WEBVTT - Thinking Sideways: GEC-Marconi deaths 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:03.279 Thinking Sideways is not brought to you by an empty 0:00:03.320 --> 0:00:07.880 DVD case. Instead, it's supported by the generous donations of 0:00:07.880 --> 0:00:12.560 our listeners on Patreon. Visit patreon dot com slash thinking 0:00:12.600 --> 0:00:20.759 Sideways to learn more and thanks Thinking Sideways. I don't understand. 0:00:23.520 --> 0:00:30.720 You never know stories of things we simply don't know 0:00:30.800 --> 0:00:37.400 the answer too. Hey guys, welcome to another episode of 0:00:37.440 --> 0:00:42.560 Thinking Sideways the podcast. I Am Devin, joined per usual 0:00:42.680 --> 0:00:46.720 by Joe and Steve. They can't even see the end. 0:00:47.360 --> 0:00:48.839 I got to do it for him. You got to 0:00:48.880 --> 0:00:51.800 do everything. I am helpless. You are Den does everything 0:00:51.840 --> 0:00:54.480 around here. It's true, I do, I do everything. Um, 0:00:54.520 --> 0:00:57.200 this week we're going to talk about a mystery, or 0:00:57.280 --> 0:01:00.360 maybe a lot of mysteries, or maybe just one mystery. 0:01:00.520 --> 0:01:03.400 Conspiracy could be a couple of dozen mysteries here, could 0:01:03.440 --> 0:01:07.320 be could be a lot of spiracy. Yeah, show Steve 0:01:07.400 --> 0:01:10.800 keeps trying to say a word conspiracy. Yeah, he thinks 0:01:10.800 --> 0:01:17.520 that's the right word. It's yeah, it's pronounced bilthy. Controversy, Yeah, 0:01:17.520 --> 0:01:20.600 that one. That one. That one's actually pretty accurate. And 0:01:20.680 --> 0:01:23.760 before we get too terribly far into this or inmate 0:01:23.880 --> 0:01:27.240 at all, it was a listeners suggestion. Um, by Rob 0:01:27.680 --> 0:01:31.640 about a million years ago or like a year in 0:01:31.720 --> 0:01:35.360 February of two. Well, if you're a bacteria, that just 0:01:35.400 --> 0:01:38.040 about a million years, it's true. Yeah, Or if you 0:01:38.080 --> 0:01:41.920 live on Pluto. Wait, no, opposite, if you live on Pluto, 0:01:41.959 --> 0:01:46.319 it's about half a day. Sorry, sorry everyone. Okay, So 0:01:46.400 --> 0:01:48.720 thanks Rob, Okay. So let's do a quick overview of 0:01:48.760 --> 0:01:52.080 this case, real quick quick click, quick quick click between 0:01:52.520 --> 0:01:56.040 nineteen two and nineteen eighty eight, or maybe nineteen depending 0:01:56.080 --> 0:01:58.720 on how you look at it, five or twenty six 0:01:58.800 --> 0:02:04.920 depending sign tists slash humans or who were employed by 0:02:05.280 --> 0:02:11.160 G e C. Marconi or its affiliates or closely related 0:02:11.240 --> 0:02:13.880 to G e C. Marconi, which, by the way, it 0:02:13.880 --> 0:02:18.640 was a very large British defense contract. Um, they died, 0:02:19.720 --> 0:02:23.760 especially especially they really the big die off was really 0:02:23.880 --> 0:02:27.320 the first for mus Yeah. And now you may be saying, Devin, 0:02:27.440 --> 0:02:29.560 it's not weird for people to die. What's going on? 0:02:29.720 --> 0:02:33.640 This was a huge company. Well, listener, you're right, it's 0:02:33.639 --> 0:02:36.840 not weird for people to die. But these people were 0:02:36.840 --> 0:02:39.280 all involved in a lot of stuff like you know 0:02:39.320 --> 0:02:43.560 the development of the Stingray torpedo, or like Star Wars, 0:02:44.440 --> 0:02:47.679 the Lucasfilms thing well, actually it was named after lucasfilm thing. 0:02:48.240 --> 0:02:53.160 Literally it was. But that's actually what the media dubbed 0:02:53.800 --> 0:02:57.640 a project that was going on with the Strategic Defense 0:02:57.680 --> 0:03:02.239 Initiative Organization in the United States, primarily our allies were 0:03:02.240 --> 0:03:05.240 helping us. Yeah, roll Reagan um. But the media called 0:03:05.240 --> 0:03:07.200 it star Wars, so we're calling it star Wars. Damn it. 0:03:08.320 --> 0:03:12.160 We'll talk more about Star Wars in a second. Mostly 0:03:12.160 --> 0:03:13.560 the thing you should be paying hinged to is the 0:03:13.560 --> 0:03:15.639 Stingray torpedo, but also Star Wars. I thought it was 0:03:15.680 --> 0:03:18.320 the Jedi Knights. No, shut up. You can't make jokes 0:03:18.320 --> 0:03:21.960 about that all the time. I can't do. Okay, These 0:03:22.960 --> 0:03:28.440 slash twenty six scientists slash people all died in different ways, well, 0:03:28.480 --> 0:03:30.280 most of them died in different ways. A lot of 0:03:30.320 --> 0:03:33.040 them actually died in the same way. Again, we'll get 0:03:33.080 --> 0:03:35.240 to that. Some of the circumstances were a little hanky 0:03:35.400 --> 0:03:37.560 and some of them not. In all of them, it 0:03:37.680 --> 0:03:40.160 was a kind of tight timeline for all these people 0:03:40.200 --> 0:03:43.160 to have died in these like kind of mysterious ways. 0:03:43.760 --> 0:03:45.920 Some of them are definitely suspects, some of them are 0:03:45.960 --> 0:03:50.440 definitely not. But it's a Cold war plot. Well, it 0:03:50.520 --> 0:03:54.840 might be right. I mean, that's the whole alleged conspiracy 0:03:55.080 --> 0:03:57.840 is that actually these people were all in on some 0:03:57.960 --> 0:04:02.680 really highly classified information and that's kind of weird. It's 0:04:02.720 --> 0:04:04.520 kind of weird that they all started to die off. 0:04:05.600 --> 0:04:08.320 I can I can see how we'd raised his eyebrows. Yeah. 0:04:09.040 --> 0:04:11.080 So I think the way we're going to approach this 0:04:11.120 --> 0:04:13.720 case is it's going to be another Devin lists and 0:04:13.800 --> 0:04:16.400 talks for a long time case because I like those 0:04:16.480 --> 0:04:20.279 right now apparently, but we're going to talk about uh, 0:04:20.480 --> 0:04:26.440 star Wars and the Stingray Torpedo, just like really basic overview, 0:04:26.480 --> 0:04:28.000 and then we're going to talk about the deaths, and 0:04:28.040 --> 0:04:32.720 then we'll talk about theories. Okay, so we're gonna talk 0:04:32.720 --> 0:04:37.680 about star Wars, the Strategic Defense Initiative Organization. I'm just 0:04:37.720 --> 0:04:39.840 going to call it the s d I oh and 0:04:39.880 --> 0:04:43.920 the Stingray Torpedo, and most people just call it sd I. No. 0:04:44.040 --> 0:04:49.159 I like sd I. Oh, it's more comprehensive that. Ok. Yeah, 0:04:49.240 --> 0:04:52.240 we don't don't do that. I'm just gonna abbreviate everything. 0:04:52.880 --> 0:04:55.599 People hate it when we do that. We do so. 0:04:55.680 --> 0:04:59.440 In the nineties sixties, the Royal Navy started to think 0:04:59.480 --> 0:05:03.440 that maybe they should start developing their own torpedoes because 0:05:03.440 --> 0:05:06.000 they were buying them from the US. They were, And 0:05:06.360 --> 0:05:08.800 not that there's anything wrong with the U S. Torpedoes, 0:05:09.120 --> 0:05:14.200 but the Britain, Britain's, Britain's British British thought they could 0:05:14.240 --> 0:05:16.280 maybe do better and they didn't want to be dependent 0:05:16.360 --> 0:05:19.839 upon somebody else for their armament. Right. That's yes, that's 0:05:19.880 --> 0:05:22.240 the way we should be saying that. Not we're better 0:05:22.240 --> 0:05:25.559 than them, but they thought they were better than us. 0:05:25.600 --> 0:05:30.480 Good point. That tendency is a very very bad thing 0:05:30.560 --> 0:05:33.200 to do. It really ever get into a large scale 0:05:33.320 --> 0:05:35.640 armed conflict, it really is. And you know what was 0:05:35.680 --> 0:05:38.680 happening around that time is the Cold War or was 0:05:38.720 --> 0:05:42.480 about to happen, and uh well that was kind of 0:05:42.520 --> 0:05:46.120 like a huge armament thing. So well, you know, they 0:05:46.520 --> 0:05:48.680 they just had ideas of their own too. I mean, 0:05:49.520 --> 0:05:50.920 you know, the U. S. Navy is a little high 0:05:50.960 --> 0:05:54.720 bound sometimes and they're thinking and and the risk though. 0:05:54.839 --> 0:05:56.880 You know, they came up with the Spearfish, which was 0:05:57.680 --> 0:06:01.599 just a what's the word I'm thinking of just clever, No, 0:06:01.760 --> 0:06:06.720 not clever efficient, it was just it was just freaking fast. Yeah, 0:06:06.800 --> 0:06:09.760 you know, they just actually would by by Mark forty 0:06:09.960 --> 0:06:12.080 from the U. S. Navy. Let's build something around this 0:06:12.120 --> 0:06:15.520 is better. Yeah, well, so the sting I'm sorry giving 0:06:15.600 --> 0:06:19.159 is that, Joe? Is that what the m K stands for? Mark? Yeah? Okay, 0:06:19.200 --> 0:06:21.359 I could never find that listed anywhere, so it always 0:06:21.400 --> 0:06:23.640 frustrated me when I was doing the research. Why is 0:06:23.680 --> 0:06:29.119 it an MK something? Yeah? Stupid US Navy and their abbreviations. Yeah, 0:06:29.200 --> 0:06:33.000 so Joe may be able to like continue to shed 0:06:33.040 --> 0:06:36.039 some light on some of this stuff. But the stingray torpedo, 0:06:36.120 --> 0:06:38.360 or at least the very beginning concepts of it, we're 0:06:38.400 --> 0:06:42.120 starting to be born in the nineteen sixties and obviously 0:06:42.240 --> 0:06:46.279 they needed some help developing said stingray torpedo, So the 0:06:46.400 --> 0:06:49.960 Royal Navy turned to what was at that point called 0:06:50.200 --> 0:06:53.680 g E C. Marconi or just Marconi. It's gone through 0:06:53.680 --> 0:06:55.840 a lot of different iterations. We're just going to call 0:06:55.880 --> 0:07:00.279 it Marconi for the rest because it's just easier. Yeah. 0:07:00.360 --> 0:07:02.240 I don't think. I think they got gobbled up by 0:07:02.279 --> 0:07:04.800 somebody else. They're not even Marconi anymore. True, they were 0:07:04.839 --> 0:07:09.240 originally Marconi and then they became g CE Marconi. G 0:07:09.480 --> 0:07:13.120 CE was a company that owned them, and they bought 0:07:13.160 --> 0:07:15.960 them out like in the late eighties, and then they 0:07:16.000 --> 0:07:18.320 got bought out by somebody else. It's been this huge thing. 0:07:18.680 --> 0:07:21.720 So we're just gonna call Marconi, Okay, cool, Yeah, the 0:07:21.840 --> 0:07:24.360 listeners cool, send me an email. If you're not cool, cool, 0:07:25.000 --> 0:07:27.680 it isn't I Well, I personally don't think it's very 0:07:27.720 --> 0:07:32.440 important to know what makes this torpedo important for this 0:07:32.720 --> 0:07:35.080 for this story. I mean, people may be interested, in 0:07:35.120 --> 0:07:37.840 which case, the internet's a thing, so look it up. 0:07:38.160 --> 0:07:42.240 Actually it's I will say that it is very interesting 0:07:42.360 --> 0:07:44.360 in the way that it operates. And yeah, and it 0:07:44.480 --> 0:07:47.440 is the multi purpose approach that they took, you know, 0:07:47.480 --> 0:07:50.480 from shooting it out of a submarine to dropping it 0:07:50.520 --> 0:07:54.000 from a plane is pretty phenomenal. Absolutely, No, I think 0:07:54.040 --> 0:07:56.920 it's as much as an instrument of war can be. Cool. 0:07:57.120 --> 0:08:00.360 It's cool. Yeah, this is a cool Yeah, this is 0:08:00.400 --> 0:08:02.280 This is kind of the equivalent of the Mark forty 0:08:02.320 --> 0:08:04.640 six US. It's like an air more meant to be 0:08:04.760 --> 0:08:07.800 dropped out of airplanes and helicopters rather than shot out 0:08:07.800 --> 0:08:12.000 of submarines. But yeah, it's a nifty little, nifty little thing. 0:08:12.400 --> 0:08:14.680 And I especially like the whole idea of fines it's 0:08:14.720 --> 0:08:16.800 been tried on other things. We Russian supposedly are trying 0:08:16.800 --> 0:08:19.040 to send submarines, which is sort of paying out like 0:08:19.200 --> 0:08:21.440 lubricant on the on the no, from the nose of 0:08:21.520 --> 0:08:27.000 the of the torpedo to basically reduced drag and make 0:08:27.040 --> 0:08:29.720 it more efficient faster. Yeah, it's kind of and it's 0:08:29.720 --> 0:08:32.760 a cool idea, although probably leaves a nasty, sticky trail. 0:08:32.880 --> 0:08:38.000 But yeah. Yeah. But the really important part to know 0:08:38.200 --> 0:08:41.120 as it pertains to this case is that most of 0:08:41.160 --> 0:08:44.200 the people who are involved in this case were involved 0:08:44.200 --> 0:08:47.959 in the development or implementation of the Stingray torpedo, which 0:08:48.160 --> 0:08:53.400 was top secret, relatively decent security clear I would say 0:08:53.520 --> 0:08:57.640 totally top secret, but yeah, really high clearance. UM. So 0:08:57.679 --> 0:09:00.680 they were either involved in that development it or in 0:09:01.080 --> 0:09:03.520 um the Star Wars project, which came a little later. 0:09:03.800 --> 0:09:07.800 Star Wars program was to basically to develop a missile 0:09:07.880 --> 0:09:13.920 defense system to protect America from any kind of nuclear attack. Yes, 0:09:14.000 --> 0:09:16.840 this is the way dumbed down version. We don't need 0:09:17.000 --> 0:09:19.640 experts to explain to us this dumbed down version. We're 0:09:19.679 --> 0:09:22.760 going to just say this dumb down version. Basically, the 0:09:22.760 --> 0:09:26.000 idea was to shoot down incoming Soviet ballistic missiles from 0:09:26.000 --> 0:09:31.920 every angle not even necessarily so so Star Wars was 0:09:32.000 --> 0:09:35.520 very controversial and it was actually like very ambitious. It 0:09:35.559 --> 0:09:40.200 included surface to air interception, orbital intervention. And this is true. 0:09:40.760 --> 0:09:45.320 Uh an X ray laser called projects called Project Excalibur 0:09:46.320 --> 0:09:52.120 yea or laser is a cool idea. It's really cool too. Yeah, 0:09:52.200 --> 0:09:55.400 we should start a kickstarter to buy our own laser 0:09:55.760 --> 0:09:58.640 extra laser. And and I've got to say, directed energy 0:09:58.679 --> 0:10:00.680 weapons have really come a long way. They had thanks 0:10:00.720 --> 0:10:02.800 the sd I, I think more than anything else. Now 0:10:02.800 --> 0:10:05.520 were and now we're fielding, we're actually getting that fielding 0:10:05.559 --> 0:10:08.440 necessarily getting ready to field really high powered lasers that 0:10:08.480 --> 0:10:12.000 actually can't shoot down. So this was early development of that. 0:10:12.080 --> 0:10:15.440 It was super topsy. We're still talking Star Wars, as 0:10:15.480 --> 0:10:17.240 you say, at this point, we're still the eighties, so 0:10:17.280 --> 0:10:21.320 we're still decades away from where we are. Absolutely. Yeah, 0:10:21.880 --> 0:10:26.000 So all of the projects that these or twenty six people, 0:10:26.120 --> 0:10:29.360 well the twenty people they person is a little different. 0:10:29.600 --> 0:10:31.840 But the people that we're going to talk about, we're 0:10:32.160 --> 0:10:36.280 all working very closely on these heavily classified projects. And 0:10:36.320 --> 0:10:40.439 by closely, you don't mean together as a group, because 0:10:40.440 --> 0:10:42.800 they were they were you know, rubbing elbows all know, 0:10:43.120 --> 0:10:45.440 most of them. Some of them did work together, but 0:10:45.520 --> 0:10:49.079 most of them didn't actually ever interact. They just were 0:10:49.120 --> 0:10:52.520 working on the same project. And these projects were large. Obviously, 0:10:52.840 --> 0:10:56.640 you don't develop an extreme laser without you know, having 0:10:56.800 --> 0:11:00.840 a couple hundred people working. You know, that's not a thing. Yeah, 0:11:01.200 --> 0:11:02.960 And I guess As a side note, I just want 0:11:02.960 --> 0:11:06.000 to say that sometimes when I was watching Fringe, UM, 0:11:06.040 --> 0:11:10.040 I started to really doubt the whole like, this reminds 0:11:10.040 --> 0:11:13.719 me of the project Belly and I worked right for 0:11:13.840 --> 0:11:21.320 multipleship and then you should, you should. But like, the 0:11:21.360 --> 0:11:24.760 further I delved into the history of the Star Wars project, 0:11:24.800 --> 0:11:28.360 the more I was like, oh crap, they literally just 0:11:28.440 --> 0:11:31.760 pulled this from history. This is like, this is exactly 0:11:31.760 --> 0:11:38.640 what we were doing. Oh god wow. So, like I said, 0:11:38.640 --> 0:11:41.560 while there's some connections to Star Wars and to the 0:11:41.600 --> 0:11:45.240 development of the Stingright torpedo, this episode is not about that. 0:11:45.400 --> 0:11:52.880 So let's get going. Let's talk about some death. First, death, 0:11:54.440 --> 0:11:58.880 We're talking about death now. Professor Keith Bowden. Professor Bowden 0:11:58.960 --> 0:12:02.480 was a computer programmer at Essex University. He was an 0:12:02.480 --> 0:12:06.240 expert on supercomputers and pretty well renowned for his work 0:12:06.280 --> 0:12:09.880 with computer controlled aircraft, which is like totally ubiquitous now 0:12:10.000 --> 0:12:15.480 but in the whole different, totally different. Yeah, I mean 0:12:15.600 --> 0:12:19.360 Pong was major at that time. UM. On an evening 0:12:19.600 --> 0:12:23.079 in March of nine two, he died in a car 0:12:23.080 --> 0:12:28.040 accident after um reportedly drinking at a social function. His 0:12:28.160 --> 0:12:31.240 friends and families say he wasn't drinking, UM, but he 0:12:31.360 --> 0:12:34.640 lost control of his car and crashed it into a 0:12:34.760 --> 0:12:38.040 rail line that wasn't being used anymore, so there were 0:12:38.040 --> 0:12:40.720 no trains using it or anything like that. Crashed into 0:12:40.760 --> 0:12:43.440 a rail line as and he crashed into a train tracks. 0:12:43.720 --> 0:12:45.960 How would you know? He went down an embankment. Yeah, 0:12:47.280 --> 0:12:50.560 at the bottom was a set of training. Um. The 0:12:50.640 --> 0:12:53.480 impact would have killed him. So he died. He died. 0:12:53.520 --> 0:12:55.520 It did kill Hiyeah, it did kill him. But it 0:12:55.600 --> 0:12:57.520 was apparently the impact right because there was no, like 0:12:57.559 --> 0:12:59.960 I said, no trains or anything like that. And something 0:13:00.000 --> 0:13:04.000 I'm gonna say a lot here. You're gonna hear like, oh, 0:13:04.040 --> 0:13:06.800 he ran his car into this thing and it wasn't 0:13:06.800 --> 0:13:13.079 in use. How lucky, right. I don't know if he 0:13:13.120 --> 0:13:16.679 did it deliberately, somebody else did it. Yeah. Next up 0:13:16.840 --> 0:13:21.600 is Lieutenant Colonel Anthony Godly. Um. Godly was the head 0:13:21.679 --> 0:13:23.960 of the work study unit at the Royal College of 0:13:23.960 --> 0:13:26.640 Military Science, which you're going to hear a lot about 0:13:26.720 --> 0:13:30.920 the Royal College of Military Science. Um. Not clear what 0:13:30.960 --> 0:13:33.480 projects he worked on, but I think he probably did 0:13:33.480 --> 0:13:37.080 work on a lot of the projects, which honestly might 0:13:37.120 --> 0:13:41.079 be more of an indication than not not knowing what 0:13:41.120 --> 0:13:43.199 projects he worked on might be more of an indication 0:13:43.240 --> 0:13:47.000 than like if they had said, what don't these guys 0:13:47.040 --> 0:13:49.280 were working because it was secret. It was it was 0:13:49.320 --> 0:13:53.760 really secret. And in fairness, Godly may or may not 0:13:53.840 --> 0:13:58.480 be dead. He just mysteriously disappeared in April of two. 0:13:59.200 --> 0:14:02.720 He has presumed dead. And the reason that people presume 0:14:02.840 --> 0:14:05.880 that he's dead is that his father died in ninety 0:14:05.960 --> 0:14:09.360 seven and left him like a ton of money, not 0:14:09.720 --> 0:14:12.440 a ton quiet but you know the modern equivalent of 0:14:12.480 --> 0:14:16.200 over grandly, like a hundred and thirty grand um. And 0:14:16.280 --> 0:14:18.840 he never named it, yeah, in today's money, and he 0:14:18.880 --> 0:14:23.280 never claimed it. It doesn't He might be like Patrick 0:14:23.360 --> 0:14:26.120 McGowan in The Prisoner and he's just being held in 0:14:26.240 --> 0:14:29.680 a little little point village on the coast somewhere held 0:14:30.560 --> 0:14:34.640 the operative word there. Yeah, it's reasonable to assume that 0:14:34.680 --> 0:14:37.840 he is not under his own personage. I mean that 0:14:37.920 --> 0:14:40.520 he's not really operating of his own free will. Yeah, 0:14:40.600 --> 0:14:44.200 that's what I mean. Yeah, but he disappeared, he did. 0:14:45.000 --> 0:14:48.040 Next up is Roger Hill. Hill was a radar designer 0:14:48.080 --> 0:14:51.160 and a drafter from mar cony Um and he shot 0:14:51.240 --> 0:14:56.480 himself with a shotgun in March of presumably on purpose. 0:14:56.720 --> 0:14:59.480 A corner report says it was a suicide. So this 0:15:00.000 --> 0:15:02.040 I'm gonna bring this up because this is We're only 0:15:02.040 --> 0:15:04.080 three in, but we're gonna see this a number of times. 0:15:04.720 --> 0:15:11.600 Things that seem very easily defined from the outside as 0:15:11.880 --> 0:15:15.640 a suicide or or and we're going to see things 0:15:15.680 --> 0:15:19.520 that are seemed very simply as just plain old accidents 0:15:19.640 --> 0:15:24.360 or intentional loss of life are going to be wrapped in. 0:15:24.640 --> 0:15:27.320 So this is gonna come up again and again. So 0:15:27.360 --> 0:15:29.200 I'm gonna warrant people because I know people are gonna 0:15:29.240 --> 0:15:31.760 be like, oh, are you kidding me? How is that 0:15:31.840 --> 0:15:34.600 on the list? This is how the list is. This 0:15:34.680 --> 0:15:38.200 let's just been I always use the phrase curated. Yeah, 0:15:38.320 --> 0:15:41.360 I feel like this list has been very tailored because 0:15:41.360 --> 0:15:43.960 I've found some alternate versions of it out there that 0:15:44.000 --> 0:15:47.080 have more info. But it always gets trimmed more and 0:15:47.120 --> 0:15:50.240 more as I read people that we're not on the list, 0:15:50.480 --> 0:15:52.400 that we who were scientists and they were not on 0:15:52.440 --> 0:15:55.960 the official list because they were outside of Marconi. Yeah, 0:15:56.200 --> 0:15:57.880 well there are some people on this list that were 0:15:57.880 --> 0:16:01.680 outside of Marconi as well. But we'll keep talking about this, 0:16:01.720 --> 0:16:04.640 and I agree that there are some that have I mean, 0:16:04.680 --> 0:16:07.960 it's definitely created. I think is like a really nice number, 0:16:09.360 --> 0:16:12.280 perfect list size. It's a good number. It's always perfect 0:16:12.320 --> 0:16:15.960 cla the top ten, the top twelve, the top twenty, 0:16:16.040 --> 0:16:19.520 the top like this is the way those things always run. 0:16:19.640 --> 0:16:22.160 So it's you know, sometimes you gotta pad that out. Yeah, 0:16:22.320 --> 0:16:27.080 evidently they did. Next up is Jonathan wolsh Um. He 0:16:27.200 --> 0:16:30.400 was a communications expert who had worked on a number 0:16:30.400 --> 0:16:36.560 of classified projects from our Coni. On November nine, wolsh 0:16:38.280 --> 0:16:42.880 fell out of his hotel room window in Abbot John 0:16:43.280 --> 0:16:46.880 West Africa. That's not suspicious at all, not at all. 0:16:47.600 --> 0:16:53.880 Actually they don't have hotel room window in Africa, that's true. Yeah, 0:16:53.920 --> 0:16:56.600 so it's really easy to fall out, of course. Yeah. Um. 0:16:57.160 --> 0:17:00.920 Walsh had actually expressed to some ends that he was 0:17:01.240 --> 0:17:03.240 that he feared that his life was in danger prior 0:17:03.280 --> 0:17:06.600 to leaving for his trip for West Africa. So that's cool. 0:17:07.720 --> 0:17:09.399 This is when things start to kind of ramp up 0:17:09.880 --> 0:17:15.760 after after Wolsh, which is pretty suspicious, but yeah, I 0:17:15.840 --> 0:17:19.480 managed to get along for many years without falling out right. Yeah, 0:17:19.480 --> 0:17:22.560 and he was only twenty nine, so like, come on. 0:17:23.240 --> 0:17:27.160 Next up is vim Al dodgy By. He was a 0:17:27.200 --> 0:17:31.439 computer software engineer with Marconi who ran most of the 0:17:31.480 --> 0:17:34.520 testing on the torpedo development projects, so that would have 0:17:34.520 --> 0:17:39.160 included the stay right torpedo and then the iterations thereafter. 0:17:40.440 --> 0:17:43.840 On August fifth, night six he told his wife that 0:17:43.880 --> 0:17:46.240 he would be working late and then drove about a 0:17:46.280 --> 0:17:50.600 hundred miles to Bristol and then mysteriously fell two hundred 0:17:50.680 --> 0:17:54.360 and sixty feet, which is eighty years from a suspension bridge. 0:17:54.720 --> 0:17:58.720 And he had no connection to Bristol. He didn't know. 0:17:59.200 --> 0:18:02.199 There was no reason for him to be there except 0:18:02.200 --> 0:18:04.280 there was a nice high bridge. Except for there was 0:18:04.280 --> 0:18:05.720 a nice high bridge. But I don't know why you 0:18:05.720 --> 0:18:07.639 would drive a hundred miles for a nice high bridge. 0:18:07.640 --> 0:18:10.520 I bet they're nice high bridges somewhere within that hundred 0:18:10.520 --> 0:18:14.919 mile radius. Not necessarily, there's there's buildings to throw yourself 0:18:14.960 --> 0:18:17.440 off trains to throw yourself in front of you. There's 0:18:17.480 --> 0:18:22.440 other ways to kill yourself. Um. The police report initially 0:18:23.040 --> 0:18:26.600 included a mention of a needle sized puncture on his 0:18:26.720 --> 0:18:30.840 left butt cheek. Um. But then later they said, oh, 0:18:30.920 --> 0:18:34.919 actually that that needle size puncture wound is actually that 0:18:34.920 --> 0:18:38.040 that actually came from his fall of course. Um. And 0:18:38.119 --> 0:18:41.040 I also heard that he when they found his body, 0:18:41.560 --> 0:18:44.400 his pants were down around his ankles. I've heard varying 0:18:44.600 --> 0:18:48.720 accounts of that. Yes, it depends on he did fall 0:18:48.720 --> 0:18:55.480 into a river that Yeah, so he'd been looking forward 0:18:55.480 --> 0:18:57.560 to starting. He had actually just been offered a job 0:18:57.560 --> 0:19:01.920 in the city of London. His friends confirmed, as did 0:19:02.000 --> 0:19:05.760 his wife, that he had no reason for committing suicide. Granted, 0:19:06.359 --> 0:19:08.760 we know from our couple of years of doing the 0:19:08.800 --> 0:19:12.639 show that there's not always a reason. There's not always 0:19:12.640 --> 0:19:16.280 outward signs signs to friends and family. Now, one of 0:19:16.320 --> 0:19:18.639 the things I want to know is did he jump 0:19:18.960 --> 0:19:21.040 during the day or at night? I believe it was 0:19:21.080 --> 0:19:25.240 at night, Okay, anybody driving by, some some big Russian 0:19:25.240 --> 0:19:28.320 looking guys, maybe throwing him off the bridge, I don't believe. So. No, 0:19:29.000 --> 0:19:31.800 the when his when he died, um, he was with 0:19:31.920 --> 0:19:35.560 the he was within a week of his last day 0:19:35.680 --> 0:19:39.880 at Marconi. UM, so that's a little yeah, Yeah, that's cool, 0:19:39.920 --> 0:19:43.000 new job in London. Yeah, although you know, like I said, 0:19:43.080 --> 0:19:45.040 there's no reason, but when you start to couple it 0:19:45.080 --> 0:19:46.680 with a lot of other stuff, it's kind of like, wow, 0:19:47.080 --> 0:19:50.320 this is this is a Domino story. This is as 0:19:50.520 --> 0:19:52.240 That's what I always refer to these as is. It's 0:19:52.440 --> 0:19:54.320 you know, the first one is fine, the second one. 0:19:55.600 --> 0:19:58.600 By the sixth, seventh, and eighth, you're like, whoa, there's 0:19:58.800 --> 0:20:02.600 something going on. That's what That's how the story gets 0:20:02.600 --> 0:20:05.680 so much. Yeah. I think I'm probably a combination of 0:20:06.160 --> 0:20:10.960 actual accidents and natural causes mixed in with some murders. 0:20:10.960 --> 0:20:15.040 Possibly it's a perfect cover. Next up is our Shads Sharif. 0:20:15.960 --> 0:20:19.040 Shariff was working on a system to allow detection of 0:20:19.080 --> 0:20:24.560 submarines by satellites. So that's that's cool technology, important technology. 0:20:24.840 --> 0:20:27.240 Synthetic aperture radar is one of the ones that the 0:20:27.240 --> 0:20:29.760 technologies they used to take waves on the surface of 0:20:29.760 --> 0:20:34.720 the ocean. Yeah. In October six um Shariff placed a 0:20:34.800 --> 0:20:37.920 rope around his neck, tied the other end of the 0:20:38.000 --> 0:20:40.760 rope to a tree, and then drove off in his 0:20:40.920 --> 0:20:45.359 Audi with the accelerated pedal, jammed down Um and effectively 0:20:45.400 --> 0:20:49.280 decapitated himself. The coroner did decide that this was a 0:20:49.320 --> 0:20:53.840 suicide because I don't know why. I think his his 0:20:54.280 --> 0:20:58.120 brother Um actually went to retreat the car. He said 0:20:58.119 --> 0:21:00.639 there was a metal rod on the floor of the 0:21:00.640 --> 0:21:03.560 car next to the gas pedal. This was retrieved after 0:21:03.640 --> 0:21:06.280 it had been in custody. You know, of course the 0:21:06.320 --> 0:21:08.520 police take the car and say we're gonna check it out, 0:21:08.600 --> 0:21:12.600 figure it out. So I always I saw that too, 0:21:12.880 --> 0:21:17.320 and I was really suspicious of that because it means 0:21:17.359 --> 0:21:20.879 it would have been in a wrecking yard and things. 0:21:21.040 --> 0:21:22.639 You know, as I get in there, I've got a 0:21:22.680 --> 0:21:24.760 thing in my hand from working on another car, and 0:21:24.760 --> 0:21:26.320 I set it down and I moved this car, and 0:21:26.359 --> 0:21:29.480 then I leave it. Like it's never described. Is it 0:21:29.560 --> 0:21:32.080 a rod that it was of the proper length? This 0:21:32.160 --> 0:21:34.040 is again, this is one of those things about the stories. 0:21:34.080 --> 0:21:37.600 It's just there was a raw metal rod on the floorboard, 0:21:37.680 --> 0:21:40.480 but we don't actually get any description to say if 0:21:40.520 --> 0:21:42.239 it could or could not have been used in a 0:21:42.240 --> 0:21:46.440 nefarious way too, as is inferred hold down the gas pedal. Well, 0:21:46.520 --> 0:21:48.919 the thing about it is too is you would have 0:21:48.920 --> 0:21:50.800 thought that there had actually been a rod there, that 0:21:50.840 --> 0:21:55.120 the police would have actually you know, taken it into evidence. Well, 0:21:55.160 --> 0:21:58.240 according to all of the folks that really believe that 0:21:58.280 --> 0:22:03.680 this is a genet conspiracy, this is examples of police ineptitude, 0:22:03.880 --> 0:22:07.119 right that happens, or a willful cover up that too, 0:22:07.760 --> 0:22:12.080 or maybe a little both. I guess. The couple of 0:22:12.080 --> 0:22:17.000 things that add to Shrief's story, Um, Sharif didn't really 0:22:17.040 --> 0:22:20.640 live anywhere near Bristol, which is where he committed suicide. 0:22:21.320 --> 0:22:23.399 And he had actually spent the last night of his 0:22:23.520 --> 0:22:26.720 life renting in what they call a rooming house, which 0:22:26.720 --> 0:22:28.680 I think is just like a hostel. There's no good 0:22:28.680 --> 0:22:34.800 reason for this. He had a nice apartment and life Bristol. Yeah, 0:22:34.880 --> 0:22:38.560 And he had apparently paid for that room in cash 0:22:38.680 --> 0:22:42.400 and apparently was seen to have had a bundle of 0:22:42.600 --> 0:22:48.959 high denomination notes, right bank notes, whichever, you know whatever. 0:22:49.560 --> 0:22:55.840 Apparently the police were told about these this money cash basically, 0:22:56.359 --> 0:22:59.199 and they they didn't make any mention of it when 0:22:59.240 --> 0:23:02.320 there was an ins into the death. Um, and it's 0:23:02.320 --> 0:23:05.320 basically just been scrubbed out of the record. I imagine 0:23:05.320 --> 0:23:07.240 the guys who drove the ambulances and picked his body 0:23:07.280 --> 0:23:10.560 up at the scene, probably found a new home for it, Yeah, 0:23:10.760 --> 0:23:13.440 if it was on him. Yeah, that's true. This is 0:23:13.480 --> 0:23:15.920 a messy scene. Tax is that what that is? That 0:23:17.080 --> 0:23:18.840 he's going to pay for this? Yeah? If I gotta, 0:23:18.840 --> 0:23:20.480 if I gotta put up with all this gross in 0:23:20.520 --> 0:23:22.439 the second of his head and put it in a 0:23:22.440 --> 0:23:26.680 paper bag. Yeah, Um wouldn't have stayed in a paper bag. 0:23:28.000 --> 0:23:31.280 Most of the other guests that were um staying in 0:23:31.280 --> 0:23:35.199 the same hostile rooming housing were all employed at the 0:23:35.440 --> 0:23:38.840 British Aerospace which is actually where Sharif worked prior to 0:23:38.920 --> 0:23:42.040 working at Marconi, and he had worked in Yeah, they 0:23:42.080 --> 0:23:44.600 were doing guided weapons. Yeah, just say they were doing 0:23:44.720 --> 0:23:47.960 similar stuff what he was doing for Marconi. Yeah, And 0:23:48.000 --> 0:23:49.840 it sounds like he had been doing that prior and 0:23:49.840 --> 0:23:51.800