WEBVTT - First Comes Love, Then Comes Marriage 0:00:00.480 --> 0:00:05.120 Hell I Suck at Dating with Dear Haven and I 0:00:05.280 --> 0:00:12.080 heard radio podcast What's Up? Everyone? Welcome to an all 0:00:12.119 --> 0:00:16.480 new episode of Help I Suck at Dating. I'm Denglert, 0:00:16.800 --> 0:00:21.720 joined by the beautifully headbanded Jared Haven and his luxury 0:00:21.720 --> 0:00:27.920 apartment in California. Quick quick disclaimer. I just want to 0:00:28.000 --> 0:00:30.560 let everyone know. I'm on the side of a highway 0:00:30.600 --> 0:00:33.480 in northern California. So I might be in and out 0:00:33.760 --> 0:00:37.360 and I might get distracted, but I'm here. We're suck 0:00:37.479 --> 0:00:41.239 army and today it's a new week. Uh, We've got 0:00:41.240 --> 0:00:43.159 a great episode coming in for you, guys. We have 0:00:44.080 --> 0:00:48.560 a very peculiar couple that started a podcast, a couple 0:00:48.640 --> 0:00:52.000 that used to be married got divorced, staying friends and 0:00:52.200 --> 0:00:54.840 coaching people through the divorce that might be going through 0:00:54.840 --> 0:00:58.680 it as well. Um, but before we do all that stuff, Jared, 0:00:58.800 --> 0:01:02.840 how are you. I'm doing well? Man? You know, just uh, 0:01:02.960 --> 0:01:06.520 day by day man, where each day gets a little 0:01:06.520 --> 0:01:09.800 bit worse than the day before. Uh, it's it's it's 0:01:09.800 --> 0:01:15.440 good though. We're you know, we're healthy. Everybody's doing well. Uh. 0:01:15.600 --> 0:01:18.600 Other than that, you know, just grinding through just like 0:01:18.640 --> 0:01:22.520 everybody else is. How are you. I'm good. I'm good. 0:01:23.280 --> 0:01:29.080 Poison Oak setting in really nicely. The van is basically 0:01:29.120 --> 0:01:31.959 taking apart right now. I'm redoing everything inside of it. 0:01:32.080 --> 0:01:35.120 So just trying to make the most of this time 0:01:35.160 --> 0:01:37.399 that we have that we're probably never going to get back, 0:01:37.560 --> 0:01:40.200 you know. I Like there are times where I like 0:01:40.280 --> 0:01:41.880 go through a couple of days and I look back 0:01:41.880 --> 0:01:43.720 on the past like three or four days and I'm like, wow, 0:01:43.760 --> 0:01:46.959 I didn't do anything, was past nine hours. So I'm 0:01:46.959 --> 0:01:48.360 trying to be like a little bit more productive with 0:01:48.400 --> 0:01:51.920 my time. Same. It's hard though, because I have no 0:01:52.080 --> 0:01:54.960 motivation to do anything. When when there's nothing to be done, 0:01:55.120 --> 0:02:00.200 I lose motivation, which is I feel like almost or beat. 0:02:00.200 --> 0:02:02.960 It's very different than Ashley. When Ashley has a lot 0:02:03.040 --> 0:02:05.320 of things to do, she gets tired very quickly, and 0:02:05.320 --> 0:02:07.360 when she has nothing to do, that's when she gets motivated. 0:02:07.360 --> 0:02:09.400 Where I'm the complete opposite. There's nothing to be done. 0:02:10.240 --> 0:02:12.880 I'm I have a tough time moving around, man, like 0:02:12.919 --> 0:02:18.000 I drag ass anyway. Um so yeah, we do have 0:02:18.160 --> 0:02:20.280 a couple of guests that are coming up, Stephanie and 0:02:20.400 --> 0:02:22.280 Eric Spett. They are the host of a brand new 0:02:22.280 --> 0:02:25.760 podcast called Divorce Done Well. They're divorced couple that started 0:02:25.800 --> 0:02:28.520 a podcast about their divorce. So it's pretty interesting stuff. 0:02:28.520 --> 0:02:30.840 So I figured we talked about in the first segment, 0:02:30.840 --> 0:02:33.000 seeing how we're gonna talk about divorce in the second segment. 0:02:33.000 --> 0:02:36.720 We talked about marriage in the first segment. Uh, because 0:02:37.320 --> 0:02:40.639 I'm fascinated by the idea of being married. I kind 0:02:40.639 --> 0:02:42.400 of wish I could get Ashley in here to talk 0:02:42.440 --> 0:02:44.480 about it, because we've talked about on the podcast before. 0:02:44.520 --> 0:02:48.280 How like, I'm not the biggest believer in soulmates, Dean, 0:02:48.320 --> 0:02:51.520 I think you're similar in that one. We're like, you 0:02:51.560 --> 0:02:54.840 don't believe in like this one person that's your predestined 0:02:54.840 --> 0:02:59.639 to be with um and I ah, And I was 0:02:59.680 --> 0:03:03.000 actually reading an article on Psychology Today dot com that's 0:03:03.160 --> 0:03:07.760 it's this woman Shana Springer, was a PhD and something. 0:03:07.800 --> 0:03:10.440 Apparently she goes, soulmates do exist, just not in the 0:03:10.480 --> 0:03:13.560 way we usually think. And her argument is kind of 0:03:13.600 --> 0:03:17.840 similar to mine, where soulmates are are She doesn't think 0:03:17.880 --> 0:03:21.480 that like there's somebody that you find, you know, you're 0:03:21.520 --> 0:03:25.400 perfectly matched soulmate, but she does believe that so like 0:03:25.440 --> 0:03:29.680 your quote unquote, soul mate does exist by like growing 0:03:30.320 --> 0:03:35.000 so much admiration for someone's and like the analogy she 0:03:35.080 --> 0:03:37.640 makes is she says, like, if humans can develop finally 0:03:38.120 --> 0:03:42.400 honed skills and like music, athletics, language, wouldn't it be 0:03:42.480 --> 0:03:46.000 equally possible for them to become perfectly suited and completely 0:03:46.040 --> 0:03:49.280 irreplaceable to their spouses. And I kind of agree with 0:03:49.360 --> 0:03:52.920 that because at least in my own experience with Ashley, 0:03:53.440 --> 0:03:56.880 like from the get go, I wouldn't have thought Ashley 0:03:57.120 --> 0:04:00.520 is my soul mate, but growing so moose to her 0:04:00.560 --> 0:04:03.000 over the past five years and starting off as friends 0:04:03.080 --> 0:04:06.400 and then boyfriend, girlfriend and fiance and now being married 0:04:06.440 --> 0:04:10.360 to her, like I could never imagine my life without her, 0:04:10.520 --> 0:04:13.400 and she's kind of grown to be my soul mate 0:04:13.400 --> 0:04:16.760 because she's irreplaceable to me, and I don't know that 0:04:17.000 --> 0:04:19.600 kind of it's very different than the love that we've 0:04:19.640 --> 0:04:22.000 been taught in our life about how a soulmate is 0:04:22.040 --> 0:04:24.520 someone that you meet who gives you feelings that you've 0:04:24.520 --> 0:04:27.360 never felt before, and it's these sparks that are just 0:04:27.960 --> 0:04:31.640 it's fireworks right off the bat, and this glorious aspect 0:04:31.680 --> 0:04:35.520 of love and and for me, I went through a 0:04:35.600 --> 0:04:39.719 very different process with my now wife, and that doesn't 0:04:39.760 --> 0:04:41.680 mean that she's not my soul mate though, I just 0:04:41.720 --> 0:04:43.839 think I have a different interpretation of a soul mate 0:04:43.839 --> 0:04:46.120 and I was kind of getting I'd love to know your, 0:04:46.960 --> 0:04:51.400 uh perspective on this team. Uh. Well, that's interesting that 0:04:51.480 --> 0:04:53.440 you say that, because I do agree with you that 0:04:54.560 --> 0:04:56.520 Uh well, I guess not agree with but I find 0:04:56.520 --> 0:05:00.640 it surprising that you're saying that because I always thought 0:05:00.680 --> 0:05:02.359 that you were kind of like the big romantic in 0:05:02.360 --> 0:05:05.120 the relationship with you and actually or did Ashley, Let's 0:05:05.120 --> 0:05:07.280 say we asked actually the same question, would she say 0:05:07.360 --> 0:05:09.320 that you were her soulmate when you guys first met 0:05:09.360 --> 0:05:11.600 and she knew it right away? Because I mean, obviously, 0:05:11.640 --> 0:05:14.000 if you watch her and and know her story, which 0:05:14.040 --> 0:05:16.760 we do, she was obviously really really into you at first. 0:05:16.760 --> 0:05:18.360 So do you think that she would call you her 0:05:18.360 --> 0:05:21.280 soul mate from from even back then? I think so. 0:05:21.480 --> 0:05:26.880 And actually perfect timing, Uh, we have uh somebody coming 0:05:26.920 --> 0:05:29.280 into the glam room right now to get her perspective 0:05:29.279 --> 0:05:32.839 on this. Ashley might be or my love, would you 0:05:32.920 --> 0:05:35.440 consider me to be your soul mate right off the bat? 0:05:35.800 --> 0:05:40.560 Did you know from the moment you met me? Um? Well, 0:05:40.600 --> 0:05:43.520 it was love at first sight, so it was definitely 0:05:43.560 --> 0:05:45.640 like I was struck by something that I had never 0:05:45.680 --> 0:05:48.039 felt before, which I know you didn't feel. And I 0:05:48.120 --> 0:05:50.599 just heard you recording. Well, yes, so you heard what 0:05:50.640 --> 0:05:52.680 I said where I said that you've grown into my 0:05:52.680 --> 0:05:55.479 soulmate because I appreciate that, and I like it just 0:05:55.520 --> 0:05:58.120 as much. You like it just as much? Yeah, I 0:05:58.200 --> 0:06:00.160 think so too. Yeah, yeah, I have no problem them 0:06:00.160 --> 0:06:04.640 with that. I like it, Okay, great, Yeah, but like 0:06:04.720 --> 0:06:06.560 for me, like I don't know of it. I don't 0:06:06.560 --> 0:06:08.160 know that I would call it like I realized you 0:06:08.200 --> 0:06:10.520 were my soul mate at first sight. I realized I 0:06:10.880 --> 0:06:12.680 felt like I was in love with you at first sight. 0:06:13.839 --> 0:06:16.799 Does that make sense? Yeah, that makes sense. I wonder 0:06:16.880 --> 0:06:18.800 I guess what soul mate would be even a step up? 0:06:18.880 --> 0:06:21.159 So you could if I was Jared, I would argue 0:06:21.200 --> 0:06:23.960 that you didn't. You could have liked him even more 0:06:24.000 --> 0:06:27.080 than you did. You know, I could have liked Jared 0:06:27.120 --> 0:06:30.080 even more than I did. Yeah, and we all know 0:06:30.200 --> 0:06:33.080 how how good Googaga you are over and at first, 0:06:33.080 --> 0:06:35.279 but you could have even been more like if he 0:06:35.360 --> 0:06:37.520 was your soul mate and you knew it from the 0:06:37.560 --> 0:06:41.000 get go, you would do if any knows that there's 0:06:41.000 --> 0:06:43.000 so many at the get go. I think you need 0:06:43.160 --> 0:06:45.840 a conversation to prove it. It's different than love at 0:06:45.880 --> 0:06:48.000 first sight, because love at first sight is like when 0:06:48.040 --> 0:06:52.400 you're struck by, like you're just struck by somebody, but 0:06:52.480 --> 0:06:55.200 then with a soul mate. I think you at least 0:06:55.240 --> 0:06:58.080 need to have a couple of days of conversation too 0:06:58.720 --> 0:07:01.240 to judge the compative ability. So are you saying that 0:07:01.320 --> 0:07:04.120 you can be in love with someone at first sight 0:07:04.240 --> 0:07:09.080 that's not your soul much? Yeah? I guess that makes sense. Actually, 0:07:09.080 --> 0:07:10.480 you're so wise. Why do you not come on this 0:07:10.520 --> 0:07:14.920 podcast more? I would love to. Yeah, we seriously to 0:07:15.000 --> 0:07:18.400 hear Jared and ize Jared and my different perspectives on 0:07:18.400 --> 0:07:20.600 our own relationship, Which isn't that is that kind of 0:07:21.080 --> 0:07:24.880 counterintuitive everything we've learned growing up about love at first sight. 0:07:25.160 --> 0:07:28.760 I mean, I I feel like every movie, every TV show, 0:07:29.000 --> 0:07:32.280 every book, everything I've ever been told is is that, like, 0:07:32.400 --> 0:07:35.120 love at first sight equates to your soul make no, 0:07:35.280 --> 0:07:37.880 like does not. I've never thought that. I've never thought 0:07:37.960 --> 0:07:40.520 that from movies or whatnot. I do agree with you 0:07:40.560 --> 0:07:43.280 that we're like conditioned to think that true love is 0:07:43.360 --> 0:07:46.440 this thing that you see someone and you know, you 0:07:46.440 --> 0:07:48.200 should know right away that you're gonna spend the rest 0:07:48.240 --> 0:07:50.400 of your life with them, and you should fight tooth 0:07:50.440 --> 0:07:52.600 and nail and never give up to fight for this 0:07:52.680 --> 0:07:55.880 one person that you don't even really know, but you're 0:07:55.920 --> 0:07:58.480 just convinced in your core that it's like the right 0:07:58.480 --> 0:08:01.200 person for you. But then in reality then you like 0:08:01.240 --> 0:08:05.080 try and like to mimic those and echo those, but 0:08:05.160 --> 0:08:07.080 it doesn't happen that way. And then I think that 0:08:07.160 --> 0:08:10.040 kind of maybe like leads to people getting depressed and like, well, 0:08:10.240 --> 0:08:11.960 I saw all these things happen in the movie when 0:08:12.000 --> 0:08:13.440 I was a kid, and now it's not working out 0:08:13.440 --> 0:08:15.080 for me that way, So why that, like what's wrong 0:08:15.120 --> 0:08:17.840 with me? Um? And I think that is what maybe 0:08:17.920 --> 0:08:20.160 leads to it's funny that we're going to have this 0:08:20.160 --> 0:08:22.480 this couple that's divorced, because I think that's what leads 0:08:22.480 --> 0:08:25.160 to divorces. People get so enamored and they like they 0:08:25.200 --> 0:08:28.000 see this like fairy tale type stuff, and then it 0:08:28.000 --> 0:08:31.080 turns out not to be that way, and so that's why, uh, 0:08:31.240 --> 0:08:34.079 you know, splits happen. I agree. I think people confuse 0:08:34.160 --> 0:08:37.720 lust with love and so and then people just act 0:08:37.760 --> 0:08:40.719 too quickly, and I mean, it's it is kind of 0:08:40.760 --> 0:08:43.200 weird though when you think about it, because the media 0:08:43.320 --> 0:08:45.559 age I look this up for getting married in the 0:08:45.640 --> 0:08:49.559 United States is at its highest point. It's thirty years 0:08:49.559 --> 0:08:51.720 old for men and twenty eight years old for women. 0:08:51.760 --> 0:08:53.559 This was back in two thousands and eighteen, according to 0:08:53.720 --> 0:08:57.559 US Census. But the divorce rate is also the highest 0:08:57.840 --> 0:09:00.720 it's ever been, where it says in two thousand fifteen, 0:09:00.720 --> 0:09:03.640 for every one thousand married adults age fifty and older, 0:09:03.800 --> 0:09:07.200 ten had divorced, which is up five and nine. So 0:09:07.200 --> 0:09:10.239 pretty much they're saying the divorce rate has roughly tripled 0:09:10.559 --> 0:09:14.200 since n so people are getting married older in life, 0:09:14.200 --> 0:09:17.080 which in my head would say that leads to a 0:09:17.160 --> 0:09:20.120 happier marriage because you get to learn more about yourself 0:09:20.120 --> 0:09:22.280 in your twenties and then get married in your thirties. 0:09:22.320 --> 0:09:26.439 But at the same time, divorce rates have also tripled, 0:09:26.800 --> 0:09:30.320 so I guess it really just wait, can we go 0:09:30.360 --> 0:09:32.080 back to that divorce that Can you say that that 0:09:32.160 --> 0:09:34.640 one more time? Pretty much the divorce rate has tripled 0:09:34.679 --> 0:09:39.240 since none of the actual numbers per per one thousand people, 0:09:39.679 --> 0:09:43.239 all right, it says that the US marriage rate has declined, 0:09:43.360 --> 0:09:46.520 so actually less people in the United States are getting married. 0:09:46.800 --> 0:09:50.440 Divorce rates have actually increased among older adults, and it 0:09:50.480 --> 0:09:54.120 says in two thousand fifteen, for every one thousand married 0:09:54.200 --> 0:09:59.160 adults aged fifty and older, ten had divorced, which is 0:09:59.280 --> 0:10:02.640 up from five and nights. So pretty much every thousand 0:10:02.640 --> 0:10:07.000 people they get married, ten divorced. Though that number is 0:10:07.160 --> 0:10:10.880 definitely not true. You're telling me one percent of marriages 0:10:10.880 --> 0:10:14.360 and in divorce that is. But this also see this 0:10:14.440 --> 0:10:17.440 is a skewed stat because this also says ages fifty 0:10:17.559 --> 0:10:20.040 and abuff. So if you're already married, if you've been 0:10:20.080 --> 0:10:23.120 married for like however many years, fifteen years, by the 0:10:23.160 --> 0:10:25.920 time you're fifty, you're probably not getting a divorce, even 0:10:25.920 --> 0:10:29.079 though ironically, the two people we have on a podcast 0:10:29.120 --> 0:10:31.600 today we're married for sixteen years and got a divorce, 0:10:31.640 --> 0:10:34.679 So who the hell knows, um, But the point is, 0:10:34.800 --> 0:10:37.240 what I'm saying is that divorce rate is going up. 0:10:37.240 --> 0:10:39.559 But also the median age of people getting married is 0:10:39.679 --> 0:10:43.360 later in life, which would have initially I would have 0:10:43.400 --> 0:10:46.000 thought that if you're getting married later in life, there 0:10:46.000 --> 0:10:48.800 would have been less likelihood of you getting divorced. But 0:10:49.160 --> 0:10:51.199 the divorce rate keeps going up, so I don't know. 0:10:54.200 --> 0:10:57.959 I think maybe in addition to that, people are staying 0:10:58.040 --> 0:11:00.480 young longer, which I think probably has a been impact 0:11:00.520 --> 0:11:03.440 on it, like with technology and social media and stuff, like, 0:11:03.840 --> 0:11:07.800 you know, a thirty year old in I could be 0:11:07.800 --> 0:11:09.760 wrong on this, but a thirty year old twenty is 0:11:09.800 --> 0:11:11.840 a lot younger than a thirty year old in nineteen, 0:11:12.720 --> 0:11:16.120 you know what I mean. But you're right. I do 0:11:16.280 --> 0:11:19.880 think that as the as as the meeting excuse older, 0:11:20.440 --> 0:11:23.080 you would think that the divorceery would go down. But 0:11:23.640 --> 0:11:25.440 I think there's just a lot of other variables that 0:11:25.480 --> 0:11:28.120 come into play, like technology and stuff like that. Like, 0:11:28.679 --> 0:11:31.920 I don't know, it's gonna be interesting because, Uh, one 0:11:31.920 --> 0:11:34.439 of the reasons that I'm like, it's not super pro 0:11:34.679 --> 0:11:37.400 marriage is just because I've seen so many marriages like 0:11:37.440 --> 0:11:44.760 through my friends parents and my parents fail so so horribly. Um. 0:11:44.880 --> 0:11:46.600 But but I think that a lot of like we 0:11:46.760 --> 0:11:48.920 it's it's kind of hard to even hold ourselves to 0:11:48.960 --> 0:11:51.600 the same standards that we do our parents, just because 0:11:51.600 --> 0:11:55.240 we're so generationally different, Like, uh, the way that we're 0:11:55.280 --> 0:11:57.839 brought up is so so different than how they were 0:11:57.840 --> 0:12:00.240 brought up thirty to forty years ago before we were 0:12:00.280 --> 0:12:03.640 even born. You know what I mean. So, um, I 0:12:03.640 --> 0:12:06.079 don't know. It's yeah, it's it's definitely an interesting thing 0:12:06.160 --> 0:12:08.320 to talk about. Yeah, I mean, if you put like 0:12:08.360 --> 0:12:12.480 religious reasons aside, it is funny when you think about marriage, 0:12:12.679 --> 0:12:17.200 because it's like, hey, to prove our love, let's bring 0:12:17.280 --> 0:12:22.880 in the government. It is. It is pretty funny. But 0:12:22.880 --> 0:12:26.120 but I'm excited to talk to both Stephanie and Eric 0:12:26.320 --> 0:12:29.040 about their new podcast, Divorce Done Well, uh, and talk 0:12:29.080 --> 0:12:31.880 about their marriage, their divorce when they knew it was over, 0:12:32.559 --> 0:12:34.720 because I think that's a difficult question to answer, Like, 0:12:34.760 --> 0:12:37.160 how do you know when you've been for sixteen years 0:12:37.160 --> 0:12:38.640 and then all of a sudden you're gonna call it quits. 0:12:38.640 --> 0:12:40.720 That's that's a hard thing to do. So I never 0:12:40.760 --> 0:12:43.840 answered your question. You I never, which I apologize for. 0:12:43.920 --> 0:12:46.920 That's my bad. You asked me if I believe in soulmates? Right, 0:12:47.040 --> 0:12:50.360 Oh yeah, that was the original question. Yeah, I kind 0:12:50.360 --> 0:12:53.840 of just deflected the whole time. Um, I don't know 0:12:53.880 --> 0:12:56.920 if I believe in soulmates. Maybe I'm kind of in 0:12:56.960 --> 0:13:00.400 the same camp as you are with Ashley, where when 0:13:00.440 --> 0:13:04.160 I look at Kalin, I'm like, oh, like I can't 0:13:04.200 --> 0:13:07.040 imagine my life without Kalin, just like you can't imagine 0:13:07.080 --> 0:13:10.240 yours without Ashley. I don't know, necessarily know if that 0:13:10.280 --> 0:13:15.560 makes us soulmates, but I know that I would prefer 0:13:16.080 --> 0:13:18.560 a life with her than I would without her, you 0:13:18.559 --> 0:13:21.080 know what I mean. So it's like, I don't know 0:13:21.080 --> 0:13:23.679 if that makes us soul mates. Maybe we are soulmates. 0:13:23.840 --> 0:13:28.240 I know that. Uh, I don't know. Actually, it's yeah, 0:13:28.240 --> 0:13:30.360 it's such an interesting thing to think about. Well, think 0:13:30.360 --> 0:13:32.200 about it. I want to get it. I want you 0:13:32.240 --> 0:13:33.800 to talk more about it because I think it's an 0:13:33.800 --> 0:13:38.600 interesting topic of conversation, specifically for you because you're in 0:13:38.679 --> 0:13:41.680 a your relationship that's been a little over a year now, 0:13:42.040 --> 0:13:45.320 so it's getting into that category of all texts. Kalin 0:13:45.440 --> 0:13:47.040 right now and ask her if he thinks we're soul mates. 0:13:47.080 --> 0:13:48.520 What do you think she'll say. I don't know, but 0:13:48.559 --> 0:13:51.120 I'm very excited to hear the answer, and hopefully you 0:13:51.160 --> 0:13:52.960 guys are too, So make sure you stick around. We 0:13:53.040 --> 0:13:55.360 have Eric and Stephanie Speck coming up next, and then 0:13:55.440 --> 0:13:58.680 Dean will tell us what Klin says about the question 0:13:59.040 --> 0:14:01.480 if Dean is her fil mate. But first let's take 0:14:01.480 --> 0:14:14.079 a little break, all right, Welcome back to help I 0:14:14.240 --> 0:14:16.880 suck at dating. We have a couple of special guests 0:14:16.920 --> 0:14:18.840 who are on the line right now. They are the 0:14:18.880 --> 0:14:22.880 hosts of the brand new podcast, Divorce Done Well. We 0:14:22.960 --> 0:14:26.760 have the host rate here, Stephanie and Eric Spett. Stephanie 0:14:26.760 --> 0:14:28.520 and Eric, thank you so much for joining us today. 0:14:28.560 --> 0:14:33.880 How are you guys doing? Thanks for having Yeah, thank you. Um, So, 0:14:33.920 --> 0:14:36.280 you guys have this brand new podcast, Divorce Done Well. 0:14:36.560 --> 0:14:38.680 So I would love a little bit of history of 0:14:38.720 --> 0:14:41.880 why you decided to jump into the podcasting world because 0:14:42.320 --> 0:14:44.320 for a little context, which I'd love for you guys 0:14:44.360 --> 0:14:46.320 to talk about, because this is what the podcast in 0:14:46.360 --> 0:14:49.960 our podcast is about two relationships. Is that you Eric 0:14:50.000 --> 0:14:52.760 and Stephanie. You were married and now you are divorced 0:14:52.800 --> 0:14:55.240 and you have kids, and you went through what a 0:14:55.240 --> 0:14:57.680 lot of people go through. And so why did you 0:14:57.720 --> 0:15:04.000 decide to start a podcast? Um talking about that situation? Seven, 0:15:04.040 --> 0:15:07.720 I'll let you take okay. Yeah, So, yes, Divorce Done Well. 0:15:07.840 --> 0:15:10.080 You can follow us by the way, or you can 0:15:10.160 --> 0:15:13.840 listen to us on Apple podcast, Spotify, our websites Divorced 0:15:13.880 --> 0:15:16.480 Done Well dot net. Why did we just decide to 0:15:16.480 --> 0:15:21.680 do a podcast? Well, it was much to my um 0:15:21.720 --> 0:15:23.760 bothering Eric about it. You know, when we were going 0:15:23.840 --> 0:15:26.160 through our divorce, it's not something that we ever I mean, 0:15:26.160 --> 0:15:27.600 I can tell you it's not something that we ever 0:15:28.040 --> 0:15:30.240 thought that we would have done, because getting a divorce 0:15:30.360 --> 0:15:35.480 is really hard. But after we got divorced, we have kids, 0:15:35.600 --> 0:15:38.480 and we both decided that our kids were going to 0:15:38.520 --> 0:15:40.520 be our north star and we were going to focus 0:15:40.520 --> 0:15:42.680 on that, and all the other stuff that sort of 0:15:42.720 --> 0:15:46.600 went into getting a divorce with time kind of went 0:15:46.640 --> 0:15:49.040 by the wayside. And I said to Eric, we're gonna 0:15:49.040 --> 0:15:52.400 get really rich and we're going to get a podcast. 0:15:52.440 --> 0:15:58.320 Not really, but but no, I mean I said to 0:15:58.400 --> 0:16:01.720 my I think that we could offer a service honestly 0:16:01.920 --> 0:16:04.760 that um, I mean, how many divorced couples do you 0:16:04.840 --> 0:16:07.160 know out there that are doing a podcast together. They're 0:16:07.160 --> 0:16:11.440 single women, they're single men, but there's no couple that 0:16:11.480 --> 0:16:14.000 are able to tolerate enough each other enough to have 0:16:14.040 --> 0:16:17.360 a podcast. So it's all came from a good place. 0:16:17.440 --> 0:16:19.880 We were trying to help people, and the funny part 0:16:19.920 --> 0:16:22.000 is that it's really kind of been therapy for us. 0:16:22.240 --> 0:16:24.400 I'm certain you cover this on your podcast, but for 0:16:24.440 --> 0:16:26.600 our listeners that want maybe a little bit more backstory, 0:16:26.920 --> 0:16:30.760 could you share how the divorce even came about, because 0:16:30.800 --> 0:16:33.600 I feel like, you know, obviously we know divorce is 0:16:33.600 --> 0:16:37.680 pretty rampant nowadays. Uh most mostly what we see is 0:16:37.800 --> 0:16:40.280 ending on bad terms. But it sounds like you guys 0:16:40.280 --> 0:16:42.200 maybe just didn't end on bad terms or because I'm 0:16:42.240 --> 0:16:45.080 kind of curious how that relationship just dissolved and now 0:16:45.120 --> 0:16:47.400 you guys seem obviously perfectly okay with each other. You 0:16:47.440 --> 0:16:49.440 want me to take it correct? Yes, I think you 0:16:49.440 --> 0:16:56.720 should take that one. Yeah. So we were married for um, okay, 0:16:56.720 --> 0:17:03.040 seventeen years. We got separated. Yeah, yeah, exactly. We got 0:17:03.080 --> 0:17:08.160 separated like just before our sixteenth wedding anniversary. But with 0:17:08.200 --> 0:17:12.000 the you know, divorce takes a while. UM. And we 0:17:12.040 --> 0:17:14.960 but we started dating when we were both in college. Um. 0:17:15.640 --> 0:17:17.680 I was a senior in college, she was a freshman, 0:17:18.320 --> 0:17:20.760 and then I went away. We were young, we were 0:17:20.800 --> 0:17:22.840 super young. And then I went away to law school. 0:17:22.920 --> 0:17:25.199 She stayed in college, and then we came back and 0:17:25.240 --> 0:17:27.520 we dated. You know, during that time we were we 0:17:27.760 --> 0:17:30.240 were on and off, we dated other people, and then 0:17:30.240 --> 0:17:33.439 we had a long UM. So we dated for a 0:17:33.480 --> 0:17:36.600 long time. UM, and then we got to this this 0:17:36.760 --> 0:17:40.040 place in you know, and I think we were just 0:17:40.119 --> 0:17:44.119 different people then we were, you know, back when you know, 0:17:44.200 --> 0:17:48.880 she was eighteen and I was twenty years old, and um, 0:17:49.520 --> 0:17:52.639 so there wasn't really any anything dramatic at that point 0:17:52.680 --> 0:17:55.719 that that you know, the forced us to to go 0:17:55.840 --> 0:17:58.960 this direction. I think it was just it just it 0:17:59.040 --> 0:18:01.320 just wasn't working for either of us anymore, and so 0:18:01.400 --> 0:18:04.720 we decided that that was, um this is what made 0:18:04.760 --> 0:18:07.040 the most sense. And you know, we've seen a lot 0:18:07.119 --> 0:18:10.439 of other people, we had some very good friends, you know, 0:18:10.560 --> 0:18:12.840 go through go through divorce. It was kind of at 0:18:12.880 --> 0:18:15.399 that stage of life where we saw a lot of 0:18:15.440 --> 0:18:18.879 people start breaking up and people were having a terrible 0:18:18.920 --> 0:18:21.000 time and they were doing terrible things to their kids. 0:18:21.040 --> 0:18:24.720 Not on purpose, but you know when when you're fighting 0:18:24.880 --> 0:18:29.000 and um uh, you're not being good to each other, 0:18:29.560 --> 0:18:31.920 it affects the kids. And so we took a look 0:18:31.920 --> 0:18:34.639 at our situation and we said, you know, is this 0:18:34.720 --> 0:18:36.320 what we want do we want to screw up our 0:18:36.400 --> 0:18:38.640 kids like we're seeing our friends do. And we both 0:18:38.720 --> 0:18:41.960 decided that's that we wanted to do it differently, and so, um, 0:18:42.240 --> 0:18:44.200 we weren't going to be married anymore. But like our 0:18:44.320 --> 0:18:47.119 our son says, you know, we're still a family. It 0:18:47.240 --> 0:18:50.080 just looks very different. Can I ask what you thought 0:18:50.160 --> 0:18:52.600 the other couples were doing that hurt the kids, because 0:18:52.640 --> 0:18:54.600 I hear a lot of times when couples are going 0:18:54.640 --> 0:18:57.480 through tough times, specifically married couples, you want to stay 0:18:57.520 --> 0:19:00.399 together for the kids. But you guys obviously decided against that. 0:19:00.480 --> 0:19:02.600 So can you kind of go into more detail about 0:19:02.640 --> 0:19:07.480 why you guys think divorce was actually better for your family. Yeah, 0:19:08.160 --> 0:19:11.359 I'll say briefly my my thoughts on it, and I 0:19:11.359 --> 0:19:15.000 know Stephanie has thoughts too, you know, towards the latter 0:19:15.440 --> 0:19:20.199 parts of our marriage, we the marriage probably ended years 0:19:20.280 --> 0:19:24.240 before we signed the papers, and um, you know, when 0:19:24.240 --> 0:19:27.359 that starts happening, the kids can tell. Kids are very intuitive, 0:19:27.359 --> 0:19:33.120 and our daughter particularly, I think, really felt the um 0:19:33.160 --> 0:19:37.600 the tension in the house, and um, you know I was. 0:19:37.760 --> 0:19:41.080 I was amazed how well adjusted she seemed to be 0:19:41.160 --> 0:19:43.199 when we, you know, when we told her we were 0:19:43.200 --> 0:19:45.840 getting divorced, and in the months and years since then, 0:19:46.080 --> 0:19:49.480 and I think it's because she recognized there was this 0:19:49.640 --> 0:19:52.280 tension had sort of dissipated, she still got you know, 0:19:53.080 --> 0:19:55.480 divorce is never great. You would love to have both 0:19:55.520 --> 0:19:58.119 parents in the house. And we don't advocate for divorce, 0:19:58.240 --> 0:20:02.560 but sometimes, you know, removing that tension isn't that positive 0:20:02.560 --> 0:20:04.800 for the kids. And I think that was the case 0:20:04.840 --> 0:20:07.600 with us, and I think and that's you know, and 0:20:07.640 --> 0:20:09.880 I think what we've seen and I mean you see 0:20:09.880 --> 0:20:12.960 it even on there was just what was that that 0:20:13.080 --> 0:20:16.040 movie that we watched Eric, not together but separately, a 0:20:16.040 --> 0:20:19.920 marriage story, but it was basically was with um what's 0:20:19.920 --> 0:20:23.879 her name? Yes? Yes, yes, yes. And so if you 0:20:24.160 --> 0:20:29.639 any any like that movie, epitomizes like what it gets 0:20:29.720 --> 0:20:32.679 like because we said, oh, there wasn't one reason, but 0:20:32.720 --> 0:20:35.000 I mean we had hurt feelings. I heard Eric. He 0:20:35.160 --> 0:20:36.600 hurt me. It's not like one day we were like, 0:20:36.680 --> 0:20:38.960 let's get divorced. It's great. There was a lot of 0:20:39.000 --> 0:20:43.080 anger and hurt, but we don't disparage. We don't disparage 0:20:43.119 --> 0:20:46.000 each other. If I'm mad at Eric, I don't tell 0:20:46.359 --> 0:20:48.840 my daughter do that have being a jerk? And this 0:20:49.000 --> 0:20:52.480 is what he did. It seems like a lot of 0:20:52.520 --> 0:20:55.080 parents resort to, like the high school ways and like 0:20:55.560 --> 0:20:58.760 talking bad about the other person. And it's easy to do. 0:20:58.840 --> 0:21:01.000 I mean, especially at the begin I mean when Eric 0:21:01.000 --> 0:21:03.480 and I were not in the best place. I mean, 0:21:03.480 --> 0:21:07.440 I was abbrobated with him. Um, but I never said 0:21:07.440 --> 0:21:11.080 anything to him. I never said to my kids anything 0:21:11.160 --> 0:21:15.520