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Speaker 1: Hi, guys, Welcome to a new episode of Legally Brunettes.

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Speaker 1: I will be your host Emily Simpson with my co

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Speaker 1: host Shane Shane. Okay, first of all, before we get

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Speaker 1: into the case we're going to talk about today, which

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Speaker 1: is the Jennifer Dulo's case, we have to talk about

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Speaker 1: Kim Kardashian not passing the bar exam. I feel like

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Speaker 1: it was it just happened. She made a statement. So

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Speaker 1: Kim Kardashian has revealed the result of her recent bar

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Speaker 1: exam as the reality TV star continues to pursue a

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Speaker 1: career in law. First of all, I have to say,

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Speaker 1: let me ask you your opinion, because you did take

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Speaker 1: the bar exam multiple times under the scrutiny, and first

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Speaker 1: of all, you had to take it up this same scrutiny,

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Speaker 1: not the same scrutiny, A low level of scrutiny. It

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Speaker 1: was the Bravo TV community scrutiny. She's taking it. And

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Speaker 1: it's a how many followers does she have on Instagram?

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Speaker 1: Like three hundred million or something, right, I mean that's

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Speaker 1: a lot of eyes on her. So what do you think, like,

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Speaker 1: what is that? What do you think to go to

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Speaker 1: have to take something at that big and then the

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Speaker 1: whole world knows about it. You have no opinion, I

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Speaker 1: don't know.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it sucks for her, okay, but but you got

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Speaker 2: to think about it. She's worth nearly two billion dollars.

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Speaker 2: She's got a skims company, which is huge. I'm sure

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Speaker 2: that's very time consuming. As much as she wanted wanted

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Speaker 2: to be all the public appearances. How many kids does

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Speaker 2: she have? I think for yeah, and then she has

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Speaker 2: to deal with Kanye right, so she's got a lot

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Speaker 2: and a reality show. Oh and she's she's playing a

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Speaker 2: bad actress on it the Lawyer movie you watch or

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Speaker 2: show you watch? Yes, also, so she's got a lot

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Speaker 2: going on. It's amazing that she even wants to do this.

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Speaker 2: I don't know why she wants to do this.

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Speaker 1: You know, I don't either, But but like you said,

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Speaker 1: she's worth two billion dollars. But you have to give

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Speaker 1: her credit for wanting to do it and saying that

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Speaker 1: she's going to do it again. I know it takes

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Speaker 1: a lot, I know, of guts to publicly put yourself

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Speaker 1: out there.

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Speaker 2: To say comments of people making Joe set her expense

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Speaker 2: or criticizing her, But it didn't stop her so you know,

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Speaker 2: good for her.

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Speaker 1: So Kim wrote via her Instagram stories on Saturday, November eighth, Well,

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Speaker 1: I'm not a lawyer yet. I just play a very

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Speaker 1: well dressed one on TV. Six years into this law

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Speaker 1: journey and I'm still all in until I pass the bar.

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Speaker 1: No shortcuts, no giving up, just more studying and even

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Speaker 1: more determination. Thank you to everyone who has supported and

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Speaker 1: encouraged me along the way. Falling short isn't a failure,

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Speaker 1: it's fuel. I was so close to passing the exam

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Speaker 1: that only motivates me even more. Let's go. Do you

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Speaker 1: think she was close?

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Speaker 2: Who knows? The scores don't come out that early. She

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Speaker 2: posted it before scores came out.

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Speaker 1: When did the scores come out?

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Speaker 2: I don't think they come out to like Monday or

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Speaker 2: something like that, like the week after, or they get

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Speaker 2: mailed to you, I think, Or I don't know, but

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Speaker 2: I don't remember the scores coming out. It's just pass

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Speaker 2: or fail. On the friday that you check the results,

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Speaker 2: you punch in your number. It either says you're there

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Speaker 2: or says your name cannot be found. It doesn't give

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Speaker 2: you results. So I don't know how she knew that.

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Speaker 1: Unless she had some she's like special insider.

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Speaker 2: She cheated, but apparently not good enough. Maybe.

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Speaker 1: No, there was no way you can't cheat on the

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Speaker 1: can of bar exam. There's no way possible.

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Speaker 2: But the only person that took a private jet to

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Speaker 2: take the California.

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Speaker 1: Bar or a private helicopter, she just landed on a

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Speaker 1: helipad and then went in the back door.

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Speaker 2: I mean they obviously she took the baby bar too.

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Speaker 2: She had to take that a couple of times and

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Speaker 2: she didn't stop. Yeah, so the baby bar is when

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Speaker 2: you go to a non licensed school or what she did,

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Speaker 2: which was some mentoring program to take the baby bar

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Speaker 2: a year into it as a couple of subjects, and

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Speaker 2: she took that a couple of times and she passed it.

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Speaker 2: So she didn't quit on that one. Yeah, and I

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Speaker 2: kind of thought she would have.

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Speaker 1: Let's just talk for a second about her new HULO show.

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Speaker 1: It's called all Hulu. I said, who said Hulo, not

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Speaker 1: Hulo Hulu Hulu show it's called All's Fair. I'm sure

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Speaker 1: the term all All's fair is taken from the what

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Speaker 1: is the line All's fair? In love and war?

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Speaker 2: Right? So yes?

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Speaker 1: I started watching it and it was so bad and

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Speaker 1: so campy. But I do have to admit that not

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Speaker 1: only I watched the whole thing, there were three episodes

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Speaker 1: that were released, and I watched all three. I think

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Speaker 1: I stayed up till three o'clock in the morning watching

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Speaker 1: all three episodes. So the acting, her acting, it's just there.

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Speaker 1: There's no acting, it's just her, Like how she is

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Speaker 1: in a reality show is just basically like how she

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Speaker 1: is on this scripted television show. Also, her outfits. There

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Speaker 1: is an outfit where she actually has a thong coming

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Speaker 1: out the back of her suit and you can see

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Speaker 1: the thong, and I'm like, what lawyer dresses like that?

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Speaker 1: It reminds me of Sex in the City. The second

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Speaker 1: movie where I feel like they just they threw out

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Speaker 1: the script. They were like, they were like, we don't

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Speaker 1: need content or good or good writing. We just will

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Speaker 1: wear fabulous outfits and go to the Middle East. And

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Speaker 1: I feel like that's kind of what they did with

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Speaker 1: All's Fair. They were like, all we need is Kim

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Speaker 1: Kardashi and some fabulous outfits and a ridiculous private jet

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Speaker 1: that looks like the inside of a of a Vegas hotel,

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Speaker 1: and that's all we need to make good TV.

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Speaker 2: And so and and you and here you.

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Speaker 1: Are and I watch it. I did all right.

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Speaker 2: Lastly, Yeah, I'm kind of secretly glad she didn't pass

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Speaker 2: because if she passed, everyone would be like.

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Speaker 1: What making fun of you? Yeah, they'd be like, Shane,

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Speaker 1: Shane couldn't pass it. But Kim Kardashian pass exactly.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you, Kim.

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Speaker 1: Yes, Shane feels better because of that. Well, we wish

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Speaker 1: Kim Kardashian luck. I hope she does eventually pass it.

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Speaker 2: I do, yeah, and then I'll be submitting my job application.

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Speaker 2: You're gonna work for her? What are you gonna do?

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Speaker 2: Whatever she wants?

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Speaker 1: Oh my goodness. Okay, let's move on to the Jennifer

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Speaker 1: Doulos case. Jennifer. First of all, let me say I

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Speaker 1: have watched multiple things on this case. I think there's

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Speaker 1: something on Hulu. There's also been twenty twenties datelines, et cetera.

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Speaker 1: I don't know what it is, but this is one

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Speaker 1: of those cases. I watch a lot of true crime,

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Speaker 1: but I will tell you this is one of those

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Speaker 1: cases that just always stuck in my mind. I would

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Speaker 1: just always think of it. I kind of I don't

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Speaker 1: know why. Jennifer Dulos is just always It just always

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Speaker 1: stayed with it.

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Speaker 2: So you've you've known about this case for a while.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I have. I've known about it for a while.

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Speaker 1: I've watched things on it. I've watched a couple different

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Speaker 1: documentary type of shows on it, and I don't know,

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Speaker 1: it just always stayed with me. So I'm I'm so,

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Speaker 1: let's go into it.

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Speaker 2: So.

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Speaker 1: Jennifer Farbar Dulos was a fifty year old mother of

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Speaker 1: five from New Canaan, Connecticut. She vanished on May twenty fourth,

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Speaker 1: in twenty nineteen after dropping her children off at school.

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Speaker 1: Jennifer was reported missing after she failed to show up

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Speaker 1: to several appointments and no one hadn't been able to

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Speaker 1: reach her for about ten hours. When officers checked Jennifer's home,

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Speaker 1: they found what appeared to be bloodstains on the floor

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Speaker 1: in the garage and on a vehicle parked inside. Police

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Speaker 1: would later find Jennifer's SUV located three miles away, but

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Speaker 1: there was no sign of her. During the investigation, police

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Speaker 1: obtained surveillance footage that showed her a strange husband photos Dulos,

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Speaker 1: who is Greek, and his mistress, Michelle Trecanis in and

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Speaker 1: around Hartford, Connecticut. The night of Jennifer's disappearance, they made

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Speaker 1: multiple stops dumping garbage bags into various bins throughout the city.

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Speaker 1: Police recovered these bags and found bloody clothing, cleaning supplies,

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Speaker 1: and sponges containing Jennifer's DNA. Her disappearance quickly became one

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Speaker 1: of the most high profile criminal cases in Connecticut, centering

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Speaker 1: around a bitter divorce and a bitter custody battle with

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Speaker 1: the children. Maybe it stuck with me because I think

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Speaker 1: when you start digging into the case and you watch it,

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Speaker 1: it shows, you know, all this aerial footage of her

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Speaker 1: home and his home, and he was a builder or developer,

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Speaker 1: and these are these huge, multi million dollar, beautiful homes

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Speaker 1: in this East Coast area of the United States. She's like.

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Speaker 2: Crime, right, I mean, like who beautiful.

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Speaker 1: I'm talking like ten thousand square foot fifteen thousand square

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Speaker 1: foot homes on like sprawling land with five children. And

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Speaker 1: she's very attractive, and he's very attractive, and they're educated

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Speaker 1: and in their ages. Well she's fifty when she disappeared,

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Speaker 1: Oh she was.

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Speaker 2: How old were their children? Do you know? I'm the

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Speaker 2: two daughters, right, I think.

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Speaker 1: Well, there's five kids altogether five. Okay, that's all right,

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Speaker 1: let's just talk about a little bit about who Jennifer

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Speaker 1: Doulos is. And May of twenty twenty five, a book

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Speaker 1: titled Murder in the Dollhouse The Jennifer Dulos Story was

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Speaker 1: written by Richard Cohen, a prolific journalist and author of

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Speaker 1: fourteen books. Cohen sketches the origin story of Jennifer Farber Dulos,

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Speaker 1: who is the niece of Liz Claiborne, an American fashion

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Speaker 1: designer and businesswoman, and the beloved daughter of a wealthy financier.

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Speaker 1: Before becoming a mother of five, Jennifer worked as a

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Speaker 1: playwright in New York City. Cohen pointed to her dream

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Speaker 1: of creating a life sized dollhouse for the inspiration behind

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Speaker 1: the title of his book. She had obsession with dollhouses

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Speaker 1: when she was a little girl, Cohen said, she had

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Speaker 1: this idea of creating a real dollhouse and building this

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Speaker 1: fantasy for real. In fact, that decor of her first

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Speaker 1: adult apartment had included an empty baby crib, so when

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Speaker 1: she was still unattached at thirty five, she began to panic.

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Speaker 1: At the time of her disappearance, Jennifer believed in curating

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Speaker 1: a dream domestic life, a dream that Colin believes she

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Speaker 1: was struggling with giving up. I think that's another reason

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Speaker 1: why she ended up in this bad marriage. I think

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Speaker 1: she had this idyllic idea of what she wanted her

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Speaker 1: life to be. And he was this good looking guy,

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Speaker 1: and he was Greek, and he was this builder and developer,

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Speaker 1: and they built this big, huge, beautiful home. And she

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Speaker 1: had this fantasy with dollhouses and creating this perfect image.

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Speaker 1: And I think in the back of her mind she

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Speaker 1: probably knew that.

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Speaker 2: This was a What was the falling out of the

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Speaker 2: marriage for.

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Speaker 1: Well, I think he was controlling and violent throughout the marriage,

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Speaker 1: and then I think she just continued to ignore or

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Speaker 1: hope that he changed or you.

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Speaker 2: Know, so was this It was just budding heads And

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Speaker 2: I mean it wasn't like there was an affair or

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Speaker 2: something shady or why don't he wasn't like being lost or.

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Speaker 1: Well he kept borrowing money from her parents. She had

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Speaker 1: wealthy parents. I believe her dad was a bank owned

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Speaker 1: a bank.

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Speaker 2: Was he was he No, he was Greek.

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Speaker 1: I believe he got that.

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Speaker 2: I'm saying.

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Speaker 1: I believe he was an emigrant that came to the

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Speaker 1: United States, and that he married her. He married into

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Speaker 1: a wealthy family, and I think he had a lot

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Speaker 1: of ambition and he wanted to make a lot of money.

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Speaker 1: I believe he borrowed a lot of money from her

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Speaker 1: father or her family.

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Speaker 2: But was he his business like viable like he was no.

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Speaker 1: From what I understood in these and a lot of

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Speaker 1: these documentaries, I watched that he was losing money. He

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Speaker 1: was a developer and he kept building these. He played

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Speaker 1: the role of a big developer, but he kept having

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Speaker 1: to borrow money from her family to pay debts, and

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Speaker 1: I think he was always in debt, and I don't

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Speaker 1: know if he was actually making money. She was the

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Speaker 1: one though, Oh.

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Speaker 2: So then yeah, okay, So then you have a divorce here,

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Speaker 2: and then she's going to still be okay financially, right

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Speaker 2: at least based on what you just said. Then he's

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Speaker 2: going to be screwed and he's probably gonna lose his

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Speaker 2: job in business.

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Speaker 1: So two thousand and three to two two thousand and four,

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Speaker 1: Jennifer Farber and Photos Dulos relationship begins. So in the

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Speaker 1: December of two thousand and three, Jennifer runs into photos Dulos,

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Speaker 1: who is currently married at an Aspen Airport. Jennifer and

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Speaker 1: Photos had attended Brown at the same time, but never

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Speaker 1: had a relationship. Photos emails Jennifer tests, are you there,

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Speaker 1: that's very romantic? M hm. In March of two thousand

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Speaker 1: and four, photos Dulos files for divorce from his first wife.

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Speaker 1: He officially signs the divorce papers in July of four,

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Speaker 1: and then in August of four, less than one month later,

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Speaker 1: Photos Dulos marries Jennifer Farber and they end up having

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Speaker 1: five children together, two sets of twins and one son.

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Speaker 1: Then we get to twenty seventeen to twenty eighteen. This

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Speaker 1: is the marital breakdown. This is when it really starts

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Speaker 1: to you know, you.

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Speaker 2: Always want to go south. The first spouse. Yeah, they're like, dang,

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Speaker 2: I escape that one. I'm glad that I didn't have

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Speaker 2: kids with that guy. I'd be dead now, right.

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Speaker 1: So in June of twenty seventeen, Jennifer Farber Dulos files

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Speaker 1: for divorce from her been, citing fear for her safety.

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Speaker 1: She accuses him of controlling behavior, threats, and having an

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Speaker 1: affair with Michelle Trecanus, one of his employees at his company,

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Speaker 1: which was called Four Group. Incorporated in twenty seventeen to

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Speaker 1: twenty nineteen, so this is a two year A bitter

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Speaker 1: custody battle unfolds. Jennifer has granted temporary sole custody of

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Speaker 1: their five children, with photos getting limited to supervise visitation.

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Speaker 1: Court records show Jennifer repeatedly expressed fear that photos would

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Speaker 1: harm her. So clearly he's exhibiting. I mean that he's

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Speaker 1: not only controlling, but he's viola as well. I think

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Speaker 1: in the documentary they are. In some of the things

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Speaker 1: that I watch, they talk about I believe he like

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Speaker 1: drove a truck at her really like fast, like he

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Speaker 1: was going to hit her. He like strangle or grabbed

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Speaker 1: her by her neck. I think there was like some stalking,

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Speaker 1: refollowder and allegations like that. And they have five children,

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Speaker 1: so clearly in regards to money and child support, he

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Speaker 1: wants the kids as much as possible. Correct.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, yeah, And probably because he's worried, fear full

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Speaker 2: for his business. If her parents, if his in laws

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Speaker 2: are actually helping on the business side, they might pull

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Speaker 2: from that. I was just looking up she was fifty seven.

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Speaker 1: Well, no, she'd be fifty seven now. She was fifty

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Speaker 1: she was fifty in twenty nineteen. Met okay, so tell

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Speaker 1: me the ages of the kids when she around the

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Speaker 1: time that she has the.

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Speaker 2: Time of her disappearance, which we know it was the death.

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Speaker 2: She had five kids, he said, two sets of twins

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Speaker 2: and at Singleton and all between the ages of eight

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Speaker 2: and thirteen. So they lost their mother at the age

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Speaker 2: of between eight and thirteen and then their father going

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Speaker 2: to jail.

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Speaker 1: So in twenty seventeen to twenty nineteen we were talked

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Speaker 1: about a bitter custody battle unfolds, and the custody battle

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Speaker 1: obviously he wants as much custody as possible because he

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Speaker 1: wants her to pay child sport. I would assume she's

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Speaker 1: the one that's financially secure. She's the one that has

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Speaker 1: the wealthy parent. She's the one you know that's going

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Speaker 1: to be fine.

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Speaker 2: He's got the upper hand in that area of finance

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Speaker 2: and playment.

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Speaker 1: But she's clearly been able to prove to a court

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Speaker 1: that he is violent because he has supervised visitations, which

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Speaker 1: I'm sure has just pushed him to Oh, I mean.

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Speaker 2: I mean, he probably well deserved, but man, that has

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Speaker 2: got to be really a blow to the ego.

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Speaker 1: Right, So I would say, as a man and having

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Speaker 1: five children and wanting as much custody as possible because

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Speaker 1: you want as much child support as possible, or he

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Speaker 1: doesn't and then to have to have supervised visits, or.

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Speaker 2: Just he's he's a madman and he does rather killer

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Speaker 2: than deal with anything at all, because clearly when they

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Speaker 2: were married he tried to run her over with a

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Speaker 2: truck or whatever.

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Speaker 1: So Thursday May twenty third, twenty nineteen, Jennifer attends a

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Speaker 1: school event with her children in New Canaan. She exchanges

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Speaker 1: texts and emails with friends that evening and everything seems

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Speaker 1: normal and she's making plans for the weekend. On Friday,

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Speaker 1: May twenty fourth, tw nineteen, this is the last day

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Speaker 1: that Jennifer's ever seen alive. Eight am Jennifer drops her

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Speaker 1: children off at New Canaan Country School. At eight oh

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Speaker 1: five am, Jennifer returns to her rented home at sixty

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Speaker 1: nine Wells Lane. At ten twenty five am, Jennifer misses

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Speaker 1: her children's orthodontia's appointments, which is uncharacteristic for her. You know,

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Speaker 1: she has a nanny that takes care of the kids

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Speaker 1: as well, and the nanny was also very frightened of

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Speaker 1: the potus. Do you have photus?

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Speaker 2: Yes?

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Speaker 1: And then nanny is the one who repeatedly tries to

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Speaker 1: get a hold of her, and she's not answering her phone,

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Speaker 1: which she said has never ever happened, that she's never

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Speaker 1: not been able to get a hold of her. And

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Speaker 1: also she doesn't show up at the Orthodonna's appointment to

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Speaker 1: meet her with the children. Then the nanny knows immediately

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Speaker 1: that she.

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Speaker 2: Had an appointment that day, the day of her disappearance.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I just said that, Yeah, yeah, it was the

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Speaker 1: same day. It was the same day she had, well

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Speaker 1: it was the children had Ordonna's appointment.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but she dropped him off at school in the morning.

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Speaker 1: She dropped him off at school in the morning, and

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Speaker 1: then the nanny had them later in the day, and

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Speaker 1: then the nanny was taking them to an orthodonots But

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Speaker 1: where she was meeting up with.

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Speaker 2: The nanny after school? Okay, confused, I thought was during school.

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Speaker 1: So the nanny gets worried and calls the police to

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Speaker 1: report Jennifer missing. This is around eleven AM. At seven pm,

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Speaker 1: police locate Jennifer's black Chevy Suburban abandoned on Lapham Road

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Speaker 1: near Waveney Park. Inside her home, detectives find blood splatter

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Speaker 1: and evidence of an attempted cleanup, later confirmed as Jennifer's blood.

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Speaker 1: So when they go back and they search her house,

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Speaker 1: I remember that the nanny said that she had just

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Speaker 1: she remembered that she had just opened a brand new

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Speaker 1: role of like those paper towels from Costco where you.

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Speaker 2: Have multiple rolls of multi pack.

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Speaker 1: Multi pack, right, and she had put them in the cabinet.

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Speaker 1: And then later that day when the police were searching,

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Speaker 1: there was only like two rolls left, which meant he,

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Speaker 1: what are there like twelve rolls in there or something?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't, oh yeah, So that means eight six

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Speaker 2: were missing, right.

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Speaker 1: So someone had gone through multiple rolls of paper towels

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Speaker 1: within that short period of time. So that evening surveillance

356
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Speaker 1: cameras capture photos Dulos and his girlfriend Michelle trecanis driving

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Speaker 1: a Ford Raptor pickup truck through Hertford. They are seen

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Speaker 1: making over thirty stops, thirty stops, thirty.

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Speaker 2: Stops at like different locations each time.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, disposing of garbage bags along Albany Avenue.

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Speaker 2: Almost dumber because now there's thirty locations where that DNA

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Speaker 2: is spread around, right, And I don't know thirty opportunities

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Speaker 2: to have you on camera or witnesses.

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Speaker 1: I don't understand how you wouldn't think that there would

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Speaker 1: be some type of surveillance camera that would pick that up.

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Speaker 1: This is in twenty nineteen, it's not like we're talking

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Speaker 1: about the eighties or nineties before, you know. I mean,

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Speaker 1: we're talking.

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Speaker 2: Digital footprint everywhere, right.

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Speaker 1: And he has a cell phone, which is like, you know,

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Speaker 1: putting him in all these da.

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Speaker 2: I always say, and it's hard to have him, but

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Speaker 2: people wouldn't commit crimes and think they were going to

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Speaker 2: get away with it. So he didn't kill her and

375
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Speaker 2: then not know how to get and then worry he

376
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Speaker 2: wasn't going to get away with it. He knew he

377
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Speaker 2: planned this, Right, we're going to get into it, but

378
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Speaker 2: he planned it.

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Speaker 1: Wasn't like it was the moment, right, It wasn't like

380
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Speaker 1: they got in a fight.

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Speaker 2: So he plans it, And if he planned it, that

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Speaker 2: means he thought this plan was full proof.

383
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Speaker 1: That's when you're a narcissist.

384
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Speaker 2: Oh well, clearly, what do you want to say? He's

385
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Speaker 2: a killer? And you're yeah, that's we got a bigger problem.

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Speaker 2: He's a murderer.

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Speaker 1: You're saying, killer goes first. At the end.

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Speaker 2: Of the day, he killed someone, so who cares what

389
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Speaker 2: the diagnosis.

390
00:18:38,119 --> 00:18:40,800
Speaker 1: But I'm saying the part of where you you just

391
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Speaker 1: honestly believe that you're selling.

392
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Speaker 2: Don't like the word narcissist.

393
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Speaker 1: I know what I'm saying.

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Speaker 2: You'll call me a narcissist, and then you call this

395
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Speaker 2: murder narcissist. So I'm in the same category as potus.

396
00:18:50,520 --> 00:18:53,399
Speaker 1: No, you're not. I'm saying he's a narcissist killer, but

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Speaker 1: I'm saying the reason that he thinks he's going to

398
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Speaker 1: get away with it is because he finds himself to

399
00:18:57,920 --> 00:19:02,880
Speaker 1: be so much more legent and better than everyone else,

400
00:19:03,240 --> 00:19:06,320
Speaker 1: which is a trade of narcissism. That that's what leads

401
00:19:06,359 --> 00:19:08,719
Speaker 1: them to do it, because he doesn't he can't fathom

402
00:19:08,760 --> 00:19:10,160
Speaker 1: the idea that he would get caught.

403
00:19:10,720 --> 00:19:13,679
Speaker 2: Right That, okay, was a long way of saying what

404
00:19:13,720 --> 00:19:14,160
Speaker 2: I just said.

405
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Speaker 1: Okay. So June through December of twenty nineteen, arrests and

406
00:19:17,960 --> 00:19:21,280
Speaker 1: evidence start building. So in June first of twenty nineteen,

407
00:19:21,359 --> 00:19:24,919
Speaker 1: Photus Dulos and Michelle Trecanas are arrested and charged with

408
00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:28,879
Speaker 1: tampering with evidence and hindering prosecution. Both were held on

409
00:19:28,920 --> 00:19:32,800
Speaker 1: a five hundred thousand dollars bond. The arrest came after

410
00:19:32,960 --> 00:19:37,639
Speaker 1: investigators descended onto two locations connected to photos and his company.

411
00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:38,000
Speaker 2: The four Group.

412
00:19:38,480 --> 00:19:41,320
Speaker 1: According to the arrests warrant, there were several blood saints

413
00:19:41,320 --> 00:19:43,480
Speaker 1: found on the garage floor in Jennifer's home, and that

414
00:19:43,520 --> 00:19:47,240
Speaker 1: blood was found in Potus's garage when officials looked as well.

415
00:19:47,760 --> 00:19:50,280
Speaker 1: The warrant had said that Photus's phone had pinged him

416
00:19:50,320 --> 00:19:53,080
Speaker 1: traveling back and forth between two properties he owns in

417
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Speaker 1: Farmington throughout the day on May twenty fourth. You know, also,

418
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Speaker 1: I believe what happened. I think he had a very

419
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Speaker 1: elaborate plan. He ended up like riding a bicycle.

420
00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:09,119
Speaker 2: No, no, no, he well, partly true. Yeah, he borrowed a

421
00:20:09,240 --> 00:20:10,680
Speaker 2: truck right from.

422
00:20:10,520 --> 00:20:12,800
Speaker 1: One employee, sang right from an employee.

423
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Speaker 2: And he drove it there at her house. So, because

424
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Speaker 2: that was when I was reading up on this, I realized, like,

425
00:20:17,040 --> 00:20:19,119
Speaker 2: why is he doing that? But then she's not living,

426
00:20:19,160 --> 00:20:21,359
Speaker 2: they're not living together day right, he lives, So he

427
00:20:21,400 --> 00:20:23,399
Speaker 2: parked his car in front of her house, she'd know,

428
00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:26,320
Speaker 2: and he's violent and whatever. So he borrowed a truck,

429
00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:31,040
Speaker 2: parked wait for her, waited for her. She comes, he

430
00:20:31,080 --> 00:20:34,080
Speaker 2: does whatever, you'll discuss it. Then when he goes, and

431
00:20:36,359 --> 00:20:39,400
Speaker 2: then he uses her vehicle to to place what three

432
00:20:39,400 --> 00:20:42,000
Speaker 2: miles away from the house or whatever, as a distraction.

433
00:20:42,440 --> 00:20:45,560
Speaker 2: Then he there's cameras of her car being driven at

434
00:20:45,560 --> 00:20:48,840
Speaker 2: ten twenty five am, but she's not driving it. He is.

435
00:20:49,359 --> 00:20:51,440
Speaker 2: Then there's I think there's cameras of him riding a

436
00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:53,760
Speaker 2: bicycle back to the house and getting in the employees

437
00:20:53,800 --> 00:20:54,520
Speaker 2: truck and leaving.

438
00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:57,320
Speaker 1: Where did he park the employee's truck though, somewhere.

439
00:20:57,160 --> 00:20:59,800
Speaker 2: Hidden, like across the street or something. That didn't say,

440
00:21:01,080 --> 00:21:03,520
Speaker 2: but the idea was it was an unrecognizable truck. So

441
00:21:03,560 --> 00:21:05,240
Speaker 2: then when she came home from taking kids to school,

442
00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:07,359
Speaker 2: he knew he knew the kids' schedule, right, so he

443
00:21:07,400 --> 00:21:09,600
Speaker 2: knew when she was going to be home. So she

444
00:21:09,680 --> 00:21:10,400
Speaker 2: comes home.

445
00:21:10,520 --> 00:21:13,000
Speaker 1: And he's hiding in the garage. Yeah, and then waiting

446
00:21:13,080 --> 00:21:14,160
Speaker 1: he's lying in wait.

447
00:21:14,080 --> 00:21:18,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, exactly right. Yeah, he's a psycho, oh sorry, narcissist.

448
00:21:18,680 --> 00:21:32,879
Speaker 1: And psycho yeah, and murder yeah. So June eleven, twenty nineteen,

449
00:21:32,880 --> 00:21:35,800
Speaker 1: Photus and traconas that's a girlfriend. Are released on bond

450
00:21:36,280 --> 00:21:38,240
Speaker 1: in September of twenty nineteen.

451
00:21:37,920 --> 00:21:40,680
Speaker 2: Six million dollars bond. By the way, So I don't

452
00:21:40,720 --> 00:21:41,200
Speaker 2: know where.

453
00:21:41,000 --> 00:21:43,040
Speaker 1: He got that money, probably because he has properties. I

454
00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:45,040
Speaker 1: don't know if he put it up for collateral or something. Yes,

455
00:21:45,560 --> 00:21:48,879
Speaker 1: Photos is taken into custody once more, and the arrest warrant.

456
00:21:49,000 --> 00:21:52,000
Speaker 1: State Police said that Treconis admitted back on June second

457
00:21:52,040 --> 00:21:54,480
Speaker 1: that she could not account for potus whereabouts on the

458
00:21:54,520 --> 00:21:57,879
Speaker 1: morning Jennifer went missing. The warrant also stated that Photos

459
00:21:57,920 --> 00:22:02,400
Speaker 1: and Traconas were wrote alibi scripts detailing where they were,

460
00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:06,320
Speaker 1: but Treconis reportedly later stated the details were false. At

461
00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:09,360
Speaker 1: the time, police also believed that Photos had driven Jennifer's

462
00:22:09,359 --> 00:22:12,480
Speaker 1: suburban with her body inside, along with items to help

463
00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:15,439
Speaker 1: clean up the evidence. Then we get to January of

464
00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:19,560
Speaker 1: twenty twenty. Photos Dulos is charged with felony murder, kidnapping,

465
00:22:20,080 --> 00:22:22,800
Speaker 1: and murder. He was held on a six million dollar bond.

466
00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:25,439
Speaker 1: That's what you were talking about. It was held on

467
00:22:25,440 --> 00:22:28,000
Speaker 1: a six million dollar bond the second time he gets arrested.

468
00:22:28,080 --> 00:22:30,520
Speaker 2: Okay, it's a second time. Sorry, So I just find

469
00:22:30,520 --> 00:22:33,919
Speaker 2: that always funny. It's like innocent before proven guilty, but

470
00:22:33,960 --> 00:22:36,000
Speaker 2: you probably did it, So six million dollars because it's

471
00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:36,640
Speaker 2: going to run away.

472
00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:38,840
Speaker 1: Well, the first time he gets arrested, he's charged with

473
00:22:38,880 --> 00:22:40,080
Speaker 1: tampering with evidence.

474
00:22:40,040 --> 00:22:42,840
Speaker 2: Because it was just the hindering the relocations he had

475
00:22:42,880 --> 00:22:46,440
Speaker 2: been in put moving the car, parking it far away,

476
00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:49,200
Speaker 2: say there's no body using up paper towels.

477
00:22:49,280 --> 00:22:51,639
Speaker 1: Yes, using a lot of paper towels to clean up

478
00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:55,040
Speaker 1: a crime scene. So the first time he's arrested, it's

479
00:22:55,080 --> 00:22:57,919
Speaker 1: only with tampering with evidence and hindering prosecution. That's why

480
00:22:57,920 --> 00:22:59,720
Speaker 1: it's a six hundred thousand dollars bond, and he gets

481
00:22:59,760 --> 00:23:02,239
Speaker 1: on bond easily, and Traconis does too.

482
00:23:02,359 --> 00:23:04,080
Speaker 2: The girlfriend, she was in the car when they were

483
00:23:04,119 --> 00:23:04,960
Speaker 2: running around.

484
00:23:04,800 --> 00:23:06,840
Speaker 1: And that's the problem with not being able to locate

485
00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:08,960
Speaker 1: a body, which is what we talked about earlier in

486
00:23:08,960 --> 00:23:11,959
Speaker 1: the Crystal Rogers case, Like her body's never been discovered.

487
00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:15,720
Speaker 1: No either, So there's no body, but there was enough.

488
00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:19,400
Speaker 2: Blood my understanding was enough blood that the expert testimony

489
00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:21,760
Speaker 2: saying it was likely death. Right.

490
00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:24,920
Speaker 1: So then later when he gets arrested for the second time,

491
00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:27,080
Speaker 1: when he gets arrested because now they have enough evidence, right,

492
00:23:27,119 --> 00:23:29,480
Speaker 1: they've been building a case. They've been they've been interviewing

493
00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:33,159
Speaker 1: Traconas and they're getting you know, her statements which contradictory,

494
00:23:33,680 --> 00:23:37,800
Speaker 1: conflicting statements, right, And they're pulling up his his forensics

495
00:23:37,800 --> 00:23:40,399
Speaker 1: on his phone, and they have all the surveillance of

496
00:23:40,480 --> 00:23:43,600
Speaker 1: him and the experts with the blood saying that she's

497
00:23:43,640 --> 00:23:44,040
Speaker 1: likely to do.

498
00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:45,760
Speaker 2: So how do you get involved with she was an

499
00:23:45,800 --> 00:23:50,240
Speaker 2: employee of his? Yeah, I mean it's like, Hey, my

500
00:23:50,280 --> 00:23:52,800
Speaker 2: wife's leaving me because she's accusing me of beating her

501
00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:54,960
Speaker 2: up and driving her over with the truck, and you

502
00:23:55,000 --> 00:23:58,040
Speaker 2: want to murder her with me? Yeah? Okay, No, No.

503
00:23:58,080 --> 00:24:00,720
Speaker 1: It's like I'll do the actual murder. I just need

504
00:24:00,760 --> 00:24:02,880
Speaker 1: you to help me dispose of everything.

505
00:24:02,960 --> 00:24:04,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, I get passengers so we can get in the

506
00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:08,439
Speaker 2: carpool lane. Please these thirty I got thirty places to go.

507
00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:11,120
Speaker 1: You know, I don't understand the kind of woman that

508
00:24:12,119 --> 00:24:14,160
Speaker 1: is so in love with someone or so in It's

509
00:24:14,160 --> 00:24:16,480
Speaker 1: not love, it has to be infatuation. Right. He's a

510
00:24:16,480 --> 00:24:19,840
Speaker 1: good looking guy. I don't Yeah, I mean he's Yeah,

511
00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:21,399
Speaker 1: he's a good looking guy. But that's not enough for

512
00:24:21,400 --> 00:24:25,080
Speaker 1: me to commit what is I mean? It would have

513
00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:26,399
Speaker 1: to be more than just a good.

514
00:24:26,280 --> 00:24:29,399
Speaker 2: Looking so there so there is a number.

515
00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:32,560
Speaker 1: There might be so when he's arrested the second time

516
00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:35,119
Speaker 1: for felony murder, kidnapping, and murder, he is held on

517
00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:38,000
Speaker 1: a six million dollar bond. Michelle Traconis was arrested in

518
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:42,520
Speaker 1: charge with conspiracy to commit murder. Kent Mawinny this is

519
00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:45,479
Speaker 1: his attorney, So Kent Mwenney got it.

520
00:24:45,560 --> 00:24:46,679
Speaker 2: I gotta look this guy up.

521
00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:52,639
Speaker 1: You're yeah, Kent Mawenny is photos Doulos's attorney. It's not

522
00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:54,280
Speaker 1: I don't think it's his defense attorney.

523
00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:56,160
Speaker 2: He's last name Mwennie.

524
00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:58,840
Speaker 1: It's m A w h I n n e y.

525
00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:02,639
Speaker 1: He's not his defense attorney. He's just like his attorney.

526
00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:04,879
Speaker 1: I don't know if in real estate transactions or like

527
00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:06,560
Speaker 1: a friend that's an attorney.

528
00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:08,800
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, let's see what kind of law he practiced.

529
00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:09,520
Speaker 2: He so.

530
00:25:09,680 --> 00:25:12,159
Speaker 1: Kent Maweney, who was a friend and lawyer for Potus,

531
00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:15,520
Speaker 1: was also charged with conspiracy to commit murder with them

532
00:25:16,160 --> 00:25:19,600
Speaker 1: and Mwennie's warrant. His name appeared in both Traconis's and

533
00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:23,880
Speaker 1: photuses alibis for the morning Jennifer was reported missing. Mlweni

534
00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:27,120
Speaker 1: was interviewed twice by police afterwards. So what did they think?

535
00:25:27,160 --> 00:25:29,680
Speaker 1: They think if they write out these alibis that are

536
00:25:29,960 --> 00:25:33,160
Speaker 1: that match each other, like, let's ride out alibis. That'll

537
00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:35,160
Speaker 1: be fun. It'll be like a fun date night. We'll

538
00:25:35,160 --> 00:25:38,159
Speaker 1: go out to dinner and we'll write our matching alibis.

539
00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:40,720
Speaker 1: And I know, let's use my friend who's a lawyer,

540
00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:43,840
Speaker 1: because that gives him credibility or gives us credibility. If

541
00:25:43,880 --> 00:25:46,320
Speaker 1: a lawyer says that he was also with us and

542
00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:49,320
Speaker 1: saw us that morning, and then what lawyer agrees to

543
00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:54,200
Speaker 1: be a part of that Kent Kent First officials said

544
00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:56,800
Speaker 1: he claimed there was no meeting scheduled between Photos and

545
00:25:56,880 --> 00:26:00,680
Speaker 1: himself on the morning of Jennifer's disappearance. In a second interview,

546
00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:04,000
Speaker 1: he reportedly stated that there was a pre arranged meeting

547
00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:07,159
Speaker 1: with Photus, stating he arrived at Photos's home just before

548
00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:09,920
Speaker 1: eight am, where he stood for almost an hour before

549
00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:14,440
Speaker 1: leaving without seeing him. The warrant said phone record showed

550
00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:17,199
Speaker 1: Mowenni had called Photus the night of May twenty fourth,

551
00:26:17,400 --> 00:26:21,119
Speaker 1: when Photos was allegedly dumping bloody bags of evidence in Hartford,

552
00:26:21,400 --> 00:26:24,960
Speaker 1: but Mowenni denied any phone contact with Photos that day. See,

553
00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:27,600
Speaker 1: that's another thing I don't understand. This guy is an attorney,

554
00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:30,640
Speaker 1: and he doesn't understand that they can get the forensics

555
00:26:30,680 --> 00:26:33,120
Speaker 1: off of his phone to show that he made multiple

556
00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:35,320
Speaker 1: phone calls, or where the phone calls were made from,

557
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:37,159
Speaker 1: or where his cell phone is pinging.

558
00:26:37,440 --> 00:26:39,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I bet you he passed the bar the

559
00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:43,280
Speaker 2: first time. I don't make a difference. He still be a.

560
00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:47,439
Speaker 1: Crap MOWENNI had been arrested before. Well, so this is

561
00:26:47,560 --> 00:26:52,480
Speaker 1: he's clearly has very high ethical standards.

562
00:26:53,480 --> 00:26:55,480
Speaker 2: I just looked him up. He's in real estate law,

563
00:26:55,720 --> 00:26:57,120
Speaker 2: in like construction law.

564
00:26:57,280 --> 00:27:00,280
Speaker 1: I don't know. Yeah, so this guy was obviously an

565
00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:03,080
Speaker 1: attorney that Photos had used that he'd become friendly with.

566
00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:07,359
Speaker 1: He's not a stand up guy. He's been arrested previously.

567
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:11,760
Speaker 2: And then he gets stupid. Is thought like, oh, attorney

568
00:27:11,760 --> 00:27:14,840
Speaker 2: client privilege. I just I can't say anything, So I'll

569
00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:16,400
Speaker 2: do a lot of the work and then they'll ask

570
00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:18,359
Speaker 2: me and I won't tell him anything. He's probably that

571
00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:19,400
Speaker 2: stupid and doesn't yet.

572
00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:21,639
Speaker 1: But they interviewed him twice saying that contradicts himself. He

573
00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:23,879
Speaker 1: can't even keep a story straight, and he's he agrees

574
00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:26,879
Speaker 1: to be part of this alibi. So Photuses and Michelle

575
00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:30,520
Speaker 1: Treconis's alibi is that they had a meeting with this guy,

576
00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:31,680
Speaker 1: this real estate.

577
00:27:32,160 --> 00:27:33,840
Speaker 2: I don't know what people are. He's just hoping for

578
00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:36,399
Speaker 2: more business from this client. I mean, I don't know.

579
00:27:36,440 --> 00:27:38,120
Speaker 2: It's one thing to take your client out to dinner

580
00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:40,800
Speaker 2: and host them somewhere. It's another thing to help him

581
00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:42,360
Speaker 2: commit murder and can cover it up.

582
00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:43,080
Speaker 1: Exactly.

583
00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:43,760
Speaker 2: So.

584
00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:45,359
Speaker 1: Mawhinney had been arrested before.

585
00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:48,080
Speaker 2: He says, how does this Photus guy get these people

586
00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:51,040
Speaker 2: so committed? He's got this girlfriend that's helping him out,

587
00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:53,440
Speaker 2: this attorney that's helping him out. He is getting the

588
00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:55,600
Speaker 2: in laws to fund his development business.

589
00:27:55,680 --> 00:27:58,840
Speaker 1: He's smooth. He's smooth. He's a smooth character.

590
00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:00,800
Speaker 2: I can't even get you to make me a turkey

591
00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:04,080
Speaker 2: pot pie. I know this guy is he could sell

592
00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:04,560
Speaker 2: a book.

593
00:28:05,119 --> 00:28:09,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, so again, I've read this line like five times now.

594
00:28:10,280 --> 00:28:14,280
Speaker 1: Moweni had been arrested previously. He's facing an allegation of

595
00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:17,880
Speaker 1: sexual assault and was charged with violating a protective order

596
00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:21,119
Speaker 1: filed by his estranged wife. See that's what they have

597
00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:25,240
Speaker 1: in common, That's where that's it. They bond over they

598
00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:30,000
Speaker 1: bond over the violence towards their previous spouses. She also

599
00:28:30,040 --> 00:28:32,640
Speaker 1: stated that she believed that Maweni was trying to kill her.

600
00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:36,480
Speaker 1: Oh see, that's his ex wife. Sate states that also

601
00:28:36,520 --> 00:28:39,720
Speaker 1: in Mowenie's arrest warrant, the Windsor Rod and Gun Club

602
00:28:39,840 --> 00:28:42,720
Speaker 1: was mentioned. Two members were reportedly hunting on the land

603
00:28:42,760 --> 00:28:44,560
Speaker 1: when they came across a large hole in the ground

604
00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:47,280
Speaker 1: that appeared to be hidden. One of the members described

605
00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:50,440
Speaker 1: the hole as one human grave. You know, the place was.

606
00:28:50,520 --> 00:28:54,120
Speaker 2: Six feet by two feet in the dimensions. Yeah, I

607
00:28:54,160 --> 00:28:56,520
Speaker 2: don't know about depth, but that was it. And it

608
00:28:56,640 --> 00:28:58,360
Speaker 2: was lined with a tarp.

609
00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:01,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, but they did not find any human remains, but.

610
00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:06,640
Speaker 2: It was lined with the tarp and limestone lime juice.

611
00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:09,520
Speaker 2: I was like, what are you talking about?

612
00:29:09,560 --> 00:29:12,840
Speaker 1: Where is that part of the murder limestone? It's it

613
00:29:12,920 --> 00:29:14,920
Speaker 1: covers up I believe the decay and the smell so

614
00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:16,640
Speaker 1: that animals don't dig it up. That's why you have

615
00:29:16,680 --> 00:29:19,400
Speaker 1: to use the limestone. But they you are not a

616
00:29:19,400 --> 00:29:22,080
Speaker 1: good murderer because you would be using lime juice and

617
00:29:23,040 --> 00:29:26,240
Speaker 1: pride in not being a good murder That's good, all right,

618
00:29:26,320 --> 00:29:29,360
Speaker 1: But anyway, this human grave that they came across it

619
00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:32,880
Speaker 1: did not have any human remains in it, So I

620
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:34,440
Speaker 1: don't know if they pre dug it. And that was

621
00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:35,760
Speaker 1: the plan. That was where they were going to get

622
00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:37,440
Speaker 1: rid of her body, and then something happened and they

623
00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:38,920
Speaker 1: ended up not burying her there.

624
00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:40,720
Speaker 2: And then and then he was pinged around that area.

625
00:29:40,760 --> 00:29:42,920
Speaker 2: He said, right, yeah, I mean it was it was

626
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:47,120
Speaker 2: a little And then I read that he after the disappearance,

627
00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:48,440
Speaker 2: he never went to the club.

628
00:29:48,280 --> 00:29:51,320
Speaker 1: Again, Lotus or the attorney.

629
00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:53,760
Speaker 2: The attorney, so it's like they were there. He was there,

630
00:29:53,800 --> 00:29:55,520
Speaker 2: he was floating around there was there a lot like

631
00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:57,160
Speaker 2: heavily and then boom vanished.

632
00:29:57,320 --> 00:29:59,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, because he dug a murder hole and he doesn't

633
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:00,280
Speaker 1: want to be a there.

634
00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:02,800
Speaker 2: We call a murder hole a murder hole, shallow.

635
00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:05,400
Speaker 1: Grave, a shallow grave. So in January twenty eighth of

636
00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:07,400
Speaker 1: twenty twenty, Photus fan it might.

637
00:30:07,240 --> 00:30:08,440
Speaker 2: Have been for his ex wife.

638
00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:10,720
Speaker 1: Oh you mean too holes?

639
00:30:11,600 --> 00:30:13,440
Speaker 2: Was it too hold? I think so, I don't know.

640
00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:15,920
Speaker 2: That might have been for his ex wife.

641
00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:20,000
Speaker 1: Which you're talking about photuses attorney's attorney's X wife. Yeah,

642
00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:21,240
Speaker 1: so their plant that's what they bought.

643
00:30:21,320 --> 00:30:24,160
Speaker 2: Maybe that was that was part two of their big plan.

644
00:30:24,680 --> 00:30:26,440
Speaker 1: They were going to bury both women there.

645
00:30:26,520 --> 00:30:29,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, or I don't know, because where is Jennifer? We

646
00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:31,600
Speaker 2: don't know, we don't know. So clearly they had a

647
00:30:31,600 --> 00:30:32,680
Speaker 2: better hiding spot for her.

648
00:30:33,080 --> 00:30:35,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, but they had the better height eating spot was

649
00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:38,440
Speaker 1: a last minute hiding spot, and they did they dumpsters.

650
00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:41,400
Speaker 2: I don't know they it's at least they put the

651
00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:42,560
Speaker 2: evidence in the.

652
00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:44,720
Speaker 1: They put the evidence of the murder in the dumpsters.

653
00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:47,480
Speaker 1: But her body has never been located right this way.

654
00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:50,080
Speaker 2: That's because if there was thirty locations that he dumped

655
00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:53,120
Speaker 2: stuff in, they probably didn't retrieve it in time, Like

656
00:30:53,160 --> 00:30:57,040
Speaker 2: if they find out days later that they're tracking his whereabouts,

657
00:30:57,400 --> 00:30:59,120
Speaker 2: but then they go and the dumpsters are gone by then,

658
00:30:59,240 --> 00:30:59,960
Speaker 2: so it's too late.

659
00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:02,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, but they found the evidence that he dumped in

660
00:31:02,680 --> 00:31:04,160
Speaker 1: those dumpsters, not all thirty.

661
00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:06,400
Speaker 2: You're gonna tell me. They went to all thirty, retrieved thirty.

662
00:31:06,520 --> 00:31:08,200
Speaker 1: So you're saying that he could have dumped the body

663
00:31:08,240 --> 00:31:09,280
Speaker 1: in one of those dumps right.

664
00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:13,000
Speaker 2: I've thought this all along, that they didn't get to

665
00:31:13,040 --> 00:31:15,880
Speaker 2: some of the dumpsters in time, and some they did, But.

666
00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:18,200
Speaker 1: I feel like they would have searched the dump site

667
00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:19,480
Speaker 1: where those dumpsters.

668
00:31:20,040 --> 00:31:24,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, like a five square foot or square five square

669
00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:26,080
Speaker 2: mile radius.

670
00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:27,000
Speaker 1: They had before I've seen please.

671
00:31:27,120 --> 00:31:29,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, And sometimes they find you, sometimes they don't.

672
00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:32,960
Speaker 1: All right. In January twenty eighth of twenty twenty, Photos

673
00:31:33,080 --> 00:31:36,680
Speaker 1: fails to appear in court. Police find him unconscious at

674
00:31:36,680 --> 00:31:39,280
Speaker 1: his home in Farmington after attempting to take his own

675
00:31:39,360 --> 00:31:44,640
Speaker 1: life by inhaling poisonous carbon monoxide inside his Farmington, Connecticut home.

676
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:49,480
Speaker 1: Photos allegedly had handwritten a suicide note, which was attained

677
00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:55,920
Speaker 1: obtained by ABC News, which he addressed to all, dear All.

678
00:31:56,000 --> 00:31:59,080
Speaker 1: It was littered with self serving statements to clear his

679
00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:02,560
Speaker 1: entraconus his names. He said, if you are reading this,

680
00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:05,560
Speaker 1: I am no more. I refuse to spend even an

681
00:32:05,560 --> 00:32:07,880
Speaker 1: hour more in jail for something I had nothing to

682
00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:10,560
Speaker 1: do with. He had nothing to do with it. However,

683
00:32:10,840 --> 00:32:18,120
Speaker 1: he's on video dumping bloody, bloody, bloodyel cowels and into dumpsters, and.

684
00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:20,560
Speaker 2: His DNA was mixed in some of the blood right.

685
00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:22,960
Speaker 1: In thirty different locations. But the fact that this man

686
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:25,960
Speaker 1: has the audacity to write a suicide note saying here's

687
00:32:26,000 --> 00:32:27,880
Speaker 1: what I got to do with it is beyond me.

688
00:32:28,120 --> 00:32:30,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, here's what I got out of it. He committed

689
00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:36,200
Speaker 2: suicide so quickly after being charged. That makes me think

690
00:32:36,280 --> 00:32:39,000
Speaker 2: his lawyer or whatever he looked it up and thought,

691
00:32:39,000 --> 00:32:41,440
Speaker 2: oh man, the evidence is against me. I'm dead. I'm

692
00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:44,320
Speaker 2: going to jail. So he killed himself. It's not like

693
00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:47,720
Speaker 2: he tried to fight it. He went to trial and

694
00:32:47,760 --> 00:32:49,880
Speaker 2: then he was sentenced and he thought, I can't live

695
00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:53,080
Speaker 2: like this. He did it in the beginning because you

696
00:32:53,080 --> 00:32:56,480
Speaker 2: would fight it. You would try if you truly didn't

697
00:32:56,560 --> 00:32:58,959
Speaker 2: have anything to do with it, you would try to

698
00:32:59,040 --> 00:33:03,000
Speaker 2: fight it. Wouldn't be so quick yourself.

699
00:33:03,080 --> 00:33:04,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, he took himself out because knew. Yeah,

700
00:33:04,880 --> 00:33:06,000
Speaker 1: because he knew he was guilty, and he knew he

701
00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:07,080
Speaker 1: was going to go to prison, he was going to

702
00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:08,240
Speaker 1: get a death penalty. I don't know if there's a

703
00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:09,040
Speaker 1: death penalty.

704
00:33:08,920 --> 00:33:11,560
Speaker 2: And together going to come see him, you know. And

705
00:33:11,640 --> 00:33:14,360
Speaker 2: I just looked it up. There was two shallow grays

706
00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:17,840
Speaker 2: Doug at the gun club. Okay, so it's very interesting.

707
00:33:17,600 --> 00:33:22,360
Speaker 1: That is too. Yeah, wow, maybe the attorney. Maybe there

708
00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:25,080
Speaker 1: was further plans for the attorney to also eliminate his wife,

709
00:33:25,080 --> 00:33:27,040
Speaker 1: and that's why they said. I know, but now that

710
00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:29,760
Speaker 1: you said there were that there was definitely two shallow graves.

711
00:33:29,760 --> 00:33:33,400
Speaker 1: That makes me think limestone, limestone, not lime juice. We're

712
00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:37,000
Speaker 1: not making fajitas. It's limestone. Yeah no, But that makes

713
00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:40,240
Speaker 1: me think that maybe that was the connection that allowed

714
00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:41,200
Speaker 1: the two of them.

715
00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:45,080
Speaker 2: Spouses right, Why.

716
00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:46,840
Speaker 1: Would they Why would you dig a shallow grave at

717
00:33:46,840 --> 00:33:48,800
Speaker 1: a gun club where there's a lot of people hunting

718
00:33:48,800 --> 00:33:49,560
Speaker 1: and walking around.

719
00:33:49,640 --> 00:33:52,840
Speaker 2: It might have been large property or something, or who knows,

720
00:33:52,880 --> 00:33:54,520
Speaker 2: why would you kill your spouses? I don't know.

721
00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:56,560
Speaker 1: I have lots of questions about that. I don't know.

722
00:33:57,000 --> 00:33:59,320
Speaker 1: So and he says, if you're reading this, I am

723
00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:01,760
Speaker 1: no more. Refuse to spend even an hour more in

724
00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:03,720
Speaker 1: jail for something I had nothing to do with. I

725
00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:06,000
Speaker 1: wanted to be known that Michelle Trecanas had nothing to

726
00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:09,759
Speaker 1: do with Jennifer's disappearance, and neither did Kent. Kent wasn't

727
00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:12,640
Speaker 1: involved here. I just want everyone to know that. He

728
00:34:12,760 --> 00:34:15,760
Speaker 1: goes on to write, my attorney can explain what happened

729
00:34:15,760 --> 00:34:20,120
Speaker 1: with the bags out on Albany Avenue, and also ads,

730
00:34:20,160 --> 00:34:22,120
Speaker 1: please let my children know that I love them. I

731
00:34:22,120 --> 00:34:24,520
Speaker 1: would do anything to be with them, but unfortunately we

732
00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:27,600
Speaker 1: all have our limits. The state will not rest until

733
00:34:27,640 --> 00:34:31,600
Speaker 1: I rot in jail. I don't know what his attorney

734
00:34:31,680 --> 00:34:33,160
Speaker 1: was going to explain he had to do with the

735
00:34:33,200 --> 00:34:36,319
Speaker 1: bags and that he dumped in the thirty different locations.

736
00:34:36,400 --> 00:34:41,520
Speaker 2: But I don't know. It's bad when your attorney can't

737
00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:45,080
Speaker 2: represent you because he's also being indicted with the murder charges.

738
00:34:45,120 --> 00:34:48,320
Speaker 1: Well, he's referring to his defense attorney was Cantry.

739
00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:50,479
Speaker 2: He had to go get a defense attorney because because

740
00:34:50,560 --> 00:34:51,800
Speaker 2: Kent was also being charged.

741
00:34:51,960 --> 00:34:55,000
Speaker 1: Right, So January thirtieth of twenty twenty, this is two

742
00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:58,759
Speaker 1: days after photos is found unconscious at his home. He

743
00:34:58,800 --> 00:35:00,960
Speaker 1: does end up dying and New York hospital.

744
00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:04,520
Speaker 2: Wait, did you mention how he committed suicide? Right?

745
00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:06,759
Speaker 1: Yeah, he did the carbon I don't was. I don't

746
00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:07,840
Speaker 1: know if it was in the Did he do it

747
00:35:07,880 --> 00:35:08,760
Speaker 1: in the car in the garage?

748
00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:11,080
Speaker 2: I understand was it was in the garage and he

749
00:35:11,120 --> 00:35:12,960
Speaker 2: had a vacuum tube or some type of hose that

750
00:35:13,000 --> 00:35:16,040
Speaker 2: went from the exhaust to inside his car to accelerate it.

751
00:35:16,600 --> 00:35:18,200
Speaker 1: And then he sat in the car and he closed

752
00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:18,879
Speaker 1: the garage door.

753
00:35:19,120 --> 00:35:22,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then you just go to sleep a lot.

754
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:24,640
Speaker 2: Sometimes you take sleeping pills or something just kind of

755
00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:26,560
Speaker 2: like pass out. Yeah, don't wake up.

756
00:35:26,800 --> 00:35:28,920
Speaker 1: Well, he had so much carbon monoxide poisoning that he

757
00:35:28,920 --> 00:35:30,040
Speaker 1: did end up dying.

758
00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:32,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know this is ridiculous, Like, Oh, I don't

759
00:35:32,719 --> 00:35:34,160
Speaker 2: want to go to jail for something I didn't do,

760
00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:35,960
Speaker 2: so I'm gonna kill myself. Well, what about taking care

761
00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:37,759
Speaker 2: of your kids? If you didn't do it? Like so,

762
00:35:37,840 --> 00:35:39,600
Speaker 2: then what you just quit on your five kids too?

763
00:35:40,120 --> 00:35:43,840
Speaker 1: Yep, all right, So then we get to twenty twenty

764
00:35:43,880 --> 00:35:47,200
Speaker 1: to twenty twenty three, there are legal proceedings continue because

765
00:35:47,239 --> 00:35:52,560
Speaker 1: we still have Michelle Traconis the girlfriend and Kent the attorney.

766
00:35:53,040 --> 00:35:55,879
Speaker 1: So the murder case against Photus is officially dismissed due

767
00:35:55,880 --> 00:35:59,600
Speaker 1: to his death. However, prosecutors continue building cases against Michelle

768
00:35:59,640 --> 00:36:03,520
Speaker 1: Traconne and can Tom Winnie. Custody of Jennifer's five children

769
00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:07,479
Speaker 1: is permanently granted to her mother, Gloria Farber, who also

770
00:36:07,640 --> 00:36:12,920
Speaker 1: files and wins a civil suit against Photus's estate. Twenty

771
00:36:12,960 --> 00:36:16,160
Speaker 1: twenty four, Michelle Treconas goes to trial. So in January

772
00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:20,040
Speaker 1: of twenty twenty four, Michelle Tracona's trial begins in Stanford, Connecticut.

773
00:36:20,360 --> 00:36:24,880
Speaker 1: The prosecution presents hundreds of exhibits, including surveillance footage, phone data,

774
00:36:24,920 --> 00:36:28,400
Speaker 1: and testimony that Traconas helped photos cover up the murder

775
00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:31,279
Speaker 1: and clean up the evidence. You know, here's the other thing.

776
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:33,960
Speaker 1: Do you think Michelle Traconis knows where the body is?

777
00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:37,200
Speaker 1: Because obviously if she did, she would use that as

778
00:36:37,640 --> 00:36:39,520
Speaker 1: as leverage for a plea deal.

779
00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:43,680
Speaker 2: Right, Well, yeah, I don't know. I think the body

780
00:36:43,760 --> 00:36:46,040
Speaker 2: is divvied up. I mean, why would you go to

781
00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:47,880
Speaker 2: thirty different locations that I know? I keep going back

782
00:36:47,880 --> 00:36:51,000
Speaker 2: to that. But they chopped it up, you think, yeah,

783
00:36:51,680 --> 00:36:53,839
Speaker 2: they did drop one piece of paper towel in each

784
00:36:53,840 --> 00:36:54,880
Speaker 2: of the thirty dumpsters.

785
00:36:55,000 --> 00:36:57,320
Speaker 1: No, because I'm saying, how do you go from digging

786
00:36:57,360 --> 00:36:59,880
Speaker 1: a grave so where you're going to carry the body?

787
00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:01,680
Speaker 2: I don't know, change plans. I don't know.

788
00:37:01,800 --> 00:37:04,080
Speaker 1: Man to cut up a body. It takes a sick

789
00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:06,040
Speaker 1: individual to be able to do something like that.

790
00:37:06,440 --> 00:37:09,080
Speaker 2: Well, or to beat someone to death. It also takes

791
00:37:09,080 --> 00:37:11,640
Speaker 2: a sick person. Then they had to go clean the blood.

792
00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:13,719
Speaker 2: Then they had to go borrow a truck and he

793
00:37:13,760 --> 00:37:15,320
Speaker 2: had to ride it. I mean there was a lot,

794
00:37:15,640 --> 00:37:19,600
Speaker 2: there was a lot of forethought. Oh yeah, of thinking. Yeah,

795
00:37:19,600 --> 00:37:21,680
Speaker 2: it was opportunities for ing to say no, this is

796
00:37:21,680 --> 00:37:23,560
Speaker 2: not a good idea, right, and he kept doing it

797
00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:24,920
Speaker 2: and doing it and doing it and doing it.

798
00:37:26,719 --> 00:37:29,400
Speaker 1: So in March first, at twenty twenty four, Michelle Traconis

799
00:37:29,400 --> 00:37:33,080
Speaker 1: has found guilty of conspiracy to commit murder and two

800
00:37:33,120 --> 00:37:36,000
Speaker 1: counts of tampering with physical evidence. I don't know. I

801
00:37:36,040 --> 00:37:38,000
Speaker 1: still don't know if I. So, you think the body

802
00:37:38,040 --> 00:37:41,840
Speaker 1: parts are in the dumpsters, Well.

803
00:37:41,640 --> 00:37:45,680
Speaker 2: What's your explanation for going to thirty dumpsters because dumpster diving?

804
00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:50,600
Speaker 1: Well, because there was so much clean up afterwards that ye.

805
00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:53,839
Speaker 2: So you think paper towels spread all out like that way,

806
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:54,279
Speaker 2: I don't think.

807
00:37:54,320 --> 00:37:55,920
Speaker 1: So, I don't know. But they didn't find any body

808
00:37:55,920 --> 00:38:00,680
Speaker 1: parts at all. None, well, and they found they found

809
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:04,040
Speaker 1: garbage bags of the cleanup material, but there was no

810
00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:09,520
Speaker 1: actual body parts. I'm saying the fact that they found zero,

811
00:38:09,800 --> 00:38:11,520
Speaker 1: to me, means that I think he disposed of the

812
00:38:11,560 --> 00:38:14,120
Speaker 1: body somewhere else and then went to thirty locations to

813
00:38:14,200 --> 00:38:17,160
Speaker 1: try to throw off police or whatever the rasoning was

814
00:38:17,200 --> 00:38:17,440
Speaker 1: for that.

815
00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:20,239
Speaker 2: So either way, we know she's dead, we know he

816
00:38:20,520 --> 00:38:25,839
Speaker 2: likely did it obviously, So I don't know. They don't

817
00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:28,640
Speaker 2: think that she was there, Michelle was there. No, she

818
00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:32,239
Speaker 2: was after the fact. Yeah, that's why she gave conflicting statements,

819
00:38:32,680 --> 00:38:34,319
Speaker 2: and she was trying to cover up because I think

820
00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:36,719
Speaker 2: at one point she said she was she vouched as

821
00:38:36,760 --> 00:38:39,640
Speaker 2: an alibi for him. Well, changed the story.

822
00:38:39,840 --> 00:38:43,279
Speaker 1: Well, they had their alibis worked out, and then Kent

823
00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:45,320
Speaker 1: because they both were claiming that they had a meeting

824
00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:46,560
Speaker 1: with the attorney.

825
00:38:47,800 --> 00:38:49,480
Speaker 2: Kent. Yeah, you're right. It's not a good idea when

826
00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:51,839
Speaker 2: your alibi is your co conspirator. Right.

827
00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:55,239
Speaker 1: So, in May thirty, twenty twenty four, Michelle traconis a

828
00:38:55,280 --> 00:38:57,680
Speaker 1: sentenced to fourteen and a half years in prison.

829
00:38:58,560 --> 00:39:03,520
Speaker 2: Then we get to June, sentenced to twenty and she

830
00:39:03,560 --> 00:39:06,080
Speaker 2: can not eligible to be released until fourteen and a

831
00:39:06,120 --> 00:39:09,399
Speaker 2: half years. So she was said, So she's gone for

832
00:39:09,520 --> 00:39:11,400
Speaker 2: nearly fifteen years, right.

833
00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:15,279
Speaker 1: Again, not. My question is she must not know what

834
00:39:15,440 --> 00:39:17,359
Speaker 1: happened to the body and she must not know where

835
00:39:17,360 --> 00:39:19,879
Speaker 1: it is, because if she did, and the guy's dead,

836
00:39:19,920 --> 00:39:21,920
Speaker 1: he killed himself, right, So it's not like she has

837
00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:23,839
Speaker 1: to be loyal to him or keep her mouth shut

838
00:39:23,880 --> 00:39:26,040
Speaker 1: for him anymore. That's why I'm saying, if she knew

839
00:39:26,040 --> 00:39:28,520
Speaker 1: where the body was, she would have used that as

840
00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:31,200
Speaker 1: a bargaining tool to get a lesser shape. Did she

841
00:39:31,880 --> 00:39:36,239
Speaker 1: plead guilty, So a trial jury found her guilty. So

842
00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:41,760
Speaker 1: all right then, so now she's in jail maybe time.

843
00:39:42,200 --> 00:39:44,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're right. So if she was gonna use the

844
00:39:44,440 --> 00:39:48,000
Speaker 2: body location as a bargaining chip, yeah, it would have

845
00:39:48,080 --> 00:39:50,520
Speaker 2: to be done prior to a trial. So yeah, I

846
00:39:50,560 --> 00:39:50,920
Speaker 2: don't know.

847
00:39:51,040 --> 00:39:53,960
Speaker 1: I'm just saying that. I feel as if she doesn't know.

848
00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:55,880
Speaker 2: What do? You make a good point? I don't have

849
00:39:55,880 --> 00:40:06,719
Speaker 2: an answer for you, but you make a good point.

850
00:40:08,200 --> 00:40:10,240
Speaker 1: So then we get to recent Actually, this just happened

851
00:40:10,239 --> 00:40:12,680
Speaker 1: in June thirteenth of twenty twenty five, so this summer,

852
00:40:12,760 --> 00:40:16,960
Speaker 1: Kimp Maweney is sentenced. So Kimp Maweney entered an Alford plea,

853
00:40:17,120 --> 00:40:19,360
Speaker 1: that is a plea where the defendant does not admit

854
00:40:19,440 --> 00:40:23,160
Speaker 1: guild but acknowledges the prosecution has enough evidence to convict him.

855
00:40:23,800 --> 00:40:27,200
Speaker 1: So he enters this plea to a lesser charge of

856
00:40:27,239 --> 00:40:30,319
Speaker 1: interfering with police. And remember he was originally charged with

857
00:40:30,400 --> 00:40:33,799
Speaker 1: conspiracy to commit murder and the disappearance and presume death

858
00:40:33,800 --> 00:40:36,880
Speaker 1: of Jennifer. He was sentenced to eleven months in jail

859
00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:40,880
Speaker 1: time he had already effectively served, and the original conspiracy

860
00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:44,640
Speaker 1: murder charge was dropped due to insufficient evidence to prove

861
00:40:44,640 --> 00:40:48,200
Speaker 1: it beyond a reasonable doubt. Mowenni maintains that he did

862
00:40:48,239 --> 00:40:51,040
Speaker 1: not conspire to kill Jennifer and has stated publicly that

863
00:40:51,080 --> 00:40:53,000
Speaker 1: he does not know what happened to her or where

864
00:40:53,040 --> 00:40:56,319
Speaker 1: her body is located. I did see him give an

865
00:40:56,320 --> 00:40:58,360
Speaker 1: interview or something, and he does claim that if he

866
00:40:58,400 --> 00:41:01,239
Speaker 1: knew where the body was, he would he would tell,

867
00:41:01,920 --> 00:41:04,160
Speaker 1: he would give it up, he would make so. I

868
00:41:04,160 --> 00:41:05,799
Speaker 1: don't think tri Furtis.

869
00:41:05,520 --> 00:41:07,720
Speaker 2: Went rogue a little bit and deviated from the plan,

870
00:41:07,880 --> 00:41:10,800
Speaker 2: That's what I think, and panicked or whatnot, didn't obviously

871
00:41:10,800 --> 00:41:12,319
Speaker 2: avoid a shallow grave, and.

872
00:41:13,160 --> 00:41:15,440
Speaker 1: I think something happened and something got messed up or

873
00:41:15,520 --> 00:41:18,040
Speaker 1: hindered where that he wasn't able to dispose of her

874
00:41:18,080 --> 00:41:20,719
Speaker 1: body in the grave that they originally had planned to

875
00:41:20,719 --> 00:41:22,960
Speaker 1: put her in. I think he did something with the body.

876
00:41:22,960 --> 00:41:24,600
Speaker 1: I don't know, Maybe he threw it off a ravine

877
00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:27,360
Speaker 1: or in a river or something. I don't know, but

878
00:41:27,520 --> 00:41:31,279
Speaker 1: I would guess that Kent and Michelle don't know where

879
00:41:31,280 --> 00:41:33,239
Speaker 1: the body is. Otherwise I feel as if they would

880
00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:36,720
Speaker 1: have used that in their defense. What impact did Jennifer

881
00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:39,920
Speaker 1: Dulos's murder have so in June of twenty twenty one,

882
00:41:40,040 --> 00:41:44,160
Speaker 1: Jennifer's Law was signed into Connecticut law. Jennifer's Law named

883
00:41:44,160 --> 00:41:48,319
Speaker 1: in honor of Jennifer Farbar Dulos and Jennifer Magnano, which

884
00:41:48,320 --> 00:41:50,600
Speaker 1: are two Connecticut women who were killed by their husbands

885
00:41:50,640 --> 00:41:53,840
Speaker 1: after suffering years of abuse. The law was created to

886
00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:57,640
Speaker 1: expand the legal definition of domestic violence beyond physical abuse,

887
00:41:58,200 --> 00:42:03,280
Speaker 1: recognizing that many victims experienced psychological, emotional, and financial control

888
00:42:03,520 --> 00:42:07,920
Speaker 1: long before violence turns physical. Under Jennifer's Law, Connecticut now

889
00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:12,200
Speaker 1: legally recognizes coercive control as a form of domestic abuse.

890
00:42:12,680 --> 00:42:16,400
Speaker 1: This means that behaviors such as isolation from friends or family,

891
00:42:17,000 --> 00:42:23,400
Speaker 1: monitoring communications or movements, financial control, threats, intimidation or manipulation, gaslighting,

892
00:42:23,400 --> 00:42:27,240
Speaker 1: and emotional degradation can all be considered forms of domestic

893
00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:30,560
Speaker 1: violence even if no physical harm has occurred. What do

894
00:42:30,560 --> 00:42:31,160
Speaker 1: you think about that?

895
00:42:31,840 --> 00:42:34,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's just that's a tough one to really, those are.

896
00:42:34,239 --> 00:42:36,160
Speaker 1: Tough to prove, that's for sure. I mean the physical

897
00:42:36,239 --> 00:42:38,520
Speaker 1: violence obviously is like that's when you have photos or

898
00:42:39,960 --> 00:42:41,520
Speaker 1: pattern Yeah.

899
00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:45,440
Speaker 2: And exercising severe control over the person or as opposed

900
00:42:45,480 --> 00:42:46,839
Speaker 2: to just like you know, he would let me call

901
00:42:46,840 --> 00:42:47,480
Speaker 2: my mom today.

902
00:42:48,920 --> 00:42:53,000
Speaker 1: Before Jennifer's Law, Connecticut's legal system typically only recognized physical

903
00:42:53,080 --> 00:42:57,640
Speaker 1: or sexual violence and domestic abuse cases. This often left victims,

904
00:42:57,800 --> 00:43:02,120
Speaker 1: especially those like Jennifer Doulo's who who express fear for

905
00:43:02,200 --> 00:43:06,400
Speaker 1: her safety during her divorce, without strong legal protections. You know,

906
00:43:06,520 --> 00:43:10,200
Speaker 1: here's here's the problem. Also, even if it was more

907
00:43:10,640 --> 00:43:18,960
Speaker 1: recognized previously that financial control, threats, stalking, following gas lighting,

908
00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:23,560
Speaker 1: emotional abuse are considered abuse and you can get a

909
00:43:23,560 --> 00:43:26,160
Speaker 1: restraining order. It doesn't have to just be evidence of

910
00:43:26,200 --> 00:43:30,040
Speaker 1: physical abuse. The problem is that someone like Fotus, he

911
00:43:30,080 --> 00:43:32,399
Speaker 1: doesn't do you think he's going to abide by He's

912
00:43:32,440 --> 00:43:35,360
Speaker 1: not going to abide by a protective a restraining order.

913
00:43:35,640 --> 00:43:35,719
Speaker 2: No.

914
00:43:35,800 --> 00:43:40,080
Speaker 1: He's a narcissist, yes, and a murderer and a psychopath.

915
00:43:40,160 --> 00:43:41,640
Speaker 2: He's not a real follower no.

916
00:43:41,960 --> 00:43:46,240
Speaker 1: So you know, being able to get a restraining order

917
00:43:46,920 --> 00:43:50,360
Speaker 1: can only go so far for a female. At the

918
00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:53,640
Speaker 1: end of the day, if someone like him, a restraining order,

919
00:43:53,640 --> 00:43:55,319
Speaker 1: a piece of paper is not going to keep him.

920
00:43:55,880 --> 00:43:58,000
Speaker 1: It doesn't matter if she got a restraining order because

921
00:43:58,000 --> 00:44:02,600
Speaker 1: he was psychologically you know, abusive or physically abusive. Someone

922
00:44:02,680 --> 00:44:05,960
Speaker 1: like that that planned the murder, that premeditated, that had

923
00:44:05,960 --> 00:44:09,480
Speaker 1: people involved, that through the cover of the night, borrowed

924
00:44:09,480 --> 00:44:12,080
Speaker 1: a truck, drove to her house, laid in wait, murdered

925
00:44:12,080 --> 00:44:14,279
Speaker 1: her in the garage, cleaned it up to row a.

926
00:44:14,320 --> 00:44:18,240
Speaker 2: Bible somewhere, rode a bike back, dumpsters exactly.

927
00:44:18,280 --> 00:44:22,320
Speaker 1: That is not someone that's going to be deterred by

928
00:44:22,360 --> 00:44:26,919
Speaker 1: a piece of paper. The new law allows victims experiencing

929
00:44:26,960 --> 00:44:31,520
Speaker 1: coercive control to obtain restraining orders before violence escalates, present

930
00:44:31,680 --> 00:44:35,560
Speaker 1: non physical evidence such as texts, financial records, witness statements,

931
00:44:35,560 --> 00:44:39,000
Speaker 1: et cetera, and court and receive broader protection through family

932
00:44:39,000 --> 00:44:43,560
Speaker 1: court proceedings, including custody hearings. Jennifer's law represents a major

933
00:44:43,600 --> 00:44:47,480
Speaker 1: step forward and domestic violence reform, aiming to prevent tragedies

934
00:44:47,520 --> 00:44:51,600
Speaker 1: by intervening earlier in the abuse cycle. It also inspired

935
00:44:51,680 --> 00:44:55,600
Speaker 1: other states to consider similar legislation, expanding the definition of

936
00:44:55,640 --> 00:45:01,239
Speaker 1: abuse to include psychological and financial domination domin I mean,

937
00:45:01,239 --> 00:45:03,319
Speaker 1: that's good, and I'm glad that it's been expanded, because

938
00:45:03,360 --> 00:45:05,839
Speaker 1: obviously we know that abuse comes in many forms. It's

939
00:45:05,880 --> 00:45:08,800
Speaker 1: not just physical, Like a woman can be severely abused

940
00:45:08,840 --> 00:45:10,440
Speaker 1: and he could never lay a hand on her. It

941
00:45:10,480 --> 00:45:14,000
Speaker 1: could all be psychological. But again when it when someone's

942
00:45:14,040 --> 00:45:17,160
Speaker 1: abusive like that, and a restraining order can only do

943
00:45:17,239 --> 00:45:19,799
Speaker 1: so much. I mean maybe it deters some men, but

944
00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:25,440
Speaker 1: not someone like him. I mean, as we discussed, do

945
00:45:25,480 --> 00:45:27,320
Speaker 1: you have anything else about this case?

946
00:45:27,600 --> 00:45:30,480
Speaker 2: Oh? Yeah, the so he posted six million dollars bond,

947
00:45:30,840 --> 00:45:33,759
Speaker 2: he did, and then he commits suicide. Yeah, so what

948
00:45:33,840 --> 00:45:34,640
Speaker 2: happens to the bond?

949
00:45:34,640 --> 00:45:36,200
Speaker 1: I don't know what happens to the bond goes to

950
00:45:36,280 --> 00:45:38,840
Speaker 1: the state. Oh, they get the six million dollars. It

951
00:45:38,880 --> 00:45:40,080
Speaker 1: doesn't like go to his children.

952
00:45:40,200 --> 00:45:44,520
Speaker 2: No, that sucks. Yeah, And I don't know if it's

953
00:45:44,520 --> 00:45:48,959
Speaker 2: because he committed suicide, like intentionally didn't appear in court.

954
00:45:49,239 --> 00:45:51,800
Speaker 2: Yeah that is versus if he got a car accident,

955
00:45:51,920 --> 00:45:56,000
Speaker 2: what would happen. But I think that's kind of weak

956
00:45:56,440 --> 00:45:58,680
Speaker 2: because the bond is meant to make sure you go

957
00:45:58,760 --> 00:46:00,640
Speaker 2: to court right, so you get ready back. So I

958
00:46:00,680 --> 00:46:03,719
Speaker 2: get it, he didn't go to court right, But it's

959
00:46:03,760 --> 00:46:06,359
Speaker 2: not like he's skipped it. I mean that so the

960
00:46:06,400 --> 00:46:09,359
Speaker 2: bond is not serving a purpose anymore. It's not like

961
00:46:09,400 --> 00:46:12,239
Speaker 2: he skipped town and they're gonna hold on the bond tilly,

962
00:46:12,360 --> 00:46:14,600
Speaker 2: you know, until they can get him into or it's like,

963
00:46:14,680 --> 00:46:16,719
Speaker 2: you know, he forfeited that and that's just his penalty.

964
00:46:17,480 --> 00:46:21,440
Speaker 2: It's like he's dead and there's five kids which now

965
00:46:21,480 --> 00:46:24,799
Speaker 2: live with the grandma. Yeah, you know what about them,

966
00:46:25,040 --> 00:46:26,000
Speaker 2: the mother's mother.

967
00:46:26,120 --> 00:46:29,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, so Jennifer Doulos's mother has the children cast.

968
00:46:29,600 --> 00:46:32,040
Speaker 2: Right, so if she secured them and they're in privacy,

969
00:46:32,080 --> 00:46:34,160
Speaker 2: it said, and they're not in the public eye, right.

970
00:46:34,600 --> 00:46:39,319
Speaker 1: I did read that the son made a statement or

971
00:46:39,360 --> 00:46:42,759
Speaker 1: wrote something, and this this was really he was I

972
00:46:43,080 --> 00:46:45,360
Speaker 1: don't remember his exact age around the time that his

973
00:46:45,440 --> 00:46:47,400
Speaker 1: mother was murdered, but I'm thinking it was like twelve

974
00:46:47,440 --> 00:46:49,560
Speaker 1: thirteen or something like that. That age, well at the

975
00:46:49,560 --> 00:46:51,879
Speaker 1: age they were eight to thirteen, Okay, so I think

976
00:46:51,880 --> 00:46:56,000
Speaker 1: he was around the thirteen age. Anyway, he wrote something.

977
00:46:56,040 --> 00:47:00,680
Speaker 1: I read that he said that during that time when

978
00:47:00,680 --> 00:47:03,280
Speaker 1: his mother disappeared and was murdered, he was not getting

979
00:47:03,320 --> 00:47:05,960
Speaker 1: along with her very well. And I think he had

980
00:47:05,960 --> 00:47:10,200
Speaker 1: a lot of the son because I mean, first of all,

981
00:47:10,280 --> 00:47:12,160
Speaker 1: let's look at his age. We you and I. We

982
00:47:12,200 --> 00:47:15,880
Speaker 1: have Annabelle. She's twelve almost thirteen. That's a very critical

983
00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:18,560
Speaker 1: age for kids. That's just they and then there's a

984
00:47:19,400 --> 00:47:20,120
Speaker 1: there's a divorce.

985
00:47:20,160 --> 00:47:21,719
Speaker 2: The dad psychodad, the.

986
00:47:21,719 --> 00:47:24,040
Speaker 1: Dad's moved out, the mom's trying to protect the kids.

987
00:47:24,360 --> 00:47:28,120
Speaker 1: Kids at that age they don't understand that you're trying

988
00:47:28,120 --> 00:47:30,440
Speaker 1: to protect them. I mean, we constantly have conversations with

989
00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:33,560
Speaker 1: Annabel that we're not limiting things or taking things away

990
00:47:33,640 --> 00:47:35,879
Speaker 1: or not allowing her to do things because we're mean

991
00:47:36,000 --> 00:47:38,120
Speaker 1: and we're terrible people and we want her to have

992
00:47:38,160 --> 00:47:41,360
Speaker 1: a terrible life. We're doing it because we're protecting her

993
00:47:41,640 --> 00:47:43,600
Speaker 1: and we love her and we care about her. But

994
00:47:43,680 --> 00:47:45,879
Speaker 1: that age, it's very difficult. They don't see it that way.

995
00:47:46,040 --> 00:47:49,960
Speaker 1: My point is is that he has now said that

996
00:47:50,280 --> 00:47:53,560
Speaker 1: he did not have the opportunity to ever say to

997
00:47:53,600 --> 00:47:56,359
Speaker 1: his mother. Now he realizes that all the things that

998
00:47:55,800 --> 00:47:59,160
Speaker 1: he was that he was upset about was just her

999
00:47:59,400 --> 00:48:02,040
Speaker 1: trying to techt him, and that he was at that

1000
00:48:02,280 --> 00:48:04,960
Speaker 1: teenage critical angst age where he was just upset with

1001
00:48:05,000 --> 00:48:06,400
Speaker 1: her and he was mad at her, and you know,

1002
00:48:06,560 --> 00:48:10,799
Speaker 1: he was arguing with her. And now right he's devastated

1003
00:48:10,840 --> 00:48:13,880
Speaker 1: that his last interactions with his mother before she was

1004
00:48:13,920 --> 00:48:18,280
Speaker 1: taken from his life were these teenage angst interactions where

1005
00:48:18,560 --> 00:48:20,600
Speaker 1: he was mad at her, he was upset with her,

1006
00:48:20,719 --> 00:48:23,360
Speaker 1: and he can't ever get that time back. He can't

1007
00:48:23,360 --> 00:48:25,800
Speaker 1: ever say what he really thinks. He can't say that,

1008
00:48:25,880 --> 00:48:27,680
Speaker 1: he can't say I now understand that you were trying

1009
00:48:27,719 --> 00:48:29,680
Speaker 1: to protect me, that you were an amazing mom. And

1010
00:48:29,719 --> 00:48:32,839
Speaker 1: that's what's so sad, is just this mom was taken

1011
00:48:32,840 --> 00:48:34,520
Speaker 1: away from these five children and was.

1012
00:48:34,520 --> 00:48:36,280
Speaker 2: The only hope they well, now they're with the grandma,

1013
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:38,680
Speaker 2: but prior to that, she was their hope. You know,

1014
00:48:38,719 --> 00:48:41,280
Speaker 2: she was protecting him. He was the one that's more aggressive.

1015
00:48:42,480 --> 00:48:45,839
Speaker 1: So so it was that's a sad story. Anyway, there's

1016
00:48:45,880 --> 00:48:49,320
Speaker 1: a lot of different documentaries out there on Jennifer Dulos.

1017
00:48:49,320 --> 00:48:51,200
Speaker 1: If you'd like to investigate it further and watch it,

1018
00:48:51,239 --> 00:48:54,040
Speaker 1: I would. I think it's an interesting story. I guess

1019
00:48:54,080 --> 00:48:56,120
Speaker 1: I take away from it because I'm the same age

1020
00:48:56,120 --> 00:48:57,799
Speaker 1: as her and I have children, and I.

1021
00:48:57,880 --> 00:49:02,200
Speaker 2: Just here nice though, the happy and the happy ending.

1022
00:49:02,520 --> 00:49:05,279
Speaker 2: The nice note to leave it on is all five

1023
00:49:05,320 --> 00:49:08,600
Speaker 2: are together. They're with the grandma. I think they moved

1024
00:49:08,719 --> 00:49:09,479
Speaker 2: to a different state.

1025
00:49:09,600 --> 00:49:10,160
Speaker 1: Did they moved down?

1026
00:49:10,160 --> 00:49:13,239
Speaker 2: And they're in privacy, and so you know, they can

1027
00:49:13,360 --> 00:49:15,399
Speaker 2: kind of try and live forward.

1028
00:49:15,120 --> 00:49:17,400
Speaker 1: That way, a normal life as much as possible.

1029
00:49:17,520 --> 00:49:19,799
Speaker 2: And I hate to say this, but I mean maybe

1030
00:49:19,800 --> 00:49:22,800
Speaker 2: it's better their dad's dead instead of in jail, where

1031
00:49:22,880 --> 00:49:27,200
Speaker 2: it's kind of always lingering that your dad's there.

1032
00:49:26,160 --> 00:49:28,720
Speaker 1: Is probably reaching out.

1033
00:49:27,120 --> 00:49:31,120
Speaker 2: To letters or fearful that he might come out one day,

1034
00:49:31,280 --> 00:49:34,200
Speaker 2: or you know, I don't know, yeah, I mean all right.

1035
00:49:34,239 --> 00:49:36,839
Speaker 1: Thanks guys for listening to Legally Brunette. We appreciate it.

1036
00:49:36,960 --> 00:49:39,279
Speaker 1: And again, we are on our own feeds, so please

1037
00:49:39,320 --> 00:49:41,080
Speaker 1: follow us on our own feed, make sure you leave

1038
00:49:41,120 --> 00:49:43,520
Speaker 1: a review, make sure you follow us, and if you

1039
00:49:43,600 --> 00:49:46,560
Speaker 1: ever have any suggestions for cases or you have feedback

1040
00:49:46,560 --> 00:49:48,520
Speaker 1: on any of the cases we talk about. I love

1041
00:49:48,520 --> 00:49:50,000
Speaker 1: it when you guys send me dms. I like to

1042
00:49:50,040 --> 00:49:51,919
Speaker 1: read them and I like to stay engaged, so please

1043
00:49:51,920 --> 00:49:54,040
Speaker 1: feel free to do that, and thanks so much for listening.

1044
00:49:54,280 --> 00:50:00,000
Speaker 2: Thank you,