WEBVTT - What if? 0:00:02.920 --> 0:00:05.680 You are listening and waiting on reparations production of I 0:00:05.800 --> 0:00:12.959 Heart Radio. Yeah, it's waiting on reparations. It's obviously fresh 0:00:13.039 --> 0:00:16.239 the podcast where hippop and politics connect and acknowledge is 0:00:16.320 --> 0:00:18.920 the quest. Any scholarship you get, how could you forget? 0:00:19.040 --> 0:00:21.439 This level? Is acknowledge? You the best? Getting the mix 0:00:21.640 --> 0:00:24.279 stopped with all the relevant ship right wing is really 0:00:24.280 --> 0:00:26.840 thinking this a session? Is it? Body? Y'allma win? In 0:00:26.920 --> 0:00:29.800 real life? They never been hit. Dope Knife been six, 0:00:29.880 --> 0:00:32.320 has never been kissed. It's hip hop. But I'm like, 0:00:32.400 --> 0:00:34.560 how metal is this? But if you want to play 0:00:34.600 --> 0:00:37.040 the dozens, we can settle it quick. I get every 0:00:37.040 --> 0:00:40.480 rebound like whenever I missed the Dope Ama laugh plus 0:00:40.600 --> 0:00:51.080 yellow and Chips. Nick Yo name is Dope Knife And 0:00:51.120 --> 0:00:56.480 we are waiting on reparations. But you know, if slavery 0:00:56.640 --> 0:01:01.520 never ended, maybe you know we have nothing to wait for. Yeah, 0:01:01.800 --> 0:01:04.160 it's all good. We're still you know. That's a groom 0:01:04.200 --> 0:01:07.959 way to open up the ship, isn't it? Well? You know, 0:01:08.080 --> 0:01:10.200 how are you doing today? I'm good. I'm doing all right. 0:01:10.200 --> 0:01:12.360 It's rainy. It's rainy day here at the Georgia, But 0:01:12.680 --> 0:01:16.160 I can't really complain too much. How you do. I'm good. 0:01:16.200 --> 0:01:19.160 It's been thunderstorming off and on in Savannah for like 0:01:19.200 --> 0:01:22.200 the last week, so same sort of thing, you know 0:01:22.200 --> 0:01:23.959 what I mean. I don't feel like leaving the house. 0:01:24.280 --> 0:01:28.679 Climate change some day, drying up this field, the pain, 0:01:29.360 --> 0:01:31.760 you know what's crazy as the rain is going but 0:01:31.920 --> 0:01:35.959 it's still hot as ship. I know. I was like yo, 0:01:36.120 --> 0:01:38.600 in the South, it'd be raining and then some come 0:01:38.640 --> 0:01:41.280 out afterwards to just steam us like a bag of crabs. 0:01:42.840 --> 0:01:45.520 Every time I was walking into the store the other day, 0:01:45.520 --> 0:01:47.800 I couldn't tell if it was rain or like sweat 0:01:47.840 --> 0:01:51.160 pouring down on me. It's just the yeah, I mean, 0:01:51.280 --> 0:01:55.440 you just gotta go with the flow. So so today 0:01:55.600 --> 0:02:01.080 we're doing something a little different. Um, we're doing a 0:02:01.200 --> 0:02:04.560 movie review of a two thousand four film by the 0:02:04.640 --> 0:02:08.440 name of C s A The Confederate States of America. 0:02:09.160 --> 0:02:12.040 This is a movie that I saw back in college 0:02:12.680 --> 0:02:16.880 years ago, and I don't know, it's circulated throughout the 0:02:16.919 --> 0:02:22.040 crew and everybody. You know. It really was a subject 0:02:22.040 --> 0:02:25.280 of discussion amongst my you know, inner circle of friends 0:02:25.320 --> 0:02:27.480 and all of the people who saw it, and it's 0:02:27.520 --> 0:02:30.720 something that just as years went on, I never really 0:02:31.360 --> 0:02:35.680 understood why it wasn't not necessarily more popular, but just 0:02:35.960 --> 0:02:38.560 more known about considering that it was made in the 0:02:38.680 --> 0:02:43.239 era of the Chapelle Show, you know, and things like that, 0:02:43.320 --> 0:02:45.200 and you can definitely see in its humor that it 0:02:45.560 --> 0:02:49.720 is it isn't that I wonder why it never caught on. 0:02:49.760 --> 0:02:52.560 I mean, it's it's definitely has more of a serious 0:02:52.600 --> 0:02:55.079 tone than Chappell's show. But anyway, I know that we're 0:02:55.120 --> 0:02:56.560 we're talking about it and we're being kind of a 0:02:56.720 --> 0:02:58.720 but that's because we want to kind of go in 0:02:58.800 --> 0:03:01.520 depth and in it on this so we are going 0:03:01.600 --> 0:03:04.080 to explain to you the premise, the plot and everything, 0:03:04.120 --> 0:03:06.640 but just to give you a little synopsis of what's coming. 0:03:07.200 --> 0:03:12.080 This film is a mockumentary about retelling of American history 0:03:12.440 --> 0:03:16.400 if the Confederacy had won the Civil War. Oh and 0:03:16.440 --> 0:03:20.200 it's available. It's available on YouTube and various other streaming platforms, so, like, 0:03:20.760 --> 0:03:23.120 you know, check it out. We do get a little 0:03:23.120 --> 0:03:25.640 spoilery in our discussion, but I don't think it ruins 0:03:25.680 --> 0:03:29.320 the film because like it's worth it for the way 0:03:29.320 --> 0:03:32.640 the humorous instantiated. Like, well, we're talking through some of 0:03:32.680 --> 0:03:35.000 the plot points, but it's still very much worth it 0:03:35.080 --> 0:03:39.040 for the chapels. Yeah, and the way that I mean, 0:03:39.080 --> 0:03:42.040 I guarantee you that what we're the things that we 0:03:42.080 --> 0:03:44.480 do go in depth on. It's not even scratching the 0:03:44.520 --> 0:03:47.520 surface of how much there is in the movie, you 0:03:47.520 --> 0:03:49.080 know what I mean to sink your teeth into. So 0:03:49.240 --> 0:03:51.720 we're just it's something that i'd I'd been wanting to 0:03:51.720 --> 0:03:55.920 get Maria to check out for years just because you know, 0:03:56.600 --> 0:03:58.840 you hadn't heard of it. It was again, it was like, damn, yeah, 0:03:58.960 --> 0:04:00.840 I think this would definitely be something that you would 0:04:00.840 --> 0:04:03.320 find interesting, you know. So we're gonna talk about that 0:04:03.960 --> 0:04:08.560 and more after Oh no, no, no, I forgot Um yeah, well, 0:04:08.560 --> 0:04:12.280 I mean the uh, I guess the inception point for 0:04:12.400 --> 0:04:15.320 this whole thing was based off of a pole that 0:04:15.400 --> 0:04:18.040 I recently heard about. It was a new you gov 0:04:18.120 --> 0:04:22.240 poll that revealed that sixty six percent of Southern Republicans 0:04:22.560 --> 0:04:26.080 support secession. According to the results, a fair share of Democrats, 0:04:26.120 --> 0:04:29.800 independence and Republicans in different regions can't imagine leaving the 0:04:29.839 --> 0:04:32.800 US to join a smaller union. Um, and I think 0:04:32.880 --> 0:04:35.920 of it. It's potentially a positive thing. Um. But an 0:04:36.000 --> 0:04:38.479 only one region, the South, did a majority of one 0:04:38.520 --> 0:04:41.800 group come out and strongly in favor. I was six 0:04:42.400 --> 0:04:46.560 of Southern Republicans approving of the idea of a secession 0:04:46.560 --> 0:04:51.320 of Southern Chane. The thing is, I can remember, you know, 0:04:51.400 --> 0:04:53.840 we all thought it was when when I saw this 0:04:53.920 --> 0:04:56.320 movie with my friends back in the day, we all 0:04:56.360 --> 0:04:58.480 thought it was funny. We all thought it was pointed 0:04:58.480 --> 0:05:00.520 and sharp and and made a lot good points and 0:05:00.600 --> 0:05:02.920 with a good commentary and all that stuff. But there 0:05:03.000 --> 0:05:08.599 was still definitely a there was a fantastical element about it, 0:05:08.880 --> 0:05:10.960 you know what I mean. There was there was definitely 0:05:11.000 --> 0:05:14.599 a like, damn, that would be crazy if that happened. 0:05:15.560 --> 0:05:20.120 And now, almost twenty years later, thinking about it, it's like, damn, 0:05:21.760 --> 0:05:25.040 this feels like it feels like we could get there. 0:05:25.680 --> 0:05:28.479 Not not likely, but it just feels like a lot 0:05:28.520 --> 0:05:30.880 more probable of a thing in the movie. It makes 0:05:30.920 --> 0:05:32.880 the movie seem a lot more grip to me when 0:05:32.920 --> 0:05:35.360 I watched, like watching it now for this for this review, 0:05:35.440 --> 0:05:37.120 it's like on a point, you do hear a lot 0:05:37.160 --> 0:05:39.320 of libs, Like on the internet you see those maps 0:05:39.320 --> 0:05:41.880 of like okay, if you had to pick four states 0:05:41.920 --> 0:05:44.880 to seceed with four contiguous states, you know what states 0:05:44.880 --> 0:05:48.159 would you pick? Or like, oh, let's break off the 0:05:48.200 --> 0:05:52.840 South from the rest of from the coasts or whatever 0:05:52.920 --> 0:05:56.200 and like join with Canada like this dream of like 0:05:56.320 --> 0:05:58.640 let's just like get away from racism. Let's just like 0:05:59.240 --> 0:06:05.039 essentially most black people to exactly the Republican overlords in 0:06:05.080 --> 0:06:08.960 the Red States where we you know, generationally, you know, 0:06:09.640 --> 0:06:13.440 it's not a yeah, it's not a good thing. You know, 0:06:13.760 --> 0:06:15.520 it's not a good thing. And it's it's something you 0:06:15.520 --> 0:06:18.400 hear both sides entertained as like a Nana Nanni boo boo. 0:06:18.800 --> 0:06:21.600 Like even if it wasn't that, like, even if it 0:06:21.680 --> 0:06:27.159 wasn't on that like lib fear raging ship, it would 0:06:27.160 --> 0:06:29.680 still be like a fucked up sentiment because like you said, 0:06:29.720 --> 0:06:33.240 it's like, well, you know, I guess everybody who lives there, 0:06:33.320 --> 0:06:35.880 we can just abandon them and it's all good, you 0:06:35.880 --> 0:06:37.479 know what I mean. I know that's not what we 0:06:37.520 --> 0:06:39.440 meant black people can come to. It's like, oh, I'm 0:06:39.440 --> 0:06:42.159 glad that we were the afterthought in your dream of 0:06:43.400 --> 0:06:46.800 just leaving behind your problems rather than confronting and addressing them, 0:06:46.800 --> 0:06:50.400 which is just like liberal wed dream. But anyway, yeah, 0:06:50.720 --> 0:06:53.360 well we're gonna get into this. Flix c s A 0:06:53.920 --> 0:07:03.920 and more after the jump. All right, we are back, 0:07:04.360 --> 0:07:08.920 so c s A the Confederate States of America. It's 0:07:09.000 --> 0:07:13.000 a two thousand four movie that's mockumentary that was directed 0:07:13.000 --> 0:07:16.240 by Kevin Wilmot, who's the writer and director and is 0:07:16.400 --> 0:07:20.880 long focused on black issues in his works. He's collaborated 0:07:20.880 --> 0:07:23.440 with Spike Lee often, and they share an OSCAR for 0:07:23.520 --> 0:07:27.320 Best Original Screenplay for the twenty nineteen movie Black Klansmen. 0:07:27.720 --> 0:07:30.360 Spike Lee is also a producer on this flick. Have 0:07:30.440 --> 0:07:35.040 you seen Black? I have not, you know, if I 0:07:35.480 --> 0:07:38.120 had tried and I fell asleep or something. I'm tripping 0:07:38.920 --> 0:07:42.040 admittedly because like I don't think I've seen Spike Lee's 0:07:42.240 --> 0:07:45.680 last three joints. In general, I'm not a huge movie watcher. 0:07:45.920 --> 0:07:48.400 Um So I'll use that as my excuse. But I mean, 0:07:48.400 --> 0:07:50.120 you watch a lot of horror movies, or at least 0:07:50.120 --> 0:07:52.160 when usually when I do see you watching movies, you're 0:07:52.160 --> 0:07:57.840 watching like so this movie was perfect. Um So, it's 0:07:57.840 --> 0:08:00.080 a it's an alternate history, as we said that for 0:08:00.160 --> 0:08:03.360 the jump, and where in the Confederacy wins the Civil 0:08:03.440 --> 0:08:07.600 War and establishes a new Confederate States of America that 0:08:07.680 --> 0:08:12.240 incorporates the majority of the Western hemisphere, including the contiguous 0:08:12.480 --> 0:08:15.680 United States as well as the Golden Circle, UM, Caribbean 0:08:15.720 --> 0:08:19.600 and South America. And it details the history of you know, 0:08:19.880 --> 0:08:24.360 significant political and cultural events UM in these Confederate States 0:08:24.400 --> 0:08:26.520 in America from its founding up until the early two 0:08:26.520 --> 0:08:30.040 thousand's UM and the viewpoint is used to kind of 0:08:30.080 --> 0:08:33.079 satirize real life issues and events and shed light on 0:08:33.120 --> 0:08:37.360 the continuing existence of discrimination in American culture. Now, the 0:08:37.440 --> 0:08:42.440 thing that separates this from other mockumentaries is, I guess 0:08:42.480 --> 0:08:45.480 I would have to say, is the perspective that it's 0:08:45.520 --> 0:08:48.320 told in. So it's it's brought to you as if 0:08:48.880 --> 0:08:52.560 it's a British documentary. Like just imagine like a sort 0:08:52.559 --> 0:08:56.480 of BBC type of channel, and imagine that you're watching 0:08:56.480 --> 0:09:00.440 that and on this BBC channel, you're there's a documentary 0:09:00.520 --> 0:09:02.880 about the history of the United States, So like you're 0:09:02.880 --> 0:09:06.080 in England and you're watching some about American history over 0:09:06.120 --> 0:09:09.880 there that you know, BBC produced production. And in in 0:09:09.960 --> 0:09:12.480 between it, you know that that's kind of the perspective 0:09:12.520 --> 0:09:15.199 that is told in. So you're watching, you know, television 0:09:15.600 --> 0:09:19.200 in this world where the Confederacy has taken over so 0:09:19.440 --> 0:09:23.280 interrupting the program you're watching. You have these commercial breaks 0:09:23.480 --> 0:09:25.719 that we're gonna get into later on, but it's it's 0:09:25.720 --> 0:09:30.400 showing you what I guess advertising and marketing would be 0:09:30.679 --> 0:09:33.839 in a white supremacist slave culture. And then it has 0:09:33.880 --> 0:09:35.720 two talking heads that sort of provide a lot of 0:09:35.720 --> 0:09:39.120 the narration for the film. There's Sherman Hoyle, who, um, 0:09:39.160 --> 0:09:40.640 I guess it is is supposed to be a parody of 0:09:40.679 --> 0:09:43.599 this dude, Shelby Foote, who was sort of a historian 0:09:43.920 --> 0:09:49.120 that was a leader with the you know, um, the 0:09:49.280 --> 0:09:54.679 Lost Cause movement of like, oh, you know, the the 0:09:54.840 --> 0:09:58.240 heroism of those that fought for the Confederacy, and then 0:09:58.240 --> 0:10:01.800 now it wasn't all about slavery, that whole branch of 0:10:01.800 --> 0:10:06.200 of history, making um, the attempt to arrest control of 0:10:06.280 --> 0:10:10.080 the narrative away from the linus UM. And so these 0:10:10.080 --> 0:10:12.120 are conservative seven are given his take. And then on 0:10:12.160 --> 0:10:15.920 the other hand, you've got a black Canadian professor, Patricia 0:10:16.040 --> 0:10:22.160 Johnson UM providing commentary throughout the film. UM. And then 0:10:22.280 --> 0:10:27.240 you've got this dude, John Ambroise spawn Troy, great grandson 0:10:27.280 --> 0:10:29.000 of one of them men that helped found the cis A. 0:10:29.800 --> 0:10:34.120 It's also interviewed and what's interesting is the narration UM 0:10:34.320 --> 0:10:39.120 explains the fake historical news real footage UM which is 0:10:39.120 --> 0:10:43.679 either acted acted out or made of genuine archival footage 0:10:43.720 --> 0:10:47.080 dubbed with fictional narration, which I found really entertaining. And 0:10:47.200 --> 0:10:49.120 one of the things one of the reviews that I 0:10:49.160 --> 0:10:52.120 read about this film is it was kind of like 0:10:52.160 --> 0:10:54.920 a critical review, but they were just saying this film 0:10:55.000 --> 0:10:59.800 suffered because the budget was very low. Yeah, it was 0:10:59.800 --> 0:11:02.720 like they were making the point that it made it 0:11:02.720 --> 0:11:07.760 seem a lot maybe more hokey or more satirical than 0:11:07.200 --> 0:11:11.040 I actually think the budget in that sense that you 0:11:11.160 --> 0:11:13.400 just made up or that you just pointed out. I 0:11:13.440 --> 0:11:15.760 think the budget helped it out because some of those 0:11:16.920 --> 0:11:20.800 scenes where they have like archival footage next to their 0:11:20.840 --> 0:11:25.040 stuff that's like re enacted. Because the budget is low, 0:11:25.360 --> 0:11:28.520 the quality of the film makes it like blended. So 0:11:28.559 --> 0:11:31.400 it's like, oh, man, is that you know what I mean? 0:11:31.440 --> 0:11:33.640 Like for a second, you're like, is that really a 0:11:33.760 --> 0:11:35.800 video of Abraham Lincoln? Like you know what I mean? 0:11:35.840 --> 0:11:38.000 Like that really like an old video of Abraham Lincoln 0:11:38.000 --> 0:11:41.960 like talking, because it looks like actually Grady photo video 0:11:42.160 --> 0:11:44.679 next to like these old Civil War photos and stuff. 0:11:44.720 --> 0:11:46.439 Like that. I thought that I thought that helped it. It 0:11:46.400 --> 0:11:48.480 It made it look genuine. I think I think it 0:11:48.520 --> 0:11:50.880 holds up. I mean I think that thinking back to 0:11:51.000 --> 0:11:53.640 like the History Channel documentaries and ship that I saw 0:11:53.720 --> 0:11:55.520 him when I was a kid, maybe late you know, 0:11:55.600 --> 0:11:59.240 late nineties, etcetera, this is very I mean it's very similar, 0:12:00.200 --> 0:12:02.200 very similar, at least in the way it looks. And 0:12:02.240 --> 0:12:05.360 so I don't know, I don't think that um pretty 0:12:05.360 --> 0:12:08.559 good the critique stance, But you'll be the judge. I 0:12:08.640 --> 0:12:11.240 can check it out after you listened to this episode. 0:12:11.640 --> 0:12:14.480 Kevin Wilmot brgan production on the film with funding from 0:12:14.480 --> 0:12:20.080 the National Black Programming Consuscordia, or the NBPC, and he 0:12:20.120 --> 0:12:24.280 wrote the first draft. He had earlier written a screenplay 0:12:24.320 --> 0:12:27.440 about abolitionist John Brown, and he told interviewers he was 0:12:27.480 --> 0:12:30.520 inspired to write the story after seeing an episode of 0:12:30.520 --> 0:12:34.360 the ken Burns nineteen nineties documentary The Civil War. I've 0:12:34.400 --> 0:12:37.679 never seen that documentary view No, I have not. Actually 0:12:38.280 --> 0:12:41.600 I've seen the Vietnam one that ken Burns did. That's 0:12:41.640 --> 0:12:44.520 like a famous one. So let's get into some of 0:12:44.520 --> 0:12:48.640 the things that kind of stand out about this film 0:12:48.760 --> 0:12:50.600 to you, Like, what were your somebody what were your 0:12:50.679 --> 0:12:54.600 initial just first and foremost, since I finally got you 0:12:54.600 --> 0:12:58.680 to see it, what's your initial like thoughts about the movie? Well, 0:12:58.720 --> 0:13:01.720 and watching it, you know, I was aware that it 0:13:01.760 --> 0:13:07.080 was intended to satirize and sort of um speculate about 0:13:07.160 --> 0:13:10.800 what if with a lot of American history had the 0:13:10.840 --> 0:13:14.760 Confederacy one. But as I was watching it, I was like, Yo, 0:13:14.920 --> 0:13:18.480 some of this kind of like did happen though, like 0:13:18.600 --> 0:13:22.400 in real life, like for real, for real um, particularly 0:13:22.480 --> 0:13:27.719 as I was thinking about like um um the so 0:13:27.920 --> 0:13:30.559 um in the film, they the Confederacy goes on to 0:13:30.640 --> 0:13:35.080 conquer not only the contiguos United States, but Cuba, South America. 0:13:35.320 --> 0:13:40.240 They build a wall between America and Canada, the Cotton Curtain, um, 0:13:40.400 --> 0:13:44.280 to to to separate the abolitionists and the runaway slaves 0:13:44.360 --> 0:13:47.000 from you know, those territory in which slavery is illegal. 0:13:47.600 --> 0:13:51.079 But thinking about like the conquests that they undertake of 0:13:51.160 --> 0:13:56.080 Latin America to sort of spread their capitalists ideology, I mean, 0:13:56.120 --> 0:13:59.960 you know, like using humans as capital um. I was like, Yo, 0:14:00.240 --> 0:14:03.760 that's sort of like real ship though, because if you 0:14:03.760 --> 0:14:09.720 you know, study the history of US Latin American relations, um, 0:14:09.800 --> 0:14:16.199 we've been involved in like regime change in Argentina, Bolivia, Brazil, Chile, 0:14:16.480 --> 0:14:22.280 Costa Rica, Cuba, the Dominican Republic, El Salvador, Guatemala, pretty 0:14:22.360 --> 0:14:26.240 much every single country. Uh, then you can name if 0:14:26.240 --> 0:14:27.880 you throw a guard at a map, you hit a 0:14:27.880 --> 0:14:32.840 country where the CIA and you know, US backed forces 0:14:33.160 --> 0:14:38.080 have been involved in the destabilization of democratically elected governments, um. 0:14:38.200 --> 0:14:41.680 Such so that um, you know, we can continue to 0:14:43.440 --> 0:14:47.800 you know, exploit their resources, UM so that you know, 0:14:47.920 --> 0:14:51.880 socialism or other forms of organizing the economy don't take 0:14:51.920 --> 0:14:54.080 on and then get exported to other countries. When people 0:14:54.080 --> 0:14:56.120 are like that actually works out really well, they're like 0:14:56.160 --> 0:14:58.080 they come in, it's like, nope, we're gonna make sure 0:14:58.120 --> 0:15:03.200 that you're working classes are held as chattel. Um by 0:15:03.360 --> 0:15:07.400 coming in and there militarily or covertly through espionage another 0:15:07.480 --> 0:15:12.280 means like I think com neoliberalism. Yeah, it feels like 0:15:12.320 --> 0:15:15.080 that's the point of the movie kind of show that. 0:15:16.120 --> 0:15:18.920 It's kind of like showing that just because the mask 0:15:19.920 --> 0:15:23.560 was on doesn't like differentiate the actions, you know what 0:15:23.560 --> 0:15:27.160 I'm saying. So it's like it shows you how this 0:15:27.560 --> 0:15:31.160 how the Confederacy one and just continued on this like 0:15:31.520 --> 0:15:35.920 white supremacist sort of agenda. But it was just like 0:15:36.000 --> 0:15:38.680 open face because it's like, hey, we're the Confederacy, you 0:15:38.720 --> 0:15:41.400 know what I mean, we got But then when you 0:15:41.440 --> 0:15:45.120 think about it in parallel to how history actually played out, 0:15:45.160 --> 0:15:47.600 it's like, oh, wait, we were doing the same white 0:15:47.600 --> 0:15:50.240 supremacist thing. We just weren't calling it that, and you 0:15:50.280 --> 0:15:51.880 know what I mean, And that just we just weren't 0:15:51.880 --> 0:15:55.160 being open with the ship. Yeah. And as an abolitionist myself, 0:15:55.200 --> 0:15:59.840 I mean, like my key, my like core political framework 0:16:00.520 --> 0:16:03.520 is the come stemps in the belief that slavery was 0:16:03.560 --> 0:16:06.920 not abolished, like with reconstructions failure, with a pull out 0:16:06.920 --> 0:16:09.160 of Northern troops from the South during the period of 0:16:09.640 --> 0:16:15.520 economic um they're rebuilding the South economically, our failure to 0:16:15.640 --> 0:16:19.560 provide um stable supports and protections for people of color 0:16:19.640 --> 0:16:23.800 during that period um, and and the way that our 0:16:23.960 --> 0:16:28.320 you know, our criminal justice apparatus apparatuses were restructured to 0:16:28.480 --> 0:16:31.960 maintain social control, like that stuff never ended. And so 0:16:32.040 --> 0:16:34.200 I think that I mean, from that lens, like a 0:16:34.240 --> 0:16:36.920 lot of what they portrayed the movie, if it very 0:16:37.000 --> 0:16:39.360 much fits into that, was like white supremacy ultimately still 0:16:39.360 --> 0:16:43.280 one even if slavery was nominally abolished in the form 0:16:43.320 --> 0:16:47.400 of like, you know, chattel ownership of of humans. So 0:16:47.480 --> 0:16:50.080 let's let me give a little, just a little like 0:16:50.240 --> 0:16:54.880 bullet point timeline of how they have events sort of happened, right, 0:16:54.960 --> 0:16:58.000 So the Civil War happens for all of the reasons 0:16:58.000 --> 0:17:01.120 of the Civil War happens. But in in the film, 0:17:01.200 --> 0:17:05.720 the South decides to like decidedly declare that the Civil 0:17:05.760 --> 0:17:08.920 War is about states rights. Like that's there. That's their 0:17:08.920 --> 0:17:12.280 main propaganda push is that it states rights instead of 0:17:12.680 --> 0:17:14.960 you know, just openly being like we're fighting for the 0:17:15.040 --> 0:17:21.239 right to preserve slavery. So this, well, I mean, you know, 0:17:21.280 --> 0:17:25.480 the ambiguity of it is strategy. So them doing that 0:17:25.720 --> 0:17:29.440 then opens the way for Europe I guess feel good 0:17:29.440 --> 0:17:32.000 with getting involved at this point. For example, in the 0:17:32.000 --> 0:17:34.720 movie The Battle of the Battle of Gettysburg, it's the 0:17:34.760 --> 0:17:38.639 Northern troops that fighting the Confederacy, but also French troops 0:17:38.640 --> 0:17:41.440 and British troops and stuff like that. The Confederacy ends 0:17:41.520 --> 0:17:44.159 up winning. This leads to a chain of events like 0:17:44.280 --> 0:17:47.120 Abraham Lincoln getting exiled and then he has to run 0:17:47.119 --> 0:17:51.080 away to Canada where he dies. Um Harriet Tubman gets 0:17:51.200 --> 0:17:55.360 gets found and they execute her. They do a they 0:17:55.400 --> 0:18:00.480 do like a Northern Northern reconstruction where they pretty much 0:18:00.480 --> 0:18:03.880 go in and then implement slavery throughout the nation, so 0:18:04.240 --> 0:18:08.000 that in turn makes this giant fascist state that yeah, 0:18:08.080 --> 0:18:11.440 they like offered tax credits for like Northerners to get them, 0:18:11.600 --> 0:18:14.960 to incentivise them to own slaves, and even got a picture. 0:18:15.080 --> 0:18:20.719 You're like, well, you know, this government benefit makes it 0:18:20.840 --> 0:18:25.320 very lucrative. I mean, I don't know, I can get 0:18:25.320 --> 0:18:28.159 a picture it. Hey, here's what I can picture, right, 0:18:28.440 --> 0:18:34.520 and this is this is what I can picture. Okay, 0:18:34.520 --> 0:18:37.520 So seventy five million people voted for Donald Trump, right, 0:18:38.160 --> 0:18:42.520 mm hmm. I feel like if Donald Trump looked dead, 0:18:43.040 --> 0:18:46.919 dead eyed in the camera tomorrow was like, yo, we 0:18:46.960 --> 0:18:50.560 need to bring back slavery. I kind of think that 0:18:50.760 --> 0:18:54.280 at least seventy million people would still vote for Donald Trump. Well, 0:18:54.280 --> 0:18:57.000 they'd be a little yeah there, There'd bet million would 0:18:57.000 --> 0:18:58.920 be like, oh, that was a deep fake. I don't 0:18:58.920 --> 0:19:02.920 believe that he's a good guy. And then another are 0:19:03.000 --> 0:19:07.360 probably like, yeah, let's do it. Other historical things that 0:19:07.440 --> 0:19:09.560 you know they portrayed the film that we're not too 0:19:09.600 --> 0:19:12.359 far off from reality. Um, I think in World War 0:19:12.400 --> 0:19:16.840 Two they go America goes to fight the Nazis, but 0:19:16.960 --> 0:19:22.240 not because um, they want but because they prefer that 0:19:22.240 --> 0:19:27.119 the Jews be enslaved rather than yeah, exterminated. Yeah, because 0:19:27.320 --> 0:19:33.280 because we're this uh giant Confederate fascist state that's taken 0:19:33.320 --> 0:19:39.840 over um, South America and has their hands rooted in everything. 0:19:39.880 --> 0:19:43.480 And also they're about some right supremacy ship. The Confederacy 0:19:43.600 --> 0:19:47.520 allies with Hitler, and while he's getting ready to do 0:19:47.920 --> 0:19:51.640 the Holocaust, they suggest to him this character who's kind 0:19:51.640 --> 0:19:54.800 of his generation. This character font Roy, is kind of 0:19:54.840 --> 0:19:57.359 a recurring character throughout the movie, like in the different 0:19:57.359 --> 0:20:00.240 generations of his families are Like you see him in 0:20:00.280 --> 0:20:02.720 the Construction of the Confederate State, and then you see 0:20:02.720 --> 0:20:07.840 his grandson who's running for office now. But that senator, 0:20:07.840 --> 0:20:12.399 that congressman. He suggests to Hitler, a, you know, you 0:20:12.440 --> 0:20:15.520 should enslave the Jews instead of killing them. So then 0:20:15.600 --> 0:20:21.240 that leads to access power that includes the US and Germany, 0:20:21.320 --> 0:20:26.240 and then we end up invading Japan prematurely and taking 0:20:26.280 --> 0:20:29.200 that over. It's it's crazy, man. I mean the whole thing, 0:20:29.280 --> 0:20:31.960 the way that I'm describing it is almost sounds like 0:20:32.040 --> 0:20:35.800 it's a fucking like sci fi thriller and ship like that. 0:20:35.880 --> 0:20:37.919 It's very much, you know, done in the style of 0:20:37.920 --> 0:20:40.800 a documentary. But I think that the ideas they're dealing with, 0:20:41.520 --> 0:20:43.000 it's just there's just so much there, you know what 0:20:43.040 --> 0:20:44.480 I'm saying. When you just think of it from a 0:20:44.560 --> 0:20:48.840 story standpoint, the it's really a cool work in world 0:20:48.880 --> 0:20:51.679 building because they really thought of every aspect of how 0:20:51.760 --> 0:20:54.399 history would play out. And I think it's a number 0:20:54.400 --> 0:20:56.400 of parallels here, but one that popped out to me 0:20:57.000 --> 0:21:00.560 was that the Confederate recruited slaves voluntarily released by their 0:21:00.560 --> 0:21:03.520 owners for military service as soldiers by and promised them 0:21:03.520 --> 0:21:07.280 their freedom after the war and exchanged for fighting I promise, 0:21:07.320 --> 0:21:09.280 which turned out to be a lie. And that this 0:21:09.400 --> 0:21:12.320 does not stray too too far from the reality of 0:21:12.359 --> 0:21:16.159 black veterans returning for more, whether it be within the 0:21:16.240 --> 0:21:19.679 promises made by the g I bill, UM for mortgages, 0:21:19.960 --> 0:21:23.800 for access to higher education, UM. The g I Bills 0:21:23.880 --> 0:21:28.119 language didn't specifically exclude African American veterans, but it was 0:21:28.160 --> 0:21:31.959 structured in a way that ultimately shut out I think 0:21:32.040 --> 0:21:35.679 like one point two million black veterans that served in 0:21:35.840 --> 0:21:39.040 the world War two who served in resegregator ranks by 0:21:39.080 --> 0:21:41.720 the way, UM, and so they actually used some of 0:21:41.720 --> 0:21:44.560 the tactics that had previously been used with the New 0:21:44.640 --> 0:21:48.320 Deal to ensure that UM. The g I Bill helped 0:21:48.359 --> 0:21:51.920 a few black people as possible. UM. You know, for example, 0:21:52.040 --> 0:21:55.320 some couldn't access benefits when they got home because they 0:21:55.320 --> 0:21:58.879 had not been given an honorable discharge. UM. A much 0:21:59.000 --> 0:22:02.040 larger number of black Urrans who were discharged were discharged 0:22:02.080 --> 0:22:06.160 dishonorably than their white counterparts. As well, UM, a number 0:22:06.200 --> 0:22:09.679 of veterans UM who did qualify couldn't find facilities that 0:22:09.760 --> 0:22:13.360 delivered on the bill's promise. For example, black veterans UM 0:22:13.480 --> 0:22:16.679 or offered access to a vocational training program, but the 0:22:16.720 --> 0:22:18.440 only place to get it was at a segregated high 0:22:18.480 --> 0:22:21.959 school and in the and then for in this specific example, 0:22:22.160 --> 0:22:27.080 it was in Indianapolis, UM because because they weren't allow 0:22:27.119 --> 0:22:28.879 because they weren't allowed to use the facilities. Because if 0:22:29.160 --> 0:22:34.160 there's a segregate UM and then intimidation from the public, 0:22:34.560 --> 0:22:37.399 you know, MOB rules also leverage to discourage black veterans 0:22:37.440 --> 0:22:40.480 from taking advantage of the benefits they were promised. UM. 0:22:40.520 --> 0:22:45.119 For example, in a crowd hurled rocks at black veterans 0:22:45.160 --> 0:22:48.840 as they were moved into a Chicago housing development. And 0:22:48.880 --> 0:22:51.400 you know, thousands and thousands of black veterans were attacked 0:22:51.400 --> 0:22:54.200 in the years following World War Two. UM, some were 0:22:54.200 --> 0:22:57.960 singled out and lynch and so just like street violence, 0:22:58.040 --> 0:23:02.399 in addition to you know aarious uh you're bureaucratic or 0:23:02.440 --> 0:23:06.040 other otherwise you know, policy means used to actually ensured 0:23:06.080 --> 0:23:09.840 that like yelling, get shit. UM. And then uh, the 0:23:09.880 --> 0:23:13.000 discussion of Interestingly, this is a theme that's carried through 0:23:13.040 --> 0:23:16.320 and some of Spike Lee's work, UM, the Five Bloods 0:23:16.359 --> 0:23:20.119 that came out into UM talks a lot about actually 0:23:20.160 --> 0:23:22.200 the focus of the film is a black federalist treatment 0:23:22.200 --> 0:23:26.840 returning from Vietnam UM, which also UM in my study, 0:23:26.840 --> 0:23:29.080 I've been reading the hub P Newton Reader, and UM, 0:23:29.119 --> 0:23:32.240 it seems like, particularly the Vietnam conflict. While it doesn't 0:23:32.240 --> 0:23:35.280 really like the factor in the film here, this idea 0:23:35.320 --> 0:23:37.880 that all you go fight you know, abroad and come 0:23:37.920 --> 0:23:41.040 back and to you know, a better life, because well yeah, 0:23:41.200 --> 0:23:43.280 but you really come back to being a slave. UM 0:23:43.400 --> 0:23:47.400