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Speaker 1: I'm Lisa and Akazawa join me on season two of

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Speaker 1: Stars and Stars with Lisa, where I sit down with

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Speaker 1: some of the most exciting stars of our time to

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Speaker 1: find out what their birth chart reveals about their life's purpose,

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Speaker 1: their relationships, and their challenges. Winner of the Signal Award

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Speaker 1: for Most Inspirational Podcast, Stars and Stars will help you

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Speaker 1: make sense of today's complicated times even if you're an

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Speaker 1: astrology skeptic. You can listen to Stars and Stars with

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Speaker 1: Lisa wherever you get your podcasts. Don't forget to follow

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Speaker 1: the show so you never miss an episode.

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Speaker 2: Dear listener. Here at Latino USA, we've been covering how

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Speaker 2: abortion access has become more and more restricted in the

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Speaker 2: United States, and in particular, how the state of Texas

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Speaker 2: is playing a leading role in the anti abortion movement.

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Speaker 2: Just early this month, Texas lawmakers passed a law that

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Speaker 2: will allow citizens to sue anyone producing, distributing, or helping

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Speaker 2: a pregnant woman access abortion pills in any way. This

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Speaker 2: means people can sue doctors, they can sue activists, but

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Speaker 2: they could also sue a family member or just a

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Speaker 2: friend who helped a woman to get pills, and they

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Speaker 2: can get fines of up to one hundred thousand dollars

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Speaker 2: in some cases. Now, what is happening in Texas is

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Speaker 2: spilling over the neighboring state of New Mexico, which, unlike Texas,

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Speaker 2: is led by Democrats. So today we're going to bring

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Speaker 2: back our reporting from twenty twenty four about how the

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Speaker 2: Texas abortion laws are shaking up small towns in eastern

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Speaker 2: New Mexico. By the way, we recently won a Webby

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Speaker 2: Award for this reporting. We are so proud of it.

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Speaker 2: And stay two all the way to the end of

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Speaker 2: the show for an exciting update about one of our

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Speaker 2: protagonists that you're going to meet. So all right, here

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Speaker 2: we go with the spillover's older.

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Speaker 3: I think this part of town is close to the tracks.

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Speaker 2: Today I'm in eastern New Mexico with Latino USA senior

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Speaker 2: producer Marta Martinez, and we just arrived to a town

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Speaker 2: called Clovis.

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Speaker 3: It's probably the older town, but it's cute.

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Speaker 2: This is which is less than ten minutes away from

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Speaker 2: the Texas border. So we're in New Mexico but a

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Speaker 2: stone's throw from Texas.

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Speaker 3: There is a welcome sign that says welcome to Clovis.

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Speaker 3: A community for family.

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Speaker 2: And then a huge cross and a large replica of

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Speaker 2: the Ten Commandments. And we're only eight miles from the

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Speaker 2: Texas border. So even though New Mexico is a blue state,

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Speaker 2: this part of New Mexico is actually kind of red.

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Speaker 4: It's not kind of red, it's very red.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And seeing the Ten Commandments is probably like the

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Speaker 2: clearest sign of what kind of a time you're arriving

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Speaker 2: to here in Clovis. Marta and I are in this

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Speaker 2: part of New Mexico to report on an issue that

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Speaker 2: has put this remote region of the country into the spotlight.

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Speaker 2: Abortion access.

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Speaker 3: All you can see around here are these endless plains

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Speaker 3: where they grow peanuts and corn. It's a landscape that

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Speaker 3: looks a lot more similar to Texas than New Mexico. Actually,

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Speaker 3: and it's not only the landscape that's similar, it's also

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Speaker 3: the politics. In the last presidential election, about seventy percent

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Speaker 3: of people in this region voted for Donald Trump.

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Speaker 4: There are sixty six.

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Speaker 3: Churches here in Clovis, and it's a town of less

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Speaker 3: than fifty thousand people, and nearly half of its students

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Speaker 3: are Latino Latina, latinx Latina, or as they often say here, Hispanic.

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Speaker 2: Just past that Christian welcome sign, we drive by a

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Speaker 2: yellow church with a big white cross, and we see

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Speaker 2: another sign that reads abortion is cold blooded murder. So

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Speaker 2: you might be wondering what's going on here because New

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Speaker 2: Mexico is blue. It's a democratic state that in fact

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Speaker 2: protects abortion in its state laws, and that central contradiction

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Speaker 2: is exactly why we are here now. Martha, You like me,

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Speaker 2: have been reporting on women and reproductive rights for many

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Speaker 2: years now, so why don't you give us the headline

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Speaker 2: about just what's happening in eastern New Mexico.

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Speaker 3: New Mexico is actually a very rural state. So yeah,

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Speaker 3: the big cities like Albuquerque, Santa Fe, Las Cruces, they

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Speaker 3: are democratic, but the rural regions, especially here in the

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Speaker 3: east side of state, are a lot more conservative and religious.

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Speaker 3: So that means there are more people who are against abortion.

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Speaker 3: But we also need to put this into context, Maria,

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Speaker 3: because a lot has happened in the last three years

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Speaker 3: when it comes to reproductive rights in the United States.

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Speaker 2: Yes, Marta, a lot has changed in terms of abortion.

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Speaker 3: In twenty twenty one, Texas passed Senate Bill eight, known

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Speaker 3: as SB eight, which is one of the strictest abortion

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Speaker 3: laws in the whole.

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Speaker 2: Country, and what that meant on the ground was that

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Speaker 2: a lot of women's clinics had to close. In fact,

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Speaker 2: Whole Woman's Health is one of the providers that was

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Speaker 2: directly affected by SB eight in Texas, and we spoke

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Speaker 2: with Amy Hagstrom, she's the CEO and founder.

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Speaker 5: When sbaight went into effect in September of twenty twenty one,

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Speaker 5: it was devastating.

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Speaker 3: So when they had to close their Texas clinics, Whole

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Speaker 3: Woman's Health and other abortion providers saw eastern New Mexico

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Speaker 3: as the best place to establish their quote unquote frontline

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Speaker 3: to keep providing services to people living in states where

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Speaker 3: abortion is banned, especially in the south of the country.

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Speaker 2: And that strategy made sense matterdam at least on paper. Right,

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Speaker 2: let's open clinics in a state that strongly protects abortion,

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Speaker 2: a state like New Mexico. But let's also open clinics

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Speaker 2: in a border region that is right next to Texas

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Speaker 2: so that people don't have to travel so far. And

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Speaker 2: on that list of locations for a new clinic was Clovis, which.

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Speaker 6: Is where we are right.

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Speaker 5: Now, primarily with proximity and part of what we were

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Speaker 5: looking at in those border communities was one will our

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Speaker 5: patients feel safe? And two will our staff and our

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Speaker 5: providers feel safe?

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Speaker 2: But it turns out that some neighbors in eastern New

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Speaker 2: Mexico were not so welcoming to this idea.

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Speaker 6: From Flutro media.

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Speaker 2: It's Latino Usa II Marino Rosa. Today the spillover we

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Speaker 2: look at how the abortion ban in Texas is mobilizing

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Speaker 2: Latinos and Latinas in eastern New Mexico.

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Speaker 6: Since the fall of Roe v.

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Speaker 2: Wade a little over two years ago, fourteen states have

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Speaker 2: banned abortions and another eight have passed laws restricting them,

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Speaker 2: especially in the south and in the midwest of the country.

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Speaker 2: This new reality has turned New Mexico into a hub

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Speaker 2: for people who are looking to end their pregnancies. And

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Speaker 2: check out this important piece of data. New Mexico is

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Speaker 2: the state where the number of abortions has grown the

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Speaker 2: most over the last three years. Abortions went from less

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Speaker 2: than five thousand total in twenty nineteen to more than

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Speaker 2: twenty thousand in three So here in eastern New Mexico,

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Speaker 2: the issue of abortion has sparked tensions and it's mobilized

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Speaker 2: Latinos and very specifically Latinas to work for or against

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Speaker 2: abortion access. Today, producer Marta Martinez and I are going

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Speaker 2: to introduce you to some of these new activists. Our

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Speaker 2: piece is a collaboration with whyyse the Pulse. And to

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Speaker 2: start off, we're going to meet Dina Ortega.

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Speaker 7: Hi, how are you nice to finally meetcha Sorry y'all

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Speaker 7: had to come in such a cold day.

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Speaker 2: Dina had a lot of energy, right Martha.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, she's this very smiley, very energetic, thirty seven year

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Speaker 3: old woman. She wears these gold rimmed glasses, and I

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Speaker 3: think what is very important for her is this small

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Speaker 3: cross that she wears on her neck.

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Speaker 7: I teach you through bat my church and we're having

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Speaker 7: a fun so I have the flyers everywhere.

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Speaker 8: Now.

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Speaker 2: Dina is not from Clovis, where we started the piece, right,

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Speaker 2: She's from a town that's pretty close, right.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, Dina lives in Portalis. It's about thirty minutes south

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Speaker 3: of Clovis and again less than twenty minutes from the

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Speaker 3: Texas border.

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Speaker 2: And then we pulled up to Dina's house, which was

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Speaker 2: a grayish blue mobile home and it was the only

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Speaker 2: one around here that has a ramp instead of stairs

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Speaker 2: to get in the reason why they have a ramp

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Speaker 2: is because Dina lives with her eighteen year old daughter Sarah,

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Speaker 2: also her cat Spark. But Sarah is in a wheelchair,

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Speaker 2: so that's why the ramp.

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Speaker 4: But this is my house, it's so cute.

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Speaker 6: Nice now.

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Speaker 2: Dina was only nineteen when she had her baby girl, Sarah.

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Speaker 7: Honestly, I was just young and stupid. There's no excuse.

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Speaker 7: I never really had that birth control talk with my mom.

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Speaker 7: It was always, if you have sex, you're.

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Speaker 4: Going to hell.

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Speaker 2: Dina was already three months in when she took the

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Speaker 2: pregnancy test and it ca back positive.

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Speaker 6: But you never thought of having an abortion.

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Speaker 7: It was ready too late.

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Speaker 6: Would you have had if you had found out earlier?

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Speaker 6: I know that's hard to say.

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Speaker 9: Now, but.

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Speaker 7: I don't know. Back then, it wasn't something we talked about.

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Speaker 7: Something even new you could get, so I wouldn't even

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Speaker 7: have known like where to go, what to do, who

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Speaker 7: to call. I mean, I was scared out of my

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Speaker 7: mind to tell my mom, much less ask her what

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Speaker 7: to do next.

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Speaker 4: What happened when you told your momof.

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Speaker 7: I got in trouble? It was awful. I know, I

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Speaker 7: broke my mom's heart.

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Speaker 6: Did she support you?

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Speaker 7: Yeah. If I didn't have my parents and my aunt

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Speaker 7: and uncle, I don't know what I would have done.

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Speaker 2: Dina's daughter was born with spina bifida, which means the

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Speaker 2: spinal cord doesn't form properly.

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Speaker 7: Daughter was sicker than sick. She only has one kidney.

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Speaker 7: She's had over thirteen surgeries on her feet.

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Speaker 2: On her back, so Sarah needed a lot of care.

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Speaker 7: I don't want to do that again.

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Speaker 2: After two years of focusing just on raising her daughter

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Speaker 2: and only twenty one years old at the time, Dina

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Speaker 2: started dating and she got into a new relationship. It

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Speaker 2: was great at first, but then he started abusing drugs

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Speaker 2: and alcohol and he got more controlling.

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Speaker 7: I wasn't allowed to wear makeup. I wasn't allowed to

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Speaker 7: have a lock pass on my phone. I wasn't allowed

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Speaker 7: to be on birth control.

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Speaker 2: I remember Dina telling us that she was really shocked

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Speaker 2: when she came under this kind of control of her partner.

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Speaker 3: She definitely didn't expect that, and that was the one

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Speaker 3: thing that Dina knew she was never going to comply with.

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Speaker 3: There was no way that she was going to have

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Speaker 3: another child after what she went through with Sarah, and

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Speaker 3: she also knew that she would be forever trapped with

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Speaker 3: her abuse partner, So she started taking birth control shots

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Speaker 3: every three months or so, and she did it in secret.

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Speaker 3: She would drive to Clovis, which is the town where

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Speaker 3: we started the story, and that's where the only women's

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Speaker 3: clinic in the region was at the time.

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Speaker 2: But Dina is very Catholic, right Martha.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and she didn't see taking birth control as a

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Speaker 3: contradiction with her Catholic faith.

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Speaker 7: I really really don't think God would have wanted me

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Speaker 7: to bring a baby into that situation. My ex was

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Speaker 7: an addict and he was abusive. Why should a child

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Speaker 7: have to live through that.

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Speaker 3: Dina stayed with her partner for thirteen years during the pandemic.

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Speaker 3: She finally told him to leave.

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Speaker 2: Is that why you understand and take the possibility of

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Speaker 2: choosing an abortion?

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Speaker 6: Is that why you take it so serious?

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Speaker 7: Because I know what it's like to feel trapped somewhere.

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Speaker 7: I would go to bed every single night and I

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Speaker 7: would just pray to God, God, I just want to

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Speaker 7: be happy. God, I just want to be happy. You

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Speaker 7: should never, as a woman, as a human being, ever

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Speaker 7: have to think.

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Speaker 2: That the summer when Roe v. Wade was overturned. That's

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Speaker 2: when Dina started joining pro choice demonstrations in Portales and

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Speaker 2: in Clovis.

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Speaker 7: I remember in high school I used to always say like,

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Speaker 7: I would love to live in like the sixties, the seventies,

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Speaker 7: so I could do the protests, do the marches. And

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Speaker 7: then thirty years later, here I am doing it. You're

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Speaker 7: not supposed to go backwards, You're supposed to go forward.

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Speaker 2: And she became the vice chair of the local Democratic Party.

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Speaker 2: It turns out that in Dina's family, their allegiance to

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Speaker 2: the Democratic Party runs almost as deep as their Catholic faith.

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Speaker 2: But then Marta Sbaight happened.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's the very restrictive abortion law that Texas passed

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Speaker 3: only six weeks of pregnancy, and Dina was at work

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Speaker 3: at the local hospital that day.

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Speaker 4: She remembers it very well.

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Speaker 7: I just started crying at my desk and I was

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Speaker 7: just like, oh my gosh. And I told my coworkers,

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Speaker 7: we're going back to like the nineteen hundreds. What are

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Speaker 7: they going to take from us next?

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Speaker 3: Dina knew that the wave of consequences from Sbaight would

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Speaker 3: also impact.

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Speaker 4: Her community in eastern New Mexico.

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Speaker 3: But she didn't expect that part of it would involve

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Speaker 3: trying to bring back laws from the nineteenth century.

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Speaker 2: And coming up on Latino USA, how those nineteenth century

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Speaker 2: laws ended up waking up Latina activists in eastern New Mexico.

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Speaker 2: Stay with us, no devayas, Hey, we're back. Before the break,

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Speaker 2: we learned how the passing of an anti abortion law

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Speaker 2: in Texas ended up sparking tensions in eastern New Mexico.

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Speaker 2: So first there's Dina Ortega, who we just met, a

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Speaker 2: devout Catholic who is also a strong believer in a

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Speaker 2: woman's right to choose.

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Speaker 3: And now we meet Victoria Robledo at a coffee shop

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Speaker 3: in Clovis.

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Speaker 7: Hello, nice for me, late.

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Speaker 3: That's the town that's less than ten minutes away from

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Speaker 3: the Texas border that we mentioned at the top of

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Speaker 3: the show, where there's this welcome sign with this big

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Speaker 3: cross and the Ten Commandments.

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Speaker 10: This is Blackwater Coffee, my favorite coffee shop and arguably

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Speaker 10: the best place in Clovis.

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Speaker 3: Victoria moved to Clovis in twenty twenty one because her

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Speaker 3: husband got a job at Canon Air Force Base, which

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Speaker 3: is nearby Clovis. And this is also the cafe where

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Speaker 3: her activism group, which is called Eastern New Mexico Rising,

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Speaker 3: was founded, and they meet regularly here. They started organizing

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Speaker 3: around reproductive rights after Rob Waite was overturned.

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Speaker 10: Can I just get an ice macho late?

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Speaker 9: A large ice matcho late?

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Speaker 2: And Victoria? I mean, she's really got a big personality.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Victoria is twenty five years old and she's already

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Speaker 3: the mother of two boys and also a personal trainer

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Speaker 3: and an activist. She's also from Corpus Christi, Texas, like

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Speaker 3: the singer Selina, and she likes to point out, so

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Speaker 3: moving over.

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Speaker 10: Here, I was like, this is not that different, you know,

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Speaker 10: even though the state aligns with my values, like the

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Speaker 10: town doesn't. So I feel like I'm just in Texas

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Speaker 10: all over again.

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Speaker 3: Victoria became a mother when she was very young, just

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Speaker 3: like the Nowtega, the other Latina we met earlier in

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Speaker 3: the show, and it had a deep impact on her

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Speaker 3: political views.

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Speaker 10: I had them at nineteen and so just like the

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Speaker 10: after effects of having him postpartum depression and not getting

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Speaker 10: the resources that I needed, it was like, okay, this

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Speaker 10: is my issue. This is the one that was what

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Speaker 10: really spearheaded it.

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Speaker 2: In early twenty twenty two, Victoria and her husband celebrated

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Speaker 2: a pregnancy, but it ended soon in miscarriage. Then she

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Speaker 2: got pregnant again, and now she was worried about how

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Speaker 2: the overturn of Roe v. Wade might impact her access

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Speaker 2: to healthcare during her pregnancy, and the news began to

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Speaker 2: hit much closer to home.

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Speaker 10: And then I see a Facebook post in April about

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Speaker 10: women's medical center closings, and I'm like, are you kidding me?

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Speaker 2: Do you remember what that felt like when you were like,

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Speaker 2: my god, there's no healthcare around for me.

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Speaker 9: Yeah, it was really upsetting.

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Speaker 10: I was frustrated because a part of me was like,

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Speaker 10: why is this the only place here?

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Speaker 4: Like why is there not more ob jo.

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Speaker 10: Enns, because like hearing about the Obbs, like your rights

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Speaker 10: might be at stake, but here, also, your women's center

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Speaker 10: is closed, so good luck.

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Speaker 2: Like super personal, Like the politics of the Supreme Court

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Speaker 2: suddenly are like in your small town.

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Speaker 3: Yes, And that led Victoria to get politically involved in

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Speaker 3: her new hometown in a way she didn't expect, and

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Speaker 3: things got more tense very fast.

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Speaker 2: So, dear listener, so far, we've heard from newly minted

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Speaker 2: Latina activists who are now out defending a woman's right

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Speaker 2: to choose in their small towns in eastern New Mexico.

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Speaker 2: But of course, Latinos, like everybody else in this country

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Speaker 2: in terms of politics, are very complex. So other people

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Speaker 2: have been mobilized now more than ever to rally against

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Speaker 2: abortion access. And we came upon this too in eastern

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Speaker 2: New Mexico.

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Speaker 11: Is this as first und to Clovis?

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Speaker 5: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah.

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Speaker 2: We met up with Pastor Eric Welsh at Grace Covenant

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Speaker 2: Reformed Church in Clovis, and that's the same town where

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Speaker 2: Victoria the activist lives.

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Speaker 4: I have no idea, it's yes, yes.

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Speaker 2: His mother's family is from Mexico. His father is Italian

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Speaker 2: and Irish, but he grew up with his familia on

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Speaker 2: his mother's side and so he identifies as Hispanic.

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Speaker 11: It's a very matriarchal family. My grandmother and all my

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Speaker 11: aunts and my mom, they're all very strong women.

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Speaker 2: In the summer of twenty twenty two, Eric Hurd that

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Speaker 2: an abortion clinic was considering his hometown as a new location.

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Speaker 11: And they had named Clovis specifically, and it was like, Oh,

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Speaker 11: we need to do something.

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Speaker 2: About this, because it was like, oh, I live in

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Speaker 2: New Mexico, which is a blue state. Yes, they're going

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Speaker 2: to protect abortion, and I don't want to see this

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Speaker 2: happen in my life.

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Speaker 9: That's right.

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Speaker 2: And in terms of Eric, he actually had a bit

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Speaker 2: of a difficult life, right. He got married at nineteen,

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Speaker 2: started drinking and taking drugs, became a father at twenty,

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Speaker 2: but says he never considered abortion, even though he was

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Speaker 2: an atheist at the time.

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Speaker 11: My mom had me at fifteen, Like fifteen, raising me

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Speaker 11: is brutal, and my dad wasn't the greatest dude, and

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Speaker 11: she always busted her rear end for me and my brother,

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Speaker 11: and I didn't really have the justification. If she could

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Speaker 11: do it, then I could do it.

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Speaker 2: Things didn't go well. He kept on drinking, he was

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Speaker 2: addicted to opioids, and then he went to rehab, even

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Speaker 2: though he was pretty skeptical about the religious part of

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Speaker 2: the program. But then one day, he says, a pastor

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Speaker 2: came and shared the Gospel with him.

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Speaker 6: So what happened in that moment.

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Speaker 11: I can't explain it. It was just I heard him.

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Speaker 11: The light switch went off, and I knew. I won't

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Speaker 11: say that I trusted it just quite yet, but I

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Speaker 11: knew that there was something different with me.

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Speaker 2: And he says, since then he's remained sober.

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Speaker 11: When I realized that God is real, I began reading

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Speaker 11: the scriptures. Where my addiction was the insatiable desire, it

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Speaker 11: now became learning about this God. And this topic of

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Speaker 11: abortion is one that is dealt with clearly in the scriptures.

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Speaker 2: But actually, Marta, the question of abortion in the scriptures

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Speaker 2: is in fact not so clear right.

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Speaker 3: Actually, the Bible doesn't mention abortion explicitly anywhere. Most anti

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Speaker 3: abortion Christians focus on its mentions of the value of

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Speaker 3: life in the womb and the idea of life beginning

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Speaker 3: a conception.

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Speaker 11: This really is about loving women, it really is. It's

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Speaker 11: not about controlling people.

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Speaker 2: But then Marta, Eric actually jumped in because he wanted

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Speaker 2: to control things that were happening in his town.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, So when he heard that potentially an abortion provider

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Speaker 3: might come to his hometown in Clovis, that's when he

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Speaker 3: devoted all of his efforts to stop it. And he

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Speaker 3: looked across the New Mexico border.

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Speaker 11: I contacted one of the guys who played an instrumental

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Speaker 11: role in the Heartbeat.

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Speaker 4: Bill for Texas.

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Speaker 3: That's SB eight, the abortion band in Texas that we've

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Speaker 3: talked about before, and Eric is referring to pastor Mark

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Speaker 3: Lee Dixon, the founder of the anti abortion group Right

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Speaker 3: to Life of East Texas.

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Speaker 12: I'm against abortion period, the taking of an innocent life

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Speaker 12: made in the image of God.

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Speaker 6: It shouldn't be.

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Speaker 3: And then the other person he reached out to is

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Speaker 3: lawyer Jonathan F. Mitchell, who is also the former Texas

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Speaker 3: Solicitor General and one of Donald Trump's personal lawyers.

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Speaker 13: If you are opposed to abortion, I think it should

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Speaker 13: be outlaw and criminalized. Then the question becomes how you

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Speaker 13: have an effective prohibition on abortion?

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Speaker 2: Okay, So to be clear, Dixon and Mitchell are basically

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Speaker 2: the forces behind the abortion ban in the state of Texas,

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Speaker 2: but now they're operating in eastern New Mexico. And so

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Speaker 2: after Eric, the pastor in Clovis, insisted for a bit,

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Speaker 2: Mark Lee Dixon, the Texas pastor, comes to Clovis and

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Speaker 2: they organize a public meeting in September of twenty twenty

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Speaker 2: two located at Eric's church. And it turns out that

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Speaker 2: a lot of people show.

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Speaker 11: Up on a normal church service, we have like fifty

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Speaker 11: people that show up here. There was a camera crew

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Speaker 11: over on that side by the exit and we literally

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Speaker 11: had every seat packed.

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Speaker 3: And that's where Mark Lee Dixon shared this strategy that

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Speaker 3: he's been leading to fight abortion.

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Speaker 4: At the local level.

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Speaker 3: And this is what they call the Sanctuary Cities of

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Speaker 3: the Unborn.

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Speaker 2: Okay, so they have a national policy and it's called

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Speaker 2: the Sanctuary Cities of the Unborn.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, this is a very well planned strategy from these

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Speaker 3: anti abortion leaders to actually bond abortion at the local level,

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Speaker 3: especially in states where abortion is protected, like New Mexico.

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Speaker 6: So how do they plan on doing that?

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Speaker 3: So what they did is they drafted this ordinance, which

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Speaker 3: is like a rule that's made by a local government,

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Speaker 3: and it's based on a very obscure and pretty much

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Speaker 3: outdated law from the nineteenth century. That's called the Comstock Act,

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Speaker 3: which is basically an anti obscenity law.

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Speaker 2: All Right, so let's take a moment because a lot

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Speaker 2: has happened here and now we're talking about nineteenth century

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Speaker 2: laws that are being used in eastern New Mexico to

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Speaker 2: restrict abortion. So that what exactly does the Comstock Act

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Speaker 2: have to do with abortion?

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Speaker 3: It gets a little bit technical, but it's very important

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Speaker 3: and we are going to hear a lot more about

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Speaker 3: the Comstock Act in the coming months. So basically, the

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Speaker 3: Comstock Act bans the shipping or receiving of any tools, drugs,

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Speaker 3: or other supplies that can be used in an abortion.

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Speaker 3: For most of the twentieth century, this was really not enforced,

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Speaker 3: and in many cases it's seen even as unconstitutional.

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Speaker 2: Right because over the years, actually more federal laws were

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Speaker 2: passed in order to protect abortion access. And now these

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Speaker 2: nineteenth century laws are being revived. So how does this work? Exactly?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's what these local ordinances are trying to do. Basically,

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Speaker 3: they would require a potential clinic that wanted to perform

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Speaker 3: abortions they would have to apply for a business license,

445
00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:04,239
Speaker 3: and in order to get a license, they would have

446
00:26:04,280 --> 00:26:08,440
Speaker 3: to confirm that they will quote unquote comply with federal law,

447
00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:12,080
Speaker 3: which it's like a trap because it means that they

448
00:26:12,119 --> 00:26:14,320
Speaker 3: won't violate the Comstock Act.

449
00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:18,560
Speaker 2: Which basically sounds like a roundabout way to effectively ban.

450
00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:22,119
Speaker 3: Abortion exactly, because as we said, how are you going

451
00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:24,840
Speaker 3: to get a license where you say you need to

452
00:26:24,920 --> 00:26:27,480
Speaker 3: comply with the Comstock Act if what you're trying to

453
00:26:27,520 --> 00:26:30,800
Speaker 3: do is to perform an abortion, and then you can't

454
00:26:30,960 --> 00:26:34,800
Speaker 3: get any supplies in town. But even though it all

455
00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:37,919
Speaker 3: sounds like it doesn't make a lot of sense, there

456
00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:41,439
Speaker 3: are actually sixty nine towns Maria across the country that

457
00:26:41,520 --> 00:26:45,840
Speaker 3: have already passed comstock coordinances. Most of them are in Texas,

458
00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:49,240
Speaker 3: but there are also cities in states like Nebraska, Iowa,

459
00:26:49,280 --> 00:26:53,199
Speaker 3: and Illinois. We actually reached out to Mark Lee Dixon

460
00:26:53,240 --> 00:26:56,439
Speaker 3: and Jonathan Mitchell to ask them about the sanctuary cities

461
00:26:56,440 --> 00:27:00,119
Speaker 3: of the unborn movement, and Dixon the Texas passed or

462
00:27:00,359 --> 00:27:04,119
Speaker 3: responded via email saying that he has assisted almost eighty

463
00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:08,399
Speaker 3: cities and counties across seven states in trying to pass

464
00:27:08,640 --> 00:27:12,920
Speaker 3: very similar ordinances to quote, protect the health and welfare

465
00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:17,560
Speaker 3: of communities. Dixon added that his motivation to go to

466
00:27:17,640 --> 00:27:21,320
Speaker 3: other states outside of Texas is that people have been

467
00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:25,119
Speaker 3: asking for his help and that quote, the rights of

468
00:27:25,280 --> 00:27:30,000
Speaker 3: unborn children must be protected everywhere. So this is the

469
00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:34,280
Speaker 3: proposal that Mark Lee Dixon brought to Clovis, and they

470
00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:37,359
Speaker 3: asked the residents to put pressure on their representatives to

471
00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:37,760
Speaker 3: pass it.

472
00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:43,560
Speaker 2: Now, this is in fact part of a highly coordinated

473
00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:48,480
Speaker 2: national strategy from these anti abortion leaders. So on the

474
00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:52,960
Speaker 2: local level, people like Vigdordia, the activists right, they were

475
00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:56,120
Speaker 2: really taken by surprise, like, how was it now that

476
00:27:56,200 --> 00:27:59,720
Speaker 2: their little town in eastern New Mexico became a kind

477
00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:02,479
Speaker 2: of ground zero of the front lines of the anti

478
00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:03,320
Speaker 2: abortion fight.

479
00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:06,680
Speaker 10: I didn't even know what an ordnance was. I didn't

480
00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:09,679
Speaker 10: even know they were called commissioners. I knew nothing.

481
00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:13,760
Speaker 2: Victoria did worry that this was now about taking away

482
00:28:13,920 --> 00:28:18,119
Speaker 2: access to women's healthcare in her community, and that would

483
00:28:18,200 --> 00:28:22,160
Speaker 2: impact her because it turns out she was now pregnant again.

484
00:28:22,800 --> 00:28:25,359
Speaker 10: It's not just about abortion, because abortion is only part

485
00:28:25,400 --> 00:28:29,359
Speaker 10: of reproductive healthcare as a whole. It is ridiculous because

486
00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:32,240
Speaker 10: it's not a moral issue. I mean, it's just healthcare.

487
00:28:34,800 --> 00:28:38,080
Speaker 2: And then everything moved really fast, right Marda.

488
00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:42,680
Speaker 3: Yes, two months after Pastor Eric Welsh organized this meeting

489
00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:46,479
Speaker 3: at his church, they were already setting a vote in

490
00:28:46,520 --> 00:28:50,920
Speaker 3: the Clovis City Commission to consider the comstock ordinance. And

491
00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:55,520
Speaker 3: that was November third, twenty twenty two. And Victoria thought

492
00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:58,920
Speaker 3: it was not random that this was moving so quickly.

493
00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:02,320
Speaker 10: People don't be attention to local politics. So you can

494
00:29:02,360 --> 00:29:06,880
Speaker 10: get this done fast without anyone noticing, then you're good.

495
00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:09,880
Speaker 10: And Clovis was the first place in New Mexico for

496
00:29:09,920 --> 00:29:10,680
Speaker 10: them to try this on.

497
00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:13,880
Speaker 4: There was a lot of expectation in the community. On

498
00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:17,680
Speaker 4: the day of the vote, good evening everyone. Mayor Morris

499
00:29:17,760 --> 00:29:18,800
Speaker 4: addressed the busy room.

500
00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:22,160
Speaker 13: We'll begin the meeting in the normal fashion with a

501
00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:23,960
Speaker 13: prayer and then we'll honor our flag. So if you

502
00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:25,320
Speaker 13: would please stand with me.

503
00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:28,400
Speaker 3: So the mayor allowed for five people to speak in

504
00:29:28,440 --> 00:29:32,000
Speaker 3: favor of the ordinance and five people to speak against it,

505
00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:35,120
Speaker 3: and one of the people who spoke in favor was

506
00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:36,440
Speaker 3: Pastor Eric Welsh.

507
00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:39,280
Speaker 11: Why do we think that the answer to this question

508
00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:41,760
Speaker 11: is going to be found in a governor, is going

509
00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:44,400
Speaker 11: to be found in an ally at the state level.

510
00:29:45,040 --> 00:29:48,480
Speaker 11: The answer to this problem is found in God alone.

511
00:29:48,560 --> 00:29:52,040
Speaker 11: This is either right or it is wrong. Which side

512
00:29:52,040 --> 00:29:54,560
Speaker 11: do you fall on? If you call yourself a Christian?

513
00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:57,600
Speaker 11: Please please vote yes on this.

514
00:29:58,200 --> 00:29:58,520
Speaker 13: Thank you.

515
00:30:01,720 --> 00:30:04,160
Speaker 3: And a few minutes later it was Victoria Robleto who

516
00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:05,160
Speaker 3: took the microphone.

517
00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:09,360
Speaker 10: I am a district or a constituent of district too pregnant.

518
00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:12,880
Speaker 3: Obviously Victoria was eight months pregnant and she was wearing

519
00:30:12,880 --> 00:30:15,960
Speaker 3: this black dress with her belly showing under a red blazer.

520
00:30:16,320 --> 00:30:19,560
Speaker 10: The city cannot be a city for the unborn, when

521
00:30:19,640 --> 00:30:23,160
Speaker 10: pregnant women like myself can't get the timely care they need.

522
00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:26,200
Speaker 10: I'm doing less than a month with no appointment scheduled

523
00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:28,680
Speaker 10: this week. It took me longer to grow this child

524
00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:31,000
Speaker 10: than for y'all to consider stripping away my rights tonight.

525
00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:34,320
Speaker 10: So please, for the sake of our community, I ask

526
00:30:35,040 --> 00:30:37,320
Speaker 10: from emotion to table Ordnance twenty one to eighty four.

527
00:30:38,240 --> 00:30:38,560
Speaker 9: Thank you.

528
00:30:39,680 --> 00:30:43,880
Speaker 3: What Victoria was asking is to table the ordinance, which

529
00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:45,880
Speaker 3: means to put the decision on hold.

530
00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:49,840
Speaker 2: And then Mark Lee Dixon, the Texas pastor who co

531
00:30:49,920 --> 00:30:53,080
Speaker 2: wrote the ordinance, he was there too, and he even

532
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:56,680
Speaker 2: spoke at the meeting, which was surprising because the testimonies

533
00:30:56,720 --> 00:30:59,000
Speaker 2: were supposed to be from the community.

534
00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:03,800
Speaker 12: Right Life Texas has no borders because people from East

535
00:31:03,800 --> 00:31:06,640
Speaker 12: Texas are coming to New Mexico for abortions.

536
00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:09,640
Speaker 2: It was clear in his speech that for him, this

537
00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:13,440
Speaker 2: local ordinance was part of something much bigger.

538
00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:17,080
Speaker 12: You're going to send a message tonight to all the

539
00:31:17,160 --> 00:31:20,160
Speaker 12: media here, to all of New Mexico, to the United

540
00:31:20,200 --> 00:31:25,360
Speaker 12: States of America. Is Clovis ready to stand for life?

541
00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:28,640
Speaker 4: We asked Peak Doria about this outside influence.

542
00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:32,360
Speaker 10: Oh, it was the worst. The idea was not spurred

543
00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:37,480
Speaker 10: from local support. The idea came from Texas and was

544
00:31:37,560 --> 00:31:38,440
Speaker 10: planted here.

545
00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:41,960
Speaker 3: I'm wondering if you felt like your town was in

546
00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:46,200
Speaker 3: a way being manipulated. Yes, and we asked the same

547
00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:49,480
Speaker 3: to Eric Welsh, but he felt the manipulation did not

548
00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:50,680
Speaker 3: come from the outside.

549
00:31:51,000 --> 00:31:53,280
Speaker 11: I felt that our town was being manipulated by our government.

550
00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:55,680
Speaker 11: I think there was a lot of fear. This was

551
00:31:55,720 --> 00:31:57,600
Speaker 11: something that they desperately did not want to have to

552
00:31:57,640 --> 00:31:58,000
Speaker 11: deal with.

553
00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:00,960
Speaker 13: I'll call the vote Comission, please vote.

554
00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:04,000
Speaker 3: It was a nail biting moment for Victoria and the

555
00:32:04,040 --> 00:32:05,600
Speaker 3: Eastern New Mexican Rising team.

556
00:32:06,120 --> 00:32:07,160
Speaker 9: So we're sitting.

557
00:32:06,840 --> 00:32:09,680
Speaker 10: Here and there's a big screen right there, and we're

558
00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:13,320
Speaker 10: just all looking at it, like holding on to each other,

559
00:32:13,360 --> 00:32:14,520
Speaker 10: holding onto our seats.

560
00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:18,280
Speaker 4: A few seconds later, the vote is out on the

561
00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:19,760
Speaker 4: screen by.

562
00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:22,600
Speaker 13: Vote of seven in favor and want to pose the

563
00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:24,200
Speaker 13: motion to table carries.

564
00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:28,800
Speaker 2: The Commission decides, in fact, to table the decision about

565
00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:32,200
Speaker 2: the ordinance, which was a win for Victoria and a

566
00:32:32,280 --> 00:32:34,640
Speaker 2: takedown of Pastor Eric Welsh.

567
00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:35,520
Speaker 11: I was upset.

568
00:32:36,200 --> 00:32:37,320
Speaker 6: I was very upset about that.

569
00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:42,600
Speaker 2: Finally, some people started applauding about the tabling of the decision,

570
00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:45,440
Speaker 2: and Victoria was among those who were celebrating this.

571
00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:47,840
Speaker 9: We all started falling.

572
00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:50,200
Speaker 10: I don't even remember the noises that were being made.

573
00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:51,840
Speaker 10: It was just like so crazy.

574
00:32:52,560 --> 00:32:55,840
Speaker 2: It was an unexpected victory in a town that is

575
00:32:56,120 --> 00:32:57,440
Speaker 2: majority Republican.

576
00:32:57,920 --> 00:33:01,880
Speaker 10: Meanwhile, we're like, we just saved our health. It was

577
00:33:01,880 --> 00:33:07,160
Speaker 10: like David and Goliath, which is ironic considering the circumstances.

578
00:33:10,600 --> 00:33:12,880
Speaker 4: But victorious joy wouldn't last long.

579
00:33:13,560 --> 00:33:17,480
Speaker 2: And that's coming up on Latino USA because a wave

580
00:33:17,600 --> 00:33:22,400
Speaker 2: of comstock ordinances gets pasted in eastern New Mexico. Feeling

581
00:33:22,520 --> 00:33:45,360
Speaker 2: a blow to pro choice Latinas there, stay with us, Yes, hey,

582
00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:50,440
Speaker 2: we're back, Producer Marta Martinez and I are reporting in New.

583
00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:54,080
Speaker 6: Mexico in Clovis, New Mexico.

584
00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:58,760
Speaker 2: The decision to pass this ordinance was tabled, but anti

585
00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:02,959
Speaker 2: abortion activists from our state then when after another eastern

586
00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:06,960
Speaker 2: New Mexico town it's called Hobbes, So Marda. Where is

587
00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:09,160
Speaker 2: Hobbes and what happened there?

588
00:34:11,360 --> 00:34:14,839
Speaker 3: So Hobbs is about two hours south of Clovis, and

589
00:34:15,120 --> 00:34:19,440
Speaker 3: it's also over sixty percent Latino or Hispanic as they

590
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:23,760
Speaker 3: usually say here. On November seventh, twenty twenty two, that's

591
00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:28,240
Speaker 3: just four days after Clovis decided to postpone their decision,

592
00:34:28,719 --> 00:34:32,320
Speaker 3: Hobbs voted on a very similar anti abortion ordinance.

593
00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:35,720
Speaker 2: So I will ask for a motion to approve Ordinance

594
00:34:35,800 --> 00:34:36,759
Speaker 2: number eleven forty.

595
00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:38,080
Speaker 6: Please vote.

596
00:34:38,160 --> 00:34:41,200
Speaker 3: And the city commission in Hobbes, which is formed by

597
00:34:41,440 --> 00:34:45,000
Speaker 3: six men, passed the comstock ordinance right away.

598
00:34:45,320 --> 00:34:46,680
Speaker 6: Most passion a study.

599
00:34:48,840 --> 00:34:52,840
Speaker 2: And then in January of twenty twenty three, only two

600
00:34:52,880 --> 00:34:56,600
Speaker 2: months after Clovis had tabled their decision about the ordinance,

601
00:34:57,200 --> 00:35:00,440
Speaker 2: the Clovis Commissioners voted on it once again.

602
00:35:01,480 --> 00:35:04,360
Speaker 13: By a vote of seven in favor and one abstention.

603
00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:05,520
Speaker 13: The motion is.

604
00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:13,520
Speaker 2: Carried and this time the ordinance passed. Sstor Eric Welch,

605
00:35:13,520 --> 00:35:15,880
Speaker 2: who had brought the ordinance here, was in the room

606
00:35:16,239 --> 00:35:17,440
Speaker 2: and he was celebrating.

607
00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:19,120
Speaker 7: I was very excited about that.

608
00:35:19,400 --> 00:35:22,920
Speaker 11: We made a stance, and any abortion clinic that wanted

609
00:35:22,920 --> 00:35:26,719
Speaker 11: to come into clothes knew that they're gonna have to

610
00:35:26,800 --> 00:35:28,759
Speaker 11: fight to be here. That we're not just going to

611
00:35:28,880 --> 00:35:31,399
Speaker 11: roll over and say, oh, well, you know state law.

612
00:35:31,880 --> 00:35:33,760
Speaker 11: They're actually going to have a fight on their hands,

613
00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:34,920
Speaker 11: and that's what we wanted.

614
00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:41,000
Speaker 2: So remember Victoria Robedo, the activist from this area. She

615
00:35:41,120 --> 00:35:44,080
Speaker 2: had just given birth. She was watching all of this

616
00:35:44,239 --> 00:35:48,239
Speaker 2: online and she was impacted because there was only one

617
00:35:48,440 --> 00:35:53,800
Speaker 2: Latina commissioner who voted for this ordinance, and she's a Democrat.

618
00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:57,080
Speaker 2: And this is what that commissioner said. Her name is

619
00:35:57,280 --> 00:36:00,880
Speaker 2: Helen Cassos. If anybody think that they can do a

620
00:36:00,920 --> 00:36:04,080
Speaker 2: better job than any of us sitting up here, they

621
00:36:04,120 --> 00:36:08,680
Speaker 2: need to run for election. And this changed everything for Victoria.

622
00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:11,560
Speaker 9: I was like, no, this is not okay.

623
00:36:14,040 --> 00:36:19,239
Speaker 10: A Hispanic woman who was a registered Democrat and then

624
00:36:19,480 --> 00:36:23,440
Speaker 10: vote for this, No, okay, that's fine.

625
00:36:23,600 --> 00:36:26,920
Speaker 9: Then I'm going to take your seat. And so I

626
00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:35,240
Speaker 9: was like, I'm going to run for office.

627
00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:39,919
Speaker 2: The move to pass these ordinances doesn't stop there.

628
00:36:40,719 --> 00:36:42,120
Speaker 6: It actually continues.

629
00:36:43,239 --> 00:36:46,880
Speaker 3: Just a few days later, another comstock ordinance passed. This

630
00:36:47,040 --> 00:36:49,359
Speaker 3: time it was in Roosevelt County, which is where Dina

631
00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:52,720
Speaker 3: Ortega lives. That's the Catholic Latina that we met earlier

632
00:36:52,760 --> 00:36:53,200
Speaker 3: in the show.

633
00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:57,160
Speaker 7: There was just so many people, it was so packed.

634
00:36:57,239 --> 00:37:00,600
Speaker 7: It's like so intense, and the people against abortion are

635
00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:03,120
Speaker 7: talking and they have just as much power and emotion

636
00:37:03,239 --> 00:37:04,439
Speaker 7: in their voice as we did.

637
00:37:05,360 --> 00:37:09,319
Speaker 3: And there was no surprise in this vote either. The

638
00:37:09,440 --> 00:37:13,400
Speaker 3: ordinance got passed by four votes in favor and one against.

639
00:37:14,160 --> 00:37:16,279
Speaker 7: I remember I walked out of that meeting and I

640
00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:18,319
Speaker 7: called my mom as soon as I got out, and

641
00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:21,200
Speaker 7: I told her, Mom, I'm going to become a politician.

642
00:37:21,640 --> 00:37:23,600
Speaker 7: You feel that rush? And I said, Mom, what are

643
00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:26,800
Speaker 7: these women? These girls are going to do? Because someone's

644
00:37:26,800 --> 00:37:29,759
Speaker 7: got a fight, Someone's got to be the backbone of

645
00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:30,280
Speaker 7: this town.

646
00:37:33,600 --> 00:37:37,200
Speaker 4: What about twenty twenty six, I'll be city council.

647
00:37:46,480 --> 00:37:50,720
Speaker 2: So you have this wave of anti abortion ordinances taking

648
00:37:50,760 --> 00:37:54,040
Speaker 2: over eastern New Mexico. But at the same time, in

649
00:37:54,080 --> 00:37:58,239
Speaker 2: twenty twenty three, Whole Woman's Health, the abortion provider that

650
00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:01,120
Speaker 2: we heard from earlier in the show, they made a

651
00:38:01,160 --> 00:38:04,800
Speaker 2: decision about where they wanted to open their first clinic

652
00:38:05,000 --> 00:38:06,080
Speaker 2: in New Mexico.

653
00:38:06,920 --> 00:38:10,640
Speaker 3: Yes, they were considering Clovis or hops, but they finally

654
00:38:10,719 --> 00:38:14,480
Speaker 3: opened the clinic in Albuquerque. Ammy Hackstrom, the founder of

655
00:38:14,520 --> 00:38:18,239
Speaker 3: Whole Woman's Health, says that ninety five percent of their

656
00:38:18,280 --> 00:38:20,520
Speaker 3: patients come from Texas now.

657
00:38:20,920 --> 00:38:23,919
Speaker 5: And I think in a community like Albuquerque, it's big

658
00:38:24,040 --> 00:38:27,520
Speaker 5: enough that we can blend in that our patients may

659
00:38:27,520 --> 00:38:30,239
Speaker 5: not be surveiled in the same kind of way that

660
00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:33,360
Speaker 5: they might be in a small border community, but I

661
00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:37,280
Speaker 5: think those kinds of communities are really targeted by this movement.

662
00:38:38,040 --> 00:38:43,080
Speaker 2: And that movement is again the Sanctuary Cities of the Unborn,

663
00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:48,160
Speaker 2: led by Texas pastor Mark Lee Dixon and Texas lawyer

664
00:38:48,360 --> 00:38:55,239
Speaker 2: Jonathan Mitchell. Because rural conservative border towns like Clovis near

665
00:38:55,520 --> 00:39:00,000
Speaker 2: states where abortion is banned are perfect locations for their strategy.

666
00:39:01,040 --> 00:39:04,319
Speaker 2: Tensions around abortion are already high, and it's easier to

667
00:39:04,360 --> 00:39:08,560
Speaker 2: stir fear about the possibility of an abortion clinic opening there,

668
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:11,600
Speaker 2: and so people get riled up.

669
00:39:12,080 --> 00:39:13,080
Speaker 4: That's right, Maria.

670
00:39:13,160 --> 00:39:15,799
Speaker 3: And they've done it in eastern New Mexico, as we

671
00:39:15,840 --> 00:39:19,800
Speaker 3: already saw. They also showed up in West Wendover, Nevada,

672
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:24,160
Speaker 3: next to the border with Utah, and also in Danville, Illinois,

673
00:39:24,360 --> 00:39:28,719
Speaker 3: next to Indiana, where abortion is also a law. And

674
00:39:28,880 --> 00:39:32,160
Speaker 3: I've read several analysis from legal experts that say that

675
00:39:32,239 --> 00:39:35,879
Speaker 3: the conservative strategy is to push for these states that

676
00:39:35,920 --> 00:39:40,680
Speaker 3: protect abortion to sue the towns that have passed comstock ordinances.

677
00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:44,640
Speaker 3: The end game, these legal experts say, is that at

678
00:39:44,680 --> 00:39:48,000
Speaker 3: some point one of these cases will make it up

679
00:39:48,040 --> 00:39:51,560
Speaker 3: to the Supreme Court and maybe even lead to a

680
00:39:51,680 --> 00:39:58,160
Speaker 3: national abortion band. And this is something Amy Haxtrom has

681
00:39:58,239 --> 00:39:58,960
Speaker 3: seen before.

682
00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:02,880
Speaker 5: I have said anti abortion strategies. You know, it starts

683
00:40:02,920 --> 00:40:05,839
Speaker 5: in Texas, doesn't stay in Texas. And I meant that

684
00:40:05,920 --> 00:40:09,280
Speaker 5: about the Roe v. Wade case, the Holven's Healthy Jackson,

685
00:40:09,320 --> 00:40:10,240
Speaker 5: the Sbaight case.

686
00:40:10,239 --> 00:40:10,920
Speaker 6: I mean, these are.

687
00:40:10,880 --> 00:40:13,919
Speaker 5: All cases that started in Texas that have affected people

688
00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:15,080
Speaker 5: all across the country.

689
00:40:15,480 --> 00:40:19,399
Speaker 2: Because there's a conservative majority in the Supreme Court, there

690
00:40:19,480 --> 00:40:23,680
Speaker 2: is a real chance that the anti abortion movement could

691
00:40:23,760 --> 00:40:27,040
Speaker 2: get another outcome in their favor, like what we saw

692
00:40:27,080 --> 00:40:28,360
Speaker 2: with the reversal of Roe v.

693
00:40:28,520 --> 00:40:30,560
Speaker 4: Wade and Martley Dixon.

694
00:40:30,800 --> 00:40:34,640
Speaker 3: The Texas pastor was also quite blunt about their final

695
00:40:34,680 --> 00:40:40,400
Speaker 3: goal when we asked him about this. In his email,

696
00:40:40,440 --> 00:40:43,200
Speaker 3: he said that the final goal for him and his

697
00:40:43,320 --> 00:40:47,400
Speaker 3: movement is the end of abortion in all fifty states,

698
00:40:47,880 --> 00:40:51,080
Speaker 3: and that the Comstock Act is for them a means

699
00:40:51,120 --> 00:40:55,359
Speaker 3: to that end. And Maria Dixon also said that he

700
00:40:55,480 --> 00:40:59,640
Speaker 3: never intended to provoke a lawsuit against the ordinances, but

701
00:40:59,800 --> 00:41:02,879
Speaker 3: that he's not afraid of these ordinances ending up.

702
00:41:02,840 --> 00:41:04,920
Speaker 4: Before the Supreme Court of the United.

703
00:41:04,640 --> 00:41:09,560
Speaker 3: States, and he adds quote such a challenge would very

704
00:41:09,600 --> 00:41:12,279
Speaker 3: well lead to the end of abortion in America.

705
00:41:12,400 --> 00:41:13,239
Speaker 4: As we know it.

706
00:41:13,880 --> 00:41:16,279
Speaker 3: If that were to happen, I do not see that

707
00:41:16,480 --> 00:41:19,879
Speaker 3: being a bad thing for America.

708
00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:22,880
Speaker 2: So this really is a much bigger issue than a

709
00:41:22,960 --> 00:41:26,680
Speaker 2: local ordinance that is based on an obscure law that

710
00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:29,279
Speaker 2: is passed in a small rural town.

711
00:41:29,719 --> 00:41:31,480
Speaker 6: The play is big.

712
00:41:32,239 --> 00:41:34,400
Speaker 5: We have to pay attention to what they're doing because

713
00:41:34,400 --> 00:41:37,440
Speaker 5: they've had a lot of success sort of rebranding a

714
00:41:37,480 --> 00:41:41,080
Speaker 5: lot of things that initially sound like absolute nonsense, and

715
00:41:41,120 --> 00:41:43,959
Speaker 5: then they introduce them over and over and over again.

716
00:41:44,160 --> 00:41:47,920
Speaker 5: In their diligence with that messaging can oftentimes make something

717
00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:51,000
Speaker 5: that started sounding extreme somehow normalized.

718
00:42:04,160 --> 00:42:08,440
Speaker 2: It is a Saturday afternoon and we are back in Portales,

719
00:42:08,560 --> 00:42:14,400
Speaker 2: New Mexico, with Dina or Taga and her family from Ortegaville,

720
00:42:14,719 --> 00:42:18,479
Speaker 2: and they are all at Catholic church for regular four

721
00:42:18,520 --> 00:42:19,560
Speaker 2: pm Mass.

722
00:42:20,360 --> 00:42:23,360
Speaker 7: We are at Saint Helen's Catholic Church. This is like

723
00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:24,400
Speaker 7: a second home to me.

724
00:42:25,200 --> 00:42:27,760
Speaker 2: As Dina talks about her daughter, Sarah.

725
00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:29,440
Speaker 7: She's a reader, she's an elector.

726
00:42:29,480 --> 00:42:31,880
Speaker 2: Dina's mother parks in front of the church.

727
00:42:32,520 --> 00:42:33,920
Speaker 7: Let me go help with the wheel chair, Give me

728
00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:34,520
Speaker 7: just a second.

729
00:42:35,560 --> 00:42:38,560
Speaker 2: Dina helps her daughter get out of the car. Sarah

730
00:42:38,640 --> 00:42:42,440
Speaker 2: is a freshman now at Eastern New Mexico University in Portales.

731
00:42:43,360 --> 00:42:47,560
Speaker 2: Next to Dina is her mother, Cindy Ortega, and I

732
00:42:47,719 --> 00:42:52,399
Speaker 2: asked Cindy about her daughter's activism. What do you think

733
00:42:52,400 --> 00:42:55,600
Speaker 2: about the fact that she's outspoken, specifically on the question

734
00:42:55,680 --> 00:42:57,560
Speaker 2: of reproductive rights abortion.

735
00:42:58,320 --> 00:43:04,319
Speaker 3: No, Dina knows that I'm not for abortion, but who

736
00:43:04,400 --> 00:43:05,320
Speaker 3: am I to judge?

737
00:43:05,480 --> 00:43:07,600
Speaker 4: You know, that's between them and their god.

738
00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:13,960
Speaker 2: Dina's daughter Sarah, went into the church, so we joined her. Inside.

739
00:43:14,160 --> 00:43:16,840
Speaker 2: Mass is about to start, so we are whispering, but

740
00:43:16,880 --> 00:43:20,359
Speaker 2: I had to ask Sarah about her mother, Dina, and

741
00:43:20,560 --> 00:43:23,520
Speaker 2: about her activism for women's right to choose.

742
00:43:24,000 --> 00:43:26,920
Speaker 8: I think it's really good just to show from women's rights,

743
00:43:27,080 --> 00:43:29,399
Speaker 8: coming from a woman, I think it's good to get

744
00:43:29,440 --> 00:43:32,279
Speaker 8: herself out there and show what she stands for.

745
00:43:32,840 --> 00:43:36,759
Speaker 2: Then Sarah tells me she's already following in her mother's footsteps.

746
00:43:37,280 --> 00:43:39,200
Speaker 6: What do you say to your little girl, cousin.

747
00:43:38,960 --> 00:43:40,480
Speaker 8: Well, you got to stand up for yourself. You kind

748
00:43:40,520 --> 00:43:43,239
Speaker 8: of watch for yourself in any moment because you never

749
00:43:43,280 --> 00:43:46,040
Speaker 8: know what can happen. But you got to just be

750
00:43:46,080 --> 00:43:47,799
Speaker 8: a woman and do things that you know that you

751
00:43:47,800 --> 00:43:48,120
Speaker 8: could do.

752
00:43:50,800 --> 00:43:53,759
Speaker 2: With the support of her family, Dina is firm in

753
00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:57,520
Speaker 2: her plans to run for city council in Portales in

754
00:43:57,600 --> 00:44:09,920
Speaker 2: twenty twenty six. Okay, Marda, as we wrap up, just

755
00:44:09,960 --> 00:44:12,280
Speaker 2: bring us up to date on what's happened with those

756
00:44:12,320 --> 00:44:15,080
Speaker 2: Comstock ordinances since twenty twenty three.

757
00:44:15,960 --> 00:44:19,080
Speaker 3: So the Comstock ordinances that were passed in eastern New

758
00:44:19,120 --> 00:44:22,920
Speaker 3: Mexico are now in illegal limbo, so to say, and

759
00:44:23,040 --> 00:44:26,879
Speaker 3: it's unclear whether they will ever come into effect. New

760
00:44:26,920 --> 00:44:30,640
Speaker 3: Mexico Attorney General Raul Torres filed a petition with the

761
00:44:30,680 --> 00:44:34,880
Speaker 3: state's Supreme Court to avoid the ordinances. He says that

762
00:44:34,960 --> 00:44:38,920
Speaker 3: the ordinances overstabbed their local power by trying to enforce

763
00:44:38,960 --> 00:44:42,799
Speaker 3: federal laws, and he also says that they violate New

764
00:44:42,840 --> 00:44:44,520
Speaker 3: Mexico's Constitution and.

765
00:44:44,640 --> 00:44:47,440
Speaker 4: Bill of Rights, which do protect abortion.

766
00:44:49,280 --> 00:44:52,760
Speaker 3: In December of twenty twenty three, the New Mexico Supreme

767
00:44:52,800 --> 00:44:57,520
Speaker 3: Court held a hearing on the Comstock ordinances. Victoria Robledo,

768
00:44:57,760 --> 00:45:00,719
Speaker 3: the activist, traveled all the way to sud Fate to

769
00:45:00,800 --> 00:45:02,400
Speaker 3: be in the courtroom that day.

770
00:45:02,800 --> 00:45:04,080
Speaker 4: And she didn't go alone.

771
00:45:04,239 --> 00:45:07,719
Speaker 3: She brought her baby Silas, with whom she was pregnant

772
00:45:07,760 --> 00:45:09,840
Speaker 3: when she first spoke at the Clovis meeting.

773
00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:15,960
Speaker 10: He was a hit among the capitol, the security guards,

774
00:45:16,000 --> 00:45:18,520
Speaker 10: the legislators. It was very easy to get people to

775
00:45:18,560 --> 00:45:20,760
Speaker 10: talk to you when you have a baby's drafting your chest.

776
00:45:21,719 --> 00:45:25,520
Speaker 3: Victoria and her husband recently purchased a new home hearing Clovis.

777
00:45:25,960 --> 00:45:29,560
Speaker 3: They've decided to raise their two children here in this community.

778
00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:31,600
Speaker 10: You don't want to close every door you see, You

779
00:45:31,680 --> 00:45:39,400
Speaker 10: know that, right, No, no, no, no, no, no no.

780
00:45:40,239 --> 00:45:43,959
Speaker 2: Victoria did end up running for city council last March.

781
00:45:44,600 --> 00:45:47,239
Speaker 2: What she enjoyed the most was knocking on doors and

782
00:45:47,360 --> 00:45:51,239
Speaker 2: listening to people from her community, people who looked just

783
00:45:51,400 --> 00:45:51,640
Speaker 2: like her.

784
00:45:52,440 --> 00:45:56,000
Speaker 10: And that was something that I had constantly heard, like, oh,

785
00:45:56,239 --> 00:45:59,040
Speaker 10: it was anywhere from what is the city Commission? To

786
00:46:00,160 --> 00:46:03,360
Speaker 10: I pay taxes and nothing gets done in my neighborhood

787
00:46:03,600 --> 00:46:05,520
Speaker 10: and we would be in a disadvantaged neighborhood.

788
00:46:05,880 --> 00:46:09,320
Speaker 2: Vittoria didn't win a seat in the city council, but

789
00:46:09,480 --> 00:46:11,479
Speaker 2: she did get about a third of the vote.

790
00:46:11,880 --> 00:46:14,280
Speaker 10: I was disappointed, but at the same time, I felt

791
00:46:15,120 --> 00:46:18,680
Speaker 10: very hopeful because like, those numbers looked a lot better

792
00:46:19,600 --> 00:46:24,960
Speaker 10: than I had thought they would. I may not be

793
00:46:25,080 --> 00:46:27,160
Speaker 10: the best person for this, but you know, we're still

794
00:46:27,200 --> 00:46:30,399
Speaker 10: going to keep doing it because if not now, then when,

795
00:46:30,520 --> 00:46:32,200
Speaker 10: And if not me, then who.

796
00:46:33,160 --> 00:46:35,080
Speaker 9: No one's going to save us. We got to do

797
00:46:35,160 --> 00:46:37,279
Speaker 9: it ourselves, and so gotta keep going.

798
00:46:47,840 --> 00:46:52,279
Speaker 2: We reported this story in twenty twenty four and since then, well,

799
00:46:52,480 --> 00:46:55,560
Speaker 2: we have some updates for you. The New Mexico Supreme

800
00:46:55,680 --> 00:46:59,879
Speaker 2: Court has indeed struck down the comstock ordinances that were

801
00:47:00,120 --> 00:47:07,120
Speaker 2: passed in eastern New Mexico because they violate state law. Also,

802
00:47:07,680 --> 00:47:12,720
Speaker 2: Dina Ortega, the Catholic woman who's also pro choice, recently

803
00:47:12,760 --> 00:47:16,640
Speaker 2: announced that she is indeed running for city council in

804
00:47:16,760 --> 00:47:21,600
Speaker 2: her hometown of Portaes. The election will take place in November,

805
00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:26,840
Speaker 2: and dear listener, don't miss our next episode, dropping on Sunday.

806
00:47:27,239 --> 00:47:30,360
Speaker 2: We're going to continue looking into the issue of abortion.

807
00:47:31,280 --> 00:47:33,719
Speaker 2: This time we're going to take you to a Salvador,

808
00:47:34,160 --> 00:47:37,400
Speaker 2: the country that has one of the strictest abortion bands

809
00:47:37,680 --> 00:48:10,440
Speaker 2: in the world. The Spillover was reported by Marta Martinez

810
00:48:10,480 --> 00:48:13,759
Speaker 2: and myself. It was produced by Marta and edited by

811
00:48:13,960 --> 00:48:18,640
Speaker 2: Mitre Bonshahi. It was mixed by Stephanie Lebau. Fact checking

812
00:48:18,719 --> 00:48:23,520
Speaker 2: for this episode by Monica Morales Garcia. Fernando Echavari is

813
00:48:23,560 --> 00:48:28,480
Speaker 2: our managing editor. The Latino USA team also includes Rosanna Guire,

814
00:48:28,800 --> 00:48:33,920
Speaker 2: Julia Caruso, Jessica Ellis, Renaldo Leanoz Junior, Andrea Lopez, Gruzsado,

815
00:48:34,200 --> 00:48:39,320
Speaker 2: Luis Luna, Joni mar Marquez, Julieta Martinez, JJ Carumin, Adriana

816
00:48:39,440 --> 00:48:43,600
Speaker 2: Rodriguez and Nancy Trujuido Benni, Lei Ramirez and I are

817
00:48:43,719 --> 00:48:47,720
Speaker 2: executive producers and I'm your host Marigu Posa. Latino USA

818
00:48:47,960 --> 00:48:52,240
Speaker 2: is part of Iheart's Mike Undura podcast network. Executive producers

819
00:48:52,280 --> 00:48:56,879
Speaker 2: that iHeart are Leogomez and Arlene Santana. Join us again

820
00:48:56,920 --> 00:48:59,359
Speaker 2: on our next episode. In the meantime, you can find

821
00:48:59,440 --> 00:49:03,200
Speaker 2: us on social media. I'll see you there. And dear listener,

822
00:49:03,800 --> 00:49:07,120
Speaker 2: you know what I recommend. Joining food Doudo Plus. You'll

823
00:49:07,160 --> 00:49:11,000
Speaker 2: be able to listen to all the episodes without ads. Also,

824
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Speaker 2: food doo Plus gets you bonus episodes, special virtual events,

825
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Speaker 2: and some cheese made behind the scenes. And you'll be

826
00:49:18,400 --> 00:49:23,200
Speaker 2: supporting futuro Media, which you love. So girasias aestel approxima

827
00:49:23,440 --> 00:49:24,600
Speaker 2: chao Yes.

828
00:49:27,160 --> 00:49:30,120
Speaker 7: Funding for Latino USA is coverage of a culture of

829
00:49:30,239 --> 00:49:32,799
Speaker 7: health is made possible in part by a grant from

830
00:49:32,840 --> 00:49:37,400
Speaker 7: the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation. Latino USA is made possible

831
00:49:37,480 --> 00:49:41,800
Speaker 7: in part by the Levi Strauss Foundation outfitting movements and

832
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Speaker 7: leaders fighting for a more just and abundant world, and

833
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Speaker 7: Skyline Foundation