1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,400 Speaker 1: Too Much Information is a production of I Heart Radio. 2 00:00:09,480 --> 00:00:12,600 Speaker 1: Hello everyone, and welcome to Too Much Information, the show 3 00:00:12,640 --> 00:00:15,640 Speaker 1: that brings you the secret histories and little known fascinating 4 00:00:15,680 --> 00:00:19,240 Speaker 1: facts and figures behind your favorite TV shows, movies, music, 5 00:00:19,280 --> 00:00:26,160 Speaker 1: and more. We are your two bad posts. I'm Alex 6 00:00:26,200 --> 00:00:29,760 Speaker 1: Hegel and I'm Jordan Run Talk and Jordan's In case 7 00:00:29,800 --> 00:00:33,040 Speaker 1: you couldn't tell from that scintillating intro, today we're talking 8 00:00:33,080 --> 00:00:35,640 Speaker 1: about what is arguably one of the most beloved films 9 00:00:35,640 --> 00:00:38,680 Speaker 1: in the past twenty years, a modern Christmas classic from 10 00:00:38,680 --> 00:00:41,320 Speaker 1: the early aughts that revitalized the genre and created a 11 00:00:41,320 --> 00:00:45,320 Speaker 1: whole new subgenre template. That's right, we're talking about Love actually. 12 00:00:45,360 --> 00:00:49,320 Speaker 1: Oh no, was that. I'm sorry. Oh, I'm just now 13 00:00:49,360 --> 00:00:51,559 Speaker 1: getting word that we're not talking about Love. Actually, we're 14 00:00:51,560 --> 00:00:55,640 Speaker 1: talking about Bad Santa, which is a fake out that 15 00:00:55,720 --> 00:00:59,800 Speaker 1: was entirely scripted by me and will surely enrage a 16 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:02,520 Speaker 1: segment of the listening populace, who no doubt wished we 17 00:01:02,560 --> 00:01:06,280 Speaker 1: had done Love Actually, but we got some requests for 18 00:01:06,319 --> 00:01:08,880 Speaker 1: Bad Santa, and it's a nice palate cleanser for the 19 00:01:08,959 --> 00:01:11,520 Speaker 1: end of the year. Uh. We did some some some 20 00:01:11,640 --> 00:01:16,080 Speaker 1: trickly Santa stuff and uh, Yeah, you all thought we 21 00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:19,680 Speaker 1: were done with Christmas, but we're not. We're faking you out. 22 00:01:20,040 --> 00:01:23,800 Speaker 1: Jordan's movie doesn't feel like your vibe. Yeah, I'll be honest. 23 00:01:24,080 --> 00:01:27,200 Speaker 1: The solitary reason we are doing this is because I 24 00:01:27,240 --> 00:01:30,800 Speaker 1: got a comment on Twitter. I had posted this very serious, 25 00:01:30,840 --> 00:01:33,720 Speaker 1: somber thing about the real life sinking of the Titanic 26 00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:38,160 Speaker 1: in preparation for our massive two part Opus dedicated to 27 00:01:38,240 --> 00:01:41,120 Speaker 1: James Cameron's epic uh, and a loyal t m I 28 00:01:41,200 --> 00:01:46,360 Speaker 1: listener named Craig commented, do bad Santa, you cowards? Jordan 29 00:01:46,480 --> 00:01:49,320 Speaker 1: was so moved and I would laugh so much. I 30 00:01:49,360 --> 00:01:51,880 Speaker 1: felt like we owed it to him. Uh, Greg, this 31 00:01:51,920 --> 00:01:54,600 Speaker 1: one's for you. And honestly, that is as far as 32 00:01:54,640 --> 00:01:57,880 Speaker 1: I was looking with this episode. I you know, I 33 00:01:57,960 --> 00:02:01,160 Speaker 1: really liked that. I watch this when it came out. 34 00:02:01,240 --> 00:02:03,360 Speaker 1: Then you know, caught it on cable every few years 35 00:02:03,400 --> 00:02:05,120 Speaker 1: and in college and all that, and it just never 36 00:02:05,160 --> 00:02:06,640 Speaker 1: came back to it. And then I just rewatched it 37 00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:08,760 Speaker 1: today right before we were taping this. This movie is 38 00:02:08,800 --> 00:02:11,920 Speaker 1: better than it. I think it's reputation suggests for various 39 00:02:11,919 --> 00:02:13,680 Speaker 1: reasons that we'll get into, most of which are the 40 00:02:13,720 --> 00:02:16,799 Speaker 1: creative team behind it. It's definitely not just like a 41 00:02:16,919 --> 00:02:21,320 Speaker 1: fairly Brothers, like you know something about Mary's style like 42 00:02:21,520 --> 00:02:24,240 Speaker 1: gross raunchy thing, and nor is it like an American 43 00:02:24,280 --> 00:02:27,559 Speaker 1: pie sex comedy. And in fact, the filmmakers were incensed 44 00:02:27,840 --> 00:02:31,480 Speaker 1: at the studio's attempts to kind of morph it into that. Yeah, 45 00:02:31,560 --> 00:02:35,959 Speaker 1: I think it's pretty actually unique film and the fact 46 00:02:36,040 --> 00:02:39,720 Speaker 1: that it's bigat so many Uh what we'll talk about 47 00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:44,680 Speaker 1: the legacy of bad plus not bad legacy, the bad 48 00:02:44,800 --> 00:02:48,240 Speaker 1: the bad legacy of the film later. Uh. You know, 49 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:51,040 Speaker 1: just before we get into this, I was researching real 50 00:02:51,120 --> 00:02:55,040 Speaker 1: life bad Santa's. There are many listicles out there about it. 51 00:02:55,120 --> 00:03:00,000 Speaker 1: They generally fall into a few categories. There's the petals, uh, 52 00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:02,200 Speaker 1: which you don't really want to get into. Then there's 53 00:03:02,240 --> 00:03:05,880 Speaker 1: the drunk ones who are like, you know, crash a 54 00:03:05,919 --> 00:03:09,040 Speaker 1: car dressed as Santa, and then there's like the then 55 00:03:09,040 --> 00:03:12,680 Speaker 1: there's the violent Santa's. Um are we ranking bad Santas 56 00:03:12,760 --> 00:03:14,400 Speaker 1: right now? Is that what we're doing? No. I was 57 00:03:14,440 --> 00:03:16,560 Speaker 1: going to do a whole sampling, like when you did 58 00:03:16,560 --> 00:03:18,800 Speaker 1: the Twins thing for parent trap was gonna do a 59 00:03:18,840 --> 00:03:21,280 Speaker 1: whole rundown of him, and then he just got so 60 00:03:21,400 --> 00:03:24,280 Speaker 1: dark there. There's two that I just want to leave 61 00:03:24,320 --> 00:03:27,280 Speaker 1: you with, um start you with because we still have 62 00:03:27,320 --> 00:03:30,480 Speaker 1: a whole episode of tape. There was a guy, and 63 00:03:30,639 --> 00:03:33,679 Speaker 1: I want to say North Carolina, who robbed a bank 64 00:03:33,840 --> 00:03:38,360 Speaker 1: dressed as Santa Okay, good plan? Was that like a 65 00:03:38,600 --> 00:03:41,080 Speaker 1: like a Salvation Army guy just went berserk, you know 66 00:03:41,120 --> 00:03:43,360 Speaker 1: with the bell outside and the bucket. I think he 67 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:46,320 Speaker 1: was a No, he was, he was. He got away 68 00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:48,760 Speaker 1: with it. That The funny coda to this is that 69 00:03:48,800 --> 00:03:50,960 Speaker 1: he came back. I don't remember if it was the 70 00:03:50,960 --> 00:03:55,040 Speaker 1: same bank or not, still dressed as Santa. No, No, 71 00:03:55,680 --> 00:04:03,320 Speaker 1: you'll never guess. Easter Bunny closer warmer uh tooth fairy 72 00:04:03,400 --> 00:04:08,520 Speaker 1: my last guest. Oh no, I'm sorry you struck out. 73 00:04:09,440 --> 00:04:13,120 Speaker 1: David Christopher Cotton, aged twenty, of Brentwood, Tennessee, held up 74 00:04:13,160 --> 00:04:16,640 Speaker 1: a bank three days before Christmas in two thousand nine, 75 00:04:16,760 --> 00:04:25,320 Speaker 1: dressed to Santa St. Patrick's Day. No, no, did he 76 00:04:25,360 --> 00:04:31,320 Speaker 1: take the money out in like a costume and then 77 00:04:31,320 --> 00:04:34,159 Speaker 1: he got in a shootout with police and kills health 78 00:04:34,720 --> 00:04:38,120 Speaker 1: a lepricn outfit. Yeah, so that's one. Could we get 79 00:04:38,120 --> 00:04:40,080 Speaker 1: the common Brothers on the phone. We got bad leprechn 80 00:04:41,320 --> 00:04:43,760 Speaker 1: They should do that. Well, there's already the leprechn movies. 81 00:04:43,839 --> 00:04:47,720 Speaker 1: But but yeah, it does feel very cognish. Uh so 82 00:04:47,800 --> 00:04:52,280 Speaker 1: does this next one? Um? Covina, California man Bruce Jeffrey 83 00:04:52,279 --> 00:04:56,039 Speaker 1: Pardo's divorce had been finalized one week before Christmas in 84 00:04:56,040 --> 00:04:58,440 Speaker 1: two thousand eight, so he subsequently showed up to a 85 00:04:58,440 --> 00:05:00,800 Speaker 1: party on Christmas Eve dressed as Sam, armed with a 86 00:05:00,839 --> 00:05:06,479 Speaker 1: homemade flamethrower and four semi automatic handguns. So you could 87 00:05:06,480 --> 00:05:08,360 Speaker 1: probably edit all this out. I just wanted to set 88 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:10,440 Speaker 1: the move to this episode. This is a good This 89 00:05:10,440 --> 00:05:12,279 Speaker 1: would be a good time to do that long beat, 90 00:05:13,600 --> 00:05:17,560 Speaker 1: just like, so they're your real life bad Santa's folks. Dude, 91 00:05:17,600 --> 00:05:20,000 Speaker 1: it's so bad. There was like a German Santa that 92 00:05:20,080 --> 00:05:23,800 Speaker 1: was roofinging teens, like so many of them are predators, 93 00:05:23,839 --> 00:05:26,719 Speaker 1: and then there's like just drunk sand It was not 94 00:05:26,760 --> 00:05:28,440 Speaker 1: as whimsical as I thought it was going to be. 95 00:05:28,480 --> 00:05:32,480 Speaker 1: And then there were just so many murders and murder suicides, 96 00:05:33,040 --> 00:05:35,279 Speaker 1: a lot of bank robberies. You know, it's a good 97 00:05:35,320 --> 00:05:39,240 Speaker 1: good costume anyway. From the film's genesis with one of 98 00:05:39,279 --> 00:05:42,880 Speaker 1: the most acclaimed directing teams in modern cinematic history, to 99 00:05:43,000 --> 00:05:46,760 Speaker 1: the intimidating drinking regimen that Billy Bob Thornton undertook one 100 00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:50,440 Speaker 1: day on set to the director's surprising unfamiliarity with one 101 00:05:50,480 --> 00:05:54,080 Speaker 1: of his female leads most prominent starring roles. Here's everything 102 00:05:54,120 --> 00:06:03,359 Speaker 1: you didn't know about Bad Santa. That's right, folks, We 103 00:06:03,440 --> 00:06:05,839 Speaker 1: bet you had no idea Bad Santa spraying from the 104 00:06:05,880 --> 00:06:08,640 Speaker 1: same creative whale. Spring is no country for old men. No, 105 00:06:08,839 --> 00:06:14,600 Speaker 1: not Cormick McCarthy, but can you imagine but the Cohen Brothers. 106 00:06:14,839 --> 00:06:17,960 Speaker 1: That's kind of almost as weird though, Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, 107 00:06:18,040 --> 00:06:21,400 Speaker 1: Joel and Ethan. The two apparently approached a writing team 108 00:06:21,480 --> 00:06:24,960 Speaker 1: named John Requa and Glenn Fakara with a very simple idea. 109 00:06:25,440 --> 00:06:27,600 Speaker 1: Record told The New York Times in sixteen that the 110 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:30,039 Speaker 1: Cohen said, we have this idea for a movie we 111 00:06:30,080 --> 00:06:32,919 Speaker 1: want you to write. It's about a bad Santa. He 112 00:06:33,040 --> 00:06:36,640 Speaker 1: drinks beer and stuff, but legally counts as an idea. 113 00:06:38,120 --> 00:06:41,360 Speaker 1: The suggestion of an idea. Well, the genesis and finishing 114 00:06:41,360 --> 00:06:44,719 Speaker 1: of this film is way more tortured than I actually 115 00:06:44,760 --> 00:06:47,000 Speaker 1: thought it was going to be. Fakara added that the 116 00:06:47,040 --> 00:06:49,479 Speaker 1: Cohens gave him in Requa the Bad News Bears as 117 00:06:49,520 --> 00:06:52,120 Speaker 1: a reference point, which is funny given that Thornton would 118 00:06:52,240 --> 00:06:55,000 Speaker 1: essentially play the same carrot in the Walter Map character 119 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:58,520 Speaker 1: in the subsequent Bad News Bears remake Reuen for car 120 00:06:58,600 --> 00:07:02,120 Speaker 1: meant it Pratt and When. From there to Nickelodeon, where 121 00:07:02,120 --> 00:07:05,600 Speaker 1: they worked on the Angry Beavers for a season and 122 00:07:05,640 --> 00:07:07,600 Speaker 1: the one in an episode of The Wild Thornberry Is. 123 00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:10,040 Speaker 1: The first feature they wrote was a spy spoof called 124 00:07:10,080 --> 00:07:12,760 Speaker 1: Cats and Dogs that featured c g I versions of 125 00:07:12,760 --> 00:07:17,960 Speaker 1: the titular animals as like spies doing like Cold War stick. 126 00:07:18,400 --> 00:07:20,800 Speaker 1: Um no idea how they got in the Cohen's radar. 127 00:07:21,360 --> 00:07:24,040 Speaker 1: Recoa explained to The New York Times that we wrote 128 00:07:24,040 --> 00:07:26,800 Speaker 1: a really crass script and then the Cohen brothers added 129 00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:30,360 Speaker 1: a bunch of crass jokes. Fakara added to that the 130 00:07:30,400 --> 00:07:33,680 Speaker 1: Cohen's cut all our down syndrome jokes. They thought that 131 00:07:33,800 --> 00:07:36,800 Speaker 1: was going too far. I'm thankful for that. But there's 132 00:07:36,800 --> 00:07:38,800 Speaker 1: a lot of conflicting narratives about this whole thing. And 133 00:07:38,840 --> 00:07:40,240 Speaker 1: one of the other big voices in here is that 134 00:07:40,320 --> 00:07:43,440 Speaker 1: director Terry's Zwigov, who had just been coming off Ghost World, 135 00:07:43,440 --> 00:07:46,520 Speaker 1: which is like his big mainstream hit. You know that 136 00:07:46,800 --> 00:07:49,480 Speaker 1: the Steve Ashemi and Thora Birch and early role for 137 00:07:49,560 --> 00:07:54,120 Speaker 1: Scar Joe. Prior to that, he had done Crumb, which 138 00:07:54,160 --> 00:07:58,600 Speaker 1: is a particularly scabrous documentary about the legendary cartoonists. Are 139 00:07:58,640 --> 00:08:02,280 Speaker 1: Crumb You ever seen that? Know it's really good, but 140 00:08:02,320 --> 00:08:04,640 Speaker 1: it's just so funny that somehow this came to this. 141 00:08:04,920 --> 00:08:08,960 Speaker 1: I think between Ghost World and crom that was how 142 00:08:09,360 --> 00:08:12,560 Speaker 1: got on the Cohen's radar. But during the original promotional 143 00:08:12,600 --> 00:08:14,440 Speaker 1: cycle for the film in two thou three, he told 144 00:08:14,480 --> 00:08:16,920 Speaker 1: The New York Times, my agent sent me the script 145 00:08:17,040 --> 00:08:18,920 Speaker 1: with a note saying, you're going to love this, but 146 00:08:18,960 --> 00:08:21,080 Speaker 1: it will never get made, so don't get your hopes up. 147 00:08:21,320 --> 00:08:23,560 Speaker 1: So of course I got my hopes up, and we 148 00:08:23,600 --> 00:08:25,800 Speaker 1: took it to a few studios who promptly turned it down. 149 00:08:26,200 --> 00:08:27,720 Speaker 1: After a couple of months of that, I got a 150 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:30,160 Speaker 1: call from Bob Weinstein saying his brother and he had 151 00:08:30,200 --> 00:08:32,360 Speaker 1: just seen Ghost World and wanted to make a film 152 00:08:32,400 --> 00:08:34,839 Speaker 1: with me. They read the Bad Santa script right away, 153 00:08:34,880 --> 00:08:37,640 Speaker 1: and so they wanted to make the film. So I 154 00:08:37,640 --> 00:08:40,200 Speaker 1: got gave us somewhat different version of events the Indie 155 00:08:40,200 --> 00:08:43,959 Speaker 1: Wire in two thousand twelve. The Colons, he explained, originally 156 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:46,320 Speaker 1: sent me the script and said, we're interested in you 157 00:08:46,400 --> 00:08:48,520 Speaker 1: directing this, but we think it still needs some work. 158 00:08:48,840 --> 00:08:50,920 Speaker 1: And the story I had heard was the original writers 159 00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:53,080 Speaker 1: who wrote about nine of what you see in any 160 00:08:53,120 --> 00:08:56,160 Speaker 1: of the cuts, John Renko and Glenn Fakara, they met 161 00:08:56,160 --> 00:08:58,240 Speaker 1: the Cohen brothers and said, we want to write a 162 00:08:58,240 --> 00:09:00,839 Speaker 1: script that you guys direct, and the Cohen said, well, 163 00:09:00,880 --> 00:09:03,079 Speaker 1: we only direct our own writing. But we've always had 164 00:09:03,080 --> 00:09:06,080 Speaker 1: this crazy idea about this drunken Santa Clause and this 165 00:09:06,200 --> 00:09:08,560 Speaker 1: little person Elf that he has to keep him in line. 166 00:09:08,840 --> 00:09:11,120 Speaker 1: That's why I got continued. So John and Glenn wrote 167 00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:12,880 Speaker 1: this script with the hopes that it would tickle the 168 00:09:12,920 --> 00:09:18,200 Speaker 1: Cohen brothers enough to direct it, and the cos and 169 00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:20,160 Speaker 1: the Cohen brothers read it and they told him we 170 00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:22,040 Speaker 1: don't want to direct it. We think it's great, but 171 00:09:22,080 --> 00:09:23,839 Speaker 1: we don't want to do it so right. Well, and 172 00:09:23,880 --> 00:09:26,360 Speaker 1: Forkara asked them if they could give them some notes, 173 00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:28,600 Speaker 1: and when the Cohens sat down to try to give 174 00:09:28,679 --> 00:09:31,120 Speaker 1: them some notes over weekend, eventually they just thought it 175 00:09:31,120 --> 00:09:32,920 Speaker 1: would be easier if they take a pass on it 176 00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:36,360 Speaker 1: and rewrite it themselves. That's why I got continued. I 177 00:09:36,400 --> 00:09:39,080 Speaker 1: got that script that still had problems. There were a 178 00:09:39,080 --> 00:09:42,000 Speaker 1: bunch of flashbacks and the kids with babble endlessly about 179 00:09:42,000 --> 00:09:44,680 Speaker 1: going to the bathroom on mommy's dishes. It went on 180 00:09:44,760 --> 00:09:48,000 Speaker 1: for pages, and I agreed that stuff should go. So 181 00:09:48,040 --> 00:09:50,040 Speaker 1: I edited that out and worked on maybe four or 182 00:09:50,040 --> 00:09:52,400 Speaker 1: five things that I wrote. A bunch of other scenes 183 00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:54,160 Speaker 1: my wife and I worked on to inject a bit 184 00:09:54,160 --> 00:09:56,600 Speaker 1: of warmth into them. It was a very cold script 185 00:09:56,600 --> 00:09:58,079 Speaker 1: when I got it, I believe it or not. It's 186 00:09:58,120 --> 00:10:01,160 Speaker 1: much warmer after I took a pass at it. Hard 187 00:10:01,200 --> 00:10:04,360 Speaker 1: to believe, although I guess if there were a bunch 188 00:10:04,360 --> 00:10:09,280 Speaker 1: of down syndrome jokes in there. Good lord h Yeah. 189 00:10:09,320 --> 00:10:13,560 Speaker 1: These guys career since then really lends credence to the 190 00:10:13,720 --> 00:10:17,960 Speaker 1: notion that the Cohen brothers fixed this. Uh ZAGV liked it, 191 00:10:18,000 --> 00:10:20,280 Speaker 1: he said, most of the scripts I've gone after to direct, 192 00:10:20,360 --> 00:10:23,040 Speaker 1: there's generally just something about the dialogue told the A 193 00:10:23,160 --> 00:10:25,760 Speaker 1: V Club, like Bad Santa. There was one line in 194 00:10:25,760 --> 00:10:27,760 Speaker 1: the script that was so good I was desperately trying 195 00:10:27,760 --> 00:10:30,480 Speaker 1: to get the job. It was something like sweet Jews 196 00:10:30,520 --> 00:10:32,920 Speaker 1: for Jesus, which is spoken to the film by Bernie 197 00:10:32,920 --> 00:10:36,920 Speaker 1: mac r i p One of the most inspired lines 198 00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:40,840 Speaker 1: i'd ever read to The Times in two thousand three 199 00:10:41,400 --> 00:10:45,160 Speaker 1: explained I thought the profanity was written very poetically, like 200 00:10:45,240 --> 00:10:49,560 Speaker 1: David Mammitt writing Glen Garry Glenn Ross. That was what 201 00:10:49,640 --> 00:10:51,320 Speaker 1: appealed to me, not just that there was a lot 202 00:10:51,320 --> 00:10:54,000 Speaker 1: of profanity. Anybody can do that to put it away 203 00:10:54,040 --> 00:10:57,439 Speaker 1: that's rhythmically and grammatically interesting, it's hard to do. It 204 00:10:57,480 --> 00:11:02,480 Speaker 1: reminds me of m Billy Scottish comedian Billy Connolly. It 205 00:11:02,480 --> 00:11:04,680 Speaker 1: reminds me of Billy Connolly. He has a whole thing 206 00:11:04,760 --> 00:11:07,400 Speaker 1: about the rhythm of the F word, and like how 207 00:11:07,400 --> 00:11:09,600 Speaker 1: he puts it into his stand up, not the prenny 208 00:11:09,640 --> 00:11:12,240 Speaker 1: shock value. It just gives us the perfect rhythm to 209 00:11:12,320 --> 00:11:14,120 Speaker 1: his language and he breaks it down almost like a 210 00:11:14,200 --> 00:11:17,360 Speaker 1: Lenny Bruce routine. I think it's wikoff. In an interview 211 00:11:17,400 --> 00:11:20,160 Speaker 1: he talks about there's a repeated line that Billy Bob 212 00:11:20,200 --> 00:11:26,559 Speaker 1: Thornton says, which is thank the Christ, which is like 213 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:29,040 Speaker 1: he said in the first draft, it was just like 214 00:11:29,080 --> 00:11:31,320 Speaker 1: thank God or something. The Cohen's punched it up that 215 00:11:31,360 --> 00:11:35,000 Speaker 1: way and it's like just their idiosyncratic that it still 216 00:11:35,080 --> 00:11:37,959 Speaker 1: sounds so natural coming out of Billy Bob Thornton's mouth, 217 00:11:38,520 --> 00:11:40,200 Speaker 1: But like, when you look at that on the page, 218 00:11:40,240 --> 00:11:43,240 Speaker 1: you're like, what who wrote that? The guys who wrote 219 00:11:43,320 --> 00:11:47,400 Speaker 1: Raising Arizona wrote that. Funnily enough. In that Time's interview 220 00:11:47,440 --> 00:11:50,520 Speaker 1: from two thousand three, Terrygoff explained that he turned down Elf, 221 00:11:51,240 --> 00:11:53,640 Speaker 1: which is also from two thousand three, probably one of 222 00:11:53,679 --> 00:11:56,880 Speaker 1: the yin and yang of some Christmas movies from this 223 00:11:57,080 --> 00:12:00,400 Speaker 1: just that year, God, the Holy Tree, Holy I can't 224 00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:05,080 Speaker 1: for I don't think I love actually Elf Santa two 225 00:12:05,120 --> 00:12:10,000 Speaker 1: thousand three. Wow, Wow, Wow. Yeah. He turned down the 226 00:12:10,040 --> 00:12:13,120 Speaker 1: opportunity to make Elf, saying, I don't like most Christmas movies. 227 00:12:13,320 --> 00:12:15,320 Speaker 1: They're pretty bad, though they seem to make tons of 228 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:18,040 Speaker 1: money anyway, Like this movie Elf. I got the script 229 00:12:18,120 --> 00:12:20,280 Speaker 1: for that and I turned it down right away, against 230 00:12:20,360 --> 00:12:23,120 Speaker 1: my wife's better judgment. She said, this film is going 231 00:12:23,160 --> 00:12:25,600 Speaker 1: to make a million dollars. It's got Will Ferrell in it, 232 00:12:25,840 --> 00:12:27,720 Speaker 1: And I said, yeah, I like Will Ferrell, but the 233 00:12:27,760 --> 00:12:30,920 Speaker 1: script is just based on this contrived silliness. How much 234 00:12:31,040 --> 00:12:34,320 Speaker 1: did Elf make? Just so we can, let's compare it 235 00:12:34,320 --> 00:12:37,599 Speaker 1: to Bad Santa. You do Elf, I'll do Bad Santa worldwide. 236 00:12:37,640 --> 00:12:43,360 Speaker 1: Elf did two six point two mill against what against 237 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:49,000 Speaker 1: the budget Okay, bad Santa did seventy six point five 238 00:12:49,040 --> 00:12:52,920 Speaker 1: million against the twenty three million dollar budgets. So to 239 00:12:53,120 --> 00:12:56,280 Speaker 1: quote the guy from Indiana Jones and the last we said, 240 00:12:56,840 --> 00:13:01,040 Speaker 1: he chose poorly? Or did he? He chose for art, 241 00:13:01,840 --> 00:13:05,479 Speaker 1: which is often the poorer choice to make all things told, 242 00:13:05,920 --> 00:13:10,079 Speaker 1: especially in Hollywood. Um recouind for Carr told The Times 243 00:13:10,120 --> 00:13:11,839 Speaker 1: that the Cohen's wanted the film to be a vehicle 244 00:13:11,880 --> 00:13:14,680 Speaker 1: for James Gandolfini, who they had just worked with on 245 00:13:14,720 --> 00:13:17,679 Speaker 1: The Man Who Wasn't There, which also features Billy Bob Thornton, 246 00:13:18,080 --> 00:13:20,480 Speaker 1: and that they wrote the character in his rhythm, but 247 00:13:20,559 --> 00:13:23,200 Speaker 1: that it just didn't work out. I know, I can't 248 00:13:23,200 --> 00:13:25,440 Speaker 1: imagine that some of these other names, I can I 249 00:13:25,480 --> 00:13:27,599 Speaker 1: cannot imagine. Do you think it would have been a 250 00:13:27,679 --> 00:13:30,520 Speaker 1: much more like Prestigee movie if Candell Foeni had gone 251 00:13:30,520 --> 00:13:34,319 Speaker 1: in it? I don't know. Candalafini could play like crass, 252 00:13:34,320 --> 00:13:36,800 Speaker 1: like do you ever see killing him softly? He's just 253 00:13:36,840 --> 00:13:39,400 Speaker 1: like a gross He's like a gross, sad weirdo in 254 00:13:39,440 --> 00:13:43,160 Speaker 1: that movie. You know, it's hard to play um Monday 255 00:13:43,200 --> 00:13:45,640 Speaker 1: Morning quarterback with it because as we get later on, 256 00:13:45,760 --> 00:13:49,000 Speaker 1: like the Weinstein's meddled with this, as they do with everything. 257 00:13:49,080 --> 00:13:52,440 Speaker 1: So Goff says, the director's cut that's out there is 258 00:13:52,520 --> 00:13:55,720 Speaker 1: he's what was shot on the page. And he says 259 00:13:55,720 --> 00:13:58,080 Speaker 1: in that Indy Wire interview that at a certain point 260 00:13:58,760 --> 00:14:01,160 Speaker 1: the Cohen's knew the because it was being done with 261 00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:02,880 Speaker 1: the Weinsteins. They were like, this is going to be 262 00:14:02,920 --> 00:14:05,559 Speaker 1: a nightmare once it gets into the edit, because they're 263 00:14:05,559 --> 00:14:07,320 Speaker 1: gonna want to come in and do their Weinstein thing, 264 00:14:07,320 --> 00:14:12,319 Speaker 1: Harvey scissor hands um scissors if you're lucky. Uh, they 265 00:14:12,360 --> 00:14:14,400 Speaker 1: were going to come in and meddle with it. So 266 00:14:14,440 --> 00:14:17,160 Speaker 1: he says that the Cohens were essentially like, all right, dude, 267 00:14:17,200 --> 00:14:20,240 Speaker 1: it's yours. And so it's interesting. It's an interesting thought 268 00:14:20,280 --> 00:14:22,880 Speaker 1: experiment to imagine a movie that hughes a little more 269 00:14:22,920 --> 00:14:27,600 Speaker 1: closely to Terry's wageoff of Crum and Ghost World, written 270 00:14:27,600 --> 00:14:31,040 Speaker 1: by the Cohen's, starring James Gaindal. That's a very interesting movie. 271 00:14:31,080 --> 00:14:34,600 Speaker 1: I don't know if it's the same one, but it 272 00:14:34,600 --> 00:14:37,600 Speaker 1: could have been even weirder. As you're about to tell us, Yes, 273 00:14:37,880 --> 00:14:40,560 Speaker 1: director Terry's wage off, I really wanted Bill Murray for 274 00:14:40,680 --> 00:14:43,520 Speaker 1: the titular bad Santa role, explaining to the times. In 275 00:14:43,520 --> 00:14:46,520 Speaker 1: two thousand three, I was told, well, Bill Murray will 276 00:14:46,560 --> 00:14:48,240 Speaker 1: never read your script. It will take him a year 277 00:14:48,280 --> 00:14:50,640 Speaker 1: to get back to you. Actually, they heard back from 278 00:14:50,680 --> 00:14:52,320 Speaker 1: him in a week saying you wanted to do it, 279 00:14:52,520 --> 00:14:54,520 Speaker 1: just tell him the time and place and he chow up. 280 00:14:54,920 --> 00:14:57,480 Speaker 1: Then he did this thing of disappearing. It got to 281 00:14:57,520 --> 00:14:59,360 Speaker 1: the point where I left a couple of messages saying, 282 00:14:59,480 --> 00:15:01,600 Speaker 1: if you wanted do this thing, great, and if you don't, 283 00:15:01,640 --> 00:15:03,280 Speaker 1: just let me know because I have to move on. 284 00:15:03,640 --> 00:15:06,120 Speaker 1: But he just disappeared. I can't say I blame him. 285 00:15:06,280 --> 00:15:07,840 Speaker 1: If I had that kind of money, I'd be doing 286 00:15:07,880 --> 00:15:10,120 Speaker 1: the same thing. This is the era where he will 287 00:15:10,200 --> 00:15:14,160 Speaker 1: not the era I guess it's been decades where he doesn't. Yeah. Yeah, 288 00:15:14,200 --> 00:15:17,440 Speaker 1: he just has an answering machine and you leave, you know, 289 00:15:17,880 --> 00:15:20,160 Speaker 1: your pitch on the answering machine, and if he's interested, 290 00:15:20,200 --> 00:15:22,840 Speaker 1: I'll call back. Well you know what he did instead, 291 00:15:23,040 --> 00:15:30,280 Speaker 1: ostensibly lesson translation. Yeah, okay, he chose wise. Robert de 292 00:15:30,360 --> 00:15:33,320 Speaker 1: Niro was supposedly also interested, which is funny considering he 293 00:15:33,360 --> 00:15:36,600 Speaker 1: would later be in an air SAT's version of this 294 00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:41,400 Speaker 1: movie with the Dirty Grandpa, Bad Old Man or whatever 295 00:15:41,440 --> 00:15:45,840 Speaker 1: that garbage movie is called. When he's now, he's in 296 00:15:45,840 --> 00:15:50,360 Speaker 1: his paycheck period. His house just got burgled. It's like 297 00:15:50,440 --> 00:15:55,480 Speaker 1: inveterate serial burglar in New York City. In Manhattan. Yeah, 298 00:15:55,480 --> 00:15:57,320 Speaker 1: this like thirty old woman who's just been breaking into 299 00:15:57,400 --> 00:16:01,240 Speaker 1: houses like her whole life burgled DeNiro's place on the 300 00:16:01,320 --> 00:16:03,840 Speaker 1: Upper East Side. I don't think he was there. That's 301 00:16:03,880 --> 00:16:06,960 Speaker 1: a bold move. I don't think she knew it was there. 302 00:16:06,960 --> 00:16:08,680 Speaker 1: I think she just was like, I mean, it's it 303 00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:12,000 Speaker 1: was on like sixty three and Park, So it's like 304 00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:16,160 Speaker 1: she picked a pretty Tony neighborhood debrace. She's like wenting 305 00:16:16,160 --> 00:16:18,400 Speaker 1: through the basement. Do you think she scouted it? Yeah, 306 00:16:18,440 --> 00:16:19,840 Speaker 1: I mean I don't know if she scouted. If you're 307 00:16:19,880 --> 00:16:22,440 Speaker 1: going to rob that level of people, I feel like 308 00:16:22,480 --> 00:16:26,080 Speaker 1: you got to do your homework. Production also asked Jack Nicholson, 309 00:16:26,240 --> 00:16:29,360 Speaker 1: Nicolas Cage, Sean Penn. We're all supposed to be considered. 310 00:16:29,400 --> 00:16:30,960 Speaker 1: I guess Sean Penn would have been coming off I 311 00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:33,040 Speaker 1: am Sam, so maybe looking for a little of a 312 00:16:33,680 --> 00:16:36,920 Speaker 1: palate cleanser of his own, if you will. Funnily enough, 313 00:16:36,960 --> 00:16:39,880 Speaker 1: the parking lot behind the department store is the same 314 00:16:39,920 --> 00:16:42,840 Speaker 1: parking lot at the del Amo Mall where DeNiro shoots 315 00:16:42,880 --> 00:16:47,520 Speaker 1: Bridget Fonda spoiler alert in Jackie Brown. Friend of the Pod. 316 00:16:50,240 --> 00:16:52,840 Speaker 1: Jackie Brown is an adaptation of an Elmore Leonard novel, 317 00:16:52,920 --> 00:16:54,640 Speaker 1: and I was reading a bunch of these Terry's Way 318 00:16:54,640 --> 00:16:57,280 Speaker 1: Golf interviews he was working on an unrealized um More 319 00:16:57,360 --> 00:17:05,159 Speaker 1: Leonard adaptation. So little synergy there, as you meditate on that, 320 00:17:05,480 --> 00:17:08,240 Speaker 1: We'll be right back with more, too much information after 321 00:17:08,280 --> 00:17:23,200 Speaker 1: these messages. Universal passed on Bad Santa. Bob Weinstein told 322 00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:25,680 Speaker 1: The Times. I asked the Universal executive, why did you 323 00:17:25,680 --> 00:17:27,840 Speaker 1: guys pass on it? And he said it was the 324 00:17:27,840 --> 00:17:32,440 Speaker 1: most foul, disgusting, misogynistic, anti Christmas, anti children thing we 325 00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:35,679 Speaker 1: could imagine. And Bob Weinstein said, that's exactly why I 326 00:17:35,720 --> 00:17:39,919 Speaker 1: bought it. And of course, as we alluded to earlier, 327 00:17:39,960 --> 00:17:42,080 Speaker 1: the fact there was a Weinstein production meant that it 328 00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:46,680 Speaker 1: has been irrevocably tainted with certain horrifying crimes. And it 329 00:17:46,760 --> 00:17:49,320 Speaker 1: also this also had a bearing on the casting. So 330 00:17:49,440 --> 00:17:51,959 Speaker 1: I got tweeted in twenty seventeen that he said, I 331 00:17:52,040 --> 00:17:55,440 Speaker 1: was interested in casting Mirror Sorvino in Bad Santa, but 332 00:17:55,480 --> 00:17:57,159 Speaker 1: every time I mentioned her over the phone to the 333 00:17:57,160 --> 00:18:00,639 Speaker 1: Weinstein's they would just hang up on him. This was 334 00:18:00,680 --> 00:18:04,359 Speaker 1: precipitated by Peter Jackson that week, having gone on record 335 00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:06,560 Speaker 1: as saying that during pre pro for Lord of the 336 00:18:06,640 --> 00:18:10,000 Speaker 1: Rings when the trilogy was originally being developed at Mirror 337 00:18:10,000 --> 00:18:14,199 Speaker 1: Max with the Weinstein Harvey Weinstein started saying, like, you 338 00:18:14,240 --> 00:18:15,919 Speaker 1: can't have Ashley jun in this movie. You can't have 339 00:18:15,920 --> 00:18:18,600 Speaker 1: mir or Sorvino in this movie. Those were two women 340 00:18:18,640 --> 00:18:24,080 Speaker 1: who both were among his earliest accusers. So disgusting. No 341 00:18:24,520 --> 00:18:30,040 Speaker 1: good outcomes there. Uh. Tony Cox, who plays Thornton's sidekick 342 00:18:30,119 --> 00:18:35,159 Speaker 1: Elf and spoiler his ultimate betrayer, was another sticking point 343 00:18:35,440 --> 00:18:38,679 Speaker 1: in the casting. Terry kept saying, I'm having trouble finding 344 00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:42,120 Speaker 1: the dwarf. Fakara told The New York Times. He read 345 00:18:42,200 --> 00:18:46,879 Speaker 1: everybody from all over the world, including Mickey Rooney. That's amazing. 346 00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:50,960 Speaker 1: I'm kind of kind of annoyed they didn't go with Yeah, 347 00:18:51,840 --> 00:18:55,119 Speaker 1: Tony Cox is great. But still when I first read, 348 00:18:55,240 --> 00:18:58,320 Speaker 1: Terry was laughing real hard. Cox told The Times, I 349 00:18:58,359 --> 00:19:00,360 Speaker 1: was feeling good, and he said, well, I have good 350 00:19:00,359 --> 00:19:02,600 Speaker 1: news in my bad news. I thought bad news. You 351 00:19:02,720 --> 00:19:05,040 Speaker 1: just laughed until you cried. He said. The good news 352 00:19:05,080 --> 00:19:07,119 Speaker 1: is that was a great reading. The bad news is 353 00:19:07,160 --> 00:19:11,119 Speaker 1: this role wasn't written for an African American. Bob Weinstein 354 00:19:11,160 --> 00:19:13,919 Speaker 1: told The Times that the Cohens wanted Danny Woodburn. He 355 00:19:14,040 --> 00:19:17,160 Speaker 1: is the dwarf stand up comic who is probably most 356 00:19:17,160 --> 00:19:20,919 Speaker 1: familiar to people from his recording role in Seinfeld for 357 00:19:21,000 --> 00:19:23,960 Speaker 1: ten years. He had just played a retail storer elf 358 00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:27,960 Speaker 1: in Jingle All the Way, Uh, and so that's who 359 00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:31,440 Speaker 1: the Cohens wanted. They said they hated Cox his audition 360 00:19:31,480 --> 00:19:34,320 Speaker 1: tape um so I got told Indie Wire that he 361 00:19:34,520 --> 00:19:37,679 Speaker 1: hasn't kept in touch with the Cohen's mostly because of 362 00:19:37,760 --> 00:19:40,120 Speaker 1: this Tony Cox thing. He said, we had a very 363 00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:43,040 Speaker 1: strong disagreement about casting Tony Cox as the black elf. 364 00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:45,639 Speaker 1: They said that they couldn't see the guy being black. 365 00:19:46,200 --> 00:19:48,159 Speaker 1: I said, I don't see the guy being black. I 366 00:19:48,200 --> 00:19:50,359 Speaker 1: think the fact of him being three ft six is 367 00:19:50,400 --> 00:19:53,520 Speaker 1: the overriding characteristic of the guy. I don't think it matters. 368 00:19:53,680 --> 00:19:55,560 Speaker 1: I just think this guy is really funny in the part, 369 00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:59,160 Speaker 1: and they thought that it would ruin the film. They 370 00:19:59,280 --> 00:20:01,520 Speaker 1: argued with me for a while and finally said you're 371 00:20:01,560 --> 00:20:03,720 Speaker 1: the one who has to direct it, so good luck. 372 00:20:04,400 --> 00:20:07,159 Speaker 1: Cox ultimately said I read for the role about nine 373 00:20:07,240 --> 00:20:09,719 Speaker 1: times and Terry told me, if they don't let me 374 00:20:09,760 --> 00:20:11,879 Speaker 1: have you, then I'm not going to do it. I 375 00:20:11,960 --> 00:20:16,560 Speaker 1: love that loyalty. Mm hmm. Billy Bob Thornton told cinnamovie 376 00:20:16,680 --> 00:20:20,000 Speaker 1: dot Tv that quote. Tony just doesn't have that part 377 00:20:20,040 --> 00:20:22,360 Speaker 1: of him that wanted to beat me up because we're buddies, 378 00:20:22,359 --> 00:20:25,280 Speaker 1: you know. So to get that passion, that juice into 379 00:20:25,320 --> 00:20:28,000 Speaker 1: their scenes where Cox had to beat him up, Billy 380 00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:29,920 Speaker 1: Bob said, I told him one day that his wife 381 00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:31,919 Speaker 1: had been flirting with me. I don't know what it 382 00:20:31,960 --> 00:20:33,800 Speaker 1: is about your wife. She just won't let me alone. 383 00:20:34,280 --> 00:20:36,560 Speaker 1: And he started slapping me in the face and the 384 00:20:36,600 --> 00:20:39,680 Speaker 1: next take was perfect. Cox also ad libbed the line 385 00:20:39,760 --> 00:20:42,920 Speaker 1: you probably shouldn't be digging in your ass, she says 386 00:20:42,960 --> 00:20:46,560 Speaker 1: to Billy Bob Thornton was sort of sprawled out on 387 00:20:46,600 --> 00:20:50,840 Speaker 1: the Santa throne. Uh and Gov says in a making 388 00:20:50,840 --> 00:20:53,159 Speaker 1: of documentary of the movie, he found that line reading 389 00:20:53,240 --> 00:20:55,439 Speaker 1: so funny that he would just wake his wife up 390 00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:58,080 Speaker 1: in the middle of the night spontaneously laughing over it 391 00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:02,120 Speaker 1: for weeks. Brett Kelly, who played the kid you will 392 00:21:02,160 --> 00:21:05,760 Speaker 1: never in all a million monkeys and a million typewriters, 393 00:21:05,800 --> 00:21:08,520 Speaker 1: would never figure out what that character's name actually is, 394 00:21:09,200 --> 00:21:16,000 Speaker 1: Thurman Merman, just a Coen Brothers as I've ever heard one. 395 00:21:16,760 --> 00:21:19,040 Speaker 1: The actor who played that kid, Brett Kelly, was another 396 00:21:19,119 --> 00:21:21,600 Speaker 1: sticking point. So I got told the Times the studio 397 00:21:21,640 --> 00:21:24,919 Speaker 1: wanted a more Disney like generic cute kid, but Brett 398 00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:27,040 Speaker 1: was so great I had to have him. So I 399 00:21:27,080 --> 00:21:29,000 Speaker 1: got told the casting director that he wanted a kid 400 00:21:29,080 --> 00:21:33,360 Speaker 1: who looked like Joe Cobb from the Little Rascals. Meanwhile, 401 00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:36,639 Speaker 1: Weinstein told the paper Terry can drop dead. That's not 402 00:21:36,680 --> 00:21:40,800 Speaker 1: how it happened. The Cohen's wanted Angus T. Jones from 403 00:21:40,840 --> 00:21:43,959 Speaker 1: Two and a half Men, who did audition and lost 404 00:21:44,080 --> 00:21:48,000 Speaker 1: to Brett Brett Kelly. Weinstein continued, Terry Billy Bob, and 405 00:21:48,040 --> 00:21:51,920 Speaker 1: I said, are you kidding? While Thornton echoes WIGFS version, 406 00:21:52,200 --> 00:21:55,840 Speaker 1: So that angust young kids because he doesn't he like 407 00:21:56,080 --> 00:21:59,119 Speaker 1: Angut T Jones, not Angut. I kept saying anges young, 408 00:21:59,119 --> 00:22:03,840 Speaker 1: because that's a c D. He got what is anglest 409 00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:06,440 Speaker 1: what's angerst when he quit to and a half Man 410 00:22:06,480 --> 00:22:10,639 Speaker 1: and he kind of over it, Yeah yeah, about how 411 00:22:10,640 --> 00:22:14,119 Speaker 1: it was like filth and yeah, yeah, yeah, I guess 412 00:22:14,119 --> 00:22:18,439 Speaker 1: he attended some fundamentalist Christian group and intimated that the 413 00:22:18,480 --> 00:22:22,199 Speaker 1: show is part of the plan of the enemy, presumably Satan. 414 00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:24,960 Speaker 1: I don't want to be contributing to the enemy's plan. 415 00:22:25,560 --> 00:22:27,600 Speaker 1: You cannot be a true God fearing person and be 416 00:22:27,640 --> 00:22:30,960 Speaker 1: on television show like that. I know I can't. I'm 417 00:22:30,960 --> 00:22:33,040 Speaker 1: not okay with what I'm learning, what the Bible says, 418 00:22:33,119 --> 00:22:37,959 Speaker 1: and being on that television show he was making episode 419 00:22:37,960 --> 00:22:41,320 Speaker 1: at that point. Yeah, yeah, it wasn't like the highest 420 00:22:41,320 --> 00:22:43,840 Speaker 1: paying like TV child Star of the time or something. 421 00:22:44,320 --> 00:22:53,800 Speaker 1: What a little ship. Uh uh uh. Kelly had already 422 00:22:53,800 --> 00:22:56,080 Speaker 1: filmed a couple of commercials and smaller roles in Canada 423 00:22:56,119 --> 00:22:57,840 Speaker 1: when he first heard of Bad Santa. In the spring 424 00:22:57,880 --> 00:22:59,920 Speaker 1: of two thousand two, the auditioned for the role of 425 00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:02,320 Speaker 1: a room full of kids in Vancouver, one of several 426 00:23:02,320 --> 00:23:04,800 Speaker 1: North American cities where the auditions were being held, and 427 00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:07,520 Speaker 1: after being called back for another audition in Vancouver, Kelly 428 00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:09,680 Speaker 1: and his mom Sue, headed to Los Angeles, where the 429 00:23:09,680 --> 00:23:12,920 Speaker 1: candidates were winnowed down further. I had to go back 430 00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:15,600 Speaker 1: and forth two or three times, he said. Another kid 431 00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:17,760 Speaker 1: he was up against for the role apparently broke down 432 00:23:17,760 --> 00:23:20,520 Speaker 1: in tears during a screen test with Thornton who started 433 00:23:20,560 --> 00:23:25,080 Speaker 1: swearing at him in character. Kelly told Crack I was like, Okay, 434 00:23:25,119 --> 00:23:26,959 Speaker 1: that's not gonna happen to me, because I know this 435 00:23:27,040 --> 00:23:32,000 Speaker 1: is all make believe. Kelly's casting had immediate ramifications because 436 00:23:32,040 --> 00:23:34,600 Speaker 1: during pre production he got chicken pox and he was 437 00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:37,800 Speaker 1: sent back home to Canada because Billy, Bob Thornton never 438 00:23:37,920 --> 00:23:41,200 Speaker 1: had chicken pox. That's a listical I would read famous 439 00:23:41,240 --> 00:23:43,960 Speaker 1: people who never had chicken pox. That was curious how 440 00:23:44,000 --> 00:23:47,400 Speaker 1: they managed to avoid this After a week, Kelly told 441 00:23:47,440 --> 00:23:49,640 Speaker 1: The Times that he quote did a little shopping around 442 00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:51,200 Speaker 1: and they get a doctor's note that he was no 443 00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:53,359 Speaker 1: longer contagious, so he could go back on the set, 444 00:23:53,440 --> 00:23:56,479 Speaker 1: probably because he's worried about getting recast. Didn't that almost 445 00:23:56,480 --> 00:23:58,280 Speaker 1: happen and some other thing we were talking about recently, 446 00:23:58,400 --> 00:24:00,200 Speaker 1: Maybe it was a tray you and never ending sorry 447 00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:03,200 Speaker 1: when he broke his leg or something during the more stuff, 448 00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:05,560 Speaker 1: and they didn't end up recasting him because they had 449 00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:10,120 Speaker 1: a million other nightmare things to worry about on that production. Anyway, 450 00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:13,360 Speaker 1: Kelly later said, Terry and Billy, because of the subject 451 00:24:13,359 --> 00:24:15,280 Speaker 1: matter of the movie, I think they felt almost in 452 00:24:15,359 --> 00:24:18,320 Speaker 1: vain and need to shelter me the whatever degree they could. 453 00:24:18,720 --> 00:24:21,240 Speaker 1: This is him talking to Cracked. It was always a 454 00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:23,280 Speaker 1: thing to try and make me feel as comfortable as 455 00:24:23,280 --> 00:24:25,359 Speaker 1: I could, because you never really know how the kid's 456 00:24:25,359 --> 00:24:28,600 Speaker 1: going to react. Lauren Graham, who played the Santa fetishist 457 00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:31,960 Speaker 1: bartender Sue, was halfway through her run when Gilmore Girls 458 00:24:31,960 --> 00:24:34,359 Speaker 1: when she auditioned for Bad Santa. So I got set 459 00:24:34,440 --> 00:24:37,359 Speaker 1: in the DVD commentary that despite this being one of 460 00:24:37,400 --> 00:24:40,520 Speaker 1: the biggest shows on network TV at the time, he 461 00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:43,920 Speaker 1: had no knowledge of her or the show. Uh. She 462 00:24:44,320 --> 00:24:47,080 Speaker 1: told Uncut mag I had to audition doing the scene 463 00:24:47,080 --> 00:24:50,359 Speaker 1: where I first straddle Santa, so basically in front of 464 00:24:50,359 --> 00:24:53,439 Speaker 1: a room full of executive I'm humping a chair. I 465 00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:56,200 Speaker 1: really did love Billy Bob though, even more than the chair. 466 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:02,720 Speaker 1: And this was I didn't realize this John Ritter's final 467 00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:06,360 Speaker 1: film role. He passed away unexpectedly on September eleventh, two 468 00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:09,080 Speaker 1: thousand three of the Ortic to section the age of 469 00:25:09,080 --> 00:25:14,639 Speaker 1: just fifty four, and the movie is decadd to his memory. Sorry, 470 00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:19,640 Speaker 1: that's a that's a beautiful gesture. But having Bad Yeah, 471 00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:22,640 Speaker 1: I just yeah, just there's a great there's a great uh. 472 00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:26,040 Speaker 1: ZAGV tells this great anecdote and um little making up 473 00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:29,040 Speaker 1: short that was on the DVD about there's this uh 474 00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:31,480 Speaker 1: he it's a scene where John Ritter and Bernie Mack 475 00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:33,879 Speaker 1: are having dialogue and John Rittor just kept making this 476 00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:37,880 Speaker 1: face that's in the film. Um Like Bernie Max says 477 00:25:37,880 --> 00:25:40,639 Speaker 1: something about like something like crass and John Ritter like 478 00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:43,600 Speaker 1: squinches up his face like all squeamishly, and it take 479 00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:45,880 Speaker 1: after take, it just kept making terry. So I go off, 480 00:25:45,880 --> 00:25:49,760 Speaker 1: burst out laughing behind the camera, just ruining take after take. 481 00:25:50,040 --> 00:25:52,560 Speaker 1: And so he finally was like, John, just keep doing 482 00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:54,600 Speaker 1: what you're doing. I'm gonna go about thirty feet away. 483 00:25:54,960 --> 00:25:59,320 Speaker 1: And I have watched this on the monitors back there. Uh. 484 00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:02,320 Speaker 1: The police chief in the movie who shows up near 485 00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:05,080 Speaker 1: the end is played by Sheriff John Bunnell. That's the 486 00:26:05,160 --> 00:26:07,199 Speaker 1: name he tended to go by professionally, and he was 487 00:26:07,240 --> 00:26:09,480 Speaker 1: in fact a real sheriff in Oregon, so that was 488 00:26:09,480 --> 00:26:12,480 Speaker 1: not his primary claim to fame. He was the host 489 00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:16,719 Speaker 1: of World's Wildest Police Videos from until two thousand and one. 490 00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:20,160 Speaker 1: You remember that show, but it sounds like a show 491 00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:22,359 Speaker 1: that I'm kind of shocked it must still be on 492 00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:24,600 Speaker 1: that That show must have been a billion dollars. Well 493 00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:29,720 Speaker 1: it was revived. It was revived, but yeah, so ran 494 00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:32,119 Speaker 1: on Fox. I definitely remember that show. I have no 495 00:26:32,200 --> 00:26:33,680 Speaker 1: idea how it was legal for them to show any 496 00:26:33,680 --> 00:26:37,199 Speaker 1: of that stuff. Um. Meanwhile, Billy Bob Thornton got the 497 00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:40,000 Speaker 1: script through his manager who called him and said, wait 498 00:26:40,080 --> 00:26:43,160 Speaker 1: until you read this script. I've never seen anything like this. 499 00:26:43,680 --> 00:26:45,919 Speaker 1: When he got the script, Thornton told The Dan Patrick 500 00:26:45,920 --> 00:26:48,520 Speaker 1: Show in sixteen, I read maybe a third of it 501 00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:50,679 Speaker 1: and called him back and said, first of all, we 502 00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:52,640 Speaker 1: have to do it. And second of all, it's either 503 00:26:52,680 --> 00:26:55,080 Speaker 1: the worst idea I've ever made and my career is over, 504 00:26:55,200 --> 00:26:58,200 Speaker 1: or it's genius one or the other. Roger Yebert had 505 00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:00,280 Speaker 1: some thoughts on this in his original review You for 506 00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:03,440 Speaker 1: Bad Santa. For Billy Bob Thornton to play Hamlet would 507 00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:07,600 Speaker 1: take nerve. For him to play Willie ta Soak took heroism. 508 00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:12,600 Speaker 1: Thornton uh committed to this role, as Tony Cox later 509 00:27:12,640 --> 00:27:15,160 Speaker 1: told The Times, I said to Billy Bob, you really 510 00:27:15,200 --> 00:27:17,480 Speaker 1: look like you're high. Are you high? And he said 511 00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:20,080 Speaker 1: every day? And I don't know if he was teasing. 512 00:27:22,119 --> 00:27:24,959 Speaker 1: Thornton allowed to The Times that quote. A couple of 513 00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:27,480 Speaker 1: times I was drunk, but not every day. I showed 514 00:27:27,560 --> 00:27:29,800 Speaker 1: up with a hangover a few times. There were times 515 00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:31,960 Speaker 1: when I'd be with my pals until three thirty am, 516 00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:34,040 Speaker 1: and then I have to be at work at seven am. 517 00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:37,040 Speaker 1: I wasn't the most pleasant guy to pee around. One 518 00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:38,840 Speaker 1: of those days was when they filmed the scene in 519 00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:41,080 Speaker 1: which Willie enters the frame on his way to the 520 00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:44,960 Speaker 1: Santa area of the mall on an up escalator. As 521 00:27:45,040 --> 00:27:48,480 Speaker 1: Billy Bob Thornton recalled The Entertainment Weekly in nineteen I 522 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:51,639 Speaker 1: drank about three glasses of red wine for breakfast. That 523 00:27:51,800 --> 00:27:54,479 Speaker 1: was just an appetizer. Then I switched over to vodka 524 00:27:54,480 --> 00:27:56,360 Speaker 1: and cran Perry juice, and then I had a few 525 00:27:56,359 --> 00:27:58,520 Speaker 1: bud lights. By the time I got to that scene, 526 00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:00,840 Speaker 1: I barely knew I was in a movie. I was 527 00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:03,520 Speaker 1: supposed to be standing on the escalator. It dumps me out, 528 00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:05,720 Speaker 1: and it literally woke me up, and that's what's in 529 00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:09,000 Speaker 1: the movie. And I get up standing around because I 530 00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:10,879 Speaker 1: thought I woke up in my house. And then I 531 00:28:10,920 --> 00:28:13,360 Speaker 1: remember what I was supposed to do. I was supposed 532 00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:15,399 Speaker 1: to go there and fall down and all those gifts 533 00:28:15,440 --> 00:28:17,800 Speaker 1: and be horrible in front of the kids. At least 534 00:28:17,800 --> 00:28:20,159 Speaker 1: it wasn't a monologue. He thought he was in his 535 00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:23,600 Speaker 1: house for a brief moment until he remembered he was 536 00:28:23,640 --> 00:28:27,520 Speaker 1: on a film set. I don't mind to smoke every 537 00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:30,680 Speaker 1: now and again, Thornton told film four dot com. I've 538 00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:33,600 Speaker 1: been known to take a drink occasionally, but I've traditionally 539 00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:37,000 Speaker 1: played really extreme characters. And even in a comedy, if 540 00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:38,800 Speaker 1: you're going to play a guy like this, you can't 541 00:28:38,800 --> 00:28:41,480 Speaker 1: be sort of drunk, you know, And I wasn't sort 542 00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:44,479 Speaker 1: of drunk. You have to go completely into it. He 543 00:28:44,520 --> 00:28:47,080 Speaker 1: echoed that to The Dan Patrick Show, saying, playing a 544 00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:50,040 Speaker 1: character like that, you can't play sevent a character. You've 545 00:28:50,040 --> 00:28:52,800 Speaker 1: got to play are So if you're playing you know, 546 00:28:52,960 --> 00:28:55,400 Speaker 1: Pat Boone, you gotta drink milk and be Pat Boone. 547 00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:58,600 Speaker 1: And if you're playing Charles Manson, you gotta be Charles Manson. 548 00:28:58,760 --> 00:29:01,160 Speaker 1: This came out the year that he and Angelia Jolie divorced. 549 00:29:01,160 --> 00:29:03,920 Speaker 1: I wonder if he's getting in the character for this movie. 550 00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:06,760 Speaker 1: Somehow played a role in that. For the record, he 551 00:29:06,760 --> 00:29:09,800 Speaker 1: would not allow his own children to watch this movie. 552 00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:13,280 Speaker 1: So I got told the times of working with Thornton 553 00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:16,840 Speaker 1: to quote the late great Leo McCarry. I can't say 554 00:29:16,880 --> 00:29:20,880 Speaker 1: I bask in the memory of it. Ultimately, I was 555 00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:23,120 Speaker 1: able to get from Billy Bob what I needed, and 556 00:29:23,160 --> 00:29:25,320 Speaker 1: I hope that by now he appreciates what I brought 557 00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:29,360 Speaker 1: to the party. In his autobiography The Billy Bob Tapes, 558 00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:31,520 Speaker 1: Thornton said that if he could go back to any 559 00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:33,520 Speaker 1: time in his life and relive it, it would be 560 00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:36,480 Speaker 1: this film, the filming of two thousand four's The Alamo, 561 00:29:36,880 --> 00:29:39,360 Speaker 1: and when he worked for the Arkansas Highway Department in 562 00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:46,120 Speaker 1: nine dudes were married six times. Yeah, yeah, you know 563 00:29:46,160 --> 00:29:51,120 Speaker 1: he's he was buddies with Waren zvon fat Scans. Yeah, 564 00:29:51,200 --> 00:29:53,520 Speaker 1: they were. They like lived at the same apartment complex 565 00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:56,520 Speaker 1: when Zevon was on his way down and Billy was 566 00:29:56,680 --> 00:29:59,680 Speaker 1: on his way up as an actor. And I guess 567 00:29:59,680 --> 00:30:02,040 Speaker 1: they both had O c D. So they would like 568 00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:05,520 Speaker 1: bond over their little like go into the mailbox rituals 569 00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:08,320 Speaker 1: and stuff. I didn't know that. Wow, let's the one 570 00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:13,080 Speaker 1: vile blood. Yes, thank you. I wasn't ever ail Intilie 571 00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:16,280 Speaker 1: did that for him or whatever. The problems too. I 572 00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:21,880 Speaker 1: think it was a two way. Yeah, we're going to 573 00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:24,160 Speaker 1: take a quick break, but we'll be right back with 574 00:30:24,200 --> 00:30:39,960 Speaker 1: more too much information and just a moment, well, without 575 00:30:40,000 --> 00:30:42,280 Speaker 1: any more filming stories to regale you with. Now we 576 00:30:42,360 --> 00:30:45,720 Speaker 1: must come to the semi disastrous test audience and screening 577 00:30:45,760 --> 00:30:48,120 Speaker 1: process for Bad Santa. There was a certain amount of 578 00:30:48,120 --> 00:30:53,120 Speaker 1: tension baked into Thornton's characters, quasi redemption arc. Requit told 579 00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:55,800 Speaker 1: The Times that as far back as the very initial writing, 580 00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:58,960 Speaker 1: the Cohen's only had one caveat. They said, it's a 581 00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:01,800 Speaker 1: story about redemn but push it to the very end. 582 00:31:02,120 --> 00:31:05,600 Speaker 1: Not too much redemption too soon. Record continued, saying of 583 00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:08,920 Speaker 1: an early screening that the audience went eighte, but they 584 00:31:08,920 --> 00:31:11,480 Speaker 1: gave it a terrible score. They were like, this thing 585 00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:13,920 Speaker 1: needs to be buried in a hole. But I loved it. 586 00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:17,680 Speaker 1: After those test scores came in, the Weinstein's freaked out 587 00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:22,520 Speaker 1: and tried to make Willie a super redeemable character. Hilariously. 588 00:31:22,560 --> 00:31:25,440 Speaker 1: Sagoff told The Times in two thousands three, there's two 589 00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:27,479 Speaker 1: New York Times interviews. There's an oral history they did 590 00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:29,320 Speaker 1: in six Team and the sequels coming out, and then 591 00:31:29,320 --> 00:31:31,800 Speaker 1: they did a bunch of Sagoff did this interview when 592 00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:33,840 Speaker 1: the movie came out. They're interesting to compare so in 593 00:31:33,840 --> 00:31:35,480 Speaker 1: the two thousand three interview, he said one of the 594 00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:38,040 Speaker 1: focus groups that we had thought that we had tacked 595 00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:40,880 Speaker 1: on a Hollywood ending when Santa doesn't die at the end. 596 00:31:41,920 --> 00:31:46,720 Speaker 1: It was a focus group in New York that never 597 00:31:46,800 --> 00:31:54,400 Speaker 1: changed New York Greatest City and Lord bing Bog kill 598 00:31:54,560 --> 00:32:01,280 Speaker 1: Santa gold Matt's uh Bob. Weinstein told The New York 599 00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:04,760 Speaker 1: Times in ten that quote. I said to Terry, We're 600 00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:07,080 Speaker 1: not trying to ruin your movie, but there's absolutely no 601 00:32:07,200 --> 00:32:09,120 Speaker 1: heart in it. So we put in a little heart. 602 00:32:09,160 --> 00:32:11,040 Speaker 1: We didn't make a vanilla. We weren't trying to make 603 00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:15,440 Speaker 1: not so good Santa. Terry's wagoff. They'll refused to film 604 00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:18,600 Speaker 1: the proposed editions, so the Weinstein brought in Hangover and 605 00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:21,760 Speaker 1: old School director Todd Phillips for the new footage, including 606 00:32:21,760 --> 00:32:23,880 Speaker 1: the scene where Thornton and Cox teach the kid how 607 00:32:23,920 --> 00:32:26,600 Speaker 1: to box, as well as a sentimental sequence about an 608 00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:30,040 Speaker 1: advent calendar. Weinstein told The Times, Todd Phillips did the 609 00:32:30,080 --> 00:32:32,760 Speaker 1: greatest job on this movie. Thank god he came in. 610 00:32:33,320 --> 00:32:38,840 Speaker 1: Terry's wagof Meanwhile, disagrees, he told Dwyer. At one point, 611 00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:40,880 Speaker 1: the Weinsteins asked the Cohens to watch a cut that 612 00:32:40,920 --> 00:32:43,800 Speaker 1: the wine Steins had done that made it much more mainstream. 613 00:32:43,840 --> 00:32:45,800 Speaker 1: They added a bunch of scenes, some of which I 614 00:32:45,840 --> 00:32:48,080 Speaker 1: refused to film, and they cut them in and the 615 00:32:48,120 --> 00:32:50,880 Speaker 1: Cohen brothers watched it. They said, well, you tried to 616 00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:53,600 Speaker 1: make this film into American pie. It's a piece of now, 617 00:32:54,120 --> 00:32:56,040 Speaker 1: that was their response, and they got into a heated 618 00:32:56,120 --> 00:32:58,480 Speaker 1: argument with the Weinsteins that ended with everyone yelling for 619 00:32:58,680 --> 00:33:00,680 Speaker 1: you at each other. It didn't when any part of 620 00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:02,680 Speaker 1: it after that, so I was stuck with it. It 621 00:33:02,760 --> 00:33:07,280 Speaker 1: got pretty nasty. Things got even uglier, so I got continued. 622 00:33:07,520 --> 00:33:10,560 Speaker 1: I went and had a Director's Guild arbitration about it, 623 00:33:10,600 --> 00:33:13,640 Speaker 1: because my lawyer had originally traded off half my salary 624 00:33:13,680 --> 00:33:16,239 Speaker 1: to get me final cut of the film. When these 625 00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:18,080 Speaker 1: guys tried to cut it, I called her up and 626 00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:20,880 Speaker 1: she said I would have to hire outside litigators at 627 00:33:20,880 --> 00:33:23,800 Speaker 1: thirty five thousand dollars a day to try and fight that, 628 00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:26,240 Speaker 1: that her office doesn't do that. And I said, well, 629 00:33:26,240 --> 00:33:29,280 Speaker 1: the contract you got me was worthless. I felt entitled 630 00:33:29,280 --> 00:33:30,640 Speaker 1: to my cut of the film, and I went to 631 00:33:30,680 --> 00:33:33,440 Speaker 1: a d G a arbitration because I couldn't afford litigation. 632 00:33:34,040 --> 00:33:36,440 Speaker 1: Under the terms of that arbitration, I can't tell you 633 00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:39,000 Speaker 1: any more than what I've told you. A lot of 634 00:33:39,040 --> 00:33:41,320 Speaker 1: what they shot they tested and it didn't work, so 635 00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:43,680 Speaker 1: they got rid of it anyway. Then I got to 636 00:33:43,680 --> 00:33:46,280 Speaker 1: work to push it closer to my original version. It 637 00:33:46,320 --> 00:33:49,360 Speaker 1: was damage control at that point. Todd Phillips has not 638 00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:53,040 Speaker 1: talked about this, so I have not been able to 639 00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:54,960 Speaker 1: find out anything more about this. But yeah, the guy 640 00:33:54,960 --> 00:33:57,880 Speaker 1: who directed Joker did a bunch of uncredited reshoots on 641 00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:01,680 Speaker 1: Bad Santa, and it piste off the Ghost World director 642 00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:04,520 Speaker 1: so much he took it to d G a arbitration. 643 00:34:04,880 --> 00:34:07,080 Speaker 1: Bet you guys didn't know that about your fun little 644 00:34:07,120 --> 00:34:12,000 Speaker 1: dirty Santa movie. The director's cut version that's available says 645 00:34:12,120 --> 00:34:14,799 Speaker 1: he's closest to his original version. He said, that's the 646 00:34:14,800 --> 00:34:17,360 Speaker 1: filming of the script. Basically, that's the script I was given. 647 00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:19,279 Speaker 1: The studio wanted to mess with it and make it 648 00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:21,960 Speaker 1: more mainstream and pour some fake sentiment on it for 649 00:34:22,000 --> 00:34:26,799 Speaker 1: the people that stumble around the mall. He's very mean. 650 00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:32,279 Speaker 1: We made Bad Santo. We expect high go I know 651 00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:34,640 Speaker 1: you've got the stats for the absanities in this movie. 652 00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:41,360 Speaker 1: Give us the final score count the unrated version of 653 00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:44,200 Speaker 1: this film, it has the record for most swears and 654 00:34:44,280 --> 00:34:49,360 Speaker 1: Christmas movie. Obviously excellent, the unrated version pushes that even further. 655 00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:52,960 Speaker 1: The total tally is, per IMDb, a hundred and seventy 656 00:34:53,280 --> 00:34:57,799 Speaker 1: uses of seventy four uses of thirty one uses of ass, 657 00:34:57,880 --> 00:35:02,920 Speaker 1: ten uses of bitch, and one news of bastard, beating 658 00:35:02,920 --> 00:35:09,600 Speaker 1: out the previous record held by It's a Wonderful Life. Yeah, 659 00:35:09,680 --> 00:35:12,200 Speaker 1: I had buddy, he used to uh his He would 660 00:35:12,200 --> 00:35:13,919 Speaker 1: do a drinking game of this, and you drink every 661 00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:19,360 Speaker 1: time someone says Jesus Well. There's a scene where la 662 00:35:19,640 --> 00:35:21,640 Speaker 1: Lauren Graham has sex with Billy Bob Thorne in a 663 00:35:21,719 --> 00:35:26,440 Speaker 1: car and she's going to mean me Santa, just chug 664 00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:28,720 Speaker 1: your beer. At that point I thought it was shots. Okay, 665 00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:34,040 Speaker 1: that's better than no that it just killed. According to 666 00:35:34,080 --> 00:35:37,960 Speaker 1: the website Film Stories, there's an even more disastrous screening 667 00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:41,560 Speaker 1: of Bad Santa for Disney executives who owned to Mention Pictures, 668 00:35:41,560 --> 00:35:44,480 Speaker 1: who released Bad Santa, Supposedly when the film was screamed 669 00:35:44,520 --> 00:35:47,719 Speaker 1: from Michael Eisner and other House of Mouse leadership. An 670 00:35:47,840 --> 00:35:51,320 Speaker 1: unnamed top source close to Eisner told the Drudge Report 671 00:35:51,360 --> 00:35:54,879 Speaker 1: that quote nothing appears sacred anymore. This is just not 672 00:35:55,000 --> 00:36:00,919 Speaker 1: in the spirit of Walt Disney, which is true. Yeah, 673 00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:03,640 Speaker 1: this report was contested because it basically went to Drudge 674 00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:06,319 Speaker 1: Report and then in like ain't it Cool News and 675 00:36:06,440 --> 00:36:08,719 Speaker 1: all the British and then all the British tabloids. So 676 00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:10,680 Speaker 1: take it with a grain of salt. But a lot 677 00:36:10,680 --> 00:36:14,320 Speaker 1: of this is actually also covered in a book about 678 00:36:14,400 --> 00:36:17,200 Speaker 1: this era of Disney which I just lost that damn 679 00:36:17,200 --> 00:36:20,040 Speaker 1: title of Um they got so much traction in the 680 00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:22,600 Speaker 1: press that Billy Bob Thornton addressed it in an interview 681 00:36:22,600 --> 00:36:25,560 Speaker 1: with Empire and it's December two thousand four issues, saying 682 00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:28,120 Speaker 1: they knew what it was. They don't give you millions 683 00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:29,799 Speaker 1: of dollars to make a movie if they don't read 684 00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:33,840 Speaker 1: the script, which is also true. Disney War is the movie. 685 00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:35,560 Speaker 1: Have you heard about that or the book? Have you 686 00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:39,960 Speaker 1: heard that? No? Yeah, it's Roy Disney versus Michael Eisner 687 00:36:40,320 --> 00:36:44,560 Speaker 1: for the soul of Disney just called Disney War. Oh wow, Well, 688 00:36:44,600 --> 00:36:47,280 Speaker 1: I mean guess bad Santa became part of the ammunition 689 00:36:47,320 --> 00:36:49,880 Speaker 1: that was used to try to push Eisner out of Disney, 690 00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:52,080 Speaker 1: even at the top of the company. For you say 691 00:36:52,120 --> 00:36:54,319 Speaker 1: over a decade. I would say probably closer to two 692 00:36:54,320 --> 00:36:57,200 Speaker 1: decades in early two thousand three, uh, and one of 693 00:36:57,239 --> 00:37:01,000 Speaker 1: his enemies was the late Roy Disney, who used Bad 694 00:37:01,040 --> 00:37:04,000 Speaker 1: Santa at one stage against Michael Eisner as an example 695 00:37:04,040 --> 00:37:07,360 Speaker 1: to how Disney had apparently lost its way. And I 696 00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:09,640 Speaker 1: guess the other big sticking point was Killed Bill, which 697 00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:12,680 Speaker 1: went out from Mirror Max and thus also technically under 698 00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:16,120 Speaker 1: the aegis of Disney. Roy Disney resigned at the end 699 00:37:16,120 --> 00:37:18,520 Speaker 1: of November two thousand three and asked I user to 700 00:37:18,560 --> 00:37:20,520 Speaker 1: follow him out the door, but I was never hang 701 00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:23,600 Speaker 1: on for another year or two, finally exiting after twenty 702 00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:27,160 Speaker 1: one years in September two five, and under pressure from 703 00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:29,759 Speaker 1: the board, he resigned a year earlier than planned and 704 00:37:29,880 --> 00:37:32,440 Speaker 1: handed the job over to Bob Igor And while all 705 00:37:32,520 --> 00:37:35,240 Speaker 1: this was going on, Disney in the UK decided to 706 00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:38,600 Speaker 1: wash their hands in Bad Santa altogether and ended up 707 00:37:38,640 --> 00:37:41,760 Speaker 1: giving it to the more than grateful Sony to release. 708 00:37:42,880 --> 00:37:46,439 Speaker 1: Thornton meanwhile found himself defending Bad Santa in public using 709 00:37:46,480 --> 00:37:49,239 Speaker 1: a stock line. We did get a few comments this 710 00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:51,480 Speaker 1: is him talking to film four dot com and my 711 00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:54,040 Speaker 1: reply was always, as far as I know, Santa Claus 712 00:37:54,080 --> 00:37:56,000 Speaker 1: is not in the Bible. I think you guys are 713 00:37:56,040 --> 00:38:01,440 Speaker 1: talking about Jesus. Whenever people would be like, what you 714 00:38:01,440 --> 00:38:05,160 Speaker 1: you've you know, you've you've the name of sanded, the 715 00:38:05,239 --> 00:38:07,040 Speaker 1: name of Santa. And he's like, well, I'm a criminal 716 00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:10,960 Speaker 1: who acts as Santa. Yeah, It's just it seems so quaint, 717 00:38:11,360 --> 00:38:14,720 Speaker 1: you know. People were so mad about this. Well. Released 718 00:38:14,719 --> 00:38:17,960 Speaker 1: on November two thousand and three, Bad Santa would go 719 00:38:17,960 --> 00:38:20,839 Speaker 1: on to gross nearly, as we mentioned before, seventy six 720 00:38:20,880 --> 00:38:23,520 Speaker 1: and a half million dollars worldwide on a three million 721 00:38:23,560 --> 00:38:26,959 Speaker 1: dollar budget. Thornton told Mandatory dot com when it first 722 00:38:26,960 --> 00:38:29,760 Speaker 1: came out, it grew slowly, but it became successful very quickly. 723 00:38:30,120 --> 00:38:32,080 Speaker 1: It was the most well reviewed comedy of that year, 724 00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:33,640 Speaker 1: and it made a lot of money, so it was 725 00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:36,520 Speaker 1: a huge success. Ebert gave it three and a half stars. 726 00:38:36,520 --> 00:38:38,720 Speaker 1: It's got a seventy eight percent rating and rotten tomatoes 727 00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:43,200 Speaker 1: on Metacritic. Aided by annual broadcasts on the edgier side 728 00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:45,800 Speaker 1: of cable like Spike TV and f X, albeit in 729 00:38:45,840 --> 00:38:48,200 Speaker 1: a heavily edited form, the film would go on to 730 00:38:48,200 --> 00:38:51,280 Speaker 1: become a cult classic and then earn a much less 731 00:38:51,280 --> 00:38:55,600 Speaker 1: well received sequel in I always had faith in it, 732 00:38:55,800 --> 00:38:59,279 Speaker 1: as GoF told The Times, despite a superficial interpretation that 733 00:38:59,320 --> 00:39:01,880 Speaker 1: it's a film ruled by vulgarity. It has an important 734 00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:08,120 Speaker 1: message consumerism can destroy us. Plus it's really funny. But 735 00:39:08,320 --> 00:39:11,480 Speaker 1: he told IndieWire, I'm more surprised by its cultural impact. 736 00:39:11,719 --> 00:39:14,239 Speaker 1: Every time I look at the newspaper or online, there's 737 00:39:14,239 --> 00:39:17,120 Speaker 1: some sort of bad Santa happening around town. There's a 738 00:39:17,160 --> 00:39:20,080 Speaker 1: Bad Santa bar crawl, there's a bad Santa party, there's 739 00:39:20,120 --> 00:39:23,839 Speaker 1: bad Santa rap music. There's bad Santa porno. I can't 740 00:39:23,880 --> 00:39:26,719 Speaker 1: fouch for that one, terry, but the rest of them 741 00:39:26,760 --> 00:39:30,680 Speaker 1: I've I've seen and heard. As we mentioned earlier, there's 742 00:39:30,680 --> 00:39:35,080 Speaker 1: been a spate of there's Bad Moms, A Bad Mom's Christmas, 743 00:39:35,719 --> 00:39:41,640 Speaker 1: Bad Teacher, which start Cameron Diaz, right, yeah, I don't 744 00:39:41,640 --> 00:39:45,440 Speaker 1: remember Bad Moms though. Got two sequels, Buddy or a 745 00:39:45,560 --> 00:39:50,080 Speaker 1: sequel um trying to think of what the other You 746 00:39:50,120 --> 00:39:52,759 Speaker 1: can't if you just search a bad Movies, you don't 747 00:39:52,800 --> 00:39:58,319 Speaker 1: really get up and Kristin Bell, Yeah, yeah, okay, yeah, 748 00:39:58,400 --> 00:40:00,520 Speaker 1: let's see what else we got. Oh well, it was 749 00:40:00,560 --> 00:40:02,520 Speaker 1: funny that someone was drawing a line between this and 750 00:40:02,560 --> 00:40:04,960 Speaker 1: Bad Lieutenant, which is the able for our movie where 751 00:40:04,960 --> 00:40:08,600 Speaker 1: Harvey Kitele plays like a horrifically corrupt uh you know 752 00:40:08,640 --> 00:40:12,920 Speaker 1: New York City police officer and um detective and like 753 00:40:13,000 --> 00:40:15,600 Speaker 1: does like full frontal nudity and like smokes crack and 754 00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:19,279 Speaker 1: all of this stuff. Um, well, you could say that 755 00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:23,080 Speaker 1: the there's the you know, dirty Grandpa and sexy Grandpa 756 00:40:23,239 --> 00:40:25,560 Speaker 1: or whatever the Robert de Niro was you know what 757 00:40:25,560 --> 00:40:30,640 Speaker 1: I'm talking about, Dirty Grandpa, bad mean Grandpa. I'm thinking 758 00:40:30,640 --> 00:40:34,239 Speaker 1: of like the Jackass spin off movie. Oh no, Robert 759 00:40:34,280 --> 00:40:38,520 Speaker 1: Janniro was in was in one of those. Um no, 760 00:40:38,640 --> 00:40:42,560 Speaker 1: I guess that's it Bad News Bear a sequel. Yeah, 761 00:40:43,960 --> 00:40:51,799 Speaker 1: that bad bad Leroy Brown. Um, I didn't write an 762 00:40:51,840 --> 00:40:58,080 Speaker 1: outre for this. Merry Christmas, yes, Mary, Christmas everyone. As 763 00:40:58,080 --> 00:41:01,719 Speaker 1: a Christmas gift to ourselves, we are taking the week 764 00:41:01,800 --> 00:41:08,120 Speaker 1: between Christmas and New Year's off, so please enjoy time 765 00:41:08,160 --> 00:41:12,880 Speaker 1: with your loved ones instead of listening to us, And 766 00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:17,719 Speaker 1: we'll be back with Jordan's uh rothco chapel of of 767 00:41:17,760 --> 00:41:24,319 Speaker 1: a series of episodes Familia. We're gonna kick off right 768 00:41:24,920 --> 00:41:28,880 Speaker 1: with our Titanic two parter, maybe even a three partter 769 00:41:28,960 --> 00:41:32,000 Speaker 1: at this stage, can't tell I've been writing it all 770 00:41:32,040 --> 00:41:34,200 Speaker 1: the month of December and I'm still not done, which 771 00:41:34,200 --> 00:41:36,719 Speaker 1: is part of the reason why we're taking off them. 772 00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:41,160 Speaker 1: We can start well, folks. As always, thank you for listening. 773 00:41:41,200 --> 00:41:44,719 Speaker 1: This has been too much Information. I'm Alex Hegel and 774 00:41:44,760 --> 00:41:47,279 Speaker 1: I'm Jordan run Tug, and thank you for making our 775 00:41:47,400 --> 00:41:55,280 Speaker 1: year Mary and Bright. Too Much Information was a production 776 00:41:55,320 --> 00:41:58,279 Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio. The show's executive producers are Noel 777 00:41:58,360 --> 00:42:01,960 Speaker 1: Brown and Jordan run Talk Shows. Supervising producer is Michael 778 00:42:01,960 --> 00:42:05,239 Speaker 1: Alder June. The show was researched, written and hosted by 779 00:42:05,320 --> 00:42:08,520 Speaker 1: Jordan Runtog and Alex Hegel, with original music by Seth 780 00:42:08,560 --> 00:42:11,120 Speaker 1: Applebaum and the Ghost Funk Orchestra. If you like what 781 00:42:11,200 --> 00:42:13,560 Speaker 1: you heard, please subscribe and leave us a review. For 782 00:42:13,680 --> 00:42:16,120 Speaker 1: more podcasts and I heart Radio, visit the I heart 783 00:42:16,200 --> 00:42:19,040 Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your 784 00:42:19,040 --> 00:42:19,760 Speaker 1: favorite shows.