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Speaker 1: Hey, Sanny and Samantha and welcome stuff. I never told

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Speaker 1: you prediction by her radio.

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Speaker 2: So we're back on part two of friendships. And if

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Speaker 2: you didn't listen to the early one, I guess you

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Speaker 2: can be you're you're okay, You're okay, because you could

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Speaker 2: go back after you're listening to this one. But if

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Speaker 2: you want to come in like a chronological order, I

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Speaker 2: would say go back, because we're going to jump in.

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Speaker 2: We just kind of talked about childhood stuff and now

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Speaker 2: we're going to talk about adult stuff. So what does

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Speaker 2: or how has it changed rather this friendship thing as adults?

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Speaker 2: How what is it like today?

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Speaker 1: Well, Samantha, I can tell you tell me. I will

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Speaker 1: say a lot of people have done so much research

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Speaker 1: on this, see our part one. But this whole idea

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Speaker 1: of making adults is making friends as adults? How does

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Speaker 1: that happen? How does that work? Oh? No, no one

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Speaker 1: can do it. So, yeah, people have looked into as

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Speaker 1: our changing times impacted what friendship looks like today, and yeah,

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Speaker 1: not in every way, but in a couple of important ways.

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Speaker 1: So there is a bit there has been a shifting

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Speaker 1: understanding of what women's friendships look like. Here's a quote

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Speaker 1: from Elle. Then things started to change. She began dropping

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Speaker 1: plans with me to do things with whomever she was

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Speaker 1: seeing instead, always a man. Of course, I didn't get it.

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Speaker 1: Why would hanging out with some guy she barely knew

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Speaker 1: be more important than plans with me. To her, disregarding

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Speaker 1: my feelings to promote romantic ones with someone else was

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Speaker 1: a totally fine thing to do. When I got mad

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Speaker 1: at her for spontaneously going with a guy she'd been

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Speaker 1: dating for two weeks to a local farm that we

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Speaker 1: had talked about visiting for age, she told me, matter

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Speaker 1: of factly, I was raised to look for the person

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Speaker 1: who I am going to share my life with, and

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Speaker 1: that's my priority. Okay, so obviously for contact. She's talking

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Speaker 1: about a friend very close to her who she started

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Speaker 1: noticing was dropping her for these kind of heterosexual relationships

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Speaker 1: with men, and it further goes on where they get

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Speaker 1: into a fight about it, and this friend said to her,

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Speaker 1: it's like, you think I'm your boyfriend or something. And

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Speaker 1: so this article actually breaks down the history of queer

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Speaker 1: coating friendships because her friend was essentially saying, I'm not gay. Okay, Like,

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Speaker 1: you know, the important relationship to me is the romantic one,

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Speaker 1: not the platonic one. I do think something we've discussed

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Speaker 1: a lot on this show. I think that's changing. I

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Speaker 1: do think that women's friendships have been demonized for a

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Speaker 1: while in media, and that has impacted real life friendships.

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Speaker 1: But we've seen so many examples of these positive portrayals

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Speaker 1: of friendships between women, and we've seen I personally have

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Speaker 1: seen a lot of media about like the commune, the

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Speaker 1: idea women just living in the commune together, all of

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Speaker 1: those things. But I also think that I went through this,

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Speaker 1: I'm sure a lot of you listeners did, but having

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Speaker 1: that friend who used to talk about how will never

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Speaker 1: be with boys, and then suddenly that's what they want

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Speaker 1: and you were I used to call it the old

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Speaker 1: tour on the shelf. That's how I felt. I was

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Speaker 1: like the one they came to when there was no

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Speaker 1: boy right then. I was the person they contacted, and

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Speaker 1: it was It's not a great feeling.

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Speaker 2: No, you knew when they were going through a break

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Speaker 2: and all of a sudden they wanted to hang out

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Speaker 2: and you're like, wait, oh, okay, y'all broke up, cools,

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Speaker 2: let's go. I will say I think it's interesting because

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Speaker 2: again I came I'm a I'm a late bloomer when

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Speaker 2: it comes to relationships, so for me, it was all

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Speaker 2: about my friends. And even coming later, I was like,

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Speaker 2: if my friends don't like him, then we are not

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Speaker 2: going to be cool, probably because I'm gonna need that.

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Speaker 2: You need to know. Yes, you are important my life,

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Speaker 2: but my friends are due mm hmm, and there's gonna

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Speaker 2: be if they need me, I'm gonna drop whatever to

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Speaker 2: go to there if at all positive, unless it's an

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Speaker 2: emergency on my end. But my loyalty goes in both

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Speaker 2: ways as well. But like my friendships always came first,

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Speaker 2: like of course being in a long term relationship, so

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Speaker 2: we actually live together and I have grown into a partnership,

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Speaker 2: like he has slowly become my best friend, like he

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Speaker 2: knows the most about me and he sees the most

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Speaker 2: about me now but when it was beginning, No, but

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Speaker 2: even now, I still try to maintain my friendships. To

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Speaker 2: be fair, it's because he also lives here, so it's

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Speaker 2: easier to maintain my friendship with a person I live with.

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Speaker 2: Am I right, But like all those things that, like,

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Speaker 2: my friendships have always been important as well, And he

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Speaker 2: also knows that. So he is also the first one

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Speaker 2: to be like, they need you, did you check up

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Speaker 2: on them? What's going on with them? Like he loves

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Speaker 2: the gossip just as much as like they do you

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Speaker 2: know what I mean, or any of those conversations and

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Speaker 2: following up make sure they're okay, and he wants to

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Speaker 2: know that they're okay. Like that's the only way this,

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Speaker 2: like this relationship has worked is because to him that

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Speaker 2: is also important, and he knows that's important. So he

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Speaker 2: respects that and is a part of that. He's a

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Speaker 2: part of the friend group and not like competing with

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Speaker 2: a friend group, which happens a lot. There are a

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Speaker 2: lot of people that I'm like, Okay, I don't like

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Speaker 2: that person you're dating. We I'm gonna have to let

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Speaker 2: you be yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And we'll get into that in a second a

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Speaker 1: bit more. But that is I think that me and

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Speaker 1: your partner, we're good friends. We hang out, we have

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Speaker 1: a great old time.

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Speaker 2: When you're like that you two have are wonderful, and

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Speaker 2: I'm like, I'll go to bed, y'all have fun.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And I do think at least that's a visible

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Speaker 1: way it's changed. I don't think that it's necessarily new,

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Speaker 1: but a lot of these things we're talking about are

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Speaker 1: more visible ways that it's changed, as opposed to I

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Speaker 1: think it was always happening, we just weren't hearing about

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Speaker 1: it as much.

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Speaker 2: And also I think like we're learning from the older

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Speaker 2: generations of women who has been ostracized, specifically women ostracized

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Speaker 2: in their marriage to feel like my life has to

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Speaker 2: be my children and my husband and two being like, wait,

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Speaker 2: don't do this to yourself, because when they leave, you

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Speaker 2: start kind of falling apart. Like my mom didn't have

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Speaker 2: many friends while she was a mother and a wife,

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Speaker 2: but when everybody left, she was kind of like, oh,

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Speaker 2: my best friend's my sister. And then her sister introduced

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Speaker 2: her to a group of women and they are doing

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Speaker 2: more and more things together. I'm like, I love that great.

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Speaker 2: But she kind of had a moment that she didn't

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Speaker 2: have that because her daughter was her best friend type

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Speaker 2: of thing. And I think like she wouldn't say she

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Speaker 2: regrets that, but I know a lot of the older generations,

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Speaker 2: Boomer generations would say I wish I'd kept in touch

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Speaker 2: with my friends or I wish I had, you know,

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Speaker 2: kept this going because they felt really isolated and lonely

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Speaker 2: after the fact.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, my mom was the same way. It was

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Speaker 1: a strange experience when her and my dad were having

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Speaker 1: such difficulties where I'm her adult child, but I'm her child,

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Speaker 1: and I was like, you know, let me talk to

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Speaker 1: you about these things. You know, you can make friends,

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Speaker 1: You've got life a of you. You don't have to.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't have to end here because this relationship has

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Speaker 1: defined you for so long that you have And she

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Speaker 1: has reconnected with her old friends, and yeah, I do too.

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Speaker 2: Get women outlive men statistically, so there's been a conversation

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Speaker 2: about what that looks like as well for the older generations.

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Speaker 1: Yes, and as we said in the last episode and

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Speaker 1: in previous episodes, friendship has positive health benefits and women

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Speaker 1: have more support systems after a divorce or breakup, and

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Speaker 1: that does help. Something else I ran into in a

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Speaker 1: lot of articles women's friendships being framed as resistance, as

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Speaker 1: power and strength. The ones who build you up, who

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Speaker 1: give you strength, who help you grow and learn, So

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Speaker 1: that touches on, you know, as we were discussing, the

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Speaker 1: friends who open you up to ideas you didn't know about,

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Speaker 1: or just show you the where you're lacking and you're learning,

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Speaker 1: or where you should really work work on. In that

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Speaker 1: positive I'm investing in you. I want you to grow way.

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Speaker 1: And when we're talking about protest or resistance and all

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Speaker 1: of that and how exhausting all of it can be,

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Speaker 1: having those friends who do help you keep going, who

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Speaker 1: are the ones that show up with you at the

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Speaker 1: protest or show up with you at whatever it is

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Speaker 1: that it is a form of resistance, and that is

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Speaker 1: something I is not new, It's not new at all,

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Speaker 1: but it is something that I think has become more

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Speaker 1: talked about visibly in recent years and is extremely important.

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Speaker 1: A recent study found that self identified feminists were less

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Speaker 1: likely to self silence in their friendships with women, which

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Speaker 1: we just talked about self silence, Yes, we did, yes,

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Speaker 1: and how that can be damaging to your health. So

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Speaker 1: I thought that was really interesting. Okay, when it comes

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Speaker 1: to marry and marrying later, because women are marrying later

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Speaker 1: in general, has it changed friendships? Uh? Okay, so many

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Speaker 1: of these things we could do entire episodes on. I know.

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Speaker 1: Here's the brief, here's the brief answer. Studies do show

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Speaker 1: that marriage does impact friendships and often leads to a

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Speaker 1: loss of friendship due to new priorities and scheduling constructions. However,

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Speaker 1: women are better at keeping friends after marriage as compared

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Speaker 1: to men, and there are tips online about how to

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Speaker 1: maintain friendships after marriage. And it echoes a lot of

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Speaker 1: what we've been talking about in this two parter, being

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Speaker 1: intentional and consistent including friends in new stages of your

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Speaker 1: life while being mindful about boundaries and being honest. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: as we talked about, sometimes life just gets in the

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Speaker 1: way and you wait until you have the right time

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Speaker 1: and proximity and that's when you meet up again. But

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Speaker 1: it does. It definitely is something we've talked about before

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Speaker 1: where like, oh you're married, now you move to the suburbs.

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Speaker 1: That's the top one for me. Yeah, I still want

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Speaker 1: to see you. I will do it.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, I would love to see you, but I

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Speaker 2: also know you may have priorities with your husband, his family,

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Speaker 2: You have new obligations. One of the things that I

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Speaker 2: newly discovered is my partner's family that I actually really

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Speaker 2: get along with and like I consider now friends, Like

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Speaker 2: there'll be a moment we are again. But this and

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Speaker 2: Breff is like ever thought of, like if we break up,

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Speaker 2: what happens. I think I always try to remain friends

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Speaker 2: with the siblings. I don't know if that's allowed or not,

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Speaker 2: because it turns out we have a lot in common,

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Speaker 2: not just poking fun at my partner, but in a

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Speaker 2: lot and common to the point that we buy same

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Speaker 2: thing because we're on the same wavelength of so many things.

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Speaker 2: But like I kind of love that, Like I get

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Speaker 2: to build even more friendships. Again, he's friends with a

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Speaker 2: lot of my friends and keeps in contact with them

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Speaker 2: and knows about them, probably has their number as well

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Speaker 2: as like can tell happy birthday, are included in the

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Speaker 2: celebrations in those moments, so like those were amazing, like

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Speaker 2: some of if you're I think with the later friendships,

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Speaker 2: we all see like we kind of get into a

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Speaker 2: bigger group. So I have a lot of friends. I

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Speaker 2: had friends who are married, like as a group of friends,

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Speaker 2: Like they were my friends. The two of them are

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Speaker 2: my friends. I had two friends again, I had friends

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Speaker 2: that married within the friend group, which was like, oh no,

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Speaker 2: but okay, And after some like rearranging of priorities, we

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Speaker 2: became good friends. Like there's this level of like older

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Speaker 2: generations that as we wait to get like in relationships,

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Speaker 2: we mature and I think for the most part, and

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Speaker 2: because this is not something that I've read yet, but

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Speaker 2: my assumption is we're a little more mature and are

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Speaker 2: able to make better decisions and usually thoughtful decisions at

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Speaker 2: an older age because we've gone through a lot of things,

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Speaker 2: whether it's we've been able to live on our own

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Speaker 2: so know how to take care of ourselves. We probably

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Speaker 2: have a lot of our own stuff that we come

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Speaker 2: together we have to like shift through because we have

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Speaker 2: too many of those adult things and like we don't

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Speaker 2: need fifteen pots, we only need five calm down, you know,

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Speaker 2: like type of conversations. But learning to work through that

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Speaker 2: because we've already established ourselves socially in whatever realm, and

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Speaker 2: so we come in with more friendships. Again, there could

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Speaker 2: be dynamics where you don't like each other the new

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Speaker 2: significant other, but if everything goes as planned, hopefully with

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Speaker 2: the better decisions, because I would think you would want

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Speaker 2: to be a partners with someone who, like your friends,

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Speaker 2: are on the same wavelength. That could be a question marks.

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Speaker 1: What the Spice Girls taught me.

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Speaker 2: And they are not wrong. It still stands strong. But

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Speaker 2: with that I think that's yeah, I think the waiting

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Speaker 2: to like with all those decisions, it's very conscious decisions.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think so too. And as we talked about

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Speaker 1: in part one, there is an intentionality in adult friendships

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Speaker 1: that is not there necessarily in childhood friendships. So the

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Speaker 1: older you get as marriage is kind of delayed, I

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Speaker 1: feel like you get that foundation of maybe your new

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Speaker 1: adult friends before you get married, and then probably there's

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Speaker 1: a meshing of meeting people and other friend groups of

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Speaker 1: your spouse's friend group or whatever before that, So there

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Speaker 1: is I do think that probably has changed how adult

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Speaker 1: friendship looks.

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Speaker 2: I mean, like I have seen many a videos where

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Speaker 2: people will say, go look at the partner's friend group

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Speaker 2: and it'll tell you a lot about them. And I

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Speaker 2: think that is like those are warning signs or those

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Speaker 2: are good signs. And I think that in itself can

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Speaker 2: be a whole thing of like, oh, yeah, that's why

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Speaker 2: we are together or we aren't together. That intention Again,

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Speaker 2: some people don't care. Some people will care about the

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Speaker 2: red flags. I think more and more people do.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And one thing I found interesting according to psychology today,

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Speaker 1: a lot of times the spouse are partner of a

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Speaker 1: friend will be a passive friend and not an active friend,

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Speaker 1: meaning that you find them pleasant enough, but don't go

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Speaker 1: out of your way to make time for them. I

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Speaker 1: feel that I've seen this a lot most of my friends.

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Speaker 1: I'm at least I'm on good terms with their partner, right,

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Speaker 1: But that makes sense to me. And the article I

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Speaker 1: was reading the Psychology today, she was like, I just

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Speaker 1: have to This is the person I want to give

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Speaker 1: my time to. If he is there, that's great, but

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Speaker 1: I'm not going to seek him out separately. But she

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Speaker 1: is the person.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there's no reason for me to talk to you.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a timing issue. Like you know, as we said,

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Speaker 1: this is the person you want to make time for

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Speaker 1: you like this other person, You're not mad that they're there,

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Speaker 1: but you're not mine, right. Yes, And there isn't too

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Speaker 1: much research on this that I could find, but anecdotal

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Speaker 1: stories online from newly divorced women report a loss of

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Speaker 1: friendships after a divorce. The speculated reasons range from fear

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Speaker 1: of grief as in, your friends don't want to deal

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Speaker 1: with your grief, choosing one partner over the other, feeling

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Speaker 1: threatened by a newly single woman, which I found interesting,

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Speaker 1: and stigma divorced stigma. On the other hand, I've spoken

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Speaker 1: personally to several divorced women who bonded with other divorced women,

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Speaker 1: So that's another instance where you might bond to someone.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I've seen so many stories. I've seen many of

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Speaker 2: stories where people who have been cheated on by the

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Speaker 2: same person becoming good friends.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Those are my favorites, to be honest, because they're like,

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Speaker 2: this is that girl's girl level of like, oh no,

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Speaker 2: you me, Let's all just show up together and now

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Speaker 2: we're going to get drinks like that level of like,

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Speaker 2: those are my one of my favorites. Not that they

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Speaker 2: got cheated and I hate that for them, but they

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Speaker 2: got at least a friendship out of it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's something we, uh, we've talked about before.

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Speaker 1: I would much rather that happen than kind of the

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Speaker 1: tearing down of the quote other woman, when usually it

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Speaker 1: was the dude who.

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Speaker 2: Look trying that person being like, why are you giving

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Speaker 2: so much grief to the woman? Is the dude is

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Speaker 2: the common factor here, He's the enemy or the person

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Speaker 2: that's cheating rather sorry sorry, because women can cheat.

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Speaker 1: You indeed.

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Speaker 2: Does having children who change friendships, and I think you

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Speaker 2: already know I think most people already know. Yeah, Unfortunately

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Speaker 2: it can. It can change, and friendships are lost, and

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Speaker 2: it's nobody's fault. Again, it's everything about time and priorities

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Speaker 2: and a child being someone's priority is not a bad thing.

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Speaker 2: Actually it should be. It makes perfect sense as to

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Speaker 2: be that if you didn't have that child as a priority,

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Speaker 2: I would be concerned and ask why you have a child.

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Speaker 2: But yes, it does, absolutely it can change a friendship.

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Speaker 2: So there was an article in Essence where they talk

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Speaker 2: to a coach and I think she has our own

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Speaker 2: podcast to a friendship coach. Her name is Danielle Bayard Jackson,

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Speaker 2: and she talks about what changes, and she says, there

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Speaker 2: is research that shows a woman's physical makeup changes when

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Speaker 2: she has a baby, even your brain changes. I'm different.

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Speaker 2: So that's going to change the way that I interact

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Speaker 2: with people, the time I have available and my priorities.

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Speaker 2: It doesn't diminish the friendships that I had, but they

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Speaker 2: are going to change. We have to stop seeing change

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Speaker 2: as a side that it wasn't real or that they

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Speaker 2: were fake. So I think that's such a big conversations,

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Speaker 2: like things change, your priority changes, and it should it

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Speaker 2: absolutely should when it comes to being responsible for another

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Speaker 2: human that you have brought into this world, whether it's adopted,

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Speaker 2: whether it's you know, through your body, whatever whatnot. Yes,

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Speaker 2: you have new priorities and it's going to be that

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Speaker 2: child and not necessarily maintaining a friendship. Again, when we

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Speaker 2: talk about the things where we might not see each

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Speaker 2: other for days and days and days, months and months

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Speaker 2: and years, but we can come back together and still

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Speaker 2: enjoy it. Yes, but let's say having that child being

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Speaker 2: a part of that social interaction, it's going to change

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Speaker 2: the way you are interacting at that moment. Whether it's

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Speaker 2: you're going to try to be conscientious of what you're

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Speaker 2: going to say in front of a child, you're also

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Speaker 2: watching that the child is safe and okay and happy,

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Speaker 2: and maybe you're doting, and the friend's attention is going

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Speaker 2: to be on the baby as well. Like things do

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Speaker 2: change no matter what. I don't think it's unfortunate, but

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Speaker 2: it just happens. It will change. Especially again, I didn't

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Speaker 2: look at the gender reference, but you know it's true

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Speaker 2: for more for women, whether it's because of patriarchy expecting

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Speaker 2: women to only care for the baby and take the

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Speaker 2: baby with them everywhere, or child with them everywhere as

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Speaker 2: opposed to having the father take care of it. Oftentimes

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Speaker 2: we also talk about the father just babysitting instead of

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Speaker 2: actually caregiving. Yeah, and that's still a conversation that's up

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Speaker 2: for debate, which is really really annoying. And then there

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Speaker 2: was this article from the pnmag dot com about parenthood.

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Speaker 2: They said motherhood is an all encompassing mind and body

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Speaker 2: consuming experience. It changes you, and that is what it's

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Speaker 2: supposed to do. You navigate pregnancy, then you have to

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Speaker 2: figure out how to care for a tiny human. You're

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Speaker 2: inundated with information from doctors, families, friends, websites, and books,

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Speaker 2: but few people talk about how some of your close

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Speaker 2: relationships may be impacted once you become a mom, and

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Speaker 2: they go onto talking about that deeper level of understanding

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Speaker 2: that this a caa' this is your priority, This is

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Speaker 2: what you live in and breathe, especially the most formative years.

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Speaker 2: There are things that you have to care for and

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Speaker 2: you should. That is parenthood actually caring and loving the child.

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Speaker 2: Of course, there are things of like also socializing children

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Speaker 2: and adapting a child into normal behavior instead of adapting

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Speaker 2: environment to the child like that's also up for debate.

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Speaker 2: Attachment issues are a thing, and having a good social

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Speaker 2: circle is important as well. That's my social work side.

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Speaker 2: We're not going to go into there, but just you know,

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Speaker 2: put that out there as well. And that article actually

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Speaker 2: goes on to talk about the child free and mothers.

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Speaker 2: So this is what it says. Doctor Holmes, who is

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Speaker 2: one of the people they are interviewed for this article,

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Speaker 2: further explains, I think there's a vast gap, if not divide,

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Speaker 2: when it comes to women with children and child free women.

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Speaker 2: I was child free until I had my daughter as

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Speaker 2: thirty six years old, and I was left out of

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Speaker 2: many conversations about having children because that is what women

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Speaker 2: often find ease and bonding over. I would not say

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Speaker 2: that I felt left out. Rather I felt like I

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Speaker 2: existed in a different world. It wasn't until I had

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Speaker 2: my daughter that I realized the depth and breadth of motherhood,

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Speaker 2: essentially how all encompassing it can be. So even understanding

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Speaker 2: that when it comes to child free and mothers, when

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Speaker 2: they come together, the conversation can sometimes lack, especially when

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00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:46,360
Speaker 2: it can feel like one side is understanding in the other.

390
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Speaker 2: I've told this story before and it's not funny, but

391
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Speaker 2: I made a bad call in saying referencing a stay

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Speaker 2: at home mom friend when she had made a passive

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Speaker 2: joke about ten minutes before my comment, and because I

394
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Speaker 2: do come off as really intense, but when she was like,

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Speaker 2: you know, I just stay home with the kids, mostly

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Speaker 2: because we were talking about the things that they'd done,

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Speaker 2: and so my translated my head translated into coming back

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Speaker 2: to that conversation and going, so what do you do

399
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Speaker 2: all day? That obviously came off very offensive, and in

400
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Speaker 2: my head I was like, no, no, no, that's not what

401
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Speaker 2: I mean. Like you said, you're the one who said okay.

402
00:23:21,640 --> 00:23:24,119
Speaker 2: Having to backtrack and realizing the way I said that

403
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Speaker 2: really was offensive, and I get why because I was like, oh,

404
00:23:27,240 --> 00:23:29,200
Speaker 2: I stepped at it. That's not how I meant to say.

405
00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:32,119
Speaker 2: I was referencing back to what you said in a

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Speaker 2: really bad way, in a really bad pause. I apologize,

407
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Speaker 2: but in understanding that she absolutely felt like I was

408
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Speaker 2: removing her importance and that's not what I'm meant to do.

409
00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:44,600
Speaker 2: It was more of like me coming back, so what

410
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Speaker 2: are you doing outside of this? Because I know you are,

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Speaker 2: But the way I said it was real bad, was

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Speaker 2: real bad, and I acknowledged that. I I acknowledged that

413
00:23:54,760 --> 00:23:56,919
Speaker 2: before then because I was like, oh, rightly so, and

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Speaker 2: I had to come back, and I don't think. I

415
00:23:58,359 --> 00:24:00,520
Speaker 2: don't think I recovered well enough because like, I'm not

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Speaker 2: saying that you don't. I'm trying to reference back what

417
00:24:02,920 --> 00:24:06,400
Speaker 2: you were hale. That conversation obviously has haunted me because

418
00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:10,119
Speaker 2: it's been over ten years, I believe. But all of

419
00:24:10,160 --> 00:24:12,920
Speaker 2: that to say is like, that's that level of like

420
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Speaker 2: her automatically thinking that I'm putting a wall up and

421
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Speaker 2: then me being like, oh, yeah, she's never gonna understand

422
00:24:21,040 --> 00:24:23,920
Speaker 2: how I'm trying to frame this because it's coming from

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Speaker 2: me who is not in that same world. So there's

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Speaker 2: this conversation of like what happened to that function of

425
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Speaker 2: friendship and our friendship, Like she and I went opposite

426
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Speaker 2: directions because she also made a statement to me it

427
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Speaker 2: was like, you don't understand what it's like to have

428
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Speaker 2: children when we were talking about a very heavy issue

429
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Speaker 2: about abortion, in which my response was like, yeah, you

430
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Speaker 2: don't understand what it's like to watch children who don't

431
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Speaker 2: have good parents and then they end up being murdered,

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Speaker 2: which is what kind of that conversation was, and it

433
00:24:56,560 --> 00:25:00,199
Speaker 2: really was a big divide because her made mine was

434
00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:02,720
Speaker 2: made up in that because I had not birth children,

435
00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:07,479
Speaker 2: I could not understand the depth of why she sees

436
00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:11,040
Speaker 2: this abhorrent thing. And for me as a child free

437
00:25:11,040 --> 00:25:15,480
Speaker 2: person who also sees the depth of like hell that

438
00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:20,639
Speaker 2: people put kids through, and then also the expectations of

439
00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:24,320
Speaker 2: women who don't have children like that level, like your

440
00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:26,399
Speaker 2: value is gone now because you choose not to have

441
00:25:26,520 --> 00:25:29,920
Speaker 2: kids like that level. So that there was just like

442
00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:33,399
Speaker 2: divide that really did break a friendship. I don't like

443
00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:36,320
Speaker 2: we haven't came back. I don't know if she'll ever

444
00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:38,679
Speaker 2: listen to if she's listening to the episode. Sorry, but

445
00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:41,280
Speaker 2: all this to say is like that it definitely was

446
00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:46,000
Speaker 2: a bigger issue that kind of came from my decision

447
00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:47,919
Speaker 2: not to have children, her decision to have children, And

448
00:25:48,119 --> 00:25:50,840
Speaker 2: both of those things are very valiant, Like I think

449
00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:54,639
Speaker 2: both of those choices are completely relevant to all the

450
00:25:54,680 --> 00:25:57,600
Speaker 2: things and the free will and having that choice is

451
00:25:57,640 --> 00:26:01,120
Speaker 2: beautiful and I love children. I don't want my own.

452
00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:04,120
Speaker 2: I've taken twenty years of my life to take care

453
00:26:04,160 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 2: of children other people's children because I want that value.

454
00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:10,720
Speaker 2: But I you know, see, like Okay, this is not

455
00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:12,720
Speaker 2: for me, This is not what I wanted, This is

456
00:26:12,800 --> 00:26:15,160
Speaker 2: not what I want. But all of that to say

457
00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:19,080
Speaker 2: is like when motherhood comes up or when parenthood comes up, rather,

458
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:23,000
Speaker 2: it does make a difference. Things state it and as

459
00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:26,119
Speaker 2: it should, as I should not be a priority to

460
00:26:26,160 --> 00:26:28,480
Speaker 2: my friend who just had a child. Why would I?

461
00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:30,520
Speaker 2: Does that hurt my feelings? No? But also like it

462
00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:34,520
Speaker 2: leads to what I said earlier, like they have the

463
00:26:34,560 --> 00:26:36,560
Speaker 2: court in their ball because I have the free, yeer

464
00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:40,680
Speaker 2: schedule than you, because you have all of these obligations

465
00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:43,440
Speaker 2: that I don't have. So my mind as a child

466
00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:48,200
Speaker 2: free person on my ay, do you and then if

467
00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:51,960
Speaker 2: you want to hang, I'm down, let's go. But again,

468
00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:55,719
Speaker 2: if I don't like your child, which I haven't met children,

469
00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:57,920
Speaker 2: I haven't met many of Like most of my friends

470
00:26:57,960 --> 00:27:00,280
Speaker 2: who have kids, I usually really like them. So I

471
00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:03,680
Speaker 2: really haven't met any that. I'm like that with trying

472
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:07,080
Speaker 2: to think, but there's just like I didn't like some

473
00:27:07,119 --> 00:27:08,840
Speaker 2: of my family members children. I'm like, yeah, I'm not

474
00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:09,560
Speaker 2: coming around to you.

475
00:27:09,680 --> 00:27:19,800
Speaker 1: See you, I have a friend's dog. Just like that.

476
00:27:20,600 --> 00:27:22,440
Speaker 1: I don't want to correct this. We're not going to

477
00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:25,920
Speaker 1: go back, but you definitely said, Court and your ball.

478
00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:32,320
Speaker 1: Oh did I believe it? I love it. I think

479
00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:32,920
Speaker 1: it's fantastic.

480
00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:34,960
Speaker 2: But yeah, so there's still much ship that like. It

481
00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:39,720
Speaker 2: is a conversation about how that does change friendships and

482
00:27:41,320 --> 00:27:46,119
Speaker 2: even people, even other mothers, whether like being able to

483
00:27:46,160 --> 00:27:52,720
Speaker 2: be friends with other mothers who that can get messy.

484
00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:55,439
Speaker 2: I just know my mom felt a certain type of

485
00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:59,200
Speaker 2: way about my friend's mom and they were not cool

486
00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:02,800
Speaker 2: until we came friends, and that still didn't like it

487
00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:07,120
Speaker 2: took a long time. Oh, and there were some judgments

488
00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:10,800
Speaker 2: about like how this person's raised this children's So I

489
00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:14,120
Speaker 2: was like, well, okay, so that also comes into play

490
00:28:14,160 --> 00:28:14,600
Speaker 2: as well.

491
00:28:14,720 --> 00:28:17,720
Speaker 1: That's true. My mom had a beef with my best

492
00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:22,439
Speaker 1: friend's mom when I was growing up. But you know,

493
00:28:22,560 --> 00:28:27,919
Speaker 1: I also was researching this and I ran across a

494
00:28:27,920 --> 00:28:32,240
Speaker 1: lot of articles written by women who were newly mothers,

495
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:34,199
Speaker 1: and they were talking about like where did all my

496
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:38,760
Speaker 1: friends go? And they have this quote that actually led

497
00:28:38,800 --> 00:28:41,880
Speaker 1: me to texting a friend of mine who just had

498
00:28:41,920 --> 00:28:45,920
Speaker 1: a kid that was like, please don't stop texting me, please,

499
00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:50,960
Speaker 1: even if I never say yes, please, please please. So

500
00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:54,960
Speaker 1: I texted this friend and they responded and were like yep,

501
00:28:55,040 --> 00:29:00,880
Speaker 1: let's hang out this week when so it does change things.

502
00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:03,520
Speaker 1: But I think a part of that article is also like,

503
00:29:04,360 --> 00:29:09,000
Speaker 1: if what's holding you back is that you think I want,

504
00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:11,160
Speaker 1: like I've entered a new stage in life and want

505
00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:13,080
Speaker 1: nothing to do with you. Please don't let that hold

506
00:29:13,120 --> 00:29:15,640
Speaker 1: you back, right if it's something, But I mean that

507
00:29:15,680 --> 00:29:19,240
Speaker 1: could be the case, because it's exhausting to have a

508
00:29:19,320 --> 00:29:22,000
Speaker 1: child and care for a child. But if that's if

509
00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:25,920
Speaker 1: you're putting it in your head, don't put that on

510
00:29:25,920 --> 00:29:28,080
Speaker 1: on them. Is basically what I took from a lot

511
00:29:28,080 --> 00:29:30,560
Speaker 1: of the articles I read. And I had a lovely

512
00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:31,640
Speaker 1: lunch and it was great.

513
00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:34,640
Speaker 2: That's beautiful. But yeah, and that's kind of that thing too,

514
00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:39,600
Speaker 2: Like first time parents, there's a lot of conversation, but

515
00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:41,760
Speaker 2: I had a lot of friends, especially the younger you

516
00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:44,960
Speaker 2: are to this age does come into play, it seems,

517
00:29:45,840 --> 00:29:48,840
Speaker 2: and the support system you have, it might like if

518
00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:51,120
Speaker 2: you have a great support system, it might not be

519
00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:53,440
Speaker 2: so hard to go out with your child, you know

520
00:29:53,440 --> 00:29:56,600
Speaker 2: what I'm saying. And having that support system, you really

521
00:29:56,640 --> 00:29:59,800
Speaker 2: do need it, and that's wonderful. As you have more children,

522
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:04,120
Speaker 2: it gets a little more difficult obviously, and you never

523
00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:06,920
Speaker 2: know because the no fault to the parent, no fault

524
00:30:06,920 --> 00:30:09,480
Speaker 2: to the child. They just may have a rougher time,

525
00:30:09,520 --> 00:30:12,840
Speaker 2: whether they have some kind of health situation they have,

526
00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:15,560
Speaker 2: like a feeding situation like that. So many things, and

527
00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:19,720
Speaker 2: it's harder to go out because it causes more anxiety.

528
00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:23,600
Speaker 2: Like if I was a parent with a newborn and

529
00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:26,440
Speaker 2: they were fussy, you would never see me out because

530
00:30:26,480 --> 00:30:31,280
Speaker 2: my anxiety could not Oh yeah, the focus I could not.

531
00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:34,760
Speaker 1: I would be the parent that thinks final destination is

532
00:30:34,760 --> 00:30:38,440
Speaker 1: gonna happen to my baby. I don't know how, but

533
00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:42,280
Speaker 1: I wasn't thinking of that. But okay, yeah, letting get

534
00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:48,240
Speaker 1: out something terrible will happens I put in place.

535
00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:50,000
Speaker 2: Let mean that do.

536
00:30:51,960 --> 00:30:55,320
Speaker 1: Well? Yah mannie. Yeah, well it was funny too. My

537
00:30:55,360 --> 00:31:00,480
Speaker 1: friend I was talking to was like, what how did

538
00:31:01,360 --> 00:31:06,040
Speaker 1: they phrase it? As they're lucky that they can afford

539
00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:12,520
Speaker 1: daycare and their child is just started daycare and he

540
00:31:12,720 --> 00:31:15,320
Speaker 1: was like, I had a friend who told me it

541
00:31:15,360 --> 00:31:17,080
Speaker 1: was better than any drug you could ever get, and

542
00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:20,480
Speaker 1: I laughed, and now I know it is. It's better.

543
00:31:20,800 --> 00:31:23,160
Speaker 1: You're buying time, that is what you're buying.

544
00:31:25,800 --> 00:31:30,360
Speaker 2: Okay, I mean, would I say, like having that support system,

545
00:31:30,640 --> 00:31:34,560
Speaker 2: whether it's having in law's grandparents who are able to

546
00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:37,680
Speaker 2: support you hopefully you're not abusing that system. And being

547
00:31:37,720 --> 00:31:41,080
Speaker 2: able to afford daycare, being afforded nanny, like all of

548
00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:44,840
Speaker 2: those things. It is important and it really should be

549
00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:48,560
Speaker 2: an automatic. It should be required for parenthood if you

550
00:31:48,640 --> 00:31:51,880
Speaker 2: want true parenthood, like if you want good parenting now,

551
00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:55,640
Speaker 2: not like I'm not saying it should be where no

552
00:31:55,680 --> 00:32:00,280
Speaker 2: one they don't have to parent anymore, right, but getting access. Yeah,

553
00:32:00,360 --> 00:32:04,640
Speaker 2: like getting respite. Respite is so important for every aspect,

554
00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:08,959
Speaker 2: and that could be just being able to sleep for

555
00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:13,080
Speaker 2: four hours, yeah, safely and comfortably.

556
00:32:14,440 --> 00:32:17,280
Speaker 1: Well, my friend said, you won't see me again until December,

557
00:32:17,520 --> 00:32:20,280
Speaker 1: so I oh contact.

558
00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:23,160
Speaker 2: I love that. I only see in people who don't

559
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:26,720
Speaker 2: have kids but just have other like priorities and other responsibilities.

560
00:32:26,760 --> 00:32:28,200
Speaker 2: I see them three times a year.

561
00:32:28,760 --> 00:32:33,320
Speaker 1: It is beautiful. Yeah. I was so happy it worked out.

562
00:32:33,760 --> 00:32:37,880
Speaker 1: But that is this episode really made me reach out

563
00:32:37,920 --> 00:32:38,320
Speaker 1: to people.

564
00:32:38,560 --> 00:32:41,960
Speaker 2: I love that, Yeah, made me think about people I

565
00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:43,400
Speaker 2: didn't reach out, like, I'm still.

566
00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:49,400
Speaker 1: Wait to hearty for that. Oh okay, well we already

567
00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:52,280
Speaker 1: kind of briefly touched on this in the last episode.

568
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:55,200
Speaker 1: I'm going to go over it because we're kind of

569
00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:58,800
Speaker 1: talking about how friendships have changed in these days and

570
00:32:59,400 --> 00:33:04,120
Speaker 1: how women being more empowered. Has that been better or

571
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:09,800
Speaker 1: worse for friendships? I feel like I would say better,

572
00:33:10,120 --> 00:33:15,480
Speaker 1: but it has mental loss of friendships in some instances,

573
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:21,120
Speaker 1: in other instances make you make your closer friends. So politics, yes,

574
00:33:21,560 --> 00:33:28,120
Speaker 1: politics from American Survey Center. Ending friendships over political disagreements

575
00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:32,640
Speaker 1: occurs more among liberal and Democratic leaning Americans. Democrats are

576
00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:35,560
Speaker 1: twice as likely as Republicans are to report having ended

577
00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:39,080
Speaker 1: to friendship over political disagreement twenty percent versus ten percent.

578
00:33:39,560 --> 00:33:42,600
Speaker 1: Political liberals are also far more likely than conservatives are

579
00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:44,640
Speaker 1: to say they are no longer friends with someone due

580
00:33:44,680 --> 00:33:48,360
Speaker 1: to political differences twenty eight percent versus ten percent, respectively.

581
00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:51,360
Speaker 1: No group is more likely to end a friendship over

582
00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:55,240
Speaker 1: politics than liberal women are. Thirty percent say they stop

583
00:33:55,360 --> 00:33:58,560
Speaker 1: being friends with someone because of their politics. In all,

584
00:33:58,760 --> 00:34:01,080
Speaker 1: twenty two percent of a Americans who have ended a

585
00:34:01,160 --> 00:34:06,920
Speaker 1: friendship sided Trump has their reason. So I think, sort of,

586
00:34:07,000 --> 00:34:09,480
Speaker 1: as we said, as you get older, you kind of

587
00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:13,760
Speaker 1: you cut some people out and you choose the ones

588
00:34:13,800 --> 00:34:16,360
Speaker 1: that you really want to be intentional with, and so

589
00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:19,800
Speaker 1: it can feel like you're losing friends and that is painful.

590
00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:22,319
Speaker 1: But on the other hand, you're probably going to make

591
00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:26,399
Speaker 1: friends who are more in line with what you're thinking.

592
00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:28,840
Speaker 1: Are you gonna are you going to make stronger friendships

593
00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:30,040
Speaker 1: with people that you already have?

594
00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:32,719
Speaker 2: Right, And I think it needs to be noted, like

595
00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:34,799
Speaker 2: I'm pretty sure you wouldn't probably jump into it that

596
00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:38,799
Speaker 2: but like when they delete it as just liberals, it

597
00:34:38,880 --> 00:34:41,879
Speaker 2: sounds like liberals are upset for myself as a person

598
00:34:41,920 --> 00:34:44,879
Speaker 2: of college, this is my livelihood. You are choosing when

599
00:34:44,920 --> 00:34:47,319
Speaker 2: we say that Trump is a reason is because his

600
00:34:47,440 --> 00:34:50,520
Speaker 2: policies are putting my life at risk. And you're okay

601
00:34:50,560 --> 00:34:53,160
Speaker 2: with it because it benefits you, and you're not since

602
00:34:53,160 --> 00:34:57,920
Speaker 2: it benefits you if you're of the Conservative party outside

603
00:34:57,920 --> 00:35:00,520
Speaker 2: of like it, outside of like it doesn't bother me.

604
00:35:00,880 --> 00:35:02,960
Speaker 2: I don't understand why you're so bothered. Literally like no,

605
00:35:03,000 --> 00:35:08,200
Speaker 2: but for me, I am waiting holding my breath to

606
00:35:08,280 --> 00:35:11,399
Speaker 2: see if that naturalization thing that they are already talking

607
00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:14,560
Speaker 2: about that Marco Robio has already like said that he's

608
00:35:14,600 --> 00:35:17,960
Speaker 2: going to do with fake reasons to take away visas

609
00:35:17,960 --> 00:35:21,800
Speaker 2: and citizenship and being like, yeah, so what you voted

610
00:35:21,800 --> 00:35:26,319
Speaker 2: for was literally me being left like everything is being

611
00:35:26,320 --> 00:35:29,400
Speaker 2: taken away from me, my rights as a woman, my

612
00:35:29,560 --> 00:35:32,960
Speaker 2: rights as a naturalized citizen, all of these things that

613
00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:36,279
Speaker 2: I never had a choice to begin with. Like it,

614
00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:40,080
Speaker 2: m it's a little different than just being liberal, Like

615
00:35:40,440 --> 00:35:42,680
Speaker 2: I understand what they're saying, being straightforward, but at the

616
00:35:42,719 --> 00:35:45,279
Speaker 2: same time, like, the reason is is not just because

617
00:35:45,320 --> 00:35:46,920
Speaker 2: you voted for somebody because I did not feel this

618
00:35:46,960 --> 00:35:49,640
Speaker 2: way about other candidates. Did I disagree with them, did

619
00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:52,799
Speaker 2: I not like them? Absolutely, but to this level that

620
00:35:52,880 --> 00:35:55,920
Speaker 2: I'm like, no, it is that serious?

621
00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:02,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, oh absolutely, Like it's that's and this, in my opinion,

622
00:36:02,840 --> 00:36:07,440
Speaker 1: this makes absolute sense because how can you square that

623
00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:13,400
Speaker 1: with the fact that, Okay, you actively voted for something

624
00:36:13,440 --> 00:36:17,239
Speaker 1: that is going to harm me physically, like people I

625
00:36:17,360 --> 00:36:22,920
Speaker 1: care about. Yeah, and it is frightening. So yeah, it

626
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:26,680
Speaker 1: is definitely. That's why. It's not because.

627
00:36:26,640 --> 00:36:32,799
Speaker 2: We're good, I'm met at you. No, No, it's also

628
00:36:33,040 --> 00:36:35,719
Speaker 2: the reason why have the people on dating sites are

629
00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:37,840
Speaker 2: lying about voting for Trump.

630
00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:42,520
Speaker 1: That's true. What we've been meaning, we've been meaning to

631
00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:47,280
Speaker 1: talk about. We have been meaning to talk about that. Yeah, well,

632
00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:53,400
Speaker 1: a future episode, a future episode. One thing I pivoting.

633
00:36:53,680 --> 00:36:56,480
Speaker 1: One thing I find interesting is how the idea of

634
00:36:56,560 --> 00:37:01,880
Speaker 1: work friends has changed. Back when we were in office, Samantha,

635
00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:04,120
Speaker 1: we went to an office. You didn't have a dass,

636
00:37:04,160 --> 00:37:05,880
Speaker 1: but you still went. Sometimes.

637
00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:08,759
Speaker 2: I dressed up way more than everybody else.

638
00:37:09,719 --> 00:37:14,839
Speaker 1: You certainly did. I spent a lot of time with

639
00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:16,960
Speaker 1: my coworkers, and I count a lot of them as

640
00:37:17,200 --> 00:37:21,520
Speaker 1: true close friends. Some of them faded during the pandemic,

641
00:37:21,640 --> 00:37:23,840
Speaker 1: especially or if they got a different job, but a

642
00:37:23,840 --> 00:37:27,000
Speaker 1: lot of them are still in place. They're still my friends.

643
00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:29,759
Speaker 1: I've gone to their weddings, I've gone to the birthdays.

644
00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:33,319
Speaker 1: I've gone to their events, and they have gone to mine.

645
00:37:33,520 --> 00:37:35,480
Speaker 1: And it makes sense because you're spending a lot of

646
00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:39,720
Speaker 1: time together, you're sharing a similar work experience and generally values.

647
00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:42,520
Speaker 1: In this case, not always, but in our case, it's

648
00:37:42,560 --> 00:37:45,160
Speaker 1: where I met friends, and historically this is where most

649
00:37:45,160 --> 00:37:50,080
Speaker 1: people in recent generations have made friends. However, I've read

650
00:37:50,080 --> 00:37:53,080
Speaker 1: that gen Z has a different attitude, wanting to keep

651
00:37:53,120 --> 00:37:57,360
Speaker 1: their work life and personal life separate. That being said,

652
00:37:58,200 --> 00:38:01,239
Speaker 1: some reportings suggests that gen Z are looking to make

653
00:38:01,320 --> 00:38:04,160
Speaker 1: friends and are tired of everything being virtual, so they

654
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:08,120
Speaker 1: are returning to the office and they are attending more

655
00:38:08,160 --> 00:38:14,000
Speaker 1: professional development events. Of note, they also came of age

656
00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:17,920
Speaker 1: without the social interaction and friendships of school that a

657
00:38:17,920 --> 00:38:20,719
Speaker 1: lot of us had, So that comes up in a

658
00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:22,480
Speaker 1: lot of the articles. I would love if somebody, if

659
00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:24,680
Speaker 1: people from gen Z would write in, because I got

660
00:38:24,680 --> 00:38:27,279
Speaker 1: a lot of conflicting information about this.

661
00:38:28,440 --> 00:38:31,560
Speaker 2: That's interesting. I've seen that as a demographic. I've seen

662
00:38:31,680 --> 00:38:36,719
Speaker 2: also like specific communities are like, no, I don't make

663
00:38:36,760 --> 00:38:39,000
Speaker 2: friends at work because I have my friends out here.

664
00:38:39,120 --> 00:38:41,240
Speaker 2: I don't need work. I want that to be separate

665
00:38:41,560 --> 00:38:46,040
Speaker 2: and like to the point that if like people would

666
00:38:46,040 --> 00:38:48,520
Speaker 2: get offended, but you had to be like, oh, okay,

667
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:51,720
Speaker 2: this makes more sense. And then also like the types

668
00:38:51,760 --> 00:38:56,480
Speaker 2: of interests that people have, and that's outside of work,

669
00:38:57,160 --> 00:39:00,719
Speaker 2: that's enough because if their interests are like a lot,

670
00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:03,520
Speaker 2: like they are something that's a common thing every week,

671
00:39:03,520 --> 00:39:07,239
Speaker 2: book club, all those things, then they don't need that

672
00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:10,600
Speaker 2: level of friendship at work. Also, sometimes when you work

673
00:39:10,640 --> 00:39:12,160
Speaker 2: make work friends, all you talk about is work, and

674
00:39:12,280 --> 00:39:13,080
Speaker 2: you don't want that either.

675
00:39:14,080 --> 00:39:16,239
Speaker 1: Yeah. I think that kind of goes back to what

676
00:39:16,239 --> 00:39:17,960
Speaker 1: we were talking about in part one though, when you

677
00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:20,520
Speaker 1: were breaking down the type of friendships. Yes, like a

678
00:39:20,520 --> 00:39:23,719
Speaker 1: lot of work friendships can be just the acquaintances I

679
00:39:23,800 --> 00:39:26,520
Speaker 1: like seeing you at work, but I've had several that

680
00:39:26,640 --> 00:39:31,759
Speaker 1: have become more than that have a slickview exactly. Well,

681
00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:36,360
Speaker 1: and that's the thing is like where our offices sort

682
00:39:36,400 --> 00:39:39,560
Speaker 1: of different than I would imagine a lot of offices are. Yes,

683
00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:42,920
Speaker 1: since it does involve a lot of collaboration and usually

684
00:39:43,040 --> 00:39:48,239
Speaker 1: people who have similar values, who are really curious and

685
00:39:48,280 --> 00:39:49,160
Speaker 1: interested in things.

686
00:39:49,480 --> 00:39:52,719
Speaker 2: Oh, we have creative outlets as so that opens up

687
00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:57,160
Speaker 2: for a lot more like personal touches. Yeah, in personal

688
00:39:57,200 --> 00:40:01,080
Speaker 2: opinions as opposed to like my job working for government.

689
00:40:01,920 --> 00:40:06,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I don't I can't really put what our

690
00:40:06,719 --> 00:40:09,719
Speaker 1: experience has been on others. So I would love to

691
00:40:09,719 --> 00:40:12,680
Speaker 1: hear from other people. But in our case, it was

692
00:40:14,040 --> 00:40:16,160
Speaker 1: we had a good we had a good office before

693
00:40:16,200 --> 00:40:18,920
Speaker 1: the pandemic. We really did. We still do, but we

694
00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:21,160
Speaker 1: just no one goes in the office right.

695
00:40:21,440 --> 00:40:26,000
Speaker 2: Well, also we are now messed with the radio side. Yeah,

696
00:40:26,040 --> 00:40:28,160
Speaker 2: and no hate to the radio side, but it's just different.

697
00:40:28,680 --> 00:40:33,520
Speaker 1: It's yeah, it is. It is. Okay, So we're not

698
00:40:33,560 --> 00:40:36,440
Speaker 1: going to go too in depth into this, but yeah,

699
00:40:36,480 --> 00:40:41,040
Speaker 1: we have discussed making friends through a pandemic. This is

700
00:40:41,080 --> 00:40:46,120
Speaker 1: something gen Z did experience differently than a lot a

701
00:40:46,160 --> 00:40:49,520
Speaker 1: lot of us did. Several studies suggest that the COVID

702
00:40:49,600 --> 00:40:53,600
Speaker 1: nineteen pandemic led to a decline in American friendships. Young

703
00:40:53,640 --> 00:40:56,839
Speaker 1: women reported higher rates of friendship loss, so this could

704
00:40:56,840 --> 00:40:59,520
Speaker 1: be because they had in general more friends to lose.

705
00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:02,520
Speaker 1: And I have to say, I wouldn't say I lost friends,

706
00:41:02,560 --> 00:41:05,080
Speaker 1: but I definitely lost touch with a lot of friends.

707
00:41:05,719 --> 00:41:10,320
Speaker 1: And we'll hear from each other every now and then,

708
00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:15,200
Speaker 1: but the pandemic really did cut down on a lot

709
00:41:15,239 --> 00:41:16,040
Speaker 1: of that interaction.

710
00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:32,040
Speaker 2: We did already kind of cover this with our Monday

711
00:41:32,120 --> 00:41:35,200
Speaker 2: mini which kind of spurred into this bigger conversation, but

712
00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:40,640
Speaker 2: is there a loneliness epidemic? So again, because I was

713
00:41:40,719 --> 00:41:43,000
Speaker 2: very confused by all the people talking about the male

714
00:41:43,080 --> 00:41:45,359
Speaker 2: lowliness epidemic, and I was like, is there a male

715
00:41:45,560 --> 00:41:48,680
Speaker 2: loneliness epidemic? What's happening? Is this because the COVID was happening,

716
00:41:49,440 --> 00:41:51,319
Speaker 2: And like I said, we talked about it and it's

717
00:41:51,360 --> 00:41:55,040
Speaker 2: not just men. Yes, there is a male lowliness epidemic,

718
00:41:55,320 --> 00:42:01,080
Speaker 2: but it's actually a loneliness epidemic in general. The numbers

719
00:42:01,080 --> 00:42:03,719
Speaker 2: weren't more. It's kind of interesting in that level of like,

720
00:42:03,760 --> 00:42:07,440
Speaker 2: actually women are just as lonely, if not more. If

721
00:42:07,440 --> 00:42:11,040
Speaker 2: we talk about marginalized people, they're even more lonely. If

722
00:42:11,080 --> 00:42:12,759
Speaker 2: we talk about the trans community right now, they feel

723
00:42:12,800 --> 00:42:15,640
Speaker 2: really lonely. Like there's so many things that we could say,

724
00:42:15,680 --> 00:42:19,400
Speaker 2: but for some reason, there's this honing end of the

725
00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:22,880
Speaker 2: male lonliness epidemic. And in that conversation, it's like, Okay,

726
00:42:22,920 --> 00:42:25,799
Speaker 2: so what's happening, what are we doing? What is going on?

727
00:42:26,120 --> 00:42:28,040
Speaker 2: Why are we worried about this? And the reason they're

728
00:42:28,080 --> 00:42:33,239
Speaker 2: focusing on the epidemic, as in focusing on males, is

729
00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:36,399
Speaker 2: mainly because of the violence that we're seeing out of that,

730
00:42:36,640 --> 00:42:39,120
Speaker 2: and that's why it's called an epidemic, Like this is

731
00:42:39,160 --> 00:42:43,160
Speaker 2: not just about everybody's lonely, No, this is about what's

732
00:42:43,200 --> 00:42:47,840
Speaker 2: happening because of them being lonely. So an article that

733
00:42:47,880 --> 00:42:49,480
Speaker 2: I read from twenty twenty four, by the way, so

734
00:42:49,480 --> 00:42:52,239
Speaker 2: I want to preface this. This is a year old,

735
00:42:52,560 --> 00:42:54,920
Speaker 2: so nothing is in reference to today, although we can

736
00:42:54,920 --> 00:42:57,200
Speaker 2: come back and talk about it because I just discovered

737
00:42:57,320 --> 00:43:00,600
Speaker 2: Groyper's the hell is that in transbax, which are things

738
00:43:00,640 --> 00:43:04,120
Speaker 2: that I'm like, why am I learning about this? Ih?

739
00:43:04,960 --> 00:43:09,239
Speaker 2: The internet is dark? But again, this is part of

740
00:43:09,280 --> 00:43:13,360
Speaker 2: the problem. So what essentially is being said is during

741
00:43:13,400 --> 00:43:18,600
Speaker 2: the lockdown, we all saw real big loneliness epidemic and

742
00:43:18,800 --> 00:43:23,640
Speaker 2: things came bursting out, and the solution became the Internet

743
00:43:23,920 --> 00:43:30,120
Speaker 2: and being critically online all the time. And we've already

744
00:43:30,120 --> 00:43:33,480
Speaker 2: talked about in cells and how pervasive they have become,

745
00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:36,880
Speaker 2: what the Reddit community has become, what four Chan community

746
00:43:36,920 --> 00:43:40,359
Speaker 2: has become. And I'm saying this as these are extremists,

747
00:43:40,920 --> 00:43:44,080
Speaker 2: but this is a result and why it's an epidemic.

748
00:43:44,800 --> 00:43:46,680
Speaker 2: And then the new stuff, which I just kind of

749
00:43:46,719 --> 00:43:49,160
Speaker 2: mentioned that I'm like, it's apparently not new, but it's

750
00:43:49,200 --> 00:43:52,080
Speaker 2: just getting more famous. And I know we've talked about

751
00:43:52,080 --> 00:43:53,640
Speaker 2: it with a red pill, we got to talk about

752
00:43:53,640 --> 00:43:55,160
Speaker 2: it with a black pill. Like there's so many things

753
00:43:55,200 --> 00:43:56,520
Speaker 2: that we need to come down to we've talked about

754
00:43:56,520 --> 00:43:58,640
Speaker 2: with Bridget and we have to keep talking about this

755
00:43:59,239 --> 00:44:01,600
Speaker 2: because this is why is kind of scary, and this

756
00:44:01,640 --> 00:44:05,360
Speaker 2: is what we're having in conversation that again earlier conversation

757
00:44:05,400 --> 00:44:08,480
Speaker 2: about the inner group concept and why that's important and

758
00:44:08,520 --> 00:44:11,200
Speaker 2: why we need that because we see that men do

759
00:44:11,200 --> 00:44:15,520
Speaker 2: not want to talk to other men about emotional things

760
00:44:15,640 --> 00:44:18,080
Speaker 2: or anything that's of depth, but they're willing to talk

761
00:44:18,080 --> 00:44:22,880
Speaker 2: about with women, but also this layer of masculinity, hyper masculinity.

762
00:44:23,239 --> 00:44:26,520
Speaker 2: You can't be friends with a woman. But all of

763
00:44:26,560 --> 00:44:29,320
Speaker 2: that to say is that they are finding their solution

764
00:44:29,520 --> 00:44:32,200
Speaker 2: online and this is the problem. So in this independent

765
00:44:32,280 --> 00:44:34,239
Speaker 2: article that they wrote in twenty twenty four, they write, this,

766
00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:37,880
Speaker 2: a vicious cycle emerges. Boys and young men are encouraged

767
00:44:37,880 --> 00:44:41,520
Speaker 2: by society to perform an unhealthy masculinity that sees them

768
00:44:41,600 --> 00:44:44,719
Speaker 2: withdrawal emotionally from friends and family. They feel lonely and

769
00:44:44,840 --> 00:44:48,239
Speaker 2: go looking for connection and support online. They get purposely

770
00:44:48,280 --> 00:44:52,640
Speaker 2: shunted towards content that reinforces those damaging gender stereotypes and

771
00:44:52,680 --> 00:44:55,960
Speaker 2: further isolates them from their peers. Told that women are

772
00:44:56,000 --> 00:45:00,680
Speaker 2: their inferiors and men their competition. So what we have

773
00:45:00,840 --> 00:45:04,239
Speaker 2: is they're lonely. So their solution is to go into

774
00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:07,160
Speaker 2: content that tells them they are lonely and that's okay.

775
00:45:07,200 --> 00:45:09,680
Speaker 2: Their loneliness is going to feel their masculinity because everything

776
00:45:09,680 --> 00:45:12,400
Speaker 2: else in society is bad and it's working against you.

777
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:15,279
Speaker 2: So they feed into this. And of course we had

778
00:45:15,320 --> 00:45:17,120
Speaker 2: a giant picture of Andrew Tait as one of the

779
00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:20,440
Speaker 2: biggest examples, who has gone through several charges of sexual

780
00:45:20,520 --> 00:45:23,920
Speaker 2: violence and rape and harassment, and men who have been

781
00:45:24,000 --> 00:45:27,440
Speaker 2: his fans continue to be his fans, which is again

782
00:45:27,560 --> 00:45:31,440
Speaker 2: part of this problem. And this leads into is this

783
00:45:31,520 --> 00:45:36,400
Speaker 2: killing women? Yes, yes, it is honestly is killing a

784
00:45:36,480 --> 00:45:41,279
Speaker 2: lot of people, including Charlie Kirk. This killed him. The

785
00:45:41,400 --> 00:45:44,560
Speaker 2: level of this problem is bigger with the added disasters

786
00:45:44,560 --> 00:45:47,439
Speaker 2: of COVID again insel and red pill, and I say

787
00:45:47,480 --> 00:45:51,839
Speaker 2: added it is kind of the result of So that's

788
00:45:51,840 --> 00:45:53,799
Speaker 2: that big problem and there's a bigger picture that can

789
00:45:53,840 --> 00:45:58,120
Speaker 2: be seen through this epidemic. So why is called an epidemic?

790
00:46:00,600 --> 00:46:03,160
Speaker 2: This is where we are. So in that same article

791
00:46:03,200 --> 00:46:04,800
Speaker 2: they kind of talk about it a little deeper and

792
00:46:04,880 --> 00:46:07,400
Speaker 2: says many on the right have sought to associate manhood

793
00:46:07,440 --> 00:46:10,120
Speaker 2: with politics. If you're a man in this country and

794
00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:12,319
Speaker 2: you don't vote for Donald Trump, you are not a man.

795
00:46:12,440 --> 00:46:16,080
Speaker 2: Charlie Kirk, a conservative activist, recently proclaimed the real world

796
00:46:16,080 --> 00:46:19,120
Speaker 2: consequences of this were arguably evident this week as Donald

797
00:46:19,160 --> 00:46:21,640
Speaker 2: Trump shocked the world to win the US presidential election.

798
00:46:21,840 --> 00:46:24,279
Speaker 2: Some fifty four percent of men cast their ballot for

799
00:46:24,320 --> 00:46:28,080
Speaker 2: the Republican but perhaps one of the starkest demographics differences

800
00:46:28,280 --> 00:46:31,319
Speaker 2: was between young men and women. Just under half. Forty

801
00:46:31,400 --> 00:46:33,560
Speaker 2: nine percent of the former age eighteen to twenty nine

802
00:46:33,680 --> 00:46:37,000
Speaker 2: voted for Trump, compared to thirty seven percent of the latter.

803
00:46:37,560 --> 00:46:41,279
Speaker 2: So this is a twenty threety four article that was

804
00:46:41,280 --> 00:46:47,279
Speaker 2: a quote from Charlie Kirk, and this concept was part

805
00:46:47,320 --> 00:46:50,279
Speaker 2: of the reason for his death. And we see this

806
00:46:50,360 --> 00:46:52,960
Speaker 2: is also the reason for many women's death and that

807
00:46:53,000 --> 00:46:56,360
Speaker 2: has heightened in itself as well. When we talk about femicide,

808
00:46:56,360 --> 00:47:00,120
Speaker 2: when we talk about grape culture, so much fear that

809
00:47:00,200 --> 00:47:04,080
Speaker 2: comes against women is this loneliness epidemic because men are

810
00:47:04,080 --> 00:47:08,800
Speaker 2: told you can't have friendships and whether it's men or women,

811
00:47:09,880 --> 00:47:13,640
Speaker 2: and that's such a dangerous, dangerous place to be obviously,

812
00:47:13,960 --> 00:47:17,080
Speaker 2: and this is where we're having this conversation of why

813
00:47:17,200 --> 00:47:19,480
Speaker 2: are we calling is an epidemic? And then we make

814
00:47:19,520 --> 00:47:23,640
Speaker 2: it a joke, and as a feminist who is sarcastic

815
00:47:23,800 --> 00:47:26,480
Speaker 2: and tired of this world, I've also made this as

816
00:47:26,520 --> 00:47:28,520
Speaker 2: a joke of like, what is happening though that he's

817
00:47:28,520 --> 00:47:32,640
Speaker 2: not lonely enough type of thing. But the real problem

818
00:47:32,800 --> 00:47:36,440
Speaker 2: is that we're teaching young boys to not trust anyone.

819
00:47:36,600 --> 00:47:40,399
Speaker 2: So therefore the internalized anger and guilt just comes out

820
00:47:40,400 --> 00:47:42,680
Speaker 2: in violence because that is told that it's the only

821
00:47:42,800 --> 00:47:47,040
Speaker 2: solution for true men is to be violent or volatile,

822
00:47:47,440 --> 00:47:50,759
Speaker 2: which is unfortunate because y'all, there's a lot to have

823
00:47:50,800 --> 00:47:54,160
Speaker 2: a good good night of wine or whatever dreams you want,

824
00:47:54,280 --> 00:47:57,680
Speaker 2: and conversations about things that you hate or love or

825
00:47:57,800 --> 00:48:00,920
Speaker 2: things you cry about or don't cry about. It's so fun.

826
00:48:02,320 --> 00:48:04,680
Speaker 2: Y'all are missing out. This is a part of being human.

827
00:48:05,680 --> 00:48:14,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I noticed this growing up where I felt

828
00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:16,239
Speaker 1: like I had a really good group of friends and

829
00:48:16,280 --> 00:48:22,160
Speaker 1: my brothers didn't. Like my brothers had almost bullies, yes,

830
00:48:22,440 --> 00:48:27,960
Speaker 1: as friends.

831
00:48:25,520 --> 00:48:27,719
Speaker 2: Or they were the bullies, Like the entire time they

832
00:48:27,719 --> 00:48:29,880
Speaker 2: were doing jokes, are like prays on each other that

833
00:48:29,880 --> 00:48:35,359
Speaker 2: would really violent, like humiliating. I'm like, why is this

834
00:48:36,640 --> 00:48:39,400
Speaker 2: y'all's friendship? This is really odd.

835
00:48:40,160 --> 00:48:43,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, I saw that too, And they would tell me

836
00:48:43,160 --> 00:48:47,800
Speaker 1: about it, and I'm like, that's not your friends, that's.

837
00:48:47,440 --> 00:48:49,000
Speaker 2: And they would tell me like, you don't get it,

838
00:48:49,040 --> 00:48:51,000
Speaker 2: you're so sensitive, You're just a girl.

839
00:48:51,080 --> 00:48:55,959
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm I'm a girl with friendships that don't

840
00:48:56,000 --> 00:48:56,399
Speaker 1: do that.

841
00:48:57,320 --> 00:49:02,880
Speaker 2: But I trust. But that's the thing. This is that

842
00:49:02,960 --> 00:49:05,960
Speaker 2: conversation that we need to have more of again about

843
00:49:05,960 --> 00:49:09,360
Speaker 2: that childhood level of understanding. That is okay, this is

844
00:49:09,360 --> 00:49:12,840
Speaker 2: what happens when we have this gender difference in gendered

845
00:49:12,880 --> 00:49:15,799
Speaker 2: makeup in childhood and we say boys need to be

846
00:49:15,800 --> 00:49:17,840
Speaker 2: with boys, boys will be boys, girls need to be

847
00:49:17,880 --> 00:49:20,120
Speaker 2: with girls, and this is your stereotype, and this is

848
00:49:20,160 --> 00:49:22,440
Speaker 2: your stereotype. Make sure you stay in this, and then

849
00:49:22,440 --> 00:49:23,640
Speaker 2: we have a lot of frustration.

850
00:49:25,920 --> 00:49:30,480
Speaker 1: Yep, I'll say it before I've said it before, I'll

851
00:49:30,480 --> 00:49:34,759
Speaker 1: say it again, adolescence that the whole show is about this.

852
00:49:35,000 --> 00:49:38,480
Speaker 2: Hey, they got a lot of awards, So.

853
00:49:37,520 --> 00:49:41,680
Speaker 1: The whole show is about how he doesn't have He

854
00:49:41,800 --> 00:49:44,640
Speaker 1: has friends, but they're not really good friends. He doesn't

855
00:49:44,680 --> 00:49:48,600
Speaker 1: have any friends who are girls, and he's online all

856
00:49:48,640 --> 00:49:48,959
Speaker 1: the time.

857
00:49:50,000 --> 00:49:53,280
Speaker 2: I mean, this is that would be exactly. I guess

858
00:49:53,320 --> 00:49:57,480
Speaker 2: it just feels too dark, but I probably should watch it.

859
00:49:57,480 --> 00:50:02,040
Speaker 1: It's very dark, but it has a fun thing. I

860
00:50:02,040 --> 00:50:04,200
Speaker 1: shouldn't phrase it that way because it's so much talent.

861
00:50:04,280 --> 00:50:07,640
Speaker 1: It's amazing. Everything is in one shot. Every episode's in

862
00:50:07,640 --> 00:50:09,960
Speaker 1: one shot, so it's very visually interesting.

863
00:50:10,080 --> 00:50:14,680
Speaker 2: It's very like, all right, I'll work myself up to it.

864
00:50:14,680 --> 00:50:17,000
Speaker 1: It's okay if you don't, but I'll tell you all

865
00:50:17,000 --> 00:50:17,520
Speaker 1: about it.

866
00:50:18,640 --> 00:50:21,560
Speaker 2: With all of that, with that happening, and then that's BLib.

867
00:50:21,640 --> 00:50:25,400
Speaker 2: We should talk about how technology has influenced friendships.

868
00:50:25,920 --> 00:50:28,120
Speaker 1: Yes, and this is also another one. I think we

869
00:50:28,120 --> 00:50:32,719
Speaker 1: should come back and go more into depth because I

870
00:50:32,719 --> 00:50:36,120
Speaker 1: didn't get to go into There are now a lot

871
00:50:36,120 --> 00:50:39,719
Speaker 1: of dating dating apps for friends, putting.

872
00:50:39,520 --> 00:50:43,360
Speaker 2: Clotes, y'all, she's putting clothes. You're saying it, but you

873
00:50:43,400 --> 00:50:45,160
Speaker 2: don't see They don't see it yet.

874
00:50:45,800 --> 00:50:48,600
Speaker 1: I've heard there's a quote voice and I'm trying to

875
00:50:48,640 --> 00:50:52,600
Speaker 1: do it, but I think so. But anyway, Yeah, there

876
00:50:52,600 --> 00:50:55,960
Speaker 1: are apps for making friends and even best friends, like

877
00:50:56,120 --> 00:50:59,360
Speaker 1: the bumble b f f app. It was really fun

878
00:51:00,840 --> 00:51:04,520
Speaker 1: reading accounts from people who have used these apps who

879
00:51:04,520 --> 00:51:06,359
Speaker 1: were like, well, that one didn't work out. I could

880
00:51:06,400 --> 00:51:08,680
Speaker 1: tell we weren't compatible, but it was for a friendship.

881
00:51:10,360 --> 00:51:13,040
Speaker 1: So that's something we're going to have to come back

882
00:51:13,080 --> 00:51:16,000
Speaker 1: and talk to because I actually got consumed by this

883
00:51:16,120 --> 00:51:22,680
Speaker 1: other aspect that has impacted my friendships, I have to say. So.

884
00:51:22,719 --> 00:51:25,799
Speaker 1: The pandemic really highlighted just how important tech can be

885
00:51:25,880 --> 00:51:30,600
Speaker 1: for maintaining friendships. I am assuming most of you downloaded

886
00:51:30,680 --> 00:51:34,520
Speaker 1: so many different apps and browser extensions during the pandemic.

887
00:51:34,600 --> 00:51:38,080
Speaker 1: To keep in touch with people. But one thing I've

888
00:51:38,120 --> 00:51:40,680
Speaker 1: noticed in my friendships that can cause some tension is

889
00:51:40,880 --> 00:51:47,959
Speaker 1: texting and texting habits. Does someone never text back oh no?

890
00:51:48,480 --> 00:51:52,160
Speaker 1: Or did they never text at all? If you're trying

891
00:51:52,200 --> 00:51:54,759
Speaker 1: to make plans and they never respond, what do you do?

892
00:51:55,239 --> 00:51:59,800
Speaker 1: Oh no? I have a friend that says no response

893
00:51:59,840 --> 00:52:04,239
Speaker 1: to the response, the response being no. But if that's

894
00:52:04,280 --> 00:52:06,640
Speaker 1: the case, then we need to establish a timeline.

895
00:52:06,719 --> 00:52:09,640
Speaker 2: Okay, my response is me, I'm thinking on.

896
00:52:09,680 --> 00:52:14,239
Speaker 1: It, which is fair. I do that too. But if

897
00:52:14,239 --> 00:52:17,440
Speaker 1: you're if the no, if the non response is no,

898
00:52:17,640 --> 00:52:22,240
Speaker 1: when can I accept it as a no? Because sometimes

899
00:52:22,320 --> 00:52:24,440
Speaker 1: I've done that and then later they'll they'll text me

900
00:52:24,480 --> 00:52:25,719
Speaker 1: and be like I want to go, and I'm like,

901
00:52:25,760 --> 00:52:27,399
Speaker 1: well it's sold out and I've already given the ticket

902
00:52:27,440 --> 00:52:29,040
Speaker 1: to someone else, and then they get mad at me.

903
00:52:29,280 --> 00:52:33,360
Speaker 2: Okay, well on them, like that's a fine line. Like

904
00:52:33,400 --> 00:52:36,040
Speaker 2: if you don't respond and it's closing the time and

905
00:52:36,080 --> 00:52:38,000
Speaker 2: you never say let me think about it, or any

906
00:52:38,040 --> 00:52:41,080
Speaker 2: of those situations, then that's on me, Like I because

907
00:52:41,160 --> 00:52:42,960
Speaker 2: I am that one. I am that person who does

908
00:52:43,000 --> 00:52:47,640
Speaker 2: not respond. If I one, if I don't immediately respond,

909
00:52:48,400 --> 00:52:50,239
Speaker 2: you're probably not going to get a response for a

910
00:52:50,280 --> 00:52:55,279
Speaker 2: while because I forgot, or I'm assuming it doesn't have

911
00:52:55,280 --> 00:52:56,600
Speaker 2: anything to do with me, even though I'm in this

912
00:52:56,600 --> 00:53:00,960
Speaker 2: group text. I really hate group text, y'all. Or I'm

913
00:53:01,000 --> 00:53:02,960
Speaker 2: thinking about it and I will let you know, but

914
00:53:03,080 --> 00:53:03,919
Speaker 2: before the time.

915
00:53:05,960 --> 00:53:08,399
Speaker 1: So we should establish a time. Listeners write in what

916
00:53:08,400 --> 00:53:13,080
Speaker 1: what is the acceptable time before? I mean, I guess

917
00:53:13,080 --> 00:53:14,759
Speaker 1: I could. I could text and be like, if you

918
00:53:14,840 --> 00:53:16,280
Speaker 1: haven't responded.

919
00:53:15,840 --> 00:53:18,920
Speaker 2: To me, I do. Yeah, if I've missed having to me,

920
00:53:19,000 --> 00:53:20,720
Speaker 2: I will ask you before I do it.

921
00:53:21,560 --> 00:53:23,759
Speaker 1: Because sometimes it's tickets are on the line and they're

922
00:53:23,760 --> 00:53:25,360
Speaker 1: going to sell it out, so I need to know.

923
00:53:26,320 --> 00:53:30,160
Speaker 1: I need to know. And yes, I have stopped inviting

924
00:53:30,200 --> 00:53:33,680
Speaker 1: people to stuff. If I never hear from you, I

925
00:53:33,719 --> 00:53:37,919
Speaker 1: do stop. Uh, And then I have found out they're

926
00:53:37,960 --> 00:53:43,040
Speaker 1: mad about it, typically through someone else. So I through

927
00:53:43,080 --> 00:53:45,920
Speaker 1: this research. I found an article again. I think it

928
00:53:45,960 --> 00:53:49,520
Speaker 1: was about the childhood, like a motherhood having a kid.

929
00:53:50,320 --> 00:53:52,879
Speaker 1: If you've just texted me and said no, but please

930
00:53:52,880 --> 00:53:54,920
Speaker 1: don't stop inviting me, I would appreciate that.

931
00:53:55,040 --> 00:53:59,160
Speaker 2: Actually I usually will. I'll be like, hey, I'm sorry,

932
00:53:59,480 --> 00:54:02,040
Speaker 2: I know I've an out interverted, don't come out, but

933
00:54:02,200 --> 00:54:03,200
Speaker 2: don't stop inviting me.

934
00:54:04,400 --> 00:54:07,360
Speaker 1: I would be happy, I'd be thrilled. But if you

935
00:54:07,600 --> 00:54:12,920
Speaker 1: never respond, then at a certain point I'm just like, Okay,

936
00:54:14,000 --> 00:54:17,080
Speaker 1: I'm picking up what you're putting down and it's nothing.

937
00:54:18,719 --> 00:54:19,319
Speaker 2: Disappeared.

938
00:54:19,960 --> 00:54:23,160
Speaker 1: Yeah. And in recent years there has been a lot

939
00:54:23,239 --> 00:54:27,480
Speaker 1: written about this and even studies done. The general consensus

940
00:54:27,560 --> 00:54:30,480
Speaker 1: is that a friendship that almost entirely relies on texting

941
00:54:30,600 --> 00:54:33,000
Speaker 1: is still a friendship as long as the exchange is

942
00:54:33,080 --> 00:54:36,919
Speaker 1: valued by all parties, especially when done frequently and when

943
00:54:36,920 --> 00:54:42,120
Speaker 1: you're sharing like mundane life stuff. Many people have also

944
00:54:42,200 --> 00:54:45,360
Speaker 1: reported enjoying it because it's easier. It can help ease

945
00:54:45,440 --> 00:54:49,440
Speaker 1: social anxiety for some. Some people have texting anxiety, and

946
00:54:49,480 --> 00:54:52,440
Speaker 1: there's more time to formulate your response, which I do appreciate.

947
00:54:53,680 --> 00:54:57,279
Speaker 1: It can help maintain otherwise unlikely friendships. I know some

948
00:54:57,320 --> 00:55:01,000
Speaker 1: people who still text people they have seen in person

949
00:55:01,120 --> 00:55:05,840
Speaker 1: for years. Texting has even been cited as potentially easing

950
00:55:05,920 --> 00:55:09,680
Speaker 1: the male friendship crisis and has been scientifically studied for

951
00:55:09,760 --> 00:55:14,360
Speaker 1: its positive benefits, which there are positive benefits. Recent research

952
00:55:14,400 --> 00:55:16,600
Speaker 1: has shown that even a brief check in with a

953
00:55:16,640 --> 00:55:19,520
Speaker 1: friend you haven't contacted it in a while has measurable

954
00:55:19,520 --> 00:55:23,200
Speaker 1: benefits especially if it's unexpected. So while a lot of

955
00:55:23,320 --> 00:55:27,279
Speaker 1: us me hesitate to text it first, science backs up

956
00:55:27,280 --> 00:55:29,879
Speaker 1: the plus size. And this is where I texted two

957
00:55:30,000 --> 00:55:32,160
Speaker 1: people I haven't texted for a while, and I've seen

958
00:55:32,239 --> 00:55:33,800
Speaker 1: both of them this week.

959
00:55:34,560 --> 00:55:41,680
Speaker 2: Wow, I'm loving that this episode has spurred your friendship times,

960
00:55:41,880 --> 00:55:42,920
Speaker 2: face to face times.

961
00:55:43,200 --> 00:55:43,640
Speaker 1: I love it.

962
00:55:43,960 --> 00:55:46,200
Speaker 2: I will say like that for me, that whole level

963
00:55:46,200 --> 00:55:49,640
Speaker 2: of anxiety when you have really smart, witty friends and

964
00:55:49,680 --> 00:55:51,560
Speaker 2: then you're all on a text threat and you're not

965
00:55:51,600 --> 00:55:53,520
Speaker 2: as funny as them or not as quick as them.

966
00:55:53,760 --> 00:55:56,279
Speaker 2: I stop and I Caroline is a part of this

967
00:55:56,360 --> 00:56:00,799
Speaker 2: group and they are so quick witted boom. We used

968
00:56:00,800 --> 00:56:02,520
Speaker 2: to do it on email. They used to do an

969
00:56:02,520 --> 00:56:06,000
Speaker 2: email chain where they would send complaints and gifts. Took

970
00:56:06,040 --> 00:56:07,719
Speaker 2: me forever to figure out how to do gifts, as

971
00:56:07,760 --> 00:56:09,200
Speaker 2: in fact, I don't think I still I still don't

972
00:56:09,200 --> 00:56:11,279
Speaker 2: think I know how to do it on email. And

973
00:56:11,320 --> 00:56:12,920
Speaker 2: so it would just come up as like you know,

974
00:56:13,000 --> 00:56:15,520
Speaker 2: an attachment, yeah, or it would blow up and do

975
00:56:15,680 --> 00:56:18,800
Speaker 2: the whole email. So I was like, I was fearful.

976
00:56:18,800 --> 00:56:21,040
Speaker 2: After that, I'm like, I cannot send, I cannot get

977
00:56:21,040 --> 00:56:24,719
Speaker 2: on par I'm not as funny as them online. I'm

978
00:56:24,760 --> 00:56:28,640
Speaker 2: funny in face to face online not as witty, so

979
00:56:28,840 --> 00:56:32,319
Speaker 2: like for me, that is my anxiety because they're so

980
00:56:32,440 --> 00:56:35,480
Speaker 2: funny and so quick and so like Quippi that I'm like,

981
00:56:36,080 --> 00:56:38,640
Speaker 2: that's funny, and then I move on and it's been

982
00:56:38,840 --> 00:56:42,920
Speaker 2: And also because other people's phones are iPhones and minds

983
00:56:42,920 --> 00:56:45,919
Speaker 2: and Android, they were not combatible for the longest time,

984
00:56:46,160 --> 00:56:49,200
Speaker 2: so sometimes they would not even get my messages, or

985
00:56:49,600 --> 00:56:51,680
Speaker 2: if I was sending us something, they couldn't read it.

986
00:56:51,680 --> 00:56:53,800
Speaker 2: It would just be an X and the same vice versa.

987
00:56:53,840 --> 00:56:56,000
Speaker 2: So it was just frustrating at that point.

988
00:56:56,080 --> 00:57:01,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, that says also caused a rift in some not

989
00:57:01,600 --> 00:57:04,360
Speaker 1: a riff, that's that's a serious term. But it's caused

990
00:57:04,360 --> 00:57:06,319
Speaker 1: a misunderstanding of friendship.

991
00:57:06,000 --> 00:57:07,960
Speaker 2: Group communications for sure.

992
00:57:07,680 --> 00:57:10,359
Speaker 1: Where they're like you never But it turns out it

993
00:57:10,440 --> 00:57:14,280
Speaker 1: was because we had an Apple group and an Android

994
00:57:14,280 --> 00:57:17,120
Speaker 1: group and they weren't getting older's messages.

995
00:57:17,800 --> 00:57:20,640
Speaker 2: I'm telling you what. That market they want you to

996
00:57:20,680 --> 00:57:24,520
Speaker 2: not be friends anymore, and they like, we don't like Android,

997
00:57:24,560 --> 00:57:26,960
Speaker 2: and Android's like, who who's appened?

998
00:57:29,200 --> 00:57:32,400
Speaker 1: That is a thing, and it's it's I've gotten caught

999
00:57:32,480 --> 00:57:34,120
Speaker 1: up in it before, where I'm like, is this friend

1000
00:57:34,160 --> 00:57:37,080
Speaker 1: mad at me, she hates me. Everything is ruined, and

1001
00:57:37,160 --> 00:57:39,120
Speaker 1: I try to look into That's one of the first

1002
00:57:39,120 --> 00:57:42,680
Speaker 1: things I check. Is there a problem with the compatibility

1003
00:57:43,080 --> 00:57:46,760
Speaker 1: of right now the text messages between Apple and Android.

1004
00:57:47,520 --> 00:58:02,200
Speaker 1: Sometimes it is, sometimes it has been. So all of

1005
00:58:02,240 --> 00:58:05,560
Speaker 1: those positive things being said, there are some things to

1006
00:58:05,640 --> 00:58:08,880
Speaker 1: watch out for. One is generally try to be present

1007
00:58:08,920 --> 00:58:10,920
Speaker 1: with the people you're with. So if you're hanging out

1008
00:58:10,960 --> 00:58:13,360
Speaker 1: with someone in person and it isn't one of those

1009
00:58:13,800 --> 00:58:17,160
Speaker 1: we're gonna chill and do our own thing hangs, then

1010
00:58:17,400 --> 00:58:20,320
Speaker 1: hang out with them and try not to text someone

1011
00:58:20,440 --> 00:58:24,480
Speaker 1: else so much. This is a huge pet peeve of mine.

1012
00:58:24,520 --> 00:58:28,160
Speaker 1: I hate it. It makes me wonder why I'm there

1013
00:58:28,240 --> 00:58:31,320
Speaker 1: at all, Like I could be doing something else instead

1014
00:58:31,360 --> 00:58:34,800
Speaker 1: I'm at a dinner table and you're texting someone else.

1015
00:58:34,880 --> 00:58:36,280
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1016
00:58:36,560 --> 00:58:38,880
Speaker 1: No, But if you're just hanging out and you've kind

1017
00:58:38,920 --> 00:58:41,320
Speaker 1: of established like, yeah, I'm just gonna do my own thing,

1018
00:58:41,360 --> 00:58:44,200
Speaker 1: you do your own thing, that's its own. But if

1019
00:58:44,240 --> 00:58:46,920
Speaker 1: I have made plans and we've gone to a place

1020
00:58:47,160 --> 00:58:51,120
Speaker 1: and that's what happens, no, I hate that. I hate it.

1021
00:58:51,880 --> 00:58:55,640
Speaker 1: Not news to anyone, but some emotional nuances can get

1022
00:58:55,680 --> 00:59:01,280
Speaker 1: lost in text emojis, gifts or not. This can lead

1023
00:59:01,320 --> 00:59:05,760
Speaker 1: to some misunderstandings. I have a friend whose messages read

1024
00:59:05,920 --> 00:59:12,040
Speaker 1: is so terse. I'm always like, is she mad? But

1025
00:59:12,160 --> 00:59:14,640
Speaker 1: then I saw her texting in action and she does

1026
00:59:14,680 --> 00:59:16,840
Speaker 1: a lot of it through voice to text in her car,

1027
00:59:16,920 --> 00:59:18,880
Speaker 1: and I'm like, got it.

1028
00:59:20,600 --> 00:59:24,320
Speaker 2: I'm also very abrupt, like I don't need I just

1029
00:59:24,520 --> 00:59:27,440
Speaker 2: like yes, no, and I don't mean it. But that

1030
00:59:27,520 --> 00:59:29,920
Speaker 2: was just the I'm not trying to be abrupt. I'm

1031
00:59:29,960 --> 00:59:32,720
Speaker 2: just like yeah, yeah, okay, fine.

1032
00:59:33,040 --> 00:59:35,080
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I've had to I've had to learn this

1033
00:59:35,120 --> 00:59:39,160
Speaker 1: with you. I feel confident no, no, I feel confident

1034
00:59:39,160 --> 00:59:41,240
Speaker 1: in our friendship where I'm like no, I get her

1035
00:59:41,600 --> 00:59:45,280
Speaker 1: and you respond if I'm like asking you, I want

1036
00:59:45,280 --> 00:59:53,880
Speaker 1: to do this, You're pretty good at like okay, yes, yeah, I.

1037
00:59:53,800 --> 00:59:56,680
Speaker 2: Don't respond with gifts. But eventually it also is partially

1038
00:59:57,000 --> 00:59:58,800
Speaker 2: someone has to end this. I'm a stuff.

1039
01:00:00,880 --> 01:00:01,480
Speaker 1: It's all good.

1040
01:00:01,520 --> 01:00:03,400
Speaker 2: I've thought that before all, not just not with you

1041
01:00:03,600 --> 01:00:05,160
Speaker 2: in general. But it goes back to four of the

1042
01:00:05,280 --> 01:00:06,560
Speaker 2: like you hang up, no, you hang up.

1043
01:00:06,640 --> 01:00:06,840
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1044
01:00:06,960 --> 01:00:08,640
Speaker 2: It feels like with a text there's no nothing, so

1045
01:00:08,640 --> 01:00:10,120
Speaker 2: i'mike I'm done.

1046
01:00:10,600 --> 01:00:13,760
Speaker 1: Someone does have to end it. I agree, I don't

1047
01:00:13,760 --> 01:00:16,920
Speaker 1: think you're wrong. It is usually me sorry, yeah, no,

1048
01:00:16,960 --> 01:00:21,280
Speaker 1: it's okay, it's okay, thank you. I love it too.

1049
01:00:22,280 --> 01:00:25,480
Speaker 1: Speaking of the male friendship crisis, as beneficial as texting

1050
01:00:25,520 --> 01:00:28,400
Speaker 1: can be for men, other articles highlighted how men aren't

1051
01:00:28,400 --> 01:00:32,920
Speaker 1: the best at texting back, not just men. To be clear,

1052
01:00:33,080 --> 01:00:37,160
Speaker 1: most notoriously bad textures in my group are women. But

1053
01:00:37,280 --> 01:00:39,280
Speaker 1: I also have more women friends that have men friends.

1054
01:00:39,320 --> 01:00:43,760
Speaker 1: So being worried about being too available or enthusiastic, so

1055
01:00:43,880 --> 01:00:46,120
Speaker 1: waiting to respond to a group text because you don't

1056
01:00:46,120 --> 01:00:48,439
Speaker 1: want to be the first one to say yes, even

1057
01:00:48,440 --> 01:00:50,840
Speaker 1: if you're excited and want to go. I run into

1058
01:00:50,840 --> 01:00:52,760
Speaker 1: this all the time, or I'm like, I have my answer.

1059
01:00:53,080 --> 01:00:54,400
Speaker 1: I don't know if I want to be the first

1060
01:00:54,440 --> 01:00:56,000
Speaker 1: one to respond, though.

1061
01:00:57,280 --> 01:01:00,000
Speaker 2: I'm more of the opposite of like, who's gonna say

1062
01:01:00,200 --> 01:01:04,080
Speaker 2: no first? I can't be too eager to say no,

1063
01:01:06,360 --> 01:01:07,320
Speaker 2: you know, But.

1064
01:01:07,360 --> 01:01:10,040
Speaker 1: To be honest again, if you just like were up

1065
01:01:10,040 --> 01:01:12,480
Speaker 1: front and told me no, I'd be like, okay, it's

1066
01:01:12,560 --> 01:01:15,320
Speaker 1: the non response that really goods.

1067
01:01:15,360 --> 01:01:17,600
Speaker 2: But the thing about that is, and I'm gonna put

1068
01:01:17,600 --> 01:01:21,080
Speaker 2: this out here, I know that my moods change, so

1069
01:01:21,120 --> 01:01:23,280
Speaker 2: I don't want to respond till it's closer to time

1070
01:01:23,480 --> 01:01:26,280
Speaker 2: to know how I feel, because it might change. I

1071
01:01:26,360 --> 01:01:29,080
Speaker 2: might be ready to go. I'm so roaring, let's do this.

1072
01:01:29,080 --> 01:01:30,840
Speaker 2: This is the one time a year I'll stay past

1073
01:01:30,840 --> 01:01:34,040
Speaker 2: eleven PM. But I don't know about it until that

1074
01:01:34,200 --> 01:01:37,160
Speaker 2: closer time. I don't want to change my mind.

1075
01:01:37,440 --> 01:01:40,680
Speaker 1: Oh, I get you. I also I have what I

1076
01:01:41,000 --> 01:01:46,920
Speaker 1: would say, enthusiastic Annie and depressed Annie. Neither of them

1077
01:01:46,920 --> 01:01:51,200
Speaker 1: should be answering the text immediately. I need a more

1078
01:01:51,240 --> 01:01:55,640
Speaker 1: stable one to be like, Okay, I am not I'm

1079
01:01:55,680 --> 01:01:57,960
Speaker 1: in a good place, and yes I want to go. No,

1080
01:01:58,040 --> 01:02:00,760
Speaker 1: I don't want to go because, yeah, husiastic me, you

1081
01:02:00,840 --> 01:02:03,080
Speaker 1: might screw me over depress me.

1082
01:02:03,120 --> 01:02:06,640
Speaker 2: Exactly exactly both both of those things. And I feel

1083
01:02:06,640 --> 01:02:09,000
Speaker 2: like I'm being very defensive in this category and I

1084
01:02:09,040 --> 01:02:09,760
Speaker 2: did my friends.

1085
01:02:09,840 --> 01:02:14,360
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, this is all about you, Samantha. I just

1086
01:02:14,400 --> 01:02:20,680
Speaker 1: wanted to confront you. I come to you. There are

1087
01:02:21,320 --> 01:02:23,800
Speaker 1: tips online about how to keep friendships healthy if you're

1088
01:02:23,800 --> 01:02:28,600
Speaker 1: a bad Texter me Samantha or our friends with a

1089
01:02:28,680 --> 01:02:32,840
Speaker 1: bad Texter. And there are also people like my previously

1090
01:02:32,880 --> 01:02:36,960
Speaker 1: mentioned friend who have a very strong opinion about not

1091
01:02:37,080 --> 01:02:40,320
Speaker 1: responding being Okay, they don't think it's a problem. There's

1092
01:02:40,360 --> 01:02:44,360
Speaker 1: also some handwringing about digital friendships in general, but a

1093
01:02:44,400 --> 01:02:47,040
Speaker 1: lot of it feels really outdated. A lot of the

1094
01:02:47,040 --> 01:02:49,000
Speaker 1: stuff I was reading about it felt really outdated. I

1095
01:02:49,080 --> 01:02:53,200
Speaker 1: was like, it's like a chat one. They were basically

1096
01:02:53,280 --> 01:02:57,080
Speaker 1: just like, this isn't real. And I feel like you

1097
01:02:57,120 --> 01:03:00,439
Speaker 1: can have a good friend that you interact through through

1098
01:03:00,560 --> 01:03:05,320
Speaker 1: digitally and it's real. It's a good friend. Yeah. Yeah,

1099
01:03:05,480 --> 01:03:06,840
Speaker 1: but I feel like a lot of it was out

1100
01:03:07,480 --> 01:03:09,120
Speaker 1: If you want to look up those tips, you can

1101
01:03:09,160 --> 01:03:10,760
Speaker 1: find them online. I'm not going to go overrom but

1102
01:03:11,880 --> 01:03:15,919
Speaker 1: they exist all right, and very briefly, to wrap this up,

1103
01:03:16,320 --> 01:03:20,560
Speaker 1: childhood friendships to adult friendships, which I have some experience

1104
01:03:20,600 --> 01:03:20,880
Speaker 1: with you.

1105
01:03:22,480 --> 01:03:27,640
Speaker 2: I have one remaining from your held second grade.

1106
01:03:27,960 --> 01:03:32,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, mine is generally I would say we solidified in

1107
01:03:32,360 --> 01:03:35,800
Speaker 1: middle school, but we still we hang out every year,

1108
01:03:35,920 --> 01:03:39,640
Speaker 1: We text each other pretty often. When it comes to

1109
01:03:39,880 --> 01:03:43,600
Speaker 1: keeping childhood friendships into adulthood, one of the biggest factors

1110
01:03:43,800 --> 01:03:47,320
Speaker 1: is that thing proximity that we've been talking about. According

1111
01:03:47,320 --> 01:03:51,520
Speaker 1: to the American Survey Society quote, childhood friendships are ubiquitous

1112
01:03:51,600 --> 01:03:54,640
Speaker 1: among the public. Two thirds of Americans say they have

1113
01:03:54,680 --> 01:03:57,520
Speaker 1: a friend whom they have known since childhood. Yet, despite

1114
01:03:57,520 --> 01:04:00,480
Speaker 1: the prevalence of these types of friendships, they have become

1115
01:04:00,600 --> 01:04:04,080
Speaker 1: less common as Americans age. More than three quarters of

1116
01:04:04,120 --> 01:04:06,920
Speaker 1: young adults have a childhood friend, compared to sixty percent

1117
01:04:06,960 --> 01:04:11,560
Speaker 1: of seniors. Childhood friendships are particularly prevalent among Black Americans.

1118
01:04:12,000 --> 01:04:15,160
Speaker 1: Nearly eight and ten Black Americans report having a friend

1119
01:04:15,160 --> 01:04:18,320
Speaker 1: whom they have known since childhood. These types of friendships

1120
01:04:18,360 --> 01:04:23,880
Speaker 1: are significantly less common among white and Hispanic Americans. I

1121
01:04:23,960 --> 01:04:26,520
Speaker 1: was kind of surprised to read. I don't know why.

1122
01:04:26,520 --> 01:04:28,520
Speaker 1: I thought they were rarer than all that.

1123
01:04:29,240 --> 01:04:31,960
Speaker 2: I wonder again, like you have the one and I'm

1124
01:04:32,000 --> 01:04:34,960
Speaker 2: wondering how many are reconnected because I really feel like

1125
01:04:35,080 --> 01:04:39,320
Speaker 2: Facebook really brought on a new era of connecting. So

1126
01:04:39,400 --> 01:04:41,840
Speaker 2: when Facebook first came out, that was the whole thing,

1127
01:04:42,040 --> 01:04:44,680
Speaker 2: was going to see what happened to your school mats

1128
01:04:44,760 --> 01:04:47,400
Speaker 2: or your college friends, like that was the intent MySpace

1129
01:04:47,440 --> 01:04:49,840
Speaker 2: even but Facebook was the big one. I feel like

1130
01:04:49,880 --> 01:04:52,440
Speaker 2: my Space was different and I think it came out

1131
01:04:52,680 --> 01:04:54,840
Speaker 2: did it come after Facebook?

1132
01:04:55,480 --> 01:04:57,800
Speaker 1: I feel like my Space was first, but I'm sure

1133
01:04:57,840 --> 01:04:58,440
Speaker 1: I can't remember.

1134
01:04:58,440 --> 01:05:02,240
Speaker 2: But for some reason, because Facebook really was the Twitter

1135
01:05:02,480 --> 01:05:05,720
Speaker 2: of that time, you just did status where you didn't

1136
01:05:05,720 --> 01:05:07,200
Speaker 2: even tell you where you were, I think, but you

1137
01:05:07,240 --> 01:05:09,960
Speaker 2: had to be a part of college. That was it

1138
01:05:10,000 --> 01:05:13,320
Speaker 2: was a college associated group. When the kids are like, what,

1139
01:05:14,040 --> 01:05:17,680
Speaker 2: it's just a misinformation machine now, Well, once upon a

1140
01:05:17,720 --> 01:05:21,440
Speaker 2: time it was about connecting two different groups within colleges.

1141
01:05:21,480 --> 01:05:24,080
Speaker 2: So uga like grads, you had to be in college.

1142
01:05:24,080 --> 01:05:26,280
Speaker 2: You had to show what school you were with when

1143
01:05:26,320 --> 01:05:30,240
Speaker 2: it first happened, and I remember it really connected to

1144
01:05:30,720 --> 01:05:34,160
Speaker 2: all of my high school, middle school people and going

1145
01:05:34,240 --> 01:05:37,320
Speaker 2: back to trying to find people reconnecting, which by the way,

1146
01:05:37,360 --> 01:05:41,080
Speaker 2: is a whole joke by the way in uh thirty

1147
01:05:41,160 --> 01:05:44,040
Speaker 2: rock about that sites like that are only used to

1148
01:05:44,160 --> 01:05:46,920
Speaker 2: reconnect or hook up with your crushes from high school

1149
01:05:47,440 --> 01:05:49,920
Speaker 2: type of thing, which was funny, but like it really did.

1150
01:05:50,080 --> 01:05:52,720
Speaker 2: You kind of went and checked and that opened up

1151
01:05:52,920 --> 01:05:55,320
Speaker 2: seeing childhood friends which you may have last lost touch with,

1152
01:05:55,400 --> 01:05:57,280
Speaker 2: especially if you went to different colleges and moved on.

1153
01:05:58,200 --> 01:06:01,280
Speaker 2: What that looked like. And I wonder how many of

1154
01:06:01,320 --> 01:06:04,320
Speaker 2: these friendships may be based on reconnecting.

1155
01:06:05,920 --> 01:06:11,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a good point. Uh. Any listeners write in

1156
01:06:11,760 --> 01:06:16,680
Speaker 1: if you have that, I've the friend group I'm thinking of.

1157
01:06:16,920 --> 01:06:23,360
Speaker 1: We mostly stayed in touched. We didn't connect over Facebook

1158
01:06:24,200 --> 01:06:27,400
Speaker 1: like reconnect, but that makes a lot of sense.

1159
01:06:27,880 --> 01:06:30,440
Speaker 2: So my friend and I, he and I have been

1160
01:06:30,440 --> 01:06:33,840
Speaker 2: friends for a long time. We were in the same area,

1161
01:06:33,920 --> 01:06:36,400
Speaker 2: so we often saw each other and then just kept

1162
01:06:36,400 --> 01:06:39,000
Speaker 2: being connected because I think we both were like minded

1163
01:06:39,040 --> 01:06:42,320
Speaker 2: and saw how people were changing and through Facebook as well,

1164
01:06:42,600 --> 01:06:45,480
Speaker 2: and that kept us connect because like, we're like another

1165
01:06:45,600 --> 01:06:48,720
Speaker 2: person like me that's different from this group of people,

1166
01:06:48,960 --> 01:06:52,160
Speaker 2: and it was nice to see. And then his partner,

1167
01:06:52,200 --> 01:06:55,600
Speaker 2: who I like very much, really loved our friendship and

1168
01:06:55,640 --> 01:07:00,000
Speaker 2: for her to see that, it like encouraged She encouraged

1169
01:07:00,200 --> 01:07:02,040
Speaker 2: him to keep more connected with me, and he was

1170
01:07:02,160 --> 01:07:04,400
Speaker 2: like me, like, I love every time they come through

1171
01:07:04,760 --> 01:07:07,640
Speaker 2: we see each other, but like, yeah, like we weren't

1172
01:07:07,720 --> 01:07:10,120
Speaker 2: necessarily because I don't even think they he was ever

1173
01:07:10,200 --> 01:07:14,640
Speaker 2: on Facebook. I've been thinking about it, but like we

1174
01:07:14,640 --> 01:07:17,160
Speaker 2: were outside of that, but there was another person. We

1175
01:07:17,240 --> 01:07:19,920
Speaker 2: never hung out, but we would reconnected through messages and

1176
01:07:19,960 --> 01:07:21,360
Speaker 2: be like, oh my god, again, you and I are

1177
01:07:21,440 --> 01:07:23,960
Speaker 2: like minded. What everybody else is this though it was

1178
01:07:24,080 --> 01:07:26,720
Speaker 2: it's nice to see, but it's hard to keep it.

1179
01:07:27,040 --> 01:07:28,480
Speaker 2: But because if we only see each other a couple

1180
01:07:28,480 --> 01:07:29,080
Speaker 2: of times a year.

1181
01:07:29,520 --> 01:07:34,120
Speaker 1: If that, yeah, Well, it's also interesting you say that

1182
01:07:34,200 --> 01:07:36,480
Speaker 1: because my mom, when I was talking about how she

1183
01:07:38,240 --> 01:07:42,800
Speaker 1: after my dad died, test like found friends or reconnected

1184
01:07:42,800 --> 01:07:45,439
Speaker 1: with friends. She doesn't have Facebook, but she did reach out.

1185
01:07:45,480 --> 01:07:51,760
Speaker 1: She somehow found like her high school friends and got

1186
01:07:51,800 --> 01:07:54,040
Speaker 1: back with them. So it wasn't like they had been

1187
01:07:56,000 --> 01:08:01,880
Speaker 1: talking to each other anything for years that she reached

1188
01:08:01,920 --> 01:08:04,680
Speaker 1: out and now they hang out a couple times a year,

1189
01:08:04,800 --> 01:08:10,400
Speaker 1: And I'm like, okay, yeah, yeah, I would say if

1190
01:08:10,440 --> 01:08:13,640
Speaker 1: your general values and path on life are compatible, that

1191
01:08:13,800 --> 01:08:18,040
Speaker 1: is one way you're going to keep your childhood friends.

1192
01:08:18,840 --> 01:08:23,439
Speaker 1: Studies show that childhood trauma and friendship fights during that

1193
01:08:23,479 --> 01:08:26,479
Speaker 1: time period of childhood can be hard to let go of,

1194
01:08:26,560 --> 01:08:30,040
Speaker 1: which means that it can be difficult to keep that

1195
01:08:30,160 --> 01:08:35,120
Speaker 1: childhood friend. But if you can, and if as adults

1196
01:08:35,120 --> 01:08:38,719
Speaker 1: you're still combatible friends as in your support of friends,

1197
01:08:39,400 --> 01:08:43,200
Speaker 1: these friendships can be incredibly valuable and rewarding. You basically

1198
01:08:43,400 --> 01:08:48,960
Speaker 1: have an entire friend elect and all of these Yeah,

1199
01:08:49,000 --> 01:08:51,200
Speaker 1: you have all of these memories, you have all of

1200
01:08:51,240 --> 01:08:55,120
Speaker 1: these things. That being said, if a relationship is toxic,

1201
01:08:55,479 --> 01:09:00,360
Speaker 1: don't exhaust yourself fighting for it. Just don't do it different.

1202
01:09:00,800 --> 01:09:03,880
Speaker 1: That's a different episode. Yeah, but I feel like a

1203
01:09:03,880 --> 01:09:06,639
Speaker 1: lot of us have been told like you need if

1204
01:09:06,680 --> 01:09:10,439
Speaker 1: you fail this childhood friendship, your failure. If you failed,

1205
01:09:11,280 --> 01:09:14,160
Speaker 1: it's not if if it's not working, it's not working.

1206
01:09:14,400 --> 01:09:15,800
Speaker 2: It's changes happen.

1207
01:09:16,040 --> 01:09:20,839
Speaker 1: Changes happen, and life is short. And I think being

1208
01:09:21,800 --> 01:09:24,240
Speaker 1: intentional with your friends is great. I think being like

1209
01:09:25,320 --> 01:09:29,240
Speaker 1: be okay, this is not for me anymore. Uh, and

1210
01:09:29,520 --> 01:09:31,960
Speaker 1: yeah it with my childhood friend group, we do try

1211
01:09:31,960 --> 01:09:34,840
Speaker 1: to do too, one or two trips a year where

1212
01:09:34,840 --> 01:09:36,639
Speaker 1: we catch up with each other and then random things

1213
01:09:36,640 --> 01:09:38,599
Speaker 1: in between. But it is that thing we've been talking

1214
01:09:38,600 --> 01:09:41,479
Speaker 1: about where we might not see each other that often,

1215
01:09:41,520 --> 01:09:45,280
Speaker 1: but when we do, it feels like, oh, hasn't been

1216
01:09:45,280 --> 01:09:51,479
Speaker 1: that long at all. We just connect, So, oh my goodness.

1217
01:09:51,479 --> 01:09:54,000
Speaker 1: We had a lot to say about friendships.

1218
01:09:53,439 --> 01:09:55,120
Speaker 2: Yes, and we have a lot more to say, but

1219
01:09:55,160 --> 01:09:57,479
Speaker 2: we're going to do this on a different episode because

1220
01:09:57,479 --> 01:10:03,080
Speaker 2: we unexpectedly, kind expectedly ended up saying a lot. Because

1221
01:10:03,160 --> 01:10:05,599
Speaker 2: there's a lot to be said when it comes to friendship,

1222
01:10:05,640 --> 01:10:07,719
Speaker 2: and it's why it's so important. We haven't even talked

1223
01:10:07,720 --> 01:10:09,600
Speaker 2: about that, more like we didn't talk about any of

1224
01:10:09,600 --> 01:10:11,720
Speaker 2: the benefits, but we have talked about some of the

1225
01:10:11,720 --> 01:10:15,240
Speaker 2: detriments of not having good friendships, and I think that's

1226
01:10:15,360 --> 01:10:17,280
Speaker 2: part of the reasons that we need to make sure

1227
01:10:18,000 --> 01:10:21,160
Speaker 2: we are encouraging that in our culture.

1228
01:10:23,280 --> 01:10:26,320
Speaker 1: Yes, and I would really love to hear from listeners.

1229
01:10:26,600 --> 01:10:31,599
Speaker 1: During this research, I really was I was motivated to

1230
01:10:31,640 --> 01:10:33,519
Speaker 1: reach out to people, but I also read about a

1231
01:10:33,520 --> 01:10:38,960
Speaker 1: lot of interesting things people do to meet new friends

1232
01:10:39,800 --> 01:10:44,880
Speaker 1: or yeah, just find find new people, and I've I

1233
01:10:44,960 --> 01:10:47,360
Speaker 1: just thought it was so fascinating. So I would love

1234
01:10:47,400 --> 01:10:51,320
Speaker 1: to hear from listeners about any of that. If you

1235
01:10:51,320 --> 01:10:53,599
Speaker 1: would like to contact us, you can. You can email

1236
01:10:53,680 --> 01:10:55,960
Speaker 1: us at Hello at stuff Whenever Told You dot com.

1237
01:10:56,040 --> 01:10:58,000
Speaker 1: You can find us on blue Sky at mom Stuff podcast,

1238
01:10:58,120 --> 01:11:00,519
Speaker 1: or on Instagram and TikTok at stuff will Never Told You.

1239
01:11:00,840 --> 01:11:05,040
Speaker 1: We're also on YouTube. We have new merchandise at Cotton Bureau,

1240
01:11:05,200 --> 01:11:06,800
Speaker 1: and we have a book you can get where we

1241
01:11:06,880 --> 01:11:09,400
Speaker 1: get your books. Thanks as always to our superduced grosine

1242
01:11:09,479 --> 01:11:12,880
Speaker 1: or executive producer My and your contributor Joey. Thank you fan, Yes,

1243
01:11:13,439 --> 01:11:15,880
Speaker 1: and thanks to you for listening. Stuff un Ever Told

1244
01:11:15,880 --> 01:11:17,640
Speaker 1: You is Prediction by Heart Radio. For more podcast from

1245
01:11:17,680 --> 01:11:19,519
Speaker 1: my Heart Radio, you can check out the heart radio app,

1246
01:11:19,520 --> 01:11:22,120
Speaker 1: Apple podcast, or where you listen to your favorite shows.