WEBVTT - Should We Give Up the Fight for Reparations? | Angela Rye SoloPod 0:00:00.160 --> 0:00:03.640 Native Land Pod is a production of iHeartRadio in partnership 0:00:03.640 --> 0:00:05.080 with Reason Choice Media. 0:00:05.559 --> 0:00:11.080 Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome home everyone. 0:00:11.360 --> 0:00:14.840 I'm Angela Raie, a host of Native Lamppod, and it 0:00:14.960 --> 0:00:18.640 is Solo Pod Day. There is so much going on 0:00:18.680 --> 0:00:21.120 in the world, and we will get into so many 0:00:21.160 --> 0:00:24.320 of those topics on Thursday for our main show. Today, 0:00:24.400 --> 0:00:27.840 I have the opportunity, the privilege, and the pleasure to 0:00:28.000 --> 0:00:30.840 speak to someone who is a dear brother, dear friend 0:00:30.880 --> 0:00:33.879 to me. He is a civil and human rights attorney. 0:00:34.240 --> 0:00:39.920 He has long represented the survivors of the Tulsa Race massacre, 0:00:40.640 --> 0:00:44.360 also known as Black Wall Street in Tulsa, Oklahoma, or 0:00:44.440 --> 0:00:47.199 Greenwood as many of you know as well. He is 0:00:47.240 --> 0:00:50.920 the founder and executive director of Justice for Greenwood. And 0:00:50.960 --> 0:00:53.800 today we're going to get into a discussion about reparations 0:00:54.480 --> 0:00:55.840 his upcoming book. 0:00:56.040 --> 0:00:59.080 That will be available for pre order very soon. 0:00:59.200 --> 0:01:03.120 And so let's bring de Mario Solomon Simmons to the stage. 0:01:03.160 --> 0:01:04.759 Thank you so much, Hey d. 0:01:05.240 --> 0:01:08.400 What's going on? Angela's good to see you as always. 0:01:08.280 --> 0:01:10.160 Thank you, good to see you virtually too. 0:01:10.720 --> 0:01:10.880 Well. 0:01:10.920 --> 0:01:13.400 First, I want to hear about this new book that 0:01:13.480 --> 0:01:17.959 you are dropping because it is so timely, so important. 0:01:18.080 --> 0:01:20.800 We are living in a day and age where you know, 0:01:22.319 --> 0:01:27.399 fact free debates, alternative facts, erasing of history. So Redeem 0:01:27.400 --> 0:01:30.399 a Nation feels like a really appropriate title for a 0:01:30.440 --> 0:01:31.400 really challenging time. 0:01:31.440 --> 0:01:32.840 Talk to us a little bit about the book. 0:01:33.000 --> 0:01:35.280 Yeah, I'm really excited about this, been working over over 0:01:35.360 --> 0:01:37.920 four years. Redeem a Nation book dot com. You can 0:01:37.959 --> 0:01:40.440 go there the book. As you stated, we're all feeling 0:01:40.440 --> 0:01:42.720 in Angela, We're all feeling that America's going to a 0:01:42.760 --> 0:01:45.440 place and particularly in our lifetime, has never been to. 0:01:45.680 --> 0:01:47.840 And one of the main arguments I'm making in my 0:01:47.920 --> 0:01:51.080 book is to redeem this country, you must have reparatory 0:01:51.200 --> 0:01:53.440 justice for black people. That's the only way you're going 0:01:53.480 --> 0:01:55.960 to ever have a country that it says it is 0:01:56.000 --> 0:01:58.560 on paper. If you don't redeem and have a repertory 0:01:58.600 --> 0:02:00.560 of justice for black people, who will not have And 0:02:00.560 --> 0:02:04.400 when I talk about redeem a nation, I am talking 0:02:04.440 --> 0:02:06.600 about getting us back to a place that we have 0:02:06.720 --> 0:02:10.679 never been before. We've never been redeemed. The only way 0:02:10.680 --> 0:02:13.760 it can actually occur if there is real repair, and 0:02:13.800 --> 0:02:15.959 then that repair will allow us to become the nation 0:02:16.040 --> 0:02:17.720 that we say on paper we want to be people 0:02:17.760 --> 0:02:20.240 talk about democracy and this and that there is no 0:02:20.320 --> 0:02:23.560 democracy without reparatory justice for black people. And what I'm 0:02:23.600 --> 0:02:27.239 excited about the book as I outline and explain the 0:02:27.280 --> 0:02:29.600 people get behind the scenes of my twenty five plus 0:02:29.720 --> 0:02:33.120 years of fighting for reparations both here for the Tulsa 0:02:33.200 --> 0:02:36.399 Race Masacre and in general, but also in my think 0:02:36.400 --> 0:02:39.040 Greenwood Principles, which you and I have talked about, where 0:02:39.040 --> 0:02:41.840 I really lay out a plan of action that any 0:02:41.919 --> 0:02:45.440 black community can utilize to create the type of Greenwoods 0:02:45.480 --> 0:02:47.240 we need. So a lot of people think when they 0:02:47.280 --> 0:02:50.160 think about Greenwood, they think about, like you said, black 0:02:50.200 --> 0:02:52.600 Wall Street, which is fine, But black Wall Street was 0:02:52.639 --> 0:02:55.760 just a part of Greenwood. The real story is the 0:02:55.800 --> 0:02:58.960 community of Greenwood, and that community was created by five 0:02:59.000 --> 0:03:02.919 particular principles. In the first was community love. We need 0:03:02.919 --> 0:03:05.560 that more than ever in today's world. The second was 0:03:05.600 --> 0:03:09.000 the freedom mind state. The third was ownership, and not 0:03:09.120 --> 0:03:12.480 just ownership of tangible things, for ownership of ourselves, ownership 0:03:12.520 --> 0:03:15.120 of our mentality, ownership of where we want to go 0:03:15.200 --> 0:03:18.799 in life. Numberfore we had education and web concentration, and 0:03:18.880 --> 0:03:21.880 number five with our real resilience. And these are things 0:03:21.919 --> 0:03:23.560 I'm talking about in the book because we're going to 0:03:23.600 --> 0:03:25.720 need all of those as we continue to go in 0:03:25.720 --> 0:03:27.720 this Magna two point ozero world. 0:03:27.880 --> 0:03:32.040 You know, it's timely because it's the holiday season. You know, 0:03:32.160 --> 0:03:36.600 Black folks in this country sometimes also celebrate Kwansas. So 0:03:36.720 --> 0:03:39.880 I like the fact that the think Greenwood principles are 0:03:39.920 --> 0:03:43.920 closely aligned with the principles of Kwansas. So hopefully folks 0:03:43.960 --> 0:03:46.000 can get the book. Where can they get a DN 0:03:46.120 --> 0:03:47.520 Is it available now for purchase? 0:03:47.840 --> 0:03:51.000 It's available now for pre order. Go to Redeem nationbook 0:03:51.120 --> 0:03:54.920 dot com. Redeem nation book dot com get your pre order. 0:03:54.960 --> 0:03:57.000 If you pre order now, and in this holiday season, 0:03:57.320 --> 0:04:00.280 my publisher is going to provide you expert died in 0:04:00.280 --> 0:04:04.640 a chapter about the book. So the book actually publishes Tuesday, 0:04:04.680 --> 0:04:07.360 May twelve, twenty twenty six, which is just a few 0:04:07.360 --> 0:04:09.920 weeks before the one hundred and fifth anniversary of the 0:04:09.920 --> 0:04:13.280 Tulsa Race Massacres. So yes, it's very very timely. And 0:04:13.320 --> 0:04:15.280 I'll tell you Angel you know, about writing a book. 0:04:15.320 --> 0:04:17.400 I was wanting this out a long time ago, but 0:04:17.480 --> 0:04:19.680 I'm really happy that it's coming out right now, right 0:04:19.720 --> 0:04:22.760 before the Anna Persi and the mid terms. I think 0:04:22.760 --> 0:04:24.680 it's gonna be something that's gonna really move our community forward. 0:04:25.120 --> 0:04:27.480 And I'm waiting on editor's notes right now, so you 0:04:27.520 --> 0:04:30.440 are ahead of me, my friend. As you know, I 0:04:30.480 --> 0:04:34.160 will just say to you that it's also very timely 0:04:34.839 --> 0:04:40.240 because we lost a heroin from the Tulsa Race massacre. 0:04:40.400 --> 0:04:44.560 With Mother Fletcher and all that she's done to make 0:04:44.600 --> 0:04:48.240 sure that she keeps or she kept the Tulsa Race 0:04:48.279 --> 0:04:52.520 massacre at the front of our minds and of our hearts, 0:04:52.839 --> 0:04:55.839 I want you just to talk a little bit about 0:04:56.360 --> 0:05:00.120 Mother Fletcher. For those who do not know her, I 0:05:00.240 --> 0:05:03.479 have the privilege of hearing her story. Can you please 0:05:03.480 --> 0:05:05.719 just share a little bit about Mother Fletcher Fletcher giving 0:05:05.760 --> 0:05:06.640 her recent passes. 0:05:07.000 --> 0:05:11.360 Yeah, and thank you for that. It's been about two weeks, 0:05:11.400 --> 0:05:14.680 and honestly, the pain is still there. Mother Fletcher, Viola 0:05:14.720 --> 0:05:16.760 Fort Fletcher, we call her Mother Fletcher, was one hundred 0:05:16.760 --> 0:05:19.799 and eleven years old. She was the oldest living survivor 0:05:19.800 --> 0:05:22.560 of the Tulsa Race massacre. She was born in nineteen fourteen. 0:05:23.080 --> 0:05:26.400 She was an extraordinary woman who really if you think 0:05:26.400 --> 0:05:29.039 about Angela, she lived the entire arc of black people 0:05:29.080 --> 0:05:32.520 in this country right born in a great community of 0:05:32.560 --> 0:05:34.640 greenwood and got to enjoy a little bit of that 0:05:34.680 --> 0:05:36.479 before she had to run for her life on a 0:05:36.600 --> 0:05:39.920 horse and buggy for her family where everything was destroyed. 0:05:40.240 --> 0:05:43.560 Therefore she didn't get to get her education. They were sharecroppers. 0:05:43.920 --> 0:05:46.880 Then she grows up as a jim crow. She's dealing 0:05:46.880 --> 0:05:50.840 with being a domestic worker for over seventy years, working 0:05:50.880 --> 0:05:54.520 for pennies, literally not getting the proper pension that she needed. 0:05:54.760 --> 0:05:57.560 And yet despite all of that heartache, she's still volunteered 0:05:57.640 --> 0:06:01.279 during World War Two to work and shipyard to San Diego, California, 0:06:01.279 --> 0:06:04.800 building navy ships. She still raised a family, she still 0:06:04.800 --> 0:06:07.240 became a grandmother and a great grandmother and an auntie. 0:06:07.520 --> 0:06:10.799 And then in her twilight years, when I met her, 0:06:11.120 --> 0:06:12.599 As you know, and I've been working on this for 0:06:12.640 --> 0:06:15.200 a long time, so I've known literally over a couple 0:06:15.279 --> 0:06:18.400 hundred survivors I've represented, but I didn't meet Mother Flesh 0:06:18.480 --> 0:06:20.800 until twenty twenty. When I met her, she was one 0:06:20.880 --> 0:06:23.760 hundred and six years old, living by herself, living on 0:06:23.800 --> 0:06:27.680 her own, and she could have easily said, look, let 0:06:27.680 --> 0:06:30.880 me just live out my life. I'm good, but she decided, no, 0:06:30.920 --> 0:06:33.240 I want to I want to get justice because every 0:06:33.320 --> 0:06:35.200 night I still see the bodies in the street. I 0:06:35.200 --> 0:06:38.360 still can fill the flames and see the flames. And 0:06:38.400 --> 0:06:41.440 this lady was relentless committed to the calls. Not for 0:06:41.480 --> 0:06:43.800 herself she would always say, you know, hey, I'm over 0:06:43.839 --> 0:06:47.080 one hundred, but for her family before the broader black community. 0:06:47.400 --> 0:06:51.120 She never missed the court date. We had several court days. 0:06:51.120 --> 0:06:54.640 She never missed. She flew to Washington, DC on three occasions. 0:06:54.640 --> 0:06:57.320 She met She testified in Congress on May nineteen, twenty 0:06:57.360 --> 0:07:01.240 twenty one. We met the Vice President, Kamala Harris. You 0:07:01.320 --> 0:07:04.479 helped that happen in Angela. Thanks again. She came back 0:07:04.520 --> 0:07:07.240 to d C and twenty twenty three to meet with 0:07:07.240 --> 0:07:10.880 the Department of Justice to push for investigation. She told 0:07:10.880 --> 0:07:13.520 me one time early on, I said, mother Fletcher, you know, 0:07:13.720 --> 0:07:16.280 what can we do for you something you always wanted 0:07:16.280 --> 0:07:17.400 to do? She said, you know, I always wanted to 0:07:17.440 --> 0:07:20.720 go to Africa, And she went to Africa. We were 0:07:20.760 --> 0:07:23.600 able to the community get her and get her to 0:07:23.640 --> 0:07:26.040 Africa with her little brother, Hughes van Ellis. She went 0:07:26.040 --> 0:07:28.000 over to Africa one hundred and seven years old, spent 0:07:28.080 --> 0:07:30.880 two and a half weeks. The lady was amazing. What 0:07:31.080 --> 0:07:34.400 on one hundred and eleventh birthday, which was last May tenth, 0:07:34.760 --> 0:07:36.760 we sang Happy Birthday to her and we were in 0:07:36.800 --> 0:07:39.960 this pack restaurant, one hundred people there. We seen the 0:07:39.960 --> 0:07:43.600 heavy birthday, the black version of course, and at the 0:07:43.720 --> 0:07:46.840 end we just started clapping. But she grabbed my shoulder, 0:07:47.240 --> 0:07:50.000 my arm. I said, you forgot to say it many 0:07:50.040 --> 0:07:54.760 more to say this lady was full of energy. I 0:07:54.840 --> 0:07:57.520 was with her. She died on Monday the twenty third. 0:07:57.560 --> 0:08:01.320 I was with her Friday night already before at the hospital, 0:08:01.440 --> 0:08:04.080 right next to a hospital bed, and she was engaged. 0:08:04.120 --> 0:08:06.440 She was talking, and she was someone that was still 0:08:06.440 --> 0:08:08.720 wanting to see justice toward dying Dae. So you know, 0:08:08.800 --> 0:08:11.520 that's our charger. If nothing else, we want to make 0:08:11.560 --> 0:08:13.960 sure that we continue to push forward because we got 0:08:14.120 --> 0:08:16.360 all the fletchers all over this country. Yes, we have 0:08:16.400 --> 0:08:18.960 all the fletchers in our families. We need to continue 0:08:18.960 --> 0:08:20.920 to fight for them. And that's what it means the 0:08:20.920 --> 0:08:23.080 redeem a nation. That's what it means to think greenwood. 0:08:23.320 --> 0:08:25.880 That's what it means to fight for paratory justice. 0:08:26.560 --> 0:08:28.960 You know, I think it's so important in this work 0:08:30.360 --> 0:08:33.920 to just deepen into the humanity for a second. You 0:08:33.960 --> 0:08:37.880 said something that I never really considered. You've been working 0:08:37.920 --> 0:08:44.040 on restorative and reparative justice for the survivors and the 0:08:44.080 --> 0:08:46.800 descendants of Black Wall Street for as long as I 0:08:46.840 --> 0:08:50.320 can remember, and I've known you since law school. Can 0:08:50.360 --> 0:08:54.600 you talk about how many people you've lost in this 0:08:54.720 --> 0:08:58.880 fight and what that feels like to you knowing that, Yes, 0:08:58.960 --> 0:09:01.280 there's been a local solve, and we'll talk about that 0:09:01.320 --> 0:09:05.600 in a moment, but there's not been this federal recognition. 0:09:05.880 --> 0:09:08.520 You heard from the former president that he was going 0:09:08.600 --> 0:09:12.120 to do something about it that didn't happen. I want 0:09:12.160 --> 0:09:15.079 you to talk about, just for a moment, the humanity. 0:09:15.160 --> 0:09:16.960 Like I already know your rage. You know, you and 0:09:17.000 --> 0:09:19.040 I can go toe to toe at the rage level, 0:09:19.080 --> 0:09:22.200 but just like what that impact is like when you 0:09:22.240 --> 0:09:24.720 think about all the people you've come to knowing this work, 0:09:24.760 --> 0:09:28.040 they're gone, they didn't get to see justice before they passed. 0:09:28.360 --> 0:09:29.600 What does that feel like to you? 0:09:30.080 --> 0:09:34.320 Wow? Man? Powerful question? And you know, something I talk 0:09:34.360 --> 0:09:36.680 about in the book a lot is the human side 0:09:36.679 --> 0:09:38.480 of it, because you know, being out front, being the 0:09:38.600 --> 0:09:41.240 leader and all that, you always want to project and 0:09:41.360 --> 0:09:45.240 be strength and beyond beyond, but you're right, I mean 0:09:45.559 --> 0:09:48.000 so many people just come to mind outside with one 0:09:48.000 --> 0:09:50.839 of our mentors, Charles Overtry. You know, he wasn't a 0:09:50.960 --> 0:09:53.480 survivor or decendent, but he was someone who poured his 0:09:53.840 --> 0:09:56.840 last fifteen years of his professional life. He poured into 0:09:56.880 --> 0:09:59.880 this work, you know, and I poured into us so much, 0:10:00.040 --> 0:10:02.040 and you know he's gone. You think about people like 0:10:02.440 --> 0:10:05.200 Otis Clark, who was one hundred and nine when he 0:10:05.240 --> 0:10:07.640 died back in two thousand and seven, and the doctor 0:10:07.640 --> 0:10:10.360 Olivia Hooker who was over one hundred and four I 0:10:10.360 --> 0:10:13.040 think when she died, and the first African American female 0:10:13.280 --> 0:10:17.240 in the Coastguard. And just I traveled with these folks 0:10:17.240 --> 0:10:19.600 so much, I mean, Wes Young. It's to so many 0:10:19.679 --> 0:10:24.560 names and to know that they all died without justice. 0:10:25.040 --> 0:10:28.160 And as you know, Angela, when I grew up here 0:10:28.160 --> 0:10:30.599 in told So, I went to middle school on Greenwood Avenue, 0:10:31.240 --> 0:10:33.120 never heard about the mask, I didn't learn about the 0:10:33.120 --> 0:10:35.360 mass couch. I went to University of Clones playing football 0:10:35.600 --> 0:10:39.320 nineteen ninety seven, and so at that point it sparked 0:10:39.320 --> 0:10:41.120 something to me to say, Okay, we're going to make 0:10:41.160 --> 0:10:45.040 sure people never forget about this. But also for our survivors. 0:10:45.240 --> 0:10:49.800 They all thought very strongly that once the conspiracy of 0:10:49.880 --> 0:10:52.920 silence was broken, that now that the world would know 0:10:52.960 --> 0:10:56.120 what actually happened, understand that fifteen hundred and fifty homes 0:10:56.160 --> 0:10:59.760 was burnt down, that over a billion dollars in property damage, 0:11:00.040 --> 0:11:02.920 that eight thousand people were main homeless, that three thousand 0:11:02.920 --> 0:11:08.280 people disappeared, etc. They believe strongly, Angela that justice will come, 0:11:09.559 --> 0:11:16.400 and it didn't, and that really hurts me deeply because 0:11:17.440 --> 0:11:20.120 they deserve that. And it also says what does it 0:11:20.160 --> 0:11:23.240 say about our standing as black people in this country 0:11:23.559 --> 0:11:26.120 that you can have the worst ever race massacre that's 0:11:26.160 --> 0:11:29.240 on video, that has hundreds of pictures, that has hundreds 0:11:29.280 --> 0:11:32.400 of insurance claims, that no one dispute to happen, and 0:11:32.480 --> 0:11:35.600 yet the local state and the federal government said we're 0:11:35.640 --> 0:11:37.760 not going to do anything about it. What does that 0:11:37.840 --> 0:11:40.880 say about our standing as full citizens? 0:11:40.960 --> 0:11:41.080 Right? 0:11:41.120 --> 0:11:43.760 The Equal Protection Clause, the fourteenth Amendment that's trying to 0:11:43.800 --> 0:11:46.320 be repealed, What does that say about us right now? 0:11:46.400 --> 0:11:49.040 And those things are it's difficult and hurtful on a 0:11:49.080 --> 0:11:51.880 personal level, but when I think about our people, we 0:11:51.960 --> 0:11:53.679 got such a long way to go, and that's why 0:11:53.679 --> 0:11:57.760 I say, preparatory justice is it's the barometer if America 0:11:57.800 --> 0:12:01.200 can actually be a democracy, can actually be what it 0:12:01.200 --> 0:12:01.960 says on paper. 0:12:02.920 --> 0:12:07.360 You know, the thing that comes to mind now is 0:12:07.840 --> 0:12:11.000 the number of folks who say, why would you continue 0:12:11.080 --> 0:12:11.640 in this fight? 0:12:11.840 --> 0:12:14.800 They're never going to do this. And it's not white 0:12:14.880 --> 0:12:15.720 people saying this. 0:12:15.800 --> 0:12:19.440 It's not Latino people saying this, it's not indigenous folks 0:12:19.480 --> 0:12:22.839 saying this. These are black folks who say, you know, 0:12:23.200 --> 0:12:26.280 we're wasting your time. There's no reason for us to be, 0:12:27.000 --> 0:12:29.960 you know, trying to get reparations. We need to move 0:12:30.040 --> 0:12:33.520 beyond it. It's time to go past this, right What 0:12:33.559 --> 0:12:36.160 do you say to people who say that ignorant? You 0:12:36.240 --> 0:12:38.040 know what, I'm not going to cuss because you don't. 0:12:38.160 --> 0:12:40.400 I'm going to be on my best behavior today. But 0:12:40.440 --> 0:12:43.040 I want to know what you say to people who 0:12:43.800 --> 0:12:46.080 really don't think that we have we should have a 0:12:46.120 --> 0:12:48.480 dog in this fight anymore, even though it is absolutely 0:12:48.559 --> 0:12:49.520 rightfully ours. 0:12:49.800 --> 0:12:51.480 I would say a couple of things. One, they don't 0:12:51.480 --> 0:12:54.120 know their own history and they don't respect their ancestors. 0:12:54.400 --> 0:12:56.440 I mean, our people from the day we got on 0:12:56.559 --> 0:12:59.000 this continent. Be it if we were indigenous folks like 0:12:59.440 --> 0:13:02.840 black and Dish, and as folks who were enslaved, or 0:13:03.120 --> 0:13:05.959 if folks coming from Africa with slave From day one, 0:13:06.000 --> 0:13:08.520 we've been fighting for our humanity, were fighting for our 0:13:08.520 --> 0:13:11.600 dignity and fighting for our just compensation. So if you're 0:13:11.600 --> 0:13:14.599 willing to say I don't care about what my ancestors 0:13:14.600 --> 0:13:17.400 fault for, I don't care about what's old to us, 0:13:17.640 --> 0:13:20.520 then you know I really don't know. We don't. We're 0:13:20.559 --> 0:13:24.520 not the same. We're not the same. Secondly, it is 0:13:24.559 --> 0:13:27.600 a very function again, are we equal underneath the law 0:13:27.679 --> 0:13:30.120 or not. If we're equal underneath the law, then we 0:13:30.640 --> 0:13:34.240 are old conversation for what happened to us, not just 0:13:34.280 --> 0:13:36.760 the physical labor, but what was taken from us, the 0:13:36.840 --> 0:13:39.920 narratives that were taking from us, the spiritual breakdown from us. 0:13:40.679 --> 0:13:45.240 I explained it like this, the every you know, people 0:13:45.240 --> 0:13:48.240 that love the NFL, Right, I'm a football guy, the 0:13:48.360 --> 0:13:49.080 NFL believe I. 0:13:49.200 --> 0:13:51.960 Have never guessed. With those two footballs sitting behind you, d. 0:13:52.559 --> 0:13:57.600 I talk about things. The NFL believes in reparations. Jerry 0:13:57.679 --> 0:14:01.560 Jones believes very strongly in reparations. If Jerry Jones, let 0:14:01.600 --> 0:14:03.920 me explain what I mean. In the NFL. If you 0:14:03.960 --> 0:14:07.320 are the best team, you pick last in the draft. 0:14:07.960 --> 0:14:10.600 The next year, if you're the worst team, you pick 0:14:10.679 --> 0:14:14.560 what pick person in the draft. It's reparations. So if 0:14:14.600 --> 0:14:18.080 Jerry Jones and these billionaire NFL owners can care about reparations, 0:14:18.280 --> 0:14:20.720 you don't want to care about reparations for your people, 0:14:20.880 --> 0:14:25.400 your community. That's actually old. And then, thirdly, reparations sometimes 0:14:25.440 --> 0:14:30.160 gets so esoteric. I think people don't realize it's just 0:14:30.200 --> 0:14:33.440 as simple as someone hitting your car from behind and 0:14:33.560 --> 0:14:35.760 damaging your car, breaking your leg, causing you to miss 0:14:35.760 --> 0:14:37.760 time for work. But obviously they got to pay to 0:14:37.800 --> 0:14:40.320 fix your car o Reusly they need to pay a fix, 0:14:40.400 --> 0:14:42.600 you get your leg fixed, oriusly need to pay for 0:14:42.880 --> 0:14:44.800 the time off for work, and the need to pay 0:14:44.800 --> 0:14:47.400 some pain and suffering. It's just that simple. So if 0:14:47.400 --> 0:14:49.560 you're saying you don't believe that we deserve reparations or 0:14:49.560 --> 0:14:52.080 we should fight reparations, you don't believe that black folks 0:14:52.120 --> 0:14:55.040 are full a citizens in the United States of America. 0:14:55.720 --> 0:14:56.880 Okay, let me ask you this. 0:14:57.040 --> 0:14:58.760 I don't like the devil, but I'm gonna be his 0:14:58.840 --> 0:15:01.440 advocate for one second, because I do believe this is 0:15:01.480 --> 0:15:04.360 the devil speaking when they do this. What about the 0:15:04.360 --> 0:15:06.920 folks who are like, okay, but you're talking about if 0:15:06.960 --> 0:15:09.560 your car was hit and you were injured, but we're 0:15:09.600 --> 0:15:13.320 talking about your great great grandparent who was injured. 0:15:13.880 --> 0:15:17.360 Why do you deserve to receive what they. 0:15:17.240 --> 0:15:20.960 Didn't Because the injury is a continuing harm. And this 0:15:21.040 --> 0:15:23.440 is exactly what we talked about in on litigation for 0:15:23.480 --> 0:15:25.960 four years, a continuing harm. So again, if we've used 0:15:26.000 --> 0:15:29.160 the massacre as an example, the massacre, it's just the 0:15:30.000 --> 0:15:34.240 event that started the harm. Let me use another impetus, right, 0:15:34.360 --> 0:15:36.480 let me use another example. You remember back during the 0:15:36.560 --> 0:15:39.800 Environment administration, I think it was twenty eleven where we 0:15:39.880 --> 0:15:42.040 had that big explosion in the Gulf of Mexico, the 0:15:42.120 --> 0:15:45.080 BP explosion, and all that oil was just shooting out 0:15:45.160 --> 0:15:48.320 underneath the war billions of millions of gallons of oil. 0:15:48.600 --> 0:15:51.160 So that's the impetus. That's like the massacre hadened, that's 0:15:51.200 --> 0:15:54.840 the injuring event. But that oil, even though they plugged 0:15:54.880 --> 0:15:57.240 that hole within you know, a couple of weeks, but 0:15:57.360 --> 0:16:02.160 that oil continued to teraminate, continue to kill wildlife, continue 0:16:02.160 --> 0:16:05.120 to contaminate the air, they can continue to contaminate the water, 0:16:05.960 --> 0:16:08.880 continue to cause people to miss and lose their livelihood. 0:16:09.120 --> 0:16:11.520 And it continued for years and years and years, and 0:16:11.560 --> 0:16:14.360 guess what, it's still continued. And it's the same thing 0:16:14.400 --> 0:16:16.640 with the master, it's the same thing with enslavement. It's 0:16:16.640 --> 0:16:19.480 the same thing with any of these issues ever renewed 0:16:19.560 --> 0:16:23.920 that destroy families, stop wealth, broke up communities. That harm 0:16:24.040 --> 0:16:26.800 is ongoing until you repair the harm. The harm is ongoing. 0:16:27.120 --> 0:16:29.520 And I think we don't have to really understand sometimes 0:16:29.760 --> 0:16:32.080 what that harm is, or we don't want to accept 0:16:32.080 --> 0:16:33.760 that we are still a harmed people. I know some 0:16:33.760 --> 0:16:38.160 people say stop being a victim. Well I was victimized. Yeah, 0:16:38.280 --> 0:16:41.280 my parents were victimized. My grandparents were victimizds. So it's 0:16:41.320 --> 0:16:43.280 not like we're gonna stop doing what we're doing. Look, 0:16:43.280 --> 0:16:45.920 we're still fighting every day, but you still owe us 0:16:46.080 --> 0:16:51.000 last thing. I would say, do you know, well two things. One, 0:16:51.320 --> 0:16:56.120 when the massurpation of proclamation came out at first they 0:16:56.120 --> 0:16:59.520 did in eighteen sixty two they made enslavement illegal and 0:16:59.720 --> 0:17:03.160 washed in DC and they paid reparations to the enslavers 0:17:03.160 --> 0:17:06.560 in Washington, right, But you know in England when they 0:17:06.600 --> 0:17:10.240 outlawed enslavement, they passed the bill I think was eighteen 0:17:10.320 --> 0:17:12.840 thirty three, eighteen thirty two. I talk about this in 0:17:12.840 --> 0:17:16.840 the book. They actually paid reparations to enslavers, and that 0:17:16.880 --> 0:17:20.000 payment lasted up to like twenty fifteen, until the last 0:17:20.080 --> 0:17:23.440 payments were paid out. Okay, I'm saying that again, from 0:17:23.520 --> 0:17:29.960 eight thousand to twenty fifteen, so they understand what it means. 0:17:29.960 --> 0:17:33.040 Look at Haiti. Haiti had to pay reparations for getting 0:17:33.080 --> 0:17:36.760 their own their own freedom from the eighteen hundreds all 0:17:36.800 --> 0:17:40.320 the way up to like nineteen forty. So I want 0:17:40.359 --> 0:17:44.200 what everybody else in the world. I want four justice. 0:17:44.359 --> 0:17:46.120 I want equal protection underneath the law. 0:17:47.359 --> 0:17:51.120 And recognition, like if you can apologize, certainly you can 0:17:51.200 --> 0:17:52.240 repair that. 0:17:52.400 --> 0:17:54.880 This country not ready for that? Oh man, what else 0:17:54.920 --> 0:17:56.439 did they say? I reject that? 0:17:56.520 --> 0:17:59.959 Actually in many Sorry sorry, no, no, no, I'm just 0:18:00.119 --> 0:18:02.280 I'm mumbling. I'm saying, like David say, the country's not 0:18:02.320 --> 0:18:03.439 ready for it. But I reject that. 0:18:03.520 --> 0:18:06.600 Actually, Oh, this country's ready for US. Countries pay reparations 0:18:06.600 --> 0:18:11.080 to Japanese Americans, the country pay reparations to Native Americans. 0:18:11.119 --> 0:18:13.520 That was old. This country's pay reparations to the state, 0:18:14.320 --> 0:18:17.520 this country's pay reparations all around. It just becomes the 0:18:17.600 --> 0:18:20.560 black folks that is a problem. And I think more 0:18:20.600 --> 0:18:22.600 of black folks are glad you asked the question and 0:18:22.680 --> 0:18:25.439 we're addressing our own community. More of us would make 0:18:25.720 --> 0:18:29.320 uncompromised and stands that preparatory justice is due and make 0:18:29.400 --> 0:18:32.440 that one of our top issues. Is not saying we're 0:18:32.480 --> 0:18:36.520 not going to vote if you don't do this preparatory justice, 0:18:36.520 --> 0:18:38.359 but make it one of our top issues that we 0:18:38.520 --> 0:18:42.119 push and push and be uncompromising, that we're old like 0:18:42.160 --> 0:18:53.200 these other people groups across the world and in this country. 0:18:55.520 --> 0:19:00.359 So this year there was as a result of a 0:19:00.720 --> 0:19:05.159 historic election in Tulsa, you saw a sea change for 0:19:05.200 --> 0:19:08.800 the first time that went beyond recognition, beyond an apology, 0:19:09.400 --> 0:19:12.760 beyond a committee that is, you know, smoking mirrors. 0:19:13.359 --> 0:19:15.560 You saw some actual shifts happening. 0:19:15.600 --> 0:19:17.800 Can you talk a little bit about your work with 0:19:17.840 --> 0:19:20.280 the mayor of Tulsa and what happened as a result 0:19:20.280 --> 0:19:20.879 of his election. 0:19:21.480 --> 0:19:24.280 Yeah, shout out Mayor Monroe Nichols, the first African American 0:19:24.840 --> 0:19:28.200 mayor in the city of Tulsa history. We had been 0:19:28.240 --> 0:19:30.160 working for a long time, known him a long time 0:19:30.200 --> 0:19:34.000 as a state legislator, and campaign for him, pushed him 0:19:34.240 --> 0:19:36.159 to get elected. But I told him every step of 0:19:36.160 --> 0:19:39.040 the way, Hey, as soon as as soon as you 0:19:39.040 --> 0:19:41.480 get into the mayor's office, I'm gonna be at your doorstep. 0:19:41.520 --> 0:19:43.879 And I was. And we presented to him what was 0:19:43.920 --> 0:19:46.679 called Project Greenwood, which you could learn more about in 0:19:46.760 --> 0:19:48.720 the book, but also at Justice Foragreen with dot org 0:19:49.320 --> 0:19:52.879 Project Greenwood, which was our thirteen point plan for a 0:19:53.000 --> 0:19:56.000 comprehensive reparations. We worked on that with him for a 0:19:56.080 --> 0:19:59.719 number of months. He didn't accept everything we wanted, but 0:19:59.800 --> 0:20:03.760 he did accept about six of our proposals, including making 0:20:04.240 --> 0:20:08.600 Tulsa June first, Tulsa Race Mask of Reparation Commemorates day, 0:20:09.000 --> 0:20:11.840 which Angel you said something very interested in your acknowledgement. 0:20:11.960 --> 0:20:14.560 One thing I found out in this work is that 0:20:14.600 --> 0:20:17.000 as much as people want to be compensated, for sure, 0:20:17.480 --> 0:20:20.800 they also want to be acknowledged for what happened. And 0:20:20.880 --> 0:20:23.280 so to have in law that this day will be 0:20:23.320 --> 0:20:27.280 a citywide holiday to commemorate the masker, particularly in this 0:20:27.400 --> 0:20:30.480 time of a rasure of black history, is huge. He 0:20:30.640 --> 0:20:33.840 also put forward one hundred and five million dollar private 0:20:33.840 --> 0:20:38.280 trust that will provide scholarships to massacre descendants. It will 0:20:38.320 --> 0:20:44.119 provide a business grant, a grant to our surviving entities. 0:20:44.119 --> 0:20:46.720