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Speaker 1: Yeah, let's just keep a real straight s right with

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Speaker 1: no Jason, I'm gonna get a little bit rougher. I'm

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Speaker 1: here for it. Those who really believe in the American process,

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Speaker 1: all of us. Straight Shot No Chaser? What's your Girl?

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Speaker 1: Tesla Figuro on the Black Effect podcast That one. What's

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Speaker 1: having Everybody? This is Tesla Figuro, straight Shot No Chaser

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Speaker 1: on the Black Effect podcast network. I Heart Radio and

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Speaker 1: we are once again digging in deep with our prison

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Speaker 1: series partnered with the George Foy Foundation. I named this

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Speaker 1: series were reclaiming your Time, taking uh that phrase from

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Speaker 1: Congressman Maxine Waters and it really made me think about

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Speaker 1: how do you reclaim the time that you lost? How

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Speaker 1: do you get back? They say one thing you can

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Speaker 1: never get back is time. But we wanted to do

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Speaker 1: this series to talk about how do you either serve

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Speaker 1: your time as best as you can, how do you

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Speaker 1: take that time and turn it into passion? How do

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Speaker 1: you take that time and turn it into a purpose.

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Speaker 1: How do you find yourself? How do you uh better

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Speaker 1: yourself while you are doing your prison time. Again reminded

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Speaker 1: everybody that this six six episode podcast it will be

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Speaker 1: distributed directly to over five hundred thousand incarcerated individuals all

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Speaker 1: over the country. It is such a blessing and opportunity

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Speaker 1: to be able to speak directly to them. But we

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Speaker 1: did want to also air this on our podcast network

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Speaker 1: because there are many of you that have loved ones

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Speaker 1: that have experience during prison time or yourself have done

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Speaker 1: prison time. If you listen to me at any time

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Speaker 1: in my career, you know that my number one, one

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Speaker 1: of my top priorities is mass incarceration. So this fits

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Speaker 1: directly in line uh to how do we uh stop

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Speaker 1: or not gonna say stopped, but how do we put

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Speaker 1: a dent into a recidivism How do we prevent people

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Speaker 1: from coming home and going back to jail and violating.

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Speaker 1: And so this last episode is critically important and it

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Speaker 1: really does sum up everything that we have talked about

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Speaker 1: thus far are as much as we can get in

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Speaker 1: in a thirty forty five minute window. Please go back

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Speaker 1: and watch all of the episodes or listened to all

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Speaker 1: of the episodes, because we do touch on mental health,

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Speaker 1: we touch on spiritual well being, We touch on um uh,

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Speaker 1: how to actually find your talent, how do you turn

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Speaker 1: the prison sentence into your purpose? All of those things

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Speaker 1: that I've had wonderful guests, those who have served time

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Speaker 1: and those who have supported those who have served time.

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Speaker 1: And so my next guest, I'm very excited about this,

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Speaker 1: And shout out to everybody that responded to UH the call,

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Speaker 1: because I put the call out to say that I

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Speaker 1: really wanted to talk to someone who has a plethora

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Speaker 1: of experience from the probation, UH and parole side of things,

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Speaker 1: and I got a great response from everybody. Shout out

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Speaker 1: to you who those who have submitted your background, but

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Speaker 1: I really wanted someone that has had over twenty years

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Speaker 1: of experience because obviously the longer that you're in something,

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Speaker 1: the more you see, the more you know. Um, I've

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Speaker 1: been in politics over fifteen years and I do not

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Speaker 1: know the same things that I knew when I started,

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Speaker 1: and there's so much more for me to know, and

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Speaker 1: that really comes from on the job training. So shout

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Speaker 1: out to counsel woman Vanessa Harper, who definitely referred my

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Speaker 1: next guest to me. Again, go check out her interview.

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Speaker 1: We've also interviewed her as well on Straight Shot, No Chaser,

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Speaker 1: but she referred my next guest to me who has

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Speaker 1: over twenty years experience with the Oklahoma Department of Corrections

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Speaker 1: as a probation officer and parole officer. And the reason

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Speaker 1: why Kelly Levine's experience is so important on point is

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Speaker 1: because not only does she have over twenty years experience

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Speaker 1: on the adult side, she also currently works in the

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Speaker 1: juvenile detention center. I definitely want to bring her back

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Speaker 1: um to talk about that because I am positive that

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Speaker 1: a lot of the learned behavior that she sees on

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Speaker 1: the adult side started on the juvenile side, and that

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Speaker 1: will be a wonderful conversation to go all the way

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Speaker 1: back and talk about how this starts with our youth

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Speaker 1: and how do they become what they become, which we

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Speaker 1: touched on that by the way with Dr Smith of

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Speaker 1: talking about how they learned behavior starts at a very

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Speaker 1: young age. So thank you so much, she said, I

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Speaker 1: can call with Kelly. So thank you so much, Kelly

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Speaker 1: for joining us on Straight Shot, No Chaser. Thank you

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Speaker 1: for the opportunity. Thank you An. It was a long

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Speaker 1: winded uh intro, but I wanted to give everybody some

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Speaker 1: context so that they could know, you know, why we're

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Speaker 1: having this conversation, how they weave together, because that is

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Speaker 1: critical when we talk about our system, our justice system,

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Speaker 1: whether you're talking about mass incarceration, whether you're talking about

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Speaker 1: how the justice system works in itself and politics. It

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Speaker 1: all layers together. It's all we've together, is one thing

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Speaker 1: after the other. And so you are here to really

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Speaker 1: talk about once they get home and to prepare those

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Speaker 1: who are coming home. We all know, Kelly, that they

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Speaker 1: give you know, they come out and they have these

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Speaker 1: conversations with folks and they prepare. Hey, you're gonna meet

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Speaker 1: your parole officer, You're gonna meet your probation officer. These

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Speaker 1: are the things you shouldn't do, such as make sure

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Speaker 1: you don't do your hugs, make sure you get a job,

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Speaker 1: make sure that you don't surround yourself what other felons.

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Speaker 1: Make sure you stay away from guns um because they

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Speaker 1: can get you, you know, time depending on the type

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Speaker 1: of uh, you know, crime in particular that you've served

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Speaker 1: that you did time for. But I really wanted you

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Speaker 1: to come in and just give us without obviously giving names,

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Speaker 1: give some game. You know, what is it that they

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Speaker 1: need to know? Know that you have seen some of

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Speaker 1: the slightest, easiest things for folks to violate, either from

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Speaker 1: a lack of ignorance of just simply not knowing, or

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Speaker 1: people once again thinking they can beat the system, thinking

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Speaker 1: that I'm smarter than my parole officer, I'm smarter than

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Speaker 1: my probation officer. A lot of the things that we see.

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Speaker 1: So I'm gonna give the floor to you, and I

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Speaker 1: do want to ask you this quickly, just to get

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Speaker 1: some context what made you get into um and particularly

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Speaker 1: being a woman, you know, to say, hey, I want

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Speaker 1: to be a probation and parole officer. Give us a

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Speaker 1: little bit of context of why you chose this particular

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Speaker 1: field um and and explain that to the listener. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that wasn't exactly my choice actually, UM. Really I've always

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Speaker 1: been fascinated just with the law in general. UM. And

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Speaker 1: I excuse me, wanted to go to law school, and

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Speaker 1: then I got to college and realized that I was

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Speaker 1: lazy and so I didn't think I was gonna make

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Speaker 1: it through law school. So UM, but my major was

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Speaker 1: criminal justice UM and so again just still always having

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Speaker 1: that passion for the legal system UM. And UM also

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Speaker 1: having a want to help people UM and that was

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Speaker 1: always my goal and especially being in Oklahoma. UM. One

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Speaker 1: thing that I did learn UM in my tenure at

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Speaker 1: there at WIDTH, the permanent corrections was even if I

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Speaker 1: didn't know them, people that look like me that walk

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Speaker 1: in and see someone that looks like them, that immediate

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Speaker 1: just that right there was it put them a little

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Speaker 1: bit at east because when you're walking into a situation

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Speaker 1: that you don't know, you know, people have horror stories

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Speaker 1: about their pro officer or their probation officer. So just

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Speaker 1: walking in and seeing someone that looks like them, that

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Speaker 1: little bit was enough to you know, give them a

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Speaker 1: little bit of ease, you know, at the very beginning.

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Speaker 1: And so that was something that I always took great

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Speaker 1: responsibility in UM, even with hiring UM, because I did

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Speaker 1: advance to be a supervisor at while I was there.

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Speaker 1: And that was another thing that UM I took very seriously.

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Speaker 1: Was because you know, again it because I took that seriously,

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Speaker 1: I wanted other people that look like me to work

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Speaker 1: there as well. So that was something that I always

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Speaker 1: took very seriously. Was whenever there was someone black coming,

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Speaker 1: I you know, I took a little bit extra note,

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Speaker 1: you know, try to you know, help them along the

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Speaker 1: way or whatever. Just because there's more people that are

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Speaker 1: coming out of prison they look like us. And so

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Speaker 1: in order for you know, to try to help people

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Speaker 1: a little bit more, not saying that they get any

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Speaker 1: special treatment, not at all, but just to know that

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Speaker 1: somebody may possibly not count you out as soon as

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Speaker 1: you walk through the door. To me, that was always

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Speaker 1: really important and um, but also the other on the

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Speaker 1: other side, don't exploit that because I looked like what

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Speaker 1: I was getting ready to cut because I looked like

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Speaker 1: you doesn't mean I don't still need to take care

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Speaker 1: of my family and still to pay my own bills

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Speaker 1: and I still have to do my job, because that's

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Speaker 1: I mean, you know what I mean. Even though I

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Speaker 1: want you to feel at ease, I also need for

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Speaker 1: you to understand that I don't. I have yeah, and

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Speaker 1: you have a responsibility as this is your life, not mine,

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Speaker 1: to take it and do with it what you need

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Speaker 1: to do with it. And so, um, I kind of

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Speaker 1: got off topic. But no, I'm glad that was my

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Speaker 1: next question I was gonna ask you because that they

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Speaker 1: were absolutely exploit that. So no, you didn't get off topic,

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Speaker 1: but go go ahead. Yeah, So that was kind of it,

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Speaker 1: like I always had, UM, I want to help people, um,

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Speaker 1: and just kind of and after I got in there

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Speaker 1: I kind of realized, like, um, because of my temperament,

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Speaker 1: it was kind of my niche because I'm very straightforward.

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Speaker 1: Some people call it aggressive. I call it straightforward whatever. Um.

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Speaker 1: But because I have that and I am able to

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Speaker 1: um adapt really well to different situations. And that was

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Speaker 1: one thing that I had to learn very quickly too,

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Speaker 1: because you may get somebody that you know has been

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Speaker 1: on pract for the last ten years, doesn't have her kids,

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Speaker 1: doesn't know where she's gonna eat tomorrow. And then the

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Speaker 1: next person that comes in your office maybe a car

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Speaker 1: salesman that makes ten tho dollars a month that has

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Speaker 1: a cocaine habit. You see what I'm saying. So and

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Speaker 1: you can't treat each person the same because they're not

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Speaker 1: the same. So you know you Because that was something

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Speaker 1: that I did learn just um, just as a person

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Speaker 1: in evolving over time, is how to adapt to different

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Speaker 1: situations and how to deal with people because you kind

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Speaker 1: of have to meet people where they are because again,

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Speaker 1: I can't have the same conversation with the lady that

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Speaker 1: you know doesn't know where she's gonna sleep tomorrow as

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Speaker 1: I have with someone that's come and then you know,

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Speaker 1: because they how did e U I you know what

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Speaker 1: I mean, Like, you can't have that same conversation because

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Speaker 1: they have different needs, so you have to address whatever

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Speaker 1: their needs are and as and again, over time, I

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Speaker 1: just learned how to do that, and you know I

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Speaker 1: was there for twenty years, so obviously I did it decently. Well. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm glad you because it wasn't off topic. It that

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Speaker 1: was exactly what I was gonna set my next question

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Speaker 1: up to kind of delve into the importance of UH.

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Speaker 1: And we get off topic here because we like to

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Speaker 1: dig deeper. You know. I can have several questions that

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Speaker 1: I think I want to ask, what if something triggers

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Speaker 1: me to go deeper into that, I really I like

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Speaker 1: my discernment to leave me that way. And um it,

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Speaker 1: what you said was critically important. On I ran a

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Speaker 1: staff and firm in Orlando and I had three hundred employees.

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Speaker 1: But before that, I worked at a Deco and Robert

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Speaker 1: had the first and third largest habing firm in the world,

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Speaker 1: and I was a branch manager there and when I

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Speaker 1: would go out to hire somebody and walk in the lobby,

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Speaker 1: was the only black person at that time in Chicago

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Speaker 1: with a hundred and twenty five, uh, hiring managers, and

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Speaker 1: I was the only one in management. And when you

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Speaker 1: walk out, you literally see breath like they literally take

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Speaker 1: the side like literally you can see the the anxiety

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Speaker 1: just pour out of their body to say, Okay, maybe

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Speaker 1: I have an opportunity. And we all know that everybody

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Speaker 1: did look like us is not for us, so that

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Speaker 1: there are definitely some folks that use that, Hey, I

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Speaker 1: need to have somebody look like me and diversity to

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Speaker 1: get the job. But then once they start doing the job,

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Speaker 1: they forget the importance of having a different learned experience

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Speaker 1: of different lens and they abuse their power. And I

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Speaker 1: want to I'm gonna talk about abusing power. Hopefully we

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Speaker 1: get enough time to talk about it. But you are

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Speaker 1: absolutely right, Uh. The the anxiety that goals, that literally

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Speaker 1: comes out of their out of their body, I'll never forget.

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Speaker 1: One of my favorite employees name was THEO Johnson, and

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Speaker 1: he would laugh all the time because we would always

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Speaker 1: joke about how when I came in and he saw

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Speaker 1: me downtown or Lando, He's like, wow, this is a sister.

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Speaker 1: He just knew it was somebody else's thing. But then

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Speaker 1: he got really comfortable and he put a two pick

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Speaker 1: in his mouth, and I said take the two pick

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Speaker 1: after math. You know, you wouldn't do that if you

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Speaker 1: go anywhere else. And so we always laughed, and then

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Speaker 1: he got even more motivated because he saw a sister

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Speaker 1: that was not only having her business but holding him

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Speaker 1: to a higher standard of accountability. And most of the

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Speaker 1: folks that I hired, Kelly, were coming directly out of

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Speaker 1: prison or jail. You know. I had guys that didn't

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Speaker 1: even have a driver's license, were literally using you know,

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Speaker 1: their i DU that they weren't supposed to take, by

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Speaker 1: the way, but using their I D from just getting released.

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Speaker 1: And so I hired folks all the way from g

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Speaker 1: E d S. I would tell people g d S,

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Speaker 1: the pH d S laid off, people that were in shelters,

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Speaker 1: people that struggle with dependency issues, all the things that

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Speaker 1: you're talking about. And it is critically important to be

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Speaker 1: able to talk to diverse groups. And it doesn't mean

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Speaker 1: you've lived everybody's experience, but you recognize there's different lived experiences.

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Speaker 1: And as now that they're talking about putting a black

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Speaker 1: woman on the Supreme Court, it just really kind of

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Speaker 1: goes into the even that argument on again, not everybody

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Speaker 1: that looks like us is for us, but the lens

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Speaker 1: is different. If you've been at least have access to

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Speaker 1: different lived experiences and understanding that you have to adjust that.

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Speaker 1: And so I'm glad that you said that because that

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Speaker 1: is what UM I talked about in politics all the time,

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Speaker 1: making sure that your teams and the folks that you're

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Speaker 1: hiring have different offer different backgrounds. People of color does

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Speaker 1: not mean black. Black means black. There's no live experience

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Speaker 1: like it in anywhere in the world, and everybody black

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Speaker 1: didn't live the experience that I did. So I'm glad

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Speaker 1: you you may point of that. I'm glad you talked

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Speaker 1: about how that has been exploited. I'm sure some of

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Speaker 1: the stuff you'll share with us are probably directly related

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Speaker 1: to people trying to exploit it and try you UM.

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Speaker 1: And so I'm I'm glad you pointed pointed that out.

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Speaker 1: So if I were to ask you, we're not as

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Speaker 1: if I were, I am going to ask you, what

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Speaker 1: what would you see? And I know it's so much

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Speaker 1: knowledge it's hard to just you know, kind of pinned down.

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Speaker 1: But I know with uh my homies and people that

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Speaker 1: I know that that came home and they they got

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Speaker 1: really comfortable you know with their uh, their probation officer,

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Speaker 1: and so I would assume you know that's happened to

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Speaker 1: you is which is why you talked about exploiting it.

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Speaker 1: What are some of the things I get some real

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Speaker 1: tangible tools on how people get comfortable too quickly and

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Speaker 1: how you have had to redirect or maybe violate some

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Speaker 1: folks based upon what they know they should not do.

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Speaker 1: I know they have a list of things they should

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Speaker 1: not do. But if you can get in some game

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Speaker 1: on you know, some of the dumb things just being honest,

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Speaker 1: you know that they try that that forces you to

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Speaker 1: have to you know, either violate or have a conversation

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Speaker 1: or or things of that nature. UM. One of the

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Speaker 1: things that just popped into my head was I have

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Speaker 1: one guy. UM, he was drug dealer. I knew he

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Speaker 1: was a drug dealer. He knew I knew he was

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Speaker 1: a drug dealer, but he would bring in UM I

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Speaker 1: checked them every time from wherever. I don't know if

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Speaker 1: he was computer generating them, I don't know, don't care,

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Speaker 1: but UM, basically what he was doing was he was

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Speaker 1: still making drug runs going to Texas. UM, you know

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Speaker 1: doing these drug runs. And so one thing that we

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Speaker 1: have to do UM yearly is order UM yearly rap

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Speaker 1: sheets on everybody that's UM and all offenders that are

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Speaker 1: on the case. We have to run yearly rap sheets

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Speaker 1: and so um. You like, if obviously, if they got

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Speaker 1: arrested in the city that they live in, you would

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Speaker 1: find that out fairly quickly. But if they got arrested

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Speaker 1: somewhere else, you wouldn't know it, you know, unless you

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Speaker 1: did the rap sheets. And you actually have to look

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Speaker 1: at the rap sheets, because that's one thing that because

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Speaker 1: we would have so many people that you would order

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Speaker 1: the raps and maybe not actually we look at them.

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Speaker 1: So we have to actually look through the wraps and

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Speaker 1: you know, actually look and see if they have anything new.

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Speaker 1: And you know, every once in a while you would

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Speaker 1: find someone. But anyway, this one guy before you say that,

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Speaker 1: can I can I ask you this because I wanna.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to forget you're talking about at the

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Speaker 1: state level, because what I've seen on the federal side

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Speaker 1: is the moment they even get pulled over their probation off. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so that would be the difference because on the state level,

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Speaker 1: we find out, like I said, we know locally, UM,

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Speaker 1: when things happen, because we get those alerts from the

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Speaker 1: local p D or whatever, or even if it's like

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Speaker 1: a surrounding community, we would get that. Or if they go, um,

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Speaker 1: you know, get arrested somewhere in another county and you

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Speaker 1: know they find out. Sometimes they'll call and tell us.

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Speaker 1: But for the most part, we have to rely on,

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Speaker 1: like A said, these rap sheets that well, but don't

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Speaker 1: try if you do a feed time, because you will

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Speaker 1: get immediately like he will get pulled over in the

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Speaker 1: probation officer will call and say, hey, did why did

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Speaker 1: you just get pulled over in Texas? Like that really

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Speaker 1: happened because rules a whole another level. So I just

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Speaker 1: want to put that out if anybody listening and saying,

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Speaker 1: oh man, they might check it. They may not check it. No,

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Speaker 1: if you're doing federal time, they're gonna okay, So go

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Speaker 1: ahead immediately and reports. He had gotten arrested in Texas,

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Speaker 1: UM doing one of these drug runs. And so when

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Speaker 1: I found out about it, you know, I had to

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Speaker 1: write a violation report let them know what was going on.

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Speaker 1: And UM, when he came in and talked to me

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Speaker 1: about it, I was like, because that's what happened. And

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Speaker 1: he came and talked to me about it, and I

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Speaker 1: was like, what's up with this? He was like, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, uh, you know, some stuff happened, and uh

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Speaker 1: I couldn't you know, I got arrested and so I

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Speaker 1: was like okay, and so I um um um I

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Speaker 1: got arrested and I was like, okay, well I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: have to write you up. And so he was like, well,

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Speaker 1: can we talk about that? And I'm like no. And

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Speaker 1: so after his office visit was over, he was like, well,

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Speaker 1: can I talk to you downstairs? And he had been

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Speaker 1: on my caselar for a while, so we were cooling

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Speaker 1: and I felt like cool. So I go downstairs and

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Speaker 1: talk to him and I was like, what's up. I

356
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Speaker 1: kind of knew what he was gonna say, but I

357
00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:07,560
Speaker 1: was hoping not um. And so he's like, well, you know,

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Speaker 1: if you um, if you don't violate me, I'll make

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Speaker 1: it worth your while. And I was like, you have

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Speaker 1: you don't have enough money. I promise you don't have

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Speaker 1: enough money to make um me put how I take

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Speaker 1: care of my family in jeopardy Like that's just not

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Speaker 1: something that I'm you know, willing to do. UM. He

364
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Speaker 1: was like, okay, well I had to try, and I'm like,

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Speaker 1: I mean not really, because I mean I still have

366
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Speaker 1: to do my job. And he ended up not even

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Speaker 1: getting Um. They didn't actually file charges, but they foiled charges,

368
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Speaker 1: but they ended up not going anywhere. So because they

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Speaker 1: didn't go anywhere in Texas, UM, they never did file

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Speaker 1: anything on him here. So you know, I'm sorry. So

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Speaker 1: when you rolled him up, was it it was because

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Speaker 1: he got arrested, But was it also because he did

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Speaker 1: not tell you? Because I want to cover that too,

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Speaker 1: because I know, UM, some folks that I know, they

375
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Speaker 1: would get in trouble mainly because you didn't tell me.

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Speaker 1: And that's normally what it was. Are the rules and

377
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Speaker 1: conditions UM, that we go over with them, and of course,

378
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Speaker 1: you know, it's like anything else you read the beginning.

379
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Speaker 1: You know, you find out about it at the beginning,

380
00:19:06,480 --> 00:19:08,119
Speaker 1: and we have to sign tape works to say that

381
00:19:08,160 --> 00:19:09,760
Speaker 1: we went over your rules and get issues with you.

382
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Speaker 1: But of course when they start doing whatever they're doing,

383
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Speaker 1: nobody's thinking about that. And so that is one of

384
00:19:14,359 --> 00:19:16,000
Speaker 1: the things that's on there is that if you do

385
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Speaker 1: have any type of law enforcement contact, you're supposed to

386
00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:21,400
Speaker 1: contact your p O and let them know. So by

387
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Speaker 1: the fact that he did go to Texas and I

388
00:19:23,040 --> 00:19:24,760
Speaker 1: had to bring it up to him that he had

389
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Speaker 1: UM you know, that he got arrested, not even just

390
00:19:28,119 --> 00:19:30,480
Speaker 1: had contact, but got arrested. Yeah, that was an issue

391
00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:33,760
Speaker 1: as were Okay, sorry, didn't want to interrupt you, but

392
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Speaker 1: I wanted to put a pin in that because I

393
00:19:35,320 --> 00:19:38,120
Speaker 1: thought that was a learning tool. And when you're gonna

394
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Speaker 1: finish with the story, oh yeah, I just basically told him,

395
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Speaker 1: you know, you don't have enough money for me to

396
00:19:44,200 --> 00:19:46,959
Speaker 1: put my family in jeopardy. Like god, this is my career.

397
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Speaker 1: And at the end of the day, if I get fired,

398
00:19:49,080 --> 00:19:51,040
Speaker 1: which I have seen people, you don't get fired for

399
00:19:51,680 --> 00:19:55,760
Speaker 1: rout now sing um inappropriately you know with offenders. Um,

400
00:19:55,840 --> 00:19:57,760
Speaker 1: that's not something I'm willing to do, you know, And

401
00:19:57,880 --> 00:20:00,399
Speaker 1: I've worked too hard for you know, the stuff obg

402
00:20:01,200 --> 00:20:04,520
Speaker 1: to do that. And so you know he understood, and UM,

403
00:20:04,640 --> 00:20:07,600
Speaker 1: like I said, they never did UM file anything. They

404
00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:09,840
Speaker 1: filed charges on him, but he didn't actually get convicted

405
00:20:09,840 --> 00:20:12,919
Speaker 1: down there, so nothing happened to his charges here. So

406
00:20:13,000 --> 00:20:17,960
Speaker 1: he was able to UM discharge dis probation. So is

407
00:20:18,000 --> 00:20:21,960
Speaker 1: that illegal to bribe you in that way or or

408
00:20:22,000 --> 00:20:24,719
Speaker 1: is it is there more of an ethical thing on

409
00:20:24,760 --> 00:20:28,040
Speaker 1: your mere was more of an ethical thing? Obviously he

410
00:20:28,080 --> 00:20:30,480
Speaker 1: shouldn't have tried it. UM. I could have written him

411
00:20:30,520 --> 00:20:33,720
Speaker 1: up again for trying that. UM. But it was one

412
00:20:33,720 --> 00:20:38,679
Speaker 1: of those things discretionary. UM. You know, I chose to

413
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Speaker 1: just kind of not really say anything and just kind

414
00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:44,120
Speaker 1: of went on and we um. You know, like I said,

415
00:20:44,160 --> 00:20:46,120
Speaker 1: he never tried it again because he knew I wasn't

416
00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:49,560
Speaker 1: doing that. So and one thing that it did kind

417
00:20:49,560 --> 00:20:51,960
Speaker 1: of bring the question is because this wasn't his first

418
00:20:52,000 --> 00:20:54,240
Speaker 1: time being our a probation, I'm wondering, you know, did

419
00:20:54,280 --> 00:20:59,280
Speaker 1: someone else take that and so amazing so comfortable doing it,

420
00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:05,840
Speaker 1: so sending to Yeah, somebody just used to being able

421
00:21:05,840 --> 00:21:09,879
Speaker 1: to pay their way out of stuff. So if you're listening, uh, listen,

422
00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:13,520
Speaker 1: that may work on something, it may not may make

423
00:21:13,560 --> 00:21:16,240
Speaker 1: your situation way worse, you know than what it has

424
00:21:16,280 --> 00:21:29,800
Speaker 1: to be shout out to you for you know, having discretion.

425
00:21:30,119 --> 00:21:33,560
Speaker 1: And you know, again case by case situation, everybody's not

426
00:21:33,560 --> 00:21:37,000
Speaker 1: gonna have discretion that some people really gonna you know,

427
00:21:37,359 --> 00:21:41,320
Speaker 1: might feel very offended and and and make your situation worse.

428
00:21:42,040 --> 00:21:46,840
Speaker 1: I want to talk about how as we're talking about discretion,

429
00:21:47,280 --> 00:21:51,560
Speaker 1: because there's rules and then there's these gray areas like that,

430
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Speaker 1: and I've seen probation officers really uh use power, weaponize

431
00:22:02,040 --> 00:22:05,920
Speaker 1: their power. UM the same relief that you saw when

432
00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:08,119
Speaker 1: the anxiety goes out and say, hey, you know, okay,

433
00:22:08,119 --> 00:22:10,880
Speaker 1: I might this might not be as band. There's there's

434
00:22:10,920 --> 00:22:13,320
Speaker 1: some that I'm to be honest, I wanted to get

435
00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:19,199
Speaker 1: a high of a power high kick UM. We after

436
00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:24,600
Speaker 1: I was a supervisor, UM, there would be stuff that

437
00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:27,040
Speaker 1: would happen and I would just see it. And because

438
00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:29,960
Speaker 1: like how our office was set up was we had teams,

439
00:22:29,960 --> 00:22:32,720
Speaker 1: and I had UM a team of like maybe six

440
00:22:32,800 --> 00:22:36,000
Speaker 1: or seven probation officers up under me, and there was

441
00:22:36,040 --> 00:22:39,520
Speaker 1: like seven supervisors, so each supervisor had their own team.

442
00:22:39,600 --> 00:22:41,480
Speaker 1: And so how our office was set up was we

443
00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:44,560
Speaker 1: all kind of intermingled together and so UM I would

444
00:22:44,600 --> 00:22:47,760
Speaker 1: kind of just overhear conversations. And one particular day I

445
00:22:47,800 --> 00:22:51,760
Speaker 1: heard that he was a newer officer UM and he

446
00:22:51,920 --> 00:22:56,199
Speaker 1: was one of those people that wanted to be a

447
00:22:56,240 --> 00:23:00,160
Speaker 1: police officer, but you know, had not had that opportunity

448
00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:05,439
Speaker 1: for whatever reason. And so you know, he was very

449
00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:10,280
Speaker 1: Um it's happy, happy to have a badge and a gun.

450
00:23:10,680 --> 00:23:13,840
Speaker 1: Let me just say that. And so um, one of

451
00:23:13,880 --> 00:23:17,119
Speaker 1: the aspects of being a probation officers having to go

452
00:23:17,160 --> 00:23:19,280
Speaker 1: and do home business on people just to make sure

453
00:23:19,280 --> 00:23:21,560
Speaker 1: that they actually live where they say they live and

454
00:23:21,640 --> 00:23:25,040
Speaker 1: you know, just to see them actually in their home environment. Um.

455
00:23:25,160 --> 00:23:29,239
Speaker 1: So UM, how our office is set up is that

456
00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:32,760
Speaker 1: we had flex time, and the officers had flex time,

457
00:23:33,040 --> 00:23:36,560
Speaker 1: not for themselves, but to have to be able to

458
00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:41,360
Speaker 1: flex their time around when their offenders were able to

459
00:23:41,400 --> 00:23:45,800
Speaker 1: meet them. And so um, we could start doing home

460
00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:49,280
Speaker 1: business as early as five and be done as late

461
00:23:49,320 --> 00:23:51,840
Speaker 1: as eleven. I did never like to go anybody's house

462
00:23:51,880 --> 00:23:54,000
Speaker 1: after like ten ten o'clock, just because I just think

463
00:23:54,040 --> 00:23:59,359
Speaker 1: that's rude. But we had that ability, so and all that,

464
00:23:59,440 --> 00:24:01,439
Speaker 1: and I'm saying all that to say we have the

465
00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:04,360
Speaker 1: ability to go whenever that would kind of go around

466
00:24:04,680 --> 00:24:08,440
Speaker 1: the offenders, you know, time frames that they needed. And

467
00:24:08,520 --> 00:24:13,040
Speaker 1: so this one guy, he um he had made I

468
00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:15,720
Speaker 1: heard him overheard a conversation, well, I just make my

469
00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:18,880
Speaker 1: people stay home from work. And I was like what,

470
00:24:19,800 --> 00:24:21,119
Speaker 1: And he was like, I just make him stay on

471
00:24:21,200 --> 00:24:23,480
Speaker 1: from work until I get there, I said, So you're

472
00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:27,359
Speaker 1: making people that just got out of prison have a

473
00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:30,320
Speaker 1: record miss a day at work for you to come

474
00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:33,800
Speaker 1: and do a fifteen minute home business that you may

475
00:24:33,880 --> 00:24:36,399
Speaker 1: or may not even do that day. He's like, well,

476
00:24:36,440 --> 00:24:37,760
Speaker 1: if I don't do it that day, I'll just do

477
00:24:37,800 --> 00:24:40,639
Speaker 1: it another day. I said, so you're potentially making someone

478
00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:44,720
Speaker 1: miss two days of work for you to do a

479
00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:47,720
Speaker 1: fifteen minute home visit. And he's like, yeah, well, I

480
00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:50,080
Speaker 1: don't know what time I'm gonna get there, but you

481
00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:52,240
Speaker 1: can kind of gage it a little bit. And if

482
00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:54,200
Speaker 1: you know they go to work at seven, then guess

483
00:24:54,200 --> 00:24:56,280
Speaker 1: what you might have to get up a little earlier.

484
00:24:56,440 --> 00:24:57,680
Speaker 1: Or if they get out, did they go to work

485
00:24:57,680 --> 00:25:00,479
Speaker 1: at seven, they get off at three or four? So

486
00:25:00,560 --> 00:25:02,760
Speaker 1: you can go this evening. He's like, I don't work

487
00:25:02,760 --> 00:25:06,920
Speaker 1: pass five. Not normal type of issue you even causing

488
00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:09,080
Speaker 1: on their job, because even though they can tell the job,

489
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:12,160
Speaker 1: hey I gotta be there with my my pos coming through,

490
00:25:12,480 --> 00:25:16,160
Speaker 1: we all know that, uh, jobs get tired of that too,

491
00:25:16,359 --> 00:25:18,399
Speaker 1: and they start thinking that as a hindrance and they

492
00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:21,280
Speaker 1: can cause them lose their job. Right That and the

493
00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:23,920
Speaker 1: fact that they're probably just happy to have a job

494
00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:26,480
Speaker 1: at this point because they they may or may not,

495
00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:28,680
Speaker 1: you know, there there's no telling how they even got

496
00:25:28,720 --> 00:25:31,399
Speaker 1: that job. Some people can't just not you know, some

497
00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:33,639
Speaker 1: people just can't miss work. And so I said, no,

498
00:25:33,760 --> 00:25:35,800
Speaker 1: that's not why you have flex time. I said, you

499
00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:38,400
Speaker 1: have flex times so you can flex around that person's schedule.

500
00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:41,240
Speaker 1: So no, and again this person wasn't even on my team.

501
00:25:41,320 --> 00:25:42,879
Speaker 1: So of course, you know, I wasn't very well like,

502
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:46,479
Speaker 1: oh well, but you know, this person was not on

503
00:25:46,520 --> 00:25:48,760
Speaker 1: my team. But I went and told their supervisor. I

504
00:25:48,800 --> 00:25:51,280
Speaker 1: was like, he's doing that wrong. We don't get to

505
00:25:51,320 --> 00:25:54,159
Speaker 1: work eight divide. That's just not the job that we have.

506
00:25:54,680 --> 00:25:56,480
Speaker 1: And if you've decided that you only can do your

507
00:25:56,560 --> 00:25:58,679
Speaker 1: job between that and five, then this isn't this. This

508
00:25:58,680 --> 00:26:01,560
Speaker 1: shouldn't be for you because you cannot get somebody fired,

509
00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:03,400
Speaker 1: and then you're gonna be mad at them when they

510
00:26:03,400 --> 00:26:05,080
Speaker 1: don't have a job, and then you're gonna be handing

511
00:26:05,160 --> 00:26:09,119
Speaker 1: them one. It's not that easy, right, and then again

512
00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:11,520
Speaker 1: what happens to them? You know? And so what I'm

513
00:26:11,560 --> 00:26:14,320
Speaker 1: glad you said, and thank you for standing up. What

514
00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:16,720
Speaker 1: happens though, when there's not somebody like you that stands

515
00:26:16,760 --> 00:26:19,280
Speaker 1: up what happens when like, there's all these rules on

516
00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:21,760
Speaker 1: what the offenders supposed to do. What are the rules

517
00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:23,399
Speaker 1: on what it is you're supposed to do? And I

518
00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:27,120
Speaker 1: say that because dealing with my friend um and man,

519
00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:29,560
Speaker 1: I I it took everything for me not to check

520
00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:31,440
Speaker 1: that woman because I know what she was doing was

521
00:26:31,520 --> 00:26:35,280
Speaker 1: out of pocket and the worst thing in the world

522
00:26:35,280 --> 00:26:36,960
Speaker 1: for him was wanting to have to go back after

523
00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:41,160
Speaker 1: serving almost sixteen years. So I watched this man, who

524
00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:45,560
Speaker 1: I've always seen as a strong man. Literally, they it's

525
00:26:45,560 --> 00:26:50,000
Speaker 1: almost they want to further dehumanize and be childlike and

526
00:26:50,080 --> 00:26:53,440
Speaker 1: be so anxious about And it was a white woman

527
00:26:53,720 --> 00:26:58,760
Speaker 1: and she would she would ask about his personal relationships, Uh,

528
00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:01,960
Speaker 1: who's these data, and get into when he was having

529
00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:06,080
Speaker 1: issues with his um, his his baby mom at the time,

530
00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:08,320
Speaker 1: you know, are y'all working out and what's going on

531
00:27:08,359 --> 00:27:10,399
Speaker 1: with y'all? And why you dating this woman? That woman

532
00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:12,560
Speaker 1: And the moment I ever, I had a chance to

533
00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:14,280
Speaker 1: finally talk to cause she tried to check me over.

534
00:27:14,320 --> 00:27:15,520
Speaker 1: So well, hold a wait a minute, I'm not a

535
00:27:15,560 --> 00:27:18,399
Speaker 1: your offender, so let's get that. I'm definitely the one

536
00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:19,879
Speaker 1: you want to try it, because not only am I

537
00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:25,200
Speaker 1: gonna talk about how you're violating him as a human being.

538
00:27:25,480 --> 00:27:28,560
Speaker 1: I'm gonna dig into your entire case foul, and I'm

539
00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:31,040
Speaker 1: gonna figure out who all in Oklahoma has had a

540
00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:33,320
Speaker 1: problem with you, because I don't believe that it's just

541
00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:35,680
Speaker 1: this one person. The way that I see you're handling

542
00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:38,240
Speaker 1: this case, it can't be just this one. Let's go

543
00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:42,200
Speaker 1: ahead and dig into really how you conduct business? Period?

544
00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:44,680
Speaker 1: And do you know when I said that, this woman

545
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:47,520
Speaker 1: immediately paused the brakes and stopped everything that she was

546
00:27:47,560 --> 00:27:49,600
Speaker 1: doing because she realized she had had the right one.

547
00:27:49,880 --> 00:27:52,400
Speaker 1: But Kelly, there's not always somebody like me in the room?

548
00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:55,120
Speaker 1: Are you in the room? What do they do when

549
00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:57,040
Speaker 1: they're home because they don't want to speak up? Because

550
00:27:57,040 --> 00:27:59,399
Speaker 1: they don't And and and my friend, he tried everything.

551
00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:02,240
Speaker 1: He asked to be transferred to someone else. That didn't work.

552
00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:05,280
Speaker 1: He tried to soft a little complaint that didn't work.

553
00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:06,760
Speaker 1: He was so nervous where you know, I don't want

554
00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:08,919
Speaker 1: to be tripping. I'm just glad that what do you

555
00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:12,280
Speaker 1: What do they do when there's a situation where they say,

556
00:28:12,320 --> 00:28:16,240
Speaker 1: this doesn't feel right. I feel this person is abusing

557
00:28:16,280 --> 00:28:20,199
Speaker 1: me emotionally or mentally and really, you know, trying to

558
00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:22,640
Speaker 1: make my life harder. What do they do when there's

559
00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:25,199
Speaker 1: not a Kelly in the office that is willing to

560
00:28:25,280 --> 00:28:28,960
Speaker 1: report that person. Well, normally the avenew that they would

561
00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:30,800
Speaker 1: have to take is they would just need to go

562
00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:34,280
Speaker 1: above that officer UM and talk to that person supervisor

563
00:28:34,880 --> 00:28:37,560
Speaker 1: UM and kind of tell them what's going on at

564
00:28:37,560 --> 00:28:39,960
Speaker 1: our office. We switched around cases all the time, so

565
00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:43,400
Speaker 1: if someone had an issue, or even just as a supervisor,

566
00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:46,080
Speaker 1: if I saw someone was having an issue and they

567
00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:48,960
Speaker 1: were just not able to some people just aren't gonna

568
00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:50,960
Speaker 1: make the connection. Not saying that they're gonna get along,

569
00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:56,400
Speaker 1: but the end goal it should always be for this

570
00:28:56,480 --> 00:29:00,200
Speaker 1: person to complete this portion of their life success fully

571
00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:02,240
Speaker 1: and go on and do whatever they're gonna do. That

572
00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:04,840
Speaker 1: should always be being goal. If it's anything other than that,

573
00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:06,840
Speaker 1: you don't need to work here, you know. And that's

574
00:29:06,880 --> 00:29:10,000
Speaker 1: what I used to tell people all the time. You you,

575
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:12,239
Speaker 1: your goal should be for them to be able to

576
00:29:12,280 --> 00:29:14,920
Speaker 1: complete their probation or pearl sentence and move on with

577
00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:18,800
Speaker 1: their life. If your specific goal is to violate everybody,

578
00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:23,520
Speaker 1: we got a problem and so um, their first step

579
00:29:23,600 --> 00:29:27,880
Speaker 1: should always be that officer's immediate supervisor and then could

580
00:29:27,920 --> 00:29:30,360
Speaker 1: kind of go from there because that person has the

581
00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:32,920
Speaker 1: ability to make those changes. It's not really a big

582
00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:35,440
Speaker 1: deal to change someone's probation. Officers. They may make it

583
00:29:35,480 --> 00:29:38,480
Speaker 1: seem like it is, but it's not. What if they say, well,

584
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:41,480
Speaker 1: I go, if I go to that person, it's gonna

585
00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:44,480
Speaker 1: make it even worse. Because they're all connected, they all

586
00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:47,640
Speaker 1: work with each other. They they all like, how do

587
00:29:47,720 --> 00:29:52,720
Speaker 1: they get over that anxiety of just telling if you

588
00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:55,880
Speaker 1: will you know somebody who's like, it's one of those

589
00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:58,720
Speaker 1: things where UM, sometimes you just have to kind of

590
00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:00,600
Speaker 1: suck it up and deal with it, you know, if

591
00:30:00,640 --> 00:30:03,640
Speaker 1: you aren't willing to tell, because that's the only way

592
00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:05,560
Speaker 1: that it's gonna change is you have to say, you

593
00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:07,400
Speaker 1: have to open up your mouth and say something. Do

594
00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:10,680
Speaker 1: they have anonymous like tips or is that set up

595
00:30:10,680 --> 00:30:12,640
Speaker 1: in the system anywhere like what it should be with

596
00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:14,720
Speaker 1: cops on the ground, Like is there is there a

597
00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:18,720
Speaker 1: system set up in a lot of they have a

598
00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:22,680
Speaker 1: grievance policy that is set up with UM. If your

599
00:30:22,760 --> 00:30:25,840
Speaker 1: officer is you know, you feel like your officers mistreating

600
00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:27,640
Speaker 1: you in any type of way, they have a grievance

601
00:30:27,680 --> 00:30:30,040
Speaker 1: policy set up to where the vendors can file a

602
00:30:30,040 --> 00:30:33,080
Speaker 1: grievance on that officer. But can they do it anonymous?

603
00:30:34,200 --> 00:30:38,800
Speaker 1: M Probably not. Maybe shouldn't be because it again make

604
00:30:38,880 --> 00:30:41,280
Speaker 1: do you think it should be? I know that in

605
00:30:41,360 --> 00:30:44,760
Speaker 1: order to I'm not necessarily saying that the the the

606
00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:47,840
Speaker 1: anonymous tip or the grievance policies shouldn't result in an

607
00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:50,320
Speaker 1: officer losing their job without having the details of the

608
00:30:50,360 --> 00:30:53,800
Speaker 1: file and you know, really being able to mediate that

609
00:30:53,960 --> 00:30:58,760
Speaker 1: and figure out who did what. But should there be uh,

610
00:30:58,840 --> 00:31:01,480
Speaker 1: you know, a complaints to them where somebody is able

611
00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:03,120
Speaker 1: to say, hey, you know what, I think Kelly is

612
00:31:03,120 --> 00:31:05,400
Speaker 1: too rough on me, she's too whatever. That at least

613
00:31:05,480 --> 00:31:10,160
Speaker 1: it gives the supervisor heads up to look further into

614
00:31:10,360 --> 00:31:13,360
Speaker 1: something or two. And should there be something like that?

615
00:31:13,520 --> 00:31:17,880
Speaker 1: And and that has happened. Um I had um a

616
00:31:17,920 --> 00:31:21,760
Speaker 1: girlfriend complained on me one time because she said that

617
00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:24,680
Speaker 1: I was too friendly with her boyfriend. Mind you, I

618
00:31:24,680 --> 00:31:26,480
Speaker 1: think I was. I don't know how old I was

619
00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:29,440
Speaker 1: at the time, but the boy was like eighteen and

620
00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:33,480
Speaker 1: I was, I'm sure thirty something. And so she called

621
00:31:33,480 --> 00:31:35,320
Speaker 1: and she was like, I just don't like their relationship.

622
00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:37,640
Speaker 1: So she had called and talked to my supervisors. So

623
00:31:37,720 --> 00:31:39,720
Speaker 1: he came and talked to me about it, and I

624
00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:43,600
Speaker 1: was like, what, Like they literally went through my personal

625
00:31:43,640 --> 00:31:50,600
Speaker 1: cell phone UM records. They went through UM my UM

626
00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:54,560
Speaker 1: office cell phone records to see if I was making

627
00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:56,800
Speaker 1: any you know, like all the time with calls to

628
00:31:56,840 --> 00:31:59,840
Speaker 1: this particular number. Of course I wasn't because again he

629
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:02,800
Speaker 1: was eighteen and but but she did it, but she

630
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:06,320
Speaker 1: didn't do it anonymously though, so I'm asking, didn't ask

631
00:32:06,520 --> 00:32:09,240
Speaker 1: should there be do you have an inappropriate relation? Do

632
00:32:09,320 --> 00:32:11,480
Speaker 1: you think that the system could benefit and this is

633
00:32:11,520 --> 00:32:14,360
Speaker 1: my question, could the system benefit from having some type

634
00:32:14,360 --> 00:32:18,160
Speaker 1: of tipline or do you think that would open up

635
00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:21,800
Speaker 1: the officers to be vulnerable to certain things? Like do

636
00:32:21,880 --> 00:32:26,360
Speaker 1: you see that being a benefit a benefit or is

637
00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:30,400
Speaker 1: it a anonymous tampline? UM? I think it probably would

638
00:32:30,480 --> 00:32:33,480
Speaker 1: be beneficial for it to be anonymous, because you will

639
00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:36,360
Speaker 1: have people that may I kind of see where you're going,

640
00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:38,600
Speaker 1: like someone like if they complain on their officer, then

641
00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:40,880
Speaker 1: their officers kind of be vindictive and try to get

642
00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:43,200
Speaker 1: because like that happened me. You have anonymous tip lines

643
00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:47,200
Speaker 1: at work, you have suggestion boxes in corporate America. I

644
00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:50,440
Speaker 1: think now the supervisor could have used that too and

645
00:32:50,600 --> 00:32:53,000
Speaker 1: take that anonymous tips face value, which I don't think

646
00:32:53,040 --> 00:32:56,080
Speaker 1: that they should, but at least it puts more onus,

647
00:32:56,200 --> 00:32:59,600
Speaker 1: on the professional, the supervisor, so you don't make a

648
00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:02,280
Speaker 1: decision and a thoughtful decision on how they look at

649
00:33:02,280 --> 00:33:05,040
Speaker 1: that tip or if you know it's something they're look into.

650
00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:07,480
Speaker 1: But I don't think the I don't think that all

651
00:33:07,600 --> 00:33:12,280
Speaker 1: of the responsibility should be on the offender to complain

652
00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:15,040
Speaker 1: because although we're saying, Okay, you suck it up, you

653
00:33:15,080 --> 00:33:17,800
Speaker 1: just gotta tell I know what I've seen. You know,

654
00:33:17,960 --> 00:33:19,960
Speaker 1: with just people I know that have come home, the

655
00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:23,600
Speaker 1: anxiety is so high that and they just spent fifteen

656
00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:25,640
Speaker 1: years and sucking it up with a bad CEO or

657
00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:29,000
Speaker 1: a bad case manager or whatever, because it was all about, hey,

658
00:33:29,040 --> 00:33:30,320
Speaker 1: I just want to do my time and I just

659
00:33:30,360 --> 00:33:32,320
Speaker 1: want to get home. But people that come home and

660
00:33:32,360 --> 00:33:36,040
Speaker 1: have to do five additional years on probation and manage

661
00:33:36,080 --> 00:33:39,440
Speaker 1: everyday life, and they feel they have nobody to talk

662
00:33:39,480 --> 00:33:42,440
Speaker 1: to without us attaching their name, that's a real fear.

663
00:33:42,480 --> 00:33:44,440
Speaker 1: And I'm just wondering if if that, if it would

664
00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:47,560
Speaker 1: be beneficial because if you just have one complaint, I'm saying, hey,

665
00:33:47,640 --> 00:33:50,560
Speaker 1: Kelly is like this, okay, fine, But if you see

666
00:33:50,680 --> 00:33:53,680
Speaker 1: numerous over and over and over various people, the common

667
00:33:53,720 --> 00:33:56,720
Speaker 1: Denominator said kinda might be Kelly. So I'm just wondering.

668
00:33:57,040 --> 00:33:59,760
Speaker 1: And we've had that, We didn't have that. We have

669
00:34:00,040 --> 00:34:04,680
Speaker 1: one guy UM that there were numerous complaints and come

670
00:34:04,760 --> 00:34:06,640
Speaker 1: to find out, I think he was doing I don't

671
00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:08,719
Speaker 1: remember what he was doing, but they did find out

672
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:11,759
Speaker 1: that he was doing some shadiness. And so we did

673
00:34:11,840 --> 00:34:14,759
Speaker 1: have those complaints, and I don't know if they were

674
00:34:14,800 --> 00:34:18,480
Speaker 1: anonymous or what, but we there. Again, there are avenues

675
00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:20,759
Speaker 1: and it's kind of like the UM what does it say,

676
00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:22,840
Speaker 1: The squeaky will is the one that gets the oil.

677
00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:27,840
Speaker 1: So if you have continuous or complaints on this one person,

678
00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:31,120
Speaker 1: at some point, you know it's coming from different angles.

679
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:35,479
Speaker 1: They have to look at that, because everybody's not gonna

680
00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:38,439
Speaker 1: be complaining, you know, about one person. You know, there's

681
00:34:38,520 --> 00:34:40,520
Speaker 1: like you know, normally I don't like them or they

682
00:34:40,520 --> 00:34:43,040
Speaker 1: don't like me, stuff like that. But when you continually

683
00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:47,759
Speaker 1: have complaints about one particular person, there's maybe not that

684
00:34:47,920 --> 00:35:00,600
Speaker 1: going on, but there's gotta be something there, Well, I'm

685
00:35:00,600 --> 00:35:02,359
Speaker 1: gonna get some tips. So those are listening, you can

686
00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:04,880
Speaker 1: let me know, and it's okay if you disagree, because

687
00:35:04,960 --> 00:35:06,480
Speaker 1: right now what I heard you say is there's not

688
00:35:06,560 --> 00:35:09,480
Speaker 1: really a system per se that has an anonymous tipline.

689
00:35:09,560 --> 00:35:13,440
Speaker 1: So what I have told individuals that if you are uncomfortable,

690
00:35:13,520 --> 00:35:15,480
Speaker 1: you know, coming forward, just like I would if I

691
00:35:15,560 --> 00:35:18,279
Speaker 1: was an HR whistle blowing that type of thing, to

692
00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:23,600
Speaker 1: reach out to an organization outside of the system, like uh,

693
00:35:23,640 --> 00:35:25,319
Speaker 1: you know, whether it's the Urban League or the Double

694
00:35:25,400 --> 00:35:28,480
Speaker 1: A c P or your pastor or somebody um in

695
00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:32,080
Speaker 1: a leadership position within the community that is willing to

696
00:35:32,120 --> 00:35:35,600
Speaker 1: go speak on your behalf without saying who you are,

697
00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:38,840
Speaker 1: because those are that That would be my tip because

698
00:35:38,840 --> 00:35:40,279
Speaker 1: if I know, if I were to go to my

699
00:35:40,400 --> 00:35:42,759
Speaker 1: friend Mr. Pruett, you know Oklahoma City and Double A

700
00:35:42,800 --> 00:35:46,200
Speaker 1: CP president in Oklahoma City, I've I've given him certain

701
00:35:46,239 --> 00:35:48,480
Speaker 1: cases where he can go and actually say, hey, we're

702
00:35:48,520 --> 00:35:51,760
Speaker 1: getting some complaints, um you know out of this office

703
00:35:52,120 --> 00:35:54,759
Speaker 1: that Kelly is x y Z. Out of protection of

704
00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:57,440
Speaker 1: the folks that I'm representing, you know, I don't want

705
00:35:57,480 --> 00:35:59,400
Speaker 1: to get into the details, but I do want to

706
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:02,520
Speaker 1: make air so that would be my my suggestion. You

707
00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:04,200
Speaker 1: can let me know if you disagree with that. But

708
00:36:04,280 --> 00:36:05,960
Speaker 1: I know that it has been helpful. You know that

709
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:08,880
Speaker 1: I've told people that, get somebody to advocate on your behalf,

710
00:36:08,880 --> 00:36:11,480
Speaker 1: because I just think it's really hard to you know,

711
00:36:11,640 --> 00:36:15,640
Speaker 1: for people to give their and even the psychological part

712
00:36:15,640 --> 00:36:17,919
Speaker 1: of the no snitching cold you know, that's a whole

713
00:36:17,920 --> 00:36:21,200
Speaker 1: another conversation, you know, and so it just it's just

714
00:36:21,360 --> 00:36:23,960
Speaker 1: really hard. And I've just seen so many people just

715
00:36:24,200 --> 00:36:28,120
Speaker 1: have officers abuse their power and they just feel helpless

716
00:36:28,360 --> 00:36:30,239
Speaker 1: and then they backed out and they end up going

717
00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:33,000
Speaker 1: back to prison. Right, let me just tell you one

718
00:36:33,040 --> 00:36:36,799
Speaker 1: thing that that that no uh state agency aren't is

719
00:36:36,880 --> 00:36:44,799
Speaker 1: any outside agency coming up. Don't that if that is

720
00:36:44,920 --> 00:36:51,560
Speaker 1: way they choose to believe it, nobody wants that press.

721
00:36:51,680 --> 00:36:53,880
Speaker 1: You better believe it because I'm told it. I know

722
00:36:53,960 --> 00:36:56,239
Speaker 1: it worked. And then my friends, Wow, I wish you

723
00:36:56,360 --> 00:36:58,520
Speaker 1: to know this all the time. And he knows me,

724
00:36:58,640 --> 00:37:02,160
Speaker 1: he know, But again, I couldn't compete with the anxiety

725
00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:05,080
Speaker 1: did he had for sixteen years? Even though and I'm like, hey,

726
00:37:05,120 --> 00:37:06,680
Speaker 1: now you know I can shut this down now, and

727
00:37:06,680 --> 00:37:08,240
Speaker 1: he was like, no, I don't want you to nobody

728
00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:09,880
Speaker 1: ever want me to show up. My grandmother wants me.

729
00:37:10,360 --> 00:37:12,400
Speaker 1: When somebody called me, they know it's over with, so

730
00:37:12,440 --> 00:37:15,600
Speaker 1: they do where they avoid everything, you know, to call me.

731
00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:17,960
Speaker 1: But it was just to the point she just happened

732
00:37:17,960 --> 00:37:21,640
Speaker 1: to call me one time on on his behalf. And

733
00:37:21,680 --> 00:37:25,279
Speaker 1: so I have my opportunity because she, you know, kind

734
00:37:25,280 --> 00:37:26,799
Speaker 1: of got a little slip with the lips with me.

735
00:37:26,840 --> 00:37:28,719
Speaker 1: So it gave me an opportunity to say, wait a minute,

736
00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:32,839
Speaker 1: hold up, you got the right cusie. That happens too

737
00:37:33,040 --> 00:37:36,239
Speaker 1: with um, like you know, talking to the girlfriends or

738
00:37:36,280 --> 00:37:39,520
Speaker 1: the cousin or the family, and even the family will

739
00:37:39,920 --> 00:37:43,040
Speaker 1: tolerate certain abuses because they don't want to make it

740
00:37:43,080 --> 00:37:46,040
Speaker 1: harder for their loved one. This particular time, I was

741
00:37:46,239 --> 00:37:48,839
Speaker 1: because I know what I do for a living. I

742
00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:51,480
Speaker 1: was able to make it easier for my loved one.

743
00:37:51,520 --> 00:37:54,279
Speaker 1: But I know that it's rare. It doesn't happen that way.

744
00:37:54,760 --> 00:37:56,680
Speaker 1: Most people just we just want you to get home,

745
00:37:56,719 --> 00:37:58,200
Speaker 1: We want you to stay home. But I was able

746
00:37:58,200 --> 00:37:59,440
Speaker 1: to shut it down and say no, no no, no, not

747
00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:01,759
Speaker 1: only am I I'm gonna pull every foul you have.

748
00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:04,279
Speaker 1: I will have a press conference tomorrow. I told you

749
00:38:04,280 --> 00:38:08,120
Speaker 1: you might want to google me. Uh I was responsibly,

750
00:38:08,120 --> 00:38:09,960
Speaker 1: I don't know if I was. Response was a part

751
00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:12,719
Speaker 1: of the Oklahoma City House called rate Case. Um. So

752
00:38:13,040 --> 00:38:15,360
Speaker 1: when I go after you and I'm not playing games

753
00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:18,200
Speaker 1: with you, I will call a full press conference and

754
00:38:18,280 --> 00:38:21,719
Speaker 1: ask anybody that ever did any time with you. Let's

755
00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:23,480
Speaker 1: start digging into the foul, and it's gonna turn to

756
00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:25,279
Speaker 1: a class actual loss. I mean, she shut it all

757
00:38:25,320 --> 00:38:27,880
Speaker 1: the way down. So for those who are listening, let

758
00:38:27,960 --> 00:38:31,239
Speaker 1: me also say, don't don't don't write a check that

759
00:38:31,360 --> 00:38:34,120
Speaker 1: you ass can't cash. Don't sit around the time about

760
00:38:34,120 --> 00:38:35,719
Speaker 1: what you're gonna do and how you gonna do and

761
00:38:35,760 --> 00:38:37,480
Speaker 1: all of that, and you know you don't have a resource,

762
00:38:37,520 --> 00:38:39,839
Speaker 1: So let me say that too. Be very careful. Though

763
00:38:39,840 --> 00:38:42,920
Speaker 1: I'm sharing my personal story indirectly affected, I want to

764
00:38:42,920 --> 00:38:46,000
Speaker 1: make sure that you understand. Don't try that at home.

765
00:38:46,320 --> 00:38:49,000
Speaker 1: Don't sit around here and make threats to probation officers

766
00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:52,200
Speaker 1: and state agencies, because you really can't make your life

767
00:38:52,200 --> 00:38:54,080
Speaker 1: for living here, especially when you know you're not standing

768
00:38:54,120 --> 00:38:56,880
Speaker 1: on justice and facts. My particular situation, I knew I

769
00:38:56,920 --> 00:38:58,560
Speaker 1: was standing on Wolf was right, So let me put

770
00:38:58,600 --> 00:39:01,520
Speaker 1: that out there too. Don't start are trying to punk

771
00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:03,480
Speaker 1: the system because the system got away of letting you

772
00:39:03,520 --> 00:39:06,319
Speaker 1: know that they are the system. So let's let's make

773
00:39:06,360 --> 00:39:11,120
Speaker 1: that Let's make that clear as well. UM. So as

774
00:39:11,160 --> 00:39:13,799
Speaker 1: we wrap up our time here, give a couple of

775
00:39:13,800 --> 00:39:16,839
Speaker 1: more things. And I've been enjoying this conversation. We talked

776
00:39:16,840 --> 00:39:19,560
Speaker 1: about make sure you don't try to bribe your your

777
00:39:19,880 --> 00:39:23,560
Speaker 1: your bio. Uh, make sure that you're staying in communication

778
00:39:24,080 --> 00:39:27,600
Speaker 1: if you get arrested, different moves, things of that sort. Um,

779
00:39:28,520 --> 00:39:30,399
Speaker 1: give us a couple of other things. We talked about

780
00:39:30,440 --> 00:39:33,279
Speaker 1: what to handle, you know, when someone is abusing their power.

781
00:39:33,320 --> 00:39:35,640
Speaker 1: And thank you for going down that that role with me,

782
00:39:35,719 --> 00:39:38,319
Speaker 1: because people can get offended with that and say, oh,

783
00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:40,160
Speaker 1: no it's never us, but it is us. So thank

784
00:39:40,160 --> 00:39:43,200
Speaker 1: you for being transparent enough to show to say that, hey,

785
00:39:43,239 --> 00:39:45,520
Speaker 1: everybody that work here doesn't need to work here. We

786
00:39:45,600 --> 00:39:49,520
Speaker 1: also talked about not exploiting, UM when you see someone

787
00:39:49,680 --> 00:39:52,680
Speaker 1: like yourself. UM, if you could give us maybe a

788
00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:54,719
Speaker 1: couple of more things, you know, as we wrap up,

789
00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:57,120
Speaker 1: I love how you talked about the main goal is

790
00:39:57,200 --> 00:40:01,040
Speaker 1: to get this part of the process complete, UM, And

791
00:40:01,160 --> 00:40:04,080
Speaker 1: that is what this really is all about. Reducing recidivism.

792
00:40:04,520 --> 00:40:06,400
Speaker 1: If you were to name a couple of things, or

793
00:40:06,440 --> 00:40:08,719
Speaker 1: one or two or however you want to frame it

794
00:40:09,040 --> 00:40:12,319
Speaker 1: on something that you see that happens all the time.

795
00:40:12,680 --> 00:40:15,120
Speaker 1: We're talking over your twenty year career that you've seen

796
00:40:15,200 --> 00:40:19,759
Speaker 1: probably the most um with how people violate. What is

797
00:40:19,800 --> 00:40:21,600
Speaker 1: that If you had to sum of that one or

798
00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:24,799
Speaker 1: two things that you just consistently see one out of

799
00:40:24,840 --> 00:40:26,719
Speaker 1: every ten or one out of every five and one

800
00:40:26,719 --> 00:40:29,799
Speaker 1: out of every twenty, that is usually the thing that

801
00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:32,960
Speaker 1: that breaks. Is it the family dynamic at home? Is

802
00:40:33,000 --> 00:40:35,400
Speaker 1: it being connected because one of the shows talked about,

803
00:40:35,480 --> 00:40:39,400
Speaker 1: you know, jumping in these relationships and not being ready

804
00:40:39,440 --> 00:40:43,279
Speaker 1: for relationships and domestic violence, and that is something people

805
00:40:43,360 --> 00:40:45,680
Speaker 1: violate for. You may have a girlfriend and every time

806
00:40:45,680 --> 00:40:47,279
Speaker 1: you do something, she say, hey, I'm gonna call your

807
00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:49,040
Speaker 1: p O p O. We got to talk about that,

808
00:40:49,120 --> 00:40:51,080
Speaker 1: two ladies. Maybe not for this conversation, but it's a

809
00:40:51,080 --> 00:40:53,799
Speaker 1: conversation to be had. How you weaponize same way these

810
00:40:54,040 --> 00:40:57,319
Speaker 1: be those weaponized something, y'all be weaponizing it too. Um.

811
00:40:57,360 --> 00:40:59,640
Speaker 1: I know that's a high one on the list. Um.

812
00:41:00,120 --> 00:41:02,640
Speaker 1: What what do you see is it the the person?

813
00:41:02,840 --> 00:41:06,320
Speaker 1: Is that the uh, you know, the indirect relationships around

814
00:41:06,360 --> 00:41:08,520
Speaker 1: and what if you sing the most kelly UM that

815
00:41:08,560 --> 00:41:10,960
Speaker 1: you can tell our listeners to look at, probably a

816
00:41:11,000 --> 00:41:15,600
Speaker 1: combination of all of those. UM. I have one more story,

817
00:41:15,680 --> 00:41:20,000
Speaker 1: but one UH in particular that literally just broke my

818
00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:24,480
Speaker 1: heart because I saw we we all saw it coming.

819
00:41:24,960 --> 00:41:28,040
Speaker 1: And so this guy got out on an ankle monitor UM.

820
00:41:28,280 --> 00:41:31,320
Speaker 1: And in Oklahoma, I'm sure you know this at this point,

821
00:41:31,320 --> 00:41:35,400
Speaker 1: but if they get out UM on the ankle monitor program,

822
00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:39,600
Speaker 1: they can't do anything wrong because they're still considered an inmate.

823
00:41:39,880 --> 00:41:42,799
Speaker 1: And basically what Oklahoma did was they let people out

824
00:41:43,360 --> 00:41:49,160
Speaker 1: on these on these GPS programs to UM alleviate prison crowdy.

825
00:41:49,680 --> 00:41:53,200
Speaker 1: So they let people out on the GPS programs and

826
00:41:53,239 --> 00:41:55,799
Speaker 1: those people were still considered inmates, but they were still

827
00:41:55,880 --> 00:41:57,319
Speaker 1: they were able to go get a job, they were

828
00:41:57,440 --> 00:41:59,319
Speaker 1: they were able to go home. They had to be

829
00:41:59,520 --> 00:42:01,799
Speaker 1: home at a certain times. The GPS monitor had to,

830
00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:04,160
Speaker 1: you know, tell us what they were doing everywhere they went,

831
00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:06,920
Speaker 1: and they had and they set up, like the officers

832
00:42:06,920 --> 00:42:10,359
Speaker 1: sets up UM parameters for the what times they work,

833
00:42:10,480 --> 00:42:12,440
Speaker 1: what times they should be at home. If they want

834
00:42:12,440 --> 00:42:14,759
Speaker 1: to do anything outside of those parameters, they would have

835
00:42:14,800 --> 00:42:17,600
Speaker 1: to inform their officers so they could change it. And

836
00:42:17,719 --> 00:42:21,640
Speaker 1: so one guy got out, girlfriend was up there, brought

837
00:42:21,680 --> 00:42:24,080
Speaker 1: him up to the office. We could tell on the

838
00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:26,720
Speaker 1: first visit that she was going to be a problem,

839
00:42:26,760 --> 00:42:30,000
Speaker 1: and we talked to him and said, if you would

840
00:42:30,040 --> 00:42:32,759
Speaker 1: like to move someplace else, let us know so we

841
00:42:32,760 --> 00:42:35,440
Speaker 1: can do a home offer somewhere else because we saw

842
00:42:35,520 --> 00:42:38,600
Speaker 1: that she was gonna be an issue. So of course

843
00:42:38,680 --> 00:42:41,120
Speaker 1: they get into it. He go to other chick. Howse

844
00:42:41,200 --> 00:42:43,480
Speaker 1: she calling up there? He did? He that he she

845
00:42:43,640 --> 00:42:47,640
Speaker 1: calling every day, she called it, she calling, she called. Finally,

846
00:42:48,440 --> 00:42:52,200
Speaker 1: I think, what did you do? I don't remember specifically

847
00:42:52,239 --> 00:42:56,200
Speaker 1: what he did, but it was enough to get him

848
00:42:56,320 --> 00:42:59,280
Speaker 1: sent back, and he was up there, and then she's

849
00:42:59,360 --> 00:43:02,600
Speaker 1: up there with him, crying, and I literally told her,

850
00:43:02,719 --> 00:43:05,320
Speaker 1: I'm like, you're the reason he's going back to prison,

851
00:43:06,360 --> 00:43:09,120
Speaker 1: Like you are the reason because you called up here

852
00:43:09,320 --> 00:43:13,320
Speaker 1: every day with something and now you're in here crying

853
00:43:13,320 --> 00:43:16,279
Speaker 1: and it's nothing because he's going back to prison. Like

854
00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:21,480
Speaker 1: you can't do that. And I'm not saying that people, um,

855
00:43:21,520 --> 00:43:25,520
Speaker 1: you know, I shouldn't call if they need Yeah, yeah,

856
00:43:25,640 --> 00:43:30,359
Speaker 1: like if something is generally generally wrong, genuinely wrong, then yes,

857
00:43:30,520 --> 00:43:34,480
Speaker 1: call up here. But every day you're calling, you're just

858
00:43:34,560 --> 00:43:36,799
Speaker 1: calling because you're piste off right, and maybe you just

859
00:43:36,840 --> 00:43:42,080
Speaker 1: need to get out that relationship, right, you know, air

860
00:43:42,160 --> 00:43:45,960
Speaker 1: out all of your relationship issues. Because Sweete, I don't

861
00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:49,360
Speaker 1: care what he's doing and where he went. I'm concerned about,

862
00:43:49,400 --> 00:43:52,879
Speaker 1: you know, these particular things, but you're calling every day,

863
00:43:52,920 --> 00:43:55,399
Speaker 1: so we have to look into it. And I think

864
00:43:55,400 --> 00:43:59,800
Speaker 1: he ended up getting arrested for like, um, like driving

865
00:43:59,800 --> 00:44:04,000
Speaker 1: a suspension something. He went back to prison for that

866
00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:08,560
Speaker 1: m hm, literally because she just kept you know what

867
00:44:08,640 --> 00:44:11,200
Speaker 1: I mean, it was like everything. So then it was

868
00:44:11,239 --> 00:44:14,359
Speaker 1: like okay, yeah, okay, we got you know, we gotta

869
00:44:14,400 --> 00:44:16,640
Speaker 1: do the paperwork. And it was so sad because he,

870
00:44:16,800 --> 00:44:19,200
Speaker 1: I mean, he was crying, She was crying, and I'm

871
00:44:19,239 --> 00:44:21,560
Speaker 1: just looking like this is your fault, like you know,

872
00:44:21,640 --> 00:44:25,759
Speaker 1: you appears and crying, but you did that. And also him,

873
00:44:25,760 --> 00:44:27,840
Speaker 1: he has to take some response. And I get I know,

874
00:44:27,840 --> 00:44:30,319
Speaker 1: when people come home, they look to these relationships to

875
00:44:30,360 --> 00:44:34,239
Speaker 1: help get them where they need to be. That's right,

876
00:44:34,560 --> 00:44:37,480
Speaker 1: that's right, because it was him, man, she did it,

877
00:44:37,600 --> 00:44:41,520
Speaker 1: but also he allowed you know, we only allowed people

878
00:44:41,520 --> 00:44:43,600
Speaker 1: can only do what we're allowed to do. But I

879
00:44:43,680 --> 00:44:46,560
Speaker 1: do lean towards him in that way because of the

880
00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:48,960
Speaker 1: vulnerability's attached were coming home that might have been his

881
00:44:49,080 --> 00:44:52,120
Speaker 1: only support system is only And that's the thing. So

882
00:44:52,520 --> 00:44:54,799
Speaker 1: um again, I think it's just a combination of all

883
00:44:54,840 --> 00:44:57,600
Speaker 1: of those things, um and And it's a lot. It's

884
00:44:57,600 --> 00:45:00,000
Speaker 1: a lot of responsibility. It's a lot when you're coming

885
00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:03,040
Speaker 1: home and you've been gone, you know it literally, And

886
00:45:03,080 --> 00:45:05,160
Speaker 1: this is what I even tell Like the kids that

887
00:45:05,160 --> 00:45:08,080
Speaker 1: I've dealt with now, you gotta understand, like they're in

888
00:45:08,200 --> 00:45:11,920
Speaker 1: juvenile for because we have yos now, so they may

889
00:45:11,960 --> 00:45:13,879
Speaker 1: be there for up to a year before they get

890
00:45:13,920 --> 00:45:17,120
Speaker 1: placed or go wherever they're going. You got baby mamas

891
00:45:17,160 --> 00:45:19,279
Speaker 1: or whatever out here. They're gonna wait for you for

892
00:45:19,320 --> 00:45:21,880
Speaker 1: a little bit. But nobody's been to sit down and

893
00:45:21,880 --> 00:45:23,640
Speaker 1: wait for you for five six years, you know what

894
00:45:23,719 --> 00:45:26,640
Speaker 1: I mean. So when you get home, it's a whole

895
00:45:26,640 --> 00:45:29,600
Speaker 1: new world. The world does not stopped because you're not

896
00:45:29,800 --> 00:45:33,640
Speaker 1: in it anymore. It continues to go. So when they

897
00:45:33,680 --> 00:45:36,640
Speaker 1: get home, it is hard. It is an adjustment. You

898
00:45:36,640 --> 00:45:38,960
Speaker 1: haven't been around your family in five years, you haven't

899
00:45:38,960 --> 00:45:41,880
Speaker 1: been around people that you grew up with in five years. Again,

900
00:45:42,239 --> 00:45:45,520
Speaker 1: people evolved in things happen, and so they have to

901
00:45:46,480 --> 00:45:48,960
Speaker 1: and it's hard and it sucks, and some people have

902
00:45:49,120 --> 00:45:53,440
Speaker 1: that support system and some people don't, and so um,

903
00:45:53,520 --> 00:45:57,400
Speaker 1: the biggest thing is obviously to try to get some

904
00:45:58,840 --> 00:46:02,640
Speaker 1: sense of normalcy. Arett do. Take the resources that are

905
00:46:02,640 --> 00:46:05,239
Speaker 1: given to you, you know, try to go find a job.

906
00:46:05,280 --> 00:46:07,000
Speaker 1: It may not be the job that you want, but

907
00:46:07,080 --> 00:46:09,080
Speaker 1: at least it's giving you something to do every day,

908
00:46:09,200 --> 00:46:10,840
Speaker 1: so you can, you know, while you're working there, and

909
00:46:10,880 --> 00:46:12,680
Speaker 1: you know, you can kind of build up a little

910
00:46:12,719 --> 00:46:14,200
Speaker 1: bit because you're a little bit of money, you know,

911
00:46:14,320 --> 00:46:16,840
Speaker 1: so you don't have to immediately go back to the street.

912
00:46:16,880 --> 00:46:18,680
Speaker 1: You don't have to, you know, go back to doing

913
00:46:18,680 --> 00:46:19,960
Speaker 1: what you were doing to get you put back in

914
00:46:20,000 --> 00:46:23,040
Speaker 1: the first place. And that's one of the biggest things too,

915
00:46:23,200 --> 00:46:25,799
Speaker 1: is you know it's like, okay, well, you know, my

916
00:46:25,880 --> 00:46:28,439
Speaker 1: people used to hear this all the time. My people

917
00:46:28,440 --> 00:46:30,600
Speaker 1: already have me set up when I got home. Okay,

918
00:46:30,600 --> 00:46:33,759
Speaker 1: set up how right? And they usually not set up

919
00:46:33,800 --> 00:46:37,319
Speaker 1: the way they think because you see it, right, yeah,

920
00:46:37,400 --> 00:46:39,759
Speaker 1: so set up how And you know it's like no,

921
00:46:39,760 --> 00:46:42,520
Speaker 1: no, no no, you know, I got this, I got this going. Okay,

922
00:46:42,560 --> 00:46:44,719
Speaker 1: that's fine, you know, and I hope that that works

923
00:46:44,719 --> 00:46:46,920
Speaker 1: out for you. So you know, if it doesn't, okay,

924
00:46:46,960 --> 00:46:49,319
Speaker 1: then if if that job that your people have set

925
00:46:49,400 --> 00:46:51,439
Speaker 1: up for you didn't work, let's try and set a job.

926
00:46:51,440 --> 00:46:53,279
Speaker 1: And they do get frustrated because a lot of people

927
00:46:53,320 --> 00:46:55,960
Speaker 1: don't want to hire feelings they you know, especially depending

928
00:46:55,960 --> 00:46:58,399
Speaker 1: if they got depending on what their charges are. So

929
00:46:58,560 --> 00:47:02,080
Speaker 1: it is hard. But um, the biggest thing is the

930
00:47:02,160 --> 00:47:05,120
Speaker 1: support system. Again, some people just don't have that, and

931
00:47:05,200 --> 00:47:07,080
Speaker 1: some people do come out with the idea, you know what,

932
00:47:07,200 --> 00:47:09,520
Speaker 1: I'm not doing any of that because they have they're tired,

933
00:47:09,880 --> 00:47:12,920
Speaker 1: and they've been doing this since they were thirteen, fourteen, fifteen,

934
00:47:13,239 --> 00:47:15,800
Speaker 1: and they're tired. Now they're thirty and you know, people

935
00:47:15,840 --> 00:47:17,520
Speaker 1: look up and like, I'm thirty five and I don't

936
00:47:17,560 --> 00:47:20,399
Speaker 1: have anything to show from my life. So they do

937
00:47:20,440 --> 00:47:22,719
Speaker 1: come out, you know, with the different mindset like I

938
00:47:22,719 --> 00:47:25,000
Speaker 1: am gonna go off and do other things with myself,

939
00:47:25,040 --> 00:47:28,080
Speaker 1: and so those things are important, but it's a combination

940
00:47:28,120 --> 00:47:31,560
Speaker 1: of everything. I think. You just have to Um, I

941
00:47:31,560 --> 00:47:33,120
Speaker 1: don't know, it's easy for me to stay you know,

942
00:47:33,280 --> 00:47:36,279
Speaker 1: just kind of persevere and do better. But because that's

943
00:47:36,320 --> 00:47:38,480
Speaker 1: not my life, you know what I mean. So today

944
00:47:38,520 --> 00:47:41,440
Speaker 1: by day thing and and you said it beautifully, Kelly,

945
00:47:41,440 --> 00:47:45,120
Speaker 1: without even hearing all of the other episodes, um, because

946
00:47:45,160 --> 00:47:47,360
Speaker 1: I'm sure you haven't had time to listen all the episode,

947
00:47:47,400 --> 00:47:49,120
Speaker 1: nor have we released them. We have too that we

948
00:47:49,239 --> 00:47:51,200
Speaker 1: released that we haven't even released since you did this.

949
00:47:51,320 --> 00:47:54,520
Speaker 1: But you know what the last two was with a

950
00:47:54,560 --> 00:47:58,799
Speaker 1: psychiatrist Dr Smith and Cliffor Johnson who did fifteen years

951
00:47:58,800 --> 00:48:01,480
Speaker 1: and both of them said, is actually that you haven't

952
00:48:01,480 --> 00:48:03,840
Speaker 1: even heard these interviews, said exactly what you said about

953
00:48:04,239 --> 00:48:06,279
Speaker 1: um the support system. And I brought up like what

954
00:48:06,320 --> 00:48:08,480
Speaker 1: happens though when they don't have a support system, like

955
00:48:08,680 --> 00:48:11,280
Speaker 1: how do they get other you know, other other ways

956
00:48:11,320 --> 00:48:15,160
Speaker 1: to support, whether it's church, friends, you know, other outside entities,

957
00:48:15,320 --> 00:48:18,440
Speaker 1: support groups, whatever it is, because everybody doesn't have that.

958
00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:20,480
Speaker 1: And you said exactly what I mean. You're literally like

959
00:48:20,560 --> 00:48:23,960
Speaker 1: saying verbatim, um, that this interview is so important because

960
00:48:23,960 --> 00:48:27,680
Speaker 1: you're literally saying verbatim things that they talked about UM

961
00:48:27,719 --> 00:48:31,279
Speaker 1: on on one. If you have that support system, appreciate it.

962
00:48:31,560 --> 00:48:34,120
Speaker 1: If you are the support system, not to abuse it,

963
00:48:34,680 --> 00:48:37,840
Speaker 1: um and and to really value it. And we talked

964
00:48:37,840 --> 00:48:41,239
Speaker 1: about that because um, well my friend was doing time.

965
00:48:41,600 --> 00:48:44,000
Speaker 1: There was a lot that I didn't tell him um

966
00:48:44,040 --> 00:48:45,960
Speaker 1: while he was doing time, and I told him it

967
00:48:46,000 --> 00:48:49,320
Speaker 1: was because whatever you needed to keep you motivated to

968
00:48:49,400 --> 00:48:52,359
Speaker 1: do your time better by letting you think that you know.

969
00:48:52,440 --> 00:48:54,040
Speaker 1: And that goes with that, Oh no, I'm set up,

970
00:48:54,040 --> 00:48:56,080
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get home. I got this this straight, order

971
00:48:56,160 --> 00:48:58,200
Speaker 1: this and that. We hear that a lot and a

972
00:48:58,239 --> 00:49:01,319
Speaker 1: lot of times that need you have to have that

973
00:49:01,400 --> 00:49:03,840
Speaker 1: to do that time because you need to look to something.

974
00:49:04,040 --> 00:49:05,799
Speaker 1: But then when you come home and see that it's

975
00:49:05,800 --> 00:49:08,000
Speaker 1: not as easy as you thought, or the homies they't

976
00:49:08,080 --> 00:49:10,960
Speaker 1: chipping in like you thought, or the job is this

977
00:49:11,000 --> 00:49:12,960
Speaker 1: is where they crash and burn and say forget it.

978
00:49:13,000 --> 00:49:16,120
Speaker 1: I'm going back to the streets. You spoke directly on it,

979
00:49:16,160 --> 00:49:18,120
Speaker 1: and you're dead on is. I know you have that

980
00:49:18,200 --> 00:49:21,280
Speaker 1: experience because that's exactly what my last guests talked about

981
00:49:21,640 --> 00:49:25,400
Speaker 1: the last two guests from the mental standpoint, the psychological standpoint,

982
00:49:25,960 --> 00:49:28,600
Speaker 1: from a professional side, and from somebody doing time. In

983
00:49:28,640 --> 00:49:31,239
Speaker 1: the very first interview that we did with Lewis Read,

984
00:49:31,520 --> 00:49:34,560
Speaker 1: he talked about that support system and that's why this

985
00:49:34,600 --> 00:49:38,080
Speaker 1: podcast has been so is weaving it all together to

986
00:49:38,160 --> 00:49:39,799
Speaker 1: make sense. But we do want to give a shout

987
00:49:39,800 --> 00:49:43,160
Speaker 1: out to those that may not have somebody. You know,

988
00:49:43,280 --> 00:49:45,719
Speaker 1: we like to say, oh, somebody loves you. Somebody had

989
00:49:45,960 --> 00:49:47,759
Speaker 1: and they's maybe listen to us right now saying I

990
00:49:47,760 --> 00:49:49,440
Speaker 1: don't have that. So I just want to speak to

991
00:49:49,560 --> 00:49:51,640
Speaker 1: regular to them to say, and like I said in

992
00:49:51,640 --> 00:49:55,200
Speaker 1: the last episode that it may not be your mom,

993
00:49:55,280 --> 00:49:58,040
Speaker 1: your dad's, your friend, your cousin or whatever, but even

994
00:49:58,120 --> 00:50:00,920
Speaker 1: this podcast here, this is a report system. You don't

995
00:50:00,960 --> 00:50:03,920
Speaker 1: have to know me personally, but the tools are out there.

996
00:50:04,280 --> 00:50:07,200
Speaker 1: Find those tools. If they're listening to this, Kelly, that

997
00:50:07,239 --> 00:50:09,680
Speaker 1: means they've already taken a giant step that many people

998
00:50:09,719 --> 00:50:12,640
Speaker 1: because this is not mandatory listening. They're clicking on this

999
00:50:13,080 --> 00:50:17,719
Speaker 1: because they already have somewhat of some motivation to say,

1000
00:50:17,760 --> 00:50:19,920
Speaker 1: I want to do better. So I want to speak

1001
00:50:19,960 --> 00:50:22,879
Speaker 1: to you directly that if you did that, you are

1002
00:50:23,000 --> 00:50:26,400
Speaker 1: halfway where you need to be. And so keep clicking

1003
00:50:26,440 --> 00:50:28,879
Speaker 1: and listening. I'm not talking about this podcast, but any

1004
00:50:28,920 --> 00:50:31,719
Speaker 1: type of self help, any type of anybody can give

1005
00:50:31,760 --> 00:50:33,839
Speaker 1: you some game the same way you learn the game

1006
00:50:33,880 --> 00:50:36,320
Speaker 1: to do whatever criminal activity you know, they got you

1007
00:50:36,520 --> 00:50:38,960
Speaker 1: in the system. And shout out to those who are

1008
00:50:39,080 --> 00:50:41,560
Speaker 1: maybe maybe innocent and had to do time for stuff

1009
00:50:41,560 --> 00:50:43,759
Speaker 1: that I want to make sure that I'm not overlooking them.

1010
00:50:43,880 --> 00:50:46,320
Speaker 1: Whatever it is that got you in those circumstances to

1011
00:50:46,360 --> 00:50:50,360
Speaker 1: get behind that wall, be just as resourceful to help

1012
00:50:50,400 --> 00:50:53,480
Speaker 1: you get out and survive and not go back. And

1013
00:50:53,480 --> 00:50:59,120
Speaker 1: that's what this podcast was all about. Well, Kelly, you've

1014
00:50:59,160 --> 00:51:01,439
Speaker 1: been great and thank you so much. I know our

1015
00:51:01,480 --> 00:51:05,000
Speaker 1: time is up, but I know there's so much you

1016
00:51:05,080 --> 00:51:07,759
Speaker 1: can cover. But I think you've covered. Don't think too it.

1017
00:51:07,800 --> 00:51:09,480
Speaker 1: You covered quite a bit and I'm just gonna recap.

1018
00:51:09,520 --> 00:51:12,480
Speaker 1: You talked about the support system and how you know,

1019
00:51:12,520 --> 00:51:15,400
Speaker 1: really latching onto a support system, the importance of not

1020
00:51:15,520 --> 00:51:19,000
Speaker 1: abusing your probation officer, Also the importance of probation officers

1021
00:51:19,040 --> 00:51:24,680
Speaker 1: not abusing you. A mutual respect of relationship. Respect is key. Uh.

1022
00:51:24,719 --> 00:51:26,800
Speaker 1: Don't try Kelly, just because you think, oh, yes, she

1023
00:51:26,880 --> 00:51:28,640
Speaker 1: black ship female. Don't try it. If you can see

1024
00:51:28,640 --> 00:51:31,280
Speaker 1: her face, you look like the type to not to try. Uh,

1025
00:51:31,360 --> 00:51:33,080
Speaker 1: And people got the young thing stopped trying. People Like

1026
00:51:33,120 --> 00:51:34,440
Speaker 1: I tell you, I was in the military. I was

1027
00:51:34,480 --> 00:51:37,120
Speaker 1: an s SP. I was an M sixty gunner. Like,

1028
00:51:37,200 --> 00:51:42,240
Speaker 1: don't ever get this confused. Everybody, don't look the way

1029
00:51:41,280 --> 00:51:44,719
Speaker 1: the present, So I appreciate you touching on that in

1030
00:51:44,760 --> 00:51:48,520
Speaker 1: the transparency of the stories that you've shared, um, outside

1031
00:51:48,640 --> 00:51:51,600
Speaker 1: of the dudes and don't Obviously, when when people go home,

1032
00:51:51,680 --> 00:51:53,319
Speaker 1: you'll have an opportunity to get to know who your

1033
00:51:53,440 --> 00:51:56,239
Speaker 1: probation officer is. You'll get all of the information that

1034
00:51:56,320 --> 00:51:58,600
Speaker 1: she told you. But shout out to you for giving

1035
00:51:58,680 --> 00:52:02,239
Speaker 1: us some inside game and sideball on what you know

1036
00:52:02,360 --> 00:52:05,279
Speaker 1: one should do, uh and not do as they go

1037
00:52:05,360 --> 00:52:08,960
Speaker 1: through this journey. Again, hopefully we will extend this conversation.

1038
00:52:09,040 --> 00:52:11,200
Speaker 1: I'm hoping because I think there's so much more. I

1039
00:52:11,200 --> 00:52:13,640
Speaker 1: want to bring some panels back where I can kind

1040
00:52:13,640 --> 00:52:15,959
Speaker 1: of match up and we can have, you know, even

1041
00:52:16,040 --> 00:52:19,399
Speaker 1: debate if you will, difference of opinions on how you

1042
00:52:19,440 --> 00:52:22,800
Speaker 1: see you see it from your side versus how uh

1043
00:52:22,880 --> 00:52:25,480
Speaker 1: the psychologists may see it or the person that's been

1044
00:52:25,560 --> 00:52:27,759
Speaker 1: that did time may see it. I think there's a

1045
00:52:27,760 --> 00:52:30,440
Speaker 1: lot of room, you know, to have this conversation and

1046
00:52:30,480 --> 00:52:33,400
Speaker 1: to go further. So if we continue this conversation, I

1047
00:52:33,400 --> 00:52:35,640
Speaker 1: do hope you stick around and become a part of stration,

1048
00:52:35,680 --> 00:52:38,040
Speaker 1: I know, chase of family. UM. So as we can

1049
00:52:38,080 --> 00:52:41,799
Speaker 1: continue this conversation. So Kelly, again, if you unless you

1050
00:52:41,840 --> 00:52:44,480
Speaker 1: have anything else you want to say. In closing, I'm

1051
00:52:44,480 --> 00:52:46,080
Speaker 1: gonna wrap it up. Is there anything else you want

1052
00:52:46,120 --> 00:52:47,719
Speaker 1: to say? I normally tell people, hey, where can they

1053
00:52:47,719 --> 00:52:49,080
Speaker 1: find you? But they don't need to be finding you.

1054
00:52:49,080 --> 00:52:50,920
Speaker 1: They don't need to be finding you on Instagram or

1055
00:52:50,960 --> 00:52:55,359
Speaker 1: Twitter or nothing else. Don't worry about don't worry about

1056
00:52:55,400 --> 00:52:58,880
Speaker 1: what Kelly said. Now all right, I just want to

1057
00:52:58,880 --> 00:53:02,399
Speaker 1: say thank you for the tunity. Um. You know, even

1058
00:53:02,400 --> 00:53:06,080
Speaker 1: though I did retire, retired three years ago now, UM,

1059
00:53:06,160 --> 00:53:10,680
Speaker 1: you know, it was I met some very very interesting people.

1060
00:53:10,800 --> 00:53:13,279
Speaker 1: I will say that. UM and the people that I

1061
00:53:13,320 --> 00:53:16,640
Speaker 1: see now you know out UM. One girl I she

1062
00:53:16,840 --> 00:53:20,440
Speaker 1: was on my caselan when she was seventeen, and I

1063
00:53:20,520 --> 00:53:22,640
Speaker 1: had her until she was twenty something and then we

1064
00:53:22,719 --> 00:53:25,120
Speaker 1: and she got off probation and I lost touch. I

1065
00:53:25,160 --> 00:53:28,399
Speaker 1: saw her last year, like last summer at quit trip

1066
00:53:29,000 --> 00:53:31,600
Speaker 1: and I was messing with my son and she was

1067
00:53:31,680 --> 00:53:33,960
Speaker 1: like Kelly, and I turned around and I was like,

1068
00:53:34,000 --> 00:53:35,640
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, like I haven't seen her in like

1069
00:53:35,719 --> 00:53:39,080
Speaker 1: fifteen years, and like I just hugged her, you know,

1070
00:53:39,200 --> 00:53:41,319
Speaker 1: and just was like I'm so glad that you're doing good,

1071
00:53:41,360 --> 00:53:43,320
Speaker 1: because you know, she literally was one of those because

1072
00:53:43,320 --> 00:53:45,200
Speaker 1: she was seventeen when I got her, so she was

1073
00:53:45,239 --> 00:53:47,359
Speaker 1: one of my babies, you know what I mean. And

1074
00:53:47,440 --> 00:53:49,719
Speaker 1: so I just hugged her. And then she found me

1075
00:53:49,760 --> 00:53:51,920
Speaker 1: on Facebook and our friended her and she made a

1076
00:53:52,040 --> 00:53:55,160
Speaker 1: post about to cry. But she made a post and

1077
00:53:55,239 --> 00:53:57,279
Speaker 1: she put my picture up and she was just like

1078
00:53:57,360 --> 00:54:00,440
Speaker 1: this lady did so much for me and she just

1079
00:54:00,480 --> 00:54:02,399
Speaker 1: will never know. And she I mean, and I did.

1080
00:54:02,440 --> 00:54:04,120
Speaker 1: I kind of went above and beyond for her because

1081
00:54:04,160 --> 00:54:07,200
Speaker 1: she was young and I wanted to help her. But um,

1082
00:54:07,239 --> 00:54:11,040
Speaker 1: you know, stuff like that made it worth it. And

1083
00:54:11,080 --> 00:54:13,160
Speaker 1: you don't get those all the time. It's not. It's

1084
00:54:13,160 --> 00:54:17,080
Speaker 1: a thankless job. So when you get that like that, yeah,

1085
00:54:17,360 --> 00:54:19,399
Speaker 1: that made it worth it. You know, when I get

1086
00:54:19,440 --> 00:54:21,440
Speaker 1: people that say thank you, you know, thank you for

1087
00:54:21,480 --> 00:54:24,160
Speaker 1: being hard on me, thank you for understanding, you know

1088
00:54:24,640 --> 00:54:27,880
Speaker 1: those things. The pay is not the greatest. I mean,

1089
00:54:27,920 --> 00:54:29,640
Speaker 1: it's a state it's a state job, so you know

1090
00:54:29,719 --> 00:54:31,440
Speaker 1: it's not you know, everybody works, it works two and

1091
00:54:31,480 --> 00:54:36,680
Speaker 1: three jobs. But that those things let me know I

1092
00:54:36,719 --> 00:54:39,960
Speaker 1: was doing the best that I could. So that's so,

1093
00:54:40,200 --> 00:54:43,840
Speaker 1: you know, um that that is always something that I

1094
00:54:43,880 --> 00:54:47,160
Speaker 1: would always take take away from my experience um and

1095
00:54:47,200 --> 00:54:49,400
Speaker 1: to know, like I said that I did, you know,

1096
00:54:49,520 --> 00:54:51,960
Speaker 1: make a difference. And so I'll say that. Then to

1097
00:54:52,000 --> 00:54:53,520
Speaker 1: those who are listening to the same way I'm saying,

1098
00:54:53,560 --> 00:54:56,160
Speaker 1: complain if they're not doing the right thing. Also be

1099
00:54:56,239 --> 00:54:59,160
Speaker 1: grateful and say thank you. You know, if somebody's taking

1100
00:54:59,200 --> 00:55:02,080
Speaker 1: this is what I do is very thankless and politics

1101
00:55:02,160 --> 00:55:05,200
Speaker 1: I'm literally talking to a cemetery on most days. So

1102
00:55:05,320 --> 00:55:07,760
Speaker 1: when someone pours into me and say, you know what, Tesla,

1103
00:55:08,160 --> 00:55:10,000
Speaker 1: I appreciate what you said. This helped me. Even when

1104
00:55:10,040 --> 00:55:13,200
Speaker 1: these podcasts very few people, we we respond negatively all

1105
00:55:13,200 --> 00:55:15,560
Speaker 1: the time. We don't like something tweeting, we're talking, well,

1106
00:55:15,640 --> 00:55:18,080
Speaker 1: I don't like it very few times if somebody hit

1107
00:55:18,160 --> 00:55:19,719
Speaker 1: me up in the d M because we have an

1108
00:55:19,719 --> 00:55:23,279
Speaker 1: issue of publicly giving praise and that's sad um. But

1109
00:55:23,440 --> 00:55:25,239
Speaker 1: in the in the d M, oh Man, that really

1110
00:55:25,239 --> 00:55:28,040
Speaker 1: helped me. I really appreciate it. You know that interview

1111
00:55:28,320 --> 00:55:31,360
Speaker 1: that gives me another hundred mouths, you know, more gas

1112
00:55:31,400 --> 00:55:34,120
Speaker 1: to go even further because it is a very thankless job.

1113
00:55:34,200 --> 00:55:37,480
Speaker 1: So when somebody is pouring into you, be grateful and

1114
00:55:37,520 --> 00:55:39,920
Speaker 1: so that blessing can come back to you ten times folds.

1115
00:55:39,920 --> 00:55:42,440
Speaker 1: So I'm glad you shared that story at the end

1116
00:55:42,440 --> 00:55:45,760
Speaker 1: because you you also have to be motivated to know, okay,

1117
00:55:45,840 --> 00:55:48,440
Speaker 1: I'm doing the right thing. How people that end up

1118
00:55:48,440 --> 00:55:50,400
Speaker 1: getting corrupt and or end up saying, you know what,

1119
00:55:50,440 --> 00:55:53,200
Speaker 1: I'm done, I'm over it, It's because nobody ever poured

1120
00:55:53,239 --> 00:55:55,600
Speaker 1: in them too. And people can't assume that you're getting

1121
00:55:55,640 --> 00:55:59,520
Speaker 1: poured into at home or everywhere else because guess what, folks,

1122
00:55:59,600 --> 00:56:02,040
Speaker 1: that's not what it is. I'm usually when i'm like this,

1123
00:56:02,160 --> 00:56:05,160
Speaker 1: I'm the one that pouring to everybody everywhere. You know,

1124
00:56:05,480 --> 00:56:09,960
Speaker 1: my child, my relationship, my my job, everything that I do.

1125
00:56:10,040 --> 00:56:12,560
Speaker 1: I'm poor and poor and pooring, and so don't assume

1126
00:56:12,840 --> 00:56:14,560
Speaker 1: you know you hear people say, oh, I'll tell you

1127
00:56:14,560 --> 00:56:15,759
Speaker 1: you all that, but I don't want you had to

1128
00:56:15,760 --> 00:56:17,919
Speaker 1: blow up any bigger. Well, why I'm putting my life

1129
00:56:17,920 --> 00:56:20,200
Speaker 1: online to make sure you know who you are, to

1130
00:56:20,239 --> 00:56:22,239
Speaker 1: make sure you have value. What's wrong with blowing on

1131
00:56:22,360 --> 00:56:29,200
Speaker 1: my because it ain't right, because it ain't trust me.

1132
00:56:29,520 --> 00:56:32,279
Speaker 1: A few people say good, they always say negative. But

1133
00:56:32,400 --> 00:56:34,400
Speaker 1: why would you not want to say, Kelly, thank you,

1134
00:56:34,440 --> 00:56:36,720
Speaker 1: I appreciate it. What is that? What is it about?

1135
00:56:36,760 --> 00:56:39,000
Speaker 1: And then that goes into mental health. What is it about?

1136
00:56:39,080 --> 00:56:41,720
Speaker 1: Not that's not want to uplift everybody. If I'm willing

1137
00:56:41,719 --> 00:56:44,040
Speaker 1: to go fight the good fight and fight the quote

1138
00:56:44,080 --> 00:56:47,200
Speaker 1: unquote man for you, I believe in lifting you up?

1139
00:56:47,239 --> 00:56:50,160
Speaker 1: Why can't you lift me up? So we again, that's

1140
00:56:50,560 --> 00:56:53,759
Speaker 1: that's trauma, and that's not loving on each other as

1141
00:56:53,800 --> 00:56:56,239
Speaker 1: we should. And so again that's a whole another podcast,

1142
00:56:56,440 --> 00:56:59,040
Speaker 1: but that I'm touching on that because a lot of

1143
00:56:59,080 --> 00:57:01,000
Speaker 1: that has to do while the folks are doing time

1144
00:57:01,120 --> 00:57:04,160
Speaker 1: and those relationships, bad relationships that you get into when

1145
00:57:04,160 --> 00:57:07,680
Speaker 1: you get home, which can help, which causes these violations.

1146
00:57:07,680 --> 00:57:11,279
Speaker 1: So thank you again, Kelly so much for joining me. Um,

1147
00:57:11,320 --> 00:57:12,600
Speaker 1: hope to have you back, because I do want to

1148
00:57:12,640 --> 00:57:14,840
Speaker 1: talk about juvenile detention. I also want to talk about

1149
00:57:15,080 --> 00:57:17,880
Speaker 1: you know what has been the most rewarding. Um. Some

1150
00:57:17,920 --> 00:57:20,880
Speaker 1: people say it's the babies and you know, getting the

1151
00:57:21,000 --> 00:57:23,720
Speaker 1: turn getting uh, you know, the sweet spot of touching

1152
00:57:23,760 --> 00:57:26,120
Speaker 1: them and turning them around in another direction. And then

1153
00:57:26,320 --> 00:57:28,560
Speaker 1: some folks say, I love teaching old dogs new tricks

1154
00:57:28,600 --> 00:57:30,880
Speaker 1: and letting them know that they're still you know, light.

1155
00:57:31,040 --> 00:57:33,560
Speaker 1: And so you have a unique experience of working with

1156
00:57:33,600 --> 00:57:35,560
Speaker 1: both sides, and so I would love to you know,

1157
00:57:35,640 --> 00:57:38,080
Speaker 1: bring you back to to talk about that. I kind

1158
00:57:38,120 --> 00:57:40,280
Speaker 1: of want to ask you though, if you can't answer,

1159
00:57:40,520 --> 00:57:42,960
Speaker 1: what has been the most rewarded has been? The juveniles

1160
00:57:42,960 --> 00:57:45,760
Speaker 1: are the that you see down the rod, like the

1161
00:57:45,920 --> 00:57:49,720
Speaker 1: young lady are the adults I've probably I've been at

1162
00:57:49,720 --> 00:57:54,160
Speaker 1: the jun I've only been at Juvenile for like two years. Okay, so, um, yeah,

1163
00:57:54,240 --> 00:57:58,280
Speaker 1: that's not rewarding yet. Okay, you got a little ways

1164
00:57:58,280 --> 00:58:00,360
Speaker 1: to go. Yeah, you gotta see him turn round to

1165
00:58:00,400 --> 00:58:03,480
Speaker 1: get Yeah, it's not rewarding yet. Um you know what.

1166
00:58:03,720 --> 00:58:06,920
Speaker 1: I'm like, Me and my son were at dinner and

1167
00:58:07,000 --> 00:58:09,800
Speaker 1: one of the kids I forgot and uh. We were

1168
00:58:09,800 --> 00:58:12,000
Speaker 1: sitting there and this kid walks by and he's like

1169
00:58:12,000 --> 00:58:15,000
Speaker 1: I know you. And I'm like why and um He's like,

1170
00:58:15,280 --> 00:58:17,600
Speaker 1: you work at Juvenile and I said yeah, And as

1171
00:58:17,640 --> 00:58:20,439
Speaker 1: he was talking, I did remember him, and I was like, oh,

1172
00:58:20,480 --> 00:58:22,160
Speaker 1: I do remember you. He's like, yeah, I'm not doing

1173
00:58:22,160 --> 00:58:24,120
Speaker 1: any of that stuff no more. He's because he was

1174
00:58:24,160 --> 00:58:26,760
Speaker 1: working at Cheddars and you know, he was doing good.

1175
00:58:26,800 --> 00:58:28,720
Speaker 1: He's like, I'm going to school. I work here. He's

1176
00:58:28,760 --> 00:58:30,880
Speaker 1: like I'm done, I'm done. I'm done. I was like,

1177
00:58:30,920 --> 00:58:37,240
Speaker 1: well good, you know, So that makes me happy, not

1178
00:58:37,360 --> 00:58:39,120
Speaker 1: even to say that, you know, I had a big

1179
00:58:39,160 --> 00:58:41,040
Speaker 1: impact on his life and is I don't think I did,

1180
00:58:41,400 --> 00:58:44,200
Speaker 1: but just for him to stop and say, hey, you know,

1181
00:58:44,440 --> 00:58:47,920
Speaker 1: I know you and you know this is what I'm doing,

1182
00:58:48,400 --> 00:58:51,240
Speaker 1: and so you know, it does give you that Okay, somebody,

1183
00:58:51,320 --> 00:58:53,880
Speaker 1: can you know, turn it around, because I did. I

1184
00:58:53,880 --> 00:58:55,640
Speaker 1: did the other side for so long, and I see

1185
00:58:55,720 --> 00:58:58,440
Speaker 1: so many of the the kids that we have, I

1186
00:58:58,480 --> 00:59:01,360
Speaker 1: see them on the other side, you know what I mean,

1187
00:59:01,400 --> 00:59:04,040
Speaker 1: Like I see them twenty years from now, still going

1188
00:59:04,080 --> 00:59:06,520
Speaker 1: in and out of the system, just because I did

1189
00:59:06,520 --> 00:59:08,880
Speaker 1: it for so long, and I kind of see, you

1190
00:59:08,920 --> 00:59:11,520
Speaker 1: know what that is hopefully something I'll happen in between

1191
00:59:11,560 --> 00:59:15,360
Speaker 1: now and then to stop it. But they're so entrenched

1192
00:59:15,480 --> 00:59:18,920
Speaker 1: into the life that they are currently living that you know,

1193
00:59:18,920 --> 00:59:22,080
Speaker 1: and when we tell them how you're going right now,

1194
00:59:22,480 --> 00:59:24,720
Speaker 1: you have two options. Either gonna be in prison or

1195
00:59:24,760 --> 00:59:27,680
Speaker 1: you're gonna be dead because you cannot continue in the

1196
00:59:27,720 --> 00:59:32,800
Speaker 1: manner that you're going. And so um, like I said,

1197
00:59:32,840 --> 00:59:35,240
Speaker 1: it's not technically rewarding. Yet it's hard for you to

1198
00:59:35,240 --> 00:59:36,840
Speaker 1: see it because they can't see it. They still have

1199
00:59:36,920 --> 00:59:39,000
Speaker 1: so much to give. But I don't want to point out,

1200
00:59:39,040 --> 00:59:41,360
Speaker 1: don't minimize. And it's kind of a perfect example in

1201
00:59:41,400 --> 00:59:43,440
Speaker 1: real time and what I'm talking about how we minimize

1202
00:59:43,440 --> 00:59:45,320
Speaker 1: our efforts. And when you said, you know, I probably

1203
00:59:45,400 --> 00:59:46,760
Speaker 1: make that big of an impact on his life, and

1204
00:59:46,760 --> 00:59:48,600
Speaker 1: I would disagree. It was an impact enough for him

1205
00:59:48,640 --> 00:59:50,760
Speaker 1: to remember you and stop. So that's a big impay.

1206
00:59:51,240 --> 00:59:53,800
Speaker 1: So that's what I'm saying. We have to lift each

1207
00:59:53,800 --> 00:59:56,000
Speaker 1: other and mind all girl, you did that. Let's not

1208
00:59:56,080 --> 00:59:58,840
Speaker 1: skate over that because he obviously remembered you, you know,

1209
00:59:58,960 --> 01:00:01,440
Speaker 1: so you know, keep doing what you're doing. And I

1210
01:00:01,480 --> 01:00:03,560
Speaker 1: hope they gave you a little bit more distance, you know,

1211
01:00:03,600 --> 01:00:06,000
Speaker 1: and it helps. And you know, some of the kids,

1212
01:00:06,080 --> 01:00:08,440
Speaker 1: like they will come and say, miss Kelly, you know

1213
01:00:08,560 --> 01:00:11,280
Speaker 1: we we appreciate you, and they you know, I know that,

1214
01:00:11,360 --> 01:00:13,160
Speaker 1: you know, have some of them respond to me. I

1215
01:00:13,200 --> 01:00:16,560
Speaker 1: can tell that I am helping, you know what I mean. Um,

1216
01:00:16,600 --> 01:00:20,560
Speaker 1: So it's just I don't know, I just have It's

1217
01:00:20,560 --> 01:00:22,160
Speaker 1: just me, I mean, and I'm in you know, I

1218
01:00:22,200 --> 01:00:23,880
Speaker 1: have a tenure old, I'm in love with my son.

1219
01:00:24,360 --> 01:00:27,400
Speaker 1: I just have this thing for just these black boys.

1220
01:00:27,440 --> 01:00:30,520
Speaker 1: I just want them to do so much better, you

1221
01:00:30,560 --> 01:00:32,400
Speaker 1: know what I mean. I just and I feel like,

1222
01:00:32,440 --> 01:00:34,200
Speaker 1: you know, a lot of times they just don't have

1223
01:00:34,320 --> 01:00:36,400
Speaker 1: that someone to you know, love on them and just

1224
01:00:36,480 --> 01:00:38,400
Speaker 1: kind of, you know, give them that you know you

1225
01:00:38,480 --> 01:00:42,840
Speaker 1: don't this doesn't have to be you. So that is, um,

1226
01:00:43,120 --> 01:00:45,440
Speaker 1: kind of just where I'm at. But the most rewarding

1227
01:00:45,440 --> 01:00:48,640
Speaker 1: I think would be like the stop in the quick

1228
01:00:48,680 --> 01:00:50,640
Speaker 1: trip to say, you know, I do appreciate you. I

1229
01:00:50,720 --> 01:00:52,600
Speaker 1: do appreciate all the things that you did for me

1230
01:00:53,160 --> 01:00:58,080
Speaker 1: that you know, let me know, Okay, I did help somebody,

1231
01:00:58,680 --> 01:01:00,800
Speaker 1: and that was always my thing. Even I can't. You

1232
01:01:00,840 --> 01:01:03,680
Speaker 1: can't help everybody, but you know, if you do break

1233
01:01:03,720 --> 01:01:07,040
Speaker 1: the crack with some people, people shouldn't just say, oh,

1234
01:01:07,160 --> 01:01:09,040
Speaker 1: that's just her job, so she just used to doing No.

1235
01:01:09,160 --> 01:01:12,840
Speaker 1: This is emotionally draining. So anything you can give back

1236
01:01:12,920 --> 01:01:16,720
Speaker 1: to say hey, good looking at I appreciate that, it

1237
01:01:16,480 --> 01:01:18,440
Speaker 1: makes it. Like you said, it's a thankless job. And

1238
01:01:18,840 --> 01:01:21,480
Speaker 1: again it's a state job, so the pay was not great.

1239
01:01:22,040 --> 01:01:25,760
Speaker 1: But you know, at the end of the day, I um,

1240
01:01:25,840 --> 01:01:27,880
Speaker 1: I am thankful because I was able to retire and

1241
01:01:27,880 --> 01:01:29,640
Speaker 1: I no longer have to work two jobs because I

1242
01:01:29,640 --> 01:01:34,680
Speaker 1: get a retirement checks. Um. But you know, it is

1243
01:01:34,800 --> 01:01:37,160
Speaker 1: and I see people out in the community and one

1244
01:01:37,160 --> 01:01:40,600
Speaker 1: of my friends she would always be like, um, do

1245
01:01:40,680 --> 01:01:43,160
Speaker 1: you know all the criminals. I was like, how about

1246
01:01:43,200 --> 01:01:45,120
Speaker 1: you just be mad because everybody and told us on

1247
01:01:45,240 --> 01:01:47,120
Speaker 1: probation like, don't be mad at me because I know.

1248
01:01:47,920 --> 01:01:50,120
Speaker 1: And that's that's interesting too when you come back. I

1249
01:01:50,240 --> 01:01:52,040
Speaker 1: like talking about that, like people walking up on you

1250
01:01:52,080 --> 01:01:53,960
Speaker 1: all the time, Like that's some anxiety with that too,

1251
01:01:54,000 --> 01:01:57,800
Speaker 1: I'm sure because everybody's experience wasn't a great experience, you know,

1252
01:01:57,960 --> 01:02:00,720
Speaker 1: people seeing you're such a small town. Have one more

1253
01:02:00,760 --> 01:02:02,520
Speaker 1: story and then I'm alleged because I can talk about

1254
01:02:02,520 --> 01:02:04,560
Speaker 1: this obviously, and I know we only have a certain

1255
01:02:04,600 --> 01:02:06,880
Speaker 1: amount of time. But um, me and my son were

1256
01:02:06,960 --> 01:02:09,520
Speaker 1: at again. We went to get something to eat, and

1257
01:02:09,600 --> 01:02:12,160
Speaker 1: this guy like followed us outside and I'm like holding

1258
01:02:12,200 --> 01:02:16,840
Speaker 1: onto my kids, like what you want, and he was like, um,

1259
01:02:16,960 --> 01:02:18,680
Speaker 1: you used to work at the probation office and I

1260
01:02:18,720 --> 01:02:20,240
Speaker 1: was like yeah. He was like, oh, I just want

1261
01:02:20,280 --> 01:02:22,200
Speaker 1: to tell you, you you know, I remember you was always

1262
01:02:22,200 --> 01:02:24,040
Speaker 1: a good one. And I was like, okay, I don't

1263
01:02:24,080 --> 01:02:26,440
Speaker 1: remember him at them, and he was like, you know,

1264
01:02:26,680 --> 01:02:28,440
Speaker 1: you walked in and I saw you and I remembered you,

1265
01:02:28,480 --> 01:02:30,040
Speaker 1: and I just wanted to know tell you that you

1266
01:02:30,040 --> 01:02:32,520
Speaker 1: you know you, you was always good and I was like,

1267
01:02:32,600 --> 01:02:35,720
Speaker 1: thank you, which was kind of scary because I don't

1268
01:02:35,760 --> 01:02:39,280
Speaker 1: remember that man them, but you know, again enough for

1269
01:02:39,320 --> 01:02:42,240
Speaker 1: him to come and say. But even if you remember them,

1270
01:02:42,400 --> 01:02:44,960
Speaker 1: they're still scary somebody walking up to you. You know,

1271
01:02:45,080 --> 01:02:46,960
Speaker 1: you don't know what impact you had on that part.

1272
01:02:47,040 --> 01:02:49,919
Speaker 1: It could have been an experience or your colleague could

1273
01:02:49,920 --> 01:02:53,040
Speaker 1: have done something. And again, mental illness is real, so

1274
01:02:53,080 --> 01:02:55,840
Speaker 1: they could look at you as the same thing as hurting,

1275
01:02:56,040 --> 01:03:00,360
Speaker 1: you know, as hurting being a representative of a bad experience. Yeah,

1276
01:03:00,560 --> 01:03:03,560
Speaker 1: so that's a lot. That's so it's you know, it

1277
01:03:03,640 --> 01:03:05,800
Speaker 1: comes both ways, like there's the good and then there's

1278
01:03:05,840 --> 01:03:08,240
Speaker 1: the oh, what do you want? And you know again

1279
01:03:08,280 --> 01:03:10,120
Speaker 1: because this is my kid, Like I'm not at work,

1280
01:03:10,280 --> 01:03:12,400
Speaker 1: so you know what I mean, Like, this is my child,

1281
01:03:12,440 --> 01:03:14,760
Speaker 1: and I have to you know, I stay strapped. I'm

1282
01:03:14,760 --> 01:03:16,320
Speaker 1: not gonna ask you if you be strapped, not because

1283
01:03:16,320 --> 01:03:18,360
Speaker 1: people don't need to know, but I I'm hoping you

1284
01:03:18,400 --> 01:03:20,960
Speaker 1: stay strapped at all times. I believe in the second

1285
01:03:20,960 --> 01:03:26,520
Speaker 1: of me at all that's correct, that's correct. I believe

1286
01:03:27,200 --> 01:03:29,440
Speaker 1: me and my girlfriend, honey, I believe it is so

1287
01:03:29,560 --> 01:03:33,000
Speaker 1: you don't try it and you have. So yeah, well,

1288
01:03:33,000 --> 01:03:36,080
Speaker 1: thank you for sharing that. This has been wonderful anticipated

1289
01:03:36,240 --> 01:03:39,760
Speaker 1: being a great opportunity. Yeah, I anticipated being a great interview,

1290
01:03:39,760 --> 01:03:41,240
Speaker 1: but it turned out even better than what I thought

1291
01:03:41,280 --> 01:03:43,240
Speaker 1: because all of the things I wanted to talk about,

1292
01:03:43,280 --> 01:03:45,440
Speaker 1: I like them to come out naturally in the conversation

1293
01:03:45,480 --> 01:03:47,080
Speaker 1: because I just want people to feel like they're just

1294
01:03:47,120 --> 01:03:49,040
Speaker 1: in the room and we're just chatting. And you were

1295
01:03:49,040 --> 01:03:51,240
Speaker 1: able to touch on all those points and you weaved

1296
01:03:51,320 --> 01:03:55,200
Speaker 1: in perfectly. Um, how to closing out this series, So

1297
01:03:55,440 --> 01:03:58,760
Speaker 1: again shout out to council Woman Harper for always looking

1298
01:03:58,800 --> 01:04:01,040
Speaker 1: out of being one of the best as allies that

1299
01:04:01,120 --> 01:04:03,960
Speaker 1: I have in the game. Uh and and answering the

1300
01:04:04,000 --> 01:04:05,840
Speaker 1: call and recommending you when I said, you know, I

1301
01:04:05,880 --> 01:04:07,680
Speaker 1: was looking for somebody I wanted to very I was

1302
01:04:07,720 --> 01:04:10,720
Speaker 1: looking for somebody with a very particular, you know background,

1303
01:04:10,920 --> 01:04:12,560
Speaker 1: And shout out to everybody out to know I had

1304
01:04:12,600 --> 01:04:15,120
Speaker 1: so many followers that, um, I either know somebody in

1305
01:04:15,160 --> 01:04:17,960
Speaker 1: this field or in this field themselves or whatever. I

1306
01:04:18,080 --> 01:04:20,400
Speaker 1: learned a great deal amount just doing this series. As

1307
01:04:20,400 --> 01:04:22,120
Speaker 1: we wrap it up that I have a lot of

1308
01:04:22,160 --> 01:04:26,040
Speaker 1: mental health experts that follow me that worked exactly with

1309
01:04:26,160 --> 01:04:30,800
Speaker 1: you know, uh, incarcerating individuals. We have UM therapists and

1310
01:04:30,800 --> 01:04:34,880
Speaker 1: psychologists and clinical workers and social workers and p o s,

1311
01:04:34,960 --> 01:04:37,840
Speaker 1: and that's a wonderful, wonderful thing because we want I

1312
01:04:38,320 --> 01:04:41,240
Speaker 1: I pride myself on being able to talk to various

1313
01:04:41,280 --> 01:04:43,880
Speaker 1: walks of life. And then I asked folks. I put

1314
01:04:43,880 --> 01:04:45,960
Speaker 1: a call out to say how many folks have violated?

1315
01:04:45,960 --> 01:04:47,840
Speaker 1: And I got an old one. You say, yeah, I violated.

1316
01:04:47,840 --> 01:04:50,000
Speaker 1: I didn't talk. So we have a cross the spectrum.

1317
01:04:50,040 --> 01:04:53,640
Speaker 1: So this was rewarding to me for doing this entire project.

1318
01:04:53,720 --> 01:04:57,120
Speaker 1: Thank you again to the George roy Foundation for allowing

1319
01:04:57,600 --> 01:05:02,360
Speaker 1: me the opportunity to create this content. Originally, create this content,

1320
01:05:02,440 --> 01:05:04,600
Speaker 1: find the sources that we need, put it together, do

1321
01:05:04,680 --> 01:05:06,600
Speaker 1: the interviews, and I hope we can do more. And

1322
01:05:06,640 --> 01:05:11,040
Speaker 1: we gave tangible, real tools to hopefully make your time

1323
01:05:11,080 --> 01:05:13,520
Speaker 1: a little bit better while you're doing the time, and

1324
01:05:13,600 --> 01:05:15,880
Speaker 1: have hope as you come home. So thank you again

1325
01:05:15,920 --> 01:05:18,560
Speaker 1: to my guests. Kelly, make sure you go back and

1326
01:05:18,600 --> 01:05:21,520
Speaker 1: listen to all six episodes. You will see at the

1327
01:05:21,560 --> 01:05:23,480
Speaker 1: title of it at the beginning of the description, it

1328
01:05:23,520 --> 01:05:27,040
Speaker 1: will say, UH, the George Floyd Foundation partnership in case

1329
01:05:27,080 --> 01:05:29,080
Speaker 1: you want to listen to them back to back to

1330
01:05:29,160 --> 01:05:31,240
Speaker 1: kind of weave it all together, and then hopefully we

1331
01:05:31,280 --> 01:05:34,440
Speaker 1: will extend this conversation as we move forward and go

1332
01:05:34,560 --> 01:05:36,480
Speaker 1: deeper into it. So again, thank you Kelly for me

1333
01:05:36,520 --> 01:05:38,720
Speaker 1: with me again late in the evening after having a

1334
01:05:38,760 --> 01:05:40,880
Speaker 1: long day of work and having a little one. I

1335
01:05:40,920 --> 01:05:43,640
Speaker 1: get it. I got a teenager myself, so I understand.

1336
01:05:43,640 --> 01:05:45,880
Speaker 1: And we're still here doing this work because it needs

1337
01:05:45,880 --> 01:05:47,840
Speaker 1: to be done. So thank you again, Kelly, and thank

1338
01:05:47,840 --> 01:05:49,880
Speaker 1: you so much everybody for listening. Please subscribe to straight

1339
01:05:49,880 --> 01:05:52,440
Speaker 1: Shot No Chase or wherever you get your podcast piece.

1340
01:05:52,600 --> 01:05:55,240
Speaker 1: If you like what you heard on Straight Shot No Chaser,

1341
01:05:55,280 --> 01:05:57,840
Speaker 1: please subscribe and drop a five star review and tell

1342
01:05:57,840 --> 01:06:00,200
Speaker 1: a friend. Straight Shot No Chaser is a production of

1343
01:06:00,240 --> 01:06:02,800
Speaker 1: The Black Effect Podcast Network and I Heart Radio on

1344
01:06:02,920 --> 01:06:05,640
Speaker 1: Tessela Figure and I'd like to thank our producer editor

1345
01:06:05,800 --> 01:06:09,600
Speaker 1: mixer Dwayne Crawford and our executive producer Charlottage Nagot. For

1346
01:06:09,640 --> 01:06:12,720
Speaker 1: more podcast from I Heart Radio, visit the I Heart

1347
01:06:12,800 --> 01:06:16,240
Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts.