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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you missed in History Class, a production

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Speaker 1: of iHeartRadio Habby Friday. I'm Tracy B. Wilson and I'm

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Speaker 1: Holly Frye. I'm hoping that at this moment I have

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Speaker 1: safely returned home from a successful trip to see the

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Speaker 1: total solar eclipse a bunch of us. As we're recording this,

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Speaker 1: we're going to go to Texas. By the time it

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Speaker 1: comes out, we will have gone to Texas and come back.

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Speaker 1: We selected a place in the path of totality that

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Speaker 1: seemed like it had a better chance of not having

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Speaker 1: cloud cover than like the parts of New England that

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Speaker 1: the path of totality is going to go through, which

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Speaker 1: would been much closer, and also places that we felt

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Speaker 1: like we could get to in a reasonable way to

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Speaker 1: do this last time total solar eclipse. Same essentially group

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Speaker 1: of people. We went to Columbia, Missouri, and it was great,

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Speaker 1: and we did have a little bit of cloud cover

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Speaker 1: that was making us nervous, but the clouds cleared over

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Speaker 1: the sun just in time for totality to happen. And

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Speaker 1: this is why I don't really get behind the criticisms

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Speaker 1: of the people who were like, well, this five eighty

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Speaker 1: five BCE eclipse would have been so late in the

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Speaker 1: day probably they wouldn't have even noticed that the eclipse happened.

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Speaker 1: I think they would have noticed because the total solar

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Speaker 1: eclipse did not feel like a cloud covering up the Sun. No,

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Speaker 1: I have another thought, but keep going. Yeah, okay. The

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Speaker 1: comparison between the eclipsed sun and not eclipsed son was

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Speaker 1: a lot more dramatic than like a cloud blue in,

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Speaker 1: even a big cloud blue in or a storm blue in.

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Speaker 1: It became really eerily quiet, and then nighttime animals started

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Speaker 1: making nighttime noises. It was really one of the It

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Speaker 1: was just like a profound experience. This is fascinating to me. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I don't get moved by them like that. Well have

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Speaker 1: you I have gone and traveled. Oh yes, okay, and

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Speaker 1: I'm like neat. Yeah, and it's neat. But that's like

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Speaker 1: then I'm ready to rock and roll. It's time to go.

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Speaker 1: But I love that people get so excited about it.

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Speaker 1: It's just one of those things where I'm like cool,

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Speaker 1: because I love astronomy and stuff. You would think I

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Speaker 1: would be like you, guys, everybody shut up, this is

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Speaker 1: really important. But well, it's not a sculpture. It's not

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Speaker 1: a piece of art. Vishal Lebron did not touch it.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, that's I don't know. And I also like

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Speaker 1: I do, especially in the wintertime, Like in the wintertime,

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Speaker 1: a lot of times I will try to hike at

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Speaker 1: the warmest point of the day, which a lot of

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Speaker 1: times is going to be in the late afternoon. So

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Speaker 1: a lot of times I am returning home from hiking

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Speaker 1: as the sun is setting. And I still think, I

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Speaker 1: still think that would have been something that would have

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Speaker 1: been noticeable. So I just like, just me personally, I

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Speaker 1: don't really agree with the argument that like probably the

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Speaker 1: armies would not have noticed an eclipse, if eclipse if

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Speaker 1: it was starting late in the day towards unde sunset.

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Speaker 1: Now this is where my other thought comes in, Okay,

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Speaker 1: because I hear you it is a dramatic like visual thing,

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Speaker 1: but you're not fighting hand to hand combat when you're

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Speaker 1: seeing them. I guess that's also true. Like that's that's

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Speaker 1: the mitigator for me, is like if I were engaged

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Speaker 1: in combat, I would be like, cool, it's dark. I

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Speaker 1: don't have time to look at that, like I might die.

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Speaker 1: But I don't know enough about how how their flavor

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Speaker 1: of combat played out to know how much of that

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Speaker 1: really was like what I'm envisioning largely from film and

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Speaker 1: occasional woodcuts, versus like if they were just sitting around

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Speaker 1: waiting for the next maneuver, Right, I don't know that

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Speaker 1: would be that would be the shifter in that one.

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Speaker 1: But I don't know. I guess yeah. Well, and then

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Speaker 1: there's also the argument of like, there probably wasn't an

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Speaker 1: eclipse like that. Some of the papers that I read

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Speaker 1: doing research for this were very stride. They were like,

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Speaker 1: the eclipse is a fiction. Yeah. I have more questions,

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Speaker 1: but they're kind of personal in nature, and you might

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Speaker 1: not want to answer them on the show. Well, we

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Speaker 1: can clut them out if okay, because this is pure curiosity.

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Speaker 1: I'm just I have been peppering portracy with questions today

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Speaker 1: for I don't know if I'm just super tired, so

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Speaker 1: I've become a toddler and I have a million ques.

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Speaker 1: When you say an eclipse for you is a very

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Speaker 1: profound experience, like profound in what way? Like what is

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Speaker 1: your takeaway? Do you feel differently about the world or

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Speaker 1: the cosmos in your place in it? Or is it

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Speaker 1: profound just in like the starkness of its difference from

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Speaker 1: day to day life. So I will confess that when

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Speaker 1: I was in maybe third grade, there was a total

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Speaker 1: annular eclipse that crossed North Carolina right where we lived,

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Speaker 1: in the path of totality. And if I'm remembering this correctly,

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Speaker 1: this happened during the school day. We all went outside

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Speaker 1: and watched it with little pinhole cameras made of index cards.

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Speaker 1: I also remember another solar eclipse that I feel like

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Speaker 1: was maybe a partial solar eclipse that we did something

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Speaker 1: similar in the yard at home because it was not

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Speaker 1: a school day. Neither of those when I was a

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Speaker 1: child really struck me as anything impressive at all, and

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Speaker 1: I was like, as I don't know why you're out

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Speaker 1: here making me look at these things through index cards.

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Speaker 1: It's a shadow like why why I could be playing. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So then this one that was in twenty seventeen, which

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Speaker 1: a group of us went to Columbia, Missouri together, I

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Speaker 1: was sort of like, this just theme seems like a

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Speaker 1: cool thing to do. At that point, I had not

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Speaker 1: seen an actual total solar eclipse within the path of totality,

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Speaker 1: and I had just seen this total annular eclipse before

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Speaker 1: which that makes like a ring around there's still a

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Speaker 1: ring of sun visible, and so I kind of went

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Speaker 1: sort of like feeling like it would be a fun

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Speaker 1: thing to do, an interesting and we went out to

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Speaker 1: this It was sort of a wildlife preservation area and

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Speaker 1: it was a whole group of us together. The people

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Speaker 1: that I was with were all people who were very

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Speaker 1: interested in what we were doing. One person background in

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Speaker 1: a related field, gotcha, so like to this person personally,

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Speaker 1: I think would have been particularly affected. So some of

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Speaker 1: it was witnessing all the things that happened when the

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Speaker 1: sun disappeared, right because we had picked a point, we

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Speaker 1: were close to the longest duration of the totality, so

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Speaker 1: there was enough time in the state of totality that

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Speaker 1: like interesting things happened around us involving how the animals

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Speaker 1: behaved to what we were doing. And then part of

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Speaker 1: it was also like how much it struck other people

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Speaker 1: that I was with, So I sort of by osmosis, right,

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Speaker 1: you're part of the group dynamic. Yeah, And then also

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Speaker 1: there's just the part of like witnessing this thing where

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Speaker 1: these the fact that we have eclipses. It all only

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Speaker 1: happens because of the position of the moon and the

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Speaker 1: Earth and our relation to the sun, and if if

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Speaker 1: that alignment was not what it is, we would not

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Speaker 1: have them. So yeah, it was a lot of stuff together, gotcha, gotcha. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it just feels momentous. Yeah. I will also just have

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Speaker 1: a note that I did try to find good pronunciation

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Speaker 1: guidance for this episode, and boy, like some things I

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Speaker 1: found Greek pronunciations for don't actually know whether the Greek

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Speaker 1: pronunciation now would be remotely like right, the Greek pronunciation then.

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Speaker 1: And also they were names of people that weren't necessarily

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Speaker 1: in Greek to start with. And then similarly, sometimes there

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Speaker 1: are Latin pronunciations that's maybe totally different, and then you'll

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Speaker 1: have English pronunciations, and then sometimes just no pronunciations by

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Speaker 1: anyone reputable seeming to say anything about any of this.

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Speaker 1: So like, we did try, but I'm not gonna say

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Speaker 1: that anything that we did would pass some kind of scrutiny.

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Speaker 1: I say, a person who's say entire PhD is about,

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Speaker 1: you know, this region of the world in the sixth

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Speaker 1: century BC. Right, Well, I mean we have talked about

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Speaker 1: pronunciation so many times, and it also comes down to you.

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Speaker 1: I bet during the sixth century bce. Not everybody said

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Speaker 1: it the same way. Yeah, yeah, we have. We We've

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Speaker 1: gotten some pronunciation corrections recently from things that I'm like,

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Speaker 1: I'm not sure what you are trying to tell me,

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Speaker 1: because there are two at least pronunciations for the thing

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Speaker 1: that you are rhyming it with, and I don't know

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Speaker 1: which you are mirking with. Yeah, yeah, I mean that

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Speaker 1: happens all the time. It's Yeah, there's a fun thing

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Speaker 1: I've probably mentioned before, uh for my Star Wars dork,

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Speaker 1: but Dave Felony, who is I forget his exact title,

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Speaker 1: but he's, you know, the Grand Pooba of Star Wars

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Speaker 1: creativity at this point. But he started doing a thing

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Speaker 1: that I found really fascinating and kind of cool. Which

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Speaker 1: is it like if he's being interviewed and a thing

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Speaker 1: comes up that people have pronounced differently in Star Wars

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Speaker 1: at various times in the course of the interview, he'll

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Speaker 1: use both pronunciations. I love this because he's like they're

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Speaker 1: both valid, and I like, that's fine, we all know

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Speaker 1: what we're talking about. And I was like, oh, this

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Speaker 1: is very genius. Yeah yeah, yeah. Some of the things

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Speaker 1: we hear from folks about I are sort of equivalent

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Speaker 1: to like the word wat er. Most of us in

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Speaker 1: the US say it sort of similarly to water, right,

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Speaker 1: which has a D in it and not a T,

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Speaker 1: which is not how it's spelled. But then there's like

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Speaker 1: variations on just that, Like there are people that say

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Speaker 1: it more like water. Yeah, well I can't even do it.

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Speaker 1: Uh so, Yeah, there's just there's so much difference in

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Speaker 1: accents and how people's mouths work. I will once again

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Speaker 1: invoke the great Facebook crayon war. Oh, people got so mad,

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Speaker 1: which we had to. That word came up on a

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Speaker 1: recent episode and it was on me and I was like,

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Speaker 1: oh gosh, I hope this doesn't happen again. I know

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Speaker 1: everybody says it differently. I say it crayon. My spouse

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Speaker 1: says it closer to cryon, which is the pronunciation people

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Speaker 1: got the most angry about when they were fighting about

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Speaker 1: the pronunciation of crayon on our Facebook. This is so

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Speaker 1: long ago, but was so dramatic. We both still remember

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Speaker 1: it was. Really I was just like I did because

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Speaker 1: we had done one on the history of Krayola creons,

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Speaker 1: and I certainly didn't know what an incendi or topic. Well,

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Speaker 1: I think the only thing that's happened recently that even

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Speaker 1: compares to that is the fight p people had about

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Speaker 1: whether The Velveteen Rabbit is an appropriate book for children

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Speaker 1: and whether you should interpret it in a way that

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Speaker 1: is happy or sad, and people got verbally violent about it.

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Speaker 1: People feel ways about things. They sure do, they sure do,

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Speaker 1: thats what's up? I'm you know. I always go the

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Speaker 1: hippie route of like, both points are valid. Yes, we

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Speaker 1: can all say it however we want, because nine times

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Speaker 1: out of ten in context is perfectly clear what you're

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Speaker 1: talking about. To just understand what the person meant, then

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Speaker 1: mission accomplished. I also just love the variance of audio

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Speaker 1: musicality of people saying things different ways. Oh me too,

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Speaker 1: I think it's beautiful. Often when I'm like, oh, that's

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Speaker 1: how you say that. That sounds pretty indifferent than the

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Speaker 1: way I say it, or like, ooh that sounds really

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Speaker 1: forceful and different than the way I've ever heard it.

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Speaker 1: I love those Yeah, yeah, not everybody does. No. I

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Speaker 1: follow a bunch of through hikers on TikTok because while

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Speaker 1: I do not think I will ever through hike anything

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Speaker 1: difficult myself, I do like to watch other people doing

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Speaker 1: it and the different ways the people will say the

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Speaker 1: thing I say as the Appalachian Trail, and sometimes fighting words. Yes,

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Speaker 1: sometimes there will be people that talk about how they're

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Speaker 1: on day fourteen, and a lot of them I've noticed

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Speaker 1: just start saying the at so that they won't have

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Speaker 1: to deal with it. But like, no matter how anybody

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Speaker 1: says it, there will be a bunch of people in

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Speaker 1: the comments being ugly about it. And I'm like, this

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Speaker 1: person is walking, do you understand how far they are

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Speaker 1: going to walk? What if this was not what we

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Speaker 1: were focused on? I feel like this, I mean, we're

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Speaker 1: getting now into the shades of like why do people

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Speaker 1: have to yell at each other on the internet? But

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Speaker 1: like my variation on this recently, it's not about pronunciation

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Speaker 1: but about various cooking accounts and like the refusal to

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Speaker 1: acknowledge that people have different taste oh, in different ways

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Speaker 1: of preparing things right, And it'll be like, I'm listen,

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Speaker 1: if you ever just are bored and need entertainment and

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Speaker 1: like your television's broken, go to the New York Times

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Speaker 1: cooking post and watch people yell at each other under

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Speaker 1: them because it's literally like it's not even like ooh,

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Speaker 1: I didn't like this. It's like I made this and

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Speaker 1: it was garbage and I hate you and I'm not subscribing.

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Speaker 1: Like it literally escalates to this like wild level in seconds.

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Speaker 1: And then you know, if someone goes, I made this

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Speaker 1: and I actually thought it was pretty good, there's a

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Speaker 1: herd of people who want to tell them that they

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Speaker 1: clearly have the palette of like a badger and they

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Speaker 1: shouldn't be allowed in a kitchen. And like it's never

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Speaker 1: just like, oh, I don't that doesn't work for me.

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Speaker 1: It's always like, and you are a monster and you're bad. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: you probably cook with crayons. I know. This is one

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Speaker 1: of the ways that I feel really conflicted about like

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Speaker 1: where we are and the ability to communicate with each other,

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Speaker 1: because I think the Internet and social media have made

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Speaker 1: it possible for people who did not have a community

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Speaker 1: before to find a community. Yeah, but it's also made

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Speaker 1: it so much easier to just be ugly, and ugliness

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Speaker 1: is such a big part of like the internet culture

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Speaker 1: at this point, and I don't love it. I'm like, hey,

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Speaker 1: what if we all remembered we're all on the same

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Speaker 1: planet with the same sun and the same moon. We're

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Speaker 1: all here together. We're all trapped on one rock hurdling

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Speaker 1: through space. Be cool, and that's where we'll end this half.

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Speaker 1: We talked about Milton Bradley and the Checkered Game of

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Speaker 1: Life this week. Yep, there have been so many versions

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Speaker 1: of this game, even in the modern versions where I'm like, yikes, yeah,

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Speaker 1: there was on the original. On some of the original

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Speaker 1: versions there was a square you could land on that

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Speaker 1: kind of encouraged things like playing the stock market and

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Speaker 1: speculation that got taken off. And even in the modern ones,

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Speaker 1: I remember, and then I thought I may have misremembered

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Speaker 1: and been experiencing a cerebral event something that I then

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Speaker 1: went and looked at ads, and it was in the ads,

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Speaker 1: which is that you used to get sent to a

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Speaker 1: poor farm, which is sucky. That's yeah, the whole thing

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Speaker 1: is sucky. The newer versions of Life are a trip

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Speaker 1: because like, you don't get cash you used to, like

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Speaker 1: I remember Life being one of those games like Monopoly

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Speaker 1: where you would get lots of paper involved, and now

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Speaker 1: the newer ones have you get like a debit card essentially,

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Speaker 1: and it's like I think they even have a partnership

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Speaker 1: with Visa. Yeah, and it's like about They always say

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Speaker 1: that it is about teaching kids financial responsibility, but it's

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Speaker 1: also like, I don't know, the whole thing is weird anymore.

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Speaker 1: I don't think we played a lot of the Game

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Speaker 1: of Life. I mean I have played it before, but

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Speaker 1: I feel like it was a game that like somebody

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Speaker 1: who baby sat us at or something like. I don't

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Speaker 1: think it was a game we had at home. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean I wonder too, because like the Game of Life, historically,

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Speaker 1: as we grew up playing, it was very gendered. Right.

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Speaker 1: You had a car that was either pink or blue

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Speaker 1: if you were a boy or a girl, and you

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Speaker 1: had little pegs that represented you and the other people

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Speaker 1: in your family that were all either pink or blue

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Speaker 1: for the same reasons. And I'm like, that's not really

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Speaker 1: today that I mean, are there other colors I haven't investigated.

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Speaker 1: I don't have no idea, But I also one. I

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Speaker 1: did love the ad campaigns for the Game of Life

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Speaker 1: because they're preposterously funny. Right, It's like a ten year

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Speaker 1: old going I had twins and just like a lot

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah. I also just have the get Lucky with

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Speaker 1: the Game of Life jingle on in my head on repeat.

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Speaker 1: The whole time we've been recording this. Oh yeah, mine

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Speaker 1: is you can be a winner at the Game of Life.

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Speaker 1: Oh I forgot that one. I love that one. That

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Speaker 1: was my favorite, even though the actual ad is probably

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Speaker 1: one of my less favorites in terms of how it

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Speaker 1: plays out. But it's very funny. I will say this though,

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Speaker 1: which makes me sound like I was a ruthless child,

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Speaker 1: and I was in some ways because I did not

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Speaker 1: want to play the Game of Life. Okay, I was

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Speaker 1: a monopoly kid because I wanted to destroy all I wanted.

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Speaker 1: I was that monster child that wanted to build up

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Speaker 1: every one of my properties to the point where like

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Speaker 1: Dubai would look on with envy. And then I wanted

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Speaker 1: to charge people. I remember charging somebody who did not

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Speaker 1: have the money to pay me when they landed on

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Speaker 1: my square. I was like, you can keep playing. I'm

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Speaker 1: not going to bank, but you will be racking up interest.

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Speaker 1: What a monstrous kid. So I in my memory, my

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Speaker 1: paternal grandmother had two board games at her house when

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Speaker 1: my brother, cousin and I were of the age to

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Speaker 1: play them, and those were Battleship and Monopoly, and my brother, no,

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Speaker 1: my cousin, and I would gang up on my brother.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, alliances and and upset him so much. Sorry, sorry, Matt,

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Speaker 1: I'm very sorry that that Rad and I were so

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Speaker 1: bad to you playing Monopoly as children. I feel like

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Speaker 1: that's always how it went. It was always me and

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Speaker 1: my cousin ganging up on my brother, and then my

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Speaker 1: grandmother would be like, y'a'll be nice. But that's not

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Speaker 1: how that works. Those don't foster niceness. No. Well, and

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Speaker 1: that whole game has its own story of it being

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Speaker 1: a game originally that was about the grossness of capitalism

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Speaker 1: that then became a game that celebrates capitalism. There's a

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Speaker 1: whole that's a whole other story. Yeah, there's lots of

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Speaker 1: other work out there on there. That article from The

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Speaker 1: New Yorker that Jim Lapour wrote, who is a history professor,

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Speaker 1: made an interesting point that I hadn't considered about the

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Speaker 1: game of life, which is that you're not the way

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Speaker 1: you're competing with other players is not in a way

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Speaker 1: that directly impacts them. You're on your own journey and

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Speaker 1: you're just trying to get through your stuff fastest, unlike

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Speaker 1: something like Monopoly, where it is a little more ruthless

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Speaker 1: and like you're trying to take down other people, and

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Speaker 1: I was like, oh, that's an interesting thing I had

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Speaker 1: not thought about. Although, of course, in the actual game

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Speaker 1: of real world life, if your only goal is to

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Speaker 1: acquire wealth, you are probably going to take down other people.

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Speaker 1: That's a different matter. And there are also a number

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Speaker 1: of awesome board games that are cooperative and everyone and

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Speaker 1: playing is working together to achieva goal. Yes, yeah, that's

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Speaker 1: I feel like. That is how I like to play

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Speaker 1: video games now. Like I don't love the games where

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Speaker 1: you just drop in and get you know, destroyed by

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Speaker 1: somebody randomly, right, I really like the ones for a while.

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Speaker 1: When when the first version of Battlefront two is out,

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Speaker 1: I'm almost reluctant to bring up Battlefront because it's going

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Speaker 1: through a little rough moment right now. But they used

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Speaker 1: to have a setting that was called Play All Maps,

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Speaker 1: and basically Brian and I would make sure we run

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Speaker 1: the same team. We would hit play All Maps and

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Speaker 1: we would spend like four hours just running around the

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Speaker 1: Star Wars universe together, you know, trying to shoot droids,

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Speaker 1: which was a very good date night for us. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I would like to do those again, but yeah,

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Speaker 1: I don't. I don't so much want to fight with

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Speaker 1: my friends in games the way I did when I

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Speaker 1: was a kid. Now I've gotten to be such a

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Speaker 1: hippie as an adult and like everybody be kind. Who

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Speaker 1: can adopt the most cats? That will be my board game. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: We So there's a game. I think it's called The

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Speaker 1: Tea Dragon Society. I'm doing this for memory, and it's

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Speaker 1: been a while since I've played. But it is a game.

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Speaker 1: You have these little dragons and tea. It is a

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Speaker 1: card game. And I was playing it with some friends

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Speaker 1: and three of us were interested in, you know, having

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Speaker 1: a good time with these adorable dragons and their tea

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Speaker 1: and flowers and et cetera. And Friend number four sort

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Speaker 1: of created an engine like he was actually playing the game,

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Speaker 1: like playing it to win. He created an engine with

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Speaker 1: the cards so that every turn he got all of

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Speaker 1: the stuff. And we were just like, we are not

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Speaker 1: we do not have the same goal for our This

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Speaker 1: is not the same game. Noh. So anyway, I don't

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Speaker 1: do many board games these days, not for lack of interest.

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Speaker 1: It's just hard to like find a time when people

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Speaker 1: I would want to play with can all be in

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Speaker 1: the same place. Right. Uh, you know, we're all a

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Speaker 1: little probably silly levels of busy, but maybe maybe that

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Speaker 1: will be a mid year resolution for me. I'll add in, Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I do. I do play some board So we've gotten

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Speaker 1: requests for a history of board games episode that's like going,

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Speaker 1: can I get a history of the sun? Yeah, and

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Speaker 1: big this is maybe gonna be ironic since we just

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Speaker 1: I just wrote six impossible episodes on etiquette manuals, which

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Speaker 1: was like, admittedly from the beginning, like this is a

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Speaker 1: very eurocentric etiquette manual thing. I feel like it would

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Speaker 1: be a huge disservice to that topic to have it

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Speaker 1: be really eurocentric. And I also don't feel like it's

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Speaker 1: possible to be more global with it and have it

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Speaker 1: fit into an episode. There's so much so like that

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Speaker 1: is something that I've thought about and that's where I

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Speaker 1: landed on it. Yeah, that's tricky. I hope if this

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Speaker 1: is your weekend coming up, that you get to maybe

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Speaker 1: play a game with somebody that you like playing with

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Speaker 1: and that has similar objectives and approaches to those games

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Speaker 1: to you. If it's not your time off coming up,

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Speaker 1: we hope that you still get to have a good

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Speaker 1: time and maybe play a game. Sometimes I can fit

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Speaker 1: a game in on a weeknight. If you are trucking

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Speaker 1: along through life and getting relaxation and being kind, we

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Speaker 1: hope you reach happy old age. We will be right

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Speaker 1: back here again tomorrow with a classic, and then on

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Speaker 1: Monday there will be another brand new episode. Stuff You

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Speaker 1: Missed in History Class is a production of iHeartRadio. For

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Speaker 1: more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

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Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.