WEBVTT - Weirdhouse Cinema: Black Lizard (1968)

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio.

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<v Speaker 2>Hey, welcome to Weird House Cinema. This is Rob Lamb.

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<v Speaker 3>And this is Joe McCormick. And hey, folks, I said

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<v Speaker 3>this on yesterday's episode, but I want to say again,

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<v Speaker 3>if I sound unusual in today's episode, if I sound

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<v Speaker 3>a little hoarse, it is because I've got a bit

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<v Speaker 3>of a cold. But a bit of a cold could

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<v Speaker 3>not stop me from talking about today's movie on Weird House,

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<v Speaker 3>which is nineteen sixty eight. It's Black Lizard.

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<v Speaker 2>We should have worked it into the picture and so

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<v Speaker 2>that you sound like you do because a strange woman

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<v Speaker 2>with demon yellow eyes through a constricting snake at your neck.

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<v Speaker 2>But it's more mundane are the causes here? But yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>we have yet another cult favorite gem from Japanese cinema today,

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<v Speaker 2>and it follows the traditions of danger diabolic and that

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<v Speaker 2>it is another super criminal film, full of style, full

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<v Speaker 2>of visual pizazz. It's campy, it's bizarre, but also I

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<v Speaker 2>think with a lot of interesting depth. As you dig

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<v Speaker 2>into it, we're going to be talking about nineteen sixty

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<v Speaker 2>eight's Black Lizard. Today's film is also notable in that

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<v Speaker 2>it is entirely centered around a charismatic drag performance. The

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<v Speaker 2>title character, Black Lizard or Cororo Tokagi, is a stylish

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<v Speaker 2>female super criminal played in this film by prominent drag performer,

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<v Speaker 2>really famous and legendary drag performer, Akihiro Miwa, who will

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<v Speaker 2>have more information about here in a bet, but a

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<v Speaker 2>true legend, but a cultural figure of note, and it's

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<v Speaker 2>all played out seriously and thoughtfully, never for a giggle

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<v Speaker 2>in a wink. I've seen descriptions of this film as

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<v Speaker 2>a comedy. I think the current Internet movie database summary,

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<v Speaker 2>for example, says it's a comedy in the summary, and

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know, I don't think that's one hundred percent accurate.

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<v Speaker 2>It is a tremendously fun film. It is certainly camp,

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<v Speaker 2>but it doesn't really seem to play for laughs. But again,

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<v Speaker 2>it is tremendously fun.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, there are funny things in it. It certainly has

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<v Speaker 3>an over the top sensibility, but I would say it

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<v Speaker 3>plays a lot more as kind of a serious tragic

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<v Speaker 3>romance and as a crime thriller more certainly more than

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<v Speaker 3>as a comedy. I would say it is no more

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<v Speaker 3>a comedy than danger diabolic as a comedy, and also

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<v Speaker 3>in Diabolic there are funny scenes and an absurd gratuitousness.

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<v Speaker 3>There's similar movies in a lot of ways, but neither

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<v Speaker 3>one really has the moment to moment focus on laughs

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<v Speaker 3>that a comedy usually does.

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<v Speaker 2>All right, elevator pitch for this film, I want to

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<v Speaker 2>approach it two ways. One, I would say it's the

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<v Speaker 2>forbidden love of a super criminal and an ace detective

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<v Speaker 2>realized in a stylish sixties counterculture Japanese cinema festival for

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<v Speaker 2>the eyes. But I also think that there's one line

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<v Speaker 2>in particular in translation here. Of course, we both watched

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<v Speaker 2>it with subtitles. I don't think a dub exists, and

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<v Speaker 2>I don't think I would want the dub. I think

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<v Speaker 2>I would want the subtitles. But there's one great line

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<v Speaker 2>where our main character, Aketchi, the number one detective in Japan,

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<v Speaker 2>is speaking to Black Lizard, the super criminal, and says,

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<v Speaker 2>black Lizard, you were an old fashioned romanticist in this

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<v Speaker 2>age soiled by corruption and murder. You believe that crime

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<v Speaker 2>should wear a gorgeous gown with a train fifteen feet long,

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<v Speaker 2>just like the primordial dreams of lizards.

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<v Speaker 3>Oh yeah, like those.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, And that's I mean, if you love that line,

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<v Speaker 2>you'll love this film. This film perfectly delivers on like

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<v Speaker 2>the glorious, poetic weirdness of that statement. All right now,

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<v Speaker 2>I wasn't able to find what I could one hundred

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<v Speaker 2>percent feel certain about concerning a trailer, Japanese or otherwise.

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<v Speaker 2>So what I did find was a that was uploaded

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<v Speaker 2>by Brooklyn's Spectacle Theater, which I've never been to, but

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<v Speaker 2>it looks amazing. It's a collectively run screening space run

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<v Speaker 2>by movie loving volunteers and they play a lot of

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<v Speaker 2>just great looking stuff, including some films that we've covered

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<v Speaker 2>on Weird House before. Like just at the time of

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<v Speaker 2>this recording, I'm like, oh, what are they playing this

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<v Speaker 2>week at this place? And they're playing Doctor of Doom,

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<v Speaker 2>which is a wonderful Mexican luchadora film that we've covered

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<v Speaker 2>in the past. So so go check them out Brooklyn

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<v Speaker 2>Spectacle Theater. We're going to borrow part of the trailer

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<v Speaker 2>they uploaded. Again. I'm not sure if this is part

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<v Speaker 2>of an original trailer part of a trailer that they made,

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<v Speaker 2>but either way, it'll give you just a little sonic taste.

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<v Speaker 4>Of black lizards, you know, it give climateg.

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<v Speaker 1>Too much.

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<v Speaker 2>On all. Right now, if you want to go out

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<v Speaker 2>and watch Black Lizard before proceeding with the rest of

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<v Speaker 2>this episode, well, I'm sad to say this one is

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<v Speaker 2>tragically hard to find right now as of this recording,

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<v Speaker 2>as of this moment, despite the film having had an

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<v Speaker 2>official international and US release, even if a limited one

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<v Speaker 2>back in nineteen sixty nine, even though it had subsequent

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<v Speaker 2>re releases in Japan and and abroad over the decades

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<v Speaker 2>to follow. It might have been released on VHS at

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<v Speaker 2>one point, as Michael Weldon, who loved it, references a

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<v Speaker 2>tape in his Psychotronic Video guide book. I'm not sure

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<v Speaker 2>if he's referring to a legit tape or more of

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<v Speaker 2>a gray market sort of thing, but yeah, it's a

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<v Speaker 2>real shame because this is a fabulous film with a

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<v Speaker 2>cult following. It has cultural significance historical significance as well,

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<v Speaker 2>and it deserves to be seen by more film fans

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<v Speaker 2>than the best quality possible. If you look around, you

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<v Speaker 2>can find some sources for it. But I also have

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<v Speaker 2>to stress that this is the nineteen sixty eight Black

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<v Speaker 2>Lizard or Coro Toakagi film, not to be confused with

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<v Speaker 2>other films titled Black Lizard, including an unrelated Shaw Brothers

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<v Speaker 2>Hong Kong film titled Black Lizard from nineteen eighty one,

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<v Speaker 2>or a nineteen sixty two Japanese film titled Black Lizard

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<v Speaker 2>that is actually an earlier adaptation of the same novel

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<v Speaker 2>in the same play. I've seen part of the sixty

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<v Speaker 2>two film, and it's also quite stylish and quite good.

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<v Speaker 2>I was about like twenty mins and it's into it

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<v Speaker 2>before I realized, Oh, I have the wrong movie. I

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<v Speaker 2>need to find I need to look around a little art.

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<v Speaker 2>I think the sixty two win is actually maybe you

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<v Speaker 2>can stream it through Criterion Collection. So, but it would

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<v Speaker 2>not be a loss to watch the sixty two version.

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<v Speaker 2>You're going to hit a lot of the same plot

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<v Speaker 2>points we're hitting here. But we are talking about the

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<v Speaker 2>nineteen sixty eight adaptation here today.

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<v Speaker 3>Now when it comes to the sixty eight version, the

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<v Speaker 3>director is actually somebody quite familiar on Weird House.

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<v Speaker 2>That's right. It's Kimji Fukusaku, who lived nineteen thirty through

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<v Speaker 2>two thousand and three. He directed nineteen seventy eight's Message

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<v Speaker 2>from Space.

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<v Speaker 3>And Nice Best of the Star Wars Repulse.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that was a one we covered early on on

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<v Speaker 2>Weird House, and he also directed nineteen sixty eight so

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<v Speaker 2>The Green Slime, which we covered far more recently, both

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<v Speaker 2>very enjoyable films in their own distinct ways and also

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<v Speaker 2>rather different from today's entry. Yes, now, Fukusako has sixty

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<v Speaker 2>eight directorial credits on IMDb, and probably the big one

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<v Speaker 2>for a lot of listeners, as I mentioned before, is

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<v Speaker 2>two thousand's Battle Royale, which was a huge late career

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<v Speaker 2>hit for him, to the extent that it can to

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<v Speaker 2>a casual fan, you might, you know, only focus on that,

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<v Speaker 2>but other films of note include at least the Japanese

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<v Speaker 2>portions of nineteen seventies Tora Tora Tora. He apparently was

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<v Speaker 2>brought in after Kurosawa backed out nineteen seventy three's Battles

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<v Speaker 2>Without Honor and Humanity. He directed a number of action

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<v Speaker 2>yakuza and samurai movies, as well as the high budget

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<v Speaker 2>nineteen eighty sci fi film Virus, which featured a host

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<v Speaker 2>of Japanese and American actors. He also directed the two

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<v Speaker 2>thousand and two video game like PlayStation video game clock

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<v Speaker 2>Tower three, which I think I did play, and in

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<v Speaker 2>doing so, this was my earliest exposure to Fukusaku's work.

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<v Speaker 3>Is that like a horror game.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, if it's the one I'm thinking of. There's a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of like creeping around and trying to avoid like killers,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, like mass killers that you can't actually directly stand.

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<v Speaker 2>So in a way, it's kind of a similar vibe

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<v Speaker 2>to like the Alien Isolation game that came many many

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<v Speaker 2>years later. I don't remember anything about it where I'm like,

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<v Speaker 2>oh wow, of course Fukusaku was involved in this anyway.

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<v Speaker 2>Fukusaku's a director often associated with the Japanese New wave

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<v Speaker 2>cinema movement of the sixties and seventies, but he was

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<v Speaker 2>also a big commercial success, highly acclaimed both in Japan

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<v Speaker 2>and by filmmakers around the world. I've seen the likes

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<v Speaker 2>of Tarantino, Paul Schraeder and others talk about how much

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<v Speaker 2>they admire his work. All right now, in terms of

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<v Speaker 2>the writing here, they'll basically be like three levels because

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<v Speaker 2>the original source for this is a novel by Rampo

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<v Speaker 2>ed Ogawa, who lived eighteen ninety four through nineteen sixty five.

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<v Speaker 2>This was the pen name of Japanese author Tero Hirari.

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<v Speaker 2>Crafted this pen name Rampo ed Ogawa was apparently crafted

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<v Speaker 2>to resemble Edgar Allan Poe or PO. Edgar Allan So

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<v Speaker 2>PO Edgar Allan Rampo ed Ogawa So and Edgar Allan Poe,

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<v Speaker 2>along with Arthur Conan Doyle and others, were our big

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<v Speaker 2>influence on Rampo's work. I have to admit I was

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<v Speaker 2>really not familiar with Rampo prior to this. I don't

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<v Speaker 2>know if you'd ever run across discussion of his work before.

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<v Speaker 3>Joe, possibly, but not that I recall.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, Yeah, apparently a huge name in the world of

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<v Speaker 2>Japanese mystery, detective and horror fiction, known for such works

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<v Speaker 2>as The Boy Detective's Club, The Fiend with Twenty Faces,

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<v Speaker 2>and of course The Black Lizard had His many short

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<v Speaker 2>stories include The Caterpillar and The Human Chair. Film and

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<v Speaker 2>TV adaptations of his work go back as far as

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<v Speaker 2>I believe nineteen twenty seven, and while he did write

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<v Speaker 2>I think just one screenplay, pretty much all of the

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<v Speaker 2>cinematic and TV treatments of his work were adapted by

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<v Speaker 2>other writers in the adaptations I've continued in film and

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<v Speaker 2>TV and manga and anime. Some of the more famous

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<v Speaker 2>adaptations and cclued nineteen sixty nine's Blind Beast and Horrors

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<v Speaker 2>of Malformed Men. So some of these are titles I'm

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<v Speaker 2>familiar with, but I didn't really know much about the

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<v Speaker 2>Rampo connection. And then twenty tens Caterpillar, and it's previously

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<v Speaker 2>mentioned Black Lizard was adapted numerous times as a play,

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<v Speaker 2>and then two separate adaptations of that play, the nineteen

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<v Speaker 2>sixty two film and this nineteen sixty eight one.

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<v Speaker 3>Okay, so that's the original novel. But there's another intermediary

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<v Speaker 3>literary source, which is the play which is eventually adapted

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<v Speaker 3>into the movie.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, and the play here was adapted by another rather

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<v Speaker 2>famous figure in Japanese culture. This is Yukio Mishima, who

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<v Speaker 2>lived nineteen twenty five through nineteen seventy. So he wrote

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<v Speaker 2>the stage adaptation upon which this is based. And there's

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<v Speaker 2>a lot potentially unpacked here with Yukyo Mashima. You could

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<v Speaker 2>do a whole podcast just on this guy. He's ultimately

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<v Speaker 2>a very controversial figure. Mishima was a Japanese author, poet, playwright, actor,

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<v Speaker 2>and model. Is a highly successful writer said to affused

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<v Speaker 2>modern Western trends with traditional Japanese elements. With a general

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<v Speaker 2>focus on beauty, eroticism, and death. In his private life

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<v Speaker 2>and revealed in some of his writings, he was apparently

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<v Speaker 2>bisexual and often dealt with themes of same sex love.

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<v Speaker 2>He was also a shintost and an ultra right wing

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<v Speaker 2>nationalist who founded a militia known as the Shield Society,

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<v Speaker 2>and on November twenty fifth, nineteen seventy, this, of course,

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<v Speaker 2>is the year of his death, he essentially attempted a

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<v Speaker 2>coup with four members of the militia invading a Japanese

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<v Speaker 2>military base, taking the commandant hostage, and trying to encourage

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<v Speaker 2>the Japanese Self Defense Forces to overthrow the government and

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<v Speaker 2>restore her like the full rule of the Emperor. In

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<v Speaker 2>this attempt culminated in Mishima's own death VI. A Sepaka

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<v Speaker 2>and Yeah Again. He's remained a very controversial figure because

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<v Speaker 2>of all of this, though on the other hand, there's

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<v Speaker 2>always been a lot of interest in him in his

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<v Speaker 2>work in and out of Japan. American director Paul Schrader,

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<v Speaker 2>for example, directed a biopic in nineteen eighty five titled Mishima,

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<v Speaker 2>A Life in Four Chapters, starring ken Ogata in the

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<v Speaker 2>lead role. We were actually chatting about this with our

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<v Speaker 2>excellent producer JJ Possway off Mike before we went in here,

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<v Speaker 2>because I don't think either of us have seen this

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<v Speaker 2>particular Paul Schrader film, but JJ has and said that

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<v Speaker 2>it's really worth saying. It's quite excellent.

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<v Speaker 3>Now, if I'm not mistaken, Mishima appears bodily in Black

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<v Speaker 3>Lizard as well, doesn't he.

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<v Speaker 2>That's right. Yeah, Mishima himself was, in addition to all

0:13:46.800 --> 0:13:48.840
<v Speaker 2>these other things, he was an actor and a model.

0:13:49.080 --> 0:13:52.440
<v Speaker 2>He was a noted bodybuilder and act. Yeah, has a

0:13:52.559 --> 0:13:55.600
<v Speaker 2>very memorable non speaking role in this film. I mean,

0:13:55.640 --> 0:13:57.040
<v Speaker 2>you could say it's a cameo, but I don't know

0:13:57.040 --> 0:13:59.720
<v Speaker 2>when a cameo has like this much weight. I don't

0:13:59.720 --> 0:14:01.080
<v Speaker 2>want to dismissed it as such.

0:14:01.520 --> 0:14:04.320
<v Speaker 3>He's the So there is a sequence later in the

0:14:04.360 --> 0:14:09.320
<v Speaker 3>movie with these frozen human figures. They're sort of described,

0:14:09.320 --> 0:14:12.560
<v Speaker 3>I think as stuffed bodies, though there's a something almost

0:14:12.880 --> 0:14:16.920
<v Speaker 3>supernatural implied about the way that they're frozen, because they're

0:14:17.000 --> 0:14:19.920
<v Speaker 3>clearly just they're not mannequins, they're human bodies, and their

0:14:20.000 --> 0:14:22.520
<v Speaker 3>human bodies just kind of like trembling. You can see

0:14:22.560 --> 0:14:25.560
<v Speaker 3>them moving a little bit and he's one of them, right,

0:14:25.680 --> 0:14:27.560
<v Speaker 3>He's the one who's like in the middle of a

0:14:27.600 --> 0:14:29.000
<v Speaker 3>knife fight with another guy.

0:14:29.400 --> 0:14:32.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, it's I mean, it's it's the classic, like

0:14:32.760 --> 0:14:36.560
<v Speaker 2>you know, wax museum effect of having people being really

0:14:36.600 --> 0:14:39.760
<v Speaker 2>still pretending to be models or some sort of preservation

0:14:39.880 --> 0:14:43.200
<v Speaker 2>of formerly living humans. So it does have that inherent

0:14:43.280 --> 0:14:46.600
<v Speaker 2>creepiness that we often touch on. But yeah, this is him.

0:14:46.880 --> 0:14:49.160
<v Speaker 2>It's a very pivotal scene as well. We'll get to.

0:14:49.440 --> 0:14:53.840
<v Speaker 2>It's also notable in that, yeah, this can't be relegated

0:14:53.880 --> 0:14:56.320
<v Speaker 2>as a cameo because a lot of times the poster

0:14:56.480 --> 0:15:01.520
<v Speaker 2>art has Mashima on the poster alongside the star, which

0:15:01.600 --> 0:15:04.840
<v Speaker 2>generally you don't do with your cameo appearances. Like the

0:15:05.240 --> 0:15:08.800
<v Speaker 2>detective Acecchi, who is in many respects the protagonist of

0:15:08.840 --> 0:15:11.200
<v Speaker 2>the picture, is not on the poster or not on

0:15:11.240 --> 0:15:14.520
<v Speaker 2>many of the posters that I was looking at, So yeah,

0:15:14.600 --> 0:15:18.680
<v Speaker 2>worth keeping in mind. As for Mishima, he has at

0:15:18.760 --> 0:15:22.280
<v Speaker 2>least some other acting credits, including the nineteen sixty yakuza

0:15:22.280 --> 0:15:25.440
<v Speaker 2>film Afraid to Die, in which he starred, and nineteen

0:15:25.480 --> 0:15:29.720
<v Speaker 2>sixty six's Patriotism, which he also wrote and co directed.

0:15:30.160 --> 0:15:33.280
<v Speaker 2>All Right, and then the screenplay based on the play

0:15:33.320 --> 0:15:39.920
<v Speaker 2>based on the novel. The credit here is Masashigi Narusawa,

0:15:40.200 --> 0:15:42.880
<v Speaker 2>who lived nineteen twenty five through twenty twenty one. An

0:15:42.920 --> 0:15:46.920
<v Speaker 2>award winning screenwriter and director. His films include nineteen fifty

0:15:46.920 --> 0:15:49.600
<v Speaker 2>six as Street of Shame, sixty eight's Curse of the Blood.

0:15:49.720 --> 0:15:52.320
<v Speaker 2>He was active from nineteen fifty through seventy five, with

0:15:52.400 --> 0:15:55.560
<v Speaker 2>a final Rampo adaptation airing on TV in nineteen eighty.

0:15:56.000 --> 0:15:59.520
<v Speaker 2>All right, so that's the director, that's the folks involved

0:15:59.520 --> 0:16:03.360
<v Speaker 2>in the writing of the picture. But now we have

0:16:03.440 --> 0:16:06.600
<v Speaker 2>to talk about are the true star of this and

0:16:06.680 --> 0:16:11.320
<v Speaker 2>that is Akihiro Miwa playing Black Lizard. This is just

0:16:11.360 --> 0:16:14.080
<v Speaker 2>a fabulous performance. This is one of those performances where

0:16:14.360 --> 0:16:17.440
<v Speaker 2>Miwa is almost constantly on the screen and is it

0:16:17.480 --> 0:16:19.680
<v Speaker 2>a light whenever he is on screen?

0:16:20.040 --> 0:16:22.400
<v Speaker 3>I agree Miwa makes this movie what it is.

0:16:22.920 --> 0:16:26.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. So, Miwa was born in nineteen thirty five and

0:16:27.000 --> 0:16:31.960
<v Speaker 2>as of this recording is still alive, and it's it's

0:16:32.040 --> 0:16:35.640
<v Speaker 2>essential to note that here in this starring role as

0:16:35.720 --> 0:16:39.480
<v Speaker 2>Black Lizard, the title character, the master criminal, we have

0:16:40.160 --> 0:16:43.320
<v Speaker 2>one of, if not the most famous Japanese drag performers

0:16:43.320 --> 0:16:45.920
<v Speaker 2>of the fifties and sixties, if not of all time.

0:16:47.120 --> 0:16:50.040
<v Speaker 2>Drag culture does still seem to be going strong in Japan.

0:16:50.880 --> 0:16:54.360
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, I'm assuming the only Western comparison would be

0:16:54.560 --> 0:16:56.520
<v Speaker 2>like someone like Rue Paul, Like this would be like

0:16:56.560 --> 0:17:00.440
<v Speaker 2>having Rue Paul appear as the title character or super

0:17:00.440 --> 0:17:03.440
<v Speaker 2>criminal picture. Maybe there's a better comparison to be made

0:17:03.840 --> 0:17:07.240
<v Speaker 2>right in if you've got one. Anyway. MIA's cabaret career

0:17:07.320 --> 0:17:09.440
<v Speaker 2>goes back to I Believe nineteen fifty two, and he

0:17:09.520 --> 0:17:14.840
<v Speaker 2>rose to popularity, transcending eventually from stage to film, TV,

0:17:15.560 --> 0:17:19.679
<v Speaker 2>music writing, and directing. He put out five albums between

0:17:19.800 --> 0:17:23.600
<v Speaker 2>nineteen seventy three and nineteen ninety five, all centered around

0:17:23.600 --> 0:17:27.359
<v Speaker 2>as drag persona. He also became an outspoken voice on

0:17:27.440 --> 0:17:30.919
<v Speaker 2>political and social issues in Japan, and he worked his

0:17:31.000 --> 0:17:35.160
<v Speaker 2>way up to this glorious leading role through often smaller

0:17:35.160 --> 0:17:38.320
<v Speaker 2>appearances sometimes it's like a singer or background character, and

0:17:38.440 --> 0:17:41.399
<v Speaker 2>number of films, and then followed this one up with

0:17:41.520 --> 0:17:45.480
<v Speaker 2>nineteen sixty nine's Black Rose or Black Rose Mansion, which

0:17:45.560 --> 0:17:49.520
<v Speaker 2>was also directed by Fukusaku. I haven't seen it, but

0:17:49.520 --> 0:17:54.560
<v Speaker 2>it's apparently classified as kind of like a dark romantic drama. Now.

0:17:54.560 --> 0:17:58.120
<v Speaker 2>While there's some additional live action roles after this Mea

0:17:58.200 --> 0:18:03.439
<v Speaker 2>was biggest contributions moving forward after this point are mostly

0:18:03.560 --> 0:18:07.199
<v Speaker 2>voice roles in animated projects, but boy did they include

0:18:07.240 --> 0:18:10.600
<v Speaker 2>some big ones. He voiced the three hundred year old

0:18:10.600 --> 0:18:15.280
<v Speaker 2>wolf goddess Moro Nokimi in Miyazaki's nineteen ninety seven masterpiece

0:18:15.320 --> 0:18:20.320
<v Speaker 2>Princess Mononoki. If you've only seen the dubbed version, this

0:18:20.359 --> 0:18:23.320
<v Speaker 2>would be the character that Gillian Anderson dubs. You know,

0:18:23.359 --> 0:18:27.320
<v Speaker 2>this big wolf goddess creature. He also voices the Witch

0:18:27.359 --> 0:18:30.080
<v Speaker 2>of the Waste in Miyazaki's two thousand and four film

0:18:30.119 --> 0:18:33.480
<v Speaker 2>Howell's Moving Castle, and for you Pokemon fans out there,

0:18:33.560 --> 0:18:37.160
<v Speaker 2>he also voiced a Pokemon by the name of Okay,

0:18:37.160 --> 0:18:40.879
<v Speaker 2>I'm not sure on this one, Arsius or Archias. I

0:18:40.920 --> 0:18:43.040
<v Speaker 2>asked my son about this real quick, and he was like,

0:18:43.119 --> 0:18:46.600
<v Speaker 2>people might get mad at you. But he was like,

0:18:46.640 --> 0:18:48.920
<v Speaker 2>they may say Archias or may they may say Arsius,

0:18:49.240 --> 0:18:51.760
<v Speaker 2>but be prepared to be corrected. So okay, I am prepared.

0:18:51.880 --> 0:18:54.480
<v Speaker 2>But anyway, this is like an important Pokemon like the

0:18:54.520 --> 0:18:57.919
<v Speaker 2>title Pokemon and the two thousand and nine TV movie

0:18:58.400 --> 0:18:59.960
<v Speaker 2>Arsius and the Jewel of Life.

0:19:00.280 --> 0:19:02.159
<v Speaker 3>If people are going to be mad at us. I

0:19:02.160 --> 0:19:03.320
<v Speaker 3>hope it's about Pokemon.

0:19:03.960 --> 0:19:06.600
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I'm always happy to be corrected.

0:19:07.280 --> 0:19:09.879
<v Speaker 3>But to come back to Black Lizard, Akihiro Miwa is

0:19:10.000 --> 0:19:13.800
<v Speaker 3>phenomenal in this movie, so much like passion and charisma

0:19:13.880 --> 0:19:15.480
<v Speaker 3>in this performance.

0:19:15.280 --> 0:19:20.080
<v Speaker 2>Absolutely every scene, and also so many costume and hair changes.

0:19:20.920 --> 0:19:23.720
<v Speaker 2>This is definitely one of those pictures where we will

0:19:23.720 --> 0:19:26.880
<v Speaker 2>call out the costume designer because you know, any new

0:19:26.920 --> 0:19:29.600
<v Speaker 2>scene with Black Lizard, you're gonna get a new costume.

0:19:29.680 --> 0:19:33.200
<v Speaker 2>You make it an entirely different hair going on as well.

0:19:33.240 --> 0:19:33.680
<v Speaker 2>It's great.

0:19:33.880 --> 0:19:37.040
<v Speaker 3>It's also a surprise for like a crime thriller, it

0:19:37.080 --> 0:19:40.920
<v Speaker 3>is a surprisingly dialogue heavy film, and I think that

0:19:41.000 --> 0:19:43.359
<v Speaker 3>may be based on the fact that it was This

0:19:43.480 --> 0:19:47.400
<v Speaker 3>is adapted from a stage play, so there are fewer

0:19:47.640 --> 0:19:50.560
<v Speaker 3>just straight action scenes than you might imagine. A lot

0:19:50.600 --> 0:19:53.880
<v Speaker 3>of it's just sort of dialogue and and and there

0:19:53.960 --> 0:19:55.640
<v Speaker 3>is There are a lot of thrills, but a lot

0:19:55.640 --> 0:19:59.600
<v Speaker 3>of the thrills are like twists that are revealed through dialogue.

0:20:00.200 --> 0:20:02.280
<v Speaker 2>Right, Yeah, so it's talkier than you might expect, but

0:20:02.359 --> 0:20:06.600
<v Speaker 2>luckily the dialogue is often just tremendous. We already quoted

0:20:06.680 --> 0:20:08.480
<v Speaker 2>a little of it, and you know, it often has

0:20:08.520 --> 0:20:12.399
<v Speaker 2>that flavor, that weird character to it, and yeah, and

0:20:12.440 --> 0:20:18.200
<v Speaker 2>when we do have punctuations of actual action, it generally

0:20:18.240 --> 0:20:21.280
<v Speaker 2>is also really weird and jaw dropping. All right, now,

0:20:21.359 --> 0:20:24.320
<v Speaker 2>it's important to talk about the Ace detective. This is

0:20:24.359 --> 0:20:28.280
<v Speaker 2>Detective Akechi, played by Issau Kimura who lived nineteen twenty

0:20:28.280 --> 0:20:31.560
<v Speaker 2>three through nineteen eighty one. The interesting thing here is that, yeah,

0:20:31.600 --> 0:20:35.680
<v Speaker 2>Detective Akechi is in many respects the actual protagonist of

0:20:35.720 --> 0:20:40.240
<v Speaker 2>the film and is essentially Rampos Sherlock Holmes character, appearing

0:20:40.280 --> 0:20:45.160
<v Speaker 2>in multiple novels and short stories. So while many viewers

0:20:45.240 --> 0:20:47.240
<v Speaker 2>may watch this and you just see the sort of

0:20:47.680 --> 0:20:51.000
<v Speaker 2>you know, typical noir detective character, you know, a little

0:20:51.000 --> 0:20:54.160
<v Speaker 2>bit tortured, a little bit jaded, smoking and drinking, trying

0:20:54.160 --> 0:20:56.040
<v Speaker 2>to solve the crime, maybe falling a little bit in

0:20:56.080 --> 0:21:00.560
<v Speaker 2>love here and there. So while many viewers I just

0:21:00.600 --> 0:21:05.520
<v Speaker 2>dismissed that this character is like the detective figure in

0:21:05.600 --> 0:21:08.560
<v Speaker 2>Japanese pop culture and was in fact the first recurring

0:21:08.560 --> 0:21:11.920
<v Speaker 2>detective character in Japanese fiction. So he's a big deal

0:21:12.240 --> 0:21:15.280
<v Speaker 2>and has been played by numerous actors over the years,

0:21:15.560 --> 0:21:19.399
<v Speaker 2>including Tadanobu Asano, who have played of course, is the

0:21:19.440 --> 0:21:22.240
<v Speaker 2>star of Ichi the Killer, and also had a really

0:21:22.240 --> 0:21:26.480
<v Speaker 2>great role in the recent FX adaptation of Showgun. He

0:21:27.040 --> 0:21:29.720
<v Speaker 2>was in two thousand and five's Rampo Noir.

0:21:31.160 --> 0:21:34.639
<v Speaker 3>So a catchy we are told is Japan's number one detective.

0:21:35.400 --> 0:21:38.040
<v Speaker 3>But he also, I don't know. It makes a lot

0:21:38.080 --> 0:21:40.600
<v Speaker 3>more sense to me knowing that this is a recurring character,

0:21:40.680 --> 0:21:43.520
<v Speaker 3>because there's a sort of prologue in the film that's

0:21:43.520 --> 0:21:46.720
<v Speaker 3>almost like, well here I am, I'm in the club,

0:21:46.760 --> 0:21:50.920
<v Speaker 3>now sucked into this crime, And it makes more sense

0:21:50.960 --> 0:21:53.320
<v Speaker 3>if this is kind of a character we would recognize.

0:21:53.720 --> 0:21:55.359
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and in a way, it kind of gives you

0:21:55.440 --> 0:22:00.760
<v Speaker 2>more license to let that character become secondary. He does

0:22:00.840 --> 0:22:04.080
<v Speaker 2>have this like iconic place already, you know, in the

0:22:04.119 --> 0:22:06.000
<v Speaker 2>same way that you can have a Sherlock Holmes film

0:22:06.359 --> 0:22:10.320
<v Speaker 2>certainly these days, and allow secondary characters to sort of

0:22:10.320 --> 0:22:11.159
<v Speaker 2>take the forefront.

0:22:11.560 --> 0:22:13.320
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, totally. So.

0:22:13.440 --> 0:22:16.960
<v Speaker 2>Anyway, Kamu right here playing the role, frequently worked in

0:22:16.960 --> 0:22:20.119
<v Speaker 2>supporting roles in Akira Kurosawa films, including fifty four to

0:22:20.119 --> 0:22:23.600
<v Speaker 2>seven Samurai and fifty seven's Throne of Blood. Yeah, I

0:22:23.600 --> 0:22:26.280
<v Speaker 2>think his performance here certainly hits all the world. Weary

0:22:26.440 --> 0:22:30.159
<v Speaker 2>noir detective notes that you'd expect, and I suppose this

0:22:30.840 --> 0:22:33.720
<v Speaker 2>in many ways. This helps like ground the flashier elements

0:22:33.720 --> 0:22:35.919
<v Speaker 2>of the picture as well. But he's good. It's a

0:22:35.920 --> 0:22:39.399
<v Speaker 2>good performance. Yeah, all right, this is all going to picture,

0:22:39.520 --> 0:22:41.560
<v Speaker 2>This is all going to center around in many respects,

0:22:41.560 --> 0:22:47.320
<v Speaker 2>a damsel in frequent distress, a youngerly, a young woman

0:22:47.400 --> 0:22:52.840
<v Speaker 2>that Black Lizard tries to kidnap multiple times. Her name

0:22:52.920 --> 0:22:58.359
<v Speaker 2>is Sane, and she is played by Kiko Matsuka, and

0:22:58.520 --> 0:23:00.480
<v Speaker 2>she was born in nineteen forty seven, and she was

0:23:00.520 --> 0:23:02.919
<v Speaker 2>in a number of sixties and seventies films, including an

0:23:03.000 --> 0:23:06.560
<v Speaker 2>uncredited role as a diver girl in nineteen sixty seven's

0:23:06.800 --> 0:23:10.000
<v Speaker 2>Bond film You Only Live Twice. Her other credits include

0:23:10.040 --> 0:23:13.159
<v Speaker 2>nineteen sixty eight's The Living Skeleton, Black Rose Mansion, and

0:23:13.200 --> 0:23:16.560
<v Speaker 2>a Rampo TV series in nineteen seventy all right. Another

0:23:16.920 --> 0:23:23.679
<v Speaker 2>important secondary character is the is the despondent musician Yunichi Amamiya,

0:23:23.880 --> 0:23:27.280
<v Speaker 2>played by Yusuku Kuwazu, who lived nineteen thirty five through

0:23:27.320 --> 0:23:30.480
<v Speaker 2>twenty twenty two. This apparently is his best known role,

0:23:30.560 --> 0:23:33.760
<v Speaker 2>but his credits include nineteen sixty one's Killers on Parade,

0:23:34.040 --> 0:23:37.080
<v Speaker 2>nineteen ninety three's Godzilla, versus Mega Godzilla two and nineteen

0:23:37.119 --> 0:23:39.760
<v Speaker 2>eighty eight, nineteen ninety eight s Gamma A three Revenge

0:23:40.000 --> 0:23:43.720
<v Speaker 2>of Iris. So, I mean, it's a solid performance this

0:23:43.840 --> 0:23:46.800
<v Speaker 2>this tragic character in this film. But also props to

0:23:46.800 --> 0:23:49.199
<v Speaker 2>anyone who was ever in both a Godzilla and a

0:23:49.240 --> 0:23:50.040
<v Speaker 2>Gamera movie.

0:23:50.840 --> 0:23:57.240
<v Speaker 3>That's right. Yeah, this is a very sad, pathetic, abject

0:23:57.359 --> 0:23:59.080
<v Speaker 3>role and this guy does well with it.

0:23:59.400 --> 0:24:02.720
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Yeah, as we'll discuss, like even when he has

0:24:02.720 --> 0:24:06.760
<v Speaker 2>his moments of seeming bravery like, there's still this wrinkle

0:24:06.800 --> 0:24:09.080
<v Speaker 2>to them that makes it even more tragic.

0:24:09.440 --> 0:24:13.119
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, it's all revealed that it's just the ultimately even

0:24:13.160 --> 0:24:14.680
<v Speaker 3>more pathetic than you would have thought.

0:24:14.920 --> 0:24:19.359
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, let's see. Another fun secondary character is Private Detective

0:24:19.640 --> 0:24:23.000
<v Speaker 2>Keniji Matoba, who I guess is like he's not the

0:24:23.080 --> 0:24:25.719
<v Speaker 2>number one detective Aketchi is the number one detective. This

0:24:25.760 --> 0:24:30.000
<v Speaker 2>is somebody further down the list that has no problem

0:24:30.080 --> 0:24:32.480
<v Speaker 2>with at all with the possibility of making a fool

0:24:32.520 --> 0:24:34.199
<v Speaker 2>out of a catchee or you know, or coming in

0:24:34.200 --> 0:24:35.680
<v Speaker 2>to clean up a catchy's mess.

0:24:36.160 --> 0:24:39.280
<v Speaker 3>You can just see this guy's displeasure with the full

0:24:39.359 --> 0:24:41.720
<v Speaker 3>knowledge that he is the number four detective.

0:24:42.000 --> 0:24:45.879
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, he is played. Yeah, so He's a rival stern

0:24:45.920 --> 0:24:51.159
<v Speaker 2>faced private detective, played here by award winning actor co Nishimura,

0:24:51.240 --> 0:24:54.920
<v Speaker 2>who lived nineteen twenty three through nineteen ninety seven, best

0:24:55.000 --> 0:24:57.639
<v Speaker 2>known for his roles in such Krosawa films as nineteen

0:24:57.680 --> 0:25:01.960
<v Speaker 2>sixty is The Bad, Sleep Well ones Yo Jimbo, nineteen

0:25:01.960 --> 0:25:04.000
<v Speaker 2>sixty three is High and Low. And he was also

0:25:04.240 --> 0:25:07.400
<v Speaker 2>greatly praised and awarded for his starring role in the

0:25:07.560 --> 0:25:11.399
<v Speaker 2>bear movie Matagi from nineteen eighty two. So he was

0:25:11.440 --> 0:25:15.760
<v Speaker 2>definitely the star of Matagi in eighty two. But yeah,

0:25:15.840 --> 0:25:19.200
<v Speaker 2>as for these Kirosawa films, several, some of which I

0:25:19.240 --> 0:25:21.080
<v Speaker 2>haven't seen and others I haven't seen in a long time.

0:25:21.720 --> 0:25:23.560
<v Speaker 2>I'm not sure exactly off the top of my head

0:25:23.600 --> 0:25:27.520
<v Speaker 2>how far up the cast he is in those, but

0:25:27.680 --> 0:25:29.760
<v Speaker 2>I love his performance series kind of like a Japanese

0:25:29.800 --> 0:25:30.560
<v Speaker 2>Christopher Lee.

0:25:30.800 --> 0:25:33.639
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, he's very very stern.

0:25:34.200 --> 0:25:39.800
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Okay, Sanya's dad is also important. Iwasa played by

0:25:40.200 --> 0:25:43.320
<v Speaker 2>yun Usami who lived nineteen eleven through nineteen eighty one.

0:25:43.560 --> 0:25:46.280
<v Speaker 2>His credits include nineteen seventies Tori Toar Tora in nineteen

0:25:46.320 --> 0:25:48.320
<v Speaker 2>fifty eight, The Man in the Moonlight Mask.

0:25:48.720 --> 0:25:51.040
<v Speaker 3>This is sort of our rich Mark. The guy who

0:25:51.160 --> 0:25:55.240
<v Speaker 3>is targeted by Black Lizard for both the kidnapping of

0:25:55.280 --> 0:25:57.800
<v Speaker 3>his daughter and the stealing of his precious jewels.

0:25:58.000 --> 0:26:00.320
<v Speaker 2>Right, and you know, he's rather proud about the fact

0:26:00.359 --> 0:26:04.240
<v Speaker 2>that he can afford Japan's number one detective. So it's

0:26:04.240 --> 0:26:06.679
<v Speaker 2>a fun, fun role. But he's also like, you know,

0:26:06.760 --> 0:26:09.080
<v Speaker 2>you're of course you're gonna get taken advantage off by

0:26:09.080 --> 0:26:09.840
<v Speaker 2>super criminals.

0:26:10.040 --> 0:26:14.280
<v Speaker 3>He also complains immediately about the cost of Japan's number

0:26:14.320 --> 0:26:18.040
<v Speaker 3>one detective when his daughter is discovered to have been kidnapped. Yeah, like,

0:26:18.440 --> 0:26:20.520
<v Speaker 3>throw back the blankets on the bed and it's like, oh,

0:26:20.600 --> 0:26:22.800
<v Speaker 3>it's just a mannequin in there. He's like, you know

0:26:22.840 --> 0:26:24.680
<v Speaker 3>how much money I paid you to protect her?

0:26:25.480 --> 0:26:29.119
<v Speaker 2>Yep, yep. We also already alluded to the snake woman

0:26:29.160 --> 0:26:31.760
<v Speaker 2>with the yellow demon eyes. We'll come back to her,

0:26:32.160 --> 0:26:35.399
<v Speaker 2>just not a lot about her, but just to credit

0:26:35.400 --> 0:26:38.920
<v Speaker 2>the actor. This is Toshiko Koboyashi, who lived nineteen thirty

0:26:38.920 --> 0:26:50.920
<v Speaker 2>two through twenty sixteen. Oh okay, so we recently received

0:26:51.359 --> 0:26:53.680
<v Speaker 2>a listener mail from someone saying, hey, you guys need

0:26:53.680 --> 0:26:57.080
<v Speaker 2>to single out the costume folks, the costume designers more well,

0:26:57.119 --> 0:26:59.240
<v Speaker 2>this is certainly a movie to do it on. We

0:26:59.280 --> 0:27:02.720
<v Speaker 2>have so many great costumes, especially for Black Lizard, and

0:27:03.280 --> 0:27:08.280
<v Speaker 2>the costume designer on this was Masako Watanabi. She's worth

0:27:08.280 --> 0:27:11.720
<v Speaker 2>singling out in part because, again, the costumes here are amazing,

0:27:11.880 --> 0:27:15.479
<v Speaker 2>but she's also a notable manga comic writer and artist,

0:27:15.960 --> 0:27:18.480
<v Speaker 2>known for such titles that I'm not familiar with as

0:27:18.640 --> 0:27:24.160
<v Speaker 2>Master of Morley, Jack, Ryerdon's Baby and Heidi. So if

0:27:24.200 --> 0:27:27.080
<v Speaker 2>you know more about about her and her work, write

0:27:27.080 --> 0:27:30.840
<v Speaker 2>in and we'll get the full details from you, all right.

0:27:30.880 --> 0:27:33.760
<v Speaker 2>And then finally the music. Oh, we have another huge

0:27:33.840 --> 0:27:36.119
<v Speaker 2>name here. This is a guy with a number of

0:27:36.200 --> 0:27:39.159
<v Speaker 2>credits in Japan film wise, but in general though just

0:27:39.600 --> 0:27:44.440
<v Speaker 2>a musical icon. Isautomita, who lived nineteen thirty two through

0:27:44.440 --> 0:27:47.040
<v Speaker 2>twenty sixteen. This is a name that I think is

0:27:47.080 --> 0:27:49.040
<v Speaker 2>going to register with a number of you. Not so

0:27:49.160 --> 0:27:53.600
<v Speaker 2>much for film though he does have associations with various films,

0:27:53.640 --> 0:27:57.200
<v Speaker 2>But this is this guy was one of the pioneers

0:27:57.200 --> 0:28:00.639
<v Speaker 2>of electronic music and space music, both in Pan and

0:28:00.720 --> 0:28:07.120
<v Speaker 2>ultimately internationally as well. His work prior to this film

0:28:07.160 --> 0:28:09.600
<v Speaker 2>included the TV series Mighty Jack, which I believe was

0:28:09.600 --> 0:28:12.480
<v Speaker 2>featured on Mystery Science Theater three thousand. But yeah, the

0:28:12.520 --> 0:28:15.320
<v Speaker 2>interesting thing is that around the same time of this

0:28:15.440 --> 0:28:20.720
<v Speaker 2>picture is when and again the score for this movie

0:28:20.840 --> 0:28:23.879
<v Speaker 2>for Black Lizard is not particularly I don't think it's electronic.

0:28:23.880 --> 0:28:27.360
<v Speaker 2>I think it's very traditional when you say but around

0:28:27.359 --> 0:28:30.080
<v Speaker 2>the same time as he would have been working on

0:28:30.080 --> 0:28:33.600
<v Speaker 2>this film, he heard Wendy Carlos's nineteen sixty eight album

0:28:33.720 --> 0:28:37.760
<v Speaker 2>Switched on Boch for the first time and was reportedly enraptured.

0:28:38.280 --> 0:28:40.440
<v Speaker 2>I heard. I read one account which I said, like, basically,

0:28:40.480 --> 0:28:42.520
<v Speaker 2>he's like, give me a ticket to New York and

0:28:43.040 --> 0:28:45.720
<v Speaker 2>like flies to the United States just so he can

0:28:45.760 --> 0:28:49.960
<v Speaker 2>bring back a mug synthesizer. He's like, I've got to

0:28:50.000 --> 0:28:51.560
<v Speaker 2>get my hands on this. Like he just saw the

0:28:51.600 --> 0:28:57.080
<v Speaker 2>tremendous potential and then started experimenting with synths and goes

0:28:57.120 --> 0:29:00.680
<v Speaker 2>on to again have become this pioneer of electronic and music,

0:29:00.760 --> 0:29:04.320
<v Speaker 2>known for such works as nineteen seventy two is Electric

0:29:04.400 --> 0:29:07.040
<v Speaker 2>Samurai Switched On Rock, which I think was released in

0:29:07.040 --> 0:29:10.360
<v Speaker 2>the US, and seventy four nineteen seventy six is the Planets,

0:29:10.400 --> 0:29:12.880
<v Speaker 2>which I was listening to while finishing up my notes

0:29:12.960 --> 0:29:13.520
<v Speaker 2>here is.

0:29:13.480 --> 0:29:16.240
<v Speaker 3>That an electronic adaptation of Holst's the Planets.

0:29:17.400 --> 0:29:20.080
<v Speaker 2>You know, I'm not sure. I listened to the whole thing,

0:29:20.120 --> 0:29:22.080
<v Speaker 2>and I'm not sure of him. They didn't have Holes

0:29:23.360 --> 0:29:26.600
<v Speaker 2>credited on the tracks on Spotify, which may mean nothing,

0:29:27.240 --> 0:29:31.560
<v Speaker 2>but a number of his works are synth treatments, electronic

0:29:31.640 --> 0:29:34.360
<v Speaker 2>treatments of pre existing works, like I know he did

0:29:34.680 --> 0:29:39.479
<v Speaker 2>a version of John Williams Star Wars theme song for example. Anyway,

0:29:39.760 --> 0:29:41.960
<v Speaker 2>he's an international legend. You'll find loads of his work

0:29:42.000 --> 0:29:44.840
<v Speaker 2>wherever you get your music. Again, I don't think we

0:29:44.880 --> 0:29:48.000
<v Speaker 2>really hear any electronic stylings in The Black Lizard's score,

0:29:48.160 --> 0:29:51.680
<v Speaker 2>as I think he flied to acquire his first synth

0:29:51.680 --> 0:29:54.680
<v Speaker 2>in around seventy two. But still, it's an amazing connection,

0:29:54.800 --> 0:29:57.920
<v Speaker 2>so we get like pre electronic to me to hear

0:29:58.640 --> 0:30:00.560
<v Speaker 2>he'd go on to score such films. Two thousand and

0:30:00.600 --> 0:30:02.840
<v Speaker 2>four is The Hidden Blade, and I've read he was

0:30:02.840 --> 0:30:06.680
<v Speaker 2>apparently Ridley Scott's first pick to score Alien. Would that

0:30:06.680 --> 0:30:09.200
<v Speaker 2>have worked? I don't know, but it's an interesting connection.

0:30:09.640 --> 0:30:11.479
<v Speaker 3>Okay, is it time just talk about the plot.

0:30:11.720 --> 0:30:12.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, let's jump into it.

0:30:13.080 --> 0:30:16.440
<v Speaker 3>Well, warning, this plot has twists and reveals a plenty,

0:30:16.520 --> 0:30:18.880
<v Speaker 3>so if you do want to experience the movie without

0:30:18.880 --> 0:30:21.760
<v Speaker 3>having anything spoiled. I guess you should pause here and

0:30:21.800 --> 0:30:23.680
<v Speaker 3>go watch it before you listen to this part of

0:30:23.680 --> 0:30:26.959
<v Speaker 3>the episode. Now we open with the kind of prologue

0:30:27.000 --> 0:30:30.520
<v Speaker 3>before we get into the main caper that will involve

0:30:30.600 --> 0:30:35.240
<v Speaker 3>most of the movie. There's like a hippie technicolor acid

0:30:35.280 --> 0:30:39.120
<v Speaker 3>freak out sex party opening. It's like a go go club.

0:30:39.160 --> 0:30:42.520
<v Speaker 3>We've seen this in movies from the sixties before. They

0:30:42.880 --> 0:30:44.680
<v Speaker 3>try to put you right in the middle of a

0:30:44.880 --> 0:30:47.720
<v Speaker 3>swinging happening go go club to like get your mind

0:30:47.800 --> 0:30:50.600
<v Speaker 3>right where it needs to be for the feeling of

0:30:50.640 --> 0:30:51.440
<v Speaker 3>the movie.

0:30:51.600 --> 0:30:54.200
<v Speaker 2>And with strong cabaret elements. I think as well, like

0:30:54.320 --> 0:30:58.280
<v Speaker 2>this is where this is where the counterculture happens. This

0:30:58.360 --> 0:31:01.240
<v Speaker 2>is where the bohemi and vibe is strong.

0:31:01.880 --> 0:31:04.600
<v Speaker 3>That's right. So it's a feeling of the sixties, a

0:31:04.600 --> 0:31:08.960
<v Speaker 3>feeling of cultural and sexual energy. But I think also Rob,

0:31:09.000 --> 0:31:10.720
<v Speaker 3>I don't know if you detected the same thing. There's

0:31:10.760 --> 0:31:13.360
<v Speaker 3>kind of a point of view the camera takes that

0:31:13.480 --> 0:31:18.520
<v Speaker 3>implies some kind of distance or hesitation, maybe like it's

0:31:18.880 --> 0:31:21.520
<v Speaker 3>it's celebrating everything that's going on in the club, but

0:31:21.560 --> 0:31:24.480
<v Speaker 3>it's also a little bit afraid. Maybe it's like this

0:31:24.760 --> 0:31:28.080
<v Speaker 3>this is an alluring but also a dangerous and confusing

0:31:28.200 --> 0:31:30.040
<v Speaker 3>frontier of freedom and pleasure.

0:31:30.520 --> 0:31:33.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, as we'll see, there's danger here and there's sadness

0:31:33.360 --> 0:31:33.920
<v Speaker 2>here as well.

0:31:34.320 --> 0:31:36.280
<v Speaker 3>In fact, that sort of point of view of the

0:31:36.280 --> 0:31:38.200
<v Speaker 3>camera maybe the point of view of the character we're

0:31:38.200 --> 0:31:43.520
<v Speaker 3>about to meet, because we go to this man, a

0:31:43.560 --> 0:31:46.680
<v Speaker 3>lonely looking man, sitting at a table overlooking the dance

0:31:46.680 --> 0:31:50.040
<v Speaker 3>floor in this freak out go Go club, and we

0:31:50.120 --> 0:31:53.960
<v Speaker 3>hear his voiceover. He says, I came here by mere chance.

0:31:54.280 --> 0:31:57.040
<v Speaker 3>A friend said he would guide me to a secret club.

0:31:57.520 --> 0:31:57.640
<v Speaker 4>This.

0:31:57.920 --> 0:32:01.440
<v Speaker 3>We never see the friend, by the way, do we Yeah?

0:32:01.560 --> 0:32:04.280
<v Speaker 3>He says, this was a world unknown to me until

0:32:04.400 --> 0:32:08.280
<v Speaker 3>a gaudy crime dragged me into it. And then suddenly

0:32:08.400 --> 0:32:12.480
<v Speaker 3>everything stops. The action freezes and darkness falls over the

0:32:12.480 --> 0:32:15.959
<v Speaker 3>go go club, and then there is somber, humming music,

0:32:16.640 --> 0:32:20.000
<v Speaker 3>and then we see Black Lizard in three forms. First

0:32:20.120 --> 0:32:23.960
<v Speaker 3>the character so we see Akihiro Miwa in jewels with

0:32:24.000 --> 0:32:27.280
<v Speaker 3>a cigarette holder, and then the image of a black

0:32:27.320 --> 0:32:31.440
<v Speaker 3>Lizard silhouette, and then the title Black Lizard. Now I

0:32:31.480 --> 0:32:35.640
<v Speaker 3>warned there would be spoilers. Technically, the character we are

0:32:35.680 --> 0:32:39.480
<v Speaker 3>meeting here is not revealed to be black Lizard the

0:32:39.600 --> 0:32:44.000
<v Speaker 3>titular criminal until a twist that comes later. But I

0:32:44.160 --> 0:32:46.320
<v Speaker 3>was in no suspense at all about this, and I

0:32:46.360 --> 0:32:49.040
<v Speaker 3>wonder if the audience is supposed to be in suspense

0:32:49.080 --> 0:32:51.280
<v Speaker 3>at all. It seems to me one hundred percent clear

0:32:52.000 --> 0:32:55.200
<v Speaker 3>from the very first frame of seeing Black Lizard that

0:32:55.720 --> 0:32:56.800
<v Speaker 3>she is Black Lizard.

0:32:57.080 --> 0:32:59.360
<v Speaker 2>I think so. Like from what I watched the sixty

0:32:59.400 --> 0:33:01.320
<v Speaker 2>two ADAP takes, I felt like it was maybe a

0:33:01.640 --> 0:33:05.360
<v Speaker 2>little less obvious, but here it's clear and been. Part

0:33:05.360 --> 0:33:06.920
<v Speaker 2>of that may be the fact that, Yeah, you have me,

0:33:07.720 --> 0:33:12.680
<v Speaker 2>this famous individual playing this title character, and you know

0:33:13.040 --> 0:33:14.760
<v Speaker 2>there are gonna be several twists in the film that

0:33:14.800 --> 0:33:17.200
<v Speaker 2>I think most viewers will see coming a mile away.

0:33:17.760 --> 0:33:19.840
<v Speaker 2>But it doesn't feel like a limitation. In a film

0:33:19.880 --> 0:33:22.200
<v Speaker 2>like this, A twist may be telegraphed, but what sort

0:33:22.240 --> 0:33:24.040
<v Speaker 2>of feast will the film make of the twist.

0:33:24.560 --> 0:33:28.480
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, so there's a dark, mysterious melody as the credits play.

0:33:28.960 --> 0:33:32.320
<v Speaker 3>I think this may be Black Lizard singing. Actually, I

0:33:32.360 --> 0:33:32.720
<v Speaker 3>think so.

0:33:32.880 --> 0:33:35.000
<v Speaker 2>I wasn't sure when I first watched it, but then afterwards,

0:33:35.000 --> 0:33:37.920
<v Speaker 2>when I was diving more into me was musical credentials. Yeah,

0:33:37.920 --> 0:33:41.200
<v Speaker 2>I assume this is his actual singing voice because he

0:33:41.240 --> 0:33:44.320
<v Speaker 2>put out all these albums and so forth. So yeah,

0:33:44.520 --> 0:33:46.000
<v Speaker 2>it belts out of tune.

0:33:46.120 --> 0:33:49.560
<v Speaker 3>So Black Lizard. After the credits, Black Lizard navigates the

0:33:49.560 --> 0:33:52.040
<v Speaker 3>club and comes up to meet the lonely man sitting

0:33:52.120 --> 0:33:55.560
<v Speaker 3>at the table above, and Black Lizard says, this is

0:33:55.600 --> 0:33:59.920
<v Speaker 3>an unusual night, an oppressive night, a night made for crime.

0:34:00.600 --> 0:34:04.320
<v Speaker 3>I love a night like this. Sleep won't come easily tonight.

0:34:04.600 --> 0:34:08.440
<v Speaker 3>And you So the lonely man tells her he's impressed

0:34:08.480 --> 0:34:10.799
<v Speaker 3>by her words. He's like, wow, you are a poetess.

0:34:11.400 --> 0:34:14.360
<v Speaker 3>And Black Lizard says, are you a critic because beauty

0:34:14.400 --> 0:34:17.319
<v Speaker 3>fails to intoxicate you? Your eyes tell me that.

0:34:18.680 --> 0:34:20.759
<v Speaker 2>And this is a catchy she's talking to This is

0:34:20.840 --> 0:34:22.440
<v Speaker 2>the number one detective, right.

0:34:22.400 --> 0:34:25.400
<v Speaker 3>Yes, But then Black Lizard backs off of a catchy

0:34:25.400 --> 0:34:27.160
<v Speaker 3>and goes to visit a different man at the bar.

0:34:27.360 --> 0:34:30.040
<v Speaker 3>She goes up to this sad looking guy and says,

0:34:30.080 --> 0:34:31.040
<v Speaker 3>thinking of death?

0:34:31.200 --> 0:34:31.520
<v Speaker 4>Are you?

0:34:32.160 --> 0:34:36.960
<v Speaker 3>And she then seemingly telekinetically moves his whiskey glass to

0:34:37.040 --> 0:34:39.799
<v Speaker 3>the edge of the table until it falls and shatters.

0:34:40.400 --> 0:34:42.799
<v Speaker 3>I'm not sure what's going on here, but I like it.

0:34:43.360 --> 0:34:46.480
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, this is a great weird moment. That is important

0:34:46.520 --> 0:34:50.359
<v Speaker 2>because we come back to it. But I guess it's

0:34:50.400 --> 0:34:52.759
<v Speaker 2>like a here as a metaphor or a splash of

0:34:52.800 --> 0:34:57.400
<v Speaker 2>magical realism, because there's nothing else to indicate that this

0:34:57.520 --> 0:35:01.560
<v Speaker 2>character has any kind of telekinetic I think it's just

0:35:01.600 --> 0:35:05.640
<v Speaker 2>to convey the charismatic power of the Black Lizard. You know,

0:35:05.640 --> 0:35:09.759
<v Speaker 2>I don't know, the inevitable trajectory of unobtainable obsessions. Yeah,

0:35:09.760 --> 0:35:13.640
<v Speaker 2>the film plays it marvelously vague. But again, it is

0:35:13.640 --> 0:35:15.040
<v Speaker 2>important because we'll come back to it.

0:35:15.280 --> 0:35:18.400
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, there's an ambiguous question about the presence of the

0:35:18.480 --> 0:35:23.240
<v Speaker 3>supernatural in this film. The movie is, you know, ninety

0:35:23.320 --> 0:35:27.120
<v Speaker 3>nine percent grounded in realism, but there are a few

0:35:27.200 --> 0:35:29.800
<v Speaker 3>things in it that are like, wait, was that magic

0:35:29.920 --> 0:35:32.960
<v Speaker 3>or not? I can't tell. So there's the whiskey glass telekinesis.

0:35:33.440 --> 0:35:36.959
<v Speaker 3>There's the lady with yellow eyes who the snake Lady later,

0:35:37.040 --> 0:35:39.879
<v Speaker 3>who sometimes seems to maybe do magic or I don't

0:35:39.920 --> 0:35:43.520
<v Speaker 3>know what's going on with her snake eyes. The statues

0:35:43.600 --> 0:35:46.239
<v Speaker 3>at the end of the movie, which are people, They

0:35:46.280 --> 0:35:50.240
<v Speaker 3>appear to be frozen in some way that almost suggests magic,

0:35:50.280 --> 0:35:51.200
<v Speaker 3>but it's not clear.

0:35:51.760 --> 0:35:53.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Yeah, So there are a few moments like that,

0:35:53.719 --> 0:35:56.520
<v Speaker 2>and it keeps things wild and unpredictable as well.

0:35:56.800 --> 0:35:59.640
<v Speaker 3>Anyway, the man at the table, who was allegedly thinking

0:35:59.640 --> 0:36:02.879
<v Speaker 3>of death leaves the club with black Lizard, and then

0:36:02.880 --> 0:36:06.439
<v Speaker 3>we smash cut to a newspaper headline that tells us

0:36:06.480 --> 0:36:11.799
<v Speaker 3>a quote despondent young musician has died by suicide. And

0:36:12.480 --> 0:36:15.640
<v Speaker 3>then we also see a different article in the newspaper

0:36:16.160 --> 0:36:20.760
<v Speaker 3>that a corpse was stolen from a medical dissection room

0:36:20.920 --> 0:36:25.480
<v Speaker 3>at the Morgue. Right, yes, okay, So then detective at

0:36:25.520 --> 0:36:28.720
<v Speaker 3>catche is suddenly there. He is at the Morgue looking

0:36:28.760 --> 0:36:32.080
<v Speaker 3>into it and finds there is a toy black lizard

0:36:32.280 --> 0:36:33.080
<v Speaker 3>at the scene.

0:36:33.600 --> 0:36:35.319
<v Speaker 2>Yeap peels it right off the floor there.

0:36:35.560 --> 0:36:37.600
<v Speaker 3>And then also, what is the deal with all these

0:36:37.680 --> 0:36:41.320
<v Speaker 3>cadavers floating in like a tank of dark green liquid?

0:36:41.400 --> 0:36:42.400
<v Speaker 3>This is so weird.

0:36:42.920 --> 0:36:45.759
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I found this creepy, but I don't know, like,

0:36:45.840 --> 0:36:48.480
<v Speaker 2>maybe this is actually how it was done. At the time,

0:36:48.960 --> 0:36:50.520
<v Speaker 2>I have no idea, and I have to admit I

0:36:50.560 --> 0:36:53.200
<v Speaker 2>was reluctant to go down the goolish avenue of researching it.

0:36:53.280 --> 0:36:55.840
<v Speaker 2>I was like, I don't know, I'm just gonna accept

0:36:55.840 --> 0:36:57.799
<v Speaker 2>it as is. Maybe I'll come back and look into

0:36:57.840 --> 0:37:00.000
<v Speaker 2>it later, but at least within the context of the film,

0:37:00.200 --> 0:37:02.640
<v Speaker 2>this is just where they put recently dead bodies instead

0:37:02.640 --> 0:37:05.760
<v Speaker 2>of having like freezers, the sort of freezer drawer scene

0:37:05.760 --> 0:37:09.520
<v Speaker 2>that we're accustomed to. Instead we have the vat scene

0:37:09.560 --> 0:37:10.319
<v Speaker 2>that we have here.

0:37:10.840 --> 0:37:13.600
<v Speaker 3>But anyway, okay, so all this is sort of prologued

0:37:13.600 --> 0:37:15.879
<v Speaker 3>to the main caper of the film, which is the

0:37:15.880 --> 0:37:19.360
<v Speaker 3>iwasa kidnapping and the Star of Egypt.

0:37:19.960 --> 0:37:22.080
<v Speaker 2>I only looked this up just before we came in

0:37:22.120 --> 0:37:25.320
<v Speaker 2>to record, but the Star of Egypt is an actual diamond.

0:37:26.040 --> 0:37:29.160
<v Speaker 2>I was reading about it on Christie's. It first appeared

0:37:29.200 --> 0:37:31.719
<v Speaker 2>on the London market in nineteen thirty nine. There's a

0:37:31.760 --> 0:37:34.200
<v Speaker 2>listing for it on Christie's. I think it recently sold

0:37:34.280 --> 0:37:37.279
<v Speaker 2>for you know, several million dollars, so it's it's a

0:37:37.280 --> 0:37:40.799
<v Speaker 2>real thing, not just a made up gym.

0:37:41.320 --> 0:37:45.280
<v Speaker 3>So we get into act one here with the main plot,

0:37:45.600 --> 0:37:49.080
<v Speaker 3>and it is that Detective Atketchi has been hired by

0:37:49.160 --> 0:37:53.200
<v Speaker 3>a rich man named iwasa to protect his daughter Senne,

0:37:54.000 --> 0:37:58.319
<v Speaker 3>who has been threatened with kidnapping. I think they get

0:37:58.360 --> 0:38:00.359
<v Speaker 3>a note in the mail or something saying that she's

0:38:00.360 --> 0:38:03.040
<v Speaker 3>going to be kidnapped, and so they hide out in

0:38:03.120 --> 0:38:06.359
<v Speaker 3>a hotel room under the supervision of a ketchee who

0:38:06.440 --> 0:38:09.520
<v Speaker 3>intends to set a trap for the would be kidnappers.

0:38:09.840 --> 0:38:12.880
<v Speaker 2>That's right, number one detective in Japan, the most expensive,

0:38:13.000 --> 0:38:14.399
<v Speaker 2>only the best for this guy's daughter.

0:38:14.719 --> 0:38:17.520
<v Speaker 3>Now, technically, even though we said it's clear who Black

0:38:17.520 --> 0:38:20.560
<v Speaker 3>Lizard is at this point in the plot, Black Lizard

0:38:21.160 --> 0:38:24.400
<v Speaker 3>has not been revealed and is in disguise as a

0:38:24.440 --> 0:38:27.960
<v Speaker 3>woman named Midori Kawa. And so this is how she's

0:38:28.040 --> 0:38:30.000
<v Speaker 3>known to a ketchee from the club. You know, he

0:38:30.080 --> 0:38:33.279
<v Speaker 3>knows her as Midori Kawa. And then we go to

0:38:33.360 --> 0:38:37.839
<v Speaker 3>the hotel lounge where Sinay is hanging out. And then

0:38:37.920 --> 0:38:41.359
<v Speaker 3>also Midori Kawa and a handsome, well dressed man named

0:38:41.480 --> 0:38:45.240
<v Speaker 3>Yamakawa are getting to know Sinay. They like they're talking

0:38:45.280 --> 0:38:48.080
<v Speaker 3>to her in the hotel bar. For some reason, Sinay

0:38:48.160 --> 0:38:51.160
<v Speaker 3>has been permitted to hang out at the bar by herself,

0:38:51.200 --> 0:38:53.399
<v Speaker 3>even though she's being targeted by kidnappers.

0:38:53.800 --> 0:38:56.000
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, it's weird. It was the same way in

0:38:56.040 --> 0:38:58.000
<v Speaker 2>the sixty two versions, So I guess it's straight from

0:38:58.080 --> 0:39:01.600
<v Speaker 2>the play and or book. Maybe the bar is considered

0:39:01.640 --> 0:39:05.920
<v Speaker 2>a safe public zone, or maybe Medora Kawa is just seeming.

0:39:06.080 --> 0:39:09.120
<v Speaker 2>She's just such a long time trusted client of dads

0:39:09.160 --> 0:39:12.040
<v Speaker 2>that you know she's perfectly safe as long as she's

0:39:12.080 --> 0:39:12.399
<v Speaker 2>with her.

0:39:12.880 --> 0:39:16.279
<v Speaker 3>But Midori Kawa is being so creepy. It is like

0:39:16.840 --> 0:39:19.680
<v Speaker 3>she's like, hey, did you play volleyball in college? I

0:39:19.680 --> 0:39:21.760
<v Speaker 3>would like to possess your body as a doll.

0:39:22.560 --> 0:39:24.799
<v Speaker 2>She's like, if I told you had a beautiful body,

0:39:24.840 --> 0:39:27.200
<v Speaker 2>would you hold it against me if I preserved you

0:39:27.239 --> 0:39:33.399
<v Speaker 2>in a perfect soul? Estate more poetic than that, but yeah, yeah,

0:39:33.440 --> 0:39:36.840
<v Speaker 2>but Black Lizard is always hitting on folks.

0:39:37.120 --> 0:39:42.040
<v Speaker 3>Yes, So Midori Kawa and her accomplice they lure Sina

0:39:42.239 --> 0:39:45.839
<v Speaker 3>back to a room in the hotel, I think, on

0:39:45.880 --> 0:39:49.399
<v Speaker 3>the promise of showing her like an antique doll. They're like, oh,

0:39:49.400 --> 0:39:52.000
<v Speaker 3>we have this interesting artifact, and she's like, okay, I'll

0:39:52.040 --> 0:39:55.600
<v Speaker 3>go look at it. But of course they kidnap her.

0:39:55.640 --> 0:39:58.160
<v Speaker 3>They like chloroform her and then stuff her into a

0:39:58.239 --> 0:40:00.160
<v Speaker 3>trunk and back.

0:40:00.160 --> 0:40:02.719
<v Speaker 2>Lizard is also like, go ahead and take her clothes off.

0:40:03.120 --> 0:40:05.160
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, for no particular reason, Well.

0:40:05.040 --> 0:40:07.440
<v Speaker 2>Didn't she does he change into those clothes. There's kind

0:40:07.440 --> 0:40:10.719
<v Speaker 2>of an initial fake out that I think maybe initially

0:40:11.560 --> 0:40:15.399
<v Speaker 2>she replaces Snae in Sanna's clothes with her back turned

0:40:15.440 --> 0:40:18.319
<v Speaker 2>to her father, and then they end up replacing her

0:40:18.360 --> 0:40:21.759
<v Speaker 2>in bed with the very dummy that you know would

0:40:21.760 --> 0:40:24.200
<v Speaker 2>have been the doll in the box originally, that's why

0:40:24.239 --> 0:40:26.880
<v Speaker 2>it is okay, yeah, but it is also played for

0:40:27.040 --> 0:40:30.080
<v Speaker 2>you know, yeah, for for more alluring purposes here too.

0:40:30.440 --> 0:40:33.880
<v Speaker 3>So also somewhere in here, Yamakawa is revealed to be

0:40:34.160 --> 0:40:37.920
<v Speaker 3>Unichi a'ma mia. This was the same guy, the despondent

0:40:37.960 --> 0:40:41.440
<v Speaker 3>young man at the club earlier, right, yes, yeah, this

0:40:41.480 --> 0:40:44.360
<v Speaker 3>is now Black Lizard's accomplice. And of course we know

0:40:44.560 --> 0:40:48.239
<v Speaker 3>Midori Kawa is Black Lizard, but we are to understand

0:40:48.360 --> 0:40:52.080
<v Speaker 3>the detective Aketchi does not know. So they pull a

0:40:52.200 --> 0:40:57.400
<v Speaker 3>clever maneuver. Amamiya takes Sannae inside the trunk and boards

0:40:57.400 --> 0:41:00.560
<v Speaker 3>a train going to some other city while Black Lizard

0:41:00.640 --> 0:41:04.240
<v Speaker 3>stays at the hotel, and she tricks Iwase into thinking

0:41:04.280 --> 0:41:07.239
<v Speaker 3>that Sennae is totally safe in the hotel room. First,

0:41:07.280 --> 0:41:11.600
<v Speaker 3>she like throws her voice and poses as her, like,

0:41:11.640 --> 0:41:14.080
<v Speaker 3>pretending to be her from the other room, and I

0:41:14.080 --> 0:41:17.719
<v Speaker 3>guess ita is He's like not, I don't know. He's

0:41:17.719 --> 0:41:19.440
<v Speaker 3>not thrown off by the fact that this is not

0:41:19.560 --> 0:41:21.080
<v Speaker 3>his daughter's voice.

0:41:21.160 --> 0:41:23.719
<v Speaker 2>Right, or it's a perfect replica for voice somehow, I

0:41:23.719 --> 0:41:25.280
<v Speaker 2>don't know. At any rate it works.

0:41:25.719 --> 0:41:28.839
<v Speaker 3>And then she tricks him into thinking that Senne is

0:41:29.000 --> 0:41:31.600
<v Speaker 3>in her bed in the hotel room. It will later

0:41:31.640 --> 0:41:34.440
<v Speaker 3>be revealed that it's a huge doll under the blankets.

0:41:35.480 --> 0:41:39.360
<v Speaker 3>But he Oh, but Black Lizard has a message delivered

0:41:39.640 --> 0:41:43.680
<v Speaker 3>stating that Senne will be kidnapped exactly at midnight. So

0:41:43.800 --> 0:41:49.120
<v Speaker 3>while it wasa sleeps soundly thinking that Sennae is asleep nearby,

0:41:49.320 --> 0:41:52.000
<v Speaker 3>a catchy stands guard in the living room of the

0:41:52.040 --> 0:41:55.960
<v Speaker 3>hotel suite, passing the time by hanging out with Black Lizard,

0:41:56.040 --> 0:41:59.040
<v Speaker 3>not knowing who she is. And this leads to a

0:41:59.080 --> 0:42:02.560
<v Speaker 3>great dialogue see where Black Lizard again in disguises. Midori

0:42:02.600 --> 0:42:07.240
<v Speaker 3>Kawa and Detective Aketchi play cards and talk about crime

0:42:07.520 --> 0:42:11.480
<v Speaker 3>and love and their careers and their character. A lot

0:42:11.480 --> 0:42:15.160
<v Speaker 3>of really fun dialogue here. Just one example is they

0:42:15.200 --> 0:42:17.960
<v Speaker 3>start talking about like what it takes to make a criminal,

0:42:18.440 --> 0:42:23.520
<v Speaker 3>and Akechi says, consider three women. A man gives a

0:42:23.520 --> 0:42:27.440
<v Speaker 3>woman a bouquet of roses. A caterpillar crawls out from

0:42:27.480 --> 0:42:31.560
<v Speaker 3>between the petals. Disgusted, the woman throws the bouquet into

0:42:31.600 --> 0:42:35.239
<v Speaker 3>the fireplace. Akechi says, this woman does not have what

0:42:35.280 --> 0:42:38.480
<v Speaker 3>it takes to be a criminal. Now consider a second woman,

0:42:38.719 --> 0:42:41.960
<v Speaker 3>same thing. She gets the flowers, caterpillar crawls out of

0:42:42.000 --> 0:42:44.840
<v Speaker 3>the flower. Instead of throwing the flowers into the fire,

0:42:44.960 --> 0:42:48.720
<v Speaker 3>she plucks out the caterpillar and throws it alone into

0:42:48.719 --> 0:42:52.320
<v Speaker 3>the flames. Akechi says, she also is not a criminal.

0:42:52.680 --> 0:42:56.000
<v Speaker 3>But consider a third woman. She sees the caterpillar crawl

0:42:56.000 --> 0:42:59.239
<v Speaker 3>out of the blossom, she throws neither the flowers nor

0:42:59.320 --> 0:43:02.640
<v Speaker 3>the insect. Instead, she pushes the man who gave her

0:43:02.680 --> 0:43:06.960
<v Speaker 3>the flowers into the flames. Akechi says, this woman can

0:43:07.040 --> 0:43:11.240
<v Speaker 3>be a criminal, but ironically she is the most tenderhearted

0:43:11.360 --> 0:43:12.000
<v Speaker 3>of the three.

0:43:12.600 --> 0:43:14.560
<v Speaker 2>I'd be lying if I said that I one percent

0:43:14.719 --> 0:43:18.000
<v Speaker 2>understood what the point is here. But I still love it,

0:43:18.440 --> 0:43:20.240
<v Speaker 2>and I do want to see a line of black

0:43:20.239 --> 0:43:23.040
<v Speaker 2>Lizard Valentine's Day cards. Based on this and other quotes

0:43:23.040 --> 0:43:23.920
<v Speaker 2>from the film.

0:43:24.160 --> 0:43:27.000
<v Speaker 3>I think Aketche is making some kind of point about

0:43:27.080 --> 0:43:30.320
<v Speaker 3>like passion and boldness, that it's like the same thing,

0:43:31.120 --> 0:43:34.160
<v Speaker 3>the same thing that makes someone that have the deepest

0:43:34.239 --> 0:43:37.000
<v Speaker 3>kind of love is also what makes someone the most

0:43:37.080 --> 0:43:38.520
<v Speaker 3>like violent and dangerous.

0:43:39.160 --> 0:43:41.960
<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, so maybe we're getting back into the territory

0:43:42.080 --> 0:43:45.799
<v Speaker 2>here of, you know, of believing that crime should wear

0:43:45.840 --> 0:43:48.839
<v Speaker 2>a gorgeous gown with a train fifteen feet long, both

0:43:48.840 --> 0:43:52.240
<v Speaker 2>stylistically but also in terms of passion somehow.

0:43:52.480 --> 0:43:56.280
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Yeah, they also talk. So they start playing cards

0:43:56.320 --> 0:44:00.319
<v Speaker 3>and they put a wager up. Aketchi is like, oh, well,

0:44:00.360 --> 0:44:02.600
<v Speaker 3>you know you're you're rich. I can't really bet against

0:44:02.640 --> 0:44:05.680
<v Speaker 3>you because you've got all this money, and Black Lizard says, well,

0:44:05.719 --> 0:44:07.640
<v Speaker 3>I'll bet all my jewels, but you have to bet

0:44:07.680 --> 0:44:11.720
<v Speaker 3>your career as a detective. So I guess if Black

0:44:11.719 --> 0:44:14.200
<v Speaker 3>Lizard wins the card game, a Catchee will no longer

0:44:14.239 --> 0:44:16.160
<v Speaker 3>get to be Japan's number one detective.

0:44:16.600 --> 0:44:18.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, this is a great scene, and I love the

0:44:18.320 --> 0:44:20.000
<v Speaker 2>way it was shot too. They're like playing on a

0:44:20.040 --> 0:44:22.840
<v Speaker 2>glass countertop, I believe, and so we get some wonderful

0:44:22.880 --> 0:44:26.080
<v Speaker 2>shots from below up through the card game as it's

0:44:26.120 --> 0:44:30.560
<v Speaker 2>taking place, and yeah, it's I believe. It's in this

0:44:30.600 --> 0:44:33.000
<v Speaker 2>scene that we get a lot of contemplation about the

0:44:33.080 --> 0:44:38.479
<v Speaker 2>idea that aketche is like the negative photo of a criminal. Yeah,

0:44:38.560 --> 0:44:41.640
<v Speaker 2>and in a way, even though although Aketchi doesn't know

0:44:41.760 --> 0:44:45.279
<v Speaker 2>that he's playing cards with the Black Lizards. Yeah, this

0:44:45.360 --> 0:44:47.799
<v Speaker 2>is very much a we're much the same you and

0:44:47.880 --> 0:44:50.440
<v Speaker 2>I speech that has become a standard trope, but it's

0:44:50.440 --> 0:44:54.040
<v Speaker 2>constructed in a fresh way. It has a very fresh

0:44:54.040 --> 0:44:54.799
<v Speaker 2>feeling to it.

0:44:55.160 --> 0:44:58.560
<v Speaker 3>This is better than most I mean it. This comes

0:44:58.600 --> 0:45:01.319
<v Speaker 3>before things that would make same point later. I think

0:45:02.200 --> 0:45:04.000
<v Speaker 3>you know, this is sort of the same point made

0:45:04.000 --> 0:45:08.600
<v Speaker 3>in like Manhunter about the Thomas Harris character Will Graham.

0:45:08.760 --> 0:45:12.320
<v Speaker 3>It's like that he is able to think like a killer,

0:45:12.480 --> 0:45:15.239
<v Speaker 3>or think like a criminal, and that's what makes him

0:45:15.239 --> 0:45:17.839
<v Speaker 3>a great detective, and Black Lizards saying the same thing

0:45:17.880 --> 0:45:19.799
<v Speaker 3>to a catchy here. It's that like, in order to

0:45:19.840 --> 0:45:23.000
<v Speaker 3>be a great detective, you must be able to think

0:45:23.080 --> 0:45:23.840
<v Speaker 3>like a criminal.

0:45:24.600 --> 0:45:26.920
<v Speaker 2>Now is this the place I may be skipping around?

0:45:26.960 --> 0:45:29.160
<v Speaker 2>I may be thinking about something earlier or later. But

0:45:29.239 --> 0:45:33.080
<v Speaker 2>there's one part where Black Lizard has an extended monologue

0:45:33.760 --> 0:45:37.000
<v Speaker 2>anguishing over the fact that beauty must age and that

0:45:37.160 --> 0:45:39.840
<v Speaker 2>is the ultimate tragedy, and therefore she pines for a

0:45:39.920 --> 0:45:44.160
<v Speaker 2>soulless existence and the heart made of pure, made as

0:45:44.200 --> 0:45:46.880
<v Speaker 2>pure and unbreakable as a diamond, both in her in

0:45:46.920 --> 0:45:48.960
<v Speaker 2>herself but also in others.

0:45:50.000 --> 0:45:51.520
<v Speaker 3>I think Yeah, it might be the scene.

0:45:51.920 --> 0:45:55.160
<v Speaker 2>Yeah either way, Like the Quest for the Diamond Heart

0:45:55.480 --> 0:45:58.319
<v Speaker 2>is one of the central themes of the film that

0:45:58.360 --> 0:45:59.960
<v Speaker 2>we come back to again and again.

0:46:00.239 --> 0:46:02.360
<v Speaker 3>And this is the scene where Black Lizard and a

0:46:02.400 --> 0:46:05.640
<v Speaker 3>Catchy do seem to be falling in love. Yes, but

0:46:05.800 --> 0:46:08.800
<v Speaker 3>then remember the thing was supposed to be. He's standing

0:46:08.800 --> 0:46:11.200
<v Speaker 3>guard there until the kidnapping, which is supposed to come

0:46:11.239 --> 0:46:15.160
<v Speaker 3>at midnight, And midnight comes and nothing happens. What gives

0:46:15.840 --> 0:46:19.120
<v Speaker 3>Sannae's absence at this point is revealed. They go in

0:46:19.120 --> 0:46:21.359
<v Speaker 3>and like pull back the covers on the bed and oh,

0:46:21.400 --> 0:46:24.520
<v Speaker 3>it's just a doll in there. But it's a double

0:46:24.560 --> 0:46:28.400
<v Speaker 3>twist because we find out a catchy knew all along.

0:46:29.280 --> 0:46:31.680
<v Speaker 3>He lets his men run into the room and he

0:46:31.800 --> 0:46:34.840
<v Speaker 3>reveals that he knew that Senne had already been taken

0:46:34.920 --> 0:46:37.120
<v Speaker 3>and he had his men collect the trunk and bring

0:46:37.160 --> 0:46:37.680
<v Speaker 3>her back.

0:46:38.160 --> 0:46:40.160
<v Speaker 2>Yeah again, Black Lizard really does feel like the main

0:46:40.239 --> 0:46:42.560
<v Speaker 2>character in all of this, in part because we're generally

0:46:42.600 --> 0:46:46.440
<v Speaker 2>clued into what her plans are far more than a catchy's.

0:46:46.719 --> 0:46:49.960
<v Speaker 2>Like a catchy ultimately ends up being like two steps

0:46:49.960 --> 0:46:52.919
<v Speaker 2>ahead of even the viewer. And I guess this corresponds

0:46:52.920 --> 0:46:56.680
<v Speaker 2>to the often observed soft rule of caper films, and

0:46:56.719 --> 0:46:58.920
<v Speaker 2>that you lay out all the beats of the caper

0:46:58.960 --> 0:47:01.720
<v Speaker 2>that's going to ultimately fail, but you reveal the beats

0:47:01.760 --> 0:47:08.040
<v Speaker 2>of a successful caper in its very real time execution. Again,

0:47:08.120 --> 0:47:11.200
<v Speaker 2>a catchy is essentially Sherlock Holmes here. He is a master,

0:47:12.120 --> 0:47:15.640
<v Speaker 2>you know, figuring out the criminal scheme and then trying

0:47:15.640 --> 0:47:17.920
<v Speaker 2>to be ahead of that. And I wonder too if

0:47:17.920 --> 0:47:20.720
<v Speaker 2>that adds to why we might be rooting for Black Lizard,

0:47:20.760 --> 0:47:23.399
<v Speaker 2>because it's like, if you don't know who a catchy is,

0:47:23.760 --> 0:47:26.120
<v Speaker 2>he's just another detective. But if you know that he's

0:47:26.200 --> 0:47:28.960
<v Speaker 2>the master detective, then you kind of know the fixes

0:47:29.000 --> 0:47:31.960
<v Speaker 2>in from the beginning, like this is an unbeatable adversary

0:47:31.960 --> 0:47:34.000
<v Speaker 2>for Black Lizard, and therefore maybe we root for her

0:47:34.040 --> 0:47:34.719
<v Speaker 2>a little bit more.

0:47:35.520 --> 0:47:37.920
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, Well, later in the story they do try to

0:47:37.960 --> 0:47:42.080
<v Speaker 3>get ahead of that by showing a catchy like doing

0:47:42.120 --> 0:47:46.279
<v Speaker 3>something sneaky and you think that he's being he's being

0:47:46.360 --> 0:47:50.920
<v Speaker 3>caught getting one over on on Black Lizard, and then

0:47:50.960 --> 0:47:53.080
<v Speaker 3>she gets one over on him. But then there's like

0:47:53.120 --> 0:47:55.600
<v Speaker 3>a triple twist where it's like, oh no, he actually

0:47:55.719 --> 0:48:00.840
<v Speaker 3>was there all along, Yes, but Anyway, Sola escapes this

0:48:01.000 --> 0:48:04.680
<v Speaker 3>trap by stealing a catche's gun from his coat pocket,

0:48:04.800 --> 0:48:07.080
<v Speaker 3>using it to escape the hotel room, and then she

0:48:07.680 --> 0:48:10.879
<v Speaker 3>gets out of the hotel by disguising herself as a man.

0:48:11.360 --> 0:48:13.080
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, this is a fun sequence, and I guess really

0:48:13.120 --> 0:48:16.040
<v Speaker 2>the only nod that we see to me was drag performance.

0:48:16.080 --> 0:48:16.640
<v Speaker 2>I suppose.

0:48:17.080 --> 0:48:28.560
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, So on to fight another day. So this sort

0:48:28.560 --> 0:48:31.080
<v Speaker 3>of gives way to Act two of the movie, the

0:48:31.120 --> 0:48:34.440
<v Speaker 3>previous plot having been foiled, we cut to the home

0:48:34.520 --> 0:48:38.760
<v Speaker 3>of Iwasa where Black Lizard is determined to strike again.

0:48:39.000 --> 0:48:41.880
<v Speaker 3>So this middle sequence of the movie involves Black Lizard's

0:48:41.920 --> 0:48:46.400
<v Speaker 3>second attempt at kidnapping Sinne and using the leverage of

0:48:46.400 --> 0:48:50.040
<v Speaker 3>her kidnapping to acquire the jeweled necklace the Star of Egypt.

0:48:50.440 --> 0:48:53.720
<v Speaker 3>So we meet a large cast of Hinchman here, hired

0:48:53.760 --> 0:48:57.800
<v Speaker 3>by Awasa to protect the family. The gang is commanded

0:48:57.840 --> 0:49:01.960
<v Speaker 3>by a new private detective met And so there's like

0:49:02.000 --> 0:49:04.600
<v Speaker 3>a furniture delivery truck that arrives at the house and

0:49:04.640 --> 0:49:07.919
<v Speaker 3>we see the whole gang run out to like menace them.

0:49:08.520 --> 0:49:12.360
<v Speaker 3>The delivery guys seem very frightened, but then they decide

0:49:12.360 --> 0:49:14.799
<v Speaker 3>it's okay, you know, it's a beautiful new futon that

0:49:15.080 --> 0:49:18.000
<v Speaker 3>IWASA did apparently actually order. So they bring it inside.

0:49:18.000 --> 0:49:20.080
<v Speaker 3>They talk about how it cost a bazillion bucks and

0:49:20.120 --> 0:49:22.839
<v Speaker 3>so forth, and the whole time Matoba is there just

0:49:22.880 --> 0:49:25.000
<v Speaker 3>looking like he's just a statue.

0:49:25.760 --> 0:49:27.479
<v Speaker 2>He's great, just scowling the whole time.

0:49:28.040 --> 0:49:30.880
<v Speaker 3>Now, I think at this point we're supposed to believe

0:49:30.920 --> 0:49:33.840
<v Speaker 3>Aketchy has been dismissed from the case, or maybe he

0:49:33.920 --> 0:49:34.879
<v Speaker 3>actually has been.

0:49:35.560 --> 0:49:38.879
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I don't know if he's like been completely pushed out,

0:49:38.960 --> 0:49:43.360
<v Speaker 2>but yeah, it's Matoba is now seemingly in charge of things,

0:49:43.480 --> 0:49:46.839
<v Speaker 2>and he seems a little rth that a catch. He's

0:49:46.880 --> 0:49:49.120
<v Speaker 2>even showing up. It's like, no, you failed, dude, I'm

0:49:49.320 --> 0:49:50.640
<v Speaker 2>I'm I'm top now.

0:49:50.960 --> 0:49:54.440
<v Speaker 3>But later that night there is an attack from inside

0:49:54.480 --> 0:49:59.640
<v Speaker 3>the house. I think it's Matoba catches. Itwasa's housekeeper, Hena

0:50:00.280 --> 0:50:04.160
<v Speaker 3>sending secret coded messages to someone via radio. She's like

0:50:04.560 --> 0:50:07.080
<v Speaker 3>talking into a radio, saying like the sea is a

0:50:07.120 --> 0:50:10.960
<v Speaker 3>flame and stuff like that. But the tables are turned.

0:50:11.080 --> 0:50:13.480
<v Speaker 3>How exactly is it revealed? Is it that Hena and

0:50:13.520 --> 0:50:17.880
<v Speaker 3>the big lug Hinchman guy both gang up on Matoba.

0:50:18.360 --> 0:50:21.080
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I don't know if Matoba vetted these henchmen, but yeah,

0:50:21.080 --> 0:50:23.800
<v Speaker 2>it's like they all were in the pocket of Black Lizard.

0:50:23.920 --> 0:50:27.200
<v Speaker 2>We'll find out. So, yeah, everybody's looking working for Black

0:50:27.320 --> 0:50:29.239
<v Speaker 2>Lizard here except for Matoba.

0:50:29.280 --> 0:50:32.759
<v Speaker 3>And this is the first reveal of Hena's like powers

0:50:32.760 --> 0:50:35.640
<v Speaker 3>and snake associations. What's the deal with this lady?

0:50:35.880 --> 0:50:38.759
<v Speaker 2>Oh? I mean this is again? Is it magic? Is it?

0:50:39.440 --> 0:50:42.319
<v Speaker 2>Is it metaphor what's going on here? I don't know,

0:50:42.360 --> 0:50:46.800
<v Speaker 2>but it's tremendous because we see, yeah, her eyes glitter, yellow,

0:50:46.840 --> 0:50:52.080
<v Speaker 2>demon's fire. She flings constricting snakes as a weapon. So

0:50:52.480 --> 0:50:55.400
<v Speaker 2>we've watched movies with projectile snakes before on the show,

0:50:55.800 --> 0:50:58.600
<v Speaker 2>namely nineteen eighty one's Venom, where we get to see

0:50:58.840 --> 0:51:01.960
<v Speaker 2>Klauskinsky with a rubber snake, and it's the kind of

0:51:02.000 --> 0:51:05.239
<v Speaker 2>thing that can easily look very rubber and fake. But

0:51:05.480 --> 0:51:08.400
<v Speaker 2>I totally bought her and her snake bolos as a

0:51:08.480 --> 0:51:11.839
<v Speaker 2>legitimate threat. So like she leaps out, you know, cool

0:51:11.880 --> 0:51:15.280
<v Speaker 2>lighting on her face and eyes, lands this constricting snake

0:51:15.400 --> 0:51:19.400
<v Speaker 2>right around Matoba's neck, and the actor Nishi Mura just

0:51:19.480 --> 0:51:22.720
<v Speaker 2>sells the living daylights out of it, just thrashing around

0:51:22.760 --> 0:51:25.520
<v Speaker 2>against the walls, trying to pull the snake off of

0:51:25.560 --> 0:51:26.240
<v Speaker 2>his throat.

0:51:26.520 --> 0:51:29.040
<v Speaker 3>Oh but it doesn't end there, right, everybody comes out

0:51:29.160 --> 0:51:32.520
<v Speaker 3>because of the commotion, and then they find what they

0:51:32.520 --> 0:51:34.520
<v Speaker 3>find black Lizard's calling card.

0:51:34.360 --> 0:51:37.080
<v Speaker 2>Here, right, there's the rubber lizard, but it is on

0:51:37.160 --> 0:51:40.760
<v Speaker 2>the palm of a disembodied hand that is on the couch,

0:51:40.760 --> 0:51:42.560
<v Speaker 2>which is now bloodied. They're gonna have to get rid

0:51:42.600 --> 0:51:46.960
<v Speaker 2>of that thing. And then they find Matoba in the bathtub,

0:51:47.160 --> 0:51:50.480
<v Speaker 2>like seemingly dead. I don't know, I can't remember if

0:51:50.480 --> 0:51:51.880
<v Speaker 2>he still has a snake on his neck or not,

0:51:51.960 --> 0:51:54.799
<v Speaker 2>but he has a bloody stump. This is clearly his

0:51:55.000 --> 0:51:57.719
<v Speaker 2>hand out there, left on the couch with the with

0:51:57.760 --> 0:52:01.160
<v Speaker 2>the calling card on it. But the like there's several

0:52:01.200 --> 0:52:02.960
<v Speaker 2>you know, guys looking in on this scene. And then

0:52:03.000 --> 0:52:06.160
<v Speaker 2>Matoba rises up out of the tub like a like

0:52:06.200 --> 0:52:10.360
<v Speaker 2>a rampaging zombie and comes rushing towards them with the stump,

0:52:10.840 --> 0:52:13.279
<v Speaker 2>and they all freak out and slam the door on

0:52:13.400 --> 0:52:16.239
<v Speaker 2>him as he thrust his bloody stump out through the

0:52:16.280 --> 0:52:19.600
<v Speaker 2>door after him, and then he finally busts through into

0:52:19.640 --> 0:52:23.680
<v Speaker 2>the hallway, slumps against the wall, slumps down and dies

0:52:23.880 --> 0:52:26.960
<v Speaker 2>just a legit jaw dropping sequence from me that that

0:52:27.120 --> 0:52:31.359
<v Speaker 2>scene is true, deeply crazy. I don't know, it's it's

0:52:31.440 --> 0:52:33.840
<v Speaker 2>really good. Yeah, it's like there's a lot of dialogue,

0:52:33.840 --> 0:52:36.440
<v Speaker 2>but then when the movie busts out these action sequences

0:52:36.480 --> 0:52:38.319
<v Speaker 2>like this, it's just they really go for it.

0:52:38.400 --> 0:52:40.320
<v Speaker 3>But as you mentioned, this all part of the plot.

0:52:40.880 --> 0:52:44.920
<v Speaker 3>The uh, of course, the attack gets blood all over

0:52:44.960 --> 0:52:48.600
<v Speaker 3>the expensive new futon and in the middle of Senne

0:52:48.760 --> 0:52:52.719
<v Speaker 3>having been kidnapped again and all that, Uh, they're like,

0:52:52.840 --> 0:52:55.680
<v Speaker 3>oh wow, well get the get this bloody futon out

0:52:55.719 --> 0:52:56.200
<v Speaker 3>of the house.

0:52:56.480 --> 0:52:59.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeap, what do you know? And this is and we

0:53:00.120 --> 0:53:02.400
<v Speaker 2>know what's up right, I mean, this is another most twists.

0:53:02.440 --> 0:53:04.840
<v Speaker 2>You know that they hit her in that couch, but

0:53:05.280 --> 0:53:08.240
<v Speaker 2>it doesn't matter. Like this all plays out like a

0:53:08.520 --> 0:53:10.680
<v Speaker 2>like a myth, like a like a fairy tale, and

0:53:10.719 --> 0:53:11.520
<v Speaker 2>you just follow it.

0:53:11.840 --> 0:53:16.080
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, so there is. They're setting up an exchange at

0:53:16.160 --> 0:53:19.239
<v Speaker 3>the pier, so Black Lizard promises that Senay will be

0:53:19.400 --> 0:53:23.160
<v Speaker 3>returned safely if iwasa gives up the Star of Egypt

0:53:23.160 --> 0:53:26.880
<v Speaker 3>at a drop off point at the port, and he does.

0:53:26.920 --> 0:53:29.759
<v Speaker 3>He shows up with the jewels, but Black Lizard is

0:53:29.800 --> 0:53:33.000
<v Speaker 3>treacherous and does not return his daughter because it seems

0:53:33.000 --> 0:53:36.240
<v Speaker 3>like Black Lizard wants Sinnay even more than she wants

0:53:36.280 --> 0:53:36.880
<v Speaker 3>the jewels.

0:53:37.200 --> 0:53:41.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, so she's just gonna keep them both. So sorry,

0:53:41.640 --> 0:53:45.440
<v Speaker 2>you've been double crossed. But Black Lizard gets what Black Lizard.

0:53:45.160 --> 0:53:48.160
<v Speaker 3>Wants and this leads to a chase with like private

0:53:48.200 --> 0:53:52.280
<v Speaker 3>detectives and cars and these motorcycle henchmen with smoke screens.

0:53:52.840 --> 0:53:55.400
<v Speaker 3>These movies of the time really loved a like multi

0:53:55.440 --> 0:53:59.320
<v Speaker 3>colored smoke screen getaway that's in danger diabolic as well.

0:53:59.560 --> 0:54:04.279
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, this whole sequence was very danger diabolic. But they

0:54:04.600 --> 0:54:06.120
<v Speaker 2>and this is one of those things we have to note.

0:54:06.520 --> 0:54:09.040
<v Speaker 2>They get away but sort of don't like we have

0:54:09.120 --> 0:54:12.800
<v Speaker 2>to again do all the math of Aketche's scheming and

0:54:12.880 --> 0:54:17.319
<v Speaker 2>counter scheming versus Black lizards scheming and counter scheming. The

0:54:17.400 --> 0:54:18.920
<v Speaker 2>viewer is just along for the ride.

0:54:19.120 --> 0:54:22.360
<v Speaker 3>So Black Lizard escapes to her steamership with both Sennae

0:54:22.600 --> 0:54:25.479
<v Speaker 3>and the jewels. But will Aketchi be able to save

0:54:25.560 --> 0:54:28.239
<v Speaker 3>the day? And here we go to a scene in

0:54:29.400 --> 0:54:33.720
<v Speaker 3>Black Lizard's cabin on the boat that can you describe

0:54:33.719 --> 0:54:34.160
<v Speaker 3>this realm?

0:54:34.440 --> 0:54:37.000
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so we know the deal with this futon. This

0:54:37.160 --> 0:54:41.000
<v Speaker 2>is how they just kidnapped her successfully for the second time,

0:54:42.000 --> 0:54:46.200
<v Speaker 2>and here's the couch that the futon in Black Lizard's chambers,

0:54:46.560 --> 0:54:50.120
<v Speaker 2>and she begins to realize what we the viewers suspect

0:54:50.239 --> 0:54:54.600
<v Speaker 2>that Aketchie has hidden himself in that futon, and so

0:54:54.640 --> 0:54:57.600
<v Speaker 2>she starts speaking to him in there. She has her

0:54:58.120 --> 0:55:01.880
<v Speaker 2>her game come in and like strap the dow straps

0:55:01.920 --> 0:55:04.759
<v Speaker 2>around the futon so that he can't get out, and

0:55:05.560 --> 0:55:09.000
<v Speaker 2>then she sends the gang back outside, and she kind

0:55:09.000 --> 0:55:11.920
<v Speaker 2>of gets this like this this tender sequence where she

0:55:12.080 --> 0:55:16.600
<v Speaker 2>speaks to Aketchee imprisoned in the futon. She reveals her

0:55:16.640 --> 0:55:19.080
<v Speaker 2>love to him, as well as her great fear of

0:55:19.120 --> 0:55:21.880
<v Speaker 2>that love, fear for what will change in her, because

0:55:22.280 --> 0:55:25.359
<v Speaker 2>it is all the antithesis of the diamond heart. You know.

0:55:25.440 --> 0:55:27.880
<v Speaker 2>It's like if I give into my love for you,

0:55:28.000 --> 0:55:31.680
<v Speaker 2>then then I'm changing in a frightening way, and I

0:55:31.719 --> 0:55:34.560
<v Speaker 2>can't have that, you know. And also you're my enemy,

0:55:34.600 --> 0:55:37.839
<v Speaker 2>so either way, I'm gonna have to kill you. And

0:55:37.920 --> 0:55:41.120
<v Speaker 2>so that's what she seemingly does. She runs the couch

0:55:41.200 --> 0:55:44.440
<v Speaker 2>through with a sword from the wall. Blood drips out

0:55:44.440 --> 0:55:46.840
<v Speaker 2>onto the floor. At that Up until that point, I

0:55:46.840 --> 0:55:48.919
<v Speaker 2>wasn't sure it even had anyone in there, because that's

0:55:48.960 --> 0:55:51.680
<v Speaker 2>the thing. You know, Aketchi's not in there really, you know,

0:55:51.760 --> 0:55:54.920
<v Speaker 2>he's a tape recorder or something. But blood comes out,

0:55:55.080 --> 0:55:58.240
<v Speaker 2>and then she has the gang throw the skewered straps

0:55:58.280 --> 0:55:59.919
<v Speaker 2>sofa overboard into the wace.

0:56:00.760 --> 0:56:03.760
<v Speaker 3>We see it like disappearing rapidly into the dark water

0:56:03.840 --> 0:56:05.880
<v Speaker 3>behind the ship. It's a very evocative shot.

0:56:06.440 --> 0:56:08.120
<v Speaker 2>And she's out there on the deck, you know, feeling

0:56:08.120 --> 0:56:11.200
<v Speaker 2>a bit melancholy by herself. And then a new character emerges,

0:56:11.640 --> 0:56:14.560
<v Speaker 2>who we quickly learn is a trusted hunchback com minion

0:56:14.600 --> 0:56:19.920
<v Speaker 2>of hers, and he kind of like you know, saunters

0:56:20.000 --> 0:56:23.080
<v Speaker 2>up onto the deck there and he apologizes to her

0:56:23.120 --> 0:56:25.080
<v Speaker 2>for not having been there when all this went down.

0:56:25.160 --> 0:56:27.840
<v Speaker 2>He says, I was asleep. He offers some comfort and

0:56:27.880 --> 0:56:29.960
<v Speaker 2>she's like that that's nice. I appreciate it, but I

0:56:29.960 --> 0:56:32.239
<v Speaker 2>need some time alone. And of course this is one

0:56:32.280 --> 0:56:33.560
<v Speaker 2>of those moments we're already like.

0:56:33.600 --> 0:56:38.000
<v Speaker 3>Hmm, yeah hm about this guy. We're never seeing his face,

0:56:38.080 --> 0:56:40.920
<v Speaker 3>like his face is always downturned. Wonder about that.

0:56:41.120 --> 0:56:45.040
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so you will have your suspicions. Those suspicions may

0:56:45.080 --> 0:56:48.399
<v Speaker 2>prove correct, but again in this film, it doesn't matter.

0:56:48.440 --> 0:56:50.480
<v Speaker 2>You're along for the ride. Because if this, if you

0:56:50.480 --> 0:56:53.880
<v Speaker 2>suspect that this hunch back is actually a catchy okay,

0:56:53.960 --> 0:56:56.680
<v Speaker 2>then the question is when will he dramatically reveal himself?

0:56:56.719 --> 0:56:58.640
<v Speaker 2>And that's what we're we're on board for.

0:56:59.160 --> 0:57:01.279
<v Speaker 3>So we're here at Act three where we make it

0:57:01.320 --> 0:57:06.000
<v Speaker 3>all the way to Black Lizard's Fortress of fortress of

0:57:07.040 --> 0:57:12.120
<v Speaker 3>I don't know of Crimtude. Yeah. So the ship arrives

0:57:12.200 --> 0:57:15.080
<v Speaker 3>and Rob, can you describe this place? I would kind

0:57:15.080 --> 0:57:19.280
<v Speaker 3>of compare it a bit to Scare Manga's Layer in

0:57:19.320 --> 0:57:20.680
<v Speaker 3>The Man with the Golden Gun.

0:57:21.560 --> 0:57:24.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, it is. It is a campy de light

0:57:24.440 --> 0:57:27.200
<v Speaker 2>that brings that to mind. It brings to mind the

0:57:27.280 --> 0:57:33.120
<v Speaker 2>various layers of doctor fibes as well as danger diabolic fibes.

0:57:33.160 --> 0:57:35.040
<v Speaker 2>Would very much approve of this because it's essentially a

0:57:35.080 --> 0:57:39.720
<v Speaker 2>cabaret ballroom where we see the taxidermied or otherwise preserved,

0:57:39.960 --> 0:57:42.080
<v Speaker 2>you know, the exact science that this doesn't matter, the

0:57:42.160 --> 0:57:46.120
<v Speaker 2>preserved bodies of the beautiful ones that she's collected on display,

0:57:46.240 --> 0:57:49.560
<v Speaker 2>these dolls, wax figures, however you want to make them.

0:57:50.240 --> 0:57:53.640
<v Speaker 2>There are all these curtains we see these often topless figures,

0:57:54.320 --> 0:57:57.240
<v Speaker 2>and as always in these films, these are of course films.

0:57:57.280 --> 0:57:59.920
<v Speaker 2>These are of course live actors frozen and still live,

0:58:00.280 --> 0:58:02.800
<v Speaker 2>which just compounds the creepiness of the situation.

0:58:03.360 --> 0:58:07.840
<v Speaker 3>So she's like going through here showing Sinnay all of

0:58:07.880 --> 0:58:11.840
<v Speaker 3>these these frozen people, and it's leading up to the

0:58:12.280 --> 0:58:14.880
<v Speaker 3>explanation that, like, Senay, I'm going to make you one

0:58:14.920 --> 0:58:16.720
<v Speaker 3>of my frozen wax dolls here.

0:58:17.120 --> 0:58:19.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and we see that one of the main tableaus,

0:58:19.880 --> 0:58:22.360
<v Speaker 2>because they're all posed in dramatic poses, you know, it's

0:58:22.360 --> 0:58:24.920
<v Speaker 2>like a wax museum. One of the tableaux concerns a

0:58:24.960 --> 0:58:29.600
<v Speaker 2>pair of knife fighters, with a particularly absolutely jacked combatant

0:58:30.000 --> 0:58:34.200
<v Speaker 2>like just you know, rippling muscles, stabbing his opponent in

0:58:34.360 --> 0:58:38.720
<v Speaker 2>mid grapple. The shirtless stabber here is played by Mashima,

0:58:39.240 --> 0:58:42.080
<v Speaker 2>and a brief backstory is kind of revealed visually where

0:58:42.080 --> 0:58:44.800
<v Speaker 2>we it looks like these two men were made to

0:58:44.880 --> 0:58:48.840
<v Speaker 2>fight to the death for Black Lizard's affections, and I

0:58:48.840 --> 0:58:52.640
<v Speaker 2>guess both both victor and the defeated here end up

0:58:53.480 --> 0:58:55.600
<v Speaker 2>being immortalized as a doll.

0:58:55.840 --> 0:58:57.479
<v Speaker 3>I didn't know if there was a victor. It looked

0:58:57.480 --> 0:58:59.680
<v Speaker 3>like they were both stabbing each other at the same time.

0:58:59.800 --> 0:59:03.760
<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, they well, in a way then I guess

0:59:03.760 --> 0:59:07.479
<v Speaker 2>they both lost and boast both won, because that's the thing.

0:59:08.320 --> 0:59:10.560
<v Speaker 2>You lose and that you die, but you win to

0:59:10.600 --> 0:59:13.520
<v Speaker 2>a certain extent in that you are immortalized in Black

0:59:13.520 --> 0:59:18.640
<v Speaker 2>Lizard's layer and in this form without life, without a soul,

0:59:19.160 --> 0:59:21.080
<v Speaker 2>then you know you have come as close to the

0:59:21.120 --> 0:59:26.280
<v Speaker 2>Diamond Heart as possible and therefore are deserving of her

0:59:26.440 --> 0:59:27.280
<v Speaker 2>true affections.

0:59:27.520 --> 0:59:29.800
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, it seems that men are just sort of like

0:59:30.000 --> 0:59:34.280
<v Speaker 3>lining up to die for Black Lizard and be preserved

0:59:34.320 --> 0:59:37.680
<v Speaker 3>as a statue in her layer forever. They're ready for it.

0:59:37.880 --> 0:59:40.000
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and women too. I guess it's like men and

0:59:40.040 --> 0:59:44.240
<v Speaker 2>women on display. But this is this moment where again

0:59:44.480 --> 0:59:49.640
<v Speaker 2>it's far more than cameo because the jacked stabber played

0:59:49.640 --> 0:59:53.920
<v Speaker 2>by Mashima here, she moves in and she kisses him

0:59:53.920 --> 0:59:56.720
<v Speaker 2>on the lips in what is I think the only

0:59:57.240 --> 0:59:59.720
<v Speaker 2>kiss that we see in the picture. Could be wrong

0:59:59.800 --> 1:00:02.000
<v Speaker 2>on that, but it certainly is the most important one,

1:00:02.240 --> 1:00:04.920
<v Speaker 2>and it's a really powerful moment and a moment that

1:00:05.080 --> 1:00:09.000
<v Speaker 2>is also very crushing for the musician i'm A Miya

1:00:09.080 --> 1:00:12.200
<v Speaker 2>who is watching on because this is what causes him

1:00:12.280 --> 1:00:15.080
<v Speaker 2>to turn against Black Lizard because he tries to help

1:00:15.160 --> 1:00:18.600
<v Speaker 2>Sana briefly locking the master criminal in her own cell.

1:00:19.120 --> 1:00:22.000
<v Speaker 2>But then we eventually learned that this kiss didn't so

1:00:22.160 --> 1:00:25.400
<v Speaker 2>much as turn him against Black Lizard. He's not like, oh,

1:00:25.680 --> 1:00:29.120
<v Speaker 2>I'm really not into you, you know, kissing the preserved

1:00:29.120 --> 1:00:33.040
<v Speaker 2>bodies of dead men. No, it made him turn against

1:00:33.040 --> 1:00:36.320
<v Speaker 2>Black Lizard because he realized the only way to fulfill

1:00:36.360 --> 1:00:40.200
<v Speaker 2>his obsession was through death. A bold action like this

1:00:40.320 --> 1:00:43.439
<v Speaker 2>he hopes will result first in his death and then

1:00:43.560 --> 1:00:46.080
<v Speaker 2>in his immortalization as one of her dolls.

1:00:46.640 --> 1:00:51.120
<v Speaker 3>Right, so he's like, now I'm just the unappreciated lackey

1:00:51.280 --> 1:00:55.280
<v Speaker 3>of Black Lizard, But he realizes that she truly loves

1:00:55.360 --> 1:00:58.920
<v Speaker 3>her sort of stuffed statue figures, and the only way

1:00:58.960 --> 1:01:01.280
<v Speaker 3>he can really be loved by her is to make

1:01:01.360 --> 1:01:05.280
<v Speaker 3>her kill him in punishment for his treachery and turn

1:01:05.360 --> 1:01:07.800
<v Speaker 3>him into a statue, and then he'll be loved by her.

1:01:08.080 --> 1:01:12.480
<v Speaker 2>So that I'm amia Redemption Arch. He enters a very

1:01:12.560 --> 1:01:17.360
<v Speaker 2>like like even more tragic and weird section because again,

1:01:17.440 --> 1:01:20.720
<v Speaker 2>for Black Loser, perfect love is soulless. It's the diamond heart,

1:01:20.760 --> 1:01:22.760
<v Speaker 2>and the only place she truly knows where to find

1:01:22.800 --> 1:01:25.760
<v Speaker 2>this is in her is in her dolls. As a

1:01:25.800 --> 1:01:28.160
<v Speaker 2>means of cultivating it as well in herself.

1:01:28.520 --> 1:01:31.600
<v Speaker 3>Oh man, But there are some more twists that come in.

1:01:31.800 --> 1:01:32.000
<v Speaker 2>Now.

1:01:32.080 --> 1:01:36.520
<v Speaker 3>One of the weirdest choices I thought is so Sinay

1:01:36.840 --> 1:01:40.360
<v Speaker 3>and Emma Mia are both kept in this prison cell.

1:01:40.440 --> 1:01:44.200
<v Speaker 3>Emmia discloses everything here. He's like, yeah, here's what I'm

1:01:44.240 --> 1:01:46.440
<v Speaker 3>trying to do. I'm trying to get turned into a statue.

1:01:47.320 --> 1:01:47.760
<v Speaker 2>Uh.

1:01:47.800 --> 1:01:52.840
<v Speaker 3>And then Sinay reveals I'm not actually Sinnay. I am

1:01:52.880 --> 1:01:56.520
<v Speaker 3>a body double. I am a woman named Yoko who

1:01:56.600 --> 1:01:59.880
<v Speaker 3>was hired by a Catchee to pretend to be sent

1:02:00.440 --> 1:02:04.160
<v Speaker 3>to keep her safe from Black Lizard. And I think

1:02:04.200 --> 1:02:06.320
<v Speaker 3>this is not just for part of the movie. I

1:02:06.320 --> 1:02:10.480
<v Speaker 3>think this character the entire film has actually just been

1:02:10.600 --> 1:02:12.400
<v Speaker 3>this body double named Yoko.

1:02:12.760 --> 1:02:15.160
<v Speaker 2>I believe. So that's the way I interpret it. Yeah.

1:02:15.680 --> 1:02:19.720
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, Also, Yoko the body double and I'm gonna be

1:02:19.760 --> 1:02:22.880
<v Speaker 3>a they sort of bond over the fact that they

1:02:22.920 --> 1:02:26.840
<v Speaker 3>are both both frauds in some way, and then they

1:02:26.920 --> 1:02:28.520
<v Speaker 3>fall in love while imprisoned.

1:02:28.760 --> 1:02:31.200
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and so then we get the redemption arc more

1:02:31.280 --> 1:02:34.840
<v Speaker 2>less back on track for our men. I'm amia here,

1:02:35.120 --> 1:02:37.840
<v Speaker 2>but from here we work our way into the big finish. Okay,

1:02:37.840 --> 1:02:40.320
<v Speaker 2>that hunchback reveal that we saw coming a mile away.

1:02:40.640 --> 1:02:43.920
<v Speaker 2>It happens. It is a catchy. It's been a catchy

1:02:43.960 --> 1:02:47.400
<v Speaker 2>the whole time. The actual hunchback was in the futon

1:02:47.480 --> 1:02:50.640
<v Speaker 2>and was stabbed through. The Snake Woman goes in for

1:02:50.640 --> 1:02:53.880
<v Speaker 2>the kill. Okay, well, also Aketche's men like the fuzz

1:02:53.920 --> 1:02:55.560
<v Speaker 2>show up there on the scene. I don't know where

1:02:55.560 --> 1:02:57.920
<v Speaker 2>they came from, but they, you know, backups have arrived.

1:02:58.560 --> 1:03:00.840
<v Speaker 2>Snake Woman goes in for the kill against a ketchi,

1:03:00.960 --> 1:03:04.600
<v Speaker 2>but Black Lizard stops her and kills Snake Woman dead.

1:03:05.440 --> 1:03:09.040
<v Speaker 2>Black Lizard then retreats into her inner chambers. A Ketchee follows.

1:03:09.080 --> 1:03:12.000
<v Speaker 2>He pursues, but when he finds her, she has already

1:03:12.000 --> 1:03:14.640
<v Speaker 2>taken a fatal poison, and so the two of them

1:03:14.680 --> 1:03:18.320
<v Speaker 2>lounge together on her couch like lovers, sharing a tender moment,

1:03:18.720 --> 1:03:21.880
<v Speaker 2>and she observes that she has at last found the

1:03:21.880 --> 1:03:25.960
<v Speaker 2>perfect diamond heart in a catchy because he was able

1:03:26.000 --> 1:03:30.520
<v Speaker 2>to outsmarter and out double and triple cross her, you know,

1:03:31.200 --> 1:03:35.200
<v Speaker 2>and then she dies in this yeah, this this tragic

1:03:35.280 --> 1:03:38.720
<v Speaker 2>and beautiful like Shakespearean moment. And then I'm a Mia

1:03:38.760 --> 1:03:42.600
<v Speaker 2>and Son or the fake sna run off together there

1:03:42.600 --> 1:03:45.800
<v Speaker 2>now a couple. The case is solved, but we close

1:03:45.800 --> 1:03:48.120
<v Speaker 2>out with a lot of stylish shots of Black Lizard

1:03:48.160 --> 1:03:50.240
<v Speaker 2>as the credits roll, because it's you know, we got

1:03:50.240 --> 1:03:52.760
<v Speaker 2>to leave everything on a stylish happy note.

1:03:52.760 --> 1:03:56.440
<v Speaker 3>To a certain extent, I almost took the happy ending

1:03:56.480 --> 1:04:00.920
<v Speaker 3>for Ama Mia and the sane body double. I almost

1:04:00.920 --> 1:04:03.760
<v Speaker 3>took that as is, like it was supposed to be funny,

1:04:03.800 --> 1:04:05.960
<v Speaker 3>the way they're just allowed to run off together.

1:04:06.160 --> 1:04:09.120
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, yeah, maybe that is a splash of comedy

1:04:09.160 --> 1:04:12.320
<v Speaker 2>where it's like, hey, we're both fakes, but we're in

1:04:12.320 --> 1:04:14.320
<v Speaker 2>love now. And then then they run off together, Like

1:04:14.360 --> 1:04:17.800
<v Speaker 2>where are you guys going? You're on like a criminal mastermind,

1:04:17.840 --> 1:04:21.520
<v Speaker 2>Like you should probably hang around and leave with the police.

1:04:21.560 --> 1:04:22.680
<v Speaker 2>But I don't know.

1:04:23.000 --> 1:04:26.000
<v Speaker 3>Well, I thought Black Lizard was a rollicking good time.

1:04:26.720 --> 1:04:29.520
<v Speaker 2>Absolutely. I had high hopes for this film, and it

1:04:29.600 --> 1:04:32.600
<v Speaker 2>didn't disappoint. I was interested when I read about it

1:04:32.720 --> 1:04:36.520
<v Speaker 2>in Fukusaku's filmography when we talked about him previously, and

1:04:36.560 --> 1:04:38.959
<v Speaker 2>then when I went and rented it at Video Drum

1:04:39.000 --> 1:04:41.680
<v Speaker 2>here in Atlanta, John, one of the crew there, really

1:04:41.720 --> 1:04:45.520
<v Speaker 2>talked it up, and again, the film absolutely delivered. Maybe

1:04:45.560 --> 1:04:48.720
<v Speaker 2>I'm a romanticist but now I too believe that crime

1:04:48.760 --> 1:04:51.840
<v Speaker 2>should wear a gorgeous gown with a train fifteen feet long,

1:04:52.280 --> 1:04:54.800
<v Speaker 2>just like the primordial dreams of lizards.

1:04:54.840 --> 1:04:56.720
<v Speaker 3>Well said, all.

1:04:56.560 --> 1:04:59.040
<v Speaker 2>Right, well, we're going to go and close it out here.

1:05:00.200 --> 1:05:02.320
<v Speaker 2>I hope you enjoyed our chat about Black Lizard, and

1:05:02.480 --> 1:05:04.800
<v Speaker 2>more importantly, I hope you enjoy Black Lizard. I hope

1:05:04.800 --> 1:05:06.120
<v Speaker 2>you're able to get a hold of it, and I

1:05:06.160 --> 1:05:09.080
<v Speaker 2>hope that, hopefully in the not too distant future, we

1:05:09.160 --> 1:05:12.479
<v Speaker 2>see an actual like Blu Ray release for this film.

1:05:12.520 --> 1:05:15.360
<v Speaker 2>It's very deserving of it, and hey, you might be

1:05:15.440 --> 1:05:17.400
<v Speaker 2>lucky enough to see it at a film festival somewhere,

1:05:17.440 --> 1:05:19.920
<v Speaker 2>and if you get the chance, make sure you do it.

1:05:20.480 --> 1:05:23.200
<v Speaker 2>Reminder that Stuff to Blow Your Mind is primarily a

1:05:23.240 --> 1:05:26.040
<v Speaker 2>science and culture podcast, with core episodes on Tuesdays and Thursdays,

1:05:26.040 --> 1:05:28.200
<v Speaker 2>but we do listener mail on Mondays, short form episodes

1:05:28.200 --> 1:05:30.920
<v Speaker 2>on Wednesdays, and on Fridays. We set aside most serious

1:05:30.920 --> 1:05:33.680
<v Speaker 2>concerns to just talk about a weird film on Weird

1:05:33.720 --> 1:05:36.000
<v Speaker 2>House Cinema. If you want to see a complete list

1:05:36.000 --> 1:05:38.040
<v Speaker 2>of all the movies we've covered thus far, and sometimes

1:05:38.080 --> 1:05:40.600
<v Speaker 2>a peek ahead at what's to come, go to letterbox

1:05:40.640 --> 1:05:42.480
<v Speaker 2>dot com. It's l E T T E r box

1:05:42.560 --> 1:05:45.040
<v Speaker 2>d dot com. Our username is weird house, and we've

1:05:45.040 --> 1:05:47.640
<v Speaker 2>got a wonderful list there that you can peruse and

1:05:48.040 --> 1:05:50.360
<v Speaker 2>see what might be up your alley and what you

1:05:50.400 --> 1:05:52.800
<v Speaker 2>want to add to your own to watch list.

1:05:53.320 --> 1:05:57.280
<v Speaker 3>Huge thanks as always to our excellent audio producer JJ Posway.

1:05:57.480 --> 1:05:59.040
<v Speaker 3>If you would like to get in touch with us

1:05:59.040 --> 1:06:01.680
<v Speaker 3>with feedback on this episode or any other, to suggest

1:06:01.680 --> 1:06:03.800
<v Speaker 3>a topic for the future, or just to say hello,

1:06:04.200 --> 1:06:06.840
<v Speaker 3>you can email us at contact at stuff to Blow

1:06:06.880 --> 1:06:14.560
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1:06:14.680 --> 1:06:17.640
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