Speaker 1: Good morning, peeps, and welcome to wikapp Daily with Meet
Speaker 1: Your Girl Danielle Moody recording Not So Live from my
Speaker 1: Brooklyn Cilarium. Today, I want to talk about the right
Speaker 1: of a woman to choose, when, where and if she
Speaker 1: wants to have a child. Justice Sonia Satomayor's quote her
Speaker 1: grief that she expressed in her thoughts after hearing the
Speaker 1: opening oral arguments for the Texas abortion ban at fifteen
Speaker 1: weeks that would ban abortion, taking the viability level down
Speaker 1: from twenty four weeks to fifteen. For no other reason
Speaker 1: than the Mississippi people that are bringing this case knew
Speaker 1: that with a six to three stacked Trump Court that
Speaker 1: they would be able to do what they've been trying
Speaker 1: to do for nearly fifty years, which is to overturn
Speaker 1: Roe v. Wade. For decades, I can remember the one
Speaker 1: of the first jobs that I had was working at
Speaker 1: a national women's organization, and I can remember carrying signs
Speaker 1: and marching and talking about ROW and its importance and
Speaker 1: freedom and liberty. And it's so funny to me the
Speaker 1: irony of a Republican party right now who has bastardized
Speaker 1: the terms liberty and justice in their desire to spread
Speaker 1: a lethal virus that is killed over seven hundred thousand people,
Speaker 1: and then at the same time want to argue and
Speaker 1: talk about the sanctity of life. If somebody were to
Speaker 1: be writing this in a Hollywood script, they would say, no,
Speaker 1: it's too dumb, No one would buy into it. But
Speaker 1: that is where we are right now. And Justice Sonia
Speaker 1: Sotomayer so eloquently expressed how millions of women and people
Speaker 1: with uteruses are feeling as we await what we know
Speaker 1: is the certain final death Knel to rov Wade, this
Speaker 1: is what she said. The right of a woman to
Speaker 1: choose the right to control her own body has been
Speaker 1: clearly set since Casey and never challenged. You want us
Speaker 1: to reject that line of viability and adopt something different.
Speaker 1: The viability line which is written here for mother. Jo
Speaker 1: Jones says, this drawn in nineteen seventy three by Row
Speaker 1: and which does not allow states to ban abortions before
Speaker 1: a fetus could survive outside of the wound, hasn't been
Speaker 1: an issue for thirty years. And just to put this
Speaker 1: into perspective, over sixty percent of the population, sixty percent
Speaker 1: not along party lines, Over sixty percent of the population
Speaker 1: is for abortion, and which seems right when we look
Speaker 1: at the stats of the number of women who have
Speaker 1: had abortions and the number of men who have fucking
Speaker 1: paid for them. Right, So when you look at the
Speaker 1: reality that the mainstream media and the right wing evangelical
Speaker 1: Christians say that they've been waging some type of culture war,
Speaker 1: but the reality is is that the culture is already
Speaker 1: on the side of liberty and freedom to control one's
Speaker 1: reproductive systems. We already decided that back in nineteen seventy three.
Speaker 1: So imagine now that there are women that are close
Speaker 1: to fifty years to hold who have never never knew
Speaker 1: what it was like to live in a country where
Speaker 1: they were literally second class citizens, going to be shackled
Speaker 1: to kitchens and their homes, not able to make decisions
Speaker 1: about their future, about their potential income, right, Because it's
Speaker 1: not as if we have paid family fucking leave in
Speaker 1: this country. It's not as if we once a child
Speaker 1: comes out of the womb that we provide any childcare.
Speaker 1: These are the things that we were talking about in
Speaker 1: the Human Infrastructure Bill, and within our own goddamn party
Speaker 1: you have Joe Manchin saying, yeah, I don't know about
Speaker 1: that child tax credit. I don't know about that paid
Speaker 1: family leave. These are things that other industrialized nations have
Speaker 1: and have had, But somehow we continue to talk about
Speaker 1: America being anybody's beacon, beacon of what America right now
Speaker 1: is at. It's like a before and after picture. It's
Speaker 1: like what not to do? You know? Sony Sartor goes
Speaker 1: on to say, this, will this institution survive the stench
Speaker 1: this creates in the public perception that the Constitution and
Speaker 1: its reading are just political acts. If people actually believe
Speaker 1: it's all political, how will the court survive? There was
Speaker 1: a time when we believed in the sanctity of the courts,
Speaker 1: when we actually had faith in our institutions and branches
Speaker 1: of government. Right. This is the beauty. This was the
Speaker 1: beauty of being an American. Was the understanding that we
Speaker 1: lived inside of a democracy where we had free and
Speaker 1: fair elections, where yes, politicians may stretch the truth at times,
Speaker 1: but we didn't live inside of a broken system that
Speaker 1: was filled with kleptocracy and lies and fake elections that
Speaker 1: are only put on for political performance. That's the beauty.
Speaker 1: It was the ability to kind of go along with
Speaker 1: your day to day life and never really have to
Speaker 1: participate or pay attention to what it was that your
Speaker 1: elected officials were doing, because your assumption was if I
Speaker 1: elected them, then they are to be my voice, then
Speaker 1: they are to vote with my best interests in mind.
Speaker 1: We have fallen so far from that reality. We are
Speaker 1: so far from that space. We have judges that are
Speaker 1: sitting on the Supreme Court in stolen goddamn seats. I mean,
Speaker 1: just think about this, folks for a minute. Brett Cavanaugh,
Speaker 1: that piece of shit, has been accused of sexual assault
Speaker 1: by multiple women, but Mitch McConnell and the Republicans didn't
Speaker 1: bother to want to do any due diligence. The fucking
Speaker 1: FBI throughout multiple tips that they were seeing thousands of
Speaker 1: tips on Brett Cavanaugh, which just what shoved under the
Speaker 1: fucking rug. So we have just think, we have two
Speaker 1: sexual predators that sit on the Supreme Court right now
Speaker 1: that are getting to make decisions about what women can
Speaker 1: do with their bodies, when in multiple instances, neither one
Speaker 1: of those son of a bitches give the woman any
Speaker 1: choice about what they did to humiliate them, to harass them,
Speaker 1: or to assault them. But this is America, and the
Speaker 1: Supreme Court and its makeup right now is an indicative
Speaker 1: of the cesspool that we have become. So when Sonya
Speaker 1: Sartomayor says, will this institution survive the stench right because
Speaker 1: the odor right now is just so foul. You know,
Speaker 1: when I see older women marching, particularly the one who
Speaker 1: went viral with the sign that says, I can believe
Speaker 1: I still have to protest this shit, I cannot think.
Speaker 1: And I feel like somebody has got to do a
Speaker 1: docuseries or some type of investigative journalism to talk to
Speaker 1: women who actually remember, those that are in their seventies,
Speaker 1: that remember what this country was like before Roe v. Wade,
Speaker 1: what it was like to be a woman in this
Speaker 1: country and know that you know, it's not as if
Speaker 1: we have real laws that prevent people from discriminating and
Speaker 1: gets pregnant people from holding onto your job. You know,
Speaker 1: every single time that I see these lists come out
Speaker 1: of other countries and the amount of leave family leave
Speaker 1: that they give, do you know that there are some
Speaker 1: countries that provide people with a year a year of NOBE.
Speaker 1: Just imagine that it seems so radical and yet it's happening.
Speaker 1: It seems so radical to be able to give new
Speaker 1: parents six months three months. I'll tell you this little
Speaker 1: anecdote that happened over Thanksgiving. One of my younger cousins
Speaker 1: works at a kind of KinderCare situation, right, a daycare.
Speaker 1: And it's one of those like big chain daycares. And
Speaker 1: the average cost of this big chain it's not a
Speaker 1: private daycare. It's not one of those that you gotta
Speaker 1: you know, on the Upper East Side if you live
Speaker 1: in New York, where you have to compete and applications
Speaker 1: and all of these things and references and blah blah blah.
Speaker 1: But this chain child daycare center costs two thousand dollars
Speaker 1: a month. Two thousand dollars a month, and that is
Speaker 1: for one child. You don't get a discount if you
Speaker 1: have two. And so let's you just assume that majority
Speaker 1: of families that are coming in there have two kids
Speaker 1: four thousand dollars a month, and a majority of this country,
Speaker 1: that is more than most people's mortgage, that is more
Speaker 1: than most people's rent. So in trying to actually work,
Speaker 1: this is why women end up being forced out of
Speaker 1: the workplace. This is why we saw this at the
Speaker 1: height of COVID in twenty twenty when over two million
Speaker 1: women left the workforce. Why, because what the fuck are
Speaker 1: you going to do with a six year old and
Speaker 1: a five year old that has to now be on
Speaker 1: zoom for seven hours? You're going to be able to
Speaker 1: just sit them in front of a computer while you
Speaker 1: go in the next room and be present on your
Speaker 1: own work calls No, And because we don't actually have
Speaker 1: equal pay in this country, if you're in a heterosexual relationship,
Speaker 1: it is most likely that the man is going to
Speaker 1: be making more money than you, and not just a
Speaker 1: little bit more, but a fucking lot more. So the
Speaker 1: system is already rigged for women to be fighting just
Speaker 1: to make half of what men make. And then you
Speaker 1: put COVID and a whole bunch of other things on
Speaker 1: top of it, and yeah, the decision is going to be, well,
Speaker 1: it's not cost effective for me to keep working. And
Speaker 1: then what do we do to women that now when
Speaker 1: their child is of school age, because again we don't
Speaker 1: have universal pre K. When the child is a school
Speaker 1: age which is around kindergarten, which is five years old,
Speaker 1: so that's five years out of the workforce, and we
Speaker 1: see that gap on your resume. It's not like employers say, oh,
Speaker 1: we'll show me the baby pictures. Oh, congratulations, good for you. No,
Speaker 1: you're a liability. Oh is this your first kid or
Speaker 1: is your second kid? Well, then this means that you
Speaker 1: may need to leave early so that you can go
Speaker 1: to parent teacher conferences, or what if your kid falls ill?
Speaker 1: So who do they decide to hire then the woman
Speaker 1: that has multiple kids in a family or the single
Speaker 1: young one who is yet to have any kids, and
Speaker 1: then you keep promoting them, or you create this kind
Speaker 1: of velvet cage where you see in reports that people
Speaker 1: are having kids later and later, or deciding not to
Speaker 1: do it at all because guess what, they can't fucking
Speaker 1: afford it. So here we have now a situation where
Speaker 1: the design the ability to create family is all based
Speaker 1: on your ability to provide. And we're supposed to have
Speaker 1: safety nets and systems set up to help. Right, Our
Speaker 1: tax dollars are supposed to be invested back into us,
Speaker 1: Except we've made and created all of these carve outs.
Speaker 1: So in certain instances, women can't get contraception covered under
Speaker 1: their healthcare for their jobs. Right, don't you think, don't
Speaker 1: think for a minute that that's not going to be
Speaker 1: next on the chopping block. But now we're setting up
Speaker 1: a situation where our next guests coming up. Danielle campomore
Speaker 1: writer for The Today's Show, and we've had her on
Speaker 1: the show before. She is a staunch abortion advocate, will
Speaker 1: tell us that when row falls, because it's not an if,
Speaker 1: when row falls, when the decision comes down in June
Speaker 1: of twenty twenty two, twenty states have trigger laws in
Speaker 1: this country where abortion will officially be banned. Twenty states
Speaker 1: and the there are those that are kind of on
Speaker 1: the bubble, and so when you actually really begin to
Speaker 1: look at the map, it looks like maybe there is
Speaker 1: going to be ten on the west and the east
Speaker 1: coast where you can actually get an abortion. Now, so
Speaker 1: who does that work for? Well, it works for the
Speaker 1: middle class. It works for the one percent because they
Speaker 1: can hop on a plane, they can take off of work,
Speaker 1: they can do whatever it is that they need to
Speaker 1: do because they have the resources to be able to
Speaker 1: do that. How many stories do we need to hear
Speaker 1: about these places that you would have to drive two
Speaker 1: three hundred miles because there's only one abortion clinic right
Speaker 1: now in the whole of fucking Mississippi that is bringing
Speaker 1: the fifteenth week abortion ban. There's one clinic in the
Speaker 1: entire state. So if you live right miles and miles
Speaker 1: and miles away, and then you get there and they
Speaker 1: tell you in most of these southern states and states
Speaker 1: in the flyover land, you have to have a waiting period.
Speaker 1: So if I've driven hundreds of miles to then be
Speaker 1: told that I will be seen by a doctor and
Speaker 1: then have to wait another twenty four hours, because again,
Speaker 1: we don't trust women to make decisions just from the jump.
Speaker 1: We either got to put them through a waiting period
Speaker 1: or transvaginal ultrasounds until then we decide, Oh, I think
Speaker 1: you're ready a gun. However, well, bitch, you can buy
Speaker 1: that today and shoot up as many fucking people as
Speaker 1: you would like. We are creating what many said was hyperbolic,
Speaker 1: the Handmaid's Tail Gilead. We're creating a system where we
Speaker 1: are going to see more women lose their lives because
Speaker 1: we are taking a fundamental right that has been in
Speaker 1: place for damn near fifty years away. And to Sonia
Speaker 1: Sotomayor's point is that this body, the Supreme Court, has
Speaker 1: never actively worked to take away individual rights. It has
Speaker 1: always been about expanding rights. To those that have been
Speaker 1: left out. But since we've had Chief Justice Roberts, who
Speaker 1: began this crusade against civil liberties with the gutting of
Speaker 1: the Civil Rights Act, I keep saying to people that
Speaker 1: they're not going to stop here. They're going to come
Speaker 1: for contraception. Every single thing that we think has been
Speaker 1: codified by law is up for grabs. That includes marriage equality,
Speaker 1: that includes Brown versus the Board of Education, and fuck
Speaker 1: it could include plessy because if you remember, in that
Speaker 1: bitch Amy Covid Barrett's confirmation, she said that Brown versus
Speaker 1: the Board of Education was not settled law. Let that
Speaker 1: sink in. They want, dear friends, they want a war,
Speaker 1: and I cannot tell you that that is not where
Speaker 1: we are headed. I cannot believe in my heart that
Speaker 1: we are going to be able to resolve these enormous
Speaker 1: problems that we have in this country by policy, because
Speaker 1: we can't get basic shit passed, right, Like, we just
Speaker 1: voted to keep funding the government kick that can down
Speaker 1: the road until February eighteen. So if we can't get
Speaker 1: basic shit done, do you think that people are going
Speaker 1: to continue to have faith in these institutions that we
Speaker 1: tell you to vote for because let me remind you again,
Speaker 1: this is what it looks like when Democrats have won.
Speaker 1: We have the House, the Senate, and the Presidency, and
Speaker 1: all of this is happening right now. You want to
Speaker 1: talk about a stench. We're never going to rid ourselves
Speaker 1: of the odor of Trump and Trumpism, not for generations.
Speaker 1: Your children's children will be still feeling the effects of that.
Speaker 1: You know why, because three of those motherfuckers are sitting
Speaker 1: on the Supreme Court appointed by Trump, and over three
Speaker 1: hundred of them are sitting on federal courts around this country.
Speaker 1: They are setting up Apartheide in America. And the question
Speaker 1: that we have to ask ourselves, particularly the majority, which
Speaker 1: is over fifty percent of women, need to ask themselves
Speaker 1: is are we just going to sit back and take it?
Speaker 1: Coming up next is my conversation with our friend Danielle Campamore,
Speaker 1: who is now very newly minted writer for the Today Show. Folks,
Speaker 1: I'm always excited when I get to welcome back my
Speaker 1: friend and just warrior, warrior for abortion rights, Danielle Campamore,
Speaker 1: who is newly minted as a reporter at Today. First
Speaker 1: of all, congratulations Danielle on the new position very excited
Speaker 1: to have your voice in a very mainstream type of
Speaker 1: space because the things that you have been writing, tweeting
Speaker 1: for the years that I that I've known you at
Speaker 1: this point are so critical, and I feel like you
Speaker 1: have been raising the alarm on what would happen if
Speaker 1: Rob Wade fell, On what it would look like in
Speaker 1: this country if we no longer had access to abortion.
Speaker 1: We are here now. The opening arguments took place at
Speaker 1: the Supreme Court earlier this month. We had listened to
Speaker 1: some of the initial thoughts of Amy Coney, Barrett, of
Speaker 1: Brett Kavanaugh, these people who we knew right where they
Speaker 1: were going to land on Rob Wade. I want to
Speaker 1: get your initial reactions, and then I want you to
Speaker 1: walk us through paint the picture of Gilead that we
Speaker 1: are about to be living in right absolutely. First, thank
Speaker 1: you so much for being here. It's always a joy
Speaker 1: to speak with you, especially about something so important. My
Speaker 1: initial reaction. I spent the day just speaking with abortion advocates,
Speaker 1: primarily mothers, as the majority of people who have abortions
Speaker 1: already have at least one child at home and know
Speaker 1: what it's like to give birth and or parent or both,
Speaker 1: and so That's how I spent my day because it's
Speaker 1: very difficult, I think, for anyone in any situation to
Speaker 1: try and pretend and go about a normal work day
Speaker 1: while their constitutional right is being debated. And so I
Speaker 1: really focused on who this is going to impact most,
Speaker 1: which are mothers, primarily black, brown, and poor mothers. And
Speaker 1: they were very clear with me. They took their babies
Speaker 1: to rallies. They were there to make their voices heard.
Speaker 1: It was a family affair. They were going with their husbands,
Speaker 1: with their partners, with their children because they know that
Speaker 1: this will continue now, this is their children's fight, probably
Speaker 1: their children's children's fight, and so it was really just
Speaker 1: a day of immense community and family time to rally
Speaker 1: together as they prepare for the fight to come. You know,
Speaker 1: it just I find it just so heartbreaking, right, you know,
Speaker 1: and since our last conversation where you use the term
Speaker 1: that I had never heard before, but I've been using
Speaker 1: it since Danielle, which is forced birth right. And I
Speaker 1: want to go to Amy Covid Barrett, which is what
Speaker 1: I refer to her as on the show. I want
Speaker 1: to go to her remarks, right, so this justice says
Speaker 1: that there should be no problem right. That essentially Roe
Speaker 1: and Casey are moot because we have safe haven laws
Speaker 1: where and you know, for the audience, safe haven laws
Speaker 1: essentially allow you to be able to drop off right
Speaker 1: a baby, no questions asked, at a church, at a
Speaker 1: community center, at different locations. And basically this Justice Barrett's responses, No,
Speaker 1: you go through the nine months of pregnancy. It doesn't
Speaker 1: matter what kind of economic hardship that that may cost you.
Speaker 1: It doesn't matter what health concerns that may arise, It
Speaker 1: doesn't matter you're emotional right well being in state that
Speaker 1: you should. What is nine months right? What's the problem here?
Speaker 1: Could you imagine? I mean, what was your reaction to her?
Speaker 1: My reaction was the same as the reaction to the
Speaker 1: lawyer who was representing and arguing against the ban, and
Speaker 1: that is that. Again, her argument was that you can't
Speaker 1: really say that you're forcing people into parenthood because they
Speaker 1: can essentially just give up their parential rights as soon
Speaker 1: as they're done giving birth. But abortion care is fourteen
Speaker 1: times safer than giving childbirth in this country alone. It
Speaker 1: is seventy five times saver in the state of Mississippi,
Speaker 1: particularly because Mississippi has such bad maternal mortality rates and
Speaker 1: infant mortality rates for that. In addition, so the idea
Speaker 1: that there is no harm to the pregnant person, that
Speaker 1: pregnancy is safe, that it doesn't alter forever your mind
Speaker 1: and your body. It's it's not an argument made in
Speaker 1: good faith, especially from someone who is a parent herself.
Speaker 1: And again, I just go back to what the advocates
Speaker 1: were talking about. They know what it's like, and many
Speaker 1: of them have had abortions because they know what it's
Speaker 1: like to parent, and the idea of going through pregnancy
Speaker 1: and having to care for their previous children, especially if
Speaker 1: they had difficult pregnancies, and many do, it's just not
Speaker 1: sustainable and it's a human rights violation. And you know
Speaker 1: what we're really talking about here is the government essentially
Speaker 1: telling people when they must be forced to either begin
Speaker 1: or in most cases, expand their families. It's the government
Speaker 1: telling parents, mothers, primarily that they need to have more children.
Speaker 1: And I can't think of anything I think very many
Speaker 1: few people can of anything more unfathomable and cruel than
Speaker 1: telling parents, especially now you know financial situations. There's no
Speaker 1: mandatory paid family leave in this country, there's no affordable childcare.
Speaker 1: Telling parents that are already under difficult circumstances and situations
Speaker 1: that they have to expand their families against their will,
Speaker 1: and that the government can do that is again the
Speaker 1: cruelty is it's astonishing, you know, it's also astonishing too
Speaker 1: for her to make such a callous statement about dropping
Speaker 1: off a baby and saying that as if pointing to
Speaker 1: our adoption and foster care system and saying, look, isn't
Speaker 1: this shining example of how good things can be for kids?
Speaker 1: It's not right, like you have foster care and adoption
Speaker 1: advocates out there talking about this that broken system right
Speaker 1: on top of our broken criminal justice system and our
Speaker 1: crumbling healthcare system and all of these things. And so
Speaker 1: to me, what it was also ironic and just fucking
Speaker 1: mind blowing was the GOP's twitter handle tweeting out that
Speaker 1: we will always protect the sanctity of life. And I'm saying,
Speaker 1: you will protect the sanctity of a collection of cells,
Speaker 1: because you sure as hell don't care about anybody's life
Speaker 1: or a livelihood. Because if you did, then if you
Speaker 1: were the party of family values, then why wouldn't you
Speaker 1: be the party of parental leave? Why wouldn't you be
Speaker 1: the party of childcare. Right, Why wouldn't you be the
Speaker 1: party of stronger public education and community development and all
Speaker 1: of these things if in fact you are pro life
Speaker 1: when to your point, it is forced birth. And I'm
Speaker 1: you know, I'm really angry. I'm angry as a woman,
Speaker 1: I'm angry as a progressive. I'm angry, you know, as
Speaker 1: a person that believes that this country is in such
Speaker 1: a dangerous dark place where I do not think that
Speaker 1: we understand, right. I don't even think that those that
Speaker 1: are pressing for this overreach, right, I don't even think
Speaker 1: that they understand what is coming. And so Dani out
Speaker 1: walk us through. Paint the picture of what a post
Speaker 1: row a miracle will look like, right. I mean I
Speaker 1: only know what it will look like because of my reporting,
Speaker 1: which is to say that a post row already exists
Speaker 1: in this country, in particular states that have done everything
Speaker 1: to whittle away access to abortion care and which have
Speaker 1: made ROW existing name only especially for black women, LGBTQ people,
Speaker 1: poor people, and young people. And so it looks like
Speaker 1: what abortion access looks like right now in Texas, what
Speaker 1: it looks like in Mississippi, what it looks like in Louisiana,
Speaker 1: What it looks like in South Dakota and North Dakota,
Speaker 1: the states that only have one abortion clinic available to them,
Speaker 1: it's a lot of relying on community fund workers, on
Speaker 1: abortion funds that have been established at the grassroots level,
Speaker 1: primarily by black and brown women. It's about communities coming
Speaker 1: together to help people pay, to provide travel, to provide childcare,
Speaker 1: and it's about those systems already in place. It also
Speaker 1: looks like medication abortion, which is something wasn't available prior
Speaker 1: to Rob Wade, and it's something that a lot of
Speaker 1: advocates are trying to kind of make people aware of.
Speaker 1: Is the rhetoric of an illegal abortion is automatically an
Speaker 1: unsafe abortion is not true. Via the science, medication abortion
Speaker 1: is extremely safe. There are oral pills that you can
Speaker 1: take from the safety of your home. Studies have shown
Speaker 1: that they're safe without the purview of a medical professional,
Speaker 1: that you can take them by yourself and self manage
Speaker 1: your abortion. The problem there is the legal issues, and
Speaker 1: we've seen that born out four years in this very
Speaker 1: country where primarily black and brown women are being incarcerated
Speaker 1: often for their miscarriages because people are convinced that they've
Speaker 1: self managed their abortions at home. So that's what a
Speaker 1: post role will look like. It will look like a
Speaker 1: lot of community organizing that has existed in this country already,
Speaker 1: a lot of reliance on funds and on independent abortion clinics,
Speaker 1: and then it's going to look like a lot of
Speaker 1: incarcerated women, especially black and brown women, for what people
Speaker 1: are going to perceive to be abortions but could very
Speaker 1: well be miscarriages. You know, um, former president of Planned Parenthood,
Speaker 1: Cecil Richards, has been making the rounds again on cable news,
Speaker 1: and you know, she also, not unlike you, has dedicated
Speaker 1: her career and life to the advocacy for reproductive freedom.
Speaker 1: And she said that she believes that this is going
Speaker 1: to be an igniter like the GOP has never seen before.
Speaker 1: That you know, women make up over fifty percent of
Speaker 1: the population here, and then if we include of course
Speaker 1: trans people, queer people, right, we're not just talking about
Speaker 1: women people with uteruses. Do you believe that this is
Speaker 1: going to be an igniter? You know, because and I
Speaker 1: asked that, because it is the complacency on a lot
Speaker 1: of powerful people's, you know, part that we have arrived here.
Speaker 1: It is you know, the the negligence, I will say
Speaker 1: of the Obama administration not to push back against Mitch
Speaker 1: McConnell holding a Supreme Court seat hostage. It is, you know,
Speaker 1: the t the tepidness of the Democratic Party not acting
Speaker 1: on behalf of reproductive freedom and codifying it right in
Speaker 1: a way that we are seeing that you can steal
Speaker 1: Supreme Court seats, you can push in, you know, Supreme
Speaker 1: Court justices. You can stack this chord right and rearrange
Speaker 1: our society and turn you know, this culture war into
Speaker 1: a civil war. So you know, I say all of
Speaker 1: that to say, you know, is this the great igniter right?
Speaker 1: Because I thought that the election of a racist, narcissist, misogynistic,
Speaker 1: homophobic pig would have been the great igniter right? So
Speaker 1: what what where do you fall on that? Well? I
Speaker 1: think I think a better question would be who are
Speaker 1: we talking about when we talk about igniting? Because you know,
Speaker 1: the previous president didn't ignite more women to vote for Democrats.
Speaker 1: More white women voted for him in the twenty twenty election. So,
Speaker 1: m who are we really talking about? I think is important.
Speaker 1: You know, black and brown women have been the base
Speaker 1: for the Democratic Party. In my reporting, I can tell
Speaker 1: you that so many of them, the ones that are
Speaker 1: at those rallies, who've been sound in the alarm about
Speaker 1: the attacks on row for decades, are very upset at
Speaker 1: the complacency of the Democrats. You know, they have been
Speaker 1: sending a message to voters that if you vote for them,
Speaker 1: they'll protect access to a board rights, they'll protect reproductive justice,
Speaker 1: they'll expand paid family leave, and then we see that
Speaker 1: those promises aren't coming to fruition, and so what are
Speaker 1: people going to be voting for the same empty promises
Speaker 1: in another three years. That's how a lot of people
Speaker 1: are feeling, and we see that born out in the
Speaker 1: polling as well, especially among young people. This president, President
Speaker 1: Biden started with a much higher approval rate, and now
Speaker 1: we see that there's things being left on the sideline,
Speaker 1: that there's promises that aren't being kept, and the people
Speaker 1: that as impacting the most people who can get pregnant
Speaker 1: in this country, parents, mothers are bearing the brunt of it.
Speaker 1: And I think it's been very difficult for so many
Speaker 1: abortion advocates, for anyone who feels at a loss in
Speaker 1: this moment, to see it being talked about as the
Speaker 1: political football of what will happen politically for undance to
Speaker 1: be strategizing when twenty states are ready to ban abortion
Speaker 1: outright as soon as raw falls, and that's going to
Speaker 1: impact millions on millions of people and their families and
Speaker 1: their communities. This is not about political strategy for people,
Speaker 1: It is about their lives and the livelihoods of their families.
Speaker 1: I just think that we are so lost, Daniel. I
Speaker 1: think that we have just so in this we have
Speaker 1: turned politics into a sporting gain and to reality TV,
Speaker 1: and in doing so, have really disassociated ourselves from the
Speaker 1: impact of these policies, of the impact of what of
Speaker 1: what it would mean. And again going back to this
Speaker 1: party that wanted to be referred to as the family
Speaker 1: Party and the pro life party and all these things
Speaker 1: and the fiscally responsible, Well, what does it mean if
Speaker 1: women are shackled to their homes and can't participate in
Speaker 1: the economy anymore? Right? Like, what does like in their mind,
Speaker 1: you know, one of the things that I've said, and
Speaker 1: I want your thoughts. I feel like in their mind
Speaker 1: they're like, oh, well, this is how we reverse to
Speaker 1: the nineteen early nineteen fifties, where you know, the sole
Speaker 1: responsibility will fall on men and white men who feel
Speaker 1: like they are being displaced right in this country will
Speaker 1: then be back in front because everyone else is forced
Speaker 1: into the kitchen or into the fields. Right. Because I
Speaker 1: have been saying for the past week that everything, everything
Speaker 1: that you believe is codified into law, is now up
Speaker 1: for grabs. Everything if a fifty year old law can fall, right, Um,
Speaker 1: what do you think is the is the mind here
Speaker 1: the mindset of what the ripple effect will be? I
Speaker 1: think bors out and reporting. Two, we know that abortion
Speaker 1: is not a hotly debated topic the way in which
Speaker 1: it is framed by politicians and media. The majority of
Speaker 1: people in this country believe in access to abortion care.
Speaker 1: Republicans don't want to see Roe fall, and I don't
Speaker 1: really believe in truth Republican leaders do. We see time
Speaker 1: and time again that there are instances in which their
Speaker 1: own family members access abortion care, their mistresses access abortion care.
Speaker 1: I think that really again, it's been treated, and has
Speaker 1: been since the seventies as a political football. Is something
Speaker 1: that can ignite a base and bring people to the polls.
Speaker 1: For Republicans, if they can secure a vote from evangelical
Speaker 1: white Christians, that will help them win. And we saw
Speaker 1: that born out with the previous president and his change
Speaker 1: in stance from pro choice to anti choice in order
Speaker 1: to drum up a base that believes the same. So
Speaker 1: I don't think that there is much thought in terms
Speaker 1: of what this will do econom comically to businesses, to families,
Speaker 1: to communities. I think it's seen as a political strategy
Speaker 1: in a way to remain in power. And that's what's
Speaker 1: so upsetting again to me in general and as a reporter,
Speaker 1: the way in which it's framed and the way in
Speaker 1: which media often regurgitates those talking points of this being
Speaker 1: a contentious issue when again, the majority of Americans support
Speaker 1: access to abortion care. When we regurgitate words often used
Speaker 1: by anti choice politicians and strategists like heartbeat band when
Speaker 1: there is no such thing as a fetal heartbeat at
Speaker 1: six weeks gestation, because there's no fetus. Those kinds of
Speaker 1: situations has made it easier for the Republican Party to
Speaker 1: maintain power, to continue to use this as a political
Speaker 1: football to drum up a base because it does work.
Speaker 1: We see at work every four years, every two years
Speaker 1: in the midterms. It works, and it's working for them now,
Speaker 1: you know, I constantly talk about the importance of framing,
Speaker 1: the importance of language, who is telling the story and
Speaker 1: your RFE you know, we constantly and it's through what
Speaker 1: it's through the desire for increased ratings, which is increased money. Right,
Speaker 1: And when you look at all everything, everything, I keep
Speaker 1: saying to everybody, just follow the money, right, like who
Speaker 1: gets to capitalize off of this cruelty? And then that
Speaker 1: will tell you who, you know, who is responsible for
Speaker 1: this happening. And you know, one of the things that
Speaker 1: really stood out for me was justice. So to MYRSU statement,
Speaker 1: and you know it, I can't imagine what it is
Speaker 1: like for her and other people who actually believe in
Speaker 1: the rule of law, who are qualified to be in
Speaker 1: the position that they are, to sit there and know
Speaker 1: that they six to three. There's just there's no power anymore.
Speaker 1: But she said, will this institution survive the stench that
Speaker 1: this creates in the public perception that the Constitution and
Speaker 1: its readings are just political acts. I don't see how
Speaker 1: it is possible. Do you think that this stench will
Speaker 1: ever be alleviated in America? And what do you think
Speaker 1: its effects are on our ability to go around the
Speaker 1: world to dictate to people how they treat women and girls. Well,
Speaker 1: I can tell you in speaking with you know, the
Speaker 1: advocates and for the people who have had abortions and
Speaker 1: who this impacts the most, I can say that no.
Speaker 1: But I could have told you that before the hearings
Speaker 1: on December first as well. I think that so many
Speaker 1: people have seen what happened to the Supreme Court nominee
Speaker 1: is in years past, what happened with Kavanaugh, what happened
Speaker 1: with Dorsage, and so I think that a lot of
Speaker 1: people didn't have faith Already. Again, we saw President promise
Speaker 1: to come into office to share up Rovy way to
Speaker 1: expand access, that he was going to fight for people
Speaker 1: who had abortions, and then his administration didn't say the
Speaker 1: word abortion for the first six months. And so again
Speaker 1: I think a lot of advocates, the people who wanted
Speaker 1: to believe that this more moderate Democrat was going to
Speaker 1: do something, didn't believe that before. They don't think that
Speaker 1: the Supreme Court is going to do what it is
Speaker 1: supposed to do. They don't believe that Senators, congressmen and
Speaker 1: women are going to do things that they're supposed to
Speaker 1: do they promised to because they haven't seen that born out,
Speaker 1: and so no, I don't believe that it will. And
Speaker 1: I think that's why we're going to continue to see
Speaker 1: communities really alley and rely on themselves and become self
Speaker 1: sustaining in certain ways when it comes to access to
Speaker 1: abortion and other healthcare. I see this happy to trans
Speaker 1: youth as well, see this happy you know, to post
Speaker 1: partum care in the absence of paid family leave. I
Speaker 1: see this happening with mental healthcare as well. Is we're
Speaker 1: going to have to rely on each other and rely
Speaker 1: on the systems that are already in place by grassroots organizers.
Speaker 1: And that's where again that the fear will then be
Speaker 1: what are the legal ramifications of that and what is
Speaker 1: that going to look like for the incarceration of black
Speaker 1: and brown men and women, which is already at a
Speaker 1: higher and disproportionate rate. And so that's I think just
Speaker 1: where we stand, there's going to be less reliance and
Speaker 1: belief in the institutions that I've promised one thing and
Speaker 1: delivered another, and more reliance on each other that could
Speaker 1: potentially have legal ramifications moving forward for those people. And
Speaker 1: I am one of them, and there are many of
Speaker 1: them that do, in fact feel extraordinarily helpless in this
Speaker 1: moment and hopeless in this moment. Can you offer any
Speaker 1: thoughts about what they can do to feel like they
Speaker 1: are helping the cause? That isn't just about marching and protesting,
Speaker 1: even though I believe that to be important, but what
Speaker 1: they can do to kind of get active and activate absolutely.
Speaker 1: I mean I asked this of every woman that I
Speaker 1: interviewed from my recent piece on Today who were going
Speaker 1: to rallies, like how were they staying positive? They all shared,
Speaker 1: you know, the viewpoint of we know how this is
Speaker 1: going to end. We think we know how this is
Speaker 1: going to end. We're preparing ourselves, preparing our families. So
Speaker 1: I asked them, how are you staying hopeful in this moment?
Speaker 1: And they offered a slew of things that I think
Speaker 1: are really beneficial to anyone who feels the same. Is
Speaker 1: one to donate to a local abortion fund in your state,
Speaker 1: It doesn't matter which state you are in. I think
Speaker 1: prior to to perhaps a few months ago, there was
Speaker 1: this belief that if there was abortion attacks on abortion
Speaker 1: access in certain states, your state would be fine. That's
Speaker 1: clearly not the case. Now twenty states could lose access
Speaker 1: to abortion care, which means that those patients are going
Speaker 1: to have to go to other states, and other states
Speaker 1: will be overwhelmed, so all funds in any state are
Speaker 1: going to need and require assistance. The moms also said
Speaker 1: to uplift and listen to people who've had abortions, listening
Speaker 1: to their stories. I get in touch with people that
Speaker 1: we Testify for example, which is a nonprofit that supports
Speaker 1: abortion storytellers and abortion advocates. Uplift their stories, share them
Speaker 1: if you feel safe, share your own while you aren't
Speaker 1: owed your story to anyone, and it is yours to
Speaker 1: share when you're ready if you do feel safe. That
Speaker 1: is also a way to combat stigma. And then what
Speaker 1: was really uplifting for me was to look at the
Speaker 1: moms and their kids, and I think that this is
Speaker 1: very overwhelming for so many people. The next generation is
Speaker 1: so involved and from very young ages, and they understand it,
Speaker 1: and we're seeing that in these demonstrations and the ways
Speaker 1: in which these moms are raising future advocates. And so
Speaker 1: there's laws. Obviously, ask anyone who has been sounding the alarm,
Speaker 1: It's always been highs and lows, and this is a
Speaker 1: low for sure for so many people. But I do
Speaker 1: believe that looking at the generations and the ways in
Speaker 1: which people are speaking about abortion within their own family
Speaker 1: members is also a really great way to look at
Speaker 1: how you know, this is far from over for advocates,
Speaker 1: and this is a moment in which I think we're
Speaker 1: going to see how much people have built, how much
Speaker 1: we've already learned from past attacks on abortion, especially at
Speaker 1: the state level, and advocates while they are disheartened or
Speaker 1: definitely not deterred, and so I think that people can
Speaker 1: find some hope in knowing that this is definitely not
Speaker 1: a way. Danielle, I can't thank you enough for your voice,
Speaker 1: for your work, for your advocacy, for the time that
Speaker 1: you make to spend with us here on woke a
Speaker 1: f and again I am so excited for you and
Speaker 1: wish you the best of luck at today. I think
Speaker 1: today needs you now more than more than ever, and
Speaker 1: we need your voice now more than ever in every
Speaker 1: space that you that you can be in, because I
Speaker 1: think that we have a very very long and rough
Speaker 1: road in front of us, but I feel confident that
Speaker 1: you're one of the warriors that are on that road
Speaker 1: with us. So I appreciate you so very much. Noah,
Speaker 1: thank you, dear friend. I appreciate you too. Folks, I
Speaker 1: have to tell you. I know that I say this
Speaker 1: at the end of a lot of shows, after we
Speaker 1: are talking about heavy shit all of the time. Please
Speaker 1: do take good care of yourselves. I am taking a break,
Speaker 1: as I tell all of you to do. I can't
Speaker 1: continue to tell folks to take a break and then
Speaker 1: don't actually take one for myself. Things have just gotten
Speaker 1: extraordinarily heavy. So do something each day for yourself, whether
Speaker 1: it is meditating, walking, working out, tending to a garden,
Speaker 1: playing with your pets, doing something that brings you joy,
Speaker 1: and making sure that you are doing it consistently. Because
Speaker 1: the weight of what is happening in our society is crushing,
Speaker 1: and if we're not grounding ourselves in something other than misery,
Speaker 1: we will not make it through. That is it for
Speaker 1: me today. Friends on woke app as always power to
Speaker 1: the people and to all the people. Power, Get wope
Speaker 1: and stay woke as fuck.