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Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the best of Coast to Coast podcasts.

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Speaker 1: Become a Coast Insider and you can hear this complete conversation,

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Speaker 1: as well as recent shows featuring guests discussing new cases

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Speaker 1: of the troubling cattle mutilation phenomenon, worries, some instances of

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Speaker 1: clandestine c I, a torture, and the evidence that the

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Speaker 1: Lost City of Atlantis may have really once existed. Check

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Speaker 1: out these programs and many other fascinating episodes waiting for

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Speaker 1: you and the Coast to Coast archive by heading over

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Speaker 1: to Coast to Coast a m dot com and signing

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Speaker 1: up for Coast Insider. Now here's a highlight from Coast

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Speaker 1: to Coast AM on iHeart Radio and welcome back to

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Speaker 1: Coast to Coast. George Nori with you, Mike Bara back

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Speaker 1: with us. Mike, of course noted author of a number

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Speaker 1: of books, including The Choice. We were just with him

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Speaker 1: on Ancient Aliens and JFK. And we're gonna be talking

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Speaker 1: with Michael about what's really happening on Mars. You know, Michael,

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Speaker 1: we get so many reports of strange stories on Mars.

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Speaker 1: Are rovers are still there? What the inside school? What

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Speaker 1: are you hearing? What's happening there, Well, I mean, Georgia.

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Speaker 1: It's really fascinating because again, you have this lake that's

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Speaker 1: announced today, and it really is old news to anybody's

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Speaker 1: been listening to Coast to Coast since two thousand and one,

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Speaker 1: two thousand two, So it's not like it's something completely new.

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Speaker 1: It's just sort of new to the general public who

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Speaker 1: doesn't listen to your show, right. But again, I mean,

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Speaker 1: I'm looking at the images that have been presented that

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Speaker 1: that support this article, and I'm looking and it's there's

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Speaker 1: stuff there that looks like structures. There's stuff there that

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Speaker 1: looks like ruined wall. So I'm thinking to myself, is

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Speaker 1: this you know, is it like disclosure, kind of a

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Speaker 1: double edged sort of disclosure, Like they're actually want everybody

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Speaker 1: to pay attention because of this big discovery of a lake.

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Speaker 1: And then they put these pictures out of the area

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Speaker 1: and it looks like there was rulins there. So I mean,

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Speaker 1: I'm feeling like what we're seeing is we're seeing a slow, steady, drip,

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Speaker 1: drip drip kind of disclosure that's happening without any really

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Speaker 1: efficial acknowledgement. I mean, they're they're twenty is behind in

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Speaker 1: terms of what they're willing to talk about, but what

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Speaker 1: they're showing us it's really extraordinary stuff. Mike, tell me, scientifically,

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Speaker 1: what do you think happened to Mars and when did

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Speaker 1: it happen? Because everybody says it once had an atmosphere,

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Speaker 1: We now know it has a lake, maybe it had

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Speaker 1: an ocean. What happened to that planet? Well, it definitely

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Speaker 1: had oceans, But I mean, I think that that the

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Speaker 1: obviously something really bad happened to Mars now, but remember

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Speaker 1: that the whole thing about what time has happened, how

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Speaker 1: long ago this catastrophe was is all based on the

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Speaker 1: idea of crater counts, which basically is from the perspective

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Speaker 1: of NASA's concept of planetary formation how this all worked.

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Speaker 1: And there's a period called the late heavy bombardment, which

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Speaker 1: was kind of the last time in the Solar System

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Speaker 1: when there's still a lot of junk, a lot of

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Speaker 1: asteroids and rocks that we're hitting the planets and cratering

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Speaker 1: them out. And then over the next three billion years

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Speaker 1: or so, supposedly you know, the planet to that water,

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Speaker 1: everything got smoothed out and the crater has disappeared. But

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Speaker 1: Mar Mars has what are commonly known as title bulges,

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Speaker 1: and what that means is that it was once in

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Speaker 1: a tidal lock relationship in orbit around a bigger parent planet,

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Speaker 1: just exactly like the Moon is in orbit around the Earth,

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Speaker 1: always showing us the same face, and every object, every

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Speaker 1: moon in the Solar System that's an in a relationship

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Speaker 1: like that, has the title bulges. So what that means

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Speaker 1: is that there was a planet somewhere near the orbit

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Speaker 1: of where Mars is today that is no longer with it,

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Speaker 1: that with us, that was blown up or exploded in

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Speaker 1: some natural catastrophe and not only wiped out the civilization

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Speaker 1: that was there, but accounted for all of the craters.

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Speaker 1: I mean, the thing about Mars isist line of dichotomy

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Speaker 1: where you've got this pretty smooth cube ball northern surface

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Speaker 1: and then you've got the southern hemisphere which is just

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Speaker 1: completely blasted with so many craters you can't even count

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Speaker 1: them or name them. So that means that their whole

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Speaker 1: method of counting and aging and dating is completely wrong.

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Speaker 1: And if that's the case, we're looking at this catastrophe,

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Speaker 1: this explode ocean in the Solar System. It could have

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Speaker 1: happened five hundred thousand years ago. It could have happened

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Speaker 1: a couple of million years ago. It could have happened

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Speaker 1: ten million years ago, It could have happened a billion

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Speaker 1: years ago. But I tend to think it was much

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Speaker 1: more recent that. I think it was probably within a

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Speaker 1: few hundred thousand years that this explosion took place. Other

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Speaker 1: people say, you know Tom ben Flanner, who kind of

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Speaker 1: came up with this, the exploded planet hypothesis, the late

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Speaker 1: Dr Tom ben Flanner, He thought that it was it

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Speaker 1: was around sixty five million years ago at the time.

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Speaker 1: The Dinosaurs Works think that it was part of that event. So,

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Speaker 1: you know, it's really a question of we don't know

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Speaker 1: when this stuff happened, but it certainly looks like Mars

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Speaker 1: was habitable not that long ago. Could it happen here

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Speaker 1: some kind of catastrophe like that, Yeah, it could happen here.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you know, we always talked about and we've

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Speaker 1: heard a lot of us have heard a lot about

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Speaker 1: the Breau and Sitchen and his concepts of of the

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Speaker 1: Breau coming through. But kind of reading his later books,

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Speaker 1: I got the impression that Nabireau never really came that

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Speaker 1: close to the inner Solar System didn't really get anywhere

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Speaker 1: near the Earth, and the whole magnetic pole alignment saying

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Speaker 1: and pull shifts. I don't think that really ever happened.

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Speaker 1: But what it could do is it could get in

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Speaker 1: around the area of the asteroid belt. So if a

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Speaker 1: big object like that came through, let's say Na Bureau

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Speaker 1: was actually a brown dwarf star as some people speculate,

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Speaker 1: it would perturb a whole bunch of bodies in the

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Speaker 1: asteroid belt and then it would be like a shooting gallery,

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Speaker 1: would be like somebody blasted a shotgun at us, and

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Speaker 1: we'd be very, very lucky to avoid getting a major

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Speaker 1: hit from an asteroid. So something like that, even a

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Speaker 1: large single object, a very large asteroid, of course we

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Speaker 1: all know, could cause an extinction level event and Ellie

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Speaker 1: as they call it, and and really do a number

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Speaker 1: on life on planet Earth. So that could happen. The

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Speaker 1: other thing that's of course, really a problem, which is

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Speaker 1: why NASA doesn't like to talk about really what really

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Speaker 1: happened to Mars is at least in terms of like

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Speaker 1: like a recent time time frame, is that if this

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Speaker 1: other planet that Mars used to orbit actually exploded, then

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Speaker 1: guess what that means that planet can explode? So NASA,

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Speaker 1: where we admit that, what do you think the first

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Speaker 1: question is going to be at the press comp happened Earth? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: don't we live on a planet. Couldn't this planet explode?

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Speaker 1: And that would really sort of mess people's lives up.

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Speaker 1: So I think that you've got all these political questions

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Speaker 1: that are swirling around what should be a scientific discussion.

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Speaker 1: But you know that you just can't you can't avoid

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Speaker 1: the politics of it. Is the asteroid belt the remnants

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Speaker 1: of that exploded planet, Yeah, I think that one. And

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Speaker 1: and there's actually another one um that probably exploded that

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Speaker 1: that Ben Planard theorized that actually was in the area

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Speaker 1: of the asteroid belt. Most of the debris probably would

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Speaker 1: have been sucked up by Jupiter. But if you look

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Speaker 1: at the what they used to call the tightest boat

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Speaker 1: law of planetary spacing, basically it says that um any

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Speaker 1: you know, any every planet is about twice twice as

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Speaker 1: far from the Sun as the previous planet. Then it

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Speaker 1: works pretty much all the way out to Neptune and Uranus,

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Speaker 1: although Uranus is off because it's got hit by something else.

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Speaker 1: But I mean, if you look at it that way,

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Speaker 1: you've basically got a planet, probably one of these heavy

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Speaker 1: rocky super earths, roughly in the orbit of where Mars

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Speaker 1: is now, and then there should be another one where

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Speaker 1: the asteroid belt is. So it looks like there's probably

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Speaker 1: at least two former bodies planetary bodies in this Solar

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Speaker 1: system that simply no longer exists, and nobody really knows

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Speaker 1: why or what happened to them. But I do think

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Speaker 1: it's a question that we ought to be really focusing

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Speaker 1: on them. I'm not going to be able to do

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Speaker 1: that unless you start being honest about what actually happened

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Speaker 1: to Mars and and more importantly, when it probably happened. Mike,

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Speaker 1: do you think the Moon was part of Earth or

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Speaker 1: that it was an object that hit Earth and that's

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Speaker 1: what's left. No, I don't be I don't buy the

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Speaker 1: second one. I think the biggest argument that the Moon

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Speaker 1: was part of Earth is that the they did some

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Speaker 1: studies on the oxygen isotopic ratio of lunar soil, and

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Speaker 1: what they found, basically is that the various elements and

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Speaker 1: isotopes that make up material on Earth make the elements

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Speaker 1: you know, um, lead, whatever. They actually had the same numbers,

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Speaker 1: and what that means is that the Moon itself was

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Speaker 1: fissioned off the Earth. It was part of the Earth. Now,

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Speaker 1: I guess theoretically it's a larger body hit the Earth

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Speaker 1: and knocked away the Moon. That that you would get

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Speaker 1: a mixture of these three different you know, the the Earth,

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Speaker 1: the Moon, and this other body, and it would kind

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Speaker 1: of all tend to be that way. But it seems

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Speaker 1: more likely to me that the fishing model is correct

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Speaker 1: because that was again Dr Van Plander's bottle, was the

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Speaker 1: idea that that planets basically got spewed out from the

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Speaker 1: Sun as you know, balls of molten energy, multen lava,

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Speaker 1: multen material that eventually spun and cooled and formed the

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Speaker 1: hardened planets that we see today. The bigger ones, the

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Speaker 1: gas giants were formed the earliest. So if that's correct,

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Speaker 1: then what would happen is all the spin energy that

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Speaker 1: the Earth possessed when it was first spun away from

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Speaker 1: the Sun would then have spun off a smaller moon,

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Speaker 1: a moon exactly like the one we see. So I

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Speaker 1: think it's kind of a combination of these two things.

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Speaker 1: I think it's you know, people always ask me as

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Speaker 1: the moon artificial and I'm like, well, kind of sort

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Speaker 1: of some of it is. And I think what happened

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Speaker 1: is this thing is a natural a natural satellite of

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Speaker 1: the Earth that has been heavily, heavily modified by somebody

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Speaker 1: at some point in the distant past. Mike Barrow with us.

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Speaker 1: His website is his name, Mike Barra b a R

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Speaker 1: A dot com. It's linked up for you at Coast

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Speaker 1: to Coast a m dot com. Mike. With everything that's

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Speaker 1: happening out there in the Solar System and the universe,

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Speaker 1: what still drives and excites you? Um, I think, you know,

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Speaker 1: it's kind of interesting because that's a great question because

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Speaker 1: I think to myself, you know, I kind of know.

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Speaker 1: I feel like I kind of know what the history

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Speaker 1: of the Solar System has had a pretty good idea

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Speaker 1: of what happened. I have a pretty good idea why

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Speaker 1: it happened. I don't always talk about the details about

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Speaker 1: that because it's it's a little out there, but I

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Speaker 1: mean I have a pretty good idea of what happened.

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Speaker 1: And it's exciting to me now is seeing the mainstream

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Speaker 1: kind of come on long with that idea. They start

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Speaker 1: there there. You know, this is an example today I mean,

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Speaker 1: if they had actually made this revelation about this lake,

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Speaker 1: this Briany Lake in two thousand one or two thousand two,

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Speaker 1: it would have been a much bigger deal in the

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Speaker 1: sense that would have been more contemporaneous with the things

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Speaker 1: that that me and other researchers were talking about at

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Speaker 1: that time. But it's like, finally, almost twenty years later,

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Speaker 1: sixteen seventeen years later, um to see them finally coming

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Speaker 1: around to our way of thinking and coming around to

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Speaker 1: the things that that all the lunar researchers, people like

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Speaker 1: Keith Laney and and you know, Gary, a lot of

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Speaker 1: other guys out there that have been working on this

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Speaker 1: stuff have known for a long time, is really encouraging

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Speaker 1: because what that could mean is that eventually they will

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Speaker 1: start admitting what some of this stuff is that we

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Speaker 1: see on Mars and we see on the boat, which is,

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Speaker 1: as we both know, artificial or artificial structures on these planets. So,

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Speaker 1: you know, I think that what excites me is that

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Speaker 1: the shift in the political winds, I guess, is how

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Speaker 1: I would describe it, Because these debates are not scientific.

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Speaker 1: I mean, if you, if you want to apply science,

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Speaker 1: Mars has got our artificial structures on it. The moon

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Speaker 1: has artificial structures on it. It's the political problem that

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Speaker 1: we have. It's it's the fact that these these issues

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Speaker 1: are so politicized is what keeps us from simply admitting

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Speaker 1: what everybody who has eyes can see. Last week we

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Speaker 1: had the anniversary of our landing not in the moon

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Speaker 1: with Apollo eleven. What do you think of those skeptics

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Speaker 1: who still continue to say we never went to the moon.

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Speaker 1: Oh God, And yeah, I know, and it drives me insane.

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Speaker 1: And you know, I was at a presentation in Manchester

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Speaker 1: given by a very nice man that was just I mean,

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Speaker 1: everything he said was completely wrong. It's just you know, um,

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Speaker 1: they were he was talking about the photography and like,

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Speaker 1: look how great this picture is, and you're telling me

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Speaker 1: that this guy had a camera strap to his chest

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Speaker 1: and he leaned way back and took a picture of

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Speaker 1: the lunar module and it came out this perfect time. Like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's exactly what they did because they trained for months

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Speaker 1: and months and months with these cameras and they did

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Speaker 1: always say to simplify them, to make the photography really good.

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Speaker 1: And it's just it's just so um, it's so aggravating

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Speaker 1: to have to constantly battle this, because the thing is, George,

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Speaker 1: is that, look, I'm a conspiracy serious. I freely admit that,

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Speaker 1: I said, a lot of your guests admit that I'm

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Speaker 1: not even sure you're not a conspiracy serious. Yeah, and

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Speaker 1: and and it's like, um okay. But the thing is

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Speaker 1: is that if we embrace the dumb conspiracy theories without

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Speaker 1: thinking them through and and hashing them out within the

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Speaker 1: uful community and coming to some sort of rational discussion

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Speaker 1: about them, then it makes the rest of us look

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Speaker 1: like fools. That really makes us look stupid. And to me,

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Speaker 1: that's what this whole fake moon landing stuff really gets

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Speaker 1: under my skin. In fact, they got under my skin

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Speaker 1: so much that I devoted the last three chapters of

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Speaker 1: Ancient Aliens and JFK to whether or not we actually

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Speaker 1: went to the movement. You know, I mean, like I

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Speaker 1: said in the book, John F. Kennedy would not have

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Speaker 1: committed us to a course of action that was not achievable.

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Speaker 1: And everybody knows it was achievable. And if and if

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Speaker 1: you've ever worked in and engineering airspace, you know that

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Speaker 1: none of the problems that are frequently listed were insurmountable.

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Speaker 1: They simply weren't. Listen to more. Coast to Coast a m.

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Speaker 1: Every weeknight at one a m. Eastern and go to

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Speaker 1: Coast to Coast am dot com for more