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Speaker 2: Latest headlines Iran firing a barrage of ballistic missiles at Israel.
Speaker 2: All of Israel's under fire. The military of Israel says
Speaker 2: it does come hours after Israeli airstrikes targeted Iranian nuclear
Speaker 2: and ballistic facilities, killing senior officials, including the commander of
Speaker 2: Iran's Revolutionary Guard.
Speaker 3: I just want to point out that our blog, and
Speaker 3: these are folks that have been following this situation so closely,
Speaker 3: our editorial team, they are pointing out that the rapid
Speaker 3: pace of the Iranian retaliation against Israel, with missiles now
Speaker 3: fired hours after Israel's airstrikes, our team pointing out stands
Speaker 3: in contrast to previous episodes with Tehran. In some of
Speaker 3: those tit for tat moments, it was a matter of
Speaker 3: weeks and a lot of rhetoric before there was a
Speaker 3: military response. Their point is this was a pretty quick response.
Speaker 3: We're talking in less than a twenty four hour period.
Speaker 2: Yeah. They note that the ball is now again in
Speaker 2: Israel's court, and the question is will it see this
Speaker 2: as a response it can tolerate, or will it soon
Speaker 2: hit iron again. In turn, we want to bring in
Speaker 2: executive director of the independent nonprofit a Middle East Forum,
Speaker 2: a Greg Roman. The Middle East Forum works too, in
Speaker 2: its own words, focus on ways to defeat radical Islam,
Speaker 2: work for Palestinian acceptance of Israel, develop strategies to contain
Speaker 2: Iron and deal with the great advances of anarchy. Greg
Speaker 2: joins us as I mentioned from Philadelphia. Greg, good to
Speaker 2: have you back on the program. The Forum oat with
Speaker 2: a piece yesterday before these strikes that says, quote, the
Speaker 2: greater strategic risk is not a decisive Israeli strike, but
Speaker 2: allowing a nuclear Iran to feel immune behind its own deterrent. So,
Speaker 2: in your view, were these strikes warranted?
Speaker 4: These strikes were warranted, and as its ambassador Bolton said,
Speaker 4: the plan for this to take place was actually going
Speaker 4: all the way back to April. But President Trump asked
Speaker 4: Prime Minister net Niahu to give him a sixty day
Speaker 4: window to be able to lay away Israeli strikes or
Speaker 4: the plan for is really action against the Iran And
Speaker 4: on day sixty one, Israel decided how to act on
Speaker 4: its own and unilaterally go after Iran's nuclear missiles program,
Speaker 4: nuclear weapons and missile program. The reason being that those
Speaker 4: sites that you're now seeing of Iranian missiles falling on
Speaker 4: Tel Aviv in civilian areas, if any one of them
Speaker 4: had a radiological, chemical, biological, or god forbid, nuclear device,
Speaker 4: tel Aviv might no longer be with us anymore. So
Speaker 4: Israel decided how to act fast, had to add at first,
Speaker 4: and it will not stop until the entire Iranian enrichment,
Speaker 4: nuclear and missile program has been eradicated.
Speaker 3: Do you see Israel acting as a proxy for the
Speaker 3: United States here? Obviously, the US and the President Trump
Speaker 3: that is, has been certainly working with a mission to
Speaker 3: get some kind of deal when it comes to nuclear
Speaker 3: capabilities in Iran.
Speaker 5: That has certainly been a goal.
Speaker 4: I don't see this as a proxy. I see as
Speaker 4: a partner to the US's national security interests. For the
Speaker 4: better part of for presidential administrations, the Iranian nuclear program
Speaker 4: is supposed a threat to the United States. However, the
Speaker 4: chosen tool for the US has been diplomacy, especially since
Speaker 4: the two thousand and three Iranian freeze on its nuclear
Speaker 4: weapons program, the military elements of not the civilian elements
Speaker 4: of it, but new intelligence that came into the United
Speaker 4: States and the DIA, the Defensive Intelligence Agency, at the
Speaker 4: beginning of May, showed that the Iranians were one week
Speaker 4: away from a nuclear weapon, and a comparable report from
Speaker 4: the Viennese the Austrian intelligence agencies said that Iran was
Speaker 4: actively marching towards a bomb. Now this is a European
Speaker 4: ally of the United States and Israels saying this.
Speaker 6: Not the US nor Israel.
Speaker 4: And I think what really finally encapsulated the US position
Speaker 4: of seeing Israel as a partner to have it willingly
Speaker 4: kinetically strike Iran's nuclear program was when Secretary of Defense
Speaker 4: Peter Hegseth said on Tuesday that he believed that Iran
Speaker 4: was developing a nuclear weapon.
Speaker 3: Can I ask you, I mean, Tim and I kind
Speaker 3: of we have this conversation or some of us do, like,
Speaker 3: who is it that determines who should have nuclear capabilities?
Speaker 3: I mean, I know, if you go back. I remember
Speaker 3: studying college the concept of nuclear deterrence, right, you have it,
Speaker 3: I have it. Nobody uses it because we know what
Speaker 3: the outcome is. Israel is widely believed, some say, to
Speaker 3: possess nuclear weapons.
Speaker 5: So how was it that we decide Iran shouldn't. I'm
Speaker 5: playing a little.
Speaker 3: Bit Devil's advocate here, but I'm trying to understand how
Speaker 3: peace actually happens in the world.
Speaker 4: Well, now, with the Iran being a signator to the
Speaker 4: Non Proliferation Treaty the NPT, and also Israel not being
Speaker 4: a signator to that treaty, just under international law, Iran
Speaker 4: had an obligation to not develop a military weapons program.
Speaker 4: But beyond that, I think it was just the common sense.
Speaker 4: Israel has never instigated nor started a war that it
Speaker 4: wanted to be able to do in terms of offensive
Speaker 4: capability to either try to take more territory or to
Speaker 4: try to impinge on the rights of countries that didn't
Speaker 4: attack it first. Unless you look at nineteen sixty seven,
Speaker 4: where you had seven Arab armies getting ready to invade Israel,
Speaker 4: and yes they had a preemptive strike at that time.
Speaker 4: But if we look back in nineteen eighty one, when
Speaker 4: they struck the Iraqi reactor two thousand and seven, when
Speaker 4: they short the Syrian reactor a now June of twenty
Speaker 4: twenty five, it was an attempt to stop a program
Speaker 4: whose sole design.
Speaker 6: Was to destroy the Jewish state.
Speaker 4: So I think Israel, with its strategic ambiguity that it's
Speaker 4: had for the last sixty years with this nuclear program,
Speaker 4: still maintains the right to have that in so far
Speaker 4: as it relates to the fact that the Jewish people,
Speaker 4: amongst maybe the Armenians and a few others, have been
Speaker 4: one of the only victims of a worldwide genocide attempt
Speaker 4: by a dictator. Wherein the Iranians prior to nineteen seventy
Speaker 4: nine had peaceful relations with Israel. So the Iranian intents
Speaker 4: was to create a niclar device to destroy other state.
Speaker 4: The Israeli intent for this program is to be able
Speaker 4: to defend its state from destruction.
Speaker 2: Greg, How is Israel going to know when Iran's nuclear
Speaker 2: program has been destroyed to its uh in a way
Speaker 2: that the country sees is sufficient.
Speaker 4: Well, there's three different indicators through Ellen Sigan and human
Speaker 4: first electronics intelligence think of satellite reconnaissance being able to
Speaker 4: actually see not just the images that you can take
Speaker 4: with a deep range camera on the surface of Iran's program,
Speaker 4: but also what you can do through different sort of
Speaker 4: thermoscopic imaging. The second, in terms of signal intelligence, Israel
Speaker 4: had indicators that Iran had reactivated an explosives line which
Speaker 4: was meant only for the purpose of being able to
Speaker 4: create a detonation device for fissile material. In terms of
Speaker 4: human intelligence, Iran has had a deep penetration of its
Speaker 4: Government of Security Organs GREG and of its nuclear program
Speaker 4: by Israeli intelligence.
Speaker 6: I think discreet indicators will give it a sign.
Speaker 2: We only have a minute left here, but another headline
Speaker 2: crossing at least two Israeli fighter jets have been shot
Speaker 2: down over Iran. That's, according to NA also a headline
Speaker 2: the US is helping Israel down Iran's missiles. A US
Speaker 2: official tells Axios. First your reaction to the two Israeli
Speaker 2: fighter jets being shot down over Iran.
Speaker 4: I think Israel Hennis plans in place through a sixty
Speaker 4: six y nine rescue unit on countries which border Iran
Speaker 4: and reps even in the country to attempt to rescue
Speaker 4: those pilots. And in terms of the US helping Israel
Speaker 4: with its missile defense. This is something that's placed in
Speaker 4: April and October of last year. And President Trump had
Speaker 4: a promise this morning that he would further assist Israel
Speaker 4: with its efforts to down Iranian missiles targeting the Jewish state.
Speaker 3: Hey, listen, just got about thirty forty seconds here, Greg,
Speaker 3: You know, it feels a little complicated, messy. Israel worried
Speaker 3: about its state, as you have said, at a time
Speaker 3: when it continues to push back it seems on a
Speaker 3: Palestinian independence state. I mean, just got about thirty seconds.
Speaker 3: Where are the lines drawn? Where are the fair lines?
Speaker 3: Just quickly?
Speaker 6: Well, right now, there are no alliance that draw.
Speaker 4: The ambition for the Palestinians to have their own state
Speaker 4: die with October seventh when Hamas brutally murdered over one
Speaker 4: thousand Israeli civilians and military members alike after that daring, dashing,
Speaker 4: brazen attack.
Speaker 6: But yeah, the.
Speaker 4: Idea for there to be an independent Palestinian state might
Speaker 4: take place after the Iranian is dealt with and you
Speaker 4: have Pelstonian people who want to have peace with Israel
Speaker 4: rather than violence.
Speaker 3: All right, time will certainly tell Executive director of the
Speaker 3: Independent nonprofit Middle East to Forum. Greg Roman joining us here.
Speaker 3: We continue to watch the headlines and the market selling
Speaker 3: off on this Friday. This is Bloomberg Business Week Daily.
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Speaker 3: Right now, we want to get to Dana Stroll to
Speaker 3: get her view specifically and what we've seen over in
Speaker 3: the Middle East. She is Senior Fellow and Director of
Speaker 3: Research at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy. Joining
Speaker 3: us from Washington, d C. Dan, just your initial thoughts.
Speaker 3: We've been talking non style here at Bloomberg our last
Speaker 3: two hours, but really all day here at Bloomberg, starting
Speaker 3: in the wee hours and really yesterday afternoon and into
Speaker 3: the late night hours last night. What's first and foremost
Speaker 3: on your mind right now as you watch the activities
Speaker 3: between Iran and Israel.
Speaker 7: Well, first of all, I think this is very different
Speaker 7: from what we saw last year. And in both April
Speaker 7: and October of last year, Israel did strike inside Iran,
Speaker 7: but in both of those cases it was one night.
Speaker 7: It was a couple wave of air strikes and it
Speaker 7: was over. This is different right now, the Israeli government
Speaker 7: is talking about a campaign, so we're talking about days,
Speaker 7: if not weeks. The target set is expansive, up to
Speaker 7: twenty senior Iranian officials, missile strikes around the Supreme Leader
Speaker 7: Ayatola Hamiene's residence, as well as nuclear installations, military installations.
Speaker 8: Air defense, etc.
Speaker 7: So an expansive campaign, and Israel clearly has been preparing
Speaker 7: for this very a long time.
Speaker 8: So going to go on for a while.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I want to talk a little bit about your experience.
Speaker 2: You served during twenty twenty one to twenty twenty three.
Speaker 2: You were Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense for the Middle East.
Speaker 2: It's the Pentagon's top civilian official with responsibility for that region.
Speaker 2: Did you ever think when you were in that position
Speaker 2: that in our lifetimes we'd see a conflict such as
Speaker 2: this between the US and Israel. I mean, excuse me,
Speaker 2: between Israel and Iran.
Speaker 7: No, Frankly, there's a lot that we've seen since October
Speaker 7: seventh that I would not put on my bingo card.
Speaker 8: We generally had views about.
Speaker 7: Iran's support for terrorist proxies Hesbalala and Lebanon, Hamas and Gaza,
Speaker 7: the militias in Iraq and Syria, Iran's client state Syria,
Speaker 7: but charl asad, all of that is basically collapsed at
Speaker 7: this point.
Speaker 8: So I would not have predicted any of that.
Speaker 7: The idea that we'd have Israel striking inside Iran twice
Speaker 7: last year, a multilateral air defense coalition standing up to
Speaker 7: defeat Iran's attack last year, none of that are scenarios
Speaker 7: that we actively planned for when I was in the Pentagon.
Speaker 8: And so now fast.
Speaker 7: Forward to today, we have, you know, in a situation
Speaker 7: where the past five presidential administrations, both Republican and Democratic,
Speaker 7: have looked at and contemplated military action against Iran and
Speaker 7: its nuclear program and have decided to pursue diplomacy and
Speaker 7: negotiations instead. And every president says the military option is
Speaker 7: on the table, and we have never seen a US
Speaker 7: president decide to execute that military option, and yet today
Speaker 7: we have Israel doing it.
Speaker 2: Israel certainly has the capabilities to defend itself against these strikes,
Speaker 2: as we've seen play out over the last few hours.
Speaker 2: But I'm curious if you think the threat to Israel
Speaker 2: right now is existential.
Speaker 7: I do not think it is existential yet, but it's serious.
Speaker 7: So Israel has since October seventh been under threats from
Speaker 7: multiple threat from multiple fronts, and they all relate back
Speaker 7: to Iran. And what we're seeing, even in the less
Speaker 7: than twenty four hours since Israel initiated it strikes inside
Speaker 7: Iran is waves of ballistic missile strikes after that drone
Speaker 7: strike that was defeated earlier this morning.
Speaker 8: So I believe as we speak, the third wave of
Speaker 8: Iranian ballistic missiles as targeting Israel.
Speaker 7: And we know that there are some injuries, and we
Speaker 7: know that some of those ballistic missiles have actually impacted
Speaker 7: in downtown Tel Aviv. And so part of the question
Speaker 7: right now is how long can Israel effectively defend itself
Speaker 7: by itself. We have US military air defense on the
Speaker 7: ground in Israel, and we know that there are ballistic
Speaker 7: missile defense capable Navy destroyers on their way to the
Speaker 7: Eastern Mediterranean to support the active defense of Israel. So we,
Speaker 7: I think, can reasonably assume that if this goes on
Speaker 7: for a really long time, Israel would be under strained
Speaker 7: to defend itself by itself. And the big question is
Speaker 7: what the Trump administration is going to do to put
Speaker 7: skin in the game.
Speaker 5: What do you think it's going to do?
Speaker 6: Well.
Speaker 7: We've seen indications that the Trump administration has already authorized
Speaker 7: certain kinds of military support, whether it's deconflicting airspace, whether
Speaker 7: it's working alongside the Jordanian Air Force and the Israeli
Speaker 7: Air Force this morning to defeat those one hundred attacked
Speaker 7: rones that are on launched from Iran.
Speaker 8: And again, we do.
Speaker 7: Haves military on the ground in Israel actively participating in
Speaker 7: air defense. And now we're putting more US posture, more
Speaker 7: military capabilities on the ground in the Middle East. So
Speaker 7: that's a serious signal of commitment from the Trump administration.
Speaker 2: Commitment is one thing, but an all out conflict between
Speaker 2: the US and Iran is a different thing. Do you
Speaker 2: see the possibility of that escalating there? Given the support
Speaker 2: that the US has committed, we are on the.
Speaker 8: Knife's edge of escalation.
Speaker 7: So right now we are seeing Israel execute a very precise,
Speaker 7: very deliberate, very well planned operation.
Speaker 8: The reports of collateral.
Speaker 7: Damage are very minimal at this point, and right now
Speaker 7: there have been no Israeli deaths, but it looks like
Speaker 7: the Iranians have targeted civilian centers in Israel, and whether
Speaker 7: or not Israel feels compelled to expand its target set,
Speaker 7: how Iran responds to that. There's no question that this
Speaker 7: could escalate. And of course there are tens of thousands
Speaker 7: of US forces across the Middle East, five big air bases,
Speaker 7: a ton of energy infrastructure across the Middle East, and
Speaker 7: the Iranians might decide to target that as well.
Speaker 5: Dana, None of this happens in a vacuum.
Speaker 3: And I just think about the last couple of years,
Speaker 3: right Hamas on Israel, Israel on Palestine, and then there
Speaker 3: were other outbreaks, if you will, and I'm just trying
Speaker 3: to understand this. On top of it, We've had Oman's
Speaker 3: government come out saying Israel's actions were reckless and would
Speaker 3: undermine regional security. Other Arab states echoed those comments, including
Speaker 3: Saudi Arabia, the United Arab Emirates, and Qatar. I think
Speaker 3: about the United States just in the Middle East region,
Speaker 3: and it seemed like everything was let's.
Speaker 5: Make deals and let's forge forward.
Speaker 3: Help me understand kind of where we are in the
Speaker 3: Middle East and who is I really want to understand
Speaker 3: who's aligning with whom and what the implications of that are,
Speaker 3: and then later on China Russia. Like I keep going
Speaker 3: back to kind of how we started at two pm
Speaker 3: Wall Street time, help me understand how this is all
Speaker 3: being carved up in terms of relationships potentially well.
Speaker 7: Such an important issue and such an important challenge. So
Speaker 7: I think the theme of President Trump's visit when he
Speaker 7: went to those three golf countries was business deals, commerce
Speaker 7: and a future based on transit, actionalism and economic interests.
Speaker 7: And what he's certainly heard from those Gulf countries is
Speaker 7: this region has been at war for a very long time,
Speaker 7: and it's been in a really intense period of war
Speaker 7: since October seventh. And war is not good for business.
Speaker 7: It's not good for our economic growth. So we want
Speaker 7: to calm things down and focus on diplomacy. But none
Speaker 7: of those leaders would say that Iran is not the
Speaker 7: driver of instability in the Middle East. Iran has an illicit,
Speaker 7: illegal nuclear weapons program. In fact, just on Monday this
Speaker 7: week you had the IAEA come out and say there
Speaker 7: is no possible civilian explanation for the nuclear steps that
Speaker 7: Iran is taking. We have that deadline coming up at
Speaker 7: the Security Council in New York for whether sanctions on
Speaker 7: Iran for its nuclear steps will snap back into place.
Speaker 7: And it's Iran who funded Hasbalah and armed and trained
Speaker 7: Hisbala in Lebanon.
Speaker 8: Hamas and Gaza.
Speaker 7: Made sure that bsharl Asad in Syria could survive as
Speaker 7: long as he did, dropping chemis weapons, barrel bombs, torturing
Speaker 7: and starving his own people. It's Aron who is arming
Speaker 7: and directing and funding the Huthis and Yemen and militias
Speaker 7: in Iraq, all of whom do not have at heart
Speaker 7: piece or regional stability as a priority for any of
Speaker 7: these terrorists. Militias are proxy non state actors.
Speaker 3: You're going to have to come back at some point, Dana,
Speaker 3: Thank you so much. Dana Stroul joining us.
Speaker 1: This is the Bloomberg Business Weekdaily Podcast. Listen live each
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Speaker 2: So, just so everybody knows, we've been planning to talk
Speaker 2: about commercial real estate at exactly this moment, but this
Speaker 2: is the news business. Things change quickly. We have with
Speaker 2: us Jay Neveloff, partner and Chair of Real Estate US
Speaker 2: at the law firm Herbert Smith Freehills Kramer, where he
Speaker 2: folks is on commercial and residential projects throughout the US.
Speaker 2: We're talking development, We're talking financing, We're talking everything. Jay
Speaker 2: joins us here in the Bloomberg Interactive Brokers studio. We
Speaker 2: are going to talk real estate, Jay, but I kind
Speaker 2: of want to bring everybody into our conversation that we
Speaker 2: were having a little earlier. As you walked into the studio,
Speaker 2: I pose the same question to you that I asked
Speaker 2: Dana Stroll, who is Senior Fellow and Director of Research
Speaker 2: at the Washington Institute for a Near Policy. She did
Speaker 2: serve for several years as Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense
Speaker 2: for the Middle East, which is the Pentagon's top civilian
Speaker 2: official with responsibility for the region. I asked her if
Speaker 2: she'd I asked you the same question that I asked her,
Speaker 2: which was, did you ever think you'd live to see
Speaker 2: the day where we'd see an escalation such as this
Speaker 2: between Iran and Israel? And you said you did.
Speaker 9: But my response was most definitely. It was only a
Speaker 9: matter of time before Israel had to take the offensive
Speaker 9: and neutralize the weapons that are in Iran. This is
Speaker 9: an ideal time to do it. President Trump has made
Speaker 9: it clear that he's going to be supporting Israel. But
Speaker 9: President Trump is looking for a lasting piece, and I believe,
Speaker 9: as I believe President Trump believes that the way to
Speaker 9: get to a lasting priest is to stand up to bullies,
Speaker 9: to stand up to things that countries that aren't abiding
Speaker 9: by nuclear proliferation treaties. And I think that's what we saw,
Speaker 9: and I think that we're going to continue to see.
Speaker 9: The goals got to be to have a lasting piece,
Speaker 9: and what we've been doing appeasing hasn't worked in the past.
Speaker 9: Hopefully this tact will be successful.
Speaker 3: You know, it's interesting and I think you know, you're
Speaker 3: a business leader. I'm assumed you're very involved in your community,
Speaker 3: and I'm just curious, you know why. You know, you've
Speaker 3: obviously watched the situation at least, and I'm sure you
Speaker 3: have folks that you talk back to in Israel, you know,
Speaker 3: talk to us about you know, kind of your vantage
Speaker 3: point in you know, this situation.
Speaker 9: I actually right before I came on, was texting with
Speaker 9: one of my colleagues who is in Israel with a
Speaker 9: husband for a family event. They were we were talking
Speaker 9: about whether she's going to be able to get out
Speaker 9: of Israel come back to the United States. And right
Speaker 9: now the airspace is closed and they have a variety
Speaker 9: of flights. It's difficult to live under the constant threat.
Speaker 9: And I know that Israel's had tremendous defenses, They've had
Speaker 9: success with the Iron Dome. But we've got to do
Speaker 9: We've got to take a different tack. What we've been
Speaker 9: doing for the past decade plus two decades hasn't worked.
Speaker 9: They need a lasting piece and hopefully this will be
Speaker 9: attack to get there.
Speaker 2: So we should note that this is all connected to
Speaker 2: the markets in the global economy. We spent a good
Speaker 2: portion of our program talking about what was happening with markets,
Speaker 2: what was happening with oil. The FED is meeting next week.
Speaker 2: If we see a spike in oil prices, we could
Speaker 2: see the rate path for the Federal Reserve change. In
Speaker 2: your position advising clients on real estate matters, you think
Speaker 2: a lot about interest rates. How do you look at
Speaker 2: a situation like this actually affecting your business world.
Speaker 9: I believe that the impact of the stock market over
Speaker 9: the past several months that we've seen with the volatility
Speaker 9: and yes it went down, that it came back up.
Speaker 9: I know today the market's down by a material amount.
Speaker 9: Those are reasons to invest in real estate. And I
Speaker 9: think that we're seeing that we talked about, or you
Speaker 9: mentioned a new name of our firm. We merged about
Speaker 9: a week ago, so a part of a big global firm.
Speaker 9: And what I'm seeing and that I did not expect
Speaker 9: to say, is a tremendous interest in inbound investment in
Speaker 9: the United States real estate. You have seen, I have seen,
Speaker 9: and we're only in a position for the past two
Speaker 9: or three weeks where we're meeting with other clients where
Speaker 9: we're interacting The inquiries that I'm getting for inband investment
Speaker 9: from firm clients, the bigger firm clients surprised me.
Speaker 1: It didn't.
Speaker 9: It didn't surprise me. It would not have surprised me
Speaker 9: if I thought about it, because I see that real
Speaker 9: estate and is getting a greater allocation of investment funds
Speaker 9: from private equity funds, from family offices. New York real estate,
Speaker 9: Gateway City real estate is more stable than the stock market,
Speaker 9: and that's what we're seeing.
Speaker 3: Well, that's interesting because we've had a lot of conversations
Speaker 3: today where folks are saying, okay, and we're asking is
Speaker 3: the USN investible right? And we're seeing a reallocation of
Speaker 3: assets overseas. Some are saying it's just a rebalancing after
Speaker 3: many years of just so much money flowing into the
Speaker 3: United States, and so it's a reallocation of you know,
Speaker 3: kind of rebalancing of your portfolio. Do you think that's
Speaker 3: the case or you are saying, oh wow, saying that
Speaker 3: you're seeing money come in.
Speaker 9: I'm seeing money come in. And I actually believe, and
Speaker 9: I say this to my clients regularly, that this is
Speaker 9: the unique opportunity in time to invest in equity and
Speaker 9: real estate. What you're I'm seeing that people need to transact.
Speaker 9: People who are in deals with loans that have protured
Speaker 9: or almost maturing, right, they need to transact. The values
Speaker 9: are low. They need to bring in new money into
Speaker 9: these There's a lot of money that's on the sidelines
Speaker 9: waiting to go into real estate. And I'm a buyer
Speaker 9: in this market.
Speaker 5: One thing I'm going to ask you, oh.
Speaker 2: Wait, a hold on a buyer in commercial residential, but
Speaker 2: you can't. We can't just say commercial, but commer but
Speaker 2: class A, class B. I mean, there's so many fine.
Speaker 9: We could be specific through the classes, but in jet
Speaker 9: and concept, I'm a buyer. I believe that there is
Speaker 9: a need to do something with deals. People at private
Speaker 9: equity funds are turned out because of COVID and everything else.
Speaker 9: Lenders are coming back, the commercial banks are coming back
Speaker 9: into the market. The alternative lenders have been big in
Speaker 9: the market, and I think we're going to see a
Speaker 9: shift from from people focused on debt to people focusing
Speaker 9: on equity.
Speaker 3: What I want to ask you to is, in terms
Speaker 3: of the uncertainty that we've seen in our world, uh
Speaker 3: oh to say since almost the beginning of the year,
Speaker 3: but certainly since President Trump took office, I am curious
Speaker 3: that whether or not you are seeing certain in real
Speaker 3: estate projects, commercial real estate projects.
Speaker 5: Not happen because of that uncertainty.
Speaker 3: You're saying money's coming into the United States, But I
Speaker 3: am curious whether or not things have slowed down because
Speaker 3: of the uncertainty.
Speaker 9: One of the things that's happened that you've seen a
Speaker 9: slow down is evaluating new development deals and that's probably
Speaker 9: a direct result of the tariffs and how the tariffs
Speaker 9: keep changing. But it's hard for a lender, it's hard
Speaker 9: for an investor to come up with a budget that
Speaker 9: they can be comfortable with and projections. So I see
Speaker 9: a number of people sitting on the sidelines on development deals,
Speaker 9: including lenders.
Speaker 2: You do see that, Okay, Jay, You've spent a lot
Speaker 2: of time working with the Trump with President Trump over
Speaker 2: the years. Are you still in touch with him right now?
Speaker 7: No?
Speaker 2: When did to explain the relationship for people who aren't
Speaker 2: familiar with the work that you've done for the president?
Speaker 9: I would say that I was his primary real estate
Speaker 9: lawyer for a few decades.
Speaker 2: But when did you still work for the Trump organization?
Speaker 6: Now?
Speaker 2: Work with the Trump organization now? I don't.
Speaker 9: I actually live next door to one of the sons
Speaker 9: on one of the golf courses, but I was supposed
Speaker 9: to be more involved in the businesses during the first administration,
Speaker 9: and it just made sense for me not to speak
Speaker 9: speak with him directly. But yes, it was a long
Speaker 9: standing the relationship. I've worked on most of his real
Speaker 9: estate deals and it was a terrific experience.
Speaker 3: One last question, and we've got to unfortunately get back
Speaker 3: to certainly the day's events. But I do wonder, Jay,
Speaker 3: in this environment, do you feel like there is you know,
Speaker 3: on a day, we're again a twenty four hour news
Speaker 3: cycle that just stuff just keeps coming at us, and
Speaker 3: it's difficult for business leaders to make decisions. Do you
Speaker 3: see that the environment is getting more certain or uncertain
Speaker 3: in this environment?
Speaker 5: In terms of real estate, I think the for you guys, yeah,
Speaker 5: but I think about in general.
Speaker 9: Yeah, I can do it with through my eyes. I
Speaker 9: think interest rates have stabilized. You're able to underwrite deals
Speaker 9: based on that. Seen and interest rates are go hand
Speaker 9: in hand. And again I think the dynamics of deals
Speaker 9: are they need people need to transact, and I think
Speaker 9: the environment. We've seen real estate values hold steady during
Speaker 9: uncertainty about tariffs and the stockwalker going down, and I
Speaker 9: just believe I'm bullish on real estate.
Speaker 3: It's a hard asset, right and longer term to hold
Speaker 3: up today, Yeah, yeah it is.
Speaker 5: Stockwalks gold is up, yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah exactly, but seen as a safe haven. And so
Speaker 3: hopefully we can have you come back at a more
Speaker 3: calmer time. But we appreciate you kind of as we
Speaker 3: have to kind of navigate a lot on this Friday,
Speaker 3: Jay Naveloff. He is a partner and Chair of Real
Speaker 3: Estate of US at the law firm Herbert Smith Freehills Kramer.
Speaker 5: Joining us here in studio. Do come back.
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Speaker 5: A lot going on this week.
Speaker 3: We did also know that recently the US Supreme Court
Speaker 3: revived a job bias lawsuit bought by a woman who
Speaker 3: says she suffered so called reverse discrimination because she's straight,
Speaker 3: in a ruling that makes it easier to bring similar
Speaker 3: cases to trial in parts of the country now. The
Speaker 3: justices unanimously said a federal appeals court was wrong to
Speaker 3: require workers in majority groups, including white people, men, and heterosexuals,
Speaker 3: to meet a more difficult test than others that have
Speaker 3: historically faced discrimination. Just some of our backdrop when it
Speaker 3: comes to the changing workplace landscape. Curious to see what
Speaker 3: our next guest has to say about this and where
Speaker 3: women are in all of this. Alisa Sankster is Chief
Speaker 3: executive officer at the Forte Foundation, joining us today from
Speaker 3: the annual Women's NBA Leadership Conference that is being held
Speaker 3: in Denver, Colorado. Alisa, good to have you here with us.
Speaker 3: Tell us about what you are hearing and what's top
Speaker 3: of mind in terms of some of the subjects at
Speaker 3: the conference, considering our backdrop, our macro backdrop when it
Speaker 3: comes to women and others in today's society and workplace.
Speaker 10: That's great, thanks, Carol. Yeah, it's wonderful to be here
Speaker 10: here at this NBA Women's Leadership Conference. We really are
Speaker 10: talking a lot about advancement for women. We're talking about
Speaker 10: the investment in that MBA. Many of the women attending
Speaker 10: are about to embark upon that journey in a full
Speaker 10: time MBA program, and they're excited about their potential for
Speaker 10: business leadership and looking forward to the next two years
Speaker 10: learning about that and building a network and community of
Speaker 10: other business leaders that they can move forward with into leadership.
Speaker 10: So it's a really great group that we've gathered.
Speaker 2: How's the pipeline looking right now. We spent some time
Speaker 2: at Cisco Live twenty twenty five earlier this week, and
Speaker 2: we spoke to Franktseutas, who handles a lot as an
Speaker 2: executive chief, People, Policy and Purpose officer at the company
Speaker 2: in addition to other roles too. And one question that
Speaker 2: we asked her was just about why there aren't more
Speaker 2: female executives right now in the C suite. I'm curious
Speaker 2: your thoughts on that.
Speaker 10: Sure, I think there's a lot of data from the
Speaker 10: NBA outcomes that we have here showing how women are
Speaker 10: lagging behind you. So, as usual, we've seen some mixed results.
Speaker 10: We know that that NBA is an investment that pays
Speaker 10: off in terms of salary by about fifty one percent
Speaker 10: increase for both men and women, but we also know
Speaker 10: that the pay gap narrows. And I think to your question,
Speaker 10: the things that we see in women post MBA. They
Speaker 10: have fewer direct reports, they have a budget that is
Speaker 10: smaller that they manage compared to their male counterparts. They're
Speaker 10: not getting as many promotions, and they're you know, more
Speaker 10: levels away from the CEO. And I think all of
Speaker 10: those things are important for companies to track and pay
Speaker 10: attention to. So what is it that is holding women back,
Speaker 10: especially women nbas who are this great talent pool for
Speaker 10: future leadership? And business and companies need to, you know,
Speaker 10: really build systems that help to track and make sure
Speaker 10: there is a movement towards the top for those women.
Speaker 2: One thing that we wanted to talk to you about
Speaker 2: is what we've seen come from companies, at least publicly,
Speaker 2: in the wake of the way that these DEI programs
Speaker 2: have become essentially verbonden at these companies thanks to what
Speaker 2: the Trump administration has said publicly about them and in
Speaker 2: fact the way that he has tried to root out
Speaker 2: DEI programs. And what we've learned from our Bloomberg News
Speaker 2: reporting and from talking to folks is that, well, we're
Speaker 2: not necessarily changing the way that we're We're not necessarily
Speaker 2: changing this stuff a lot. What we're doing is we're
Speaker 2: changing the way that we talk about it. We're making
Speaker 2: these programs more inclusive. Maybe we're changing the names. What
Speaker 2: are you hearing and how does that affect your world?
Speaker 10: Yeah, it's a great question because over the years, we
Speaker 10: really have seen the pendulum swing from one end to
Speaker 10: the other and everywhere in between. And we're really focused
Speaker 10: as an organization, and I think many of the companies
Speaker 10: we talk to focused on inclusion, opportunity, for all. We
Speaker 10: spent yesterday talking a lot about how to make the
Speaker 10: systems fair and how to focus more on the outcomes
Speaker 10: of the work we're doing and creating these inclusive work
Speaker 10: environments where everyone does feel represented, valued, respected, and that
Speaker 10: that's important. And I think all companies and all employees
Speaker 10: want a place that as diverse perspectives and backgrounds, but
Speaker 10: they also want everyone to feel, as I said, respected
Speaker 10: and valued as they work every day, and that is
Speaker 10: for majority and minority groups.
Speaker 3: Melyssa, is it harder? I mean, in today's environment.
Speaker 8: It is harder. It's not.
Speaker 10: It's not impossible, and it's hard because you go every
Speaker 10: day and it feels maybe a little heavier than it
Speaker 10: used to feel. And no one wants to go to
Speaker 10: work feeling that kind of heaviness. But there's hope, and
Speaker 10: there's a way forward, and there's lots of great things
Speaker 10: that we can do, and not to dwell too much
Speaker 10: on the past, but to look to the future and
Speaker 10: how can we make things better, and how can we
Speaker 10: make things that adhere to the rules that are being
Speaker 10: put out there, but also that still get the good
Speaker 10: work done.
Speaker 3: Listen, So glad we could find some time to connect
Speaker 3: with you on what's been a super super busy day.
Speaker 3: Good luck with everything at the conference. Alissa Sangster. She's
Speaker 3: chief executive officer of Forte Foundation. Joining us from Denver, Colorado.
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