WEBVTT - Why Now? 0:00:05.160 --> 0:00:08.160 Welcome to reparations, the big payback, the production of Color 0:00:08.240 --> 0:00:12.039 Farm Media, I Heart Radio and the Black Effect podcast network. 0:00:12.560 --> 0:00:16.680 I'm Erica, Alexander and I Whitney out. There's no reason 0:00:17.160 --> 0:00:25.720 reparations what we are. The ones that were injured were solos, 0:00:26.760 --> 0:00:33.000 were solos. Enslavement is stuff. The people who are owed 0:00:33.120 --> 0:00:36.160 for slavery are no longer here. I want to check. 0:00:36.320 --> 0:00:40.360 I don't think reparations is a good idea. Everyone should 0:00:40.360 --> 0:00:43.280 be given the damage that was done to their family 0:00:43.440 --> 0:00:47.559 cash payment. I don't want no government and though reparations 0:00:47.840 --> 0:00:51.320 should be welcomed by all, some folks may want checks, 0:00:51.360 --> 0:00:54.240 but what we're really talking about is closing that wealth 0:00:54.280 --> 0:00:58.600 gap and making people whole. Let me tell you justice. 0:00:59.040 --> 0:01:06.640 It's just uh. Here we are on the corner of 0:01:06.880 --> 0:01:10.360 Wall and Broad Street, one of the most like famous 0:01:10.920 --> 0:01:15.320 corners in America. Right, it's the seat of capitalism. We're 0:01:15.360 --> 0:01:18.720 standing at the feet of George Washington, founder of our country, 0:01:18.720 --> 0:01:22.520 who's looking across Wall Street at the New York Stock Exchange. 0:01:25.040 --> 0:01:30.319 It this is it. It's smaller than I thought. It 0:01:30.360 --> 0:01:33.520 looks more impressive than pictures. I was doing a little 0:01:33.520 --> 0:01:36.720 research before we came down here. Erica, and you know 0:01:36.959 --> 0:01:40.440 the value of the company's contained in the New York 0:01:40.440 --> 0:01:44.520 stock has changes over thirty trillion dollars. That's ten trillion 0:01:44.520 --> 0:01:50.360 dollars more than the nation's GDP every year thirty Amazon, 0:01:54.760 --> 0:01:57.880 and the value and the amount of trading that is 0:01:57.920 --> 0:02:00.760 done every day about of money that passes through there 0:02:00.920 --> 0:02:04.320 is I think, over a hundred and sixty billion dollars 0:02:04.320 --> 0:02:06.840 every day. When you think of Wall Street, what do 0:02:06.840 --> 0:02:09.520 you think of I think of this. I mean, it's 0:02:10.000 --> 0:02:13.280 a little a lot of stone. There's all these really 0:02:13.320 --> 0:02:19.240 beautiful polished bronze doors with sparkling glass and a lot 0:02:19.280 --> 0:02:22.440 of really decorative iron work around, and it's kind of 0:02:22.480 --> 0:02:25.840 telling everybody, well, if you're a white man, you can 0:02:25.880 --> 0:02:29.080 come in, but everybody else stay out. Meant to intimidate, 0:02:29.160 --> 0:02:32.680 and it does. It's not only intimidating to New Yorkers, 0:02:32.720 --> 0:02:34.720 but I think it's meant to be intimidating to the world. 0:02:35.160 --> 0:02:38.360 What I didn't realize is that directly across the street 0:02:39.360 --> 0:02:42.160 is Federal Halls. Walk up there a little bit America. 0:02:44.480 --> 0:02:49.119 We're standing in front of Federal Hall Memorial and that's 0:02:49.120 --> 0:02:51.359 another Gothic building, and out in front of it, there's 0:02:51.400 --> 0:02:54.799 a statue of George Washington, and it really struck me 0:02:54.800 --> 0:02:56.680 when I saw us. Here's the founder of our country, 0:02:57.560 --> 0:03:00.000 and he's looking across the street at the stock exchange 0:03:00.000 --> 0:03:04.560 age as if he's looking at the capitalist foundation of 0:03:04.600 --> 0:03:06.919 the country. But this is where he took the oath 0:03:06.960 --> 0:03:12.000 of office upstairs in this building. Wow, they really did 0:03:12.040 --> 0:03:14.720 a nice job on the bronze work near his crutch, 0:03:15.480 --> 0:03:17.640 and it matters because you're looking up at him and 0:03:17.639 --> 0:03:19.600 you're meant to see his penis first and then go 0:03:19.720 --> 0:03:21.760 up to his face and follow his eyes to the 0:03:22.000 --> 0:03:25.799 stock exchange. At least that's not what I see at 0:03:25.840 --> 0:03:29.799 our back is George Washington. If we look to our right, 0:03:30.360 --> 0:03:33.280 we can see Trinity Church, the oldest church I think's 0:03:33.280 --> 0:03:34.720 one of those churches in the country, all these church 0:03:34.720 --> 0:03:41.720 in New York. If you look across the street directly 0:03:41.720 --> 0:03:44.520 in front of us as a stock exchange, and then 0:03:45.000 --> 0:03:48.720 if you look down the street to the water, do 0:03:48.760 --> 0:03:53.080 you know what's down that street The location of New 0:03:53.160 --> 0:03:58.920 York's first slave market that was founded in seventeen eleven. 0:03:59.520 --> 0:04:01.760 So if we're should have like the four points of 0:04:01.760 --> 0:04:07.760 the compass in America, we have politics, money, religion, slavery. 0:04:08.080 --> 0:04:10.960 That sounds right. Black people will always make up the 0:04:11.000 --> 0:04:13.960 four points. And in fact, none of these things could exist, 0:04:14.640 --> 0:04:20.039 these politics, that religion, or that money without slavery. And 0:04:20.120 --> 0:04:24.200 that's the unfortunate part. For them to have white freedom 0:04:24.200 --> 0:04:30.800 and white success, they needed black bodies. You know, when 0:04:30.880 --> 0:04:33.880 I met you, Whitney, I had no idea that I 0:04:33.880 --> 0:04:36.560 would be stuck with you for this long. We've been 0:04:36.560 --> 0:04:40.120 talking about reparations for two years. It's only been two 0:04:40.160 --> 0:04:42.200 years for us, but it's been a hundred and fifty 0:04:42.279 --> 0:04:45.200 years for our country. Did you ever imagine yourself making 0:04:45.200 --> 0:04:47.679 a project about reparations with a guy named Whitney Burton 0:04:47.760 --> 0:04:51.720 Dow from the colony of Cambridge, Massachusetts, Like you often 0:04:51.760 --> 0:04:53.760 point out a look the drawing of a wasp or 0:04:54.560 --> 0:04:57.840 a colonist. Well, yeah, I guess if you come from Cambridge, 0:04:57.839 --> 0:05:01.400 Massachusetts in your name Mats Whitney Burton Dow, you look 0:05:01.440 --> 0:05:05.000 a little whitish. So yeah, but who better than you 0:05:05.279 --> 0:05:08.599 represent for your people if you're talking about white people, Yes, yes, 0:05:09.279 --> 0:05:12.120 white people. Yeah, you're the guy white people in America. 0:05:12.200 --> 0:05:15.359 That's you. Well, Hams Hollywood, you know you're no pauper. 0:05:15.360 --> 0:05:18.520 I've seen your house. If you did, you wouldn't be 0:05:18.520 --> 0:05:23.520 saying that I need reparations just as much as anybody. 0:05:24.400 --> 0:05:27.599 I am no Cambridge Whitney Dow and I didn't just 0:05:27.680 --> 0:05:30.760 pop into people's movie screens and on stages and in 0:05:30.839 --> 0:05:33.880 theaters all over the world. I have an origin story. 0:05:34.000 --> 0:05:38.360 We all have origin stories, and origin stories are how 0:05:38.400 --> 0:05:42.720 you live. They don't hopefully determine who you are. It's 0:05:42.720 --> 0:05:45.680 about the stories we tell ourselves, and I guess story 0:05:45.800 --> 0:05:49.360 shape our present reality, and I think that's where every 0:05:49.360 --> 0:05:54.560 story starts. Every good story is between reality and myth, Like, 0:05:54.640 --> 0:05:58.679 what's possible telling the truth? Well, you're setting a pretty 0:05:58.760 --> 0:06:00.880 high bar that you and I are going to get 0:06:00.920 --> 0:06:03.880 to the truth. Everybody loves different truths, and I think 0:06:03.920 --> 0:06:07.320 your truth is mixed with a lot of lies. Thanks 0:06:07.400 --> 0:06:10.360 for that. Are you talking about me personally, Erica, or 0:06:10.400 --> 0:06:17.200 collectively as the white guy here? Both reparations. It's a 0:06:17.240 --> 0:06:22.279 complicated issue, and I'm not sure if I'm the right 0:06:22.480 --> 0:06:25.160 person to tell the story with you, Erica. Yeah, I 0:06:25.240 --> 0:06:28.359 might be too white. Well I'm extra black, I'm extra 0:06:28.440 --> 0:06:31.440 crispy black. Does that offset some of my whiteness? Is 0:06:31.480 --> 0:06:34.200 that what you're saying no, No, you're white. You white, 0:06:34.200 --> 0:06:37.240 you gotta live with it, any of my problem. I'm 0:06:37.240 --> 0:06:39.360 gonna coattail on your blackness here. By the way, this 0:06:39.440 --> 0:06:41.440 is a conversation. If we're going to go on this 0:06:41.520 --> 0:06:44.760 journey about reparations, it ain't about you. Know, you would 0:06:44.760 --> 0:06:46.880 say it is about you, But I'm Harry, it's child 0:06:46.960 --> 0:06:48.640 you hear me. I'm here to rescue my people. And 0:06:48.640 --> 0:06:50.760 the last time I checked, we just got a new 0:06:51.000 --> 0:06:53.960 black woman VP. So right now I'm feeling like, ain't 0:06:53.960 --> 0:06:56.560 nothing too big for me? And if not you Whitney, 0:06:56.640 --> 0:06:59.120 then who step up? If we're gonna do this, We've 0:06:59.160 --> 0:07:01.479 got to make a plan. We gotta find experts. We 0:07:01.560 --> 0:07:04.520 gotta you know, find people who actually know what they're 0:07:04.560 --> 0:07:08.560 talking about. Just goose your eyes and make a wish 0:07:09.160 --> 0:07:13.920 count to three. Yeah, that's come on, that's Sheila Jackson Lee. 0:07:14.160 --> 0:07:19.240 That's Congressional hearing on hrd. America is a place and 0:07:19.360 --> 0:07:23.360 welcomes the diversity of thought. We even welcome the diversity 0:07:23.360 --> 0:07:27.600 of thought among the multi colored chocolate people that are 0:07:27.680 --> 0:07:32.600 African Americans. Did you hear that multi colored chocolate? Do 0:07:32.640 --> 0:07:35.520 you see how she got down old old girl as 0:07:35.560 --> 0:07:40.000 a warrior if we were to pay reparations today, we 0:07:40.040 --> 0:07:42.680 would only divide the country further about to turn on 0:07:42.800 --> 0:07:48.080 him like Mr Colored Purpose. Reparations by definition, are only 0:07:48.120 --> 0:07:52.200 given to victims. Victims had no consent. What you're supposed 0:07:52.200 --> 0:07:54.920 to say? I give you permission to rid Maddin me 0:07:55.040 --> 0:08:00.640 massa who here comes down? Mr Wakanda buck up. We 0:08:00.720 --> 0:08:06.080 recognize our lineage as a generational trust as inheritance, and 0:08:06.120 --> 0:08:09.600 the real dilemma posed by reparations is just that, a 0:08:09.640 --> 0:08:15.480 dilemma of inheritance. Yep, that's what's happening in d C. 0:08:15.840 --> 0:08:18.960 I guess that's why HR forty, a built to discuss reparations, 0:08:19.080 --> 0:08:23.440 has been stuck in committee for thirty years. Meanwhile, on 0:08:23.520 --> 0:08:27.840 these mean streets here we are out here, man, it's crazy. 0:08:27.960 --> 0:08:35.480 The remnants of this history is all around us. Oh snap, 0:08:36.679 --> 0:08:42.960 the New York's Municipal slave market. There's a sign here 0:08:42.960 --> 0:08:47.240 are we less than two feet across and just over 0:08:47.280 --> 0:08:51.959 one ft high. It's drawing on it and has a 0:08:52.040 --> 0:08:57.079 green New York Parks emblement. It says our Wall Street 0:08:57.120 --> 0:08:59.720 between Pearl and Water Streets and market that auction enslave 0:08:59.800 --> 0:09:03.439 people of African ancestry is established by a Common Council 0:09:03.559 --> 0:09:06.600 law on November thirtieth, sev eleven. This is the New 0:09:06.679 --> 0:09:11.600 York's municipal slave market sign. But you can look up 0:09:12.360 --> 0:09:16.480 from this site and see Trinity Church, and you can 0:09:16.520 --> 0:09:19.920 see the New York Stock Exchange and the foundation of 0:09:19.920 --> 0:09:23.679 it all. American slavery gets a two by two plaque. 0:09:24.880 --> 0:09:26.960 You know, I've been here before, but this is the 0:09:27.000 --> 0:09:29.560 first time I'm seeing this. Some I'm a little piste off. 0:09:30.280 --> 0:09:33.520 I don't know why it's not more prominent. I don't 0:09:33.520 --> 0:09:36.280 know why it's just a sign. Look, there's a big 0:09:36.280 --> 0:09:39.800 old statue George Washington over there. Big buildings that we 0:09:39.880 --> 0:09:42.400 talked about with stones look like it should be here, 0:09:42.559 --> 0:09:44.440 and this looked like it'd be. It could be knocked 0:09:44.480 --> 0:09:47.959 over by a hard wind. How does it make you 0:09:48.600 --> 0:09:53.840 feel thinking about all this? You're visibly upset, You're shaking, 0:09:54.240 --> 0:09:58.080 you know much shaking. I'm upset. I mean, I really 0:09:58.080 --> 0:10:00.640 wish I could rip that sucker out. It's not even 0:10:00.640 --> 0:10:03.680 worth it being there. And then also I'm kind of 0:10:03.720 --> 0:10:06.640 mad because I have been here before, I didn't see it. 0:10:07.800 --> 0:10:11.520 There are people walking through, their immigrants, got their children, 0:10:11.559 --> 0:10:14.120 they've got all their families, They should be able to 0:10:14.160 --> 0:10:17.719 see it. There should be the stain of it in 0:10:17.800 --> 0:10:20.040 New Yorkers should have to live with it, they should 0:10:20.040 --> 0:10:22.280 have to learn about it, they should be confronted with it. 0:10:22.920 --> 0:10:25.280 I want them to really acknowledge slavery. I want them 0:10:25.280 --> 0:10:28.920 to give us justice. Black people want justice. We deserve it. 0:10:29.360 --> 0:10:32.800 We should have it by any means necessary. And part 0:10:32.800 --> 0:10:34.480 of that justice is that you should not be able 0:10:34.520 --> 0:10:38.400 to come and walk by a slave market marker and 0:10:38.480 --> 0:10:40.920 not be moved by it, or at least have to 0:10:40.960 --> 0:10:47.560 reckon with it or see it. That was so brutal. 0:10:48.160 --> 0:10:50.800 Being there with you, Erica, someone who I care about, 0:10:51.120 --> 0:10:54.800 and seeing the vistal reaction, the pain that it caused 0:10:54.840 --> 0:10:58.600 you to be there, it left me feeling kind of helpless. 0:10:59.160 --> 0:11:01.120 And I know that if I've been alone, if I 0:11:01.120 --> 0:11:02.880 had been there by myself, I would have find some 0:11:02.920 --> 0:11:05.599 way to push myself away from it and the absurdity 0:11:05.640 --> 0:11:09.720 of it and just kind of intellectualize it. Where being 0:11:09.720 --> 0:11:12.920 there with you forced me to own it a bit. 0:11:13.400 --> 0:11:16.400 But that's my problem, not yours. It is your problem 0:11:16.720 --> 0:11:20.520 and black people's burden to bear. I mean, we gave 0:11:20.600 --> 0:11:24.520 you money and paid the big on your loan. Who 0:11:24.520 --> 0:11:27.720 needs bootstraps when they've got friends like you, Whitney. That's 0:11:27.760 --> 0:11:30.560 what I mean earlier when I said your truth is 0:11:30.600 --> 0:11:34.360 filled with a lot of lies. These realities, they show 0:11:34.400 --> 0:11:38.480 it for me every day. Meanwhile, you're underwater thinking your 0:11:38.520 --> 0:11:42.920 real estate has value. What I'm thinking about is solutions. 0:11:43.040 --> 0:11:46.120 And I really believe the only way towards a true 0:11:46.120 --> 0:11:51.640 reconciliation is to create a funded reparations program. And white 0:11:51.640 --> 0:11:53.720 Americans you have to decide if they want to rise 0:11:53.760 --> 0:11:56.120 with Black Americans or fall with them. I see you, 0:11:56.120 --> 0:11:58.760 Whitney down you're doing something. I mean, you're here, you're 0:11:58.840 --> 0:12:02.560 working on it, you're talking about it. But don't expect 0:12:02.559 --> 0:12:06.120 the parade or props are shown up to clean up 0:12:06.120 --> 0:12:10.120 the mess you've made. Yeah, it is a big mess. 0:12:10.400 --> 0:12:14.000 And Erica, you've told me in the past that you 0:12:14.080 --> 0:12:17.319 feel like James Baldwin or Tattenhassi Coates has said that 0:12:17.559 --> 0:12:19.920 you don't really believe, you don't really have faith that 0:12:20.000 --> 0:12:23.640 white people of the ability to change. And I totally 0:12:23.720 --> 0:12:26.880 understand that if I were black, I imagine I would 0:12:26.880 --> 0:12:30.600 feel the exact same way, and especially looking at the 0:12:30.640 --> 0:12:33.400 events the last you know, a few weeks and we've 0:12:33.440 --> 0:12:36.640 had three or four thousand white people storming the Capitol 0:12:36.800 --> 0:12:40.160 and it looks horrible. Those images were just like atrocious. 0:12:40.200 --> 0:12:44.680 But at the same time, we've also had millions of 0:12:44.760 --> 0:12:47.679 white people in the street marching alongside black and brown 0:12:47.720 --> 0:12:51.559 people protesting police violence. So that does make me a 0:12:51.600 --> 0:12:54.880 little optimistic. I hope it doesn't sound corny that I 0:12:54.960 --> 0:12:57.640 do believe we can change, right, Maybe I feel like 0:12:57.679 --> 0:13:00.880 I kind of have to believe we can change. Like 0:13:00.960 --> 0:13:04.480 in Evanston, Illinois, things are changing. I've known his reparation 0:13:04.640 --> 0:13:09.160 robbin and rolls of parks now, so that's different. How 0:13:09.200 --> 0:13:14.600 about that she's a rock star. Four hundred years after 0:13:14.640 --> 0:13:18.600 the first enslaved Africans got off the boat, Alderman Robin 0:13:18.679 --> 0:13:23.640 Ruth Simmons passes the first reparations bill in America. Oh Man, 0:13:24.200 --> 0:13:27.800 talk about the long arc. We gotta keep an eye 0:13:27.800 --> 0:13:29.720 on her. We will. But I want to show you 0:13:29.760 --> 0:13:36.079 something first. So Erica, tell me what do you see here? 0:13:36.080 --> 0:13:39.640 What are we? What were you walking up to? Oh? 0:13:39.760 --> 0:13:43.040 We're Duyne in Elk Street and it says African burial 0:13:43.120 --> 0:13:46.280 ground a way. So they're building a federal building at 0:13:46.280 --> 0:13:49.319 two hundred fifty six million dollar building and when they 0:13:49.320 --> 0:13:52.640 broke ground on they discovered this burial ground. What does 0:13:52.679 --> 0:13:56.800 this say here? Changing landscape obscures the past. The African 0:13:56.880 --> 0:14:02.559 burial ground was labeled Negroes Burial Ground on the seventeen 0:14:02.600 --> 0:14:06.280 fifty five map at right. Colonial New York laws banned 0:14:06.320 --> 0:14:12.120 African funerals and officially consecrated graveyards, prohibited gatherings of large 0:14:12.200 --> 0:14:15.880 numbers of enslaved Africans, and decreed that funerals had to 0:14:15.920 --> 0:14:20.320 be held during daylight. Nonetheless, Africans and their descendants held 0:14:20.320 --> 0:14:23.600 burial ceremonies in a cemetery outside the city wall, near 0:14:23.640 --> 0:14:26.800 a ravine. As New York City expanded northeast, the burial 0:14:26.800 --> 0:14:30.160 ground was closed in seventeen nine and eventually divided into 0:14:30.200 --> 0:14:33.120 lots for sale. The land was filled in and buildings 0:14:33.120 --> 0:14:36.400 were constructed on top. For almost two centuries. New York 0:14:36.400 --> 0:14:40.000 City's growth obscured the graves and the African burial ground 0:14:40.120 --> 0:14:43.760 was nearly forgotten. So we tried to put a Starbucks 0:14:43.800 --> 0:14:48.840 on it. It's a metaphor, right, The foundation is African 0:14:48.880 --> 0:14:51.880 Americans Americans both on top of it. They turned their 0:14:51.920 --> 0:14:56.560 barrel ground into real estate, but that foundation wasn't paid 0:14:56.640 --> 0:15:01.400 for it was paid for in blood, guts and suffering. 0:15:01.880 --> 0:15:07.480 I think of the people buried here were children. So 0:15:07.520 --> 0:15:13.000 we talk about reparations for work and value created, but 0:15:13.520 --> 0:15:18.000 what about reparations for all the people that were destroyed 0:15:18.040 --> 0:15:21.800 by it? It as children, the people who actually never 0:15:22.000 --> 0:15:25.440 had a life. So this is showing the levels of 0:15:25.520 --> 0:15:29.640 different centuries and what they built on top of those coffins. 0:15:29.880 --> 0:15:33.960 It's a diagram. We're ground level, right, Yeah, we're ground level. 0:15:34.360 --> 0:15:37.360 So the on top there's three different centuries. In the 0:15:37.400 --> 0:15:40.560 lowest right, or at least, is the seventeen hundreds. People 0:15:40.600 --> 0:15:44.000 were buried in individual coffins up to three deep. But 0:15:44.120 --> 0:15:48.920 that looks exactly like the slave ship diagrams coming across. 0:15:49.480 --> 0:15:52.640 That's interesting from Africa. So they went out like they 0:15:52.680 --> 0:15:58.960 came in. That's a cold, cold thought. Let's walk up 0:15:58.960 --> 0:16:06.640 to the next marker. This one is says Africans in 0:16:06.720 --> 0:16:10.640 early New York before the American Revolution, York had more 0:16:10.760 --> 0:16:15.240 enslaved Africans. It's most valuable commodity than any other colony 0:16:15.280 --> 0:16:18.360 in the North. You're leaving out the most important thing here. 0:16:18.760 --> 0:16:21.480 It's not that these people were just here, they say, 0:16:21.520 --> 0:16:23.920 and they give an account of their work. Women sewed, 0:16:23.920 --> 0:16:27.360 cooked harvests, didn't care for owners children. Labors tore up 0:16:27.400 --> 0:16:30.680 cobblestone streets, dug trenches late and joined the pipe sections, 0:16:30.680 --> 0:16:33.720 and filled in the trenches. Pay one dollar a day 0:16:33.760 --> 0:16:37.480 in slave workers wages went to their owners. That's real, 0:16:38.520 --> 0:16:40.200 and you know the real One of the reasons why 0:16:40.240 --> 0:16:43.800 the slave market was established down on Wall Street was 0:16:43.960 --> 0:16:49.320 because there were so many enslaved Africans here and the 0:16:49.400 --> 0:16:52.400 actual way the labor pool was structured wasn't really structured. 0:16:52.400 --> 0:16:53.840 There to sending people out in the street to like 0:16:53.920 --> 0:16:56.120 earn money, and they wanted to sort of like codify 0:16:56.160 --> 0:16:59.000 into something more structural. By the way, this whole thing 0:16:59.040 --> 0:17:02.480 is about white fear. Yeah, you should be fucking afraid 0:17:02.960 --> 0:17:06.280 because if we ever get what we deserve and if 0:17:06.280 --> 0:17:09.639 we ever start to balance those books, there ain't no 0:17:09.680 --> 0:17:12.520 stopping us, and it's over. It's not just the rebrowning 0:17:12.520 --> 0:17:15.760 of America, it's the black nation coming into its own. 0:17:16.440 --> 0:17:20.080 So yeah, they try to bury us too black, too strong. 0:17:21.280 --> 0:17:26.280 From eighteen nineties and estimated fifteen thousand enslaved in free 0:17:26.320 --> 0:17:30.360 Africans were laid to rest in African fifteen thousand bodies 0:17:30.400 --> 0:17:34.520 are here seven burial mounds mark the locations of the 0:17:34.600 --> 0:17:39.119 re internments. Here. They are over here, So this is it. 0:17:39.640 --> 0:17:42.800 Look at the mounds here. Oh my god. Now to me, 0:17:43.000 --> 0:17:47.239 this is significant. My god, look at that. What does 0:17:47.280 --> 0:17:51.120 it make you feel to stand here and look at this? Well, 0:17:51.119 --> 0:17:54.199 I'm very proud. I'm glad to see them. And I 0:17:54.200 --> 0:17:57.520 don't know I gained comfort from them being here. I'd 0:17:57.520 --> 0:18:00.600 come out here and eat my lunch with them. What 0:18:00.680 --> 0:18:03.800 do you think? It's funny because you know, you look 0:18:03.840 --> 0:18:06.720 over at the stone and it's all representational. This is 0:18:06.760 --> 0:18:10.000 so much more concrete. These are real burial mounds. And 0:18:10.040 --> 0:18:14.359 knowing that the remains lie underneath it, and knowing that 0:18:14.720 --> 0:18:18.359 they're aligned in a certain way with their heads facing Africa. 0:18:19.000 --> 0:18:28.360 I think it's beautiful. It's beautiful and they shall rise again. 0:18:29.920 --> 0:18:33.879 Oh hey, you know they give tours of this stuff. 0:18:34.480 --> 0:18:40.480 M Black Gotham, thirty books, Totally worth it. Definitely buy 0:18:40.480 --> 0:18:43.080 several tickets. I gotta take my mom and show her 0:18:43.119 --> 0:18:45.840 all these hidden gyms, because she's the greeno in the family. 0:18:46.760 --> 0:18:49.720 Oh man, it's a shame because no matter how hard 0:18:49.760 --> 0:18:53.359 she worked with me, it wasn't enough, and she won't 0:18:53.440 --> 0:18:57.000 live to see a new world that's created through the 0:18:57.040 --> 0:19:01.560 application of reparations. So like the Africans, underneath those buildings, 0:19:02.480 --> 0:19:04.359 it's going to be beyond her flesh and bone. But 0:19:05.080 --> 0:19:08.679 that means it's fertile ground. It's very fertile. My mother's 0:19:08.680 --> 0:19:13.600 in it. It's blessed and highly favored. What really strikes 0:19:13.600 --> 0:19:16.360 me about it, Eric because that it's called the African 0:19:16.359 --> 0:19:21.040 burial ground. But it's not just African history. It's white 0:19:21.080 --> 0:19:25.600 history too, and it's history that's layered across generations. And 0:19:25.960 --> 0:19:28.560 it's not just about what happened before it happened hundreds 0:19:28.560 --> 0:19:31.080 of years ago. You can also see in it how 0:19:31.119 --> 0:19:33.960 it's impacted what's happening today and how you and I 0:19:34.080 --> 0:19:37.760 how our own families are living within the legacy of slavery. Yeah, no, 0:19:37.840 --> 0:19:39.320 I get it. I mean my brother is a Philly 0:19:39.359 --> 0:19:41.920 copp and my sister is a social worker, and they 0:19:41.960 --> 0:19:46.040 worked within the racist system that we're talking about every day. 0:19:46.320 --> 0:19:48.399 You know, that's how they make their living. And the 0:19:48.400 --> 0:19:51.920 weird part is if systematic reformation is needed and reparations 0:19:52.119 --> 0:19:54.960 is part of the cure, we have to get ready 0:19:55.200 --> 0:19:57.800 because there's a whole lot of black folks that are 0:19:57.840 --> 0:20:01.119 baked into the current architecture and they ain't gonna get out. So, 0:20:01.160 --> 0:20:03.600 I mean, it's a rough ride. It would disrupt everything. 0:20:03.680 --> 0:20:06.280 So we got to be careful what we wish for first, 0:20:06.359 --> 0:20:08.720 do no harm. Maybe we need to step out of 0:20:08.720 --> 0:20:21.840 our current reality from all Reven Barber says that we're 0:20:21.840 --> 0:20:25.800 in the third reconstruction. So Whitney, this is our opportunity 0:20:25.920 --> 0:20:29.240 to map out a blueprint, to chart a new destiny, 0:20:30.000 --> 0:20:34.600 to decide who our builders are. Our architects are machinists. 0:20:35.440 --> 0:20:37.440 You would probably need a few arsonists. We're gonna have 0:20:37.440 --> 0:20:40.399 to tear some things down along the way. But first 0:20:41.040 --> 0:20:50.280 we need vision. Imagination, you mean a reimagination. That's a 0:20:50.320 --> 0:20:54.120 little change. Oh, it's amazing what a good composition can 0:20:54.200 --> 0:20:59.600 do to carry us away. Okay, I'm ready. I think. Well, 0:20:59.680 --> 0:21:01.240 let's be real. You always feel your best at the 0:21:01.280 --> 0:21:04.920 beginning of the marathon. I hope, I'm ready, Yeah, I hope. 0:21:04.960 --> 0:21:11.400 I bought a black power bar this season on Reparations, 0:21:11.520 --> 0:21:14.160 the Big Payback. I didn't have a lot of skills. 0:21:14.200 --> 0:21:16.159 I was a bad student. That was kind of this 0:21:16.400 --> 0:21:18.720 histof Charlie got thrown out of schools. I was always 0:21:18.720 --> 0:21:21.200 getting good fights. So that's why you got into race work, 0:21:21.359 --> 0:21:25.679 because you were a mediocre white man anywhere anywhere, exactly 0:21:25.680 --> 0:21:29.480 what you're saying. I failed everywhere else, So race took 0:21:29.520 --> 0:21:31.120 me in it. I made a career out of it 0:21:31.359 --> 0:21:34.480 because that's what we needed. This business. We need to 0:21:34.480 --> 0:21:39.800 rejects awesome. Look, we have to define reparations. Some people 0:21:39.800 --> 0:21:42.640 want to define reparations as a give me a check. 0:21:43.200 --> 0:21:46.879 That's not reparations. They treat us like animals more or 0:21:46.960 --> 0:21:50.439 less than like human beings. And we are the ones 0:21:50.800 --> 0:21:54.399 who lost our lives building this country and got paid 0:21:54.560 --> 0:21:58.240 not one dime for it. But everybody else is reaping 0:21:58.359 --> 0:22:02.840 the benefits. That's album money. My life revolves primarily around 0:22:03.119 --> 0:22:06.200 my discovery that my ancestors were the largest slave trading 0:22:06.240 --> 0:22:09.320 family in US history. When I looked at you, Wikipedia, 0:22:09.440 --> 0:22:12.440 my god brother, you're not playing you like the John 0:22:12.520 --> 0:22:18.000 Lewis of the Aristocrats, the inspiration for me and reparations. 0:22:18.040 --> 0:22:22.200 I know that the injustice and the discrimination in the 0:22:22.320 --> 0:22:26.119 racism is a shared problem, but which has to be 0:22:26.200 --> 0:22:30.360 confronted if we're gonna move on successfully together. My life 0:22:30.359 --> 0:22:32.760 would have been any different if I was black, because 0:22:32.920 --> 0:22:36.359 it's the core of who you are. Everyone has a burden. 0:22:36.680 --> 0:22:39.800 It's how you handle the burden, and so I truly 0:22:39.840 --> 0:22:42.920 don't feel that there was a privilege. Absolutely not. Mom. 0:22:43.080 --> 0:22:47.240 What happened was we were standing in there and suddenly 0:22:47.359 --> 0:22:51.840 the window shatters. The policeman told me that he was 0:22:52.080 --> 0:22:57.280 trying to kill some blackbirds, meaning my children, who were 0:22:57.359 --> 0:23:02.159 standing at the window at and not been for a 0:23:02.400 --> 0:23:07.919 double pain windows, probably I would have that morning lost 0:23:08.080 --> 0:23:11.359 two of my children. If I had enough money to 0:23:11.960 --> 0:23:16.240 ease the disparities and enough programs directed run by black 0:23:16.280 --> 0:23:19.520 people to help us, then I would even be willing 0:23:19.640 --> 0:23:24.040 not to have Chambel Harris Speed Vice President. What goes 0:23:24.080 --> 0:23:27.440 on your playlist? The reparations playlist? Well, what I play 0:23:27.520 --> 0:23:29.320 for my students at the end of the semester is 0:23:29.560 --> 0:23:36.159 um when will we get paid? This podcast is produced 0:23:36.160 --> 0:23:39.560 by Eric Alexander, Dan Arnon and Whitney daw The executive 0:23:39.560 --> 0:23:42.639 producers are Charlomagne the God and Dolly s. Bishop, The 0:23:42.680 --> 0:23:47.280 supervising producers Nicole Childers and the lead producers Devin Madock Robins, 0:23:47.280 --> 0:23:50.520 the producer writer Serres Castle, and the associate producers Kevin 0:23:50.560 --> 0:23:54.400 fan With additional research support provided by Nile Blast original 0:23:54.480 --> 0:24:04.080 music by dj d t P Reparations. The Big Payback 0:24:04.160 --> 0:24:07.000 is a production of color Farm Media, I Heart Radio, 0:24:07.240 --> 0:24:10.800 and The Black Effect Podcast Network in association with Best 0:24:10.800 --> 0:24:14.680 Case Studios. For more podcasts from I heart Radio, visit 0:24:14.680 --> 0:24:18.159 the I heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you 0:24:18.160 --> 0:24:19.399 listen to your favorite shows.