WEBVTT - Cryfest 0:00:01.880 --> 0:00:06.520 Wine Down with Jane Kramer and I Heart Radio podcast. Okay, 0:00:06.519 --> 0:00:11.720 well I'm back in Nashville, UM, and I have to 0:00:11.760 --> 0:00:14.240 be honest with y'all. I feel like I'm having a 0:00:14.240 --> 0:00:20.200 little mini breakdown. UM. I think it's interesting to go 0:00:20.640 --> 0:00:24.040 from Well, first of all, i've been for the last month. 0:00:24.079 --> 0:00:27.800 I've been in Connecticut filming and it was such an 0:00:27.840 --> 0:00:31.480 amazing experience. UM. It's a Christmas movie. I can't say 0:00:31.480 --> 0:00:35.280 the title yet, but it's coming out UH later this 0:00:35.360 --> 0:00:39.960 year in December for UM one of the Lifetime movies. UM. 0:00:40.000 --> 0:00:44.280 And it was such a fun experience, and I think 0:00:44.520 --> 0:00:49.840 coming back from that world has been a harder transition 0:00:49.840 --> 0:00:51.080 than I thought it was going to be. Like I 0:00:51.200 --> 0:00:55.520 knew amazing. Hillary just popped down, So this is awesome. UM. 0:00:55.960 --> 0:00:59.200 I texted my UH producer and was like, I need 0:00:59.240 --> 0:01:02.120 a therapist and I need a stat like stat So 0:01:02.520 --> 0:01:05.800 thank you Hillary for for for coming on and joining. 0:01:05.880 --> 0:01:09.360 I was just kind of saying like, obviously I talked 0:01:09.360 --> 0:01:13.120 to you when I was in Connecticut, and I knew 0:01:13.200 --> 0:01:15.240 like it was gonna be weird kind of coming home, 0:01:15.319 --> 0:01:17.559 but it today it just hit me like a ton 0:01:17.600 --> 0:01:20.959 of bricks and was like and I don't know if 0:01:21.000 --> 0:01:23.039 it was because I was in a world where it 0:01:23.120 --> 0:01:28.080 was just this bubble of like positive energy and um, 0:01:28.120 --> 0:01:30.840 you know, positive people around me, and I was working 0:01:31.000 --> 0:01:34.640 and I didn't. I wasn't in that reality. Even when 0:01:36.400 --> 0:01:41.480 you know, um, the divorce was finalized, I still had 0:01:41.520 --> 0:01:43.840 to I I cried about it, but then I had 0:01:43.880 --> 0:01:45.759 to go, Okay, I have to walk into work now. 0:01:45.800 --> 0:01:47.600 So now I have to button up really fast and 0:01:47.920 --> 0:01:51.680 go to work and then coming home and obviously I'm 0:01:51.720 --> 0:01:53.680 so happy to be back with the kids. But it's 0:01:53.760 --> 0:01:56.360 just like, oh crap, like this is my reality, not 0:01:56.560 --> 0:02:00.360 the reality of like being in this amazing movie with 0:02:00.480 --> 0:02:03.840 really positive energy. So how do I walk through that? 0:02:03.880 --> 0:02:06.800 Because I feel like I'm like, I mean, I just 0:02:06.960 --> 0:02:10.040 had a total cry fast about thirty minutes ago. Just 0:02:10.160 --> 0:02:13.680 like it's just it's weird. I don't I don't even 0:02:13.720 --> 0:02:15.160 know how to like put it. Does it even make 0:02:15.200 --> 0:02:18.639 sense what I'm saying? Yeah, I mean to me, you're 0:02:18.680 --> 0:02:23.200 talking about this like very painful but very authentic kind 0:02:23.240 --> 0:02:27.040 of coexistence of these two truths I mean, which is 0:02:27.080 --> 0:02:32.040 that you're in the middle of this terrible deep grief 0:02:32.120 --> 0:02:36.360 and mourning, which is going to keep evolving, and evolution 0:02:36.400 --> 0:02:40.480 doesn't just mean it gets better and more positive and easier. 0:02:40.560 --> 0:02:43.400 It also means that you have dark knights of the 0:02:43.440 --> 0:02:47.360 soul where it feels unbearable, and there's certain moments or 0:02:47.680 --> 0:02:51.120 seasons or events or circumstances that will kind of bring 0:02:51.160 --> 0:02:54.280 that to bear. And I just want to offer that, like, 0:02:55.000 --> 0:02:57.920 even though obviously the movie set can't be your literal 0:02:58.040 --> 0:03:00.680 reality and it has some you know, low the aspects 0:03:00.680 --> 0:03:03.640 to it that aren't like, um, you know, scalable on 0:03:03.680 --> 0:03:06.360 a day to day basis, both are true. You know 0:03:06.480 --> 0:03:11.519 that you have this lovely, amazing professional life and these wonderful, 0:03:11.639 --> 0:03:15.920 supportive group of friends, um that lift you up, and 0:03:16.520 --> 0:03:20.480 in their presence you fly, you know, and you you 0:03:20.520 --> 0:03:22.760 get a glimpse of yourself like sort of in this 0:03:23.160 --> 0:03:26.640 other new way. And that's as true as the grief 0:03:26.840 --> 0:03:29.760 that you experienced when you came home, I'm sure and 0:03:29.840 --> 0:03:32.400 felt the emptiness of the house in a profound way 0:03:32.480 --> 0:03:36.120 and the change in your lifestyle in a really deep way. 0:03:36.760 --> 0:03:39.680 And and so I don't know if if we're in 0:03:39.720 --> 0:03:42.240 a position where we can just make the grief get better, 0:03:42.440 --> 0:03:46.120 but at least to widen the perspective around that just 0:03:46.200 --> 0:03:49.720 like both are true deep grief, deep grief and like 0:03:49.920 --> 0:03:55.600 deep precious growth. You know that just both are true. Yeah, 0:03:55.640 --> 0:03:57.600 and I love that and I hear that, and I 0:03:57.640 --> 0:04:03.960 also we're fat being said, how do I like, I'm like, 0:04:07.400 --> 0:04:11.800 will I get to a place where this doesn't affect 0:04:11.920 --> 0:04:14.640 me as much? Because it's like I would love to 0:04:14.680 --> 0:04:16.799 get out of the space. I was reading some comments 0:04:16.800 --> 0:04:18.880 and people were like, I'm so sick of hearing about 0:04:19.360 --> 0:04:22.240 and I'm like, well, I'm sick of feeling it, you know, 0:04:22.440 --> 0:04:26.120 like uh so, And that's where you know, I got 0:04:26.279 --> 0:04:28.320 upset earlier today because I'm just like I don't even 0:04:28.400 --> 0:04:32.920 know what to talk about anymore, because I'm like, I 0:04:32.960 --> 0:04:34.680 obviously want to be authentic and I want to be 0:04:34.720 --> 0:04:36.560 open and I want to share, but I can only 0:04:36.720 --> 0:04:39.400 share certain things because I don't want my kids to 0:04:39.440 --> 0:04:41.440 read certain things. I don't want the press to pick 0:04:41.520 --> 0:04:44.240 up you know, how I really feel about my ex 0:04:44.360 --> 0:04:46.520 or like, you know, it's like there's so many things 0:04:46.520 --> 0:04:50.600 that I don't you know, I'm trying to keep everything kosher, 0:04:50.680 --> 0:04:53.240 but I'm inside I'm like battling all these things that 0:04:53.279 --> 0:04:56.040 have been really hard to battle that it feels like 0:04:57.480 --> 0:05:00.560 I think it's tough because I have have been so 0:05:00.680 --> 0:05:03.320 open and honest about everything, and even when my ex 0:05:03.400 --> 0:05:06.000 and I were talking about infidelity, I didn't feel alone. 0:05:06.040 --> 0:05:08.560 But now I feel probably the most alone I've ever 0:05:08.600 --> 0:05:12.840 felt because I'm actually not being able to authentically share 0:05:13.040 --> 0:05:15.880 everything that's like on my heart. And I think that's 0:05:15.920 --> 0:05:19.080 like it's been the hardest thing because it's like it's 0:05:19.120 --> 0:05:22.320 like two different um spaces where I'm like, I want 0:05:22.320 --> 0:05:24.799 to be so authentic, but then like I can only 0:05:25.520 --> 0:05:28.839 be so authentic without hurting people or having that energy 0:05:28.880 --> 0:05:31.840 out there or causing more chaos with my ax or 0:05:31.880 --> 0:05:33.920 you know. So it's like I don't know like who 0:05:33.960 --> 0:05:35.720 to be or how to be, or what to say 0:05:35.880 --> 0:05:38.919 or like. And it's such a weird reality when the 0:05:39.040 --> 0:05:41.320 last five years of my life I've been so open 0:05:41.400 --> 0:05:45.480 and so honest in those trials and things that most 0:05:45.480 --> 0:05:47.680 people would never talk about. So now I'm supposed to 0:05:47.720 --> 0:05:51.000 like not say anything, and and I don't know like 0:05:51.040 --> 0:05:56.320 how to like walk that path. Help me well that 0:05:57.520 --> 0:06:00.400 pain and grief that comes from what you're having to 0:06:00.560 --> 0:06:04.160 embody in this sort of let me let me stay back. 0:06:04.200 --> 0:06:07.080 I think every marriage that ends in a divorce has 0:06:07.160 --> 0:06:09.760 what I like to call like an after marriage and 0:06:09.880 --> 0:06:12.599 after marriage, right, which is the new season of what 0:06:12.720 --> 0:06:16.479 your relationship is and what all the feelings are around 0:06:17.000 --> 0:06:21.839 this new quote relationship that has its own season, and 0:06:22.000 --> 0:06:26.920 in my experience as a clinician, that season last for 0:06:26.960 --> 0:06:30.200 a year or two, depending on the circumstances, depending on 0:06:30.200 --> 0:06:32.720 if kids are involved, and so to kind of start 0:06:32.760 --> 0:06:36.320 where you started. The idea that you would be in 0:06:36.360 --> 0:06:39.400 a different place than you are now that is being 0:06:39.440 --> 0:06:43.000 proffered by I don't know, fans or people who follow you, etcetera, 0:06:44.000 --> 0:06:46.520 is not the norm. I would not only would I 0:06:46.560 --> 0:06:48.240 not expect to see it. If I did see it, 0:06:48.279 --> 0:06:51.159 I would be concerned that there was suppression of the grief, 0:06:51.240 --> 0:06:55.400 that there was suppression of the trauma. There's an entirely 0:06:55.560 --> 0:06:59.200 new relationship you have to build with your after marriage 0:06:59.440 --> 0:07:02.880 that is just to its infancy stages. And I know 0:07:02.960 --> 0:07:04.920 that's not like amazing, great news, but I think it's 0:07:04.920 --> 0:07:07.479 just a truth and the answer to the question will 0:07:07.520 --> 0:07:10.520 you feel better? Will you not always feel like this? Absolutely? 0:07:10.640 --> 0:07:14.080 Of course and no no doubt, like that's an unequivocal yes. 0:07:14.480 --> 0:07:17.880 From my standpoint and my experience, it's just not not now. 0:07:17.960 --> 0:07:20.280 This is pretty brand new, even though I know it 0:07:20.320 --> 0:07:22.000 feels like you've been doing a bunch of heavy lifting 0:07:22.040 --> 0:07:25.440 for a lot of days now. In kind of terms 0:07:25.600 --> 0:07:30.200 of marriage with children that's ended, and um, your public 0:07:30.240 --> 0:07:33.800 profile and all the hurt that we see and don't see. 0:07:33.880 --> 0:07:37.400 It's it's pretty early on. And I think in terms 0:07:37.400 --> 0:07:39.480 of the actual question like how do I manage that? 0:07:39.600 --> 0:07:43.760 How do I manage that? There's I'm sure in evolving 0:07:43.840 --> 0:07:46.120 acceptance of the truth and what you're dealing with, Like 0:07:46.160 --> 0:07:50.080 you're having to embody this pretty heroic role right where 0:07:50.360 --> 0:07:53.640 you're holding the line, you're holding that boundary I suppose 0:07:53.680 --> 0:07:55.960 on behalf of your kids for the most part, right, 0:07:56.600 --> 0:07:59.920 And I guess that that is in these like dark 0:08:00.080 --> 0:08:01.600 at moments, I think the thing that you have to 0:08:01.680 --> 0:08:04.480 most lean into is like this boundary is for them 0:08:04.600 --> 0:08:07.240 and them only. That's it, and um, that's it and 0:08:07.280 --> 0:08:10.760 that's everything right and and that's like I always call it, 0:08:10.840 --> 0:08:13.800 like heroes work. You know, this is heroes work. That 0:08:13.800 --> 0:08:16.200 that is the motivation, that is the inspiration, And it 0:08:16.240 --> 0:08:18.720 couldn't be harder because of course, in a lot of 0:08:18.720 --> 0:08:21.160 ways it would be better if you could just feel 0:08:21.520 --> 0:08:24.120 more integrated. You know that you weren't having to separate 0:08:24.120 --> 0:08:27.640 out your feelings in different contexts of your life, and 0:08:27.640 --> 0:08:29.679 and so I think that's part of why you're suffering 0:08:29.720 --> 0:08:32.640 so much. It's really really difficult, and having to accept 0:08:33.120 --> 0:08:36.000 at least that current truth is really really hard. You 0:08:36.000 --> 0:08:38.640 feel a bit split and right and not totally authentic 0:08:38.760 --> 0:08:41.800 and not totally supported and seen in all the ways 0:08:41.840 --> 0:08:44.240 that you deserve to be supported and seeing. Because of 0:08:44.280 --> 0:08:46.680 all this, Yeah, like I would love to be able 0:08:46.720 --> 0:08:50.120 to express and share certain things just like I did 0:08:50.160 --> 0:08:53.160 with the past stuff, so that way I don't feels 0:08:53.160 --> 0:08:59.120 alone in certain situations. But yeah, I mean, I I 0:08:59.160 --> 0:09:02.880 think I'm just I don't know who Like I guess 0:09:02.920 --> 0:09:05.200 I had this, UM. I called a friend, yeah, about 0:09:05.200 --> 0:09:06.920 thirty minutes ago and was just like started crying. I 0:09:06.960 --> 0:09:08.400 was like, I don't even know, like who I am? 0:09:08.480 --> 0:09:10.680 Like who am I? Like? What's my story? Like? What 0:09:10.760 --> 0:09:13.920 am I? Like? You know what? Why do I? Like? 0:09:14.080 --> 0:09:16.280 I just I just feel lost. And I think it 0:09:16.400 --> 0:09:19.079 is because I had shared so much previously that now 0:09:19.080 --> 0:09:21.240 I just and yes, I've shared, but like there's still 0:09:21.360 --> 0:09:26.719 so many things that like I've would love to um, 0:09:26.760 --> 0:09:30.600 you know, Um, let out, and I guess it's and 0:09:31.080 --> 0:09:34.160 I've just never done it like privately, like you know, 0:09:34.200 --> 0:09:37.080 I've always just been sharing, like sharing, and like, okay, 0:09:37.120 --> 0:09:40.080 this is like what I'm going through. But now that, yeah, 0:09:40.080 --> 0:09:41.920 I have you know, kids to protect. And then also, 0:09:43.400 --> 0:09:50.960 I mean I think it's I think there's something too 0:09:51.040 --> 0:09:53.200 to be said where I just don't want any more 0:09:53.280 --> 0:09:55.080 conflict with my ax. So I'm like, well, if I 0:09:55.120 --> 0:09:57.880 shut up, then you know he won't be mad at me, 0:09:58.240 --> 0:09:59.920 even though he has no reason to be mad at me, 0:10:00.800 --> 0:10:03.160 right you know. So I mean, sure, I've of course 0:10:03.200 --> 0:10:06.480 played my parts in the marriage, like I've said before, 0:10:07.120 --> 0:10:11.400 but with the ending of it, it's like and he 0:10:11.440 --> 0:10:13.160 even knows, like he even said, he's like, you could 0:10:13.200 --> 0:10:15.640 run me over with the bus if you wanted to, um, 0:10:15.760 --> 0:10:19.360 but I don't. I don't want I just like I 0:10:19.400 --> 0:10:22.280 don't want that that anymore. But I also want to 0:10:22.360 --> 0:10:25.880 share my experiences and and share all that. But then 0:10:25.920 --> 0:10:29.240 it's like, but I don't want the flak from from that, 0:10:29.280 --> 0:10:32.120 and I want that to go away. But then I'm like, okay, then, 0:10:32.880 --> 0:10:34.800 and then what am I sharing? Like? Who am I? Like? 0:10:34.960 --> 0:10:38.840 Is it just I don't know, it's just confusing. I 0:10:38.880 --> 0:10:42.000 get that there's a there's an identity loss here, right, 0:10:42.080 --> 0:10:45.680 I mean both kind of personally and publicly. I really 0:10:45.679 --> 0:10:47.760 I'm really taking that in and that that is I'm 0:10:47.800 --> 0:10:51.280 sure totally disorienting, which prompted that call like, well, who 0:10:51.320 --> 0:10:53.920 am I if I'm not this? And he boxed in 0:10:54.080 --> 0:10:59.760 and not kind of free and spontaneous like and theoretically 0:10:59.760 --> 0:11:03.840 you hope to in the aftermath of of this kind 0:11:03.880 --> 0:11:06.000 of shift, you know that you start to feel like 0:11:06.679 --> 0:11:10.439 more rather than like expansive rather than narrow, right, And 0:11:10.480 --> 0:11:12.520 I guess you're feeling narrowed right now, which is a 0:11:12.679 --> 0:11:16.880 very difficult, painful place to be. I would I would 0:11:16.920 --> 0:11:21.520 offer that I imagine this will be evolving, meaning that 0:11:21.559 --> 0:11:24.160 there might be another time in space where your story 0:11:24.320 --> 0:11:28.439 is able to be delivered in a way that isn't 0:11:28.480 --> 0:11:33.640 so current and isn't so conflictual and um, where your 0:11:33.679 --> 0:11:37.439 kids are a bit older and can hold all the sides. Um, 0:11:37.520 --> 0:11:39.800 so this might not be like the ending to the story, 0:11:40.360 --> 0:11:44.800 you know, and um. The word that keeps coming to 0:11:44.840 --> 0:11:48.320 mind is you're talking about it is grace, you know, 0:11:48.679 --> 0:11:51.080 grace and being able to ground yourself in the grace 0:11:51.320 --> 0:12:03.280 of what you're doing. You know, what I'd love to 0:12:03.320 --> 0:12:06.920 talk about is gaslighting because I feel like the term 0:12:07.200 --> 0:12:12.640 is is used a lot, and I've h I didn't 0:12:12.679 --> 0:12:14.679 honestly know what it was. So can you just kind 0:12:14.679 --> 0:12:17.040 of give a broad spectrum of what gas lighting is 0:12:17.240 --> 0:12:20.760 and and um in all of its traits and where 0:12:20.760 --> 0:12:24.000 it comes from. Yeah. So the idea of gaslighting, which 0:12:24.040 --> 0:12:26.760 is actually a super old concept, is the idea of 0:12:26.760 --> 0:12:32.520 sort of using kind of emotional manipulation to make the 0:12:32.600 --> 0:12:36.559 receiver of that energy or that dynamic kind of question 0:12:36.640 --> 0:12:44.680 their own reality or emotional experience. And yeah, I feel 0:12:44.679 --> 0:12:48.960 like in those types of relationships to the person that's 0:12:48.960 --> 0:12:53.480 gaslighting doesn't know, doesn't won't like say that they're gaslighting, like, 0:12:53.520 --> 0:12:55.560 they'll continue to still make you feel crazy. And I 0:12:55.559 --> 0:12:59.360 think that's like the part where I've I've been stuck 0:12:59.440 --> 0:13:02.520 for you in my past relationships. Yeah, that's the key 0:13:02.559 --> 0:13:05.600 element of gas lighting. That that that's that that's the 0:13:05.679 --> 0:13:07.760 core of it. The pain of it is that the 0:13:07.840 --> 0:13:12.120 person doing the gas lighting is committed to denying that 0:13:12.280 --> 0:13:16.520 the dynamic is occurring. And that is because there's sort 0:13:16.559 --> 0:13:21.319 of a protection of their own wound, their own vulnerability, 0:13:21.360 --> 0:13:24.400 their own responsibility, their own accountability. So it's sort of 0:13:24.440 --> 0:13:29.480 like a almost like a like there's a frenetic energy 0:13:29.679 --> 0:13:33.840 around denying your reality in the service of protecting their's, 0:13:33.960 --> 0:13:35.760 which is, I did nothing wrong, I have nothing to 0:13:35.800 --> 0:13:38.360 be accountable for, I have nothing to look at, I 0:13:38.360 --> 0:13:42.080 have nothing to deal with. I'm not responsible here. So 0:13:42.160 --> 0:13:46.040 when you know that that person is doing it, how 0:13:46.080 --> 0:13:50.440 can you not let that gaslighting person affect you? Because 0:13:50.480 --> 0:13:53.560 I think that's where I struggle with have had struggled 0:13:53.600 --> 0:13:57.160 with the most in the past, is like they make 0:13:57.240 --> 0:14:02.800 you question your craziness so good that you're like, maybe 0:14:02.800 --> 0:14:05.120 I am crazy, but then really comes to find out 0:14:05.160 --> 0:14:07.959 that you're not, and it's you know, here's the proof 0:14:08.000 --> 0:14:11.800 of A through Z. But even when you're out of 0:14:11.840 --> 0:14:16.040 that situation, how do you not let that still creep in? Two? 0:14:17.200 --> 0:14:22.640 Not um letting them affect you in that way? Yeah, 0:14:22.720 --> 0:14:25.680 well you kind of started where I was going to start, 0:14:25.680 --> 0:14:31.920 which is that how one doesn't let intense pathological gaslighting 0:14:32.040 --> 0:14:36.800 impact them is uh is sort of an unanswerable question, 0:14:36.880 --> 0:14:38.720 meaning the only way to not have an impact you 0:14:38.800 --> 0:14:42.920 is to leave. If it's toxic and pathological, right, there's 0:14:43.560 --> 0:14:47.160 no matter how psychologically savvy and sturdy, you are one 0:14:47.200 --> 0:14:51.400 cannot be um not impacted by having that kind of 0:14:51.440 --> 0:14:56.920 toxicity sort of put upon them. So my general advice 0:14:57.000 --> 0:14:58.920 is if you find yourself in that kind of situation, 0:14:59.000 --> 0:15:02.840 to find support help in exiting the situation. But where 0:15:02.840 --> 0:15:07.360 you're talking about is the aftermath, because there's collateral damage 0:15:07.400 --> 0:15:12.720 that happens. Right you start questioning yourself and feeling um 0:15:12.840 --> 0:15:15.920 a sense of disorientation that what your experience tells you 0:15:16.040 --> 0:15:19.400 might not be correct, and can feel a lack of 0:15:19.440 --> 0:15:23.880 groundedness and connectedness. So I think it's it's it's critical 0:15:24.160 --> 0:15:28.160 to regard that as as a trauma of sorts, and 0:15:28.200 --> 0:15:30.840 to do some trauma work to deal with the grief, 0:15:30.880 --> 0:15:33.640 to deal with the depression, to deal with the anxiety 0:15:33.720 --> 0:15:37.640 in a very slow and deliberate way, and ideally in 0:15:37.760 --> 0:15:41.480 a professional setting. And then as you start to re 0:15:41.720 --> 0:15:45.240 emerge in kind of the aftermath of that trauma, to 0:15:45.360 --> 0:15:49.360 be surrounding yourself with people who are available for a 0:15:49.480 --> 0:15:56.360 sort of vulnerable, supportive, messy discussions and reflections. So I 0:15:56.360 --> 0:15:58.880 think it's about the inside work and then about what 0:15:59.000 --> 0:16:01.120 your life looks like and feels like as you kind 0:16:01.160 --> 0:16:04.760 of re emerge from that trauma. Yeah, for sure. I 0:16:04.800 --> 0:16:06.840 was going to say too that I think when you 0:16:06.880 --> 0:16:09.040 find yourself going down that path, you know to be 0:16:09.120 --> 0:16:11.920 very deliberate about that moment of sort of questioning yourself 0:16:12.040 --> 0:16:15.040 or doubting yourself, to really be like very deliberate about 0:16:15.080 --> 0:16:17.040 how you talk to yourself in that moment to kind 0:16:17.080 --> 0:16:20.400 of have enough mindfulness that you step outside yourself. It 0:16:20.560 --> 0:16:24.880 might sound um um overly simplified, but even picturing like 0:16:24.880 --> 0:16:27.960 a red stop sign stop, you know that you're literally 0:16:28.000 --> 0:16:31.240 interrupting the dynamic, the like neural pathway that goes from like, 0:16:31.240 --> 0:16:33.960 oh this happened to like I'm wrong, I'm bad, because 0:16:34.000 --> 0:16:36.800 that's what we do. We developed like an automatic, uh 0:16:37.040 --> 0:16:39.800 sort of a path to like something bad happens, and 0:16:39.880 --> 0:16:41.840 you're all the way to like I'm bad, I'm wrong, 0:16:42.480 --> 0:16:45.040 I'm not valuable, and being able to interrupt that and 0:16:45.080 --> 0:16:47.680 stop it and talk yourself through it, like wait a minute, 0:16:47.680 --> 0:16:50.880 what's happening here? What is my intuition telling me, what 0:16:51.000 --> 0:16:52.600 part of that feels right? What part of that is 0:16:52.640 --> 0:16:54.600 resonating with me? And to be able to kind of 0:16:54.640 --> 0:16:58.560 reparent yourself back to trusting your own voice and to 0:16:58.640 --> 0:17:00.560 kind of tolerate moments. Maybe you don't get it right, 0:17:00.600 --> 0:17:03.800 maybe do get it right. Sometimes that's what um um. 0:17:04.200 --> 0:17:06.640 Relying on our own intuition looks like. Right, we never 0:17:06.680 --> 0:17:08.760 get right all the time. But being able to build 0:17:08.760 --> 0:17:12.720 like a new relationship with ourselves around listening to ourselves, 0:17:12.920 --> 0:17:15.960 because gas lighting takes us outside of ourselves, we have 0:17:16.000 --> 0:17:19.080 to go back in. It's that's like it's just so 0:17:19.160 --> 0:17:23.040 hard to do though, I mean because it's like, you know, 0:17:23.080 --> 0:17:24.639 even when people like, oh, you're strong, I'm like, no, 0:17:24.680 --> 0:17:26.360 I'm not. I'm weak and I'm miss and then it's 0:17:26.400 --> 0:17:29.560 like the negative voices that we feed into ourselves. And 0:17:29.600 --> 0:17:32.960 then even like you know, the other night, when I 0:17:33.000 --> 0:17:35.280 had just gotten home from Connecticut and I was home alone, 0:17:35.280 --> 0:17:38.280 I was like, oh I miss you know, I miss 0:17:38.400 --> 0:17:40.359 my my family. And then I'm like, okay, what do 0:17:40.400 --> 0:17:41.879 I What do I miss? Am I missing? Am I 0:17:41.880 --> 0:17:43.919 actually missing Mike? Or am I missing? And it's like 0:17:43.920 --> 0:17:45.399 that when you start to really break it down and 0:17:45.400 --> 0:17:47.879 you're like okay, and then you can get back into, 0:17:48.680 --> 0:17:53.359 you know, um, a healthier mind frame around it. But 0:17:53.400 --> 0:17:56.359 it is very hard when you start telling yourself certain 0:17:56.480 --> 0:17:59.360 things that when you really separate it out and you're 0:17:59.400 --> 0:18:01.399 in your right and it's like, okay, no, this is 0:18:01.400 --> 0:18:02.919 what I miss. I just missed that, you know, I 0:18:02.960 --> 0:18:05.080 hate that this happened. Then I miss my kids upstairs. 0:18:05.119 --> 0:18:06.960 But like, if I was to do this again, I 0:18:07.000 --> 0:18:09.720 wouldn't go through it again, you know, I wouldn't. And 0:18:10.560 --> 0:18:12.639 it's good to sit that down. But in those moments, 0:18:12.680 --> 0:18:14.399 it's very hard because am like I miss him, and 0:18:14.520 --> 0:18:16.639 I'm like, wait a minute, let's take it. Take a beat. 0:18:17.320 --> 0:18:19.639 What do you miss And then you're like, okay, yeah, 0:18:20.080 --> 0:18:23.439 it couldn't be harder, and you won't do it every time, right, 0:18:23.480 --> 0:18:25.399 Sometimes our emotions just take over and they get the 0:18:25.440 --> 0:18:28.159 best of us. You're right, it's emotional heavy lifting in 0:18:28.240 --> 0:18:31.119 the middle of brief It couldn't be harder. So it's 0:18:31.160 --> 0:18:32.720 good that you're saying that out loud, both to like 0:18:32.800 --> 0:18:35.639 validate it for yourself for your listeners that like that 0:18:35.760 --> 0:18:37.800 is the most difficult thing to do, is like to 0:18:37.920 --> 0:18:41.119 stand up against those voices. But I had a thought 0:18:41.160 --> 0:18:43.640 that you know, when you have those moments where you're 0:18:43.640 --> 0:18:46.440 thinking people say to you you're so strong, and your 0:18:46.440 --> 0:18:48.800 head you're thinking like, I'm that's not true, I'm weak. 0:18:48.840 --> 0:18:50.600 You know all that and that sort of conflict about 0:18:50.600 --> 0:18:52.840 how people see you, how you really feel inside. I 0:18:52.840 --> 0:18:54.840 think it's so important. I was talking at the beginning 0:18:54.840 --> 0:18:57.640 about like feelings coexisting and how important is to lean 0:18:57.680 --> 0:18:59.600 into that truth if you can feel like strong and 0:18:59.640 --> 0:19:01.840 weak at the same time, like both can be so true. 0:19:02.280 --> 0:19:05.560 And to be careful not to exile those parts of you. 0:19:05.840 --> 0:19:08.600 They're like super useful that are have a lot of 0:19:08.640 --> 0:19:10.919 important information to tell us. Like the part of you 0:19:11.000 --> 0:19:14.600 that's quote weak, which I'm putting in quotes, is really 0:19:14.600 --> 0:19:16.800 important to heap close to us, not to exile it 0:19:16.840 --> 0:19:18.760 and kind of call it bad and try to make 0:19:18.760 --> 0:19:20.639 it not a part of us, but to bring it close. 0:19:20.640 --> 0:19:22.040 Like what are you trying to tell me? Like kind 0:19:22.040 --> 0:19:24.680 of what you just we're talking about? What's the weak 0:19:24.760 --> 0:19:26.680 quote week voice trying to tell me? Oh, I'm sad 0:19:26.720 --> 0:19:29.200 I'm missing this part of this dream, this narrative I 0:19:29.280 --> 0:19:31.080 had about what my life is supposed to be is 0:19:31.400 --> 0:19:34.160 is different now has fallen apart, and how that makes 0:19:34.160 --> 0:19:37.160 me feel so like not so quickly exiling those sort 0:19:37.200 --> 0:19:39.639 of quote bad parts of yourself. They're good, They're like 0:19:39.920 --> 0:19:42.520 super important for us to get closer to, not get 0:19:42.560 --> 0:19:45.959 far away. So maybe that helps in this like darker 0:19:46.080 --> 0:19:48.120 part of where you are right now, to like invite 0:19:48.160 --> 0:19:51.280 those pieces in so you can learn more from them 0:19:51.359 --> 0:19:52.800 rather than feel like, oh, they're so bad, I just 0:19:52.840 --> 0:19:55.240 want them to go away. Yeah. No, I love that. 0:19:55.400 --> 0:19:59.040 I do appreciate that a lot. And thanks for happening on. 0:19:59.119 --> 0:20:01.480 I know you. I know you have a very busy day, 0:20:01.480 --> 0:20:03.439 so I appreciate the time that you do give us 0:20:03.440 --> 0:20:05.560 here at one down. We we appreciate you very much. 0:20:06.320 --> 0:20:08.080 So good to see you YouTube Maney. I'll talk to 0:20:08.119 --> 0:20:15.200 you soon on my next breakdown. UM. You know what's 0:20:15.240 --> 0:20:18.840 interesting about that is I actually have, UM, I've got this. 0:20:19.160 --> 0:20:21.560 I've got so many notes on my phone. One of 0:20:21.560 --> 0:20:23.359 the things that I said, you know, I I write, 0:20:23.600 --> 0:20:28.000 UM instead of saying negative things to my ex. I've 0:20:28.040 --> 0:20:32.000 got a I literally a full notepad of just everything 0:20:32.160 --> 0:20:35.440 I want to say when I'm having a bad day. UM, 0:20:35.520 --> 0:20:37.959 and I just I Sometimes we will even put an 0:20:37.960 --> 0:20:41.560 email form but I click, you know delete. Just getting 0:20:41.600 --> 0:20:44.359 it out sometimes very helpful because there's a lot of 0:20:44.400 --> 0:20:47.720 emotions that come with um, you know, being in this 0:20:47.720 --> 0:20:51.439 this season. UM. And then yeah, when I do miss 0:20:51.680 --> 0:20:53.960 you know, because there's times when of course I miss 0:20:54.040 --> 0:20:57.320 my ex and to be able to sit down and go, okay, 0:20:57.720 --> 0:21:01.040 yes there was good moments here, but I go back here, 0:21:01.160 --> 0:21:04.480 here's what I don't miss, and then it's like, okay, yeah, 0:21:04.520 --> 0:21:06.239 I don't. I don't want to go back to that, 0:21:06.280 --> 0:21:08.760 Like this is this is a healthier, but it's still 0:21:08.800 --> 0:21:10.879 it's still hard. And so if you're struggling with that, 0:21:11.040 --> 0:21:13.520 like it's it's okay to still have those feelings. I 0:21:13.600 --> 0:21:18.040 do too, It's normal, I think. But UM, but with 0:21:18.080 --> 0:21:21.000 the negative things I have realized, you know, just write 0:21:21.000 --> 0:21:23.200 them down because they feel really good to get out. 0:21:23.280 --> 0:21:25.400 Just don't send them because it's not going to get 0:21:25.400 --> 0:21:27.679 you anywhere. UM. Let's take a break and then I'm 0:21:27.680 --> 0:21:29.240 going to go through a few of the things that 0:21:29.320 --> 0:21:32.280 you guys wanted me to talk about, UM from my 0:21:32.320 --> 0:21:45.399 instagram the other day. So we were talking about different 0:21:45.480 --> 0:21:49.359 kind of co hosts to have on the show, UM 0:21:49.400 --> 0:21:52.280 and different guests that we can have on and Uh, 0:21:52.440 --> 0:21:54.280 one of the topics that you brought up, which I 0:21:54.320 --> 0:22:01.600 think is really interesting, is about UM, good guys, my 0:22:01.680 --> 0:22:05.919