WEBVTT - Dig DeepXYZ: Commitment Phobes & Breakup Blunders

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to desperately devoted Think of us as your favorite

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<v Speaker 1>neighbors as we chat about life and relationships.

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<v Speaker 2>All while we revisit the iconic show Desperate Housewives together.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm Terry Hatcher, I'm Andrea Bowen, and I'm Emerson Tony. Well,

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<v Speaker 1>we're back and we're here to continue talking about episode twenty.

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<v Speaker 1>And actually, you know this aired at the beginning of May,

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<v Speaker 1>which is also when a very famous cover of all

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<v Speaker 1>of us girls on Vanity Fair magazine came out in

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<v Speaker 1>that first week of May, and I thought this was crazy.

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<v Speaker 1>So that was a very iconic photo by a pool,

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<v Speaker 1>all of us in bathing suits looking fabulous. And just

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<v Speaker 1>the other week, the Real Housewives of Salt Lake City

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<v Speaker 1>did a copy of our photo for the cover of

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<v Speaker 1>US magazine to promote their show, and down to the tea,

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<v Speaker 1>like one of the women was wearing a red bathing

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<v Speaker 1>suit like me, one of the women was wearing a

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<v Speaker 1>black bathing suit and lying across on a lounge chair

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<v Speaker 1>like Eva was. I mean, it was exactly the same

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<v Speaker 1>foot And I just know we're here doing this podcast

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<v Speaker 1>partly because the show continues to be relevant to a

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<v Speaker 1>certain group of people and new generations of people seem

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<v Speaker 1>to be enjoying it. But isn't that crazy that this

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<v Speaker 1>this image from pop culture was I guess significant enough

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<v Speaker 1>that a show that's actually on the air right now

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<v Speaker 1>uses it to promote their show.

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<v Speaker 3>It's amazing. I mean, it's it's it's actually very cool

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<v Speaker 3>that the show has maintained this type of relevance. But

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<v Speaker 3>also we've noted that there's a little there's an obvious

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<v Speaker 3>tie in between the Real Housewives franchise and Desperate Housewives,

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<v Speaker 3>and so I sort of love that they just went

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<v Speaker 3>full let's let yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Let's just do it. Do you have an all time

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<v Speaker 1>favorite house? Real house Oh my gosh, because I know

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<v Speaker 1>what you'd say if I asked you your all time

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<v Speaker 1>favorite house. Well, that's right, no, no, no answer.

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<v Speaker 3>I am a big sonya Morgan fan, I love me

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<v Speaker 3>some Dunda, which is a reference to the show for this.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>But I mean, really, then, you guys have I've heard

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<v Speaker 1>It's not like one I've heard is supposed to be

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<v Speaker 1>really good. It is.

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<v Speaker 3>It's really good because they're all bold and and and

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<v Speaker 3>they put it all out there and it's just h.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, that makes sense why they did the cover because

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<v Speaker 1>we were bold and put it all out there.

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<v Speaker 2>I was going to say, yeah, and you're all You're

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<v Speaker 2>all by a pool in the cover. And here we

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<v Speaker 2>are at the end of episode twenty buy a pool again.

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<v Speaker 3>Yes, this time by Gabby and Carlos's pool in their backyard.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes.

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<v Speaker 2>I had a wildly large fiesta party to go.

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<v Speaker 1>Away going to prison y you know, as one does.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, full of drama, full of Gabby slapping Carlos in

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<v Speaker 2>the face and realizing he's been tampering with her birth control,

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<v Speaker 2>full of so many things.

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<v Speaker 3>Brion George end up in the pool because Rex pushes

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<v Speaker 3>George into the pool.

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<v Speaker 2>And he takes Bree down with him, which I feel

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<v Speaker 2>like that's gonna pay off more.

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<v Speaker 3>Ali breaks up with Zach.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, that's what I wanted to get to. Yes, Julie

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<v Speaker 2>breaks up with Zach and I find it interesting because

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<v Speaker 2>at the beginning of episode twenty, Julie says to Susan God,

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<v Speaker 2>I've been trying to break up with him for so long. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>and you even said when we were talking about it

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<v Speaker 2>that you, as an actor, like, didn't even remember how

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<v Speaker 2>significant this storyline was between Julie and Zach. And I

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<v Speaker 2>think that is probably because Julie was not particularly present

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<v Speaker 2>or significantly invested in the relationship with Zach. It's such

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<v Speaker 2>a one sided I mean when we see that final

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<v Speaker 2>of how Zach has like all these images of Julie

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<v Speaker 2>up on his wall a camera, I know I would

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<v Speaker 2>a borderline obsession. Have you ever found yourself in a

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<v Speaker 2>dynamic that was a maybe initially a romantic relationship that

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<v Speaker 2>then you realized very quickly you were on very different

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<v Speaker 2>pages with the person than they were on with you.

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<v Speaker 2>Or similarly, have you ever struggled to end a relationship

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<v Speaker 2>like to you think it's been clear and and the

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<v Speaker 2>other person doesn't, or you like it's hard to break up.

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<v Speaker 2>Have you just turn that question back? Yeah, immediately, No,

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<v Speaker 2>I just like as you were saying, and I was

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<v Speaker 2>just like, oh, I wonder if you have I think

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<v Speaker 2>I have. I have certainly been in a few relationships

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<v Speaker 2>that I I'm one in particular is coming to mind

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<v Speaker 2>where I feel like I knew for a long time

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<v Speaker 2>that the relationship was not right for me, and that

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<v Speaker 2>I had and I was compared to from well, this

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<v Speaker 2>is the fascinating psychology of it. Like, I think I

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<v Speaker 2>was transparent with the person I was dating at the

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<v Speaker 2>time and told her and said, you know, I'm not

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<v Speaker 2>ready for this committed of a relationship. I whatever like

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<v Speaker 2>from the jump of our relationship, and I feel like

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<v Speaker 2>she sort of strong armed like, well, I don't want

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<v Speaker 2>to date casually into me being like well, I do

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<v Speaker 2>still want to see each other, and so I sort

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<v Speaker 2>of agreed to be in more of a committed relationship

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<v Speaker 2>than I was ready for. Yeah, and that I mean

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<v Speaker 2>from that very inception with someone who is a bit

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<v Speaker 2>more like domineering personality. I felt for months in the relationship.

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<v Speaker 2>I know this isn't right. I don't want to be

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<v Speaker 2>in this, but I she had a hold on me.

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<v Speaker 2>I really and I've never I've not since then or

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<v Speaker 2>before then, ever experienced something quite like it. Maybe it's

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<v Speaker 2>because it was the first woman that I like, seriously

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<v Speaker 2>had a committed relationship with, a committed, romantic reallytionship with,

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<v Speaker 2>and I think you're when you come out your first

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<v Speaker 2>queer relationship often holds a lot of significance and a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of fear around the idea of, well, if I'm

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<v Speaker 2>finally feeling attracted to this person in a way that

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<v Speaker 2>feels like how I am attracted to people, and if

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<v Speaker 2>this relationship ends, will I ever feel that attraction to

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<v Speaker 2>someone else. I think there was just like much more

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<v Speaker 2>fear in ending that at the time. And obviously since then,

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<v Speaker 2>I've gone on to be in other relationships and I

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<v Speaker 2>don't have that feeling. But it was tough, and I

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<v Speaker 2>remember when we finally did finally did break up, being like,

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<v Speaker 2>I've tried to do this for a few months and

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<v Speaker 2>now I have to really just do it. And I

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<v Speaker 2>felt for Julie in this scene.

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<v Speaker 3>You know, I do think Julie has done nothing wrong,

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<v Speaker 3>Like I think it's totally okay that she has moved

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<v Speaker 3>on and she's not interested in continuing this relationship, and

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<v Speaker 3>I think that needs to be loud and clear respected.

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<v Speaker 3>But I on the heels of obviously, we know that

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<v Speaker 3>Paul has that horrifying line to Zach in this episode

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<v Speaker 3>where he tells him that Julie could have anyone she

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<v Speaker 3>wants and that he can't because he's not that special.

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<v Speaker 2>I was like, yes, that's right, Julie, go off, you

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<v Speaker 2>can have anyone you want.

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<v Speaker 3>And then you know he is trying still with Julie

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<v Speaker 3>and she's like, listen, I don't want to hang out

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<v Speaker 3>with you. I don't want to talk to you. I

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<v Speaker 3>don't want to date you. You know, she has been.

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<v Speaker 1>Really weird when you get pushed into like having to

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<v Speaker 1>be mean yes, yeah, because they just won't accept what

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<v Speaker 1>you're saying. Yeah, trying to say it nicely, like letting

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<v Speaker 1>them down gently, and they just won't let you.

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<v Speaker 2>I've had someone in a breakup say to me before,

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<v Speaker 2>just say you're not in love with me any like,

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<v Speaker 2>like say you don't love me anymore.

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<v Speaker 1>In what way were they trying to just actually say that?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Well I don't I don't know what they were

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<v Speaker 2>trying to accomplish in that. I was trying to because

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<v Speaker 2>I do hold a lot like you can have love

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<v Speaker 2>for someone and not want to be in a relationship

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<v Speaker 2>with them anymore. But I remember feeling like, God, that's

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<v Speaker 2>so mean. But they were like, I need to hear

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<v Speaker 2>you say I don't love you.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. What they really needed was to somehow be able

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<v Speaker 1>to position you as the villain so that it wasn't

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<v Speaker 1>like so hard for them. I feel like the last

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<v Speaker 1>the person that I broke up with that I still

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<v Speaker 1>cared about, Like this thing you're talking about, I did

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<v Speaker 1>so when you were still pretty young, like maybe seven

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<v Speaker 1>or so, and the dating was getting to the point

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<v Speaker 1>where the other person wanted it to be more serious,

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<v Speaker 1>which then, of course was going to involve being in

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<v Speaker 1>the house more and then you become more inclusive with

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<v Speaker 1>your child. And I just couldn't do it. I just

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<v Speaker 1>couldn't do that. And and I feel like the person

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<v Speaker 1>did push me to be me because they they I

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<v Speaker 1>didn't know how to break it off and be nice,

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<v Speaker 1>because they just they just didn't want to accept where

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<v Speaker 1>I was at. And in hindsight, what is really been

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<v Speaker 1>interesting to me twenty years later, as I'd sort of

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<v Speaker 1>done work on myself and like, looking back, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>I was abused as a child and by my uncle,

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<v Speaker 1>and it makes so much sense to me in hindsight

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<v Speaker 1>that some unconscious part of me was never going to

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<v Speaker 1>let a man that wasn't your father into our house.

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<v Speaker 1>Like I don't think I knew it at the time,

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<v Speaker 1>Like I wasn't purposefully walking around going well, I can't

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<v Speaker 1>have a man that isn't Emerson's father in this house.

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<v Speaker 1>But the discomfort that, just like on a cellular basis,

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<v Speaker 1>lived in my body, I just don't think I was

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<v Speaker 1>going to fall in love and have a relationship while

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<v Speaker 1>you were still a child.

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<v Speaker 2>You weren't able to let yourself do that.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't think so.

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<v Speaker 2>That's fascinating.

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<v Speaker 1>I really don't think so.

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<v Speaker 2>I've never heard you say it like that. That makes

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<v Speaker 2>so much sense.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it makes sense to me too.

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<v Speaker 3>Just said, is such a proof of so much time

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<v Speaker 3>that you have reflected on your life and your choices.

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<v Speaker 3>And I mean, I think that's incredible. I'm curious how long,

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<v Speaker 3>like when did you unpack that?

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<v Speaker 1>Probably when Emerson was in college, okay, and I was

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<v Speaker 1>beginning to be like an empty nester and really look

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<v Speaker 1>at my surroundings alone in the house, and I think

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<v Speaker 1>I was talking to a therapist and also understanding what

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<v Speaker 1>are my hang ups with intimacy or trust or all

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<v Speaker 1>of that that comes along with being a survivor. And

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know, you know, when you're a busy mom

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<v Speaker 1>and you're busy protecting your child, and you're busy focusing

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<v Speaker 1>on lifting your child up and giving them every opportunity,

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<v Speaker 1>and those are all the things that I was doing,

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<v Speaker 1>along with making the money to support all of those things.

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<v Speaker 1>There just wasn't I didn't have to look at it

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<v Speaker 1>I didn't really have to question, you know, why am

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<v Speaker 1>I not dating? Like why am I not letting myself

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<v Speaker 1>fall in love with someone? You know, It wasn't really

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<v Speaker 1>until after you went to college and then on upwards

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<v Speaker 1>and onwards out with your adult life that I was

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<v Speaker 1>sort of left with the space to go what happened there? Right?

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<v Speaker 1>And I do find also that women are you know,

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<v Speaker 1>self sufficient in terms of like I think men when

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<v Speaker 1>they get out of marriages, like they do, tend to

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<v Speaker 1>just get right back into you know, because like men

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<v Speaker 1>need support systems, women are really good doing it by themselves.

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<v Speaker 1>But you know, so there might have been a tiny

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<v Speaker 1>bit of that too, But I'm honest with myself when

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<v Speaker 1>I reflect on it, to look at that, and you know,

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<v Speaker 1>it is what it is. I'm not sorry about.

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<v Speaker 2>It, but well, you do what you can with the

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<v Speaker 2>tools you have at the time that you have them.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, is that something I said to you, because

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<v Speaker 1>I feel like I've said that to.

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<v Speaker 2>You probably something along those lines, but really to take it.

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<v Speaker 1>That was one of my not bad parenting moments. No,

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<v Speaker 1>I wasn't a bad parent.

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<v Speaker 2>Now you're a good parent.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, thank you for sharing that, Terry.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, I hope it helps somebody. I mean, I hope

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<v Speaker 1>you know all of our you know, but I kind

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<v Speaker 1>of like laugh that off because I do believe what

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<v Speaker 1>you said. Say that again, Uh, you.

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<v Speaker 2>Do what you can with the tools you have at

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<v Speaker 2>the time that you have them.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And I think that actually should be on a

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<v Speaker 1>shirt because what hearing that deeply and sort of considering

0:12:38.720 --> 0:12:41.079
<v Speaker 1>what that means is that we should all be giving

0:12:41.120 --> 0:12:47.200
<v Speaker 1>ourselves a bigger break for what we haven't done right

0:12:47.760 --> 0:12:51.080
<v Speaker 1>in the time that we did it. You know that

0:12:51.080 --> 0:12:53.319
<v Speaker 1>that we might feel like, oh I could have done

0:12:53.360 --> 0:12:57.240
<v Speaker 1>that better. I wish that had been different. And I

0:12:57.280 --> 0:13:01.439
<v Speaker 1>really do think that that is true. You know, part

0:13:01.480 --> 0:13:05.440
<v Speaker 1>of the joy of being human is growing and changing

0:13:06.200 --> 0:13:11.920
<v Speaker 1>and learning and becoming better and and so you can't

0:13:11.920 --> 0:13:14.240
<v Speaker 1>be mad at yourself about what you weren't able to

0:13:14.280 --> 0:13:17.680
<v Speaker 1>do fifteen years ago because you didn't have the tools. Yeah.

0:13:17.800 --> 0:13:20.040
<v Speaker 3>I think that's great advice. I think that's great advice

0:13:20.080 --> 0:13:22.679
<v Speaker 3>for life. I think that's great advice when you're trying

0:13:22.679 --> 0:13:25.400
<v Speaker 3>to get yourself out of a relationship and not knowing

0:13:25.480 --> 0:13:29.880
<v Speaker 3>how to gracefully do that. And so thank you for

0:13:29.920 --> 0:13:31.560
<v Speaker 3>adding another tool to my tool belt.

0:13:31.559 --> 0:13:34.880
<v Speaker 1>TV Mom TV Mom, TV Mom.

0:13:34.960 --> 0:13:37.040
<v Speaker 2>That's my favorite thing of it too. I'm jealous. I

0:13:37.080 --> 0:13:39.880
<v Speaker 2>can't say it well, you get mom.

0:13:40.640 --> 0:13:42.920
<v Speaker 1>Real mom. Okay, so this is TV Mom and real

0:13:43.000 --> 0:13:45.240
<v Speaker 1>Mom saying goodbye and good luck.

0:13:45.160 --> 0:13:47.600
<v Speaker 2>Now until next week.

0:13:48.120 --> 0:13:50.200
<v Speaker 3>We will not be breaking up with you because we

0:13:50.320 --> 0:13:52.320
<v Speaker 3>are desperately devoted to you