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Speaker 1: And here to take us through these employment numbers for

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Speaker 1: this week, we welcome our very special contributor, Larry Summers

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Speaker 1: of Harvard. So, Larry, more jobs were created than expected

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Speaker 1: and unemployment was lower than expected. How do you interpret.

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Speaker 2: Them, David? These were good numbers.

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Speaker 3: They showed an economy that, at least as of November,

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Speaker 3: was still looking pretty robust. Some of the greatest fears

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Speaker 3: that the economy was turning over certainly looked to have

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Speaker 3: been falsified by this number. The fact that average hourly

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Speaker 3: earnings were running running at four tenths of a percent,

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Speaker 3: a bit more than was expected, reinforces my sense that

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Speaker 3: people need to be careful about declaring the war against

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Speaker 3: inflation as having been one.

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Speaker 2: They need to be nervous.

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Speaker 3: About what could happen from supply shocks, from other adverse development.

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Speaker 3: But I read these as a pretty favorable.

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Speaker 2: Number.

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Speaker 3: They certainly make a soft landing look more in play,

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Speaker 3: although I certainly think it would be a mistake to

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Speaker 3: treat a soft landing as something we can take for

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Speaker 3: granted or be confidence about.

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Speaker 2: What do they say to the Fed?

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Speaker 1: Do you think, Larry, Because on the one hand, you say, boy,

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Speaker 1: this is a pretty robust labor economy, we don't need

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Speaker 1: to cut too soon, and people were expecting some cuts.

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Speaker 1: And as you say, on inflation, there are some indications

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Speaker 1: inflation is ticking back up. We have a lane of

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Speaker 1: FED that says that, and you miss consumer in a

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Speaker 1: sentiment this week indicated that it really dropped the consumer

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Speaker 1: expectations for inflation for one year out look.

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Speaker 2: I think the Fed's got to be very careful.

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Speaker 3: Progress has been made about against inflation, but they've got

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Speaker 3: to make sure that it keeps being made, and they've

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Speaker 3: got to make sure that once it's made, it's entrenched

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Speaker 3: and locked in. And I think this will make it

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Speaker 3: easier for them to do that. They've got a very

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Speaker 3: tricky problem at the FED because whenever people conclude that.

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Speaker 2: It's looking good that we're not going to need more.

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Speaker 3: Rat increases, they long rates come way down, and the

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Speaker 3: stock market has a tendency to go up, and that

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Speaker 3: then undoes some of the tightening that they have already

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Speaker 3: put in place. So I think it's very hard to

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Speaker 3: know what's going to happen. I still think the market

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Speaker 3: is a bit overpricing how much easing the Fed's going

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Speaker 3: to decide it can prudently undertake, but those issues are

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Speaker 3: very much at the margin, unlike this situation we had

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Speaker 3: a couple of years ago where it seemed to me

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Speaker 3: the FED was very far, very far off. So I

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Speaker 3: think the Fed's in broadly the right place of watchful waiting.

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Speaker 3: But the moment they turn or announced they're going to turn,

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Speaker 3: is going to be a seismic moment, and for that reason,

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Speaker 3: they probably need to be very deliberative and careful about

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Speaker 3: getting to that point and waiting until they see some

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Speaker 3: overwhelming evidence of inflation being locked in low or see

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Speaker 3: some real evidence of the economy turning over. And I

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Speaker 3: don't think we have either of those at this point.

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Speaker 1: Len just turn this out and it's very much in

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Speaker 1: the news once again this week, and you have spoken

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Speaker 1: out about it. And that is the rise of antisemitism,

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Speaker 1: at least on some college campuses. We had the three

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Speaker 1: university presidents go down and appear in Congress from your

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Speaker 1: own Harvard, as well as MIT and pen And if

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Speaker 1: they meant to put an end to this, they certainly

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Speaker 1: did not succeed. As of right now, it looks like

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Speaker 1: if anything, got to be more so. But this is

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Speaker 1: one of my questions you ran Harvard, you're a president there,

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Speaker 1: but you also were at very senior levels in the government.

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Speaker 1: When things start to go off the rails, when you

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Speaker 1: start to lose control of the narrative, how do you

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Speaker 1: get it back. Because we have everybody now wanting to

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Speaker 1: run universities for the college presidents, whether it's congress is,

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Speaker 1: whether the contributors, or whatever, how do you regain control

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Speaker 1: of the narrative.

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Speaker 3: I think this is as difficult a moment for elite

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Speaker 3: higher education as any moment since the Vietnam War period,

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Speaker 3: perhaps more difficult. I think everybody needs to take a

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Speaker 3: bit of a deep breath. I've had considerable sympathy with

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Speaker 3: some of the things that have been saying said by

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Speaker 3: both people in the government and by some of the

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Speaker 3: billionaires some of the donors to these universities. But even

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Speaker 3: when the concerns are warranted, it's very important for us

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Speaker 3: to remember that if universities start being run by politicians

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Speaker 3: or by small groups of large donors, that's going to

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Speaker 3: be a very problematic thing over time for the American

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Speaker 3: university system, which is a huge source of.

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Speaker 2: Strength for our country.

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Speaker 3: That said, David, we have to recognize that there's been

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Speaker 3: a double standard in how incidents of racism have been

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Speaker 3: regarded in the past, Incidents of what people call micro aggressions,

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Speaker 3: incidents of things that make people feel hurt or sensitive

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Speaker 3: have been regarded in the past, and the way things

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Speaker 3: that are abhorrent to the sensibilities of so many of

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Speaker 3: us have been regarded in the.

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Speaker 2: Last several months.

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Speaker 3: And that double standard, which in different ways has been

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Speaker 3: present on many campuses, creates an extremely difficult situation. I

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Speaker 3: do not side with those who believe that the answer

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Speaker 3: is simply to ratchet up the protections and condemnations of

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Speaker 3: speech which is offensive, to include Jewish students more fully

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Speaker 3: in what has happened in the past. Indeed, I think

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Speaker 3: a substantial part of what we're seeing is in a

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Speaker 3: way related to errors that have in taking place in

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Speaker 3: the past, where there has been a tendency to adopt

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Speaker 3: as norms certain ideologies that regard themselves as very progressive.

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Speaker 3: And so I think we all need to step back,

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Speaker 3: and it's not going to get done in a week

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Speaker 3: or a month, and think about the task of norm setting.

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Speaker 2: And I use that.

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Speaker 3: Word very carefully, David, because I think if you're debating

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Speaker 3: whether people get to say the violence things, with or

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Speaker 3: without being punished, you've lost. The real challenge is to

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Speaker 3: create a climate where people don't want to say those things.

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Speaker 2: And that's a.

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Speaker 3: Matter of moral leadership, it's a matter of guidance. In part,

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Speaker 3: it's a matter of education.

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Speaker 2: Now, look at.

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Speaker 3: A number of the schools that were represented at that hearing.

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Speaker 2: How many thoughtful.

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Speaker 3: Dialogues have been convened by their leaders with leading experts

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Speaker 3: from around the world to discuss these things in front

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Speaker 3: of students. Not very many, as best I can tell, Larry.

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Speaker 2: Really food for thought.

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Speaker 1: Thank you so much. That's our special contribuity to here

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Speaker 1: on Wall Street is Larry Somers of Harvard