1 00:00:00,560 --> 00:00:05,360 Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Law with June Grassoe from Bloomberg Radio. 2 00:00:05,720 --> 00:00:09,200 Speaker 1: The Trump administration is seeking an emergency restraining order to 3 00:00:09,280 --> 00:00:12,200 Speaker 1: block the sale of a tell all book by John Bolton, 4 00:00:12,520 --> 00:00:16,560 Speaker 1: President Trump's former national security advisor. The government claims the 5 00:00:16,640 --> 00:00:21,000 Speaker 1: memoir contains classified information and that Bolton never got approval 6 00:00:21,040 --> 00:00:23,959 Speaker 1: to have it published, but excerpts of the book have 7 00:00:24,160 --> 00:00:28,000 Speaker 1: already been published by several major newspapers. Joining me as 8 00:00:28,080 --> 00:00:31,520 Speaker 1: national security lawyer Bradley Moss, a partner at Mark's Eight. 9 00:00:31,880 --> 00:00:37,280 Speaker 1: The Department of Justice sought a preliminary injunction last night 10 00:00:37,360 --> 00:00:40,760 Speaker 1: to block publication of the book. Why do they say 11 00:00:40,760 --> 00:00:44,520 Speaker 1: they need this? So? The government's view here is that 12 00:00:44,720 --> 00:00:48,560 Speaker 1: because they believe they're still classified information in this book, 13 00:00:48,920 --> 00:00:52,560 Speaker 1: in the version that is set to be released on Tuesday, 14 00:00:52,800 --> 00:00:55,560 Speaker 1: there is going to be irreparable harm to US national 15 00:00:55,600 --> 00:00:58,240 Speaker 1: security if the book is allowed to actually come out. 16 00:00:58,680 --> 00:01:01,440 Speaker 1: So they're attempting some thing that to my knowledge, they've 17 00:01:01,440 --> 00:01:04,080 Speaker 1: never actually tried to do. They're trying to halt the 18 00:01:04,120 --> 00:01:07,959 Speaker 1: publication not only by getting an injunction against the author, 19 00:01:08,000 --> 00:01:10,920 Speaker 1: who's the person John Boltan who had the security clearance, 20 00:01:11,400 --> 00:01:15,039 Speaker 1: but they're also trying to enjoin the publisher and all 21 00:01:15,080 --> 00:01:18,800 Speaker 1: commercial resellers. They're trying to do it through an obscure 22 00:01:19,000 --> 00:01:22,000 Speaker 1: federal provision that would allow them to basically end run 23 00:01:22,200 --> 00:01:25,840 Speaker 1: around Supreme Court precedent from the Pentagon Papers days in 24 00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:29,680 Speaker 1: terms of a prior restraint. It's the novel argument. It's 25 00:01:29,720 --> 00:01:32,080 Speaker 1: almost certainly going to fail, and it's even if it 26 00:01:32,200 --> 00:01:35,240 Speaker 1: was ordered by the judge and tomorrow's hearing, it's almost 27 00:01:35,280 --> 00:01:38,319 Speaker 1: certainly impractical and not going to be feasible to implement. 28 00:01:38,360 --> 00:01:41,000 Speaker 1: The book is everywhere. When they sued for breach of 29 00:01:41,080 --> 00:01:45,080 Speaker 1: contract on Tuesday, I believe they didn't seek an injunction 30 00:01:45,120 --> 00:01:47,320 Speaker 1: at that point. Why didn't they seek an injunction at 31 00:01:47,360 --> 00:01:51,360 Speaker 1: that point? There will no doubt be some interesting articles 32 00:01:51,360 --> 00:01:53,400 Speaker 1: in the Times, in the Post over the next couple 33 00:01:53,400 --> 00:01:56,080 Speaker 1: of days outlining the TikTok of how this all went down, 34 00:01:56,440 --> 00:01:58,320 Speaker 1: because that was what we all thought at the beginning, 35 00:01:58,360 --> 00:02:00,800 Speaker 1: was that when they didn't file the temper restraining order, 36 00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:04,480 Speaker 1: then that the argument about an injunction that was in 37 00:02:04,480 --> 00:02:06,680 Speaker 1: the lawsuit, which is the throwaway line, that the real 38 00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:08,720 Speaker 1: point of it was that at a breach of contract 39 00:02:08,800 --> 00:02:11,359 Speaker 1: and they want all the monetary proceeds, which was fine 40 00:02:11,880 --> 00:02:14,120 Speaker 1: and it was certainly going to happen anyways. But for 41 00:02:14,160 --> 00:02:16,760 Speaker 1: whatever reason, they were delayed by twenty four or thirty 42 00:02:16,760 --> 00:02:19,480 Speaker 1: six hours whatever it was before they filed for the 43 00:02:19,520 --> 00:02:22,560 Speaker 1: emergency t r oh. And now it's almost kind of 44 00:02:22,600 --> 00:02:24,799 Speaker 1: a situation of one, why do you wait this long? 45 00:02:25,040 --> 00:02:28,880 Speaker 1: To what's the point? They've known for weeks this thing 46 00:02:28,960 --> 00:02:31,240 Speaker 1: is coming out. They could have moved on this weeks 47 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:34,600 Speaker 1: ago if they truly were that concerned. The books everywhere, 48 00:02:34,600 --> 00:02:38,639 Speaker 1: advanced copies are everywhere. You know, it's been shift overseas. 49 00:02:38,720 --> 00:02:41,320 Speaker 1: Probably at this point is sitting with commercial resellers. How 50 00:02:41,360 --> 00:02:44,320 Speaker 1: are you truly going to implement this? And how much 51 00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:48,239 Speaker 1: is this motion just an effort to put Donald trumpety 52 00:02:48,400 --> 00:02:51,600 Speaker 1: that he got abound of flesh. The publishers said that 53 00:02:51,680 --> 00:02:54,880 Speaker 1: they've shipped out hundreds of thousands of copies in this 54 00:02:55,040 --> 00:02:57,960 Speaker 1: country and in the world. Has there ever been a 55 00:02:58,040 --> 00:03:01,359 Speaker 1: case where they've said to the publisher, okay, bring those 56 00:03:01,400 --> 00:03:05,359 Speaker 1: books back from third parties. I'm not aware of there 57 00:03:05,360 --> 00:03:09,040 Speaker 1: ever being a case where they've gotten an order to 58 00:03:09,200 --> 00:03:12,320 Speaker 1: compel a publisher to do that. I'm sure they've asked. 59 00:03:12,400 --> 00:03:14,800 Speaker 1: I know, and I mean they've they've meant, they've mentioned 60 00:03:14,800 --> 00:03:18,280 Speaker 1: it at times to some of our clients that try 61 00:03:18,320 --> 00:03:21,160 Speaker 1: to ask for but it never happens because the client 62 00:03:21,240 --> 00:03:23,280 Speaker 1: no longer has control over the book at that point. 63 00:03:23,280 --> 00:03:26,480 Speaker 1: It's in the control of the publisher. Um. The only 64 00:03:26,520 --> 00:03:29,160 Speaker 1: thing that comes even close was that ten years ago 65 00:03:29,200 --> 00:03:32,600 Speaker 1: the Pemagon literally bought up ten thousand copies of a 66 00:03:32,639 --> 00:03:35,800 Speaker 1: book that had been initially approved and then the last 67 00:03:35,800 --> 00:03:39,760 Speaker 1: minute of approval was rescinded, and so instead of trying to, 68 00:03:39,840 --> 00:03:41,840 Speaker 1: you know, and get an injunction, they literally bought off 69 00:03:41,880 --> 00:03:43,800 Speaker 1: all the copies of the book and just shredded them. 70 00:03:44,160 --> 00:03:46,720 Speaker 1: But that's the closest, you know, example there is to 71 00:03:46,840 --> 00:03:50,040 Speaker 1: what's going on here. This is very much an unprecedented situation. 72 00:03:50,640 --> 00:03:55,080 Speaker 1: Let's go go back a moment. There are conflicting stories 73 00:03:55,680 --> 00:03:59,440 Speaker 1: or explanations of whether or not this book went through 74 00:03:59,720 --> 00:04:03,760 Speaker 1: the view process at the White House. So explain what 75 00:04:04,040 --> 00:04:07,440 Speaker 1: a review process would be like and what you understand 76 00:04:07,480 --> 00:04:10,680 Speaker 1: about what this book went through. Sure, so, the normal 77 00:04:10,720 --> 00:04:13,800 Speaker 1: process that anybody who has held a security clearance with 78 00:04:13,800 --> 00:04:16,480 Speaker 1: the US government, and particularly anybody who has held the 79 00:04:16,600 --> 00:04:19,440 Speaker 1: level of access that someone like John Bolton would have 80 00:04:19,440 --> 00:04:23,120 Speaker 1: had which is access to sensitive compartment and information. Is 81 00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:26,200 Speaker 1: that you draft your manuscript, believe it or not, your 82 00:04:26,320 --> 00:04:28,800 Speaker 1: love and drafted at home on your own computer, even 83 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:30,599 Speaker 1: though later on it has to be submitted for review. 84 00:04:30,680 --> 00:04:32,760 Speaker 1: You drafted on your own computer, and you submit it 85 00:04:32,839 --> 00:04:35,040 Speaker 1: to the agency that held your clearance. You know, in 86 00:04:35,040 --> 00:04:37,880 Speaker 1: this case, because John Bolton was the National Security Advisor, 87 00:04:38,240 --> 00:04:41,480 Speaker 1: he submits it the National Security Council. It goes through 88 00:04:41,480 --> 00:04:44,080 Speaker 1: an administrative review. They read the entire book, they go 89 00:04:44,120 --> 00:04:46,760 Speaker 1: through it line by line. They consult with relevance subject 90 00:04:46,800 --> 00:04:49,720 Speaker 1: matter experts to see what is and is not still 91 00:04:49,760 --> 00:04:53,800 Speaker 1: properly classified. Because the person is no longer a federal employee, 92 00:04:53,800 --> 00:04:56,760 Speaker 1: because John Bolton obviously had left, the only thing that 93 00:04:56,800 --> 00:05:00,400 Speaker 1: can be redacted is properly classified information. Every in else 94 00:05:00,400 --> 00:05:04,000 Speaker 1: that's unclassified doesn't matter if it would implicate the executive privilege, 95 00:05:04,040 --> 00:05:07,080 Speaker 1: anything like that. That cannot be redacted. All that can 96 00:05:07,080 --> 00:05:10,279 Speaker 1: be redacted as class fined information. The agency will respond 97 00:05:10,360 --> 00:05:13,120 Speaker 1: back to the individual. Sometimes they'll say the books ready 98 00:05:13,120 --> 00:05:16,000 Speaker 1: to go, here's your final written approval of the times 99 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:18,040 Speaker 1: they'll come back and say, we have all kinds of 100 00:05:18,040 --> 00:05:21,159 Speaker 1: revisions and edits that need to be made for classified information. 101 00:05:21,640 --> 00:05:24,359 Speaker 1: They'll have meetings with you. Sometimes depends on the situation, 102 00:05:24,400 --> 00:05:27,479 Speaker 1: depends on the circumstances. Sometimes it can take weeks, sometimes 103 00:05:27,480 --> 00:05:30,320 Speaker 1: it can take years. The point is until you get 104 00:05:30,360 --> 00:05:32,600 Speaker 1: to the end, until you have gotten a final approval 105 00:05:32,640 --> 00:05:35,320 Speaker 1: letter in writing from the agency saying your book is 106 00:05:35,360 --> 00:05:38,320 Speaker 1: ready to go, feel free to publish, you have not 107 00:05:38,400 --> 00:05:41,440 Speaker 1: completed the process. John Bolton never got that letter. In 108 00:05:41,480 --> 00:05:44,599 Speaker 1: the breach of contract lawsuit, they say that not only 109 00:05:44,640 --> 00:05:46,880 Speaker 1: didn't you wait for the review process to finish, but 110 00:05:47,000 --> 00:05:51,640 Speaker 1: even before the publication he shared the manuscript. Yes, so 111 00:05:51,720 --> 00:05:53,880 Speaker 1: this whole thing with how he shared the manuscript with 112 00:05:53,920 --> 00:05:57,200 Speaker 1: the lawyers and with the editors and the publisher in advance. 113 00:05:57,839 --> 00:06:01,359 Speaker 1: That happens a lot. We certainly don't advise it in 114 00:06:01,440 --> 00:06:02,920 Speaker 1: terms of we don't ask the client ever give it 115 00:06:02,960 --> 00:06:05,440 Speaker 1: to us for various reasons, but a lot of people 116 00:06:05,480 --> 00:06:08,040 Speaker 1: do that because the guidance that's given to individuals on 117 00:06:08,080 --> 00:06:11,239 Speaker 1: how to do this it's horribly poor and really not clear. 118 00:06:11,279 --> 00:06:14,359 Speaker 1: So people don't know any better, and usually the agencies 119 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:16,640 Speaker 1: don't care. You know, it's that's a risk they just 120 00:06:16,680 --> 00:06:19,240 Speaker 1: assume as part of the realities of life. So long 121 00:06:19,279 --> 00:06:22,479 Speaker 1: as the person ultimately goes through the whole process, gets 122 00:06:22,480 --> 00:06:25,440 Speaker 1: the proper approval in writing from the agency, and only 123 00:06:25,480 --> 00:06:30,000 Speaker 1: publishes that approved version. They kind of dismissed those errors 124 00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:31,960 Speaker 1: in the earlier parts of the process as part of 125 00:06:32,040 --> 00:06:35,400 Speaker 1: reality and assumption of risk in that free society like this. 126 00:06:35,760 --> 00:06:39,679 Speaker 1: But they're allowed here because Bolton didn't get that final 127 00:06:39,680 --> 00:06:42,400 Speaker 1: approval to bring it up to ding him because he 128 00:06:42,480 --> 00:06:46,200 Speaker 1: did what he's not technically supposed to do. So then 129 00:06:46,320 --> 00:06:49,320 Speaker 1: does the Trump administration have a good case against him 130 00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:52,680 Speaker 1: in the breach of contract lawsuit? Yeah, as far as 131 00:06:52,720 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 1: I'm concerned, the breach of contract claimed by the government 132 00:06:55,480 --> 00:06:58,240 Speaker 1: is open and shut. They will win that argument. John 133 00:06:58,279 --> 00:07:00,680 Speaker 1: Bolton is gonna bring up some bad faces and unclean 134 00:07:00,800 --> 00:07:05,680 Speaker 1: hands defenses. They've been tried before another prepublication review cases. 135 00:07:05,920 --> 00:07:09,920 Speaker 1: They always fail. The simple fact is the process wasn't done. 136 00:07:10,280 --> 00:07:12,800 Speaker 1: It doesn't matter what was said to him verbally, doesn't 137 00:07:12,840 --> 00:07:15,800 Speaker 1: matter what reassurances he was given. Until you have the 138 00:07:15,880 --> 00:07:19,000 Speaker 1: final written letter, you have not completed the process, and 139 00:07:19,040 --> 00:07:21,760 Speaker 1: therefore he preached his contract. The government will get all 140 00:07:21,800 --> 00:07:25,400 Speaker 1: financial proceeds. It's been reported that Bolton got a two 141 00:07:25,440 --> 00:07:28,400 Speaker 1: million dollar advance for the book, So would the government 142 00:07:28,440 --> 00:07:31,920 Speaker 1: get that money the book advances something different because that's 143 00:07:32,000 --> 00:07:35,200 Speaker 1: usually given in advance. So assuming that was given as 144 00:07:35,200 --> 00:07:38,360 Speaker 1: an advance, then no, that would be more complicated because 145 00:07:38,360 --> 00:07:41,200 Speaker 1: he presumably already took that to Positans Bank account. It's 146 00:07:41,200 --> 00:07:44,280 Speaker 1: been dispersed various places. I've never seen them go after 147 00:07:44,320 --> 00:07:47,200 Speaker 1: the book advanced. What they will go after is all 148 00:07:47,280 --> 00:07:49,960 Speaker 1: proceeds from the sale of the book. So every time 149 00:07:50,000 --> 00:07:53,280 Speaker 1: someone buys John Bolton's book, the money won't go to him, 150 00:07:53,520 --> 00:07:55,040 Speaker 1: it will go to the U. S. Treasury. If he 151 00:07:55,120 --> 00:07:58,120 Speaker 1: negotiates a TV deal or a movie series based off 152 00:07:58,120 --> 00:08:01,320 Speaker 1: the book, all proceeds from that would go to the U. S. Treasury. 153 00:08:01,640 --> 00:08:06,080 Speaker 1: Bolton's publisher called the request for a preliminary injunction a frivolous, 154 00:08:06,280 --> 00:08:12,360 Speaker 1: politically motivated exercise in futility. You agree with that it's futile, Yeah, yeah, 155 00:08:12,480 --> 00:08:16,280 Speaker 1: I mean reading through that preliminary injunction motion, the first 156 00:08:16,560 --> 00:08:20,040 Speaker 1: twenty five pages are irrelevant because they're all about how 157 00:08:20,120 --> 00:08:23,239 Speaker 1: John Bolton breached and how John Bolton, you know, should 158 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:25,960 Speaker 1: be enjoined. And if I'm the judgment saying that's great, 159 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:29,000 Speaker 1: you can enjoin John Bolton from publishing anything to your 160 00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:31,480 Speaker 1: blue in the face. He's not. He has no control 161 00:08:31,520 --> 00:08:34,319 Speaker 1: over at this point. The control is given to the publisher. 162 00:08:34,720 --> 00:08:37,520 Speaker 1: You didn't suit the publisher, you soon, John Bolton. And 163 00:08:37,559 --> 00:08:40,800 Speaker 1: if you want to impose a prior restraint on on 164 00:08:40,880 --> 00:08:43,839 Speaker 1: the publisher, you have to meet the standards set forth 165 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:46,760 Speaker 1: in the seventies under the Pentagon Papers case. You have 166 00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:52,480 Speaker 1: to demonstrate this overwhelming need, this irreparable harm the national security, 167 00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:55,480 Speaker 1: that the government couldn't do back then. You'd have to 168 00:08:55,520 --> 00:08:58,520 Speaker 1: do it now. And they haven't necessarily made that presentation 169 00:08:58,559 --> 00:09:01,839 Speaker 1: of trying to circumvent it with this obscure federal rule 170 00:09:02,080 --> 00:09:06,640 Speaker 1: rule which I didn't even know existed until yesterday. That's 171 00:09:06,800 --> 00:09:09,920 Speaker 1: not likely going to fly with Judge Lambert. They have 172 00:09:10,040 --> 00:09:14,520 Speaker 1: said that the book is rife with classified information, and 173 00:09:14,720 --> 00:09:18,600 Speaker 1: President Trump said it's highly classified, but he also said 174 00:09:18,760 --> 00:09:23,439 Speaker 1: I will consider every conversation with me as president highly classified. 175 00:09:23,840 --> 00:09:26,320 Speaker 1: Do we know from what's come out so far whether 176 00:09:26,400 --> 00:09:29,640 Speaker 1: this is really classified? I mean, suppose he's talking to 177 00:09:29,880 --> 00:09:34,120 Speaker 1: the Chinese premier. Are all those conversations classified? So as 178 00:09:34,160 --> 00:09:35,880 Speaker 1: you can already see from what's come out in the 179 00:09:35,880 --> 00:09:39,160 Speaker 1: excerpts of what was already approved in the original version 180 00:09:39,360 --> 00:09:42,760 Speaker 1: what the pre publication review folks had already authorized. All 181 00:09:42,840 --> 00:09:45,440 Speaker 1: kinds of conversations Bolton had with the President have not 182 00:09:45,520 --> 00:09:47,920 Speaker 1: been redacted as classified, because that's the president who can 183 00:09:47,920 --> 00:09:49,880 Speaker 1: have his own view of what should be classified, place 184 00:09:49,880 --> 00:09:52,800 Speaker 1: boul in the face unless he's going to personally intervene 185 00:09:52,800 --> 00:09:55,520 Speaker 1: to implement it. That's not the reality of how it works. 186 00:09:55,559 --> 00:09:58,840 Speaker 1: And the security officials who are making these determinations aren't 187 00:09:58,880 --> 00:10:01,000 Speaker 1: adhering to any kind of st like that. They have 188 00:10:01,080 --> 00:10:04,400 Speaker 1: to adhere to the actual executive order. So you know, 189 00:10:04,559 --> 00:10:06,520 Speaker 1: by and large, a lot of what this is going 190 00:10:06,559 --> 00:10:09,120 Speaker 1: to come down to, what the president's tweets is going 191 00:10:09,200 --> 00:10:12,280 Speaker 1: to be irrelevant in the civil case. It might become 192 00:10:12,320 --> 00:10:16,079 Speaker 1: relevant in the criminal case if John Bolton gets indicted, 193 00:10:16,600 --> 00:10:20,679 Speaker 1: because if the President and it tweets keeps identifying particular 194 00:10:21,040 --> 00:10:25,040 Speaker 1: allegations from the book and saying these never happened, it's 195 00:10:25,040 --> 00:10:27,800 Speaker 1: going to undermine any case for the government to say 196 00:10:27,800 --> 00:10:31,199 Speaker 1: it's properly classified, because by and large, this has never 197 00:10:31,200 --> 00:10:34,720 Speaker 1: been litigated, so it's gonna be another unprecedented case. By 198 00:10:34,720 --> 00:10:38,559 Speaker 1: and large, you can't classify knowingly false information. That was 199 00:10:38,600 --> 00:10:40,559 Speaker 1: going to be one of my questions. You got ahead 200 00:10:40,559 --> 00:10:44,200 Speaker 1: of me because I was considering that if it's not true, 201 00:10:44,320 --> 00:10:47,439 Speaker 1: then how can it be exposing a secret. Yes, there's 202 00:10:47,440 --> 00:10:49,480 Speaker 1: an open debate about this, so there's never been a 203 00:10:49,520 --> 00:10:51,680 Speaker 1: case where's ever been litigated on that front. We don't 204 00:10:51,679 --> 00:10:54,760 Speaker 1: actually have any standard on it. There have been situations 205 00:10:54,760 --> 00:10:58,640 Speaker 1: where the agencies have classified works of fiction where the 206 00:10:58,800 --> 00:11:02,120 Speaker 1: entire book is a work of fiction, but particular facts 207 00:11:02,240 --> 00:11:05,319 Speaker 1: came too close to the reality of what something was 208 00:11:05,520 --> 00:11:07,959 Speaker 1: that the author would have known about. Because their clearance 209 00:11:08,040 --> 00:11:11,120 Speaker 1: that they had that they imposed some redactions. But I've 210 00:11:11,160 --> 00:11:14,920 Speaker 1: never heard of them saying they're going to classify as secret, 211 00:11:14,960 --> 00:11:18,679 Speaker 1: top secret whatever a piece of information, you know, describing 212 00:11:18,800 --> 00:11:22,120 Speaker 1: a conversation the president had that they know never happened. 213 00:11:22,640 --> 00:11:24,760 Speaker 1: That doesn't mean they can't try. It would make for 214 00:11:24,880 --> 00:11:28,520 Speaker 1: fascinating case law. I've never seen it happen. Tell us 215 00:11:28,559 --> 00:11:32,040 Speaker 1: about the criminal case against Bolton, I sort of dismissed 216 00:11:32,040 --> 00:11:35,319 Speaker 1: that as overreach. What is the criminal case against him? 217 00:11:35,800 --> 00:11:38,079 Speaker 1: So they can certainly bring a criminal case against him 218 00:11:38,080 --> 00:11:41,480 Speaker 1: for unauthorized disclosures of classified information in the sense that 219 00:11:41,600 --> 00:11:45,079 Speaker 1: the book itself still contains, according to the government, various 220 00:11:45,120 --> 00:11:48,000 Speaker 1: classified information and the book is set to be published 221 00:11:48,000 --> 00:11:50,680 Speaker 1: for the world to buy and see starting on Tuesday. 222 00:11:50,840 --> 00:11:53,679 Speaker 1: That isn't an authorized dissemination of classified information. He held 223 00:11:53,720 --> 00:11:55,840 Speaker 1: the clearance, he put it in the book. They didn't 224 00:11:55,880 --> 00:11:58,160 Speaker 1: get redacted. It's going out to the world. That's the 225 00:11:58,160 --> 00:12:02,080 Speaker 1: criminal charge in the criminal okase. Unlike in the simple case, 226 00:12:02,480 --> 00:12:05,960 Speaker 1: Bolton would have the ability to challenge how the classification 227 00:12:05,960 --> 00:12:08,840 Speaker 1: determinations were made, and he particularly would be able to 228 00:12:08,840 --> 00:12:13,160 Speaker 1: harp on how the internal review initially cleared the book 229 00:12:13,440 --> 00:12:16,880 Speaker 1: and then a higher level of reviewer intervened and overroad 230 00:12:16,960 --> 00:12:20,560 Speaker 1: that internal decision and found additional information to be classified. 231 00:12:20,640 --> 00:12:23,920 Speaker 1: That doesn't mean that that overruling was bad or illegitimate, 232 00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:26,440 Speaker 1: But in a criminal case, John Balton would be able 233 00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:29,160 Speaker 1: to probe into that and try to challenge that and 234 00:12:29,280 --> 00:12:33,360 Speaker 1: challenge the propriety of the classification determination. What do you 235 00:12:33,400 --> 00:12:37,920 Speaker 1: think of his statements about impeachment that Trump did other 236 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:40,960 Speaker 1: things and yet, as I recall, he didn't want to 237 00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:45,440 Speaker 1: testify at the impeachment. Yeah. John Bolton is nobody's hero 238 00:12:45,760 --> 00:12:48,839 Speaker 1: and there is nobody who is happy with John Bolton 239 00:12:48,880 --> 00:12:50,720 Speaker 1: in either way. Neither the left nor the right care 240 00:12:50,720 --> 00:12:52,960 Speaker 1: about John Bolton right now, and a lot of where 241 00:12:53,000 --> 00:12:55,800 Speaker 1: he's describing things saying that you know, the House Democrats 242 00:12:55,880 --> 00:12:58,839 Speaker 1: committed male pactice by not expanding the scope of impeachment. 243 00:12:59,200 --> 00:13:01,800 Speaker 1: The response from Democrats has pretty much been, how the 244 00:13:01,840 --> 00:13:03,440 Speaker 1: heck are we supposed to know about these kinds of 245 00:13:03,480 --> 00:13:06,720 Speaker 1: things because you refuse to testify. We aren't mind readers. 246 00:13:07,080 --> 00:13:10,960 Speaker 1: We rely on people providing testimony, documents, and information. So 247 00:13:11,000 --> 00:13:13,960 Speaker 1: we didn't know about some of these very disturbing allegations 248 00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:15,680 Speaker 1: that are coming out of the book. And again they're 249 00:13:15,720 --> 00:13:18,600 Speaker 1: just allegations. We don't know if this isn't fact true, 250 00:13:18,800 --> 00:13:21,400 Speaker 1: and some of it is speaks more to you know, 251 00:13:21,440 --> 00:13:24,640 Speaker 1: the president being a vile and potentially unethical person but 252 00:13:24,720 --> 00:13:29,080 Speaker 1: not necessarily committing an impeachable offense. Cheering on the premiere 253 00:13:29,120 --> 00:13:34,640 Speaker 1: of China, establishing concentration camp is vile, but not necessarily impeachable. 254 00:13:34,920 --> 00:13:36,520 Speaker 1: You know, that's one of those things where John Bolton 255 00:13:36,559 --> 00:13:38,280 Speaker 1: will not come out of this smelling like Roses. I 256 00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:41,160 Speaker 1: don't think John Bolton cares. He just wanted the story 257 00:13:41,200 --> 00:13:44,560 Speaker 1: told us. He's doing these interviews now where he's saying 258 00:13:44,840 --> 00:13:47,440 Speaker 1: what he said in the book and and amplifying in 259 00:13:47,480 --> 00:13:51,960 Speaker 1: some cases, How does that fit into this whole picture. Well, 260 00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:54,800 Speaker 1: he's doing the media interviews and he's doing this whole 261 00:13:55,000 --> 00:13:58,760 Speaker 1: rollout in anticipation of a potential effort to silence them 262 00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:01,319 Speaker 1: if there is a preliminary are in junction um And 263 00:14:01,400 --> 00:14:03,880 Speaker 1: that's why he's pre taping these various interviews so that 264 00:14:03,960 --> 00:14:06,960 Speaker 1: he no longer has any control over and you know, 265 00:14:07,120 --> 00:14:09,400 Speaker 1: and you can say you can enjoin mutually ends the time. 266 00:14:09,840 --> 00:14:11,960 Speaker 1: I don't have any control over what CBS does, all right, 267 00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:14,079 Speaker 1: don't want to control what ABC does. At this point, 268 00:14:14,320 --> 00:14:15,920 Speaker 1: He's going to try to hype the book as much 269 00:14:15,960 --> 00:14:19,560 Speaker 1: as you can. He doesn't care on the Jumbleton cares 270 00:14:19,600 --> 00:14:22,400 Speaker 1: about the money Jumplton has millions of dollars already. He's 271 00:14:22,480 --> 00:14:24,520 Speaker 1: he's well off. He doesn't need the money in the 272 00:14:24,600 --> 00:14:27,080 Speaker 1: sale of this book. He wants the story out there, 273 00:14:27,200 --> 00:14:29,240 Speaker 1: and if that means doing a media tour, then he'll 274 00:14:29,280 --> 00:14:33,240 Speaker 1: do a media tour. One of Trump's nieces is planning 275 00:14:33,240 --> 00:14:36,280 Speaker 1: to tell all book as well. Apparently, Trump said that 276 00:14:36,440 --> 00:14:39,080 Speaker 1: years ago she signed an n DA to explain the 277 00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:44,320 Speaker 1: difference between what the niece may write and Bolton situation. Sure, 278 00:14:44,360 --> 00:14:47,840 Speaker 1: so what general Bolton is implicated in is a government 279 00:14:47,920 --> 00:14:50,840 Speaker 1: not disclosure agreement. So when you serve in the US government, 280 00:14:51,040 --> 00:14:53,320 Speaker 1: the only time you have to sign a nondisclosure agreement 281 00:14:53,360 --> 00:14:55,800 Speaker 1: is if you hold a security clearance. Um. If you 282 00:14:55,800 --> 00:14:57,920 Speaker 1: hold the US government security clearance. One of the various 283 00:14:58,040 --> 00:15:00,880 Speaker 1: various documents you'll have, ever if you uti out is 284 00:15:00,920 --> 00:15:03,400 Speaker 1: what's called it an SS three twelve, which is a 285 00:15:03,480 --> 00:15:05,960 Speaker 1: non disclosure agreement. And if you have the level of 286 00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:10,160 Speaker 1: access John Bolton had, which was for sent compartment and information, 287 00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:13,520 Speaker 1: you signed an additional non disclosure agreement particular to the 288 00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:16,360 Speaker 1: s c I. Those nondisclosure agreements have been found to 289 00:15:16,360 --> 00:15:19,800 Speaker 1: be constitutional, and they only are allowed to be imposed 290 00:15:19,800 --> 00:15:23,320 Speaker 1: to the extent that the information at issue is properly classified. 291 00:15:23,600 --> 00:15:26,600 Speaker 1: What is going on with the president's niece is a 292 00:15:26,640 --> 00:15:29,800 Speaker 1: private nondisclosure agreement, just like any number of people in 293 00:15:29,840 --> 00:15:33,560 Speaker 1: the private world can craft between two parties and signed. 294 00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:38,800 Speaker 1: Tied to litigation surrounding the state of Fred Trump, of 295 00:15:38,880 --> 00:15:43,200 Speaker 1: Donald Trump's father, and debates over how various assets are 296 00:15:43,200 --> 00:15:46,200 Speaker 1: being allocated and who within the family was getting what money. 297 00:15:46,280 --> 00:15:49,520 Speaker 1: Apparently there was some litigation over that, as countless people 298 00:15:49,800 --> 00:15:51,720 Speaker 1: do in the United States and they fight over a 299 00:15:51,840 --> 00:15:55,040 Speaker 1: state and who gets the money from stead relative. And 300 00:15:55,200 --> 00:15:58,320 Speaker 1: as part of the conclusion of that litigation, apparently there 301 00:15:58,360 --> 00:16:01,960 Speaker 1: was a non disclosure agreement signed by various parties, including 302 00:16:02,160 --> 00:16:06,360 Speaker 1: the president's niece. Now there's not necessarily anything illegal about 303 00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:08,480 Speaker 1: doing that. Some parties might can do it with the 304 00:16:08,520 --> 00:16:11,640 Speaker 1: nondisclosure agreement. Usually, I think it's just considered a confidentially 305 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:14,120 Speaker 1: how the agreement, not to talk about the particular terms 306 00:16:14,120 --> 00:16:16,880 Speaker 1: of what the settlement agreement was. I've never seen it 307 00:16:16,920 --> 00:16:19,400 Speaker 1: as an NBA. But if you're Donald Trump, I'm sure 308 00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:22,640 Speaker 1: that was just commonplace for him. He had everybody that 309 00:16:22,760 --> 00:16:26,320 Speaker 1: was his life. Thanks Brad. That's Bradley Moss, a partner 310 00:16:26,320 --> 00:16:28,560 Speaker 1: at Mark's A. And that's it for this edition of 311 00:16:28,600 --> 00:16:32,080 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Law. I'm June Grasso. Thanks so much for listening, 312 00:16:32,240 --> 00:16:34,280 Speaker 1: and remember to turn to The Bloomberg Law Show every 313 00:16:34,280 --> 00:16:37,280 Speaker 1: week night at ten pm Eastern right here on Bloomberg Radio.