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Speaker 1: Hey, everyone, Josh and Chuck here to remind you that

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Speaker 1: our last three shows of the year. Boy, this is

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Speaker 1: a good show this year are taking place very soon

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Speaker 1: and tickets are still available.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so get in the saddle and come out and

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Speaker 2: see us partners in Orlando, Atlanta, and Nashville.

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Speaker 1: Just go to stuff youshould know dot com and click

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Speaker 1: on the tour link and you can get all your

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Speaker 1: tickets right there. Welcome to Stuff you Should Know, a

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Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh and there's

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Speaker 2: Chuck and Jerry's here too, and this is Stuff you

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Speaker 2: should Know about PCP.

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Speaker 3: And yes, we're talking about the PCP. You think we're.

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Speaker 1: Talking the one from the if you were a child

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Speaker 1: of the seventies and eighties, where you heard that your

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Speaker 1: friend's friend's cousin did it and they carve their face

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Speaker 1: off with a butcher knife and then jumped off a

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Speaker 1: building so they thought they could fly.

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Speaker 2: Yes, as a matter of fact, that's exactly the PCP

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Speaker 2: we're talking about, Yeah, which stands for By the way,

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Speaker 2: I'm gonna attempt this chemical name.

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Speaker 1: You're ready, This one's easy, no pressure.

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Speaker 2: Okay, I don't know how to say the ones. So

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Speaker 2: I'm just gonna that's I think it's kind of important

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Speaker 2: chemically speaking. I think they didn't just put part of

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Speaker 2: it in parentheses for nothing. But I'm just gonna call

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Speaker 2: it one one fennel cyclo hexel, pepper dye and those

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Speaker 2: in the number dye pipper dye, piper dye, probably piper dyne.

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Speaker 2: I think it's those in the know who don't smoke PCP.

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Speaker 2: But oh, I actually took out a syllable this time.

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Speaker 1: Oh man, this is gold.

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Speaker 2: So the people who study it call it fen cyclodine, okay,

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Speaker 2: with a pH because it's fat.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. And if you if you're wondering, like, oh, why

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Speaker 1: do people even study this old street drug from the seventies,

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Speaker 1: it's because it wasn't always that. It was kind of

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Speaker 1: the precursor to the ketamine in a lot of ways,

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Speaker 1: which we'll talk about here and there. And if you

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Speaker 1: think people study ketamine the party drug, well that's true too,

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Speaker 1: because both PCP and ketamine had legitimate uses and were

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Speaker 1: created for legitimate uses like mini drugs, yeah, recreational drugs.

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Speaker 2: The Germans gave us both heroin and PCP. I think

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Speaker 2: in nineteen twenty six, German chemists created PCP. I'm not

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Speaker 2: sure what they were creating it for. I think this

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Speaker 2: is a time of experimentation in chemistry where you just

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Speaker 2: put stuff together and saw what happened. Sure, So it

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Speaker 2: sat on the shelf for almost thirty years before Park Davis,

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Speaker 2: a pharmaceutical company from the United States which is now

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Speaker 2: part of Pfizer. I believe they came along and they said, Hey,

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Speaker 2: this would be a gangbuster's tranquilizer sedative something. Let's forget

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Speaker 2: out what to do with this because I just smoke

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Speaker 2: some out back and I feel like a million bucks.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I gotta tell you, we should use this stuff.

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Speaker 2: So they looked at it as an anesthetic at first,

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Speaker 2: and I think it first came to market in like

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Speaker 2: the mid fifties, and by nineteen sixty five they had

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Speaker 2: removed it.

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Speaker 3: From the market.

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Speaker 2: The reason they removed it from the market is one

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Speaker 2: it showed very quickly it had a high potential for abuse,

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Speaker 2: because the hippies in San Francisco started smoking it before

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Speaker 2: there was even hippies in San Francisco. Yeah, and it

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Speaker 2: had a slew of side effects that you just really

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Speaker 2: don't want, which is one of the reasons why we'll

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Speaker 2: say you probably shouldn't do PCP.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, we should have led with that. Sure, Like what

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Speaker 1: if someone heard the first what is this four minutes

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Speaker 1: of the episode.

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Speaker 3: It turned it out, they're like, I gotta go try PCP.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, because Josh and Chuck said it exists, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: don't do PCP, everybody, you shouldn't do that. And this

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Speaker 1: is not, you know, coming as a sort of satanic,

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Speaker 1: panicky eighties you're gonna jump off a building because you

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Speaker 1: think you can fly kind of thing. It's just not

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Speaker 1: a drug you want to do. So, like you said,

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Speaker 1: you know, uses, well, I don't think we've even said it. Yes,

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Speaker 1: uses really dropped off over the years. It was a

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Speaker 1: very much a bigger deal in the nineteen seventies and eighties.

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Speaker 1: I think stats that the Grabster found for US saw

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Speaker 1: that between seventy six and seventy seven, use among high

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Speaker 1: school students doubled. In a nineteen seventy nine study, seven

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Speaker 1: percent of high school seniors reported having used PCP in

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Speaker 1: the last year. In twenty thirteen that was down to

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Speaker 1: less than one percent, and then in twenty twenty. Though

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Speaker 1: the stats are a little bit different. I think it

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Speaker 1: went down to like point zero zero zero two percent

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Speaker 1: of the country, not just high school students.

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Speaker 3: So of adults.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, like fifty two thousand people. Well, adults, it's just

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Speaker 1: twelve and over.

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Speaker 3: Hey, you're old enough to smoke PCP. You're old enough

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Speaker 3: to be considered an adult.

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Speaker 1: That's right. But you can't vote.

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Speaker 2: It doesn't matter what age you are. If you smoke

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Speaker 2: a lot of PCP, you probably shouldn't vote anyway.

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Speaker 1: Right. Oh, I thought you're gonna say, then you've earned

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Speaker 1: the right to vote.

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Speaker 3: No, No, I think the opposite.

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Speaker 1: Maybe.

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Speaker 3: I don't know.

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Speaker 1: So all that to say, it used to be a pretty,

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Speaker 1: you know, frequent recreation, recreational street drug, and it has

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Speaker 1: really really gone out of fashion, in large part because

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Speaker 1: ketamine is not the same exact thing, but it's it's

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Speaker 1: largely the same thing, and that became I guess, the

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Speaker 1: trendier drug to use.

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Speaker 2: Yes, but it has remained in fashion in certain pockets,

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Speaker 2: especially like deep in the inner cities of Washington, d C.

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Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, Kansas City, Okay.

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Speaker 3: I believe it's a town in Connecticut, Hartford.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if it's Hartford, but there's at least

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Speaker 2: two towns in Connecticut that have interesting a lot of

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Speaker 2: PCP use and they think I read this really great

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Speaker 2: article and vice about why America is the only country

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Speaker 2: in the world basically literally where people use PCP still

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Speaker 2: or ever ever, but it's still as well. Ever, yeah,

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Speaker 2: it never really made it out of America. It was

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Speaker 2: written by Max Daley and sam Irravani. It's definitely worth

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Speaker 2: a read. But they say, one of the reasons why

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Speaker 2: it's so overlooked and one of the reasons why it's

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Speaker 2: not that studied, and one of the reasons why you're

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Speaker 2: just like, yeah, ketamine replace it is because the people

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Speaker 2: who do use it tend to be marginalized. Unemployed, black

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Speaker 2: inner city men ages mid twenties to mid fifties are

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Speaker 2: typically the people who get busted for PCP. So it's

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Speaker 2: kind of like this viewed as this drug that like

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Speaker 2: a drug of inequality, I think.

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Speaker 3: Is how they put it.

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Speaker 2: And that'll come up late too, because some of the

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Speaker 2: myths around it seem to be tied to the people

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Speaker 2: who use it.

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Speaker 1: Now, I'm not a very smart person, but if if

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Speaker 1: there are like two towns or two cities in Connecticut

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Speaker 1: that are known for PCP, still doesn't that just mean

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Speaker 1: there's someone in two towns in Connecticut that are making PCP.

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Speaker 2: So no, almost all of the PCP in the world,

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Speaker 2: because it's almost all of the PCP in the United

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Speaker 2: States are still controlled and made by black street gangs

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Speaker 2: in LA, like crips, bloods.

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Speaker 3: It's weird.

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Speaker 1: Then, how does it get to these two weird specific

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Speaker 1: places in Connecticut right now?

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Speaker 2: Those cities that still do and have always smoked PCP

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Speaker 2: it's always been around, are cities that have like clearly

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Speaker 2: some way or another, very deep ties to those same

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Speaker 2: LA street gangs. Because it's really hard to distribute PC,

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Speaker 2: really hard, So for it to show up in Connecticut

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Speaker 2: from LA, there's some there's like somebody's cousin lives there

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Speaker 2: and is controlling the PCP market.

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Speaker 3: They're getting it to actually from.

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Speaker 2: Somebody in LA who knows a chemist who will go

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Speaker 2: out into the desert and make hm PCP all day long.

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Speaker 1: Oh oh, that makes sense because I just I don't know.

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Speaker 1: It seems like there would be like a Walter Whitton

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Speaker 1: Connecticut or something, but they're still out in the desert.

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Speaker 3: Yes, supposedly it's all coming out from LA.

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Speaker 1: All right. Well, in seventy eight is when the United

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Speaker 1: States government said, all right, this thing is officially a

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Speaker 1: scheduled to controlled substance, which means, you know a lot

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Speaker 1: of things we've talked about the different drug schedules, but

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Speaker 1: it means that its prevalence of abuse is a big deal,

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Speaker 1: and that it can be addictive, and you know, it's

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Speaker 1: ranked right up there with cocaine and crystal meth and

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Speaker 1: stuff like that, which I think we've covered all those before.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and in fact, it shares a precursor drug, pyrad dene,

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Speaker 2: with crystal meth. But it's not that, No, it is not,

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Speaker 2: and it actually does have anesthetic effects. Like one of

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Speaker 2: the side effects of in ingesting PCP one way or

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Speaker 2: another is like, not only do you not really feel pain,

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Speaker 2: you don't experience pain because you're disassociated from your body.

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Speaker 2: It's a disassociative, hypnotic sedative essentially, and one of the

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Speaker 2: reasons why, sure, you have to add the essentially though

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Speaker 2: comma essentially sure, but one of the reasons why PCP

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Speaker 2: and ketamine were first brought to market was because they

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Speaker 2: produce sedative effects, like you don't really know what's going

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Speaker 2: on after a certain dose. You're not really with it.

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Speaker 2: You actually can fall into a coma with your eyes open,

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Speaker 2: but it doesn't slow your heart rate or pulse or.

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Speaker 3: Anything like that.

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Speaker 2: So it really made a Ketamine in particular, found a

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Speaker 2: great use as a battlefield sedative for surgery in like Vietnam,

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Speaker 2: where somebody might have lost a lot of blood. They

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Speaker 2: couldn't hand a traditional sedative or anesthesia, so they gave

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Speaker 2: them ketamine and it did the same trick without dropping

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Speaker 2: their blood pressure even further.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and and what's good for the battlefield is good

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Speaker 1: for the rave. But it makes total sense, you know

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Speaker 1: because if you were like, as far as the rave

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Speaker 1: culture goes or went, I don't think is that still

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Speaker 1: a thing? Even I it's got to be somewhere.

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Speaker 3: It isn't.

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Speaker 2: It's it's coming back soon because the nineties are so

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Speaker 2: hot right now.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, somebody's out there raven with their big they're not

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Speaker 1: bell bottoms. Even did this have a name? No, it

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Speaker 1: was just like the pants that had like like two

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Speaker 1: foot what's it called there at the bottom with what's

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Speaker 1: the bottom of your pants, like called the cuff cuff.

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Speaker 3: The bottom of those big pants.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they didn't, but the whole leg was like that. Essentially,

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Speaker 2: it was just the waste that was a generally normal size.

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Speaker 2: The legs were huge. Believe me, buddy, I had more

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Speaker 2: than one pair of those.

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Speaker 1: I thought they flared. Anything to see you in a

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Speaker 1: pair of those.

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Speaker 2: I had some cool ones too, but I also had

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Speaker 2: some uncool ones.

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Speaker 1: We used to when we lived in these warehouses in

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Speaker 1: the West end of Atlanta and ninety nine two thousand

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Speaker 1: would and this is that was a big rave loft

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Speaker 1: over there, Like people would drive from different states to

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Speaker 1: go to these things, thousands of kids, and we used

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Speaker 1: to just sit around and play pavement and laugh and

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Speaker 1: make fun of them in those pants.

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Speaker 3: And they were doing ketamine, ketamine, ketamine, and you're.

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Speaker 1: Like, like those losers probably, But where I was going

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Speaker 1: with all this was I guess it makes sense why

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Speaker 1: the PCP and ketamine and that kind of thing would

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Speaker 1: have been because you know, you feel funky, but it

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Speaker 1: doesn't like slow you down, essentially.

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Speaker 2: No, And in fact, it can actually increase your heart

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Speaker 2: rate and do all sorts of other weird stuff to you.

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Speaker 3: And what's really odd about.

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Speaker 2: It is that it has a lot of paradoxical effects

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Speaker 2: on humans. I say, we talk a little bit about

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Speaker 2: how it impacts the brain, and I think that it'll

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Speaker 2: become apparent.

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Speaker 1: What do you think, Yeah, let's do it.

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Speaker 2: So it's it's considered a N methyl d aspirate antagonist.

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Speaker 2: NMDA antagonists and NMDA receptors are really important as far

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Speaker 2: as things like memory formation, neuroplasticity, very important stuff. But

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Speaker 2: what they they're triggered by glutamate. And what PCP does

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Speaker 2: is it prevents those ndm A receptors from accepting glutamate

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Speaker 2: and hence firing. And because there's either more glutamate or

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Speaker 2: less glutamate in your body, I think less glutamate floating

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Speaker 2: around is what it is. A Whole host of other

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Speaker 2: stuff happens, like dopamine and nourep and ephyrin get released,

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Speaker 2: those two and serotonin their reuptake is inhibited, so they're

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Speaker 2: floating around in your your brain even longer.

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Speaker 1: So that's all the good feely stuff, right.

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Speaker 2: Your opioid receptors are stimulated as a result, your nicotinic receptors,

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Speaker 2: which control things like your neural muscular activity rapid neural

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Speaker 2: transmission essentially, and then your muscarinic activity, which includes like breathing,

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Speaker 2: your pupil's salivation. All these things are going haywire. And

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Speaker 2: then what else is weird about it is that your

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Speaker 2: central nervous system can be both depressed and excited by

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Speaker 2: this same drug. This is how this is how nuts

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Speaker 2: and effect it has on your brain, so that you

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Speaker 2: can cycle between like utter sedation to the point of catatonia,

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Speaker 2: and between that and serious agitation where like you see

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Speaker 2: you know, videos of people who are being arrested and

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Speaker 2: they're not like hitting the ground even though they're getting

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Speaker 2: sprayed in the face of bear spray because they're so

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Speaker 2: on like a rant. So it has like all these

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Speaker 2: really crazy effects, but it all comes down to the

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Speaker 2: fact that it affects your ability to receive glue tomate

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Speaker 2: in your NMDA receptors.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and we'll talk a bit more about that sort

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Speaker 1: of reputation as like a superhuman strength, like you know,

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Speaker 1: takes twelve cops to subdue someone on PCP thing. And

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Speaker 1: a little bit what were those people on those videos

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Speaker 1: that you sent me? Okay, so Josh sent me some

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Speaker 1: videos and people I guess the next day or whatever

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Speaker 1: on ketamine or I assume it was the next.

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Speaker 3: I think it was hours later. It was like hours afterwards.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, And they were almost all of them when

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Speaker 1: they were walking like down the sidewalk or whatever, had

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Speaker 1: this backward lean as if they were walking up like

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Speaker 1: a very very steep hill, but it was on solid ground.

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Speaker 1: And then the one guy if it was a very

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Speaker 1: slight incline on the sidewalk and he would take a

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Speaker 1: few steps up and then take a few back, and yeah,

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Speaker 1: he had. They were all having a hard time, and

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Speaker 1: it was just I don't know, it's just sad to

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Speaker 1: see someone in that sort of a stupor around in

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Speaker 1: the daylight when people are going to work and stuff.

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Speaker 2: Right, Well, the thing that really kind of makes it

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Speaker 2: worth watching is they're with it enough to know that

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Speaker 2: they shouldn't be walking weird in public, and they need

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Speaker 2: to tell they suspect that they might be.

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Speaker 1: So it's kind of funny in a way, but it's

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Speaker 1: really not when you really think about it.

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Speaker 3: You know, well, watching.

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Speaker 2: Them play it off or try to play it off

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Speaker 2: and just fail utterly at it, that's that's objectively funny

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Speaker 2: to see it.

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Speaker 1: Well, And it doesn't help that they did the Staying

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Speaker 1: Alive Beg's song cut to it. We used to there

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Speaker 1: was my friend in college used to call not on drugs,

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Speaker 1: but if you were drunk and you were trying to

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Speaker 1: like play it off like you were super sober and

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Speaker 1: walking around. He called that sugarfooting, like you're just you're

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Speaker 1: not just like, oh, I'm just gonna walk down the

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Speaker 1: street thinking left foot, right foot, everything's fine, exactly. You

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Speaker 1: called it sugarfoot in, which always thought was kind funny.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a term for that, a medical term for it,

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Speaker 2: choreo something. I'm sure I'll turn it up at some point,

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Speaker 2: But basically, it's unwanted muscle movement. So you're trying to

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Speaker 2: just walk, but you're also doing like you're also just

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Speaker 2: just like you're dancing, says, even though you don't mean

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Speaker 2: to and you're trying really hard not to.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly.

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Speaker 2: So one of the that's one of the side effects

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Speaker 2: of it, is these unwanted muscle movements. And then also

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Speaker 2: for that reason, in San Francisco, when it first started

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Speaker 2: being abused on the street, the hippies called it wobble weed. Oh, yeah,

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Speaker 2: which makes a lot more sense now that you you

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Speaker 2: know a little bit more about it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And we'll talk about the association with marijuana too, uh,

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Speaker 1: in a little bit. But why don't we take a break? Yeah, yep,

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Speaker 1: all right, we'll put on staying alive and we'll stumble

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Speaker 1: up the sidewalk and we'll you right back, all right.

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Speaker 1: So we talked a little bit about what PCP does

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Speaker 1: to you and sort of in the brain, and also

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Speaker 1: how you can sugar foot up the street. But it's

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Speaker 1: not like, uh, even though it was used as an anesthetic,

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Speaker 1: that that association with sleepiness isn't accurate.

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Speaker 3: Right, No, it's not.

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Speaker 2: And like I said, you can go catatonic with your

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Speaker 2: eyes open, but you're still able to move around and

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Speaker 2: do things that you just shouldn't be doing. Like I

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Speaker 2: saw that people will frequently, like try to get off

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Speaker 2: a stretcher even though they're catatonic.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: And the reason why it's it's a dissociate and you

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Speaker 2: feel not connected to your body. Your senses are coming

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Speaker 2: in hot and weird and not making any.

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Speaker 3: Sense to you. You know.

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Speaker 2: It removes ego boundaries, so your feeling of self and

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Speaker 2: the distinction between you and other people and the rest

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Speaker 2: of the world around you and the supernatural has kind

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Speaker 2: of blurred or fallen away.

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Speaker 1: Right. I've heard dreamlike from well, to be honest, I've

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Speaker 1: known people have done this and they've said dream like.

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Speaker 3: I can I could imagine that.

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Speaker 2: And then also, one of the other things I saw

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Speaker 2: that I thought it was just fascinating is that it's

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Speaker 2: it makes it difficult to tell whether an event has

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Speaker 2: already happened in the past, is going to happen in

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Speaker 2: the future, or is happening.

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Speaker 1: Now right, the whole time time jump thing, right, Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Isn't that nuts?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: And then of course, because it's a hypnotic sedative that

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Speaker 2: affects your your NMDA receptors that are involved in memory formation,

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Speaker 2: you you frequently black out even though you're walking around

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Speaker 2: doing stuff and even interacting, you probably aren't going to.

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Speaker 3: Remember most of it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, big memory impacts. And the stuff comes on very

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Speaker 1: quickly too, which is one of the I think the historically,

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Speaker 1: like the most addictive kind of recreational street drugs are

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Speaker 1: ones that are really fast acting, and PCP is definitely

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Speaker 1: one of those. What I didn't see, or maybe I

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Speaker 1: just overlooked it is how long it lasts.

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Speaker 2: It can last for twenty four hours.

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Speaker 1: Right, it's a long lasting deal. Okay, that's right. I

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Speaker 1: did read that because I remember, like when we did

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Speaker 1: the crack episode. I think I always thought that crack

360
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Speaker 1: was some long term thing, but was shocked to learn

361
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Speaker 1: it was just like a super quick high.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think this can be, but it depends

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Speaker 2: on how.

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Speaker 1: You take it, right, Should we talk about that?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there's different ways you can take it, So let's

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Speaker 2: talk about that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it used to be in the earlier days it

368
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Speaker 1: was like a liquid PCP a lot of times that

369
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Speaker 1: you would take orally, but very quickly. The most recreational

370
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Speaker 1: use users used it like it came in like a

371
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Speaker 1: crystalline powder, and they would typically smoke it or snort

372
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Speaker 1: it like a heroine or a cocaine, I guess, And

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Speaker 1: that became sort of the main way aside from and

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Speaker 1: again I said earlier we were going to talk about

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Speaker 1: the Marijuana Association, that was dipping a marijuana joint or

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Speaker 1: just a regular cigarette, and liquid PCP has you can

377
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Speaker 1: do that with a lot of drugs are called wet drugs,

378
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Speaker 1: and it's it's a thing. And there was some confusion

379
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Speaker 1: about the names because I heard I knew what SHRM

380
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Speaker 1: was because I'd heard that in a movie from Tuarantina movie,

381
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Speaker 1: which one was that really yeah movie. I think it

382
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Speaker 1: was the one he wrote, only was it true romance

383
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Speaker 1: or maybe it was pulp fiction. It was Sam Jackson,

384
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Speaker 1: and he wasn't introu or.

385
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Speaker 3: No, I don't believe he was scared anyway.

386
00:21:01,320 --> 00:21:03,919
Speaker 1: You smoke enough sherms something something something was the line.

387
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Speaker 1: And that's the first time I had heard that word.

388
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Speaker 1: But that's a cigarette that was dipped in embalming chemicals

389
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Speaker 1: and I think kind of like a prison drug a

390
00:21:14,800 --> 00:21:16,720
Speaker 1: lot of times, because that was something that you could

391
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Speaker 1: get apparently easier than you know, regular hard drugs. And

392
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Speaker 1: I think for a time that was like PCP was

393
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Speaker 1: sometimes mixed with embalming fluid. Sometimes the just names were

394
00:21:29,480 --> 00:21:32,080
Speaker 1: used interchangeably. There was a lot of confusion in the

395
00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:37,359
Speaker 1: media about embalming fluid and PCP. Yeah, and I think,

396
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Speaker 1: I mean, I read a lot about it today, and

397
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Speaker 1: where I landed was sometimes it might have been mixed

398
00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:45,400
Speaker 1: with PCP, but sometimes people were smoking inbalming fluid as well.

399
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Speaker 2: So what I found from my research is that so

400
00:21:48,560 --> 00:21:50,400
Speaker 2: this is a big thing in like the mid nineties

401
00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:55,160
Speaker 2: to the early two thousands. Oh really yeah, And that

402
00:21:55,280 --> 00:21:58,320
Speaker 2: if you were smoking embalming fluid and you got high.

403
00:21:58,400 --> 00:22:02,280
Speaker 3: It's because there was PCP in that embalming fluid. Oh,

404
00:22:02,320 --> 00:22:03,680
Speaker 3: so it was mixed, and that it.

405
00:22:03,680 --> 00:22:06,680
Speaker 2: Was yes, and that it was a that I read

406
00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:09,840
Speaker 2: from somebody, a medical examiner, who said, like, there's there.

407
00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:12,280
Speaker 2: You don't get high at all from embalming fluid. He's like,

408
00:22:12,280 --> 00:22:15,120
Speaker 2: I used to mix it myself, and if anybody would

409
00:22:15,160 --> 00:22:17,160
Speaker 2: have gotten high from it, I've spent more time around

410
00:22:17,160 --> 00:22:20,000
Speaker 2: it than most people. Never got even the slightest buzz.

411
00:22:20,400 --> 00:22:24,159
Speaker 2: So it's the PCP that's making you highcha. And it

412
00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:27,119
Speaker 2: might not even be embalming fluid in the first place,

413
00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:31,080
Speaker 2: because PCP has kind of a very distinct chemically smell

414
00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:36,200
Speaker 2: and taste, and it you could easily pass it off

415
00:22:36,240 --> 00:22:39,280
Speaker 2: as embalming fluid to somebody who'd never smoked PCP before.

416
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Speaker 2: The thing that I kind of landed on was that

417
00:22:44,080 --> 00:22:48,000
Speaker 2: it was mistaken either among like recovery people or the

418
00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:52,159
Speaker 2: GA or something. The slang term for PCP embalming fluid

419
00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:56,040
Speaker 2: came to be accepted as Oh, teenagers are now smoking

420
00:22:56,080 --> 00:22:59,679
Speaker 2: embalming fluid. By the L seven's, it ended up in

421
00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:05,360
Speaker 2: the and it became self perpetuating. I think some kind

422
00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:10,480
Speaker 2: of particularly low intelligent drug dealers were like, oh, we

423
00:23:10,520 --> 00:23:13,919
Speaker 2: can sell embalming fluid. We're gonna start robbing funeral homes

424
00:23:14,040 --> 00:23:17,280
Speaker 2: and then actually started selling embalming fluid and it was

425
00:23:17,320 --> 00:23:19,480
Speaker 2: all just a comedy of errors.

426
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Speaker 1: Yeah, that makes sense of why it's so hard to

427
00:23:22,920 --> 00:23:26,200
Speaker 1: separate fact from fiction online today, because it's all over

428
00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:28,000
Speaker 1: the place once you start looking into that thing.

429
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Speaker 2: Yeah, there's not really any drug ever. Crack used to

430
00:23:32,080 --> 00:23:35,720
Speaker 2: come close in the eighties. People were hysterical about crack,

431
00:23:35,800 --> 00:23:39,760
Speaker 2: Crack baby super Predators. Yeah, it was really bad. But

432
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Speaker 2: as like for duration of like the hysterical moral panic

433
00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:47,439
Speaker 2: over it, PCP has every other drug beat by a

434
00:23:47,520 --> 00:23:52,320
Speaker 2: mile because not only is it like urban legend, but

435
00:23:52,359 --> 00:23:56,520
Speaker 2: that urban legend becomes fact because the media reports it. Yeah,

436
00:23:56,920 --> 00:24:01,080
Speaker 2: drug abuse organizations say the same thing, the cops say

437
00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:05,320
Speaker 2: the same thing. Everybody's saying these same things, like if

438
00:24:05,359 --> 00:24:09,080
Speaker 2: you'll have superhuman strength, for example, that is not true.

439
00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:11,600
Speaker 2: You don't get superhuman strength. We'll talk a little more

440
00:24:11,600 --> 00:24:13,320
Speaker 2: about that. I don't want to get ahead of ourselves,

441
00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:17,240
Speaker 2: but it's exactly what you said, is exactly right. There's

442
00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:21,560
Speaker 2: so much disinformation on PCPs you just end up having

443
00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:23,800
Speaker 2: to guess here or there about what's true and what's not.

444
00:24:24,560 --> 00:24:26,119
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, we can go ahead and talk about it.

445
00:24:26,160 --> 00:24:30,320
Speaker 1: Some that was, you know, I invoked the Satanic panic.

446
00:24:30,359 --> 00:24:32,639
Speaker 1: It was sort of around those same times when we

447
00:24:32,680 --> 00:24:37,280
Speaker 1: were kids in the late seventies where I mean, I

448
00:24:37,320 --> 00:24:41,080
Speaker 1: remember PCP was like the scariest sounding thing on the planet,

449
00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:43,959
Speaker 1: and it was sort of made out to be like,

450
00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:47,679
Speaker 1: if you do PCP, there's a very good chance that

451
00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:51,040
Speaker 1: you'll end up dead, and not from like overdosing on PCP,

452
00:24:51,240 --> 00:24:55,000
Speaker 1: but because you've done something crazy, like you know, try

453
00:24:55,080 --> 00:24:58,199
Speaker 1: to bake yourself in an oven or something because you

454
00:24:58,200 --> 00:25:02,400
Speaker 1: thought you were a cake. And every school, every region,

455
00:25:02,520 --> 00:25:07,320
Speaker 1: every town had some story or set of stories that

456
00:25:07,359 --> 00:25:10,720
Speaker 1: were passed around urban legend style. Well, there were urban

457
00:25:10,800 --> 00:25:13,959
Speaker 1: legends about some friend of a friend or some friend's

458
00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:16,840
Speaker 1: cousin who who they know for sure did this and

459
00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:20,040
Speaker 1: they fought fifteen cops and ed used an example of

460
00:25:20,400 --> 00:25:23,919
Speaker 1: some kid who at a hockey game fought like twenty

461
00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:26,920
Speaker 1: cops or something. And it's just so funny how those

462
00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:31,080
Speaker 1: things proliferate. And we're not saying like in PCP, it

463
00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:33,119
Speaker 1: was just great. There was no problem with it, but

464
00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:35,600
Speaker 1: it wasn't what it was made out to be, which

465
00:25:35,720 --> 00:25:40,680
Speaker 1: was this a lot of times an excuse for cops

466
00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:43,840
Speaker 1: to beat down a person because all they have to

467
00:25:43,880 --> 00:25:46,680
Speaker 1: do afterward to say, we suspected they were on PCP

468
00:25:46,840 --> 00:25:48,480
Speaker 1: and they had crazy look in their eyes and they

469
00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:52,359
Speaker 1: were super strong. Ye, I mean Rodney King was supposedly

470
00:25:52,359 --> 00:25:55,160
Speaker 1: on PCP. You heard some cops yelling out the word

471
00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:58,760
Speaker 1: dust at the beginning of that video. Yeah, he's dusted,

472
00:25:58,920 --> 00:26:02,320
Speaker 1: And that happens and happened all the time. I don't

473
00:26:02,359 --> 00:26:04,119
Speaker 1: think it's quite as common now, but it was a

474
00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:05,680
Speaker 1: very prominent thing back then.

475
00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:10,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then cops speak, he's dusted, is raising the

476
00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:13,560
Speaker 2: alarm that this person is going to try to kill

477
00:26:13,600 --> 00:26:16,000
Speaker 2: all of us and possibly could so go ahead and

478
00:26:16,119 --> 00:26:19,200
Speaker 2: use excessive force, And it was used as a defense

479
00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:21,560
Speaker 2: in the Rodney King trial. He didn't have any PCP

480
00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:25,119
Speaker 2: in his system, by the way, but that fear, just

481
00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:30,119
Speaker 2: the very fact that cops are scared of superhuman strength

482
00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:33,200
Speaker 2: brought on by PCP is one of the things that

483
00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:37,600
Speaker 2: got those officers off the hook in the Rodney King trial,

484
00:26:37,640 --> 00:26:41,280
Speaker 2: the Rodney King beating trial. But just the fact that

485
00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:44,600
Speaker 2: PCP gives people superhuman strength. Yeah, he didn't know he

486
00:26:44,760 --> 00:26:48,160
Speaker 2: wasn't on PCP. Ergo, they're not really guilty of using

487
00:26:48,200 --> 00:26:51,239
Speaker 2: excessive force because he could have been on PCP. And

488
00:26:51,440 --> 00:26:57,000
Speaker 2: if you strip away that argument, like these police officers

489
00:26:57,000 --> 00:27:01,560
Speaker 2: were let off for beating a man in a circle, Yeah,

490
00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:05,680
Speaker 2: because they were afraid he was on PCP, because PCP

491
00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:09,439
Speaker 2: gives you superhuman strength. Even though that doesn't actually happen.

492
00:27:09,720 --> 00:27:12,880
Speaker 2: It's just a total myth that's perpetuated still today.

493
00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:16,120
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it's still around. I think you found this

494
00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:21,000
Speaker 1: meta analysis from a legal paper that really did some

495
00:27:21,080 --> 00:27:26,160
Speaker 1: scouring and found two cases where PCP was the sole cause,

496
00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:30,960
Speaker 1: the sole cause of like a violent behavior or violent episode.

497
00:27:30,760 --> 00:27:32,000
Speaker 3: Two out of like hundreds.

498
00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:35,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we're not saying that, you know, people do crazy,

499
00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:37,280
Speaker 1: all kinds of crazy things and all kinds of drugs,

500
00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:41,280
Speaker 1: So we're not saying no one's ever been violent because

501
00:27:41,359 --> 00:27:44,600
Speaker 1: and had PCP in their system. But the key is

502
00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:49,120
Speaker 1: did PCP trigger and cause that thing to happen? And

503
00:27:49,600 --> 00:27:51,840
Speaker 1: the evidence just says that that's just not the case. No.

504
00:27:52,359 --> 00:27:56,040
Speaker 2: From what I saw, it amplifies your personality twenty times,

505
00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:57,640
Speaker 2: I think, is what one person put it.

506
00:27:58,240 --> 00:28:00,919
Speaker 1: If you want to beat up people anyway aggressive anyway,

507
00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:01,679
Speaker 1: then it might.

508
00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:04,040
Speaker 2: Then yes, that might be a problem, but you're not

509
00:28:04,080 --> 00:28:08,760
Speaker 2: going to have superhuman strength. Potentially, the one the one

510
00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:12,760
Speaker 2: explanation for that, because I did see videos of a

511
00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:15,679
Speaker 2: dude on PCP who was getting bear sprayed in the

512
00:28:15,720 --> 00:28:18,800
Speaker 2: face multiple times and just kind of wiped his eyes

513
00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:20,399
Speaker 2: and kept walking around.

514
00:28:20,520 --> 00:28:22,960
Speaker 1: Was stay alive wing No, I had it on.

515
00:28:23,000 --> 00:28:26,639
Speaker 2: Mute, so as possible, it was, but he kept getting

516
00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:30,679
Speaker 2: tased repeatedly and nothing. He didn't have superhuman strength. He

517
00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:34,800
Speaker 2: was just disassociated from his senses, so he wasn't experiencing pain.

518
00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:40,760
Speaker 2: So you will not move away from noxious stimulized stimuli

519
00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:45,600
Speaker 2: like bear spray or tasers because it's not coming through.

520
00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:47,840
Speaker 1: And finally, not superhuman strength.

521
00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:49,600
Speaker 3: That is not superhuman strength.

522
00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:55,680
Speaker 2: And there's also a really really like widespread idea that

523
00:28:56,120 --> 00:29:00,840
Speaker 2: at least one person on PCP is snapped perfectly good.

524
00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:03,760
Speaker 3: Handcuffs because of those superhuman strength.

525
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:07,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just probably not the case that that ever

526
00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:10,240
Speaker 2: actually happened. So there's a lot of myths around this.

527
00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:12,959
Speaker 2: And again it's like you kind of hinted at like

528
00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:16,880
Speaker 2: we're not defending PCP. We're not saying like guys. PCP's

529
00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:19,280
Speaker 2: got such a bad rap. There's a lot of really

530
00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:22,720
Speaker 2: bad stuff that can come out of ingestion PCP. It's

531
00:29:22,800 --> 00:29:26,800
Speaker 2: just that superhuman strength is not one of them. That's

532
00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:30,600
Speaker 2: just a myth. And it has been used. It's been

533
00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:37,040
Speaker 2: argued to target those marginalized communities who use PCP and used.

534
00:29:37,480 --> 00:29:40,600
Speaker 2: It's been used to justify excessive force. So much so

535
00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:45,480
Speaker 2: I saw that the non or no less than lethal

536
00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:51,440
Speaker 2: weapon industry, tasers, bear spray, all that stuff that did

537
00:29:51,480 --> 00:29:56,440
Speaker 2: not exist until the cops started being criticized for using

538
00:29:56,480 --> 00:30:01,880
Speaker 2: excessive force and they had the the decision to either

539
00:30:02,160 --> 00:30:05,440
Speaker 2: use their police baton, their nightstick or their gun. That's

540
00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:09,520
Speaker 2: all they had, and they they when they encountered PCP users,

541
00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:11,120
Speaker 2: they needed another option.

542
00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:12,840
Speaker 3: So that's that's why we have that.

543
00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:18,200
Speaker 2: Yes, that is why to subdue PCP users. That's why

544
00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:19,640
Speaker 2: that whole industry exists.

545
00:30:19,840 --> 00:30:20,880
Speaker 3: That's why it began.

546
00:30:21,880 --> 00:30:23,680
Speaker 1: Is that why I have bear spray hanging up at

547
00:30:23,680 --> 00:30:24,440
Speaker 1: my camp on the wall.

548
00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:27,440
Speaker 2: That's right, because of PCP users in Washington, d C.

549
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:29,160
Speaker 2: In anatomy.

550
00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:32,800
Speaker 1: I don't want to spray a bear, even I don't.

551
00:30:32,880 --> 00:30:35,200
Speaker 3: I think you're okay if a bear's coming at you.

552
00:30:35,200 --> 00:30:37,080
Speaker 3: You can. You can spray that bear.

553
00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:40,440
Speaker 1: I mean I would, and that's why it's there. I

554
00:30:40,520 --> 00:30:41,400
Speaker 1: just said I don't want to.

555
00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:41,640
Speaker 4: Like.

556
00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:45,360
Speaker 1: My first line of defense at at camp is I

557
00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:50,000
Speaker 1: have an air horn. Good so annoying my friends, drive

558
00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:55,640
Speaker 1: away the bear, drive away my friends on Sunday morning. Yeah,

559
00:30:55,680 --> 00:30:58,600
Speaker 1: and then the bear spray would be the last resort.

560
00:30:58,680 --> 00:31:00,280
Speaker 3: I'll tell you what you do. Chuck this way. Do

561
00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:03,080
Speaker 3: you got a bear coming at you? You lay down?

562
00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:06,240
Speaker 3: What is it prostrate when you're face down?

563
00:31:07,360 --> 00:31:07,880
Speaker 1: I don't remember.

564
00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:11,600
Speaker 3: Let's say it is. Okay, yeah, I think it is.

565
00:31:11,640 --> 00:31:14,960
Speaker 2: I don't remember. But you're laying face down, pretending you're dead.

566
00:31:15,520 --> 00:31:18,640
Speaker 2: Wait till the bear comes over and kind of moves

567
00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:22,680
Speaker 2: you with its paw and you roll over and spray

568
00:31:22,680 --> 00:31:25,080
Speaker 2: it in the face with the bear spray. Kind of

569
00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:27,600
Speaker 2: like that whole trope where you roll somebody over and

570
00:31:27,600 --> 00:31:29,680
Speaker 2: they're holding like a bunch of grenades with the pins

571
00:31:29,680 --> 00:31:31,800
Speaker 2: pulled out, same.

572
00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:32,880
Speaker 3: Thing, but with bear spray.

573
00:31:33,400 --> 00:31:34,280
Speaker 1: That's a great idea.

574
00:31:34,360 --> 00:31:36,320
Speaker 3: I think so too. I think we should go try it.

575
00:31:36,720 --> 00:31:40,000
Speaker 1: That Elizabeth Banks should have made PCP Bear instead of

576
00:31:40,000 --> 00:31:44,080
Speaker 1: Cocaine Bear. I know we disagree about that, Yes, we do.

577
00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:47,880
Speaker 1: But what we can agree is that the story about

578
00:31:48,480 --> 00:31:52,480
Speaker 1: the crew of the Titanic movie, not the boat itself,

579
00:31:52,960 --> 00:31:56,760
Speaker 1: but when James Cameron was making Titanic. This sounds so

580
00:31:56,840 --> 00:31:59,760
Speaker 1: much like an urban legend, but it's actually true that

581
00:32:01,120 --> 00:32:05,080
Speaker 1: at some I think it was another crew member that part.

582
00:32:05,120 --> 00:32:06,400
Speaker 1: I don't know, but I'm pretty sure it was another

583
00:32:06,440 --> 00:32:06,800
Speaker 1: crew member.

584
00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:11,920
Speaker 2: The mystery still like they've never fully.

585
00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:16,120
Speaker 1: Okay, Well, they dosed some chowder with PCP and dosed

586
00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:18,680
Speaker 1: everyone who ate that chowder, which was a lot or

587
00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:22,160
Speaker 1: most of the crew, and it really happened, and I

588
00:32:22,160 --> 00:32:25,560
Speaker 1: think different stories come out of that.

589
00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:25,760
Speaker 4: You know.

590
00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:28,000
Speaker 1: I think some people had a really hard time. Some

591
00:32:28,040 --> 00:32:29,800
Speaker 1: people probably loved it.

592
00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:33,120
Speaker 2: Yeah they apparently there was a congo line and wheelchair

593
00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:36,600
Speaker 2: racing in the er at the local hospital. But then

594
00:32:36,680 --> 00:32:38,920
Speaker 2: other people, yeah, we're not having a good time at all.

595
00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:42,240
Speaker 2: Jinks Cameron said that one of the crew members, I

596
00:32:42,280 --> 00:32:44,720
Speaker 2: think he said a PA stabbed him in the face

597
00:32:44,760 --> 00:32:47,000
Speaker 2: of a pen and oh wow, he said.

598
00:32:47,040 --> 00:32:47,480
Speaker 3: He was just.

599
00:32:47,520 --> 00:32:50,600
Speaker 2: Laughing, laughing, laughing about it, like like James Cameron was

600
00:32:50,680 --> 00:32:53,080
Speaker 2: laughing about having been stabbed in the face of a pen.

601
00:32:54,560 --> 00:32:57,640
Speaker 1: The PA said this is for Avatar that hasn't even

602
00:32:57,680 --> 00:32:58,440
Speaker 1: happened yet.

603
00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:00,880
Speaker 2: Right, But this is I think the the biggest star

604
00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:03,720
Speaker 2: that got it was Bill Paxton because they were shooting

605
00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:08,680
Speaker 2: those current day shots and like Nova Scotia or something.

606
00:33:09,080 --> 00:33:12,720
Speaker 1: Boy, I hope that that old lady Old Rose didn't happen.

607
00:33:12,880 --> 00:33:13,640
Speaker 3: Was at a restaurant.

608
00:33:13,720 --> 00:33:17,080
Speaker 1: She did not, Man, could you imagine?

609
00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:20,480
Speaker 2: No, that would be really bad. We don't want our

610
00:33:20,520 --> 00:33:23,680
Speaker 2: senior friends taking PCP, especially not accidentally.

611
00:33:24,240 --> 00:33:26,840
Speaker 4: Her acting might have improved, you never know. I thought

612
00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:31,160
Speaker 4: she did so, so she wouldn't very good in my opinion.

613
00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:34,640
Speaker 4: So you want to take a break, Sure, let's take

614
00:33:34,680 --> 00:33:36,280
Speaker 4: a break, and then we'll come back and talk about

615
00:33:36,280 --> 00:34:02,960
Speaker 4: some problems with getting high on PCP, Chuck. One of

616
00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:07,080
Speaker 4: the things about PCP that makes it so vexing, yeah,

617
00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:12,200
Speaker 4: is that the symptoms that it can produce are really undesirable,

618
00:34:12,920 --> 00:34:16,479
Speaker 4: and an overdose threshold is not very high at all.

619
00:34:16,600 --> 00:34:20,560
Speaker 4: It basically dances along the top end of a normal dose.

620
00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:23,040
Speaker 4: So a normal dose is between five and ten milligrams.

621
00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:26,160
Speaker 4: I saw as low as one, yeah, but after.

622
00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:29,160
Speaker 2: About ten milligrams, or maybe even at ten milligrams, you

623
00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:33,960
Speaker 2: might start exhibiting the exact same symptoms of somebody in

624
00:34:34,000 --> 00:34:36,360
Speaker 2: the throes of a schizophrenic episode.

625
00:34:36,880 --> 00:34:39,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we'll talk about that in a second. But

626
00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:41,960
Speaker 1: part of the problem there, I mean, that's a problem period.

627
00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:44,879
Speaker 1: But part of the problem is the dosage, especially if

628
00:34:44,880 --> 00:34:49,359
Speaker 1: you're smoking fry or churm or something like that. Is

629
00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:52,840
Speaker 1: I'm sure the dosage isn't that accurate when you're dipping

630
00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:55,239
Speaker 1: a joint or a cigarette and liquid, it's probably hard

631
00:34:55,239 --> 00:34:56,200
Speaker 1: to tell how much is on there.

632
00:34:56,320 --> 00:34:58,600
Speaker 2: No, but I read that you can control it much

633
00:34:58,600 --> 00:35:00,880
Speaker 2: more easily. You just take it hit and wait a

634
00:35:00,880 --> 00:35:03,439
Speaker 2: couple minutes, and then sure if you if you start

635
00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:05,239
Speaker 2: to come down, you take another hit. And I saw

636
00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:07,799
Speaker 2: it like an old cop say, you can you know

637
00:35:07,880 --> 00:35:12,320
Speaker 2: if you smoke it, you know with intent, I guess

638
00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:15,040
Speaker 2: you can stay high for twenty four hours just from

639
00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:17,240
Speaker 2: one one shurm.

640
00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:21,720
Speaker 1: Stick, right, Which means if you're if this is something

641
00:35:21,719 --> 00:35:25,799
Speaker 1: that you know to do and recreationally do often, then

642
00:35:25,840 --> 00:35:27,920
Speaker 1: you probably know what you're doing. But if someone's like, here,

643
00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:30,719
Speaker 1: try this thing and then ed, you know, use the

644
00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:34,840
Speaker 1: example of of you know, someone who like finds the

645
00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:38,600
Speaker 1: joint on the street or something, and I'm sure that's happened.

646
00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:40,839
Speaker 1: But I kind of lump that in with that that

647
00:35:41,200 --> 00:35:44,960
Speaker 1: eighties hysteria of like, you know, you might come across

648
00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:47,480
Speaker 1: a cigarette that's been laced with PCP that you don't

649
00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:50,520
Speaker 1: know about, or or buy a marijuana joints laced with PCP.

650
00:35:51,600 --> 00:35:53,160
Speaker 1: I'm sure that really didn't happen very.

651
00:35:53,120 --> 00:35:56,080
Speaker 2: Much there, So, No, it does not happen very much.

652
00:35:56,120 --> 00:35:59,640
Speaker 2: Those stories are, they abound, but they're also really really rare.

653
00:35:59,760 --> 00:36:04,560
Speaker 2: But there are stories of people who have done horrific

654
00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:11,480
Speaker 2: things on PCP. Sure the qualifier is though, that they

655
00:36:11,680 --> 00:36:18,200
Speaker 2: already had pre existing mental disorders, and the PCP does

656
00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:21,279
Speaker 2: not do any favors for you if you have a

657
00:36:21,320 --> 00:36:25,120
Speaker 2: pre existing mental condition, even if it hasn't come out

658
00:36:25,160 --> 00:36:29,080
Speaker 2: yet or emerged yet, it'll make it emerge. And they

659
00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:32,479
Speaker 2: argue that it's possible that even if you didn't have

660
00:36:32,560 --> 00:36:37,320
Speaker 2: one that was going to come out eventually, PCP could conceivably,

661
00:36:37,520 --> 00:36:43,840
Speaker 2: especially after prolonged use, essentially infect you with schizophrenia.

662
00:36:44,520 --> 00:36:47,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's the one I've seen more often than anything else.

663
00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:52,399
Speaker 1: Is it will exacerbate something like that, but it can

664
00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:57,040
Speaker 1: also Why cann't we think of the word install.

665
00:36:57,440 --> 00:37:00,240
Speaker 3: And still delivered, still produced.

666
00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:05,480
Speaker 1: Induce, produce produce schizophrenia. And you know, a little bit

667
00:37:05,480 --> 00:37:08,799
Speaker 1: of a silver lining on that is they actually can

668
00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:11,520
Speaker 1: use PCP now and do use PCP as far as

669
00:37:11,560 --> 00:37:16,760
Speaker 1: studying schizophrenia, and you know how those two are related

670
00:37:17,040 --> 00:37:17,560
Speaker 1: in humans.

671
00:37:17,719 --> 00:37:22,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a big They give PCP to primates and

672
00:37:22,080 --> 00:37:28,359
Speaker 2: study what happens to study schizophrenia, and then weirdly, they're

673
00:37:28,400 --> 00:37:32,160
Speaker 2: also looking at PCP as a way to study or

674
00:37:32,200 --> 00:37:37,879
Speaker 2: produce drugs that treat Alzheimer's because schizophrenia apparently is associated

675
00:37:37,920 --> 00:37:42,960
Speaker 2: with a lack of glutamate. Remember, PCP inhibits glutamate and

676
00:37:43,080 --> 00:37:48,359
Speaker 2: Alzheimer's results from they think an overabundance of glutamate in

677
00:37:48,560 --> 00:37:51,640
Speaker 2: the in the brain. And so PCP has both of

678
00:37:51,640 --> 00:37:55,719
Speaker 2: those effects that can induce schizophrenia. It could treat Alzheimer's conceivably.

679
00:37:56,120 --> 00:37:59,200
Speaker 2: So I think the fact that it has so many

680
00:37:59,280 --> 00:38:03,480
Speaker 2: terrible myths around it has really made people cautious about

681
00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:06,000
Speaker 2: suggesting doing research using PCP.

682
00:38:06,719 --> 00:38:10,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's not like researching microdosing mushrooms or something like

683
00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:10,920
Speaker 1: that now.

684
00:38:11,120 --> 00:38:14,080
Speaker 2: But there is a there is a whole thread of

685
00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:17,799
Speaker 2: inquiry into it to say like okay, there's there's this

686
00:38:17,880 --> 00:38:20,040
Speaker 2: is doing some stuff to the brain that we should

687
00:38:20,080 --> 00:38:20,719
Speaker 2: be studying.

688
00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:25,839
Speaker 1: Yeah. It can also induce seizures. It can really ramp

689
00:38:25,960 --> 00:38:30,400
Speaker 1: up your heart rate. It can it can produce rapid

690
00:38:30,440 --> 00:38:33,520
Speaker 1: involuntary eye movement. It's called nice stagmus.

691
00:38:33,840 --> 00:38:36,399
Speaker 2: Yeah, not just like side to side or up and down,

692
00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:39,160
Speaker 2: but in rotary fashion is one of the ways. So

693
00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:41,160
Speaker 2: your eyes are just going in a.

694
00:38:41,080 --> 00:38:45,200
Speaker 1: Cartoon style, yes exactly. Yeah. Uh. And it just seems

695
00:38:45,200 --> 00:38:47,040
Speaker 1: to be sort of all over the map as far

696
00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:52,600
Speaker 1: like a very unpredictable drug as far as its sedative qualities,

697
00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:54,839
Speaker 1: and then it's sort of amping you up qualities.

698
00:38:54,600 --> 00:38:55,400
Speaker 3: Yes exactly.

699
00:38:55,719 --> 00:38:57,680
Speaker 2: That's what I was saying earlier, where you kind you

700
00:38:57,719 --> 00:39:02,759
Speaker 2: can just vacillate between extremely digitation and catatonia essentially, and

701
00:39:02,800 --> 00:39:06,000
Speaker 2: on the same trip over and over again. Really interesting,

702
00:39:06,239 --> 00:39:10,400
Speaker 2: It is extremely interesting. One of the other big problems

703
00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:12,240
Speaker 2: with it, And this is why I said you probably

704
00:39:12,239 --> 00:39:15,239
Speaker 2: shouldn't vote if you are a frequent PCP user, not

705
00:39:15,360 --> 00:39:18,640
Speaker 2: because you're a member of a marginal community, but because

706
00:39:19,200 --> 00:39:23,560
Speaker 2: you probably have some really strange beliefs about yourself and

707
00:39:23,600 --> 00:39:24,320
Speaker 2: your place.

708
00:39:24,080 --> 00:39:24,840
Speaker 3: In the universe.

709
00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:25,920
Speaker 1: Yeah.

710
00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:26,880
Speaker 3: One of the big.

711
00:39:26,680 --> 00:39:29,839
Speaker 2: Things that comes out of it is especially prolonged use

712
00:39:29,880 --> 00:39:35,520
Speaker 2: and chronic use is a shift in your spiritual and

713
00:39:35,719 --> 00:39:39,640
Speaker 2: religious beliefs. And typically it kind of comes down to, Oh,

714
00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:43,600
Speaker 2: I'm a god, and I need to just be hanging

715
00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:45,759
Speaker 2: out and not doing much because that's what gods do.

716
00:39:46,719 --> 00:39:49,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, And that's also kind of ties back into the

717
00:39:50,080 --> 00:39:54,400
Speaker 1: even though it's not superhuman strength, just a feeling of invincibility.

718
00:39:55,040 --> 00:39:58,239
Speaker 1: But I've also seen that it's not so much an invincive.

719
00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:01,279
Speaker 1: Usually it's not an invincibility of like I can take

720
00:40:01,280 --> 00:40:03,840
Speaker 1: anyone on who wants to fight me. It's more of

721
00:40:03,920 --> 00:40:06,759
Speaker 1: like I'm invincible in a good way, like I can

722
00:40:06,800 --> 00:40:10,200
Speaker 1: do whatever I want. Again, not suggesting that it's like

723
00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:12,879
Speaker 1: a motivational tool or something like that, sure, but it's

724
00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:14,280
Speaker 1: just one of the things that can happen.

725
00:40:14,360 --> 00:40:18,920
Speaker 2: And then conversely, if you are feeling, like say, socially anxious,

726
00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:23,440
Speaker 2: you're probably going to experience profound paranoia. It will amplify

727
00:40:23,480 --> 00:40:25,799
Speaker 2: it one way or another. It's the same thing with

728
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:28,680
Speaker 2: LSD that wholes set and setting thing right.

729
00:40:29,400 --> 00:40:33,560
Speaker 3: So what else is there, Chuck, Well, if.

730
00:40:33,400 --> 00:40:37,839
Speaker 1: You become addicted to PCP, there isn't like a sort

731
00:40:37,880 --> 00:40:41,799
Speaker 1: of a straight ahead pharmaceutical treatment. It's gonna you know

732
00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:44,000
Speaker 1: you're gonna have to wean yourself off of it through

733
00:40:44,040 --> 00:40:48,840
Speaker 1: therapy and treatment. Basically, I think ed did find that

734
00:40:50,239 --> 00:40:56,120
Speaker 1: chre prout here. I go chlor promozine core promisine, which

735
00:40:56,160 --> 00:40:59,480
Speaker 1: is a drug. It can help reverse the effects if

736
00:40:59,480 --> 00:41:02,880
Speaker 1: you're like like overdosing on PCP, but it's not like

737
00:41:02,920 --> 00:41:05,359
Speaker 1: the kind of thing you used to break an addiction.

738
00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:06,880
Speaker 3: No, and you can get addicted.

739
00:41:06,920 --> 00:41:11,320
Speaker 2: It does have a high incidence of dependence because it's

740
00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:16,000
Speaker 2: schedule too exactly. Not everything schedule two is actually addictive,

741
00:41:16,040 --> 00:41:20,080
Speaker 2: But in this case it's actually correct that it stimulates

742
00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:24,200
Speaker 2: your reward center so much it produces euph you that

743
00:41:24,239 --> 00:41:27,760
Speaker 2: you want it again. But also it can physically alter

744
00:41:27,920 --> 00:41:30,200
Speaker 2: your brain, not just to make you believe that you

745
00:41:30,400 --> 00:41:34,320
Speaker 2: are a god or something on earth, but also to

746
00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:39,560
Speaker 2: make that threshold for your reward system higher.

747
00:41:39,800 --> 00:41:40,680
Speaker 3: So it's harder to.

748
00:41:42,200 --> 00:41:46,279
Speaker 2: Feel good even a normal on a normal basis, and

749
00:41:46,360 --> 00:41:49,520
Speaker 2: in turn, you end up having to ingest more and

750
00:41:49,640 --> 00:41:52,880
Speaker 2: more amounts of PCP to get high. And that's a

751
00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:55,480
Speaker 2: classic hall mark of dependency.

752
00:41:55,400 --> 00:41:58,839
Speaker 1: Yep, classic hall mark of many drugs, because you use

753
00:41:58,880 --> 00:42:00,520
Speaker 1: more and more and then that's just becomes more and

754
00:42:00,560 --> 00:42:01,520
Speaker 1: more dangerous.

755
00:42:01,120 --> 00:42:03,680
Speaker 2: Again, the withdrawal symptoms are really bad too. You can

756
00:42:03,920 --> 00:42:07,440
Speaker 2: you can very frequently fall into major depression that can

757
00:42:07,520 --> 00:42:08,320
Speaker 2: last weeks.

758
00:42:08,719 --> 00:42:09,919
Speaker 3: Yeah.

759
00:42:09,760 --> 00:42:12,400
Speaker 2: Uh, sometimes some of the symptoms don't ever go away,

760
00:42:12,440 --> 00:42:15,880
Speaker 2: like you might have trouble talking or speaking. It's just

761
00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:18,600
Speaker 2: not it's not a good thing to get into, especially

762
00:42:18,719 --> 00:42:19,800
Speaker 2: long term.

763
00:42:20,080 --> 00:42:22,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's not the seventies anyway. What are you

764
00:42:22,200 --> 00:42:23,439
Speaker 1: doing with PCP these days?

765
00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:26,320
Speaker 2: Did you see that Saturday Night Live skit with Tracy

766
00:42:26,360 --> 00:42:28,200
Speaker 2: Morgan and Will Ferrell and Matthew Broderick.

767
00:42:29,960 --> 00:42:33,200
Speaker 1: No, is that what you said? Yes, that that link

768
00:42:33,239 --> 00:42:35,920
Speaker 1: took me straight to a clip of The Ladies Man.

769
00:42:36,560 --> 00:42:38,680
Speaker 2: Oh right, That's why I gave you the timestamp at

770
00:42:38,680 --> 00:42:41,480
Speaker 2: the end. It's like at the end of the whole episode.

771
00:42:41,280 --> 00:42:42,759
Speaker 1: All right, I missed that. I was like, what has

772
00:42:42,760 --> 00:42:44,239
Speaker 1: the Ladies Man got to do with this? I was like,

773
00:42:44,280 --> 00:42:46,240
Speaker 1: I love the Ladies Man bit, but right.

774
00:42:46,160 --> 00:42:48,080
Speaker 3: No, it had nothing to do with it.

775
00:42:48,200 --> 00:42:54,279
Speaker 2: Although it was it was basically like, uh, inside the

776
00:42:54,320 --> 00:42:57,360
Speaker 2: Actors Studio kind of type thing, but for comedy, so

777
00:42:57,440 --> 00:43:00,560
Speaker 2: it was real highbrow. Matthew Broderick's the host, and he

778
00:43:00,680 --> 00:43:03,560
Speaker 2: was focusing on drug based comedy that had been inspired

779
00:43:03,600 --> 00:43:07,240
Speaker 2: by Cheech and Chong, and he featured Orbit and zach

780
00:43:07,360 --> 00:43:12,720
Speaker 2: or something like that. Who did PCP comedy. Yeah, Tracy

781
00:43:12,719 --> 00:43:15,800
Speaker 2: Morgan was zach or or whatever, and Will Ferrell was Orbit,

782
00:43:16,320 --> 00:43:21,080
Speaker 2: and they played little clips from their record, their hit

783
00:43:21,160 --> 00:43:24,040
Speaker 2: records from the seventies, and it's just them like screaming

784
00:43:24,080 --> 00:43:26,200
Speaker 2: about how there's snakes in the toilet and shooting the

785
00:43:26,200 --> 00:43:30,520
Speaker 2: toilet with the shotgun. It's it's really funny, even if

786
00:43:30,520 --> 00:43:35,000
Speaker 2: this stuffed mythical, it's it's just so easy to make

787
00:43:35,200 --> 00:43:37,680
Speaker 2: really hilarious jokes off of PCP.

788
00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:39,960
Speaker 1: I mean, that's what comedy is. No one's going to

789
00:43:40,000 --> 00:43:41,520
Speaker 1: come along and say, like, actually, and that's not what

790
00:43:41,560 --> 00:43:42,360
Speaker 1: PCP does.

791
00:43:42,280 --> 00:43:42,920
Speaker 3: Right, exactly.

792
00:43:43,560 --> 00:43:44,280
Speaker 1: That's good stuff.

793
00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:44,680
Speaker 3: Yep.

794
00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:47,920
Speaker 2: And then one other thing, if you want maybe a

795
00:43:48,000 --> 00:43:50,879
Speaker 2: less than accurate depiction of PCP, you can check out

796
00:43:50,880 --> 00:43:52,640
Speaker 2: the movie from nineteen eighty two called.

797
00:43:52,480 --> 00:43:55,000
Speaker 1: Desperate Lives that the hell Hunt.

798
00:43:55,200 --> 00:43:58,480
Speaker 2: Yes, a teenage Helen Hunt smokes PCP, jumps out of

799
00:43:58,480 --> 00:44:00,920
Speaker 2: a second story window in her high school and becomes

800
00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:02,200
Speaker 2: paralyzed as a result.

801
00:44:02,840 --> 00:44:05,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was Was that an actual after school special

802
00:44:05,200 --> 00:44:08,880
Speaker 1: or it's possible it had that stink?

803
00:44:08,920 --> 00:44:11,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely it was definitely a made for TV anti

804
00:44:11,600 --> 00:44:14,200
Speaker 2: drug movie, but I'm not sure if it came on

805
00:44:14,280 --> 00:44:15,120
Speaker 2: after school or not.

806
00:44:15,840 --> 00:44:18,880
Speaker 1: I remember very vivid memories of that one, and then

807
00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:21,080
Speaker 1: I know I mentioned it before, probably in one of

808
00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:25,399
Speaker 1: the marijuana episodes the uh Chachi in Charge.

809
00:44:25,400 --> 00:44:26,919
Speaker 3: Who's the guy Scott Bayo.

810
00:44:27,440 --> 00:44:31,600
Speaker 1: Scott bo was in one on marijuana and I remember

811
00:44:31,680 --> 00:44:34,800
Speaker 1: that's the first time I heard a bong because he

812
00:44:34,840 --> 00:44:37,479
Speaker 1: smoked out of a bomb and had that bubbling and

813
00:44:37,560 --> 00:44:39,320
Speaker 1: it's like, what is that? It was like it sounds

814
00:44:39,320 --> 00:44:41,719
Speaker 1: like like rice crispies or something, and I was a

815
00:44:41,719 --> 00:44:43,640
Speaker 1: little kid. I was just like, I've never heard anything

816
00:44:43,680 --> 00:44:46,320
Speaker 1: like that. Yeah, So there you have it. Scott Bo

817
00:44:46,960 --> 00:44:48,799
Speaker 1: and Helen Hunt, the kid, those two together.

818
00:44:48,840 --> 00:44:49,000
Speaker 3: Yeah.

819
00:44:49,000 --> 00:44:55,360
Speaker 2: Apparently Helen Hunt was in two anti PCP.

820
00:44:55,360 --> 00:44:58,520
Speaker 1: Okay, I thought that one was an LSD one two PCPs.

821
00:44:58,560 --> 00:44:59,080
Speaker 1: Good for her.

822
00:44:59,760 --> 00:45:01,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's how her career started.

823
00:45:02,040 --> 00:45:03,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then she went on to star in the

824
00:45:03,520 --> 00:45:04,840
Speaker 1: show Matt about PCP.

825
00:45:04,960 --> 00:45:07,880
Speaker 2: That's right, and then she did at a guest spot with

826
00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:10,160
Speaker 2: Orbit and Zach Manta.

827
00:45:10,200 --> 00:45:10,759
Speaker 1: I gotta watch that.

828
00:45:10,880 --> 00:45:12,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's at the very end. I think it's the

829
00:45:12,400 --> 00:45:12,960
Speaker 2: less Kid.

830
00:45:13,520 --> 00:45:14,520
Speaker 1: All right, let me cue it up.

831
00:45:14,560 --> 00:45:16,520
Speaker 2: All right, well, well Chuck's queuing it up everybody. That

832
00:45:16,560 --> 00:45:17,839
Speaker 2: means it's time for listener mail.

833
00:45:20,440 --> 00:45:22,839
Speaker 1: Oh wait, so I can't watch it right now?

834
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:26,160
Speaker 2: Sure we'll wait. Okay, it's pretty funny, but you can't

835
00:45:26,200 --> 00:45:27,520
Speaker 2: turn it up. You have to put it on your

836
00:45:27,560 --> 00:45:30,360
Speaker 2: headphones because we can't pay for the copyright usage.

837
00:45:31,600 --> 00:45:33,960
Speaker 1: Let me find me boys here, anyone funnier than Tracy.

838
00:45:33,719 --> 00:45:35,120
Speaker 3: Morgan, I don't think so.

839
00:45:35,840 --> 00:45:40,600
Speaker 1: I love that guy. So this is about manners. Hey, guys,

840
00:45:40,800 --> 00:45:44,400
Speaker 1: it's been a million years at your old Canadian Palamanda Hear,

841
00:45:45,520 --> 00:45:48,560
Speaker 1: who missed the Toronto Live show. So Amanda says, I

842
00:45:48,600 --> 00:45:51,360
Speaker 1: remember Amanda many moons ago when stuff you should know

843
00:45:51,480 --> 00:45:54,040
Speaker 1: was new, and my boy Grant was about eleven. Chuck

844
00:45:54,040 --> 00:45:57,399
Speaker 1: sent me an email response that encouraged Grant to read more,

845
00:45:57,800 --> 00:46:00,399
Speaker 1: and he did. Thanks for that. He's twenty seven and now,

846
00:46:02,600 --> 00:46:06,520
Speaker 1: oh goodness, and a carpenter living in Calgary who read

847
00:46:06,520 --> 00:46:08,879
Speaker 1: your book. We are still avid listeners, and you guys

848
00:46:08,960 --> 00:46:13,040
Speaker 1: kept the company on his recent drive from Toronto. You're

849
00:46:13,080 --> 00:46:15,560
Speaker 1: the best companions on drives and while doing household chores,

850
00:46:15,560 --> 00:46:18,719
Speaker 1: while doing so many other things. Anyway, about manners. My

851
00:46:18,800 --> 00:46:21,520
Speaker 1: grandmother was a stickler for good manners, as were my parents.

852
00:46:21,760 --> 00:46:23,719
Speaker 1: I passed out on to Grant and we have often

853
00:46:23,760 --> 00:46:26,520
Speaker 1: been told how good manners make situations so much easier.

854
00:46:26,920 --> 00:46:29,239
Speaker 1: I was recently asking in a professional development setting what

855
00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:31,880
Speaker 1: the best advice for life I ever received was, and

856
00:46:31,960 --> 00:46:35,520
Speaker 1: obviously I responded with what I told my kid and

857
00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:39,960
Speaker 1: now stepkids. Manners are free and they're a social lubricant.

858
00:46:41,040 --> 00:46:43,560
Speaker 1: It always gets a laugh and then once considered a

859
00:46:43,600 --> 00:46:45,319
Speaker 1: nod and oh, that's right.

860
00:46:45,880 --> 00:46:49,839
Speaker 2: And then everybody has a sandwich and goes their separate.

861
00:46:49,560 --> 00:46:52,799
Speaker 1: Wings the dining table. If someone forgets their napkin on

862
00:46:52,800 --> 00:46:56,960
Speaker 1: their lap or cuts their food all at once instead

863
00:46:56,960 --> 00:46:59,400
Speaker 1: of eating it bite by bite, my partner and I

864
00:46:59,440 --> 00:47:01,600
Speaker 1: will say if you were invited to dine with the queen,

865
00:47:02,080 --> 00:47:04,240
Speaker 1: And it always gets a big eye roll and giggle

866
00:47:04,280 --> 00:47:07,640
Speaker 1: at the table and make sure that the napkins are

867
00:47:07,640 --> 00:47:09,800
Speaker 1: also in lapse though, and the food is cut properly.

868
00:47:09,840 --> 00:47:11,799
Speaker 1: It's a fun game for all. I hope you have

869
00:47:11,800 --> 00:47:14,319
Speaker 1: a marvelous day. Can't wait to hear the next episode

870
00:47:14,760 --> 00:47:17,799
Speaker 1: after all these years. Stuff you should know is rock

871
00:47:17,840 --> 00:47:19,240
Speaker 1: and roll nice?

872
00:47:19,280 --> 00:47:21,240
Speaker 3: That was Amanda, That was Amanda.

873
00:47:21,320 --> 00:47:23,000
Speaker 1: Manners are free, though, I like that. I don't know

874
00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:26,440
Speaker 1: so much. The social lubricant part I might lose because

875
00:47:26,480 --> 00:47:28,680
Speaker 1: manners are free is just so succinct.

876
00:47:29,840 --> 00:47:31,680
Speaker 2: So I kind of like that, you know, I was thinking, Remember,

877
00:47:31,680 --> 00:47:33,800
Speaker 2: I was kind of railing about elbows on the table

878
00:47:33,920 --> 00:47:37,799
Speaker 2: just being so dated and unnecessary. I've been thinking about

879
00:47:37,840 --> 00:47:40,640
Speaker 2: it since then, and while I still agree that it's

880
00:47:40,680 --> 00:47:44,120
Speaker 2: a great example of people being overly uptight about manners,

881
00:47:44,280 --> 00:47:46,400
Speaker 2: as if their identity is associated with it, and if

882
00:47:46,440 --> 00:47:49,560
Speaker 2: you violate it, you're somehow insulting them, I disagree with

883
00:47:49,600 --> 00:47:53,480
Speaker 2: that part. But I realized that being aware of whether

884
00:47:53,520 --> 00:47:55,719
Speaker 2: your elbows are on the table or not makes you

885
00:47:55,840 --> 00:47:58,920
Speaker 2: more aware of everything you're surrounding, the people with you,

886
00:47:59,000 --> 00:47:59,880
Speaker 2: the food you're eating.

887
00:48:00,320 --> 00:48:01,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, it just makes you.

888
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:05,360
Speaker 2: So I'm kind of done with you keeping your elbows

889
00:48:05,400 --> 00:48:08,000
Speaker 2: up the table, not because somebody told you to, because

890
00:48:08,000 --> 00:48:09,440
Speaker 2: you can do whatever you want as far as your

891
00:48:09,480 --> 00:48:11,120
Speaker 2: elbows are concerned, as long as you don't put them

892
00:48:11,120 --> 00:48:15,520
Speaker 2: in somebody else's space, but because it makes you more mindful.

893
00:48:16,120 --> 00:48:19,000
Speaker 1: Don't dip your elbows in your partner soup. But I

894
00:48:19,040 --> 00:48:21,040
Speaker 1: do want to say there's a couple of elbows on

895
00:48:21,080 --> 00:48:25,520
Speaker 1: the table methods though, if you're if you're in the

896
00:48:25,600 --> 00:48:27,880
Speaker 1: middle of eating and you've got like your elbow on

897
00:48:27,920 --> 00:48:29,480
Speaker 1: the table and your hunch forward and you're eating with

898
00:48:29,520 --> 00:48:32,479
Speaker 1: the other hand. I think that's kind of the rule.

899
00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:35,719
Speaker 1: But like, if you're eating and you're done and you're

900
00:48:35,719 --> 00:48:39,200
Speaker 1: having conversation, to push the plate away and put both

901
00:48:39,239 --> 00:48:41,560
Speaker 1: elbows on the table and pat your hands together in

902
00:48:41,600 --> 00:48:44,799
Speaker 1: a pensive way while you think of something smart and funny. Like,

903
00:48:44,840 --> 00:48:45,759
Speaker 1: that's a whole different deal.

904
00:48:45,880 --> 00:48:46,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, well that's elegant.

905
00:48:47,680 --> 00:48:50,839
Speaker 2: So I've been training myself by putting the little dab

906
00:48:50,840 --> 00:48:53,080
Speaker 2: of Momo's poop on each of my elbows right before

907
00:48:53,120 --> 00:48:55,839
Speaker 2: dinner to make sure that I don't put them on

908
00:48:55,880 --> 00:48:56,680
Speaker 2: the dinner table.

909
00:48:57,120 --> 00:48:58,239
Speaker 3: It's working really well.

910
00:48:58,719 --> 00:49:00,440
Speaker 1: That poop stays on your elbows belongs.

911
00:49:01,800 --> 00:49:03,880
Speaker 2: That was from Amanda, what was your son's name? The

912
00:49:03,920 --> 00:49:05,279
Speaker 2: one you inspired.

913
00:49:05,840 --> 00:49:08,400
Speaker 1: Grant who has been listening since eleven and is now

914
00:49:08,480 --> 00:49:09,200
Speaker 1: you know, sixty.

915
00:49:09,320 --> 00:49:09,840
Speaker 3: That's awesome.

916
00:49:09,880 --> 00:49:12,120
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to us, Amanda and Grant, and thank

917
00:49:12,160 --> 00:49:13,960
Speaker 2: you for listening to this episode.

918
00:49:13,960 --> 00:49:15,560
Speaker 3: And if you want to get in touch with us.

919
00:49:15,680 --> 00:49:18,600
Speaker 2: Like Amanda did and Grant by proxy, you can send

920
00:49:18,680 --> 00:49:24,120
Speaker 2: us an email to Stuff Podcast at iHeartRadio dot com.

921
00:49:25,920 --> 00:49:28,799
Speaker 1: Stuff you Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. For

922
00:49:28,880 --> 00:49:33,040
Speaker 1: more podcasts my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

923
00:49:33,160 --> 00:49:35,040
Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.