to be careful here because people are overwhelmingly 320 00:19:52,920 --> 00:19:56,359 Speaker 1: coming from very good intentions, from a very good place. 321 00:19:56,440 --> 00:20:00,560 Speaker 1: They just don't want more people to die, which is 322 00:20:00,600 --> 00:20:04,120 Speaker 1: totally understandable. And if you if you want to help 323 00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:07,840 Speaker 1: someone in this situation, specifically, if you want to help 324 00:20:08,600 --> 00:20:14,040 Speaker 1: Katie Janice Tory Lane, you can look into the resources 325 00:20:14,080 --> 00:20:18,679 Speaker 1: that the relatives and local law enforcement have made available. 326 00:20:18,720 --> 00:20:21,720 Speaker 1: Like as we record today, there's a ten thousand dollar 327 00:20:21,840 --> 00:20:26,440 Speaker 1: reward being offered to anyone with information on Janice's murder. 328 00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:29,399 Speaker 1: You can call a p D homicide at four oh 329 00:20:29,480 --> 00:20:32,600 Speaker 1: four or five or sixty two thirty five where you 330 00:20:32,600 --> 00:20:34,960 Speaker 1: can call crime stoppers and four oh four or five 331 00:20:35,080 --> 00:20:38,480 Speaker 1: seven seven t I p s. There's also a go 332 00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:42,080 Speaker 1: fund me page. You saw that as well, Yes, I didn't, Ben, 333 00:20:42,119 --> 00:20:45,160 Speaker 1: I have a one last question for me anyway. Um, 334 00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:48,720 Speaker 1: isn't it a little suss that FBI is involved though 335 00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:51,920 Speaker 1: for just a stabbing? I mean, I know stabbing is 336 00:20:52,000 --> 00:20:56,119 Speaker 1: certainly grizzly and and uh creates a lot of outcry 337 00:20:56,160 --> 00:20:58,639 Speaker 1: and people's imaginations tend to run wild, especially you know, 338 00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:00,840 Speaker 1: with the dog being killed as well, that certainly seems 339 00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:04,760 Speaker 1: like kind of fetishistic murder, you know, um, much much 340 00:21:04,760 --> 00:21:08,200 Speaker 1: more so than a crime of opportunity maybe. But why 341 00:21:08,359 --> 00:21:10,640 Speaker 1: do you think the FBI is involved for this one 342 00:21:10,680 --> 00:21:13,000 Speaker 1: case if they're saying there's not a pattern, which is 343 00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:14,800 Speaker 1: certainly doesn't seem like there as I mean, the other 344 00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:17,919 Speaker 1: park was like almost half an hour away, like at 345 00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:20,919 Speaker 1: least twenty miles away, uh, and was a shooting, not 346 00:21:21,040 --> 00:21:24,119 Speaker 1: a stabbing. So I know we were probably just conjecturing 347 00:21:24,160 --> 00:21:25,640 Speaker 1: at this point, but do you have any thoughts as 348 00:21:25,640 --> 00:21:29,840 Speaker 1: to why in an isolated case like this, just because 349 00:21:29,840 --> 00:21:31,800 Speaker 1: it's a stabbing doesn't seem like reason to bring in 350 00:21:31,840 --> 00:21:35,080 Speaker 1: the FBI unless there's something else going on. Yeah, it's 351 00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:39,840 Speaker 1: a good question, and I would be misleading if I 352 00:21:39,920 --> 00:21:45,480 Speaker 1: said I had anything more than speculation regarding FBI involvement here. 353 00:21:46,080 --> 00:21:49,120 Speaker 1: But we can confirm again the FBI is looking into 354 00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:52,000 Speaker 1: it if we can, if we can find the internal reasoning, 355 00:21:52,080 --> 00:21:54,399 Speaker 1: or if any of our fellow conspiracy realists can provide 356 00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:57,440 Speaker 1: us with that reasoning, then we'll be We'll be glad 357 00:21:57,480 --> 00:22:00,800 Speaker 1: to learn more. But at this point I'm not I'm 358 00:22:00,840 --> 00:22:06,920 Speaker 1: not specifically able to disclose or conjecture as to why 359 00:22:07,040 --> 00:22:10,360 Speaker 1: the FBI is specifically involved. Okay, well, I think we'll 360 00:22:10,359 --> 00:22:12,520 Speaker 1: probably be keeping an eye on this certainly, and maybe 361 00:22:12,600 --> 00:22:14,560 Speaker 1: there will be more information that comes out. But as 362 00:22:14,560 --> 00:22:17,439 Speaker 1: of now, I think we can say, based on the 363 00:22:17,440 --> 00:22:19,600 Speaker 1: information that we have that this is likely not a 364 00:22:19,680 --> 00:22:23,560 Speaker 1: serial killer um and we have nothing backing up any 365 00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:27,680 Speaker 1: of these more intensely over the top, you know, grizzly 366 00:22:27,720 --> 00:22:31,000 Speaker 1: aspects of the crime. Agreed, and we will update if 367 00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:36,200 Speaker 1: more information comes to light. Our next piece of correspondence 368 00:22:36,240 --> 00:22:42,520 Speaker 1: today comes from Nadia Commanency. Nadia Commanency, who says this 369 00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:45,560 Speaker 1: is a fake alias for the Olympics, but writes to 370 00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:51,400 Speaker 1: us with a tremendously insightful follow up to our earlier 371 00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:54,560 Speaker 1: strange news story on n s O and the now 372 00:22:54,640 --> 00:22:59,359 Speaker 1: infamous pegas is malware, spyware, whenever you want to call it, 373 00:22:59,800 --> 00:23:06,240 Speaker 1: the software that is helping state level regimes murder innocent people. Hi, 374 00:23:06,640 --> 00:23:10,840 Speaker 1: says Nadia, comminency, please not use my name. I want 375 00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:13,400 Speaker 1: to explain a little bit more about pacases and companies 376 00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:16,159 Speaker 1: similar to in ESSO. I'm trying to write this so 377 00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:19,639 Speaker 1: that it is informative, but everyone is protected. That's what 378 00:23:19,760 --> 00:23:23,199 Speaker 1: caught my eye here, Uh, Nadia, and no, I do 379 00:23:23,359 --> 00:23:26,399 Speaker 1: want to note that this is a there's a pretty 380 00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:29,959 Speaker 1: lengthy letters, so we're gonna paraphrase a little and we're 381 00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:31,840 Speaker 1: going to use some excerpts, but we're going to make 382 00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:34,040 Speaker 1: sure you get the soul of what's being said here. 383 00:23:34,520 --> 00:23:37,960 Speaker 1: They continue saying there is private technology for hire for 384 00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:41,440 Speaker 1: whoever can pay the bill. In ESSO is just one company, 385 00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:44,119 Speaker 1: and the company with the worst reputation for having no 386 00:23:44,280 --> 00:23:48,320 Speaker 1: scruples in business their private sector companies. But honestly, I 387 00:23:48,359 --> 00:23:52,120 Speaker 1: find that questionable because they are outrageously capable. They can 388 00:23:52,160 --> 00:23:55,440 Speaker 1: supply any intel for example real time satellite feeds, where 389 00:23:55,480 --> 00:23:59,400 Speaker 1: the information obtained from real time satellite fees. This information 390 00:23:59,440 --> 00:24:02,679 Speaker 1: can be used to identify when and where illegal fishing 391 00:24:02,880 --> 00:24:06,160 Speaker 1: or legal waste dumping is happening. For example, whenever someone 392 00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:08,800 Speaker 1: here's a tool is used by law enforcement, they expect 393 00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:12,040 Speaker 1: the CIA and secret hits an espionage. This is not 394 00:24:12,119 --> 00:24:14,399 Speaker 1: always the case, and there's a lot of protection of 395 00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:16,880 Speaker 1: the environment that comes about from the use of companies 396 00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:21,919 Speaker 1: similar to n s O, but not in The number 397 00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:24,560 Speaker 1: one piece of evidence in a crime is the data 398 00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:28,439 Speaker 1: mind from cell phones. All the contacts, any details of meetings, 399 00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:30,840 Speaker 1: photo evidence of the crime, etcetera. Is on the phone. 400 00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:33,800 Speaker 1: If all the criminal contacts can be linked to the 401 00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:36,679 Speaker 1: organization of a crime, then you can take down the 402 00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:41,159 Speaker 1: entire criminal organization. The phone information is so valuable. My 403 00:24:41,280 --> 00:24:44,760 Speaker 1: dream is for an agency to bring reco charges against 404 00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:46,560 Speaker 1: some of the criminals. It is still up to the 405 00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:50,000 Speaker 1: investigative agency to prove a crime was committed, so spyware 406 00:24:50,320 --> 00:24:53,400 Speaker 1: is really just a tool. A federal judge can give 407 00:24:53,440 --> 00:24:57,160 Speaker 1: permission for wire taps and access to bank records. UH. 408 00:24:57,200 --> 00:25:00,640 Speaker 1: These things combined as well as eyewitness testimon money, will 409 00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:03,280 Speaker 1: make a case water tight. I guess I'm trying to 410 00:25:03,320 --> 00:25:05,280 Speaker 1: say that there are people doing a lot of good 411 00:25:05,320 --> 00:25:08,160 Speaker 1: with the same technology, and it is not that easy 412 00:25:08,280 --> 00:25:11,000 Speaker 1: to get in on someone's phone, so it is not 413 00:25:11,040 --> 00:25:14,280 Speaker 1: on my phone and your phone and his phone. Yeah, 414 00:25:14,640 --> 00:25:16,800 Speaker 1: makes I mean, that makes sense, and I think that's 415 00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:21,520 Speaker 1: a very valid point. Uh, this goes on Nadia Koma. 416 00:25:21,600 --> 00:25:25,439 Speaker 1: Nancy says, finally, it's important that these surveillance companies have 417 00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:29,200 Speaker 1: scruples ding ding ding we put the ding ding ding 418 00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:33,000 Speaker 1: in there. Uh, say, I am a Russian mobster parentheses. 419 00:25:33,040 --> 00:25:37,320 Speaker 1: A lot of Russians and ex Russian mobsters like using 420 00:25:37,400 --> 00:25:41,199 Speaker 1: and doing this technology in parentheses, And my employee at 421 00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:44,119 Speaker 1: my corrupt firm ran off with five hundred thousand dollars 422 00:25:44,160 --> 00:25:46,160 Speaker 1: in bitcoin, and I want to find him. I can 423 00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:48,360 Speaker 1: hire one of these companies to find them, so they 424 00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:51,520 Speaker 1: can negotiate my money back for a finder's fee. Now, 425 00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:55,560 Speaker 1: if there is honor among thieves and this mobster legit 426 00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:58,560 Speaker 1: just once his money back, then an honorable company might 427 00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:01,720 Speaker 1: help him. But say they want to kill him and 428 00:26:01,880 --> 00:26:04,560 Speaker 1: get their money back, that's not something that honorable company 429 00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:06,760 Speaker 1: would help with. And maybe they would not even help 430 00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:09,200 Speaker 1: with rush them upster in the first place. These spy 431 00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:11,399 Speaker 1: companies have all the info with their fingertips, they know 432 00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:13,960 Speaker 1: or can find out who they're working for. They can 433 00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:16,119 Speaker 1: decide who to help and who not to help, and 434 00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:19,879 Speaker 1: they can also filter information they give back. The client 435 00:26:19,960 --> 00:26:22,920 Speaker 1: cannot listen or go through a vegas Ist phone that's 436 00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:26,400 Speaker 1: vegas is apostrophe d. When they hire someone to spy 437 00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:28,879 Speaker 1: for them, the spying agency goes through the intel and 438 00:26:28,920 --> 00:26:31,840 Speaker 1: decides what's relevant and what's not, what to tell the client, 439 00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:35,080 Speaker 1: what's not divulge. If there is no evidence of a crime, 440 00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:37,840 Speaker 1: there's no info to offer. Case closed, so they act 441 00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:42,480 Speaker 1: as a middleman. These private companies act as certified informants 442 00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:47,560 Speaker 1: on international cases. Fascinating. There's always a double edged sword 443 00:26:47,560 --> 00:26:50,040 Speaker 1: with this kind of stuff. I mean, if people can 444 00:26:50,119 --> 00:26:52,040 Speaker 1: use it for evil, then people can use it for 445 00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:53,879 Speaker 1: good and vice versa. I mean, you can always flip 446 00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:56,199 Speaker 1: the script and take something that's we see it all 447 00:26:56,200 --> 00:26:58,560 Speaker 1: the time with this type of technology. And of course 448 00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:01,119 Speaker 1: this is the kind of like or valence stuff that 449 00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:03,800 Speaker 1: you could use against bad guys, you know, like that's 450 00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:08,320 Speaker 1: much more helpful and efficient than say, wire taps and 451 00:27:08,359 --> 00:27:11,320 Speaker 1: all the guidelines surrounding wire taps and how long you 452 00:27:11,359 --> 00:27:13,760 Speaker 1: can listen and all of that stuff, you know, I mean, 453 00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:16,639 Speaker 1: it's just not to be a broken record. But you know, 454 00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:20,960 Speaker 1: in The Sopranos, Tony Soprano buys his son a SUV 455 00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:22,760 Speaker 1: in one episode and he's like, I pulled all that 456 00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:25,199 Speaker 1: GPS out of there. But this is you know, The 457 00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:29,920 Speaker 1: Sopranos was in the days before cell phones, before like smartphones. 458 00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:32,280 Speaker 1: If you look at the phones everyone has in that show, 459 00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:35,480 Speaker 1: they're all like, you know, those little sprint type flip phones. 460 00:27:35,560 --> 00:27:38,959 Speaker 1: So it wasn't even something that people considered. And you've 461 00:27:38,960 --> 00:27:41,600 Speaker 1: gotta wonder if people in organized crime, and I know 462 00:27:41,640 --> 00:27:45,359 Speaker 1: they're probably using smartphones for personal stuff, but I bet 463 00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:50,280 Speaker 1: they still use burner phones for actual illegal operations, or 464 00:27:50,480 --> 00:27:53,600 Speaker 1: they have some kind of special encryption on their devices. 465 00:27:54,040 --> 00:27:58,480 Speaker 1: Not to sound too old school, but but there's something 466 00:27:58,520 --> 00:28:02,280 Speaker 1: to be said for technology that would be considered archaic. 467 00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:05,639 Speaker 1: It's a little bit easier to to make sure that 468 00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:08,679 Speaker 1: the people you're reaching are the people you want to reach, 469 00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:11,000 Speaker 1: and that no one's listening on the on the line, 470 00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:14,679 Speaker 1: you know, Like I'm not saying all paper ciphers and 471 00:28:14,760 --> 00:28:17,760 Speaker 1: dead drops, but don't be surprised that people still use 472 00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:20,359 Speaker 1: some of those because they work. What I think Nadia 473 00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:23,600 Speaker 1: is saying here is that we have to be careful 474 00:28:23,680 --> 00:28:28,720 Speaker 1: not to lump all these private sector intel companies into 475 00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:33,760 Speaker 1: one bucket. Uh. Nadia, I do appreciate that you agreed 476 00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:37,400 Speaker 1: with us from from a position of expertise and credibility 477 00:28:37,440 --> 00:28:40,360 Speaker 1: that an s O does have one of the worst 478 00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:44,920 Speaker 1: reputations here UH. And in in return and reciprocity, I 479 00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:52,280 Speaker 1: agree that these agencies are not all necessarily doing nefarious things. 480 00:28:52,320 --> 00:28:57,080 Speaker 1: But in s O clearly, as we said in our 481 00:28:57,120 --> 00:29:03,880 Speaker 1: previous segment, in s O clearly is claiming that they 482 00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:09,800 Speaker 1: are not aware slash not responsible for uh, for the 483 00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:14,400 Speaker 1: stalking of like Kashaki's family, for the deaths that have 484 00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:21,840 Speaker 1: been traced to agencies using vegas is in Mexico and 485 00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:25,880 Speaker 1: in other places around the world. And we aimed to 486 00:29:25,960 --> 00:29:29,160 Speaker 1: be very very fair, fair to the best of our 487 00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:32,640 Speaker 1: ability with the information we had when we presented an 488 00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:36,160 Speaker 1: s O company's statements, UH, and when we presented the 489 00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:40,640 Speaker 1: accusations of these journalists. But let's pause for word from 490 00:29:40,640 --> 00:29:43,520 Speaker 1: our sponsor, and then let's let's dive into this a 491 00:29:43,560 --> 00:29:47,760 Speaker 1: little bit more. While we're on break. Everybody check your phone, 492 00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:59,920 Speaker 1: ask yourself what's on it? Just candy crush um, Let's 493 00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:05,080 Speaker 1: see coop group on got dr Mario World. That's a 494 00:30:05,080 --> 00:30:08,120 Speaker 1: fun one in some games when kids play, I got 495 00:30:08,160 --> 00:30:11,320 Speaker 1: spotify them. Here ways a bunch of pictures that will 496 00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:13,520 Speaker 1: probably never look at a lot. I don't know, hopefully 497 00:30:13,560 --> 00:30:16,440 Speaker 1: not Pegasus though, But how how do you how does 498 00:30:16,480 --> 00:30:18,400 Speaker 1: it get on there? Ben? I know it has to 499 00:30:18,440 --> 00:30:22,120 Speaker 1: do with like you can get a FaceTime call that 500 00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:25,040 Speaker 1: you don't even have to answer and it can infect 501 00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:26,840 Speaker 1: you that way. There there was some really creepy do 502 00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:29,440 Speaker 1: you think of we've always thought of Well, first off, 503 00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:32,760 Speaker 1: we've always thought of max as being impervious to viruses. 504 00:30:32,880 --> 00:30:35,720 Speaker 1: Viruses are only for PCs, we said, and that, of 505 00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:38,479 Speaker 1: course isn't true anymore. For the longest time that we 506 00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:43,120 Speaker 1: seem like to be blissfully you know, impervious to viruses 507 00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:45,920 Speaker 1: where cell phones are concerned. But this is that's why 508 00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:47,520 Speaker 1: I think this is such an interesting development. But it's 509 00:30:47,520 --> 00:30:49,880 Speaker 1: also something that's been around for a lot longer than 510 00:30:49,880 --> 00:30:53,680 Speaker 1: we realized. Right, Yeah, No, I think that's a really 511 00:30:53,920 --> 00:30:59,600 Speaker 1: that's a really good point because originally vegas is would 512 00:30:59,760 --> 00:31:03,720 Speaker 1: say end a malware link and you had to click 513 00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:06,200 Speaker 1: on that link at least and then you would be 514 00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:10,040 Speaker 1: you would get popped. But now, like you said, it 515 00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:15,480 Speaker 1: can install itself with simply a missed call on what's app. 516 00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:20,880 Speaker 1: I believe is the platform that's You're You're perfect. I'm sure. 517 00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:23,640 Speaker 1: I'm sure there's work going on to make it even 518 00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:29,840 Speaker 1: more easily transmissible. Right now, the only way to get 519 00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:35,080 Speaker 1: rid of pagas is completely is to discard the phone 520 00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:38,360 Speaker 1: like you have. You cannot really wipe it. You have 521 00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:42,360 Speaker 1: to discard the phone. And then secondly, because this is 522 00:31:42,360 --> 00:31:46,960 Speaker 1: if you look at objective, this is brilliant design. But secondly, 523 00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:53,040 Speaker 1: to Nadia commanencis point, these companies do have the ability 524 00:31:53,160 --> 00:31:57,080 Speaker 1: to act as a middleman to filter information. And if 525 00:31:57,160 --> 00:32:01,680 Speaker 1: they have the ability to filter information, then does that 526 00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:07,640 Speaker 1: not logically mean they are seeing the information. Does that 527 00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:12,320 Speaker 1: not logically mean they are able to draw some conclusions 528 00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:15,320 Speaker 1: about how this information is going to be used? Like 529 00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:19,920 Speaker 1: you see a journalist family members show it up right 530 00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:23,320 Speaker 1: and and their intel is going through vegases right, and 531 00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:29,960 Speaker 1: then later that journalist is dismembered, is vivisected? Then is 532 00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:33,360 Speaker 1: it like is it unfair to say that they probably 533 00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:36,560 Speaker 1: could have figured out what the software was being used for. 534 00:32:36,920 --> 00:32:39,160 Speaker 1: I just I don't know. I don't have all the facts, 535 00:32:39,160 --> 00:32:42,040 Speaker 1: but it seems like it doesn't seem like an argument 536 00:32:42,040 --> 00:32:44,040 Speaker 1: in good faith. Does that make sense my being too 537 00:32:44,040 --> 00:32:46,040 Speaker 1: hard on them? No, I don't think so at all. 538 00:32:46,040 --> 00:32:49,640 Speaker 1: I don't think you're being too hard on them at all. Um. 539 00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:51,520 Speaker 1: But let's le's let's flip back to the you know, 540 00:32:51,640 --> 00:32:54,560 Speaker 1: the positive uses for this. Like, I mean, we know, 541 00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:59,480 Speaker 1: probably largely from fiction and true crime stuff, that career criminals, 542 00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:02,600 Speaker 1: professional criminals are very paranoid about this kind of stuff, 543 00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:04,720 Speaker 1: and I think that kind of paranoia is starting to 544 00:33:04,760 --> 00:33:07,720 Speaker 1: filter into just you know, regular civilians, just because of 545 00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:10,880 Speaker 1: all of the surveillance state type stuff that we're you know, 546 00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:14,640 Speaker 1: reading about and seeing firsthand. But um, do you think 547 00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:19,400 Speaker 1: it would take more to infect a criminal someone you 548 00:33:19,440 --> 00:33:22,720 Speaker 1: were actually trying to surveil? Um, you know, for recod 549 00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:26,480 Speaker 1: type cases, would it take more of a clever back 550 00:33:26,560 --> 00:33:30,720 Speaker 1: door than say, just like a fishing scam or or 551 00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:33,840 Speaker 1: even like a WhatsApp call that maybe someone wasn't expecting. 552 00:33:33,880 --> 00:33:36,800 Speaker 1: I would think, you know, you see CEC mobsters throwing 553 00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:38,719 Speaker 1: cell phones out the window all the time. I mean, 554 00:33:38,720 --> 00:33:40,880 Speaker 1: I'm just wondering, like to get this done and to 555 00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:43,880 Speaker 1: do it effectively, would there need to be even further 556 00:33:44,800 --> 00:33:48,120 Speaker 1: more clever ways of infecting someone's phone with this? Yeah, 557 00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:50,760 Speaker 1: that's the race. That's a good question as well because 558 00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:56,240 Speaker 1: right now this hit the mainstream recently, but in the industry, 559 00:33:56,320 --> 00:34:01,600 Speaker 1: pakeances is old beans. People know about it. What'sapp, Microsoft, Google, 560 00:34:01,640 --> 00:34:04,800 Speaker 1: all the other kids, all the all the all the hits. Uh, 561 00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:10,640 Speaker 1: the continually patching security loopholes that allowed pagases to function. 562 00:34:11,160 --> 00:34:14,480 Speaker 1: But that doesn't mean the researchers on the vegas IS 563 00:34:14,560 --> 00:34:17,640 Speaker 1: and s O side stopped doing that research. There are 564 00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:21,640 Speaker 1: new variants of vegases that will probably come out with 565 00:34:22,120 --> 00:34:25,640 Speaker 1: different or more sophisticated exploits. There are a couple of 566 00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:27,920 Speaker 1: ways to think about think about your question. You're with 567 00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:33,719 Speaker 1: organized crime. First, it's it would be hilarious if it 568 00:34:33,800 --> 00:34:36,759 Speaker 1: wasn't so dangerous. But I think the average person would 569 00:34:36,760 --> 00:34:41,680 Speaker 1: be surprised by how many high level criminal and like 570 00:34:41,880 --> 00:34:46,839 Speaker 1: legal state level operations do dummy things, knucklehead things like 571 00:34:47,239 --> 00:34:51,600 Speaker 1: have the administrator password for their system be you know 572 00:34:51,960 --> 00:34:56,720 Speaker 1: admin or admin one two three? Uh, this this seems 573 00:34:56,760 --> 00:34:59,359 Speaker 1: like a huge misstep, but it's not an uncommon one 574 00:34:59,400 --> 00:35:03,800 Speaker 1: even today. A Uh. Secondly, it's tough because the more 575 00:35:03,880 --> 00:35:08,920 Speaker 1: people you have in any operation, the more opportunities for 576 00:35:09,040 --> 00:35:13,160 Speaker 1: exploits naturally come to exist. And all it takes is 577 00:35:13,200 --> 00:35:16,480 Speaker 1: just one person who's a little bit sloppy and that 578 00:35:16,520 --> 00:35:19,200 Speaker 1: can that can reco everyone, you know what I mean. 579 00:35:19,280 --> 00:35:23,799 Speaker 1: So it's it's no surprise that some criminal organizations have 580 00:35:24,239 --> 00:35:31,239 Speaker 1: very specific, pretty extreme rules about how they use telecommunication devices. 581 00:35:31,760 --> 00:35:34,520 Speaker 1: You know, these devices are a necessity now for a 582 00:35:34,520 --> 00:35:38,000 Speaker 1: lot of people, especially if you're looking at international crime. 583 00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:41,600 Speaker 1: But one of the best, uh one, one of the 584 00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:43,920 Speaker 1: best things that people have on their side when it 585 00:35:43,920 --> 00:35:47,719 Speaker 1: comes to something like vegas Is is that vegas Is 586 00:35:47,719 --> 00:35:52,799 Speaker 1: is not really something the average person could buy, you know, 587 00:35:52,960 --> 00:35:56,360 Speaker 1: to star their X or something like that. It costs 588 00:35:56,360 --> 00:36:00,160 Speaker 1: like millions of dollars to to use. You have to 589 00:36:00,200 --> 00:36:04,000 Speaker 1: have some sophisticated handling. This is the opposite of plug 590 00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:06,920 Speaker 1: and play. It's not like clear View AI or whatever 591 00:36:07,360 --> 00:36:13,200 Speaker 1: this software. The journalists involved are saying that it is 592 00:36:13,280 --> 00:36:18,600 Speaker 1: being used to target high value, high value folks who 593 00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:21,759 Speaker 1: the most of the world would not think of as criminals. 594 00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:27,240 Speaker 1: Like lawyers, journalists, politicians, um, people who might have access 595 00:36:27,320 --> 00:36:31,040 Speaker 1: to top secret information via their device, you know, and 596 00:36:31,080 --> 00:36:34,560 Speaker 1: like it's like you and I and our ride or 597 00:36:34,560 --> 00:36:37,799 Speaker 1: die mat. A number of years ago, we were stranded 598 00:36:38,360 --> 00:36:41,799 Speaker 1: in the Atlanta airport and we made for whatever, like 599 00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:46,880 Speaker 1: eighteen hours or something. No, for a while, it seemed 600 00:36:46,920 --> 00:36:51,480 Speaker 1: like an attorney GoF, you're talking about our friend we made. Yeah, yeah, 601 00:36:51,520 --> 00:36:54,160 Speaker 1: and you know I was. I was going back and 602 00:36:54,200 --> 00:36:56,040 Speaker 1: forth on whether he says his name on air, but 603 00:36:56,320 --> 00:36:58,560 Speaker 1: he's we converted. He's a good fan of the show, 604 00:36:58,680 --> 00:37:01,080 Speaker 1: friend of the show now and aside from being a 605 00:37:01,120 --> 00:37:03,719 Speaker 1: magnificent guy. And dude, if you're listening, I hope it 606 00:37:03,760 --> 00:37:06,960 Speaker 1: worked out with the girl. Thank you for taking take 607 00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:12,359 Speaker 1: you for listening to our weird, weirdly specific advice. Um. 608 00:37:12,560 --> 00:37:17,240 Speaker 1: But he had something interesting, like in his line of work, 609 00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:20,960 Speaker 1: he had some pretty tight op sack on his work 610 00:37:21,000 --> 00:37:23,960 Speaker 1: computer and he wasn't doing any spy stuff, you know, 611 00:37:24,120 --> 00:37:27,040 Speaker 1: he was just working with financials and it was great 612 00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:30,600 Speaker 1: to have him walk us through it, uh because you know, 613 00:37:30,640 --> 00:37:34,680 Speaker 1: obviously were we are not gonna try to take advantage 614 00:37:34,680 --> 00:37:37,400 Speaker 1: of anybody. But also I don't know if you remember 615 00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:39,320 Speaker 1: this there was that moment where I just had to 616 00:37:39,440 --> 00:37:42,440 Speaker 1: very politely say to him, you know, hey, man, this 617 00:37:42,520 --> 00:37:44,719 Speaker 1: is fascinating because we're all nerds and we love seeing 618 00:37:44,719 --> 00:37:47,520 Speaker 1: all this stuff works. But I don't know if you 619 00:37:47,520 --> 00:37:50,360 Speaker 1: should be telling some dudes you just met at the airport, 620 00:37:51,719 --> 00:37:54,719 Speaker 1: which he found hilarious. Well, I remember too, was the 621 00:37:54,800 --> 00:37:57,759 Speaker 1: first time I've ever seen something that's now pretty commonplace, 622 00:37:58,239 --> 00:38:00,600 Speaker 1: at least, you know, in terms of like three factor 623 00:38:00,680 --> 00:38:04,359 Speaker 1: authentic authentication. But he had a thumb drive that had 624 00:38:04,440 --> 00:38:09,200 Speaker 1: like a constantly changing key. It constantly updated like out 625 00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:11,719 Speaker 1: of timer, like I think every like ten minutes or 626 00:38:11,760 --> 00:38:14,680 Speaker 1: something like that. It changed, and he had to you know, 627 00:38:14,760 --> 00:38:17,960 Speaker 1: put in a new key that was actually physically displayed 628 00:38:18,239 --> 00:38:20,720 Speaker 1: somewhere or like on an app. I don't remember exactly 629 00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:22,000 Speaker 1: how it works, but it's like, you know, they're all 630 00:38:22,000 --> 00:38:25,480 Speaker 1: these authenticator programs now that you know, the keys literally 631 00:38:25,520 --> 00:38:27,400 Speaker 1: are always on a cycle and changing, and you have 632 00:38:27,480 --> 00:38:29,160 Speaker 1: to entern the new one and if you miss it 633 00:38:29,160 --> 00:38:30,839 Speaker 1: by a couple of seconds and it won't work. So 634 00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:32,600 Speaker 1: it just you know, proves that you have access to 635 00:38:32,680 --> 00:38:36,360 Speaker 1: the device. So probably that kind of uh, multi factor 636 00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:41,080 Speaker 1: authentication or encryption will maybe be more of a thing, uh, 637 00:38:41,120 --> 00:38:45,920 Speaker 1: and get more robust, you know, and as that evolves, 638 00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:51,120 Speaker 1: we will see attempts to break that security layer evolved 639 00:38:51,239 --> 00:38:55,399 Speaker 1: in step. It's a continuing kind of Uh. Let's see. 640 00:38:55,440 --> 00:38:57,279 Speaker 1: This might be too old school for some people, but 641 00:38:57,680 --> 00:39:01,400 Speaker 1: if you remember the Mad magazine comics a spy versus spy, 642 00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:08,239 Speaker 1: that's essentially That's essentially what's happening. But I really appreciated 643 00:39:08,280 --> 00:39:10,719 Speaker 1: your point there, n Idea, like not all of these 644 00:39:10,760 --> 00:39:15,920 Speaker 1: things are inherently bad. Indeed, all technology is like fire 645 00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:18,680 Speaker 1: the way I said earlier, It can warm you and 646 00:39:18,760 --> 00:39:21,680 Speaker 1: save your life, or it can burn you and your house. 647 00:39:21,840 --> 00:39:25,719 Speaker 1: Doubt technology has ever been a double edged sword. And 648 00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:29,439 Speaker 1: whether you're dealing with your smartphone at home, or whether 649 00:39:29,480 --> 00:39:33,120 Speaker 1: you're dealing with weird email on your laptop, whether even 650 00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:37,560 Speaker 1: your cars GPS is doing something weird, it's important to 651 00:39:37,640 --> 00:39:43,919 Speaker 1: keep that in mind. Technology is only as ethical as 652 00:39:44,000 --> 00:39:47,319 Speaker 1: the people who wield it. And with that, I think 653 00:39:47,360 --> 00:39:50,719 Speaker 1: we can leave it there. We hope you enjoyed this 654 00:39:50,760 --> 00:39:54,200 Speaker 1: week's listener mail. Thank you so much to m thank 655 00:39:54,239 --> 00:39:57,279 Speaker 1: you so much to Nadia, and we cannot wait to 656 00:39:57,480 --> 00:40:00,320 Speaker 1: hear from you. If you want to take a age 657 00:40:00,320 --> 00:40:03,080 Speaker 1: out of their book and contact us. We have so 658 00:40:03,120 --> 00:40:05,960 Speaker 1: many ways to do it. We try to be easy 659 00:40:06,040 --> 00:40:10,960 Speaker 1: to find online. Please don't give us vegases, Please don't uh. 660 00:40:11,080 --> 00:40:15,200 Speaker 1: Please direct your non uh Pegasus tainted admissives to us 661 00:40:15,680 --> 00:40:18,879 Speaker 1: via our social media channels. The usual ones we've got 662 00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:22,760 Speaker 1: Instagram or or Conspiracy Stuff show during a different order today. 663 00:40:22,880 --> 00:40:25,920 Speaker 1: And then we've got Conspiracy Stuff, which is our handle 664 00:40:26,200 --> 00:40:29,920 Speaker 1: on Facebook, Twitter and YouTube, where you can find daily 665 00:40:30,040 --> 00:40:33,480 Speaker 1: video clips of little you know, key moments from every 666 00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:36,000 Speaker 1: podcast that we do every single day of the week. 667 00:40:36,239 --> 00:40:39,400 Speaker 1: And if that doesn't quite bag your badgers, if you 668 00:40:39,440 --> 00:40:42,040 Speaker 1: feel like going a bit more old school, we have 669 00:40:42,120 --> 00:40:45,120 Speaker 1: your back as well. You can call us directly on 670 00:40:45,200 --> 00:40:48,840 Speaker 1: your telephonic device, yes, even if it's a rotary phone. 671 00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:51,120 Speaker 1: Our number is one eight three three. Say it with 672 00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:54,840 Speaker 1: me st d w y t K. You'll hear a 673 00:40:54,880 --> 00:40:56,840 Speaker 1: message that let you know you're in the right place, 674 00:40:56,880 --> 00:40:59,440 Speaker 1: and then you'll have three minutes. Those three minutes belong 675 00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:02,399 Speaker 1: to you. We ask only that you let us know 676 00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:05,000 Speaker 1: if it's okay to use your name and or voice 677 00:41:05,000 --> 00:41:08,160 Speaker 1: on air. Give yourself a sick nickname, a moniker and 678 00:41:08,280 --> 00:41:10,560 Speaker 1: a k A. We love that sort of thing, tell 679 00:41:10,640 --> 00:41:14,359 Speaker 1: us what's on your mind. Most importantly, if you have 680 00:41:14,640 --> 00:41:17,719 Speaker 1: something you'd like to tell us that doesn't fit into 681 00:41:17,800 --> 00:41:22,680 Speaker 1: three minutes, please do not censor yourself. Instead, write the 682 00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:26,400 Speaker 1: story out, give us any supplementary links, any leads that 683 00:41:26,520 --> 00:41:29,480 Speaker 1: you feel are important, and send us down the rabbit 684 00:41:29,520 --> 00:41:33,360 Speaker 1: hole via email where we are conspiracy at iHeart radio 685 00:41:33,440 --> 00:41:54,000 Speaker 1: dot com. Stuff they Don't Want You to Know is 686 00:41:54,040 --> 00:41:57,080 Speaker 1: a production of I heart Radio. For more podcasts from 687 00:41:57,080 --> 00:41:59,560 Speaker 1: my heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, Apple 688 00:41:59,600 --> 00:42:02,120 Speaker 1: podcast Us, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.